How to Get to Heaven with the Hutterites

In the middle of the Canadian Prairies,

100 kilometres from the nearest city,

there lives a group of people who have separated themselves

from what they refer to as "The World."

They're called Hutterites,

and this place is a colony.

Traditionally an intensely private people,

they allowed cameras in to see a way of life and faith

they believe God intended for us all.

Hutterites believe that all you could ever need in life is here

and living communally is the path to heaven.

-Hi! Good morning!

-Can we come in?

Yes, welcome to Maple Grove!

-Come on in.

-Thank you.

What you want us to show in the film?

We want you to show the simplicity,

how you can live in simplicity.

And live together in unity and peace.

That the world can learn from it.

Zach said he would explain Hutterite life and faith

and gave me permission to talk to anyone in the community.

We take care of everyone that is in our midst here.

From the cradle to the grave, we take care of them, and that's community.

We function that...everything I do,

I do for somebody else.

I don't do it for me.

And everything that somebody else does, does it for me too. You share.

You work together, for the good of everybody.

This is a protected place, then?

Yes, it's protected, in the sense that we all watch one another.

If you are two of you,

you will not do things that you would do maybe when you're alone.

And that's the way it works with us.

Just under 100 men, women, and children live in Maple Grove colony.

There are 500 colonies in North America,

and 50,000 people live this way.

The number increases every year.

The Hutterite way of life has been passed down over 500 years

and is thought to be part of a divinely structured plan.

They see communal living as a way of daily enacting

Christ's command to "Love thy neighbour."

When Jesus was asked, "What is the most important commandment?"

He said, "Love God with all your heart, with all your soul,

"and your neighbour as yourself."

And that's...

If you live in a community, that's where you can do that.

And by living this life, this guarantees you...what?

If I live a life that will be pleasing to God,

where I will follow his commandments

in everything that I do and don't do,

I expect, when I pass on from here,

-to get eternal life.

-To be in heaven?

To be in heaven with God. And he promised us.

But if you live in a colony, in a community,

and you are not living right,

and you're just in there

because of the convenience and stuff like that,

you don't love your fellow man and stuff like that,

you still have to sit beside him to eat. You have to work with him.

You do everything together...

it can be, maybe, a hell.

Being Hutterite means living and working

with virtually the same 100 people all your life.

Hutterites accept it's not easy.

Not everyone can live this way,

but it remains the ideal.

Most of the people at Maple Grove are related to Zach.

He and his wife, Lydia, have seven children and 23 grandchildren,

and most of them live here.

Zach's agreed two of his sons and their wives

should take part in the film.

The young couples have been married for three years.

We just happened to find two girls we both liked that were sisters!

We're sisters, and we married brothers,

and right now, we live in the same house.

THEY LAUGH

Cheryl and Diana come from Green Acres,

a colony about 100km away.

Hutterites can only marry Hutterites.

The limited gene pool means they'll look for a spouse

in another colony, so they're not too closely related.

These couples are third cousins,

so have known each other from childhood.

Life is pretty simple here.

We don't have to worry about...

Financial stuff...

We don't have to worry about food, about...

nothing of that sort.

I just worry about my children

and take care of them and raise them as best as I can.

And we can have as many children as we want.

I...love...you!

CHILDREN SQUEAL

The oldest person at Maple Grove is Zach's father.

Grandpa has devoted his life to his family and the colony.

Family life and caring for one another

are central to Hutterite beliefs.

In about six weeks time, he's going to be 89 years old.

He worked for us, now we work for him.

He took care of us when we were small, and now we take care of him.

Grandpa is being cared for by Sarah, one of his daughters.

She lives with him, and other members of the family help.

The elderly rarely go into old peoples' homes.

# There's a path we all can take as life we're living

# In the law of love for God sincere

# As He fills our hearts with love and love we're giving

# We will walk in love and never need to fear

-# Walk in love

-# Walk in love

-# Let love surround you

-# Let love surround you

-# As it flows from heaven above

-# As it flows from heaven above

-# Walk in love

-# Walk in love

-# Let love surround you

-# Let love surround you

# For a life that's worth the living

-# Walk in love. #

-# Walk in love. #

It's the best place to be.

It's nice to be out and not mingle with The World if you can.

We can't do it, because we've got to do business.

We've got to mingle with The World.

But we've got to keep our faith, and...

You want to be separate?

Yes, yes. And we are.

Hutterites do business with the outside world

only out of necessity, and try to be self-sufficient.

