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Russia is about to elect a new president. | 0:00:09 | 0:00:12 | |
There's no doubt who it's going to be. | 0:00:12 | 0:00:14 | |
The same man who has ruled unchecked for the last 18 years. | 0:00:15 | 0:00:19 | |
Now it's classical one-man dictatorship. | 0:00:21 | 0:00:23 | |
That's what always happens with dictators. | 0:00:24 | 0:00:27 | |
You look at Hitler and Stalin, it's always, you know, | 0:00:27 | 0:00:29 | |
step-by-step, step-by-step. | 0:00:29 | 0:00:31 | |
The real Vladimir Putin remains an enigma. | 0:00:31 | 0:00:36 | |
So who is the world's most powerful and feared leader? | 0:00:36 | 0:00:39 | |
We talk to the presidents he has threatened... | 0:00:42 | 0:00:45 | |
He said, "Your friends are making lots of nice promises to you, | 0:00:45 | 0:00:49 | |
"but they never deliver. | 0:00:49 | 0:00:51 | |
"I don't promise you anything nice, but I always deliver." | 0:00:51 | 0:00:54 | |
..the Western leaders whose vulnerability he has exploited... | 0:00:55 | 0:00:59 | |
Putin has invented new kinds of warfare, | 0:00:59 | 0:01:02 | |
which Western countries are still struggling to come to terms with. | 0:01:02 | 0:01:06 | |
What is called this full-spectrum capability. | 0:01:07 | 0:01:10 | |
..and the inner circle of intimates | 0:01:11 | 0:01:14 | |
who made him president in the first place. | 0:01:14 | 0:01:16 | |
Vladimir Putin's psyche | 0:01:30 | 0:01:32 | |
has been forged on the anvil of absolute power. | 0:01:32 | 0:01:35 | |
The consequences for the future of the world are nothing | 0:01:35 | 0:01:38 | |
if not significant. | 0:01:38 | 0:01:39 | |
It's not IF Putin would attack, it's only when and where. | 0:01:39 | 0:01:44 | |
You could take the view that Putin's had long enough, | 0:02:00 | 0:02:03 | |
it's time for somebody else. | 0:02:03 | 0:02:05 | |
Really a time for a change is the root of what you should be saying. | 0:02:05 | 0:02:09 | |
Ksenia Sobchak is one of eight Russian presidential candidates. | 0:02:09 | 0:02:14 | |
Vladimir Putin has been a family friend for decades. | 0:02:14 | 0:02:18 | |
One important goal is to speak to the world, | 0:02:18 | 0:02:22 | |
to make them understand that Russia is not Putin. | 0:02:22 | 0:02:27 | |
She's meeting Lord Bell, one-time Thatcher confidante, | 0:02:27 | 0:02:31 | |
for some strategic advice. | 0:02:31 | 0:02:32 | |
You're a woman, for a start. | 0:02:32 | 0:02:34 | |
That gives you an immediate advantage over Putin | 0:02:34 | 0:02:36 | |
-and every other contestant. -A young woman. | 0:02:36 | 0:02:39 | |
It wasn't true of Thatcher. | 0:02:39 | 0:02:41 | |
Thatcher had never thought of herself as a woman. | 0:02:41 | 0:02:43 | |
THEY LAUGH | 0:02:43 | 0:02:44 | |
-She thought of herself as a politician... -That's true. | 0:02:44 | 0:02:47 | |
I actually met her in Saint Petersburg, you know. | 0:02:47 | 0:02:50 | |
I know you worked with her... | 0:02:50 | 0:02:52 | |
But Sobchak knows her family friend all too well. | 0:02:52 | 0:02:56 | |
He isn't going to allow her to win. | 0:02:56 | 0:02:58 | |
..after elections, | 0:02:58 | 0:02:59 | |
I hope it will be a big result to understand | 0:02:59 | 0:03:02 | |
that chances of winning are quite minimal right now, shall we say. | 0:03:02 | 0:03:06 | |
-But... -But never say that, though, will you? | 0:03:06 | 0:03:09 | |
Yes, I am saying it. | 0:03:09 | 0:03:11 | |
You should always tell people you're going to win. | 0:03:11 | 0:03:13 | |
You want people to vote for you... | 0:03:13 | 0:03:15 | |
But in Russia, you know, people know that Putin will win. | 0:03:15 | 0:03:18 | |
He created the system that allows only him to win, | 0:03:18 | 0:03:22 | |
so the system is unfair. | 0:03:22 | 0:03:24 | |
There were no hints of the future Tsar back in the '70s. | 0:03:47 | 0:03:51 | |
Born to poor parents in a tough suburb, | 0:03:51 | 0:03:53 | |
he fought his way to university and then a lowly KGB post. | 0:03:53 | 0:03:58 | |
But that only lasted as long as the Soviet Union. | 0:03:58 | 0:04:02 | |
In the chaos of the time, | 0:04:48 | 0:04:49 | |
Mayor Anatoly Sobchak needed a tough guy - | 0:04:49 | 0:04:53 | |
and the KGB officer fitted the role perfectly. | 0:04:53 | 0:04:56 | |
From being a grey-faced KGB agent, just a servant | 0:04:59 | 0:05:03 | |
of the state, he becomes a personality, | 0:05:03 | 0:05:06 | |
and so the ego starts to grow. | 0:05:06 | 0:05:09 | |
Struggling to understand the unfolding enigma | 0:05:11 | 0:05:13 | |
of Vladimir Putin, successive world leaders have turned | 0:05:13 | 0:05:17 | |
to one man for answers, a respected authority on power and the mind. | 0:05:17 | 0:05:22 | |
The human brain has a single reward network, | 0:05:22 | 0:05:25 | |
a single feel-good network that gets switched on whenever we feel, | 0:05:25 | 0:05:31 | |
paid a compliment, whenever we have sex, whenever we take cocaine | 0:05:31 | 0:05:36 | |
and whenever we have power and great success. | 0:05:36 | 0:05:39 | |
What happens is you get a surge of intense pleasure | 0:05:40 | 0:05:43 | |
and satisfaction from the stimulus, | 0:05:43 | 0:05:46 | |
but as you repeat that at a higher level, the brain needs more | 0:05:46 | 0:05:49 | |
and more to achieve the same effect. That's called tolerance. | 0:05:49 | 0:05:52 | |
It's an insatiable appetite. | 0:05:54 | 0:05:56 | |
I don't think Putin was born to be an emperor. | 0:05:56 | 0:06:00 | |
His brain was PROFOUNDLY changed by the power he managed to get. | 0:06:00 | 0:06:06 | |
CHEERING AND MUSIC | 0:06:08 | 0:06:10 | |
In the late 1990s post-Soviet Russia was on the brink of collapse. | 0:06:15 | 0:06:20 | |
A drunk president, gang warfare, | 0:06:20 | 0:06:22 | |
robber baron businessmen, openly contemptuous of the rule of law. | 0:06:22 | 0:06:26 | |
Kremlin insiders knew the country needed a saviour. | 0:06:26 | 0:06:30 | |
Any saviour. | 0:06:30 | 0:06:31 | |
The obvious successor to Yeltsin was Deputy Prime Minister Boris Nemtsov, | 0:06:52 | 0:06:57 | |
charismatic, eloquent and principled. | 0:06:57 | 0:07:00 | |
But Yeltsin hated him, after he opposed the Chechen war. | 0:07:00 | 0:07:04 | |
And there was somebody else. | 0:07:05 | 0:07:07 | |
In 1996, Vladimir Putin had come to Moscow | 0:07:07 | 0:07:11 | |
