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US society and its military. | 0:00:00 | 0:00:01 | |
This special documentary makes reference to some distressing | 0:00:01 | 0:00:03 | |
historical events. | 0:00:03 | 0:00:04 | |
This is a story about the word "hero". | 0:00:06 | 0:00:08 | |
Who uses it? | 0:00:08 | 0:00:09 | |
Who's called it? | 0:00:09 | 0:00:10 | |
Less than 1% of Americans served in Iraq and Afghanistan, but the | 0:00:10 | 0:00:13 | |
support for them is unequivocal. | 0:00:13 | 0:00:17 | |
They are lauded in speeches, they are thanked for their service, | 0:00:17 | 0:00:19 | |
they are called heroes. | 0:00:19 | 0:00:28 | |
To honour you, the heroes. | 0:00:28 | 0:00:29 | |
So why are some vets pushing back against this? | 0:00:29 | 0:00:31 | |
Many veterans of our generation really balk | 0:00:31 | 0:00:37 | |
at the term hero, saying, no, I was just doing my job. | 0:00:37 | 0:00:40 | |
I've done it, I've stopped doing it. | 0:00:40 | 0:00:41 | |
We don't need parades and celebrations, we need people to give | 0:00:41 | 0:00:44 | |
us an opportunity when we come home. | 0:00:44 | 0:00:46 | |
It often makes the veterans themselves feel uncomfortable. | 0:00:46 | 0:00:48 | |
I'd be embarrassed if someone called me a hero | 0:00:48 | 0:00:50 | |
for joining the Marine Corps. | 0:00:50 | 0:00:53 | |
There's also a sense of guilt that comes with it, I think. | 0:00:53 | 0:01:00 | |
They worry the word is becoming devalued. | 0:01:00 | 0:01:01 | |
That it takes away from true heroes. | 0:01:01 | 0:01:03 | |
That it obscures real issues that need to be addressed. | 0:01:03 | 0:01:05 | |
But what does this mean for the relationship | 0:01:05 | 0:01:07 | |
between civilians and veterans? | 0:01:07 | 0:01:12 | |
Are we going to push back too hard that we swing the other way, where | 0:01:12 | 0:01:16 | |
it's like, well, screw you guys? | 0:01:16 | 0:01:18 | |
I had a close friend, we had children exactly the same age, so, | 0:01:25 | 0:01:28 | |
you know, Barry and I helped coach the soccer team together. | 0:01:28 | 0:01:32 | |
We knew each other for about eight or ten years. | 0:01:32 | 0:01:35 | |
Sleepovers with the kids overnight. | 0:01:35 | 0:01:44 | |
One evening, the wives were talking and realised their husbands | 0:01:44 | 0:01:46 | |
had both been Marines in Vietnam. | 0:01:46 | 0:01:48 | |
We were both Marines in Vietnam and didn't know it | 0:01:48 | 0:01:50 | |
for eight or ten years. | 0:01:50 | 0:01:51 | |
That was the atmosphere back then. | 0:01:51 | 0:01:53 | |
We never talked about being in the Vietnam War. | 0:01:53 | 0:01:55 | |
You kept your mouth shut. | 0:01:55 | 0:01:57 | |
Did society use the word hero at all? | 0:01:57 | 0:02:00 | |
How was it used in the context? | 0:02:00 | 0:02:02 | |
No. | 0:02:02 | 0:02:13 | |
# How beautiful our heroes proved #. | 0:02:13 | 0:02:16 | |
It's to the country's credit they don't do that any more. | 0:02:16 | 0:02:18 | |
The pendulum may have swung too far. | 0:02:18 | 0:02:20 | |
Now everybody is a hero instead of a villain. | 0:02:20 | 0:02:22 | |
That's not true either. | 0:02:22 | 0:02:23 | |
I think all of them, all the veterans are here | 0:02:23 | 0:02:26 | |
because they volunteer alone, just to keep our safety here back home. | 0:02:26 | 0:02:31 | |
That's why we have Veterans Day, to celebrate the heroes and they can | 0:02:31 | 0:02:34 | |
talk about them and raise them up. | 0:02:34 | 0:02:36 | |
