28/02/2013 Daily Politics


28/02/2013

Andrew Neil and Jo Coburn with the latest political news, interviews and debate.


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Afternoon, folks. Welcome to the Afternoon, folks. Welcome to the

:00:38.:00:39.

Afternoon, folks. Welcome to the Daily Politics. More bad news from

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Daily Politics. More bad news from Daily Politics. More bad news from

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RBS. It's announced another set of RBS. It's announced another set of

:00:41.:00:43.

RBS. It's announced another set of losses and they are big. �5.2

:00:43.:00:44.

losses and they are big. �5.2 losses and they are big. �5.2

:00:44.:00:45.

billion for last year after paying billion for last year after paying

:00:45.:00:46.

billion for last year after paying compensation or fines for miss-

:00:46.:00:47.

compensation or fines for miss- selling payment protection

:00:47.:00:48.

selling payment protection insurance and manipulating the

:00:48.:00:52.

insurance and manipulating the insurance and manipulating the

:00:52.:00:53.

inter-bank lending rate. It's not inter-bank lending rate. It's not

:00:53.:00:55.

inter-bank lending rate. It's not all doom and gloom though.

:00:55.:00:56.

all doom and gloom though. all doom and gloom though.

:00:56.:00:57.

Underlying profits were about �3.5 Underlying profits were about �3.5

:00:57.:00:58.

Underlying profits were about �3.5 billion. More than twice the

:00:58.:01:01.

billion. More than twice the billion. More than twice the

:01:01.:01:03.

previous year. Are we nearly there previous year. Are we nearly there

:01:03.:01:04.

previous year. Are we nearly there yet? We'll be looking at moves

:01:04.:01:05.

yet? We'll be looking at moves yet? We'll be looking at moves

:01:05.:01:07.

afoot to change our motorway afoot to change our motorway

:01:07.:01:08.

afoot to change our motorway service stations. Dishing the dirt

:01:08.:01:11.

service stations. Dishing the dirt service stations. Dishing the dirt

:01:11.:01:12.

on the Commonwealth. We'll be on the Commonwealth. We'll be

:01:12.:01:13.

on the Commonwealth. We'll be speaking to its former Secretary

:01:13.:01:16.

speaking to its former Secretary speaking to its former Secretary

:01:16.:01:16.

General, Don McKinnon. And comedian, General, Don McKinnon. And comedian,

:01:16.:01:17.

General, Don McKinnon. And comedian, Phil Jupitus will be here,

:01:17.:01:18.

Phil Jupitus will be here, explaining why coalition government

:01:18.:01:19.

explaining why coalition government explaining why coalition government

:01:19.:01:29.

All that in the next hour. And I've All that in the next hour. And I've

:01:29.:01:29.

All that in the next hour. And I've ditched Andrew, and bagged myself

:01:30.:01:30.

ditched Andrew, and bagged myself ditched Andrew, and bagged myself

:01:31.:01:36.

the King of daytime telly, Richard the King of daytime telly, Richard

:01:36.:01:37.

the King of daytime telly, Richard Madeley. Welcome. Now before we

:01:37.:01:38.

Madeley. Welcome. Now before we Madeley. Welcome. Now before we

:01:38.:01:38.

Madeley. Welcome. Now before we move on just a reminder that voting

:01:38.:01:39.

move on just a reminder that voting move on just a reminder that voting

:01:39.:01:40.

has begun in the Eastleigh by- has begun in the Eastleigh by-

:01:40.:01:41.

has begun in the Eastleigh by- election, caused by the resignation

:01:41.:01:42.

election, caused by the resignation election, caused by the resignation

:01:42.:01:43.

of the former Liberal Democrat of the former Liberal Democrat

:01:43.:01:46.

of the former Liberal Democrat Cabinet Minister, Chris Huhne. 14

:01:46.:01:47.

Cabinet Minister, Chris Huhne. 14 candidates are standing for

:01:47.:01:48.

candidates are standing for election in the Hampshire

:01:48.:01:50.

election in the Hampshire election in the Hampshire

:01:50.:01:50.

constituency. The polls close at constituency. The polls close at

:01:50.:01:51.

constituency. The polls close at 10pm tonight, with the result

:01:51.:01:52.

10pm tonight, with the result 10pm tonight, with the result

:01:52.:01:54.

expected in the early hours of expected in the early hours of

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expected in the early hours of Friday morning. We can't talk about

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Friday morning. We can't talk about Friday morning. We can't talk about

:01:56.:01:57.

it for fear of influencing your it for fear of influencing your

:01:57.:01:59.

it for fear of influencing your it for fear of influencing your

:01:59.:02:00.

vote. As if we could. So let's kick vote. As if we could. So let's kick

:02:00.:02:02.

vote. As if we could. So let's kick vote. As if we could. So let's kick

:02:02.:02:03.

off today with the council tax. A off today with the council tax. A

:02:03.:02:04.

off today with the council tax. A survey suggests more than 40% of

:02:04.:02:05.

survey suggests more than 40% of survey suggests more than 40% of

:02:05.:02:05.

local authorities in England are local authorities in England are

:02:05.:02:06.

local authorities in England are planning to increase council tax in

:02:06.:02:10.

planning to increase council tax in planning to increase council tax in

:02:10.:02:11.

planning to increase council tax in April. Well, this is what the Local

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April. Well, this is what the Local Government Minister, Brandon Lewis

:02:12.:02:13.

Government Minister, Brandon Lewis Government Minister, Brandon Lewis

:02:13.:02:17.

had to say a little earlier. had to say a little earlier.

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had to say a little earlier. Obviously we would like to see

:02:17.:02:20.

Obviously we would like to see Obviously we would like to see

:02:20.:02:22.

every council freeze council tax or every council freeze council tax or

:02:22.:02:23.

every council freeze council tax or every council freeze council tax or

:02:23.:02:24.

reduce it. I want to focus on those reduce it. I want to focus on those

:02:24.:02:26.

reduce it. I want to focus on those councils so doing the right thing

:02:26.:02:27.

councils so doing the right thing for hard-working taxpayers and

:02:27.:02:28.

for hard-working taxpayers and for hard-working taxpayers and

:02:28.:02:31.

freezing and reducing the council freezing and reducing the council

:02:31.:02:32.

freezing and reducing the council tax. Do you have sympathy with

:02:32.:02:33.

tax. Do you have sympathy with tax. Do you have sympathy with

:02:33.:02:34.

councils that are saying they have councils that are saying they have

:02:34.:02:36.

councils that are saying they have councils that are saying they have

:02:36.:02:37.

to put up council tax? Yes, it's a to put up council tax? Yes, it's a

:02:37.:02:38.

to put up council tax? Yes, it's a to put up council tax? Yes, it's a

:02:38.:02:39.

tricky position and it's a bit much tricky position and it's a bit much

:02:39.:02:42.

tricky position and it's a bit much for Eric Pickles earlier today to

:02:42.:02:43.

for Eric Pickles earlier today to for Eric Pickles earlier today to

:02:43.:02:45.

berate them for putting them up berate them for putting them up

:02:45.:02:46.

berate them for putting them up berate them for putting them up

:02:46.:02:48.

with in the 2% allowance. He has with in the 2% allowance. He has

:02:48.:02:52.

with in the 2% allowance. He has given them that 2% allowance. But

:02:52.:02:53.

given them that 2% allowance. But given them that 2% allowance. But

:02:53.:02:55.

given them that 2% allowance. But if he gives them 2%, what does he

:02:55.:02:56.

if he gives them 2%, what does he if he gives them 2%, what does he

:02:56.:02:56.

if he gives them 2%, what does he expect them to do? Of course you'll

:02:56.:02:58.

expect them to do? Of course you'll expect them to do? Of course you'll

:02:58.:03:00.

expect them to do? Of course you'll put it up to 1.9%. He should have

:03:00.:03:02.

put it up to 1.9%. He should have put it up to 1.9%. He should have

:03:02.:03:04.

made a complete veto, not given made a complete veto, not given

:03:04.:03:05.

made a complete veto, not given made a complete veto, not given

:03:05.:03:06.

them 2%. You're not surprised a lot them 2%. You're not surprised a lot

:03:06.:03:08.

them 2%. You're not surprised a lot of them are going for higher

:03:08.:03:09.

of them are going for higher of them are going for higher

:03:09.:03:09.

council tax bills particularly when council tax bills particularly when

:03:09.:03:10.

council tax bills particularly when the government is offering more

:03:10.:03:11.

the government is offering more the government is offering more

:03:11.:03:12.

the government is offering more cash, not as much as they could put

:03:12.:03:14.

cash, not as much as they could put cash, not as much as they could put

:03:14.:03:15.

cash, not as much as they could put up their bills, but if they freeze

:03:15.:03:17.

up their bills, but if they freeze up their bills, but if they freeze

:03:17.:03:18.

the council tax? Not remotely the council tax? Not remotely

:03:18.:03:20.

the council tax? Not remotely surprised. The economy is to the

:03:20.:03:23.

surprised. The economy is to the surprised. The economy is to the

:03:23.:03:24.

surprised. The economy is to the old at the moment. They are worried

:03:24.:03:25.

old at the moment. They are worried old at the moment. They are worried

:03:25.:03:26.

about keeping up services and it's about keeping up services and it's

:03:26.:03:27.

about keeping up services and it's about keeping up services and it's

:03:27.:03:29.

a balancing act. If they go over 2% a balancing act. If they go over 2%

:03:29.:03:30.

a balancing act. If they go over 2% a balancing act. If they go over 2%

:03:30.:03:33.

and go to a referendum, the public and go to a referendum, the public

:03:33.:03:36.

and go to a referendum, the public and go to a referendum, the public

:03:36.:03:37.

will decide. If they get 1.9%, the will decide. If they get 1.9%, the

:03:37.:03:39.

will decide. If they get 1.9%, the public will make their decision.

:03:39.:03:40.

public will make their decision. public will make their decision.

:03:40.:03:41.

The government will argue everybody The government will argue everybody

:03:41.:03:43.

The government will argue everybody is struggling. People do not want

:03:43.:03:44.

is struggling. People do not want is struggling. People do not want

:03:44.:03:46.

is struggling. People do not want to pay higher council tax bills and

:03:46.:03:47.

to pay higher council tax bills and to pay higher council tax bills and

:03:47.:03:49.

many people don't use the services. many people don't use the services.

:03:49.:03:50.

many people don't use the services. many people don't use the services.

:03:50.:03:51.

Well then, don't say you can go up Well then, don't say you can go up

:03:51.:03:52.

Well then, don't say you can go up Well then, don't say you can go up

:03:52.:03:56.

by 2%. You can't have it both ways. by 2%. You can't have it both ways.

:03:56.:03:57.

by 2%. You can't have it both ways. To me, it doesn't make any

:03:57.:03:58.

To me, it doesn't make any To me, it doesn't make any

:03:59.:03:59.

political sense at all. Would you political sense at all. Would you

:04:00.:04:00.

political sense at all. Would you political sense at all. Would you

:04:00.:04:03.

like for them to have a cap? Yes, like for them to have a cap? Yes,

:04:03.:04:04.

like for them to have a cap? Yes, like for them to have a cap? Yes,

:04:04.:04:05.

it's the only way to keep it down. it's the only way to keep it down.

:04:05.:04:06.

it's the only way to keep it down. it's the only way to keep it down.

:04:06.:04:07.

If you give them the option to put If you give them the option to put

:04:07.:04:08.

If you give them the option to put If you give them the option to put

:04:08.:04:09.

up or have a referendum, a lot of up or have a referendum, a lot of

:04:09.:04:11.

up or have a referendum, a lot of up or have a referendum, a lot of

:04:11.:04:12.

councils will do that for some tell councils will do that for some tell

:04:12.:04:12.

councils will do that for some tell them it's frozen and make them

:04:13.:04:14.

them it's frozen and make them them it's frozen and make them

:04:14.:04:15.

them it's frozen and make them sorted out. Now it's time for our

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sorted out. Now it's time for our sorted out. Now it's time for our

:04:18.:04:19.

daily quiz. And the question for daily quiz. And the question for

:04:19.:04:20.

daily quiz. And the question for today, in honour of the former

:04:20.:04:21.

today, in honour of the former Secretary General of the

:04:21.:04:22.

Secretary General of the Secretary General of the

:04:22.:04:22.

Commonwealth, who will be appearing Commonwealth, who will be appearing

:04:22.:04:23.

Commonwealth, who will be appearing Commonwealth, who will be appearing

:04:23.:04:24.

later, is: Which of these flags is later, is: Which of these flags is

:04:24.:04:28.

later, is: Which of these flags is later, is: Which of these flags is

:04:28.:04:28.

the odd one out? I'm not sure I the odd one out? I'm not sure I

:04:28.:04:30.

the odd one out? I'm not sure I recognise any of them. Do you

:04:30.:04:31.

recognise any of them. Do you recognise any of them. Do you

:04:31.:04:33.

recognise any of the flags, recognise any of the flags,

:04:33.:04:36.

recognise any of the flags, Richard? Absolutely not.Good, that

:04:36.:04:36.

Richard? Absolutely not.Good, that Richard? Absolutely not.Good, that

:04:36.:04:38.

Richard? Absolutely not.Good, that makes two of us then. Towards the

:04:38.:04:39.

makes two of us then. Towards the makes two of us then. Towards the

:04:39.:04:40.

makes two of us then. Towards the end of the show Richard or Don

:04:40.:04:41.

end of the show Richard or Don end of the show Richard or Don

:04:41.:04:42.

McKinnon will give us the correct McKinnon will give us the correct

:04:42.:04:43.

McKinnon will give us the correct answer. More likely to be Don

:04:43.:04:46.

answer. More likely to be Don answer. More likely to be Don

:04:46.:04:47.

McKinnon, at this rate. Now let's McKinnon, at this rate. Now let's

:04:47.:04:48.

McKinnon, at this rate. Now let's turn our attention to banks because

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turn our attention to banks because turn our attention to banks because

:04:49.:04:50.

the Royal Bank of Scotland, which the Royal Bank of Scotland, which

:04:50.:04:51.

the Royal Bank of Scotland, which the Royal Bank of Scotland, which

:04:51.:04:52.

is 81% owned by the government, has is 81% owned by the government, has

:04:52.:04:52.

is 81% owned by the government, has released its annual figures this

:04:52.:04:53.

released its annual figures this released its annual figures this

:04:53.:04:54.

morning. RBS has reported that it morning. RBS has reported that it

:04:54.:04:55.

morning. RBS has reported that it made a pre-tax loss of �5.17

:04:55.:04:56.

made a pre-tax loss of �5.17 made a pre-tax loss of �5.17

:04:56.:04:57.

billion. It was fined �381 million billion. It was fined �381 million

:04:57.:04:58.

billion. It was fined �381 million for attempting to fix the inter-

:04:58.:05:03.

for attempting to fix the inter- for attempting to fix the inter-

:05:03.:05:04.

bank lending rate, Libor. The bank bank lending rate, Libor. The bank

:05:04.:05:05.

bank lending rate, Libor. The bank bank lending rate, Libor. The bank

:05:05.:05:05.

has taken a charge of �700 million has taken a charge of �700 million

:05:05.:05:06.

has taken a charge of �700 million has taken a charge of �700 million

:05:06.:05:07.

for money it expects to have to pay for money it expects to have to pay

:05:07.:05:08.

for money it expects to have to pay out to cover mis-selling interest

:05:08.:05:09.

out to cover mis-selling interest out to cover mis-selling interest

:05:09.:05:10.

out to cover mis-selling interest rate swaps. It also took a �450

:05:10.:05:11.

rate swaps. It also took a �450 rate swaps. It also took a �450

:05:11.:05:12.

million charge in the last three million charge in the last three

:05:12.:05:13.

million charge in the last three million charge in the last three

:05:13.:05:14.

months of the year to cover mis- months of the year to cover mis-

:05:14.:05:15.

selling of Payment Protection selling of Payment Protection

:05:15.:05:16.

Insurance, taking its total Insurance, taking its total

:05:16.:05:21.

Insurance, taking its total provision to �2.2 billion. RBS set

:05:21.:05:22.

provision to �2.2 billion. RBS set provision to �2.2 billion. RBS set

:05:22.:05:23.

aside �607 million to pay bonuses aside �607 million to pay bonuses

:05:23.:05:26.

aside �607 million to pay bonuses aside �607 million to pay bonuses

:05:26.:05:26.

to its staff. However, it is not to its staff. However, it is not

:05:26.:05:29.

to its staff. However, it is not all bad news. Underlying these

:05:29.:05:30.

all bad news. Underlying these all bad news. Underlying these

:05:30.:05:30.

special charges, RBS reported an special charges, RBS reported an

:05:30.:05:37.

special charges, RBS reported an operating profit of �3.5 billion.

:05:37.:05:38.

operating profit of �3.5 billion. operating profit of �3.5 billion.

:05:38.:05:39.

Here's what the bank's chief Here's what the bank's chief

:05:39.:05:40.

Here's what the bank's chief executive Stephen Hester had to say

:05:40.:05:43.

executive Stephen Hester had to say executive Stephen Hester had to say

:05:43.:05:45.

this morning. I was clear when this morning. I was clear when

:05:45.:05:47.

this morning. I was clear when arriving at RBS four years ago,

:05:47.:05:49.

arriving at RBS four years ago, arriving at RBS four years ago,

:05:49.:05:49.

arriving at RBS four years ago, that there was the need to change

:05:50.:05:52.

that there was the need to change that there was the need to change

:05:52.:05:53.

that there was the need to change the way that our people were paid,

:05:53.:05:54.

the way that our people were paid, the way that our people were paid,

:05:54.:05:55.

the way that our people were paid, and to align it more closely with

:05:55.:05:56.

and to align it more closely with and to align it more closely with

:05:56.:05:57.

and to align it more closely with what we wanted them to do. Part of

:05:57.:05:59.

what we wanted them to do. Part of what we wanted them to do. Part of

:05:59.:06:00.

what we wanted them to do. Part of which is profits, but part of it is

:06:00.:06:01.

which is profits, but part of it is which is profits, but part of it is

:06:01.:06:02.

serving customers, making sure risk serving customers, making sure risk

:06:02.:06:04.

serving customers, making sure risk serving customers, making sure risk

:06:04.:06:05.

serving customers, making sure risk is right and so on. So we have both

:06:05.:06:07.

is right and so on. So we have both produced pay, to reflect

:06:07.:06:10.

produced pay, to reflect performance, and fundamentally

:06:10.:06:11.

performance, and fundamentally performance, and fundamentally

:06:11.:06:11.

performance, and fundamentally changed the way in which it is

:06:11.:06:13.

changed the way in which it is aligned. Stephen Hester there.

:06:13.:06:14.

aligned. Stephen Hester there. aligned. Stephen Hester there.

:06:14.:06:15.

Meanwhile, David Cameron has said Meanwhile, David Cameron has said

:06:15.:06:16.

Meanwhile, David Cameron has said he will look carefully at proposed

:06:16.:06:17.

he will look carefully at proposed he will look carefully at proposed

:06:17.:06:18.

new EU banking regulations, agreed new EU banking regulations, agreed

:06:18.:06:22.

new EU banking regulations, agreed in Brussels overnight. The measures,

:06:22.:06:23.

in Brussels overnight. The measures, in Brussels overnight. The measures,

:06:23.:06:23.

in Brussels overnight. The measures, which still have to be approved by

:06:23.:06:24.

which still have to be approved by EU ministers, include capping

:06:24.:06:25.

EU ministers, include capping EU ministers, include capping

:06:25.:06:26.

bankers' bonuses at a maximum of bankers' bonuses at a maximum of

:06:26.:06:27.

bankers' bonuses at a maximum of one year's basic salary. Britain

:06:28.:06:28.

one year's basic salary. Britain one year's basic salary. Britain

:06:29.:06:29.

has strongly opposed that idea, has strongly opposed that idea,

:06:29.:06:30.

has strongly opposed that idea, arguing it will drive away talent

:06:30.:06:32.

arguing it will drive away talent arguing it will drive away talent

:06:32.:06:33.

and hamper growth. Here's what the and hamper growth. Here's what the

:06:33.:06:36.

and hamper growth. Here's what the Prime Minister had to say earlier.

:06:36.:06:37.

Prime Minister had to say earlier. Prime Minister had to say earlier.

:06:37.:06:39.

Prime Minister had to say earlier. We do have, in the UK, not every

:06:39.:06:40.

We do have, in the UK, not every We do have, in the UK, not every

:06:40.:06:43.

other European country has this, we other European country has this, we

:06:43.:06:44.

have major international banks have major international banks

:06:44.:06:45.

have major international banks have major international banks

:06:45.:06:47.

based in the UK but have branches based in the UK but have branches

:06:47.:06:48.

based in the UK but have branches and activities all over the world.

:06:48.:06:49.

and activities all over the world. and activities all over the world.

:06:49.:06:50.

We need to make sure that We need to make sure that

:06:50.:06:51.

We need to make sure that regulation put in place in Brussels

:06:51.:06:54.

regulation put in place in Brussels regulation put in place in Brussels

:06:54.:06:56.

is flexible enough to allow those is flexible enough to allow those

:06:56.:06:57.

is flexible enough to allow those banks to continue competing and

:06:58.:06:58.

banks to continue competing and banks to continue competing and

:06:58.:07:00.

succeeding while being located in succeeding while being located in

:07:00.:07:01.

succeeding while being located in succeeding while being located in

:07:01.:07:02.

the UK. I'm now joined by the the UK. I'm now joined by the

:07:02.:07:06.

the UK. I'm now joined by the banking analyst Ralph Silva. His

:07:06.:07:11.

banking analyst Ralph Silva. His banking analyst Ralph Silva. His

:07:11.:07:12.

banking analyst Ralph Silva. His RBS been turned around? Do we have

:07:12.:07:22.
:07:22.:07:25.

RBS been turned around? Do we have RBS been turned around? Do we have

:07:25.:07:26.

RBS been turned around? Do we have him? Hello?Right, we will try one

:07:26.:07:26.

him? Hello?Right, we will try one him? Hello?Right, we will try one

:07:27.:07:27.

him? Hello?Right, we will try one more time and then I will turn to

:07:27.:07:30.

more time and then I will turn to more time and then I will turn to

:07:30.:07:31.

more time and then I will turn to my other guests. Can you hear me?

:07:31.:07:34.

my other guests. Can you hear me? my other guests. Can you hear me?

:07:34.:07:34.

my other guests. Can you hear me? Yes, I can. Has RBS been turned

:07:34.:07:37.

Yes, I can. Has RBS been turned Yes, I can. Has RBS been turned

:07:37.:07:37.

Yes, I can. Has RBS been turned around? Yes, we have to look at

:07:37.:07:39.

around? Yes, we have to look at around? Yes, we have to look at

:07:39.:07:40.

around? Yes, we have to look at them in two lights. Prix 2008, the

:07:40.:07:42.

them in two lights. Prix 2008, the them in two lights. Prix 2008, the

:07:42.:07:44.

old regime, and those problems are old regime, and those problems are

:07:44.:07:45.

old regime, and those problems are still there and the current

:07:45.:07:46.

still there and the current still there and the current

:07:46.:07:47.

management is still in place but management is still in place but

:07:47.:07:48.

management is still in place but management is still in place but

:07:48.:07:49.

they are running the bank in a very they are running the bank in a very

:07:49.:07:50.

they are running the bank in a very efficient way. They are good people

:07:50.:07:52.

efficient way. They are good people efficient way. They are good people

:07:52.:07:52.

efficient way. They are good people doing a good job and customers, by

:07:53.:07:55.

doing a good job and customers, by doing a good job and customers, by

:07:55.:07:56.

and large, are happy. Today's RBS and large, are happy. Today's RBS

:07:56.:07:57.

and large, are happy. Today's RBS and large, are happy. Today's RBS

:07:57.:07:59.

is the RBS we want for the future. is the RBS we want for the future.

:07:59.:08:00.

is the RBS we want for the future. is the RBS we want for the future.

:08:00.:08:02.

Why is there a loss of �5 billion? Why is there a loss of �5 billion?

:08:02.:08:03.

Why is there a loss of �5 billion? Because they are dealing with the

:08:03.:08:05.

Because they are dealing with the Because they are dealing with the

:08:05.:08:06.

past. All these issues which past. All these issues which

:08:06.:08:07.

past. All these issues which happened prior to the disaster,

:08:07.:08:10.

happened prior to the disaster, happened prior to the disaster,

:08:10.:08:11.

2008, and dealing with the disaster 2008, and dealing with the disaster

:08:11.:08:13.

2008, and dealing with the disaster that was created by the previous

:08:13.:08:16.

that was created by the previous that was created by the previous

:08:16.:08:17.

that was created by the previous manager of RBS. I used to hate them

:08:17.:08:17.

manager of RBS. I used to hate them manager of RBS. I used to hate them

:08:17.:08:20.

manager of RBS. I used to hate them manager of RBS. I used to hate them

:08:20.:08:21.

and be so angry at them. A now you and be so angry at them. A now you

:08:21.:08:21.

and be so angry at them. A now you feel sorry for them because you

:08:22.:08:22.

feel sorry for them because you feel sorry for them because you

:08:22.:08:23.

feel sorry for them because you don't think there will ever be a

:08:23.:08:24.

don't think there will ever be a don't think there will ever be a

:08:24.:08:25.

don't think there will ever be a stage, even if it's being run more

:08:25.:08:27.

stage, even if it's being run more stage, even if it's being run more

:08:27.:08:28.

effectively, where they will be in effectively, where they will be in

:08:28.:08:30.

effectively, where they will be in effectively, where they will be in

:08:30.:08:31.

profit? I'm hopeful they will be in profit? I'm hopeful they will be in

:08:31.:08:32.

profit? I'm hopeful they will be in profit. They are a good

:08:32.:08:33.

profit. They are a good profit. They are a good

:08:33.:08:34.

organisation. They need to get organisation. They need to get

:08:34.:08:35.

organisation. They need to get their debt under control. It has

:08:36.:08:36.

their debt under control. It has their debt under control. It has

:08:36.:08:37.

their debt under control. It has their debt under control. It has

:08:37.:08:38.

taken on too long to do that and I taken on too long to do that and I

:08:38.:08:40.

taken on too long to do that and I think there's a lot of politics

:08:40.:08:41.

think there's a lot of politics think there's a lot of politics

:08:41.:08:42.

think there's a lot of politics involved in that. They need to be

:08:42.:08:43.

involved in that. They need to be involved in that. They need to be

:08:43.:08:44.

involved in that. They need to be able to operate how they want so it

:08:44.:08:44.

able to operate how they want so it able to operate how they want so it

:08:44.:08:45.

able to operate how they want so it can bring in some money so they can

:08:45.:08:46.

can bring in some money so they can can bring in some money so they can

:08:46.:08:49.

can bring in some money so they can give me my tax money back. Right,

:08:49.:08:50.

give me my tax money back. Right, give me my tax money back. Right,

:08:50.:08:51.

give me my tax money back. Right, so you're saying we to sell-off the

:08:51.:08:53.

so you're saying we to sell-off the government stake? Absolutely, we

:08:53.:08:54.

government stake? Absolutely, we government stake? Absolutely, we

:08:54.:08:56.

need to let them operate and need to let them operate and

:08:56.:08:57.

need to let them operate and compete against Barclays Bank and

:08:57.:08:59.

compete against Barclays Bank and compete against Barclays Bank and

:08:59.:09:00.

HSBC in a free environment. Not HSBC in a free environment. Not

:09:00.:09:01.

HSBC in a free environment. Not under the confines of the

:09:01.:09:04.

under the confines of the government. The problem is,

:09:04.:09:05.

government. The problem is, government. The problem is,

:09:05.:09:05.

taxpayers won't want to lose money taxpayers won't want to lose money

:09:05.:09:06.

taxpayers won't want to lose money taxpayers won't want to lose money

:09:06.:09:07.

which they will do at the moment if which they will do at the moment if

:09:07.:09:08.

which they will do at the moment if which they will do at the moment if

:09:08.:09:09.

they try to sell it off too soon. they try to sell it off too soon.

:09:09.:09:10.

they try to sell it off too soon. they try to sell it off too soon.

:09:10.:09:11.

We certainly will not make a lot of We certainly will not make a lot of

:09:11.:09:13.

We certainly will not make a lot of money, that's true, but I'm not

:09:13.:09:14.

money, that's true, but I'm not money, that's true, but I'm not

:09:14.:09:15.

money, that's true, but I'm not happy having a bank the size of RBS

:09:15.:09:17.

happy having a bank the size of RBS in government hands. The

:09:17.:09:18.

in government hands. The in government hands. The

:09:18.:09:20.

implications of being able to buy implications of being able to buy

:09:20.:09:21.

implications of being able to buy votes by moving money to certain

:09:21.:09:22.

votes by moving money to certain votes by moving money to certain

:09:22.:09:23.

areas is something we definitely areas is something we definitely

:09:23.:09:24.

areas is something we definitely areas is something we definitely

:09:24.:09:25.

don't want to go into. This too don't want to go into. This too

:09:25.:09:26.

don't want to go into. This too much danger having the government

:09:26.:09:27.

much danger having the government much danger having the government

:09:27.:09:28.

much danger having the government running this bank and I'm sorry we

:09:28.:09:29.

running this bank and I'm sorry we running this bank and I'm sorry we

:09:29.:09:29.

running this bank and I'm sorry we won't make the money back but right

:09:29.:09:30.

won't make the money back but right won't make the money back but right

:09:30.:09:31.

won't make the money back but right won't make the money back but right

:09:31.:09:32.

now we have to get rid of it as now we have to get rid of it as

:09:32.:09:33.

now we have to get rid of it as now we have to get rid of it as

:09:33.:09:34.

fast as possible. With us now is fast as possible. With us now is

:09:34.:09:35.

fast as possible. With us now is the Conservative MP and former

:09:35.:09:36.

the Conservative MP and former the Conservative MP and former

:09:36.:09:36.

cabinet minister John Redwood. And cabinet minister John Redwood. And

:09:36.:09:37.

cabinet minister John Redwood. And cabinet minister John Redwood. And

:09:37.:09:38.

Labour MP Andy Love. He's a member Labour MP Andy Love. He's a member

:09:38.:09:39.

Labour MP Andy Love. He's a member of the Parliamentary Commission on

:09:39.:09:41.

of the Parliamentary Commission on of the Parliamentary Commission on

:09:41.:09:42.

Banking Standards. Welcome to both Banking Standards. Welcome to both

:09:42.:09:43.

Banking Standards. Welcome to both Banking Standards. Welcome to both

:09:43.:09:45.

of you. Do you agree with the of you. Do you agree with the

:09:45.:09:45.

of you. Do you agree with the assessment of the Bank is being

:09:45.:09:48.

assessment of the Bank is being assessment of the Bank is being

:09:48.:09:49.

turned around? I think these turned around? I think these

:09:49.:09:50.

turned around? I think these results are disappointing and it's

:09:50.:09:51.

results are disappointing and it's results are disappointing and it's

:09:51.:09:51.

results are disappointing and it's taking too long. I think they ought

:09:51.:09:52.

taking too long. I think they ought taking too long. I think they ought

:09:52.:09:54.

to be breaking it up more to be breaking it up more

:09:54.:09:55.

to be breaking it up more energetically and we have learned

:09:55.:09:56.

energetically and we have learned energetically and we have learned

:09:56.:09:57.

today they might get round to today they might get round to

:09:57.:09:59.

today they might get round to selling part of their American bank

:09:59.:09:59.

selling part of their American bank selling part of their American bank

:10:00.:10:01.

selling part of their American bank and I can't see a reason why their

:10:01.:10:02.

and I can't see a reason why their and I can't see a reason why their

:10:02.:10:03.

own an American bank and the own an American bank and the

:10:03.:10:03.

own an American bank and the British taxpayers have to stand

:10:03.:10:08.

British taxpayers have to stand British taxpayers have to stand

:10:08.:10:09.

behind it. It's a decent enterprise, behind it. It's a decent enterprise,

:10:09.:10:10.

behind it. It's a decent enterprise, then get rid of it. Otherwise,

:10:10.:10:12.

then get rid of it. Otherwise, then get rid of it. Otherwise,

:10:12.:10:13.

then get rid of it. Otherwise, close it down. I think we also need

:10:13.:10:15.

close it down. I think we also need close it down. I think we also need

:10:15.:10:16.

more competition in the British more competition in the British

:10:16.:10:17.

more competition in the British banking industry. I don't think

:10:17.:10:18.

banking industry. I don't think your analyst understand the

:10:18.:10:20.

your analyst understand the disconnection between the British

:10:20.:10:21.

disconnection between the British disconnection between the British

:10:21.:10:22.

public and the banking system public and the banking system

:10:22.:10:23.

public and the banking system generally. The you don't think

:10:23.:10:24.

generally. The you don't think generally. The you don't think

:10:25.:10:25.

generally. The you don't think people are happy with RBS might he

:10:25.:10:29.

people are happy with RBS might he people are happy with RBS might he

:10:29.:10:30.

said? No, not taxpayers, not said? No, not taxpayers, not

:10:30.:10:31.

said? No, not taxpayers, not customers, and managers are trying

:10:31.:10:32.

customers, and managers are trying customers, and managers are trying

:10:32.:10:33.

customers, and managers are trying to improve it. They inherited a bad

:10:34.:10:34.

to improve it. They inherited a bad to improve it. They inherited a bad

:10:34.:10:35.

situation and are trying to make situation and are trying to make

:10:35.:10:36.

situation and are trying to make situation and are trying to make

:10:36.:10:37.

sense of it but it's taking a very sense of it but it's taking a very

:10:37.:10:39.

sense of it but it's taking a very sense of it but it's taking a very

:10:39.:10:41.

long time. I don't think RBS is a long time. I don't think RBS is a

:10:41.:10:43.

long time. I don't think RBS is a natural successful big bank company.

:10:44.:10:44.

natural successful big bank company. natural successful big bank company.

:10:45.:10:45.

It was spatchcocked together too It was spatchcocked together too

:10:45.:10:47.

It was spatchcocked together too quickly out of assets to diverse.

:10:47.:10:48.

quickly out of assets to diverse. quickly out of assets to diverse.

:10:48.:10:49.

quickly out of assets to diverse. Do you think we get a better deal

:10:49.:10:50.

Do you think we get a better deal Do you think we get a better deal

:10:50.:10:52.

Do you think we get a better deal Do you think we get a better deal

:10:52.:10:53.

if we hang on a bit longer? If they if we hang on a bit longer? If they

:10:53.:10:54.

if we hang on a bit longer? If they if we hang on a bit longer? If they

:10:54.:10:55.

hung on for a couple more years, hung on for a couple more years,

:10:55.:10:56.

hung on for a couple more years, hung on for a couple more years,

:10:56.:10:57.

due to the taxpayer would get their due to the taxpayer would get their

:10:57.:10:59.

due to the taxpayer would get their due to the taxpayer would get their

:10:59.:11:00.

money back? I doubt it. I was money back? I doubt it. I was

:11:00.:11:00.

money back? I doubt it. I was against the nationalisation in the

:11:01.:11:02.

against the nationalisation in the against the nationalisation in the

:11:02.:11:02.

against the nationalisation in the first place and they want it split

:11:02.:11:03.

first place and they want it split first place and they want it split

:11:03.:11:05.

first place and they want it split up at the point the crisis hit,

:11:05.:11:06.

up at the point the crisis hit, up at the point the crisis hit,

:11:06.:11:07.

because things could have been because things could have been

:11:07.:11:08.

because things could have been saved early on and things should

:11:08.:11:09.

saved early on and things should saved early on and things should

:11:09.:11:10.

saved early on and things should have been closed down early on but

:11:10.:11:11.

have been closed down early on but have been closed down early on but

:11:11.:11:12.

have been closed down early on but the government had to step in to

:11:12.:11:13.

the government had to step in to the government had to step in to

:11:13.:11:15.

support the important network the support the important network the

:11:15.:11:16.

support the important network the banks sustained but didn't support

:11:16.:11:18.

banks sustained but didn't support banks sustained but didn't support

:11:18.:11:19.

everything else. We need controlled everything else. We need controlled

:11:19.:11:21.

everything else. We need controlled administration for RBS. What do you

:11:21.:11:22.

administration for RBS. What do you administration for RBS. What do you

:11:22.:11:25.

think about selling it off? Early? think about selling it off? Early?

:11:25.:11:26.

think about selling it off? Early? think about selling it off? Early?

:11:26.:11:29.

Would you like to see the bank in Would you like to see the bank in

:11:29.:11:31.

Would you like to see the bank in Would you like to see the bank in

:11:31.:11:32.

private hands? I think so. I agree private hands? I think so. I agree

:11:32.:11:33.

private hands? I think so. I agree private hands? I think so. I agree

:11:33.:11:34.

with a comment made a few moments with a comment made a few moments

:11:34.:11:34.

with a comment made a few moments with a comment made a few moments

:11:34.:11:36.

with a comment made a few moments ago, if we sell it off now, we will

:11:36.:11:39.

ago, if we sell it off now, we will ago, if we sell it off now, we will

:11:39.:11:40.

ago, if we sell it off now, we will get far less than it cost the

:11:40.:11:40.

get far less than it cost the get far less than it cost the

:11:41.:11:41.

government in the time, whereas government in the time, whereas

:11:41.:11:44.

government in the time, whereas there is every indication to

:11:44.:11:45.

there is every indication to there is every indication to

:11:45.:11:46.

there is every indication to believe that if we hold on for a

:11:46.:11:47.

believe that if we hold on for a believe that if we hold on for a

:11:47.:11:48.

believe that if we hold on for a period, then we will get our money

:11:48.:11:51.

period, then we will get our money period, then we will get our money

:11:51.:11:54.

back. One reason, there is a back. One reason, there is a

:11:54.:11:55.

back. One reason, there is a divestment strategy may need leaner,

:11:55.:11:58.

divestment strategy may need leaner, divestment strategy may need leaner,

:11:58.:11:59.

more profitable. Less of the risks more profitable. Less of the risks

:11:59.:12:01.

more profitable. Less of the risks involved with the larger RBS.

:12:01.:12:02.

involved with the larger RBS. involved with the larger RBS.

:12:02.:12:05.

Secondly, we all assume the economy Secondly, we all assume the economy

:12:05.:12:05.

Secondly, we all assume the economy Secondly, we all assume the economy

:12:05.:12:06.

will turn around and, as it does, will turn around and, as it does,

:12:07.:12:09.

will turn around and, as it does, will turn around and, as it does,

:12:09.:12:10.

banks will begin to rise. But, of banks will begin to rise. But, of

:12:10.:12:12.

banks will begin to rise. But, of banks will begin to rise. But, of

:12:12.:12:13.

course, RBS will be one of those. course, RBS will be one of those.

:12:13.:12:16.

course, RBS will be one of those. course, RBS will be one of those.

:12:16.:12:17.

But by holding on to them, then a But by holding on to them, then a

:12:17.:12:18.

But by holding on to them, then a you're slowing down the process of

:12:18.:12:19.

you're slowing down the process of you're slowing down the process of

:12:19.:12:21.

RBS getting back into profit. We RBS getting back into profit. We

:12:21.:12:22.

RBS getting back into profit. We will see these losses continue year

:12:22.:12:25.

will see these losses continue year will see these losses continue year

:12:25.:12:26.

will see these losses continue year after year. No, I don't think we

:12:26.:12:27.

after year. No, I don't think we after year. No, I don't think we

:12:27.:12:28.

will. The vast majority of the will. The vast majority of the

:12:28.:12:31.

will. The vast majority of the losses this year were provisions

:12:31.:12:32.

losses this year were provisions for payment protection insurance,

:12:32.:12:35.

for payment protection insurance, for payment protection insurance,

:12:35.:12:36.

which actually, don't predate as which actually, don't predate as

:12:36.:12:38.

which actually, don't predate as was suggested by or analyst. They

:12:38.:12:39.

was suggested by or analyst. They was suggested by or analyst. They

:12:39.:12:40.

continued well past the changeover continued well past the changeover

:12:40.:12:42.

continued well past the changeover dates. I do think there are

:12:42.:12:44.

dates. I do think there are dates. I do think there are

:12:44.:12:45.

continuing problems at RBS, but continuing problems at RBS, but

:12:45.:12:47.

continuing problems at RBS, but they have gone through a remarkable

:12:47.:12:48.

they have gone through a remarkable they have gone through a remarkable

:12:48.:12:49.

transformation in the last few transformation in the last few

:12:49.:12:52.

years, they have divested years, they have divested

:12:52.:12:53.

years, they have divested themselves of the bad assets they

:12:53.:12:55.

themselves of the bad assets they themselves of the bad assets they

:12:55.:12:56.

themselves of the bad assets they had, and we need to see this

:12:56.:12:58.

had, and we need to see this had, and we need to see this

:12:58.:12:58.

programme through. And then decide programme through. And then decide

:12:58.:12:59.

programme through. And then decide when the appropriate time is to

:12:59.:13:01.

when the appropriate time is to when the appropriate time is to

:13:01.:13:02.

when the appropriate time is to sell. At this point, do you think

:13:02.:13:04.

sell. At this point, do you think sell. At this point, do you think

:13:04.:13:05.

was justified to have over �600 was justified to have over �600

:13:05.:13:07.

was justified to have over �600 million worth of bonuses? I think

:13:07.:13:08.

million worth of bonuses? I think million worth of bonuses? I think

:13:08.:13:09.

you are stuck with the bonus you are stuck with the bonus

:13:09.:13:10.

you are stuck with the bonus you are stuck with the bonus

:13:10.:13:11.

problem. It makes my blood boil but problem. It makes my blood boil but

:13:11.:13:12.

problem. It makes my blood boil but it's the way they operate. Boris

:13:12.:13:13.

it's the way they operate. Boris it's the way they operate. Boris

:13:13.:13:16.

Johnson spoke out about it this Johnson spoke out about it this

:13:16.:13:17.

Johnson spoke out about it this morning. He said we should Capper

:13:17.:13:18.

morning. He said we should Capper morning. He said we should Capper

:13:18.:13:19.

bankers bonuses for so it sounds bankers bonuses for so it sounds

:13:19.:13:20.

bankers bonuses for so it sounds all well and good and makes

:13:20.:13:22.

all well and good and makes all well and good and makes

:13:22.:13:22.

everybody feel better, but the fact everybody feel better, but the fact

:13:22.:13:24.

everybody feel better, but the fact everybody feel better, but the fact

:13:24.:13:24.

of the matter is, bank bonuses are of the matter is, bank bonuses are

:13:24.:13:28.

of the matter is, bank bonuses are essential in business. It's an ugly

:13:28.:13:28.

essential in business. It's an ugly essential in business. It's an ugly

:13:28.:13:30.

side of banking, not at all side of banking, not at all

:13:30.:13:32.

side of banking, not at all attractive, but a matter of fact.

:13:32.:13:34.

attractive, but a matter of fact. What is particularly unattractive

:13:34.:13:35.

What is particularly unattractive What is particularly unattractive

:13:35.:13:36.

What is particularly unattractive is a registered a loss of over �5

:13:36.:13:39.

is a registered a loss of over �5 is a registered a loss of over �5

:13:39.:13:40.

billion, and are paying out bonuses billion, and are paying out bonuses

:13:40.:13:42.

billion, and are paying out bonuses billion, and are paying out bonuses

:13:42.:13:42.

at the same time for that the at the same time for that the

:13:42.:13:44.

public won't understand that. public won't understand that.

:13:44.:13:45.

public won't understand that. Except, of course, there is the

:13:45.:13:47.

Except, of course, there is the Except, of course, there is the

:13:47.:13:48.

ironic situation of an underlying ironic situation of an underlying

:13:48.:13:50.

ironic situation of an underlying profit, which most people, I did

:13:50.:13:52.

profit, which most people, I did profit, which most people, I did

:13:52.:13:53.

appreciated, in terms of justifying appreciated, in terms of justifying

:13:53.:13:56.

appreciated, in terms of justifying and giving out bonuses, but, John

:13:56.:13:58.

and giving out bonuses, but, John and giving out bonuses, but, John

:13:58.:14:00.

Redwood, these people have made his Redwood, these people have made his

:14:00.:14:01.

underlying profits. I would underlying profits. I would

:14:01.:14:02.

underlying profits. I would distinguish between people of the

:14:02.:14:03.

distinguish between people of the distinguish between people of the

:14:03.:14:04.

top lot of responsibility for the top lot of responsibility for the

:14:04.:14:05.

top lot of responsibility for the overall results. It's a loss-making

:14:05.:14:08.

overall results. It's a loss-making overall results. It's a loss-making

:14:08.:14:09.

bank, state-owned. We need profit bank, state-owned. We need profit

:14:09.:14:12.

bank, state-owned. We need profit bank, state-owned. We need profit

:14:12.:14:12.

and we need a return on investment. and we need a return on investment.

:14:12.:14:14.

and we need a return on investment. People in the individual divisions,

:14:14.:14:15.

People in the individual divisions, People in the individual divisions,

:14:15.:14:16.

People in the individual divisions, offered a bonus to make sure they

:14:16.:14:17.

offered a bonus to make sure they offered a bonus to make sure they

:14:17.:14:18.

were properly, have a clear legal were properly, have a clear legal

:14:18.:14:21.

were properly, have a clear legal were properly, have a clear legal

:14:21.:14:21.

case to be paid a bonus. People case to be paid a bonus. People

:14:21.:14:22.

case to be paid a bonus. People case to be paid a bonus. People

:14:22.:14:23.

will find it a double to understand will find it a double to understand

:14:23.:14:25.

will find it a double to understand that. Do you appreciate that, in

:14:25.:14:26.

that. Do you appreciate that, in that. Do you appreciate that, in

:14:26.:14:27.

that. Do you appreciate that, in order for the bank to get back to

:14:27.:14:28.

order for the bank to get back to order for the bank to get back to

:14:28.:14:29.

business as usual, people do have business as usual, people do have

:14:29.:14:30.

business as usual, people do have business as usual, people do have

:14:30.:14:31.

to be rewarded if they are helping to be rewarded if they are helping

:14:31.:14:33.

to be rewarded if they are helping it become more profitable? Yes, but

:14:33.:14:34.

it become more profitable? Yes, but it become more profitable? Yes, but

:14:34.:14:36.

it become more profitable? Yes, but there needs to be a clear link

:14:36.:14:37.

there needs to be a clear link there needs to be a clear link

:14:37.:14:38.

established for the public and the established for the public and the

:14:38.:14:39.

established for the public and the performance on which to base those

:14:39.:14:40.

performance on which to base those performance on which to base those

:14:40.:14:42.

bonuses. When you lose the amounts bonuses. When you lose the amounts

:14:42.:14:44.

bonuses. When you lose the amounts bonuses. When you lose the amounts

:14:44.:14:44.

of money RBS have been losing for of money RBS have been losing for

:14:44.:14:46.

of money RBS have been losing for the last few years, it's very

:14:46.:14:47.

the last few years, it's very the last few years, it's very

:14:47.:14:47.

difficult and I understand the difficult and I understand the

:14:47.:14:50.

difficult and I understand the public don't always understand the

:14:50.:14:51.

public don't always understand the public don't always understand the

:14:51.:14:52.

complexities and nuances of this, complexities and nuances of this,

:14:52.:14:54.

complexities and nuances of this, complexities and nuances of this,

:14:54.:14:54.

but it is incumbent on RBS and but it is incumbent on RBS and

:14:54.:14:56.

but it is incumbent on RBS and other banks as well to establish

:14:56.:14:57.

other banks as well to establish other banks as well to establish

:14:57.:15:00.

very firmly why these bonuses have very firmly why these bonuses have

:15:00.:15:00.

very firmly why these bonuses have very firmly why these bonuses have

:15:00.:15:02.

been paid. If you work at RBS and been paid. If you work at RBS and

:15:02.:15:03.

been paid. If you work at RBS and you know you are personally

:15:03.:15:04.

you know you are personally you know you are personally

:15:04.:15:05.

responsible for the rise in profits, responsible for the rise in profits,

:15:05.:15:07.

responsible for the rise in profits, and then you're told, for political

:15:07.:15:09.

and then you're told, for political reasons, public relations reasons,

:15:09.:15:10.

reasons, public relations reasons, reasons, public relations reasons,

:15:10.:15:11.

reasons, public relations reasons, you will go to another bank, when

:15:11.:15:12.

you will go to another bank, when you will go to another bank, when

:15:12.:15:15.

she couldn't get a bonus. It's she couldn't get a bonus. It's

:15:15.:15:16.

she couldn't get a bonus. It's important that they explain it but

:15:16.:15:17.

important that they explain it but important that they explain it but

:15:17.:15:18.

important that they explain it but also we have to set is the context.

:15:18.:15:20.

also we have to set is the context. also we have to set is the context.

:15:20.:15:21.

Of course, they might make money Of course, they might make money

:15:21.:15:22.

Of course, they might make money Of course, they might make money

:15:22.:15:26.

this year but what about in future? this year but what about in future?

:15:26.:15:28.

Long-term performance. We need Long-term performance. We need

:15:28.:15:29.

proper performance-based incentives. proper performance-based incentives.

:15:29.:15:31.

proper performance-based incentives. proper performance-based incentives.

:15:31.:15:32.

We need to make sure that these We need to make sure that these

:15:32.:15:33.

We need to make sure that these arrangements don't just last for

:15:33.:15:34.

arrangements don't just last for arrangements don't just last for

:15:34.:15:37.

arrangements don't just last for one year but 10 years. And we need

:15:37.:15:39.

one year but 10 years. And we need one year but 10 years. And we need

:15:39.:15:41.

one year but 10 years. And we need to be firm and suggest you don't

:15:41.:15:42.

to be firm and suggest you don't to be firm and suggest you don't

:15:42.:15:44.

to be firm and suggest you don't to be firm and suggest you don't

:15:44.:15:45.

pay this in cash. You pay it, in my pay this in cash. You pay it, in my

:15:45.:15:48.

pay this in cash. You pay it, in my pay this in cash. You pay it, in my

:15:48.:15:50.

view, in that debt, and it should, view, in that debt, and it should,

:15:50.:15:50.

view, in that debt, and it should, view, in that debt, and it should,

:15:50.:15:52.

if the bank goes bust, they will if the bank goes bust, they will

:15:52.:16:02.
:16:02.:16:05.

if the bank goes bust, they will So what do you say about capping

:16:05.:16:06.

So what do you say about capping So what do you say about capping

:16:06.:16:09.

So what do you say about capping bonuses? It is -- is it a good idea?

:16:09.:16:10.

bonuses? It is -- is it a good idea? bonuses? It is -- is it a good idea?

:16:10.:16:11.

It is dangerous because the banks It is dangerous because the banks

:16:11.:16:13.

It is dangerous because the banks will simply increase the base salad

:16:13.:16:14.

will simply increase the base salad will simply increase the base salad

:16:14.:16:14.

will simply increase the base salad tail -- salaries so they are more

:16:14.:16:17.

tail -- salaries so they are more tail -- salaries so they are more

:16:17.:16:17.

volatile. If there is a downturn volatile. If there is a downturn

:16:17.:16:18.

volatile. If there is a downturn volatile. If there is a downturn

:16:18.:16:20.

they won't be able to cut the base they won't be able to cut the base

:16:21.:16:22.

they won't be able to cut the base they won't be able to cut the base

:16:22.:16:23.

salary, but they will be able to cut salary, but they will be able to cut

:16:23.:16:24.

salary, but they will be able to cut salary, but they will be able to cut

:16:24.:16:27.

bonuses, so it makes them far less bonuses, so it makes them far less

:16:27.:16:29.

bonuses, so it makes them far less bonuses, so it makes them far less

:16:29.:16:29.

stable. And then others will go to stable. And then others will go to

:16:29.:16:30.

stable. And then others will go to centres outside the European Union

:16:30.:16:30.

centres outside the European Union centres outside the European Union

:16:31.:16:31.

centres outside the European Union where they don't face those kinds of

:16:31.:16:34.

where they don't face those kinds of where they don't face those kinds of

:16:34.:16:35.

restrictions. One of the biggest restrictions. One of the biggest

:16:35.:16:36.

restrictions. One of the biggest problem still is lending to small

:16:36.:16:38.

problem still is lending to small problem still is lending to small

:16:38.:16:38.

problem still is lending to small businesses. I don't know what RBS is

:16:39.:16:40.

businesses. I don't know what RBS is businesses. I don't know what RBS is

:16:40.:16:41.

businesses. I don't know what RBS is like in terms of its performance or

:16:41.:16:42.

like in terms of its performance or like in terms of its performance or

:16:42.:16:45.

giving credit generally. Has that giving credit generally. Has that

:16:45.:16:47.

giving credit generally. Has that giving credit generally. Has that

:16:47.:16:47.

improved? No, it hasn't. In fact, it improved? No, it hasn't. In fact, it

:16:47.:16:48.

improved? No, it hasn't. In fact, it is getting worse because they are

:16:48.:16:51.

is getting worse because they are is getting worse because they are

:16:51.:16:53.

using the opportunity of businesses using the opportunity of businesses

:16:53.:16:54.

using the opportunity of businesses paying back to increase their

:16:54.:16:55.

paying back to increase their paying back to increase their

:16:55.:16:55.

capital. They are under some capital. They are under some

:16:55.:16:56.

capital. They are under some pressure to increase the level of

:16:56.:16:59.

pressure to increase the level of pressure to increase the level of

:16:59.:17:01.

capital. But isn't that the problem capital. But isn't that the problem

:17:01.:17:01.

capital. But isn't that the problem for the banks dash that the

:17:01.:17:02.

for the banks dash that the for the banks dash that the

:17:02.:17:04.

Government has got them between a Government has got them between a

:17:04.:17:05.

Government has got them between a Government has got them between a

:17:05.:17:06.

rock and a hard place? They are rock and a hard place? They are

:17:06.:17:06.

rock and a hard place? They are putting down these measures and

:17:06.:17:08.

putting down these measures and putting down these measures and

:17:08.:17:12.

saying, you have got to increase saying, you have got to increase

:17:12.:17:12.

saying, you have got to increase saying, you have got to increase

:17:12.:17:13.

your balance sheets but lend more at your balance sheets but lend more at

:17:13.:17:18.

your balance sheets but lend more at the same time? Many have been

:17:18.:17:20.

the same time? Many have been the same time? Many have been

:17:20.:17:22.

saying, then this money because we saying, then this money because we

:17:22.:17:22.

desperately need an economic desperately need an economic

:17:22.:17:23.

desperately need an economic recovery. I've been saying for a

:17:23.:17:25.

recovery. I've been saying for a recovery. I've been saying for a

:17:25.:17:25.

recovery. I've been saying for a long time that I think you have

:17:25.:17:26.

long time that I think you have long time that I think you have

:17:26.:17:27.

long time that I think you have tough regulation near the top of the

:17:27.:17:31.

tough regulation near the top of the tough regulation near the top of the

:17:31.:17:32.

tough regulation near the top of the cycle and much weaker rules at the

:17:32.:17:33.

cycle and much weaker rules at the cycle and much weaker rules at the

:17:33.:17:33.

bottom of the cycle. And bottom of the cycle. And

:17:34.:17:35.

bottom of the cycle. And unfortunately we are still at the

:17:35.:17:36.

unfortunately we are still at the unfortunately we are still at the

:17:37.:17:37.

unfortunately we are still at the bottom of the cycle. At this point

:17:37.:17:39.

bottom of the cycle. At this point you should be reasonably

:17:39.:17:40.

you should be reasonably you should be reasonably

:17:40.:17:42.

accommodating. The banks have made accommodating. The banks have made

:17:42.:17:42.

accommodating. The banks have made huge strides in having more

:17:43.:17:44.

huge strides in having more huge strides in having more

:17:44.:17:45.

capital. The regulators should now capital. The regulators should now

:17:45.:17:46.

capital. The regulators should now capital. The regulators should now

:17:46.:17:47.

say, job done, for a bit, and we say, job done, for a bit, and we

:17:47.:17:50.

say, job done, for a bit, and we say, job done, for a bit, and we

:17:50.:17:51.

should go on and then some. Do you should go on and then some. Do you

:17:51.:17:53.

should go on and then some. Do you should go on and then some. Do you

:17:53.:17:58.

should go on and then some. Do you see that as a priority? Yes, I do.

:17:58.:17:59.

see that as a priority? Yes, I do. see that as a priority? Yes, I do.

:17:59.:18:01.

think the regulator could start by think the regulator could start by

:18:01.:18:03.

think the regulator could start by telling banks publicly that since we

:18:03.:18:04.

telling banks publicly that since we telling banks publicly that since we

:18:04.:18:05.

telling banks publicly that since we are at the low point in the cycle,

:18:05.:18:06.

are at the low point in the cycle, are at the low point in the cycle,

:18:06.:18:08.

are at the low point in the cycle, that they are going to be much more

:18:08.:18:09.

that they are going to be much more that they are going to be much more

:18:09.:18:10.

lenient in terms of what they lenient in terms of what they

:18:10.:18:11.

lenient in terms of what they lenient in terms of what they

:18:11.:18:12.

demand, and then of course we need demand, and then of course we need

:18:12.:18:13.

demand, and then of course we need to enter into discussions with the

:18:13.:18:15.

to enter into discussions with the to enter into discussions with the

:18:15.:18:16.

banks as to exactly what that banks as to exactly what that

:18:16.:18:18.

banks as to exactly what that means, but undoubtedly, unless that

:18:18.:18:18.

means, but undoubtedly, unless that means, but undoubtedly, unless that

:18:19.:18:21.

means, but undoubtedly, unless that happens, it is really hard to see

:18:21.:18:22.

happens, it is really hard to see happens, it is really hard to see

:18:22.:18:22.

that banks will increase their that banks will increase their

:18:22.:18:27.

lending, particularly to small lending, particularly to small

:18:27.:18:28.

businesses. Gentlemen, thank you. businesses. Gentlemen, thank you.

:18:28.:18:29.

businesses. Gentlemen, thank you. businesses. Gentlemen, thank you.

:18:29.:18:30.

businesses. Gentlemen, thank you. Now, it is a bill that has made the

:18:30.:18:34.

Now, it is a bill that has made the Now, it is a bill that has made the

:18:34.:18:34.

headlines today in Resource Magazine headlines today in Resource Magazine

:18:34.:18:35.

headlines today in Resource Magazine and Recycling Today. It should

:18:35.:18:37.

and Recycling Today. It should and Recycling Today. It should

:18:37.:18:41.

become law later today. The Scrap become law later today. The Scrap

:18:41.:18:44.

become law later today. The Scrap become law later today. The Scrap

:18:44.:18:45.

Metal Dealers Bill is going on. It Metal Dealers Bill is going on. It

:18:45.:18:46.

Metal Dealers Bill is going on. It is obviously an important bill,

:18:46.:18:47.

is obviously an important bill, is obviously an important bill,

:18:47.:18:50.

Richard Ottaway? You have made the Richard Ottaway? You have made the

:18:50.:18:51.

Richard Ottaway? You have made the Richard Ottaway? You have made the

:18:51.:18:52.

headlines? Yes, it was made law this headlines? Yes, it was made law this

:18:52.:18:53.

headlines? Yes, it was made law this morning. And it is an important

:18:53.:18:55.

morning. And it is an important morning. And it is an important

:18:55.:18:56.

morning. And it is an important bill, as you rightly say. It is

:18:56.:18:57.

bill, as you rightly say. It is bill, as you rightly say. It is

:18:57.:18:58.

addressing a serious problem. It is addressing a serious problem. It is

:18:58.:19:00.

addressing a serious problem. It is addressing a serious problem. It is

:19:00.:19:01.

not just petty crime or a victimless not just petty crime or a victimless

:19:01.:19:02.

not just petty crime or a victimless not just petty crime or a victimless

:19:02.:19:03.

not just petty crime or a victimless crime. It is a crime that has a big

:19:03.:19:04.

crime. It is a crime that has a big crime. It is a crime that has a big

:19:04.:19:04.

crime. It is a crime that has a big pat on society so it is important

:19:05.:19:09.

pat on society so it is important pat on society so it is important

:19:09.:19:13.

pat on society so it is important legislation. -- a big impact. We are

:19:13.:19:14.

legislation. -- a big impact. We are legislation. -- a big impact. We are

:19:14.:19:16.

not just talking about metal left not just talking about metal left

:19:16.:19:17.

not just talking about metal left outside people's houses. We are

:19:17.:19:21.

outside people's houses. We are outside people's houses. We are

:19:21.:19:23.

talking major theft? The estimate is talking major theft? The estimate is

:19:23.:19:24.

talking major theft? The estimate is talking major theft? The estimate is

:19:24.:19:26.

that nationwide it is -- costing the that nationwide it is -- costing the

:19:26.:19:26.

that nationwide it is -- costing the economy quarter of �1 billion a

:19:27.:19:29.

economy quarter of �1 billion a economy quarter of �1 billion a

:19:29.:19:30.

year, from church groups to year, from church groups to

:19:30.:19:31.

telecommunications cables and then telecommunications cables and then

:19:31.:19:34.

telecommunications cables and then telecommunications cables and then

:19:34.:19:34.

plaques in memorials. It is a lot of plaques in memorials. It is a lot of

:19:34.:19:36.

plaques in memorials. It is a lot of plaques in memorials. It is a lot of

:19:36.:19:36.

money involved and indeed a lot of money involved and indeed a lot of

:19:36.:19:40.

money involved and indeed a lot of lost revenue to the Treasury.

:19:40.:19:41.

lost revenue to the Treasury. lost revenue to the Treasury.

:19:41.:19:41.

lost revenue to the Treasury. will you so interested in it? Apart

:19:41.:19:44.

will you so interested in it? Apart will you so interested in it? Apart

:19:44.:19:45.

will you so interested in it? Apart from the fact that it is costing the

:19:45.:19:46.

from the fact that it is costing the from the fact that it is costing the

:19:47.:19:47.

from the fact that it is costing the economy so much money? -- why were

:19:47.:19:52.

economy so much money? -- why were economy so much money? -- why were

:19:52.:19:53.

economy so much money? -- why were you? Well, bits of lead from the

:19:53.:19:54.

you? Well, bits of lead from the you? Well, bits of lead from the

:19:54.:19:55.

you? Well, bits of lead from the parish roof where I live with stolen

:19:55.:19:56.

parish roof where I live with stolen parish roof where I live with stolen

:19:56.:19:57.

and the damage to the organ and the damage to the organ

:19:57.:19:59.

and the damage to the organ underneath the roof cost over

:19:59.:20:00.

underneath the roof cost over underneath the roof cost over

:20:00.:20:01.

underneath the roof cost over �100,000, so I pledged in the last

:20:01.:20:02.

�100,000, so I pledged in the last �100,000, so I pledged in the last

:20:02.:20:02.

�100,000, so I pledged in the last election that if I had a chance, I

:20:02.:20:03.

election that if I had a chance, I election that if I had a chance, I

:20:03.:20:04.

election that if I had a chance, I would do my best to reform in the

:20:04.:20:06.

would do my best to reform in the would do my best to reform in the

:20:06.:20:07.

would do my best to reform in the Lords and I like to think I have

:20:07.:20:08.

Lords and I like to think I have Lords and I like to think I have

:20:08.:20:10.

Lords and I like to think I have done that in my pledge this morning.

:20:10.:20:11.

done that in my pledge this morning. done that in my pledge this morning.

:20:11.:20:13.

done that in my pledge this morning. How do people get away with stealing

:20:13.:20:15.

How do people get away with stealing How do people get away with stealing

:20:15.:20:20.

How do people get away with stealing this? Things like a roof?It is a

:20:20.:20:22.

this? Things like a roof?It is a this? Things like a roof?It is a

:20:22.:20:23.

fairly lawless area. There have been fairly lawless area. There have been

:20:23.:20:24.

fairly lawless area. There have been many rogue scrap metal dealers, to

:20:24.:20:28.

many rogue scrap metal dealers, to many rogue scrap metal dealers, to

:20:28.:20:31.

many rogue scrap metal dealers, to be honest. We have had to make it

:20:31.:20:34.

be honest. We have had to make it be honest. We have had to make it

:20:34.:20:35.

difficult by saying cash can't be difficult by saying cash can't be

:20:35.:20:36.

difficult by saying cash can't be difficult by saying cash can't be

:20:36.:20:38.

used for deals and records have to used for deals and records have to

:20:38.:20:39.

used for deals and records have to be made. Where we've actually done

:20:39.:20:40.

be made. Where we've actually done be made. Where we've actually done

:20:40.:20:43.

this on voluntary basis around the this on voluntary basis around the

:20:43.:20:44.

this on voluntary basis around the country through the police, who have

:20:44.:20:45.

country through the police, who have country through the police, who have

:20:45.:20:48.

been operating voluntary codes, we been operating voluntary codes, we

:20:48.:20:49.

been operating voluntary codes, we been operating voluntary codes, we

:20:49.:20:50.

been operating voluntary codes, we have seen a 40% fall and more in the

:20:50.:20:51.

have seen a 40% fall and more in the have seen a 40% fall and more in the

:20:51.:20:51.

have seen a 40% fall and more in the level of metal theft and I like to

:20:51.:20:52.

level of metal theft and I like to level of metal theft and I like to

:20:52.:20:53.

level of metal theft and I like to think that figure will go up quite

:20:53.:20:55.

think that figure will go up quite think that figure will go up quite

:20:55.:20:55.

dramatically later this year when my dramatically later this year when my

:20:55.:21:01.

dramatically later this year when my dramatically later this year when my

:21:01.:21:01.

act comes into effect. Thank you and act comes into effect. Thank you and

:21:01.:21:07.

act comes into effect. Thank you and enjoy being on the headlines today!

:21:07.:21:08.

enjoy being on the headlines today! enjoy being on the headlines today!

:21:08.:21:09.

Figures this morning reveal net Figures this morning reveal net

:21:09.:21:12.

Figures this morning reveal net Figures this morning reveal net

:21:12.:21:13.

migration fell by a third to 163,000 migration fell by a third to 163,000

:21:13.:21:14.

migration fell by a third to 163,000 migration fell by a third to 163,000

:21:14.:21:15.

to the 12 months in June. The to the 12 months in June. The

:21:15.:21:16.

to the 12 months in June. The Government has pledged to reduce

:21:16.:21:17.

Government has pledged to reduce Government has pledged to reduce

:21:17.:21:18.

Government has pledged to reduce that to the tens of thousands by

:21:18.:21:19.

that to the tens of thousands by that to the tens of thousands by

:21:19.:21:20.

2015 and showed its immigration 2015 and showed its immigration

:21:20.:21:23.

2015 and showed its immigration policy is working. The figures show

:21:23.:21:26.

policy is working. The figures show policy is working. The figures show

:21:26.:21:28.

a significant decrease from people a significant decrease from people

:21:28.:21:31.

arriving from the Commonwealth arriving from the Commonwealth

:21:31.:21:34.

countries, such as Bangladesh, countries, such as Bangladesh,

:21:34.:21:37.

Pakistan, India, Botswana and Pakistan, India, Botswana and

:21:37.:21:38.

Pakistan, India, Botswana and elsewhere. We are joined by Mark

:21:38.:21:39.

elsewhere. We are joined by Mark elsewhere. We are joined by Mark

:21:39.:21:40.

Harper. Why have the numbers come Harper. Why have the numbers come

:21:40.:21:45.

Harper. Why have the numbers come down so dramatically? They are

:21:45.:21:46.

down so dramatically? They are basically reflecting the policy

:21:46.:21:50.

basically reflecting the policy basically reflecting the policy

:21:50.:21:51.

changes we have made. The overall changes we have made. The overall

:21:51.:21:53.

changes we have made. The overall changes we have made. The overall

:21:53.:21:54.

number of students is down while we number of students is down while we

:21:54.:21:55.

have protected our university have protected our university

:21:55.:21:56.

have protected our university have protected our university

:21:56.:21:57.

places, so the number of those is up places, so the number of those is up

:21:57.:21:58.

places, so the number of those is up places, so the number of those is up

:21:58.:21:59.

by 3%. We have seen fewer people by 3%. We have seen fewer people

:21:59.:22:00.

by 3%. We have seen fewer people by 3%. We have seen fewer people

:22:00.:22:02.

coming to do unskilled work but more coming to do unskilled work but more

:22:02.:22:03.

coming to do unskilled work but more coming to do unskilled work but more

:22:03.:22:04.

people coming to do skilled work, so people coming to do skilled work, so

:22:04.:22:06.

people coming to do skilled work, so bringing in benefit to the country,

:22:06.:22:06.

bringing in benefit to the country, bringing in benefit to the country,

:22:07.:22:08.

and a reduction in people applying and a reduction in people applying

:22:08.:22:09.

and a reduction in people applying and a reduction in people applying

:22:09.:22:10.

for family visas. So we are getting for family visas. So we are getting

:22:10.:22:11.

for family visas. So we are getting a more selective system, so fewer

:22:11.:22:12.

a more selective system, so fewer a more selective system, so fewer

:22:12.:22:14.

people overall but the right people people overall but the right people

:22:14.:22:16.

people overall but the right people coming to add youngster the country.

:22:16.:22:17.

coming to add youngster the country. coming to add youngster the country.

:22:17.:22:18.

The best and the brightest from The best and the brightest from

:22:18.:22:18.

The best and the brightest from around the world, as the Prime

:22:18.:22:24.

around the world, as the Prime around the world, as the Prime

:22:24.:22:28.

Minister said recently. But the Minister said recently. But the

:22:28.:22:31.

Minister said recently. But the Prime Minister said Britain was open

:22:31.:22:32.

Prime Minister said Britain was open Prime Minister said Britain was open

:22:33.:22:33.

for business. What is the change for business. What is the change

:22:33.:22:34.

for business. What is the change that means we are getting those

:22:34.:22:36.

that means we are getting those that means we are getting those

:22:36.:22:40.

skilled people without the unskilled skilled people without the unskilled

:22:40.:22:41.

skilled people without the unskilled ones? We have very good performance

:22:41.:22:44.

ones? We have very good performance ones? We have very good performance

:22:44.:22:45.

for people coming on business and for people coming on business and

:22:45.:22:46.

for people coming on business and tourism visits. We have a good

:22:46.:22:47.

tourism visits. We have a good tourism visits. We have a good

:22:47.:22:48.

system with company transfers, which system with company transfers, which

:22:48.:22:49.

system with company transfers, which is where companies can use their

:22:49.:22:50.

is where companies can use their is where companies can use their

:22:51.:22:51.

employees around the world. Many employees around the world. Many

:22:51.:22:52.

employees around the world. Many employees around the world. Many

:22:52.:22:53.

have said it is the best system in have said it is the best system in

:22:53.:22:54.

have said it is the best system in have said it is the best system in

:22:54.:22:57.

the world. And many are coming for the world. And many are coming for

:22:57.:22:58.

the world. And many are coming for skilled work and we aren't anywhere

:22:58.:22:59.

skilled work and we aren't anywhere skilled work and we aren't anywhere

:22:59.:23:00.

skilled work and we aren't anywhere near a on that so there hasn't been

:23:00.:23:01.

near a on that so there hasn't been near a on that so there hasn't been

:23:01.:23:02.

anybody prevented coming here to do anybody prevented coming here to do

:23:02.:23:06.

anybody prevented coming here to do skilled work the United Kingdom.

:23:06.:23:06.

skilled work the United Kingdom. skilled work the United Kingdom.

:23:06.:23:07.

skilled work the United Kingdom. is not getting in now who was

:23:07.:23:08.

is not getting in now who was is not getting in now who was

:23:08.:23:09.

is not getting in now who was getting in a couple of years ago?

:23:09.:23:10.

getting in a couple of years ago? getting in a couple of years ago?

:23:10.:23:14.

getting in a couple of years ago? Who is being turned away? One of the

:23:14.:23:15.

Who is being turned away? One of the Who is being turned away? One of the

:23:15.:23:16.

big reductions is people coming in big reductions is people coming in

:23:16.:23:17.

big reductions is people coming in through the student route who aren't

:23:17.:23:18.

through the student route who aren't through the student route who aren't

:23:18.:23:19.

through the student route who aren't students. So people come in a couple

:23:19.:23:21.

students. So people come in a couple students. So people come in a couple

:23:21.:23:22.

of years ago either coming to of years ago either coming to

:23:22.:23:24.

of years ago either coming to institutions to ostensibly study but

:23:24.:23:25.

institutions to ostensibly study but institutions to ostensibly study but

:23:25.:23:26.

they weren't studying. They were they weren't studying. They were

:23:26.:23:26.

they weren't studying. They were they weren't studying. They were

:23:26.:23:27.

they weren't studying. They were coming as a way to work and we have

:23:27.:23:28.

coming as a way to work and we have coming as a way to work and we have

:23:28.:23:28.

coming as a way to work and we have rooted out that abuse, which is why

:23:29.:23:30.

rooted out that abuse, which is why rooted out that abuse, which is why

:23:30.:23:32.

we have seen the overall student we have seen the overall student

:23:32.:23:33.

we have seen the overall student numbers fall while universities are

:23:33.:23:33.

numbers fall while universities are still seeing more international

:23:33.:23:36.

still seeing more international still seeing more international

:23:36.:23:37.

students. The second is those students. The second is those

:23:37.:23:39.

students. The second is those staying after their studies. We now

:23:39.:23:41.

staying after their studies. We now staying after their studies. We now

:23:41.:23:41.

staying after their studies. We now say if you are a university student

:23:41.:23:42.

say if you are a university student say if you are a university student

:23:42.:23:43.

say if you are a university student you can stay to take a graduate

:23:43.:23:44.

you can stay to take a graduate you can stay to take a graduate

:23:44.:23:45.

level drop pay more than �20,000. level drop pay more than �20,000.

:23:45.:23:46.

level drop pay more than �20,000. level drop pay more than �20,000.

:23:46.:23:47.

What was happening a few years ago What was happening a few years ago

:23:47.:23:48.

What was happening a few years ago was that many people were staying

:23:48.:23:49.

was that many people were staying was that many people were staying

:23:49.:23:51.

and they were only getting unskilled and they were only getting unskilled

:23:51.:23:51.

and they were only getting unskilled work. They were going on benefits.

:23:51.:23:53.

work. They were going on benefits. work. They were going on benefits.

:23:53.:23:54.

work. They were going on benefits. We have stop that so it is fewer

:23:55.:23:55.

We have stop that so it is fewer We have stop that so it is fewer

:23:55.:23:58.

people overall but the right people. people overall but the right people.

:23:58.:23:59.

people overall but the right people. people overall but the right people.

:23:59.:24:00.

Except a think tank has said this Except a think tank has said this

:24:00.:24:01.

Except a think tank has said this morning that the reduction today is

:24:01.:24:03.

morning that the reduction today is morning that the reduction today is

:24:03.:24:03.

due to falling numbers of due to falling numbers of

:24:03.:24:04.

international students which will international students which will

:24:04.:24:06.

international students which will international students which will

:24:06.:24:07.

only have a short-term effect on net only have a short-term effect on net

:24:07.:24:07.

only have a short-term effect on net migration, so actually the figures

:24:07.:24:11.

migration, so actually the figures migration, so actually the figures

:24:11.:24:12.

migration, so actually the figures will go back up. Well, no, if you

:24:12.:24:13.

will go back up. Well, no, if you will go back up. Well, no, if you

:24:13.:24:15.

look at the figures they publish, look at the figures they publish,

:24:15.:24:16.

look at the figures they publish, those longer ago than our up-to-date

:24:16.:24:17.

those longer ago than our up-to-date those longer ago than our up-to-date

:24:17.:24:18.

Visa statistics. And they say the Visa statistics. And they say the

:24:18.:24:21.

Visa statistics. And they say the number of visas we are granting,

:24:21.:24:22.

number of visas we are granting, number of visas we are granting,

:24:22.:24:23.

which show the statistics of which show the statistics of

:24:23.:24:25.

which show the statistics of migrants, are continuing to fall, so

:24:25.:24:26.

migrants, are continuing to fall, so migrants, are continuing to fall, so

:24:26.:24:27.

the direction of travel is still the direction of travel is still

:24:27.:24:28.

the direction of travel is still heading towards us being able to

:24:28.:24:30.

heading towards us being able to heading towards us being able to

:24:30.:24:30.

fulfil our promise of getting net fulfil our promise of getting net

:24:30.:24:31.

fulfil our promise of getting net migration down towards the tens of

:24:31.:24:33.

migration down towards the tens of migration down towards the tens of

:24:33.:24:34.

thousands by the election. Can you thousands by the election. Can you

:24:34.:24:38.

thousands by the election. Can you thousands by the election. Can you

:24:38.:24:41.

guarantee you will hit that? We have guarantee you will hit that? We have

:24:41.:24:42.

guarantee you will hit that? We have guarantee you will hit that? We have

:24:42.:24:43.

reduced the total, two years in, by reduced the total, two years in, by

:24:43.:24:44.

reduced the total, two years in, by reduced the total, two years in, by

:24:44.:24:44.

a third, and we have three more a third, and we have three more

:24:44.:24:46.

a third, and we have three more a third, and we have three more

:24:46.:24:47.

years of the Parliament to go, so we years of the Parliament to go, so we

:24:47.:24:52.

years of the Parliament to go, so we are absolutely on track. You have

:24:52.:24:53.

are absolutely on track. You have are absolutely on track. You have

:24:53.:24:54.

talked about the figures you can talked about the figures you can

:24:54.:24:56.

talked about the figures you can talked about the figures you can

:24:56.:24:57.

affect but people talk about it the affect but people talk about it the

:24:57.:24:58.

affect but people talk about it the fact that the majority of people

:24:58.:24:59.

fact that the majority of people fact that the majority of people

:24:59.:25:03.

coming in from other EU countries. coming in from other EU countries.

:25:03.:25:05.

coming in from other EU countries. coming in from other EU countries.

:25:05.:25:05.

That is not true. 55% of people That is not true. 55% of people

:25:06.:25:06.

That is not true. 55% of people coming to this country are coming

:25:07.:25:08.

coming to this country are coming coming to this country are coming

:25:08.:25:08.

coming to this country are coming from outside the EU, where we have

:25:09.:25:09.

from outside the EU, where we have from outside the EU, where we have

:25:09.:25:11.

complete control over whether we let complete control over whether we let

:25:11.:25:12.

complete control over whether we let complete control over whether we let

:25:12.:25:15.

them in. 30% are coming from the them in. 30% are coming from the

:25:15.:25:16.

them in. 30% are coming from the EU... Have those numbers come down

:25:16.:25:20.

EU... Have those numbers come down EU... Have those numbers come down

:25:20.:25:22.

as well? Well, those numbers are as well? Well, those numbers are

:25:22.:25:23.

as well? Well, those numbers are flat and some Brits returning from

:25:23.:25:25.

flat and some Brits returning from flat and some Brits returning from

:25:25.:25:26.

flat and some Brits returning from abroad. The EU number is both only a

:25:26.:25:27.

abroad. The EU number is both only a abroad. The EU number is both only a

:25:27.:25:28.

third and it's actually fairly third and it's actually fairly

:25:28.:25:29.

third and it's actually fairly third and it's actually fairly

:25:29.:25:30.

stable. It is balanced out by the stable. It is balanced out by the

:25:30.:25:34.

stable. It is balanced out by the number of British people leaving.

:25:34.:25:40.

number of British people leaving. number of British people leaving.

:25:40.:25:41.

Cynics might argue more people from Cynics might argue more people from

:25:41.:25:43.

Cynics might argue more people from Cynics might argue more people from

:25:43.:25:43.

places like Poland are now going to places like Poland are now going to

:25:43.:25:44.

places like Poland are now going to Germany because the economy is flat

:25:44.:25:50.

Germany because the economy is flat Germany because the economy is flat

:25:50.:25:52.

Germany because the economy is flat here now. Well, I think Labour let

:25:52.:25:52.

here now. Well, I think Labour let here now. Well, I think Labour let

:25:52.:25:53.

the Eastern European migration get the Eastern European migration get

:25:53.:25:55.

the Eastern European migration get out of control, even during their

:25:55.:25:57.

out of control, even during their out of control, even during their

:25:57.:25:57.

time of office, when 80% of time of office, when 80% of

:25:57.:25:58.

time of office, when 80% of migration wizard from outside the

:25:58.:26:00.

migration wizard from outside the migration wizard from outside the

:26:00.:26:00.

migration wizard from outside the EU, which is when we had complete

:26:01.:26:01.

EU, which is when we had complete EU, which is when we had complete

:26:01.:26:02.

EU, which is when we had complete control as long as we have firm

:26:02.:26:03.

control as long as we have firm control as long as we have firm

:26:03.:26:06.

control as long as we have firm policies like the ones we set out.

:26:07.:26:12.

policies like the ones we set out. policies like the ones we set out.

:26:12.:26:17.

-- migration was from. Do you -- migration was from. Do you

:26:17.:26:17.

-- migration was from. Do you support this? Are there any

:26:17.:26:22.

support this? Are there any support this? Are there any

:26:22.:26:25.

corresponding figures that show the corresponding figures that show the

:26:25.:26:31.

corresponding figures that show the numbers and the draining resources?

:26:31.:26:32.

numbers and the draining resources? numbers and the draining resources?

:26:32.:26:34.

Well, last week the interesting Well, last week the interesting

:26:34.:26:35.

Well, last week the interesting thing about the numbers produced

:26:35.:26:38.

thing about the numbers produced thing about the numbers produced

:26:38.:26:41.

showed that 90% of British citizens. showed that 90% of British citizens.

:26:41.:26:41.

showed that 90% of British citizens. showed that 90% of British citizens.

:26:41.:26:44.

Where we saw quite a lot of people Where we saw quite a lot of people

:26:44.:26:44.

Where we saw quite a lot of people getting into work previously who

:26:45.:26:46.

getting into work previously who getting into work previously who

:26:46.:26:46.

were British citizens, more of the were British citizens, more of the

:26:47.:26:47.

were British citizens, more of the were British citizens, more of the

:26:48.:26:48.

job is now being created in Britain job is now being created in Britain

:26:48.:26:50.

job is now being created in Britain job is now being created in Britain

:26:50.:26:50.

and new people going into work are and new people going into work are

:26:51.:26:52.

and new people going into work are British citizens, so I think the

:26:52.:26:53.

British citizens, so I think the British citizens, so I think the

:26:53.:26:55.

changes we're making in the benefit changes we're making in the benefit

:26:55.:26:56.

system combined with migration system combined with migration

:26:56.:26:57.

system combined with migration policies are giving British people

:26:57.:27:00.

policies are giving British people policies are giving British people

:27:00.:27:00.

more of an opportunity. more of an opportunity.

:27:01.:27:01.

more of an opportunity. personally I don't see anything

:27:01.:27:03.

personally I don't see anything personally I don't see anything

:27:03.:27:04.

wrong with a good, fair, democratic wrong with a good, fair, democratic

:27:04.:27:06.

wrong with a good, fair, democratic wrong with a good, fair, democratic

:27:06.:27:06.

filter. I want to make sure we get filter. I want to make sure we get

:27:07.:27:07.

filter. I want to make sure we get the right people coming to the

:27:08.:27:08.

the right people coming to the country because obviously

:27:09.:27:09.

country because obviously country because obviously

:27:10.:27:13.

immigration is crucial to any immigration is crucial to any

:27:13.:27:13.

immigration is crucial to any country, especially a one developing

:27:13.:27:14.

country, especially a one developing country, especially a one developing

:27:14.:27:15.

country, especially a one developing country, especially a one developing

:27:15.:27:17.

like ours. But it has to be a good like ours. But it has to be a good

:27:17.:27:18.

like ours. But it has to be a good thing. But will it change with

:27:18.:27:19.

thing. But will it change with thing. But will it change with

:27:19.:27:21.

Bulgaria and Rumania towards the end Bulgaria and Rumania towards the end

:27:21.:27:22.

Bulgaria and Rumania towards the end of the year? We won't expected

:27:22.:27:25.

of the year? We won't expected of the year? We won't expected

:27:25.:27:26.

forecasts. Because we heard from forecasts. Because we heard from

:27:27.:27:28.

forecasts. Because we heard from forecasts. Because we heard from

:27:28.:27:28.

Michael has time who said, it is Michael has time who said, it is

:27:28.:27:31.

Michael has time who said, it is pointless because you can't tell.

:27:31.:27:32.

pointless because you can't tell. pointless because you can't tell.

:27:32.:27:34.

Yes, exactly. We are looking across Yes, exactly. We are looking across

:27:34.:27:35.

Yes, exactly. We are looking across government in a committee I am

:27:35.:27:36.

government in a committee I am government in a committee I am

:27:36.:27:39.

chairing at all the access to chairing at all the access to

:27:39.:27:39.

chairing at all the access to benefits... Where are you getting

:27:39.:27:42.

benefits... Where are you getting benefits... Where are you getting

:27:42.:27:43.

benefits... Where are you getting that? Because it still seems you can

:27:43.:27:45.

that? Because it still seems you can that? Because it still seems you can

:27:45.:27:46.

get those immediately. We look at get those immediately. We look at

:27:46.:27:47.

get those immediately. We look at what we offer competitive other

:27:47.:27:47.

what we offer competitive other what we offer competitive other

:27:47.:27:48.

what we offer competitive other people and that we are not a soft

:27:48.:27:49.

people and that we are not a soft people and that we are not a soft

:27:49.:27:50.

touch, and the Prime Minister said touch, and the Prime Minister said

:27:51.:27:52.

touch, and the Prime Minister said that again yesterday. So that work

:27:52.:27:53.

that again yesterday. So that work that again yesterday. So that work

:27:53.:27:53.

that again yesterday. So that work is underway, putting a lot of work

:27:53.:27:55.

is underway, putting a lot of work is underway, putting a lot of work

:27:55.:27:56.

across government. You have the across government. You have the

:27:56.:28:01.

across government. You have the across government. You have the

:28:01.:28:01.

Secretary of State for health say he Secretary of State for health say he

:28:01.:28:02.

Secretary of State for health say he Secretary of State for health say he

:28:02.:28:03.

was looking at things as well this was looking at things as well this

:28:03.:28:08.

was looking at things as well this was looking at things as well this

:28:08.:28:08.

week, making sure we cannot -- do week, making sure we cannot -- do

:28:08.:28:13.

week, making sure we cannot -- do not get health tourists. What can

:28:13.:28:14.

not get health tourists. What can not get health tourists. What can

:28:14.:28:16.

not get health tourists. What can you do on health benefits? You say

:28:16.:28:16.

you do on health benefits? You say you do on health benefits? You say

:28:17.:28:17.

you do on health benefits? You say that you have to give what you have

:28:17.:28:21.

that you have to give what you have that you have to give what you have

:28:21.:28:23.

to give. There are other countries to give. There are other countries

:28:23.:28:25.

to give. There are other countries with concerns about free movement so

:28:25.:28:28.

with concerns about free movement so with concerns about free movement so

:28:28.:28:29.

with concerns about free movement so we have an action plan and other

:28:29.:28:30.

we have an action plan and other we have an action plan and other

:28:30.:28:30.

countries who are concerned about countries who are concerned about

:28:30.:28:31.

countries who are concerned about countries who are concerned about

:28:31.:28:32.

that. When we have things to say we that. When we have things to say we

:28:32.:28:33.

that. When we have things to say we will save them to Parliament first

:28:33.:28:34.

will save them to Parliament first will save them to Parliament first

:28:34.:28:34.

will save them to Parliament first and then I will be delighted to come

:28:34.:28:35.

and then I will be delighted to come and then I will be delighted to come

:28:35.:28:39.

and then I will be delighted to come on your program and say them to you.

:28:39.:28:40.

on your program and say them to you. on your program and say them to you.

:28:40.:28:41.

on your program and say them to you. That is most kind of you, but you

:28:41.:28:43.

That is most kind of you, but you That is most kind of you, but you

:28:43.:28:44.

That is most kind of you, but you won't be able to change the basics,

:28:44.:28:45.

won't be able to change the basics, won't be able to change the basics,

:28:45.:28:48.

won't be able to change the basics, the statute written into the EU?

:28:48.:28:49.

the statute written into the EU? the statute written into the EU?

:28:50.:28:50.

the statute written into the EU? are doing that work at the moment,

:28:50.:28:52.

are doing that work at the moment, are doing that work at the moment,

:28:52.:28:53.

looking at how we compare to looking at how we compare to

:28:53.:28:55.

looking at how we compare to European partners and making sure we

:28:55.:28:56.

European partners and making sure we European partners and making sure we

:28:56.:28:57.

are tougher and more restrictive so are tougher and more restrictive so

:28:57.:28:58.

are tougher and more restrictive so are tougher and more restrictive so

:28:58.:29:00.

people come here to work and to people come here to work and to

:29:00.:29:01.

people come here to work and to contribute. They don't come here to

:29:01.:29:06.

contribute. They don't come here to contribute. They don't come here to

:29:06.:29:09.

take. What is your feeling about take. What is your feeling about

:29:09.:29:10.

take. What is your feeling about migrants coming from Romania and

:29:10.:29:12.

migrants coming from Romania and migrants coming from Romania and

:29:12.:29:18.

migrants coming from Romania and Bulgaria? Is it a concern? I don't

:29:18.:29:19.

Bulgaria? Is it a concern? I don't Bulgaria? Is it a concern? I don't

:29:19.:29:19.

think it matters where people are think it matters where people are

:29:20.:29:21.

think it matters where people are think it matters where people are

:29:21.:29:21.

coming from but it is a slippery coming from but it is a slippery

:29:21.:29:22.

coming from but it is a slippery slope. The question is, are they

:29:22.:29:24.

slope. The question is, are they slope. The question is, are they

:29:24.:29:25.

slope. The question is, are they welcome, do they fit in? Do they

:29:25.:29:26.

welcome, do they fit in? Do they have something to contribute,

:29:27.:29:29.

have something to contribute, have something to contribute,

:29:29.:29:29.

have something to contribute, whether it is the education and the

:29:29.:29:30.

whether it is the education and the whether it is the education and the

:29:30.:29:31.

whether it is the education and the workplace. I don't really care if a

:29:31.:29:31.

workplace. I don't really care if a workplace. I don't really care if a

:29:31.:29:36.

percentage comes from Bulgaria or percentage comes from Bulgaria or

:29:36.:29:37.

percentage comes from Bulgaria or anywhere else. Thank you. We look

:29:37.:29:38.

anywhere else. Thank you. We look anywhere else. Thank you. We look

:29:38.:29:38.

anywhere else. Thank you. We look forward to you coming back when you

:29:38.:29:39.

forward to you coming back when you forward to you coming back when you

:29:39.:29:45.

have something to say about the benefits system.

:29:45.:29:47.

benefits system. benefits system.

:29:47.:29:48.

When you think of motorway service When you think of motorway service

:29:48.:29:49.

When you think of motorway service stations, what you think of? Soggy

:29:49.:29:51.

stations, what you think of? Soggy stations, what you think of? Soggy

:29:51.:29:53.

chips, queues at the toilets, chips, queues at the toilets,

:29:53.:29:58.

chips, queues at the toilets, constant" are we there yet?". Will

:29:58.:30:00.

constant" are we there yet?". Will constant" are we there yet?". Will

:30:00.:30:00.

it be a every second interchange it be a every second interchange

:30:00.:30:02.

it be a every second interchange with the changes proposed to them.

:30:02.:30:03.

with the changes proposed to them. with the changes proposed to them.

:30:03.:30:03.

with the changes proposed to them. We took to the road to find out

:30:04.:30:13.
:30:14.:30:16.

We are going to peek under the We are going to peek under the

:30:16.:30:16.

We are going to peek under the bonnet of motorway service station

:30:16.:30:19.

bonnet of motorway service station bonnet of motorway service station

:30:19.:30:20.

regulation. They are obliged to be regulation. They are obliged to be

:30:20.:30:21.

regulation. They are obliged to be regulation. They are obliged to be

:30:21.:30:22.

open 24 hours a day, every single open 24 hours a day, every single

:30:22.:30:22.

open 24 hours a day, every single day of the year, including

:30:22.:30:25.

day of the year, including day of the year, including

:30:25.:30:26.

Christmas. They have to offer two Christmas. They have to offer two

:30:26.:30:28.

Christmas. They have to offer two hours of free parking. To be

:30:28.:30:28.

hours of free parking. To be hours of free parking. To be

:30:28.:30:30.

eligible for a road sign saying eligible for a road sign saying

:30:30.:30:31.

eligible for a road sign saying eligible for a road sign saying

:30:31.:30:32.

you've got a picnic area, you have you've got a picnic area, you have

:30:32.:30:33.

you've got a picnic area, you have to have 10 tables seating six

:30:33.:30:36.

to have 10 tables seating six to have 10 tables seating six

:30:36.:30:37.

people each. The maximum size of people each. The maximum size of

:30:37.:30:38.

people each. The maximum size of the retail area is 500 square

:30:38.:30:41.

the retail area is 500 square the retail area is 500 square

:30:41.:30:42.

the retail area is 500 square metres. If you have a bridge over

:30:42.:30:42.

metres. If you have a bridge over metres. If you have a bridge over

:30:42.:30:43.

metres. If you have a bridge over the motorway, you can't have a shop

:30:43.:30:45.

the motorway, you can't have a shop the motorway, you can't have a shop

:30:45.:30:45.

the motorway, you can't have a shop on it. And the toilets have to be

:30:45.:30:48.

on it. And the toilets have to be on it. And the toilets have to be

:30:48.:30:49.

free. David has quite literally free. David has quite literally

:30:49.:30:50.

free. David has quite literally free. David has quite literally

:30:50.:30:51.

written the book on the subject. He written the book on the subject. He

:30:51.:30:52.

written the book on the subject. He written the book on the subject. He

:30:52.:30:53.

says some of the rules date back to says some of the rules date back to

:30:53.:30:54.

says some of the rules date back to the building of the very first

:30:54.:30:57.

the building of the very first the building of the very first

:30:57.:30:58.

service stations, which came in the service stations, which came in the

:30:58.:31:00.

service stations, which came in the 1950s and Sixties. The regulations

:31:00.:31:04.

1950s and Sixties. The regulations 1950s and Sixties. The regulations

:31:04.:31:05.

for areas are for refreshing and for areas are for refreshing and

:31:05.:31:06.

for areas are for refreshing and refuelling but not to become

:31:06.:31:07.

refuelling but not to become refuelling but not to become

:31:07.:31:09.

destinations in their own right. destinations in their own right.

:31:09.:31:10.

destinations in their own right. destinations in their own right.

:31:10.:31:11.

There would not be tailbacks on the There would not be tailbacks on the

:31:11.:31:12.

There would not be tailbacks on the motorway for people queuing up to

:31:12.:31:14.

motorway for people queuing up to motorway for people queuing up to

:31:14.:31:15.

motorway for people queuing up to visit the services. Now a load of

:31:15.:31:16.

visit the services. Now a load of regulations regarding building by

:31:16.:31:17.

regulations regarding building by regulations regarding building by

:31:17.:31:18.

regulations regarding building by the side of the motorway are under

:31:18.:31:19.

the side of the motorway are under the side of the motorway are under

:31:19.:31:20.

review as the government seeks to review as the government seeks to

:31:20.:31:21.

review as the government seeks to turn the road network into an

:31:21.:31:24.

turn the road network into an turn the road network into an

:31:24.:31:25.

engine of economic growth. The engine of economic growth. The

:31:25.:31:26.

engine of economic growth. The Department for Transport is looking

:31:26.:31:27.

Department for Transport is looking Department for Transport is looking

:31:27.:31:27.

Department for Transport is looking at ripping up the rules which say

:31:27.:31:28.

at ripping up the rules which say at ripping up the rules which say

:31:28.:31:30.

at ripping up the rules which say there has to be a minimum of 12

:31:30.:31:31.

there has to be a minimum of 12 there has to be a minimum of 12

:31:31.:31:33.

miles between each service station. miles between each service station.

:31:33.:31:35.

miles between each service station. miles between each service station.

:31:35.:31:36.

The idea being, more of them will The idea being, more of them will

:31:36.:31:37.

arrive, bringing increased arrive, bringing increased

:31:37.:31:39.

arrive, bringing increased competition and more choice. An

:31:39.:31:41.

competition and more choice. An competition and more choice. An

:31:41.:31:42.

competition and more choice. An competition and more choice. An

:31:42.:31:43.

idea stuck in a bit of a tail back idea stuck in a bit of a tail back

:31:43.:31:44.

idea stuck in a bit of a tail back because John Major first called for

:31:44.:31:47.

because John Major first called for because John Major first called for

:31:47.:31:49.

because John Major first called for it in 1992. Next services, 54 miles,

:31:49.:31:50.

it in 1992. Next services, 54 miles, it in 1992. Next services, 54 miles,

:31:50.:31:55.

when your children can't make 10. when your children can't make 10.

:31:55.:31:56.

when your children can't make 10. when your children can't make 10.

:31:56.:31:57.

They have got to go and so those They have got to go and so those

:31:57.:31:59.

They have got to go and so those They have got to go and so those

:31:59.:32:00.

rules have got to go. It's been rules have got to go. It's been

:32:00.:32:02.

rules have got to go. It's been rules have got to go. It's been

:32:02.:32:02.

applauded by the AA, who reckon it applauded by the AA, who reckon it

:32:02.:32:03.

applauded by the AA, who reckon it may mean more petrol stations which

:32:03.:32:04.

may mean more petrol stations which may mean more petrol stations which

:32:04.:32:05.

may mean more petrol stations which could bring down the cost of fuel

:32:05.:32:07.

could bring down the cost of fuel could bring down the cost of fuel

:32:07.:32:08.

on the motorway. But local on the motorway. But local

:32:08.:32:09.

on the motorway. But local authorities will still have the

:32:09.:32:10.

authorities will still have the authorities will still have the

:32:10.:32:12.

power to refuse planning permission. power to refuse planning permission.

:32:12.:32:13.

power to refuse planning permission. Something the owners of this place

:32:13.:32:14.

Something the owners of this place Something the owners of this place

:32:14.:32:16.

Something the owners of this place know all about because it took 19

:32:16.:32:17.

know all about because it took 19 know all about because it took 19

:32:17.:32:18.

years and five public inquiries years and five public inquiries

:32:18.:32:19.

years and five public inquiries before it opened for business.

:32:19.:32:21.

before it opened for business. before it opened for business.

:32:21.:32:24.

Don't worry, the toilets will still Don't worry, the toilets will still

:32:24.:32:25.

Don't worry, the toilets will still be free. I'm hugely relieved about

:32:25.:32:27.

be free. I'm hugely relieved about be free. I'm hugely relieved about

:32:27.:32:27.

be free. I'm hugely relieved about that. And we're joined now by Chris

:32:27.:32:29.

that. And we're joined now by Chris Goffey, a motoring journalist.

:32:29.:32:31.

Goffey, a motoring journalist. Goffey, a motoring journalist.

:32:31.:32:33.

Welcome. Do we need more service Welcome. Do we need more service

:32:33.:32:36.

Welcome. Do we need more service stations? I think so. In France,

:32:36.:32:37.

stations? I think so. In France, stations? I think so. In France,

:32:37.:32:38.

while the major service stations while the major service stations

:32:38.:32:40.

while the major service stations are well spaced, there are little

:32:40.:32:40.

are well spaced, there are little are well spaced, there are little

:32:40.:32:41.

are well spaced, there are little are well spaced, there are little

:32:41.:32:42.

pots now when Ben and you can go to pots now when Ben and you can go to

:32:42.:32:43.

pots now when Ben and you can go to pots now when Ben and you can go to

:32:43.:32:44.

the loo and Parker and eat your the loo and Parker and eat your

:32:44.:32:48.

the loo and Parker and eat your sandwich -- now and then. Those

:32:48.:32:49.

sandwich -- now and then. Those sandwich -- now and then. Those

:32:50.:32:50.

more regular stops are welcome and more regular stops are welcome and

:32:50.:32:51.

more regular stops are welcome and more regular stops are welcome and

:32:51.:32:52.

I would like to see more service I would like to see more service

:32:52.:32:55.

I would like to see more service areas, that's for sure. John major

:32:55.:32:57.

areas, that's for sure. John major areas, that's for sure. John major

:32:57.:32:58.

highlight the problem in 1992. Why highlight the problem in 1992. Why

:32:58.:33:01.

highlight the problem in 1992. Why highlight the problem in 1992. Why

:33:01.:33:01.

has it been so slow? The iron grasp has it been so slow? The iron grasp

:33:01.:33:03.

has it been so slow? The iron grasp of bureaucracy has been on the

:33:03.:33:04.

of bureaucracy has been on the of bureaucracy has been on the

:33:04.:33:06.

motorway service areas and, to be motorway service areas and, to be

:33:06.:33:07.

motorway service areas and, to be motorway service areas and, to be

:33:07.:33:09.

fair, they have done a good job in fair, they have done a good job in

:33:09.:33:12.

fair, they have done a good job in some areas. In the USA, the

:33:12.:33:13.

some areas. In the USA, the some areas. In the USA, the

:33:13.:33:15.

advertising slogans on a huge masts, advertising slogans on a huge masts,

:33:15.:33:16.

advertising slogans on a huge masts, 10 miles before each stop, are

:33:17.:33:18.

10 miles before each stop, are 10 miles before each stop, are

:33:18.:33:20.

absolutely horrendous now. We have absolutely horrendous now. We have

:33:20.:33:21.

absolutely horrendous now. We have absolutely horrendous now. We have

:33:21.:33:22.

avoided all that, and I hope we avoided all that, and I hope we

:33:22.:33:24.

avoided all that, and I hope we will continue to avoid it, however

:33:24.:33:26.

will continue to avoid it, however more stops, obviously more

:33:26.:33:27.

more stops, obviously more more stops, obviously more

:33:27.:33:28.

convenience for the motorist and convenience for the motorist and

:33:28.:33:30.

convenience for the motorist and convenience for the motorist and

:33:30.:33:30.

their families, and I think that is their families, and I think that is

:33:30.:33:31.

their families, and I think that is their families, and I think that is

:33:31.:33:33.

a ballad point about the high cost a ballad point about the high cost

:33:33.:33:35.

a ballad point about the high cost a ballad point about the high cost

:33:35.:33:36.

of fuel. -- a valid point. We are of fuel. -- a valid point. We are

:33:36.:33:37.

of fuel. -- a valid point. We are going to welcome the viewers in

:33:37.:33:39.

going to welcome the viewers in going to welcome the viewers in

:33:39.:33:40.

Scotland to have been watching Scotland to have been watching

:33:40.:33:50.

First Minister's Questions. That First Minister's Questions. That

:33:50.:33:51.

First Minister's Questions. That means, presumably, there will be

:33:51.:33:53.

means, presumably, there will be means, presumably, there will be

:33:53.:33:53.

means, presumably, there will be more than the four providers at the

:33:53.:33:54.

more than the four providers at the more than the four providers at the

:33:54.:33:55.

moment, more people being courage moment, more people being courage

:33:55.:33:56.

moment, more people being courage to enter the market. There does

:33:56.:33:57.

to enter the market. There does to enter the market. There does

:33:58.:33:59.

to enter the market. There does seem to be a stranglehold by the

:33:59.:34:01.

seem to be a stranglehold by the seem to be a stranglehold by the

:34:01.:34:02.

main providers, but if you notice main providers, but if you notice

:34:02.:34:03.

main providers, but if you notice main providers, but if you notice

:34:03.:34:04.

over the last 10 years, Marks and over the last 10 years, Marks and

:34:04.:34:05.

over the last 10 years, Marks and over the last 10 years, Marks and

:34:05.:34:06.

Spencer Shops has come in, and that Spencer Shops has come in, and that

:34:06.:34:09.

Spencer Shops has come in, and that has provided much better quality,

:34:09.:34:10.

has provided much better quality, has provided much better quality,

:34:10.:34:11.

has provided much better quality, if you like of the food on offer

:34:11.:34:12.

if you like of the food on offer if you like of the food on offer

:34:12.:34:14.

if you like of the food on offer you can take away and eat yourself.

:34:14.:34:15.

you can take away and eat yourself. The government issued a

:34:15.:34:17.

The government issued a The government issued a

:34:17.:34:17.

consultation don't forget back in consultation don't forget back in

:34:17.:34:19.

consultation don't forget back in 20th June 12, on lifting the

:34:19.:34:24.

20th June 12, on lifting the 20th June 12, on lifting the

:34:24.:34:25.

regulations on alcohol. If you regulations on alcohol. If you

:34:25.:34:26.

regulations on alcohol. If you trawl through that a very long

:34:26.:34:27.

trawl through that a very long trawl through that a very long

:34:27.:34:30.

document, you will find that they document, you will find that they

:34:30.:34:32.

document, you will find that they project an increase of sales about

:34:32.:34:35.

project an increase of sales about project an increase of sales about

:34:35.:34:36.

�21 million. That wouldn't be a �21 million. That wouldn't be a

:34:36.:34:39.

�21 million. That wouldn't be a very wise idea in service stations.

:34:39.:34:40.

very wise idea in service stations. very wise idea in service stations.

:34:40.:34:40.

The safety people would take great The safety people would take great

:34:41.:34:41.

The safety people would take great The safety people would take great

:34:41.:34:43.

exception to it. To be fair, they exception to it. To be fair, they

:34:43.:34:44.

exception to it. To be fair, they say they would relax the

:34:44.:34:47.

say they would relax the say they would relax the

:34:47.:34:48.

regulations on drinks in motorway regulations on drinks in motorway

:34:48.:34:49.

regulations on drinks in motorway regulations on drinks in motorway

:34:50.:34:53.

hotels and motels. And in the shops. hotels and motels. And in the shops.

:34:53.:34:54.

hotels and motels. And in the shops. But not necessarily serving alcohol

:34:55.:34:55.

But not necessarily serving alcohol But not necessarily serving alcohol

:34:55.:34:57.

over the counter to every football over the counter to every football

:34:57.:34:57.

over the counter to every football over the counter to every football

:34:57.:34:59.

coach that wants to pull into the coach that wants to pull into the

:34:59.:35:01.

motorway services. They actually motorway services. They actually

:35:01.:35:02.

motorway services. They actually serve alcohol in French service

:35:02.:35:03.

serve alcohol in French service serve alcohol in French service

:35:03.:35:06.

serve alcohol in French service areas but you have to have hot food,

:35:06.:35:07.

areas but you have to have hot food, areas but you have to have hot food,

:35:07.:35:08.

areas but you have to have hot food, and they sell it in one small

:35:08.:35:09.

and they sell it in one small and they sell it in one small

:35:09.:35:09.

and they sell it in one small bottle and won't sell more than one

:35:09.:35:10.

bottle and won't sell more than one bottle and won't sell more than one

:35:10.:35:12.

bottle and won't sell more than one and most people have a drink.

:35:12.:35:14.

and most people have a drink. and most people have a drink.

:35:14.:35:15.

forget, the French rules on forget, the French rules on

:35:15.:35:16.

forget, the French rules on drinking and driving are more

:35:16.:35:18.

drinking and driving are more drinking and driving are more

:35:18.:35:18.

stringent than ours. That doesn't stringent than ours. That doesn't

:35:18.:35:22.

stringent than ours. That doesn't seem to matter. What about the

:35:22.:35:24.

seem to matter. What about the seem to matter. What about the

:35:24.:35:25.

worry you might suddenly get great worry you might suddenly get great

:35:25.:35:27.

worry you might suddenly get great shopping malls springing up at the

:35:27.:35:28.

shopping malls springing up at the shopping malls springing up at the

:35:28.:35:29.

side of motorways and you would side of motorways and you would

:35:29.:35:30.

side of motorways and you would side of motorways and you would

:35:30.:35:31.

need better access to get to them need better access to get to them

:35:31.:35:32.

need better access to get to them need better access to get to them

:35:32.:35:34.

if there were lots more of them. A if there were lots more of them. A

:35:34.:35:35.

if there were lots more of them. A if there were lots more of them. A

:35:35.:35:35.

bit more like Euro Disney for that bit more like Euro Disney for that

:35:35.:35:38.

bit more like Euro Disney for that bit more like Euro Disney for that

:35:38.:35:39.

we don't wonder, do we? Actually, I we don't wonder, do we? Actually, I

:35:40.:35:42.

we don't wonder, do we? Actually, I do. Do you? Justified.I'm in

:35:42.:35:43.

do. Do you? Justified.I'm in do. Do you? Justified.I'm in

:35:43.:35:45.

favour of expansion of choice. The favour of expansion of choice. The

:35:45.:35:46.

favour of expansion of choice. The gaps that in the service stations

:35:46.:35:48.

gaps that in the service stations gaps that in the service stations

:35:48.:35:49.

gaps that in the service stations are too wide. I agree about America

:35:49.:35:50.

are too wide. I agree about America are too wide. I agree about America

:35:50.:35:51.

and France, where there is more and France, where there is more

:35:51.:35:52.

and France, where there is more and France, where there is more

:35:52.:35:53.

rest areas. They don't have to be rest areas. They don't have to be

:35:53.:35:54.

rest areas. They don't have to be great big buildings but I think

:35:54.:35:55.

great big buildings but I think great big buildings but I think

:35:55.:35:56.

great big buildings but I think what's wrong with it? It would be

:35:56.:35:58.

what's wrong with it? It would be what's wrong with it? It would be

:35:58.:35:59.

quite fun driving to Cornwall on quite fun driving to Cornwall on

:35:59.:36:00.

quite fun driving to Cornwall on holiday to stop at your service

:36:00.:36:01.

holiday to stop at your service holiday to stop at your service

:36:01.:36:01.

holiday to stop at your service station and to all of your shopping

:36:01.:36:03.

station and to all of your shopping station and to all of your shopping

:36:03.:36:05.

there. You have persuaded me for there. You have persuaded me for

:36:05.:36:05.

there. You have persuaded me for some were directed something more

:36:05.:36:06.

some were directed something more some were directed something more

:36:06.:36:08.

entertaining other side of the entertaining other side of the

:36:08.:36:08.

entertaining other side of the roadway? The absolutely but let's

:36:09.:36:11.

roadway? The absolutely but let's roadway? The absolutely but let's

:36:11.:36:13.

not go for too much advertising. not go for too much advertising.

:36:13.:36:14.

not go for too much advertising. Advertising other side of the

:36:14.:36:15.

Advertising other side of the motorway is very contentious

:36:15.:36:18.

motorway is very contentious because you're distracting drivers

:36:18.:36:20.

because you're distracting drivers because you're distracting drivers

:36:20.:36:20.

because you're distracting drivers I lines and attention for a brief

:36:20.:36:23.

I lines and attention for a brief I lines and attention for a brief

:36:23.:36:24.

couple of seconds. Something Major couple of seconds. Something Major

:36:24.:36:27.

couple of seconds. Something Major could happen. As long as the

:36:27.:36:29.

could happen. As long as the could happen. As long as the

:36:29.:36:30.

control the advertising before them control the advertising before them

:36:30.:36:31.

control the advertising before them control the advertising before them

:36:31.:36:32.

and after them, yes, I would like and after them, yes, I would like

:36:32.:36:34.

and after them, yes, I would like and after them, yes, I would like

:36:34.:36:36.

to see far more. His access a to see far more. His access a

:36:36.:36:37.

to see far more. His access a potential problem, even at sites

:36:37.:36:39.

potential problem, even at sites potential problem, even at sites

:36:39.:36:40.

identified, slip roads on and off? identified, slip roads on and off?

:36:40.:36:42.

identified, slip roads on and off? As long as they make adequate

:36:42.:36:43.

As long as they make adequate As long as they make adequate

:36:43.:36:45.

As long as they make adequate slippers on and off, and also that

:36:45.:36:48.

slippers on and off, and also that slippers on and off, and also that

:36:48.:36:48.

the new service Feria doesn't the new service Feria doesn't

:36:49.:36:49.

the new service Feria doesn't the new service Feria doesn't

:36:49.:36:50.

interact with a rope -- local road interact with a rope -- local road

:36:50.:36:57.

interact with a rope -- local road network -- slip roads don't

:36:57.:36:57.

network -- slip roads don't network -- slip roads don't

:36:57.:36:59.

interfere with local road networks. interfere with local road networks.

:36:59.:37:00.

interfere with local road networks. interfere with local road networks.

:37:00.:37:01.

That would be a problem. As long as That would be a problem. As long as

:37:01.:37:03.

That would be a problem. As long as That would be a problem. As long as

:37:03.:37:05.

they don't do that. What annoys me they don't do that. What annoys me

:37:05.:37:05.

they don't do that. What annoys me is this two our free parking

:37:05.:37:07.

is this two our free parking is this two our free parking

:37:07.:37:07.

is this two our free parking because, if you are very tired at

:37:07.:37:09.

because, if you are very tired at because, if you are very tired at

:37:09.:37:10.

night, heading up north or night, heading up north or

:37:10.:37:11.

night, heading up north or something, and you feel sleepy, and

:37:11.:37:14.

something, and you feel sleepy, and something, and you feel sleepy, and

:37:14.:37:15.

you stop, and sleek, somebody you stop, and sleek, somebody

:37:15.:37:17.

you stop, and sleek, somebody you stop, and sleek, somebody

:37:17.:37:18.

knocks on your window and says, you knocks on your window and says, you

:37:18.:37:19.

knocks on your window and says, you can't stay here for longer than

:37:19.:37:21.

can't stay here for longer than can't stay here for longer than

:37:21.:37:22.

can't stay here for longer than this time period. They put you back

:37:22.:37:25.

this time period. They put you back this time period. They put you back

:37:25.:37:27.

onto the motorway? Yes, which is onto the motorway? Yes, which is

:37:27.:37:28.

onto the motorway? Yes, which is extremely dangerous. I would like

:37:28.:37:29.

extremely dangerous. I would like extremely dangerous. I would like

:37:29.:37:30.

extremely dangerous. I would like to see a free sleeping, if you like

:37:30.:37:32.

to see a free sleeping, if you like to see a free sleeping, if you like

:37:32.:37:33.

between midnight and 6am. At the between midnight and 6am. At the

:37:33.:37:34.

between midnight and 6am. At the between midnight and 6am. At the

:37:34.:37:35.

end of the day, what might get in end of the day, what might get in

:37:35.:37:37.

end of the day, what might get in end of the day, what might get in

:37:37.:37:42.

the way of your new service station, the way of your new service station,

:37:42.:37:43.

the way of your new service station, the local authority will refuse it.

:37:43.:37:44.

the local authority will refuse it. the local authority will refuse it.

:37:44.:37:45.

the local authority will refuse it. Yes, it would have to go through

:37:45.:37:46.

Yes, it would have to go through Yes, it would have to go through

:37:46.:37:48.

planning but, in principle, it's a planning but, in principle, it's a

:37:48.:37:49.

planning but, in principle, it's a terrific idea. If anything could

:37:49.:37:50.

terrific idea. If anything could terrific idea. If anything could

:37:50.:37:51.

improve the quality of service improve the quality of service

:37:51.:37:53.

improve the quality of service station food, that should be

:37:53.:37:56.

station food, that should be station food, that should be

:37:56.:37:57.

cheered loudly. Many TV chefs have cheered loudly. Many TV chefs have

:37:57.:37:59.

cheered loudly. Many TV chefs have been shouting about it for years.

:37:59.:38:01.

been shouting about it for years. been shouting about it for years.

:38:01.:38:01.

Jamie Oliver and Nigella Lawson Jamie Oliver and Nigella Lawson

:38:01.:38:03.

Jamie Oliver and Nigella Lawson will be all over motorway service

:38:03.:38:05.

will be all over motorway service will be all over motorway service

:38:05.:38:09.

stations. Thank you very much. stations. Thank you very much.

:38:09.:38:09.

Yesterday, Environment Secretary Yesterday, Environment Secretary

:38:10.:38:10.

Yesterday, Environment Secretary Owen Paterson turned his attention

:38:10.:38:11.

Owen Paterson turned his attention Owen Paterson turned his attention

:38:11.:38:12.

from horses to culling badgers. from horses to culling badgers.

:38:12.:38:13.

from horses to culling badgers. from horses to culling badgers.

:38:13.:38:14.

from horses to culling badgers. This is what he had to say at the

:38:14.:38:15.

This is what he had to say at the National Farmers Union conference

:38:15.:38:16.

National Farmers Union conference National Farmers Union conference

:38:16.:38:16.

in Birmingham. Research in this in Birmingham. Research in this

:38:16.:38:17.

in Birmingham. Research in this in Birmingham. Research in this

:38:17.:38:19.

country over the past 15 years has country over the past 15 years has

:38:19.:38:20.

country over the past 15 years has clearly demonstrated not only that

:38:20.:38:21.

clearly demonstrated not only that clearly demonstrated not only that

:38:22.:38:23.

cattle and badgers transmit the cattle and badgers transmit the

:38:23.:38:25.

cattle and badgers transmit the disease to each other, but the

:38:25.:38:26.

disease to each other, but the disease to each other, but the

:38:26.:38:26.

disease to each other, but the cunning of badgers can lead to a

:38:26.:38:27.

cunning of badgers can lead to a cunning of badgers can lead to a

:38:27.:38:29.

reduction of the disease in cattle reduction of the disease in cattle

:38:29.:38:31.

reduction of the disease in cattle reduction of the disease in cattle

:38:31.:38:32.

if carried out over a large enough if carried out over a large enough

:38:32.:38:32.

if carried out over a large enough area for a sufficient length of

:38:33.:38:36.

area for a sufficient length of area for a sufficient length of

:38:36.:38:36.

area for a sufficient length of time. We must also learn from the

:38:36.:38:39.

time. We must also learn from the time. We must also learn from the

:38:39.:38:40.

experience of other countries. TB experience of other countries. TB

:38:40.:38:42.

experience of other countries. TB in cattle cannot be controlled

:38:42.:38:44.

in cattle cannot be controlled in cattle cannot be controlled

:38:44.:38:44.

in cattle cannot be controlled without also bearing down on it in

:38:44.:38:47.

without also bearing down on it in the surrounding wildlife population.

:38:47.:38:48.

the surrounding wildlife population. the surrounding wildlife population.

:38:48.:38:49.

the surrounding wildlife population. In the New Zealand, the number of

:38:49.:38:53.

In the New Zealand, the number of In the New Zealand, the number of

:38:53.:38:54.

infected cattle has been reduced infected cattle has been reduced

:38:54.:38:55.

infected cattle has been reduced infected cattle has been reduced

:38:55.:38:58.

from 1,700 in the mid- 1990s to from 1,700 in the mid- 1990s to

:38:58.:38:59.

from 1,700 in the mid- 1990s to from 1,700 in the mid- 1990s to

:39:00.:39:01.

fewer than 120 in 2011. This is the fewer than 120 in 2011. This is the

:39:01.:39:02.

fewer than 120 in 2011. This is the result of rigorous buyers secured,

:39:02.:39:06.

result of rigorous buyers secured, strict cattle controls and

:39:06.:39:08.

strict cattle controls and proactive wildlife management. A

:39:08.:39:09.

proactive wildlife management. A similar approach has been

:39:09.:39:10.

similar approach has been approached in Ireland, Australia

:39:11.:39:14.

approached in Ireland, Australia approached in Ireland, Australia

:39:14.:39:16.

approached in Ireland, Australia and the USA. This is why I'm

:39:16.:39:17.

and the USA. This is why I'm and the USA. This is why I'm

:39:17.:39:18.

committed to ensure the badger committed to ensure the badger

:39:18.:39:21.

committed to ensure the badger culls go-ahead in Somerset and

:39:21.:39:21.

culls go-ahead in Somerset and culls go-ahead in Somerset and

:39:21.:39:28.

Gloucestershire at go ahead this So are plans to begin a pilot for

:39:28.:39:29.

So are plans to begin a pilot for culling badgers necessary? Susana

:39:29.:39:30.

culling badgers necessary? Susana culling badgers necessary? Susana

:39:30.:39:34.

Mendonsa is in central lobby with Mendonsa is in central lobby with

:39:34.:39:35.

Mendonsa is in central lobby with Mendonsa is in central lobby with

:39:35.:39:36.

Mendonsa is in central lobby with two MPs. This seems to be a lot of

:39:36.:39:38.

two MPs. This seems to be a lot of two MPs. This seems to be a lot of

:39:38.:39:39.

confusion over whether or not this confusion over whether or not this

:39:39.:39:40.

confusion over whether or not this pilot is necessary. The government

:39:40.:39:42.

pilot is necessary. The government pilot is necessary. The government

:39:42.:39:43.

is talking about the need to is talking about the need to

:39:43.:39:45.

is talking about the need to introduce this cull to reduce the

:39:45.:39:47.

introduce this cull to reduce the introduce this cull to reduce the

:39:47.:39:48.

spread of bovine TB. Owen Paterson spread of bovine TB. Owen Paterson

:39:48.:39:49.

spread of bovine TB. Owen Paterson spread of bovine TB. Owen Paterson

:39:49.:39:50.

talk about the science but there is talk about the science but there is

:39:50.:39:51.

talk about the science but there is uncertainty about whether it shows

:39:51.:39:52.

uncertainty about whether it shows uncertainty about whether it shows

:39:52.:39:53.

what they wanted to show and what they wanted to show and

:39:53.:39:54.

what they wanted to show and certainly some people think there

:39:54.:39:55.

certainly some people think there certainly some people think there

:39:55.:39:56.

certainly some people think there might even be an increase in the

:39:56.:39:58.

might even be an increase in the might even be an increase in the

:39:58.:39:58.

might even be an increase in the spread of bovine TB and are calling

:39:58.:40:01.

spread of bovine TB and are calling spread of bovine TB and are calling

:40:01.:40:02.

for vaccinations. A couple of MPs for vaccinations. A couple of MPs

:40:02.:40:06.

for vaccinations. A couple of MPs are interested in this. Simon Hart

:40:06.:40:11.

are interested in this. Simon Hart are interested in this. Simon Hart

:40:11.:40:12.

and Caroline Lucas. Simon, Owen and Caroline Lucas. Simon, Owen

:40:12.:40:13.

and Caroline Lucas. Simon, Owen Paterson says this is needed but

:40:13.:40:14.

Paterson says this is needed but Paterson says this is needed but

:40:14.:40:15.

what is the evidence because we what is the evidence because we

:40:15.:40:16.

what is the evidence because we what is the evidence because we

:40:17.:40:18.

know bovine TB can go from cow to know bovine TB can go from cow to

:40:18.:40:19.

know bovine TB can go from cow to know bovine TB can go from cow to

:40:19.:40:20.

cow? There's a lot of evidence. I cow? There's a lot of evidence. I

:40:20.:40:21.

cow? There's a lot of evidence. I don't think any politician would

:40:21.:40:22.

don't think any politician would don't think any politician would

:40:22.:40:23.

don't think any politician would want to do this lightly. Over the

:40:23.:40:27.

want to do this lightly. Over the want to do this lightly. Over the

:40:27.:40:28.

want to do this lightly. Over the years, one held the farm animal has

:40:28.:40:29.

years, one held the farm animal has years, one held the farm animal has

:40:29.:40:30.

been killed every 15 minutes, lots been killed every 15 minutes, lots

:40:30.:40:35.

been killed every 15 minutes, lots of foreign evidence suggests it's a

:40:35.:40:37.

of foreign evidence suggests it's a of foreign evidence suggests it's a

:40:37.:40:38.

pilot cull, but will prove once- pilot cull, but will prove once-

:40:38.:40:40.

pilot cull, but will prove once- and-for-all, whether a wider cull

:40:40.:40:41.

and-for-all, whether a wider cull and-for-all, whether a wider cull

:40:41.:40:43.

is required to cure this dreadful is required to cure this dreadful

:40:43.:40:45.

is required to cure this dreadful is required to cure this dreadful

:40:45.:40:45.

disease. He tabled a motion to stop disease. He tabled a motion to stop

:40:45.:40:48.

disease. He tabled a motion to stop the cull in the autumn. People

:40:48.:40:49.

the cull in the autumn. People the cull in the autumn. People

:40:49.:40:50.

the cull in the autumn. People would say this is a serious problem

:40:50.:40:51.

would say this is a serious problem would say this is a serious problem

:40:51.:40:53.

would say this is a serious problem which costs farmers a lot of money,

:40:53.:40:54.

which costs farmers a lot of money, which costs farmers a lot of money,

:40:54.:40:55.

which costs farmers a lot of money, �500 million in the last 10 years,

:40:55.:40:56.

�500 million in the last 10 years, �500 million in the last 10 years,

:40:56.:40:57.

social and the government do social and the government do

:40:57.:41:00.

social and the government do something about it? Yes, but the

:41:00.:41:00.

something about it? Yes, but the something about it? Yes, but the

:41:00.:41:01.

issue is precisely because it's issue is precisely because it's

:41:01.:41:02.

issue is precisely because it's issue is precisely because it's

:41:02.:41:05.

important they have to do the right important they have to do the right

:41:05.:41:07.

important they have to do the right thing. The point is, the majority

:41:07.:41:08.

thing. The point is, the majority thing. The point is, the majority

:41:08.:41:09.

thing. The point is, the majority of people who voted against it, we

:41:09.:41:11.

of people who voted against it, we of people who voted against it, we

:41:11.:41:12.

would like to see an alternative would like to see an alternative

:41:12.:41:14.

would like to see an alternative based on vaccination because we

:41:14.:41:15.

based on vaccination because we based on vaccination because we

:41:15.:41:17.

believe the vast majority of believe the vast majority of

:41:17.:41:18.

scientific evidence demonstrates a scientific evidence demonstrates a

:41:18.:41:19.

scientific evidence demonstrates a cull is not effective. The biggest

:41:19.:41:20.

cull is not effective. The biggest cull is not effective. The biggest

:41:20.:41:23.

cull is not effective. The biggest pilot of that kind of approach, it

:41:23.:41:24.

pilot of that kind of approach, it pilot of that kind of approach, it

:41:24.:41:25.

took 10 years, cost �50 million, took 10 years, cost �50 million,

:41:26.:41:26.

took 10 years, cost �50 million, took 10 years, cost �50 million,

:41:26.:41:28.

and it showed the cull was not an and it showed the cull was not an

:41:28.:41:30.

effective way forward. Because effective way forward. Because

:41:30.:41:31.

effective way forward. Because effective way forward. Because

:41:31.:41:31.

science is not behind this, we want science is not behind this, we want

:41:31.:41:33.

science is not behind this, we want to do something like the initiative

:41:33.:41:36.

to do something like the initiative to do something like the initiative

:41:36.:41:37.

backed by the RSPCA, badger backed by the RSPCA, badger

:41:37.:41:41.

backed by the RSPCA, badger backed by the RSPCA, badger

:41:41.:41:41.

vaccination. It is ready to go. It vaccination. It is ready to go. It

:41:41.:41:43.

vaccination. It is ready to go. It vaccination. It is ready to go. It

:41:43.:41:43.

could be as effective as the cull could be as effective as the cull

:41:43.:41:45.

could be as effective as the cull could be as effective as the cull

:41:45.:41:47.

and cost lower. Why not try this? and cost lower. Why not try this?

:41:47.:41:51.

and cost lower. Why not try this? We would love to do vaccination.

:41:51.:41:52.

We would love to do vaccination. We would love to do vaccination.

:41:52.:41:53.

The European Parliament only this The European Parliament only this

:41:53.:41:55.

The European Parliament only this The European Parliament only this

:41:55.:41:57.

week has said it will be 10 years... week has said it will be 10 years...

:41:57.:41:59.

week has said it will be 10 years... Simon, there's a difference between

:41:59.:42:00.

Simon, there's a difference between Simon, there's a difference between

:42:00.:42:04.

a couple vaccination and Bagehot a couple vaccination and Bagehot

:42:04.:42:05.

vaccination. -- cattle vaccination vaccination. -- cattle vaccination

:42:05.:42:11.

and Badger vaccination. Absolutely. and Badger vaccination. Absolutely.

:42:11.:42:12.

Badger vaccination is perfectly Badger vaccination is perfectly

:42:12.:42:15.

Badger vaccination is perfectly legal to do. More and more

:42:15.:42:16.

legal to do. More and more legal to do. More and more

:42:16.:42:17.

veterinarians are trained to do it. veterinarians are trained to do it.

:42:17.:42:19.

veterinarians are trained to do it. veterinarians are trained to do it.

:42:19.:42:20.

It will be at least as effective as It will be at least as effective as

:42:20.:42:22.

It will be at least as effective as It will be at least as effective as

:42:22.:42:23.

the cull at no greater cost. What the cull at no greater cost. What

:42:23.:42:24.

the cull at no greater cost. What the cull at no greater cost. What

:42:24.:42:25.

we want to see is a combination of we want to see is a combination of

:42:25.:42:27.

these things, better husbandry, these things, better husbandry,

:42:27.:42:30.

better transport, vaccinations. We better transport, vaccinations. We

:42:30.:42:31.

better transport, vaccinations. We agree with that but there is

:42:32.:42:34.

agree with that but there is agree with that but there is

:42:34.:42:35.

evidence across the world. The only evidence across the world. The only

:42:35.:42:36.

evidence across the world. The only evidence across the world. The only

:42:36.:42:36.

places we have been able to bear places we have been able to bear

:42:36.:42:37.

places we have been able to bear places we have been able to bear

:42:37.:42:38.

down on this disease is where there down on this disease is where there

:42:38.:42:40.

down on this disease is where there has been a concentration on animal

:42:40.:42:41.

has been a concentration on animal has been a concentration on animal

:42:41.:42:45.

control. It simply not true. There control. It simply not true. There

:42:45.:42:46.

control. It simply not true. There control. It simply not true. There

:42:46.:42:49.

is a massive cost associated with a is a massive cost associated with a

:42:49.:42:49.

is a massive cost associated with a cull. The badger vaccination would

:42:50.:42:51.

cull. The badger vaccination would cull. The badger vaccination would

:42:51.:42:53.

not cost anything more than the not cost anything more than the

:42:53.:42:54.

not cost anything more than the cull. So much scientific evidence

:42:54.:42:54.

cull. So much scientific evidence cull. So much scientific evidence

:42:54.:42:57.

cull. So much scientific evidence say it's not going to be effective.

:42:57.:42:58.

say it's not going to be effective. say it's not going to be effective.

:42:58.:42:59.

say it's not going to be effective. Sadly, sadly we have run out of

:42:59.:43:01.

Sadly, sadly we have run out of Sadly, sadly we have run out of

:43:01.:43:04.

time. The cull was delayed last time. The cull was delayed last

:43:04.:43:05.

time. The cull was delayed last time. The cull was delayed last

:43:05.:43:05.

year. As you can see, clearly still year. As you can see, clearly still

:43:06.:43:07.

year. As you can see, clearly still year. As you can see, clearly still

:43:07.:43:07.

a lot of debate in here about a lot of debate in here about

:43:07.:43:08.

a lot of debate in here about a lot of debate in here about

:43:08.:43:10.

whether or not we should go ahead with it.

:43:10.:43:12.

with it. with it.

:43:12.:43:13.

with it. Thank you. It is the world's most

:43:13.:43:13.

Thank you. It is the world's most diverse international organisation

:43:13.:43:14.

diverse international organisation diverse international organisation

:43:14.:43:15.

diverse international organisation after the UN with a membership of

:43:15.:43:17.

after the UN with a membership of after the UN with a membership of

:43:17.:43:18.

54 countries. It covers a quarter 54 countries. It covers a quarter

:43:18.:43:18.

54 countries. It covers a quarter of the world's population, from

:43:18.:43:19.

of the world's population, from of the world's population, from

:43:19.:43:20.

India's one billion citizens to India's one billion citizens to

:43:20.:43:24.

India's one billion citizens to India's one billion citizens to

:43:24.:43:28.

tiny Nauru's 14,000. So what is the tiny Nauru's 14,000. So what is the

:43:28.:43:29.

tiny Nauru's 14,000. So what is the Commonwealth? Well, as the first

:43:29.:43:30.

Commonwealth? Well, as the first Secretary General of the

:43:30.:43:31.

Secretary General of the Secretary General of the

:43:31.:43:32.

organisation once said, it is organisation once said, it is

:43:32.:43:33.

organisation once said, it is organisation once said, it is

:43:33.:43:34.

easier to explain what it is not. easier to explain what it is not.

:43:34.:43:35.

easier to explain what it is not. So here a few common misconceptions.

:43:35.:43:36.

So here a few common misconceptions. So here a few common misconceptions.

:43:36.:43:37.

It is not the British Commonwealth. It is not the British Commonwealth.

:43:37.:43:38.

It is not the British Commonwealth. The word British hasn't been used

:43:38.:43:42.

The word British hasn't been used The word British hasn't been used

:43:42.:43:42.

The word British hasn't been used since 1949. It is not just the

:43:43.:43:44.

since 1949. It is not just the since 1949. It is not just the

:43:44.:43:45.

former territories of the British former territories of the British

:43:45.:43:46.

Empire. Former Portuguese territory Empire. Former Portuguese territory

:43:46.:43:47.

Empire. Former Portuguese territory Mozambique joined in 1995 and the

:43:47.:43:48.

Mozambique joined in 1995 and the Mozambique joined in 1995 and the

:43:48.:43:53.

ex-Belgian Colony of Rwanda in 2009. ex-Belgian Colony of Rwanda in 2009.

:43:53.:43:54.

ex-Belgian Colony of Rwanda in 2009. ex-Belgian Colony of Rwanda in 2009.

:43:54.:43:55.

The Queen is the Head of the The Queen is the Head of the

:43:55.:43:56.

The Queen is the Head of the Commonwealth, even though most of

:43:56.:43:58.

Commonwealth, even though most of Commonwealth, even though most of

:43:58.:43:58.

the members are republics. And the members are republics. And

:43:58.:43:59.

the members are republics. And there are five other monarchs in

:43:59.:44:04.

there are five other monarchs in there are five other monarchs in

:44:04.:44:05.

the organisation. But, unlike the the organisation. But, unlike the

:44:05.:44:05.

the organisation. But, unlike the British monarchy, the title is not

:44:06.:44:07.

British monarchy, the title is not British monarchy, the title is not

:44:07.:44:07.

hereidtary, so there is no hereidtary, so there is no

:44:07.:44:08.

hereidtary, so there is no guarantee that the Prince of Wales

:44:08.:44:09.

guarantee that the Prince of Wales guarantee that the Prince of Wales

:44:09.:44:12.

would be the organisation's next would be the organisation's next

:44:12.:44:13.

would be the organisation's next would be the organisation's next

:44:13.:44:13.

head. I'm now joined by Sir Don head. I'm now joined by Sir Don

:44:13.:44:14.

head. I'm now joined by Sir Don McKinnon who, as Secretary General

:44:14.:44:15.

McKinnon who, as Secretary General McKinnon who, as Secretary General

:44:15.:44:16.

from 2000 to 2008, was responsible from 2000 to 2008, was responsible

:44:16.:44:17.

from 2000 to 2008, was responsible for running the organisation. He

:44:17.:44:18.

for running the organisation. He for running the organisation. He

:44:18.:44:19.

for running the organisation. He has just published a book about his

:44:19.:44:24.

has just published a book about his has just published a book about his

:44:24.:44:24.

experiences. I suppose the first experiences. I suppose the first

:44:24.:44:25.

experiences. I suppose the first question is, how would you describe

:44:26.:44:28.

question is, how would you describe question is, how would you describe

:44:28.:44:28.

the Commonwealth? It depends where the Commonwealth? It depends where

:44:28.:44:31.

the Commonwealth? It depends where the Commonwealth? It depends where

:44:31.:44:32.

you are standing. If you are in you are standing. If you are in

:44:32.:44:32.

you are standing. If you are in some well, it's different to

:44:33.:44:34.

some well, it's different to some well, it's different to

:44:35.:44:36.

Trinidad, India is different to Trinidad, India is different to

:44:36.:44:37.

Trinidad, India is different to Zambia. That part of the issue.

:44:37.:44:39.

Zambia. That part of the issue. Everybody sees it differently.

:44:39.:44:40.

Everybody sees it differently. Everybody sees it differently.

:44:40.:44:41.

Everyone sees it through different Everyone sees it through different

:44:42.:44:44.

Everyone sees it through different Everyone sees it through different

:44:44.:44:45.

eyes. How did you see it?A massive eyes. How did you see it?A massive

:44:45.:44:47.

eyes. How did you see it?A massive countries all over the globe which

:44:47.:44:48.

countries all over the globe which countries all over the globe which

:44:48.:44:49.

had difficulties everywhere, when I had difficulties everywhere, when I

:44:49.:44:51.

had difficulties everywhere, when I had difficulties everywhere, when I

:44:51.:44:52.

first took office. But what you do first took office. But what you do

:44:52.:44:54.

first took office. But what you do appreciate in the end is the

:44:54.:44:55.

appreciate in the end is the appreciate in the end is the

:44:55.:44:57.

feeling amongst all those countries, feeling amongst all those countries,

:44:57.:45:07.
:45:07.:45:11.

despite the disparities amongst What is the Commonwealth to do? I

:45:11.:45:14.

What is the Commonwealth to do? I What is the Commonwealth to do? I

:45:14.:45:15.

slip back 40 years to my childhood slip back 40 years to my childhood

:45:15.:45:16.

slip back 40 years to my childhood and the classroom, which is very

:45:16.:45:17.

and the classroom, which is very and the classroom, which is very

:45:17.:45:18.

and the classroom, which is very simplistic. But if I wear head of

:45:18.:45:19.

simplistic. But if I wear head of simplistic. But if I wear head of

:45:19.:45:25.

state for a Commonwealth country, state for a Commonwealth country,

:45:25.:45:25.

state for a Commonwealth country, state for a Commonwealth country,

:45:25.:45:27.

and you turned to a minister and and you turned to a minister and

:45:27.:45:28.

and you turned to a minister and and you turned to a minister and

:45:28.:45:30.

said, what you get from being in the said, what you get from being in the

:45:30.:45:30.

said, what you get from being in the Commonwealth? What would the answer

:45:30.:45:35.

Commonwealth? What would the answer Commonwealth? What would the answer

:45:35.:45:36.

Commonwealth? What would the answer be? That is exactly what they should

:45:36.:45:38.

be? That is exactly what they should be? That is exactly what they should

:45:38.:45:39.

be? That is exactly what they should ask. Are we getting value for money?

:45:39.:45:40.

ask. Are we getting value for money? ask. Are we getting value for money?

:45:40.:45:42.

ask. Are we getting value for money? From a British point of view, which

:45:42.:45:43.

From a British point of view, which From a British point of view, which

:45:43.:45:44.

is different from Zambia or anywhere is different from Zambia or anywhere

:45:44.:45:45.

is different from Zambia or anywhere is different from Zambia or anywhere

:45:45.:45:49.

else, you have 54 friends out there. else, you have 54 friends out there.

:45:49.:45:49.

else, you have 54 friends out there. Anything Britain wants to initiate

:45:49.:45:50.

Anything Britain wants to initiate Anything Britain wants to initiate

:45:50.:45:51.

internationally, they can go to the internationally, they can go to the

:45:51.:45:53.

internationally, they can go to the internationally, they can go to the

:45:53.:45:54.

World Bank, the UN, the IMS and World Bank, the UN, the IMS and

:45:54.:45:56.

World Bank, the UN, the IMS and World Bank, the UN, the IMS and

:45:56.:45:57.

say, I've got 54 votes behind me for say, I've got 54 votes behind me for

:45:57.:45:57.

say, I've got 54 votes behind me for this procedure. Now, let's move it

:45:57.:46:00.

this procedure. Now, let's move it this procedure. Now, let's move it

:46:00.:46:03.

on. You don't have that anywhere on. You don't have that anywhere

:46:04.:46:04.

on. You don't have that anywhere on. You don't have that anywhere

:46:04.:46:07.

else. So it does have clout, then? else. So it does have clout, then?

:46:08.:46:10.

else. So it does have clout, then? else. So it does have clout, then?

:46:10.:46:10.

else. So it does have clout, then? It is how it is used. I mean, for

:46:10.:46:13.

It is how it is used. I mean, for It is how it is used. I mean, for

:46:13.:46:14.

the bigger countries, Australia and the bigger countries, Australia and

:46:14.:46:15.

the bigger countries, Australia and India, they can use the membership

:46:15.:46:18.

India, they can use the membership to enhance their relationships

:46:18.:46:19.

to enhance their relationships to enhance their relationships

:46:19.:46:20.

to enhance their relationships because they can say, look, I've got

:46:20.:46:22.

because they can say, look, I've got because they can say, look, I've got

:46:22.:46:23.

Africa, Asia, the Caribbean, the Africa, Asia, the Caribbean, the

:46:23.:46:26.

Africa, Asia, the Caribbean, the Pacific supporting me. It depends

:46:26.:46:28.

Pacific supporting me. It depends Pacific supporting me. It depends

:46:28.:46:29.

very much on the issues. Trade very much on the issues. Trade

:46:29.:46:30.

very much on the issues. Trade related issues are very difficult

:46:30.:46:31.

related issues are very difficult related issues are very difficult

:46:31.:46:32.

related issues are very difficult and complex because we are all at

:46:32.:46:34.

and complex because we are all at and complex because we are all at

:46:34.:46:35.

different stages of the relevant. different stages of the relevant.

:46:35.:46:36.

different stages of the relevant. Everyone wants free trade going in

:46:36.:46:37.

Everyone wants free trade going in Everyone wants free trade going in

:46:37.:46:37.

Everyone wants free trade going in and not so much coming back in

:46:37.:46:42.

and not so much coming back in and not so much coming back in

:46:42.:46:45.

again. Did the common market kill again. Did the common market kill

:46:45.:46:47.

again. Did the common market kill the Commonwealth? No. It is a

:46:47.:46:48.

the Commonwealth? No. It is a the Commonwealth? No. It is a

:46:48.:46:51.

the Commonwealth? No. It is a question of how you use it. You are

:46:51.:46:52.

question of how you use it. You are question of how you use it. You are

:46:52.:46:53.

question of how you use it. You are part of the European Union and us

:46:53.:46:55.

part of the European Union and us part of the European Union and us

:46:55.:46:58.

taxpayers you put �350 million into taxpayers you put �350 million into

:46:58.:46:59.

taxpayers you put �350 million into taxpayers you put �350 million into

:47:00.:47:01.

the EU and just �1 Commonwealth. I the EU and just �1 Commonwealth. I

:47:01.:47:02.

the EU and just �1 Commonwealth. I the EU and just �1 Commonwealth. I

:47:02.:47:03.

think that �1 is a pretty good think that �1 is a pretty good

:47:03.:47:03.

think that �1 is a pretty good investment. I think Britain has

:47:03.:47:06.

investment. I think Britain has investment. I think Britain has

:47:06.:47:06.

investment. I think Britain has always used it rest. On the other

:47:06.:47:07.

always used it rest. On the other always used it rest. On the other

:47:07.:47:08.

hand, I don't think many hand, I don't think many

:47:08.:47:12.

Commonwealth countries really used Commonwealth countries really used

:47:12.:47:13.

Commonwealth countries really used it. Smaller countries are the ones

:47:13.:47:14.

it. Smaller countries are the ones it. Smaller countries are the ones

:47:14.:47:17.

it. Smaller countries are the ones it. Smaller countries are the ones

:47:17.:47:18.

who tend to use it the best. And do who tend to use it the best. And do

:47:18.:47:19.

who tend to use it the best. And do who tend to use it the best. And do

:47:19.:47:19.

they benefit from it? If you are they benefit from it? If you are

:47:20.:47:20.

they benefit from it? If you are going to point successes, what would

:47:20.:47:25.

going to point successes, what would going to point successes, what would

:47:25.:47:27.

spring to mind? Well, in the spring to mind? Well, in the

:47:27.:47:27.

spring to mind? Well, in the Caribbean, you have 12 small

:47:27.:47:28.

Caribbean, you have 12 small Caribbean, you have 12 small

:47:28.:47:30.

countries. Nobody really listens to countries. Nobody really listens to

:47:30.:47:33.

countries. Nobody really listens to countries. Nobody really listens to

:47:33.:47:34.

them. If the president of the United them. If the president of the United

:47:34.:47:36.

them. If the president of the United States talks about the Americas, he

:47:36.:47:37.

States talks about the Americas, he States talks about the Americas, he

:47:37.:47:38.

means North America and South means North America and South

:47:38.:47:39.

means North America and South America, and doesn't really think

:47:39.:47:40.

America, and doesn't really think America, and doesn't really think

:47:40.:47:42.

about those 12 countries. If they about those 12 countries. If they

:47:42.:47:43.

about those 12 countries. If they about those 12 countries. If they

:47:43.:47:43.

come together, I have got a voice come together, I have got a voice

:47:44.:47:44.

come together, I have got a voice come together, I have got a voice

:47:44.:47:47.

and then they bring it to the and then they bring it to the

:47:47.:47:48.

and then they bring it to the Commonwealth. Can you think of

:47:48.:47:49.

Commonwealth. Can you think of Commonwealth. Can you think of

:47:49.:47:50.

something in your time that would something in your time that would

:47:50.:47:51.

something in your time that would something in your time that would

:47:51.:47:53.

have said, we did this in the have said, we did this in the

:47:53.:47:54.

have said, we did this in the Commonwealth? Well, I think one

:47:54.:47:56.

Commonwealth? Well, I think one Commonwealth? Well, I think one

:47:56.:47:57.

Commonwealth? Well, I think one thing that they did initiate was the

:47:57.:47:58.

thing that they did initiate was the thing that they did initiate was the

:47:58.:48:03.

massive write-off of debt. That massive write-off of debt. That

:48:03.:48:04.

massive write-off of debt. That began in the Commonwealth and Gordon

:48:04.:48:06.

began in the Commonwealth and Gordon began in the Commonwealth and Gordon

:48:06.:48:07.

Brown, as the Chancellor, went with Brown, as the Chancellor, went with

:48:07.:48:08.

Brown, as the Chancellor, went with Brown, as the Chancellor, went with

:48:08.:48:09.

his 53 votes to the World Bank his 53 votes to the World Bank

:48:09.:48:10.

his 53 votes to the World Bank meetings and it took about five

:48:10.:48:12.

meetings and it took about five meetings and it took about five

:48:12.:48:12.

meetings and it took about five years. But that was the beginning of

:48:12.:48:13.

years. But that was the beginning of years. But that was the beginning of

:48:13.:48:15.

the initiative that went all the the initiative that went all the

:48:16.:48:16.

the initiative that went all the way. Which leaders have you enjoyed

:48:16.:48:20.

way. Which leaders have you enjoyed way. Which leaders have you enjoyed

:48:20.:48:20.

way. Which leaders have you enjoyed working with the most? Or who are

:48:20.:48:23.

working with the most? Or who are working with the most? Or who are

:48:23.:48:24.

the worst? I've had some very the worst? I've had some very

:48:24.:48:26.

the worst? I've had some very difficult ones! But they are all

:48:26.:48:29.

difficult ones! But they are all challenging and interesting people!

:48:29.:48:30.

challenging and interesting people! challenging and interesting people!

:48:30.:48:31.

challenging and interesting people! I suppose you have to be diplomatic

:48:31.:48:32.

I suppose you have to be diplomatic I suppose you have to be diplomatic

:48:32.:48:35.

I suppose you have to be diplomatic in that role, don't you? Their risen

:48:35.:48:36.

in that role, don't you? Their risen in that role, don't you? Their risen

:48:36.:48:36.

from political leader that doesn't from political leader that doesn't

:48:36.:48:39.

from political leader that doesn't have a complex personality. They may

:48:39.:48:40.

have a complex personality. They may have a complex personality. They may

:48:40.:48:40.

have a complex personality. They may look as though they are very black

:48:40.:48:44.

look as though they are very black look as though they are very black

:48:44.:48:44.

and white. -- there isn't one and white. -- there isn't one

:48:45.:48:45.

and white. -- there isn't one political leader. They are all very

:48:45.:48:50.

political leader. They are all very political leader. They are all very

:48:50.:48:50.

complex people. Were people like complex people. Were people like

:48:51.:48:51.

complex people. Were people like Robert Mugabe vilified in the

:48:51.:48:55.

Robert Mugabe vilified in the Robert Mugabe vilified in the

:48:55.:48:56.

Commonwealth? Welcomer he was, but Commonwealth? Welcomer he was, but

:48:56.:48:58.

Commonwealth? Welcomer he was, but Commonwealth? Welcomer he was, but

:48:58.:48:59.

not always in Africa. He was still a not always in Africa. He was still a

:48:59.:49:02.

not always in Africa. He was still a not always in Africa. He was still a

:49:02.:49:03.

hero. -- well, he was. This is hero. -- well, he was. This is

:49:03.:49:06.

hero. -- well, he was. This is because he still had that frontline

:49:06.:49:08.

because he still had that frontline because he still had that frontline

:49:08.:49:08.

state credential of what he state credential of what he

:49:08.:49:09.

state credential of what he state credential of what he

:49:09.:49:13.

delivered. And he did a lot for that delivered. And he did a lot for that

:49:13.:49:14.

delivered. And he did a lot for that country. But did the condemnation of

:49:14.:49:15.

country. But did the condemnation of country. But did the condemnation of

:49:15.:49:16.

country. But did the condemnation of the rest of the Commonwealth on his

:49:16.:49:16.

the rest of the Commonwealth on his the rest of the Commonwealth on his

:49:16.:49:25.

deeds have any effect on him deeds have any effect on him

:49:25.:49:27.

deeds have any effect on him personally? He was very angry. He

:49:27.:49:30.

personally? He was very angry. He personally? He was very angry. He

:49:30.:49:31.

tackled his fellow African leaders tackled his fellow African leaders

:49:31.:49:33.

tackled his fellow African leaders tackled his fellow African leaders

:49:33.:49:33.

and said, don't even think of having and said, don't even think of having

:49:34.:49:34.

and said, don't even think of having a conference without me, don't think

:49:34.:49:35.

a conference without me, don't think a conference without me, don't think

:49:35.:49:38.

a conference without me, don't think of castigating me in public. And the

:49:38.:49:39.

of castigating me in public. And the of castigating me in public. And the

:49:39.:49:40.

President of Nigeria worked very, President of Nigeria worked very,

:49:40.:49:42.

President of Nigeria worked very, very hard to turn Robert Mugabe

:49:42.:49:44.

very hard to turn Robert Mugabe very hard to turn Robert Mugabe

:49:44.:49:44.

very hard to turn Robert Mugabe round but in the end Robert Mugabe

:49:44.:49:45.

round but in the end Robert Mugabe round but in the end Robert Mugabe

:49:45.:49:50.

wasn't going to play ball. What wasn't going to play ball. What

:49:50.:49:55.

wasn't going to play ball. What about the Queen? Wonderful. You have

:49:55.:49:56.

about the Queen? Wonderful. You have about the Queen? Wonderful. You have

:49:56.:49:58.

about the Queen? Wonderful. You have to be so impressed with that lady.

:49:58.:49:59.

to be so impressed with that lady. to be so impressed with that lady.

:49:59.:50:00.

to be so impressed with that lady. And so many sitting beside her over

:50:00.:50:01.

And so many sitting beside her over And so many sitting beside her over

:50:01.:50:02.

the years, and what a marvellous the years, and what a marvellous

:50:02.:50:03.

the years, and what a marvellous the years, and what a marvellous

:50:03.:50:04.

diary she could have kept if she diary she could have kept if she

:50:04.:50:05.

diary she could have kept if she diary she could have kept if she

:50:05.:50:07.

ever did on how she felt about all ever did on how she felt about all

:50:07.:50:08.

ever did on how she felt about all these people! She's very easy to

:50:08.:50:11.

these people! She's very easy to these people! She's very easy to

:50:11.:50:12.

talk to about Commonwealth issues talk to about Commonwealth issues

:50:12.:50:13.

talk to about Commonwealth issues talk to about Commonwealth issues

:50:13.:50:14.

and I enjoyed every minute I had. and I enjoyed every minute I had.

:50:14.:50:17.

and I enjoyed every minute I had. and I enjoyed every minute I had.

:50:17.:50:17.

How did she manage dinner or how did How did she manage dinner or how did

:50:17.:50:18.

How did she manage dinner or how did How did she manage dinner or how did

:50:18.:50:22.

you manage dinner sitting next to a you manage dinner sitting next to a

:50:22.:50:23.

you manage dinner sitting next to a despot? Would she make small talk

:50:23.:50:27.

despot? Would she make small talk despot? Would she make small talk

:50:27.:50:28.

despot? Would she make small talk with them? Well, she had to. And she

:50:28.:50:29.

with them? Well, she had to. And she with them? Well, she had to. And she

:50:29.:50:30.

did it successfully. She might have did it successfully. She might have

:50:30.:50:32.

did it successfully. She might have did it successfully. She might have

:50:32.:50:33.

gritted her teeth! And it was the gritted her teeth! And it was the

:50:33.:50:33.

gritted her teeth! And it was the Foreign Office saying, we want you

:50:33.:50:35.

Foreign Office saying, we want you Foreign Office saying, we want you

:50:35.:50:36.

Foreign Office saying, we want you Foreign Office saying, we want you

:50:36.:50:37.

to have him as a state guest of our to have him as a state guest of our

:50:37.:50:38.

to have him as a state guest of our country and therefore he will be

:50:38.:50:39.

country and therefore he will be country and therefore he will be

:50:39.:50:39.

country and therefore he will be sitting next to you at dinner at

:50:39.:50:40.

sitting next to you at dinner at sitting next to you at dinner at

:50:40.:50:44.

sitting next to you at dinner at some time. And she had to say, OK.

:50:44.:50:45.

some time. And she had to say, OK. some time. And she had to say, OK.

:50:45.:50:48.

Did she tell you anything personal Did she tell you anything personal

:50:48.:50:49.

Did she tell you anything personal about leaders? We had lots of

:50:50.:50:50.

about leaders? We had lots of about leaders? We had lots of

:50:50.:50:53.

wonderful conversations! So she did? wonderful conversations! So she did?

:50:53.:50:53.

wonderful conversations! So she did? We had lots of wonderful

:50:53.:50:56.

We had lots of wonderful We had lots of wonderful

:50:56.:50:58.

conversations! And what about Prince conversations! And what about Prince

:50:58.:50:59.

conversations! And what about Prince Charles? It is not a natural

:50:59.:51:04.

Charles? It is not a natural Charles? It is not a natural

:51:04.:51:05.

succession. He just finished a tour succession. He just finished a tour

:51:05.:51:09.

succession. He just finished a tour succession. He just finished a tour

:51:09.:51:09.

of Australia and New Zealand. In our of Australia and New Zealand. In our

:51:09.:51:10.

of Australia and New Zealand. In our of Australia and New Zealand. In our

:51:11.:51:15.

part of the world, I'm in New part of the world, I'm in New

:51:15.:51:17.

Zealand, and the Republican Zealand, and the Republican

:51:17.:51:18.

-monarchy pendulum swings backwards -monarchy pendulum swings backwards

:51:18.:51:19.

-monarchy pendulum swings backwards -monarchy pendulum swings backwards

:51:19.:51:19.

and forwards and I think they caused and forwards and I think they caused

:51:19.:51:20.

and forwards and I think they caused it to swing back towards the

:51:20.:51:24.

it to swing back towards the it to swing back towards the

:51:24.:51:27.

monarchy with that visit. And your monarchy with that visit. And your

:51:27.:51:30.

monarchy with that visit. And your monarchy with that visit. And your

:51:30.:51:35.

book? In The Ring - The Commonwealth book? In The Ring - The Commonwealth

:51:35.:51:36.

book? In The Ring - The Commonwealth book? In The Ring - The Commonwealth

:51:36.:51:37.

Memoir. Now Time To Find Out The Memoir. Now Time To Find Out The

:51:37.:51:38.

Memoir. Now Time To Find Out The Memoir. Now Time To Find Out The

:51:38.:51:38.

Answer To Our Quiz. Which Flag Is Answer To Our Quiz. Which Flag Is

:51:38.:51:44.

Answer To Our Quiz. Which Flag Is Answer To Our Quiz. Which Flag Is

:51:44.:51:45.

The Odd One Out? The First Was The Odd One Out? The First Was

:51:45.:51:45.

The Odd One Out? The First Was Mozambique, Then Algeria With The

:51:45.:51:49.

Mozambique, Then Algeria With The Mozambique, Then Algeria With The

:51:49.:51:50.

Red Crescent And Star. Then The Red Crescent And Star. Then The

:51:50.:51:51.

Red Crescent And Star. Then The Rather Psychedelic Flag Of The

:51:51.:51:52.

Rather Psychedelic Flag Of The Rather Psychedelic Flag Of The

:51:52.:51:54.

Seychelles And Then The Pacific Seychelles And Then The Pacific

:51:54.:51:55.

Seychelles And Then The Pacific Island Of Tuvalu, Featuring The

:51:55.:51:58.

Island Of Tuvalu, Featuring The Island Of Tuvalu, Featuring The

:51:58.:52:05.

Union Flag. What is the correct Union Flag. What is the correct

:52:05.:52:07.

Union Flag. What is the correct Union Flag. What is the correct

:52:07.:52:08.

answer? We might even give you a answer? We might even give you a

:52:08.:52:08.

answer? We might even give you a daily politics mug forgetting it

:52:08.:52:13.

daily politics mug forgetting it daily politics mug forgetting it

:52:13.:52:15.

daily politics mug forgetting it right. -- for getting it right. Sit

:52:15.:52:16.

right. -- for getting it right. Sit right. -- for getting it right. Sit

:52:16.:52:20.

comfortably and look at this. comfortably and look at this.

:52:20.:52:23.

comfortably and look at this. It has been the most exciting,

:52:23.:52:24.

It has been the most exciting, unpredictable election in a

:52:24.:52:25.

unpredictable election in a generation. Welcome to election

:52:25.:52:29.

generation. Welcome to election night on the BBC.

:52:29.:52:30.

night on the BBC. night on the BBC.

:52:30.:52:30.

night on the BBC. Here is how we voted last time

:52:31.:52:31.

Here is how we voted last time Here is how we voted last time

:52:31.:52:32.

Here is how we voted last time round. What colour will we paint the

:52:32.:52:35.

round. What colour will we paint the round. What colour will we paint the

:52:35.:52:36.

country this time? Politicians on country this time? Politicians on

:52:36.:52:37.

country this time? Politicians on all sides are expecting a result

:52:37.:52:40.

all sides are expecting a result all sides are expecting a result

:52:41.:52:41.

that makes history. Fascinating to that makes history. Fascinating to

:52:41.:52:42.

that makes history. Fascinating to see these results coming in... We

:52:42.:52:43.

see these results coming in... We see these results coming in... We

:52:43.:52:49.

see these results coming in... We are almost on the cusp of a name.

:52:50.:52:51.

are almost on the cusp of a name. are almost on the cusp of a name.

:52:51.:52:52.

are almost on the cusp of a name. This is the key number to remember.

:52:52.:52:53.

This is the key number to remember. This is the key number to remember.

:52:53.:52:58.

Paving stones flying into Downing Paving stones flying into Downing

:52:58.:52:59.

Paving stones flying into Downing Street. The Conservatives are the

:52:59.:53:00.

Street. The Conservatives are the Street. The Conservatives are the

:53:00.:53:03.

largest party and are tonight largest party and are tonight

:53:03.:53:04.

largest party and are tonight seeking power... The first hung

:53:04.:53:06.

seeking power... The first hung seeking power... The first hung

:53:07.:53:07.

parliament in decades! They are parliament in decades! They are

:53:07.:53:08.

parliament in decades! They are desperately trying to thrash out a

:53:08.:53:09.

desperately trying to thrash out a desperately trying to thrash out a

:53:09.:53:13.

desperately trying to thrash out a deal on a shared government. We are

:53:13.:53:14.

deal on a shared government. We are deal on a shared government. We are

:53:14.:53:14.

deal on a shared government. We are steps closer to a new government for

:53:14.:53:21.

Don't worry! Your clock hasn't Don't worry! Your clock hasn't

:53:21.:53:22.

Don't worry! Your clock hasn't Don't worry! Your clock hasn't

:53:22.:53:24.

broken. It is not 2am and we are not broken. It is not 2am and we are not

:53:24.:53:26.

broken. It is not 2am and we are not broken. It is not 2am and we are not

:53:26.:53:27.

about to hear the result of a about to hear the result of a

:53:27.:53:27.

about to hear the result of a certain by-election that we can't

:53:27.:53:28.

certain by-election that we can't certain by-election that we can't

:53:28.:53:30.

mention! Voting is still going on. mention! Voting is still going on.

:53:30.:53:31.

mention! Voting is still going on. mention! Voting is still going on.

:53:31.:53:33.

That was a clip from the new satire That was a clip from the new satire

:53:33.:53:33.

That was a clip from the new satire currently on a Pleasance Theatre in

:53:33.:53:35.

currently on a Pleasance Theatre in currently on a Pleasance Theatre in

:53:36.:53:36.

currently on a Pleasance Theatre in London. We are joined by Sir Francis

:53:36.:53:39.

London. We are joined by Sir Francis Whitford, special adviser, perhaps

:53:39.:53:41.

Whitford, special adviser, perhaps Whitford, special adviser, perhaps

:53:41.:53:42.

better known as comedian Phill better known as comedian Phill

:53:42.:53:43.

better known as comedian Phill Jupitus. Do you think a coalition

:53:43.:53:45.

Jupitus. Do you think a coalition Jupitus. Do you think a coalition

:53:45.:53:45.

government gives you rich pickings government gives you rich pickings

:53:46.:53:46.

government gives you rich pickings for satire? Richer than single party

:53:46.:53:51.

for satire? Richer than single party for satire? Richer than single party

:53:51.:53:52.

for satire? Richer than single party once? I think it has. That is what

:53:52.:53:54.

once? I think it has. That is what once? I think it has. That is what

:53:54.:53:55.

once? I think it has. That is what we are looking at - this very, very

:53:55.:53:57.

we are looking at - this very, very we are looking at - this very, very

:53:57.:53:59.

uneasy alliance that has developed. uneasy alliance that has developed.

:53:59.:54:00.

uneasy alliance that has developed. uneasy alliance that has developed.

:54:00.:54:01.

We have watched the drama played out We have watched the drama played out

:54:01.:54:02.

We have watched the drama played out in newspapers, on television and on

:54:02.:54:02.

in newspapers, on television and on in newspapers, on television and on

:54:02.:54:03.

in newspapers, on television and on the wireless for the last couple of

:54:03.:54:07.

the wireless for the last couple of the wireless for the last couple of

:54:08.:54:08.

the wireless for the last couple of years, and now what the guys who

:54:08.:54:10.

years, and now what the guys who years, and now what the guys who

:54:10.:54:11.

years, and now what the guys who have written a play have done is,

:54:11.:54:12.

have written a play have done is, have written a play have done is,

:54:12.:54:13.

have written a play have done is, right, let's look at a possible way

:54:13.:54:15.

right, let's look at a possible way right, let's look at a possible way

:54:15.:54:15.

right, let's look at a possible way it could fall apart. So it is like

:54:16.:54:18.

it could fall apart. So it is like it could fall apart. So it is like

:54:18.:54:19.

it could fall apart. So it is like wargames in the coalition. And it is

:54:19.:54:22.

wargames in the coalition. And it is wargames in the coalition. And it is

:54:22.:54:23.

wargames in the coalition. And it is wargames in the coalition. And it is

:54:23.:54:27.

good fun? Well, yes, I get to play a good fun? Well, yes, I get to play a

:54:28.:54:29.

good fun? Well, yes, I get to play a good fun? Well, yes, I get to play a

:54:29.:54:30.

Tory! I have loosely based it on... Tory! I have loosely based it on...

:54:30.:54:31.

Tory! I have loosely based it on... Tory! I have loosely based it on...

:54:31.:54:31.

Tory! I have loosely based it on... Well, my dad is in a Rotary club and

:54:31.:54:32.

Well, my dad is in a Rotary club and Well, my dad is in a Rotary club and

:54:32.:54:33.

Well, my dad is in a Rotary club and Well, my dad is in a Rotary club and

:54:33.:54:34.

I went to dinner once and I have a I went to dinner once and I have a

:54:34.:54:37.

I went to dinner once and I have a I went to dinner once and I have a

:54:37.:54:37.

memory of that! It is that and also memory of that! It is that and also

:54:37.:54:42.

memory of that! It is that and also memory of that! It is that and also

:54:42.:54:44.

I went to boarding school , so I I went to boarding school , so I

:54:44.:54:45.

I went to boarding school , so I I went to boarding school , so I

:54:45.:54:45.

remember a fewer of the Masters. I remember a fewer of the Masters. I

:54:45.:54:46.

remember a fewer of the Masters. I remember a fewer of the Masters. I

:54:46.:54:48.

went to Westminster once and I was went to Westminster once and I was

:54:48.:54:48.

went to Westminster once and I was went to Westminster once and I was

:54:48.:54:49.

hanging out with the Labour guys and hanging out with the Labour guys and

:54:49.:54:50.

hanging out with the Labour guys and hanging out with the Labour guys and

:54:50.:54:51.

it was all a bit called Troy and" it was all a bit called Troy and"

:54:51.:54:56.

it was all a bit called Troy and" it was all a bit called Troy and"

:54:56.:54:57.

it was all a bit called Troy and" how are you, lad? " . So is it, Dior

:54:57.:55:02.

how are you, lad? " . So is it, Dior how are you, lad? " . So is it, Dior

:55:02.:55:12.
:55:12.:55:16.

how are you, lad? " . So is it, Dior satire? -- so is it, D or satire?

:55:16.:55:18.

satire? -- so is it, D or satire? satire? -- so is it, D or satire?

:55:18.:55:21.

satire? -- so is it, D or satire? Well, my mother was there, which was

:55:21.:55:22.

Well, my mother was there, which was Well, my mother was there, which was

:55:22.:55:23.

Well, my mother was there, which was Well, my mother was there, which was

:55:23.:55:24.

fun. It is easy to do that but if fun. It is easy to do that but if

:55:24.:55:25.

fun. It is easy to do that but if fun. It is easy to do that but if

:55:25.:55:28.

Ewing gate with the process as it is Ewing gate with the process as it is

:55:28.:55:29.

Ewing gate with the process as it is going along, you can do yourself

:55:29.:55:30.

going along, you can do yourself going along, you can do yourself

:55:30.:55:30.

going along, you can do yourself more favours if you can kind of look

:55:30.:55:31.

more favours if you can kind of look more favours if you can kind of look

:55:31.:55:33.

more favours if you can kind of look at what is going on around you. And

:55:33.:55:34.

at what is going on around you. And at what is going on around you. And

:55:34.:55:35.

at what is going on around you. And the play has made me kind of more

:55:35.:55:36.

the play has made me kind of more the play has made me kind of more

:55:36.:55:38.

the play has made me kind of more aware of what is happening. It is

:55:38.:55:39.

aware of what is happening. It is aware of what is happening. It is

:55:39.:55:40.

aware of what is happening. It is very easy to go, turn it off, turn

:55:40.:55:41.

very easy to go, turn it off, turn very easy to go, turn it off, turn

:55:41.:55:45.

very easy to go, turn it off, turn it off, as many do. Are all the

:55:45.:55:51.

it off, as many do. Are all the it off, as many do. Are all the

:55:51.:55:51.

characters fictional? Yes, but there characters fictional? Yes, but there

:55:51.:55:52.

are touchstones within the are touchstones within the

:55:52.:55:53.

are touchstones within the production and you will recognise

:55:53.:55:57.

production and you will recognise production and you will recognise

:55:57.:55:59.

certain people. And do you alter certain people. And do you alter

:55:59.:56:04.

certain people. And do you alter production at all to match reality?

:56:04.:56:05.

production at all to match reality? production at all to match reality?

:56:05.:56:07.

production at all to match reality? Well, we can't. We did in Edinburgh

:56:07.:56:08.

Well, we can't. We did in Edinburgh Well, we can't. We did in Edinburgh

:56:08.:56:09.

Well, we can't. We did in Edinburgh has the coalition was having a bumpy

:56:09.:56:12.

has the coalition was having a bumpy has the coalition was having a bumpy

:56:12.:56:13.

time, Iraqi time, and we thought, time, Iraqi time, and we thought,

:56:13.:56:15.

time, Iraqi time, and we thought, please don't fall apart. We would

:56:15.:56:16.

please don't fall apart. We would please don't fall apart. We would

:56:16.:56:17.

please don't fall apart. We would have had to write a musical version!

:56:17.:56:24.

have had to write a musical version! have had to write a musical version!

:56:24.:56:24.

have had to write a musical version! -- a rocky time. Are any of the

:56:24.:56:29.

-- a rocky time. Are any of the -- a rocky time. Are any of the

:56:29.:56:30.

politicians funny? John we -- John politicians funny? John we -- John

:56:30.:56:34.

politicians funny? John we -- John politicians funny? John we -- John

:56:34.:56:35.

Reid was rather funny. But they will Reid was rather funny. But they will

:56:35.:56:38.

Reid was rather funny. But they will tell you something different. They

:56:38.:56:39.

tell you something different. They tell you something different. They

:56:39.:56:41.

tell you something different. They will say one thing in interviews and

:56:41.:56:41.

will say one thing in interviews and will say one thing in interviews and

:56:42.:56:42.

will say one thing in interviews and then later, they will say, you are

:56:42.:56:45.

then later, they will say, you are then later, they will say, you are

:56:45.:56:48.

then later, they will say, you are right, we should do the other thing.

:56:48.:56:49.

right, we should do the other thing. right, we should do the other thing.

:56:49.:56:55.

Who is the funniest politician? Who is the funniest politician?

:56:55.:56:55.

Who is the funniest politician? Who is the funniest politician?

:56:55.:56:56.

People will hate me saying this but People will hate me saying this but

:56:56.:56:57.

People will hate me saying this but People will hate me saying this but

:56:57.:57:03.

Tony Blair was pretty funny. He was Tony Blair was pretty funny. He was

:57:03.:57:04.

Tony Blair was pretty funny. He was pretty witty. Yes, funny how, as

:57:04.:57:07.

pretty witty. Yes, funny how, as pretty witty. Yes, funny how, as

:57:07.:57:10.

they said! Mo Mowlam was hilarious. they said! Mo Mowlam was hilarious.

:57:10.:57:11.

they said! Mo Mowlam was hilarious. they said! Mo Mowlam was hilarious.

:57:11.:57:13.

When she was on her way out, she When she was on her way out, she

:57:13.:57:16.

When she was on her way out, she When she was on her way out, she

:57:16.:57:17.

went, where's the toilet? To one of went, where's the toilet? To one of

:57:17.:57:20.

went, where's the toilet? To one of the people at the Palladium. And

:57:20.:57:21.

the people at the Palladium. And the people at the Palladium. And

:57:21.:57:22.

the people at the Palladium. And they pointed her the way but she

:57:22.:57:23.

they pointed her the way but she they pointed her the way but she

:57:23.:57:27.

they pointed her the way but she said, no, the one the Queen uses!

:57:27.:57:28.

said, no, the one the Queen uses! said, no, the one the Queen uses!

:57:28.:57:29.

said, no, the one the Queen uses! you think they need to loosen up or

:57:29.:57:32.

you think they need to loosen up or you think they need to loosen up or

:57:32.:57:33.

would they lose credibility? They would they lose credibility? They

:57:33.:57:36.

would they lose credibility? They would they lose credibility? They

:57:36.:57:36.

are all being petrified -- they are are all being petrified -- they are

:57:36.:57:40.

are all being petrified -- they are all petrified of being found out.

:57:40.:57:40.

all petrified of being found out. all petrified of being found out.

:57:40.:57:44.

all petrified of being found out. Would you ever be on question Time?

:57:44.:57:45.

Would you ever be on question Time? Would you ever be on question Time?

:57:45.:57:46.

No. I don't think comedians belong No. I don't think comedians belong

:57:46.:57:50.

No. I don't think comedians belong No. I don't think comedians belong

:57:50.:57:53.

on that forum. It is not supposed to on that forum. It is not supposed to

:57:53.:57:54.

on that forum. It is not supposed to on that forum. It is not supposed to

:57:54.:57:57.

be... I'm sick and tired of, you be... I'm sick and tired of, you

:57:57.:57:57.

be... I'm sick and tired of, you know, here am the programme-mack,

:57:57.:58:01.

know, here am the programme-mack, know, here am the programme-mack,

:58:01.:58:01.

which might seem contradictory, but which might seem contradictory, but

:58:01.:58:08.

which might seem contradictory, but which might seem contradictory, but

:58:08.:58:09.

I am plugging my play! You should I am plugging my play! You should

:58:09.:58:09.

I am plugging my play! You should see these senior Cabinet ministers

:58:09.:58:10.

see these senior Cabinet ministers see these senior Cabinet ministers

:58:10.:58:11.

see these senior Cabinet ministers on the phone to head office. They've

:58:11.:58:14.

on the phone to head office. They've on the phone to head office. They've

:58:14.:58:15.

on the phone to head office. They've got an adviser with them and then

:58:15.:58:16.

got an adviser with them and then got an adviser with them and then

:58:16.:58:16.

got an adviser with them and then they say, no adviser, put it this

:58:16.:58:24.

they say, no adviser, put it this they say, no adviser, put it this

:58:24.:58:26.

they say, no adviser, put it this way. But what about George. He is

:58:26.:58:27.

way. But what about George. He is way. But what about George. He is

:58:27.:58:31.

way. But what about George. He is funny and a good politician. I laugh

:58:31.:58:35.

funny and a good politician. I laugh funny and a good politician. I laugh

:58:35.:58:36.

funny and a good politician. I laugh a lot at Boris! I said his jokes,

:58:36.:58:37.

a lot at Boris! I said his jokes, a lot at Boris! I said his jokes,

:58:37.:58:40.

a lot at Boris! I said his jokes, not he is a joke! Thank you for

:58:40.:58:42.

not he is a joke! Thank you for not he is a joke! Thank you for

:58:42.:58:43.

coming on. Thank you, Richard, for coming on. Thank you, Richard, for

:58:43.:58:45.

coming on. Thank you, Richard, for coming on. Thank you, Richard, for

:58:45.:58:46.

being our guest of the day. Andrew being our guest of the day. Andrew

:58:46.:58:49.

being our guest of the day. Andrew is back tonight with an extended

:58:49.:58:50.

is back tonight with an extended is back tonight with an extended

:58:50.:58:53.

programme in honour of the Eastleigh programme in honour of the Eastleigh

:58:53.:58:55.

by-election. Apparently John by-election. Apparently John

:58:56.:58:57.

Prescott is nominated Best Prescott is nominated Best

:58:57.:58:58.

Prescott is nominated Best Supporting Actress! Wonder who the

:58:58.:58:59.

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