The Leader, His Driver and the Driver's Wife

Left, right, left! Left.

Left, right, left!

Newcastle, Natal, South Africa.

I'm waiting for Eugene Terre Blanche,

leader of the AWB, the white supremacist party in South Africa

which is preparing itself for war against the blacks.

It had been a fairly frustrating week.

The leader just didn't seem to be interested in meeting us

and its press liaison officers said I looked like a Turk

and should be put in the coloured section of town.

A major power base for the AWB is the support

and help it receives from the army, police and security forces.

UPBEAT MARCHING MUSIC

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

CROWD, IN AFRIKAANS PRONUNCIATION: AWB! AWB! AWB! AWB!

AWB! AWB! AWB!

AWB! AWB! AWB! AWB!

AWB! AWB!

AWB! AWB!

APPLAUSE AND WHISTLING

LAUGHTER AND APPLAUSE

AUDIENCE LAUGHS

AUDIENCE LAUGHS

CONTINUES SPEAKING IN AFRIKAANS

THUD

Barry, my cameraman was hit to the floor by one of the supporters.

Terre Blanche's driver saw it happening from the stage

and out of sympathy offered to arrange an interview for us with the leader.

We drove from Newcastle in the south-east of South Africa

to Ventersdorp, a small town in the Transvaal

where the leader has his headquarters.

There was a news report that day of 50 AWB members

armed with shotguns, knives and pick handles

attacking black mine workers returning to the surface.

The AWB are objecting to blacks being employed on certain shifts.

Hello?

Oh, I'm sorry. Mr Terre Blanche waited for you about a quarter

and then he said you would have to make another appointment to see him.

-Mr Blanche came back?

-Yes.

-When should we have a meeting?

-Um...

Um, you'll have to make another appointment, to see him. Um...

Um, I think you can call Mr Meyer this afternoon.

-Have you got his number?

-I've got his number.

-So I'll try and make another appointment with him?

-Yes, yes, I think so. Yes.

I'm sorry.

'JP Meyer, the leader's driver,

'lives in this street in the house next to the leader's.

'I learned he'd only come out of prison last week

'because of his involvement with Piet Rudolph,

'South Africa's most wanted white terrorist.'

Why don't we let you get up?

-Just come and have a seat here, I'll be up in a few seconds.

-All right.

-Sorry to wake you.

-That's OK, you're welcome.

Look, shall we come back in half an hour? Or an hour?

-What time is it now?

-About 4:30.

-Well, I told you four o'clock, man.

-Please come in.

-We'll come back in an hour.

-OK.

-All right?

Don't photograph me, you bastard!

BARKING AND WHIMPERING

These are the leader's dogs

and this is the closest we've got to the leader since we've arrived.

UPBEAT MUSIC PLAYS

'We finally agreed to meet the leader

'at a barbecue being given in our honour.

'Johann, one of the town councillors, was host -

'largely, I think, because he was taken by the blonde hair,

'blue eyes and Aryan looks of my assistant, Rita.'

What do you people expect to get here?

I don't know, we're just looking.

No, but you people left home, you climb on the aeroplane,

then you travel 14 hours to South Africa.

What did you people expect to get here, eh? People wearing pants?

Good people.

-So the Queen of England...

-'JP, the leader's driver, was there too

'only he'd shaved his beard off since we had last seen him.'

And you're my brother, you've got the same colour as what I've got.

-You were made to the image of God.

-What colour?

-White.

Or do you think the image of God is my face or your face?

If you read the Bible, what do you say, what is the image of God?

-Well, tell me.

-It's our colour.

This white uniform that God gave us to wear.

This is the image of God, the white colour. We are special people.

Even if you don't realise it, you'll realise it in the end.

You might not realise it now but you are part of my people.

-Don't you believe that?

-I don't know, I haven't...

You should come to South Africa more often, man. I'll convert you.

'There was still no sign of the leader.

'I asked Johann, the town councillor, where he was.'

I don't know. I really don't know.

'We were making slow progress. I was asked if I wanted

'to interview the fugitive Piet Rudolph for 5,000

'but I was still no closer to the leader.

'I was reduced to pleading to ride with the leader to his next meeting

'in the hope I could ask a couple of questions on the way.'

-In the car?

-Yeah.

-I told you the leader won't allow it.

He said, no way. Not a chance.

I just wanted to show you driving and...

There's nothing to driving a car that needs filming. Is there?

Do we drive differently to the people in your country?

Goodbye.

A report came through from Cape Town of AWB supporters

badly beating three young black children

and five black schoolteachers as they were leaving a swimming pool.

The AWB has vowed to keep the pool for whites only.