to work in the administration, keeping a low profile. | 0:07:11 | 0:07:16 | |
POLICE SIREN | 0:07:39 | 0:07:41 | |
Gleb Pavlovsky was Boris Yeltsin's spin doctor, | 0:07:53 | 0:07:57 | |
and he was tasked with preparing the succession. | 0:07:57 | 0:07:59 | |
APPLAUSE AND CHEERING | 0:08:44 | 0:08:47 | |
Now he's locked in a bitter legal conflict with Putin's government, | 0:08:53 | 0:08:57 | |
but back in the '90s, | 0:08:57 | 0:08:59 | |
his old dacha neighbour was also a Kremlin insider. | 0:08:59 | 0:09:03 | |
APPLAUSE AND CHEERING | 0:10:12 | 0:10:15 | |
If you're made president, that's one big, big rush. | 0:10:21 | 0:10:25 | |
That is an enormous biological hit to the reward network. | 0:10:27 | 0:10:35 | |
Suddenly, you're no longer just subject to the corporatist | 0:10:37 | 0:10:41 | |
ideology of the communist regime. | 0:10:41 | 0:10:44 | |
That regime is dead. | 0:10:44 | 0:10:45 | |
You're now in charge of a new regime. | 0:10:45 | 0:10:49 | |
That is a rush to the brain. | 0:10:49 | 0:10:52 | |
That is a rush to the brain. | 0:10:52 | 0:10:53 | |
You have not been brought up with the notion | 0:10:55 | 0:10:58 | |
that there are constraints in power. | 0:10:58 | 0:11:00 | |
You know, you've been brought up in a system, | 0:11:00 | 0:11:02 | |
there's no democracy to it. | 0:11:02 | 0:11:04 | |
That ideology has gone, the communist ideology has gone, | 0:11:04 | 0:11:08 | |
so he's left without an ideology. | 0:11:08 | 0:11:09 | |
The ideology he's witnessed in Saint Petersburg | 0:11:11 | 0:11:13 | |
and around him is an ideology of power. | 0:11:13 | 0:11:16 | |
Of power and money. | 0:11:16 | 0:11:18 | |
Putin asked me at that time, | 0:11:32 | 0:11:34 | |
just two days after he became Acting President, he called for me | 0:11:34 | 0:11:39 | |
and offered me position of Prime Minister. | 0:11:39 | 0:11:42 | |
I listed my conditions, | 0:11:42 | 0:11:45 | |
those conditions were just very simple, just like 10, 15 | 0:11:45 | 0:11:50 | |
reforms, which I understood and were absolutely sure Russia badly needed. | 0:11:50 | 0:11:55 | |
And he accepted it. | 0:11:55 | 0:11:57 | |
And the only clamour from his side was just, "Don't step on his field." | 0:11:57 | 0:12:04 | |
On presidential field. | 0:12:05 | 0:12:06 | |
Erm, I... | 0:12:08 | 0:12:10 | |
..decided to accept this. | 0:12:10 | 0:12:12 | |
CAMERAS CLICK | 0:12:12 | 0:12:14 | |
Mr Putin implemented his promises. | 0:12:16 | 0:12:19 | |
He supported all the reforms. | 0:12:19 | 0:12:21 | |
Except one. | 0:12:21 | 0:12:23 | |
Except the reform of gas sector. | 0:12:23 | 0:12:26 | |
APPLAUSE | 0:12:31 | 0:12:33 | |
I first met him early in the year 2000. | 0:12:33 | 0:12:35 | |
He was very much the apprentice leader. | 0:12:35 | 0:12:38 | |
He had been surprised to find himself President of Russia. | 0:12:38 | 0:12:41 | |
When he became president, | 0:12:41 | 0:12:43 | |
everybody in Moscow was saying "Who is this man?" | 0:12:43 | 0:12:45 | |
He had no political background, he'd hardly ever made a political speech. | 0:12:45 | 0:12:49 | |
He was quite nervous. | 0:12:49 | 0:12:51 | |
But also very sharp. | 0:12:51 | 0:12:53 | |
He selected Tony Blair as the first foreign leader that he wished | 0:12:55 | 0:13:00 | |
to meet, because at the time Tony Blair was the pre-eminent | 0:13:00 | 0:13:03 | |
leader in Europe, he was at the height of his popularity | 0:13:03 | 0:13:06 | |
and, in a sense, one felt that Putin was trying | 0:13:06 | 0:13:09 | |
to learn from Tony Blair how to be a political leader. | 0:13:09 | 0:13:13 | |
My impression of this was that he was a guy who was in charge, | 0:13:16 | 0:13:19 | |
who was comfortable in his skin. | 0:13:19 | 0:13:21 | |
And, of course, Tony Blair was the same. | 0:13:23 | 0:13:27 | |
So there was a lot of testosterone around. | 0:13:27 | 0:13:30 | |
You know, Tony, one of the reasons why he was | 0:13:30 | 0:13:33 | |
so successful was he has a very strong sense of who he is | 0:13:33 | 0:13:36 | |
and who he was and also he likes himself and he likes his body. | 0:13:36 | 0:13:39 | |
I mean, neither will thank me for saying this, | 0:13:39 | 0:13:42 | |
but they are actually remarkably similar in many ways. | 0:13:42 | 0:13:46 | |
Putin said, "I want to make Russia a strong state again and I want | 0:13:50 | 0:13:53 | |
"to reconnect it with the West," | 0:13:53 | 0:13:55 | |
and he spent a lot of the next three to four years | 0:13:55 | 0:13:57 | |
trying to get a seat at the top table of world and Western leaders. | 0:13:57 | 0:14:02 | |
Question to President Bush - | 0:14:02 | 0:14:04 | |
is this a man that Americans can trust? | 0:14:04 | 0:14:06 | |
I'll answer the question. I looked the man in the eye, | 0:14:06 | 0:14:09 | |
I found him to be very straightforward and trustworthy. | 0:14:09 | 0:14:13 | |
I was able to... | 0:14:13 | 0:14:15 | |
..erm, get a sense of his soul. | 0:14:15 | 0:14:18 | |
The sight of their president back on the world stage, | 0:14:18 | 0:14:21 | |
his team's success in stabilising the country's battered economy | 0:14:21 | 0:14:25 | |
led to soaring personal approval ratings. | 0:14:25 | 0:14:29 | |
But also a desire for personal compensation. | 0:14:29 | 0:14:32 | |
I never dreamed to become the member of the government, | 0:16:00 | 0:16:05 | |
and actually I was Deputy Minister of Transport, | 0:16:05 | 0:16:08 | |
and that was just coincidentally. | 0:16:08 | 0:16:11 | |
TYPEWRITER CLICKS IN BACKGROUND | 0:16:13 | 0:16:15 | |
INTERVIEWER: You know, the lazy argument in the West | 0:16:18 | 0:16:20 | |
is that you only got these posts | 0:16:20 | 0:16:21 | |
because you were a neighbour of Vladimir Putin. | 0:16:21 | 0:16:24 | |
Er, quite contrary. | 0:16:24 | 0:16:26 | |
Er... | 0:16:28 | 0:16:29 | |
Quite contrary. | 0:16:29 | 0:16:31 | |
At that time he was already in Moscow | 0:16:31 | 0:16:33 | |
and that was a pure invitation | 0:16:33 | 0:16:39 | |
from the Ministry of Transport. | 0:16:39 | 0:16:41 | |
INAUDIBLE | 0:16:43 | 0:16:44 | |
It wasn't only a reward for a job well done. | 0:16:48 | 0:16:51 | |
Ministers' rising compensation | 0:16:51 | 0:16:53 | |
was a reflection of others' vast wealth. | 0:16:53 | 0:16:56 | |
At that time, 46%... | 0:16:58 | 0:17:00 | |
..of entire GDP... | 0:17:02 | 0:17:04 | |
..of Russian Federation | 0:17:04 | 0:17:07 | |
