08/04/2017 Saturday Kitchen

Get set for a truly mouth-watering display of world class cooking.

I'm Matt Tebbutt and this is Saturday Kitchen Live.

Top chefs Freddie Forster, Olia Hercules and wine expert

I'm doing a West African inspired dish, fried plantain, some fritters

with the okra and some marinated red mullet. That is not your usual

style? This is from my roots, where I am from, West Africa, Sierra

Leone. Nice. Minors from my roots, the Ukraine,

duck and sorrel broth with lots of spring onions and quails eggs.

Beautiful, very nice. Jane, do you have any thing from your roots?

Nothing from Wales but we are covering the world. Ayew Welsh?

Whereabouts? Shall we do this another time?

LAUGHTER South America, Eastern Europe,

something from everywhere. I look forward to that.

And we've got brilliant clips from some of the BBC's

biggest food stars - Rick Stein, The Incredible Spice

Men, The Hairy Bikers and Nigella Lawson.

Our special guest today makes viewers cry every week transforming

the homes of deserving families across the country in DIY SOS,

gets our brains working with his Saturday night quiz

Who Dares Wins, and now he's trying to "nick" my job in the kitchen!

APPLAUSE No, you don't have too stand. I have

had my roots done, so we have roots all around! People always ask me why

I have dyed my hair that ridiculous colour, and I never dye my hair.

Ideye middle of my beard, I look like gorillas in the mist! You are

here to face food heaven and food hell and you also have a cookbook.

Tellers about your food heaven and food hell? Food hell for me is heavy

beef, food heaven would be something vegetarian, aubergine, really nicely

done. About one and a half years ago I became mostly be in. The militant

Huygens get very upset about the idea that I am mostly... Because you

could eat beef cheek?! The problem with trying to go vegan or

vegetarian is that it is really hard, if you really like meat it is

hard to give it up. The Californians have a term for it, of course they

do, flexitarian. It'll never work yet! Most of the time I eat vegan

food, if I can't get hold of it like at an airport of something I'd

vegetarian, once in a blue moon, like if I have had four pints of

Guinness, I will need to meat. And then light up. It is about eight

times a year that ie is meat instead of four times a day, so it is lot

better in terms of health. -- that ie to meet.

For your food heaven I am going to make roasted aubergine puree,

roast sweet potato and spicy roasted wild rice.

First I'll roast aubergines and then blend to a puree.

I'll roast some sweet potato with chilli.

Then I'll toast almonds with spices and serve on top of the puree along

with wilted spring onions, spinach and garlic and wild rice.

Do you like the look of that? Because it is complex and

interesting and it is not a risotto, because that is what you get offered

in virtue every restaurant if you are a vegetarian. Don't get angry!

But if you get hell, then it will be beef cheeks.

I'll braise beef cheeks with aromatics and fresh

I'll dice some ox tongue and asparagus spears and saute

together and serve with mashed potato made with lots

We are only on as for an hour and a half! Don't worry, we can do it in

seven minutes. You don't like creamy mash? I am trying to get rid of the

heavy dairy. Giving up cheese has been more difficult than meat. I can

believe it. But you'll have to wait

until the end of the show to find If you'd like the chance to ask us

a food or wine question today If I get to speak to you,

I'll also ask you if Nick should face his food heaven

or his food hell. You can also get in touch

with social media using Right, you have a seat, we will

start cooking. Freddie, what are we doing? How you? Good. Tell us about

this dish? My mother taught me it's many years ago. It is a West African

brunch dish, we will make some fritters using some okra and some

peas, you will make a marinade for the red mullet with olive oil, lemon

juice, coriander seeds and herbs. When I looked at this recipe in the

notes, it looked like cured sort of fish. Similar principles, my own

take. I have a whole egg, creme fraiche, peas, flour, milk, red

onions diced. OK. Is that your interpretation or exactly as your

mum... My mum used to make it with cassava and yams, I added okra. And

with it being spring, some lovely peas to give it that sweetness as

well. Something you could have for brunch over the weekend. This is

quite a big departure for you, you are classically trained, very grand

heritage? That I think it is important for me to understand and

remember my heritage and routes where I have came from, I learned

how to cook primarily because of my mother, she taught me dishes like

this. It is very important once in awhile to showcase these ingredients

which do not get used a lot, like okra, yam and plantain. It is a

little bit different, but nothing wrong with being different. We have

these edible flowers. We will look at these later in the show, this is

quite unusual to put them in a marinade? They pick up a little bit

of flavour, especially the nasturtium, which is fragrant, it

gives texture at the same time. It is a very, very colourful thing and

it is fun to eat. Mix that all in together like that. OK. Freddie,

you... Your professional break came when you won the Roux scholarship? I

won it in 2002, it was a turning point in my career when I entered

and won that. I think it is a great competition simply because the roof

family -- the Roux family nurture cooks in this country. The big thing

was having the opportunity to go to anywhere in Europe or the world,

like it is now, to train for three months. Presumably because the Roux

game opened up doors? Yes, and it is a wonderful opportunity that I'm

grateful for even to this day, they look out for me. They are always

there at hand? You are like part of the family. That is really

important. This Monday in London is the final of that, I look forward to

going. You will be part of that? I go down as a former scholar to

support the talent. Do you go down and look stern? Because it is quite

a terrifying thing. I certainly don't go there with papers in my

hands, I go down there to support the people who are down now.

Obviously me being a past winner, I feel very proud and honoured to be

invited down there again. How many people take part in the final? Six.

The great thing about it, lots of people are quite scared to enter the

Roux scholarship but it is important to let them know that it can change

your life, change your career and you should go for it. Back to the

red mullet, quickly. Just season it with salt and pepper, place it

upside down, skin side, OK? You don't have to use red mullet. Back

in the day my mum used to cook things like red snapper, you could

use macro, that works very, very well. A beautiful little fish.

Freddie, can I as good at the okra, even in central London I had trouble

tracking this down when I made this recipe, what alternatives could you

use? Spinach, spring onions. You don't need to use okra, it works

with most ingredients but I think the okra gives it a nice West

African field. That will go in the other now. The okra is a pain to

prepare, you have to so Kate? -- that will go in the oven now. You

can slice it and use it dry. If you'd like to ask any of us

a question then call 0330 123 1410. Calls are charged at your standard

network rate. Is that OK? Plantain is not something I ever cook with.

Most people would probably say the same. It is very much under use

nowadays, you don't see it used at all, really, but I think it has a

lovely sweetness, it lends itself to various types of cooking methods,

led Dann like deep frying -- like deep frying. Is it starchy? Many

people think that but after cooking it hit becomes rather sweet as it is

a wonderful staple diet that I used to have as a young child, it can be

used very much in Kuku reef. What is the secret to the lovely crispy fish

skin? A nice hot pan, a nonstick pan. Looking at very slowly on the

outside to get a nice crust. Without moving at about? Probably people at

home try to move the plan to quickly and it starts to stick. That is

roasted off, put that in there. We have a couple of minutes left, is

there much to do? No. It has a beautiful, simple smell. It smells

like the Mediterranean on a good day. Nice lemon juice and olive oil,

a nice fragrance. You should use plantain more, I go down to the

Notting Hill Carnival every year to hand down honey roast plantain,

which is amazing. Almost there. It don't take long? We cook at about

170, one 80 degrees, golden brown on the outside and soft in the centre.

If you don't have a Friday you could use a nonstick pan, shallow fry

them. Is this something you think more people could and should use?

Hopefully, the idea of doing it today is to show everybody there are

lots of ingredients out there that you can use, it is quite diverse in

terms of using okra and plantain. These are the great brunch dishes,

they should be used more. It is not a cure? Just a marinade? More of a

marinade. It comes out nice and Gordon Brown. How are we doing for

time? We are good. A little bit of salt. This takes me back to my

childhood. This is proper home cooking. -- it comes out nice and

golden brown. How would your mum had an snapper? Pan-fried with spices,

lots of palm oil, stuff like that, quite heavy stuff. I have made it

later. I have the fritters ready now. Have you got the lemon, please?

Got a lemon. Place that just... A wedge here. Beautiful. How spicy is

this? My son shares out of the guy may, a Gambian and a Nigerian and he

cooks for all of them, it is all scratch bonnet peppers. I can't eat

the stuff. I was going to use them today but I thought people might be

struggling. Mix it all together, fresh colours. It looks beautiful, I

am amazed you put the flowers in. People will think it will be mashed

up but it adds to the text Jabba contrasts. They bring a lot of

flavour? Big-time. That is what you cause serious West African brunch

cooking. So there we have some fried plantain with okra and fares

fritters and marinated red mullet. Let's go over here. Try this, Nick.

How is fish in your diet? A bit like meat, eat it ten times a year, tried

to reduce it. Fantastic. It looks beautiful, the colours. It's a west

African portion, big-time! Thank you. Saffron with red wine is really

something. There are some great vegetable things on here. With okra

people think it is slimy so they find it off-putting but doing it

this way this takes that quality away. Chain, what are we drinking

with this. I have a bottle of Riesling for you. One of the rules

in terms of wine and food matching is, with a fish dish a white wine

from the coast is a useful seem to go for. That is exactly what I've

done. Not only does it have a cool label, it is delicious and works

with all different aspects of Freddie's recipe. I like it. It is

new and I'm getting used to it. This is called a Lo Abarca Riesling. It

is made by a fantastic producer in Chile. It costs ?10. Reasonably

priced and but works with all the aspects of this dish. Reasonably

pricy. What I love is, not only is it fresh enough for the fish, when I

made it, the richness of the plantain brought out the tropical

flavour so I needed that in the wine. This Riesling is brilliant at

that and being zesty as well. It really is. It is a great wine with

things like Chinese and Oriental food, anything with a lot of spices

and flavours in. You like your wine, you haven't got that out of your

diet? No, although there is a product that the vegans have chosen

but I have chosen to ignore that completely! Olia, you are cooking

for us later. I'm making a duck broth, very clear duck broth with

sorrel, spring onions, dill and little quails eggs. Like home

cooking but elegant. Remember, if you would like to ask us questions

this morning, just call this number. Or you can tweet us a question

using the hashtag #SaturdayKitchen. Time now to join Rick Stein,

on his trip around the Far East. He's in Malaysia cooking

their traditional dish - a rendang! This is the Indian part of

Georgetown. What are these tiny seeds? The English name is poppy

seeds. These are important when you want to make curry. It's very

addictive. Yes, after you eat with this then

you come back again for it It really Is there anywhere we can go and have

some Indian food for lunch? Oh, yes, I know of a very nice,

authentic, Indian Muslim restaurant. In Chinatown, it's

called Hameediyah. We are here now in

Campbell Street, yeah? This road, in the early days

the Chinese actually call it Yes, because those days,

you find the Chinese coolies, immigrants, they came here to work,

so later they have Second-class, the older ones

they moved to the second class. And in the middle, there's

Sintra Street, that is a Japanese So we now are here actually,

you can smell the food at Hameediyah It's one

of the pioneer Indian Muslim 'This is the ultimate

curry experience. 'I don't know how many they're

expecting for lunch, but there's enough here

to feed hundreds. 'This is the famous beef rendang,

'and the whole spectrum of curries from all over India

is reflected here. 'When you're with Indians over

here you're never far from the ingenious 'mechanical

device to make life a little easier. My mouth was watering

at the thought of lunch. We were having a regular

favourite, curried pigeon, the famous chicken kapitan,

cooked in coconut milk, spicy vegetables,

and of course, rice. We haven't got our

own plates, have we? Yes, normally we eat

this with our fingers. Put on the rice, mix it

with the curry, and then Just like they say,

when you're in Rome, I asked many Malaysians

to tell me their favourite dish, We saw it in the Hameediyah

restaurant, a great vat of it, but it's interesting,

rendang, because it's part a sort of curry,

but part almost a pickle, because I read somewhere the point

of it is that you slaughter a whole beast in a hot country without any

refrigeration, what do You can't refrigerate it,

so you cook it with lots of spice, lots of paste which acts

as a preservative as well as producing

a thoroughly delicious dish. This is central to any

South-East Asian dish, whether it's Indian,

Thai or Malay. Well, it's not just any old paste,

it's pretty special. I mean, this is what the whole

dish is about, rendang. I just thought I'd show

you what goes into the paste. I mean, one of the worries

I have with all these dishes is these pastes,

because they're so essential to the dish, and there's a lot

of ingredients that go into it. But if you just buy the stuff

in supermarkets, you never get that wonderfully fragrant flavour that

you'll get from things like using fresh turmeric,

and galangal, which you can get all over the place, particularly

in Chinese supermarkets now, fresh chilli of course,

and fresh coconut - not your tinned stuff -

you've gotta grate that, Shallots, good garlic,

plenty of chillies and some coriander and cumin,

obviously you've got to grind that first and then pound them,

if you've got a big enough mortar, but a food processor does

the job perfectly well. There's a lot of work,

but it's absolutely essential if you really want to taste that

sort of mind-blowing flavour, that aromatic quality of something

like a good beef rendang. First of all I'm using a couple

of tins of coconut milk Give them a good old thump

to make sure their flavour I always think of cigars

when I look at them. Next, tear up as much as eight

kaffir lime leaves for fragrance, complimented by a generous portion

of tamarind juice which has been previously strained

to remove the stones. Finally some salt, and then let

the rendang simmer for about 2? hours, until the beef

has become tender. Before serving, remove

the stalks of lemon grass. A spoon of palm sugar rounds off

the flavours nicely. This cucumber and coconut salad

works well alongside the rendang. I've added freshly grated coconut

to the de-seeded cucumbers and some thinly sliced shallots,

and then some red chillies, Then I made a dressing of coconut

milk, lime juice and sugar. I didn't add any more salt

because I'd used that to crisp up the cucumbers when I de-seeded

and sliced them. These Eastern salads,

so unlike ours in the West, are the making of something

like a rendang, and if I was doing a series entitled

"The Best Curries In The World", the noble beef rendang would

definitely be a star attraction. He's back next week with more foodie

stories from the Far East. Rick cooked the Malaysian national

dish of rendang using a fresh paste, and they're actually much easier

to do than you think. All you need to do is get hold of

the stuff. I'm

going to show you how I have a chilly, some curry leaves,

cardamom but, clothes, black peppercorns, fennel seeds, black

mustard seeds, stay with me! Turmeric, ground ginger and ground

cumin. That has been troubling me all morning! Anyway, I'm not going

to toast them now because the chances are you will not use it all.

Put it in an airtight tab, leave it in the fridge somewhere cool. And

then toasted when you need it. Nick. You have been kicking around the TV

for a long time! Just over 30 years now. How did you get into it, you

did not go out to be a presenter, did you? I was working

behind-the-scenes as a runner - researcher, a producer, I worked on

news in Australia and America, I was in his journalist for a long time. I

think that is held at only restarted and look where he is now. I was

tired of doing miserable stuff and wanted to do positive stuff so I did

more positive TV. Producing and directing and then people started

asking me to present because I used to do a comedy thing at the end of

the news show which was a bit radical in itself to but comedy in a

news show. And people started bringing up asking me to present and

eyes and No which is radical for people to hear when they are trying

to cast presenters! I would rather have been a director. The more I

said No, the more people asked me to do stuff! It resulted in my going to

these jobs which I presented, to stay me. One of the hardest things

about being a presenter is, when you start, you want to please all the

directors that you work with and they always want you to do it... Not

everyone would agree! ICU bypassed that but you are a chef, they make

their own choices. So you have to be someone different every time you

present something, it can be confused, I know that some people

don't like me, some people do, the thing is, they know who I am. Think

of the presenters you'll all who are successful, you know who they are.

Jeremy Clarkson, Jeremy Paxman, whether you like them or not, they

are the same person, you know who they are. You are the same as in

every time -- they are the same person. Has this been key to the

success of DIY SOS? I think it is because it isn't really about

building, it is about people. All shows are about people. You could

get a recipe online, people don't tune in here, they tune in to see

the people. The charming conversation! And your ability to

remember herbs! LAUGHTER

They all about relationships. It wasn't really about the buildings,

as OS, it is now something much bigger. Like the conscience of the

nation. After working in a kitchen we used to turn on the TV, with my

wife, have a bottle of wine at about 1am and there was a show which is

similar to yours, called Extreme Home Making. We used to set their

sobbing. It's a lot like DIY SOS. It's an American show, so they

always say we got this given by this person, these given by these people.

It's a huge and this why people give them things. In SOS although we have

built ?15 million worth of homes and hospitals and respite centres, the

people who give us the donations, we never see who they are. They get no

advertising. They are doing it out of the goodness of the heart. It is

the ultimate altruistic act. It is amazing from that point of view. The

more I got into helping people in difficult circumstances, the more I

got interested in mental health and well-being. I did a retreat last

year. Which I will get onto right now. Just to drag you back to this

recipe, I've got some garlic, red onion, red and yellow pepper, spice

mix, you leave that for ten minutes, after this time you are left with

that, I will add some beans and some fruit. I like this because it is

hearty, chunky, a proper vegetarian dish as opposed to the weedy

vegetarian dishes, when I came back from Thailand and was trying to eat

like a vegetarian, everything was so weedy and even the cookbooks were

extremely like nine stone people! I think as a chef you have to work

are dead vegetarian dishes to make them very tasty. GQ?! I think that

was the case before the chips are becoming more diverse and

understanding that you have to cook more vegetarian food. -- but chefs

are becoming more diverse. There is no excuse for it now. Most people

are poor around the world and most cultures can't afford meat, so they

do amazing things with herbs and spices to make vegetables taste

good. African cultures, the borscht and things like that. Is that what

you had done in your book? Yes, I grew up in Southall so most of my

friends were from different cultures, which all have a massive

background of making veggie foods. And making them really amazing. So I

went back to those roots and I started cooking some of those things

that my friends used to cook for me and their families cooked for me

when I was younger. Then in order to make it big and wholesome, I started

doing things like I will quite often than rose the vegetables first to

compress it and give it more bite before I will start making the curry

sauce. Have you brought a copy today? Yes, but I am not allowed to

show it on the BBC! I am not very good it. When I had my restaurant I

would fall back into the trap of the risotto, goats cheese tart. It is

very good of you to say that. I will regret it later. Yachts are not

allowing he has done a lot, been very creative with herbs and yoghurt

some things. But there is so much more that you can do. When I was

trying to make my cookbook, Proper Healthy Food, by the way, I was not

sure that you would get round to it so thought I should... But I thought

which recipes do I know? I suddenly found I had 160 recipes in no time

at all, which I then pinged out to all of my friends who are meat

eaters and said... I missed out all my veggie and vegan friends, I gave

it to all the meat eaters and said which one of these, pick out the 100

that you think would interest you. I started making that and taking it to

the building site and the builders were like... That is brave! They

love it. There is a big view that the world is super meat-eating, most

young guys are in the gym and try to look after themselves, my sons look

after themselves and their food much better than I ever did. The idea on

a building site of somebody in a string vest and shorts is not there.

I do tea and coffee ones, at certain points of the day I am just talking

and doing no building, so I'm useless, I have 20 builders tea,

coffee, I don't suppose you have chamomile, do you have roobios? What

sort of fruit teas? Proper Healthy Cooking... Proper Healthy Food...

Came out in January? It came out in March or April. I am doing well!

Lots of people are buying it and cooking things, for example, my

husband is a real carnivore but this week I have given him three recipes

from your book and he has not noticed he is not eating meat. That

is the point. I don't expect people to give up meat, it is not about

giving up meat but it is making sure you eat less and your diet is more

healthy. When I did The in Thailand, I measured everybody beforehand and

at the end of the month. The changes in the heart rate, we had a 19 stone

type two diabetic, he had been diabetic than three within ten days

of eating raw vegan he was no longer tied to that diabetic. It is quite

amazing. Touch no longer take two diabetic. I would be sceptical, but

a couple of weeks ago we had a very good chef called Phil Howard who

said of his new restaurant on the back of cooking at a yoga retreat

and has changed his whole... I am running retreats in the Maldives

this year where people can come and do yoga, learn how to breathe

slower, sleep better and do some vegan and vegetarian cooking. Would

you like to come? I would like to. You start diving into that. Retreat

in Maldives, sounds good. A friend of mine has a Moldavian island, they

have just opened... What kind of brands have I got?! He said, why

don't you do retreats? My mate is a therapeutic yoga teacher from

Stockholm, desperate to get out of Stockholm because it is freezing

cold. What would you pair with that? If there is another spice, I would

go for that! There is a bright equal Pinot Gris, it is the same greatness

Pinot Grigio but it is orderly and richer. Touch there is a great one

called Pinot Gris, it is the same grape as Pinot Grigio.

So what will I be making for Nick at the end of the show?

Food heaven - roasted aubergine puree, roast sweet potato and spicy

First I'll roast aubergines and then blend to a puree.

I'll roast some sweet potato with chilli.

Then I'll toast almonds with spices and serve on top of the puree along

with wilted spring onions, spinach and garlic and wild rice.

I'll braise beef cheeks with aromatics and fresh

I'll dice some ox tongue and asparagus spears and saute

together and serve with mashed potato made with lots

Because next is not like that, either! -- Nick does not like that,

either. But you'll have to wait

until the end of the show to find What you think of that? It is

really, really good. You can tell it has been cooked by somebody with

zips on the back of their genes, they are modern and cruel and down

with the kids. A shop assistant told me these and I fell for it because

she is a little bit gorgeous. They can't actually see them. Thank you

very much for that! Now it's time to catch up

with The Incredible Spice Men, They are in east Sussex visiting

a pig farm and serving up 'We're meeting a local food hero

'who's saving a rare breed of pig from becoming extinct.' He also

breeds something which is really, really rare and precious,

and this you are going to love. These little fatties are extremely

rare Middle White pigs, lovingly raised in an old-fashioned

way by Roland and Jane Horton. They're very docile

and they were nicknamed the London Porker because until

the 1950s, their meat was sold So this is a traditional

British pig... These were the cutting

edge pig of its day. The quality of the pork is extremely

high and they're now down to just 400 registered pigs

in the whole country. My God, and I've been lucky enough

to get a piece of that meat. It's free ranged and

they're happy pigs. Middle Whites grow much slower

than most modern breeds and slow growth allows the meat

to develop its legendary flavour. The Emperor of Japan only eats

Middle White pork when he eats pork. I wonder if the emperor

enhances his pork with spices. And what we're going to do is we're

going to spice it up of course. Deep, deep, deep marination,

so a few hours of marinating. And then we're going

to roast it gently. Ooh, so all the fat

melts into the meat. We're making a spiced marinade

to infuse the pork with flavour You'll have to start the day

before but believe me - Cloves and cinnamon go

extremely well with it. So if you ask me I'll tell

you how much I need. In the meantime, I'm just

going to scour this now. We're blending fresh zingy spices

with dry warming spices for a full balanced flavour.

First, the dry spices - chilli, cloves and cinnamon.'

And how much cinnamon? Roughly break up a four inch piece

of cinnamon 'and add it to the mortar and pestle.' Chilli -

I need about three to four, sir. Cloves may look like little black

nails but they're the dried buds And why you check it is some

unscrupulous traders take the oil out and then you get left with just

a dry twig, a shadow The definition of a spice is a root

or a seed containing essential oils To activate that essential oil,

we're bashing them up. Whenever you're cooking with dry

spices, always crush them first and then gently toast them

to intensify their flavour. After about a minute on low heat,

the spices will release a strong... Whilst the dry spices cool I'm

starting on the fresh, zingy spices. You'll need about two

inches of fresh ginger Add them to the blender

with two red onions, four cloves of garlic

and the toasted dry spices. Now for a vivid spice which gives

an earthy background flavour It's sold in small

jars in supermarkets. The king ingredient

today in our marinade. 'You'll need two and a half

tablespoons 'to give 'Then half a tablespoon of sugar,

'100ml of cider vinegar 'and a splash of rapeseed oil.'

Can I be the porky masseuse? The pork needs to marinate

for at least four hours, or pop it in the fridge

the night before you want to The next morning, scrape the excess

off, 'and brown the meat for five Cover the tin with foil and roast

for 15 minutes at 200 degrees, then turn down the heat

to 120 degrees. How long has that got

to be in there for? We're serving the pork with fresh

coleslaw and after all that slow-cooking, the meat will be

tender enough to fall apart. You agree with me that

this meat is perfect? The tamarind's seeped right

through the rind, you know? It's got this beautiful

brown colour. The sweetness of the cinnamon,

the clove coming through... Chef, if I was a porker, this is how

I'd want to finish up my life! Fantastic, and there's

more fabulous recipes Still to come on today's show,

Nigella is busy in her kitchen. She's making a sumptuous chocolate

and hazelnut cheesecake with toasted hazelnuts

sprinkled on top. And it's almost Omelette Challenge

time, and today's puns are in honour of our guest Nick and DIY

SOS, so here goes. Have you both got what it takes

to NAIL the perfect omelette? Can you both use your skills

to SAW up the leaderboard I can't HAMMER it home enough how

tough this challenge could be! And will Nick get his food heaven,

aubergine, sweet potatoes and wild rice or food hell,

braised beef cheek with creamy mash? We'll find out at

the end of the show! This is a variation of a borsch,

isn't it? Yes, it has nothing to do with the borsch you know with

beetroot, I think there is a version of this in Eastern Europe, Polish

and Russian and Lithuanian people would make a similar thing. The

bases, we are making a duck stock, you can use anything, pork bones,

chicken bones, anything, to use up your carcasses. It is a good way

of... We're making a simple stock, which you can make well in advance

and freeze. Whatever vegetables you have in the fridge. And this is your

take on this because it seems a luxurious ingredient, duck. My

mother has ducks at home so since we have a lot to go through we started

making it with that. The vegetables and the cold water here. You call it

borsch but you don't have to put beetroot in it. Add-on things. It is

just what we call it but essentially it is a duck broth with sorrow and

lovely herbs. -- I don't think so. It is a beautiful Tanguay flavour. I

don't know if you've heard that you tell me something fantastic. There

was no citrus in the UK and we brought it from abroad because we

don't grow it in this country and in the middle ages sorrow was used for

that citrus flavour. So everything we cook my with citrus, in the

middle Ages they would have used Sorrell to get that lemonade, zesty

taste. It should come back. Sorrel is the thing. I guess there isn't

much citrus in the Ukraine? Sorrel is the thing, it is like a spring

flavoured dish. I'm going to sweat this off. Instead of using oil just

skim a little duck fat off the mixture. It has this lovely flavour.

What you have done know, have chopped everything, they shall very

finely and grated carrot and it will add a nice sweetness to the broth.

So this dish has everything. Sweet, sour, rich and really fresh. You

finish the broth and then we will add this when it is sweated... Yes,

and it will give it a nice colour as well. It's from my first cookbook.

So important, it is the second recipe in the book, the first recipe

is the borsch, the red borsch. It won an award, your book. Fortnum and

Mason debuted cookbook of the year. You have mother coming out. It is

called Caucuses, my ode to the people and the food of Georgia,

Azerbaijan, Armenia and other beautiful countries. Largely

undiscovered. Yes, the area is sandwiched between Iran and Turkey

so you can imagine the interesting influences on the food. Georgia has

this really cool spice called blue fenugreek which is different from

the utter Indian fenugreek we know. It is so complex and flavour to --

the bitter Indian fenugreek. Why have we not got that here, do we

need someone like you to tell us about it? Hopefully it will all come

in August. A good rugby playing nations as well. Yes, they are. In

the mountain is I kicked around a rugby ball with a friend, they loved

it. Went you going to be a professional rugby player? I was,

when I left school travelled the world playing rugby, played in

Colorado and San Francisco and Samoa. I got unlucky because one

thing got in the way, the lack of talent! The inability to be as good

as anybody else! That's what stopped me! As well as being a peasant dish

this is quite elegant, the way I serve it. My grandmother used to put

in the tangy and sits down, I like to put all the garnish in the bowl,

imagine you have a dinner party, you put a bowl in front of your guests

with the beautiful things, it adds a piece of theatre.

And if you'd like to try Olia's or any of our studio recipes

then visit our website bbc.co.uk/saturdaykitchen.

Look at that for multitasking. Olia, does it matter if you are busy and

forget it and it goes over for more than to hours? It will be fine

because it is just of the bones. You can use it if you are using meat as

well. Just put it on a really low heat. It intensifies? Yes, exactly.

You want a nice strong meaty taste but you can make a nice vegetarian

version of this as well, just use some celeriac, drop it and make a

nice vegetable broth. That is what chefs do, instead of a broth it is

now a reduction! Or you call it a foreign name! Can you put this in?

It goes in the stock and you interviews and for how long? One

hour would be nice but if you are short of time it will be fine to

infuse it like that. If you have lots of classic Mac carcass left

over just freeze it. It is a very nice way of using ab... No waste at

all. This will colour the stock. Are using this plate, Matt? Whichever

one you like. It's a lovely Ukrainian dish and I'm going to

Ukraine in June on a foodie tour which will be nice. I would like to

tour that area. It's beautiful. We will seize on good cheese producers

in the mountains and supermarkets. Ukrainian food is all about

ingredients. If you go to the Ukrainian market there would be

mountains of herbs and everything. In the countryside is beautiful by

all accounts. Yes, a little bit of duck, do not worry if it is not hot

because the broth will warm it. Then the dill and a bit of spring onion

as well. Very nice. A little egg, you can use normal egg, you don't

have to use quails egg. This is almost one duck serves to meals. We

have scraps of meat but you are using the broth. It's fantastic. And

very nourishing is that it doesn't have to be fancy, it can be as

simple as you want. Here's a bit of micro sorrel to be a bit fancy for

the show! Duck broth, here it is. Look at the colours, really lovely.

It looks amazing. Remind us what it is? Green borsch with duck and

Sorrell broth. Fantastic. Really, really fresh and I like the last

minute hit. I think people cooked sorrel so much that it loses its

natural greenness. This way it stays fresh and crispy. Won did you season

it? Yes I did! Low-pressure! How is it? It's really good. Perfectly

seasoned. The sorrel cuts through, because the fat on the duck is quite

emollient and the sorrel cuts through that. Jane, what are we

drinking? You want to go quite light and duck

and Pimot Noir have quite an affinity. It has a good affinity

with me! I think a lot of wine varieties have an affinity with you!

It comes from Western Hungary. On the shores of a lake, with a cool

climate, fresh, other grape varieties grown as well. Because

Pinot Noir is expensive this is great, you can get it from Waitrose

for ?7 79 and hard to get a really juicy Pinot Noir for that money. It

goes with all the herbs and it is juicy enough to go with the citrus

flavours of the sorrel and it is not too strong. Happy with it? If not we

could go back to the old school! I'm joking!

It's now time to catch up with The Hairy Bikers, Si and Dave.

They're in rural Derbyshire and have the tough job

For centuries Mattan has been one of the most widely eaten meets in the

whole of the UK. Certainly has. Samuel Pepys aged as the great Fire

of London was blazing. And Mrs Beeton said it was generally used by

families. However while ago and fell out of favour but now it is back on

our dinner plates and we are here to out why. This shop is a Glossop

institution, five generations of the family have run a butchers here for

over 100 years and the current owner and soul food hero is keen to

champion Britain mutton as his father and his father 's father and

his father 's father 's father and his father 's father 's father 's

father... All right, stop the bleeding on! Hello, John, I'm Dave.

How are you? Knots about, Si. The story of mutton. John, to kick off,

what is the difference between lamb and mutton? Lamp is under

one-year-old whereas mutton is more than to years old. So you should eat

more mutton. You should. It only went out of fashion because it was

slow to cook and we are in this environment now everything has two

big quick, everything has to be cooked yesterday! When you turn an

animal into a carcass, the process it goes through is called dressing.

And when you dress a lamb the traditional way is to put this fat

here, that is the fact that surrounds the stomach of the animal.

Originally this was put on as fly protection before they had

refrigeration! Now this is a lamb. Perhaps a slaughterman decided, I'm

going to pass off a piece of mutton as lamb so he put fat on the lake to

pass it off as mutton dressed as lamb. That is where we think the

saying came from. Mutton has remained popular in West Indian and

African cooking, John has worked hard to get it back into his

customers's repertoire. He has mutton sausages, mutton chops,

mutton Kerry and kebabs. And know the piece to resistance. Know which

is which? Lamb, mutton. It would be good to do a taste test. Liverpool

we can do that, we'll cook them side by side and see what people think.

So the taste test will be lamb and mutton. Why don't you to clear off

and see something while I stick this in the oven. Sounds like a plan!

John and his father and his father 's father 's father and his father

's father 's father... Stop ramming home the point, they've been buying

mutton from the same farm just five miles away for years. It has the

quality mark which means that the borders around the field can grow

wild which means that the herb get to graze -- the sheep get to graze

on the herbage. Which means even better tasting mutton. It is run by

Mike Salisbury. Hello, Mike, I'm Si, good to meet you. This is a grand

spot. Anything that roams these hills for long enough will be

healthy. You have to be healthy to survive up here. You're not wrong!

The years that people didn't eat mutton, several decades, it must

have been so destroying for you because you had a product that was

good, and you are not going to get a price for it. There was a time when

mutton couldn't be sold. You would struggle. And is a great British

farmer that must have driven you mad. There have been times it has

been stressful. In 2004 Prince Charles spearheaded the mutton

release 's campaign to raise awareness and support sheep farmers.

Now more than 200 family farms, restaurants, butchers are rearing,

selling and serving mutton. That's the thing, you know the meat from

those animals will be superb. Look at them. They are healthy, the

husbandry, its top drawer. Fabulous. Our taste test should just about be

ready so we are heading back to the butchers to find out how the more

slowly cooked mutton gets on against the roast leg of lamb. Shall I tell

you which is which or shall we decide when we tasted? We'll decide

when we tasted! We can't tell which is which now. There we are. Going to

dive in and try some? Yeah! This is what we reckon Islam.

Beautiful. Really good. -- this is what we reckon is lamb. That is a

lot deeper, more structured flavour. You are happy with that, aren't you?

Google very nice. It is tender, it is tasty, it just melts in the

mouth. This mutton, slowly weird, slowly cooked and then joined slowly

with the dignity it deserves. -- slowly reared, slowly cooked and

then enjoyed slowly with the dignity it deserves.

And there's more from Si and Dave next week

It's now time to speak to some of you at home.

First up we have Tanya from London? I have got a kilo of bavette steak

and I am wanting a way to barbecue it, maybe with a marinade? Bavette

is a nice meat, vegetable oil, chopped chilli, chopped red onion

is. Not Olive Oyl? Vegetable oil is fine. Maybe some gherkins, parsley,

garlic, marinade for 24 hours. On the barbecue, nice, high heat. Cover

it with foil and cook it for maybe 25 minutes. Olia? I would totally go

with that. It can be quite tough, not too long. Jane, what wine?

Something big, hearty and read, something like a ganache, which is

very popular in the South of France, facing big, rich and read. Steak is

good to match with red wine. Happy? Sounds great, thank you. Heaven or

hell? Hell. She has the bavette! They will just think it is hilarious

to make me eat meat. I have some tweets, Karen says ideas

for an interesting way to cook wood pigeon breast, plus an unusual wine

to go with it? Google would pigeon, I think it is nice in salads. Mixer

roasted beetroot with some pan-fried wood pigeon and a vinaigrette, maybe

someone that is. Maybe cement deeds. Very simple, earthly. Jane?

Something quite on trend at the moment is South Africa in general.

Like my jeans! There is a good variety from the South of France,

they are doing a fantastic job with it in South Africa, it is quite

light in the South African version but really fruity. Stick it in a

bun, barbecue sauce, have a beer. Claire says can you give me some

ideas for batch cooking with mince, I am bored of Bolognese and chiili.

Olia? There is a really great Central Asian dish, basically you

fried inserts and spices, a little bit of coriander and cumin until it

is really crispy, don't disturb it too much, really high heat, crispy.

Then either pasta sheets, like lasagne sheets, or your own

home-made lasagne, boil it and lay it with the meat and some lovely

garlicky yoghurt on top, lots of herbs, coriander, dill. Jane? Mince

in general I often go central Italy, Chianti, and nice Tuscan red.

Chianti is not that big. A bit more easy-going. There are some of the

Afro-Caribbean patties, like pasties with mince. I had a great one last

week, the Cape Malay food we were doing earlier, the chutney that I

put into that dish, Mrs Ball's chutney, which is not funny, it is a

South African staple and it makes it very sweet, with cinnamon. That is

delicious. Back to the phones, we have got fillip from Birmingham? I

am entertaining a friend tonight who would like a vegetarian dish,

preferably non-spicy. Shall we just ask Nick Knowles? Get a cauliflower

head, slice it into steaks, about this big, mix butter with an fennel

seeds, commie and seeds, keirin seeds, Fry it like a stake in the

pan and fry it until it is caramelised, that is when

cauliflower really sings. And a nice, simple salad. I would probably

go with something like a ribbon courgette and caper lemon linguine,

something like that, nice and easy. Very delicate. Would you serve that

to your builder mates? You are surprised how many of them would eat

that, holding their fork with their little fingers in the air! As long

as it is a good plateful. It is quite a meal. Jane? I would go with

something zesty, with a faint -- fennel and that sort of thing. Quite

citrusy and zesty. If you want something more unusual, the white

wines from northern Portugal are fantastic. Sir Steve, fresh, bright,

zingy. And something like the light pair ciders from northern France.

What would you like to see at the end of the show, fillip? Hell,

because I am a meat eater. But you are not eating it! As lovely as it

is to have a wine expert in the studio, we still want to get out and

about. Each week we will bring you topical

foodie films from all over the UK. Chef Galton Blackiston has gone

foraging in Hunstanton in Norfolk for fresh seasonal produce visiting

a place called Nurtured In Norfolk who fulfil the "growing" demand

for micro vegetables Another planet! Have a look.

Spring in Norfolk, there is no finer place to be. I would say that, I am

biased, but we had some of the finest raw ingredients in the

country. I am here to show you what we have to offer.

Hello, lovely to see you. Tell me, what happens here? Basically

reproduce a range of edible flowers, Micro vegetables, micro herbs, micro

leaves for the food service industry. This is dedicated to

flowers. We work with the number of foragers as well, providing us with

various products through spring and summer. Maybe you should do some

foraging for us? Hello, Martin. Lovely to meet you. I

believe you are a foragers, what do you forage? Anything edible and

wild, if it is wild and edible, I will forage for it. You have to know

exactly what you are picking, some plants are poisonous, you need

permission from the landowner, if you are not sure, do not do it. You

could almost find anything in any field anywhere? Almost definitely. A

good time of year for nettles? Very good, you just use the tips. You can

use the whole thing before it goes woody, these top leagues. When the

stem goes to Woody, you leave it. This is the perfect time to use

nettles, green and French. -- green and fresh.

These are edible. You can make juice out of them, serve it with lobster

or anything. All these plants are edible. Blimey! What is he? Scurvy

grass, salads. Years ago I made ale out of it, it is full of vitamins C,

that is why it is called scurvy grass. See purslane is a zebra

where, as salty vegetable, blanched in risotto or served with fish. --

see purslane is everywhere. We have some young C Aster, -- sea astor.

Here is a smidgen of what Norfolk has to offer. I will be sending

these micro herbs to you in the studio to play about with.

Next week we will be in New York for Easter. We might be using these

herbs in food hell in a little bit. -- next week we will be in York for

Easter. Olia, you are in a lovely headscarf.

Freddie, you went in the bin last time.

You must use three eggs but feel free

to use anything else from the ingredients

in front of you to make them as tasty as possible.

The clocks stop when your omelette hits the plates.

We will be running out of music soon! Yum! Can't wait to try that!

What do you mean?! It looks great, it has flowers on it! You have won

me over. It is seasoned. That is nice. Quite hot. OK. Both very nice

omelettes. Olia, did you beat your time? I don't think so, but I got

flowers on it, so... Yes, you did. 28.48, I have lost you again. Pretty

good. That put it there for now. Freddie, are you back on the board?

I hope so. You are. 30 .12. I will take that. Well done.

Stop self congratulating! We will find out whether Nick

Knowles is getting food heaven food hell after Nigella Lawson's

chocolate and hazelnut cheesecake, and her invention of a meatzza.

He looks like he is joining in. My children are bigger than me now,

but luckily I always have lots of other little one surrounding me, so

I am happy. It happens that might meatzza and my chocolate hazelnut

cheesecake are perfect for this sort of thing. It is a family favourite,

because those are my stepdaughter 's' absolute favourites. Because the

cheesecake needs to sit in the fridge for a good, long while, I get

started the night before. The base is made like most cheesecake bases,

a mixture of digestives and butter. Then I had to micro other

ingredients, some chocolate hazelnut spread and some chopped hazelnuts.

-- then I add two other ingredients. I blitzed the ingredients until they

resemble damp sand. With this in a cake tin and press it down smoothly.

The base is made and ready in the fridge, I had to make the topping,

which is as easy as one, two, three. One, it is a cheesecake so you have

cream cheese. Two, icing sugar. Not an awful lot because there is

sweetness to come. And now, very important, chocolate hazelnut paste.

I'm determined to get every last bit out of this. Now I'm just mixing

these three ingredients together, whilst they are mixing I shall slink

off and retrieve my base. Perfect to me. All smooth and

whipped. This is my treat, later. It is actually therapeutic trying to

get the top smooth, not to smoke because I am going to scatter

hazelnuts on top, ready toasted, I love the bronze a golden topping.

Both cheesecake and cheese cake maker can now chill.

My cheesecake has had time to set, resting overnight and the rest in

the fridge. I need do nothing further with that. All I have to do

is consider might Meat-zza. It is a wondrous thing, I say with no

modesty! It is like a pizza, you might guess, although instead of a

bread base it has a meatball mixture squashed flat into a disk. Break to

eggs into the mincemeat and sprinkle over some Parmesan. And that is to

give saltiness and boost the flavour. And then you can add either

breadcrumbs which is more Italian or porridge oats. What you want is to

make the base of the Meat-zza firm up. Mince over the mixture a clove

of garlic and sprinkle with freshly chopped parsley. These are the

traditional flavourings for Italian meatballs. Just mix everything

together in a bowl. It is easiest to do by hand, whatever implement the

dues, don't over-mix. Put this mixture into a greased round baking

tin. Squished it down gently, remember not to press too hard. You

don't want to over-work the mixture. Open a can of chopped tomatoes and

drain it. I don't want any access liquid ruining my meatzza base. I

add a sprinkling of dried oregano, a small amount of sea salt and a

drizzle of garlic oil. Stir that to mix and then use it to spread over

the top of the meatzza base. Slice a mozzarella ball into thin slices. I

think of this as a cheese sunburst! Is needed to go into a hot oven for

25 minutes. I which time the meat base is set, the tomatoes are

bubbling and the cheese listed gold. Before I slices and serve it I strew

it with fresh basil. It really does look like a pizza.

