Gene Kelly Talking Pictures


Gene Kelly

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Dancer, actor, singer,

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director, producer.

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In the Hollywood of the 1940s, and '50s,

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Gene Kelly was the perfect package.

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He didn't just dance in some of cinema's greatest scenes,

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he was the man who choreographed the dances.

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He earned himself a reputation as an artist and an innovator,

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We join him now for an interview he gave

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at the BBC's famous Lime Grove studios on a visit to London,

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with his then wife, Betsy Blair,

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to promote the 1956 film Invitation To The Dance.

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I have taken over reception duties at Lime Grove -

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temporarily, I hasten to add -

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because in a few moments we are expecting a visitor

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who started life with the intention of becoming a lawyer.

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But, to coin his own phrase,

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he thought he might save an awful lot of people from prison,

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by becoming instead one of the best-known choreographers,

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dancers, actors, writers, directors in the film business.

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I'd like you to meet him straightaway, here he is, Gene Kelly.

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-Hello, Gene.

-Hello, Peter. How are you?

-Oh, I'm fine, thanks.

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-And you?

-Just fine. It's good to be here,

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and to do a little bit of work over in England.

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I remember about three months ago I was talking to your wife

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in this very same building.

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Yes, so I understood. That was about Marty.

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-Her picture.

-Of course. How is she?

-She's just fine.

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She's over here now with me, and my little girl.

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-We're afraid we have to leave soon, but we're glad to be here.

-Good.

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-Gene, let's get straight to you, now. How did you start?

-Well, start what?

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-Start coming to England, or...?

-Start in the business

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Well, that's a long story.

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I'm afraid it was sheer economics - I had to make a living some way.

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I didn't want to do it by stealing, so.. Well, I became a dancer.

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I was working my way through school, and I found out

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I could do it best by doing little performances and dancing.

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And I soon fell into show business. It's as simple as that.

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Now, they tell me that you opened a dancing school

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when you were 18 years old. Is that right?

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Yes, I started to teach kids on the block

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and fellow students at school, and so forth.

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And I got so interested in it, I began to study very hard.

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And, fortunately, it turned out very well.

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After a while, though, I decided to brave New York City

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and become a choreographer.

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But strangely enough, nobody wanted me to be a choreographer,

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so I ended up being an actor.

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But afterwards, I became a choreographer.

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-Gene, what was your first picture?

-Uh, Me And My Gal with Judy Garland.

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Gee, that seems a long time ago!

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You shouldn't ask me questions like that. I get feeling older here.

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Yes, that was the first one, and then it went on from there.

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-Do you remember that one?

-Well, I don't think I do.

-You're just a boy.

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I tell you one I do remember, one I liked very much - The Three Musketeers.

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-I liked that one myself!

-You went all over the place, didn't you?

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That was hard work. But we enjoyed it.

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Sort of cowboys and Indians with long wigs and beards and everything.

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Yes, I liked that.

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I'm glad you mentioned that - it's about the only one

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-that I didn't dance in.

-INTERVIEWER LAUGHS

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Gene, where did you develop this particular style of dancing

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which is very much all your own.

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Well, it...

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I, believe it or not, was a classic ballet dancer first,

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and a lot of things I tried to say,

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I found I couldn't quite say.

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For instance, if I wanted to play a truck driver in movies, that is,

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you can say anything you want with classic ballet,

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but playing a part and having to dress like a truck driver

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instead of dressing in a classical costume,

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I decided to try and work out a style that would go along

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with American speech and American moves, American jazz music, and so forth.

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So, I did work hard at developing a style of my own.

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Whether this is successful or not, we'll leave that to you to judge,

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but it was with malice aforethought that I did it all.

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Let's talk, if we may, a little while,

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about Invitation To The Dance.

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Oh, good. I'd like to talk about that.

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First of all, where did you get the idea?

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-Let's start like that.

-Oh, I've had it a long time.

