Scottish Football: The Debate

Is te Scottish game on the road to recovery? Or have our football

fortunes still to bottom out? Where has it all gone wrong? And do we

have the right plans in place to put it right? Let's see if we can

get some answers to Scottish football's problems in the next 50

minutes. With the help of Scotland manager Craig Levein, SFA chief

executive Stewart Regan, Hibs chairman Rod Petrie, Falkirk

manager Steven Pressley and last night's documentary maker Jim

Traynor. And lots of other football people with us tonight, all of whom

have a vested interest in getting football back on track. This is a

critical time for Scottish football. Our last World Cup outing is 14

years old. Our clubs have fallen down the football rankings. Moves

had been made to improve our footballing fortunes. A wind of

change is blowing through the game. Central to its future is finding

more young footballers and developing their talents in the

right way. Football has lots of other big issues - finance,

facilities, the structure and running of the game, and its

popularity with supporters. We all have plenty of questions, let's try

and get some answers. Since our football documentary and this

debate were lined up, the Rangers crisis has blown up and we can't

open up a discussion about the big issues in the Scottish game without

touching on the impact Rangers' financial problems have right

around the country. Stuart Lovell is with us from PFA

Scotland. You were at Murray Park today to witness what must be a

painful process? It certainly has. A lot of people have tried to come

to terms with the fact a lot of clubs in the UK are in

administration. A lot of players have handled themselves extremely

well over the last few weeks and that is starting to hit home that

this club is in a dire situation and there having to make massive

compromises to keep the players. it has been slow and agonising, has

it not been, before the administrators do what they have to

do? The administrators have a job to do but a difficult one, to make

sure their run the club and avoid putting up -- totting up any more

losses. Their responsibility is to keep the club on an even keel. From

our perspective, the players' union, we're trying to make sure the

playing staff is kept together. The talks have been ongoing for a good

while now. We would argue that is the right thing to do and we have

to praise the administrators that they wanted to at least hear what

we had to say on behalf of the players and hopefully we will find

a compromise. Jim Traynor, two players have gone on Palais, what

happens next? For -- von Halle. I think some of the players who are

expected to take these massive cuts, the high earners, 75%, middle

earners, 50%. Even if you're an a high-wage, and 75% reduction is

massive, but these will keep job losses to a minimum. One of the

delays today has been that the players are saying, if we do this,

and save some jobs, which we are willing to do, then we want

something changed in our contract which says that when the transfer

window opens in the summer, the club can set a fee and if that is

offered, the club cannot prevent them from leaving. The new owner

could not prevent them because then they could get their money back.

What is the impact of this on Scottish football as a whole?

Obviously, a difficult time for Scottish football and Rangers are a

big club. It pits the game under pressure and it has to be viewed

negatively. What we're trying to do his work alongside the

administrators to understand the issue. We have our own independent

inquiry taking place as to what has happened at Rangers. Unfortunately,

I am not able to con -- comment on the detail of that. We're hoping

for a positive outcome for all concerned. Neil Doncaster, lots of

inquiries on going just now. Too little, too late? From our point of

view, all of the evidence has been given and the tax case and we are

in a position where the SPL board can set its own inquiry. That is

now under way. It is difficult to comment at the moment about that.

That inquiry fault be resolved as quickly as possible and as soon as

we ever position to comment, we'll do so. Could one of the controlling

bodies not have had more of an influence and averted this?

point of it is, it has been alleged there is a has been a non-

disclosure that perhaps should have been picked upon. It is important

we give the inquiry time to take place and if a breach of our rules

is discovered, we will act on it. Lots of clubs are being impacted,

one of them being your club, Dundee United. These are sad times for up

Glasgow Rangers just now but we hope that somewhere along the line,

some good can come of it. We have to worry about the people losing

their jobs and that is hopefully kept to a minimum. We need a strong

Rangers and Celtic for the SPL and Scottish football. What we have

already seen as a lot of people saying that the game would survive

and of course it would without Rangers. Here we have three clubs

already, Hearts and unfair one, affected by the financial Troubles.

