Conference Special Daily Politics


Conference Special

Andrew Neil with the latest political stories, including live coverage of shadow chancellor Ed Balls' speech to the Labour party conference.


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Transcript


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Afternoon folks, welcome to the Daily Politics. The weather in

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Brighton's rather unremarkable, unlike the Labour conference, which

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is turning into rather a stormy affair. Mainly because of a former

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spin doctor and a certain book he'd like to sell. But fear not my policy

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wonks, there is substance to the event too. In fact it's been hard to

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keep Mr Miliband quiet. He's been keen to take centre stage - or at

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least centre table - to announce he'd reverse the so-called bedroom

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tax, he's been offering child care sweeteners and a brand new

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apprenticeship scheme. Today the Shadow Chancellor Ed Balls will be

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taking the limelight, fleshing out the party's economic policy. Let's

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hope his strategy for the country is better than his footballing skills.

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Should it be move over Balls, come back Darling? Adam's been putting

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the "who should be Shadow Chancellor conundrum" to the mood box test. Who

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would you rather hang out with? Ed conundrum" to the mood box test. Who

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Balls. He is just so hunky! And we'll have you spinning in your

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armchairs till you're dizzy with not one but two former spin doctors on

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the programme. Messrs Campbell and Wheelan. It could get ugly!

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All that in the next 90 minutes, and with us for the whole programme

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today we've got two top economists - the financial analyst, Louise Cooper

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and Ann Pettifor who was one of the few economists to forsee the

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economic crisis. She's in her prime. Welcome to you both. So it's

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Labour's annual big bash, time for the party to put a little bit of

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flesh to its bones, so to speak, and the party Leader Ed Miliband has

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been busy making a series of major policy announcements. First came

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confirmation that Labour would scrap what it calls the bedroom tax - a

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housing benefit cut for people living in social housing with spare

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bedrooms. Mr Miliband's also promised all parents of primary

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school children guaranteed access to childcare through their school from

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8am to 6pm. And he wants big firms to train up an apprentice every time

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they bring in a worker from outside the EU. Shadow Chancellor Ed Balls

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is also getting in on the act, pledging to increase free childcare

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for three and four-year-olds of working parents from the current 15

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hours to 25 hours a week. But how much will all this cost and how will

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the party pay for it all? The Conservatives claim Labour's now

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made almost £28 billion of unfunded spending commitments. Ed Balls'

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answer to this is that he wants the Office for Budget Responsibility to

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scrutinise all Labour's tax and spending plans before the election.

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It's Labour making itself vulnerable to the charge that it is a tax and

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spend party again? I think it is, actually. It is engaged in petty

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politics, it seems, and salami slice economic 's. A bit of this and a bit

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of that. Childcare here, tax increases there, where is the

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wreath, I would ask. We want the big picture, the big story, we want

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hope. Instead, what we are getting is these slices of economic policy,

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which don't add up. They are not part of a big vision. I have to say,

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I don't agree with the need to actually finance childcare with tax

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rises. We can do it by increasing economic activity. In particular,

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jobs and employment. That is what Labour is there to do. But they are

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going to tell us they're not good to do what they did in the past. All

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political parties have to get used to the fact there is no money

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around, they have to tighten their belts, and make sure they stay

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within a tight financial straitjacket. But that is not what

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it seems. Of course, politicians love to announce grandly and loudly

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their plans for spending. What you rarely hear that transfer how

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they're going to finance it. That is my key criticism of what they are

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doing now. You give us your plans, we want to know how you will fund

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them. Remember, the deficit-cutting continues for many, many years. In

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2015 to 2016, which is what we're talking about, what we are still

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expecting to have a 90 billion deficit. So we are still spending 19

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Ilium more than we are getting in taxation. -- 90 billion. So it is

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not like that will be a year of plenty. Ed Balls will announce 25

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hours of free childcare, and he will finance it by taxing the banks, but

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I put this to you. George Osborne has already been doing it. He has

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increased the rank levy because he's not getting as much as he says he

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wants out of it. Financial services are in decline in this country now,

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is there really scope to do it this way? To be honest, our economy is in

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so much trouble, we can't really be taking more out of it than it is

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capable of creating. So what is wrong with this is the idea that you

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finance 1-piece with a bit of tax rises here, the way in which to fix

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the budget deficit is to increase employment. We have 2.5 million

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people in the country are unemployed, it is a mass and

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employment situation, we had never lived with so much unemployment for

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so long. There was 3 million unemployed in the 80s? For most of

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the 80s. But it would deal with unemployment, the deficit will look

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after itself. I wonder if he understands that if it takes 800

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million out of the banks, it is that much of their capital, which given

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that banks use leverage, banks will therefore be lending to the economy,

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which is what petitions say, billions and billions less. If you

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take money out of the banking sector, it cannot lend as much, that

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is the maths. I wonder if he realises that. We will speak to his

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spokesman Chris Leslie later. Earlier this morning Ed Balls was

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interviewed on BBC Breakfast. Asked by Bill Turnbull whether he'd ever

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been involved in the same kind of negative briefing as Damian McBride,

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the Shadow Chancellor was keen to emphasise his new-found cuddly

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credentials. That's not something I have ever done, it is the wrong way

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to do politics. He says he has done those things, it was despicable, the

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wrong thing to do. Critics is tough, and they have been times in the past

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where I have had strong arguments with Tony Blair, with Gordon Brown

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where I have had strong arguments on different issues, but I have

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always done that in an open way. This kind of negative, nasty

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briefing is wrong, but also, it's a thing of the past. That Iran is

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gone, it is not how Ed Miliband and I are doing things in the Labour

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Party is gone. -- that era is gone. We are in a better place now. We all

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are nowadays! So are the Brownites and the

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Blairites at war? Can they give it up and get proper jobs? Who better

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to give us the mood of conference than a couple of tabloid hacks. I

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should fire whoever called you that! The Mirror's Kevin Maguire and the

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Sun's Emily Ashton. Welcome to you both. Kevin, what are they talking

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about in the pubs and bars and lounges of Brighton? Quantitative

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easing or Damian McBride? If you say that, it is more Damien Wright, but

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actually there is surprisingly little, because that is at a level

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for the people who come here, they take a week off work and pay their

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own way. But there is some chatter around that, it is the recent past

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but what they are talking about really is how terrible the Tories

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are, you get a lot of that. Thank really is how terrible the Tories

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you for that scoop! But it tells you something about the mindset, Andrew,

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it is always looking at the Coalition, attacking them. As I

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think coming some way behind is a discussion about where labour is,

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the policies, the bedroom tax, but also that talk about Ed Miliband

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two. At best, you will get people saying he has to do better. Do you

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agree with that? I was in a bar last night... I can see! Everybody was

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talking about McBride. There were a lot of MPs around, a lot of ex-MPs,

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everybody was saying, and my name checked in the book? It is pure

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gossip. But maybe this is an out there on the streets as much as the

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cost of living prices, but the fact that Ed Miliband and Ed Balls were

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involved in this is actually an issue for real people as well as

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journalists and MPs who are here. I am told that Gordon Brown has

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descended and is on the conference -- at the conference. Is there any

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chance he is good to say something about this? Absolutely, really, the

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person who loses out most is Gordon Brown, who include Damian McBride,

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and as he said, actually kind of knew who what was going on -- who

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employed Damian McBride. If we fighting, I will ask him! I didn't

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know he was here. But he can sometimes be elusive. You always

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learn something when you are on the Daily Politics. Kevin mentioned that

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a lot of Labour activists think Ed Miliband has to do better. Would I

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a lot of Labour activists think Ed be right in thinking they may think

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that even more after his interview with Andrew Marr yesterday, got

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pretty bad reviews in the papers are even in the Labour papers? I think

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this is all about showing that Ed even in the Labour papers? I think

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Miliband can be prime minister, and I'm not sure he has put in flesh on

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the bones, he talks about minimum wage, cracking down on employers who

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don't pay it, and raising the minimum wage, but there is no detail

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on those policies. Until he does that, you can't really take him

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seriously as the next party leader in government. But it you think of

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his performance yesterday? I wish I had watched it with my eyes closed,

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he sits rather awkwardly, he keeps looking down, it's a visual medium

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and if someone looks awkward on the looking down, it's a visual medium

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TV, you think there aren't as are going to be awkward. I wasn't as

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critical as many people, because there are signs of a manifesto and a

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programme, and yes, there are chunks missing, we are 20 months from a

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general election, it would be odd if you put the manifesto forward now.

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But things like child care, the bedroom tax, the minimum wage is

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important for many people who don't get it and want it enforced. He has

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a long way to go, and he has too convinced the public that he has

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what it takes to get into Downing Street and be a prime minister and

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he keeps falling short on that. His poll ratings are poor, not as bad as

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Nick Clegg 's. That's a pretty good yardstick! Emily, when he was

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talking yesterday about the referendum on Europe, in or out, he

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said, we have made our position very, very clear and then he added,

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but we will make our position clear in the manifesto. That's eight, the

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position is not clear and he is able to sit on the fence until he can see

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where the wind is blowing and what the public wants. This is typical of

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his leadership, I have to say. He comes up with these ideas but

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doesn't actually put any flesh on the bones at all until the last

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minute. David Cameron has promised a referendum in 2017 and it might be

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difficult to renegotiate the relationship with Brussels in the

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meantime but at least he has come up relationship with Brussels in the

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with the proposal. Damian McBride is coming to the conference, he's going

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to do an interview with Newsnight, coming to the conference, he's going

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he will then be on the Daily Politics tomorrow. If he gets out!

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Will he need a couple of minders? I think people want receiving well

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because they will feel at this time, the Daily Mail, he shouldn't be

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washing labour 's dirty linen in public. I admire his honesty but

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maybe not his timing. Kevin, Emily, our new superb double act, I think

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it was for the money! Go and enjoy yourselves. The question for

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today's quiz, which of these is the only one that does not made Ed Balls

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cry, at least as far as we know! The Antiques Roadshow, Bambi, American

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sitcom titled his modern family, or the Sound Of Music? -- Modern Family

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full stop now, what do you do if you are a former Labour spin doctor.

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If you are Damian McBride, you write a salacious book about your years in

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office and hope you get a lot of one go for it. If you are Alistair

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Campbell, , you go running with Andy Burnham to raise awareness about

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alcohol misuse. A pretty good subject for a party conference, I

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can tell you! I interviewed him yesterday for the Sunday Politics,

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and he so enjoy that he is back again for and two, but first, as a

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special treat, let's talk to another famous spin doctor from the

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Brown-Blair years. Yes, I speak of none other than Charlie Whelan,

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there he is, smiling away in the gloom of Brighton! Welcome to the

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Daily Politics. Good morning, it is very pleasant to be back in

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Brighton. It is a pleasure to see you there. Alistair Campbell says

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that you are evil, evil is the word he used! What do you make of that? I

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that you are evil, evil is the word don't know, I just bumped into him

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downstairs, we had a little chat to talk about his football team,

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Burnley, not doing as well as my team, but he didn't say anything

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like that. He did, he said it on Sky News! You would not say it to me,

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because he knows how much I would defend you! I do not bother with

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because he knows how much I would this kind of nonsense. People here

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want to talk about jobs, living standards, the NHS, the minimum

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wage. They are not interested in books by Damian McBride, Alistair

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Campbell or anybody else, which is why I never wrote a book. I have got

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bad news for you, I am interested! So I am going to keep on with the

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questions. I notice Kevin Maguire said, will Damian McBride get a

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welcome here? Most of the delegates will not recognising, they do not

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know who he is. This is just stop for the media. I went into the press

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room, and the media was talking about Damian McBride. I went into

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the conference area to talk to delegates and a number of old

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friends, and nobody mentioned him. The people are interested in jobs,

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living standards and the NHS. They are not as brave as me, that is why

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living standards and the NHS. They I am going to as the these

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questions. Did you know that Damian McBride got up to this sort of thing

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cause me as you probably know as a student of politics, when I worked

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for Gordon Brown in opposition then for a few years at the Treasury, I

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met Damian McBride, I never met him, he did not come onto the scene

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until three years after I had left frontline politics. He was there

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when you were political officer for Unite. He was indeed, yes. So did

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you know that he was and the mining political careers of Labour

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colleagues like John Reid, Charles Clarke? -- undermining. I am sure

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John Reid and Charles Clarke could look after themselves! Andrew, I

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know you are interested in this, but if you talk about Damian McBride, go

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to Alistair Campbell, who was waiting for you. I don't want to

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talk about it, and neither do delegates. People think you were a

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forerunner for Damian McBride, that you were pretty tough on anybody

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that got in Gordon Brown's way - is that true? I suppose I was from a

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different era, most of the time I was working was in opposition, where

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it is a hard fight to win an election, which is why both eggs are

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finding it difficult - opposition is difficult. -- Eds. It is a tough job

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being a press officer, because we have to deal with people like you,

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Andrew, Alistair Campbell did a good job, and so did I, but that was many

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moons ago. Alistair Campbell said to me yesterday that there was no

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equivalence between what he and Peter Mandelson did and what you and

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Damian McBride did, that you were much rubber, much tougher, much more

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brutal, much more unscrupulous. -- Robert. Oh, dear, I wish, I wish!

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Oh, dear, oh, dear. Did he rerelease say that?! I will have a word with

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him afterwards! Only after I have had a word with him. There are

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reports that you were copied in on briefing e-mail that were sent out

:19:28.:19:32.

by Damian McBride in 2009. You must have known what was going on. Were

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you? I had no idea what he was up to, and neither did Gordon Brown,

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because I must say that I do genuinely think that Gordon Brown

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would be more shocked than anybody with some of the allegations that

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have been made in this book. Really?! I do think... Gold belt

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this man was obsessive for detail, he read the papers avidly, he wanted

:19:58.:20:03.

to know where every story came from, and you are telling me that he saw

:20:03.:20:07.

these things, oh, Charles Clarke is in a briefing war, no idea where

:20:07.:20:11.

that came from! The idea that Charles Clarke could not look after

:20:11.:20:18.

himself, or John Reid, an old comrades in the Communist Party era,

:20:18.:20:19.

himself, or John Reid, an old it is ridiculous. I am sure you have

:20:19.:20:23.

enjoyed reading it, I certainly have not read any of these books. I never

:20:23.:20:28.

read Alistair Campbell's books, Tony Blair's books. When I worked in

:20:29.:20:32.

government, I felt that what was happening was private. If I had a

:20:32.:20:37.

bad Jonny that said, when I leave, I am going to write about what

:20:37.:20:41.

everybody said, there are enough, but I didn't, and I think it is

:20:41.:20:45.

dishonest, I do not like these books. I certainly do not like

:20:45.:20:49.

Damian McBride's book. Did you not like Alistair Campbell's diaries? I

:20:49.:20:59.

bet you looked yourself up in the index! Why would I possibly be

:20:59.:21:03.

interested in that?! I am interested in real politics, which is about

:21:03.:21:10.

what happening in this country, living standards, about getting a

:21:10.:21:13.

Labour government and getting rid of the Tories. All right, we got our

:21:14.:21:18.

message, thank you for joining us. Now, Ed Balls is bidding later this

:21:18.:21:23.

morning, but before we do the build-up to that, let's go to

:21:23.:21:26.

Alistair Campbell, who I think could hear what we were saying, and he

:21:26.:21:31.

joins us again, twice in two days, it is too much for me! Same time as

:21:31.:21:38.

well. I have changed mine, but it is the same colour! What did you make

:21:38.:21:44.

of Charlie Whelan? Just doing his job, never delete thing wrong, this

:21:44.:21:48.

is all a waste of time nobody cares? Well, I think I would say

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borderline... No, not borderline, dishonest. He is right that the

:21:55.:21:59.

delegates do not want to talk about it and would rather focus on jobs,

:21:59.:22:04.

the economy, because these abuses that matter to people, but I think

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that you cannot go through the decade that went through with the

:22:12.:22:15.

sort of politics that they operated in and explain to come along and

:22:15.:22:19.

say, oh, I don't read books, I don't know what is going on. I thought you

:22:19.:22:23.

were right to press him with some of the questions that you did, because

:22:23.:22:28.

the idea that he has not read those books as well is, I suspect,

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borderline dishonest as well. The point is that when he talks about

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borderline dishonest as well. The wanting to get a Labour government,

:22:34.:22:37.

one of the reasons we don't have a Labour government is because of the

:22:37.:22:41.

way that people like this behaved when we were in government. Because

:22:41.:22:46.

a narrative was fed to the public, day in, day out, that Tony Blair was

:22:46.:22:51.

not very good at his job, that any minister who was frankly very good

:22:51.:22:53.

not very good at his job, that any at his job and thereby seen as a

:22:53.:22:56.

threat by people like him and McBride were consistently briefed

:22:56.:23:02.

against. You made the point, and he tried to laugh it off, about me

:23:02.:23:06.

saying that Peter Mandelson and I, we never saw an equivalence, and I

:23:06.:23:10.

did not. The reason why I felt that we were different to them is because

:23:11.:23:15.

we understood we were part of a team, and as you know, you have been

:23:15.:23:19.

around politics for a long time. This can get very tough, things can

:23:19.:23:24.

get very heated, because the issues matter. But the reason why I am

:23:24.:23:26.

still angry at people like Whelan matter. But the reason why I am

:23:26.:23:30.

and McBride, and to be frank, let me say, Andrew, a lot of the journalist

:23:30.:23:34.

who are now running around saying, how terrible these people work, they

:23:35.:23:38.

were taking this poison. You just add Kevin Maguire on the programme.

:23:38.:23:42.

Kevin Maguire would take their messages every day of the week. And

:23:42.:23:47.

on a paper like the Daily Mirror, they would damage the Labour

:23:47.:23:50.

government of the time. These people frankly, I have no time for them, I

:23:50.:23:54.

never will have time for them, because they are among the reasons

:23:54.:23:58.

why we have a Conservative government screwing up the recovery,

:23:58.:24:01.

the health service, punishing people on welfare, and with a foreign

:24:01.:24:05.

policy in shambles. That is why it is right that that is what matters,

:24:05.:24:08.

policy in shambles. That is why it and they are partly responsible for

:24:08.:24:10.

the Conservatives now being in power and us being out of power. You know,

:24:10.:24:15.

for Damian McBride to come here and stinky can have his 15 minutes of

:24:15.:24:18.

fame, he can sell as many thousands of his books as he wants, but he

:24:18.:24:22.

should have it on his conscience that one of the reasons we have a

:24:22.:24:24.

should have it on his conscience conservative and not a Labour

:24:24.:24:28.

government is because he spent his whole time inside government at

:24:28.:24:32.

taxpayers expense on the payroll, frankly undermining the

:24:32.:24:36.

effectiveness and performance and leadership of that government. Lets

:24:36.:24:39.

come onto the position that Labour finds itself in now, because I said

:24:39.:24:43.

yesterday that when you were with Labour and in opposition, you at

:24:43.:24:47.

this stage in the political cycle were always well ahead in the

:24:47.:24:50.

polls, and certainly in the run up to 1997, looking like he would win

:24:50.:24:55.

by a comfortable majority, maybe not as big as it subsequently became,

:24:55.:24:59.

that surprised a lot of people, but big. At the moment, the polls are

:24:59.:25:03.

narrowing, Labour is not that far ahead of the Tories, on economic

:25:04.:25:08.

confidence the Tories are ahead in the polls. This is an unusual

:25:08.:25:14.

situation for Labour. Well, I think one of the difficulties for Labour

:25:14.:25:18.

is that the currently ship, Ed Miliband, Ed Balls and a lot of

:25:18.:25:24.

winning environment. -- current leadership. I think a lot of people

:25:24.:25:30.

sensed we were going to win in 1997, and that is when most of them came

:25:30.:25:34.

into active Labour politics. Those of us who had been through the Neil

:25:34.:25:37.

Kinnock era and Thatcher winning election after election, we remember

:25:37.:25:41.

what it was like to be in that position and what it was like to be

:25:41.:25:44.

in a losing and environment, and it is a very difficult place to be.

:25:44.:25:50.

See, I think it'll be interesting to hear what Ed Balls has to say, but

:25:50.:25:53.

one of the things that the Labour Party has not properly is rebut this

:25:53.:25:59.

whole message from the coalition about the mess that we inherited.

:25:59.:26:03.

Strategically, the Conservatives now do not need to have that much of a

:26:03.:26:08.

recovery to be able to say, look, we inherited this mess and we are

:26:08.:26:11.

starting to move on the right direction. The truth is they did not

:26:11.:26:15.

inherit the mess - they inherited an international financial crisis which

:26:15.:26:20.

Gordon handled pretty well, and we had ten years of growth and

:26:20.:26:24.

prosperity under Labour. I think the public have been allowed to have

:26:24.:26:27.

this message given, the mess we inherited. We need to challenge

:26:27.:26:31.

that, and obviously most importantly it is about forward policy and the

:26:31.:26:35.

policy agenda for the future, and this is the week that has to get put

:26:35.:26:40.

out to the public. The public do not follow politics like you do, they do

:26:40.:26:44.

not follow politics like your viewers do, who are obviously

:26:44.:26:48.

interested. Most of the public are getting on with their lives, they

:26:48.:26:51.

just did in and out of the debate, but between now and the election the

:26:51.:26:54.

key policy platforms on which we will fight the next election, they

:26:55.:26:58.

have got to be at there, they have got to be clear, they have got to

:26:58.:27:02.

fit a coherent strategy, and the other thing is we have to start

:27:02.:27:06.

taking lumps out of this incompetent, useless government. A

:27:06.:27:17.

final point, you are in Brighton as part of your campaigning against

:27:17.:27:19.

alcohol abuse and to raise awareness of these issues - some people will

:27:19.:27:21.

think that taking that anti-alcohol message to a party conference is a

:27:21.:27:22.

think that taking that anti-alcohol bit like taking the car ran into a

:27:23.:27:27.

synagogue. How is it going? And I am here to plug a book! No, it is about

:27:27.:27:35.

alcoholism. Did you have that down your trousers?! Yes, I did, you do

:27:35.:27:39.

not want to go there! I would not your trousers?! Yes, I did, you do

:27:39.:27:47.

take that particular copy! It is down there now. No, the points

:27:47.:27:51.

today, and I saw the pictures you ran of Eddie Isard, and I was really

:27:51.:27:56.

pleased to see Andy Burnham there as well, because I really hope the

:27:56.:27:58.

pleased to see Andy Burnham there as Labour Party seizes this agenda,

:27:58.:28:02.

because I think that on the food industry, on smoking and packaging,

:28:02.:28:04.

because I think that on the food and on the alcohol industry, because

:28:04.:28:10.

David Cameron went down the road of minimum unit pricing and then did a

:28:10.:28:16.

reversal Eddie Burnham -- Andy Burnham did say there was a vacuum

:28:16.:28:20.

in health policy. I am going to attempt to launch an attempt to all

:28:20.:28:26.

parties, and I'm going to the Tories next week in Manchester for the

:28:26.:28:29.

first time in 20 years, to get all the parties to commit to minimum

:28:29.:28:33.

pricing and to increasing treatment availability to people who are

:28:34.:28:38.

dependent drinkers, from 6%, which is pathetic, 6% of alcoholics get

:28:38.:28:42.

treatment at the moment, up to 15%, which are still poultry in my view,

:28:42.:28:46.

but it would be a start. And I think that you are right, these

:28:46.:28:50.

conferences swim on alcohol, and if anybody wants to come tonight,

:28:50.:28:55.

5:30pm in the Thistle Hotel, it will be the one who's free reception of

:28:55.:29:01.

the week, hosted by me and Alcohol Concern. -- who's free. We will do a

:29:01.:29:10.

hat-trick of interviews tomorrow! Do not mess up and get any food on that

:29:10.:29:14.

site if it is the only one you have got. Thanks for joining us from

:29:14.:29:16.

Brighton. got. Thanks for joining us from

:29:16.:29:21.

We are expecting Ed Balls to address conference a little after midday,

:29:21.:29:24.

but this morning it was the turn of Douglas Alexander, who was caught up

:29:24.:29:29.

in the Damian McBride memoirs as well. His foreign affairs team were

:29:29.:29:32.

trying to rally the party faithful, not always easy on foreign affairs,

:29:32.:29:37.

but let's give you a favour -- a flavour of the conference floor.

:29:37.:29:43.

When the government get it right, we flavour of the conference floor.

:29:43.:29:49.

should support them. The truth is, just look at the legacy. Forces

:29:49.:29:54.

housing has been neglected, forces and allowances have been cut and

:29:54.:29:58.

they have been sackings of specialists who served on the front

:29:58.:30:02.

line. When it came to the big vote on Syria, two government ministers

:30:02.:30:06.

lock themselves away in a soundproofed cupboard and missed the

:30:06.:30:12.

boat. Is there any wonder this is a government doesn't listen? These are

:30:12.:30:17.

the people gave us aircraft carrier without an aircraft, they are at it

:30:17.:30:18.

again. They sacked 20,000 soldiers without an aircraft, they are at it

:30:18.:30:24.

to be replaced by reservists. They now have two deployed soldiers to

:30:24.:30:28.

risk the private sector contract now have two deployed soldiers to

:30:28.:30:31.

that was meant to find the reservists to replace the soldiers

:30:31.:30:36.

that the country didn't want to lose in the first place. It's time for a

:30:36.:30:42.

new era of international cooperation, it's time to reform

:30:42.:30:46.

Europe and its institutions, strengthen NATO and better

:30:46.:30:50.

coordinate capabilities. It is time to deepen our partnerships with Asia

:30:50.:30:53.

as economic power moves inexorably to the east. We need that

:30:53.:31:00.

corporation and that engagement, because you are on your own is as

:31:00.:31:05.

hopeless a guide to foreign policy as it is a guide to domestic policy

:31:05.:31:10.

here in the UK. Sadly the Conservatives just don't get that,

:31:10.:31:16.

they never have and they never will. Douglas Alexander addressing the

:31:17.:31:20.

they never have and they never will. conference this morning. We are

:31:20.:31:22.

joined now by Emma Reynolds in Brighton. Welcome back to the Daily

:31:22.:31:30.

Politics. Can I start on the German election results? The British Labour

:31:30.:31:34.

Party and the German social Democrats are very close, lots of

:31:34.:31:38.

ties between them, why did the SPD do so badly? I think the question is

:31:38.:31:47.

why did Angela Merkel do so well. No, my question is what the SPD do

:31:47.:31:53.

so badly, never mind her. The reason that the SPD did badly is because

:31:53.:31:59.

Angela Merkel is an extremely difficult politician to deal with,

:31:59.:32:03.

to oppose. I think this is really relevant. What she has done if she

:32:03.:32:06.

has stolen their clothes. She has relevant. What she has done if she

:32:06.:32:10.

talked about introducing minimum wages, she has talked about

:32:10.:32:15.

introducing rent controls, these are policies that are more typical of

:32:15.:32:18.

social Democrats, so they have really been squeezed, she has moved

:32:18.:32:23.

to the centre and taken up a lot of their ground. It has been extremely

:32:23.:32:28.

difficult for them to have policies that are distinctive, that's why

:32:28.:32:31.

they haven't done as well as we would have liked them to do. What

:32:31.:32:36.

happened in Germany hasn't happened in isolation. Why, after the slump

:32:36.:32:43.

of 2008, a slump caused by capitalists, has the right one in

:32:43.:32:52.

the UK, Spain, Greece, Australia, Norway, New Zealand, now Germany?

:32:52.:32:59.

What is wrong with the left? I do think the results of those countries

:32:59.:33:02.

are disappointing but we have also seen the centre-left win in France,

:33:02.:33:09.

lead a government in Italy... That has been a big success! There are

:33:09.:33:15.

nine countries in Europe where the centre-left leads the government, so

:33:15.:33:19.

it is not a total wash-out for the centre-left in Europe. No, but you

:33:19.:33:25.

would have thought, after the slump, which wasn't caused by trade unions

:33:25.:33:28.

or pay demands or strikes or whatever, but caused by the

:33:28.:33:32.

activities of bankers, surely you would have expected the left to

:33:32.:33:37.

activities of bankers, surely you largely sweep the board, and they

:33:37.:33:40.

haven't. So there must be something wrong with their appeal across

:33:40.:33:46.

Europe if it is doing so badly. I would like the left to do better but

:33:46.:33:53.

I also think that it is generally about anti-incumbency, and you have

:33:53.:33:56.

seen government after government in the EU for in the last two or three

:33:56.:34:03.

years, because of the economic situation -- fall. Germany is an

:34:04.:34:10.

exception, because we will see if the same thing happens in Austria,

:34:10.:34:14.

they may hang onto power, but this about incumbency and about the

:34:14.:34:19.

economic situation of the particular country. Apart from Australia, but

:34:19.:34:27.

it just shows what happens when a very divided party, in this case the

:34:27.:34:33.

Australian Labour Party, when they go to the polls, they really get

:34:33.:34:38.

punished. When you go to the polls that divided, you will receive the

:34:38.:34:43.

same treatment. Yesterday, Ed Miliband said on the BBC that labour

:34:43.:34:49.

's policy on an in out referendum for Europe was very, very clear.

:34:49.:34:58.

What is that policy? We have been clear that we would keep on statute

:34:58.:35:02.

the legislation that has been recently passed, couple of years

:35:02.:35:06.

ago, that if there is a transfer of power from our Parliament to

:35:06.:35:10.

introduce and of the European Union based in Brussels, then there would

:35:10.:35:15.

be a referendum. But we have said we are opposed to the Tory promise of a

:35:15.:35:18.

referendum before the end of 2017, are opposed to the Tory promise of a

:35:18.:35:22.

which creates great uncertainty and could put jobs and vital foreign

:35:22.:35:27.

direct investment at risk. Thank you for that. Ed Balls is on the stage.

:35:28.:36:17.

last. An economy that works were just for the few but for working

:36:17.:36:25.

people in every part of Britain. And conference, three and a half years

:36:25.:36:31.

after the general election defeat, we have learned from that experience

:36:31.:36:37.

and our time in government. Where we got things wrong on immigration

:36:37.:36:41.

control, on the 10p tax rate, the next Labour government will be

:36:41.:36:45.

different from the last. And where change is needed in our party, we

:36:45.:36:50.

will reconnect with our members and working people across the country by

:36:50.:36:54.

making necessary changes. But conference, let us also be proud of

:36:54.:37:00.

what the last Labour government achieved. National minimum wage,

:37:00.:37:05.

schools and hospitals rebuilt, NHS waiting times down from 18 months to

:37:05.:37:11.

18 weeks. More apprenticeships, not joining the euro, 1 million more

:37:11.:37:16.

this small businesses, crime down, child poverty down, and 3000 500

:37:16.:37:26.

more sure start, one of the most important reforms ever delivered by

:37:26.:37:28.

more sure start, one of the most a Labour government. And conference,

:37:28.:37:39.

replacing the Tory abomination that was clause 28 with civil

:37:39.:37:45.

partnerships. Paving the way for a landmark reform, something that

:37:45.:37:50.

wouldn't have happened without Labour votes in parliament, the

:37:50.:37:53.

progressive triumph that is gay marriage. And as we look forward to

:37:53.:38:05.

the general election to come, determined to win a Labour majority,

:38:05.:38:11.

I want you all to know, as the Labour and co-operative MP, majority

:38:11.:38:19.

just 1101, the state that David Cameron needed to win to get a Tory

:38:19.:38:27.

majority in 2010, but because of our hard work and determination, the

:38:27.:38:31.

seat he failed to win in 2010, I am up for the battle to come. And as

:38:31.:38:41.

chair of our economic policy commission, I know this whole party

:38:41.:38:46.

is up for the battle to come. And please join me in thanking my

:38:46.:38:52.

co-chair, Margaret Eckert, for her continuing hard work and service to

:38:52.:39:04.

this party -- Margaret Beckett. Not just over the past year but in four

:39:04.:39:08.

decades in Parliament, we thank you, Margaret. And conference, as a proud

:39:08.:39:22.

member of the Unison and Unite trade unions, I know to this whole

:39:22.:39:28.

movement is up for the battle to come. And in the coming months, let

:39:28.:39:33.

us a cure the foundations for the general election. Selecting the best

:39:33.:39:37.

parliamentary candidates we have ever had, with more women candidates

:39:37.:39:38.

parliamentary candidates we have in key seats than ever before.

:39:39.:39:45.

Winning council seats and by-elections up and down the

:39:45.:39:50.

country, with the toughest and best generation of local government

:39:50.:39:53.

leaders we have ever had. Winning more seats in the European

:39:53.:39:58.

elections, and let us end next year in the European elections, the stain

:39:58.:40:00.

on our country 's reputation, by in the European elections, the stain

:40:00.:40:05.

kicking the BNP out of the European Parliament. And conference... In

:40:05.:40:21.

next September 's Scottish recommend -- referendum, now showing so

:40:21.:40:26.

powerfully up there that the case for suppression is falling apart,

:40:26.:40:30.

when Alex Salmond is in a state of total confusion on the single most

:40:30.:40:35.

important decision a country can take on the economy, which currency

:40:35.:40:40.

to have, first he wanted the euro, saying sterling was a millstone

:40:40.:40:44.

around our neck, now he says he wants independence but to keep the

:40:44.:40:48.

pound all the same. Let us win the argument that we are better together

:40:48.:40:58.

in next year 's Scottish referendum. And let us demonstrate as Welsh

:40:58.:41:06.

Labour have done so brilliantly that it is our Labour values of

:41:06.:41:10.

cooperation, solidarity and social justice that best secure our union.

:41:10.:41:18.

And conference, it is Labour whose leader is facing up to the need for

:41:18.:41:22.

reform, leading from the front on phone hacking, on banking firm,

:41:22.:41:28.

putting the crisis of the squeezed middle on the political agenda

:41:28.:41:34.

before anyone else. And who on Syria, had the courage to stand up

:41:34.:41:41.

and say that if the case was sound and the United Nations was properly

:41:41.:41:45.

engaged, Labour would support military action but that Labour

:41:45.:41:50.

would not support a gung ho prime minister putting the decision for

:41:50.:41:52.

evidence in a reckless -- to conflict. Conference, Ed Miliband

:41:52.:42:07.

was right. He prevailed. My friend, our leader, Britain 's next prime

:42:07.:42:19.

minister, Ed Miliband. And conference, when David Cameron and

:42:19.:42:24.

William Hague now have the nerve to go around saying that Parliament has

:42:24.:42:28.

Mac refusal to be bounced into military action in Syria has

:42:29.:42:37.

diminished Britain, let us reply, no Labour government will ever stand

:42:37.:42:41.

aside when terrible expertise are committed and international law is

:42:41.:42:46.

broken. -- terrible atrocities. But we know what has diminished Britain.

:42:46.:42:53.

Flouncing out of a European summit, leaving Britain without influence,

:42:53.:42:57.

isolated, that is what has diminished Britain. Absurdly

:42:57.:43:02.

comparing Britain to Greece, and choking off business confidence and

:43:02.:43:07.

our recovery, that is what has diminished Britain. Stigmatising the

:43:07.:43:11.

unemployed and low paid and calling them shirkers, driving vans read our

:43:11.:43:15.

streets, telling immigrants to go home, attacking our police, teachers

:43:15.:43:20.

and social workers, peddling the lie that Britain is broken, that is what

:43:20.:43:30.

has diminished Britain. Conference, we know who has diminished Britain.

:43:30.:43:36.

We know who has diminished Britain. David Cameron has diminished

:43:36.:43:36.

Britain. Although, didn't you feel a David Cameron has diminished

:43:36.:43:49.

little sorry for our promise to this summer? Didn't you? -- for our Prime

:43:49.:43:56.

Minister. Back in August, on the beach, changing into his swimming

:43:56.:44:02.

trunks, behind that Mickey Mouse towel, captured on camera 's,

:44:02.:44:07.

unflattering pictures spread across the national press conference, I

:44:07.:44:11.

have in there, I know what it's like. But when Yvette saw the

:44:11.:44:18.

pictures, she said, rather pointedly, she said that for a

:44:18.:44:22.

46-year-old man, David Cameron looked rather slim. Slim! Who on

:44:23.:44:28.

earth can she have been comparing him to? ! I just thought, for a

:44:28.:44:40.

prime minister, it was a surprisingly small towel. But

:44:40.:44:49.

conference, let us all agree, after the last three years, the sooner

:44:49.:44:52.

David Cameron throws in the towel, the better. Conference...

:44:52.:45:04.

Conference, we all remember, as Margaret has just said, what David

:45:04.:45:13.

Cameron, George Osborne said on the economy three years ago - they

:45:14.:45:17.

claimed in 2010 Baxter tax rises and deeper spending cuts would secure

:45:17.:45:22.

the economic recovery and make it stronger. They said their plan would

:45:22.:45:27.

make people better off and get the deficit down. On every test they set

:45:27.:45:30.

themselves, the Prime Minister and Chancellor have failed. They did not

:45:30.:45:35.

secure the recovery, they choked it off, as we want, and a flat lined

:45:36.:45:40.

our economy for three wasted and damaging years. They claimed living

:45:41.:45:46.

standards would rise, but they have fallen year-on-year. They made the

:45:46.:45:49.

number one test of their economic credibility keeping the AAA credit

:45:49.:45:53.

rating, and our country has been downgraded not once but twice. They

:45:54.:45:59.

promise to balance the books by 2015, but the deficit is now said to

:45:59.:46:07.

be over £90 billion. And now, after three wasted years, David Cameron

:46:07.:46:13.

and George Osborne try to claim their plan has worked. Worked! It we

:46:13.:46:17.

have worked for a privileged few at the top, but for the million young

:46:17.:46:23.

people trapped out of work, that Tory plan has not worked at all.

:46:23.:46:24.

For... For millions... For millions of

:46:25.:46:33.

ordinary families worried about how to make ends meet, when wages are

:46:33.:46:38.

falling and prices are rising, for the young couples struggling to get

:46:38.:46:41.

on the housing ladder because the chronic shortage of homes is forcing

:46:41.:46:47.

up prices, for ordinary working families, the aspirational majority

:46:47.:46:51.

who work hard, pay their taxes, who wants to get on and not just get by,

:46:51.:46:56.

but who are working harder for less as the cost of living keeps on

:46:56.:47:00.

rising, this Tory plan is not working. And for the 400,000

:47:00.:47:07.

disabled adults forced to pay the government's perverse and deeply

:47:08.:47:11.

unfair bedroom tax, this Tory plan has failed them absolutely. And that

:47:11.:47:15.

is why, in our first budget, the has failed them absolutely. And that

:47:15.:47:19.

next Labour government will repeal the bedroom tax.

:47:19.:47:23.

So when David Cameron and George Osborne say that everything in the

:47:23.:47:39.

economy is down to them, let us remind them prices rising faster

:47:39.:47:47.

than wages for 38 of the 39 months since David Cameron went into

:47:47.:47:51.

Downing Street, three years of flat-lining, the slowest recovery

:47:51.:47:55.

for over 100 years, 1 million young people out of work, welfare spending

:47:55.:47:59.

rising, more borrowing to pay for their economic failure. That is

:48:00.:48:05.

their economic record, and we will not let them forget it. I say to

:48:05.:48:11.

David Cameron and George Osborne, you cannot just airbrush away three

:48:11.:48:15.

wasted years, you cannot just airbrush away your economic failure.

:48:15.:48:20.

And, conference, as for their claim that we are all in this together, we

:48:20.:48:31.

don't hear that line much anymore. And with the deficit still high and

:48:31.:48:36.

ordinary families still struggling with the cost of living crisis, how

:48:36.:48:42.

can it be right or fair for David Cameron and George Osborne to have

:48:42.:48:46.

chosen this year to give the richest people in our country earning over

:48:46.:48:55.

£150,000 a £3 billion tax cut? Isn't it is now clear whose side David

:48:55.:49:01.

Cameron and jaws bottom -- George Osborne are really on? Cutting taxes

:49:01.:49:05.

for hedge funds, trying to bribe working people to give up

:49:05.:49:08.

for hedge funds, trying to bribe rights, country suppers at Chequers

:49:08.:49:12.

for Tory party fundraisers, protecting the privileges of the few

:49:12.:49:17.

while the many work hard and do not see the benefit. For all their claim

:49:17.:49:21.

to be modernisers, with Cameron and Osborne, it has not been, who wants

:49:21.:49:27.

to be a millionaire? It is who wants to help a millionaire. It is not

:49:27.:49:29.

to be a millionaire? It is who wants phone a friend, it is cut taxes for

:49:29.:49:34.

your friend. It is not 50-50, it is winner takes all. Conference, isn't

:49:34.:49:38.

it about time they asked the audience? Because... Because we...

:49:38.:49:45.

Because we know the truth. We know the truth. After the last three

:49:45.:49:53.

years, David Cameron and George Osborne, for the few not the many,

:49:53.:49:59.

more of the same, from the same old stories. And, conference, after

:49:59.:50:04.

three years of stagnation, it is good news our economy has started to

:50:04.:50:10.

finally started to grow again. It was going three years ago before

:50:10.:50:14.

they choked it. That it was growing. So don't listen to the Tory

:50:14.:50:18.

propaganda that says that Labour does not want the economy to grow,

:50:18.:50:23.

what nonsense! Because when the economy was in recession, we know

:50:23.:50:27.

which communities lose out. When unemployment becomes entrenched, we

:50:27.:50:30.

know which constituencies suffer most. When the cost of living is

:50:30.:50:35.

rising, we know which families are hardest hit. And we know that three

:50:35.:50:42.

years of flat-lining, far longer than any of us expected, has caused

:50:42.:50:47.

long-term damage. Businesses bankrupt, investment in capacity

:50:47.:50:51.

lost, long-term unemployment entrenched. And now even as growth

:50:51.:50:56.

finally returns, with prices still rising faster than wages, with

:50:56.:51:00.

business investment still weak, with unemployment still rising in half

:51:00.:51:04.

the country, with bank lending still falling to businesses, we cannot be

:51:04.:51:11.

satisfied. For millions of people in our country, this is no recovery at

:51:11.:51:16.

all. And when, around the world, emerging markets are jittery, China

:51:16.:51:19.

all. And when, around the world, is slowing, oil prices are rising,

:51:19.:51:24.

the eurozone is still stuck with chronic low growth, I say, this is

:51:24.:51:28.

no time for complacency, to sit back with fingers crossed. That is why we

:51:28.:51:33.

no time for complacency, to sit back have urged George Osborne to act to

:51:33.:51:37.

secure a strong recovery, because what Britain needs now is strong

:51:37.:51:43.

enough growth to catch up all that lost ground and so that everyone can

:51:43.:51:47.

feel the benefit, and not the view. Not a recovery that just works. ,

:51:47.:51:51.

not early hikes in interest rates and mortgage rates as a weak British

:51:51.:51:56.

economy hits the inflationary buffers, but a recovery that works

:51:56.:52:00.

for all and is built to last. And that is why, along with voices from

:52:00.:52:08.

bankrupt England and the IMF, we are right to be concerned that the

:52:08.:52:11.

government is boosting housing demand. The taxpayer mortgage

:52:11.:52:16.

guarantee on houses up to £600,000 in value while doing nothing about

:52:16.:52:22.

the supply of housing which has fallen to its lowest level since the

:52:22.:52:29.

1920s. George, its basic economic, its basic economic. If you push up

:52:29.:52:36.

housing demand and do nothing to boost supply, prices go up and up,

:52:36.:52:40.

and the end result is that the very people you should be helping - young

:52:40.:52:47.

first-time buyers, will find it even harder to get on the housing ladder.

:52:47.:52:57.

Conference, I have to ask, when we need to secure stronger growth and

:52:57.:53:00.

invest for the long-term, how can it be right George Osborne to be

:53:00.:53:04.

planning to cut infrastructure investment in 2015? That is why we

:53:04.:53:10.

have consistently said, why the IMF have said, bring forward £10 billion

:53:10.:53:16.

of infrastructure investment now. Build 400,000 affordable homes over

:53:16.:53:22.

the next two years, create 500,000 jobs and thousands of

:53:22.:53:25.

apprenticeships. That is the way to secure an economy that works for all

:53:25.:53:27.

and is built to last. But, conference, we cannot rely on

:53:27.:53:39.

George Osborne to do the right thing. And with George Osborne doing

:53:39.:53:45.

the wrong things, we stand to inherit a very difficult situation.

:53:46.:53:50.

After three wasted years of lost growth, far from balancing the

:53:50.:53:56.

books, in 2015, there is now set to be a deficit of over £90 billion.

:53:56.:54:01.

And I need to be straight with this conference and with the country

:54:01.:54:06.

about what that means. The Government's day-to-day spending

:54:06.:54:10.

totals in 2015-16 will be our starting point. Any changes for

:54:10.:54:13.

current spending plans will need to be fully funded and send out an

:54:13.:54:18.

advanced in our manifesto. There will be no more borrowing for

:54:18.:54:21.

day-to-day spending, we will set out to fiscal rules to balance the

:54:21.:54:24.

current budget and to get the national debt on a downward path. Of

:54:24.:54:29.

course, Labour will make different choices, we will combine iron

:54:29.:54:33.

discipline on spending control with a fairer approach to deficit

:54:33.:54:36.

reduction. And with our 0-based review, a review of every £1 spent

:54:36.:54:42.

by Government from the bottom-up, Rachel Reeves and my Shadow Cabinet

:54:42.:54:45.

colleagues have begun the work of identifying savings so we can switch

:54:46.:54:51.

to Labour's priorities. But we will not be able to reverse all the

:54:52.:54:53.

to Labour's priorities. But we will spending cuts and tax rises that the

:54:53.:54:56.

Tories have pushed through. We will have to govern with less money

:54:56.:54:59.

around. The next Labour government would have to make cuts to, because

:54:59.:55:03.

while jobs and growth are vital to get the deficit down, they are not

:55:03.:55:08.

going to be able to magic away a £90 billion deficit at a stroke.

:55:08.:55:13.

Delivering our Labour goals will be harder than at any time than we can

:55:13.:55:17.

member, but it can be done - if we get people back to work, strengthen

:55:17.:55:22.

the economy, cut out waste, focus relentlessly on our priorities, and

:55:22.:55:25.

make sure difficult choices are not ducked but are rooted in our values,

:55:25.:55:30.

fairness and common sense. So, conference, at a time in the public

:55:30.:55:34.

services that pensioners rely on under such pressure, we cannot

:55:34.:55:37.

continue paying the winter fuel allowance to the richest 5% of

:55:37.:55:39.

pensioners. We will not be able to allowance to the richest 5% of

:55:40.:55:44.

reverse the Government's cuts to child benefit for the highest

:55:44.:55:47.

earners. We will keep the benefit stab at major problem reflects

:55:47.:55:48.

housing costs. We will have to have stab at major problem reflects

:55:48.:55:54.

a cap on structural social security. Over the long term, as our

:55:54.:55:58.

population ages, there will need to be increases in the retirement age.

:55:58.:56:02.

But a fairer approach to deficit reduction means we will also crack

:56:02.:56:08.

down on tax avoidance, scrap the shares schemes, and reverse the tax

:56:08.:56:12.

cut for hedge funds, and we will insist that all the proceeds from

:56:12.:56:16.

the sale of our stakes in Lloyds and RBS are used not for a one-off

:56:16.:56:22.

pre-election tax giveaway, but every penny of profit used to repay the

:56:22.:56:27.

national debt. Conference, that is fiscal responsibility in the

:56:27.:56:28.

national interest. And with our 0-based reviews, we

:56:28.:56:40.

will make different choices, so we will ask, can we improve care and

:56:40.:56:46.

save money, as Andy Burnham has proposed, by pooling Health and

:56:46.:56:49.

Social Care Act a single service with a single budget and joint

:56:49.:56:54.

management? And, conference, we will repeal the damaging and costly Tory

:56:54.:56:58.

privatisation of our National Health Service.

:56:58.:57:08.

And we will... We will ask, does it really makes sense to have separate

:57:08.:57:15.

costly management and bureaucracy. Many separate governments

:57:15.:57:19.

departments, agencies, fire services and police forces? -- for so many.

:57:19.:57:23.

We will not pay for new free schools and police forces? -- for so many.

:57:23.:57:26.

in areas where there are extra school places well parents in other

:57:26.:57:30.

areas are struggling to get their children into a local school.

:57:30.:57:36.

And on infrastructure, we need more long-term investment. And we will

:57:36.:57:44.

assess the case for capital investment as we prepare our

:57:44.:57:47.

manifesto, but we must also set the right priorities and get value for

:57:47.:57:53.

money. Conference, we support investment in better transport links

:57:53.:57:56.

for the future. We continue to back the idea of a new North-south rail

:57:56.:58:03.

link, but under this government, the High Speed Two project has been

:58:03.:58:05.

totally mismanaged, and the High Speed Two project has been

:58:05.:58:08.

have shot up to £50 billion. David High Speed Two project has been

:58:08.:58:14.

Cameron and George Osborne have made clear that they will go full is team

:58:14.:58:18.

ahead with this project, no matter how much the costs spiral up and up.

:58:18.:58:22.

They seem willing to put their own pride and urbanity above best value

:58:22.:58:28.

for the taxpayer. Maria Eagle and I are clear that we will not take this

:58:28.:58:32.

irresponsible approach. Let us be clear, in tough times, when there is

:58:32.:58:37.

less money around and a big deficits to get down, there will be no blank

:58:37.:58:42.

cheque from me as a Labour Chancellor for this project or any

:58:42.:58:46.

other project, because the question is not just whether a new high-speed

:58:46.:58:51.

line is a good idea or a bad idea, but whether it is the best way to

:58:51.:58:57.

spend £50 billion for the future of our country.

:58:57.:59:04.

Conference, in tough times, it even more important that all our

:59:04.:59:10.

policies and commitments are properly costed and funded. The

:59:10.:59:13.

policies and commitments are British people rightly wants to know

:59:13.:59:17.

that the sums add up, so we will go one step further and ask the

:59:17.:59:21.

independent Office for Budget Responsibility, the watchdog set up

:59:21.:59:25.

by this government, to independently audited the costings of every single

:59:25.:59:30.

individual spending and tax measure in Labour's manifesto at the next

:59:30.:59:35.

election. This is the first time a Shadow Chancellor, the first time

:59:35.:59:39.

any political party has ever said he wants this kind of independent

:59:39.:59:44.

audit. It is a radical change from what has gone before, but it is the

:59:44.:59:48.

right thing to do to help restore trust in politics, and that is why

:59:48.:59:50.

we are going to do it. Conference, you know we need

:59:50.:00:03.

economic responsibility and fiscal rigour. And we can't write all the

:00:03.:00:09.

details of our first budget today, where we don't know the estate of

:00:09.:00:11.

the economy and how bad the where we don't know the estate of

:00:11.:00:14.

finances are going to be that we will inherit. But after three wasted

:00:14.:00:19.

years of Tory failure, people are rightly now asking, what will Labour

:00:19.:00:24.

do differently? And now, with 19 months to go to the election, this

:00:24.:00:29.

week, today and tomorrow and in the coming days is the right time to set

:00:29.:00:33.

out Labour's alternatives. Conference, as Liam Byrne has said,

:00:33.:00:38.

Labour would stand aside without almost 1 million young people out of

:00:38.:00:42.

work and when long-term unemployment is so high. We know can't make our

:00:42.:00:45.

comic grow more strongly, get the cost of welfare down and deal with

:00:45.:00:48.

the deficit if we are squandering the talents of so many. We will fund

:00:48.:01:14.

this by repeating the tax on bank bonuses and restricting pensions tax

:01:14.:01:18.

relief for the very highest earners to the same rate as the average

:01:18.:01:22.

taxpayer. We will work within ploy is to make sure there will be a paid

:01:22.:01:27.

job for all young people out of work for more than 12 months and adults

:01:27.:01:31.

out of work for two years or more, which people will have to take or

:01:31.:01:37.

lose benefits. That is welfare reform that works. That is what we

:01:37.:01:40.

mean by matching rights with responsibilities, eating young

:01:40.:01:45.

people into work and ending the scourge of long-term unemployment

:01:45.:01:49.

once and for all. -- getting young people into work. Conference, when

:01:49.:01:55.

people get into work they should always be better off, it should

:01:55.:02:00.

always pay more to be in work than on benefits so we must do more to

:02:00.:02:05.

make work pay. The national minimum wage is one of our proudest

:02:05.:02:09.

achievements. It was opposed by the Tories every step of the way, even

:02:09.:02:13.

now some Conservatives say the minimum wage should be suspended.

:02:13.:02:19.

And its value has fallen by 5% in real terms since 2010. So we must

:02:19.:02:24.

now fight to protect and strengthen the national minimum wage,

:02:24.:02:26.

increasing the fine for those who exploit workers, strengthening it

:02:26.:02:33.

and restoring its value, catching up the ground lost over the last three

:02:33.:02:37.

years and encouraging employers to go further and pay the minimum --

:02:37.:02:48.

living wage. And conference, to move Labour on from the past, to put it

:02:48.:02:52.

where it should always be, on the side of working people, we will

:02:52.:02:56.

introduce a new 10p starting rate of tax will stop a tax cut for 25

:02:56.:03:02.

million hard-working people on minimum and lower incomes. And we

:03:02.:03:13.

will pay for it by introducing a mansion tax on property is worth

:03:13.:03:21.

over £2 million. -- properties. Introduced in a fair way, so that

:03:21.:03:25.

foreign investors who buy a property in London to make a profit will

:03:25.:03:29.

finally make a proper tax contribution to our country. But the

:03:29.:03:42.

many families, high childcare costs are a real problem, it can mean it

:03:42.:03:45.

many families, high childcare costs doesn't even add up to go to work.

:03:45.:03:49.

Childcare is a vital part of our doesn't even add up to go to work.

:03:49.:03:55.

economic infrastructure. That alongside family support and

:03:55.:03:58.

flexible working should give parents the choice to stay at home with

:03:58.:04:01.

their children when they are very small, and balance work and

:04:01.:04:03.

their children when they are very as they grow older. To make work pay

:04:03.:04:09.

for families, we must act. Stephen Twigg said that yesterday how we

:04:09.:04:13.

will guarantee childcare available for all primary school children from

:04:13.:04:20.

8am until 6pm. And today, I want to go further. As we need to do more

:04:20.:04:25.

for families with nursery age children, too. Conference, here is

:04:25.:04:31.

how we can. After the financial crisis, it is right that the banks

:04:31.:04:36.

make a greater contribution. In the last financial year, the banks made

:04:36.:04:41.

a staggering £2.7 billion less in overall tax than in 2010. Over the

:04:41.:04:46.

last two years, the government 's bank levy has raised 1.6 billion

:04:46.:04:52.

less than even they said it would. At a time when resources are tight

:04:52.:04:55.

and families are under pressure, that's not right, and we will act.

:04:55.:05:00.

The next Labour government will increase the bag levy rate to raise

:05:00.:05:04.

an extra £800 million and we will use the money for families where all

:05:04.:05:08.

parents want to work and are in work, to increase free childcare for

:05:08.:05:11.

three-year-olds and four-year-olds work, to increase free childcare for

:05:11.:05:28.

from 15 hours to 25 hours. For parents in work, free childcare for

:05:28.:05:32.

three-year-olds and four-year-olds from 15 to 25 hours a week, for the

:05:32.:05:39.

first time, parents able to work part time without having to worry at

:05:39.:05:42.

all about the cost of childcare, that is what we mean by making work

:05:42.:05:47.

pay. That's what we mean by tackling the cost of living crisis, that is a

:05:47.:05:52.

radical transformation in the provision of childcare in our

:05:52.:06:01.

country. And conference, we need a radical transformation in our

:06:01.:06:05.

economy. Because the countries that radical transformation in our

:06:05.:06:10.

succeed now are those that exploit the huge opportunities that digital

:06:10.:06:21.

media and education, medical technology are coming, will Britain

:06:21.:06:23.

seize this opportunity or squander it? As we and

:06:23.:06:27.

seize this opportunity or squander know there is no future in trying to

:06:27.:06:31.

undercut the merging market economies like India, China and

:06:31.:06:36.

Brazil on wages and cost. That's why so many companies look at this

:06:36.:06:40.

government 's record on industrial policy with increasing dismay. The

:06:40.:06:49.

Heseltine growth review muted, the British bank a damp squib,

:06:49.:06:53.

apprenticeships for young people actually falling. Energy policy in

:06:53.:06:54.

chaos. On infrastructure, dither, actually falling. Energy policy in

:06:54.:07:02.

delay and inaction. We cannot succeed with this race to the

:07:02.:07:06.

bottom, with laissez faire deregulation and trickle-down

:07:06.:07:10.

economic. Because it's NRO and defeatist vision, it is doomed to

:07:10.:07:13.

fail and we have seen it fail before. Just look at the British car

:07:14.:07:19.

industry in the 70s and 80s, trying to compete on cost, cutting back on

:07:19.:07:24.

innovation, quality and skills, played by terrible industrial

:07:24.:07:28.

relations. And now look at the Renaissance in Jaguar Land Rover,

:07:28.:07:31.

creating thousands more jobs, exporting around the world, not by

:07:31.:07:35.

cutting corners but waste of world-class, long-term investment in

:07:35.:07:40.

innovation, skills and supply chains. We are determined to learn

:07:40.:07:45.

from that success and that is why we can announce executive director of

:07:45.:07:53.

Land Rover will now lead a review for us on how we can help strengthen

:07:53.:07:57.

our supply chains and deliver the skills and innovation Britain needs

:07:57.:08:03.

to succeed. Following the review on short-term is, we will change

:08:03.:08:07.

takeover rules and corporate incentives and reform taxes to stop

:08:07.:08:12.

asset stripping in the short-term and instead, support long-term

:08:12.:08:16.

investment. And why not use any revenues from the planned increase

:08:16.:08:19.

in the license fees for the mobile phone spectrum, expected to be over

:08:19.:08:25.

£1 billion in the next Parliament, to capitalise the British investment

:08:25.:08:29.

bank so that region by region, we can get small businesses, the

:08:29.:08:34.

finance they need to grow and create jobs. Conference, we will set up an

:08:34.:08:43.

independent infrastructure commission has recommended by the

:08:43.:08:46.

chair of the Olympic delivery authority, to end either and delay

:08:46.:08:52.

in infrastructure planning. We will legislate for us to get free banking

:08:52.:08:56.

code of conduct and demand real reform and cultural change from the

:08:56.:08:59.

banks. We will legislate for a decarbonisation, and unlock billions

:08:59.:09:05.

of pounds of investment in renewables, nuclear, clean coal

:09:05.:09:10.

technology and we will give the green investment bank borrowing

:09:10.:09:15.

powers it needs to do it is job. That is what the next Labour

:09:15.:09:28.

government will do. So conference, even in difficult times, even as we

:09:28.:09:33.

face a huge deficit, we will rise to the challenge. We will build an

:09:33.:09:37.

economy that works for the many and not just a few at the top. And we

:09:37.:09:43.

know it can be done. Because we have done it before. Conference, we are

:09:43.:09:46.

know it can be done. Because we have not the first Labour generation to

:09:46.:09:53.

face a huge deficit and the need for spending restraint and a country

:09:53.:09:56.

crying out the change. We are not the first generation to be awed by

:09:56.:10:00.

the scale of what needs to be done, to transform our country. As we

:10:00.:10:04.

prepare for the 20 15th general election, to be held in the 70th

:10:04.:10:11.

anniversary year of the Second World War, let us take inspiration from

:10:11.:10:15.

the great reforming Labour government of 1945. Conference, that

:10:15.:10:25.

past Labour generation faced huge economic and fiscal challenges. But

:10:26.:10:36.

they did not flinch. And they built lasting change. New homes for

:10:36.:10:39.

returning heroes, universal welfare state and national health of which

:10:39.:10:45.

65 years on is still weak and four British values, for all and not just

:10:45.:10:58.

a privilege few. -- privileged few. So conference, let us not be the

:10:58.:11:03.

a privilege few. -- privileged few. Labour generation that fringed in

:11:03.:11:09.

the face of hardship. Let us show we will not duck the great challenges

:11:09.:11:12.

we are going to face on spending and the deficit. And let us build an

:11:13.:11:19.

economy that works for all working families, in every part of our

:11:19.:11:22.

country. And in the coming weeks and months, when people ask what would a

:11:22.:11:27.

Labour government do? Let's go out and tell them. Jobs for young people

:11:27.:11:30.

guaranteed. Expanding free childcare, a British investment

:11:30.:11:34.

bank, infrastructure delivered, green investment unlock, the deficit

:11:34.:11:42.

down fairly, tax cuts for millions, not the millionaires. Reforming our

:11:42.:11:47.

banks, the NHS saved, tackling tax avoidance, rail fares capped, the

:11:47.:11:53.

bedroom tax scrapped, building the homes we need. That is what a Labour

:11:53.:11:57.

government could do. Let's come together, go out there and make it

:11:57.:11:59.

happen. Thank you, conference. They get to their feet as Ed Balls

:11:59.:12:10.

finishes his address as Shadow Chancellor. He spoke for just over

:12:10.:12:16.

half an hour. The new story in it, he started to distance himself from

:12:16.:12:23.

HS2, the rail line from London to Birmingham, originally a Labour idea

:12:23.:12:25.

picked up by the Coalition Government but he seems to be

:12:25.:12:28.

worried about the escalating cost of it. He says there is no blank cheque

:12:28.:12:34.

for it and he wants to review it along with all the other

:12:34.:12:37.

infrastructure projects he might get involved in. He also said he wanted

:12:38.:12:42.

the Office for Budget Responsibility to look at his sons and spending

:12:42.:12:47.

plans, to get an endorsement, to get them independently audited. He took

:12:47.:12:53.

awhile to get the economy, even though he is Shadow Chancellor, he

:12:53.:12:57.

spent the first pages of his speech sounding more like the Labour

:12:57.:13:00.

leader, but I'm sure there is nothing in that. He promised tough

:13:00.:13:05.

fiscal constraints, he wants a compulsory jobs guarantee. He will

:13:05.:13:12.

pay for that with a tax on bankers bonuses, takeaway pension relief

:13:12.:13:16.

from the highest earners, so everybody gets it at the basic rate

:13:16.:13:20.

of tax. He wants to encourage a living wage and he wants up a levy

:13:20.:13:23.

of tax. He wants to encourage a to be able to pay for more child

:13:23.:13:28.

care. These are the highlights of his speech. We are joined by Sajid

:13:28.:13:34.

Javid to get some reaction to that. Would you make of that? I'm made of

:13:34.:13:42.

that that he is showing a lack of confidence. The conservative

:13:42.:13:49.

government is embarking on a massive £50 billion investment in

:13:49.:13:52.

infrastructure, which tells us that they know that the government as to

:13:52.:13:57.

invest in infrastructure in order to get the economy ticking again. And

:13:57.:14:04.

yet what he is saying is that he's not talking about that, talks about

:14:04.:14:09.

that in a small way, what he's emphasising is he will raise taxes

:14:09.:14:15.

to pay for childcare and to pay for jobs guarantees. But he is losing is

:14:15.:14:19.

the big picture, which the Tory government has finally got, which is

:14:19.:14:23.

the only way you're going to get the revenue you need to bring down the

:14:23.:14:28.

deficit is to invest in infrastructure, stimulate the

:14:28.:14:30.

private sector and then your tax revenues will flow. He's suggesting

:14:30.:14:36.

that HS2 may not be the most productive way of doing that. He

:14:36.:14:40.

wants a rail line to the North but his wandering why it is so

:14:40.:14:41.

expensive. But here you have his wandering why it is so

:14:41.:14:47.

political consensus between all the parties, that £50 billion is needed

:14:47.:14:51.

to kick-start something, in this case for HS2. We have agreement, so

:14:51.:14:58.

the salami slicing around little bits per childcare here and there,

:14:58.:15:03.

that is not what it is about. What did you make of it? Clearly he wants

:15:03.:15:10.

to criticise the Tories further economic policy and he talks about

:15:10.:15:13.

these wasted years of stagnation. What is the real case is that after

:15:13.:15:18.

a global financial crisis, we were never going to recover properly.

:15:18.:15:23.

There has been plenty of analysis, and they take a long time to recover

:15:24.:15:29.

from. The matter who was in charge, we would have years of negative

:15:30.:15:34.

growth and an economy that flat lined -- no matter who was in

:15:34.:15:39.

charge. What is interesting is the economy starting to bloom now. Boom?

:15:39.:15:47.

Many economists are now predicting 3% growth. The profession always

:15:47.:15:57.

gets the amplitude wrong, and it is not until the data comes out

:15:57.:16:01.

properly years later that we realise the down periods were a lot more

:16:01.:16:05.

than and the other periods were a lot more of. So that is what I

:16:05.:16:09.

think, he has missed that. Let me bring in Sajid Javid, the fact is

:16:09.:16:14.

that the economy did not go for three years. We inherited an economy

:16:14.:16:19.

that had just experienced the mother of all recessions, the deepest

:16:19.:16:23.

recession we had seen in peacetime. There was a worldwide financial

:16:23.:16:27.

crash. That did not mean we have to have the biggest deficit of any

:16:27.:16:33.

industrialised country. But our financial services were bigger, so

:16:33.:16:36.

it was going to hit us more. That is because we took our eye off the

:16:37.:16:39.

ball, and when the alarm bells were ringing, no one was listening

:16:40.:16:43.

because we changed the regulatory system. You never objected. With the

:16:43.:16:50.

encouragement of the Conservative Party. We voted against those

:16:50.:16:54.

changes, and Peter Lilley said it would be a field day. It is and

:16:54.:16:58.

groups, and he has been proven right. But you were urging for less

:16:58.:17:06.

regulation. What was important, what I took away from Ed Balls' speech

:17:06.:17:09.

regulation. What was important, what just now is that, first of all,

:17:09.:17:13.

let's look at the words he did not use. He did not say plan be, too far

:17:13.:17:17.

too fast, he did not say triple dip, recession made in Downing

:17:17.:17:22.

Street. Why? Because he knows he has lost the economic argument. The

:17:22.:17:25.

economy is recovering, I would not say it is booming but it is turning

:17:25.:17:29.

the corner. There are still a lot of work to do, and Ed Balls knows that.

:17:29.:17:38.

Now he has not got any policies, other than what he has been talking

:17:39.:17:40.

Now he has not got any policies, about. You would have thought he

:17:40.:17:42.

would have learned the lesson, but it is about more spending and debt.

:17:42.:17:45.

By 2015, will people be worse off or better off than 2010? I hope they

:17:45.:17:49.

will be better off. They are not now. That is our target, to make

:17:49.:17:54.

sure that everyone feels the benefits of economic recovery, and

:17:54.:17:57.

if we are going to do that we have to be serious about tackling our

:17:57.:18:01.

record budget deficit. We have to keep interest rates low and major

:18:01.:18:06.

our economy keeps generating jobs. It is generating jobs today faster

:18:06.:18:10.

than any other country in the G7. There are more people employed today

:18:10.:18:13.

in Britain than at any other time in our history. Excuse me, the Governor

:18:13.:18:19.

of the Bank of England has made it clear you cannot have a substantial

:18:19.:18:22.

fall in unemployment and low interest rates, it is one or the

:18:22.:18:25.

other, what do you want going into 2015, unemployment below 7% or

:18:26.:18:33.

interest rates at 0.5%? We are going to keep focusing on bringing

:18:33.:18:37.

unemployment is down, and the claimant level is coming down. If

:18:37.:18:40.

you look at the forecasts of the major bodies, the major think tank

:18:40.:18:46.

said so forth, they are showing increasing economic growth. I

:18:46.:18:51.

understand that, so in return for unemployment going below 7%,

:18:51.:18:53.

understand that, so in return for although I am not sure it will by

:18:53.:18:56.

2015, although it could, under what you're saying, you are happy to see

:18:56.:19:01.

interest rates rise? That is what the governor says. I think if we

:19:01.:19:05.

stick to our economic policy, which is bringing back confidence, keeping

:19:05.:19:08.

stick to our economic policy, which interest rates low, keeping mortgage

:19:08.:19:13.

rates low, and if the Bank of England decides to do that, it is up

:19:13.:19:16.

to them. With this forward guidance, the governor has told us

:19:16.:19:20.

that if unemployment falls below 7%, he will take it as a sign that the

:19:21.:19:25.

economy is under way and interest rates will have to rise. You

:19:25.:19:28.

comfortable to go into the next election rising interest rates? I

:19:28.:19:36.

trust his judgment. That is not the answer to my question. You are

:19:36.:19:40.

comfortable with rising interest rates? Once the economy starts to

:19:40.:19:43.

recover, and right now we're just the corner, and we have to keep

:19:43.:19:49.

working, it is not a judgment for the government to make. What we have

:19:49.:19:53.

got to do is keep focusing on the deficit, keep reducing taxes on

:19:53.:19:58.

business to generate jobs. Coming back to living standards, at the

:19:58.:20:01.

moment they are substantially below 2010, when you came into power.

:20:01.:20:05.

Prices have consistently risen higher than wages in the public and

:20:05.:20:10.

private sectors. Can I get it clear, are you telling us that that will no

:20:10.:20:14.

longer be the case by 2015, that he will fight the next election with

:20:14.:20:18.

living standards higher than 2010? What I am saying is that we will

:20:18.:20:22.

keep working hard to help people with their living standards and the

:20:22.:20:23.

keep working hard to help people best way to do that is the root

:20:23.:20:27.

page, full-time employment. The fact that the economy is generating jobs

:20:27.:20:32.

faster than anyone else in the G7 is a good thing. Will people be better

:20:32.:20:38.

off or not by 2015? I hope so, but I cannot judge the future. Will you

:20:38.:20:43.

let the office for budget responsible do to an independent

:20:43.:20:51.

audit on Mr Balls' manifesto policies? -- the office of budget

:20:51.:20:53.

responsible to. We created this office in the first

:20:53.:21:01.

place because Gordon Brown fiddled the figures whenever he felt like

:21:01.:21:04.

it, so we have this independent office... That would politicise it.

:21:04.:21:12.

You will not allow it? It would require primary legislation, so it

:21:12.:21:15.

is high in the sky to even think about it. That is not what the Tory

:21:15.:21:19.

chairman of the banking committee says. It would require primary

:21:20.:21:24.

legislation, and Ed Balls has used this Ahmed is a bit of a stunt to

:21:24.:21:26.

take us away from the real argument, this Ahmed is a bit of a stunt to

:21:26.:21:30.

which is an unfunded spending commitments. -- this argument. Thank

:21:30.:21:36.

you for your figures. These are Treasury figures that I have

:21:36.:21:41.

collected. Let's go now, fresh from the speech, to the Shadow Treasury

:21:41.:21:45.

minister, Chris Leslie. Welcome to the Daily Politics. Ed Balls

:21:45.:21:48.

minister, Chris Leslie. Welcome to made it clear that he will stick to

:21:48.:21:51.

the existing coalition spending plans if he is in power for 2015-16,

:21:51.:21:57.

but that is only the first year of any future Labour government, and it

:21:57.:22:00.

does not include capital spending, so you could unleash, put the taps

:22:00.:22:07.

on for 2016? You have only committed to one year, correct? ? We had their

:22:07.:22:18.

Spending Review in 2015-16 in the summer, that one year, and we are

:22:18.:22:21.

only able to talk about that starting point in the context of the

:22:21.:22:24.

announcements that the Chancellor has made. Sadly, that is the bases

:22:24.:22:39.

we are starting from the -- there, even though we have this deficit.

:22:40.:22:44.

You could tell us what your pistol rules would be for the subsequent

:22:44.:22:47.

years, because at the moment we have no idea, and you may be very much by

:22:47.:22:52.

stopping in year one, but you could go back to your profligate ways in

:22:52.:22:57.

years two, three and four. Well, no, look, I think it is a commitment

:22:57.:23:01.

that is quite important for opposition to make. People want to

:23:01.:23:05.

know how we would approach fiscal policy, and I think the fact that we

:23:05.:23:10.

are recognising that we are still going to have a legacy of the

:23:10.:23:15.

deficits despite all the promises that George Osborne made, that it

:23:15.:23:18.

would balance the books, that deficit is still going to be very

:23:18.:23:22.

considerable indeed, and therefore it is only the responsible thing to

:23:22.:23:26.

say to the public, you know, we cannot magic that away, we will have

:23:26.:23:30.

to use it as a starting point, the plans that they have sat out. If

:23:30.:23:34.

Sajid Javid and others are going to be decked for future years, we will

:23:34.:23:39.

look at that at that point. -- going to project. Let me ask you a couple

:23:39.:23:44.

of details, very important details on mansion tax - on houses worth

:23:44.:23:50.

more than £2 million, will that mansion tax be on the value above £2

:23:50.:23:54.

million, or on the whole value of the house? Well, it will not be

:23:54.:24:00.

hitting anybody with properties below £2 million. I am not asking

:24:00.:24:06.

that. We need to have an approach to the mansion tax that looks at those

:24:06.:24:11.

properties... I understand that. It is only on those amounts. Know,

:24:11.:24:18.

clarify that for me. Let me ask you the question again, it is very

:24:18.:24:23.

important - is it on the value over £2 million, supposing it is £3

:24:23.:24:27.

million, the value of the house, is it on that final £1 million, or

:24:27.:24:32.

visit on the full £3 million? Well, no, the rate of tax would be

:24:32.:24:39.

dependent on the calculation is of the numbers of properties at that

:24:39.:24:43.

point in time worth... Am not asking you the raid. Let me finish, please.

:24:43.:24:49.

I have to finish the sentence to explain it. The Government, for

:24:49.:24:53.

example, have just introduced a new regime called the annual tax on

:24:53.:24:57.

envelope dwellings for £2 million and above, where they are owned by

:24:57.:25:01.

companies. The Government, the Treasury have all the methodology

:25:01.:25:04.

for dealing with high-value properties of £2 million and above,

:25:04.:25:10.

the question is, why would they extended... The question is, no, Mr

:25:10.:25:15.

Leslie, the question is quite simple, and you have yet to answer

:25:15.:25:20.

it! Let me try one more time. If we look at a house that is valued at £3

:25:20.:25:24.

million, above the £2 million that you have said will be where the

:25:24.:25:28.

mansion tax kicks in, will be you have said will be where the

:25:28.:25:32.

mansion tax, whatever level it is, will it fall just on the incremental

:25:32.:25:37.

1 million, or will it fall on the full 3 million? Well, obviously, on

:25:37.:25:42.

the incremental, because properties below £2 million will not be

:25:42.:25:43.

affected by this. They will not be below £2 million will not be

:25:43.:25:47.

classified as mansions. The Liberal Democrats came up with a proposal

:25:47.:25:52.

that they think around £2 million can be raised from this, so it is

:25:52.:25:56.

not just something that is the preserve of the Labour Party. You

:25:56.:26:00.

have not and my question, that is fine, that is your privilege. No,

:26:00.:26:08.

you do not like the answer. No, I do not understand, because you have not

:26:08.:26:11.

and said on that distinction. How big will the bankers' levy have to

:26:11.:26:17.

be to raise the extra 800 million? Well, the bank levy was supposed to

:26:17.:26:23.

be yielding £2.5 billion from the moment at which the Chancellor

:26:23.:26:27.

designed it in the way that he did. It was unusual, because he set out

:26:27.:26:30.

the amount that he was targeting explicitly, 2.5 billion in every

:26:30.:26:35.

year. Every year in the House of Commons we have had that debate, it

:26:35.:26:40.

raised, I think, 1.8 billion... He has had to increase it. And every

:26:40.:26:43.

raised, I think, 1.8 billion... He year he has failed to get it. How

:26:43.:26:48.

big will you make it? We believe that it needs to be, the methodology

:26:48.:26:54.

needs to be adjusted so we can get the extra £800 million, and we would

:26:54.:26:58.

use that, importantly, to increase the hours of free childcare from

:26:59.:27:04.

15... I know what you are going to do, I understand that. You are going

:27:04.:27:08.

to use the money for that, I just wondered what the rate would be.

:27:08.:27:14.

Finally, briefly, do you take 800 million out of the banks, it is less

:27:14.:27:17.

they will have to lead to small businesses, correct question me I do

:27:17.:27:23.

not accept that. Banks have all sorts of reserves, they have costs,

:27:23.:27:29.

compensation, as they call it, to senior management. They are more

:27:29.:27:34.

than able to deal with the £2.5 billion that George Osborne said

:27:35.:27:38.

they should be paying. Why hasn't he got that amount of them? It is a

:27:38.:27:42.

scandal, the banks are paying less and less tax under this government.

:27:42.:27:47.

All right, we have run out of time. Everyone else is paying more. Oh,

:27:47.:27:54.

still going! Just time to get the answer to the quiz, which film

:27:54.:27:59.

doesn't make Ed Balls cry? I have got no idea, Bambi, he did not cry

:27:59.:28:03.

at Bambi. I do not know why you would cry at the Antiques Roadshow

:28:03.:28:06.

at Bambi. I do not know why you but not at Bambi! What kind

:28:06.:28:08.

at Bambi. I do not know why you person is that?! Anyway, there you

:28:08.:28:13.

go. Thanks to our guests today, you have had to sit through the party

:28:13.:28:18.

conference speech. We have got more of it next week with the Tories!

:28:18.:28:23.

Sorry that we did not renew Adam's mood box, I have heard it is very

:28:23.:28:28.

good. Thanks to all of our guests. The one o'clock news is starting on

:28:28.:28:31.

BBC One, James Landale will be hosting today at conference after

:28:31.:28:38.

Newsnight on BBC Two. And we will be back tomorrow, Jo and I, with not

:28:38.:28:41.

one but two programmes on the Labour back tomorrow, Jo and I, with not

:28:41.:28:46.

conference, what value we give you! From midday, and normal conference

:28:46.:28:49.

Marshall, then a quick break, back at two o'clock for a very important

:28:49.:28:55.

speech for Ed Miliband. Goodbye!

:28:56.:28:57.

Andrew Neil with the latest political stories, including live coverage of shadow chancellor Ed Balls' speech to the Labour party conference.


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