Maple Grove Farm's 4,000 acres has pigs and chickens

and a number of small manufacturing businesses.

All provide income for the community.

Hutterites have always embraced technology,

because it's essential for farming.

But they continually try to keep the outside world at arms length.

There's no TV,

and there are tight controls over the use of the Internet.

We try to insulate our people.

We don't try to isolate them.

Insulating is teaching them what is right and wrong.

That they will know what to do, what not to do,

in case, for instance, we go to town, we're in The World,

and if they have a conscience,

they will watch what they do.

They could be tempted to go and do things, go see things,

and do things that wouldn't be right.

I mean, what do you mean in particular?

Let's say, for instance,

young people going in bars and drinking

and stuff like that could be,

and going to see movies and stuff like that.

'500 years ago, Hutterites fled religious persecution.

'They believe God has called them to live separately from The World

'because of its evil influences.'

What is it that you want to be separate from, do you think?

From the lusts of the world.

Like, all the temptations and everything like that.

Like John said,

"The lusts of the world, what the eye sees and what the flesh wants."

That is what we want to avoid.

Seeing. Because if you see it,

then you will probably lust for it.

And just like it happened with our first parents, Adam and Eve,

they looked too much.

They saw it was nice, it looked good,

but it was to their downfall.

Originally from Europe, Hutterites moved to America in the late 1800s.

They still speak a German dialect, and worship in German.

At Maple Grove, they usually attend church seven days a week

and twice on Sundays.

Zach is minister for life.

He reads the same Hutterite sermons

his forefathers used hundreds of years ago.

HE READS GERMAN SERMON

TRANSLATED FROM GERMAN:

UPBEAT TUNE PLAYS FROM TANNOY

Three meals a day are eaten communally

and at the same set times each day.

Adults eat in a separate dining room, away from the children.

Men and women sit apart, and are allocated a place according to age.

It can mean they'll sit in the same seat for years,

moving only when someone new marries into the community

or a child reaches the age of 15 and is allowed to join them.

TRANSLATED FROM GERMAN:

The girls sit separately from the boys?

Yes. It's always been that way.

-I think it's more appropriate.

-In what way?

HE SIGHS

How would I say it?

I would say that...

Hmm... it's just...

I'd say it's better that they don't sit together.

Separated.

-It's the way it's always been?

-That's the way it's always...

As you look... they don't sit together.

-Every day, a child sits at the same place?

-Yes, they do.

They sit in that place every meal time.

TRANSLATED FROM GERMAN:

Amen.

On the colony, the system is, men and boys go off to work and chores,

and the women and girls are left to wash up.

Every morning after breakfast,

the elders of the colony meet at Zach's house.

All the elders are men, two of them are Zach's brothers.

They make all the day-to-day decisions about the running of the colony.

Usually, women aren't allowed to attend these meetings,

but I asked Zach if I could film, and he agreed.

Anyone who needs to go out of the colony for whatever reason

always has to ask the elders' permission.

That includes Zach's own sons, who live in this house.

I don't think.

HE REPLIES IN GERMAN

Why do people have to come and see you in the morning

and ask for permissions?

Because it is our life structure.

I mean, if everybody would go where he wants to go,

and when he wants to go, how would you control it? You couldn't.

You need to know where everyone is?

Yes, we need to know where everybody is.

And why is that, then, really?

Because of the way we are.

We are a community, and everybody should know what the other person does,

and then you always...

In every company, you have your higher-ups that know what the lower-downs are doing...

..to make it work efficiently.

We have rules and regulations, just like any other company,

any other religion.

We have rules and regulations that we would like the people to follow if they live here.

On a colony, men and women have traditional roles.

Women care for the children, work in the garden,

they cook and they constantly clean.

I could see it was important to them.

Why are Hutterite ladies so keen to clean?

We like cleanliness.

They always say cleanliness is next to godliness.

-Do you enjoy it?

-Yeah. I enjoy it very much.

'The women, they have nothing to say in our daily running of the community,

'but if there are issues relating to the female side of it,

'like their work, and stuff like that, we will consult with them

'and work according to what they think.

'The women don't have a vote, but you are listening to them?

'Well, they can... They can give their opinion.

'I mean, if they have a good opinion, we can surely think about it.'

We kind of let them run the women's side of it - the cooking,

the baking, the washing, and things like that. They arrange that.

We don't...butt in, I'd say.

-Can the women be elders?

-We have never done it.

Why is that?