-- Dunfermline. Those who think the game can thrive without Rangers or

Celtic for that matter, one of the big two, this should tell and

warned everybody what it would be like if they're not with us.

you concerned about how this was allowed to happen? How insight is a

wonderful thing. It is easy to look back and say, what if? It is

important to establish the facts and as Neil Doncaster said, the

independent inquiry is looking into what happened and when they get to

the bottom of that, if it has been found there is a breach of her

articles, we will take the appropriate sanctions. It is

important that that process is a letter continued. There will be

stuffed to learn afterwards and there will be articles to say what

we can do differently in the future. If there is non-disclosure of

information that should have been disclosed, it is difficult to go

back and say, how could we have found that out sooner, without

undertaking huge investigations into every director across Scottish

football. Their stuff to be learned but we have to get the facts first.

Rob Petrie, some people are inevitably the lighting and this at

the moment. Does Scottish football need Rangers? Scottish football

needs successful clubs which are well managed and a lot of clubs and

the SPL have taken their own share of pain and budgets. I think this

needs to be maintained throughout, integrity, to ensure the

competition is there. Each club has its own budget and own resources

and the important thing is the sporting integrity and making sure

the competition is balanced and fair. We will see Rangers continue

to play with a depleted squad again SCOP -- clubs which they played

with a stronger squad. We need to ensure fixtures are for fault and

that is fair and balanced. -- fulfilled. Watching Scotland

play in major tournament finals has become a distant memory. It used to

be a happy habit. World Cup 1998 was the last one. That's 14 years

and counting. What a goal by Strachan! To McCoist,

it's a goal for Scotland! That Craig Burley, he's done it! 1-1.

Don Hutchison! Scotland have We should bottle that, that does

you good. Was it complacency about qualification which prompted the

slump? It is difficult to say exactly what the problem was. You

have to remember, some of those qualifications were done by the

skin of Our teeth. I do not think we have been strong qualifiers for

a while now. There has been a steady decline. The challenge now

is for everybody in this room to get us back in that position where

we are regularly qualifying. The king back on it, I think we can

recognise we where punching above her weight for some time, to

qualify for so many call up -- competitions. That is where we want

to be. Football is a national team and we want to be playing at the

top table. We need the support of everybody pulling together. Does

this laid down the ranking give us tougher groups and then the

qualification each time that little bit more difficult? I think what is

important for me is that there is a realisation or a recognition that

we can alter some things in Scottish football to give us better

chances of qualifying. I feel that we have had the bottom and are on

the way back up again. The points he made at the start, certainly we

have been improving. I see better- quality players coming into the

group now that I have. I am very hopeful for the future. I get to

see it at the coalface and work with the players. I am very pleased

with the way things have been going. A former Scotland player, Stephen

Pressley, do you share that optimism? First, what we must

recognise is that we often refer to the glory years of Scotland as the

late 1960s, the Seventies. During that period, we did not qualify for

any major tournaments and they must remember that. I am of the opinion

that we have bottomed out. Through all of the difficulties with

regards to financial plates of many clubs, one real positive will be

that many clubs will look back to their young players and the

development there, and I think at this moment in time, we have seen

some very good young players coming through. I believe it is the only

I think, when the Premier League was introduced in England, there

was a desire to bring in a lot of foreign players from overseas. We

saw Arsenal, at one point, a few years ago, playing 11 foreigners in

the team. A lot of foreigners coming in. In my opinion that kept

Scot lads out of the team. They weren't playing regular football at

the highest level. The downturn in the economy has given players an

opportunity, Stevens played a number of young lads at Falkirk and

their game is getting better. That is helping Craig in building a

strong squad for the future. went through a period when we were

bringing in foreign players to our own game, our own teams. They

weren't particularly good. Like in Rangers case, they may have to pay

for that not. They were awash with foreign players who were not

particularly talented. That kept Scottish players out. They had no

chance of coming through any system and going down south. They couldn't

get into their own teams because we were playing second and third rate

foreigners. That was wrong. concern on that, if there is a

reason of financial stability and income to club clubs that we revert

back to that. Unless now we make major changes in our game. I don't

think we should go back down that road. You can't say though, because

of we are in the European Union, you can't say you can't come and

play here or work here. You can't do that. We can use common sense

and look at our own young players and think, two seasons, properly

nurtured through in and out of the team he will be good as that person

you are looking to spend money on. We have a tendency to forget the

experiences of today. The plight of Rangers we will forget that quickly

and we move and never make change. I will give you a copy of that

documentary and can you play that. The new performance strategy that

the Scottish FA recognises the need for home-grown talent and rewards

the clubs trying to bring players through their own academy system.