We were on the outskirts of Pretoria when we discovered

we weren't going to be able to get our interview with Pete Rudolph.

Good evening. One of South Africa's most wanted fugitives,

right winger Piet Rudolph, has been arrested in Pretoria.

Rudolph, known as "Piet Skiet", was wanted for questioning

in connection with the theft of a quantity of arms and ammunition

from a defence force base in Pretoria.

Law and Order Minister Adriaan Vlok said Rudolph

had been arrested in Paul Kruger Street in Wonderboom this afternoon.

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

AWB, AWB, AWB!

'People are stunned by Piet Rudolph's arrest.

'The leader recites a poem about the death of the 27,000 Boer women

'and children in the British concentration camps.'

RECITES AFRIKAANS POETRY

'Now that Piet Rudolph was arrested,

'JP was terrified that he would be put back in prison.

'Piet Rudolph had promised he would kill himself

'rather than testify against his collaborators in the AWB.'

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

-Good morning. My, but you're early.

-'This is the driver's wife, Anita.'

-Is JP still here?

-Yes, he's sleeping.

-He's only going to the office a little bit later.

-Oh, I see.

-So he's not going to disappear or anything?

-No, I don't think so.

I hope not so.

Because last night, JP said he thought he might have to...

Yes, he's a bit frightened at the moment and I think he's nervous

but I talked to him last night

and said he must think properly about things.

About me and the kids staying alone at home and things like that, you know?

So what do you think he'll...?

I don't know.

I think he'll think about it today and then make a decision.

But I can't really decide for him and I can't do anything.

I must take what he's doing. I'm used to that.

Yeah, because we thought he might be going halfway through the night yesterday.

Oh. No, no. Would you like to see him? He's still in bed.

-You can come and see him.

-He's probably asleep, is he?

-Yes.

-Maybe we should let him sleep.

-Or shall we have a quick look?

-Yeah, just to be sure he is there!

'There was an announcement in the paper that day

'that Piet Rudolph intended to go on hunger strike.'

I'm quite upset because he's the best human being in the whole world.

And...looks to me like he's going to become the second Bobby Sands,

or the South African Bobby Sands, as the newspaper says.

CHILD SPEAKS IN AFRIKAANS

What did you admire so much about him?

His whole personality.

He's not really a criminal, he's just a guy that loves his volk and his country.

Do you think he'll go through with a hunger strike?

Oh, yes, he'll carry through with it. Definitely.

What will you do if they come to arrest you again?

They won't arrest me again. I won't allow them, they'll have to kill me.

I'm sleeping with a Luger right next to me.

Would you seriously use it?

Yes, I don't think I'll try seriously to kill somebody

but I'll definitely make a lot of noise and force them to shoot me.

That I'd do.

'We were hoping to see the leader later that morning.

'In the meantime, we accompanied Anita, JP's wife,

'who works as a health visitor.'

Somebody's calling us along the road.

THEY CHAT IN NATIVE DIALECT

Just hold the line. Condoms.

'Her chief concerns are sterilisation

'and the distribution of condoms.'

THEY CHAT FURTHER

All right.

'That week in Anita's area, they manage to sterilise 60 women.

'We were due to have a meeting with the lead at 11am.

'I had been advised not to ask the leader

'any direct personal questions and to drop or rephrase any questions

'that he took obvious exception to.

'Apparently, he was particularly sensitive about questions

'about his relationship with Jani Allan, the gossip columnist,

'and to reports that week that three members of the AWB executive

'in the Cape had emptied their guns into a black bus,

'killing seven and wounding 20.'

-Hello, good morning.

-Good morning, can I help?

Yes, we've come to do our interview with Mr Terre Blanche.

Oh, he's in a...meeting.

-He's in a meeting?

-Yes.

Oh.

-He didn't leave a message about us coming here?

-No, no. No message.

So this is Mr Terre Blanche here.

This might be the closest we'll ever get to Mr Terre Blanche.

DOG SNARLS AGRESSIVELY

'Things weren't going much better back in town.'

SINGING IN AFRIKAANS

'We'd been trying for weeks to get permission to film

'at the APK breakaway church which is still exclusively white

'and that all members of the AWB belong to,

'but just couldn't get through the door.'

So, what are you busying with?

We were just getting some shots of the people outside.

Yes, but you haven't got any permission to do this, or what?

I thought we were allowed to film outside but we couldn't film inside?

No, I don't think it's...

No, I think we'd rather leave it alone because we must first

go into this case and see what it's all about, you know?

-Which case?

-This filming of the building and...

'At the golf club I was shouted at for being a Communist

'and an ANC sympathiser and refused a drink at the bar.'

