27/11/2013 Daily Politics


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This is the Daily Politics. Waging war on EU migration, the Prime


Minister says he wants to make it harder for EU immigrants to claim


benefits in the UK, and they will not qualify for jobless benefits


until they have been here for three months. They will not receive


housing benefit immediately either. It has led to what EU commission


accusing Mr Cameron of an unfortunate overreaction and warning


that Britain risks being seen as the nasty country of the EU. We will ask


the Bulgarian ambassador if he is right. Will it get nasty at PMQs? It


normally does, tune in for the action at midday.


And we will be discussing pigs in the trough, not MPs and their


expenses, or even Andrew and his noises, the real thing!


All that and more coming up in the next 90 minutes and with us for the


duration two former BBC employees who have moved on to bigger and


better things, I wish we all could! That is what it says down here.


Esther McVey, formerly of the Heaven And Earth Show, Shopping City and


How Do They Do That? , who was now the employment must. Owen Smith used


to work on Radio 4's flagship Today programme, never heard of it either!


For the better-known programme in Wales, Dragon's Eye, we all watched


that! He is now the shadow Welsh secretary, I do not know whether


that is a promotional deal motion. Welcome to you both. What a thing to


say! If we decide to take an early lunch... Just move in here. We do


not get the autocue! Let's talk about their current day jobs, Esther


is pretty rare these days, let me get this right, she's female, a


Tory, she has a seat in the North of England, and she is not standing


down at the next election, a bit unusual. At the last count, there


are three standing down, three and a half if you include Louise Mensch!


And you have managed to escape the exodus. Absolutely, I am a


Conservative MP on Merseyside, you said the North, but in my hometown.


Merseyside is the North, isn't it? Yes, I was just pointing it out


specifically. Sarah Wollaston, another one of the 2010 intake, she


says something needs to be done to detoxify this role of being a female


Tory MP. And? Go on! Is she right? Absolutely not! For me, someone who


tried for ten years to become a Conservative MP, and the only one on


Merseyside, it was because I believe in what are timeless values. It is


not always a sexy message, sometimes that is the difficulty, living


within your means, saving, looking after yourself, having these sort of


freedoms to do things, not always sexy, but it is the truth. It is


about a long-term message, about building strong foundations, it is


about being secure, and all of these things, we have just got to reach


out and make sure that they are relevant at the moment, which we


know they are, with making sure workdays, making sure education


system is sound, so you know... It was not a Jew for a speech, just a


question! So you do not agree with Sarah Wollaston, do you agree with


Nick Boles that you are seen as the party of the rich? Absolutely not,


it is a party that cut through all classes, all parts of the country,


all different regions, all different ethnicities, because it is built on


very strong foundations and core values. Everybody knows you have to


live within your means, everybody knows... But you are proportionally


more southerners, you are an exception. That being the case, we


need to make sure I am no longer the exception, that we go out and build


on what we have got, but it is the oldest party, it is always


modernising, the first to have a female leader, all these things. So


you do not agree with Sarah Wollaston, you do not agree with


Nick Boles, are there any of your colleagues that you agree with?


Yeah, the rest of them! They all believe that this is the party to be


in. Either way this is the party that is actually digging the country


out of the mess, and that is what we always do, isn't it? Pick up the


pieces when we have been left in debt, left in a vulnerable position,


and that is what we do. It is good to see you so on message! Listen, I


am not on message, hang on a sec, Andrew, I am not on message, this is


the reason I bought for ten years to become a Conservative MP, because


that is what I believe in. It is not about message, that is the reason I


did it. I do not know why this individual Tory MP decided to


resign, but the reason the papers are running a story about the Tory


party potentially not being a welcoming place for women is that


there is still a perception that the Tory party went through what was


effectively a spin operation, trying to present itself as having


modernised, and did manifestly has not. Spin operation?! You would


never get Labour doing that! They have tried to present themselves as


a modernised party... The key thing is, you said, I do not know why she


stood down, and that is why what you have just said was all hyperbole and


a spin. You don't know why. I want to come on to Scotland, and


Labour's attitude towards it. Do you agree with the Welsh First Minister,


Carwyn Jones, that Scotland should not be allowed to keep sterling as


part of a currency union? I don't think he said that. What he said


was, in the event that Scotland voted to leave the UK, he would hope


and expect that the Welsh Assembly Government, the Welsh people more


broadly, as part of a currency union, would have some say... He


described it as a recipe for instability, and these things matter


in a time of crisis. I think that is entirely right, it would be


destabilising in Scotland left the UK. I think what he said was that he


would expect the Welsh people and the Welsh government, as one of the


parties in the union, one of the parties in the currency union, to


have a proper seat at the table in any negotiation that followed a


referendum to get Scotland to leave the union. I would be uncomfortable


being part of a currency union with competing governments trying to run


it. I think that is a legitimate concern. Are you against it? I would


be worried that if Scotland were to leave the union, we would expect


there to be a currency union between a Scotland outside the Union in


other respects, but inside the currency. What he was pointing out


was two things, that there are many and answered questions in


yesterday's white paper, and that Wales would expect to have a say in


how it would play out. Are you against a currency union of Scotland


went independent? Personally, I do not think Scotland will go


independent. I would like to put on record that I do not think they are


going to. Look, Scotland is having a referendum, and you can only have


the debate if you assume, on some of the questions that people like me


asked, that it goes independent. You can do other questions that assume


that it stays part of the Union, but if it did go independent, would


Labour support a currency union Kaymer on current evidence and


polling, it is reasonable to assume they will not, but I would expect


there to be a very detailed discussion between the British


government... Of course there will be a detailed discussion, Alex


Salmond is not fixing independence until 2016, that is not what I asked


you. It is very hard to say, isn't it, whether it would be the rest of


the UK at that point, Britain's interests to expel Scotland from the


currency union? Since devolution, why has Wales been the worst


performing part of the UK? In what sense? According to the centre for


public policy at the University of Glasgow, in terms of productivity,


per capita GDP, unemployment, performance of schools and


hospitals. What more do I need to say? That is a very sweeping


generalisation, I do not think it stands up to scrutiny. I have read


the research, and I do not think it stands up. In terms of per capita


GDP? We have declined versus England in terms of per capita GDP, but the


overall amount of GDP generated by Wales over that period as increased,


the volume of jobs has increased, productivity on three or four


different measures has increased. The reality is that we know that


Wales, like the north-east of England and other post-industrial


parts of Britain, like the north-west, are parts of Britain


where it is more difficult to generate economic growth, and that


is why we have seen those parts struggling to a greater extent.