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It originally started because I'd been in so many films

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and we always had trouble getting some of the dancers we wanted

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because a dancer spends all his life learning to dance,

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then he gets in a film and they say, "Here's a scene, you act in it,"

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and, "Here's a song, you sing it," and so forth.

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And so a lot of good dancers - and I mean wonderful dancers -

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never have the opportunity to work in films because of this,

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because they can't act.

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So, I said, "Wouldn't it be wonderful one day if we made a film

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"that was about dancers and for dancers."

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So, I've had this bee in my bonnet for a long time.

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The trouble was selling it, you see, selling the idea,

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and spending all that money on a film with no dialogue, and...

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just dancers in it

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and, if I may say it, no Hollywood people.

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-You say no dialogue?

-No dialogue. No, it's all dancing.

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Really, all dancing.

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Do you find that dancing in television

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and dancing in films has maybe drawn a lot of people to the ballet?

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Well, I know... I can't answer for England, of course,

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but I know in America that the interest in Sadler's Wells,

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for example, was so popular when I visited there,

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that people just jammed the theatre to see them.

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I know a big reason for that was ballet films,

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-particularly, I must say, the English film Red Shoes.

-Oh, yes.

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So, it has had a great effect on popularising ballet in America.

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I'm sure it must have over here too.

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It probably has. Like so many other things, when you see something

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at home on your television screen, you want to see more of it.

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Well, I'm glad to hear that.

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Oh, Mr Kelly, please! We're ready now.

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I think I must go and make a living.

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Gene, just before you do go, one more question.

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Any regrets at all about not being a lawyer?

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Any regrets... Uh...

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No, I don't think so!

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Goodbye!

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So, there goes Gene Kelly, and the best of luck to him.

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-SYLVIA SYMS:

-After dominating dance on the silver screen for over 20 years,

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20th Century Fox gave Kelly the chance to direct the 1969 musical Hello, Dolly,

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starring Barbra Streisand, Walter Matthau,

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and Michael Crawford, who talks about working with Kelly

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in this interview for the programme Line Up Film Night.

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They got me together with Gene Kelly in San Francisco

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and I spent half an hour just talking to him,

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and he said, "Can you sing?"

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And I said, "Well, yes, I can sort of sing."

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And, "What about your dancing?"

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And I said, "Well, I'd done a bit in the bath," you know.

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And he...he didn't laugh at that.

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And he said, "Well, can you do this?"

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He did a little...thing. And I got very scared at that point, and...

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I said, "Well, I really don't..."

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He said, "Come on, just do it! Just try putting those two legs there and there."

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And I had a go, and it was really very messy, but he said...

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"Well, I think it's worth doing a test.

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"What we need is a sort of, erm, person who is a...has some charm,

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"but is a sort of an idiot.

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"Well, my wife thinks you've got charm and I think

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"you're a bit of an idiot, so you stand a good chance of doing this."

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I think it's the best thing he could ever direct.

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I don't think anyone else could have directed it

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anywhere near as well as him, but, uh, um,

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maybe I can just say that quietly.

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Because he has done an incredible job with it.

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It has all the feeling that he had in his films.

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He generates enthusiasm...

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..and tremendous vitality.

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He is 26!

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He's...my age! I'm 27.

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But the boy with me in the film is a dancer, since he was that high.

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Now, we did... You can do things like cartwheels with no hands -

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they're called butterflies.

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The boy I was with could do four.

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Kelly could do six, and he's 56.

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And that is really something.

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He's still got so much energy, that man.

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He works seven days a week.

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And I used to have to work seven days a week out there

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because of dancing, everything I'm learning,

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so I got a special pass to work on Saturdays.

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He'd come, cos he knew that was going on. He'd want to be there.

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He'd come up to the house and say, "I've got a great idea for Monday,"

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and it's a change of half a line, or something.

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But his enthusiasm just doesn't stop him from wanting to work

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and work and work.

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-SYMS:

-Hello, Dolly, won three Academy Awards

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and was nominated for another four.

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Despite that success,

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musicals were no longer as popular as they had been.