-Good morning.

-Can I help you?

-We asked you before...

No, we said this is a private place, no photos, no nothing. Please.

-I'm sorry, I thought you said that we could film here.

-No.

RHYTHMIC MARCHING CHANT

'At the school we were told to write to Pretoria

'and when we tried to film the girls behind the matching band...'

You can't film here.

Excuse me?

You have no... You have... We have to...

'Johann, the town councillor, the richest man in town,

'owns a diamond mine and a tractor business by the black township.

'He was the only town official prepared to talk to us.'

-What is prettier than a pretty woman?

-RITA: I don't know.

It's a woman who's pretty but is sitting bad.

She looks prettier.

'Johann was trying to talk my assistant Rita into marrying him.

'He and his friend Anton had a special joke for her.'

-Can you understand it?

-What is prettier than a pretty woman?

-I don't know.

-When a pretty woman sits pretty.

-Sits bad, not pretty.

-Oh, bad.

-Ja.

-And she looks prettier.

-I still don't get it.

-You can't get it?

You see, a woman's a pretty thing.

There's nothing prettier than a woman, only one thing is prettier.

-A pretty woman sitting bad...

-Is prettier.

-..is prettier.

'Finally, we were going to meet the leader.

'We were amongst a group of other journalists and photographers,

'a kind of mini press junket organised by the AWB

'at one of their secret commando training camps way out on the veld.

'Originally we were being told that we would have an exclusive,

'but the leader clearly had other ideas.'

-How are you people?

-How do you do?

-Fine. Good to see you again.

Hope you enjoy it.

We're looking forward to watching today.

And tomorrow, as well, isn't it?

-Well, I'm not sure, you'll have to arrange that with the Kommandant.

-OK.

HE SPEAKS IN AFRIKAANS

'I'd been hoping to raise the question of an interview,

'but the leader seemed much too preoccupied

'with the other journalists.'

SHOUTING

We like the atmosphere here. It's quite nice.

All the cattle and the horses together

and all the people together.

Drop the weapon into your hand and let it balance. Like that.

Close the bottom three fingers.

Lay your trigger finger alongside the trigger guard on the frame. OK?

That's your single hand grip. Nice and firm but not too hard.

Right, take it away again.

SHOUTING IN AFRIKAANS

GUN HAMMERS CLICK

'It was at this point that Anita

'nearly cost the leader his life by waving a loaded Luger at him.'

-Whoa, whoa!

-Put that thing away.

-Put it down.

(INAUDIBLE)

-Right?

-Ja.

-OK, that's your beret.

All right, ladies.

Ha, now I'm looking smart, eh?

Not really.

HORSES WHINNEY

'I learned to my horror that Terre Blanche's horse

'had once trampled one of the journalists present underfoot

'cracking several of his ribs

'and leaving him hospitalised for days when he got a bit too close.

'Terre Blanche was also famous for having chased journalists out of his office mid-interview

'if he considered a particular question insulting or stupid.'

HE SPEAKS IN AFRIKAANS

'I was beginning to get slightly desperate now.

'We'd been in South Africa for several weeks

'and I was still no closer to an interview

'than the day I'd arrived.

'This seemed the ideal time to adopt a more direct approach,

'though I have to admit to being quite intimidated by him.'

-Ja?

-Do you think maybe we could do an interview with you later today?

My good friend, I said last week you can have an interview with me

-in my office.

-OK.

-So I let you come to this place.

-OK.

-To see all this.

But why, always when I'm busy

with my people, I do not have the opportunity to see them many times.

-OK, we...

-This is the first time in two years that I see them

so please give me... Let... Take the time to see my people

-and next week in my office officially you'll have your interview, OK?

-OK.

-So you go and take all the shots you want here and then we can discuss it in my office.

-OK.

NEWS JINGLE PLAYS

'I wasn't able to see the leader that week

'because he was in Pretoria

'meeting with the Minister of Law and Order, Adriaan Vlok,

-'about AWB violence.'

-NEWSREADER: Mr Vlok expressed concern about the breaking up

of political meetings and the activities

of the AWB's Boer commandos.

Mr Blanche said at a news conference after the meeting

that the unruly behaviour of people

at National Party meetings was the result of what

he called the government's policy of selling out whites to terrorists,

and if the government wanted to stop such actions,

it should stop the reform process.

'I had the feeling that Anita didn't like the leader very much.'

Yes, in a sense I like him, but he's also very...dominative.

When he tells you to get up, you must get up.

Now, sometimes I'm stubborn.

If he says to me, "Get up," then I'll sit down.