We feel... If you read the Epistles of Paul,

it kind of tells us that the women should be subject to their husbands,

and stuff like that, and we kind of keep it that way.

I don't know if it will ever come that we might change,

I don't know, but...

-So, they have to be under the authority of men?

-Yes.

-What does it actually say? Do you remember what it says?

-Subject...

Paul said the women should be subject to their husbands.

I wondered how the women felt about this.

We were taught that menfolks should...

Like, Adam was born first, and God made Eve for Adam,

not Adam for Eve, so the menfolks are often...

..the head of the house, the head of the colony,

and it's not that we're not important,

we don't feel less important,

it's just they have their duties, we have our duties.

Does it work well for you,

the fact that the women are at home looking after the children?

-Absolutely.

-Yes, it does. It works really well.

There's a reason God made men a little stronger than women.

They can handle a little more physically, and all that.

I think they have a better knack of it,

of child-rearing and stuff like that, than males.

Whereas males have a better knack at hammering on steel!

But they also do a lot of the domestic cleaning and cooking as well.

-Yes.

-And the thing is, they enjoy it.

Do you think there will ever be a day where there'll be men in the kitchen on a colony?

-No.

-No.

I like the status quo.

I like the system, the Hutterite system.

I see absolutely no problem with my little girl growing up as a housewife.

Absolutely none.

-You'd like that for her?

-Yes.

And why is that?

Because that's the way I grew up, and I liked it.

And I...

If that's ever going to change...

..it's not going to be because of me.

The community's assets - land and property -

are collectively owned,

and the proceeds of labour are shared equally.

Individuals own very little.

There is a system for everything,

from cooking to storing food in the cellars.

Here, we usually have our soap.

That's the home-made soap we make maybe every second year...

with fat. Animal fat.

-Why do Hutterites have their own soap?

-Oh, it cleans...

It cleans a lot of dirt and grime.

It's very powerful soap, and we like it.

Like, if we wash dishes,

we actually put it into a kettle with water and it melts,

if it's hot it melts,

and that we use to wash dishes, so it is liquid soap.

And we even use it to wash. We grind it up and use it to wash our clothes.

Um...

We love that soap.

We have to ask for everything that's in here.

Even if we need it for cooking, we ask the head cook, and she said, "Yes. It's down there," or whatever.

So, in there is mostly...

..like dates and raisins.

The fruits are mostly in here. See the cherries?

And pineapples and all the seasonings that we need,

the dressings for the salads...

So, this is everything we need to ask for before.

-We just can't go and take it.

-You have to ask permission?

Yes, we have to ask permission.

And this is some stuff that we need daily, like pickles,

so we can go down and take some of that.

Why don't you have to ask permission in this room, but you do in the other room?

I guess things that we need every day doesn't need to ask permission,

and like, if we go and take cherry-pie filling,

or something like that, it's more expensive,

so you don't want to have the people come in and take some every day to make desserts,

so we had to have some kind of a system

to keep it under lock and key, and just ask when you need it.

-Do people get paid?

-We don't get paid individually.

It all goes into one fund, into a kitty, you would say,

and it's used for everybody's good.

Do individuals get an allowance of any sort?

We get a small allowance every month,

just to buy small things that maybe the colony won't supply, like...

We supply everything a person...

If a person needs something, she goes to the secretary and tells them, "I need it."

And if it's important, we will supply it.

There's a big difference in a need and a want.

So, how much is the allowance?

You'd have to ask... HE LAUGHS

It's not very much.

It's just a few dollars a month, just for small, little things.

The allowance is four dollars a month per adult.

Everybody is the same. There is no rich or poor here.

You share.

You work together for the good of everybody.

-Like a communist system?

-It's a religious communism.

Religious community.

Communism is forced.

This is not forced.

This is... willingly.

Sure, it's a community life. Community means communism.

Communism had central government and stuff like that.

That's kind of how we do it - we have a secretary,

we have a minister, we have people in charge of those things.

Just like the communists had.

The people had to do what those guys wanted, but with us,

if somebody wants to leave, he doesn't like it here,

he's free to leave. We don't hold him back.

A feature of Hutterite life is that each year,

one or two young people leave a colony, usually in secret.

They are referred to as "runaways".

I was told about a young man called Jordan.

He ran away from the colony,

but like so many, he returned within months.

When you leave, you leave behind everyone you love

and who loves you.

Out in the world, Hutterites often struggle.

They are used to everything being provided.

Jordan's 20, and is Zach's nephew.