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But in 1974, the surprise hit That's Entertainment

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had Kelly topping the box office once again,

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meaning new interest in his career, and an encounter with Barry Norman.

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Dancing is not all that joyful when you're putting it on film.

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It's great joy in creating it,

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but it's a chore to get it in that box.

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It's a big chore.

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And, uh, it's a lot of sweat, blood and tears.

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You were quite late starting in films, weren't you?

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-You were already 30 when you made For Me And My Gal.

-Yes.

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I was exactly 30. I left Broadway...

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Yes, I turned 30 in the middle of the film.

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Working with Judy in my first film, I was automatically in a hit

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cos she was such a big star.

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People liked her, and I sort of tagged along behind her,

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and I did very well.

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One of our critics described you as a greater film artist than Astaire.

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Now, I'm sure your modesty will forbid you to accept this,

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but modesty apart...

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Well, I...

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No, it has nothing to do with modesty. I, um...

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Fred, whom I dearly love,

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and admire, was the epitome of American dance for ten years.

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And that was quite important. I think he kept the dance alive.

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It's true that he danced with Ginger Rogers and they were a team -

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it was in the old... it was the older tradition.

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But he was the American dance to people all around the world.

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What would you say was your own major contribution to the musical?

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It would seem to me that you were the man

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who brought muscle and sweat and athleticism into dance.

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Well, that...that...that might be true, but I feel

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that my biggest contribution was changing the costume.

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Whereas the male dancer in movies was always

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representative of the upper classes,

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I certainly couldn't be because of... not only the way I danced,

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the way I wear clothes.

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If I put on a...evening dress - a white tie and tails -

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I look like a truck driver. The Iceman Cometh.

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NORMAN LAUGHS

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I think the outfit,

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changing into sweatshirt and blue jeans and moccasins,

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visually changing the look of the male dancer,

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might have been, uh...

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my greatest contribution. I don't know.

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I remember, I suppose On The Town was the one I remember most vividly,

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that all of a sudden, and it seemed to me for the first time in a musical,

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the song and the dance came spontaneously out of the action.

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That was a contribution you made, surely.

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Yes, we did it on location. We did On The Town on location

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and we did it as real people coming down real streets in New York City.

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And the sailor suits show your body

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just the same as a ballet dancer wearing tights.

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You can see how he dances.

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# New York, New York

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# New York, New York

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# New York, New York

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# It's a wonderful town... #

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MAN LAUGHS

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Hey, fellas. What's the big rush!

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-We only got 24 hours!

-Yeah!

-And we never been here before!

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Ah, what can happen to you in one day. What do you think you'll do?

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THEY HOWL AND BARK

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# New York, New York A wonderful town

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# The Bronx is up and the Battery's down

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# The people ride in a hole in the ground

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# New York, New York

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# It's a wonderful town. #

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But didn't the studio think with On the Town

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that they had a disaster on their hands?

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They thought going to New York

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was the most ridiculous thing in the world, yes.

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-They wanted to do it all in the back lot?

-Oh, sure. "Why not?" they said.

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-Cheaper.

-Yes. And quicker, yes.

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-But it was your idea to take it to New York?

-Yes.

-Why?

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Because I knew it would work. I somehow knew it would work.

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Maybe if I'd been older and wiser,

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I would've said, "I shouldn't take that kind of a risk."

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But I felt it was time to do it.

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And I had planned out ways to hide the camera

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so that we didn't need a police force around us

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to hold people back, and we could shoot very quickly. And we did.

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# We've sailed the seas and we've been the world over

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# Been to Mandalay

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# We've seen the Sphinx and seen the cliffs of Dover

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# But we can safely say

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# The most fabulous sight is New York in the light of the day

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# Our only day

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# New York, New York A wonderful town

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# The Bronx is up and the Battery's down

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# The people riding a hole in the ground

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# New York, New York It's a wonderful town! #

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Well, let's talk about the musical which I suppose has got to be

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among almost everybody's top two or three musicals

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and that's Singin' In The Rain. How much of that was scripted?

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Because I can't imagine a script that says,

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"At this point, Gene goes dancing up and down through puddles."