And he tells me to go and fetch something,

I say... I'll tell him that I'm busy now.

-It's just, um...a reaction of mine against...

-Maybe it's good for him.

-Pardon?

-Maybe it's good for him.

For the leader? No, it's not good.

And that's what JP discovered long ago.

It's no use going against him, rather please him

and you'll have a much more comfortable man.

When you go against him, he gets more and more aggravated.

But now I can't help myself.

I'm just stubborn when I'm in his company.

'When the leader returned,

'I decided to employ a more direct paparazzi style.'

-Stop.

-OK, sorry. Sorry.

-When you take photos of me, you have to ask me, OK?

-All right. Sorry.

Now, you've really upset him.

What? Just because we...?

I assumed he didn't mind us taking pictures of him.

'We travelled to Upington on the Namibian border.

'A report came through from the Northern Transvaal

'that AWB members armed with sticks and whips

'attacked 300 black children attending Sunday school.

'At the court hearing, the AWB accused received a standing ovation

'and their bail was raised from public donations.'

APPLAUSE AND CHANTING

SPEAKS IN AFRIKAANS

JP speaks of his admiration for Piet Rudolph.

He appeals to the people to give money for Piet

and all he stands for.

JP believes that Beweg have found a martyr, a man prepared

to starve himself to death for the people and their cause.

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

At the end of the meeting,

supporters rush up to sign on as commandos.

AWB already have several thousand commandos,

trained in semi-automatic weapons, unarmed combat and explosives.

THEY SPEAK AFRIKAANS

'At the time, I had no idea that the leader was illegally advising

'this man to keep his weapons.'

OK, now. I suppose you want to ask me a few questions.

Of course, I want to use this little time to talk to my people.

Do you want to ask a few questions?

-We just wanted to film a little.

-But that is not fair.

Because my people do not know that they are on camera in Britain

when they are not there to defend themselves.

-Would you like us to stop?

-If I want you to stop? Well, I think so.

I think this is a private... It's time when one...

Maybe one or three times per four years I can see my people.

So this is really a private conversation.

I want to chat with my people. And that is not for broadcasting. OK.

CHEERING

The one place we did receive a warm welcome

was from the kids in the township outside Vanderstoep.

Few of them had ever touched white skin.

Kaffir Cat.

Kaffir Cat. Kaffir Cat.

Why do you call it Kaffir Cat?

Because it's black.

Blacks are called Kaffirs here.

So Jani wants to call it Blackie or something like that, so I said,

"No. Every second dog and cat in town that's black are called Blackie."

"Let's be different and call it Kaffir Cat."

So I think it's a marvellous idea.

Tell us, what exactly did JP do with Piet Rudolph?

And why did he go to prison? What did they want from him?

They thought he knew where Piet Rudolph was.

And he did not know where he stayed.

But he just helped him because Mr Rudolph was his good friend

and he was loyal to him.

I mean, I'm also loyal to Mr Rudolph. He's a good man.

What did JP do with Piet Rudolph?

Now he...

He introduced him to the people who know how to work explosives.

Piet Rudolph and them come to an agreement...

to blow up Melrose House.

But JP wasn't pleased. He had nothing to do with it, really,

other than introducing Mr Rudolph to those people.

JP's houseboy is cleaning the BMW with the three sevens number plate.

The Biblical three sevens are the AWB's adopted emblem and insignia.

So, JP, what does the triple seven stand for on the car?

It's a normal registration number.

I thought the triple seven had a significance.

It has a significance.

Don't you think it's beautiful having a registration number like that?

-Explain it to us.

-There's not much to explain.

-You want me to explain the sevens or the registration number?

-The sevens.

Well, the sevens are the sevens of God.

Comes out of the Bible. Right through the Bible, you read about seven.

God created Earth in seven days. He created man on the seventh day.

He actually rested on the seventh day,

man was created on the sixth day.

We took it as our sign.

It's the antipole of the triple sixes of the Antichrist.

What kinds of people do you think are Antichrists?

Satan and his disciples.

Anybody that works with Satan.

And, of course, the international money power.

They are working in his hand.

Who are "they"?

-Just look around. Who owns Chase Manhattan Bank?

-Who does?

Well, it's the... Rothschilds and the Rockefellers.

And the Oppenheimers of the world.

Have you ever read the book

called The Illuminati And The CFR Conspiracy?

Do yourself a favour and get hold of that book.

The Terre Blanche interview

had developed into some ridiculous kind of game.

We once again arrived

for an appointment to find he'd gone to yet another meeting.

At least this time, though, we'd gotten into his office

and were able to poke around in some of the leader's memorabilia.

