Browse content similar to 08/05/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Hello and welcome to the Daily Politics. | :00:36. | :00:40. | |
After a strong showing in the local elections last week, | :00:41. | :00:43. | |
Theresa May is out on the general election campaign trail today | :00:44. | :00:52. | |
re-stating her commitment to the Tories' so far failed target | :00:53. | :00:54. | |
of reducing net immigration to the tens of thousands. | :00:55. | :00:58. | |
Jeremy Corbyn is focusing on health today, unveiling a fresh Labour | :00:59. | :01:01. | |
pledge for free parking at NHS hospitals in England, | :01:02. | :01:03. | |
paid for by increasing tax on private health insurance. | :01:04. | :01:07. | |
The BBC announces plans for a televised election debate | :01:08. | :01:09. | |
featuring seven parties on May 31st but it won't feature | :01:10. | :01:12. | |
We've got full details of the beeb's special election programming. | :01:13. | :01:21. | |
And we are taking the mood box on the road across the whole | :01:22. | :01:23. | |
of the UK for the general election campaign. | :01:24. | :01:25. | |
All that in the next hour and with us for the whole | :01:26. | :01:37. | |
of the programme today are the former Attorney General | :01:38. | :01:39. | |
Dominic Grieve and the Shadow Foreign Office Minister, | :01:40. | :01:41. | |
So lots to discuss, but before we get stuck | :01:42. | :01:48. | |
in to the British general election, let's take a look at the election | :01:49. | :01:51. | |
across the Channel and the victory of centrist | :01:52. | :01:53. | |
candidate Emmanuel Macron as the new President of France. | :01:54. | :02:00. | |
In the second round run-off between Mr Macron and Marine Le Pen, | :02:01. | :02:04. | |
the leader of the Front National, Mr Macron took two thirds | :02:05. | :02:07. | |
Speaking last night outside the Louvre in Paris, | :02:08. | :02:16. | |
Emanuel Macron said a new page was being turned in French history. | :02:17. | :02:23. | |
TRANSLATION: What we've done for so many months, | :02:24. | :02:26. | |
there is no comparison, there is no equivalent to that. | :02:27. | :02:28. | |
Everybody was saying to us it was impossible. | :02:29. | :02:32. | |
But they didn't know anything about France! | :02:33. | :02:39. | |
Victory speech therefore Emmanuel Macron. I mean, it was a pretty | :02:40. | :02:46. | |
impressive win for him, bearing in mind he hadn't been elected before. | :02:47. | :02:51. | |
But will it be good for Britain and Brexit, Dominic Grieve? I think on | :02:52. | :02:54. | |
the face of it it must be a good thing to have a moderate and | :02:55. | :02:58. | |
sensible President as the President of France. Is it going to give as | :02:59. | :03:03. | |
advantages in the Brexit negotiations? I rather doubt it. | :03:04. | :03:07. | |
France will clearly look to its long-term national advantage but | :03:08. | :03:10. | |
some of that national advantage is bound up with ours. It is in the | :03:11. | :03:13. | |
French interest to have good trading relations and a stable relationship | :03:14. | :03:18. | |
with the UK. I would be very surprised if Mr Macron did not | :03:19. | :03:21. | |
understand that and therefore I would expect and hope that he will | :03:22. | :03:26. | |
be reasonable in approaching the Brexit negotiations and will look at | :03:27. | :03:28. | |
those areas where French interest and our own in fact meet. And there | :03:29. | :03:33. | |
is a longer-term security issue which is of immense importance and | :03:34. | :03:37. | |
the French know this. The UK is their key security partner in the | :03:38. | :03:41. | |
European context. Although he says he wants to reform the lid to pay | :03:42. | :03:46. | |
agreement which we will come to in a moment. How will Jeremy Corbyn if he | :03:47. | :03:52. | |
is Prime Minister after the general election approached discussions? Or | :03:53. | :04:00. | |
how should he approached them? I really loved the motto, the bringing | :04:01. | :04:04. | |
together in the national interest of France. And that is the key thing of | :04:05. | :04:08. | |
the negotiations, searching out the key things we can do together and | :04:09. | :04:13. | |
resolving those, rather than megaphone diplomacy. Emmanuel Macron | :04:14. | :04:17. | |
has said in the past that Britain can expect no concessions in the | :04:18. | :04:21. | |
Brexit negotiations and we will see if he sticks to that and he has said | :04:22. | :04:26. | |
that he will hold a rigid line on the single market and access to the | :04:27. | :04:31. | |
European court. I think what get says in election campaigns and what | :04:32. | :04:38. | |
happens afterwards with a clear head is different. That is why Keir | :04:39. | :04:41. | |
Starmer will be so fantastic as our number one negotiator. We're looking | :04:42. | :04:48. | |
at pictures now off Emmanuel Macron, the President-elect, and Francois | :04:49. | :04:51. | |
Hollande, the outgoing President of France, meeting at the World War II | :04:52. | :04:55. | |
memorial. You mention security, Dominic Grieve. I mentioned the lE | :04:56. | :05:10. | |
-- Touquet agreement which allows passport checking to be done in | :05:11. | :05:14. | |
France. It was clear at the time that the agreement would be | :05:15. | :05:25. | |
beneficial to both parties, but following the arrival of so many | :05:26. | :05:28. | |
migrants in the Schengen area, it turned out to be bad for the French. | :05:29. | :05:31. | |
It would be very bad if it was changed for us. And even outside of | :05:32. | :05:37. | |
the EU we need to be able to facilitate movement of people | :05:38. | :05:41. | |
between both countries. I am not horribly pessimistic about the | :05:42. | :05:45. | |
future of the Le Touquet agreement. One of the consequences Brexit which | :05:46. | :05:48. | |
was predicted at the time was that this would come up for review and | :05:49. | :05:50. | |
the French would probably take a different view than they did before | :05:51. | :05:56. | |
Brexit. And before the referendum. I think it is inevitable that that | :05:57. | :05:59. | |
will go into the mixture of our bilateral relations but it is worth | :06:00. | :06:02. | |
bearing in mind that it is not linked directly to the EU at all. | :06:03. | :06:06. | |
Manual Macron has been pretty shameless in his ambition to your | :06:07. | :06:11. | |
French workers and money back to France, and as you know there are | :06:12. | :06:14. | |
many French workers here. They say London is the fourth biggest city in | :06:15. | :06:20. | |
France. Just quickly on the Le Touquet agreement, we remember the | :06:21. | :06:23. | |
chaos last year just after the referendum. I am afraid if we don't | :06:24. | :06:27. | |
have a plan, if we don't get our ducks lined up in a row, and stop | :06:28. | :06:31. | |
the megaphone diplomacy and think about the facts, we will have a | :06:32. | :06:36. | |
similar situation. But on the question of the finance sector and | :06:37. | :06:40. | |
so on, due to Brexit I believe we have lost hundreds of people who | :06:41. | :06:43. | |
work in the financial sector already and as a London MP that is something | :06:44. | :06:47. | |
that concerns me. I would like to get them back. We will leave it | :06:48. | :06:49. | |
there for the moment. The question for today | :06:50. | :06:53. | |
is all about Tim Farron. The Lib Dem leader has revealed | :06:54. | :06:57. | |
that, as a boy, he had a poster in his bedroom of a rather | :06:58. | :07:01. | |
unusual political icon. Was it: | :07:02. | :07:03. | |
a) Che Guevara At the end of the show Dominic | :07:04. | :07:06. | |
and Catherine will give Throughout the general election | :07:07. | :07:11. | |
campaign we'll be getting political insight from two top | :07:12. | :07:19. | |
political journalists. Today | :07:20. | :07:20. | |
we're joined by Christopher Hope of the Telegraph and the political | :07:21. | :07:22. | |
commentator Martha Gill. I am sure you are going to live up | :07:23. | :07:30. | |
to that great billing of the two of you! Welcome to the programme. What | :07:31. | :07:37. | |
sort of campaign is it going to be? Battle buses? Morning conferences? | :07:38. | :07:42. | |
How will it feel? I think no. Apart from the Lib Dems and Ukip, who are | :07:43. | :07:46. | |
doing press conferences, but not every morning. The Lib Dems have got | :07:47. | :07:50. | |
the yellow battle bus and we are yet to see a Tory or Labour one and it | :07:51. | :07:54. | |
is hard for me and mother to get onto them. Normally it is a few | :07:55. | :07:58. | |
camera crews and a wire service and that is it so we are left trying to | :07:59. | :07:59. | |
scramble to where they are going to be, and cut | :08:00. | :08:14. | |
them off at the pass. We have more control than ever with a short | :08:15. | :08:16. | |
campaign. Mother, what will you be doing? Chris has made suggestions. | :08:17. | :08:19. | |
How will you keep tabs and hold their feet to the fire? It is | :08:20. | :08:21. | |
difficult, particularly with the Tories. The campaign is all about | :08:22. | :08:23. | |
Theresa May. There has really been no difference between the local at | :08:24. | :08:25. | |
the general election in that respect, I think. The local and | :08:26. | :08:29. | |
general election have been exactly the same and all about Theresa May | :08:30. | :08:33. | |
and her message. Labour looks disorganised. I think probably what | :08:34. | :08:40. | |
will happen is local candidates are going to distance themselves from | :08:41. | :08:45. | |
Jeremy Corbyn at it. That is what we saw having the most success in the | :08:46. | :08:49. | |
local election. The Lib Dems will try as hard as they can to push the | :08:50. | :08:54. | |
anti-Brexit message. Let's talk about the issues, namely immigration | :08:55. | :08:57. | |
and the target that the Tories looked as if they may well restate | :08:58. | :09:01. | |
in terms of bringing net migration down to tens of thousands. Before I | :09:02. | :09:05. | |
come to you, this is what Theresa May had to say in Harrow. | :09:06. | :09:11. | |
It is important that we continue and we will continue to say that we do | :09:12. | :09:14. | |
want to bring net migration down to sustainable levels. | :09:15. | :09:16. | |
We believe that is the tens of thousands. | :09:17. | :09:18. | |
And of course once we leave the European | :09:19. | :09:20. | |
Union we will have the opportunity to ensure that we have control of | :09:21. | :09:23. | |
our borders here in the UK because we will be able to establish our | :09:24. | :09:27. | |
rules for people coming from the European Union into the UK. | :09:28. | :09:30. | |
That's a part of the picture we haven't been | :09:31. | :09:32. | |
able to control before and we will be able to control it. | :09:33. | :09:35. | |
Leaving the EU means that we won't have freedom | :09:36. | :09:37. | |
of movement as it has been in the past. | :09:38. | :09:46. | |
So they are going to go for it again. The Tories have got nowhere | :09:47. | :09:50. | |
near that pledge of bringing migration down to tens of thousands | :09:51. | :09:55. | |
so will it be third time lucky? It is not just the Tories, it was | :09:56. | :10:00. | |
Theresa May as Home Secretary, and it is on her watch. It is a problem | :10:01. | :10:04. | |
getting a net figure when you don't know how many people will leave the | :10:05. | :10:08. | |
country. You get the net figure when you take off the number of people | :10:09. | :10:11. | |
leaving and those coming back, which is why it is so hard to hit it. | :10:12. | :10:15. | |
Amber Rudd said yesterday that she thought the figure would be the same | :10:16. | :10:19. | |
as the last one and now Tories are slapping down. In that press | :10:20. | :10:25. | |
Conference that you played there, Theresa May will be discussing the | :10:26. | :10:29. | |
Le Touquet agreement with President Macron from France, which is very | :10:30. | :10:33. | |
interesting. The big question there is word of the Jungle camp go, the | :10:34. | :10:38. | |
north of France or cad? The fact that is on the table again could be | :10:39. | :10:44. | |
a problem for Theresa May. -- the north of France or Kent? She has | :10:45. | :10:50. | |
said it will not be freedom of movement as we have known it but | :10:51. | :10:56. | |
what will come in its place? The fact that she has stuck by that | :10:57. | :11:00. | |
100,000 figure from 2010 indicates that she is willing to tie herself | :11:01. | :11:08. | |
up, tie her hands, in order not to rock the Brexiteer vote at the | :11:09. | :11:15. | |
moment. That 100,000 figure was an albatross around David Cameron's | :11:16. | :11:18. | |
neck and many said it was the biggest mistake he ever made. | :11:19. | :11:22. | |
Theresa May is falling into exactly the same trap. It will become even | :11:23. | :11:25. | |
more toxic with Brexit as people watch that figure. It will be | :11:26. | :11:31. | |
something that the globalists in her party and the local lists can really | :11:32. | :11:36. | |
fight over. But she is willing to take that risk and really ensure | :11:37. | :11:43. | |
that this election doesn't get any... She doesn't lose any | :11:44. | :11:47. | |
Brexiteer votes. On freedom of movement we expected to go in a | :11:48. | :11:52. | |
similar direction at the moment. Let's look at health, Labour's | :11:53. | :11:56. | |
chosen issue today. They were talking about a range of things that | :11:57. | :11:59. | |
perhaps the most eye-catching is this idea of free NHS hospital | :12:00. | :12:03. | |
parking. Just listen to Jeremy Corbyn, the Labour leader. If you go | :12:04. | :12:16. | |
there in an emergency, I don't think you should be charged for doing so. | :12:17. | :12:20. | |
I have just been talking to nurses, some of whom are community nurses, | :12:21. | :12:25. | |
who go to different hospitals at different times, others do night | :12:26. | :12:28. | |
shifts and there is no public transport available, and they have | :12:29. | :12:31. | |
got to park their car and often they have to pay for the privilege of | :12:32. | :12:36. | |
parking at the place of work where they have got to be and they have | :12:37. | :12:40. | |
had frozen pay for seven years so I think it is absolutely right that | :12:41. | :12:44. | |
going to a hospital doesn't incur an additional charge. In reality it is | :12:45. | :12:50. | |
a charge on sickness. That will be popular, won't it? I can hear my | :12:51. | :12:55. | |
voice echoing. Sorry. For sure it will be popular. It plays very well | :12:56. | :13:00. | |
into Labour's key voters. Though more charges for parking, but | :13:01. | :13:07. | |
hitting people who can afford private insurance. -- no more | :13:08. | :13:10. | |
charges for parking. But it will face the same criticism that many of | :13:11. | :13:15. | |
Labour's policies do. Will this cover the cost? Parking fines and | :13:16. | :13:22. | |
charges have filled gaps in the NHS. Is this really something we want to | :13:23. | :13:26. | |
lose? But it is more than that. It is punishing any kind of aspiration. | :13:27. | :13:31. | |
People want to work hard and pay taxes for health care and fund the | :13:32. | :13:35. | |
wonderful NHS, but also pay money into an insurance scheme to go to | :13:36. | :13:39. | |
the doctor when they want to, and I think this policy is damaging to | :13:40. | :13:44. | |
aspiration. It is Jeremy Corbyn not reaching out. Parking charges have | :13:45. | :13:48. | |
been a big issue. We have written in The Telegraph about how unfair it is | :13:49. | :13:52. | |
to be taxed to go to sleep a relative in hospital but I think it | :13:53. | :13:58. | |
is a tax on aspiration and that is the problem he has got. Moving on | :13:59. | :14:02. | |
the television debates, Theresa May has said she will not do leaders | :14:03. | :14:06. | |
debate in terms of debating had to head with Jeremy Corbyn. Will | :14:07. | :14:10. | |
pressure come on them during the campaign? I think so. The BBC | :14:11. | :14:15. | |
announcement at lunchtime today, about having Question Time sessions | :14:16. | :14:22. | |
with voters in the audience questioning the leaders | :14:23. | :14:25. | |
individually. It will not wash. Theresa May seem to have won the | :14:26. | :14:30. | |
battle with the BBC. There will be a seven strong front bench debate. ITV | :14:31. | :14:33. | |
are going to have a go at doing the debates and good luck to them. Our | :14:34. | :14:37. | |
readers, voters and viewers want to see had to hand combat which they | :14:38. | :14:42. | |
will not get if Theresa May gets her way. Thank you. Let's pick up on | :14:43. | :14:45. | |
some of the points discussed there. Let's pick up on some of those | :14:46. | :14:56. | |
points, if this isn't going to be freedom of movement as we know and | :14:57. | :15:00. | |
what are the feasible alternatives? We'll have to see how this develops | :15:01. | :15:05. | |
because there are different options. Which would you prefer? Clearly when | :15:06. | :15:11. | |
you consider our European partners there is great design ability that | :15:12. | :15:14. | |
people should be able to come in and out of the UK. We are not about to | :15:15. | :15:20. | |
impose visas on millions of tourists coming over to visit Westminster | :15:21. | :15:24. | |
Abbey. So we will have people coming from the EU to work here. Not | :15:25. | :15:29. | |
necessarily because if you have a work permit system after we leave | :15:30. | :15:33. | |
the EU you'll be able to regulate the number of permits you give out. | :15:34. | :15:38. | |
The desirability of reducing overall net migration, I've no doubt about | :15:39. | :15:42. | |
it because if you look at the pressure it is based on communities | :15:43. | :15:45. | |
and infrastructure it is very real in those areas where they are most | :15:46. | :15:51. | |
concentrated. It is also right to say that achieving that reduction | :15:52. | :15:55. | |
will be very challenging. And very challenging to achieve that tens of | :15:56. | :15:59. | |
thousands pledged to bring down net migration. It hasn't been done, | :16:00. | :16:05. | |
anything like it. Is it sensible to be stated? We had net migration in | :16:06. | :16:11. | |
the tens of thousands in the 1990s. It hasn't been achieved since this | :16:12. | :16:18. | |
pledge... Absolutely right, successive governments have | :16:19. | :16:21. | |
indicated a desire to reduce immigration and not been able to | :16:22. | :16:25. | |
achieve that. On leaving the EU the options are doing and are increased | :16:26. | :16:30. | |
because the freedom of movement linked to EU membership goes. It | :16:31. | :16:33. | |
will still be a challenge but I don't criticise the Prime Minister | :16:34. | :16:39. | |
for coming along and making it an aspiration, indicating that they are | :16:40. | :16:43. | |
seeking to reducing it to those levels. And fail again if the past | :16:44. | :16:48. | |
record is anything to go by. Can we look to health. Very briefly, three | :16:49. | :16:55. | |
quick points. One, broken promise. Two, Labour would move towards | :16:56. | :16:59. | |
allowing all EU National is to remain on the first day of the | :17:00. | :17:03. | |
Labour government. That is our unilateral pledge. And three, take | :17:04. | :17:07. | |
students out of absolute target because it is breaking our | :17:08. | :17:12. | |
university system, one of our biggest exports. Why isn't it | :17:13. | :17:15. | |
happening because everyone seems to think it is right to take students | :17:16. | :17:22. | |
out of that target. The measure of international migration includes | :17:23. | :17:24. | |
students, something I've always found surprising. I don't think | :17:25. | :17:27. | |
people are concerned at the number of students coming into the country | :17:28. | :17:32. | |
as long as this number is not the feel of long-term migration. The | :17:33. | :17:36. | |
difficulty that the government has is to depart from an internationally | :17:37. | :17:40. | |
recognised Norm will attract criticism and I suspect that is one | :17:41. | :17:44. | |
reason why the Prime Minister is very reluctant to do it. Let's talk | :17:45. | :17:48. | |
about health because as well as free image is parking Labour wants to ban | :17:49. | :17:55. | |
junk food advertising during programmes like the X Factor, hardly | :17:56. | :18:00. | |
revolutionary, and if you go ahead with the proposal to stop car | :18:01. | :18:04. | |
parking charges again it has not been costed. So many people who are | :18:05. | :18:08. | |
ill are facing this extra cost every time they go to hospital. Is the | :18:09. | :18:13. | |
sort of thing Labour can do. It's not extremely expensive. It's | :18:14. | :18:17. | |
between ?160 million and ?190 million. It is feasible and I think | :18:18. | :18:23. | |
it is the correct thing to do, especially for staff who are running | :18:24. | :18:25. | |
out of appointments to put more pennies into the parking meter. We | :18:26. | :18:30. | |
need something workable. This is not only going to food banks, they have | :18:31. | :18:35. | |
to stump up extra money because they are on consultancy arrangements that | :18:36. | :18:38. | |
they don't know which hospital they will be ad from one day to the next | :18:39. | :18:41. | |
and it seems to me something we could sort out overnight but the | :18:42. | :18:45. | |
government has failed to do so until now. Let's move on. | :18:46. | :18:47. | |
With just over four weeks to go until the general | :18:48. | :18:50. | |
election on June 8th, the main parties' tax plans | :18:51. | :18:52. | |
Labour have put forward a so-called "personal tax guarantee". | :18:53. | :18:57. | |
This means that, under a Labour government, | :18:58. | :18:59. | |
there would be no rises in the standard rate of VAT, personal | :19:00. | :19:02. | |
National Insurance Contributions or income tax on those earning less | :19:03. | :19:05. | |
than ?80,000 a year, which is 95% of taxpayers. | :19:06. | :19:13. | |
However, the Shadow Chancellor John McDonnell | :19:14. | :19:15. | |
said yesterday that people earning more than ?80,000 a year would have | :19:16. | :19:18. | |
refused to say whether or not they will repeat the so-called | :19:19. | :19:29. | |
"triple tax lock", this was a promise not to raise income | :19:30. | :19:33. | |
tax, VAT or national insurance, which they made at the last | :19:34. | :19:36. | |
In a recent interview Theresa May said "We won't be increasing VAT." | :19:37. | :19:42. | |
But she did not make a similar promise for either income tax | :19:43. | :19:44. | |
Meanwhile, the Liberal Democrats have said that they would raise | :19:45. | :19:48. | |
They say that this would raise ?6 billion, | :19:49. | :19:55. | |
and that money would be ring-fenced for the NHS and social care. | :19:56. | :19:58. | |
The party's leader Tim Farron said the money | :19:59. | :20:00. | |
Let's look at what John McDonnell the Shadow Chancellor said about | :20:01. | :20:13. | |
Labour's tax policy yesterday. What we are saying is anyone earning | :20:14. | :20:17. | |
below ?80,000 will be guaranteed, you're not have an increase in | :20:18. | :20:21. | |
income tax, the 80 national insurance contributions and for | :20:22. | :20:24. | |
those above ?80,000 we are asking them to pay a mod and bit more to | :20:25. | :20:30. | |
fund our public services. You had Theresa May on last week. You put | :20:31. | :20:34. | |
that good question to her about nurses, 11% cut in wages in the | :20:35. | :20:47. | |
last seven years and some of them having to go to food banks, nurses, | :20:48. | :20:51. | |
that can't be right. We will ask those higher earners just to pay a | :20:52. | :20:53. | |
bit more. Shadow Chancellor John McDonnell. | :20:54. | :20:56. | |
We've been joined to discuss the parties' tax promises | :20:57. | :20:58. | |
by the Liberal Democrat, Dick Newby. | :20:59. | :21:01. | |
Is it possible that the party will raise national insurance | :21:02. | :21:07. | |
contributions? Will have to wait for the manifesto but two things, Labour | :21:08. | :21:11. | |
will be much tougher on the corporations, we know that from | :21:12. | :21:16. | |
2011-15 Thames water, paid zero corporation tax. So we will make | :21:17. | :21:20. | |
sure that the corporations pay their tax. Why should we pay our 's and | :21:21. | :21:28. | |
they pay zero... We will change the legislation which the Tories have | :21:29. | :21:31. | |
had seven years to do and failed to do. They've failed to crack down on | :21:32. | :21:36. | |
corporations paying supertax. You can set the rate of 40 alike but | :21:37. | :21:39. | |
you've allowed a loophole such as the one that has developed under the | :21:40. | :21:45. | |
Tory government -- you can set which of the rate you like but if you have | :21:46. | :21:48. | |
allowed a loophole, these people are getting away with paying zero. How | :21:49. | :21:53. | |
will we get the money ad of the system which exists already... What | :21:54. | :22:00. | |
rate of corporation tax? You want to reverse any cuts. What rate will the | :22:01. | :22:06. | |
party set it at? That will be in the manifesto but the main thing is that | :22:07. | :22:11. | |
they pay it. What was the rate that they have been paying zero on? | :22:12. | :22:15. | |
That's the real injustice, Jo. Very briefly because I want to go onto | :22:16. | :22:23. | |
policies. This is a sideline. The questions to the legal framework of | :22:24. | :22:26. | |
corporation tax may be relevant and I am in favour of closing | :22:27. | :22:30. | |
loopholes... Voters won't be pleased if they found out corporations are | :22:31. | :22:37. | |
not paying their share. This having an impact on revenue is negligible. | :22:38. | :22:42. | |
The reality is that by cutting corporation tax the Conservative | :22:43. | :22:44. | |
government has raised the amount you get to corporation tax because the | :22:45. | :22:48. | |
economy has grown. This is what Labour will attack and, I'm afraid, | :22:49. | :22:53. | |
undermined because they have never had a coherent economic policy and | :22:54. | :22:57. | |
their tax policies always have the consequence of reducing economic | :22:58. | :23:01. | |
growth... They seem to be clear on the tax policy. Labour has promised | :23:02. | :23:06. | |
not to raise the standard rate of VAT. Does that leave open the chance | :23:07. | :23:10. | |
of raising the reduced rate of VAT paid on things like energy? Talking | :23:11. | :23:15. | |
about energy, big company like Thames Water, let's look at how much | :23:16. | :23:23. | |
tax they pay first. This is about Labour's tax policy... Our priority | :23:24. | :23:27. | |
is not your average person today paying more tax, it's about getting | :23:28. | :23:32. | |
the corporations, which are greedy, and taking all they can, as | :23:33. | :23:37. | |
disturbing, you have to agree on this, the government has done | :23:38. | :23:40. | |
nothing to crack down on these big companies. They can pay so much more | :23:41. | :23:46. | |
than an average person... And so according to John McDonnell is | :23:47. | :23:52. | |
people paying ?80,000. He will protect 90% of the working | :23:53. | :23:56. | |
population. That will be revealed in the manifesto. Of course but when | :23:57. | :23:59. | |
promises like this made people want to know that they are going to lead | :24:00. | :24:04. | |
the amount of money that say... Thames Cameron - David Cameron | :24:05. | :24:10. | |
wanted to cut down on business loopholes and yet Thames Water paid | :24:11. | :24:14. | |
no corporation tax in those years, how can that be fair? There was this | :24:15. | :24:20. | |
triple tax lock not to raise the three main taxes and of course | :24:21. | :24:25. | |
Philip Hammond did the opposite and tried to raise national insurance | :24:26. | :24:27. | |
contributions class war. Why should anyone trust what you say in your | :24:28. | :24:33. | |
manifesto. I hope the manifesto will avoid detailed pledges because | :24:34. | :24:35. | |
everything that I have ever seen shows that you have an intention | :24:36. | :24:40. | |
which is that they are a low tax party and we have been consistent in | :24:41. | :24:44. | |
trying to achieve that everyone but if you stop making detailed promises | :24:45. | :24:48. | |
particularly at a time of economic turbulence linked to leaving the | :24:49. | :24:52. | |
European Union you are likely to saddle yourself with potential | :24:53. | :24:58. | |
problems. I will read the manifesto with interest but in my view I think | :24:59. | :25:03. | |
that blocks are probably and desirable. Except that of swing | :25:04. | :25:11. | |
voters are trying to decide who to vote for and Labour say they won't | :25:12. | :25:15. | |
raise income tax and 95% of people, then you should vote Labour if you | :25:16. | :25:26. | |
want a lower tax. They've got a ?45 billion hole in their financial | :25:27. | :25:31. | |
projections, we will they fill it from, they've either got to borrow | :25:32. | :25:35. | |
it or they will have to raise taxes which will be equally bad, I would | :25:36. | :25:41. | |
not believe a word the Labour manifesto says on this. You promised | :25:42. | :25:47. | |
not to increase national insurance contributions. David Cameron said | :25:48. | :25:53. | |
that there wouldn't be an increase in VAT and appoint VAT. Being a | :25:54. | :26:03. | |
voter, Labour is going to be the party to relieve the tax burden so | :26:04. | :26:09. | |
far, it seems. We've taken 4 million people and of higher tax, we have | :26:10. | :26:16. | |
taken people out of tax altogether, the culmination of raising tax | :26:17. | :26:19. | |
thresholds and the living wage is likely to benefit the poorest. For | :26:20. | :26:24. | |
those reasons everyone should trust the Conservative government over | :26:25. | :26:28. | |
this because its record on this is very good. And what about Thames | :26:29. | :26:35. | |
Water? We've mentioned them, they are just one company. We are talking | :26:36. | :26:43. | |
about tax proposals. Dick, is it fair to raise all rates by the same | :26:44. | :26:48. | |
percentage, whether you are a basic rate taxpayer or a higher rate | :26:49. | :26:52. | |
taxpayer? The great thing about income tax generally is that it is | :26:53. | :26:56. | |
the most fair tax. On this policy, it means that a nurse, for example, | :26:57. | :27:02. | |
will pay an extra three or four quid a week, but someone on a quarter of | :27:03. | :27:07. | |
a million pounds will pay an extra few thousand pounds a year. This is | :27:08. | :27:11. | |
a fair way of dealing with a national crisis. The other parties | :27:12. | :27:15. | |
admit there is a problem that haven't found a way of dealing with | :27:16. | :27:20. | |
it because the Labour proposal is incredible, you can't get 6 billion | :27:21. | :27:26. | |
quid out of people who burn over ?80,000 a year because as we know, | :27:27. | :27:31. | |
once you put up headline tax rates, they stop paying it. Why is John | :27:32. | :27:39. | |
McDonnell being so timid, you won't raise anything like ?6 million, | :27:40. | :27:48. | |
which Dick Newby says will put more money in the NHS, it yours won't | :27:49. | :27:51. | |
raise much but it will put more burden on the people you want to | :27:52. | :27:55. | |
hit. We've had seven years to deal with rip-off companies who takes | :27:56. | :27:59. | |
much money out of our economy day in, day out... What John McDonnell | :28:00. | :28:04. | |
is saying is that that isn't where most of the money is coming from. | :28:05. | :28:08. | |
They've had seven years to do it and they haven't done it. What will this | :28:09. | :28:15. | |
race? This seems to be displacement activity. And the first to accept | :28:16. | :28:25. | |
that tax avoidance is a loophole but to suggest that this will certainly | :28:26. | :28:28. | |
lead to massive sums of money which will fund Labour's ?45 million black | :28:29. | :28:35. | |
hole I think is fanciful. What is the ?45 million black hole, what is | :28:36. | :28:39. | |
that referring to? They have referred to a range of things that | :28:40. | :28:42. | |
they say they wish to finance more and which on the face of it, when | :28:43. | :28:52. | |
you total the aggregate promises, they may clarify where that is but | :28:53. | :28:56. | |
when you aggregate it up is the figure. And John McDonnell has not | :28:57. | :29:00. | |
explained that. There have been a series of promises about more money | :29:01. | :29:03. | |
for everything. And let's face it, I am the first to accept that in any | :29:04. | :29:08. | |
society with public services, you can find a justification... And many | :29:09. | :29:13. | |
people will find many of those policies popular, especially if they | :29:14. | :29:16. | |
feel that there is a crisis, for example in social care and the | :29:17. | :29:30. | |
NHS... If that economy is wrecked in the process that money will never | :29:31. | :29:32. | |
come. The Tories have borrowed twice as much as both Labour governments | :29:33. | :29:34. | |
put together between 1997 and 2010. From 2010 to 2017 have borrowed... | :29:35. | :29:38. | |
As usual, the Lib Dems are attacking Labour. Let Dick Newby make his | :29:39. | :29:44. | |
point. You both failed to do with tax avoidance. No we didn't! Let | :29:45. | :29:53. | |
Dick Newby answer. Because of the high levels of investment that | :29:54. | :29:56. | |
Thames Water have made they offset that against their tax liability. If | :29:57. | :30:02. | |
you are saying you want to change... I thought that was separate... | :30:03. | :30:06. | |
Corporation tax in the last financial year went up considerably | :30:07. | :30:10. | |
because people invested less. If you want that to happen, find that there | :30:11. | :30:16. | |
is no easy huge bucks out of companies. We need to move on now. | :30:17. | :30:22. | |
You need incentives for investment, and the corporations, which happen | :30:23. | :30:26. | |
to be the Tory donors on the whole, they are the ones... You have made | :30:27. | :30:30. | |
your point, Catherine. I need to ask Dick Newby about something else. The | :30:31. | :30:41. | |
Conservatives have sent out a press piece suggesting that Labour | :30:42. | :30:46. | |
supporters should vote for the Lib Dems. Labour voters should make up | :30:47. | :30:51. | |
their minds for the most important thing is for them. If the most | :30:52. | :30:56. | |
important thing for them is Brexit, they have a hard Brexit Conservative | :30:57. | :31:00. | |
and a strong, moderate Labour candidate, who is a strong Remainer, | :31:01. | :31:05. | |
it wouldn't surprise me if they voted for that Labour candidate. But | :31:06. | :31:10. | |
you shouldn't be encouraging it as official party policy. It is for | :31:11. | :31:13. | |
everybody to make their own mind up in the seat where they live. So you | :31:14. | :31:17. | |
wouldn't want to adopt it as party policy as Vince Cable would like to | :31:18. | :31:21. | |
see? It is for everybody to decide in the seat where they live in the | :31:22. | :31:27. | |
absence of PR to decide who best represents their interest. Thank | :31:28. | :31:28. | |
you. In the last hour, the BBC has | :31:29. | :31:34. | |
announced the details of its special Election Debate on Wednesday May | :31:35. | :31:37. | |
31st, a seven-way debate on policy, involving senior spokespeople | :31:38. | :31:48. | |
from the Conservatives, Labour, Liberal Democrat, | :31:49. | :31:50. | |
SNP, Plaid Cymru, Green Two days later on Friday June 2nd, | :31:51. | :31:52. | |
David Dimbleby will chair a Question Time Leaders Special | :31:53. | :31:59. | |
from York live on BBC One, featuring And on Sunday 4th June, leaders | :32:00. | :32:02. | |
Tim Farron and Nicola Sturgeon will take part in a second | :32:03. | :32:06. | |
Question Time Special, Leanne Wood and Paul Nuttall | :32:07. | :32:10. | |
will also face questions that Sunday in separate programmes | :32:11. | :32:16. | |
from Swansea and The final debate before the election | :32:17. | :32:17. | |
will be a Newsbeat Youth Debate in Manchester on Tuesday 6th June, | :32:18. | :32:26. | |
where leading Conservative, Labour, Liberal Democrat, SNP, Plaid Cymru, | :32:27. | :32:28. | |
Green and Ukip politicians will face questions in front of an audience | :32:29. | :32:38. | |
of 16 to 34-year-olds. Elsewhere Andrew Neil will be | :32:39. | :32:40. | |
presenting a series of one-on-one interviews with Theresa May, | :32:41. | :32:42. | |
Jeremy Corbyn, Tim Farron, Paul Nuttall and Nicola | :32:43. | :32:47. | |
Sturgeon throughout We've been joined by the BBC's head | :32:48. | :32:48. | |
of newsgathering and elections Welcome. There are reports that | :32:49. | :33:02. | |
Theresa May will be appearing on The One Show on Tuesday night. That is | :33:03. | :33:08. | |
true. She will be on the sofa at seven o'clock tomorrow night and | :33:09. | :33:11. | |
there will be other interviews with party leaders on the show. It is not | :33:12. | :33:15. | |
part of the debate strategy but that is true. And what about Jeremy | :33:16. | :33:20. | |
Corbyn's wife? It is up to Mr and Mrs Corbyn about whether they want | :33:21. | :33:24. | |
to appear as a couple. The invitation has been extended. The | :33:25. | :33:28. | |
seven way debate on the 51st of May that I mentioned, involving all the | :33:29. | :33:33. | |
major parties, it is trailed that senior spokespeople will take part | :33:34. | :33:38. | |
and not the leaders. Why not? -- on the 31st of May. Theresa May | :33:39. | :33:42. | |
announced that she would not take part in any television debate. We | :33:43. | :33:46. | |
went into the process of piecing together a plan for our programmes | :33:47. | :33:48. | |
knowing that the Prime Minister would not appear in that format. So | :33:49. | :33:52. | |
you accept did it right there and decided not to work for it? We asked | :33:53. | :33:56. | |
officials in Downing Street whether that was likely to change and we | :33:57. | :34:00. | |
were told it wouldn't on several occasions. We had a position that | :34:01. | :34:11. | |
was clear. The Prime Minister has decided not to take part in the | :34:12. | :34:13. | |
programmes, which is perfectly within her rights. We discussed | :34:14. | :34:15. | |
whether to do a seven hander or so-called leaders debate eliminating | :34:16. | :34:17. | |
the Prime Minister and her party. There were leader debates in 2010 | :34:18. | :34:20. | |
and in 2015. Are you letting the Prime Minister off the hook by not | :34:21. | :34:27. | |
having a leaders debate with an empty chair? We don't really believe | :34:28. | :34:30. | |
in an empty chair. It is embarrassing someone and it is not | :34:31. | :34:34. | |
in the interests of the audience. We want a format that is for the | :34:35. | :34:38. | |
audience, who are large part the electorate. And if you want to | :34:39. | :34:42. | |
discuss immigration or the health service, the audience is best served | :34:43. | :34:45. | |
by hearing all the cases from the parties they can vote for. If you | :34:46. | :34:49. | |
are saying that because one or two leaders have decided not to take | :34:50. | :34:53. | |
part, you eliminate that argument from the picture, and don't that is | :34:54. | :34:57. | |
in the interest of the audiences overall. ITV have extended | :34:58. | :35:00. | |
invitations to the leaders of those seven parties and they will run that | :35:01. | :35:04. | |
debate with whoever replies. The leaders are very welcome to turn up | :35:05. | :35:08. | |
for hours and they know that. There will be a mixed bag. There will be | :35:09. | :35:12. | |
leaders and non-leaders from the various parties and ITV have made | :35:13. | :35:15. | |
their own perfectly legitimate decision but it is not the | :35:16. | :35:19. | |
conclusion we came to. Is anybody confirm that debate? A few people | :35:20. | :35:23. | |
but until all the cast list is confirmed, we will not publicise it, | :35:24. | :35:27. | |
we have said that to the parties. The debate that happened in 2015 | :35:28. | :35:29. | |
involving Ed Miliband and other opposition parties, why not do | :35:30. | :35:48. | |
that again? I don't think it was investing for the audience because | :35:49. | :35:51. | |
you didn't hear from the governing parties, and there were two in the | :35:52. | :35:53. | |
coalition at the time and nobody was on the stage. It was a complicated | :35:54. | :35:56. | |
balance with other programmes and so on, and I think this time we have a | :35:57. | :35:59. | |
better solution given the circumstances that the Prime | :36:00. | :36:01. | |
Minister has decided not to do it. You don't think that if more | :36:02. | :36:03. | |
pressure is brought to bear, that eventually Jeremy Corbyn and Theresa | :36:04. | :36:06. | |
May would be forced to turn up? The freedom of speech comes with the | :36:07. | :36:08. | |
freedom not to speak. If political leaders decide for whatever reason, | :36:09. | :36:10. | |
and we have not discussed the reasons, it is up to the parties, if | :36:11. | :36:13. | |
they have chosen not to take part, we are not really into strong arming | :36:14. | :36:16. | |
people into the studio. We want to bring people in who want to debate. | :36:17. | :36:22. | |
Theresa May, is she running scared? I don't think so. Listening to what | :36:23. | :36:26. | |
has been said, I think the format is very interesting. Of course because | :36:27. | :36:29. | |
she is not and extended pressure to come. The point for me is whether | :36:30. | :36:34. | |
you are going to get the discussion. I have personally never found a | :36:35. | :36:38. | |
gladiatorial contests that we have had very helpful. It worked very | :36:39. | :36:41. | |
well in a presidential debate between Marine Le Pen and Emmanuel | :36:42. | :36:46. | |
Macron. But we are not a presidential state. So says Theresa | :36:47. | :36:50. | |
May, me, myself and I in this election. She has made it very | :36:51. | :36:53. | |
presidential between her job and Jeremy Corbyn. As far as I'm | :36:54. | :36:56. | |
concerned we don't have a presidential system and I don't want | :36:57. | :37:03. | |
to see one. I don't want a system where you can't grill the | :37:04. | :37:05. | |
spokesperson fully and where there is no proper debate. I am sure there | :37:06. | :37:09. | |
are better ways of doing it than having a gladiatorial contest. I | :37:10. | :37:16. | |
suppose it all comes down to Lynton Crosby in the end. No doubt Jeremy | :37:17. | :37:23. | |
Corbyn has strategies. Why is he not taking part? For the first time ever | :37:24. | :37:27. | |
we have a very independent minded person. Who doesn't want to take | :37:28. | :37:30. | |
part in debates either. He does want to do it provided it is fair, | :37:31. | :37:37. | |
meaning the top two people. Why not do the opposition debate? 72% of | :37:38. | :37:39. | |
people are apparently going to choose between the two main parties | :37:40. | :37:44. | |
so why not have those up there? It is all about brinkmanship. If Jeremy | :37:45. | :37:48. | |
said yes, then everybody would say where is Mrs May? The important | :37:49. | :37:54. | |
thing is that we get to hear within our own context of Parliament and so | :37:55. | :37:59. | |
on that we get to hear them. While we haven't got PMQs we haven't got | :38:00. | :38:03. | |
that weekly debate. What do you think of that idea? The key thing is | :38:04. | :38:07. | |
what is of interest to the audience and are we going to see the party | :38:08. | :38:10. | |
leaders, particularly those leading big blocks of numbers of MPs, | :38:11. | :38:18. | |
interacting with real people on live television? The Question Time | :38:19. | :38:21. | |
debates? Yes. And we have changed that format. It will be longer, 45 | :38:22. | :38:27. | |
minutes each other than half an hour each. And we have included the SNP | :38:28. | :38:31. | |
in the format which we didn't do in 2015, to reflect the fact that when | :38:32. | :38:35. | |
Parliament dissolved they were a bigger presence than previously. | :38:36. | :38:38. | |
Both those things are in the interests of the audience, I think. | :38:39. | :38:40. | |
Thank you for coming in. After last week's local | :38:41. | :38:52. | |
election results, which saw the Conservatives make | :38:53. | :38:53. | |
gains across the country and Labour slip back, | :38:54. | :38:56. | |
the line from both party leaders was that there's still everything | :38:57. | :38:58. | |
to play for when it comes So could there be a big switch | :38:59. | :39:01. | |
in the way people vote Welcome to Harlow, is celebrating 70 | :39:02. | :39:09. | |
years since it was designated as a new town. In a County Council | :39:10. | :39:11. | |
elections last week, the Conservatives made big gains and | :39:12. | :39:13. | |
there were small losses for Labour and the Liberal Democrats and losses | :39:14. | :39:18. | |
for Ukip. But at the general election, will people vote the same | :39:19. | :39:22. | |
way or change their minds? Can I ask how you voted in the council | :39:23. | :39:25. | |
elections last week? No. Are you going to vote for the same party in | :39:26. | :39:30. | |
the general election? Yes. But your political allegiance will remain | :39:31. | :39:35. | |
secret? Exactly. You have a strong sense of civic duty. Did you vote | :39:36. | :39:41. | |
last week? No. You don't then! Who did you vote for? Conservative. Will | :39:42. | :39:46. | |
you be voting Conservative on the 8th of June? Yes. Pop your ball in | :39:47. | :39:52. | |
the box. Would you vote on different issues for the Council compared to a | :39:53. | :39:57. | |
general election? The roads, the schools, the car parks, the town | :39:58. | :40:01. | |
centre policies, policies on housing. You are a different | :40:02. | :40:05. | |
headspace when it comes to the local elections? Yes. OK. Did you vote in | :40:06. | :40:14. | |
the council elections last week? No. OK. Did anyone vote in the council | :40:15. | :40:20. | |
elections? Anyone vote in elections last week? I do believe that | :40:21. | :40:24. | |
everybody should vote. The turnout here were 35% last week. Does that | :40:25. | :40:28. | |
make you ashamed to be an ethics person? It does. A fidget spinner? | :40:29. | :40:34. | |
You just do that? Is that what all the fuss is about with these things? | :40:35. | :40:39. | |
I have a tip-off that there is a comic convention happening down | :40:40. | :40:42. | |
there and the opportunity is too good to miss. Did you vote at the | :40:43. | :40:48. | |
local election? I wasn't here. Were you on a planet somewhere? Somewhere | :40:49. | :40:53. | |
in the galaxy. People should vote to ban Christmas. Will you be voting | :40:54. | :40:58. | |
Green? You have got to go with your hair colour. I think the council | :40:59. | :41:05. | |
elections will be a precursor to the general election. A bellwether. A | :41:06. | :41:10. | |
trailer for the main film? Unless there is an earthquake of change. I | :41:11. | :41:15. | |
think Brexited go through without any opposition. Jeremy Corbyn and | :41:16. | :41:23. | |
his team don't come over very well. But you will still vote Labour? Yes. | :41:24. | :41:32. | |
Even though it might not make any difference? Yes, because you have | :41:33. | :41:35. | |
got to keep voting and hope it turns around. We have a couple of switches | :41:36. | :41:40. | |
but the most people will vote the same way as they did last Thursday. | :41:41. | :41:41. | |
Thanks, Harlow. And we've been joined by Joe Twyman, | :41:42. | :41:48. | |
from the opinion pollster YouGov. Will most people vote the same, | :41:49. | :41:58. | |
local to general? There is the voter choice and also the decision to vote | :41:59. | :42:02. | |
or not, which other two interesting questions that we have got to answer | :42:03. | :42:08. | |
as pollsters. And we have seen previously that there is a lot of | :42:09. | :42:11. | |
churn between local and general election, especially when they are | :42:12. | :42:14. | |
so close to each other. Going back to 1983, Labour enjoyed being just | :42:15. | :42:19. | |
three points behind the Conservatives are the local | :42:20. | :42:22. | |
elections and one month later, they were 16 points behind in the 1983 | :42:23. | :42:27. | |
election. Not a happy historical precedent if you are choosing 1983? | :42:28. | :42:35. | |
Or any opposition. And in 1987 the Conservatives gained 5% in the | :42:36. | :42:38. | |
months between the locals and the general. On that basis and looking | :42:39. | :42:41. | |
at the recent performance by Labour, you will desperately be hoping that | :42:42. | :42:45. | |
people switch between local and general. I think the big question is | :42:46. | :42:50. | |
the Ukip vote. Mrs May has responded by wrapping herself in the Ukip | :42:51. | :42:54. | |
flag, each one of the commentators said on the day that the BBC did the | :42:55. | :42:58. | |
coverage of that last Friday. It does explain her announcement today | :42:59. | :43:03. | |
on immigration. What about Labour's performance? Trying to keep Ukip | :43:04. | :43:10. | |
voters on board. Labour has got a very good promises around the ?10 | :43:11. | :43:14. | |
minimum wage which could transform a lot of people's lives. Switching | :43:15. | :43:21. | |
between Ukip and Labour? Not a wholesale switch from Ukip to the | :43:22. | :43:26. | |
Conservatives? Two thirds of the people who voted Ukip in the last | :43:27. | :43:29. | |
election are moving to the Conservatives which could explain | :43:30. | :43:31. | |
why they are higher in the polls than previously but we have still | :43:32. | :43:35. | |
got an entire campaign left and things can change. Back in 2010, and | :43:36. | :43:39. | |
you are talking about television debates previously, the Lib Dems | :43:40. | :43:43. | |
jumped ten points in a week as a result of Nick Clegg mania, from the | :43:44. | :43:48. | |
first televised debate, and it fell back a bit. But substantial change | :43:49. | :43:52. | |
can happen. There is the potential for it to do so. I don't think it is | :43:53. | :43:56. | |
the most likely outcome in this campaign that campaigns can have an | :43:57. | :44:00. | |
effect and they have the potential to make that difference. Does it | :44:01. | :44:04. | |
follow that in local election campaigns people don't necessarily | :44:05. | :44:06. | |
vote on local issues in the way that Lib Dems would have us believe? They | :44:07. | :44:10. | |
vote for the party and the leader that they like. It depends on | :44:11. | :44:15. | |
timing. In some cases people vote on local issues but they also decide | :44:16. | :44:18. | |
not to vote in local elections when they decide to vote at the general | :44:19. | :44:22. | |
election, which can make things very different. How important for you is | :44:23. | :44:28. | |
the issue of vote share? If the seats were translated or the local | :44:29. | :44:33. | |
election gains were translated into seats it would not be the big | :44:34. | :44:38. | |
majority for the Tories. I am very wary about extrapolating between | :44:39. | :44:41. | |
local and national election results. You often get localised voting on | :44:42. | :44:46. | |
local issues. The turnout is low. It might provide an indication of the | :44:47. | :44:50. | |
way that people are thinking, but in my view I would be very careful | :44:51. | :44:54. | |
about saying just because it has gone well or did well at a local | :44:55. | :44:58. | |
election, you're going to do well at a national election. The other thing | :44:59. | :45:02. | |
is the long campaign and other things to be discussed. I feel | :45:03. | :45:08. | |
buoyed up by what happened last week and any Conservative is going to. | :45:09. | :45:14. | |
But I certainly don't translate that into some mathematical calculation | :45:15. | :45:16. | |
about what will happen in the general election. And I am sure it | :45:17. | :45:20. | |
will not be a mathematical calculation that you can make. In | :45:21. | :45:23. | |
terms of the policies you are talking about, you think the more | :45:24. | :45:30. | |
policies, the more popular Labour will become. What about seeing | :45:31. | :45:34. | |
Jeremy Corbyn? Jeremy is an independent minded person with a lot | :45:35. | :45:38. | |
of energy and he is running an energetic campaign. And he is an | :45:39. | :45:42. | |
asset as far as you are concerned? He has a lot of very good values and | :45:43. | :45:47. | |
people like the fact that as a committed person he will not walk | :45:48. | :45:50. | |
away in the way that David Cameron and George Osborne did. They walked | :45:51. | :45:56. | |
away after two years and they broke the pact with the electorate. Even | :45:57. | :46:00. | |
though it hasn't gone that well in terms of his personal support? We | :46:01. | :46:04. | |
still have four reached ago and we do have a lot of people. The | :46:05. | :46:10. | |
Conservatives have got a lot of money and we have a lot of people | :46:11. | :46:16. | |
knocking on doors. We have got a lot of people. I am in your constituency | :46:17. | :46:19. | |
and you haven't knocked on my door at my grandma is as well. Plenty of | :46:20. | :46:25. | |
doors do knock on! I might have been busy at work. But we have certainly | :46:26. | :46:29. | |
knocked on lots of doors in my constituency. Thank you for coming | :46:30. | :46:31. | |
in. Let's get a round-up of all today's | :46:32. | :46:34. | |
other election news now. Welcome to Election Corner. We are | :46:35. | :46:45. | |
in a sandwich this week. Last ago had the local elections, next week | :46:46. | :46:49. | |
we'll have the manifesto is, we are stuck in the middle. But don't | :46:50. | :46:52. | |
worry, plenty of tasty morsels, plenty of filling. Tim Farron | :46:53. | :46:58. | |
is getting Farron stuck into this election race. | :46:59. | :47:00. | |
The fell-running Lib Dem leader showed he doesn't | :47:01. | :47:02. | |
mind an uphill struggle at this fun run in Kendal. | :47:03. | :47:04. | |
Then he got some orange stuff thrown at him. | :47:05. | :47:12. | |
Oh, there goes Iain Duncan Smith doing Eminem. | :47:13. | :47:17. | |
He opens his mouth but the words don't come out. | :47:18. | :47:20. | |
He's choking now, everybody's joking now and the clock's run out. | :47:21. | :47:22. | |
I suppose that's what this election is all about. | :47:23. | :47:26. | |
Meanwhile Labour's Peter Kyle got the feline he ought | :47:27. | :47:28. | |
to help out on the campaign trail and held a ladder while someone else | :47:29. | :47:31. | |
Labour's Shadow Chancellor John McDonnell | :47:32. | :47:34. | |
says he doesn't think the capitalist system should be brought down | :47:35. | :47:37. | |
I believe there's a lot to learn from reading Das Kapital, of course | :47:38. | :47:49. | |
there is, and that's not been recommended only by me but by many | :47:50. | :47:52. | |
others, mainstream economists as well. | :47:53. | :47:53. | |
No, they weren't at a swanky London nightclub but a press conference | :47:54. | :47:57. | |
Zero net immigration over the next five-year period. | :47:58. | :48:03. | |
And the things you can organise at a brewery. | :48:04. | :48:06. | |
Nicola Sturgeon out in Perth poured her | :48:07. | :48:08. | |
obligatory campaign pint and doesn't like things to go to waste. | :48:09. | :48:11. | |
All the party leaders are out this afternoon. Election Corner will be | :48:12. | :48:29. | |
here for the entire campaign. If you think we're missing something tweet | :48:30. | :48:30. | |
us. Thank you, Ellie. Let's discuss Ukip's immigration | :48:31. | :48:37. | |
policy in more detail now. We've been joined by the party's | :48:38. | :48:39. | |
immigration spokesman, John Bickley. Welcome to The Daily Politics. | :48:40. | :48:46. | |
Immigration statistics are notoriously hard to collect. How | :48:47. | :48:50. | |
much would it cost you and Ukip to institute this policy and get | :48:51. | :48:54. | |
precise data on who is leaving and who is arriving? That would be a | :48:55. | :48:57. | |
role for the migration control commission. I find it interesting | :48:58. | :49:01. | |
that this morning we've heard from Theresa May yet again, she's going | :49:02. | :49:05. | |
to promise to reduce immigration to tens of thousands. And what are you | :49:06. | :49:11. | |
promising? I am reminded of fool me once, shame on you, fool me two, | :49:12. | :49:18. | |
three, four times... What about your policy. You can't control the number | :49:19. | :49:22. | |
of people leaving, their skills and experience and what they take with | :49:23. | :49:27. | |
them. How would one in, one out of work? The key is that it's a rolling | :49:28. | :49:32. | |
average over five years so you give the migration control commission | :49:33. | :49:35. | |
flexibility on a rolling five-year period to take into account and | :49:36. | :49:40. | |
variants is. Rather than dictating absolute numbers by particular | :49:41. | :49:44. | |
sectors you are taking a broad average look at this over a | :49:45. | :49:49. | |
five-year period. What we are trying to say is that we need to get | :49:50. | :49:56. | |
immigration under control. What does that mean? For the last few years | :49:57. | :50:00. | |
the Tories have failed completely... What does it mean for you in terms | :50:01. | :50:05. | |
of numbers? We've got 600,000 people coming in or thereabouts, the size | :50:06. | :50:11. | |
of the city of Newcastle coming here. We want net zero immigration. | :50:12. | :50:19. | |
Net zero immigration. Basically 300,000 people leave, you want | :50:20. | :50:24. | |
300,000 people coming in. So on average over five years, it's flat. | :50:25. | :50:28. | |
Frank Field has been saying this for years... How would you do it? | :50:29. | :50:34. | |
Because rather than pretending the politicians will do all this | :50:35. | :50:37. | |
themselves because they never deliver that is why we'd have a | :50:38. | :50:41. | |
migration control commission. How many people would be involved in | :50:42. | :50:45. | |
this? It would be a massive expansion of government power to | :50:46. | :50:49. | |
monitor every individual person leaving and what skills they may be | :50:50. | :50:57. | |
taking... That's a challenge for the political class, they've failed | :50:58. | :51:01. | |
miserably. Is it achievable, and trying to work at the mechanics. It | :51:02. | :51:07. | |
is because other countries achieve it, Australia 41. Have they got a | :51:08. | :51:14. | |
zero? I don't know if they wish to grow their population, they are a | :51:15. | :51:19. | |
sovereign nation. We are saying it is politically correct to deliver | :51:20. | :51:28. | |
zero net migration and of the government can't do this they should | :51:29. | :51:32. | |
be of power. I am trying to challenge you on whether it is | :51:33. | :51:37. | |
achievable, not just desirable, is it achievable? If two migrants and | :51:38. | :51:40. | |
similar skills would your commission which was one over another based on | :51:41. | :51:45. | |
their country of origin? Bush if they had similar skills. No, we are | :51:46. | :51:49. | |
not interested in where people come from. That's up to the migration | :51:50. | :51:53. | |
control commission to come up with a plan for allowing us to balance | :51:54. | :51:58. | |
migration. That seems a reasonable way of moving this debate forward | :51:59. | :52:00. | |
and delivering what the British people want. They've had enough of | :52:01. | :52:04. | |
being lied to by the Tory party and the Labour Party would keep | :52:05. | :52:06. | |
promising them they will control immigration but they don't. That you | :52:07. | :52:11. | |
want to ban all and skilled migration to the UK for five years. | :52:12. | :52:15. | |
What impact will that have on certain sectors of the economy? | :52:16. | :52:21. | |
Maybe they will start employing more British people. Remember there are | :52:22. | :52:24. | |
already hundreds of thousands of low skilled immigrants in this country. | :52:25. | :52:28. | |
We are not short of low skilled immigrants. And employment is not | :52:29. | :52:32. | |
particularly high. If you look at the EU National is they account for | :52:33. | :52:38. | |
31% of the workers and food manufacturing, 21% in hotels and 15% | :52:39. | :52:48. | |
of those in warehouses. With the best will in the world if on day one | :52:49. | :52:51. | |
you sent them home and stop them coming in even over a five-year | :52:52. | :52:53. | |
period what would happen to those economies? We haven't said anything | :52:54. | :52:57. | |
about reducing the number of people already in this country. We would | :52:58. | :53:01. | |
want to see a situation where everyone here from the EU who has | :53:02. | :53:06. | |
been here, up to the day Article 50 was triggered, to be able to stay | :53:07. | :53:10. | |
here. That needs to be done on the basis that the British people who | :53:11. | :53:15. | |
reside in the EU in 2017 can stay there. We want to say to the EU lets | :53:16. | :53:20. | |
have a sensible deal where all the people from the EU are here, over 3 | :53:21. | :53:25. | |
million, we want them to stay here and continue to contribute to the | :53:26. | :53:29. | |
British economy. My question was what impact would it have on the | :53:30. | :53:32. | |
sectors are listed when you think of the percentage of EU National is | :53:33. | :53:37. | |
working there. I don't think it will have any impact. We will is seasonal | :53:38. | :53:44. | |
agricultural leases, expect them to fall over time because we need to | :53:45. | :53:48. | |
get more of Oscar people brush our people into work. Theresa May is | :53:49. | :53:52. | |
talking the talk but not walking the walk, she's promised, with Cameron, | :53:53. | :53:57. | |
to bring down emigration, that is two prime ministers, not some second | :53:58. | :54:02. | |
string civil servant! Can you name me a country in the Western world | :54:03. | :54:07. | |
which aims to have zero net immigration? I'm not interested in | :54:08. | :54:11. | |
any other country. So there isn't one. I'm interested in us doing the | :54:12. | :54:18. | |
right thing for Britain. You think this is intrinsically desirable. | :54:19. | :54:21. | |
That's what I say and the British people want to see migration | :54:22. | :54:25. | |
Broadstone. John Bickley, thank you for coming in. -- they want to see | :54:26. | :54:29. | |
migration brought down. Of course, whenever the country goes | :54:30. | :54:31. | |
to the polls a whole host of smaller parties get their candidates | :54:32. | :54:34. | |
on the ballot paper, and throughout the campaign we'll be | :54:35. | :54:36. | |
taking a closer look Today it's the turn | :54:37. | :54:39. | |
of the Yorkshire Party, who are currently fielding twenty | :54:40. | :54:42. | |
three candidates in the election. The Yorkshire Party | :54:43. | :54:44. | |
was founded in 2014, It has just over 2,000 | :54:45. | :54:46. | |
Twitter followers They're calling for | :54:47. | :54:49. | |
a Yorkshire Assembly, with powers similar to those | :54:50. | :54:50. | |
of the Scottish Parliament. It wants to see increased | :54:51. | :54:52. | |
school funding per pupil, a regional energy hub, | :54:53. | :54:55. | |
and it wants Yorkshire to be able They think Yorkshire Day, | :54:56. | :54:58. | |
which is celebrated on August 1st, And they want a Yorkshire team | :54:59. | :55:05. | |
to be able to take part And we've been joined | :55:06. | :55:11. | |
from our Hull studios by the party's leader, | :55:12. | :55:14. | |
Stewart Arnold. Welcome to the programme. You had | :55:15. | :55:21. | |
candidates stand in the local elections last week, how did you do. | :55:22. | :55:26. | |
Not too bad actually, our best results in our Short history, we got | :55:27. | :55:31. | |
up to 33% in Doncaster, narrowly failing to take a seat. The portents | :55:32. | :55:35. | |
are good and we are in a very good position coming into the general | :55:36. | :55:40. | |
election. How many seats are you fielding candidates in in the | :55:41. | :55:44. | |
general election? 23 pencilled in and I'm hoping we get up to 27. | :55:45. | :55:49. | |
Significant because it is double what we did last time in 2015, half | :55:50. | :55:53. | |
the number of seats in Yorkshire and I think that sends a statement of | :55:54. | :55:56. | |
intent as far as the party is concerned. What is your strong | :55:57. | :56:01. | |
message going to be on the campaign? Basically we feel we are losing out | :56:02. | :56:05. | |
on the devolution discussion that's going on. When we first started the | :56:06. | :56:09. | |
discussion was centred around Scotland and Wales and the | :56:10. | :56:13. | |
assemblies and time has moved on. Last Thursday we had elections for | :56:14. | :56:17. | |
Metro mayors in Manchester and other parts of the country. And all this | :56:18. | :56:21. | |
time Yorkshire has been left behind. Not the fault of the people, they | :56:22. | :56:24. | |
just haven't been engaged in the process, it is the fault of local | :56:25. | :56:28. | |
council leaders who can't agree the way forward and I think the general | :56:29. | :56:31. | |
election gives us the opportunity to put this argument front and centre | :56:32. | :56:35. | |
and say, OK, let's have a resolution on this, where are we going with | :56:36. | :56:40. | |
Yorkshire devolution. What is your judgment on the northern powerhouse | :56:41. | :56:42. | |
which George Osborne talked about so much? It was | :56:43. | :56:56. | |
a good idea. I'm not sure exactly what it means but I think George | :56:57. | :56:59. | |
Osborne did recognise that the UK economy is out of kilter. There's | :57:00. | :57:01. | |
fantastic potential in the north, not least in Yorkshire which if we | :57:02. | :57:03. | |
could unleash it would improve the economy overall. It seems bizarre | :57:04. | :57:06. | |
that London and the South East is racing ahead and leaving the rest of | :57:07. | :57:11. | |
the country behind. This political disconnect came through in the | :57:12. | :57:15. | |
Brexit referendum, in Yorkshire with voted for welcoming me to leave. You | :57:16. | :57:21. | |
point to Yorkshire having an economy twice the size of Wales. What is | :57:22. | :57:28. | |
your party's position on Brexit. We allowed people a free vote and as | :57:29. | :57:32. | |
occurred in Yorkshire most people did vote to leave. So what we are | :57:33. | :57:36. | |
arguing for now is a fair Brexit, fair deal for Yorkshire... What does | :57:37. | :57:41. | |
that mean. It means let's have an engagement first of all with the | :57:42. | :57:44. | |
Prime Minister because it took ten months in the general election | :57:45. | :57:48. | |
before she even visited Yorkshire since you became promised, frankly | :57:49. | :57:51. | |
not good enough, treating the people of Yorkshire with disdain. We need | :57:52. | :58:05. | |
to put our forest across just as London, Scotland, Wales and Northern | :58:06. | :58:08. | |
Ireland are in terms of what we want for the farming sector, fishing and | :58:09. | :58:10. | |
so on. Do you expect a breakthrough in this election for your party? | :58:11. | :58:13. | |
Yes, we do, because I think the results from Doncaster showed | :58:14. | :58:16. | |
there's great potential us. With Ukip going off a cliff and Labour | :58:17. | :58:20. | |
following them closely think we are in a position to begin to sweep up | :58:21. | :58:28. | |
some seeds. Stewart Arnold, thank you very much. -- sweep up some | :58:29. | :58:30. | |
seats. There's just time before we go | :58:31. | :58:32. | |
to find out the answer to our quiz. The question was, who did | :58:33. | :58:35. | |
Tim Farron have a poster Che Guevara, Jacques | :58:36. | :58:37. | |
Delors, Arthur Scargill So, Dominic, Catherine, | :58:38. | :58:41. | |
what's the correct answer? Margaret Thatcher. The Eurosceptic! | :58:42. | :58:51. | |
We're surprised. Not entirely, I can see that in youth he had wisdom | :58:52. | :58:57. | |
although he's lost it since. Is extraordinary with his | :58:58. | :59:01. | |
Euroscepticism. Who did you have on your wall, I was going to ask but | :59:02. | :59:05. | |
there's no time. Thank to both of you for being our guests today. I'll | :59:06. | :59:13. | |
be back with and you bye. -- I'll be back with | :59:14. | :59:15. | |
When it came to my TV habits, I'd watch anything. | :59:16. | :59:20. |