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No. No script.

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Usually the scripts that were written about musicals

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would say, "Here Kelly or Astaire or O'Connor does a dance

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"and it stops the show."

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Usually they'd say something like that.

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It's up to the choreographer to supply a great deal.

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# Doo-doo-doo-doo-doo Doo-doo-doo-doo-doo-doo

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# Doo-doo-doo-doo-doo Doo-doo-doo-doo-doo-doo

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# Doo-doo-doo-doo-doo Doo-doo-doo-doo-doo-doo

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# I'm singin' in the rain

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# Just singin' in the rain

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# What a glorious feelin'

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# I'm happy again

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# I'm laughing at clouds

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# So dark up above

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# The sun's in my heart

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# And I'm ready for love... #

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The Singin' In The Rain number per se

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was done because it's a charming song.

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The producer who happened to write it, Arthur Freed, said,

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"What are you going to do with this now? We've done it a couple of times before."

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I said, "It's going to be raining and I'm going to be singing."

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And it was one of the easiest numbers I've ever had to put together.

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That's fantastic, because it's the one everybody remembers.

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It's... It's a joyous number.

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I think people like to see joy on the screen.

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I think I had a long career as a dancer. I think I've been very lucky.

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The...

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Things combine to do things to a dancer, or any kind of athlete.

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When you...

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When you go into this type of vocation, you have to be...

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Or you should be intelligent enough to know that you're not going to

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last as long as a painter or a musician or a writer.

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Because the tools with which you work - the tool, I should say -

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is your anatomy.

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And you're at your peak when you're about 25, physically.

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Except you don't know anything. You're fairly stupid.

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When you begin to mature, which I will do when I'm about 80...

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When you begin to mature, you begin to deteriorate physically.

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So, a dancer is disproportionately fighting against himself.

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Um... One has to learn to pace oneself.

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And you can do a better number, and that,

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but you still can't jump over the same table you could ten years ago.

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So, you say, "Oh, I'll have to cut that out."

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And you have to substitute something else.

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I love everything about show business.

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I can't imagine myself in any other trade. I don't know any other trade.

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But even if I had to hang around and just work lights or something,

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I think I'd enjoy it. I do love show business.

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Two years after That's Entertainment came the inevitable sequel

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and a date with Michael Parkinson that showed just why Kelly

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never lost his status as a true Hollywood legend.

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APPLAUSE

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You were telling me also too... People tend to think now

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of song and dance men and musicals as being a thing of the past,

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which indeed they are in terms of film.

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But you mentioned to me earlier that, in fact, tap dancing

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is coming back as a vogue now?

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Yes, that's true.

0:19:030:19:06

And I was talking to Mr Astaire two weeks ago

0:19:060:19:09

when we were doing a little thing introducing some clips and so forth,

0:19:090:19:13

in That's Entertainment II,

0:19:130:19:15

and he said, "Look at this silly letter I got.

0:19:150:19:19

"I have to fill it in." I said, "Look, I got the same letter."

0:19:190:19:22

It was from a university.

0:19:220:19:23

I won't mention the university, quite a good university in America.

0:19:230:19:28

And we get a lot of these things...

0:19:280:19:30

They're looking at tap dancing now

0:19:300:19:33

as some kind of a basic American art form.

0:19:330:19:37

And I guess it is that.

0:19:370:19:39

-We never looked at it that way.

-Yeah.

0:19:390:19:42

We just got up there, took our check and went home!

0:19:420:19:45

LAUGHTER

0:19:450:19:47

And they're asking you, are they, to sort of teach them how to do it?

0:19:470:19:50

-I thought that was water!?

-It is water.

0:19:500:19:53

LAUGHTER

0:19:530:19:54

Yes. Yes, they said... Have a sip of that.

0:19:540:19:59

-You got lucky.

-LAUGHTER

0:20:020:20:05

-Well, I worked this morning.

-That's right.

0:20:050:20:08

But let's go back and talk about Fred Astaire because, as I mentioned

0:20:080:20:12

in my introduction, you're the two great giants of the film musical.