It's someone who puts their country ahead of themselves. | 0:02:36 | 0:02:38 | |
Are they heroes to you? | 0:02:38 | 0:02:39 | |
Absolutely, everyday of the week. | 0:02:39 | 0:02:44 | |
There's this thing that's been happening over the past few years, | 0:02:44 | 0:02:47 | |
where you get veterans becoming more vocal and pushing back | 0:02:47 | 0:02:49 | |
on the hero label. | 0:02:49 | 0:02:57 | |
It's really important that veterans, we make this messy. | 0:02:57 | 0:02:59 | |
We make those conversations messy and complicated and nuanced, | 0:02:59 | 0:03:01 | |
because that's what people are. | 0:03:01 | 0:03:03 | |
OK, so I'm a veteran, I served with the Marine Corps in Iraq back during | 0:03:04 | 0:03:07 | |
the beginning of the war in 2003. | 0:03:07 | 0:03:09 | |
And I do find these messy conversation is really difficult, | 0:03:09 | 0:03:13 | |
And I do find these messy conversations really difficult, | 0:03:13 | 0:03:15 | |
it's like sometimes you don't know what way to think, | 0:03:15 | 0:03:18 | |
it's like a tug of war. | 0:03:18 | 0:03:19 | |
That happens a lot, especially when someone thanks you for your service. | 0:03:19 | 0:03:22 | |
This is what goes through my mind. | 0:03:22 | 0:03:27 | |
I get snapped out of the moment and there's this intense flood | 0:03:27 | 0:03:30 | |
of memories about what it meant to serve, | 0:03:30 | 0:03:32 | |
the good times, the hardships, what it meant for my family. | 0:03:32 | 0:03:34 | |
I think of the Marines I knew who didn't come home. | 0:03:34 | 0:03:37 | |
And I realise I'm expected to respond, but what do I say? | 0:03:37 | 0:03:40 | |
I want to do those memories justice but that would mean sitting down and | 0:03:40 | 0:03:43 | |
talking for hours with a stranger. | 0:03:43 | 0:03:49 | |
But then that feels like I'm not doing all those intense | 0:03:49 | 0:03:51 | |
memories justice and I feel guilty. | 0:03:51 | 0:03:53 | |
Then I feel ungrateful. | 0:03:53 | 0:03:55 | |
You can sniff out very quickly where the impetus behind the question is | 0:03:56 | 0:04:03 | |
coming from and if it's coming from a flippant or shallow place, that's | 0:04:03 | 0:04:11 | |
deeply frustrating, but if it's coming from an earnest place, | 0:04:11 | 0:04:14 | |
genuine place, maybe they don't | 0:04:14 | 0:04:15 | |
know what else to do. | 0:04:15 | 0:04:16 | |
A lot of us say, don't call us hero, don't thank us for our service, | 0:04:16 | 0:04:20 | |
you feel awkward when somebody says that to you, which I totally get. | 0:04:20 | 0:04:25 | |
The same token, are we going to push back too hard that we swing the | 0:04:25 | 0:04:29 | |
other way where it's like, screw you | 0:04:29 | 0:04:31 | |
other way where it's like, screw you guys? | 0:04:31 | 0:04:33 | |
Last year there was a big survey of veterans from Iraq and Afghanistan. | 0:04:33 | 0:04:37 | |
42% said they didn't think civilian respect | 0:04:37 | 0:04:38 | |
for the military was genuine. | 0:04:38 | 0:04:39 | |
About 70% said they often felt misunderstood. | 0:04:39 | 0:04:41 | |
But almost the same number also said they felt appreciated. | 0:04:41 | 0:04:44 | |
So that's what makes this so complex. | 0:04:44 | 0:04:51 | |
These are people's lives we are talking about | 0:04:51 | 0:04:53 | |
and how we interpret, we as civilians interpret, their | 0:04:53 | 0:04:58 | |
lives, impacts them and their ability to carry forward on a daily | 0:04:58 | 0:05:01 | |