A picture of the leader as a policeman in the South African police force

that had been used as a recruiting poster at the time.

Terre Blanche, the poet and writer, whose play in Afrikaans

about the Boer people and their struggle against thirst and hunger

was compulsory reading in the school syllabus for children in Natal.

Terre Blanche the private man whose nine-year-old daughter

is rarely allowed out to play with other children for security reasons.

Portraits of the original Boer generals who fought

the British from 1899 to 1902 look on across the room, and almost silently witnessed

the destruction of Terre Blanche's political career when he was found

on the steps of the Paardekraal Monument with Jani Allan,

a former model turned journalist.

After their first meeting, Jani referred to the leader as Ramboer

and wrote, "He doesn't walk into a room, he takes occupation of it.

"Things shrink, the roomscape insidiously rearranges itself

"so that he becomes the focal point.

"He speaks with a rich earth-brown voice, sometimes the texture

"of a newly ploughed field,

"sometimes it's a caress of warm corduroy.

"Right now, I've got to remind myself to breathe.

"I'm impaled on the blue flames of his blowtorch eyes."

Jani Allan left South Africa after a bomb exploded in her apartment.

Johan the town councillor is particularly concerned

that black men are starting to have sex with white women.

What about AIDS in this country? Tell him about AIDS.

-AIDS in this country...

-They've got millions here.

-The blacks...

I've got something in mind.

I've got a paper to show you. They used it the other day.

There is always 20 or 30, or 120,000 blacks that's got AIDS.

But the next day, I don't know where it came from,

I still want to find out, next week,

they talk about 1.5 million who's got AIDS.

-Now.

-Where is apartheid?

-Where is apartheid now?

Since apartheid disappeared, with FW de Klerk,

-we've got all the bloody AIDS.

-We'll die.

-It's unreal, man.

-We'll die.

We will die all of AIDS. We can't mix. We can't mix.

Like I tell you one thing, people,

the whole world is crying for the blacks.

The next thing is, I'm a Christian, I've got the Bible.

I've got the Bible. And I believe in my Bible, I read my Bible.

Before the world is going to disappear, through fire,

AIDS is going to take 80% of the world's population.

And 20% of that is going to survive.

I won't say 20%, I'm not sure, I'm not Christ.

I just make a statement to this.

And I can tell you one thing, that few people who's going to be left

is going to be Christians, and they're going to start

a whole new, decent world, without Mandela and de Klerk.

-Let me tell you that tonight.

-AIDS will help us.

AIDS is going to kill all the kaffirs.

Yeah, we don't want to mix.

We don't want to mix because AIDS will kill all the blacks.

And we're going to survive.

And when we are separate, apartheid was the word, what do you call it?

-We will survive.

-You're going to survive.

-Yeah.

The blacks is going for the white woman now in South Africa.

-And this is where the war's going to start.

-Yeah, I'm telling you.

-This is not Rhodesia.

-I know Rhodesia.

You know what's going to happen here? Did you ever see bullets fly?

Did you ever see it? This is what's going to...

I've got three daughters.

One is 15, one is just under 14, one is just under 12.

And I tell you one thing, if a black ever tries to touch my daughter,

I don't care who's in charge of the government, or the police,

I'll shoot the whole lot out.

Fire. Little.

So, he's going to be a gunmen yet?

I think anybody likes to play with a gun, balance or something like that.

He's just a natural boy.

'A couple of hours later, Yanni shot Terre Blanche's daughter,

'which went down less well.'

WALTZ

'It was the AWB annual dinner, being held at a golf club near Sun City.

'There was trouble down on the Cape,

'and JP had gone out alone to sort things out.

'I asked to go too, but all I got from him was that he was

'going to recruit commandos for the AWB rally on Paul Kruger Day.

'The leader was there with his wife,

'and General DeWitt, an ex-chief of police.

'At the other end of the table was Anita,

'and the leader's nine-year-old daughter.

'They all love Bruce Springsteen.'

# I'm just living in a dump like this

# Something happening somewhere

# Baby, I just know where it is

# I can't start a fire

# I can't start a fire with a broken heart

# This gun's for hire

# Even if we're just dancing in the dark

# Even if we're just dancing in the dark

# Hey, baby

# Even if we're just dancing in the dark. #

'A couple of days later.'

-Oh, hi, JP, it's Nick.

-'How are you?'

-I'm fine.

I was just calling up to see if it might be possible

to interview the leader today?

'If you just hold on, I'll find out for you.'

'Nick, 12.15.'

'The leader interview saga continued.

'I arrived ten minutes late for a 12.15 appointment

'to discover the leader had left in anger.

'I was told to come back again at 6.30pm.'

Hi.

-We came to try and do an interview.

-For the leader?

-Yeah.

-He left.

Oh, God. Let's just stop.

Come inside.

I'm glad it's not me

-having an interview with Mr Terre Blanche tonight.

-Why?

You upset him terribly.

We were there waiting half an hour from six to 6.30.

And what about this afternoon?

And this afternoon, we were there at 12.15, and at one o'clock.

HE TALKS AFRIKAANS

'JP and Anita ended up getting caught in the crossfire

'between us and the leader.

'A considerable amount of anger had been directed at JP that day.'

I've had more shit than I could handle today.

So I'm glad it's you having the interview, and not me.

He said, OK, for my part,

he's willing to see you at seven o'clock tonight.

At the office. He'll be there. I'll take him there.

I'll take you there, too, so as I see that you are all there together.

-But I've had enough now.

-Have you?

-I really have.

I think if he's not happy about being interviewed by someone,

it's not going to be a happy occasion, he shouldn't do it.

-Don't you want to do it?

-I want to do it, but I want to do it...

Well, then you better do it on his terms, friend.

Mr Terre Blanche, I'm very sorry that we were ten minutes late.

I'm not making a movie. I'm not making a film.

I'm preparing my people for a fight.

-Don't do it to me again.

-Well, we won't...

Yes, you won't, because you will have tonight what you're looking for,

and then you'll go out.

They'll move out. So, let's finish it.

And stop it.

Mr Terre Blanche, I'm very sorry that we were ten minutes late.

Oh... (HE MUMBLES)

Stop it. I'm not accepting your apologising. You were late.

And I listened to that man, Mr Meyer, he said to you,

"If you are late, no interview!"

Yet you chose to be late.

If I'm not so important that you are on time here,

why the hell was it discussed with you, anything?

Where were you?

Where were you, the time when you should be arrived at my place?

Where were you?

Well, I think we were actually five minutes late...

Yes, five minutes is enough, man.

Where were you then at 12.15? Tell me!

I heard him...

At that stage, I was busy with a meeting, and I hear him say,

"If you are late, stop it."

So I ran from the City Hall to the office, and you were not here.

I was on time, that you were late.

Well, we were then told to come back at one, which we did.

That is not the point, the point is you were late.

Who are so important, that you people were late, tell me?

Well, we then came back at six...

-No, who were so important that you were late?

-We were five minutes late.

Who was so important that you were five minutes late? Tell me.

Give me the name of the man, he must be a hell of an important man.

-Who was it?

-I think we were just actually, were we getting some tea?

Well, that's good. Tea and dinner is better than a man.

I thought you used up my time for somebody else.

Well, all we can do is say that we are sorry,

we waited a lot today to try and interview you...

You can't do anything, my good friend.

Nothing. I will always remember it.

This is the heartland. This is Africa.

And I am a Boer.

And I will never accept that, because I will never do it to you.

With my full programme, I will never, ever do it to you,

but yet you did it to me.

What do you want from me?

Well, we wanted to ask you some questions about...

Well, you can ask me questions. Yes.

-What?

-At what point did you decide that it was a war?

When I, when I choose a time.

When I choose a time, I will decide it will be war.

Are you one of my generals?

No, I'm just asking you when you decided it was a war?

Yes, when I decide, it will be a war, I will choose a time.

Are you one of the officers or one of the generals?

So I will not tell you.

But what I can tell you is we will never accept an ANC government

over my people, OK?

Then we will start the war, that day or that night.

But it will be my choice. And as you are not an officer or general...

I think maybe you misunderstood me, what I meant...

No, I've not misunderstood you.

What I meant was, at what time did you decide

you might have to go to war?

When I choose a time. I'm not misunderstanding you.

I will decide when. And that is my choice.

What I was meaning, at what point did you decide

that AWB needed to be formed,

in order to fight a war, if you needed to fight one?

I answered your question already. That is my choice, my good friend.

'JP said it was the worst interview he had ever witnessed.

'I think he then expected us to go back to England,

'but then instead, we went with him to Carletonville,

'a large mining town just 50 miles away.'

AFRICAN MUSIC

-'Good evening.

-Welcome to the news at eight.

'Detained Orde Boerevolk leader Piet Rudolph

'has appealed to members and sympathisers

'of the organisation to hand over illegal weapons to the police.

'In a signed statement, he called on members of the Orde Boerevolk

'to return all the illegal weapons, ammunition and explosives.

'Mr Rudolph said he had ended his hunger strike.

'In the statement he also said he was being treated very well.'

'The AWB was shattered by the news that Piet Rudolf had ended

'his hunger strike, and was calling on them to hand in their arms.