0:20:120:20:15

What, in fact, was the basic difference between the two of you?

0:20:150:20:19

Well, there's a great difference between the two of us.

0:20:190:20:22

One of the reasons, I guess, for our friendship

0:20:220:20:26

is that we often get together and talk about it

0:20:260:20:29

over dinner or a drink or something. And...

0:20:290:20:33

Fred started dancing in vaudeville at a very early age

0:20:330:20:36

with his sister, Adele.

0:20:360:20:38

As a matter of fact, he was very popular here in England.

0:20:380:20:41

And they danced in musical comedies long before talking pictures.

0:20:410:20:46

And Adele ran off and married

0:20:460:20:49

an English lord or a count or someone like that.

0:20:490:20:53

-I think it was the Earl of Cavendish, wasn't it?

-That's right. It was.

0:20:530:20:57

And here Fred was all alone,

0:20:570:20:59

so they sent him out to Hollywood to go into talking pictures.

0:20:590:21:02

And his first partner was Joan Crawford.

0:21:020:21:06

And... Then he latched onto Ginger Rogers.

0:21:060:21:11

And they had a successful career of I don't know how many years.

0:21:110:21:15

But they were really the stars of the American film

0:21:150:21:18

and they represented American dance.

0:21:180:21:21

But Fred's success, I believe, was his elegance,

0:21:210:21:26

his particular style which was unique - nobody can really dance like him.

0:21:260:21:31

And when I wanted to dance,

0:21:310:21:36

I started on the Broadway Theatre a couple of decades later.

0:21:360:21:40

And I wanted to dance like Marlon Brando wanted to act.

0:21:400:21:44

Roll up my sleeves and say, "Hey..." LAUGHTER

0:21:440:21:48

If there is a difference,

0:21:480:21:51

I would categorise it as saying...

0:21:510:21:54

Let's see how I can put it succinctly,

0:21:540:21:57

that Fred is sort of... He represents the aristocracy when he dances.

0:21:570:22:04

And I represent the proletariat.

0:22:040:22:06

LAUGHTER AND APPLAUSE

0:22:060:22:09

Up the rebels!

0:22:090:22:11

I was going to ask you about the first act that you ever did

0:22:130:22:16

when you went on stage with your brother.

0:22:160:22:19

Well, my brother taught me to tap dance.

0:22:190:22:22

Because we were going to speakeasies, which existed until 1932.

0:22:220:22:27

And we'd go to amateur nights

0:22:270:22:29

where they'd hold the handkerchief over your head

0:22:290:22:31

and whoever got the most applause got the five dollars.

0:22:310:22:35

The next was three, and the next two.

0:22:350:22:38

Of course, if you were in an Italian neighbourhood

0:22:380:22:41

you knew the accordion player would get the five dollars.

0:22:410:22:44

No matter what he played!

0:22:440:22:46

Miss the notes, he'd hit the wrong key - he'd get the five dollars.

0:22:460:22:50

So, if we'd see the accordion player, nothing happened...

0:22:500:22:55

But we'd... That's where we got our training.

0:22:550:22:58

My brother taught me to tap dance very quickly

0:22:580:23:01

and we formed this poor little act.

0:23:010:23:03

And then we tried to improve on it and we put on roller skates.

0:23:030:23:07

And we were gymnasts. We were on a gymnastic team in high school.

0:23:070:23:11

And we did a tap dance on roller skates,

0:23:110:23:13

and we were foolish enough to put acrobatics into it,

0:23:130:23:17

which I would never do today, you see.

0:23:170:23:20

But, in fact, that background, you put some of it into a film, didn't you?

0:23:200:23:23

-I did that in a film, yes.

-In It's Always Fair Weather.

0:23:230:23:26

-We've got that clip with us now.

-Oh, you have? I'd love to see that.

0:23:260:23:29

It's one of my favourite sequences.

0:23:290:23:31

It just shows how good That's Entertainment Part I was

0:23:310:23:34

because, in fact, it wasn't in that.