The man tasked with making major changes in the Scottish game is

here, how soon will we see the fruits of your labour? We are

starting a project with 12-year- olds. You have to wait at least

eight years. We are intensifying the programme for the current young

players with better programmes. We are trying to achieve more

academies to do a better job. I'm positive we will see some results.

The big change will come in maybe five, six, seven years. In the past

we didn't have to put too much thought into producing good players.

Great players they seemingly rolled off an assembly line. Not any more.

Youth development has become a big issue and a big challenge. Nobody

could argue that the standard of player at clubs isn't as good as it

was even five years ago or ten years ago. We don't have to go back

20 years. Five years. The life blood is young players. They can

grow to be real assets. That helps football clubs. Money changes over.

Had hasn't been common place in the last few years. The use of the

academy you spend a lot of money, if we want to survive we have to

get every time new players. I don't think schools help either. For me,

you do maybe one or two sessions of physical education a week. You are

there four, five, six times doing maths and English. If you forgot

your PE kit there wasn't much said. If you went to maths and didn't do

anything, you were sent to the headmaster. It's not enough.

Society has become more affluent. Football is not the beall and end

all in a lot of young people's lives. Have the computer generation

and mobile phone generation. The kids have to get interested in

football again. You spoke about it in the documentary last night. How

badly have we been getting it wrong with youth development? Not so

wrong. There are always talented players in any country, it's how

you want to develop them and how you bring them up in good

facilities in a good environment with the right philosophy. This is

were we can win. What are the right things? What are the wrong things?

If you are working with kids it's not about winning, but developing

skills and basic skills, technique and awareness. I'm not sure

everybody understands that if you see the behaviour of parents and

coaches along the line. They only want to win, it doesn't matter how.

You have to work from a philosophy to develop players to the top level.

Intensify training programmes and make them train on better

facilities. That is essential. people understand what a

performance strategy is? I'm not sure they do. I agree with the

point Mark made. I notice in Jim's documentary last night, there was

an interesting quote from the St Mirren striker, Steven tau Thomson

talking about when he was a kid, "I don't remember emphasis on

technique". I don't think anything has changed. I have a young lad of

eight who is playing with a team in Edinburgh. I can only reinforce the

point that Mark made, it's about results. Even Attapatu that age

they are interested in winning than working out about technique. I wish

people would reinforce the word "pass". Try and get them to pass

and pass and pass again. There is still this attitude from the

coaches which is, you know, even though this is only under 9s, we

still have to win. You are talking about changing a philosophy?

Passing is better than to kick the ball away. It's important they are

allowed to dribble. That they are allowed to show their qualities

that they can make their own decisions to establish a better

awareness. The top players are all clever players. They are not...

It's not only about technique, which is the most important thing,

it's about decision making. If you shout at kids, "do this, do that",

they will not make their own decisions. Having done that

documentary we did one 20 years ago, that is why we re-visited. 20 years

ago when we did it, you got the impression that because things were

going along nicely, we were qualifying for major finals, that

they were saying, we will do this and we will do that. There wasn't

really a will. You got that impression. This time, I must say,

I think there is a greater consensus that maybe it's because

we bottomed out. There is a greater consensus among everybody, the

governing bodies, and the clubs, to get together and do something about

this. I think that is the thing that encourages them. That is the

most important thing for me, having been involved in club management

and moving to the SFA. There hasn't been a great relationship between

the clubs and SFA. This has been part of the problem. The SFA are

important in Scottish football, the clubs are important in Scottish

football. We can't have one working towards a goal and the other not.

This, for the first time, the two organisations... That is what I

found doing that programme. I always believe, I know clubs have

their own agendas and they have to look after themselves, we have a

greater responsibility. Nothing, nothing does it for the entire

country like the national team succeeding. Falkirk have gone down

the road of developing uer own players. Is that what you wanted to

do or financial necessity? A little bit of both. We were forced down

that road because of the financial plight of the football club. The

Academy had been put in place for seven years. It takes seven or

eight years, like Mark says, before you see the fruits of that. The one

thing I will say, I disgreet with Stuart. There we are doing things

right at grassroot level. Many clubs are working properly in the

development of the young player in teaching them the correct habits.