'Terre Blanche recited one of his poems for the occasion.'

RECITES IN AFRIKAANS

'JP was terrified and disillusioned

'by what his friend Piet Rudolph had reportedly done.

'There were rumours that he given away the names

'and addresses of his collaborators.

'Rumours that the government now intended to round up

'the white right.

'Rumours that the AWB was infiltrated by the security police,

'who were just waiting for the right time to strike.

'JP was still making his Piet Rudolf speech,

'still talking about him as the hero of the Boer nation.

'JP didn't want to believe what he was hearing on TV,

'he wanted to believe it was a government conspiracy

'to destroy the right, and to corrupt the spirit of the volk.'

SHOUTS IN AFRIKAANS

APPLAUSE AND CHEERING

-No, please, man. No.

-Please, JP.

-JP...

-Yeah.

Are you kidding us that you're through with AWB, or are you honest?

I'm honest.

Well, what made you decide to stop working for Mr Terre Blanche?

Are you filming me?

-Just be honest, JP.

-Well, I just...

-I just decided to call it a day.

-Why?

-I'm fed up.

-What are you going to do instead?

I'm going to work on the mines.

Come and make yourself at home, I'm just fetching Anita.

But what specifically made you decide to change?

Don't, JP, please, come on. JP!

HORSE NEIGHS

'The leader, meantime, tends to his favourite horse,

'called Bestorm, which in Afrikaans means, "to charge in battle".

'He plans to ride Bestorm at the head of the AWB rally,

'to be held on Paul Kruger's Day.

'The next day, JP's friends from the AWB come round to try

'to get him to change his mind.'

So how are you going to try and persuade JP...

Oh, we'll discuss this later. I don't know yet how.

But if he thinks it's the best belief, I won't stand in his way.

He's not going to leave the AWB.

He's only going to leave his job.

-So these are the ingredients for what?

-For teargas.

That's formalin and Condy's crystals.

-And what do you do with it?

-You mix it together, and you get teargas.

-But beautiful teargas.

-No, that's good teargas.

And do you have a lot of uses for it?

Only to break up NP meetings.

That's all we use it for!

LAUGHTER

That's apart from the genuine teargas that we steal from the Army.

Hey!

-And the police.

-You're piss.

Danny, would you like to catch a shot of this?

HE SPEAKS AFRIKAANS

That's teargas.

-Go, JP.

-Bye-bye.

'JP promised that when his friends left,

'he would explain why he resigned, and what he intends to do.

'I still can't tell whether he's going to reveal

'something quite extraordinary,

'or if he's just enjoying the attention of the camera.

'We've been talking to Johann about getting JP a new job

'and a house away from Terre Blanche.

'And I'm hoping, with enough pushing,

'we are about to watch the transformation

'of a white supremacist into a new South African.'

No, I think you're giving us a kind of party line at the moment.

And that you were going through a real dilemma.

And that you felt very disillusioned,

both with the leader and with Piet Rudolph.

But I don't think you're prepared to talk about that openly.

Look... (HE CLEARS HIS THROAT)

Yesterday, and the day before yesterday, I promised you

that today you could speak to me, and you could ask me anything,

and as far as possible, I'd be honest with you.

When you caught me yesterday and the day before yesterday,

I was really at my weakest.

That's why I didn't want to speak to you.

That's why I made a promise to speak to you today.

So, I can't say I think you really, you shouldn't blame me

-for being dishonest with you.

-No, I'm not blaming you,

I understand what you're really thinking.

You see, any person that goes through this type of thing needs

a few hours with himself to sort out his thoughts,

and I've had the time...

..and as I'm sitting here at the moment, I'm really honest with you.

The things I tell you here, I'm honest, I can promise you that.

That's why I didn't want you to film me yesterday.

-So, what are your feelings about?

-My feelings at the moment,

I've decided to resign, and I'm not sorry about that.

I've resigned from the AWB.

I'm not in their employ any more,

but that doesn't stop me from being a member of the AWB

as an organisation,

and I'll still do my part in the revolution that's coming.

And if all these things they say about Piet Rudolph is true,

then we need somebody to take his place.

And if we couldn't find anybody like that, I'm willing to take his place.

I don't think of myself as great a man as Piet Rudolph,

I'm not saying that.

But at least we need somebody to do the job,

and if it has to fall on me, I'll have to do it.

-I'm honest with you now.

-What kind of things are you prepared...?

Anything that Piet has done up to this moment.

And anything that might pop up in future,

I don't know what will happen.

Like what? Just mention what.

One thing I'm quite sure of, I'd pick my targets better.