0:23:340:23:35

It's one of my favourite sequences of all-time. Let's have a look.

0:23:350:23:39

APPLAUSE

0:24:460:24:50

You've...

0:24:550:24:57

-You've got to be a little nutty to do that.

-I think so!

0:24:570:25:01

Everybody always says to me,

0:25:010:25:03

"Of course, the wheels were locked on those skates."

0:25:030:25:06

I'm going, "Bzzzz..."

0:25:060:25:10

I say... I don't know how they look at the film and say that.

0:25:100:25:13

-It's beautiful, that. Super.

-Thank you.

0:25:130:25:16

-Did you ever fall down when you were rehearsing that?

-No.

0:25:160:25:20

No, those steps were easier than the ones I did with my brother,

0:25:200:25:24

-so there was no problem.

-Easier?

0:25:240:25:27

Yes, because we used to do backflips and things.

0:25:270:25:31

As I grew older and more mature, you see, I kept that out.

0:25:310:25:34

You danced with a mouse and all kinds of... Some kids you performed with.

0:25:340:25:38

But once you also danced with Francis Albert Sinatra, didn't you?

0:25:380:25:42

Yes.

0:25:420:25:45

-Would you say he was...?

-He danced with Eugene Curran Kelly, yes!

0:25:450:25:48

LAUGHTER

0:25:480:25:50

What was...? Were there any special problems involved

0:25:520:25:55

-in teaching Mr Sinatra how to dance?

-Yes...

0:25:550:25:59

LAUGHTER AND APPLAUSE

0:25:590:26:02

First, he was...

0:26:040:26:06

He didn't know how to dance - that was the first problem.

0:26:060:26:09

But he was very good at rhythm.

0:26:090:26:13

And he had had two pictures that didn't go down well

0:26:130:26:17

that he had done at another studio.

0:26:170:26:20

So, he came to me and asked me if I'd work with him on it.

0:26:200:26:24

I told him he'd have to really work like a boxer, prizefighter, every day.

0:26:240:26:30

And, after about a week, he became a bit recalcitrant

0:26:300:26:34

because I'd make him do the same thing over and over again.

0:26:340:26:37

But he got quite good.

0:26:370:26:39

And then, of course, I would do things that were within his range.

0:26:390:26:43

I wouldn't give him exactly what I'd give Igor Youskevitch, you know.

0:26:430:26:48

But he became quite adept and a very good partner.

0:26:480:26:54

And, of course, he was very good for me, and I'm very grateful to him

0:26:540:26:59

because when I'd work with someone like Francis Albert,

0:26:590:27:02

or Judith Garland... LAUGHTER

0:27:020:27:07

..or Judy, see, they would sing the ballads in the show,

0:27:070:27:12

and I wouldn't have to sing the ballad, I would sing the... # I got rhythm... #

0:27:120:27:16

I could sing the song and dance man stuff.

0:27:160:27:19

-So, it was very good for me to work with them.

-Yes.

0:27:190:27:22

But occasionally I would get stuck with a ballad,

0:27:220:27:27

when the other person wasn't a good ballad singer.

0:27:270:27:30

That's when I appreciated Francis Albert the most!

0:27:300:27:34

In fact, you're selling yourself short,

0:27:340:27:36

because I remember the film Cover Girl.

0:27:360:27:38

-You sang a beautiful Kern number, Long Ago And Far Away...

-Yeah, I had to sing the ballad!

0:27:380:27:43

..which is a beautiful song.

0:27:430:27:45

Well, Mr Kern was known for his, erm, sternness on Broadway,

0:27:450:27:51

and I had just come from the theatre a short time ago,

0:27:510:27:55

and Kern and I, or Gershwin, had written this song, and...

0:27:550:28:00

..I was ready to record it.

0:28:020:28:04

And in those days they put you in a glass booth,

0:28:040:28:07

and the orchestra was over there,

0:28:070:28:08

and I didn't know how to do that, to begin with.