There can be further improvement. I think one of the problems as well

is not in the development of the young player, but when they come to

a more senior level, we must continue that development and

continue that philosophy in asking the players to play in the same way

as they have been taught within the system. What generally happens in

Scotland is they are schooled in the manner to pass the ball at a

young age. When it comes to the top end of the game, we win at all

costs. We win at all costs. This is one of the arguments I have with

regards the largest league structure in Orde not to have such

a degree of pressure on managers to win at all costs. It takes time to

implement a philosophy. That is not relistic. I disagree. When it comes

to the top level. A manager is employed by a football club, the

job is to win. That is the manager's job. Now... The point I'm

making. Some managers, whether you agree with it or disagree with it,

win by playing the long ball game. Some managers win by playing like

Barcelona. For me, development of players is giving the player all of

the tools necessary to play whatever style of football the

manager at a particular club wants them to play. So, it's development

that I believe we are talking about here. I disagree with that. I think

there is a correct way to play the game. You and I both agree we like

to see football played... Absolutely. Managers, when they get

a job, the pressure on them is to win. Of course. If they don't win

within a certain period of time they get moved on. For me, the

players have to be capable. That is a development job. Capable with

every style. Mark made reference to the long ball game, we don't want

to teach them that. If we want to school them in a certain manner.

When it comes to top level football we must play in that manner. If a

manager wants to because he is under pressure, doesn't want to,

but feels he must, it's the only way, maybe he is panicking, he

thinks that is the way I will get results against this team. If it's

a long ball. We play a long ball the player can't control it. If you

have the tools you will be able to do that. It won't be attractive.

can all find young players and educate them and bring them through

academies it's the integration into the first team. What happens at

that point? Absolutely. To our shame we did away with the reserve

league which was a steppingstone before going into the first team.

We need to join that up again to get an opportunity for these

players to get a proper path way into the first team. It's down to

the individual manager... If we are failing anywhere... I'm encouraged

because everybody I spoke to in that documentary, there was that

consensus we should do it this way. Were we are failing, you may say

it's a government problem, it's a social problem, it is, football is

part of the social fabric of the country, the life blood was the

schemes in the streets, which we don't have, obviously. We skill is

have the schemes. We have social exclusion and social deprivation.

So many families living below the poverty line. Football is becoming

a middle-class sport. The kids in the scheme can't afford it play

football. If we gave them back somehow, even through the schools,

it gives them something to aspire to, something to believe in. I

think that football has a Can I get to John Murray. Was your

job but Hearts in producing young players submerged for a while with

the big influx of foreign talent there? We had five Academy players

playing against Rangers on Saturday. Has the climate changed

considerably? It has and will drastically change in the next 18

months as well. The. Jim Traynor made about their schemes, you have

400,000 kids playing football. Very few are playing football on the

schemes. I think the issue is wider than that. I think Scotland's lost

its way as far as children are concerned and sport, never mind

football. If you look at schools across Scotland at the moment, we

struggle to get two hours of physical activity per week in at

school. It is fine to talk about developing a meet players but they

get the gene pool of players which will become elite, they have to be

doing exercise on a regular basis. They have to have a routine and

have to be encouraged and it starts for me at school. We have to get

back to basics and have more physical activities in schools.

speak to Tom Smith from Hutchison Vale. Is your club, or other clubs

like cures, given her rightful place in the structure of the game?

I do not think so. When all the changes were made when the new

system came in in 1989, we had applied, because we would rather

not play for trophies. We work hard at a grassroots level. The years

between six and 12 I would say are the golden learned the years for

children. What we would rather do best not to play for trophies. We

would rather produce the players without the pressure of having to

when, as Stuart Lovell said earlier. What we do is we have a for a side,

six-a-side system, where the ball was not allowed off the surface.

What you're trying to do in at all football education is empower the

child. The hard work is done in the training ground and it is about

letting a -- taking a step back and letting them make mistakes, because

that is a part of development. We talked about Rangers at the

start of the programme but they're not the only club with financial

issues. Bet is widespread at the top of the game and money matters

more than ever before. If I went to my chairman and said,

I want to take a player in, there is frustration if be directed

towards youth development. I have every sympathy with our clubs have

to stretch those finances as much as possible. We work in an economic

climate that is very difficult to compete with other clubs. When I

first came to this team, we could compete with the Premiership but

that is gone now. We do not have the advertising or hospitality of a

few years ago, and that is all clubs. We are badly affected by the

economic situation the country finds itself in.

