Jo Courn is joined by Neil O'Brien and Helen Goodman, as EU leaders finalise details of the Brexit transition period in Brussels. Plus should shock collars for pets be banned?
Browse content similar to 19/03/2018. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
Line | From | To | |
---|---|---|---|
Hello and welcome to
the Daily Politics. | 0:00:38 | 0:00:42 | |
David Davis is in Brussels
where an agreement between Britain | 0:00:42 | 0:00:46 | |
and the EU over the transition
period after Brexit looks | 0:00:46 | 0:00:48 | |
close to being struck. | 0:00:48 | 0:00:49 | |
We'll bring you all the latest. | 0:00:49 | 0:00:53 | |
The EU has offered "unqualified
solidarity" with the UK | 0:00:53 | 0:00:56 | |
as the investigation
into the poisoning of | 0:00:56 | 0:00:58 | |
ex-Russian spy Sergei Skripal
and his daughter goes on. | 0:00:58 | 0:01:03 | |
Is the Government serving up
cuts to free school meal | 0:01:03 | 0:01:06 | |
entitlement for some
children, or is Labour | 0:01:06 | 0:01:07 | |
over-egging the pudding? | 0:01:07 | 0:01:08 | |
We'll try to find out. | 0:01:08 | 0:01:11 | |
Should shock collars for dogs
in England like Bella | 0:01:11 | 0:01:14 | |
and Abbie be banned? | 0:01:14 | 0:01:16 | |
We'll be debating this
charged political issue. | 0:01:16 | 0:01:24 | |
I think if I didn't have it two
years ago I wouldn't be here right | 0:01:24 | 0:01:29 | |
now. You can't put a price on it. | 0:01:29 | 0:01:33 | |
And MPs debate whether people
with cystic fibrosis should | 0:01:33 | 0:01:35 | |
receive a life-changing,
but very expensive, drug on the NHS. | 0:01:35 | 0:01:41 | |
All that in the next hour
and with us for the whole | 0:01:53 | 0:01:56 | |
of the programme today,
it's the shadow foreign office | 0:01:56 | 0:01:58 | |
minister Helen Goodman and
the Conservative MP Neil O'Brien. | 0:01:58 | 0:02:00 | |
Welcome to the show both of you. | 0:02:00 | 0:02:02 | |
First today - a deal
between Britain and the EU | 0:02:02 | 0:02:04 | |
on the transition deal,
that's the period of two | 0:02:04 | 0:02:06 | |
years after Brexit -
looks to have been reached. | 0:02:06 | 0:02:08 | |
David Davis is in Brussels
where he's been meeting | 0:02:08 | 0:02:11 | |
with the EU's negotiator
Michel Barnier, we'll hear that | 0:02:11 | 0:02:13 | |
in a moment, it's potentially a big
moment in the Brexit process. | 0:02:13 | 0:02:16 | |
It means there's an agreed set
of rules to smoothe the way | 0:02:16 | 0:02:18 | |
from our current relationship
to our new relationship with the EU. | 0:02:18 | 0:02:24 | |
The EU wants this period,
which the British government calls | 0:02:24 | 0:02:26 | |
the implementation period,
to last until the end of December | 0:02:26 | 0:02:29 | |
2020, so we're all looking forward
to finding out where each side | 0:02:29 | 0:02:32 | |
has given way. | 0:02:32 | 0:02:33 | |
Here's Michel Barnier. | 0:02:33 | 0:02:41 | |
TRANSLATION: And what we are
presenting to you today with David | 0:02:42 | 0:02:46 | |
is a legal texts, a joint legal
text, which constitutes in my mind a | 0:02:46 | 0:02:53 | |
decisive step because we were able
this morning to agree that after all | 0:02:53 | 0:02:59 | |
those days and nights of hard work
on a large part of what will make up | 0:02:59 | 0:03:04 | |
an international agreement for the
ordered withdrawal of the United | 0:03:04 | 0:03:08 | |
Kingdom. | 0:03:08 | 0:03:13 | |
And we're also joined by Bernard
Jenkin, the Conservative MP. I want | 0:03:13 | 0:03:18 | |
to ask my two guests hear what do
you say to the announcement by | 0:03:18 | 0:03:22 | |
Michel Barnier that there has been a
legal text agreed on the withdrawal | 0:03:22 | 0:03:26 | |
agreement and there sounds like some
sort of agreement has been made on | 0:03:26 | 0:03:30 | |
the transition? It is ready great
news because it is another milestone | 0:03:30 | 0:03:34 | |
on the way to delivering Brexit in a
smooth, orderly way, which is a big | 0:03:34 | 0:03:38 | |
prize because it means we'll get
back control of our laws, borders | 0:03:38 | 0:03:43 | |
and money so this is a big | 0:03:43 | 0:03:49 | |
and money so this is a big step
forward it is what most of this | 0:03:54 | 0:03:55 | |
country now want. People voted for
Brexit, we need to get on with it | 0:03:55 | 0:03:58 | |
and do it in a sensible and orderly
way and this is another milestone. | 0:03:58 | 0:04:01 | |
Bernard Jenkin, as we understand it
the agreement has been done but | 0:04:01 | 0:04:06 | |
everything stays the same during the
transition period, that two-year | 0:04:06 | 0:04:10 | |
period, but we will not have a seat
at the table. In other words, we | 0:04:10 | 0:04:16 | |
will be a rule take and not a rule
giver. I happy with that? It'll be | 0:04:16 | 0:04:21 | |
in the small print which we haven't
had a look at yet. Michel Barnier | 0:04:21 | 0:04:26 | |
has presented the pages of text on a
massive slide behind him saying that | 0:04:26 | 0:04:31 | |
all the bits coloured in yellow are
the bits where the drafting is | 0:04:31 | 0:04:35 | |
subject to alteration so we don't
have a finished text and there are | 0:04:35 | 0:04:39 | |
some bits that are in green which
seem to be on my television | 0:04:39 | 0:04:43 | |
indecipherable from the bits in
yellow. But can you accept the fact | 0:04:43 | 0:04:48 | |
that Britain won't have a seat at
the table when decisions are being | 0:04:48 | 0:04:51 | |
made during the transition period?