0:28:080:28:12

But I had learned the song,

0:28:120:28:14

and just before we were going to take it, in walked Mr Kern.

0:28:140:28:17

He sat down on a chair like this. Well, I was scared to death!

0:28:170:28:22

I was shaking. I thought he'd, y'know, say, "Throw that bum out!"

0:28:220:28:28

So I come out and I said, "Well, Mr Kern, I can do better than that.

0:28:280:28:31

"Next take, you'll see, Mr Kern, I'll do much better."

0:28:310:28:34

He said, "What? That's fine!"

0:28:340:28:36

And years later, I thought to myself,

0:28:360:28:38

"Well, he expected much worse!"

0:28:380:28:41

LAUGHTER

0:28:410:28:43

Frank Sinatra says, actually, about working with you

0:28:430:28:46

in this excellent book that Clive Hirschhorn's written about you,

0:28:460:28:50

he said that you paid him the ultimate compliment

0:28:500:28:52

after eight weeks of working with him.

0:28:520:28:54

"Francis, you've worked your way up from being lousy to adequate."

0:28:540:28:58

LAUGHTER

0:28:580:28:59

Well, if he said that to Clive, who's in the audience, I know,

0:29:010:29:05

because I passed him coming in, it must be true.

0:29:050:29:08

You're very much a perfectionist.

0:29:080:29:10

I mean, it shows in your work that we see on screen.

0:29:100:29:12

Would you say that you're a difficult man to work with?

0:29:120:29:15

Any dancer has to be a perfectionist,

0:29:150:29:17

because if a dancer gets up and dances across the stage

0:29:170:29:21

and stumbles or falls, he's a bum.

0:29:210:29:23

If a singer hits a high note, he laughs and he goes right on,

0:29:230:29:27

or he says, "Whoops! It's not on the cue card!"

0:29:270:29:30

-You can't dance off a cue card.

-Yeah.

0:29:300:29:33

You have to dance, you have to know the dance.

0:29:330:29:35

And the music keeps on going, you can't make it up.

0:29:350:29:38

If you make a slip, you can't say, "Whoops, let's start again."

0:29:380:29:41

So, if a dancer falls or stumbles

0:29:410:29:44

or makes a bad move or a ghost gesture of any kind,

0:29:440:29:48

he's out of luck.

0:29:480:29:49

So, you have to be highly disciplined.

0:29:490:29:51

I think the dancer is as highly disciplined as the...

0:29:510:29:57

..symphony orchestra player,

0:29:580:30:00

who has to take the conductor's beat right away.

0:30:000:30:04

-Mm.

-Except he's sitting down all the time.

0:30:040:30:06

A dancer has to work with his body.

0:30:060:30:08

Was there anything left unfulfilled after your career in Hollywood,

0:30:080:30:13

anything that you wanted to do with the film dance

0:30:130:30:16

that you didn't manage to do?

0:30:160:30:17

No. When the bottom dropped out of the musical comedy "market" again,

0:30:180:30:24

to use the Hollywood term...

0:30:240:30:26

Because when Elvis Presley and the Beatles and other groups

0:30:260:30:31

took over the record business,

0:30:310:30:34

records became more profitable...

0:30:340:30:37

..than making movies or doing plays.

0:30:400:30:43

If you do a movie now or a play now and you have a hit album,

0:30:430:30:48

-you'll make more money off the album than you make from the show.

-Yes.

0:30:480:30:53

And there's no use complaining about it. It's one of the facts of life.

0:30:530:30:58

And the statistics, I think, are

0:30:580:31:01

85% of the records sold in America now,

0:31:010:31:04

and I believe it's around the world, are sold to...

0:31:040:31:09

..9-, 10-, 11-, 12-, 13-, 14-year-old groups.

0:31:100:31:14

And they buy the rock and the country and western records.

0:31:140:31:19

And they account for 85% of the records sold,

0:31:190:31:22

so naturally they want to push them.

0:31:220:31:26

It's true they don't last very long.

0:31:260:31:28

One group comes up and dies, one group comes up and dies,

0:31:280:31:31

but they sell a great amount of records.