A man who keeps a close eye on Scottish football finances is Neil

Patey. What is the current broad picture among Scotland's top

football clubs? It may seem strange given these last few weeks but if

you look at the last decade, Scottish football is in a better

position than the first half of the decade the King that profitability

or debt levels. This apparent the deal falling over, the recession

hitting has caused the situation for the last few years, but they

are doing better than at the start of the decade when the ever more

clubs facing administration. We're not too bad. Perform more

efficiently at the moment but some of them carrying big debts? Yes.

The worry is that clubs have got better at adapting to declining

turnover and cutting the cost base. Do you get into a downward spiral?

Can club somehow be creative at the top level so that they can start

increasing revenue? We have spoken of SPL clubs, what about clubs and

the Scottish Football League? Are the cutting profitability? I am

glad you mentioned the Scottish Football League because we're the

biggest organisation in terms of delivery of football. We have two

national cup competitions, under 17 and Under 19 spitball, so we punch

above our weight. -- football. Most other clubs are having to live

within their means because there is no other choice. There is no

television income. Her window to the world is the press and we thank

them for all they do and the money that does come into the Scottish

Football League. We're doing a lot behind the scenes to ensure that

the SPL continues to punch above its weight bringing in as much as

we can from government and other facilities through sponsorship, and

focusing very heavily on the community. There are only two clubs

in Scotland who can actually sell out side of their town. The

marketing opportunity for small clubs is within their community.

The work is hard work but you have to get out there and engage with

the local community, engage with the local business community. Make

the S -- SFL clubs the core of football and indeed sport. We need

a lot of things to help that along the way such as more of pitches.

You begin to see where the Belmont is coming in Scottish football. I

would like to compliment Stephen Pressley. Falkirk where credit to

the SPL of this here and the average age of the team at their

semi-final was 19. That is great testament to the work going on. The

SPL clubs are having to work within their means and work creatively

with their youth development programmes. We are beginning to see

some real positive things happening. Will the SPL as an organisation

have to contemplate the possibility of life without Rangers? Trying to

look into a crystal ball is difficult. That is not what we

should be doing. We apply our rules and live with the consequences of

those rules. Financially, the SPL isn't a good place. We have agreed

a five-year deal for live broadcast rights which has 24% up on last

year. We're looking to draw as much money up -- as we can into a member

clubs. We hope we can draw more and more money in at a time when the

economy is under pressure. We look to enhance that quality on the

pitch and enhance the speeds are going to matches.

Are we too dependent on television income? Can that be a get-out

clause for not co-operating clubs properly financially? Every club

need a budget and has to work that out and work within it. It is easy

to put cost on the bottom line and revenue as a thing which is

variable. Season-ticket income is vitally important and is the

lifeblood of any club. They cannot afford to pay any more for the

football and the problem we have at the moment is that television and

the dislocation of games upset supporters. We have had four games

televised since the start of the season and they have had four

different kick-off times. Supporters what consistency in

terms of 3pm on Saturday for the football. If it has to be

dislocated for football, some certainty is required for when they

are played. Television and supporters together working with

the clubs should be a combination which gives the club's more income.