The main reason I left is something different.

I mean, you show up for work, you do your work, you go home,

you eat, you go to sleep.

I mean, that's basically what they do.

What brought you back?

I don't know, I just missed...

I mean, even my neighbours, I missed them,

because they are in a sense also my family.

I mean, this whole colony is my family.

I'm kind of on a rehabilitation.

I'm not allowed to do certain things,

like I'm not allowed to leave the colony

until I am accepted fully and all that.

And what you have to do to be accepted?

Basically, they watch you, see if you're fitting in,

see if you're going to work, see if you're at breakfast,

see if you actually want to stay.

I mean, if I just came back here in the colony for a few months

just because I...

I don't know, I didn't have money outside

and then decided to leave again,

then they've noticed that and would not fully accept me.

But if they see I'm fully committed back, then they will accept me.

And I think I'm pretty fully committed.

I'm not going to run away again.

-The people are watching your behaviour?

-Yeah.

How does that feel?

Basically, it feels like every other day.

Everybody is watching everybody else.

I mean, that's part of the Hutterite culture,

everybody watching everybody else.

Jordan, since he's back, there are improvements for him.

He could do better, but he seems to enjoy what he's doing.

We gave him a job of helping a carpenter.

And hopefully... he's on probation right now,

if we want to accept him back or not, so he better make a good job of it.

How long will you give him?

It's up to him.

If he'll behave, it won't be that long.

If he misbehaves, we might push it off a bit.

Have you ever thought about what your lives would be like

if you had left the colony and if you are out in the world now?

I've never really thought about it,

because it never was something I wanted to pursue.

When we were younger, we had dreams,

but I think when you get older, you are so used to your world here,

you don't know what's happening out there.

You know, but you're not really interested, because it says...

you bloom where He planted you, and if you don't know that life,

why would you miss it? We don't.

Like, some say,

"How can you survive without TVs?"

We never had any TVs, so...

-We won't miss it.

-We don't know what it is to live with a TV.

I'm not comfortable with this outside world.

Our world is more secluded or...

-Protected.

-Yeah, we're more protected and...

there's too many things that we really don't do day-to-day,

like having to do with money stuff,

and I don't know if I could do with this.

I guess with time, you teach yourself to do stuff like that, but...

Leaving would never have been one of my things, never ever.

And I think my mom always put the fear of the Lord in us,

and we grew up in a Christian family and Christian community,

and you didn't think of wanting to go out and have good times.

You didn't.

Because a Christian shouldn't really have good times.

Have you ever thought about travelling?

I was in Alberta once, and I enjoyed the trip.

Went to visit my friends 12 hours from here.

My main goal was going there.

I wanted to see them, and a little of the mountains and all that,

and I saw them for an hour or two and then that was all I needed.

My main goal wasn't going out and seeing things, really.

I enjoyed it, but I'm no traveller.

So that was enough for me.

Well, you're very positive about colony life, that's the point.

-Yeah.

-Oh, yes.

This is the only life we know and hope for for our children as well.

It's something our forefathers started and...

And we feel that's the plan, and the way to Heaven.

We find hope in it, and happiness and contentment.

-The knowledge of salvation?

-Yes.

If we won't follow it, we feel guilty about it and that keeps nagging,

and if we try our best and do what God wants us to do,

that's where the happiness comes in, the true happiness.

The key is to get them young.

You have to start preschool, that's at two and a half.

They know a lot of Bible stories already,

and even though they might not always know what they mean,

as they grow older, "OK, that's what it means."

They're going to be our next leaders,

so we have to teach them the proper ways of doing things.

We want them to be obedient to God and...

well, to be obedient to God is number one,

and then there are rules and morals that we have.

We have to be obedient to the colony and to the church here.

Hutterite life is founded on the belief

that the needs of the community come before individual desires.

From an early age,

children are taught to surrender for the higher good.

They attend Maple Grove's own school,

but from the age of 10, they start doing colony work.

At 15, they're considered adults,

and by 18 are expected to work full-time for the colony.

We want people to work here on the place,

be separated from the world.

We need them here, and we want to build up this community,

not build up the world outside.

What if somebody wants to work outside a colony?

If he wants to work outside of the colony, he goes on his own.

-He has to leave?

-Yeah, he leaves.

We have work here for our people.

It's going into the world and being part of them

if they go outside and work, that's the main thing.

We want to keep our people here.

You have the influence of the world beside you if you work outside.