Let's be clear, Wales is hit harder by the policies of the Tory


governorate in Westminster, worse economic performance in Wales as a


result of greater difficulties. You'll be pleased to know that an


employment, when you talk about national things like jobs, you be


pleased to know that unemployment is significantly down... We outweigh


over and we have to stop. It is a good start! Jo. It is more than a


year since Andrew Mitchell clashed with a police officer as he cycled


out of Downing Street, but did he use the word pleb? Yesterday the


Crown Prosecution Service said there was insufficient evidence to support


either the former chief whip, who insists he did not, or the police


officer, who says he did. Both are sticking to their stories, this is


what Andrew Mitchell had to say yesterday. I have told the truth


about these incidents. The police did not. My reputation was


destroyed. I was vilified relentlessly over 33 days, with over


808 females received during the course of that first week. -- 800


hate e-mails. I and my family were driven from my home, with as many as


20 journalists and photographers camped outside. My children were


followed by the press. My 92-year-old mother-in-law was


pursued in Swansea. I was spat out in the street. I lost my job after a


career spanning more than 25 years in Parliament, serving my


constituents, my party and my country. Andrew Mitchell giving a


press conference yesterday, Esther McVey, do you feel sorry for him? I


do, and I think that was very heartfelt, because you have the


trial in the media, speculation, nobody got to the root of what


happened, and yet people felt free to say whatever they wanted to, and


when you look at what happens to his family, what happened to his wife,


his mother-in-law, his daughter, you know, you have to reflect on that


and think what the man as an individual has gone through. He


started off with the word the truth, and that is what we are searching


for. It is still disputed. That goes to the very heart, really, of, you


know, the police, the organisation, is this something we have faith in?


I think it is really important... Have you lost faith in the police?


No, but they need to get to the bottom of this to ensure that


everybody has faith, that they will always be treated fairly. What we


are looking at here is an unfair situation, and an unresolved


situation. Was David Cameron wrong to sack him, in effect? At the time,


what he needed to do was not have a distraction of what was going on in


the House, he was the chief whip, so in that regard, you thought, I do


not want this stopping us getting on with our day-to-day business,


because whether it is opposition, the media or whatever, it would


constantly being pulled back to the person, rather than the job to get


the country right. I understood what he did, and so Andrew did not want


to be a distraction to the Government business... I think he


would like to come back. You know what? He may well do. Do you think


so? If he is exonerated? There is not an opportunity for him to be


completely exonerated, he would have to take some sort of libel action


himself. You think he should clear his name once and for all? I cannot


say what he should and should not do, but if he believes that is the


party should follow, and he's a very tenacious man, obviously a strong


man, if he thinks that he can put his family through that, then that


is what he should pursue and do. What about the police? Esther McVey


talked about the trust in the police, we have had this statement


from the CPS, one officer charged, five others facing misconduct


proceedings. How do you feel about the police now? Disappointed,


because I think all of us want our police to be as well respected and


well trusted as they have been traditionally, and this has clearly


cast a pall over policing in Britain, and we do need to trust our


police. It is a vital part of our society, people have got trust and


faith in the honesty, above all else, the police, and therefore this


is a serious matter. I know there is now one prosecution that is being


taken forward, but it is still a question of the said, she said,


there are still contested evidence about who said what at the gates of


Downing Street. But I think the whole affair, as it has played out,


has been deeply unfortunate. As it poisoned relations between the


police and politicians particularly? No, because most people operating as


politicians in their constituencies or in Westminster work extremely


well alongside local and national plea, and I think there are still


respect and trust. And still a general belief the police will act


honestly but we do and you need to see further reforms. It's crucial we


have standards in the police that people can properly respectful we


have the report from Lord Stevens in which he said, in respect of this


Plebgate affair, it underlines to have stronger standards,


investigative standards, the recommendation you should merge the


IPCC and the HMI C. They shouldn't investigate themselves? There seems


to be missed trust and duplication because it is the police


investigating the police, quite often. I think we need to review


that to restore some trust. Should Andrew Mitchell be given his job


back? I don't know, it's a question for the Prime Minister. I don't know


what he said Downing Street also I know what he says and what the


policeman said he says, so I'm not in a position to judge. If the said


what he is alleged to have said, it's a serious thing. Why do this


become such a big issue? In part, it's about the perception that the


Tories are the party which represents the village and the rich


in this country and that's why it rang true for lots of people.


Fundamentally, it actually getting the country back on its feet and


getting an extra million people into employment. And cutting taxes.


Astor, the notion of the Tory party is that party of the workers is


ridiculous. I will have to stop you there. Andrew. Now how do you try


and see off UKIP and please your backbenchers all in one go? Talk


tough on immigration, of course, especially EU immogration. David


Cameron has outlined a number of new measures to crack down on EU


migrants coming to the UK in the future. Writing, ironically, in that


most pro-Eu of papers, the Financial Times, the Prime Minister said


people were deeply concerned about levels of migration from Bulgaria


and Romania. So what are the details? The Borgen British


podcasting has the information. Brigitte Nyborg, you can call me.


David Cameron has today announced a number of restrictions to welfare


for current and future migrants from other EU countries, which he hopes


to implement next year with the support of the Liberal Democrats. Mr


Cameron says migrants shouldn't be able to receive out-of-work benefits


for the first three months. And payments will be stopped after six


months unless the claimant has a genuine chance of a job. An earnings


threshold will also be introduced, new migrants will not be able to


claim housing benefit immediately. And anyone not seeking work will be


sent back and won't be able to return for 12 months. The


announcement comes ahead of the restrictions affecting Bulgarian and


Romanians being able to come here and work, which have been in place


since 2007, expiring at the end of next month. Mr Cameron also wants to


restrict the numbers coming to the UK from current and new EU countries


in the future, saying the right of free movement in Europe couldn't be


unqualified. But European Commissioner Laszlo Andor has warned


David Cameron of hysteria and the UK being seen as a nasty country. While


Labour's Yvette Cooper said the Prime Minister was playing catch-up


and copying their idea. Andrew, back to you. Thanks, Borgen. I'm joined


now by the head of UKIP's policy unit, Tim Aker. You have a policy


unit? When did that happen? If David Cameron got that through, we would


have more controlled migration from Eastern Europe and still all the


benefits of labour capital. You can tell there's an election round the


corner because David Cameron starts talking like a Eurosceptic. They've


already said the knot breeze to this, they're not least the right to


residency proposals so they take Mr the European Court of Justice. If he


gets this through, it's a step in the right direction but we have


known this when Bulgaria and Romania joined. Why now am so late, are they


talking about it now? We have known for ages the restrictions are coming


off in January. And this is now November for the why has he waited


so long? He hasn't waited so long. It's two years worth of work, Iain


Duncan Smith, Teresa May, putting these in place and fermenting them.


There are various stages you got to deal with, domestic legislation but


you have got to see what is acceptable, what would be working


within the EU framework. None of this will be in place by January.


Yes, it will, actually. The two things in place will be the habitual


residence test, a tougher, stronger more accurate thing which wasn't


there before. The other thing in place in January is the six months


in the country, which is coming from the Home Office. You don't need


legislation for that? So it happening? It's not a border control


issue, to benefit issue. You're not restricting the numbers. European


commissioners are very unhappy with this so they will do what they have


done over the rights to residency proposals, they will take it to the


European court of justice. That takes a long while. There are two


parts to this. It will take a while but the numbers will still come.


200,000 Roma here. You need to have a serious discussion about where the


EU has competence and it doesn't control the borders. You are quite


right, the commission standing alone here. We have now gathered support


across various countries across Europe who are like-minded with us


and it shows how far removed the commissioners's views are the people


on the ground. It's taken two years to get on the ground. Iain Duncan


Smith was in Paris last week, and we are getting a critical mass who are


thinking the same things. We will have the habitual residence test,


the removal after six months, and in the various other things which are


coming will be in place next year. I will come to Labour in a minute.


Which European countries agreed welfare payments should be stopped


after six months? They have different rules of the moment, so


you have places like Germany, they would say you have got to have done


stuff so long, different rules, we are all different. But they don't


agree with that specifically? Whether it's from general taxation


or the insurance rules or contributory system in the paid


into, so the rules are slightly different. Which country agrees that


those not seeking work will be removed and not able to attend the


12 months? That its future work going on for the other four David


Cameron... You told me you had all these countries lined up who were


backing us. And they will be Germany, Spain, Denmark... All these


countries support that? They are working with us, that's right. Where


is the evidence any of these countries reporters on this? These


are the negotiations which have been done the two years. I follow German


and French politics carefully and I'm not aware of those governments


supporting this. Were you at the same meeting of Iain Duncan Smith


two weeks ago in Paris? Are you telling me Iain Duncan Smith had a


breakthrough at these meetings and France and Germany will support the


return to host country after 12 months? I am saying is this is what


we are all agreeing at the moment for the David Cameron is leading the


way. I'm asking a game for them to the French and Germans agree with


this or not? If they do, where are they on the record saying they do


so? You do your domestic, consensus of opinion,


benefits for the first three months? Yes I supported as eight months ago.


Does Labour support stopping payments after six months and less


of a genuine chance for a job? On all of these things, actually. We


have not seen the details for that we have only seen one article, so it


needs to be looked at. They are pretty clear policies. Will new


migrants not be able to claim housing benefit immediately? I


think, again, alongside the three-month rule, that's probably


reasonable. Do you agree those not seeking work should be removed and


not be able to return for 12 months? Again, I want to see the


detail. They are talking about... They are saying if they see beggars


and vagrants from Eastern Europe and they can't show that they are


queueing up to do any work, they will be removed. Do you agree with


that? Howard sack the other going to determine that question how will


they know? -- how are they going to determine that? So you might not


support that? We need to see the detail, Andrew. The key thing, the


law changes. The reality is, Labour... Left us in this mess. It


was the way we dealt with immigration. You have done this. The


key thing, the reason we have been ahead of the game... You haven't.


You have to let him speak. If that Cooper gave a speech in which she


said you should title the habitual residency. Too late. We have been


doing it for two years. People should be of claim benefits abroad.


And dealing with a minimum wage. Excuse me. Excuse me. Can I just...


It's all about party politics. Listen to me. This is an unpleasant


arms race for the three of you, trying to be nasty to foreigners.


That's what the three of you wondering. Labour, of all parties,


which allowed for mass immigration when you were in power, for you now


to try to outdo the Tories in being nasty. Migrants, it really is quite


remarkable. Labour has learned the lesson that we fail to appreciate


what a big impact it would have on working-class communities where


there's a lot of low-wage people. And now we want to recognise the


fact that we should put in place transitional controls, we should


have thought about the impact on the working classes. Should've,


could've, would have. Excuse me. Be quiet, both of you. A final question


to my UKIP guest. Do you think a lot of Romanians and Bulgarians will


come in January? Yes. Potentially for the if I was in their position,


and very low standard of living. These two have been bickering for


years over this issue. UKIP is on the rise. The Tory held seat, if


third now. Congratulations. Are you determine to speak over every time I


speak? You're doing pretty well so far. Nobody said the challenge of


being the UK's foremost broadcaster was an easy one. Trying to maintain


impartiality during such a turbulent debate is nigh on impossible. Maybe


I shouldn't confess this but, well, I feel I'm among friends. Well, I


did until I started this programme! The question is this: In or out? Can


we still dip our Scottish shortbread into our English breakfast tea? And,


if the biscuit gets soggy and falls in, whose turn is it to clean up the


Daily Politics mug? Not me! Well, my bravehearts, you can make the


choice. Destiny can be in your hands whether you're from Paisley or


Penge, Portadown or Pontypridd! But only if you win this little beauty.


Well read. We'll remind you how to enter in a minute. But let's see if


you can remember when this happened. We have become a grandmother. Other


grandson. Called Michael. -- they grandson.


# How can we dance when our world is turning? # How do we sleep whilst


our Beds are burning? Here we are for the first time in the House of


Commons televised. # Here we are, back to reality. I still think I'm


doing what I believe to be right. # I hear your voice, it's like an


angel sighing # I have no choice, I hear your voice # Feels like flying.


# I close my eyes. To be in with a chance of winning a


Daily Politics mug, send your answer to our special quiz email address.


That's [email protected] And you can see the full terms and conditions


for Guess The Year on our website. He has been fired, I can tell you.


Let's take a look at Big Ben. . Yes, Prime Minister's Questions is on its


way. If you'd like to comment on proceedings you can email us at


[email protected] Or tweet your thoughts using the hashtag


#bbcdp. We'll read some out after PMQs. Nick Robinson is here fresh


north of the border. There is not an earthquake in Messman stuck because


Big Ben was bouncing up and down. -- in Westminster. I have got to ask,


what a beautiful Mr Miller band to do today? It will be interesting to


see if he wants to mention immigration. -- Ed Miliband. I doubt


that. I think you'll want to talk about health. Let's go straight to


the Commons. This morning I had meetings of


ministerial colleagues and others and in addition to my duties in this


House, I shall have further such meetings later today.


This week I have launched a cross-party campaign with the


support of the GMB union to provide justice for the 3230 workers and


their families who were victims of blacklisting by 44 construction


companies. We have written to all the companies involved and will post


their responses on our website. Will the Prime Minister join me in this


campaign to support hard-working people and stamp out the terrible


disease of blacklisting? I am very glad to join my honourable friend,


and I congratulate him on the work that he has done on this issue.


Blacklisting is illegal, blacklisting is wrong. This sort of


intimidation is wrong, just as intimidation of non-striking workers


or indeed managers is also wrong. I am happy to condemn both forms of


intimidation, and I hope others will as well. Mr Ed Miliband. Mr


Speaker... Mr Speaker, following his U-turn on payday lending, can I ask


the Prime Minister why he has moved in two short months from believing


that intervening in broken markets is living, and I quote, in a Marxist


universe, to believing it is a solemn duty of government? Well, as


I have said, there are some dreadful practices that take place in the


payday lending market, and there are some very disturbing cases, and


frankly for 13 years they did absolutely nothing about it! So I am


proud of the fact, I am proud of the fact that we have intervened to


regulate this market properly, and we are also going to be put in place


a cap. Mr Speaker, let me be very fair to the right honourable friend.


I followed very carefully his interview on Desert Island discs,


and I think it is there to say that he is no longer a follower of marks,


he is having angels instead. -- Engels. Ed Miliband!


You would have thought he would be spending his time as Prime Minister,


Mr Speaker. What is surprisingly off what is surprising, Mr Speaker, is


that the Chancellor said just a few weeks ago, and I quote, that


attempts to fix prices crash endeavour and blunt aspiration. For


the avoidance of doubt, can he just reassure us that his U-turn had


nothing to do with the prospect of losing a vote in parliament the


following day? I am sorry the right honourable gentleman has had a


slight sense of humour failure, not a very good start to these


exchanges! I have done a little bit of research, Mr Speaker, and in


three years he has never asked me a question about payday lending, not


once! Not a single question. I have been asked about all sorts of


things, look, it is right to intervene when markets are not


working and people are getting hurt, that is what we are doing. 13


years they had, they looked at a cap in 2004, and they rejected it. That


was when he was working in the Treasury. We have looked at a cap,


we looked at the evidence from Australia and elsewhere, it is the


right thing to do, and I am proud that we are doing it. Ed Miliband!