It is seen as a negative at the moment and we have to turn it into

positive, getting consistency for kick-off times might help. Looking

at consistency with the broadcasters might help. We want to

improve this for all stakeholders in the game. Let's hear from a

command up fan. His football value for money? That really depends on

who you are watching on any particular day. I think overall,

the price to get into any game just now is over and above what people

can sustainably afford unless the Dubai season ticket, which will be

cheaper in the long term. Anything above �20 is asking too much for

your man in the street. We look earlier at that becoming a middle-

class game. That really strikes a chord with us now because crowds

are going down because they are spending so much money actually

going to games. This is hard up -- it is hard to justify that your

family that all that money is going to leisure. You're looking to go to

other things and saying, it will take me �50 to go to the football

with my boy. It is not on. We have just lost our season tickets for

next season -- set our season tickets for next season. The

average price for attending a match for her average season ticket is

�12 a game. The football clubs are trying very hard to get supporters

to the game. Attendance within the stadium is vital. Every football

club needs the support has to engage it, not just at times of

crisis but to help and sustain the clubs. You're doing advertisements

and refereeing... The challenge is that football is too expensive. If

you buy a season ticket, it will cost you �12 a game as opposed to

some of their head line ticket prices. That loyalty is vital in

going forward and taking the game forward so we can encourage

everyone to be there. It is a far better spectacle for television

with a live audience in the stadium. I just wanted to say, I think

everything in our game is driven by television money. Not what is best

for our game as a whole. I hear Rob Petrie talking about supporters

being the life blood of her game. We actually need to listen to our

supporters. 85% -- we have been talking about change in the

structure but do we listen? have been intent and jumping the

gun all night and moving the discussion. Can I say that going

forward, what will come at more and more or over the coming years as

financial fair play. --, it. Football has a simple business

really with money coming in and you spend that money. You have to make

sure you do not spend more until you have it. Clubs had been chasing

the dream and spending to achieve success. We have to get value for

that money. We do have to get value and unfortunately, when you're

spending and fans like to see big- name players and like to think

their club is ambitious and wants success, to cover the cost of that,

they have to charge at ticket price to do that. It is a bit of a

vicious circle because unless you do that, you cannot cover your

costs and you end up in a difficult position. I think the secret of

handing for word is to focus on home-grown talent, built from the

academies and actually try to bring fans in to watch that home-grown

There are too many bodies. Getting it from three to two would be an

improvement. There are historic reasons why the SPL probbing away

from the SFL. There is no reason why you can't have a league that

covers everybody. Self-interest is a big thing in the SPL. There has

to be a compromise in there for what is best for football. No doubt

in my mind the league could go to 16 maybe. From the players point of

view, it would be better you wouldn't be playing against the

same teams all the time. Having been a manager and playing in the

First Division with St Johnstone we finished second a couple of times,

it's the only league in the world were second counts for nothing.

don't think changing leagues or changing cosmetic aspects of it

will change football, it's about footballers. Alan, do we get too

over excited about the structure of the game, should we just find

players? No, I think the fans and the game agree with Steven, nine

out of ten fans would rather see a 16 or 18 team league. They want to

see more competition. The way to get more competition, fans believe,

is by re-distributing the wealth in the game. At the present moment, a

third of the total money in the SPL kitty at the end of the season goes

to the top two teams. That's about �5 million out of �15 million. We

feel that if that money was re- distributed there would be greater

competition and it would be more likely that fans would want to

watch the games. Are the fans not telling you in big numbers now they

want a bigger league? There has to be a balance between what

supporters want and what is affordable. By our calculations

moving to a 16 team league, which is the most popular number out,

there would cost Scottish football �20 million. If that is a price

people are willing to pay, fine. How do you calculate that �20

million? 30 games rather than 38. In terms of big TV games the

product will be less valuable to broadcasters. That is a robust

figure. That will mean much poorer quality on the field of play. That

in turn will put pressure on attendances. That is very, very

difficult place to be in. I think there is a very important role to

listen to supporters and hear what they have to say and what they

wanted and, at the same time, the people who manage the finances they

have to make sure whatever we decide is affordable. Getting that

balance right is a key thing. is a cliche about supporters being

the most important people in noob football, do we listen to them?

don't listen to them. The debate is whether or not we need to focus on

bringing them back through the gates or do we just become more and

more reliant on TV money? I think the life blood of Scottish football

is by getting the supporters back through the gates. You know, I know

Neil there talks about �20 million deficit, surely, we have to reverse

the cycle, the more people we get through the gate, then the game

becomes stronger. We could save money by turning three governing

bodies into twofplt we have been talking about that for years. How

close are we to a resolution? are making progress. We have a

blueprint at the moment that we have been consulting on. We are

making progress. There will be more information on that, I'm sure, in

the coming weeks. I think, you know, to go back to the point on league

reconstruction, I think we get too hung up on numbers. For me, it's

not about one number in a top division. If that was the case you

would have one standard size across every single country in Europe. We

haven't, we have 10s, 12s, 20s and 16s. It's important to have a

competitive tier, and strengthening the clubs that can come up so they

compete at the highest level. It's the bridge between the League

Premier League and the fist division and making sure that can

thrive and be successful for the future. Do you have fears what a

merger between SPL and SFL would mean? I don't have any fears. We

ran a one league organisation for 100 years. In 1998 that the

organisations decided to go down a different route. Does it make sense

to revert to were they -- to where they were? It will bring sinneringy.

If it created play-offs from the top of the Premier League and

bottom. It would provide refreshment. There may be marketing

opportunities. We run three leg leagues of 10 with play-offs. With

two weeks to go we had 22 clubs for something to play for because of

their play-off systems. That generates excitement. We know how

big and important play-offs are. The thing we are lacking in the

lower leagues is income. As I say, we have to go back to what our

roots our, community, young Scottish talent and bringing people

back to the game with affordable prices in the way we will do with

the Scottish Cup. �20 is the standard price for a ticket for the

communities League Cup final. �10 for under 16. The semis were �15

and �5. Less than a standard SPL game. I think that the play-offs,

we have to look at play-offs everywere. Fans want play-offs. We

are ignoring that plea as well from fans. They want play-offs. They are

exciting. We could get extra income. You could televise them. I don't

know, perhaps, do a separate deal, depending on the play-offs and

depending on who is in them. We need to listen to the fans. Whether

to go to 16 or not, I'm not convinced, were to extend the

league we have to listen. Neil was saying, when you were having the

review, it took nine months. The status quo was not an option, we

were told. Here we still have the status quo. There was this online

survey taking -- taken by the SPL. Hundreds of thousands of people

going off... I didn't mean meet one person who knew about that survey

much I don't believe we are engaging with fans. We have to. I

would quite look forward to two organisations, the SFL and any one

of these two, that would be fine by me. We have talked about the

football structure, finance, youth development and the national team.

It's time now to round things up and point the way towards hopefully

a more successful Scottish football future. The reason why in Germany

it's better, every club, everyone wants to work together. That's what

you must d with Glasgow Rangers, we want to do it together. Then you

have a big chance to do it. dwell on the negativities. There

are postives out there. Put facilities in place. There are good

young players. What we are blessed with, we have terrific managers and

coaches. If supporters know that we are going to be bringing kids in.

We are going to be bringing through Scottish players, this is the only

way forward for our country at the present moment, because we can't

generate the level of finance that is necessary, I think they would

fully understand that. There is a great love of the game in Scotland

by everyone. We don't have a da vine right to be at the top table

at football. We have to earn it. With the right people progressing

the game further than we are, the future is looking better than what

it was. Thats with a vote of confidence in the SFA from Neil

Lennon. Can we conker our self- interest? It needs that, doesn't

it? Can we afford not to, that is the question? The development of

young players is, for me, the way ahead for Scottish football. Steven

has proved if you work hard, Hibs have produced players, Hearts, Old

Firm have produced players. We need to work even harder. That is what I

firmly believe. We need to work very hard to start producing young

players. Effectively, they are cheaper. As much as we talk about

finances at football clubs, you put a young kid through your system. It

cost you money to bring him through. He gets into your team. The wages

are lower, there is a chance of sell yon value. Every club in

Scotland is a selling club. There is a bigger league next door.

Concentrate on developing players. Developing players brings fans back.

Nothing better than supporters like to see than a young player getting

an opportunity, young Scottish player getting an opportunity at

their clubs. They love that. It's important what is happening right

now. With the new found believe belief in each other. It's very

important that we continue to work together and work very hard to

produce players. You don't think we will be having this programme in

2032 and still posing the same questions? I hope not. Looking back,

what was very encouraging about the German system is that all clubs

came together for the benefit of the German game and all worked

closely together in the same strategy, in terms of developing

good young players. They all moved forward together. That is important

to our game here. That we all try and help each each other to develop

young players. If they can do it in Germany, we can do it here?

years ago we looked at different systems abroad. Everybody in the

Scottish game said, yes, we will work towards that. We didn't. As I

said earlier, I'm greatly encouraged there is this

willingness now, from all parties, to work together, club level,

international level, to work together and do the right things. I

was impressed with the enthusiasm. I believe them this time. I think

that we are heading in the right direction. I think that can only

make us better. Therefore, we should have a better chance. Can I

make another point. I do believe that the clubs have learnt a lesson.

You know, a lot of clubs spent a lot of money from the 2000, even

before 2000, 96/97, everybody chased the dream. All the clubs in

Scotland chased the dream. We had Santa deal were it looked like we

would get more money. The clubs have learnt how to control their

finances. They are getting better at that. A lot of the debt clubs

are carrying is historical. There is a new realisation we need our

feet on the ground and work hard with our own players. It's fair to

say we could talk all night about the way ahead for Scottish football.