There is going to have to be some | 0:04:51 | 0:04:56 | |
pretty significant safeguards that
no country would submit itself is | 0:04:56 | 0:05:01 | |
completely to a foreign
jurisdiction, which is what the EU | 0:05:01 | 0:05:04 | |
becomes after we have left, and just
accept new laws and court rulings. | 0:05:04 | 0:05:08 | |
There will have to be some mediation
arrangement, even if by our own | 0:05:08 | 0:05:12 | |
parliament because when you are no
longer represented on the court, | 0:05:12 | 0:05:15 | |
when you are not sitting at the
table to make the new laws, how can | 0:05:15 | 0:05:21 | |
we possibly make ourselves a
prisoner of this arrangement? That | 0:05:21 | 0:05:24 | |
would not be acceptable. There are
other issues, like we are going to | 0:05:24 | 0:05:29 | |
be bound by the doctrine of sincere
integration, but we want to | 0:05:29 | 0:05:36 | |
negotiate our own trade deals. Do
you see this as success? A moment at | 0:05:36 | 0:05:44 | |
which the government can claim that
it has got agreement on this | 0:05:44 | 0:05:48 | |
implementation period? I hope so
because we were calling for a | 0:05:48 | 0:05:52 | |
transitional agreement with access
to the single market and the customs | 0:05:52 | 0:05:56 | |
union a year ago and the government
made some demands which couldn't be | 0:05:56 | 0:05:59 | |
met and now they've had to accept
that wasn't negotiable, and we | 0:05:59 | 0:06:04 | |
really do need this smooth
transition because the amount of | 0:06:04 | 0:06:07 | |
uncertainty and chaos which has been
caused for industry and business has | 0:06:07 | 0:06:11 | |
ready been terrible. We don't want
to see a repeat of this pattern | 0:06:11 | 0:06:15 | |
where the government requests things
it cannot achieve. We need a better | 0:06:15 | 0:06:18 | |
approach. Right, I'm going to talk
to if political correspondent for TV | 0:06:18 | 0:06:27 | |
island but first of all will you be
happy to support a deal when it | 0:06:27 | 0:06:31 | |
comes to parliament later this year
if the issue of Ireland and Northern | 0:06:31 | 0:06:36 | |
Ireland hasn't been completely
resolved or if there is some | 0:06:36 | 0:06:40 | |
infrastructure at the border? We
think getting the Northern Ireland | 0:06:40 | 0:06:44 | |
border sorted on the basis of a soft
border is absolutely essential to a | 0:06:44 | 0:06:50 | |
satisfactory deal. We've just heard
from Michel Barnier on the border | 0:06:50 | 0:06:54 | |
issue that both sides, the UK and
the EU, are committed to all part of | 0:06:54 | 0:06:59 | |
what was agreed in December.
Briefly, to summarise, what was | 0:06:59 | 0:07:03 | |
agreed in that draft text was either
there was going to be a full free | 0:07:03 | 0:07:08 | |
trade agreement that would take in
the issue of the board or that's | 0:07:08 | 0:07:13 | |
technology would provide the
solution, which is what the | 0:07:13 | 0:07:16 | |
government has been suggesting, but
has been rejected so far by certain | 0:07:16 | 0:07:20 | |
parties on EU side, or the third
backstop issue which is that | 0:07:20 | 0:07:25 | |
Northern Ireland would remain
aligned to the EU, which is the | 0:07:25 | 0:07:29 | |
least favoured option for most
sides, certainly in the UK. Gavin | 0:07:29 | 0:07:34 | |
Reilly, do you think this is a
problem that the issue of the border | 0:07:34 | 0:07:39 | |
hasn't yet been resolved, even
though this implementation period | 0:07:39 | 0:07:42 | |
has been agreed? It is a point of
anxiety that the Irish government is | 0:07:42 | 0:07:46 | |
still waiting to find a very
workable solution about how exactly | 0:07:46 | 0:07:52 | |
such technological solutions might
work. The Irish government has been | 0:07:52 | 0:07:56 | |
transparent and upfront and says its
best possible solution is a very | 0:07:56 | 0:08:01 | |
all-encompassing free-trade
agreement between EU and the UK | 0:08:01 | 0:08:04 | |
which would render the border? Is at
it because they would be part of the | 0:08:04 | 0:08:09 | |
same trading block. If that isn't
going to be any prospect of the UK | 0:08:09 | 0:08:17 | |
coming forward with technological
solutions, at least island considers | 0:08:17 | 0:08:19 | |
it feasible. The real question for
the Irish government is whether the | 0:08:19 | 0:08:28 | |
UK government is prepared to honour
the backstop agreement you | 0:08:28 | 0:08:31 | |
mentioned, where Northern Ireland
would remain part of the European | 0:08:31 | 0:08:36 | |
single trading area, even if it
means it become segmented from the | 0:08:36 | 0:08:40 | |
rest of the UK. The Irish government
says it doesn't want to do it and | 0:08:40 | 0:08:44 | |
the Taoiseach has been at pains to
article at this point because it is | 0:08:44 | 0:08:49 | |
perceived this is some sort of an
agenda to create a united Ireland by | 0:08:49 | 0:08:54 | |
stealth, to fragment the UK and have
Northern Ireland broken away from | 0:08:54 | 0:08:57 | |
the rest of mainland Britain. The
Irish government says it isn't its | 0:08:57 | 0:09:02 | |
intention at all but it wants to see
some commitment that it is prepared | 0:09:02 | 0:09:05 | |
to put its money where its mouth is,
the UK government. And that is | 0:09:05 | 0:09:11 | |
something the UK is prepared to
honour. It is interesting in the | 0:09:11 | 0:09:15 | |
agreement Michel Barnier posted at
text is highlighted yellow which | 0:09:15 | 0:09:19 | |
means that although the final legal
technicalities are not agreed, they | 0:09:19 | 0:09:23 | |
are agreed in principle. Two weeks
ago Theresa May suggested that | 0:09:23 | 0:09:27 | |
agreement was something no British
Prime Minister could stand over. | 0:09:27 | 0:09:35 | |
Bernard Jenkins, we've heard from
Michel Barnier on the UK island | 0:09:35 | 0:09:39 | |
border, we have agreed the backstop
solution must form part of the legal | 0:09:39 | 0:09:43 | |
text of the withdrawal agreement. It
will apply unless and until another | 0:09:43 | 0:09:48 | |
solution is found. Is that
acceptable to you the UK government | 0:09:48 | 0:09:51 | |
has signed up to the idea that
unless another solution is found | 0:09:51 | 0:09:55 | |
Northern Ireland will remain aligned
to EU rules? I'd want to look at the | 0:09:55 | 0:10:00 | |
small print. Well, this is what
Barnier has said. They've just | 0:10:00 | 0:10:05 | |
published a very long document
annual quoting a very small part of | 0:10:05 | 0:10:11 | |
it. Until I've read it... I'm asking
for your reaction to what is pretty | 0:10:11 | 0:10:16 | |
clear they've agreed the backstop
solution. Are you happy with that? | 0:10:16 | 0:10:20 | |
There will be no infrastructure at
the border on nest that you put it | 0:10:20 | 0:10:25 | |
there. If the EU is stupid enough
and wants to breach the terms of the | 0:10:25 | 0:10:30 | |
Northern Ireland peace agreement,
the Belfast Agreement, wants to put | 0:10:30 | 0:10:34 | |
up obstacles and be obstructive,
then they are going to go ahead and | 0:10:34 | 0:10:37 | |
do that but actually I think they
will not. What do you say to that? | 0:10:37 | 0:10:42 | |
There is a political will lacking on
the side of the EU? It is no good | 0:10:42 | 0:10:48 | |
saying just because someone else is
in the driving seat it doesn't | 0:10:48 | 0:10:51 | |
matter if we drive over the cliff
edge. What we really need is a clear | 0:10:51 | 0:10:57 | |
way to ensure that there is a soft
border, and, so far, the government | 0:10:57 | 0:11:02 | |
hasn't produced it. Is there a lack
of will on the side of the EU? If | 0:11:02 | 0:11:06 | |
they wanted to find a solution, one
would be found. I think it is a | 0:11:06 | 0:11:11 | |
tricky, technical thing to do
because of the red lines which | 0:11:11 | 0:11:15 | |
Theresa May has put forward, which I
think make it very difficult. Why | 0:11:15 | 0:11:21 | |
should the EU break its rules for
the UK, in terms of the Irish | 0:11:21 | 0:11:26 | |
border, and other UK to come out of
the customs union and the single | 0:11:26 | 0:11:30 | |
market and yet keep a completely
open and frictionless border? As | 0:11:30 | 0:11:35 | |
they say, they will never agree to
us cherry picking when it comes to | 0:11:35 | 0:11:41 | |
the rules and integrity of the
single market and customs union? The | 0:11:41 | 0:11:45 | |
reason we are agreeing on this is
because both sides want it, neither | 0:11:45 | 0:11:49 | |
side wants a hard border... On the
other hand we can't see a hard | 0:11:49 | 0:11:53 | |
border between one bit of the UK and
another bid. It won't be an easy | 0:11:53 | 0:11:58 | |
issue to solve, and it'll be one of
the last issues to solve but with | 0:11:58 | 0:12:03 | |
goodwill on all sides, it is
soluble. I feel sympathetic to | 0:12:03 | 0:12:07 | |
Bernard. To me, the text you read
out, which we have had no time to | 0:12:07 | 0:12:12 | |
respond to... He has had time to
respond to it, he hasn't seen the | 0:12:12 | 0:12:17 | |
full document. One last point on
this, it is saying something that is | 0:12:17 | 0:12:21 | |
obvious, it's always the case then
needs to be a real that deals with | 0:12:21 | 0:12:26 | |
the problem of the border between
Northern Ireland and the republic. | 0:12:26 | 0:12:30 | |
Obviously, that needs to be solved.
Are you happy with the fact the | 0:12:30 | 0:12:35 | |
agreement today during transition is
going to give EU citizens who come | 0:12:35 | 0:12:40 | |
during the two-year period exactly
the same rights as their | 0:12:40 | 0:12:44 | |
predecessors who were here before
March 2019? If what you say is | 0:12:44 | 0:12:48 | |
correct, no, I am not happy because
we are going to leave the EU in | 0:12:48 | 0:12:53 | |
March 2019 and I suspect you'll find
in the small print that isn't what | 0:12:53 | 0:12:56 | |
the agreement says. What differences
would you like to see? We need to be | 0:12:56 | 0:13:01 | |
able to verify and register people
coming into the country. We can do | 0:13:01 | 0:13:05 | |
that now. To check they are EU
citizens. We can do that now in the | 0:13:05 | 0:13:10 | |
single market. We don't do it but we
could do it. The government could do | 0:13:10 | 0:13:15 | |
it. Under EU law that could be
described as discrimination that we | 0:13:15 | 0:13:20 | |
are registering some EU citizens and
not others so let's be accurate | 0:13:20 | 0:13:24 | |
about this. Also the enforcement
mechanisms. We can't have the United | 0:13:24 | 0:13:29 | |
Kingdom Parliament around Loch,
stock and barrel by the European | 0:13:29 | 0:13:34 | |
Court of Justice as it is now when
we are no longer represented on the | 0:13:34 | 0:13:40 | |
European Court of Justice. Why are
we passing an act of Parliament that | 0:13:40 | 0:13:42 | |
abolishes the European Communities
Act? It is going to be technically | 0:13:42 | 0:13:50 | |
difficult exactly replicate this. I
think there will be technical legal | 0:13:50 | 0:13:54 | |
details that will end up with us
having a subtly different | 0:13:54 | 0:13:58 | |
jurisdiction, where we perhaps have
regard to what is happening in the | 0:13:58 | 0:14:02 | |
EU and we oblige our courts to do
this, to have regard, but we cannot | 0:14:02 | 0:14:08 | |
actually be bound as we are now. We
are leaving! It doesn't respect the | 0:14:08 | 0:14:15 | |
referendum result! Let's imagine
that is the case and that is what we | 0:14:15 | 0:14:18 | |
understand from the agreement today.
What are you going to do about it? I | 0:14:18 | 0:14:22 | |
think it'll be difficult to get the
agreement through the House of | 0:14:22 | 0:14:26 | |
Commons because how can you... Most
constituencies in the House of | 0:14:26 | 0:14:32 | |
Commons voted leave, they voted to
be free of the European Court of | 0:14:32 | 0:14:37 | |
Justice and the lawmaking capacity
of the EU, that is what the | 0:14:37 | 0:14:41 | |
referendum was about... And you are
not in agreement with that? To end | 0:14:41 | 0:14:45 | |
up at the same case but without
sitting at the table, without being | 0:14:45 | 0:14:50 | |
a member, this becomes a
constitutional outrage and I am | 0:14:50 | 0:14:53 | |
quite certain the government won't
agree to it. Will it be the same on | 0:14:53 | 0:14:57 | |
fishing? Would you feel the same
about fishing quotas? Fish is a big | 0:14:57 | 0:15:02 | |
problem because how can we allow the
EU to set fishing quotas for British | 0:15:02 | 0:15:07 | |
boats, particularly as big changes
are coming through, when we have no | 0:15:07 | 0:15:11 | |
chance of taking part in the
initiation? What is the government | 0:15:11 | 0:15:14 | |
going to do if there are people like
Jacob Rees Mogg and Bernard Jenkins | 0:15:14 | 0:15:18 | |
who can't sign up to this transition
deal? | 0:15:18 | 0:15:24 | |
The on fish, it looks from the
rumours on twitter like we are | 0:15:24 | 0:15:28 | |
actually getting a good deal today
on fish. I looked at what Jacob | 0:15:28 | 0:15:33 | |
Rees-Mogg said and it seemed like
something everyone would agree to. | 0:15:33 | 0:15:37 | |
Obviously we won't be able to
implement new trade deals until | 0:15:37 | 0:15:39 | |
we've left the EU, that's a matter
of logic. But if we can negotiate | 0:15:39 | 0:15:44 | |
them and get to the point of signing
them during the transition I think | 0:15:44 | 0:15:48 | |
everyone will be happy with that.
David Davis has said that the UK | 0:15:48 | 0:15:52 | |
will be able to step up, put and
sign new trade deals across the | 0:15:52 | 0:16:00 | |
globe that will come into force once
the implementation period is over. I | 0:16:00 | 0:16:05 | |
think we can hear him say it. | 0:16:05 | 0:16:08 | |
The United Kingdom will be able to
step out, sign and ratify new trade | 0:16:08 | 0:16:13 | |
deals with old friends and new
allies around the globe for the | 0:16:13 | 0:16:17 | |
first time in more than 40 years.
These will come into force when the | 0:16:17 | 0:16:24 | |
implementation period is over.
Providing new opportunities for | 0:16:24 | 0:16:28 | |
businesses across the UK and seizing
one of Brexit's greatest | 0:16:28 | 0:16:33 | |
opportunities. Your reaction to
that? I'm delighted. There is one | 0:16:33 | 0:16:39 | |
important caveat. We must be able to
conduct those negotiations in | 0:16:39 | 0:16:43 | |
private. We shouldn't be obliged to
have the EU sitting at the table. | 0:16:43 | 0:16:47 | |
They have said they would like to be
part of what's going on. We can't be | 0:16:47 | 0:16:53 | |
conducting negotiations with the EU
alongside every negotiation we are | 0:16:53 | 0:16:56 | |
conducting in the World Trade
Organisation. It is a diplomatic | 0:16:56 | 0:17:01 | |
triumph. A lot of people in Brussels
didn't want to agree that... But if | 0:17:01 | 0:17:06 | |
they are overseeing it then actually
we don't have our own control, we | 0:17:06 | 0:17:11 | |
haven't taken back control over this
important part of our foreign | 0:17:11 | 0:17:15 | |
policy. We have because we'll be
able to set our own trade deals. | 0:17:15 | 0:17:20 | |
That is something a lot of people in
Brussels didn't want to agree to and | 0:17:20 | 0:17:24 | |
now we've achieved it. That's a big
result. Thank you very much for | 0:17:24 | 0:17:29 | |
coming in. Gavin Reilly, I haven't
quite dispensed with you before | 0:17:29 | 0:17:36 | |
you're allowed to go. In terms of
the Irish government, is there now a | 0:17:36 | 0:17:41 | |
more positive outlook from the Irish
government in terms of engaging with | 0:17:41 | 0:17:48 | |
the UK over finding a solution that
could involve technology? There will | 0:17:48 | 0:17:53 | |
probably be a lot of good faith
about it. The fact they bid Davis | 0:17:53 | 0:17:58 | |
has been willing to stake his claim
and that the UK appears to be in | 0:17:58 | 0:18:03 | |
principle willing to implement the
backstop, that will help. There will | 0:18:03 | 0:18:08 | |
be some frustration on the Irish
side about how long that has taken. | 0:18:08 | 0:18:13 | |
What we got out of the UK last
December was an agreement that if no | 0:18:13 | 0:18:17 | |
other solution could be found then
Northern Ireland would enough | 0:18:17 | 0:18:21 | |
European rules in order to avoid a
border in the first place. It seems | 0:18:21 | 0:18:26 | |
after Theresa May seemed to
backtrack from that, that David | 0:18:26 | 0:18:29 | |
Davis has been prepared to commit to
bat again. All we've got is a | 0:18:29 | 0:18:33 | |
reassertion of a principle to which
the UK signed up three months ago | 0:18:33 | 0:18:37 | |
anyway. There probably be some
anxiety about how long it's taken | 0:18:37 | 0:18:44 | |
given that Brexit is now only a year
and a week away. There might be some | 0:18:44 | 0:18:47 | |
more earnest intention on the Irish
government's part to talk about | 0:18:47 | 0:18:51 | |
technological solutions, in part
because time is of the essence. If | 0:18:51 | 0:18:55 | |
we are going to have to start
looking at some kind of | 0:18:55 | 0:18:58 | |
infrastructure even if it is only
technological, surveillance and the | 0:18:58 | 0:19:02 | |
like, it is something Ireland will
no doubt be willing to pursue. It | 0:19:02 | 0:19:05 | |
was something that at the start of
the negotiations they had ruled out | 0:19:05 | 0:19:09 | |
in theory. Now it seems they are
open to it. The question is when the | 0:19:09 | 0:19:13 | |
UK will come up with the solutions.
The implementation period will end | 0:19:13 | 0:19:21 | |
in December 2020 which is what David
Davis had asked for. | 0:19:21 | 0:19:26 | |
And for more reporting
and analysis of Brexit, | 0:19:26 | 0:19:28 | |
check out the BBC News website: | 0:19:28 | 0:19:32 | |
Lynn Davidson is here and Sam Coates
for reaction. Something to cheer | 0:19:32 | 0:19:38 | |
about? I think it depends what side
you are on. If you're a Scottish | 0:19:38 | 0:19:44 | |
Conservative MP at the moment you
may not be necessarily very happy | 0:19:44 | 0:19:48 | |
with what's been said about fishing.
John Lambert said he would be | 0:19:48 | 0:19:53 | |
willing to break down a final Brexit
deal if there were not guarantees | 0:19:53 | 0:19:57 | |
over fishing quotas and vessels.
What we are not entirely clear about | 0:19:57 | 0:20:03 | |
is the timing on that. How much has
the government had to compromise on | 0:20:03 | 0:20:10 | |
getting this transition agreement
and this legal text of the | 0:20:10 | 0:20:13 | |
Withdrawal Agreement that was
broadly signed up to in December? | 0:20:13 | 0:20:18 | |
Quite a lot. You call it a
transition, Theresa May calls it an | 0:20:18 | 0:20:24 | |
implementation. Frankly it's a
standstill. Our relationship with | 0:20:24 | 0:20:27 | |
the EU will stay the same without us
having a seat in the decision-making | 0:20:27 | 0:20:32 | |
bodies. Just to get that 21 month
extension we've had to abandon plans | 0:20:32 | 0:20:44 | |
to stop EU citizens who come here
during the transition period from | 0:20:44 | 0:20:47 | |
staying, we've had to abandon the
desire to bring back control of | 0:20:47 | 0:20:51 | |
fishing, we even wanted the
transition to go on longer. Brussels | 0:20:51 | 0:20:54 | |
said no. On those things we've had
to eventually climbed down to insure | 0:20:54 | 0:21:01 | |
a relationship stays the same.
Briefly, how much trouble are the | 0:21:01 | 0:21:05 | |
likes of Bernard Jenkin saying he
wouldn't be happy to sign up to a | 0:21:05 | 0:21:10 | |
deal that gave exactly the same
rights to EU citizens who arrive | 0:21:10 | 0:21:14 | |
during that transition period and
colleagues like Jacob Rees-Mogg are | 0:21:14 | 0:21:17 | |
going to cause the Prime Minister? I
think they are deciding right now as | 0:21:17 | 0:21:25 | |
it's all rolling out. Someone might
Bernard Jenkin is being loyal to | 0:21:25 | 0:21:29 | |
Theresa May and has been quite
outspoken about backing her. This | 0:21:29 | 0:21:33 | |
puts them in an awkward position.
Quotas are being decided and we | 0:21:33 | 0:21:39 | |
aren't even in the rim. It will be
the vassal state Jacob Rees-Mogg | 0:21:39 | 0:21:42 | |
talked about. | 0:21:42 | 0:21:45 | |
Adam Fleming is there. We talked
about lots of colour coding going | 0:21:45 | 0:21:50 | |
on. There it is! If it has clear as
mud? It's quite difficult to read. | 0:21:50 | 0:21:58 | |
Try reading that with the green
highlighter on it. My first | 0:21:58 | 0:22:02 | |
impressions are both sides are
obviously over the moon because | 0:22:02 | 0:22:06 | |
they've been negotiating all through
the weekend and all through the | 0:22:06 | 0:22:08 | |
night to get as much of this
document as green as possible, which | 0:22:08 | 0:22:13 | |
is obviously a big achievement. Two
weeks ago this was the EU's text, | 0:22:13 | 0:22:19 | |
the UK hadn't really contributed or
given their say. Now they've managed | 0:22:19 | 0:22:22 | |
to wrap up lots of it in quite a
short period of time and they've | 0:22:22 | 0:22:28 | |
managed to close some key chapters.
Most of the citizens' rights stuff | 0:22:28 | 0:22:32 | |
is agreed, most of the financial
settlement staff is agreed, most of | 0:22:32 | 0:22:36 | |
the transition period is agreed.
They are pretty happy about that. | 0:22:36 | 0:22:41 | |
There's still some big caveats. It
looks like the 25% that hasn't been | 0:22:41 | 0:22:46 | |
agreed is governance. How do you
enforce disputes and make sure the | 0:22:46 | 0:22:50 | |
agreement is adhered to by both
sides after Brexit day and what does | 0:22:50 | 0:22:54 | |
the European Court of Justice have
to do with it? The other bit, | 0:22:54 | 0:23:02 | |
Northern Ireland and Ireland which
isn't agreed. Those two things are | 0:23:02 | 0:23:04 | |
quite big things to still agree.
They've been kicked down the road. | 0:23:04 | 0:23:06 | |
I'm surprised there's been no
decision about the European Court of | 0:23:06 | 0:23:10 | |
Justice and whether it would still
arbitrate over any disputes or new | 0:23:10 | 0:23:15 | |
laws that are brought in during that
two-year implementation period by | 0:23:15 | 0:23:18 | |
the EU. So, what they've done is
they've have agreed a governance | 0:23:18 | 0:23:24 | |
mechanism for the citizens' rights
part of this. That was agreed in | 0:23:24 | 0:23:28 | |
December, the whole thing of the UK
courts will make voluntary | 0:23:28 | 0:23:31 | |
references to the | 0:23:31 | 0:23:37 | |
references to the EC -- the ECJ. Now
the British idea of a joint | 0:23:37 | 0:23:42 | |
committee to handle disputes that
arise during the fermentation or | 0:23:42 | 0:23:46 | |
transition period has been agreed to
and we'll have to go through the | 0:23:46 | 0:23:50 | |
document and see the details. It's
what comes after that which is still | 0:23:50 | 0:23:54 | |
to be agreed and is there a role for
the European Court of Justice. That | 0:23:54 | 0:23:59 | |
seems like quite a big sticking
point, still. What about signing up | 0:23:59 | 0:24:02 | |
to free trade deals? David Davis
said the UK will be allowed to do | 0:24:02 | 0:24:07 | |
that but Bernard Jenkin said yes
that's great but not if we have two | 0:24:07 | 0:24:13 | |
deferred to the EU during that
two-year implementation period while | 0:24:13 | 0:24:18 | |
we are setting up these free trade
deals. Do you know what the decision | 0:24:18 | 0:24:21 | |
is there? I'm trying to find that in
the document... Hang on! Article | 0:24:21 | 0:24:30 | |
124, paragraph four... It still has
the language saying they've got to | 0:24:30 | 0:24:36 | |
be authorised by the European Union.
The UK will have the power to | 0:24:36 | 0:24:42 | |
negotiate and sign and ratify free
trade deals, but they cannot be | 0:24:42 | 0:24:46 | |
implemented unless they've got
permission from the EU. That has | 0:24:46 | 0:24:49 | |
pretty much stayed the same. It's
always been a bit bizarre because | 0:24:49 | 0:24:54 | |
all along Michel Barnier has said
it's OK for the UK to go out into | 0:24:54 | 0:24:57 | |
the world and talk to third
countries and talk about trade | 0:24:57 | 0:25:01 | |
deals, it's just getting it written
down that the Brits want it. When | 0:25:01 | 0:25:07 | |
the giddiness has died down in
Brussels, what happens next? Michel | 0:25:07 | 0:25:11 | |
Barnier is going to take this
document to the meeting of EU | 0:25:11 | 0:25:15 | |
affairs ministers for the 27 to get
it signed off by ministerial level | 0:25:15 | 0:25:19 | |
tomorrow. Then he'll go to the
Wednesday meeting of the European | 0:25:19 | 0:25:22 | |
Commission with Jean-Claude Juncker
whether commissioners will sign it | 0:25:22 | 0:25:27 | |
off. Then he'll take it to the
European Council, the meeting of | 0:25:27 | 0:25:30 | |
leaders on Friday where they will
sign it off and they will also sign | 0:25:30 | 0:25:35 | |
of their guidelines for phase two
which is the 6-page document setting | 0:25:35 | 0:25:38 | |
out their blueprint for how the
talks about the future relationship | 0:25:38 | 0:25:42 | |
are going to work. That will be
another symbolic moment. We know | 0:25:42 | 0:25:47 | |
roughly what they will say. Then it
will be a case of how quickly can | 0:25:47 | 0:25:51 | |
they get down to talking about that
future relationship. Will be | 0:25:51 | 0:25:55 | |
straight after the meeting of the
European Council and the meeting of | 0:25:55 | 0:25:58 | |
the leaders, or will there be
another bureaucratic process where | 0:25:58 | 0:26:02 | |
Michel Barnier takes those
guidelines awake and clarifies them | 0:26:02 | 0:26:05 | |
into an even detailed document? Or
can he get down to it straightaway? | 0:26:05 | 0:26:12 | |
Worth remembering what the EU says
is the best case scenario for the | 0:26:12 | 0:26:17 | |
outcome from those negotiations. It
is a political agreement about the | 0:26:17 | 0:26:21 | |
shape of the future relationship.
The EU saying it will not be the | 0:26:21 | 0:26:24 | |
fully fledged free trade deal that
the British government talks about, | 0:26:24 | 0:26:29 | |
so that's what the next few months
is going to be about, how detailed | 0:26:29 | 0:26:33 | |
is that political declaration and
how much does look like a free trade | 0:26:33 | 0:26:37 | |
agreement. Thank you, Adam. | 0:26:37 | 0:26:41 | |
Vladimir Putin has been elected
Russian President for another six | 0:26:41 | 0:26:43 | |
years in a victory that was assured
after the country's most popular | 0:26:43 | 0:26:46 | |
opposition politician
was excluded from standing. | 0:26:46 | 0:26:50 | |
There were reports of ballot
rigging, and turnout was up, | 0:26:50 | 0:26:52 | |
something Putin's campaign claimed
was due to the confrontation | 0:26:52 | 0:26:54 | |
with Britain over the poisoning
of Sergei Skripal. | 0:26:54 | 0:26:56 | |
International experts are arriving
in the UK today to assess the type | 0:26:56 | 0:26:59 | |
of nerve agent used to poison
the former double agent | 0:26:59 | 0:27:03 | |
and his daughter in Salisbury. | 0:27:03 | 0:27:04 | |
Tom Burridge is there. | 0:27:04 | 0:27:10 | |
Can you bring us up to speed with
what's going on in Salisbury? In | 0:27:10 | 0:27:16 | |
terms of police activity over the
weekend, a pretty minimal amount of | 0:27:16 | 0:27:22 | |
visible activity. One focus of the
investigation is Sergei Skripal's | 0:27:22 | 0:27:26 | |
car. Parked in the city centre of
the afternoon that they fell | 0:27:26 | 0:27:32 | |
critically ill. The police want to
hear from anyone in Salisbury on | 0:27:32 | 0:27:37 | |
Sunday the 4th of March who might
have seen the car earlier in the | 0:27:37 | 0:27:40 | |
morning. The other main development
is officials from the Organisation | 0:27:40 | 0:27:45 | |
for the Prohibition of Chemical
Weapons, a delegation of ten | 0:27:45 | 0:27:48 | |
individuals are in Wiltshire now.
