Episode 3 BBC Proms

Beethoven not once, not twice, but three times. We have an interview

with Nigel Kennedy, and we bring you 24 hours of hope - Daniel Hope. This

am joined by a trio of guests who will be giving me their thoughts on

what they have seen, heard and are looking forward to at the Proms. We

are four weeks in, halfway through, but there has been no letup in the

range of concerts from the past seven days. Never mind the new

football season and retaining the Ashes, we have had the classical and

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athletic big hitters performing in that have taken place in the past

week of Proms 2013. Inside our studio, based in the Royal College

of Music, I am joined by a triumvirate of talent from the Proms

family. First, she is a Proms old hand . She starred in the Last Night

of the Proms in 2009 and has just played her fourth Proms concert at

Cadogan Hall. She will be playing for us at the end of the show. It is

trumpeter Alison Balsom. Then we have a conductor who has been

rehearsing for his prom with our National Youth Orchestra tomorrow.

He is officially known as the principal conductor of the Royal

Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra, but unofficially, he is the Russian

Scouser, Vasily Petrenko. And one of the world's greatest harpsichord

players who made his Proms debut in 2009, Mahan Esfahani. Welcome to all

of you. Members of the Proms family. Alison and Mahan, you have played at

the prom together? We did. Quite some time ago. Nice to see you

again. Vasily, how are they rehearsals going? As always, very

intense. We did a couple of performances in Northern Ireland.

They have been amazing. The achievement over the week was

amazing. Well, the Proms has hundreds of artists appearing over

the course of the season. One example is the violinist annual

Hope, based in Vienna. But he was here a couple of weeks ago,

performing with the BBC National Orchestra of Wales and with

conductor Thomas Sondergard. For that concert, Daniel allowed Proms

Extra to follow him for the day. How could we refuse ready for hours of

Hope? This world is on the move. That is what it is. Violinist travel

a lot. We are wandering minstrels, basically. It is now the fourth or

fifth time I have worked with the BBC National Orchestra of Wales. I

have played with Thomas Sondergard three times. The piece is very

tricky. There are lots of things which could go wrong that we hope

won't. Sometimes, one does have longer run throughs, but today is a

hectic day, so we take whatever we can. Now we are hurtling through the

UK on our way to Manchester, where there is a Breakfast News appearance

tomorrow morning, very early. From there, we are getting on the train

to London, hopefully in time for the general rehearsal for the concert at

the Albert Hall. You learn to make your own normality and you learn to

be at home in different places very quickly. That is a consequence of

the fact that you are on the road all the time. Delicious. I missed

this. It is early in the morning. It was a very long journey yesterday.

We got here late last night. Breakfast TV. This is hectic even

for me. How often do you practice a day? Is it hours? You try and get in

four hours a day if you can, but if you are travelling, it is difficult.

To cope with the level of stress that you have from travelling,

performing, nerves, it needs great discipline. You have to know your

needs. So when an audience comes and they see the performer, they don't

know what that person has gone through to get to that stage. It is

a real experience being at the Proms. You have got this

unbelievable concert Hall, surrounded by people standing close

by. The music is the most important thing, but without the audience, you

have no one to communicate with. You hope it will be good, you never know

what the audience reaction will be like. I am nervous and excited. We

are backstage for the dress rehearsal, Rob agreed the most

important rehearsal. This is a chance to play the piece the whole

way through without stopping. In the musical world, there is often a

saying that if you have a bad dress rehearsal, you have a good concert

and if the dress rehearsal goes too well, you had better be careful.

Having a televised prom is fantastic, because you have a record

to look back on, but it is also an added element of stress because if

you look up occasionally, you will see a camera or a red light to

remind you of where you are. Certainly at this stage, it is

getting close, so you feel the adrenaline beginning to rush. It is

basically the worst moment. You want to go out and play, but you can't

yet, so you feel like a caged tiger. Do you feel like a caged tiger,

Alison, before going on stage? is something special about being

about to go out. The adrenaline is pumping and you can't wait to get on

with it. To see him doing that, I felt for him. It is an exciting

moment. He says it is the worst it, but it is also when you feel alive.

It was interesting to realise how complicated your lives are as

international performers. People don't realise the amount of

travelling and the logistics. light is never easy. They think

about travelling in limos and drinking champagne, but in fact, it

is a lot of very early morning flights, travelling straight to

rehearsals, then straight to the concert. For the concert, there is a

reception, interviews, media activity. Talking about a caged

tiger, I am always trying to postpone the moment when I dress

myself and go on stage. I do it at the last minute, because then you

come in fresh. Your mind is ready. The benefit of conducting is that

you don't need to warm up your hands or your breath. You are just warming

up your mind. Mahan, how do you prepare 's if I had any moment of

difficulty doing this, I would not be a musician. My friends know I

have to be terribly unsociable. I will not be a good friend if I don't

feel good about the performance. Someone said to me the other day

after a concert, you must find it difficult to do all this travelling

and all these concerts. I said, well, I have found that the days on

which I don't perform are worse. That is terribly deep. It is not. I

just don't like life that much outside of the stage. You choose to

do it because it is your life and it gives it meaning. I see no reason to

apologise for that. I was interested in the comment that Daniel made when

hitting his Tunbridge about creating his own normality. How do you do

that? It depends where you are. If I am playing at the Proms, it is my

hometown. But on the other side of the world, there are certain things

you need to make it feel like a routine. Materialistic clique, it is

not much. A good cup of tea and a paper, maybe. But psychologically,

you have to be strong and disciplined about making sure you

feel at your peak fitness by the time of the concert. Sometimes I

feel sad, because you are travelling a lot, you come to the place, and

all you see is the hotel, the rehearsal venue and probably the

railway station or airport. You never have time to discover the

places. London is London, of course, and we perform regularly

hear, so we know the city. That when you go to the beautiful parts of the

planet, you are missing that. is because you are too much in

demand, Vasily ! I think that savers us the problem of going on holiday.

I have a staycation when I have a vacation. I sit at home and watch

The Simpsons, basically. But for me, normalcy is about holding to what is

close to you. For me, I talk to my father every day. I ask him about

what I should do, and he listens to broadcasts and says, I think this

did not go well. You should have done that. And that keeps you

grounded. I think, would my father like this? Would you approve?

is what you are thinking when you are playing? It is a matter of

trust. We see all these audience members and we think, we don't know

these people, but they like us. I want to be our friends. But we don't

know them. You grab for people that you know and trust, and that makes

home. Welcome lets have a look at the moment from Daniel Potts Mac

performance at the Royal Albert Hall. -- from Daniel Potts Mac

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watch on the iPlayer on till tomorrow night. Still to come, the

enfant terrible of the classical world, Nigel Kennedy. But now, the

biggest, boldest, loudest naming classical music, Beethoven. Since

the first days of Henry Wood, his music has been the backbone of the

Proms repertoire. We are about to hear the beginning of a piece that

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incredibly popular, at why was this works a revolutionary? Firstly, to

create a melody from just three notes was a revolutionary thing. And

all this intense journey from C minor to C major at the very end,

through so many circumstances and obstacles and so many tensions, was

something revolutionary for that time. The piece goes through a big

journey, a fight for eternal glory and paradise at the end, the

paradise of C major, which is very modern now. Usually, people don't

want to have something given to them. They value much more something

they have achieved through hard work. That is what this is about.

And in the 20th century, of course, it becomes one of the most difficult

pieces for conductors to start. wanted to ask you about this,

because it is an upbeat. You can treat it in various ways. There have

been various masterclasses given in the 70s. They were given by someone

who came from the Soviet Union to teach conducting. All of them were

struggling to stop the peace, because the Leningrad Philemon Nick

had been famous -- the Leningrad Philharmonic had been famous for

dealing with the sound. If you give a downbeat, nothing happens. If you

are not experienced enough, it can fall down there. All young

conductors were struggling because they did not have enough authority

for this orchestra. Then someone said, what is so difficult? Look,

look at me. Just do it like that. One 2... And the whole orchestra

waits. That is one of the examples that you need to have certain

authority with the orchestra. And you need to trust the orchestra to

know that this up heat will happen in time, right with you, in the

right character -- this upbeat. know the beginning of that piece so

well. It has been performed 144 times at the Proms in 119 seasons,

so it is played twice! It is not just the famous movement, there is a

lot to listen out for. I know you have picked out a favourite clip.

am ready for you to disagree with me as a conductor, I have only played

the forehand piano version of this a few times in college. I think...

This symphony and this performance made me realise I am bitterly

opposed to playing only one movement of a work on the radio. I think we

have to fear the whole thing. Funny, the gift of Beethoven, what

he does is so special # for me, the gift of Beethoven is that all

movements are a rhetorically statement. If we look at and Elgar

statement it is one cyclical statement. For Beethoven to do this,

it is very revolutionary. When I listen to the second movement, I

realise this blustery loudmouth that Beethoven is, he shows you his heart

a little bit. He says, I am a weak person. When I listen to that second

and third movement and when I listen to the last chords of the fourth

movement, I think, it is not heroic. I feel a great sadness when

Beethoven is blustery and I think this clip will show a bit why that

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in C minor but ends in C major. The record of the week, David Owen

Norris takes us on a trip and is our guide to the last chord in

Beethoven's fifth Symphony. So much has happened up by the time we get

to the finale, Beethoven is fizzing with energy and he can't stop. He is

like an athlete who keeps running long after he has passed the

finishing tape. We hear accord which finishing tape. We hear accord which

could be the but in fact there is a third as much music still to come --

that could be the end, but in fact there is as dead as much music still

to come. Beethoven tries and tries to finish and eventually gets to

this point. Will he manage it? No. Can't stop. Still can't stop. Have

about this? No. Just can't stop! In fact, you can't stop until he plays

not a C major chord but the single note C. And then he can stop, at

last. Now, one definition of a discord is something that you can't

stop on. Amazingly enough, the effect of the fifth Symphony has

been to turn this lovely C major chord technically into a discord.

And Beethoven can't stop until he will be back next week. If you go to

our Proms website you will find an extended version of David and his

musings as well. I think we have come principally discussed that

particular symphony. Vasily, you are in the midst of rehearsing for

Beethoven's ninth. What is it about the ninth that remain so eternally

the ninth that remain so eternally popular? It is a very special piece.

It is somehow about what we can achieve in our lives. It starts from

this creation of the universe. The beginning is really like someone

creating the universe from nothing, from the fifth, then it creates the

massive storm. It is global, a global symphony, one of the most

performed in the world. It is also very personal because each person

understands it in a very personal way. I would love to ask you how you

feel the National youth Orchestra at their energy to a piece that is so

well-known. They are amazing kids we will have nearly 400 performers on

Sunday. Of course, most of them are doing it for the first time. The

very first time. That makes it so special. You have an immense amount

of energy. Sometimes I feel you need to control this energy very

carefully. Because it can blow away. They give themselves 100% for

every single note. Every single person. Because of that, the energy

and the blast is absolutely massive. You were in that orchestra, weren't

you? I was, that was my first experience and I agree, the energy

committee is very hard to recapture that. You have been practising your

instrument for a long time, the standard of the orchestra is very

high. Technically it is fantastic. My memories of playing on the

stage, particularly at the Proms with the National Youth Orchestra,

some of my greatest musical memories. Can you ever have too much

Beethoven? Clearly not at the Proms, nor on Proms Extra. We are going to

talk about Beethoven's fourth Piano Concerto. After an absence of nearly

20 years, on Thursday night the Beatles stage saw the return of the

Japanese born soloist Mitsuko Uchida with one of the great visiting

orchestras, the Bavarian radio Symphony and conductor Mariss

Jansons. It was all was going to be a highlight and it did not

disappoint. The queue was around the block, the anticipation was

phenomenal. What is it about her? Who knows her? It was so marvellous

that we saw the fourth Piano Concerto of Beethoven. These people

talk about eight woven as an inheritor of Mozart which he is not

really. -- talk about Beethoven as an inheritor of Mozart. This is the

one piece in which he tries to have the charm of Mozart. She has such a

way with drama, sometimes understated, sometimes in the style

of Mitsuko Uchida. For me it was the operatic ambivalence, we have been

talking about heroic and I think she stood away from that kind of eight

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performer. Her face is so expressive. It goes without saying

that her technique is formidable but more importantly she is musically

intelligent and she is able to reveal her personality through her

playing. She takes wonderful risks, she is almost perfect, if you can

ever use that word in an art form. She is perfect, the all-round

musician. I want a slight piano nerd question here, I was fascinated by

how still her forearms are, Italy seems to be in the fingers. Is that

something you would aspire to -- it wonderful Viennese objectivity to

her playing. She can take the swell of the voice and it goes from loud

to very soft in one phrase. That sort of nuance, think the technique

is so well suited to that concerto. I would be very curious to hear her

play the Emperor Concerto or the first Concerto, which are so

irritatingly blustery as Beethoven can be. I would love to hear what

she does with that. This is where Beethoven is Mozart. I enjoyed it so

much last night. The one thing which I took from Mike quick meeting with

-- my quick meeting with was how she described her experience of

Beethoven. She says she sees him as a man who was in hell but who was

constantly questing for heaven, for the light. I had that image in my

mind throughout the performance, does that resonate with you? I don't

think he was so much in hell himself. Of course his life wasn't

easy. You can see a lot of troubles which were happening with him and

which he made himself. It is just he was always trying to find something

new, something rather radical for this time in life, music, the

organisation of concerts. This fourth Concerto was premiered in a

concert of music only by Beethoven. It was a four-hour concert and there

hadn't been one rehearsal. The fact that Beethoven even stopped in the

middle because someone made a mistake, he said, we offer is for

it, we need to start from the beginning. -- we are very sorry. He

was always trying to satisfy his wish for progress, his wish to go

forward, his wish to move the music forward and find this other world.

It might be paradise, it might be hell. He wanted to go somewhere.

Only those people who do something like that, they move the music

forward. You can find both Beethoven concerts on the BBC iPlayer. We are

going to move onto a man who delights whenever he appears. This

year he was back with the work that catapulted his work into the

classical stratosphere. He is unconventional, opinionated, debris

and violinist with a love of Aston Villa. I am talking about Nigel

Kennedy who I caught up with after his rehearsal of Vivaldi's four

seasons. Typically for Nigel Kennedy, nothing is what you would

expect. There is so much going on behind us. The deconstruction of it

at the moment! A lot of people will be coming to see Nigel Kennedy

playing the four seasons and they will get a surprise. They will get

more for the money because there is this section where are my Arab

friends and Pulis Denny and friends improvisation. Bach was a great

improviser. If you literally play what Vivaldi wrote, it sounds

ridiculous. So having jazz musicians is taking forward the art of

improvisation from the 1600s, but is then linked into The four Seasons

hoping. I never like to count my chickens before the gig.

Nigel talked a lot about improvising, and particularly about

how normal improvisation was during the baroque period. Allison, you are

steeped in the period. Is that something you entertain? Absolutely.

There are so many parallels between jazz and the baroque period. It is

mainly about rhythm and getting this elusive groove. It is very subtle

between getting and not getting it, but it applies to both genres. And

improvisation is important in both of them, in terms of being

spontaneous and alive and exciting. It is never quite the same two times

in a row. It is fascinating. Although it is a disciplined art

form, you are able to express yourself as a performer. I also like

that jazz and Barack doesn't need a conductor. That is a nice side.

Nigel's concert is on the iPlayer and will be showed on the TV on the

23rd of August. There are still a lot more to look forward to at the

BBC Proms. Anything particularly caught your eye? I am excited about

Vasily's prom, not least because the soloist are fabulous. And he's

sitting next to you. And Vasily, you have got your prom. I am very much

looking forward to tomorrow, but if I can pick something else, I need to

be in Oslo in the next week, so I can't stay at the Royal Albert

Hall. But there is a concert on Tuesday where the audience will be

able to listen to the second piano Concerto by a soloist that is rarely

played. And Mahan, how about you? Well, I have got to plug one of my

favourite pieces. I think it will be on the 14thth, but I am not sure. If

you say check music, it is of course some of the best music. This country

punches above its weight in terms of musical quality. Anything nation

macro, I like. So I have to plug my adopted people. And you have. Thank

you very much. We have Alison's performance still to look forward

to, but here is a Proms Extra preview of one of the BBC for

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You can see that performance in full on BBC Four on Thursday night. That

is it for Proms Extra. Next week, I will be joined by another trumpeter,

the Norwegian sensation Tine Thing Helseth, the vocal polymath, Mary

King. I will talk to the first woman ever to conduct the Last Night of

the Proms, Marin Alsop. And on the sofa, fresh from performing at the

open class ROM, Britain's late Laura Mvula. You can catch the Urban

Classic Prom later tonight live on radio one, 1Xtra and Radio 3 at

eight o'clock, which is something you don't often say ! You can also