11/02/2014 Daily Politics


Similar Content

Browse content similar to 11/02/2014. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!



Good afternoon, welcome to the Daily Politics. The waters rise, more rain


is forecast as politicians try to get a grip of the flooding affecting


large parts of the UK. We will bring you the latest.


MPs vote to ban smoking in cars with children, but there is opposition


from Cabinet ministers, and it is not clear how the ban will be


implemented. News, there is lots of it, but are


we equipped to take it all in? We will be talking to the author of a


user's manual. And the claws are out in the latest


vote rigging scandal to hit Westminster, MPs get catty over who


has the best looking moggy. All the important stories, of


course, any next hour! And no dispute about who is top cat in the


studio today, television presenter and journalist Fiona Phillips,


welcome to the programme. It is very kind of you! Let's start with


smoking, because last night MPs voted in favour of a ban on smoking


in cars carrying children, and amendment put down by Labour MPs,


and the Government side were given a free vote on the issue. Downing


Street says such a ban would come into force before the next


election. Let's get a flavour of the debate. The Government is clear, and


I think all members are clear, that children should not be exposed to


the harm of second-hand smoke, which can be extremely harmful to young


children. They have chucked no choice about being in places where


they are exposed to smoke in many cases. Are we going to have smoking


police weaving in and out of traffic and looking in car windows? There


must be a serious answer do this, how can it be enforced? If we know


beyond doubt that passive smoking in an enclosed space can do serious


harm to a person's health, and that hundreds of thousands of children


are being subjected to this in a Karl every single week, and if we


know from experience of similar laws passed in this country and other


countries that legislation can have a major impact in changing behaviour


and improving public health, should we act and do something? Or do we


stand by and do nothing? By that same token, would she therefore


concede that we should criminalise pregnant women who smoke on the


basis that their child is in an even more confined space than in a car? I


have no quibble at all with the honourable lady for Liverpool way


betray, she represents the smug, patronising excesses of new Labour


who thinks the only reason they are in parliament is to ban things they


do not like. What perturbs me are the Conservative ministers who


appeared to have not grasped the concept, even though they claim to


be Conservatives, that you can disapprove of something without


actually banning it. This is just yet another in the long line of


Tridents for the nanny state. If the honourable member had been present


at the time, he would argue very strongly against compulsory seat


belts in cars. Of course he would have done! Because when I was


listening to him today, I heard the authentic voice of primitive


Toryism. And on the note of primitive


Toryism, let's speak to Ross Hawkins. People were divided over


this issue, when today, right up to ministerial and Cabinet level? This


is the thing, Jo, this Government is about to introduce legislation, it


says by the election that is the sort of thing that affects real


lives. It is understood and will stick in the memory, it could even


change a little bit of the national behavioural culture. And yet large


swathes of the Government did not want to do it at all. Nick Clegg did


not vote, he could only persuade four to vote against. Many others


were against this, Theresa May, Chris Grayling, pretty important


Conservatives. And yet something that they oppose, something that was


suggested and proposed by Labour in the House of Lords and the House of


Commons, is now set to become law. If you have any complicated


questions, like, what would the penalties beat? How would it work?


How would it function? Keep them to yourself for now, because the


department for health does not know. There will have to be a


consultation, they will have to work out how this is going to happen.


They are not pretending they have all the answers now, but it is an


intriguing development that Labour have managed to get this particular


changing, and I think you heard of there some Conservatives wondering,


in the face of that free vote, why the Conservative front bench did not


come out against an idea like that and why some of their senior


colleagues seem quite enthusiastic. Ross Hawkins, thank you very much.


Fiona Phillips, do you support the idea? In principle, but you can be


against it without wishing for a ban, and you do not start going


inside people's cars, you are talking to someone who has driven


around in a white Ford Anglia. We will not condemn you for that! It


was yellow because my father smoked constantly, lovely nicotine brown


roof. I smoked from the age of 11, gave up about 14 years ago. But you


did not have a choice, isn't the Government saying, we would have


saved you from passive smoking? But how far do you go, into people's


homes? Pregnant women? I mean, that is a direct hits into a feed is


taking nicotine, that is when I gave up, by the way. How much more


traffic police supposed to do than what they are doing already? They


are not enforcing the mobile phone law very much, they are not even


enforcing speeding, from what I have seen. How is it going to be


enforced? It is going to be interesting to see how it unfolds,


what penalties and fines there will be, maybe along similar lines to


mobile phones, but they did manage to ban it in pubs. Well, this is...


People never thought that would happen, but now if you go into a


pub, people will think, I cannot remember when you could smoke! They


are public places, we cannot smoke in the workplace, fine, but you


cannot go into people's homes and cars and tell them what they should


do. What about alcohol at home and children? That is far more


damaging, actually, than cigarette smoke. Sorry, Jo, because of the


education we have had about smoking, education always works. Only 20% of


the population smoke now, so educating these people who have a


fight with a car load of kids, educate them, don't ban it. Is this


the nanny state? Do you agree with the Conservatives who say this is


the nanny state in operation and Conservatives are allying themselves


with it? I never knowingly agree with a Tory, I have to say, but


yeah, I agree! You cannot go into personal spaces and tell people not


to smoke. But they did with seat belts, didn't they? And now it has


become part of everybody's day-to-day life, you put your seat


belt on. I remember the advert, they have changed attitudes. And that is


a direct life-saver, it is for everyone in the car, it makes sense


for the whole population, but only 20% of the population smoke - in


their own space. So will it work? I do not see how it can be forced. You


mentioned the seat belt law, it is very important, we all do now, but


how often is that enforced? We will leave it there. Time for the daily


quiz, and the question for today, which of these roles has the owner,


our guest, not been offered? -- Fiona. Chairmanship of the


Environment Agency, Labour candidate for the Eastleigh by-election, or


Labour peer under Gordon Brown? At the end of the show, Fiona will give


us the correct answer! Water, water everywhere, well, certainly if you


live on the Somerset Levels, and now flooding has spread to the Thames


Valley after days and weeks of seemingly continuous rain. The map


of England and Wales as seen through the eyes of the Environment Agency


is a pretty scary looking place. There are 14 severe weather


warnings, which indicate a threat to life, in place for Berkshire and


Surrey. Two warnings remain in place in Somerset. Over the last 48


hours, things have got much worse in Berkshire and Surrey, where river


levels in some places are at their highest level since gauges were


installed in the 1980s and 1990s. It has meant homes and businesses in


Datchet in Berkshire have been flooded, with hundreds of homes


further down the river, as far as Shepperton, under threat. The


problems will be compounded with more rainfall over the coming days,


with gusty winds and rain fall of 20 millimetres likely across the


country. With more than 30 millimetres possible across parts of


south Wales and south-west England. And here is is the impact that the


rain has had, large sections of the Thames have burst their banks,


meaning homes in places like Wraysbury, Maidenhead and Datchet,


bordering the river, have been flooded. It has meant many people


have had to switch their mode of transport, as residents try to get


around the water, more than a couple of feet deep in places. Ed Miliband


as dust and off his wellies and headed out to the small village of


Purley, and he used the visit to call on the Government to invest


more in flood defences. This is a wake-up call, it is an issue here


and around the country. There is clearly this kind of extreme weather


that is becoming more likely with climate change, and we need to make


sure we put in that investment, we put in the flood defences and


protection so that we prevent this kind of thing from happening as much


as we possibly can. Another man wading through the water was Defence


Secretary Philip Hammond, whose Runnymede constituency has been


badly hit by the floods. The crisis has brought the work of the


Environment Agency, and particularly chairman Lord Smith, into the


spotlight, but Mr Hammond told the BBC that now is not the time to play


the blame game. I don't want to spend the time now, in the middle of


this crisis, recruiting and finger-pointing. Clearly, there are


issues around policy, and long-term planning, around strategy that will


have to be reviewed when all of this is over. And we will have to look at


decisions that were made in the past, whether they were the right


decisions, whether we need to change policy for the future, particularly


on things like dredging. But it would be a great disservice to


people who are facing floodwaters lapping around the threshold of


their houses to spend our time now arguing about what he liked rather


Easter Terex question is, frankly. Transport has been severely


disrupted, the Prime Minister was keeping dry but out and about in


Polish in South Devon, where he was assessing the damage to rail lines.


We have had the wettest start to the four 250 years, some of the most


extreme weather we have seen in decades, and you can see behind me


the effect is as hard. It will take time before we get things back to


normal, we are in for a long haul, but the Government will do


everything it can to co-ordinated national sources. If money needs to


be spent, it will be spent. If the military can help, they will be


there. We must do everything, but it is going to take time to put things


right. Our correspondent Philippa Young is by the River Thames in


Marlow in Buckinghamshire. What is it like there? Amazing news, it has


stopped raining finally! We have a really short weather window. I have


been here since around seven o'clock this morning, it was drizzle, then


pretty soon after that it was hammering down. And the wind is


really whipped up, you can see now the speed of the river. It looked to


be flowing pretty slowly first thing this morning. It really has whipped


up. Firefighters further upriver are pumping very close to houses, which


are very close to the river. You can see how far back it has come into


the graveyard. If you can just about make out that Bush there, that is


normally wear the river bank is, and you can stand there and look at the


river. You can see how far it has come back. Residents say this has


been pretty wet for a couple of weeks, but in the last 24 hours or


so there has been a dramatic rise in the river. The Church earplugs tells


me they have a flooded crypt, the Hotel on the other side of the river


almost certainly must have flooded cellars. -- the church here. They


have put sandbags on the other side of those chairs and tables, I do not


think people will be fancying afternoon tea at there. Fire crews


are using their own pumps, and they also have a high volume pump on loan


from Staffordshire Fire Service, and that can pump 7000 litres of water a


minute, they tell me, and that is in operation further up the river. The


concern is, though, the Environment Agency and buy a cruise here say


that the river for the time being has stabilised, but there is concern


that there is more water on the way. -- Fire crews. They are dealing with


tidal surges further upriver, and of course whatever the weather chucks


at us for the next few days. Do people in the surrounding area feel


the authorities have been doing enough? Marleau, really, does feel


pretty lucky. People I've spoken to this morning and seeing what's been


happening further up and down, not very far away across the river and


they do feel pretty lucky. The firefighters I spoke to this morning


say everything they can do with being done to keep the water away


from houses. There are a couple that are pretty close with sandbags just


haven't quite done the trick, nothing, though, they say alarming


at the moment but they are on stand-by obviously not able to tell


exactly what the weather is going to do. I'm sure anybody who has been


affected would be saying the Environment Agency could be doing


more. I've been speaking to people here who have been measuring the


flow of the river and saying it's pretty fast. They are trying to


enter is about what's going to happen but, of course, there's an


element of guesswork and they are trying to do as much as they can,


they tell me, for the residents in this area. Philip Ah, thank you very


much. Joining me now is John Howell, Conservative MP for Henley. How is


it there? Henley is suffering from flooding as is the rest of the


constituency. It's basically around the Thames, but, fortunately,


there's not that many properties affected. It's not the disaster area


of the bits of the country. So you are seeing this as a crisis that


perhaps the Government should have stepped in earlier to deal with? No,


in my constituency, the flooding is not yet affecting major properties.


The council are working extremely hard on this. They have issued 6000


sandbags already. They are working very hard with the Fire Service to


have the right pumps in place. What I'm saying is if their concentration


on that which is actually helped to give the situation at bay. What


difference has it made seeing Government ministers and senior


politicians of all parties out and about in flood hit areas? It's a


great question and a great PR opportunity, but I'm not sure we do


very much by going out into the water. We can be sympathetic to


people and all of that. What I have done is to have meetings with the


Environment Agency in order to ensure that what I think is being


done is really being done and they are doing all that they can to deal


with the situation. How helpful has it been listening to and watching


the name-calling and sniping between ministers and the Environment Agency


over the past few weeks? I think Philip Hammond's was the best on


this. There are issues with the Environment Agency over the whole


policy of dredging, for example. It's a big issue in the north and my


own constituency but now was not the time to have those issues. Now was


not the time to have a discussion with the Environment Agency. Now is


the time to provide assistance to the people flooded and then tackle


it later. Who should be providing that assistance in your mind? Who in


a broader sense should be providing information? People talk about great


community spirit and volunteer services and the Fire Service and


how marvellous they have been. Should be local initiatives to did


with local crisis is? We are facing an unusual situation with people


saying it's the worst rain for 250 years. Ultimately, it comes down to


a draining a hell of a lot. But who'd you expect to help? The


Government, centrally controlled, or local initiatives in the way you


have described? A bit of both, and the Prime Minister has already set


out what the central Government will provide on the way of assistance


from the military, additional sandbags, flood equipment, but it


also comes down to the fact that we need to be planning properly. And


not building on the flood plain. We will come onto that. Just looking at


it from the outside, I presume your home has not been flooded. What do


you feel for these people who are now dealing with on a daily basis?


What I find, cut, not their situation, but suddenly politicians


going out there and being the font of all knowledge were adding to do


with flooding and how it affects people in what should be done. They


should have been out in the communities before this. But, well,


it's awful. I have a small business near Somerset, actually, a pub which


people are not able to get to the moment. There are small businesses


and homes all over the place being affected. I've heard of landlords is


mourning not re-homing people who are being forced out of their homes.


It needs everyone to help. The HMRC needs the good businesses when their


VAT quarters adieu, and not be hard on them. The banks to listen when


businesses can't afford to pay their small loan payments. It reaches out


further out than people in their homes, but that's really tragic. Who


was going to pay fraud this? Insurers estimate it could be up to


?1 billion. -- pay for this. The Prime Minister has to ?7 million


front to help councils were the immediate clean-up. There will be a


big call on the insurance companies. That's why people pay insurers. So


people's premiums are going to go sky-high presumably as a result of


this, and it could affect people outside of those flooded areas, too?


I have no idea how the insurance industry will react to this, but the


first call has to be on the insurance industry, because people


are their premiums and they need something back for them. You talked


about planning and people would say planning and perhaps more money


going into Government agencies like the Environment Agency, and into


desperate -- DEFRA, may have prevented the excesses of flooding.


Firstly, no more money going into the Environment Agency would have


affected this in the slightest. The amount of money going into the


Environment Agency has continued to increase. Now, the issue of planning


is an important one. We need to ensure, as the National planning


poverty framework makes absolutely clear, that we do not make the


situation worse on the flood plain. It's very clear about the areas in


which building can take place, and if building does need to take place


on the flood plain, because sometimes it does, it needs to make


sure that it takes every precaution it can to overcome the problems of


flooding. When it came to funding for DEFRA in flood defences in real


terms, that amount has fallen since the Government has been in power


from ?690 million to ?576 million. Was that correct? I think you're


being selective in the figures. No, the Government has spent some


amounts to the last four years of a Labour Government, but in real


terms, if you count inflation, it is fallen, and that a Parliamentary


figure. What do we do about things like the policy on dredging for


example? More money might have paid the more dredging. It's not a


question of money coming back. It's a question of policy, and we need to


discuss this with the Environment Agency at a later stage but now is


not the time for that. Thank you. Now, earlier this month the Labour


peer Sally Morgan spoke of her unhappiness at not being


re-appointed to the role of Chairman of the Education Watchdog Ofsted.


Reports over the weekend suggested that Education Secretary Michael


Gove might replace other members of Ofsted's board. Mr Gove was asked


about the issue by Shadow Education Secretary Tristam Hunt in parliament


yesterday. Mr Speaker, we will see that the


Secretary of State has refused to condemn the campaign against the


chief inspector and is not the truth of the matter that Ofsted is


inspecting the free schools without fear or favour and he doesn't like


it. The chief inspector wants to inspect Academy chains and he


doesn't like it. On Friday, a secondary school closed and a new


Ofsted purge on Sunday. Surely he should be focused on raising


standards, not politicising our school inspectorate system. If he


wants to be taken seriously, he must pay close attention to the facts.


And the facts are these, that I had been zealous and making sure that we


applied a typed and more rigorous inspection framework to all schools,


free schools, academies, maintained schools, and I appointed Sally


Morgan and I have been leading change in our schools. I have been


the person in system to be held our education system to the highest


standard and I'm the person demanding the honourable gentleman


once again, once again, withdraws the statement he made earlier


putting words into the mouths of Sir Michael will sure he did not at. If


he doesn't, we will draw the appropriate conclusion that his


policies, are both timid and incoherent. Michael Gove and Tristam


Hunt they are engaging in lively debate. And joining us is a


supporter of the government's education reforms and free school


founder Toby Young. Welcome to the programme. Is this another example


of Michael Gove attacking the educational establishment he wants


to improve? I don't think he has been attacking it. I think Sir


Michael Wilshaw misunderstood and thought that policy exchange had


reports commissioned into Ofsted pondered by the Secretary of


State... Think tanks, that's what was claimed against Ofsted, but is


not undermined. The head of Ofsted as saying he is undermined, he feels


by Michael Gove on the Government, spitting blood about those


briefings. How does I improve standards in schools? Appointing Sir


Michael has helped improve standards in schools in the first place. There


is now timid and 50,000 children being taught in failing schools than


under the last Government. The claim by Tristam Hunt is because Michael


Gove is unhappy that Ofsted are infecting that inspecting free


schools is clearly nonsense, because 75% of those free schools have been


ranked outstanding including the free school I co-founded in 2011.


That's higher than the national average, 64%, so Ofsted are giving a


ringing endorsement of the free schools policy. To suggest Michael


Gove wants to politicise Ofsted because they are criticising free


schools is utter rubbish. Isn't this a storm in a teacup when it comes to


improving standards? Isn't Michael Gove trying to push a teaching


establishment which has been set in its ways for too long? He doesn't


listen to teachers, he's dictator. He doesn't talk to teachers for the


bid and talk to parents, pupils, he doesn't listen to anyone. He has his


own agenda, even taking questions. If anybody opposes him, he puts


down, doesn't want to get into discussion with anyone. He is


closing very good state schools down in Boro 's all over the place and


replacing them with free schools. In your area, the O'Sullivan School in


Hammersmith, an outstanding primary school in the top 2% of the country,


there was a council meeting last night, and the decision by the Tory


council has been to go ahead and close it, despite protests by


parents, they've been to Downing Street with petitions, but it's


going. The closure of that school was because it was undersubscribed,


they went on a pupils for though they are merging two undersubscribed


schools to create a site for much-needed school places in the


area. They are imposing a secondary school, free school the boys... I


don't think that decision has been made yet. If you listen to Andy


Slaughter, the local MP,... I don't recognise your caricature of Michael


Gove as a dictator. I think everyone else does. If you look at this


curriculum reforms, many changes remain to the proposed changes to


the National Curriculum after teachers and other organisations


have spoken. Free schools are untestable moment. Your school is


every two years old. Seven and eight. And nine. No one has taken


GCSE get whatever they will be under Michael Gove. People say they will


be dumbed down qualifications. Free schools have taken, in some cases,


taken public exams. A free school is where Michael Gove delivered a


speech last week, they have got ten offers from Oxbridge, for their


children, extraordinary. Have they got the same intake is you? You have


a remarkably high intake of students going into your school, which have


sat level for, compared to the average in your borough. How does


that happen? It's not a selective school. But let me explain, there


was a Freedom of information request about your school in terms of the


standard already gained of pupils coming into the school and it seemed


incredibly high from nonselective school. Can you explain it? 25% of


the children at the West London free school are on free school meals, 40%


are black and minority ethnic, it's very reflective. I think the reason


we have attracted perhaps above-average children from an


academic point of view is because we offer... You sort them out. Have


they? Isn't a case on offer have a tap attracted those people because


the standards were higher. Not the backgrounds of the children. Isn't


what's on offer from some of these free schools which has attracted


that kind of student? It's all a bit of a noise about nothing because it


hasn't been proven yet because no exams have been taken, but how do


explain at 95.4% of your intake got level four and above in English


compared to the borough average of 62%? Similar figures in mathematics


as well. These are children and parents who can't find the kinds of


opportunities are looking for elsewhere in the borough so I think


their children, who may be above average academically, have a better


chance at school. Parents are discovering the school. If more


state schools offer the rigorous... But they do. Michael Gove said that


teachers need to teach with rigour, isn't that what teachers tried to


do? He calls the educational establishment of the blog, a fairly


antagonistic term, isn't it? -- the blob. Would you call it that? That


is insulting to the pupils, and to call GCSE is that still two years


have got today, dumbed down exams, how dare he do that? My son will be


taking them, and he knows it is a dumbed down exam. He does not have


to take it. Michael Gove has eliminated things like s, BTECso we


are beginning to see positive changes. How does the teaching


establishment response to being called the blob? Is this the way to


encourage and improve standards? I think the teaching, the educational


establishment, not to be confused with teachers, the establishment


have always been hostile to any attempt to reform education. So you


think they are Marxists, the same way as Michael Gove does! They have


been saying no to reform for 50 years, whether proposed by Labour or


the Tories. Isn't there some truth in the fact that they have resisted


a change in order to drive up standards in state schools? But


standards have been driven up in state schools. By what? According to


grade inflation, you are measuring that by the number of children


getting five passes at GCSE, and as we know, that is to do with grade


inflation. If you look at the attainment gap between independent


schools and children from comprehensives at a level under


Labour, it doubled. The number of children getting good A levels at


independent schools doubled compared to children at comprehensives under


the last government. What to think about Michael Gove trying to bring


down the so-called Berlin Wall between state and private education?


That is a wall that can be smashed to pieces by getting rid of private


education and having to play nonselective schools. Don't you


agree with that? He is selecting! Don't you agree with that? If you


got rid of private education, state schools... Everyone would go to good


local schools. I am not opposed to people sending their children to


good state schools, but the way to do that is to raise standards in


state schools, not eliminate private schools, which isn't politically


possible. By emulating private schools, longer school days? Let's


emulate the best practice. At the, the top five independent schools are


getting more children into Oxford and Cambridge than the worst


performing 2000 state schools. That cannot be right, we have got to do


something about it. There are around 800,000 people in the UK with a


disease. It already costs the economy ?23 billion a year. By 2040,


dementia is expected to affect twice as many people, and the costs are


likely to travel. At the G8 dementia summit in December, David Cameron


spoke about the global challenge of dementia. Today really is about


three things. It is about realism, it is about determination, and it is


about hope. Realism because no-one here is in any doubt about the scale


of the dementia crisis. A new case every four microseconds, a global


cost of $600 billion a year. And that is to say nothing of the human


cost. Because it doesn't matter whether you are in London or Los


Angeles, in rural India or urban Japan, this disease steals lives,


wrecks families and breaks hearts, and that is why all of us here are


so determined to beat it. David Cameron there. Fiona Phillips is an


Alzheimer's Society Ambassador, Christian Guy is from the Centre for


Social Justice, the think tank founded by Work and Pensions


Secretary Iain Duncan Smith. That commitment made by David Cameron,


did it impress you? Well... No. What is really needed, so many things are


needed, I don't know where to start, but I spoke to David Cameron right


after, actually, he held a round table thing at Number Ten, and he


only recently clocked that dementia was not just a sign of ageing, old


people saying silly things. It is only recently that he clocked that


it was a disease. That is progress, but the money he has put up for...


We are 30 years behind in this country because of lack of funding,


and the funding that he offered and has put in, he has arranged to


double it, but it is still not fit for purpose. It is good that it is


being talked about and given national importance, but it is not


enough. Both your parents had Alzheimer's, tell us a little bit


about how it affected you . My mum started showing signs in her 50s, my


dad in his 60s. I gave up my job because something had to give, I


couldn't have children, ageing parents and do the whole lot, and


they were living at a distance from me in Wales, I was in London, and


eventually both they went into care. You looked after them... As much as


I could. Is the problem here that nobody has addressed the scale of


the problem that is affecting all of us with this issue? There has been a


gradual awakening, but this thing has taken a long time to emerge. In


relation to cancer, we have seen much more investment in research and


care over the last three or four decades. By 2050, 1.7 million people


will have dementia, against 800,000 now. One of the things that features


is that people deal with it at crisis point, because it is


difficult to plan, to have conversations about the issue, but


often then people go straight to A, they feel they cannot go home


because there is no support, they go into care homes. It is difficult for


families to have that conversation about the future, but as much as we


can plan, it is better for everyone if we can do that, to face up to it.


To have a national strategy which ends in 2015, France is on to its


fourth national strategy now. President Obama as a 25 year


strategy for dementia. Ours ends in 2015, and we do not know what is


going to follow it. A classic example of politicians wanting to


pass it onto the next group, but we cannot keep taking it down the


trail. But who has to actually grab all the problem? There is an endless


discussion, on this programme and lots of others like it, about


whether it is a social problem or a health problem. Would that change


things, classifying it as a health problem? Most care homes and nursing


homes are not just residential facilities, but the way we have


funded nursing homes has been to keep it quite separate. We know for


example that certain risk factors, we can take control of smoking,


exercise and weight. There is also the planning point, can we have


conversations now that so we are not reacting at crisis point. How do you


pay for it, Fiona? Do people have to accept that if more people are going


to get dementia or Alzheimer's, maybe they will get it earlier, they


will have to use some of their own resources? Because it manifests


itself eventually as a mental health problem, it is treated as the bum


end of everything, if you will pardon the expression. It is classed


as needing social care, rather than medical care. It is a physical


disease, and if it was treated as a physical disease, the care would be


funded by the NHS. So would make a big difference to reclassified in


that way? Absolutely, we shouldn't even be talking about this. I was at


a hospital in Portsmouth where they are making their geriatric wards


dementia friendly, and the nurses were saying they keep talking about


this time bomb going off. It has gone off and we are playing catch up


already. How much money would have to go into the NHS, for example, or


local authorities to deal with this problem in terms of providing the


right sort of care and nursing at home? Already cost billions, and we


are well short of what it takes to deal with the problem. When you look


at the way the trends are moving in the next three or four decades, we


are facing up to the fact that this will cost a lot more, and if people


play their part... What you mean by that? You seem to be skating around


the issue, what should people be doing, saying, we will have to sell


our family home to pay for care? That is part of the realistic


discussion that we have to have, because we have challenged the idea


that home is something we want to pass on to our children. Our assets


need to help us through, and a lot of children feel that if mum and dad


need that money, they should not feel it is protected for them.


Selling the home could be an important part of the discussion.


And the younger generation are being disenfranchised from the property


market, they cannot get on the ladder. The bigger question is not


how you funded, which is a problem, but how Health and Social Care Act


work together, what kind of care we want. The big debate is how we fund


it, but no-one is saying that. A really good example is training. GPs


and care workers often do not know how to spot the onset, so it comes


to the crisis point. That is an awareness that we are slowly


catching up to. If it is early-onset, in your 50s, I presume


medical staff are not necessarily looking for it, because at that


point it is still relatively unusual. Even if it is diagnosed,


and only at the rate of about half of people who present with cognitive


difficulties, about 50% now, which is a rise, are being diagnosed, but


once you have been diagnosed, you are pretty much told to get home and


get on with it. So there is nothing there? There is more than there ever


was, and the Alzheimer's Society has done a lot to bring this to the


forefront. There are schemes where people are being trained to


recognise what it is like living with dementia. And there are great


local projects, it is too sporadic, but some wonderful charity sane, we


will come with you on the journey as families. What about carers, usually


family members? What happens to them? It can go on for ten or 20


years. We have looked at unpaid carers who save about ?8 billion a


year for the economy, and we have looked at social prescriptions were


GPs could actually help carers get some respite, but also the workforce


that is official, often there are problems with very low pay, people


doing a 15 minute flying visit, the training is not there. The


experience of being cared for professionally as a problem. Would


you like them to be paid more in those care homes? They have to be in


the longer term, because what value do we place on the care going to


vulnerable people if we will not pay minimum wage? There has to be a gold


standard, training and qualifications in care, and


commensurate salary. It has to be a professional qualification.


Christian Guy, thank you very much. News, there is more of it, from all


sources, and it is more accessible than ever, so do we need to be


taught how to cope with it. In a moment we will talk to the author of


News: A User's Manual. First, Adam has a wry look at our recent news


has been reported. Water! People valiantly struggling


on! We did have nice apples until the rats ate them. Politicians being


shouted at quite incoherently! He says you should resign! You said


dredging is not the answer but now it is! And you wonder why the news


loves a flood, although it has posed a problem for West Country


correspondent Jon Kay - how many ways can he say it has been raining


a lot? This morning it flooded. This is something else, the whole barn


has been flooded. The weekend will bring yet more rain. In fact, it has


already begun. And there is more heavy rain due this weekend. There


is more heavy rain coming in. While he has been doing that, I have been


doing something much more to look goal of life as a journalist, trying


to drum up some interest in the Wythenshawe by-election. Does anyone


in Wythenshawe care about the by-election?! No! I am going to vote


for what is named. Are you excited about the by-election? Oh, no


interest. Why does no one care?! Meanwhile, the boffins back at base


have been experimenting with this, news stories in just 15 seconds on


the Instagram app. So you have seen three sides of our trade, the


exciting, the mundane and the very, very new. After all that, what has


been our most popular items so far this year? And now the weather for


all areas of the British Isles, but definitely not Bongo Bongo Land. And


the author of "News: A User's Manual", the philosopher, Alain de


Botton joins us now. Why was that the most popular, the weather being


done by Nigel Farage? People like that of human sapphire. -- -- people


like humour and satire. People like to know the something behind the


curtain. You guys are making it up, people in the studios. What do you


mean? Lots of research goes into these programmes. Some news is


masquerading as good news and a sound serious. The 8 billion stories


happening every day. The BBC picks on a certain number and says that's


what's happening. Of course, it's only very partial and at a basic


point we have to keep remembering. What would you have on today's


programme, what would have been your agenda on Dailyl Politics? I think a


lot of it would have been how you present the information. Take a


flood. The news likes to make is terrified and helpful. Wildly


hopeful about politicians and what they might do to transform the


country in a minute, and then totally terrified about something


else, because it keeps us coming back to the screens and keep you


guys on the job. I will gently say, the floods are terrible but we will


survive. Humanity, we have been in such things before, and we will come


out of them. The news is catastrophic. Individuals need to be


resilient. We need to be resilient. The news doesn't help that. I debate


the fact whether we are just reflecting what is happening and


what some people feel? Cheryl in defensive as a news percent. Let's


go to another news presenter. Do you think we all go for raw emotion?


Anger? Love, hate, because those are the things which sell newspaper and


put programmes in people's living rooms? To be fair, when they start


the news bulletins, they say these are the headlines. Not, this is the


news going on everywhere. They do pre-empted by saying we can only fit


in the headlines in this bulletin. I agree, but there's a weird way in


which despite the unbelievable technological news-gathering


sophistication, the key stories sometimes don't make it or we don't


quite put our finger on them. Can you give some examples of what you


would think is a key story? Today, we've talked about the floods, the


banning of smoking in cars, dementia. Are those issues salient


issues in your mind? It is said to your viewers, what was on the show


last week and how do you remember it and how are you living that


information? Make it memorable something different. It's about


trying to give the viewer some sense of the continuity of stories. It's


an easy target the modern news leaves you overwhelmed with


information so it's often hard to know what we actually care about and


a genuine political story knows how to make a change. The problem is, by


scattering so many causes, the population is overwhelmed and often


things don't change because politicians can't get an agenda


going because people are so distracted. Are you saying get rid


of it? If you're going to keep it, whoever edits it, you're going to


disagree with whatever is put on it because you don't agree with it. The


problem with the BBC, is so worried people will disagree with that, it's


so much on the one hand and not the other. You want more opinion, more


politicised? More biased? I wish you the best of luck with the BBC! The


BBC only once came off the fence in the last 20 years over apartheid


full for the BBC thought long and hard and decided it was against


apartheid. Ever since then, it's tied to a frame from expressing an


opinion on anything. I was at Sky News writeback on it first started


and we all had this backs to the wall mentality because everyone said


it would fail. Look at it now. There's obviously an appetite for 24


hours news. The issue is not should we have bias or not, but can we have


good bias question isn't it a judgement you're talking about pet


whose bias is good and bad? We get endless criticism for displaying


bias from the tumours. There's multiple crises and if the job of


the BBC to hand out the best possible bias in relation to the big


questions, rather than standing back and saying you make your own mind.


They do that on programmes which digests the news rather than just


give you the news. There is a distinction between Di jesting and


giving you the news. The news is constantly giving used up without


knowing what am I supposed to do with this? What would you like


people to do that? Are you saying the new should provide bigger with


moral guidance? How to improve their lives? We have to get better at


training people to cope with news. I wrote this book as a user manual to


the news. There's a lot of debate about how the news should be


structured with little thought given to the audience. Especially children


today. What should we teach people about the news? We can into the


world of news that thinking about it. I have this debate with a radio


on all the time and I'm not monitoring back closely what they're


listening to and what their absorbing. I remember when my


children were affected by what they have seen on the news, actually, and


you can't say, don't worry, it's not real. It is real. I remember 6pm


news bulletin, I can't member the news was on, and there was rape and


murder and I thought, how do I explain all this away? And how do I


put it into context? Most children grow into a situation where no one


sits down and says there's a weird thing called the news, collected by


people under works like this. Maybe there's a GCSE class in this. On the


whole, media studies is seen as a joke GCSE. It's one of the most


important things out there. Have a word of Michael Gove people listen


to you. Let's not go back to that. Thank you so much. There's just time


before we go to find out the answer to our quiz. The question was: Which


of these roles has Fiona NOT been offered? A) Chairmanship of the


Environment Agency. B) Labour candidate for the Eastleigh


by-election. Or c) Labour peer under Gordon Brown. Thankfully, Chris


Smith was offered that. I'm very relieved. What about standing as a


Labour candidate and becoming appear and Gordon Brown? I'm very


interested in things which affect ordinary people, people who use


hospitals, go to school, things everything that everyday people care


about. But I don't think the way party politics stands the moment,


people have enough respect the members of Parliament. And that's


what put you off? Did you think about accepting the offer to stand


as a candidate for example? No, I would rather write and campaign and


actually go out and see people, go to care homes and hospitals and talk


to real people and tried to do it from without rather than from within


because of a healthy disregard for politicians of the moment. More than


there ever has been, and I don't want to get into that thing and the


press take me apart, when actually I would be in it for altruistic


reasons yet you're not allowed to be. Let's leave it there. Now a


vote-rigging scandal has hit Westminster this week. Oh yes. Yes,


the fur is flying in the Westminster Cat of the Year competition run by


Battersea Dogs and Cats Home. Organisers became suspicious when


Bosun, cat to Tory MP Sheryll Murray, received 30,000 votes in


just seven hours. Politicians can only dream of such a thing. A


spokesperson for Sheryll Murray said there had clearly been dirty tricks


but denied any wrongdoing on her part. Bosun has now withdrawn from


the competition, leaving eight other felines to fight it out for top cat.


The competition closes on Thursday and the vote is expected to be


close. Organisers said it could come down to a whisker. One MP who


withdrew his cat, Jude, from the vote in protest is Labour's Andrew


Gwynne. Jude, my five-month-old kitten, who was fished out of the


Manchester canal, thought he had the ideal back story to be crowned the


first-ever Battersea Dogs and Cats Home cat of the year in the contest,


so along with ten other cats, he put his name down, but sadly, while all


the other cats were cat napping, one cat in particular seem to clock up


30,000 votes overnight and then tried to claim that his victory was


because of a sudden surge in Australian votes. Clearly, that was


a perfect alibi. Such serious stuff. A serious matter. I'm joined now by


two MPs whose moggies are still in the running for the top prize.


Conservative Justin Tomlinson and Labour's Bill Esterson. Welcome to


you both. Congratulations for the no cat fights on this show. Whose cat


is whose? Mine is the one with a white body and the blackface and


very big risk is. Mine is the black and white cat called Kevin. A


brilliant name. Named after his Schumann Mum's former my friend who


was a boxer. What is the point of all of this? They are supporting


Battersea cats and dogs home who do such a great job, raising profile. I


recently adopted a ten-year-old rescue dog, so it was something I


was keen to support. It was meant to be a bit of fun. It's turned into a


scandal for some how can that be? Yes, who knows? I think the


important thing to remember is we entered the same reason, to support


the good work that Battersea dogs and cats do, but I've also got a


rescue centre in my constituency who do a fantastic job. I think it's


important to support these organisations. Do you think this


might ruin it for future years now? I think they will look at the voting


system for next time. A single transferable vote? Who knows? It


would disappointing it come to this. We are meant to be doing our bit to


support Battersea and certainly, my cat is fast asleep on the keyboard


as we speak at the moment, so he's quite relaxed about it. At least


it's not the MP. I also am a cat from Battersea cats home. I'm not a


cat lover, I have to say. I think they are selfish and on for


themselves, rather like politicians. You have got to defend yourselves.


My cat is very good. He welcomed Susie the rescue dog with open arms.


My cat is called Monty. I like that. I think Kevin might confirm what


Fiona just said, because we've had two new arrivals in the household


but is determined to stay top cat. What about the mouse problem? The


Houses of Parliament are in the stated. Montague would struggle. He


would get excited for 30 seconds and then would have asleep. I think


Kevin's mouse catching days are past for the Pier 16, disabled full so he


went for operation in the summer. Are you going to be very


disappointed if you don't win? Not at all. It's about championing what


Battersea are doing. The cats are big coming good friends. May the


best one winner. Why is Andrew Gwynne so serious about it? Was it


tongue-in-cheek? I can't believe there has been vote rigging. Who


would've done that? I was surprised. Cheryl is one of the nicest and


least capable of cheating and IT system. I did speak to her and she


was bewildered by the whole thing. She entered the genuine reasons, but


I think it's all a bit silly. It's meant to be a bit of fun. Do you


think this is nonsense, Fiona? Yes, I do. It was all a bit of fun but I


would say, though to Kevin. When are you going to hear? Thursday is the


closing date. It's longer for people do look at the potential cats and


dogs to go and re-home. At apparently Apple say it alleged vote


rigging. I wouldn't want to get the lawyers involved. None of you have


seen or heard anything. What did you win? Do you get a prize? The cat


gets to be Purr Minister. Good luck to both of you. Maybe we will read


the winner when the comeback. That's all for today. Thanks to our guests.


Particular to you, Fiona. The One O'Clock News is starting over on BBC


One now. Andrew and I will be here at 11.30am tomorrow with Prime


Minister's Questions and all the big political stories of the day. Bye


bye. It's your job to keep law


and order, isn't it?


Download Subtitles