What kind of targets would you go for?

Up to this stage, or up to the stage that Piet Rudolph was arrested,

the Boerevolk hasn't really decided yet to kill people.

And I'm not at this moment saying that I might kill people,

but it might just get to that point where we'll have to do that.

What kinds of people would be killed?

Well, the enemies of our volk.

The people that are at the moment they're very busy

-selling out our people.

-Like who?

Well, I can't at the moment think of any names,

but if you want to mention names, maybe people like Vlok, and FW

and Mandela, all the enemies of our volk.

And even people from outside our country

that want to poke their long noses into our affairs.

I'm not sure, I haven't got any targets,

but I feel the climate is beginning to be ripe

for human life to be taken.

-Hey. Put it down.

-Switch off.

-Switch off.

All right, see you!

'For once, the leader was playing and joking around with us.

'He had managed to persuade JP, despite his resolution,

'to play the drums at the enormous AWB rally on Paul Kruger Day.

'The leader was hoping 5,000 people would attend

'and he saw it as a message to the world of his strength and support.

'The leader is in the truck, closely tailed by a security vehicle.

'He is carrying his saddle as he plans to ride into the stadium on his favourite horse.

'And in a press statement, he also said

'he would sleep with his horse in the stables the night before.

'We have agreed to carry JP's drums

'and I'm determined to get the shot that has been refused me

'throughout the film, the leader in a vehicle travelling to one of his meetings.'

Left, left, left, left.

MUSIC: Radetzky March

-Hi, JP.

-Good morning.

-How are you?

-Fine, thank you. Yourself?

Had a nice rest?

THEY SPEAK AFRIKAANS

Ja.

What is he saying?

He wants to show the State President that they would like

their schools to be white.

SHE SPEAKS AFRIKAANS

Ja, he will eat the black when he comes to his school.

-Is that what he said?

-Ja.

-What did the girls say?

CHANTING

Stop it now.

'The 5,000 that the leader had expected didn't show up

'and I heard he was furious.

'I gathered also that his night with his horse in the stables

'hadn't been a great success and part-way through

'he had retreated to the Holiday Inn for more comfortable accommodation.

'To make matters worse, we had shown up late with JP's drum kit

'and the leader blamed us personally for delaying the parade.

'In a particularly animated argument with my assistant Rita,

'he had actually accused us of trying to sabotage the day.'

-Excuse me, Mr Terre Blanche.

-Yes.

-I am sorry about the mix-up.

Listen, my good friend.

This is the last time that one of your people, I don't mind

whether it is a woman or not, be cheeky with me, you understand?

This is my country, this is my place, this is my day here.

And last night I said I don't want you people any more here.

This morning you have to speak to me.

And the first thing you do is take photos.

Before you even ask me if you are welcome or not.

I thought this was a parade...

If you, if you people interfere today again like you did yesterday,

then you... I will put you out, you understand me?

Yesterday, when we came from Ventersdorp,

you even interfered with security.

You passed my car two times and blocked the traffic

so that the head of security cannot even see me.

And you're just taking over. Who the hell do you think are?

We were just trying to get a passing shot...

Listen, I am not working for your bloody company, OK?

So you do the things which I like, not what you people like.

Can you understand me, lady?

You even interfered with security.

My wife and my child was in that bloody car.

So what do you ask now?

-Well, we just want to take the parade, that was all.

-Yes, but...

These... See that you are not in the way of the parade itself.

-You can take some photos. Go on. But don't interfere. Please.

-OK.

And this man, I said in Ventersdorp,

I tell you people when you can take shots from us.

But he's like a bloody monkey.

-He's hanging on that camera like a monkey in a bloody tree.

-He is a monkey.

You are a monkey. He definitely is.

-Hey, monkey, put off that thing.

-OK.

Now you have got something to take to England.

A good argument with me. That is exactly what you wanted.

No, what we wanted to do was just to film the parade,

we wanted to film a passing shot yesterday.

Yesterday? I explained to the lady yesterday.

-OK.

-All right, Jim.

-Follow me.

SHOUTING AND COMMOTION

DRUMMING

APPLAUSE

-JP.

-Yes.

-How are you doing?

-Fine, thank you. Just tired.

So how's the leader today?

-Well, I saw him shutting you out.

-Why's that?

Apparently, he just doesn't like your face today.

I just quickly see if I can find my wife.

Because we've only got ten minutes and I've got to be back again.

'A couple of months later, JP opened a small electrical store.

'The leader's attempts at driving himself proved to be disastrous

'when he and the 777 BMW plunged drunkenly into a river.

'A large number of his supporters left the AWB following the incident.'

Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd