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Nowhere has been hit harder by the economic crisis than here, the | :00:03. | :00:08. | |
North East and Cumbria. Two years of austerity has cost tens of | :00:08. | :00:12. | |
thousands of people their jobs and put the squeeze on family incomes. | :00:12. | :00:16. | |
Where will the jobs of the future come from? And can we find the | :00:16. | :00:19. | |
skills - and the entrepreneurs - to get this region's economy back on | :00:19. | :00:29. | |
:00:29. | :00:46. | ||
track? I'm Victoria Derbyshire - welcome to the Look North Debate. | :00:46. | :00:51. | |
Hello. Our audience this evening comes from right across the North | :00:51. | :00:55. | |
East and Cumbria - and each has their own story to tell about the | :00:55. | :00:58. | |
economic crisis. Unemployment in the North East fell last month, but | :00:58. | :01:01. | |
it's still the highest in Britain. It's particularly tough for | :01:01. | :01:05. | |
youngsters with one in ten on the dole. But there's another group - | :01:05. | :01:15. | |
:01:15. | :01:22. | ||
the over 50s - who fear they may never work again. I have worked | :01:22. | :01:26. | |
here for 37 years. Never thought for one minute I would be finished | :01:26. | :01:33. | |
at the drop of the hat. There was another 125 people on the same day. | :01:33. | :01:40. | |
You think, "All them years "and it just took a minute. It is not a | :01:40. | :01:45. | |
good time to look for a job. Every Thursday I meet with the lads that | :01:45. | :01:48. | |
were finished the same day as me. You need it to keep you going. They | :01:48. | :01:54. | |
are in the same position as you and they need help just as much as you. | :01:54. | :01:59. | |
The job offers aren't there. They are telling you to look for work. | :01:59. | :02:06. | |
There's thousands upon thousands doing the same. Where do I go? The | :02:07. | :02:11. | |
last interview I was at, there were two other young lads there. They | :02:11. | :02:19. | |
looked like two school kids. What I want to know is, am I on the | :02:19. | :02:22. | |
employment scrapheap? Alan, you can relate to what | :02:22. | :02:30. | |
happened to Eddie? Yes. I was sacked by AEI Cables, a minute's | :02:30. | :02:34. | |
notice. How many minutes? minute. I was told, "You are | :02:34. | :02:39. | |
finished, there's your letter, leave the premises now." It was | :02:39. | :02:44. | |
called a CVA, which you will be finding out a lot more of in the | :02:44. | :02:49. | |
near future. Do you feel you are on the scrapheap? I do. I'm a single | :02:49. | :02:59. | |
parent. I'm finding it hard to get a job. I would love a job. My house | :02:59. | :03:05. | |
is paid for. I was saving up for the biggest holiday of my life when | :03:05. | :03:13. | |
I got to 65. Eddie, you are 61. You had worked there for 37 years. What | :03:13. | :03:19. | |
is it like when that is taken away from you? It is such a shock. You | :03:19. | :03:22. | |
don't expect it. At least if they are going to sack you, you would | :03:22. | :03:29. | |
think they would do it in a better way, like, have some morales and | :03:29. | :03:35. | |
explain why. There was nothing. Some might say you are about to | :03:35. | :03:39. | |
reach retirement anyway? Unemployment is at a 17-year high | :03:39. | :03:44. | |
at the minute. They are wanting to sack people at the drop of the hat. | :03:44. | :03:49. | |
They want to make it easier for employers to sack people. They want | :03:49. | :03:53. | |
to make it easier put more on the dole, which is a strain on the | :03:53. | :03:58. | |
economy. All I can hear is, "We have to find jobs for the youth." | :03:58. | :04:03. | |
There's thousands of people my age who haven't got a job. James is 23 | :04:03. | :04:08. | |
and you are a qualified bricklayer. How long have you been out of work | :04:08. | :04:12. | |
for? Just under three year. many jobs have you applied for in | :04:12. | :04:16. | |
that time? A couple of hundred. Have you had an interview? | :04:16. | :04:21. | |
Nothing? No. I have had a work trial and that was it. That's all I | :04:21. | :04:27. | |
have had. Do you think it is worse for you, or for gentlemen like Alan | :04:27. | :04:31. | |
and Eddie? I can understand his point where he's coming from. What | :04:31. | :04:35. | |
can we do? We have no support from the Government, have we? Especially | :04:35. | :04:43. | |
people my age. Mickey, you would say you were at the end of your | :04:43. | :04:46. | |
tether? Definitely. I'm a bricklayer as well. I have been | :04:46. | :04:51. | |
applying for ten jobs nearly every day, going down London. I have | :04:51. | :04:55. | |
given myself six to eight month. I'm going to go to Australia, I | :04:55. | :04:59. | |
think, if I can't get no work. If I do get work, it is only for a | :04:59. | :05:05. | |
couple of weeks. I cannot get my own place because there is no work | :05:05. | :05:09. | |
at all. You would consider leaving this country and going thousands of | :05:09. | :05:15. | |
miles... I'm going to. If I haven't got a permanent job, I have got my | :05:15. | :05:22. | |
visa so it will happen. You can't blame him. He hasn't got a choice. | :05:22. | :05:26. | |
The worst thing is, you end up in situation where you have a 23-year- | :05:26. | :05:30. | |
old sat there who can't get a job, who has been trying for three years | :05:30. | :05:34. | |
already. These older guys here who have still got a good few years | :05:34. | :05:39. | |
work left in them and, again, they think that that is it, life is over | :05:39. | :05:43. | |
work-wise. There is no way we are going to be able to keep youth like | :05:43. | :05:49. | |
that in this country if they can see a future like this. Let us | :05:49. | :05:54. | |
retire early at 60 and give the jobs to the youngsters. It would be | :05:54. | :05:58. | |
a better country to live in. This country is going to the dogs. | :05:58. | :06:01. | |
me as well, I already know people in Australia that have got work | :06:01. | :06:06. | |
there and they are getting twice as much more money as me labouring and | :06:06. | :06:12. | |
I'm doing a trade here. I cannot make a living. How will he get a | :06:12. | :06:17. | |
job with no experience? You cannot get one. Particularly with me, I | :06:17. | :06:21. | |
feel as if there is too much competition. If I haven't had a | :06:21. | :06:27. | |
foot in the door work, there is them who have had over 20 years' | :06:27. | :06:33. | |
experience, who will they take? will be cheaper! That is the honest | :06:33. | :06:40. | |
truth. He is right. Last year I applied for a job. The foreman told | :06:40. | :06:44. | |
me 380 people had applied for that one job and within two months the | :06:44. | :06:48. | |
company went under. He is right what he is saying there. There's | :06:48. | :06:54. | |
that many people applying for jobs. You cannot get a decent job. What | :06:54. | :07:02. | |
do you do? I run a food bank. is a food bank? We provide free | :07:02. | :07:07. | |
food to people who find themselves in a position where they can't | :07:07. | :07:11. | |
afford to feed themselves. But that goes across society. We have single | :07:11. | :07:15. | |
guys like these guys here who come in. They might have spent their | :07:15. | :07:21. | |
dole money chasing after a job in Berkshire, you know, they come back, | :07:21. | :07:28. | |
they have got no dole money or food. The gents on the end there, we have | :07:28. | :07:33. | |
older people who have been made unemployed, they have been sacked | :07:33. | :07:37. | |
and suddenly, their electricity bills go through the roof, | :07:37. | :07:40. | |
everything else goes through the roof. The benefits stay down there | :07:40. | :07:44. | |
and they are finding they have a choice - do they pay the bills or | :07:44. | :07:49. | |
eat? Do families pay their mortgage or do they eat? Tracy, are you | :07:49. | :07:54. | |
facing those choices? Yes, my partner works but he is unemployed | :07:54. | :07:58. | |
at the minute. The work he does, there is no work. We are having to | :07:58. | :08:04. | |
go on benefits. You use the food bank? Yes. We have to. What do | :08:04. | :08:08. | |
people think about the fact we live in one of the richest economies in | :08:08. | :08:12. | |
the world and we have a food bank operating? You can't be proud of | :08:12. | :08:18. | |
that, can you? This has been - the North East had an unemployment | :08:18. | :08:22. | |
problem for a lot of years. food bank has only been going for | :08:22. | :08:27. | |
three weeks? We are now trying to find a way out of the recession. We | :08:27. | :08:31. | |
have to create the jobs for these people to work. What do you think | :08:31. | :08:40. | |
of the fact there is a food bank operating in Darlington? I'm from a | :08:40. | :08:46. | |
charity in Stockton and Sainsbury's provide us with food parcels for - | :08:46. | :08:51. | |
basically, it is an open-door policy. People from the local | :08:51. | :08:55. | |
hostels, homeless people... What would happen to these people if... | :08:55. | :09:00. | |
They would come and get... They would do crime. It is that bad, the | :09:00. | :09:05. | |
ones at the bottom have got nothing and they are having to beg for food. | :09:05. | :09:08. | |
How is the private sector going to pull the public sector out when you | :09:08. | :09:12. | |
are paying the public sector workers off? In terms of why there | :09:12. | :09:17. | |
is a problem, particularly perhaps regarding private versus public, | :09:17. | :09:23. | |
Keith tell us why this region has the highest unemployment in the UK? | :09:23. | :09:27. | |
It's had the highest rate for some considerable time. It's become a | :09:27. | :09:32. | |
cliche, but there are lots of job opportunities lost in a narrow set | :09:32. | :09:38. | |
of industries - coal, steel, shipbuilding - and the region never | :09:38. | :09:45. | |
discovered. -- the region never recovered. The region has always | :09:45. | :09:50. | |
been playing catch-up. In the last few years, the austerity drive from | :09:50. | :09:55. | |
the Government has led to hundreds, thousands of public sector workers | :09:55. | :09:58. | |
being made redundant? One of the measures that the Government | :09:59. | :10:02. | |
brought in to address this issue was to locate some Government | :10:02. | :10:06. | |
departments within regions like the North East to try to soak up some | :10:06. | :10:10. | |
of this unemployment. That has created a dependency on the public | :10:10. | :10:15. | |
sector. One in three jobs are in the public sector. The North East | :10:16. | :10:20. | |
is suffering disproportionately. Had the Labour Party won the last | :10:20. | :10:23. | |
election, that Government would have been making similar cuts in | :10:23. | :10:28. | |
the public sector? Absolutely not. Yes, we had a huge recession and | :10:28. | :10:32. | |
yes, there needed to be cuts to the public sector. But what this | :10:32. | :10:38. | |
Government is doing is it is not only cutting too far and too fast - | :10:38. | :10:42. | |
because we need growth we cannot cut our way out of the crisis. It | :10:42. | :10:47. | |
is cutting the wrong thing. It is cutting the Future Jobs Fund. | :10:47. | :10:51. | |
would have cut jobs in the public sector had you won the last | :10:51. | :10:57. | |
election? We had to make some cuts... Hang on. What is causing | :10:57. | :11:01. | |
the problem here is the level of cuts and the fact also because we | :11:01. | :11:08. | |
have lost 23,000, 32,000 public sector jobs but also 8,000 private | :11:08. | :11:11. | |
sector jobs in the years since the election. That is because the | :11:11. | :11:16. | |
private sector is not being invested in to grow. James, are | :11:17. | :11:21. | |
these public sector jobs a price worth paying? It is very dangerous | :11:21. | :11:28. | |
to start using language like that. Why? No, no... What lies behind | :11:28. | :11:32. | |
jobs figures are individuals who are trying to make the best of | :11:32. | :11:35. | |
their lives. What we all have to do is get the economy in the North | :11:35. | :11:40. | |
East up and running again. There are a lot of good signs to the | :11:40. | :11:46. | |
North East economy. It has a long way to go. Unemployment fell by | :11:46. | :11:51. | |
11,000 in two months. Corus is creating jobs. We have a long way | :11:51. | :11:57. | |
to go. But some of the positive signs are there. We have to | :11:57. | :12:06. | |
encourage private sector growth. We will come back to you. Well, | :12:06. | :12:09. | |
with 53 people chasing every vacancy in parts of the North East | :12:09. | :12:11. | |
it seems incredible that some businesses can't find the staff | :12:11. | :12:21. | |
:12:21. | :12:30. | ||
they need. But that's the case at I have been in manufacturing for 48 | :12:30. | :12:36. | |
years. In 2000, we were turning over �4 million. In 2005, we bought | :12:36. | :12:42. | |
the business. This year, we will be doing �15 million. We are involved | :12:42. | :12:45. | |
in defence, pharmaceutical equipment, you name it we have been | :12:45. | :12:49. | |
involved in it. I feel a great deal of pride. We have achieved a lot. | :12:49. | :12:53. | |
We are adding something to the economy in the North East and the | :12:53. | :12:56. | |
country as a whole. We could be taking on 20 skilled people | :12:56. | :13:00. | |
tomorrow, but we can't get the highest skilled people that we need | :13:00. | :13:05. | |
and the result of that is that we have been turning business away. | :13:05. | :13:09. | |
Media Studies, health, leisure, beauty, those degree courses are of | :13:09. | :13:13. | |
no interest to me whatsoever. None of the degrees have been focusing | :13:13. | :13:17. | |
on manufacturing. My key question is what is the education system | :13:17. | :13:22. | |
going to do to accelerate the availability of skilled people to | :13:22. | :13:29. | |
support my growth of my business? Are you producing the wrong | :13:29. | :13:36. | |
trainees from Gateshead College? Peter can't take on the skilled | :13:36. | :13:40. | |
workers? I know. I understand what Peter's problem is. Tell us, what | :13:40. | :13:44. | |
is it? Why can't you solve it? have heard a bit of discussion | :13:44. | :13:48. | |
going around. The interesting thing about the North East - the North | :13:48. | :13:53. | |
East has always been - the very thing that Micky talked about - the | :13:53. | :13:58. | |
thing that happens in the North East when you can't find work, what | :13:58. | :14:04. | |
do you do? You leave. Then when you get an upsurge in the way Peter has, | :14:04. | :14:11. | |
he has not got the high-end workers. It takes two or three years to | :14:11. | :14:15. | |
train those people. Also, the other problem is that people aren't | :14:15. | :14:23. | |
taking on apprenticeships either. Who else is worried about the lack | :14:23. | :14:27. | |
of skills or the wrong kind of skills in the region? One of the | :14:27. | :14:31. | |
problems is that there has been this fetish in Government for | :14:31. | :14:34. | |
having half of the population going to university and the universities | :14:34. | :14:40. | |
have been selling students a lie that there's millions of jobs in | :14:40. | :14:44. | |
Media Studies. That won't happen now that Nick Clegg has decided to | :14:44. | :14:49. | |
raise tuition fees? We need a lot more apprenticeships. That is one | :14:49. | :14:55. | |
thing that people have to realise. There's been a massive amount of no | :14:55. | :15:03. | |
more apprenticeships offered in the North East. Andrew, Andrew's earned | :15:04. | :15:09. | |
an apprenticeship at Caterpillar, a couple of years ago. Last year, ten | :15:09. | :15:13. | |
apprenticeships available and there were 510 applicants. What is so | :15:13. | :15:19. | |
special about you? How did you get it? I don't know. I was lucky, I | :15:19. | :15:24. | |
suppose. I went to sixth form for two-year and aapplied for an | :15:24. | :15:27. | |
apprenticeship. The company was in a position where I could be offered | :15:27. | :15:32. | |
that. That is not the case for everybody. What do you do with | :15:32. | :15:39. | |
those ten... We put the apprentices through a four-year programme. We | :15:39. | :15:43. | |
are looking for the skills that we need. There is a shortage within | :15:43. | :15:47. | |
manufacturing and we are also working in local schools to | :15:47. | :15:50. | |
encourage children that manufacturing is not a dirty and | :15:50. | :15:56. | |
dark and dank place to be. There's skills that you can be had. The | :15:56. | :16:02. | |
earnings potential in gaining a skilled trade, you could get | :16:02. | :16:07. | |
�200,000 by the time you have finished. You moved your customer | :16:07. | :16:12. | |
contact centre from Gloucester to Gateshead, Robert. Why? We had two | :16:12. | :16:16. | |
contact centres. We felt that the service we were getting from the | :16:16. | :16:22. | |
Gateshead one was exemplary in terms of sales, absence - we find | :16:22. | :16:25. | |
the North East workforce the best workforce in the country. Every | :16:25. | :16:30. | |
time we take over a business, we try and create as many North East | :16:30. | :16:34. | |
jobs - 175 North East jobs in the last two years. Was part of the | :16:34. | :16:38. | |
decision to move from Gloucester to do with the fact it is cheaper | :16:38. | :16:41. | |
here? We paid the Newcastle people more than we paid the Gloucester | :16:41. | :16:46. | |
people. That is interesting. Are you worried about the lack of | :16:46. | :16:51. | |
skills? Yes, moving forward, one of the statistics I'm familiar with - | :16:51. | :16:54. | |
there's only 10% of the companies in the manufacturing engineering | :16:54. | :17:01. | |
sector in the North East. There's 4,800 of them take apprentices on. | :17:01. | :17:07. | |
So we sort of - we reap what we sow, really. If we don't invest, we | :17:07. | :17:13. | |
won't have the skills. If you look at offshore on Teesside, there's | :17:13. | :17:16. | |
zero unemployment in offshore skills. We are employing foreigners | :17:16. | :17:22. | |
to come and do jobs on Teesside. Offshore didn't have the foresight | :17:22. | :17:27. | |
to train and educate. That is absurd. There are people here who | :17:27. | :17:32. | |
could do those jobs but you have to bring foreigners in? I would like | :17:32. | :17:37. | |
to pick up on a couple of the points from over there. A question | :17:37. | :17:42. | |
to the economist is, why don't we attract and what is wrong with our | :17:42. | :17:46. | |
reputation that we don't attract more blue ship plcs to come to the | :17:46. | :17:51. | |
region? Nissan, the most production car plant in the world - we operate | :17:51. | :17:57. | |
on Teesside, we have a fantastic workforce. We have still got this | :17:58. | :18:04. | |
stigma, this reputation that the North East is a dull place to work. | :18:04. | :18:09. | |
Our football team has struggled! have to invest in the future. One | :18:09. | :18:15. | |
thing we cannot do. This is where we sometimes fall down. We don't | :18:15. | :18:19. | |
have the infrastructure. We can't build roads or motorways. We can't | :18:19. | :18:22. | |
build those world-class projects, so that is all I ever want | :18:22. | :18:26. | |
Government to do. I don't want Government to support me in | :18:26. | :18:30. | |
training, I don't need that. I can't build a motorway. So when we | :18:30. | :18:40. | |
:18:40. | :18:41. | ||
are saying, "Hell us" we don't want major help. We -- are saying, "Help | :18:41. | :18:50. | |
us", we don't want major help. problem that we have is that when | :18:50. | :18:55. | |
we are facing significant cuts in public services, we do need to look | :18:55. | :18:58. | |
at the investment there is in this region in terms of infrastructure, | :18:58. | :19:05. | |
whether it be road, rail, what other links to the rest of the | :19:05. | :19:09. | |
country. No-one bats for the North East. Keith, where are the jobs of | :19:09. | :19:15. | |
the future going to come? If only I knew. That is why we have booked | :19:15. | :19:21. | |
you! I know. I think it's - to pick up on some of the the other points | :19:21. | :19:25. | |
- it is about Government creating the conditions within which the | :19:25. | :19:30. | |
jobs can be created. Companies aren't looking for hand-outs, they | :19:30. | :19:34. | |
are looking to draw on a stock of reasonably well-educated people | :19:34. | :19:38. | |
that they can train for the specific disciplines that relate to | :19:38. | :19:42. | |
their business. Rather perversely, at this time of economic difficulty, | :19:42. | :19:48. | |
the Government is investing less. So if a company like Amazon wanted | :19:48. | :19:53. | |
to come to this region, completely outbid and outfought by Scotland | :19:53. | :19:56. | |
which has all of the infrastructure to take thousands of businesses | :19:56. | :20:03. | |
north of the border, the region is missing out. It is very important | :20:03. | :20:07. | |
because we all go out and sell the North East. All too often the | :20:07. | :20:10. | |
national picture that is presented of the North East is the negative | :20:10. | :20:17. | |
story. There are a lot of skills and great companies. There are good | :20:17. | :20:23. | |
roads and good infrastructure in this region. When East Coast Trains | :20:23. | :20:29. | |
closed a call centre in Newcastle and moved it to Mumbai a | :20:29. | :20:33. | |
Government-run train operating company, they moved the workers to | :20:33. | :20:35. | |
Mumbai the Conservative Government done nothing about it at all. | :20:36. | :20:42. | |
Nothing about it at all! The point I'm making is... I have to say | :20:42. | :20:52. | |
there is a lot that Government can do. It is important for | :20:52. | :20:57. | |
Government... There is a lot they can be doing. Would the Labour | :20:57. | :21:00. | |
Party require that call centre to re-open now if it was in | :21:00. | :21:06. | |
Government? I bet it wouldn't. It set it up as an arms-length | :21:06. | :21:10. | |
organisation. The Labour Party believes in active Government. | :21:10. | :21:14. | |
Answer the question. Would you make that Government-controlled company | :21:14. | :21:19. | |
re-open that call centre? You are going to privatise it anyway! | :21:19. | :21:22. | |
Exactly. You can't answer for the industrial policy of this | :21:22. | :21:26. | |
Government now and you can expecting me to answer in three | :21:26. | :21:34. | |
years' time? I left school in the '60s. The biggest apprenticeship | :21:34. | :21:39. | |
pool was in the British Coal, the coal industry, the shipbuilding, | :21:39. | :21:44. | |
the steel industry, the railways and they were all nationalised | :21:44. | :21:49. | |
companies. They just churned apprentices out for fun. Now we | :21:49. | :21:52. | |
have privatised all these industries and they are looking for | :21:52. | :22:00. | |
profit and money for shareholders, so apprentices, the easy way out. | :22:00. | :22:04. | |
Let me ask Ian. There is speculation the Chancellor may | :22:04. | :22:09. | |
scrap national pay rates, national pay bargaining so each region could | :22:09. | :22:14. | |
work out its own pay for public sector workers which might bring | :22:14. | :22:18. | |
their pay down so the private sector would be able to match it. | :22:18. | :22:24. | |
Would that be a good idea? You need flexibility. I know colleagues like | :22:25. | :22:29. | |
the big bulk bargaining power. If you want to be flexible, the people | :22:29. | :22:32. | |
that are successful in business are the ones that can move, can change, | :22:32. | :22:38. | |
people can retrain, get into new jobs. They survive. Should it be | :22:38. | :22:42. | |
easier to "hire and fire"? should be. Why? People will take | :22:42. | :22:46. | |
the risk. Not sure how long this job is going to last, but I will | :22:46. | :22:51. | |
give it a go. I can only look at best three or four months in | :22:51. | :22:55. | |
advance so am I going to guarantee somebody a job for life? That | :22:55. | :22:59. | |
employment legislation... You can't do it. That is hampering | :22:59. | :23:03. | |
businesses? Far too easy to dismiss people in this country already. We | :23:03. | :23:07. | |
have some of the weakest employment rights anywhere in Europe. I think | :23:07. | :23:11. | |
it is appalling we have got engaged in a debate that says someone who | :23:11. | :23:14. | |
does a job in Newcastle that is exactly the same as someone who | :23:14. | :23:18. | |
does a job in another part of the country should be paid a lot lower. | :23:18. | :23:22. | |
What we are doing is accepting this area as a low-wage economy if we go | :23:22. | :23:26. | |
down that line. That is bad for all of us. APPLAUSE Is it not true that | :23:26. | :23:30. | |
it is more expensive to live in the South East so why should you not be | :23:30. | :23:35. | |
paid a little bit more in the South East? You will subdue economic | :23:35. | :23:41. | |
development throughout the whole range. How? You are taking out | :23:41. | :23:46. | |
money from the economy. You are saying people in the north are | :23:46. | :23:52. | |
worth less than those in the south. No, you are not. Had I been asked | :23:52. | :23:57. | |
about it, I would have said I had some concerns about getting rid of | :23:57. | :24:02. | |
national pay bargaining. If it is going to be done, we have to make | :24:02. | :24:06. | |
sure it doesn't hit the North East unfairly. I will speak for myself. | :24:06. | :24:09. | |
You can speak for your union members! It is an important point | :24:09. | :24:14. | |
that we need to see investment in this region, we need to see people | :24:14. | :24:19. | |
spend the money they earn in this region. The Government is | :24:20. | :24:23. | |
increasing the lower tax threshold... James, thousands of | :24:23. | :24:30. | |
public sector jobs have been sacrificed on your Government's | :24:30. | :24:35. | |
austerity measures. People who were losing their jobs because they have | :24:35. | :24:39. | |
very few rights... Can I ask you, Craig, why is it fair that the | :24:39. | :24:43. | |
average wage for a public sector worker in the North East of England | :24:43. | :24:48. | |
is 11% higher than the pay for a private sector? Why is it fair? | :24:48. | :24:53. | |
you do the same job, you should get the same pay. That is not happening. | :24:53. | :24:57. | |
If you accept this principle, it is the same as the nonsense argument | :24:57. | :25:01. | |
the Government puts forward in terms of pensions. If you attack | :25:01. | :25:05. | |
public sector pensions, no-one will have pension provision. We have | :25:05. | :25:09. | |
businesses all over the UK. It is a fact in private business life in | :25:09. | :25:12. | |
the South East we have to pay our managers more than we do in the | :25:12. | :25:16. | |
North East. Our North East managers are better. It is a fact of life to | :25:16. | :25:21. | |
retain those people, I have to keep them more. The only way for the | :25:21. | :25:24. | |
North to get back on its feet - and end its reliance on the public | :25:24. | :25:28. | |
sector - is to grow more new businesses of its own. But have we | :25:28. | :25:31. | |
got the entrepreneurs ready to take on that challenge? Well, not | :25:31. | :25:41. | |
:25:41. | :25:45. | ||
everyone's attempt to start their We had a sandwich shop in Gateshead. | :25:45. | :25:50. | |
We took it over, we did really well for a while. You buy in the correct | :25:50. | :25:54. | |
foods and whatever. But because there's a recession, people aren't | :25:54. | :25:58. | |
willing to pay that price. We noticed people taking sandwiches to | :25:58. | :26:03. | |
work as opposed to calling into the shop. And because of that, we had | :26:03. | :26:09. | |
to close it down. Standing here it feels really depressing. All that | :26:09. | :26:14. | |
time, all that energy put into the business and for what? This is | :26:14. | :26:17. | |
Darren, my partner. He is running a building business. The construction | :26:17. | :26:21. | |
industry has been hit hugely. Now we are getting to the point you are | :26:21. | :26:25. | |
using your savings. Once that has gone, that will be the end. We have | :26:25. | :26:29. | |
already had one failed business. We have another one on the brink. We | :26:29. | :26:33. | |
need to find out what is the help out there for the likes of us and | :26:33. | :26:37. | |
if it can happen to us, it can happen to all these other | :26:37. | :26:42. | |
businesses around here. Darren, Valerie, how much have you | :26:42. | :26:49. | |
got left in savings? Less than two grand. That is it. If work doesn't | :26:49. | :26:56. | |
pick up, we will have to close it. We find - we have a building | :26:56. | :27:00. | |
company and people aren't spending the money, or they want you to keep | :27:00. | :27:07. | |
the price so tight that you can't make any money. So the balance is | :27:07. | :27:11. | |
you are giving more out than you are getting in. When that two grand | :27:11. | :27:15. | |
runs out, then what? Tell me. don't know. I have already asked | :27:15. | :27:20. | |
the question, but apparently in this country if you try and do it | :27:20. | :27:23. | |
yourself, and you try and look after yourself, you think you will | :27:23. | :27:27. | |
have a safety net. We have paid our taxes for years and years. When you | :27:27. | :27:34. | |
go for the help, it is like, "You are claiming benefits?" No. "I'm | :27:34. | :27:40. | |
sorry, we can't help you." What are we supposed to do? That is the same | :27:40. | :27:45. | |
for you? Yes. I work for a charity full-time. I have a 16-year-old | :27:45. | :27:50. | |
daughter and I want to send her to uni. I'm doing business management. | :27:50. | :27:56. | |
I do - I would like to have my own business, eventually. There's lots | :27:56. | :27:59. | |
of worries. I'm really stretched now. I have paid for my course as | :27:59. | :28:05. | |
well. I don't get any help there. I don't understand why there is not... | :28:05. | :28:11. | |
You help yourself and you don't get any help? No. People are on | :28:11. | :28:16. | |
benefits and they don't work. They get everything paid for them. In | :28:16. | :28:21. | |
actual fact, I would be better off on benefit. That is what we said. | :28:21. | :28:26. | |
understand why people on benefit stay on benefit. I tell you the | :28:26. | :28:30. | |
difference, you know that every week or every two weeks, that is | :28:30. | :28:39. | |
going to happen. However low it is. The likes of us, we just don't have | :28:39. | :28:45. | |
that. I see people in this position every day. They have taken on | :28:45. | :28:49. | |
mortgages they can't afford, or businesses that go under. They | :28:49. | :28:52. | |
never thought they would be in a position where they would have to | :28:52. | :28:55. | |
look at benefits. Unfortunately, the recession is hitting, but the | :28:55. | :29:00. | |
Government is taking �18 billion out of the welfare benefits system | :29:00. | :29:04. | |
and that is going to hit people who are just above the edge. People who | :29:04. | :29:08. | |
are on benefits will find it difficult to get off benefits | :29:08. | :29:17. | |
because the margin to get a job is not there. Yvonne has been waiting. | :29:17. | :29:22. | |
What happened to your jewellery and accessory shop in Maryport? | :29:22. | :29:27. | |
opened it up five-and-a-half years ago. Initially, it was very, very | :29:27. | :29:32. | |
good. Then, unfortunately, when Northern Rock collapsed, it hit | :29:32. | :29:37. | |
Cumbria because they invested in it as well. It literally sliced the | :29:37. | :29:47. | |
:29:47. | :29:47. | ||
economy. You could literally see it cut in two. What did your | :29:47. | :29:52. | |
accountant say to you? He said, "Shut the shop!" Simple as that? | :29:52. | :29:57. | |
Simple as that. You are going under. I knew. I mean, I have been in | :29:57. | :30:02. | |
business since I was 21. I have always been self-employed. The last | :30:03. | :30:07. | |
business that we had was in the last recession and that went | :30:07. | :30:12. | |
bankrupt and we lost our home, we lost everything. Literally, we had | :30:12. | :30:16. | |
to live in the middle of a field. Now it's happened again, how does | :30:16. | :30:22. | |
that make you feel? I'm really sad. I'm more sad for the fact that - I | :30:22. | :30:26. | |
don't feel I have let myself down. I feel I have let the people that I | :30:26. | :30:32. | |
have grown to like in the shop down. I went into something - I knew | :30:32. | :30:36. | |
there was something wrong and I thought I have to find a gap. | :30:36. | :30:40. | |
Michelle, let me ask you about your business. You set up a business in | :30:40. | :30:46. | |
the middle of the recession, two years ago. I did. What was the | :30:46. | :30:52. | |
thinking there? I'm thinking, "Was I a fool?" My business is luxury | :30:52. | :30:56. | |
lingerie, I had the option to do standard lingerie or luxury. I went | :30:56. | :31:00. | |
for the luxury market. We are exporting to 14 countries. We are | :31:00. | :31:03. | |
based in Gateshead. I'm so proud of being from the North East. We need | :31:03. | :31:08. | |
to look at some of the positives about living here. I have been | :31:08. | :31:14. | |
given a hell of a lot of support from Gateshead Council and the | :31:14. | :31:18. | |
University of Northumbria. How is the business doing? It is doing | :31:18. | :31:25. | |
really well. I need to thank all of my students who have helped me get | :31:25. | :31:32. | |
by. I have been to the job tenner. My business is run by me and two or | :31:33. | :31:39. | |
three of the in -- I have been to the Jobcentre. My business is in | :31:39. | :31:49. | |
run by me and two or three of the students. What is frustrating you | :31:49. | :31:55. | |
at the moment, Jalf? There are fantastic opportunities. There are | :31:55. | :31:58. | |
always opportunities in the recession. You need to find the | :31:58. | :32:02. | |
right product for the right market. If you are forward-thinking, you | :32:02. | :32:08. | |
could still make a successful business. In order to fund it, the | :32:08. | :32:11. | |
Regional Development Agency has gone, the small loans guarantee | :32:11. | :32:16. | |
scheme, which was in existence a few years ago, that's gone, and the | :32:16. | :32:19. | |
Banks aren't giving any money regardless of how good your | :32:19. | :32:23. | |
business plans are. They have said blank to the restaurant industry | :32:23. | :32:28. | |
they are not borrowing at all. We could create jobs and create new | :32:28. | :32:31. | |
businesses but we don't have the means to do so. James, the | :32:31. | :32:35. | |
Coalition Government has been putting pressure on banks, it is | :32:35. | :32:41. | |
not happening in the North East? Some banks are looking at whole | :32:41. | :32:48. | |
sectors of commerce and saying, "We are not going to lend to | :32:48. | :32:52. | |
restaurants." Why don't you have a word? Talk to the Bank managers? | :32:52. | :32:58. | |
are aware of what the problem is. We have to facilitate it. You are | :32:58. | :33:04. | |
right. There are huge numbers... Who runs the country, the Banks or | :33:04. | :33:09. | |
the politicians? The politicians don't run the Banks. Everything is | :33:09. | :33:14. | |
arms-length but it is our money. is. There are huge numbers of | :33:14. | :33:17. | |
entrepreneurs in the North East and across the country who want to do... | :33:18. | :33:22. | |
Why are you laughing? The previous Government's policy was to be at | :33:22. | :33:28. | |
arms-length when we were offering support, we set up the RDAs... | :33:28. | :33:33. | |
couldn't make the Banks lend either, let's be honest? They would be | :33:33. | :33:38. | |
saying the same. We would have much... She would be saying the | :33:38. | :33:46. | |
same. It is like a game of tennis! If you were in power, it would be | :33:46. | :33:52. | |
the same thing. You would be blaming him. I have to say if you | :33:52. | :33:56. | |
believe that, if everyone believes that no Government makes a | :33:56. | :34:03. | |
difference, that is the reason why we get the... It is our fault! | :34:03. | :34:07. | |
last four years of your power, you were no better, if not worse, than | :34:07. | :34:11. | |
the Tories are at the moment. had the Future Jobs Fund which | :34:11. | :34:16. | |
would have given jobs to these people. We had the National Health | :34:16. | :34:21. | |
Service... Hang on a minute. Phil? I don't want a party political | :34:21. | :34:27. | |
argument. The Bank loans go beyond restaurants. We are in a | :34:28. | :34:31. | |
manufacturing industry. We have suppliers in our supply chain that | :34:31. | :34:37. | |
can't buy raw materials to supply my factory. We are a very solid | :34:37. | :34:42. | |
business. We is suppliers that can't buy steel. I have to say, | :34:42. | :34:48. | |
with the Banks, I went with an order book of �26,000 of orders and | :34:48. | :34:54. | |
said, "I have these orders. If you give me the money, I can supply | :34:54. | :34:59. | |
these orders." "Sorry, we are not going to give you the money." So | :34:59. | :35:09. | |
:35:09. | :35:10. | ||
those orders went. That is crazy. I want to bring you some research. | :35:10. | :35:14. | |
Experian say the North East has the highest number of young small | :35:14. | :35:19. | |
companies with the potential to grow and create new jobs. They call | :35:19. | :35:23. | |
these companies business champions. Newcastle and Middlesbrough are in | :35:23. | :35:26. | |
the top ten local authorities for business champions. Steve, you run | :35:26. | :35:34. | |
such a company. What is it? Basically, we put high-resolution | :35:34. | :35:39. | |
graphics on shutters, shop shutters, or basically any shutters. When the | :35:39. | :35:46. | |
shuts are down, companies can advertise? Yes, it can be used as a | :35:46. | :35:49. | |
cost-effective form of advertising, or just to brighten up - our | :35:49. | :35:54. | |
mission statement is to brighten up Britain. OK. Keith, are you upbeat | :35:54. | :35:59. | |
because of this research? I wish I was. There are clearly some great | :35:59. | :36:04. | |
examples of these companies, but if they believe that they have found | :36:04. | :36:09. | |
the formula to identify growth companies, that is the Holy Grail | :36:09. | :36:15. | |
of economic development. Sadly, I don't think that is going to be the | :36:15. | :36:19. | |
case. One of the reasons why the region has come out well is because | :36:19. | :36:24. | |
there has been a little bit of an upsurge in new businesses starting. | :36:24. | :36:28. | |
The business base is so small that relatively it looks as if there's | :36:28. | :36:32. | |
lots of new young businesses, but it is also a reflection of the fact | :36:32. | :36:36. | |
there aren't that many businesses in this region. OK. There's plenty | :36:36. | :36:43. | |
of empty shops... Can I say, instead of having party political | :36:43. | :36:49. | |
argpts full of -- arguments full of bluster, why don't the parties get | :36:49. | :36:54. | |
together, get those guys into work, in some form, get that guy's | :36:54. | :36:58. | |
business going again, promote this region, do what they can for this | :36:58. | :37:05. | |
region, get this guy apprentices. If they acted like adults, they | :37:05. | :37:15. | |
:37:15. | :37:18. | ||
would do some good. Well said. APPLAUSE Thank you, Craig. We are | :37:18. | :37:23. | |
One NorthEast! I would like to end with some final thoughts from the | :37:23. | :37:28. | |
three people we featured in our short films. Really to get your | :37:28. | :37:32. | |
thoughts about how you are feeling about your future, Eddie? I haven't | :37:32. | :37:38. | |
got a future. Not in work. There isn't anything there. They can | :37:38. | :37:42. | |
argue as much as they like. Unless they find the jobs and the jobs are | :37:42. | :37:48. | |
there, you have had it. Peter? can correct one thing that was said | :37:48. | :37:52. | |
before about not investing in apprentices. Our business invests | :37:52. | :38:00. | |
very strongly in apprentices. We have 10% of our workforce who are | :38:00. | :38:05. | |
apprentices. Are you optimistic about the future? Generally, | :38:05. | :38:10. | |
optimistic. Valerie? I think it's - there is nothing worse than being | :38:10. | :38:14. | |
on these programmes and you have different political parties | :38:14. | :38:18. | |
fighting. Get together and put it right. We have a great country. | :38:18. | :38:23. | |
Thank you very much. APPLAUSE And that's about it from us, we're out | :38:23. | :38:26. | |
of time. My thanks to everyone in our audience and to you at home for | :38:26. | :38:30. |