It has not turned out, there have been cases,

it has not turned out

where people spend too much time away from home on a job.

It has not turned out.

When someone leaves a colony, it's a shock to the whole community.

I met a number of mothers whose children had left

and realised that years later, they still felt bereft.

Cathy is Cheryl and Diana's mother.

She lives in Green Acres where the girls grew up,

and has seven children in all.

I enjoyed my children and what brought me the biggest heartache

is when my first son, he left the colony,

and this was very tough for both my husband and me.

He left 12 years ago.

He was around 21 or so.

And we didn't expect it. He was very happy.

-Do you remember the day he left?

-Just like today, yes.

It was very heartbreaking.

But leaving the colony like Irvine did, to me is not natural.

I mean, we get baptised, we get married

and we live together, we help each other.

With Irvine, I...

I, I'm afraid he's going to...

not make it into the Kingdom of Heaven.

The lust of the world, anything. You can fall into anything.

Like, we read our Bible every day,

but I can't say he does.

But...and if he doesn't have a direction,

what direction will he go in?

I don't want him to be lost.

I want him to...

to make it into the Kingdom of Heaven.

When Irvine left, Cheryl and Diana felt they'd lost their brother.

I know Mom prays every day. She wants him back.

You can't give up, I don't think so.

He maybe comes to visit once a year.

Some people leave 10 years, 15,

and they come back and they're happy.

But I think the more they're gone, though...

the less contact you have,

and even when some of them do come home and visit,

you see they've gained a lot of different morals

than we have, and sometimes they don't even fit in.

Like swearing or telling jokes that are not really suitable, or...

I don't know.

I just know when I'm around some of those,

I'm not relaxed around them any more.

You just sort of shy away from them.

If Irvine wants to visit your mother, he has to ask?

Yes, he phones the minister,

and usually the minister has a little chat with them to tell them.

I guess that they don't like it that they left the colony

or just a little acknowledgement,

but usually, they come and I think

they're so used to the outside world,

they don't want to stay longer than a week.

Did Irvine come to your weddings?

-No.

-He wasn't allowed to?

He was allowed to come two weeks before,

but not on the wedding day.

I became aware of another young man on the colony.

I saw him every day on his way to work.

I sensed he had something he wanted to say.

Waylan is another of Zach's nephews. He's 15.

He's still at school, but is now expected to work

seven days a week in the chicken barn.

He works every morning and every evening after school,

and at weekends.

Every day I do the same thing. It's the same every day.

I don't really like animals.

-Pardon?

-I don't like animals,

but I do it because the colony put me here.

It's my job to do it.

Do you see this as a place that you may stay all your life?

I don't think so, I'll be staying here for all my life.

You're such a long way away from everyone.

I don't know how other people that left here left.

All I know is that one went walking,

one went biking to a nearby neighbour,

asked for a ride to the nearby town, went on a bus.

That's how I think most of them left, either walking for biking.

What's your dream? What would you really...?

I'd probably be an architect or a designer.

I'd try for that.

I can't be a designer in the colony.

My teacher told me that I could try to build our next colony house,

but I like fancy, and...

..our colony houses don't want to be fancy, they want to be plain.

Every one the same.

Which...

I don't want to make.

-You want to be more creative?

-Yeah.

What would be your dream thing to be able to design?

A mansion, a big house.

I often dream of being rich in a big house.

And all the stuff I would have.

What sort of things would you like?

Electronics. I like electronics.

I often wish for an iPad, what I would do with it,

but I have to live with what I have.

That's how I was brought up.

That's how I start to live up to it.

Some people like it here.

It's good enough. But I want something bigger.

I do worry sometimes, people think of us as very narrow-minded,

which I totally feel we are not.

Oftentimes, I will think people are a lot more narrow-minded...

..when they're too open-minded,

because...uh...

..there's a time for narrow-mindedness.

I have seen the world

and I have chosen not to be part of this and that and that,

and I feel a little liberated by that.

There's my case for narrow-mindedness.

Sharon, lean on him.

Kelly is Zach's nephew.

He was over on a family visit from his colony Greenacres

on a Sunday afternoon.

Kelly's 19, and six days a week,

he works on a factory production line in his colony

but his passion is photography.

Kelly is entirely self-taught.

I knew he'd won prizes for his work

and had become known as the Hutterite photographer.

What I didn't know was, he'd struggled

to have his photos accepted by the elders in his community

and was deeply unhappy.

'In a colony, being an individual'

like a "me" or an "I" is very difficult.