was produced by companies, | 0:17:07 | 0:17:10 | |
privatised companies, | 0:17:10 | 0:17:12 | |
which actually belong to eight families | 0:17:12 | 0:17:17 | |
in Russian Federation. | 0:17:17 | 0:17:19 | |
It is not known. | 0:17:20 | 0:17:22 | |
You are the first to whom I am telling this openly. | 0:17:22 | 0:17:25 | |
And what is the danger of an economy that is controlled by eight people? | 0:17:25 | 0:17:30 | |
Same like all over the world. | 0:17:30 | 0:17:33 | |
Inequality. | 0:17:33 | 0:17:35 | |
Just inequality. | 0:17:35 | 0:17:37 | |
Putin now trained his sights on those eight men, the oligarchs. | 0:17:38 | 0:17:42 | |
They'd been gifted their companies and huge wealth | 0:17:42 | 0:17:45 | |
by the Yeltsin administration, in a chaotic auction, | 0:17:45 | 0:17:48 | |
in return for political support. | 0:17:48 | 0:17:51 | |
Early in 2003, the President engineered a gladiatorial clash. | 0:17:56 | 0:18:02 | |
On the one side, the man who ruled Russia. | 0:18:02 | 0:18:05 | |
On the other, the men who owned half of it. | 0:18:05 | 0:18:08 | |
The chosen topic of conversation, corruption. | 0:18:08 | 0:18:12 | |
A double-edged sword. | 0:18:12 | 0:18:14 | |
Mikhail Khodorkovsky was the spokesman for the oligarchs, | 0:18:37 | 0:18:41 | |
the fourth richest man in the world, | 0:18:41 | 0:18:43 | |
suspected by the Kremlin of wanting to turn wealth | 0:18:43 | 0:18:47 | |
into political influence. | 0:18:47 | 0:18:48 | |
I didn't pay much attention at that time, | 0:19:14 | 0:19:17 | |
because, just, it was announced that there would be meeting | 0:19:17 | 0:19:20 | |
devoted to, er, corruption | 0:19:20 | 0:19:22 | |
and the oligarchs' team, erm... | 0:19:22 | 0:19:26 | |
..offered to Mikhail Khodorkovsky | 0:19:26 | 0:19:29 | |
to make a presentation on their behalf. | 0:19:29 | 0:19:32 | |
And then Putin, he explode a little bit and saying how all of you, | 0:20:09 | 0:20:13 | |
and you particular, Khodorkovsky, got your wealth. | 0:20:13 | 0:20:17 | |
I arranged this meeting. | 0:20:29 | 0:20:31 | |
-You arranged it? -Yes. | 0:20:31 | 0:20:33 | |
-What?! -Yeah. | 0:20:33 | 0:20:34 | |
MIKHAIL BREATHES HEAVILY AND SIGHS | 0:21:05 | 0:21:07 | |
LAUGHTER | 0:21:07 | 0:21:08 | |
Khodorkovsky's fatal mistake was that he chose a massive oil deal | 0:21:56 | 0:21:59 | |
as his major example of corruption. | 0:21:59 | 0:22:02 | |
A deal which it turned out his president knew everything about. | 0:22:02 | 0:22:07 | |
Mr Putin started to explain me, in the many, many details, | 0:22:07 | 0:22:11 | |
he knew everything in details, that was...brought me to the | 0:22:11 | 0:22:15 | |
understanding there's something wrong, started to appear... | 0:22:15 | 0:22:18 | |
That he knew about the terms of this transaction. | 0:22:19 | 0:22:23 | |
Putin was as good as his private word. | 0:23:44 | 0:23:47 | |
Khodorkovsky was slammed in jail and his vast business sold off, | 0:23:48 | 0:23:52 | |
first to a vodka bar in Siberia, | 0:23:52 | 0:23:54 | |
and then to a company controlled | 0:23:54 | 0:23:56 | |
by one of the President's closest allies. | 0:23:56 | 0:23:59 | |
This was a turning point, | 0:24:02 | 0:24:03 | |
because Yukos was the poster child for the Russian oil industry. | 0:24:03 | 0:24:08 | |
It was very well regarded in the West, | 0:24:08 | 0:24:12 | |
and you thought, you are damaging Russia's image | 0:24:12 | 0:24:16 | |
in the Western business world. | 0:24:16 | 0:24:17 | |
You're damaging the chances of getting more investment in. | 0:24:17 | 0:24:20 | |
So it seemed like a pretty high-risk policy, but for Putin, | 0:24:20 | 0:24:24 | |
zapping Khodorkovsky was so important | 0:24:24 | 0:24:27 | |
that the economic considerations took second place. | 0:24:27 | 0:24:31 | |
The West may not have liked it, but ordinary Russians did. | 0:24:31 | 0:24:35 | |
They were delighted to see their president | 0:24:35 | 0:24:37 | |
taking on the hated oligarchs. | 0:24:37 | 0:24:40 | |
And it wasn't the only sign of a new-found personal confidence. | 0:24:42 | 0:24:45 | |
Russia and Belarus were negotiating a gas deal and talks broke down. | 0:24:47 | 0:24:51 | |
I instructed Gazprom, continue to supply. | 0:24:54 | 0:24:56 | |
It's February, minus 25 in Minsk, | 0:24:56 | 0:24:59 | |
continue to supply, then later we negotiate. | 0:24:59 | 0:25:02 | |
And next morning just Prime Minister of Poland calling me, | 0:25:02 | 0:25:06 | |
Prime Minister of Lithuania... | 0:25:06 | 0:25:07 | |
Governor of Kaliningrad Region. | 0:25:07 | 0:25:10 | |
"What's going on? We have no gas." | 0:25:10 | 0:25:12 | |
Because just they were on the same line, on the same pipeline. | 0:25:14 | 0:25:17 | |
President of Gazprom, he said - | 0:25:19 | 0:25:21 | |
"Putin instructed me to cut supplies." | 0:25:21 | 0:25:24 | |
Then we were shouting to each other. | 0:25:25 | 0:25:27 | |
HE LAUGHS So what did you say? | 0:25:27 | 0:25:29 | |
He said he didn't respect Lukashenko, didn't respect me. | 0:25:29 | 0:25:32 | |
I, Putin, asked him personally just to accept this price and he didn't. | 0:25:32 | 0:25:37 | |
He didn't sign the contract. He didn't respect me. | 0:25:37 | 0:25:39 | |
Two weeks after, I was fired. | 0:25:41 | 0:25:42 | |
The whole Cabinet was fired just two weeks prior to elections. | 0:25:44 | 0:25:48 | |
HE LAUGHS | 0:25:48 | 0:25:49 | |
Stability at home, his vast country once again at peace | 0:25:50 | 0:25:55 | |
and a Cabinet under his direct control. | 0:25:55 | 0:25:58 | |
It looks like the new president has single-handedly reversed | 0:25:58 | 0:26:02 | |
the years of decline. | 0:26:02 | 0:26:04 | |
One of the features of unlimited power | 0:26:12 | 0:26:15 | |
is the acquired narcissism that occurs. | 0:26:15 | 0:26:20 | |
And the acquired narcissism leads to, you know, | 0:26:22 | 0:26:26 | |
a really...enormously inflated ego. | 0:26:26 | 0:26:29 | |
You know, you're teaching cranes to fly, | 0:26:31 | 0:26:34 | |
or you're fighting bears, you're wrestling tigers. | 0:26:34 | 0:26:37 | |
You're just the smartest, cleverest, strongest, | 0:26:37 | 0:26:41 | |
best-looking guy in the world! | 0:26:41 | 0:26:45 | |
HE LAUGHS | 0:26:45 | 0:26:46 | |
And, you know, if you inflate an ego enough, | 0:26:48 | 0:26:51 | |
then the vulnerability of it increases proportionately. | 0:26:51 | 0:26:56 | |
SHOUTING AND CHANTING | 0:26:59 | 0:27:01 | |
Then trouble broke out where he least expected it... | 0:27:12 | 0:27:16 | |
Georgia. | 0:27:16 | 0:27:17 | |
Revolutions swept away his allies | 0:27:17 | 0:27:19 | |
and a coltish reformer took power, Mikheil Saakashvili. | 0:27:19 | 0:27:23 | |
My first contact with Vladimir Putin | 0:27:25 | 0:27:28 | |
was during my first official visit to Moscow. | 0:27:28 | 0:27:32 | |
They tried to persuade... | 0:27:34 | 0:27:36 | |
Er, he actually rolled out red, red carpet, | 0:27:36 | 0:27:39 | |
first full official visit ceremony. | 0:27:39 | 0:27:42 | |
The whole setting was meant to be a kind of recruiting session, | 0:27:44 | 0:27:49 | |
because Putin first took us to the office that... | 0:27:49 | 0:27:53 | |
He'd said that it was former office of Stalin, | 0:27:53 | 0:27:55 | |
and then he took off his tie, jacket, | 0:27:55 | 0:27:58 | |
he invited me to do the same, and then sat down with me | 0:27:58 | 0:28:01 | |
in what was meant to be a very, | 0:28:01 | 0:28:04 | |
you know, friendly and open conversation. | 0:28:04 | 0:28:06 | |
From the very first meeting, I ask him, "So, so, Vladimir, | 0:28:08 | 0:28:11 | |
"do you have any problems with our dealings with the Americas?" | 0:28:11 | 0:28:15 | |
"No", he said "no". | 0:28:15 | 0:28:16 | |
"I myself friends with George Bush. | 0:28:16 | 0:28:18 | |
"Of course we strongly... | 0:28:18 | 0:28:20 | |
"No, we are not in principle against you dealing with the Americas, | 0:28:20 | 0:28:24 | |
"we are just against you being slaves to the Americas". | 0:28:24 | 0:28:27 | |
But then he told me something very clear. | 0:28:28 | 0:28:31 | |
He told me that the sitting Georgian Minister of Security | 0:28:31 | 0:28:35 | |
in Shevardnadze's government, he told me that this is our guy. | 0:28:35 | 0:28:39 | |
"We have very good experience of working with him. | 0:28:39 | 0:28:42 | |
"He really helped us a lot and I hope he keeps his position. | 0:28:42 | 0:28:46 | |
"If he keeps his position, that will make it very easy, | 0:28:46 | 0:28:49 | |
"our co-operation." | 0:28:49 | 0:28:50 | |
Second time I met him, he asks, "Where is he?" | 0:28:52 | 0:28:54 | |
And I told him, "Well, he got promoted. | 0:28:54 | 0:28:56 | |
"We appointed him as Deputy Prosecutor General. | 0:28:56 | 0:28:58 | |
He said, "Well, this is not a promotion. | 0:28:58 | 0:29:01 | |
"We wanted to help him as Minister of Internal Security". | 0:29:01 | 0:29:04 | |
By that he told me, "You are not going to fool me". | 0:29:04 | 0:29:06 | |
Saakashvili, he enjoyed sort of poking the bear in the eye, | 0:29:06 | 0:29:11 | |
and that's not always a very wise policy, | 0:29:11 | 0:29:13 | |
and some people around him advised him not to do it, | 0:29:13 | 0:29:16 | |
and he would've been better advised not to do it. | 0:29:16 | 0:29:19 | |
The psychological and the personal now | 0:29:20 | 0:29:23 | |
plays a much bigger role in international politics, | 0:29:23 | 0:29:27 | |
because of the old certainties, | 0:29:27 | 0:29:29 | |
the old tectonic plates of ideology and of interest between blocs, | 0:29:29 | 0:29:35 | |
they've all gone, | 0:29:35 | 0:29:36 | |
and we're now in a system where individual human psychology | 0:29:36 | 0:29:39 | |
and personality plays much more of a role. | 0:29:39 | 0:29:42 | |
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE | 0:29:42 | 0:29:44 | |
To Putin's intense irritation, | 0:29:44 | 0:29:46 | |
Bush immediately responded to Saakashvili's overtures, | 0:29:46 | 0:29:49 | |
reversing the pro-Russian stance he'd earlier held. | 0:29:49 | 0:29:53 | |
Georgia is today most sovereign and free | 0:29:55 | 0:29:58 | |
and a beacon of liberty for this region and the world. | 0:29:58 | 0:30:03 | |
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE | 0:30:03 | 0:30:06 | |
Putin began to believe that the Americans could never be trusted. | 0:30:06 | 0:30:09 | |
A view strengthened as the tide of revolution | 0:30:09 | 0:30:12 | |
reached neighbouring Ukraine. | 0:30:12 | 0:30:14 | |
BBC NEWS THEME | 0:30:14 | 0:30:17 | |
-HUW EDWARDS: -Now to the political crisis in Ukraine. | 0:30:17 | 0:30:20 | |
CROWD CHANTS | 0:30:20 | 0:30:22 | |
The Orange Revolution pitted Putin's man, incumbent Viktor Yanukovich, | 0:30:22 | 0:30:27 | |
against challenger Viktor Yushchenko, | 0:30:27 | 0:30:30 | |
who the Kremlin thought was a US puppet. | 0:30:30 | 0:30:34 | |
At the polls, Yushchenko won, | 0:30:34 | 0:30:36 | |
despite the best efforts of Putin's personal spin doctor. | 0:30:36 | 0:30:39 | |
That was a massive humiliation for Putin | 0:31:32 | 0:31:35 | |
and it was the shakiest moment of his 18 years in power. | 0:31:35 | 0:31:38 | |
For three months after that, people in Moscow were actually asking | 0:31:38 | 0:31:43 | |
whether he would last till the end of his Presidential term. | 0:31:43 | 0:31:45 | |
It was a huge defeat for him | 0:31:47 | 0:31:49 | |
because he was perceived as having lost Ukraine. | 0:31:49 | 0:31:53 | |
It's a defeat the President has never forgotten and never forgiven. | 0:31:56 | 0:32:01 | |
He could never trust the West again. | 0:32:01 | 0:32:04 | |
A perception its politicians, | 0:32:04 | 0:32:06 | |
glorying in democracy's victory in Ukraine, only strengthened. | 0:32:06 | 0:32:10 | |
From the West's point of view, this was the end of history, | 0:32:15 | 0:32:19 | |
liberal capitalism had triumphed. | 0:32:19 | 0:32:22 | |
I was a bit tough on the Russians, but there we are. | 0:32:22 | 0:32:25 | |
And I wish we'd handled it differently. | 0:32:26 | 0:32:29 | |
Imagine if, in the United Kingdom, there'd not just been Scottish | 0:32:29 | 0:32:34 | |
independence but Welsh independence and Northern Irish independence, | 0:32:34 | 0:32:37 | |
but the North West and the North East of England | 0:32:37 | 0:32:41 | |
and the South West had also decided to declare independence. | 0:32:41 | 0:32:44 | |
So we didn't really factor that in in my view | 0:32:47 | 0:32:50 | |
and we then scared the Russians with this absolutely fundamental | 0:32:50 | 0:32:58 | |
anxiety they've always had about being encircled. | 0:32:58 | 0:33:03 | |
In hindsight, I think that we created the anxieties | 0:33:03 | 0:33:08 | |
and we could have avoided them | 0:33:08 | 0:33:10 | |
from which many of Putin's subsequent policies followed. | 0:33:10 | 0:33:14 | |
2005, everything changes. | 0:33:21 | 0:33:25 | |
Vladimir Putin turns inward back to Russia and its people. | 0:33:25 | 0:33:30 | |
Gone modernisation, gone attempts to woo the fickle West. | 0:33:30 | 0:33:35 | |
Instead, "Putin is Russia, Russia is Putin" is the new slogan. | 0:33:35 | 0:33:40 | |
He will rebuild his country himself. | 0:33:40 | 0:33:43 | |
But there's a looming problem. | 0:34:05 | 0:34:08 | |
In two years' time, Putin has to stand down. | 0:34:08 | 0:34:11 | |
A new president is to be elected | 0:34:11 | 0:34:13 | |
and liberal opponents are already starting their campaigns. | 0:34:13 | 0:34:17 | |
Notably chess grandmaster Garry Kasparov. | 0:34:17 | 0:34:21 | |
It was a very different game from one that I'd been playing before | 0:34:23 | 0:34:27 | |
because that game was a clear winning combination. | 0:34:27 | 0:34:32 | |
In 2007 there still was a chance for Putin to walk away. | 0:34:32 | 0:34:36 | |
Already probably the richest man in the world, | 0:34:36 | 0:34:39 | |
and was a massive influence and, by the way, with a decent reputation. | 0:34:39 | 0:34:43 | |
This is the world's most famous chess player, | 0:34:46 | 0:34:48 | |
then still ranked number one. | 0:34:48 | 0:34:51 | |
Definitely one of the most recognisable faces in Russia. | 0:34:51 | 0:34:54 | |
Absolutely the most recognisable face in Russia | 0:34:54 | 0:34:57 | |
outside of movie stardom and Putin. | 0:34:57 | 0:35:00 | |
Certainly the man, if you asked anybody anywhere in Russia, | 0:35:01 | 0:35:04 | |
"Who's the smartest man in Russia?" | 0:35:04 | 0:35:07 | |
they'd probably say Garry Kasparov. | 0:35:07 | 0:35:10 | |
He almost immediately went on tour | 0:35:12 | 0:35:15 | |
and I was with him on this little chartered plane. | 0:35:15 | 0:35:20 | |
Within the space of a week, things started shutting down. | 0:35:22 | 0:35:27 | |
First we had to give up the plane | 0:35:28 | 0:35:31 | |
because they would no longer let him land. | 0:35:31 | 0:35:33 | |
In Beslan he couldn't get the venue where he was supposed to speak. | 0:35:35 | 0:35:41 | |
They said that they had a burst pipe | 0:35:41 | 0:35:45 | |
or they had an electrical failure. | 0:35:45 | 0:35:48 | |
Wherever anyone went it was either a burst pipe or an electrical failure. | 0:35:48 | 0:35:51 | |
I think that was the first place where he got stuff thrown at him | 0:35:53 | 0:35:58 | |
and we actually thought it was a gunshot. | 0:35:58 | 0:36:01 | |
By the time we got to Sverdlovsk, | 0:36:01 | 0:36:02 | |
which is the largest city in Southern Russia, | 0:36:02 | 0:36:05 | |
it was no longer a chain of coincidences. | 0:36:05 | 0:36:08 | |
At this point the plane is grounded, | 0:36:08 | 0:36:10 | |
the place where he is supposed to speak had a burst pipe | 0:36:10 | 0:36:14 | |
and then we try to check into a hotel and they say, | 0:36:14 | 0:36:16 | |
"No, you can't check into this hotel." | 0:36:16 | 0:36:18 | |
We had a dinner booked for 30 or 40 people | 0:36:20 | 0:36:26 | |
from the local small business association | 0:36:26 | 0:36:29 | |
and we get to this restaurant | 0:36:29 | 0:36:32 | |
and there was one person there. | 0:36:32 | 0:36:34 | |
And it emerged as we talked... | 0:36:36 | 0:36:39 | |
She was from the small business organisation. | 0:36:39 | 0:36:41 | |
It emerged as we talked that she had lost her cellphone the day before, | 0:36:41 | 0:36:46 | |
so she was the only one who wasn't called | 0:36:46 | 0:36:50 | |
and threatened by the Governor's people. | 0:36:50 | 0:36:53 | |
The grandmaster soon finds himself under arrest. | 0:36:59 | 0:37:02 | |
Tell your leaders that this regime is criminal. It's a police state. | 0:37:09 | 0:37:13 | |
I have to say that, compared to what we are seeing today, | 0:37:16 | 0:37:19 | |
those were vegetarian times. | 0:37:19 | 0:37:23 | |
Ten years ago, for protesting peacefully against Putin | 0:37:23 | 0:37:27 | |
on the streets you could end up in prison for five or ten days. | 0:37:27 | 0:37:30 | |
Today you would end up in prison for five or ten years. | 0:37:30 | 0:37:33 | |
My first trial, which ended up with a £40 fine, | 0:37:38 | 0:37:42 | |
but the judge there, she set up the rules for the future | 0:37:42 | 0:37:45 | |
because everything that happened with me was videotaped. | 0:37:45 | 0:37:48 | |
I had videotape, I had witnesses that proved that everything that | 0:37:48 | 0:37:52 | |
they presented in court was a lie. | 0:37:52 | 0:37:54 | |
She said she trusted a policeman, one policeman, over the rest | 0:37:54 | 0:37:59 | |
of the pile of evidence because he wore the military uniform. | 0:37:59 | 0:38:06 | |
Kasparov isn't the only one trying his luck. | 0:38:28 | 0:38:32 | |
So is Mikhail Kasyanov, keen to return to power. | 0:38:32 | 0:38:36 | |
I decided to run. I believed at that time we had a chance. | 0:38:36 | 0:38:41 | |
I started to run and at that time it was necessary to collect | 0:38:41 | 0:38:45 | |
two million signatures and we did it. | 0:38:45 | 0:38:49 | |
Then my support started to grow from 6%, which is usually 5%-6%, | 0:38:49 | 0:38:56 | |
up to 18% and one month after they cut me out of elections, | 0:38:56 | 0:39:02 | |
just describing that 35 signatures out of two million signatures | 0:39:02 | 0:39:06 | |
we believe not right, not correct. | 0:39:06 | 0:39:08 | |
HE LAUGHS | 0:39:08 | 0:39:11 | |
With no Kasyanov or Kasparov in the mix, Putin's man, Prime Minister | 0:39:12 | 0:39:17 | |
Dmitry Medvedev, succeeds him as President, but then, in defiance of | 0:39:17 | 0:39:22 | |
the spirit if not the letter of the constitution, | 0:39:22 | 0:39:25 | |
that new Prime Minister is Vladimir Putin. | 0:39:25 | 0:39:29 | |
His country's future too important to relinquish. | 0:39:29 | 0:39:32 | |
Power too addictive to give up. | 0:39:32 | 0:39:35 | |
That is absolutely clear for everyone in Russia | 0:39:35 | 0:39:38 | |
that his successor is simply just to keep the presidential seat warm | 0:39:38 | 0:39:44 | |
and he successfully implemented this goal Mr Putin wanted him to do. | 0:39:44 | 0:39:50 | |
This is why democracy was invented. | 0:39:52 | 0:39:55 | |
Take anyone who is given absolute power for more than, say, | 0:39:55 | 0:40:00 | |
eight or ten years, that will inevitably distort their behaviour | 0:40:00 | 0:40:05 | |
in ways that can be very dangerous. | 0:40:05 | 0:40:07 | |
In 2006, Putin had pushed a law through Parliament allowing | 0:40:14 | 0:40:17 | |
the KGB to kill traitors outside Russia. | 0:40:17 | 0:40:21 | |
Months later, Alexander Litvinenko lay dead in London, | 0:40:23 | 0:40:27 | |
the KGB defector poisoned with radioactive polonium after | 0:40:27 | 0:40:31 | |
eating sushi and drinking tea in a Mayfair restaurant. | 0:40:31 | 0:40:36 | |
I was on my way to London for a meeting with Tony Blair | 0:40:36 | 0:40:39 | |
and Litvinenko had been murdered a few days before that | 0:40:39 | 0:40:44 | |
and everybody was talking about it. | 0:40:44 | 0:40:47 | |
So we had to stop over in Minsk. | 0:40:47 | 0:40:48 | |
We went to see an exhibit, after which we had a banquet. | 0:40:48 | 0:40:52 | |
There was Putin in the middle. | 0:40:52 | 0:40:54 | |
I was on his right hand and Lukashenko on his left. | 0:40:54 | 0:40:59 | |
And Lukashenko has this habit of poking Putin from time to time, | 0:40:59 | 0:41:05 | |
even making fun of him. | 0:41:05 | 0:41:08 | |
And so he started to say, "So from here you're leaving for London | 0:41:08 | 0:41:13 | |
"so you should really be well fed. | 0:41:13 | 0:41:15 | |
"I don't advise you to eat anything in London." | 0:41:15 | 0:41:18 | |
And so he said, "Especially I don't advise you to eat any sushi. | 0:41:18 | 0:41:23 | |
"Don't even go close to sushi, but the safest thing to eat from | 0:41:23 | 0:41:27 | |
"which you won't for sure be poisoned | 0:41:27 | 0:41:29 | |
"is from plate in front of Vladimir." | 0:41:29 | 0:41:31 | |
So he takes plate from Putin and gives it to me. | 0:41:31 | 0:41:35 | |
And so Putin suddenly interrupts and says, | 0:41:35 | 0:41:40 | |
"I have nothing to do with the murder of this Litvinenko guy." | 0:41:40 | 0:41:44 | |
He got visibly annoyed. | 0:41:44 | 0:41:45 | |
"No. Who the hell needed Litvinenko? He was nobody. | 0:41:48 | 0:41:52 | |
"Why would I murder him?" | 0:41:52 | 0:41:54 | |
But it really got under his skin. | 0:41:54 | 0:41:57 | |
Ever since, Russia has persistently denied responsibility | 0:41:57 | 0:42:01 | |
for Litvinenko's death. | 0:42:01 | 0:42:04 | |
But behind the jokes in Minsk lay tension, | 0:42:04 | 0:42:08 | |
Putin warning Saakashvili he should drop the West or pay the price. | 0:42:08 | 0:42:12 | |
He took me aside. It was a meeting without witnesses. | 0:42:14 | 0:42:18 | |
It was a dark room next to the main hall. | 0:42:18 | 0:42:22 | |
We sat on chairs. There was not even a table. | 0:42:22 | 0:42:26 | |
So he put his hand on my knee, like, with nails and, | 0:42:26 | 0:42:31 | |
looking straight into my eyes, said, | 0:42:31 | 0:42:33 | |
"You really underestimate us. You cannot play around with Russia." | 0:42:33 | 0:42:38 | |
The all-powerful Putin was increasingly inclined to show | 0:42:40 | 0:42:44 | |
open contempt for his former allies. | 0:42:44 | 0:42:46 | |
One thing that struck me, | 0:42:49 | 0:42:51 | |
an anecdote about Putin which reveals to me | 0:42:51 | 0:42:55 | |
that he's probably not a very nice person, is Angela Merkel is | 0:42:55 | 0:43:00 | |
afraid of dogs and made the mistake of divulging this to Putin. | 0:43:00 | 0:43:06 | |
And one time when she was in Russia, what did he do, | 0:43:09 | 0:43:11 | |
but bring this enormous horrible big dog into the room | 0:43:11 | 0:43:15 | |
just so that he could then enjoy the power that comes, that | 0:43:15 | 0:43:19 | |
somewhat sadistic power that comes from making someone frightened. | 0:43:19 | 0:43:24 | |
2008 - The Georgian crisis boiled over. | 0:43:29 | 0:43:33 | |
A separatist rioted in the dissident republic of South Ossetia. | 0:43:33 | 0:43:37 | |
The Russian Army massed on the border with Putin certain | 0:43:37 | 0:43:40 | |
the hapless West would do absolutely nothing. | 0:43:40 | 0:43:44 | |
It was obviously that it was basically on the edge of war, | 0:43:44 | 0:43:49 | |
so Europeans and America started to make statements. | 0:43:49 | 0:43:53 | |
I tried to call Medvedev because Medvedev was officially the | 0:43:53 | 0:43:55 | |
President, but then they called me back from Russian protocol and said, | 0:43:55 | 0:43:59 | |
"Vladimir Putin wants to talk to you." | 0:43:59 | 0:44:01 | |
And Putin says, "Why are you calling Medvedev? | 0:44:01 | 0:44:03 | |
"It's me who is doing all these things | 0:44:03 | 0:44:05 | |
"and I'm directing the whole operation." | 0:44:05 | 0:44:08 | |
So I told him, "Look, we are very worried. Not only are we worried. | 0:44:08 | 0:44:12 | |
"Look at the statements. We have the White House, the European Union." | 0:44:12 | 0:44:17 | |
He said, "I already saw the statements. | 0:44:17 | 0:44:20 | |
"They are really very harsh, strong statements." | 0:44:20 | 0:44:23 | |
He said lots of paper was spent on the statements. | 0:44:23 | 0:44:27 | |
So he told me, "Mikheil, why don't you call your friends in the West | 0:44:27 | 0:44:31 | |
"and tell them to roll this paper and stick it in their asses?" | 0:44:31 | 0:44:35 | |
While the rest of the world is watching the Beijing Olympics, | 0:44:47 | 0:44:51 | |
Vladimir Putin sends in the tanks | 0:44:51 | 0:44:54 | |
for the first time since the collapse of the Soviet Union. | 0:44:54 | 0:44:58 | |
What happened at that moment, finally the Americans will help. | 0:45:07 | 0:45:11 | |
I have directed the Secretary of Defense Bob Gates to begin | 0:45:14 | 0:45:17 | |
a humanitarian mission to the people of Georgia | 0:45:17 | 0:45:20 | |
headed by the United States military. | 0:45:20 | 0:45:23 | |
This mission will be vigorous and ongoing. | 0:45:23 | 0:45:27 | |
And one of the things that they leaked was that Cheney wanted | 0:45:27 | 0:45:30 | |
to hit the Russians with cruise missiles. | 0:45:30 | 0:45:33 | |
Within 40 minutes of the Bush announcement, | 0:45:35 | 0:45:38 | |
Russian troops' advance on our capital was stopped. | 0:45:38 | 0:45:42 | |
So Putin got the message. | 0:45:42 | 0:45:45 | |
The West was horrified by the invasion and relieved at the | 0:45:45 | 0:45:48 | |
pull back, but even a five-day war | 0:45:48 | 0:45:51 | |
made Russians feel their country was strong again. | 0:45:51 | 0:45:54 | |
A firm leader at its tiller. | 0:45:54 | 0:45:56 | |
Worried European countries decide it's time to try | 0:45:56 | 0:46:00 | |
and be friends again. | 0:46:00 | 0:46:01 | |
I visited Moscow and I saw then-President Medvedev. | 0:46:03 | 0:46:07 | |
This was in the period | 0:46:07 | 0:46:09 | |
when Putin had stepped into being Prime Minister | 0:46:09 | 0:46:12 | |
while, of course, still holding the reins of power. | 0:46:12 | 0:46:16 | |
Medvedev is much more a normal European politician. | 0:46:16 | 0:46:21 | |
Talking to him you get a much less sinister feeling really | 0:46:21 | 0:46:26 | |
than talking to President Putin. | 0:46:26 | 0:46:28 | |
I escorted him to the Olympics when he came here in 2012. | 0:46:31 | 0:46:37 | |
I took him to the ExCel Centre to see the Judo. | 0:46:37 | 0:46:41 | |
I know a bit about Judo. I've done some Judo. Not as much as he has. | 0:46:41 | 0:46:46 | |
A Russian won the gold medal, which Putin enjoyed, of course, | 0:46:46 | 0:46:49 | |
immensely because he wasn't going to go back to Moscow | 0:46:49 | 0:46:52 | |
until he had seen a Russian win a gold medal. | 0:46:52 | 0:46:55 | |
He was going to stay as long as necessary. | 0:46:55 | 0:46:57 | |
We had champagne, you know, we had quite a party | 0:46:57 | 0:47:04 | |
and we waved him off, knowing that they'd won a gold medal, | 0:47:04 | 0:47:07 | |
with some relief that he didn't need to stay a couple of days. | 0:47:07 | 0:47:10 | |
Two years later, the Sochi Olympics were intended to be another | 0:47:20 | 0:47:23 | |
stepping stone in Russia's path to global dominance. | 0:47:23 | 0:47:26 | |
The President poured vast amounts of time and money into the project. | 0:47:28 | 0:47:32 | |
But the Games also served to distract the world's cameras | 0:47:37 | 0:47:40 | |
from his next bold foreign policy manoeuvre, | 0:47:40 | 0:47:43 | |
as Russia seized control of Crimea. | 0:47:43 | 0:47:46 | |
Dictators never ask why. It's always why not? | 0:47:51 | 0:47:54 | |
But we could see an acceleration. | 0:47:56 | 0:47:58 | |
For Hitler it took 20 months from Berlin Olympics | 0:47:58 | 0:48:02 | |
to annexation of Austria. | 0:48:02 | 0:48:04 | |
For Putin it took only 20 days, | 0:48:04 | 0:48:07 | |
from Olympics to annexation of Crimea. | 0:48:07 | 0:48:09 | |
Putin has developed a very clear consistent approach in dealing with | 0:48:13 | 0:48:18 | |
problems in those neighbours, which is to take a physical stake in them. | 0:48:18 | 0:48:22 | |
Something which, | 0:48:22 | 0:48:24 | |
every time he does it, is astonishing to Western opinion. | 0:48:24 | 0:48:27 | |
Of course it wouldn't be astonishing any more because he's done it | 0:48:27 | 0:48:30 | |
several times, but to physically take part of one of those countries, | 0:48:30 | 0:48:36 | |
to stop that country functioning as a sovereign state... | 0:48:36 | 0:48:40 | |
..and that is how he arrests the arrival | 0:48:42 | 0:48:45 | |
or the growth of Western ideas. | 0:48:45 | 0:48:48 | |
And of course he was bold enough to do the same in Syria. | 0:48:51 | 0:48:54 | |
To physically intervene, in my view, | 0:48:54 | 0:48:57 | |
emboldened by Western failure to intervene. | 0:48:57 | 0:49:02 | |
One of the key features | 0:49:04 | 0:49:07 | |
of the extreme narcissism of the emperor | 0:49:07 | 0:49:12 | |
is you lose the ability to distinguish your interests | 0:49:12 | 0:49:17 | |
from the interests of the country. | 0:49:17 | 0:49:20 | |
And so you and your nation's interest becomes identical. | 0:49:20 | 0:49:24 | |
To the baffled West, Vladimir Putin looked arbitrary and out of control. | 0:49:26 | 0:49:31 | |
But to his people he looked like a true Tsar, happy to flout | 0:49:31 | 0:49:35 | |
Western norms of behaviour to safeguard Russia's vital interests. | 0:49:35 | 0:49:39 | |
Then one old rival decides to challenge the apparently | 0:49:45 | 0:49:48 | |
invincible President. | 0:49:48 | 0:49:49 | |
CROWDS CHANT | 0:49:50 | 0:49:54 | |
Boris himself had as close a relationship to power as anyone. | 0:49:54 | 0:49:58 | |
For many years he was perceived as the heir apparent to Yeltsin. | 0:49:58 | 0:50:02 | |
And then Putin takes that place. | 0:50:02 | 0:50:04 | |
And, of course, | 0:50:05 | 0:50:08 | |
neither of them can sort of | 0:50:08 | 0:50:09 | |
let the other alone. | 0:50:09 | 0:50:12 | |
Nemtsov, I think, for principled reasons, | 0:50:12 | 0:50:14 | |
and Putin for reasons of insecurity and vengefulness. | 0:50:14 | 0:50:16 | |
Boris Nemtsov started small - | 0:50:20 | 0:50:23 | |
a pamphlet alleging that his nemesis had 58 jets, two yachts, | 0:50:23 | 0:50:29 | |
a summer palace, | 0:50:29 | 0:50:30 | |
making Vladimir Putin the world's richest man. | 0:50:30 | 0:50:34 | |
His co-author was a former government minister. | 0:50:34 | 0:50:37 | |
Boris Nemtsov and myself, we were questioning the whole narrative | 0:50:39 | 0:50:42 | |
that things got so much better under Putin that we should be just | 0:50:42 | 0:50:46 | |
happy and let him be the lifetime monarch. | 0:50:46 | 0:50:49 | |
We described a lot of irregularities and serious problems that | 0:50:49 | 0:50:53 | |
existed underneath the economically brilliant surface. | 0:50:53 | 0:50:57 | |
Growing inequality became much higher than in the 1990s, | 0:50:57 | 0:51:03 | |
growing corruption and institutionalised corruption, | 0:51:03 | 0:51:06 | |
which also was never the case in the '90s because, in the '90s, | 0:51:06 | 0:51:09 | |
it was all bribes from businessmen to bureaucrats, but under Putin, | 0:51:09 | 0:51:15 | |
it became bureaucrats completely affiliated with making dirty money, | 0:51:15 | 0:51:19 | |
and actually it became their business, | 0:51:19 | 0:51:21 | |
and their only business, to do so. | 0:51:21 | 0:51:24 | |
You know, we are not perfect, | 0:51:25 | 0:51:28 | |
but who actually is? | 0:51:28 | 0:51:30 | |
Did I commit things? | 0:51:32 | 0:51:34 | |
Yes, I committed things. | 0:51:34 | 0:51:36 | |
But I never killed a person, | 0:51:36 | 0:51:40 | |
I never slapped anybody by the face, | 0:51:40 | 0:51:44 | |
either figurally, either, you know, physically, | 0:51:44 | 0:51:48 | |
and I never stealed from anybody. | 0:51:48 | 0:51:52 | |
I help a lot and, you know, from time to time, | 0:51:52 | 0:51:57 | |
it returns to me in the form of just unexpected support. | 0:51:57 | 0:52:01 | |
I call him Boris, | 0:52:07 | 0:52:10 | |
but sometimes I have started to call him suspect. | 0:52:10 | 0:52:15 | |
But he was a man with a brilliant sense of humour. | 0:52:15 | 0:52:21 | |
He was preparing the next pamphlet devoted to the election in Crimea. | 0:52:24 | 0:52:30 | |
It's a very sensitive subject for Putin's regime. | 0:52:32 | 0:52:35 | |
One winter's night, Boris Nemtsov | 0:52:45 | 0:52:48 | |
starts to cross the Moskvoretsky Bridge, | 0:52:48 | 0:52:50 | |
in the shadow of the Kremlin walls. | 0:52:50 | 0:52:53 | |
Moments later, he's shot in the back and the head four times. | 0:52:53 | 0:52:59 | |
I was of course shocked. | 0:52:59 | 0:53:00 | |
I couldn't even imagine that it could happen | 0:53:00 | 0:53:03 | |
in the 21st century, | 0:53:03 | 0:53:04 | |
with us, in the centre of Moscow. | 0:53:04 | 0:53:07 | |
I immediately came there, on the bridge, | 0:53:09 | 0:53:12 | |
and I just was standing, | 0:53:12 | 0:53:14 | |
and the body of... Murdered my friend. | 0:53:14 | 0:53:18 | |
Just on the front of Kremlin wall, | 0:53:18 | 0:53:21 | |
where just all Secret Service cameras were just installed. | 0:53:21 | 0:53:25 | |
I was shocked. It was a real shock for me. | 0:53:33 | 0:53:37 | |
I didn't think it was possible. | 0:53:37 | 0:53:38 | |
I didn't think it was possible. | 0:53:40 | 0:53:42 | |
And I didn't know... | 0:53:42 | 0:53:43 | |
..who was guilty of it. | 0:53:45 | 0:53:47 | |
Despite the absence of any CCTV - | 0:53:47 | 0:53:50 | |
Kremlin's cameras were being serviced that night - | 0:53:50 | 0:53:53 | |
four men are arrested for Nemtsov's murder - one a former para. | 0:53:53 | 0:53:57 | |
But Nemtsov's supporters doubt ultimate responsibility lies | 0:53:59 | 0:54:03 | |
with the former serviceman. | 0:54:03 | 0:54:05 | |
If you stand there and look at the location, | 0:54:05 | 0:54:08 | |
then you completely understand that, | 0:54:08 | 0:54:10 | |
in this place, it cannot happen | 0:54:10 | 0:54:14 | |
without not only the permission but the order from person number one. | 0:54:14 | 0:54:19 | |
Almost all people who hold great power for a long time begin | 0:54:31 | 0:54:36 | |
to feel so special. | 0:54:36 | 0:54:38 | |
"I am so amazing. | 0:54:38 | 0:54:40 | |
"God must have something to do with this. | 0:54:42 | 0:54:44 | |
"Look, I can snap my fingers and they invade a country. | 0:54:47 | 0:54:51 | |
"I can... I have power of life and death over man and woman." | 0:54:51 | 0:54:55 | |
George W Bush confessed he thought that God was | 0:54:57 | 0:55:01 | |
involved in his decision on the Iraq war. | 0:55:01 | 0:55:04 | |
Tony Blair hinted of a wee chat with God now and again. | 0:55:04 | 0:55:09 | |
Julius Caesar had himself deified when he was still alive. | 0:55:09 | 0:55:12 | |
With unchallenged authority at home | 0:55:13 | 0:55:15 | |
and his nearest neighbours put in their place, | 0:55:15 | 0:55:18 | |
the President is now able to spread his influence even further afield. | 0:55:18 | 0:55:23 | |
It seems very evident there was a Russian interference | 0:55:24 | 0:55:29 | |
in the election. | 0:55:29 | 0:55:30 | |
The amount of evidence amassed by the intelligence agencies | 0:55:30 | 0:55:34 | |
in the United States about Russia is unlikely to be wrong. | 0:55:34 | 0:55:38 | |
A lot of people say, as an example, you know, | 0:55:38 | 0:55:41 | |
"Hillary likes to play tough with Russia." | 0:55:41 | 0:55:44 | |
Putin looks at her and he laughs, OK? | 0:55:44 | 0:55:47 | |
Putin's goals are strategic goals. | 0:55:52 | 0:55:55 | |
He wants chaos because that's his breathing air. | 0:55:55 | 0:56:01 | |
He needs chaos because that's how he installs his authorities | 0:56:01 | 0:56:06 | |
inside and outside of Russia. | 0:56:06 | 0:56:08 | |
He doesn't want to compete. | 0:56:09 | 0:56:11 | |
He cannot compete with the free world, | 0:56:11 | 0:56:13 | |
but the moment it comes into wars and conflicts, | 0:56:13 | 0:56:16 | |
he's dominant because he is very quick at making decisions. | 0:56:16 | 0:56:20 | |
He doesn't bother about Parliament, free press, | 0:56:20 | 0:56:23 | |
public opinion, so he immediately grabs | 0:56:23 | 0:56:26 | |
an opportunity if it is presented. | 0:56:26 | 0:56:31 | |
He looks at the world map, looking for bargaining chips, | 0:56:31 | 0:56:35 | |
because for him it's all geo-political casino. | 0:56:35 | 0:56:37 | |
I think this is part of a pattern where there has quite probably been | 0:56:40 | 0:56:44 | |
Russian interference in elections | 0:56:44 | 0:56:47 | |
and referendums throughout Europe over the last few years, | 0:56:47 | 0:56:52 | |
not always to achieve a specific result | 0:56:52 | 0:56:55 | |
but to diminish confidence in the democratic process | 0:56:55 | 0:57:01 | |
over time and to weaken the unity of the West. | 0:57:01 | 0:57:05 | |
And it's not over. | 0:57:07 | 0:57:09 | |
With just days to go to the election, | 0:57:20 | 0:57:23 | |
the President announces a new global arms race, with nukes | 0:57:23 | 0:57:28 | |
designed to elude any antimissile system, present or future. | 0:57:28 | 0:57:32 | |
Out on the campaign trail, there's | 0:57:46 | 0:57:48 | |
a growing tide of suspicion that the President is just using his family | 0:57:48 | 0:57:52 | |
friend as a window-dressing on his inevitable accession to power. | 0:57:52 | 0:57:56 | |
So you're not the Kremlin's puppet, then? | 0:57:59 | 0:58:02 | |
Well, I'm tired of answering this question. No, I'm not. | 0:58:02 | 0:58:06 | |
Do you want to be the next president? | 0:58:06 | 0:58:08 | |
Well, I want to, | 0:58:08 | 0:58:11 | |
but I'm not sure it will be this year. | 0:58:11 | 0:58:14 | |
But I hope in six years, I'll have a chance to do that. | 0:58:14 | 0:58:17 | |
To my mind, there is no way out, | 0:58:17 | 0:58:20 | |
he will stay there for a long time. | 0:58:20 | 0:58:24 | |
Even if you could arrange a handover | 0:58:29 | 0:58:33 | |
that guaranteed he would not suffer the fate of Gaddafi | 0:58:33 | 0:58:38 | |
or Saddam Hussein, | 0:58:38 | 0:58:40 | |
how would you replace the incredible | 0:58:40 | 0:58:44 | |
mainlining into your reward network of exceptional power? | 0:58:44 | 0:58:49 | |
There is an awful bleakness and blackness out there awaiting you. | 0:58:49 | 0:58:53 |