Right, time to find out whether Nick is getting his food

The full week to that we need to address something, you didn't see

you had a husband earlier, did you become because there's a lot of

Twitter activities suggesting that you have one. I haven't been lucky

enough to have a husband, only wives. It might be embarrassing to

go any further than that other than that I am single after a long time!

It's getting personal. This is your food heaven. You like aubergine

heaven. I hated it for years but then suddenly got to like it. If you

are vegetarian you can't afford to lose a food. This is why I could not

understand the vegan diet because I couldn't lose eggs and cheese.

70,000 vegetables in the world you could eat. That was your heaven, a

lot of my things, or hell. Big old beef cheeks. I've bet they've gone

about. We know that the callers went for hell. These guys could have

saved you. Freddie was the only one who voted for you. I forgot what

hell was, to be honest! Jon Daly that's very nice of you, Freddie!

That's very nice of you, Freddie! I'm getting a steam facial, it's

quite nice. This is why cooks's complexions are always so good. You

can stand there, guys, or you can help! Freddie, could you do the

maths? It's got to be really creamy. I need some asparagus. If you could

pass me these? Some watercress puree. Beef cheeks. This is

delicious. You are just trying to cut the meat right back? Yes, one

thing that happens is that your stomach becomes used to the fact

that you don't eat much meat. Fish is easier but when you get a heavy

piece of beef or lamb, you can feel it. You can feel the difference in

the rest of your day. I'm sure. You feel a lot heavier. Julius Caesar

wouldn't allow his army to eat meat. They were vegetarian. You are full

of facts! There's a book in there. I like historical dramas, I write

historical scripts, I've got a film company. He wouldn't let them eat

meat because he thought it made them slow and sluggish. It's good for the

environment, we all need to eat less meat. I had a bit of a battle with

the beacons when I started because their view was you either of Egan --

you are either vegan or you are not. But I want to experiment more with

it. Guys tend to eat too much meat. Have a meat free Monday or something

like that. And if you want to be vegetarian 80% of the time you can.

Don't put yourself on the wagon that you can then fall off and give up

on. You know? My trip to South Africa, the other week, they love

their meat and when they are not eating big parts of steak, they are

chewing it. So you are eating meat between meat meals. I got a load of

stuff from the Natural History Unit, I went there for 12 weeks and I had

to come back in the middle, and the vegetarians were dying on their

feet. You couldn't get a vegetable in South Africa at all. When I went

back and packed vegetarian sausages in the middle of my suitcase and got

them back to Africa. They were crying with gratitude one I actually

walked in. Smuggling vegetables! When I came back with the vegetarian

sausages they said, that's pork and I said no, they sausages. It's true,

in sausages there isn't always much meat!

Freddie, you are making that vegan super creamy. Blend this watercress

with the oil. Basically blitz the watercress with some oil. In here,

Browning off the veg, a few clothes in there as well. A few bay leaves

-- a few clothes. -- cloves. Nick, you are a busy man at this moment,

doing this programme, mind of a marathon. It is a documentary to

coincide with the London Marathon. We worked together with Prince

William, Prince Harry and the Duchess of Cambridge. They are a

good team. They really are. The future is bright for the monarchy in

this country with those guys, they are properly engaged and they

genuinely care about the things... They have chosen a mental health as

an issue. I worked with William and Harry when we did building for

veterans and that was about mental health, and weirdly, all of this

stuff that I'm talking about, the reason that I got involved with a

vegan restaurant up North is because the connection between your mental

health and what you eat, it's really, really strong. So we got

together with ten people suffering different types of mental health

issues, and they are heading towards the London Marathon and using

exercise and nutrition to try and give themselves coping techniques. I

am hoping that these to programmes will a real insight... Will be a

real insight for people into what it is to suffer with your mental health

or battle with mental health and had to get coping mechanisms. I also

want people to watch it and think, that might be me, that might explain

why I feel this way. Or I think my dad might have been like that and

that is why I never really connected with him. Yes, they might have it

and can't come to terms with that. One in for people are said to suffer

with mental health issues, the more I have done it, the more I realise

that for in for people have mental health issues at some stage. There

is a time when you are depressed, and happy, and the degree to which

you can say, this person is no longer just a little depressed

because their relationship has broken up or they are clinically

depressed, or suffering from anxiety, it's such a ridiculously

blurred line. And there's a stigma associated with it. Learning

techniques to help you sleep, learning breathing techniques to

help you breathe more comfortably, sleep properly, eat properly, and

stressful times in your life, finding techniques to calm down,

also with the programme I hope people will be able to learn from

these people how to be around people, if you love someone who has

a mental health issue, it is difficult to know how to behave

around them. So I am hoping, it is very ambitious, a lot has gone into

it, but the people that we work with our amazing. Good luck with that.

You are unofficial friend of the Royal family. I live in Eaton, they

are literally around my house for a cup of tea and a cigarette everyday!

No, we are not, I have met them five or six times but they are nice

people. Very personable. And they care. They came to meet the guys I'm

working with and they asked me what they were like and it was nice that

I could say, if you imagine the best that you hope they could be they are

even better than that. It is nice to know. Beautiful Blu-ray. Your hell

is nearly ready -- beautiful puree. Jane? We have a lovely red from

southern Portugal. It costs ?7 50 in Majestic. Beef and hearty red wine

is a no-brainer match. Could you pass this down? It's made from a

combination of native grapes to Portugal and an international grape.

So it is sweet with red and black fruit but also beefy and hearty. It

needs good beef to go with it. Not in your cookbook? No, although there

was a coward in my pie because of a printing error. It didn't say vegan

gelatine, it just said gelatine. So the first day it was published I had

people on Twitter going, you realise that there is a cow in your book!

Enjoy that. That's all we have time for today on programme at her Live,

thanks to our guests, Freddie Forster and Olia victories. Jane

Parkinson, and Nick Knowles, all the recipes are on the website, next

week and joined by Mitch Turner and the one expert Susie Barry. No

jealousy! Best Buy and tomorrow morning at my 15 on BBC Two. All

good? Delicious.