0:31:310:31:34

And we as adults,

0:31:340:31:38

our musical listening habits

0:31:380:31:41

are formed by 12-year-olds, whether we like it or not.

0:31:410:31:46

Mine aren't.

0:31:460:31:47

Well, then you must go home and lock yourself in,

0:31:470:31:50

cos if you get in the car and turn on your radio, you'll hear rock music.

0:31:500:31:56

And some of it's very good. I'm afraid that most of it's...

0:31:560:32:01

..the bands are electronically produced

0:32:020:32:05

and they use about three chords,

0:32:050:32:07

and most of it's not very good. But some is very good, yes...

0:32:070:32:11

as some of anything is good.

0:32:110:32:13

But what's interesting is that if you,

0:32:130:32:16

who've written your own chapter in the history of movies,

0:32:160:32:20

if you were starting out now, as the young Gene Kelly,

0:32:200:32:23

what on earth would you do?

0:32:230:32:25

-I'd try to do the same thing.

-But could you, you see?

0:32:250:32:28

Well, I never meant to be a movie actor.

0:32:280:32:32

I went to Broadway to be a choreographer.

0:32:320:32:35

But if I went to be a choreographer,

0:32:350:32:37

I'd do the dance that was in style, I guess,

0:32:370:32:40

-or try to create my own dance and make a style out of it.

-Mm.

0:32:400:32:44

-I think I'd do the same thing, but who knows?

-Yes.

0:32:440:32:47

Do you have, when you look back...

0:32:470:32:48

Are there any parts that you missed in your movie career,

0:32:480:32:52

any musicals that you wanted to do,

0:32:520:32:54

were scheduled for and didn't do them?

0:32:540:32:56

Uh, nothing that I was scheduled for.

0:32:560:32:59

-Yes, I was scheduled for one called Guys And Dolls.

-Really?

0:32:590:33:02

Sam Goldwyn wanted to borrow me from MGM,

0:33:020:33:06

but Nicholas Schenck, the head of MGM, had a feud on with him

0:33:060:33:10

and wouldn't lend me out to him.

0:33:100:33:12

You see, they loaned out players like baseball or football players.

0:33:120:33:17

We were all in a contract.

0:33:170:33:19

So, that was the only one I really wanted to do.

0:33:190:33:21

-That was the Brando part, presumably, was it?

-Yes.

0:33:210:33:23

And Sam was very honest.

0:33:230:33:25

He said he'd wait three months and if he didn't get me

0:33:250:33:28

then he would get the best actor and make it more of an acting part.

0:33:280:33:32

Yes.

0:33:320:33:34

Damn. But one film you did make which I suppose is...

0:33:340:33:39

I don't know, it's your trademark now, isn't it?

0:33:390:33:41

-..was Singin' In The Rain, which is...

-I guess so, yes.

0:33:410:33:46

I mean, I play it over and over again. I've got it on tape.

0:33:460:33:49

And I think it's flawless as a musical comedy.

0:33:490:33:53

-I think it's absolutely beautiful.

-I think it's a film that might last.

0:33:530:33:58

LAUGHTER

0:33:580:34:00

-No, I'm serious!

-It'll last for ever.

-Very few films last.

0:34:000:34:04

They date. They date themselves.

0:34:040:34:07

But what's good about Singin' In The Rain is that it's all true.

0:34:070:34:10

-All of that happened.

-Really?

-Yes!

0:34:100:34:13

When the studios turned over into sound, all of that happened.

0:34:130:34:19

-All of those incidents are true.

-Those lovely Jean Hagen things.

0:34:190:34:22

They're all true. They're all true.

0:34:220:34:24

It was beautiful.

0:34:240:34:26

# I'm dancin'...

0:34:300:34:32

# ..and singin'...

0:34:320:34:34

# ..in the rain. #

0:34:340:34:39

APPLAUSE

0:34:480:34:50

And that's Hollywood!

0:34:590:35:01

Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd

0:35:120:35:14

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