basis. | 0:05:01 | 0:05:02 | |
He was a councillor to veterans and he also studies heroism. | 0:05:02 | 0:05:06 | |
Veterans are not fragile people, but they have had very complex | 0:05:06 | 0:05:09 | |
experiences so we need to be a society that is in conversation with | 0:05:09 | 0:05:12 | |
our veterans, not telling them, you are a hero, or you are not a hero. | 0:05:12 | 0:05:18 | |
Let's start at the beginning. | 0:05:22 | 0:05:24 | |
The dictionary defines hero as an illustrious warrior, | 0:05:24 | 0:05:26 | |
one that shows great courage. | 0:05:26 | 0:05:29 | |
But I wanted to know where our idea of what a hero is even came from. | 0:05:29 | 0:05:34 | |
What I started doing when I was researching heroes was to go back to | 0:05:34 | 0:05:38 | |
the ancient Greeks, in particular to Achilles, and the Trojan War. | 0:05:38 | 0:05:40 | |
Achilles is the kind of hero par excellence. | 0:05:40 | 0:05:44 | |
He is the best warrior, the fastest, he tears through the enemy. | 0:05:44 | 0:05:47 | |
He's not doing it on behalf of someone else, for him, | 0:05:47 | 0:05:50 | |
the idea is simply to be great. | 0:05:50 | 0:06:00 | |
Fast forward 800 years. | 0:06:00 | 0:06:02 | |
To a jail cell. | 0:06:02 | 0:06:03 | |
Socrates on trial for practising philosophy. | 0:06:03 | 0:06:08 | |
It's where he turns down an opportunity to escape. | 0:06:08 | 0:06:12 | |
He says, I have to follow the laws, I want to lead by example | 0:06:12 | 0:06:16 | |
in some sense, show people they are wrong about what they think, about | 0:06:16 | 0:06:19 | |
philosophy, that it's dangerous. | 0:06:20 | 0:06:23 | |
He says, I have to do this for them, but also for future philosophers. | 0:06:23 | 0:06:27 | |
He sacrifices his life for other people, for an ideal, | 0:06:27 | 0:06:31 | |
that is where Cohen thinks our modern interpretation | 0:06:31 | 0:06:33 | |
of heroism comes from. | 0:06:33 | 0:06:37 | |
Even in war it's not enough for us now to go and kill 50 people, | 0:06:37 | 0:06:43 | |
right, that's very impressive, that an Achilles level of impressive. | 0:06:43 | 0:06:52 | |
But we even want our great warriors to end up sacrificing for others. | 0:06:52 | 0:06:55 | |
The criteria have shrunk. | 0:06:55 | 0:06:56 | |
But the usage of the word seems to be growing. | 0:06:56 | 0:06:59 | |
Right, I think that's exactly right. | 0:06:59 | 0:07:02 | |
OK, so that's the Socrates hero story, and it's pretty cut and dry, | 0:07:02 | 0:07:05 | |
he's just a really selfless guy. | 0:07:05 | 0:07:10 | |
Here's a more complicated story and it starts with the idea that | 0:07:10 | 0:07:13 | |
you never hear people say they actually want to become a hero or | 0:07:13 | 0:07:17 | |
that they want to earn medals. | 0:07:17 | 0:07:20 | |
But that's exactly what was on the mind of 22-year-old | 0:07:20 | 0:07:22 | |
Marine Karl Marlantes in 1968. | 0:07:22 | 0:07:25 | |
My guess is if a young man doesn't think about | 0:07:25 | 0:07:28 | |
doing something heroic in battle, I think it would be highly unusual. | 0:07:28 | 0:07:31 | |
Of course I thought about it. | 0:07:31 | 0:07:32 | |
I imagine you'd like to be John Wayne, too. | 0:07:32 | 0:07:41 | |
But as it turned out, that desire would haunt him | 0:07:41 | 0:07:44 | |
for the rest of his life. | 0:07:44 | 0:07:45 | |
The Bronze Star was on an assault and I was the company XO. | 0:07:45 | 0:07:50 | |
As the rifle company moved forward, Karl heard a young Marine cry out | 0:07:52 | 0:07:56 | |
that he'd been hit. | 0:07:56 | 0:07:57 | |
I had the idea, you know, I can go get him. | 0:07:57 | 0:08:04 | |
There was a double motive, the first motive was I really liked | 0:08:04 | 0:08:07 | |
this guy, had to get him out from the machine gun, that was noble. | 0:08:07 | 0:08:11 | |
The second, I thought it would be pretty neat if I got a medal. | 0:08:11 | 0:08:14 | |
It occurred to me, I went, whoa! | 0:08:14 | 0:08:17 | |
Karl charged up the hill alone. | 0:08:17 | 0:08:21 | |
He kept firing to keep the enemy machine gunners at bay. | 0:08:21 | 0:08:24 | |
And when he reached the wounded Marine, Karl pulled him | 0:08:24 | 0:08:26 | |
down the hill to safety. | 0:08:26 | 0:08:27 | |
Then the medic arrived. | 0:08:27 | 0:08:36 | |
I still get quite sad about this after all these years. | 0:08:36 | 0:08:42 | |
I remember Yankee trying to give him artificial respiration and the kid | 0:08:42 | 0:08:48 | |
was vomiting, so Yankee would get vomit and spit from it out and blow | 0:08:48 | 0:08:55 | |
was vomiting, so Yankee would get vomit and spit vomit out and blow | 0:08:55 | 0:08:58 | |
air into him and suck vomit out. | 0:08:58 | 0:09:00 | |
Then Doc Yankee looked at me and he said oh no. | 0:09:00 | 0:09:03 | |
And he pulled the kid's head back and there was | 0:09:03 | 0:09:05 | |
a bullet hole right in his head. | 0:09:05 | 0:09:07 | |
He said, he's not going to make it. | 0:09:07 | 0:09:09 | |
That night, it occurred to me that he had said, I'm hit. | 0:09:09 | 0:09:12 | |
How could he say "I'm hit" with a bullet in his head? | 0:09:12 | 0:09:15 | |
There was no way I could find out. | 0:09:16 | 0:09:24 | |
If, in fact, the bullet in his head hadn't been the one I | 0:09:24 | 0:09:27 | |
put there when I was trying to keep the machine gunners down. | 0:09:27 | 0:09:30 | |
And I'll never know to this day. | 0:09:30 | 0:09:32 | |
The lesson drawn from that is, I would feel way less sad about it, | 0:09:32 | 0:09:36 | |
conflicted about it, if I'd done it from totally pure motives. | 0:09:36 | 0:09:44 | |
Then I realised they would give me a Bronze Star for it and I said I | 0:09:44 | 0:09:47 | |
had mixed feelings, because I may have gotten this medal | 0:09:47 | 0:09:50 | |
because I did something that ended up killing a guy. | 0:09:50 | 0:09:58 | |
A few months later, Karl would earn another medal, | 0:09:58 | 0:10:03 | |
the second-highest a Marine can receive, the Navy Cross. | 0:10:03 | 0:10:05 | |
But in this case, Achilles would become Socrates. | 0:10:05 | 0:10:07 | |
Again, his unit was on the assault, but they were pinned down. | 0:10:07 | 0:10:11 | |
Karl ran out all by himself to clear the enemy bunkers, but suddenly he | 0:10:11 | 0:10:14 | |
realised he was no longer alone. | 0:10:14 | 0:10:16 | |
Off to the side came one of his men. | 0:10:16 | 0:10:19 | |
I looked behind him and all the marines were coming up behind me. | 0:10:19 | 0:10:22 | |
The whole line. | 0:10:22 | 0:10:28 | |
I mean, to this day I get emotional about it, because to see all these | 0:10:28 | 0:10:32 | |
kids just coming up that hill. | 0:10:32 | 0:10:33 | |
We hit the line of bunkers and we took the hill. | 0:10:33 | 0:10:37 | |
The massive difference between getting the Navy Cross | 0:10:37 | 0:10:41 | |
and that Bronze Star is that I was just trying to get us out | 0:10:41 | 0:10:44 | |
of a pickle, I was trying to figure out how to save people. | 0:10:44 | 0:10:52 | |
It's your motivations that are what's | 0:10:52 | 0:10:53 | |
really important about heroism. | 0:10:53 | 0:10:57 | |
More than the deed itself. | 0:10:57 | 0:11:05 | |
In October, I travelled to Boston, and this happened | 0:11:07 | 0:11:09 | |
in the city's main park. | 0:11:09 | 0:11:13 | |
It was a gathering of over half the living congressional medal | 0:11:13 | 0:11:15 | |
of honour recipients. | 0:11:15 | 0:11:17 | |
There are only 78. | 0:11:17 | 0:11:27 | |
It is the military's highest, most public award. | 0:11:27 | 0:11:33 | |
You know, I feel like I'm not a hero, you know, I didn't do anything | 0:11:33 | 0:11:37 | |
more | 0:11:37 | 0:11:37 | |
heroic than 52 other guys who were with me that day on the battlefield. | 0:11:37 | 0:11:40 | |
The eight guys who never made it home, those guys were the heroes. | 0:11:40 | 0:11:44 | |
Clint received the medal for his actions when 400 Taliban fighters | 0:11:44 | 0:11:46 | |
attacked his outpost in 2009. | 0:11:46 | 0:11:47 | |
Never in a million years did I ever think I'd be wearing this little | 0:11:47 | 0:11:51 | |
blue ribbon of silk around my neck, it's the farthest from your mind. | 0:11:51 | 0:11:54 | |
So when it happens it's very you know, emotional, very, just, | 0:11:54 | 0:11:57 | |
a a lot of stuff happening at once. | 0:11:57 | 0:12:01 | |
It's kind of hard to process, as much as you'd like to travel all | 0:12:01 | 0:12:05 | |
over the US, talk to everybody, shake everyone's hand, you still | 0:12:05 | 0:12:07 | |
have a lot back on the home front you need to take care of. | 0:12:07 | 0:12:12 | |
The psychologist we met earlier says what's complex | 0:12:14 | 0:12:18 | |
about heroism is that it's an intensely private act, but it | 0:12:18 | 0:12:21 | |
also becomes intensely public, too. | 0:12:21 | 0:12:24 | |
They have to make a choice, literally, often go or no-go. | 0:12:24 | 0:12:28 | |
That's a very personal choice in that moment, they take the next | 0:12:28 | 0:12:31 | |
action they see is necessary. | 0:12:31 | 0:12:32 | |
Then people label them a hero and they say, I didn't do anything | 0:12:32 | 0:12:35 | |
heroic, I just did the next thing. | 0:12:35 | 0:12:41 | |
Medal of honour recipients don't have a choice if their actions are | 0:12:41 | 0:12:44 | |
known or not, but other veterans do. | 0:12:44 | 0:12:49 | |
The story of one begins with a Vietnam vet. | 0:12:49 | 0:12:52 | |
My name is Walter Robinson, I write for the Boston Globe, | 0:12:52 | 0:12:55 | |
where I've worked since 1972. | 0:12:55 | 0:12:58 | |
Because he's a veteran, he's kind of a go to guy when | 0:12:58 | 0:13:01 | |
a story involves military records. | 0:13:01 | 0:13:03 | |
In the fall 2014, a Marine veteran of Iraq was running | 0:13:03 | 0:13:05 | |
for Congress in Massachusetts. | 0:13:05 | 0:13:14 | |
Walter called a campaign consultant so he could take a look at Moulton's | 0:13:14 | 0:13:17 | |
military record. | 0:13:17 | 0:13:18 | |
The campaign huddled and said, is there anything | 0:13:18 | 0:13:19 | |
in it we should be worried about? | 0:13:19 | 0:13:22 | |
As we found out later, the consultant didn't know | 0:13:22 | 0:13:24 | |
what was in those records. | 0:13:24 | 0:13:29 | |
I got the record, which indicated that on two separate | 0:13:29 | 0:13:40 | |
occasions he had been decorated for some valiant action under fire | 0:13:40 | 0:13:42 | |
in combat, leading his men in Iraq. | 0:13:42 | 0:13:46 | |
It turned out no one in the public or | 0:13:46 | 0:13:56 | |
on the campaign staff knew about the awards, except for Moulton's | 0:13:56 | 0:13:58 | |
campaign manager, who was also a Marine. | 0:13:58 | 0:14:00 | |
At one point, not even his parents knew of the medal. | 0:14:00 | 0:14:03 | |
In a way, we caught him. | 0:14:03 | 0:14:04 | |
I mean, in an odd way. | 0:14:04 | 0:14:10 | |
Not taking credit for something that he damn well | 0:14:10 | 0:14:14 | |
deserved to take credit for. | 0:14:14 | 0:14:15 | |
It was very apparent from the beginning that he was | 0:14:15 | 0:14:18 | |
uncomfortable talking about it. | 0:14:18 | 0:14:19 | |
I'm curious if you remember the moment that you | 0:14:19 | 0:14:21 | |
found out you were going to be awarded the Bronze Star and how it | 0:14:21 | 0:14:24 | |
made you feel in the moment? | 0:14:24 | 0:14:26 | |
To be very honest, I don't remember it. | 0:14:26 | 0:14:27 | |
You know, it's not such a big deal in | 0:14:27 | 0:14:30 | |
the military, because we were just doing what we thought was right. | 0:14:30 | 0:14:38 | |
Do people call you a hero? | 0:14:39 | 0:14:41 | |
I mean, some people do, sometimes my colleagues in Congress | 0:14:41 | 0:14:47 | |
refer to me as a war hero, I don't think that's true. | 0:14:47 | 0:14:50 | |
I know they are doing it to be nice, but it honestly makes me feel | 0:14:50 | 0:14:54 | |
a bit uncomfortable. | 0:14:54 | 0:14:55 | |
Why do you think it's a bigger deal to civilians? | 0:14:55 | 0:14:58 | |
I think that they lot of Americans who don't have a real connection to | 0:14:58 | 0:15:02 | |
the troops are looking for something to grasp onto. | 0:15:02 | 0:15:05 | |
Something to celebrate. | 0:15:05 | 0:15:07 | |
Frankly, we don't need that as veterans, we don't need parades and | 0:15:07 | 0:15:10 | |
celebrations, we need people to give us an opportunity when we come home. | 0:15:10 | 0:15:13 | |
I think one of the problems with the wars we've been involved in | 0:15:16 | 0:15:19 | |
for the past decade or so is that all the sacrifice is borne | 0:15:19 | 0:15:22 | |
by the troops and their families. | 0:15:22 | 0:15:26 | |
If more Americans were involved, asked to participate in some way, | 0:15:27 | 0:15:31 | |
there probably wouldn't be this sense of guilt, where we always have | 0:15:31 | 0:15:34 | |
to be super conscious of protecting the troops and doing | 0:15:34 | 0:15:36 | |
what's right for the troops. | 0:15:36 | 0:15:42 | |
Not that doing what's right for the troops is wrong, | 0:15:42 | 0:15:45 | |
that's exactly what we should be doing, but there's almost a sense | 0:15:45 | 0:15:48 | |
of guilt that comes with it. | 0:15:48 | 0:15:50 | |
For many civilians. | 0:15:50 | 0:15:53 | |
I met a veteran who actually did have post-traumatic stress. | 0:15:56 | 0:16:02 | |
And he said, you know, I don't tell stories about Iraq | 0:16:02 | 0:16:04 | |
because the only stories people want to hear is about the worst thing | 0:16:04 | 0:16:07 | |
that ever happened to me. | 0:16:07 | 0:16:13 | |
There's this idea that some veterans have that they feel they can only | 0:16:13 | 0:16:16 | |
talk about the stories they think people want to hear, | 0:16:16 | 0:16:19 | |
stories that are really exciting, really violent, really funny. | 0:16:19 | 0:16:22 | |
But they are actually not the stories that mean the most to | 0:16:22 | 0:16:25 | |
the veterans themselves. | 0:16:25 | 0:16:28 | |
A few months ago I met with three veterans who are all writers, | 0:16:28 | 0:16:33 | |
they belong to a group called "Words After War". | 0:16:33 | 0:16:38 | |
Phil Klay even won the National Book Award last year for | 0:16:38 | 0:16:41 | |
his collection of short stories. | 0:16:41 | 0:16:42 | |
So they know a thing or two about narratives. | 0:16:42 | 0:16:44 | |
What is the story you think people want to hear, | 0:16:44 | 0:16:47 | |
civilians want to hear, coming out of veterans when they come home? | 0:16:47 | 0:16:49 | |
And what's the story you think they should hear? | 0:16:49 | 0:16:52 | |
It's interesting because it's changed over time. | 0:16:52 | 0:16:57 | |
So, early on, there was a particular sort of guy that I seemed to keep | 0:16:57 | 0:17:01 | |
meeting, who, when he found out I was in the Marine Corps would ask, | 0:17:01 | 0:17:05 | |
you ever shoot those big guns that could kill somebody from far away? | 0:17:05 | 0:17:08 | |
And would want the exciting, aggressive stories. | 0:17:08 | 0:17:12 | |
At a certain point I realised that kind of expectation had shifted | 0:17:12 | 0:17:18 | |
and what I tended to be getting in New York much more often was | 0:17:18 | 0:17:21 | |
people assuming I was broken. | 0:17:21 | 0:17:28 | |
I remember when I came back I definitely wanted to get | 0:17:28 | 0:17:32 | |
the assurance that what I did was masculine, so I would tell | 0:17:32 | 0:17:35 | |
the stories about being down range. | 0:17:35 | 0:17:38 | |
Now, stories that mean the most to me are the times where the sun is | 0:17:38 | 0:17:42 | |
just coming over Kandahar and I know the day is going to be crazy, | 0:17:42 | 0:17:51 | |
but there's that lull in the battle and I get that peace to myself. | 0:17:51 | 0:17:54 | |
The problem is that many veterans find it hard to share | 0:17:54 | 0:17:57 | |
these deeply personal stories. | 0:17:57 | 0:17:58 | |
Because so few back home have served. | 0:17:58 | 0:18:00 | |
We, as veterans, have a responsibility to meet | 0:18:00 | 0:18:02 | |
people halfway. | 0:18:02 | 0:18:03 | |
A small number of people have a big responsibility, it seems like. | 0:18:03 | 0:18:07 | |
Absolutely. | 0:18:07 | 0:18:10 | |
It greatly limits the direct connection that everyday | 0:18:10 | 0:18:12 | |
Americans have with these wars. | 0:18:12 | 0:18:15 | |
Not just, well, it's not my son or daughter any more. | 0:18:15 | 0:18:18 | |
It's not even the kid down the street any more. | 0:18:18 | 0:18:25 | |
You call that folding? | 0:18:25 | 0:18:26 | |
Where's that military precision? | 0:18:26 | 0:18:29 | |
You don't fold that many onesies in the Navy. | 0:18:29 | 0:18:35 | |
This is US sitcom Modern Family. | 0:18:36 | 0:18:40 | |
And this is Jay, who sometimes brings up the fact he's a Navy | 0:18:40 | 0:18:43 | |
veteran. I wasn't worried, I boxed in the Navy. | 0:18:43 | 0:18:45 | |
And that's it. | 0:18:45 | 0:18:51 | |
Jay in Modern Family is a prime example of a neutralised portrayal | 0:18:51 | 0:18:54 | |
of a veteran. | 0:18:54 | 0:18:54 | |
He is just the guy next door, who you happen to find out served | 0:18:54 | 0:18:58 | |
in the Navy. | 0:18:58 | 0:18:58 | |
You want to see more of that? | 0:18:58 | 0:19:00 | |
Yeah. | 0:19:00 | 0:19:00 | |
I mean, that's what we need to get away from broken hero. | 0:19:00 | 0:19:03 | |