You're encouraged, like everybody is encouraged to have their interests

but it's also encouraged that it's all for the greater good

and not for the good of ourselves,

and...

..I'm often baffled by that very fact

'because people see my photography as something that's very self-centred

'or individualistic, I guess.'

They see photography as being essentially non-useful,

irrelevant to our daily life.

'If my specific goal is to take photos

'and that's what a certain colony wants me for,'

it's often hard to get permission to go,

it's hard to get permission

from the Minister and the elders of the colony.

Hutterite life is in a sense...

it's what makes my photos unique but it's also my heaviest shackle.

'I'm very limited in the choice of styles'

or even what specific subject I can photograph.

How could you develop your photography, do you think?

Hmm...

I'm kind of stumped, though.

I knew that Kelly had a sister

who'd left their colony some years earlier.

'I think it's one of the... I guess,'

easiest way is to leave.

The easiest way to open up new doors

both in my life and in terms of photography

is just to leave the colony

because while I'm here,

it's kind of like a cocoon with a butterfly in it,

and I guess the butterfly is waiting to come out.

MUSIC: "Hallelujah" performed by Jeff Buckley

# Well, I heard there was a secret chord

# That David played and it pleased the Lord

# But you don't really care for music, do you?

# Well, it goes like this, the fourth, the fifth

# The minor fall and the major lift

# The baffled king composing Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelu-u-jah

# Your faith was strong but you needed proof

# You saw her bathing on the roof

# Her beauty in the moonlight overthrew you

# She tied you to her kitchen chair

# She broke your throne and she cut your hair

# And from your lips she drew the Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelu-u-jah... #

There he is.

Kelly had hatched a plan.

He'd wanted to film himself leaving

and asked me to be there with his sister.

# Maybe there's a God above

# But all I've ever learned from love

# Was how to shoot somebody who outdrew you... #

-ZACH:

-We don't force anybody to stay here, to live here.

It's all voluntary.

Of course, the young people are not to blame that they're born here

but once they get up to age,

they have a choice to do whatever they want.

We don't put the leash around their neck and keep them here.

They should make their own decisions.

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelu-jah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah

# Hallelujah!

# Hallelujah!

# Hallelujah... #

You're gone.

You're answering the phone calls and texts.

If Mom calls me on my phone, you're answering!

Especially Mom. I'm not talking to her today.

"Where are you?"

# Halleluuu-jah. #

Go and find out the hard way, maybe,

what is right and what is wrong,

and he might learn something that he hadn't learned here, or she.

Denise is Kelly's sister.

She's 23 and ran away from Greenacres colony when she was 16.

She now lives 1,000 kilometres away in Calgary.

Over the years,

Denise has successfully made her way in the world -

a job, an apartment, her own car,

and she's funding herself through university.

She's not allowed to visit her family at Christmas

and she always has to ask the minister's permission

to see her own parents.

The Hutterite belief is that

the way to heaven is by living communally, isn't it?

Yeah, so...

Where does that leave you?

Going to hell.

That's my perception. When I first left,

when I was home, to put it plain, they said,

"If you're born on the colony and you know the ways of the colony,

"if you leave, you're going to hell,

"because the only way to heaven is the colony."

'Right now, I'm still viewed as,

'I think in a lot of ways, immature and a bad influence.

'I would tear people away, as they will say I did with my brother

'so it would make it, I know this meeting with my brother

'will make it even more difficult for me to go visit in the future.'

Everything's supposed to be about community and being together,

so when somebody tries to be an individual,

which is, I think, the number one case is my brother,

he's trying so hard to be as individual,

he tries to bring in his own style,

he's always been told to cut his hair differently,

he's always wanted it different,

he's always had his uniqueness about him,

he's wanted to try new things, and that's how I was.

I wanted to be my own person,

and it's just not the way it is back home. You...

It's as a unit or you can't fit in, it just doesn't work for you.

'I think they think once you leave,

'you're going to fall into, you know, drugs and bad, shady stuff

'and bad people and everything, and it's a choice you have to make.

'I don't have problems with stuff like that.

'It's how you build your life when you leave.

'I want him to realise he can follow his dreams and do what he's good at

'and be happy and not let somebody control your life.

'It takes time to not let it affect you so much what your parents say,

'and with time, I want him to find that too,

'to just realise, you don't have to do what makes your parents happy.

'As much as they want that,

'you have to find what makes you happy in life.

'Till then, you won't really be happy.

'You can't please other people.'

Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd