06/11/2017 Daily Politics


06/11/2017

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LineFromTo

Hello and welcome

to the Daily Politics.

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The Prime Minister calls

for a "new culture of respect" ahead

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of a meeting with other party

leaders to discuss the Westminster

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sexual misconduct scandal.

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But are the party leaders getting

to grips with the problem?

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Lord Ashcroft, former

Conservative Party Deputy

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chairman and party donor,

faces fresh questions about his tax

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affairs following a huge leak

of financial documents,

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known as the Paradise Papers.

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We'll be discussing the Government's

industrial strategy

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and the progress of Brexit talks

with the Director General of the

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business lobbying group, the CBI.

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And should we give money

to people street beggars?

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One activist tells us it's time

to rethink our attitudes to those

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who find themselves homeless

on the streets.

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All that in the next hour.

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And with us for the whole programme

today is the Conservative MP,

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Alex Burghart, and the

Labour MP, Liz Kendall.

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Now, despite being on opposite sides

of the aisle, Alex and Liz have one

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crucial thing in common.

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They've both gone up against

Jeremy Corbyn in an election.

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As you probably know, in 2015,

Liz was one of the unsuccessful

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candidates in the Labour leadership

election which was of course

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won by Jeremy Corbyn.

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But what you probably didn't know

was that, earlier that year,

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Alex was the Conservative candidate

in Islington North up against...

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Yes, Jeremy Corbyn!

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We're glad to say Alex had more

success as the candidate

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in Brentwood and Ongar in June,

which is why he can join us today.

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Welcome to you both!

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Labour has renewed calls

for a public inquiry into tax

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avoidance after a massive leak

of secret documents detailing

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the financial affairs

of the global super rich.

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The leak, dubbed the Paradise

Papers, contains 13.4 million

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documents, mostly from one leading

firm in offshore finance.

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In UK political circles,

fresh questions have been raised

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about the tax affairs of the former

Conservative donor Lord Ashcroft.

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The papers suggest he may have

ignored rules around how his

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offshore investments were managed.

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Other papers suggest

he retained his non-dom status

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while in the House of Lords,

despite reports he had become

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a permanent tax resident in the UK.

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Well, the BBC's Panorama programme

which is reporting on the leak tried

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to interview Lord Ashcroft

at the recent Conservative

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Party Conference.

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Lord Ashcroft, hi,

I'm Richard Bilton,

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I work for Panorama.

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Sir, could I grab

a quick word with you?

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I have been trying to send you these

letters, but you wouldn't take them.

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Sir, could I just have

a quick word with you?

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Did you have tens of millions

in an off-shore trust that

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you secretly control, sir?

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Did that mean you could avoid

millions in tax through that trust?

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Lord Ashcroft, would

you just talk to me?

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It would be great to hear your view.

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It was the Punta Gorda

Trust, Lord Ashcroft.

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Sir, the Punta Gorda Trust...

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Dear, dear, dear.

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"Dear, dear", is that your response?

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It was the Punta Gorda Trust.

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Sir, where we are going?

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This is amazing.

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We have been walking now more

about two minutes, why don't

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you just give me your views?

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We could have been sponsored, we

have done about a mile-and-a-half.

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Sir, why don't you just

tell me your view, it would be

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really nice to get your view.

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Sir...

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No, sir, just give me your view,

did you sir secretly a control

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-- a trust in which you had tens

of millions and therefore

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avoiding tax, sir?

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Did you do that?

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Did you do that, sir?

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It would be great to know.

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Where are we going?

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This is brilliant.

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I don't know where

we're going to end up.

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Dear, dear, dear.

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I'm not going to follow

you in there, sir.

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Michael Ashcroft struggling to find

the exit. We did a full tour of the

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floor.

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Well, we put a call

in to Conservative Central Office

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this morning to ask if they wanted

to respond to the leaks

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about Lord Ashcroft,

but we have received no response.

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And his spokesman says he has not

done anything illegal.

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Should he face an investigation by

HMRC in light of the leaked

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documents?

I understand that HMOs

see have asked to see all the

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Paradise papers to see if there has

been any wrongdoing. -- the HMRC. I

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do not want to speculate on

individual cases. The Government

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takes tax evasion very seriously.

You said tax evasion.

That is

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illegal.

And aggressive.

What you as

that? We have brought in an extra

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£160 billion by clamping down on all

of this sort of thing. We have one

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of the narrowest tax gaps anywhere

in the world that has happened under

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a Conservative government over the

past seven years because we want to

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get more money to put into public

services.

The leaked papers Lord

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Ashcroft ignored rules around the

management of his offshore

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investments for the it is not

illegal to have offshore investments

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but if the rules around them are

ignored and tax is not paid that is

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rightfully owed? Should he be

questioned?

The HMRC has asked for

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all the papers.

It is not illegal to

use offshore tax havens. What is

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Labour calling for?

There should be

a public register of who owns what

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in all of our overseas territories

and secondly we need much tougher

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regulation and enforcement. I would

like to see all of the advisers, the

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lawyers, the accountants, held

responsible and accountable should

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any of the schemes they have

proposed turn out to be illegal. We

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also need to do more to reach

international agreement. We have

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been here before and we need to see

the action happening now.

Would you

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like to stop investors like the

Duchy of Lancaster putting money

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into non-UK fans?

The issue here is

that the Queen has been badly

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advised of what strikes me as the

real issue is they thought it would

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be access to ball. There are

megabucks in tax havens. Some of it

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is evasion, some of it is avoidance,

and some of it is money-laundering.

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Do you want those investments to

stop?

I want to see a full public

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disclosure of who owns those trusts,

those companies, and any other

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corporate identity. I want to see

much tougher regulation and

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enforcement. That is what we do know

straightaway and we need to see

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action. Aye after the Panama papers,

George Osborne said a blacklist of

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tax havens should be created. --

After the Panama papers. What else

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has the Government done to crackdown

on aggressive tax avoidance?

We have

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spearheaded work with 100 other

nations. There is much greater

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transparency than there has ever

been before. We have to be extreme

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heat careful that we don't

necessarily drive investment out of

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this country.

John McDonnell, the

Shadow Chancellor, spoke at the

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weekend about Labour run Preston

Council as a model for keeping

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wealth in the city. Reports show

they have nearly £12 million

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invested overseas. Is there anything

wrong with that?

My concern is about

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people not just evading tax but also

avoiding it. If you believe in a

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fairer society, people have to pay

their fair share of tax?

How do you

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legislate for that?

I would argue

that wealth inequalities are a

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serious problem for our economy and

society. Tax havens are

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turbo-charging deep inequalities.

I

still do not have from you where you

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would draw the line on that. The

previous Conservative government did

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talk about aggressive tax avoidance

full stop unless you make it

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illegal, the line would be blurred.

Why are people putting money into

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these countries?

They want to

maximise their profits.

It is to

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minimise their payment of tax. If

you believe in paying your fair

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share of tax, putting it into your

school and public services, the

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infrastructure helping the economy

create these services in the first

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place... I don't know about that

example was that is the first I have

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heard about it today. I believe that

Britain is at the heart of the tax

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haven problem. Unless we take

action...

The Conservatives have

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been in government for seven years

we are still talking about this

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subject.

We have taken another £160

billion in tax otherwise we would

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not have taken. We have ploughed

more money into HMRC. This is it

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good news story insofar as we have

been making improvements since 2010

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and are committed to making further

improvements.

You have not make good

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on the pledge by David Cameron.

We

have substantially improved on

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things as they were in 2010.

Cameron

committed in 2010, 2013, 2014.

We

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have said that the onus of

companies, the beneficiaries of

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those companies have to be

identified rather than hiding the

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hind shell companies. There are lots

of things we are doing. -- hiding

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behind shell companies.

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Theresa May has called

for a "new culture of respect" ahead

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of a meeting with other party

leaders to discuss the Westminster

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sexual misconduct scandal.

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Fresh allegations have been made

to the BBC's Victoria Derbyshire

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programme this morning

about a former Conservative Party

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activist claiming her allegations

of rape were ignored

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by the Parliamentary authorities.

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The woman claims she was raped

by someone working for a Tory MP,

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she said went to the police

and while the case awaited trial

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she spoke to Commons

officials about how she felt

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the "heavy-drinking and sex-driven"

culture within Westminster

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had contributed to it.

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The woman said she was led

to believe the complaint would be

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passed onto the then

Chief Whip Gavin Williamson

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and the leader of the

Commons Andrea Leadsom.

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Both Mr Williamson and Mrs Leadsom

insist they weren't told

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about the rape claims

but Andrea Leadsom admits

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she was told about concerns over

the culture at Westminster.

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Elsewhere several Conservative

and Labour MPs are being

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investigated over claims of sexual

misconduct, and all the party

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leaders in Westminster will be

meeting later this afternoon

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to discuss setting up an independent

grievance procedure for Parliament.

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Also today the Cabinet inquiry

into First Secretary Damian Green's

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behaviour will hear

from ex-Metropolitan

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Police Assistant Commissioner

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Bob Quick about allegations that

pornography was found

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on his computer by police

following an investigation

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into Home Office leaks in 2008.

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For more on that, we're

joined by our Home Affairs

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Correspondent, Danny Shaw.

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Can you bring us up to speed on what

is going on?

Bob quick is preparing

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to give evidence to the inquiry into

the conduct of Damian Green. My

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understanding is that some other

officers who were involved in that

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very controversial leaks enquiry

into Gazza then eight, 2009, are

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also considering whether they will

give evidence to the inquiry as

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well. It is looking at several

issues relating to Damian Green.

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This is absolutely crucial. Here's

the Deputy Prime Minister. Bob

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Quick, the man who oversaw the

investigation is a former police

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officer of extremely great repute

and high integrity who tackled some

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of the thorniest issues at the time.

He is well respected by many

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colleagues and certainly statements

that he makes about this clearly

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have to be taken seriously.

Damian

Green has denied the allegation that

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he has also accused Bob Quick

political smears. Has there been a

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direct response to that?

Bob Quick

says he 100% stands behind the

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account he gave and bears Damian

Green no malice at all. The leaks

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enquiry is an uncomfortable time for

Scotland to guard and Bob Quick in

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particular. -- Scotland Yard. Bob

Quick lost his job after a very

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high-profile blunder when he was

photographed carrying sensitive

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documents into Downing Street. It is

a difficult time for him. If

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anything he feels anger towards

other colleagues in Scotland Yard

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than anything more than he does

towards Damian Green. The concern

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here is the use of a Parliamentary

computer allegedly to look at

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pornography. That is what we are

looking about. There is no

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suggestion that any of the material

is illegal but it is the use of a

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work computer essentially to look at

pornography. The question of whether

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the allegations were referred to the

Parliamentary authorities is

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something that Bob Quick is

concerned about.

There are concerns

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this could have a serious impact on

Damian Green's.

It could have. You

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would think they would be records,

an infantry of what was found on the

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computers, notes in police officers

notebook is about what they

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discovered what action they took, a

policy log detailing what they took

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in response to the various alleged

fines. Also it is said that a

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computer expert was called in to

look at the material. If that is the

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case, it should be documented. It is

not about one person's word against

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another. There should be Independent

verification to prove or disprove

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the allegations.

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Shut the first secretary state,

Damian Green, step down while this

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is going on?

I don't want to get

into the particular case, but what I

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will say is that Damien has strongly

denied

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will say is that Damien has strongly

denied all of the allegations. The

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investigation is going on and at the

end of it, we will have an answer. I

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don't believe there is suggestion

that Damien has broken the law. I'm

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not convinced that he should stand

whilst the inquiry goes on, but I

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think we need answers quickly.

It is

a matter of consistency, Michael

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Fallon resign as Defence Secretary

and in the light of allegations made

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against him your colleagues feel

that Damian Green should also, to be

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consistent, step down from his

influential position while the

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claims are investigated?

Michael

took a personal decision to resign

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and it's for Damien to make the

decision as to whether he is going

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to step aside whilst the inquiry is

going on. He doesn't think he has

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done anything wrong. He denies there

has been any wrongdoing. I don't

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believe there is an accusation that

he has broken the law and so I

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understand he will carry on.

So you

are happy for him to stay on?

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Personally.

The woman interviewed by

the BBC today, explained how she

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felt the heavy drinking and

sex-driven culture within

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Westminster had can'ted to her

alleged attack. I mean she also said

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that women in the bars were being

plied with drink and became so drunk

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that they could barely stand up. Is

that a characterisation of

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Westminster that you recognise?

I

don't spend a lot of time in the

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bars to be honest.

But you talk to

people, is that going on?

I do.

In

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the way that she describes?

I think

the real issue is about power and

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the power and influence over your

career that people are worried

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about. That's one of the main

reasons, people don't come forward

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and report because they're worried

the person that they're going to

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report to, might work with the

person they are accusing, might be a

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friend of theirs, or just as

importantly, a political ally. So,

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they fear they won't be believed. No

action will be taken or that their

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future will be damaged as a result.

I have no doubt, you know, drinking

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doesn't make any of this stuff any

better, but the real issue here, I

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think, is about power and whilst I

hope Westminster does take action

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and the party lead, are meeting

today, all of the individual

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political parties have to sort their

own processes out too.

Let's hear

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what the Prime Minister had to say.

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Here is Theresa May.

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Of course people can be friends

with their colleagues and

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consensual relationships

can develop at work.

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This isn't about prying

into private lives.

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What we are talking

about is the use and abuse

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of power.

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We must stand up for all the victims

of abuse, harassment or

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discrimination, wherever

it has occurred.

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Now is the time to act decisively

without fear or favour to

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guarantee a safe and respectful

working environment for everyone in

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the future.

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You have just become an MP. Are you

shocked by what has been emerging

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and unfolding in the past few weeks?

I am actually. This is a pretty grim

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time to be working in Westminster.

It's not, the stories that are

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coming forward certainly don't

represent the world that I have

0:18:460:18:50

worked in so far and many years ago

I was a researcher in Parliament, I

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never saw anything going on like

this, but obviously, there are

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people who have, you know, had

seriously awful experiences and

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those experiences need to be looked

into. What I would say to anyone

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listening is that the vast majority

of experiences that people have in

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the House of Commons are positive.

That there are lots of researchers

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who really enjoy and benefit from

working there. Most MPs, I believe,

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are decent upstanding people who

want to improve their country. I do

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hope that that will be remembered

and I also, but I also believe that

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this, that our Parliament will be a

better place once all the

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allegations have been worked

through.

It is not just what happens

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in Parliament. It is about what

happens at all levels of our

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politics, at local councils and I

think it is really important that

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every single political party sets up

their own independent third party

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system to make the initial

complaint, that there is mandatory

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training of staff, of elected

representatives, and that there are

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independent experts who actually

advice the parties about their

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processes and that the cases that

they are looking at.

Dawn Butler,

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who is in the Shadow Cabinet, women

and Equalities Minister said that

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these robust policies were now in

place, but didn't actually say what

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they were. Has an independent third

party been set-up to investigate

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claims going forward in the Labour

Party? No. . Why not?

The parties

0:20:220:20:26

are looking to appoint an

independent specialist organisation

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that will be able to give people

advice and support. If they make a

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complaint and that will do some

training of the staff involved with

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dealing with those processes. I

think it is really important that

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people are actually allowed it make

their initial complaint to that body

0:20:400:20:44

and that the training, the mandatory

safeguarding training needs to

0:20:440:20:48

spread wider. So I think we have

made a big step forward, but there

0:20:480:20:52

is more that we need to do.

Right,

we are talking about codes of

0:20:520:20:56

conduct, codes of conduct are for

the parties themselves individually

0:20:560:21:01

and so far they have not shown

themselves being able to cope with

0:21:010:21:05

the complaints or pass them on to

the relevant authorities. How did

0:21:050:21:09

you feel about Jeremy Corbyn once he

had been told about the reprimand

0:21:090:21:14

against Kelvin Hopkins, the Labour

MP, months later appointing him to

0:21:140:21:18

the Shadow Cabinet. Was that right?

Well, I don't know what Jeremy was

0:21:180:21:22

told or not told.

He made it clear,

Jeremy Corbyn himself said he did

0:21:220:21:28

know. The Labour Party said both

sides admitted they were happy with

0:21:280:21:33

the outcome.

It is strange to think

if somebody admitted to any form of

0:21:330:21:38

sexual harassment or abuse should

have been promoted. We need to have

0:21:380:21:42

action, actions must have

consequences whether that is

0:21:420:21:47

suspending the whip, expulsion from

the party. I think that's something

0:21:470:21:50

that I would like to see more

information about because I think if

0:21:500:21:53

you have admitted to it, I don't

know whether Kelvin did or what

0:21:530:21:57

happened, but promotion should not

follow.

0:21:570:21:59

Right, well on that basis of what

action can actually be taken because

0:21:590:22:02

it is one thing to set-up or improve

codes of conduct or to have an

0:22:020:22:09

independent body where people can go

and complain, but Michael Fallon,

0:22:090:22:14

admitted his behaviour may have

fallen short. He talked about the

0:22:140:22:18

standards of 15, ten to 15 years ago

and he has resigned, but he remains

0:22:180:22:21

an MP. He still has his job. Why is

it OK to still be an MP Alex, with

0:22:210:22:29

all the responsibilities that that

entails, but not Defence Secretary?

0:22:290:22:32

It's a good question, Jo. I think,

we are still at the start of a

0:22:320:22:37

process of looking through all of

these issues. I think the next

0:22:370:22:41

hurdle for that is five o'clock this

afternoon when the Prime Minister is

0:22:410:22:45

convening a meeting of all party

leaders to talk about collectively

0:22:450:22:49

what we can do as a political

culture to improve things. So this

0:22:490:22:55

is all part of an on going dialogue.

You see how it is not illogical

0:22:550:23:00

train of events if you can still

keep your job as an MP, but not as a

0:23:000:23:04

minister?

Well, you know, obviously

your responsibility as an MP and

0:23:040:23:11

minister is different. I would say

it was a question for Michael

0:23:110:23:16

Fallon's constituents if they wanted

him to carry on.

Also it was not

0:23:160:23:21

acceptable 15 years ago. The fact is

we are speaking up about it.

You can

0:23:210:23:29

suspend an MP and Labour have taken

the action, but unless there is a

0:23:290:23:34

criminal prosecution, you can't get

rid of them as an MP, is that right?

0:23:340:23:38

There isn't a legal way. Even if

they are expelled from the party

0:23:380:23:42

they would remain as an MP. We look

at this in the Commons. I think

0:23:420:23:47

investigations have to happen. We

can't have trial by media.

0:23:470:23:50

Unfortunately, many people feel

that's the only way that they are

0:23:500:23:52

get going to action, but you should

be suspended while an investigation

0:23:520:23:57

happens and then there have to be a

range of sanctions but there is

0:23:570:24:01

nothing to make people stand down as

an MP even if the whip is removed.

0:24:010:24:05

Should there be? How would you

explain to constituents when they

0:24:050:24:09

say we have got this person, we

found him to have fallen well below

0:24:090:24:13

the standards that we would...

The

only way to change that if

0:24:130:24:16

Parliament decided that that could

happen. I don't think is available.

0:24:160:24:20

What do you think in the light of

allegation that have been brought

0:24:200:24:23

forward?

Well, there is a range of

seriousness here and certainly if

0:24:230:24:29

something goes down a criminal route

and you know, in any examples of I

0:24:290:24:34

mean, we haven't had some of the

cases that we've heard about rape

0:24:340:24:37

have not been by MP allegations,

have not been about MPs, but people

0:24:370:24:41

who work in the party or have worked

for them. But I think that the

0:24:410:24:45

parties have to set out quite

clearly what the actions and

0:24:450:24:49

sanctions will be and that is one of

the things I hoch will be discussed

0:24:490:24:53

today, let me come back to the

point. It can't just be about

0:24:530:24:57

Westminster putting in place a

proper process. Individual parties

0:24:570:25:01

must do that too because it's not

unfortunately just something that

0:25:010:25:04

happens in Parliament. It's

everywhere.

The Conservative Party's

0:25:040:25:09

new code of conduct covers politics

at all levels and covers from the

0:25:090:25:13

most grass-roots...

But it doesn't

deal with why people don't report

0:25:130:25:17

because they are worried about the

internal political bias.

It is by

0:25:170:25:23

the refreshing actions that we hope

more people will feel empowered to

0:25:230:25:28

come forward in the future.

Andrew

McDonald, head of IPSA, has said

0:25:280:25:36

that all staff working for members

of Parliament should be centrally

0:25:360:25:39

employed. Do you think that would

work? Do you think it would take

0:25:390:25:42

away the onus on MPs to employ their

own staff?

These are all things we

0:25:420:25:47

can look into. At the moment

obviously, the researchers who work

0:25:470:25:52

for me are employed by me as I'm

sure Liz's are.

Would it be better

0:25:520:25:57

if they were centrally employed?

I

don't think it would deal with the

0:25:570:26:01

problem, Jo. Is it going to deal

with the fundamental problem and I

0:26:010:26:05

am not sure it would.

I agree with.

0:26:050:26:16

Now, Parliament goes on a brief

holiday this week with the house

0:26:170:26:22

rising from Tuesday until Monday,

so that means no PMQs this week.

0:26:220:26:25

But the wheels of Westminster

keep on rolling.

0:26:250:26:27

Let's take a look at the week ahead.

0:26:270:26:29

On Tuesday, Commissioner

of the Metropolitan Police

0:26:290:26:31

Cressida Dick will face

the Home Affairs Select Committee

0:26:310:26:33

for the first time

since taking the role.

0:26:330:26:35

She'll be quizzed on the future

of policing just a few days

0:26:350:26:38

after criticising funding cuts.

0:26:380:26:39

On Wednesday, the new Defence

Secretary Gavin Williamson will meet

0:26:390:26:41

with his NATO counterparts

in his first such engagement since

0:26:410:26:44

replacing Michael Fallon last week.

0:26:440:26:48

Afghanistan and Russia are likely

to be on the agenda.

0:26:480:26:50

On Thursday, the sixth

round of Brexit negotiations

0:26:500:26:52

begin in Brussels.

0:26:520:26:53

Brexit Secretary David Davis

is expected to head out on Friday,

0:26:530:26:58

hoping to break the deadlock over

the Brexit divorce bill.

0:26:580:27:04

Thursday will also see a brief

revival of Big Ben's bells,

0:27:040:27:07

albeit for just four days,

in preparation Remembrance

0:27:070:27:10

commemorations this week.

0:27:100:27:18

We're joined now by

the Deputy Political Editor

0:27:180:27:20

of the Sunday Times Caroline Wheeler

and the Political Editor

0:27:200:27:22

for the New Statesman George Eaton

to discuss the weeks top stories.

0:27:220:27:25

Caroline Wheeler, first of all, what

do you make of the latest allegation

0:27:250:27:29

that has been made on the BBC

against a politician, a Tory

0:27:290:27:35

politician, how much more pressure

now is Theresa May in terms of

0:27:350:27:39

getting a grip of this scandal?

I

think it's one of those scandals

0:27:390:27:42

that it's very difficult to get a

grip of because I think what we have

0:27:420:27:46

seen so far is a number of

allegations being made whether

0:27:460:27:49

substantiated or not, but in the

background I'm aware of a number of

0:27:490:27:54

journalists and MPs even as well as

those outside the Westminster bubble

0:27:540:27:58

with stories to tell, who are

weighing up whether or not they are

0:27:580:28:02

going to break their cover and break

their silence and come forward and

0:28:020:28:04

talk about what they feel has been

going on, that's been inappropriate

0:28:040:28:08

within Parliament. So, it is very

difficult for any of the party

0:28:080:28:11

leaders to keep a grip on this.

They're saying some really warm

0:28:110:28:14

words about how they want to

transform the system so that it is

0:28:140:28:18

easier for people to come forward,

but it is very difficult when you

0:28:180:28:21

know, we don't know how widespread

all of this has been. There are 650

0:28:210:28:26

members of Parliament and who knows

how many of them have skeletons in

0:28:260:28:30

their closet.

There has been enough

leadership from the Prime Minister

0:28:300:28:35

on this, George Eaton. Is did a case

it's impossible to know the scale if

0:28:350:28:40

more people break cover and decide

to come forward with allegations

0:28:400:28:44

against politicians, what more can

be done to deal with it?

It has been

0:28:440:28:49

difficult for Theresa May. I don't

think it helps this that her

0:28:490:28:55

government is in a fragile position

and it is dependant on the DUP.

0:28:550:29:00

Theresa May's allies would say she

acted decisively in term of Michael

0:29:000:29:06

Fallon, but there are Tory MPs who

don't think it is appropriate that

0:29:060:29:12

Stephen Crabb has the whip. He has

been accused and had admitted to

0:29:120:29:18

sectioning young girls and you have

seen some Tory MPs lose the whip,

0:29:180:29:24

but I don't think Theresa May has

given enough clarity on how she

0:29:240:29:28

thinks the problem can be resolved

and I mean the Prime Minister was

0:29:280:29:33

absent yesterday, it was Amber Rudd

who was doing the rounds and saying

0:29:330:29:36

it maybe right for MPs not just to

lose their ministerial position, but

0:29:360:29:41

to leave Parliament. I think Theresa

May would have been wiser to deliver

0:29:410:29:44

that message.

As it goes on and the

investigations are carried out,

0:29:440:29:49

Caroline Wheeler, we have been

discussing if people are found to

0:29:490:29:51

have behaved in a way that's not

acceptable under the new more

0:29:510:29:55

robust, we hear, codes of conduct

that the parties are looking at,

0:29:550:30:00

then you know what happens to the

politicians because they may well be

0:30:000:30:06

suspended from their ministerial

posts and lose the whip, but they

0:30:060:30:09

will still be MPs, won't they?

0:30:090:30:18

What we are being told as there is a

complaints procedure in terms of the

0:30:180:30:22

Conservative Party. MBAs or anyone

who feels someone has behaved

0:30:220:30:28

inappropriately can e-mail in. We

don't know who can deal with the

0:30:280:30:32

complaints. We understand there is

an Independent person but we do not

0:30:320:30:36

know who that is and where it goes

from there. It is difficult in terms

0:30:360:30:41

of working out what will happen

there will be people within the

0:30:410:30:46

Conservative Party associations and

the constituencies scratching their

0:30:460:30:49

heads and thinking, is this the type

of person I want to be representing

0:30:490:30:53

me in Parliament?

Let's talk about

the other issue and that is Brexit.

0:30:530:31:03

Talking about the procedure

committee. Charles Walker, head of

0:31:030:31:08

the Commons procedure committee

believes the oversight of the EU

0:31:080:31:11

withdrawal bill is not enough. What

is he suggesting? Element he is

0:31:110:31:16

suggesting a separate committee be

set up simply because of the volume

0:31:160:31:22

of amendments. --

He is suggesting.

This is the biggest task any

0:31:220:31:29

government has faced since 1945. Not

surprising that the House of Commons

0:31:290:31:34

and House of Lords are not capable

of giving it the scrutiny giving how

0:31:340:31:39

transformative the impact of Brexit

could be for our political system

0:31:390:31:44

and the UK economy.

Mark Carney, the

governor of the Bank England, said

0:31:440:31:50

the uncertainty was having an

adverse impact on business

0:31:500:31:54

investment. No doubt he will be

labelled as an enemy of Brexit by

0:31:540:32:01

those who want to see Brexit happen.

What is the general feeling about

0:32:010:32:06

the role of Mark Carney in this?

It

depends who you ask. It is the same

0:32:060:32:13

with all the Brexit stories. We

still have people who voted remains,

0:32:130:32:18

campaigning to remain saying things

they feel pertain to the cause.

0:32:180:32:21

There are those on the side of

Wexford who seek Mark Carney as the

0:32:210:32:28

bogeyman. -- Brexit. When you think

about the negotiations at the end of

0:32:280:32:34

the week there is a growing sense of

frustration we're not getting on

0:32:340:32:36

with it. You can see some of that

reaction from the European side. The

0:32:360:32:42

idea that we'll have talks about

talks and there will not be any

0:32:420:32:46

substantive progress until the end

of year is getting people's backs

0:32:460:32:48

up. At the same time we are seeing a

strong message that business needs

0:32:480:32:53

to know what transition will look

like by the first quarter of next

0:32:530:32:57

year, otherwise confidence in the

economy and in their ability to make

0:32:570:33:03

future decisions is very much

compromised.

Let's talk about the

0:33:030:33:09

procedure committee and all of the

laws that have to be looked over in

0:33:090:33:13

the EU withdrawal bill. Do you agree

with your colleague that there needs

0:33:130:33:17

to be a new committee to filter

through all the substance?

We have

0:33:170:33:24

spoken about this before. I think we

have to approach this with a very

0:33:240:33:28

broad mind about how Parliament uses

its time. In a speech if you weeks

0:33:280:33:36

ago I said I would be in favour of

Parliament tearing up its timetable,

0:33:360:33:40

sitting on Fridays and looking at

the lengths of recess. This is the

0:33:400:33:46

most important part of legislation

we will have to deal with in this

0:33:460:33:50

Parliament and it is only right that

the House of Commons and the House

0:33:500:33:54

of Lords gets a proper opportunity

to scrutinise it. There is not a lot

0:33:540:33:59

of other legislation going through

at the moment for that we can create

0:33:590:34:02

time for Parliament to do it and we

can do it properly.

You think that

0:34:020:34:10

Parliament is being bypassed?

We

have an assembled list of amendments

0:34:100:34:15

at the moment.

300 and something guy

coming up to 400 amendments.

We will

0:34:150:34:25

see, as the process begins after

recess, how many people start to

0:34:250:34:28

support each other's amendments.

Which you signed up to?

I am still

0:34:280:34:33

going through the Bill and have not

signed against any of them.

Is there

0:34:330:34:40

enough time to look through all of

the legislation or is it as claimed

0:34:400:34:45

by the Government important that the

Government gets on with the Brexit

0:34:450:34:49

bill and the EU withdrawal bill so

that something is on the statute

0:34:490:34:54

books so anything not covered by the

laws we currently have because

0:34:540:34:59

Parliament is delaying the process.

Nobody is questioning the need to

0:34:590:35:05

get the EU legislation into our own

legislation. This issue of statutory

0:35:050:35:10

instruments and which ones are

important and which ones are not,

0:35:100:35:13

should we just leave it up to the

Government to determine which ones

0:35:130:35:17

are done in committee or which are

decided upon in the House? Dominic

0:35:170:35:24

Grieve and others have tabled

amendments to set that out and I

0:35:240:35:27

agree with it. I personally think

the most important amendment on be

0:35:270:35:33

withdrawal bill is to guarantee that

Parliament gets a say on the final

0:35:330:35:39

deal in enough time.

When would be

enough time? David Davis has said it

0:35:390:35:46

could all be done at the last

moment.

It has to happen before it

0:35:460:35:53

goes to European Parliament.

We are

seeing a number of checks and

0:35:530:35:57

balances being discussed. I think it

is absolutely right we get to go

0:35:570:36:01

through the legislation with a tooth

comb, making sure that Parliament is

0:36:010:36:05

happy with it.

Should Parliament

have a meaningful say six months

0:36:050:36:12

before the European Parliament?

The

Prime Minister has said that

0:36:120:36:16

Parliament will have a meaningful

say.

It is yet another infusion.

0:36:160:36:22

Simon I think we can rest assured

that we will. --

I think we can rest

0:36:220:36:32

assured. Whenever if Parliament vote

down the deal, what happens then?

I

0:36:320:36:41

want to see it in legislation, the

final, meaningful vote.

That means

0:36:410:36:46

would be able to vote down the deal.

Would you say you have to go back to

0:36:460:36:52

Brussels and renegotiate or do we

just fallout of the EU at that

0:36:520:36:57

point?

By having legislation where

Parliament will have the final say,

0:36:570:37:03

the Government will deal much more

effectively with MPs to stop them

0:37:030:37:06

getting a bad deal in the first

place. No one wants this going

0:37:060:37:10

backwards and forwards. By having a

power for Parliament, it will ensure

0:37:100:37:17

that government works across the

House and get agreement. Simon and

0:37:170:37:21

there is a real danger that if

Parliament votes down the final

0:37:210:37:25

deal, the Prime Minister will

suddenly be able to go back and

0:37:250:37:28

start the whole process again. --

There is a real deal. Be you will

0:37:280:37:34

not play ball in that way. They will

be given more time to do that. There

0:37:340:37:41

is a danger that MPs create the

danger for constituents. There is a

0:37:410:37:49

reset button on this but there is

not.

I think there is a safety

0:37:490:37:55

mechanism that the Government should

deal more effectively with MPs to

0:37:550:38:01

deal cross -- get cross-party

support for a deal.

We are seeing a

0:38:010:38:05

lot of that work going on.

We will

find out in a couple of weeks.

0:38:050:38:11

There's just time before we go

to find out the answer to our quiz.

0:38:110:38:14

The question was about

Donald Trump's visit to Japan.

0:38:140:38:17

What did he do that has sparked

outrage on Twitter?

0:38:170:38:19

Was it a) Overfeed the fish

0:38:190:38:21

b) Pick some flowers

0:38:210:38:22

c) Refuse to eat the sushi

0:38:220:38:26

or d) Tweet through

a press conference?

0:38:260:38:29

At the end of the show, Alex and

lives will give us the correct

0:38:290:38:33

answer. -- lives.

0:38:330:38:39

Now, homelessness in the UK

is a problem every party has pledged

0:38:390:38:41

to tackle:whether it be with more

houses or more money.

0:38:410:38:44

But what's the right thing for each

of us to do when we walk past

0:38:440:38:47

someone begging in the street?

0:38:470:38:49

Should we buy them some

food and a hot drink -

0:38:490:38:51

or should we give them the money

directly regardless of how

0:38:510:38:54

we think they'll spend it?

0:38:540:38:55

The journalist Matt

Broomfield thinks so.

0:38:550:38:57

Here's his soapbox.

0:38:570:39:07

We're often told we shouldn't give

cash to the homeless but I think we

0:39:080:39:12

should give them money,

directly and unconditionally.

0:39:120:39:17

Don't just buy them

a sandwich, they're not four.

0:39:170:39:21

They have the right to spend

their money, as they choose.

0:39:210:39:26

Don't try to second-guess

if they're really homeless.

0:39:260:39:29

If they're desperate enough

to beg, they need it.

0:39:290:39:35

Many street beggars

are addicts but addiction

0:39:350:39:37

can only be tackled by raising

people out of poverty.

0:39:370:39:42

Cutting off people's only

source of income is not

0:39:420:39:44

going to starve them into

seeking help from authorities they

0:39:440:39:47

know will not or cannot help them.

0:39:470:39:49

When the Government says street

beggars are refusing long-term help,

0:39:490:39:52

what they mean is that help

on offer is not adequate.

0:39:520:39:55

What homeless people need

is free, state-provided

0:39:550:39:59

housing and fully-funded

psychological care.

0:39:590:40:01

What they get is austerity

measures, driving them

0:40:010:40:03

onto the street.

0:40:030:40:09

Thanks to a poor state

response, charitable giving

0:40:090:40:11

and hostels remain life-savers

to many thousands of people.

0:40:110:40:15

But big homelessness

charities already

0:40:150:40:17

receive millions from government

and private donors every year

0:40:170:40:20

while those deemed impossible

to help die outside.

0:40:200:40:24

Many structural barriers

separate long-term rough

0:40:240:40:26

sleepers from hostel beds.

0:40:260:40:32

Many of the foreign nationals making

up half of London's sleeping

0:40:320:40:37

population cannot claim benefits

to access the charity-run hostel

0:40:370:40:39

network at all.

0:40:390:40:43

In fact some major homelessness

charities actively shop

0:40:430:40:45

foreign rough sleepers

to the Home Office to be deported.

0:40:450:40:48

It is the same

government-funded charities

0:40:480:40:52

which pushed the narratives that

"kindness kills" as they tout for

0:40:520:40:55

your donations.

0:40:550:40:56

Do not believe them.

0:40:560:40:57

Apathy and austerity kills.

0:40:570:41:00

Your kindness saves lives.

0:41:000:41:03

And Matt Broomfield joins us now.

0:41:030:41:05

Also here is the chief

executive of the homelessness

0:41:050:41:08

charity Thames Reach,

Jeremy Swain.

0:41:080:41:15

Welcome to both of you. Can I start

with you, jammy, why shouldn't

0:41:150:41:19

people give cash directly and

unconditionally to homeless people?

0:41:190:41:25

-- Jeromy.

We have workers on the

street every day going out and

0:41:250:41:29

begging on the street, sleeping

rough. People on the street have

0:41:290:41:35

normally gone onto the street to get

money from the public. For my staff,

0:41:350:41:42

working on the street, it is not

something which is the theoretical

0:41:420:41:46

issue, we are losing people dying on

the street. Our job is to transform

0:41:460:41:52

lives and get those people off the

streets and get them into treatment.

0:41:520:41:58

Often they are into treatment. We

need to change things. 50 of our

0:41:580:42:03

colleagues are former homeless

people. They can tell you that we

0:42:030:42:08

need change. When Matt said in the

piece that even if somebody's going

0:42:080:42:11

to use the money for an overdose,

still give it to them. This is just

0:42:110:42:17

appalling and offensive.

New office

he want to come back. You quoted

0:42:170:42:23

approvingly someone says, if your

money funds the final drugs kit,

0:42:230:42:28

accept the person would rather be

dead. Sun this is a quote from

0:42:280:42:35

another former rough sleeper,

another former addict. --

This is a

0:42:350:42:39

quote. This is as a way of opening

up the conversation more broadly.

0:42:390:42:46

When you say people are coming onto

the street to bake it is a fact to

0:42:460:42:49

get money and it is about rough

sleeping doubling, quadrupling in

0:42:490:42:58

some cities. If anything they are

given less cash. This is keyed into

0:42:580:43:07

rising poverty, austerity cuts and a

lack of adequate housing. This is

0:43:070:43:11

what we should be tackling.

However

much work you do, you will never be

0:43:110:43:17

able to combat, if that is the case,

the situation that Matt is

0:43:170:43:21

describing. If someone wants to give

money, should we make our moral

0:43:210:43:26

judgment?

You certainly do. By

giving people money on the street

0:43:260:43:29

they can die. There was a young

woman living in a hostel who came

0:43:290:43:33

onto the street to bake one night

from people coming out of the clubs

0:43:330:43:37

in Southampton thought she came back

to our hostel, had a bath and a

0:43:370:43:43

seizure and is dead. Matt is not

someone who has to attend funerals

0:43:430:43:47

and talk to families about why their

daughter, son or mother died. There

0:43:470:43:53

are serious issues about poverty on

the street. We have high numbers of

0:43:530:43:57

rough sleepers. We have 1300 people

off the street and we need public to

0:43:570:44:02

work with us. Giving money at the

right place might actually be the

0:44:020:44:07

way of doing it.

In the sense that

the person who gave the money for

0:44:070:44:11

the heroine very sad because Turk to

lose her life, you could equally say

0:44:110:44:14

because the people who die of

exposure, people who did not get

0:44:140:44:20

money costs them their lives in the

same sense.

When I was last talking

0:44:200:44:26

about this issue, it was two years

ago when the police had the freedom

0:44:260:44:32

of information request to get the

number, the percentage of people

0:44:320:44:36

begging on the street who were

housed and it was 20%. Only one in

0:44:360:44:40

five is literally homeless. We have

people coming onto the streets to

0:44:400:44:43

bed. Our job is to move people off

the streets and into treatment. This

0:44:430:44:50

can be done. It is about people

living long and fulfilling lives.

I

0:44:500:44:55

do not think the way to help is to

create a hostile environment on the

0:44:550:45:00

street. There is no way I can even

survive. There are many reasons why

0:45:000:45:06

people leave the shelter.

Come out

with us until one o'clock in the

0:45:060:45:11

morning. We will help people into

hostels. In some hostels, in a safe

0:45:110:45:16

and controlled way, you can use will

stop

I have spoken to many people

0:45:160:45:22

who are out of the hostel system.

Not one is saying it is because they

0:45:220:45:27

have so much money on the streets.

They give a number of reasons. Most

0:45:270:45:32

say there is not enough money for

hostels as a first response. Maybe

0:45:320:45:37

difficulties with caseworkers or

people are now. There are many

0:45:370:45:41

reasons why people leave hostels. No

one says they have deliberately left

0:45:410:45:44

the hostel and gone on to the

street.

If there are enough money

0:45:440:45:48

being given to be the act as a

magnet for people to stay on the

0:45:480:45:51

street for that reason?

0:45:510:45:55

We are on the street every night of

the year talking to people. You have

0:45:550:46:00

come out to do an article. That's

fine. We are the ones picking up the

0:46:000:46:04

pieces when you have moved on to

another piece. The money you can get

0:46:040:46:07

on the street, in two hours you can

raise £50, but let's remember...

And

0:46:070:46:12

they can get a hot meal and drink

with that money.

You don't need to

0:46:120:46:17

book into accommodation because it

is free on the point of access. In

0:46:170:46:22

our service across London, Thames

Reach has food and there is 30 soup

0:46:220:46:27

runs giving out food at the top of

the Strand in Central London. Food

0:46:270:46:31

is not the issue. Changing people's

lives and giving them accident

0:46:310:46:35

accommodation and helping them solve

their addiction problem is what it

0:46:350:46:39

is about.

The money that's given,

some of it, to people who are

0:46:390:46:44

begging or people who are homeless

on the street would be better if

0:46:440:46:49

people were encouraged to give that

to charities?

There are groups I

0:46:490:46:52

support with the charities the point

where I decided I felt I would no

0:46:520:46:56

longer want to support the big

charities such as Thames Reach when

0:46:560:47:00

I reared about their involvement in

providing a database of location of

0:47:000:47:05

foreign national rough sleepers...

This is factually incorrect. We have

0:47:050:47:08

never away an individual's details

to the Home Office where they could

0:47:080:47:11

be picked up and tan off the street.

You have a database of locations.

0:47:110:47:20

Data protection would prevent us

doing that. I was out two weeks ago,

0:47:200:47:24

there were four people sleeving

rough in the reception area of a

0:47:240:47:27

police station and we were delighted

to help those people get off the

0:47:270:47:30

street.

Have you given money to

people begging on the street?

I have

0:47:300:47:36

done both, given money individually

and to charities. The two things we

0:47:360:47:39

need to do, one is we need to make

sure local councils are building

0:47:390:47:44

more council houses, affordable

housing, that's the big thing and

0:47:440:47:47

secondly, now, I am much more

focussed on giving to charities

0:47:470:47:51

because it is, you have got to fix

all these different pieces together,

0:47:510:47:54

what you want is a roof over their

head, something warm to eat, but

0:47:540:47:58

deal with their addiction, and get

them skills and training and

0:47:580:48:02

charities can bring that together.

Right. Building more homes as we

0:48:020:48:07

have seen over successive years and

with successive governments takes

0:48:070:48:09

time. In the meantime should people

stop giving money to people who are

0:48:090:48:14

homeless on the streets?

I would

strongly encourage people to give

0:48:140:48:19

their money to homeless charities

and if you see someone on your

0:48:190:48:23

street who you feel is in need of

help, give them advice, give them a

0:48:230:48:27

cup of tea and something to eat, but

I would recommend that people direct

0:48:270:48:31

their money to homeless charities

who understand this problem better

0:48:310:48:33

than we do and the Government has

recently brought in the homeless

0:48:330:48:38

reduction Act which is a good first

stepment we are looking at housing

0:48:380:48:41

first model which is being

successful in other parts of the

0:48:410:48:44

world where you get people into

accommodation and get them the

0:48:440:48:47

services they are required to solve

their mental health problems.

What

0:48:470:48:49

do you say to Matt who says it is

austerity that put a lot of these

0:48:490:48:53

people on the street in the first

place?

What you have seen in London

0:48:530:48:58

is that you have seen yes, I know

that rough sleeping has increased,

0:48:580:49:02

but a lot of the numbers of the

increase have gone people coming and

0:49:020:49:06

working from abroad rather than

people who have been forced on the

0:49:060:49:08

streets here.

Is it as a result of

austerity?

That's far...

We have

0:49:080:49:13

seen people lose.

Let him answer.

Those their homes.

This is a time of

0:49:130:49:20

record employment, you have more

people than ever in the workplace.

0:49:200:49:24

Rent has gone sky high. Landlords

kicking people out because...

We are

0:49:240:49:27

going to have to leave it there,

thank you for coming in today.

0:49:270:49:34

We have had the party conferences

and the trade union congress.

0:49:340:49:37

This week it's the turn of Britain's

bosses to have their knees up

0:49:370:49:39

at the venue formerly

known as The Dome,

0:49:390:49:41

where they are meeting

for the CBI annual conference.

0:49:410:49:44

This morning has been

all about politics

0:49:440:49:45

with an appearance by Jeremy Corbyn

and the Prime Minister bigging up

0:49:450:49:48

the role of state in the economy.

0:49:480:49:54

A strategic state has a major

influence on the economy.

0:49:540:49:56

In exerting that

influence, governments

0:49:560:49:57

must inevitably make choices.

0:49:570:50:01

And in a democracy, be held

to account for them.

0:50:010:50:05

The choice which this government

makes is to deploy this

0:50:050:50:09

influence in a thought through way,

taking decisions for the long term.

0:50:090:50:12

Because while the power and

potential of the market is immense,

0:50:120:50:15

I also strongly believe in the good

that government can do.

0:50:150:50:20

Carolyn Fairbairn is

the Director General of the CBI.

0:50:210:50:25

She joins us now from the CBI

conference in Greenwich.

0:50:250:50:30

Welcome to the Daily Politics. We

have just heard Theresa May there,

0:50:300:50:34

the Prime Minister, talking about

the Government, state intervention

0:50:340:50:39

and strategic intervention of

industry and Jeremy Corbyn wants to

0:50:390:50:41

nationalise a few of your members.

Do you believe that Thatcherism is

0:50:410:50:46

truly dead?

Well, I think what we

have seen is a lot of common themes

0:50:460:50:51

around the value of markets and the

value of business. That came through

0:50:510:50:55

from Jeremy Corbyn's speech as well,

but a role for the state which I

0:50:550:50:58

think is well accepted and has to be

right. But the importance of markets

0:50:580:51:02

to be able to work, what we are also

hearing, I think, is commitment on

0:51:020:51:10

boths both sides. And that's a good

combination, good government and

0:51:100:51:14

responsible business.

Both party

leaders are talking about state

0:51:140:51:20

intervention and for the

Conservatives you could argue we

0:51:200:51:22

haven't heard as much about state

intervention as we have under

0:51:220:51:26

Theresa May and presumably that's

because they feel the public is

0:51:260:51:30

blaming big business, many of them

your members, because the market has

0:51:300:51:32

failed them?

Well, I think that

there are questions around the role

0:51:320:51:39

of business and how it works, but I

think that the massive contribution

0:51:390:51:43

that businesses can make,

particularly now, around our

0:51:430:51:47

productivity challenge, the

investment that we need to raise

0:51:470:51:48

living standards, I think is coming

through really strongly politically

0:51:480:51:52

now and I think we have got the

biggest conference here... Sorry.

0:51:520:51:58

What way do you think it is coming

through strongly? We have heard

0:51:580:52:01

Theresa May talk about the

importance of capitalism and the

0:52:010:52:04

free-market economy, but we are

seeing and hearing policies on state

0:52:040:52:09

intervention on housing, on energy

which the Labour Party had first

0:52:090:52:12

suggested, your banking members had

to be bailed out by the tax payer.

0:52:120:52:17

So what way is there evidence that

the free-market economy has worked?

0:52:170:52:21

Well, I think in terms of living

standards that have risen and the

0:52:210:52:27

contribution that companies and

markets have made over many years, I

0:52:270:52:29

think it was where the Prime

Minister opened her speech today.

0:52:290:52:33

There is, of course, an important

role for the state and I think that

0:52:330:52:38

the points made by both Prime

Minister and Jeremy Corbyn about

0:52:380:52:41

housing very, very welcome. Social

issue, but a very important business

0:52:410:52:45

issue as well in terms of people

being able to get to their places of

0:52:450:52:48

work. So I think it is this marriage

of state and business that is going

0:52:480:52:53

to work best and it is about a

partnership. So, I think we are

0:52:530:52:57

hearing the right kinds of messages

and also around Brexit where the

0:52:570:53:00

voice of I think the economy is

coming through much more strongly

0:53:000:53:04

from both leaders.

So why are living

standards delining? Wages aren't

0:53:040:53:10

keeping up with inflation. If you

say it has been a something ses, why

0:53:100:53:13

are we in that state and

productivity levels are very low?

We

0:53:130:53:18

have a huge challenge around

productivity. I think if you look

0:53:180:53:20

over the course of the last 30

years, you know, we have seen the

0:53:200:53:23

benefits that markets have brought

to society and to people's lives. We

0:53:230:53:28

have got a massive productivity

problem and that is where business

0:53:280:53:31

comes in because it will be through

the kinds of investments that we

0:53:310:53:35

need, the new products that are

developed, the new jobs that are

0:53:350:53:37

created, there is a big theme here

around technology that I think

0:53:370:53:43

living standards will be

kick-started again and again, I go

0:53:430:53:45

back to the themes of industrial

strategy that we're hearing

0:53:450:53:49

repeated, but I think the message

from businesses are around pace, we

0:53:490:53:52

need to see the actions coming in

very soon.

Right, well, let's talk

0:53:520:53:57

about Brexit because there have been

threats that businesses, your

0:53:570:54:00

members are going to stop investing,

they're going to have to start

0:54:000:54:03

firing people. Do you stand by those

sorts of comments? Is that what's

0:54:030:54:07

going to happen if, in your words,

there isn't more certainty on

0:54:070:54:12

Brexit?

Well, we are in a place

where firms are having to look at

0:54:120:54:16

their plans in case there is no

deal. And we're heading into the

0:54:160:54:20

period where that is happening now.

So our latest survey suggests that

0:54:200:54:26

about 10% of firms have already made

that move and 20% by the end of the

0:54:260:54:30

year and a further 25% by next

March. These are just rational

0:54:300:54:35

responses that firms are taking to

how they organise themselves. The

0:54:350:54:38

good news though is that it can be

prevented if a transition

0:54:380:54:41

arrangement is put in place by the

end of the year, a status quo

0:54:410:54:45

transition, what firms tell us,

large firms, three-quarters of them

0:54:450:54:48

will pause the plans. So it is a

really, are really key few weeks

0:54:480:54:53

leading up to the December

negotiations.

But what sort of

0:54:530:54:56

proposals are looking for? The

Government is in the middle of a

0:54:560:54:59

negotiation and the Government will

say it cannot reveal or give away

0:54:590:55:04

it's negotiating hand in the way you

seem to be calling for. What

0:55:040:55:09

precisely would give this certainty

that you say business needs?

0:55:090:55:12

I think, at moment from the

Government's side, I think we are

0:55:120:55:16

seeing this increasingly is unity

around the Florence speech which was

0:55:160:55:20

I think very, our members and firms,

thought it was a good step forward.

0:55:200:55:24

We need the unity around that which

I think we are seeing increasingly

0:55:240:55:30

and was reaffirmed this morning.

There is a consensus from Labour and

0:55:300:55:33

the positions are consistent and

that's a strong position to be

0:55:330:55:36

taking into the European Union and

there is a lot of conversation, we

0:55:360:55:38

are doing a lot of work with

European businesses to put the case

0:55:380:55:41

on the other side, why this is in

the mutual interest of all firms.

0:55:410:55:46

That's what we are wanting to see,

unity and clarity and urgency going

0:55:460:55:51

into December.

This is regarding

membership of the single market?

For

0:55:510:55:59

the transition period. For the

transition period. There is then a

0:55:590:56:03

massive question about the shape of

the final deal and that's what is

0:56:030:56:06

going to be next in line. So, again

the Florence speech gave some

0:56:060:56:13

indication that the importance of

keeping a close economic

0:56:130:56:17

relationship, barrier-free trade, as

frictionless as possible. These are

0:56:170:56:20

going to come back on to the agenda

in the New Year as the new deal gets

0:56:200:56:24

sorted out and that's going to be

the thing, if we can get transition

0:56:240:56:27

agreed in the New Year, we need to

quickly move on to that because

0:56:270:56:30

that's the next level of certainty

business wants to see.

Thank you

0:56:300:56:34

very much for joining us today.

0:56:340:56:38

There's just time before we go

to find out the answer to our quiz.

0:56:380:56:42

The question was about

Donald Trump's visit to Japan.

0:56:420:56:44

What did he do that has

sparked outrage on Twitter?

0:56:440:56:47

Was it a) Overfeed the fish?

0:56:470:56:48

b) Pick some flowers?

0:56:480:56:52

c) Refuse to eat the sushi?

0:56:520:56:53

or d) Tweet through

a press conference?

0:56:530:56:58

He is alleged to overfed the fish.

He did, but so did the Japanese

0:56:580:57:03

Prime Minister.

We don't know how

many fish were in the pond! I

0:57:030:57:09

understand in the palace, it is

teeming with these coy carp.

0:57:090:57:17

I'm impressed by your level of

interest in this. This is the

0:57:170:57:23

picture that got Twitter buzzing.

There is Donald Trump seen to be

0:57:230:57:26

emptying and dumping the food in one

go, but it is not as clear as the

0:57:260:57:30

photograph implies because as Liz

suggested the president is standing

0:57:300:57:35

next to Japan's Prime Minister and

which each of them starts throwing

0:57:350:57:40

the food in, with moderation, with

the spoon. Oh, it's the Prime

0:57:400:57:45

Minister who dumps husband food

first! He is laughing and so does

0:57:450:57:48

Donald Trump!

So, what do we think? Unfair

0:57:480:57:51

coverage for Donald Trump?

I think

so. Look, he was following the lead

0:57:510:57:55

of his host and I think if you were

to see the grateful fish at the

0:57:550:58:00

bottom of the pond they would have

been eating it up!

Are you from the

0:58:000:58:05

Fishing Times newspaper or

something?

I follow Buzz feed

0:58:050:58:11

because they reveal truth of these

stories.

0:58:110:58:17

Since it is a year since President

Trump came president, how will you

0:58:170:58:22

be celebrating?

The year is a far

less safe and society and culture is

0:58:220:58:30

less.

I think the best is to come.

The best is to come from Trump.

0:58:300:58:36

President Trump. That's diplomatic

of you.

0:58:360:58:42

That's all for today.

0:58:420:58:43

Thanks to our guests.

0:58:430:58:44

The One O'Clock News is starting

over on BBC One now.

0:58:440:58:46

I'll be here at noon

tomorrow with all the big

0:58:460:58:49

political stories of the day.

0:58:490:58:50

There is then a short recess, but I

will be back the following Monday.

0:58:500:58:53

From all of us here, good afternoon.

Bye-bye.

0:58:530:58:58

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0:59:020:59:04

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