Folks need to know that veterans are literally your neighbour. | 0:19:03 | 0:19:05 | |
Kate was a soldier in Iraq and now she's with an advocacy group | 0:19:05 | 0:19:09 | |
which pushes for more realistic portrayals of veterans. | 0:19:09 | 0:19:09 | |
Do you think Hollywood has a responsibility to do this could | 0:19:10 | 0:19:13 | |
Do you think Hollywood has a responsibility to do this? | 0:19:13 | 0:19:18 | |
I almost think that the media has a responsibility to | 0:19:18 | 0:19:20 | |
change the portrayal of veterans. | 0:19:21 | 0:19:22 | |
I worked at the Department of veterans affairs and there was | 0:19:22 | 0:19:24 | |
a point in time, 2012, every other week we were writing a story pushing | 0:19:24 | 0:19:28 | |
back on the narrative that veterans were ticking time bombs. | 0:19:28 | 0:19:30 | |
That all veterans suffer from PTSD. | 0:19:30 | 0:19:32 | |
TBI. | 0:19:32 | 0:19:32 | |
It really took hold in the media. | 0:19:32 | 0:19:33 | |
It has a huge impact on today's veterans. | 0:19:33 | 0:19:35 | |
While I was reporting this story, I was e-mailing with a friend | 0:19:35 | 0:19:38 | |
about the themes I was exploring. | 0:19:38 | 0:19:40 | |
And at one point she sent me this message, | 0:19:40 | 0:19:42 | |
it really kind of shocked me. | 0:19:42 | 0:19:44 | |
That's because I use the word civilian all the time, but I never | 0:19:44 | 0:19:47 | |
thought about it quite like this. | 0:19:47 | 0:19:49 | |
I remember when I first even became aware of that word. | 0:19:50 | 0:19:56 | |
It made me feel like this other, like I was on a different planet | 0:19:56 | 0:19:59 | |
and would never understand war. | 0:19:59 | 0:20:00 | |
And that's true. | 0:20:00 | 0:20:07 | |
But that idea of civilian life, a life form so separate | 0:20:07 | 0:20:10 | |
and ignorant and sheltered from the experience of war, I don't know, | 0:20:10 | 0:20:13 | |
it makes me feel really distant. | 0:20:13 | 0:20:14 | |
It makes me feel funny. | 0:20:14 | 0:20:15 | |
And it makes me feel guilty. | 0:20:15 | 0:20:21 | |
Our civilian friends may just not get what we did or why we did it. | 0:20:21 | 0:20:25 | |
That's OK. | 0:20:25 | 0:20:26 | |
Veterans can be frustrated with the lack of differentiation that | 0:20:26 | 0:20:30 | |
civilians make towards the veteran community, it's just | 0:20:30 | 0:20:34 | |
as easy for veterans to keep the civilian community at a distance. | 0:20:34 | 0:20:37 | |
What I do think, over time, it will be a problem in America | 0:20:37 | 0:20:40 | |
if fewer and fewer people serve. | 0:20:40 | 0:20:43 | |
And, therefore, a greater number of Americans have | 0:20:43 | 0:20:45 | |
no connection, real connection from emotional connection, | 0:20:45 | 0:20:47 | |
understanding, deep understanding. | 0:20:47 | 0:20:54 | |
If everybody's a hero, it trivialises something that | 0:20:54 | 0:20:56 | |
society really needs. | 0:20:56 | 0:21:00 | |
It's a really subjective thing and it's not a comfortable one. | 0:21:00 | 0:21:03 | |
I don't think there can be a clear, coherent answer. | 0:21:03 | 0:21:05 | |
I don't think there should be. | 0:21:06 | 0:21:07 | |
If we start losing our heroes, then we're really going to be lost | 0:21:07 | 0:21:10 | |
as a society. | 0:21:10 | 0:21:12 | |
Good | 0:21:43 | 0:21:43 | |
Good evening. | 0:21:43 | 0:21:45 | |
Good evening. Abigail | 0:21:45 | 0:21:45 | |
Good evening. Abigail is | 0:21:45 | 0:21:45 |