Mr Speaker, even by his standards, this is a bit rich. On the 22nd of


May 2012, they voted against capping payday lenders. On the 4th of July


2011, they voted against capping payday lenders. On the 3rd of


February 2011, they voted against capping payday lenders. We were for


it, they were against it. Clearly, he wants to claim... Clearly, he


wants to claim this is a principled decision, so can the Prime Minister


explain why the Government intervening to cap the cost of


credit is right, but the Government capping energy bills is communism? I


feel like one of those radio hosts who says, and your complaint is,


caller? We are taking action when they did not take action. We are


doing the right thing. He should be standing up and congratulating as.


He wants to turn... He wants to turn to energy, let me turn specifically


to energy. The point is we do not have control of the international


price of gas, so what we need to do is have more competition to get


profits down, and roll back the costs of regulation to get prices


down. That is a proper energy policy, and when it comes... We know


his version of intervention, his version of intervention is take


money from the Co-op and do not ask any questions! Ed Miliband! Mr


Speaker, Mr Speaker, here is the reality... Here is the reality, this


is not a minor policy adjustment, it is an intellectual collapse of their


position, because the two months, because for two months they have


been saying that if you take action to intervene in markets, it is back


to the 1970s, it is Marxism, and now they realise they are on the wrong


side of public opinion. That is the reality. Now, on energy, on


energy... On energy, he must realise... Order! We will get


through Question Time. However long it takes! I appealed to members


simply to calm down and think of the electorate, who we are here to


serve. Very straightforward, Ed Miliband! They are shouting because


they have no answer, Mr Speaker, and he must realise the gravity of the


situation, when there are figures this week showing 31,000 deaths as a


result of the cold winter, with around 10,000 as a result of cold


homes. So can he explain how things are going to be better this winter


than they were last? Well, what they will be this winter, and this is a


vitally important issue, what there will be is the cold weather payments


that we have doubled from their previous level. They will be in


place. The Winter fuel payment will be in place, the warm homes discount


that helps two million people in our country, that will be in place. The


increase of the pension, that will be in place. Now, look, every excess


deaths in the winter is a tragedy, and there were 31,000 last year. He


might care to recall that when he was Energy Secretary, there were


36,500. Ed Miliband! Mr Speaker, I asked him a very specific question,


how will it be better this winter than last? On the reality, prices


are going to be higher than last. For the average household, the


British Gas bill went up ?123 this week, and it was also revealed that


the profits of the energy companies are up 75% in the last year alone.


Why, under his government, is unacceptable for the British people


to pay exorbitant prices to fund exorbitant profits? What is


intellectual incoherence is not to address the fact that there were


36,500 winter deaths when he was standing here as Energy Secretary,


and that number was low at last year. What is intellectual


incoherence is to promise a price freeze for 20 months' time when you


do not control the global price of gas, incoherent and a total con.


While we are on the collapse of intellectual positions, more


borrowing, more spending, more taxing - exactly the things that got


us into this mess in the first place, and he remains committed to


each and everyone! Ed Miliband! Mr Speaker, I will tell you what is a


con, it is saying one thing before the election and then another thing


as Prime Minister. Here is what the honourable member for Richmond, here


is what the honourable member for Richmond said about him, he likes


reading out tweets, Mr Speaker, maybe will listen to this one. If


the PM can casually drop something that was so central to his


identity, he can drop anything. Hashtag green crap, that is this


Prime Minister all over! The truth is that any action he takes on the


cost of living prices is that he is being dragged there kicking and


screaming. On the cost of living prices, he is not the solution, he


is the problem. Nobody believes that he or his cabinet had any sense of


the pressures facing the people of Britain! I think everyone can


recognise a collapse when they see one, we just saw one right now!


Isn't it interesting... Isn't it interesting, the week before the


autumn statement, he cannot ask about the economy because it is


growing? He cannot ask about the deficit because it is falling, he


cannot ask about the numbers on work because they are rising. People can


see that we have a long-term plan to turn our country around, and people


can also see him sitting in his room, desperate for bad news to suit


his own short-term political interests!


Mr George Freeman! Mr Speaker, one in eight men will be diagnosed with


prostate cancer, the silent killer of middle-aged men. Survival rates


have risen to 80% because of improvements in science and


charities which have gone from five blokes raising $500 to the world's


biggest prostate charity. With the Prime Minister meet with me and


representatives of UK research charities to help the UK innovate


more quickly I think my honourable friend raises a very important


issue, where everybody wants to see more research and better outcomes in


terms of prostate cancer, and can I personally praise for that


magnificent growth on his top lip? I have noticed a number of my


colleagues suddenly resembling banditos and others on these


benches, not something I am fully capable of myself, I am jealous on


those grounds as well! But this is important, better diagnosis, better


knowledge and information are all vital to beat prostate cancer. The


Prime Minister one said he wanted to see rising living standards for


all, not just rewards for those in high finance. Why, then, real wages


down by over ?1600, while bank bonuses are up by 83%? That is


happening because we are cutting taxes, disposable income went up


last year, and what we have done is lit the first ?10,000 that people


turn out of tax altogether. That is worth ?700 for every person who pays


that tax. That is something he should be welcoming. In addition, we


have frozen the council tax, cuts the petrol duty, and helped in all


sorts of ways with family incomes. Every single step opposed by the


party opposite. Mr Richard Fuller. Thank you, Mr Speaker. This


foundation provides an lifting support for people living with


dementia in Bedfordshire and for their carers. -- uplifting.


Following his challenge on dementia last year and ahead of the G8 Summit


that he will host in London next month, can my right honourable


friend send a message to my constituents about his commitment to


achieving real progress on dementia research and care? I am very


grateful to my honourable friend for raising this issue. I think for too


long in our country people thought of dementia as a natural part of


ageing, rather than what it is, a disease that we should be fighting


with all the energy that we are fighting heart disease and fighting


cancer. As part of the dementia challenge, we will double research


funding over the lifetime of this Government, from 26 million to up to


66 million per year in 2014-15, but we also want to see an increase in


diagnosis rates, because getting to grips with this early, and we want


the rates to go to two thirds. I think is constituents will welcome


those pledges. Through the G8 chairmanship, we can galvanise


action around the world as well. Mr Speaker, REPORTER: Years the people


of Scotland were promised they would receive a detailed and costed white


paper to answer all their questions. Instead they got a thick document


full of false promises. In the absence of detailed costings, it was


not a blueprint for independence but a wish list. Given that the entire


white paper is based on the assumption that Scotland would keep


the pound as part of a sterling zone with no Plan B, can the Prime


Minister tell us whether that lack of Plan B calls into question the


entire credibility of the white paper? I very much agree with the


honourable gentleman. We have been waiting a long time for this


document. We were told it would answer every question, and yet no


answer on the currency, no answer on the issue of EU membership, no


proper answers one NATO. We were left with a huge set of questions,


and for Scottish people, also the prospect of a ?1000 bill has the


price of separation. Thank you, Mr Speaker.


Thank you, Mr Speaker! We are celebrating a year after new owners


of the former Pfizer site and with our commitment to small and


medium-sized enterprises in Kent, we now have 1400 jobs and 60 companies.


Would the Prime Minister agree with me that when the private sector


needs a proactive government, we can replicate these sorts of successors


around the country? Can I praise for the work she in. Clearly it was a


blower Pfizer made their decision and I think many people thought it


would be the end of that site in terms of jobs and investment but


because of the hard work she is put in, and also my right honourable


friend, the Business Secretary, and the science minister, a huge amount


of work, the enterprise zone is working well, attracted over 20


high-tech companies, and Pfizer is now staying with 500 jobs as well.


It has been a success and shows if you work with the private sector,


you can get good results like this. Andy McDonald. The disability


benefits Consortium, over 50 charities have signed a letter to


the Secretary of State calling for immediate action to exempt disabled


people from the bedroom tax. Why on earth does he and his government


refused to listen? What we have done is exempt disabled people who need


an extra room but it does, I think, come back to a basic issue of


fairness. And that basic issue with this. People in private sector


rented accommodation who get housing benefit and don't get a subsidy for


a spare room whereas people in council houses do get a subsidy for


spare rooms and that's why I think it was right to end that, thinking


of the 1.8 million people in our country on housing waiting lists. I


wonder what the is to have a chance to watch any of the fantastic rugby


league World Cup semifinal match which took place between England and


New Zealand at the weekend? The tournament has been a great success


and shortly rugby fans will have the Rugby union World Cup to look


forward to in 2015 with games in England and Wales. Will he agree


with me that the great interest in rugby presents an opportunity for my


constituency to attract visitors to the birthplace of the game? I think


he is absolutely right that it is the best possible advertisement for


his time and I have done a public meeting in his high Street and know


what a varied reception you can get in the town of rugby. It's hard to


keep up with a quantity and quality of rugby union and rugby league


games. I made a wager with a New Zealand Prime Minister I would wear


a kiwi cuff link if they won in the rugby union match and they did so


last week but fortunately, nobody noticed. The Prime Minister has


vowed to fight for the UK with its head, heart and soul, but when it


comes to a debate of guts, we now have a blueprint for independence.


We know what his UK will look like. Will he now stop being pathetic and


debate the issues with the first Minister? I'm enjoying the debate


were having now, which is where it should take place. Of course, there


should be a debate including televised debates, but this is a


debate between people in Scotland. This is not a debate between the


leader of the Conservative Party and the UK Prime Minister and the


Scottish first Minister? It's a debate between the leader of the no


campaign and the leader of the yes campaign. And they should fight it


out on the facts. And on the issues. I know you want to find every


destruction possible because when it comes the economy, jobs, Europe, all


the arguments are for staying together. For future reference, you


shouldn't be yelling at the Prime Minister like an overexcited puppy


dog. It is unseemly. You can do a lot better if you try. Mary McLeod.


Small businesses and traders, 40 million people employed in them, in


Bradford and I is the web, 825 new business has been set up in the last


two years. -- I saw worth. Will you join with me in encouraging


businesses to become champions in all of our secondary schools to


inspire another generation of entrepreneurs? First of all, the new


businesses setting up in Britain, we do have 400,000 more businesses than


three years ago, but the point she makes about encouraging businesses


into schools to inspire young people about enterprise, about small


business and what that can involve, I think it's really important and I


would urge all MPs to make the most of small business Saturday and in


the visits they make to primary schools and secondary schools to


push the case for good business access and discussions. Four weeks


ago in Eccles, I met a woman, 55 years old, a mother married to


Tony. For the last four years, Joyce had problems in their memory and on


her 55th birthday she was diagnosed with onset dementia. Her family are


devastated but his inspirational woman and now fighting for better


services for people in similar circumstances. Will he ensure at the


G8, in London in two weeks time, there is a real plus for increase in


research and quality of care and support and prevention as well as


the important search for a cure? She's absolutely right. There was no


one single thing we have to do. The research budget is going up but we


also need to work within the health and social care sector to improve


standards but frankly, we also need to make our communities more


dementia friendly and something all of us can do is actually to become a


dementia friend, a simple relatively short test, and that of learning,


about how to help people in our communities with dementia. It's when


people are trying to go on a bus, or access their bank account, or go to


the post office, how they live their lives with something we can all make


a difference too. Last Friday, on the border between Gibraltar in


Spain, one about the dramatic pouches was opened, clear breach of


our sovereignty, -- diplomatic pouches. I ask what further


measures, political and indeed any other measures we can take towards


Spain, to stop this harassment of our people in Gibraltar? First of


all, he is right to raise this because it is a breach of the


principle of state immunity and the principles underlying in the Vienna


Convention on diplomatic conventions. It's a serious action


which took place. We asked the Spanish authorities to investigate


and they have done that and we are perceived and expiration. We are


reassured this will not happen again but that me be absolutely clear, we


will always stand up for the rights of people in Gibraltar and for the


sovereignty of Gibraltar. Earlier the Primus tag line for the


government is doing in relation to fuel poverty in the winter. -- the


Prime Minister. Outlined. The further north, incomes are lower,


the Colbert is, and fuel prices are higher. What additional measures can


he take to ensure the alleviates the problems suffered by people in


Northern Ireland? I do think the cold weather payments are perhaps


the key thing because they are triggered I load temperatures and


they kick in at ?25 a week, which makes the biggest difference. The


warm homes discovered, the energy companies themselves are putting in


place to help tackle fuel poverty. The measures under the last


government, fuel poverty is lower today than it was when the party


opposite was in office. It is my right honourable friend aware of the


concern in Suffolk about using a road toll to pay for improvements to


be a 14? And the consequent risk but introducing tolls on the roads may


undermine support for the sensible concept of road pricing? I am well


aware of the strong feelings about this issue and had been approached


by many MPs but I believe that road tolls can play an important part in


providing new road capacity. It's important we find way to praise for


road capacity, but I understand the concerns about this individual case.


Does he realise he has something in common with the SNP? While he


refuses to back a call on a freeze on energy bills, they were not there


to grips with the energy companies, what does he think this says to the


millions of Scottish people? Getting to grips with energy bills means


more competition in the market which we are delivering. We were left the


big six by the party opposite and we see new companies coming in and


people like the leader of the opposition sensibly deciding to


switch their energy supply, good or very principle. We need to go back


the costs of the levies, and we're looking at that, as well. The Prime


Minister will be aware that MPs from rural areas across party lines have,


for many years, campaigned for a fair funding formula for schools.


Ably led by David kidney, the former Labour MP, and by the Honourable


member for Buster, the issue has been brought to a head again and we


have been expected to expect news shortly. Can't reassure teachers


they won't be disappointed? I do understand the concerns because


these funding formulas are built up over many years and there are places


in the country which do feel disadvantaged, particularly in rural


areas, who can suffer exclusion and poverty and feel there is not proper


reflection in the funding formula. The Education Secretary will see


what he can do. In my constituency, the engine room of the economy is S


M Es full sub while business rates rising by an average ability of


thousand pounds in this Parliament? Really are extending the freezer


business rates that the last government was going to get rid of


that we are extending the freeze on business rates for the last


government is going to get the dog. --.


we are on the subject of how to help business. How on earth can it be a


good idea to say you want to increase corporation tax as you go


into the next Parliament? That seems, to me, absolutely mad in


terms of a new Labour jobs tax. By the end of this year, over 8000


people in our country would have been diagnosed with pancreatic


cancer. Only 4% will even have the chance of a five-year survival


rate. And these figures have not changed for the last 30 years. When


the Prime Minister join the all-party group and pancreatic


cancer UK to improve these dreadful outcomes? There is always an issue


raised by those charities who are campaigning on some of the less


well-known and less prevalent cancers that they don't get a fair


share of the research funding. It's an issue I had taken up by the


Health Secretary and I think we need to make sure we are spreading


research funding and the work we do into cancer fairly across different


disciplines and cancers. Could I repeat, energy companies are making


77% profits per customer in 2012. Does the Prime Minister agree that


this is unacceptable? And, if so, what immediate steps is he proposing


to take to protect customers from blatant profiteering? What we need


to do is create a more competitive energy market. We inherited a


situation with just six big companies, we have seen seven new


companies coming to the market, and the number of people with


independent suppliers like the leader of the opposition, has


doubled during this Parliament, so we're making progress. I always


follow up the Honourable gentleman says, because recently gave an


interview when he went on the radio and said about Labour 's policies,


and said, I don't know our position on welfare, education, how we would


run the NHS. I think? That would be a good thing. -- I think a question


on that would be a good thing. What lessons has he learned from the


failures of the last Labour government which, despite claiming


just 13,000 immigrants will arrive in the UK, deliberately allowed more


than 1 million to come into our country? I think he raises an


important point because of course the benefits within the EU of free


movement, but there should be proper transition controls. We increase the


transition controls on Bulgaria and the mania from five years to seven


years, when we became the government, but it still baffles me


why the last Labour government decided to have no transitional


controller told for the a predicted 14,000 Polish people would arrive to


work in Britain but it was over 700,000. It is a shameful direction


of duty. The Prime Minister will be aware that the Mayor of London,


Boris Johnson, proposes to close nearly every single ticket office on


the London Underground network. With over 700 jobs being lost. Does the


Prime Minister believe that that is the way to raise living standards


for ordinary Londoners? The best way to happen Londoners is to make sure


we have a safe and affordable tube station and use modern technology to


deliver that. I think the conversation the Honourable Lady


needs to have is with the trade union would have done so much damage


to our underground, and we ought to be having on our underground,


permanent systems which provide a good service. Mr Speaker, earlier


this week, in Brighton, I was tested for HIV. This Sunday, it was world


AIDS Day. With the Prime Minister agree that in view of the fact in


this country, one in five people with HIV don't know they have it,


regular testing is to be in courage? I absolutely pay tribute to my


honourable friend and to all Honourable friends around this House


and in politics who campaigned so persistently and consistently on


this issue. It's vitally important we improve the livelihoods of people


with HIV and AIDS in the UK, but also vital we go on working


internationally including through the aid budget, to tackle HIV and


AIDS around the world but I think we can be proud of the money we have


put into things like the global fund and the fact, in this country, we


have achieved not .7% of gross national income when other countries


are broken promises. He's very keen to encourage energy users to switch


energy providers to get the best tariff. Why is it so difficult, over


the last three years, for mobile phone providers to be able to


switch? I think right across these utilities we want to see it made


easier for people to switch full sub we have done that on banks and is


now easier to switch bank account because of the hard work of a


Chancellor of the Exchequer. It's now easier to switch energy. Because


of the excellent work of climate change secretary. But it also be


easier to switch on other utilities, so it is an important bit of work we


are doing. The number of apprenticeships in Cornwall has


doubled since 2010. It helps to create a stronger economy and a


fairer society. Will he meet with me and a delegation of young people


from Cornwall to see how we can further promote these worthwhile


schemes? I am delighted with the news from Cornwall about the number


of apprenticeships. It's been a major financial commitment to help


fund apprenticeships. It's making a real difference but we have lots to


do to tackle worthlessness and unemployment for people between the


ages of 16 and 24 for the always happy to meet with him when I'm in


Cornwall. House prices are going up. At a time when real wages are coming


down. Does the Prime Minister accept that when interest rates go up,


after the election, this will detonate a sub-prime debt crisis of


his making? The greatest danger in terms of interest rate is if we had


a government that believed in more borrowing, more spending and more


taxes. That is what would drive up interest rates, that is what would


head the cost of living, and that is what every family in this country


should dread. Order. That's the end of primers as


questions. The first exchange between them were on payday loans.


And regulations to cap them in various ways.


Mr Cameron said that the opposition had decided not to do it in power,


they both have the same policy, not an unrewarding exchange between the


two. They then got onto the issue of the number of people who died last


winter because of the cold, and the fears of the number that will this


year, that will happen this year, and that brought us onto energy


prices and the usual exchanges about whether there should be a freeze or


not and what was the answer to rising energy prices. We may talk


about that in a moment. And the other thing of note, what I think


was generally pretty in distinguished exchange, Diane Abbott


asking a question about London and about the London Underground, which


those of us in the studio take to be the launch of her mayoral campaign.


We know these things! We don't, really. Half the backbenchers want


to go for that job! Diane from Cornwall said, a good week for Ed


Miliband who adroitly linked payday lenders to energy costs and the fear


of cold weather deaths and NHS backlogs. Jim brought in from


Nuneaton said, David Cameron summed the situation up nicely at the end


of his exchange with Ed Miliband, desperately searching for bad news


on which to score political points. But this is from Bernard Whitaker,


Newcastle upon Tyne, can run all over the place and payday loans, he


struggles on electricity. -- Cameron. Alan Waugh would, a very


interesting point, is Tory ideology becoming inconsistent under David


Cameron? Interventionist tendencies. From John Smith, nothing


from Labour on the economy, the thing that troubles the majority of


hard-working folk. The reason MPs or a number of them were wearing red


ribbons is as a sign for international AIDS day, which is


this Sunday, and there was a question about AIDS testing in the


exchanges there. Immigration did not come up, interesting thing is that


the issue that regularly comes top of the polls after the economy is an


issue about immigration, but the mother of Parliaments does not talk


about it on the one bit that is broadcast on network television. You


said Ed Miliband would not raise it, I think we all agreed, in that it


would have been an opportunity to do what David Cameron briefly did at


the end, when a Tory backbencher raised it. The Prime Minister was


then able to say Labour got it wrong in 2004, the lack of transitional


controls to prevent so many polls and other Eastern European is coming


over. But that is is chosen topic of the day, this climb-down.


Interestingly, while we have been on air, the EU commission have been


reacting. We heard earlier one EU commission speaking on the Today


programme, very critical of David Cameron's article in the Financial


Times, and now a justice commissioner has said it is


non-negotiable for member states, the issue of freedom of movement,


and went on to say, a woman called Vivian Reading, that Britain had


always been in favour of enlarging the EU and now politicians seem


unhappy with it. What is striking on these benefits tightening up is that


the Liberal Democrats wanted it to be known that they had accepted


them, not just as it were acquiesced, but that they were in


favour, and the Labour Party's only criticism was that they recommended


tightening up earlier. So there is now a cross-party consensus about


the need to tighten up benefit controls. You only have to look at


the opinion polls that were all over the front pages the other day, the


Daily Mail, to know why. It is not just the top issue regularly, but


people's concern about the influx of EU migrants, you are talking about


very high numbers in the opinion polls. So UKIP calling the shots


again. But is it UKIP? You could say that UKIP is breathing down their


necks ahead of the European elections, the last set of migration


statistics were not good for the Government, so they may be trying to


get in pre-emptively. We know this 1st of January deadline looms, the


point at which Romanians and Bulgarians can, if they choose, come


and work freely, there are plenty here already, of course, working


self-employed or on special work permits. But there is also coming up


in Parliament a Tory backbench rebellion on this issue of Romania


and Bulgaria. There are all sorts of political reasons. Partly because


they are worried about UKIP. If all three age of parties are now


effectively saying the same thing, the only party that has got a


different story, tougher than all three of them, is UKIP. That is


true. The reason I cavil with you slightly... Did you?! If UKIP did


not exist, the fact that the predictions were for 14,000 polls to


come per year and the total over ten years was more than 700,000, that


would have created a climate of public anxiety, whether UKIP were


there ten. They have not created it, they have served the wave of


anxiety. I accept your cavil, I will then go up and see it means! Let's


come back to the issue of energy prices, at a time when we know that


more old people dying because of cold, as they did last winter, the


need to, and that there is a fear of whether that will happen again,


given that energy prices have gone way ahead of any possible income


increased that old people have had, is it not really embarrassing that,


at the same time, the energy can show a 75% increase in profits? Of


course it is an embarrassing thing for them, and it is obviously


something that we have really got to deal with what we are doing, and the


thing that I suppose I admire the nerve of Ed Miliband was to put


legislation in place which rapidly increased the prices, the green


levies, and now he is saying, he would want to freeze prices. What we


have got to do is remove what Government can genuinely do, and


that will be looking at the green levies, looking at what we can do


there, bringing the prices down. We have to do that, it has to be


affordable for the people on the ground. The green levies are one


issue, you both have always sung from the same song sheet, Labour and


conservative. But they did introduce a more, you are quite right. But


there is an additional problem, because the green levies do not


extend to profits. If they have got 75% increase in profits, there is


something systemically wrong with the market, and yet you have been in


power for over three and a half years now, and I see no changes that


you have made to the energy market. You are quite right. We have got to


make sure the markets work. We believe any market, and we have to


make sure they are going to work. That is why David Cameron has said


we are bringing more people into the marketplace, and we are going to do


it within a time frame. Yes, this is something we have to accelerate. The


Autumn Statement coming up next week, it is almost certain, I think,


talking about this, that there will be movement on the green levies.


Some of them will be scrapped or diminished or put onto general


taxation. We'll Labour supports that? I don't know, we need to look


at their proposals. You are responsible for a lot of the green


levies. The current government introduced more of the green levy


cost than the last Labour government. You did introduce a lot.


In order to try and encourage, incentivise renewables... They


account for 10% of the bill. But I mean, I want to make this point, Mr


Miliband talks about the need for a price freeze, yet the 2008 climate


change act, for which she was responsible, had a specific


intention of raising energy prices. That was the specific intention,


because it put a lot of money into onshore wind, which was twice the


normal price of electricity, and offshore wind, which is three times


that, and solar power as well. Now, the intention was to do it, so now


to call for a price freeze on it seems either inconsistent or


hypocritical or both. No, the intention was to try to deal with


the prospect of climate change by getting the energy companies to take


greater responsibility for paying for developing the next generation


of carbon neutral and carbon free energy. Which are more expensive.


You are entirely right that it is not down to the energy levies, it is


not down to the green levies. It is to do with the fact that you have


vertically integrated energy companies, who both generate,


transmit and sell to consumers. Which you created. The last Tory


government is what privatised energy in this country. Not a Mac, we are


going historic now! You allowed them to be integrated. Tell us a bit more


about... We need to freeze the bills because people... We know that is


Labour policy, we have covered the freeze quite a lot on this


programme. You will be with me for the Autumn Statement next Thursday,


it has been delayed a day. Any hints you can do? We know these green


levies are going to be shifted in some way. It may turn out to be


complex. It would be interesting to see whether he wants to announce it


on his big day or get it out of the way so that it is not all that


anybody talks about, that is one thing that is worth watching for.


But he has got to raise some money to pay for the goodies promised by


both the Liberal Democrats and the Tories at their party conferences.


One brief thoughts on price? The Treasury always looks for pain-free


ways of putting taxes up, that is why there was the fuel duty


escalator, remember that? Marvellous, we can put money on


petrol, nobody will mind, but then of course people do mind. After the


protest it never went up again. Or let's put it on energy bills, they


will not mind, that is green. What we discover is that civil servants


come up with ways to put bills up painlessly, and politicians


discover, actually, people find it quite painful. And when they all


agree, it is incumbent on us to look harder at the issues. Which is why


you have got journalists here. Well done! Toady! I'm going to give him a


fiver afterwards. Going back to a story we covered earlier, the


announcement that David Cameron will restrict benefits for out of work EU


migrants, attempting to limit numbers coming year in the future


just five weeks before restrictions relaxed on Bulgarians and Romanians


coming to the UK to live and work. Speaking earlier on the BBC, Alp


Mehmet from Migration Watch UK is that Mr Cameron is just doing what


everyone else in Europe would like to do. He suggests that we are the


nasty country or likely to be labelled as a nasty country. Is he


saying that to the Germans, I wonder, who have some other


concerns? Or the French, who have already acted? Or any of the other


countries? In Dade, does he say that to the Romanians and Bulgarians that


I talked to say, you are mad for opening up in this way? -- indeed. I


welcome what the Prime Minister is proposing for I believe he is


proposing. We do need to tighten the benefits system, we cannot have


uncontrolled access to the labour market in this way. It was never


intended for that purpose. It was never intended for countries that


are so far and bounced from the sort of countries that Romania and


Bulgaria are at the moment. Joining us is the Bulgarian Ambassador


Konstantin Dimitrov. Welcome to the Daily Politics. What is your


reaction to David Cameron's financial Times article in which


each attempts to limit welfare benefit in a number of ways to


migrants? I think it's an expected political announcement in the form


of an article. It is to be read very carefully, to be studied, to be


consulted back in my capital. It is, which is very important to us, and


indirect confirmation that the UK Government will lift the remaining


restrictions to access to the labour market for Bulgarians and Romanians,


levelling them up with the rest of the citizens of the European Union.


And I had confirmation from the Foreign Office that this is indeed


the message among the Alliance of the article in question. So there is


no doubt in your mind that the final restrictions on Bulgarians and


Romanians will be lifted in January? That they will have the same rights


of movement across European borders as the rest of the EU? May I make an


important decision, the right of movement is there but the right to


work legally was subject to some administrative restrictions which


will go. They will go, and it's a different subject altogether, the


issue of the access to your social welfare system. I understand that. I


would like to have a triple distinction in this amalgam of


notions. Let me ask you this. Are you broadly sympathetic to the


tightening up of welfare benefits for EU migrants? In principle, we


stick to the view that those who have access to benefits should have


contributed to the gross domestic product of each nation where the


National 's work. However, there are two conditions attached to it. One


of them if they should be a non-discriminatory attitude to


specific citizens from a specific country in the EU, and indeed, all


national legislative measures should be in full compliance with


applicants in EU legislation. Is it the case, as I think I have seen you


have said, that noble dairy 's who have applied to come and work here


have been turned down anyway? -- no Bulgarians. Those who have provided


the necessary documents have been granted to work here in the specific


category to which they belong, in other words, there hasn't been a


trend of the number of workers so far because it is contrary to the


new legislation, so, in other words, the 1st of January, once the


floodgates opened, the access to your labour market, you will see a


situation of access through work permits towards the situation of


finding work without the permit characteristic for the transitional


periods. Are you saying we will not see the floodgates opening? We will


not see a sudden rush of large numbers of Bulgarians and Romanians


coming to work in this country? We are not crystal ball gazers but the


analysis suggests that because of the factors I explained below, the


easy access to your labour market for legally working Bulgarians


before the 1st of January, we don't see any objective be requisite for a


rising coming of our complete clearance. Moreover, there is a


large-scale information campaign of the existing restrictions to the


access of your social welfare system and indeed, the need for people to


be absolutely immaculate in terms of the documents they will have to have


two even applied for work here in the period after the New Year


coming. The gap in living standards in GDP between Bulgaria, Romania and


the western part of the EU, France, Germany, the UK, it is large. That


is true. Are you not worried, as movement for jobs becomes friction


free, that you lose a lot of your best and brightest? We are very


worried and if I have to be very honest with you, it is a problem of


a brain drain for Bulgaria, much more than the influx of the best


qualified nurses and doctors, entrepreneurs or financiers into


your country. I can understand why that is a worry. Do you think


Britain is becoming a nasty country in its attitude towards this? I


don't think so but there was a nasty anti-bug Aryan campaign from certain


politicians and certain media which I will not name. -- antibody Aryan.


Go on. -- anti-Bulgarian. I am too much of an ambassador. Now, have all


you Borgen fans caught up on last weekend's episodes? We are obsessed


on this programme. If you have you'll know that Brigitte Nyborg's


new party makes a break through in the Danish Parliament after her MPs


tackle the contentious issue of Danish pork and animal welfare


standards. Put your hands over your ears. Well, believe it or not, that


issue is also very topical here because a number of celebrity chefs


have joined forces to try and change what we feed our pigs. Here's


Thomasina Miers, winner of MasterChef and co-founder of the


Wahaca restaurant chain with her soapbox.


For 9000 years of humans have lived alongside domestic pigs, they have


been the perfect partner for consuming wasted humans produce and


converting it into calories and pork roast to eat, but that changed a


decade ago. After the outbreak of foot and mouth disease and its


devastating consequences for British livestock in 2001, politicians and


-- introduced a ban on feeding catering waste on pegs without


considering the impact. The ban them became permanent across the EU. We


now have a crazy system with pegs are being fed food humans could eat


and much of it is Sawyer, where rainforests are being cut down at an


alarming rate. -- soy. It is used for animal feed and Europe now


produces 40 million tonnes a year which is not sustainable. Many pig


farmers are now going out of business because of the expensive


price of grain when I have a ready-made food source in the form


of food waste for their livestock, a significant portion of farmers now


want to feed their livestock pigs will. The UK is also out of step


with the rest of the world. The government of other countries like


Japan, South Korea, New Zealand, China and many states in America but


organise the best way of telling food waste into a valuable resource


is to feed it to livestock. Inside are banning the practice, the


Japanese support pig farmers who want to use food waste as feed.


Eco-pork is sold on the same supermarket shelves where the waste


originated. Working in restaurants can we separate food waste into food


bins to avoid cross contamination, and easy solution. Recycling food


waste into livestock feed is also a print way of increasing Europe's


food security for the future. And Thomasina Miers joins us now.


Welcome to the programme. It didn't work last time because there was


that cross contamination. What makes you think it will be different now?


Last time, you talk by the single incident of foot and mouth which had


devastating consequences, so a temporary ban was put on the pigs


will industry which sadly spread across the EU and is now


semipermanent. That's what we're trying to change for the in New


Zealand, China, America, South Korea, Japan, they have a very good


swill system for the day take the catering waste, cook it to a certain


level, which safely killed pathogens including foot and mouth, and make


it two double foot of in the UK, we are throwing out 15 million tonnes


of food waste a year, just in the UK. If you took a globally the food


waste your chucking out and fed it to animals, you would be liberating


enough grain to feed 3 billion people. You said it had devastating


consequences, that one incident. How do you reassure people that that


incident wouldn't be repeated? There are several things to do. If you


listen to our detractors, they are highlighting a lethal outbreak of


foot and mouth disease again but foot and mouth is already out


there, it's everywhere, it's a question of controlling it. Proper


investigations were not done at the time. It was a remiss farmer who


wasn't doing the correct heat treating. It was one farmer. We're


talking about factories, having proper regulations, like the food we


eat is pasteurised and cooked. It wasn't necessarily downed that


farmer treating outbreak. The type of foot and mouth was similar to one


in South Africa the year before. Proper investigations were not done


so it absolutely not sure it was foot and mouth. You've obviously


thought about it carefully, thought that what happened in the past. Have


you had any response from the EU or government? They passed a blanket


ban. We are trying to engage the subject of politicians because,


apart from anything else, the health scares of what we're doing at the


moment, are really scary, so 50 million tonnes of food waste are put


into landfill, which is completely untreated for the rodents, rats,


Vernons -- seagulls are scavenging on it. I can see the sense of the


argument. What we got to do is have consumer confidence there. People


are fearful of there being another food scare. I think that's what we


have got to do, allay peoples fears, explain clearly, as you are doing


very coherently. And putting regulation in place to ensure it


couldn't have this contamination gainful we look at the human food,


look after pig food. I say, start lobbying your local MPs. Would you


support it? I think, when you hear him make the arguments, they sound


plausible. I only read about it last week. What is striking is so minute


of the interested parties, pig producers, veterinarians, so opposed


to it, and the reason they are opposed to it is they think we don't


have the structures in place, the treatment plants, the means to


separate out the waste to guarantee you weren't feeding pigs to pigs.


You can feed animals to animals, only chickens and pigs but not to


beef. It looks like it ought to be interesting. The sustainability


issues you raise are very important. I think we need to be


very, very clear that we could do something like this safely, because


the downside is enormous. You can understand it in a way. I understand


it as a mother of two children, as someone who has been friends of


farmers who lost livestock. It was horrific, foot and mouth for the it


wasn't proven it was caused by the swill industry, number one. It


happens across the world safely. America, New Zealand, Japan. If they


can do it, why can't we? The third thing is, what is the third thing?


Don't worry. It's always terrible things first, second and third.


Maybe the farmers are the ones who have to convince Festival. Convince


them and create a new economy. -- convince farmers. OK, we have run


out of time. Now, it's time to put you out of your misery and give you


the answer to Guess The Year. Esther press that big red button now! The


answer was 1989. She is my best friend. OK, that's all for today.


Thanks to our guests. The One O'Clock News is starting over on BBC


One now. We'll be back tomorrow at noon with all the big political


stories of the day. Anne Widdecombe will be with us so do join us then.


Bye bye. Bye bye.


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