They'll be here for a week or so is | 0:27:48 | 0:27:52 | |
spending most of their time at the
MoD's scientific research facility. | 0:27:52 | 0:27:57 | |
The idea is that samples of the
nerve agent used to attack so Gail | 0:27:57 | 0:28:06 | |
and Yulia Skripal will be sent to as
many as 20 laboratories and 16 | 0:28:06 | 0:28:11 | |
countries. These are independent
laboratories signed off by the OPCW | 0:28:11 | 0:28:16 | |
for testing. The idea is in about
three weeks' time at least the OPCW | 0:28:16 | 0:28:23 | |
will make its own conclusions about
the nerve agent used in the attack. | 0:28:23 | 0:28:26 | |
Thank you. | 0:28:26 | 0:28:32 | |
Helen Goodman, what is Labour's line
in terms of its confrontation with | 0:28:33 | 0:28:37 | |
the government over this issue? We
supported everything that the | 0:28:37 | 0:28:42 | |
government has done in the wake of
Salisbury and we agree with the | 0:28:42 | 0:28:46 | |
Prime Minister's assessment that the
overwhelming probability is that | 0:28:46 | 0:28:49 | |
it's either deliberate on the part
of the Russians or they lost | 0:28:49 | 0:28:53 | |
control. On either bases they are
wholly culpable. What the Leader of | 0:28:53 | 0:28:58 | |
the Opposition was asking was for
the involvement of the Organisation | 0:28:58 | 0:29:03 | |
for the Prohibition of Chemical
Weapons. We've got that now and it's | 0:29:03 | 0:29:05 | |
extremely helpful. We also pressed
the | 0:29:05 | 0:29:13 | |
the government on Magnitsky and
they've done a U-turn as well. On | 0:29:13 | 0:29:16 | |
Magnitsky, what do you say about the
governments and the party 's | 0:29:16 | 0:29:21 | |
opposition to something that would
strengthen what the row could be | 0:29:21 | 0:29:23 | |
used against Russian oligarchs or
money laundering in Britain? It's | 0:29:23 | 0:29:29 | |
not a U-turn. We are in favour of a
Magnitsky style act... It is a | 0:29:29 | 0:29:36 | |
U-turn, you voted against it a
fortnight ago stopped with that was | 0:29:36 | 0:29:39 | |
because of technical problems. This
is too important to play party | 0:29:39 | 0:29:44 | |
politics. We all agree on a
Magnitsky act. We all agree on | 0:29:44 | 0:29:49 | |
people who have been involved in
corruption in Russia. We cannot let | 0:29:49 | 0:29:53 | |
the people who run Russia try and
divide us and make us play party | 0:29:53 | 0:29:58 | |
politics against each other. One of
the things I've been most disgusted | 0:29:58 | 0:30:03 | |
by is the way the Russians have
mocked us over this issue. | 0:30:03 | 0:30:10 | |
This is a situation where a brave
police officer and a man are nearly | 0:30:10 | 0:30:16 | |
dead because of a brush and
state-sponsored assassination | 0:30:16 | 0:30:19 | |
attempt on our streets and we must
not let them do what they always do, | 0:30:19 | 0:30:23 | |
when they shot down the passenger
jet over Ukraine, they blamed | 0:30:23 | 0:30:28 | |
Ukraine and they said the dues to
did. We've got to be canny about it | 0:30:28 | 0:30:33 | |
and not let the Kremlin divide us.
Do you think you've had support from | 0:30:33 | 0:30:37 | |
the Labour Party cuisine and I was
initially disappointed by Jeremy | 0:30:37 | 0:30:42 | |
Corbyn's responds. It was a lot of
backbenchers who are disappointed in | 0:30:42 | 0:30:48 | |
his response but let's move on from
that now. We are getting together a | 0:30:48 | 0:30:53 | |
strong coalition about partners. The
Prime Minister is leading the | 0:30:53 | 0:30:57 | |
country strongly on this. We've got
people in from the Organisation for | 0:30:57 | 0:31:03 | |
the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons
and the live the Russians are trying | 0:31:03 | 0:31:06 | |
to tell, firstly they are saying
they didn't make it at all, then | 0:31:06 | 0:31:09 | |
they are saying we made it but we
got rid of it. Then they are saying | 0:31:09 | 0:31:13 | |
maybe some got out of the country.
They are always using their | 0:31:13 | 0:31:19 | |
propaganda television stations to
muddy the water, to wrap you up in | 0:31:19 | 0:31:23 | |
process. Do you think it should be
stopped in this country? I don't | 0:31:23 | 0:31:27 | |
think any serious MP should be going
on it. Alex Salmond shouldn't be | 0:31:27 | 0:31:32 | |
going on it. Should Ofcom stop
broadcasting it? We have the rule of | 0:31:32 | 0:31:39 | |
law here and Ofcom will make a
decision on the basis of the fact. I | 0:31:39 | 0:31:45 | |
don't think it was right for Jeremy
Corbyn to go on that or to promote | 0:31:45 | 0:31:49 | |
it as a serious news outlet and I
hope the Labour MPs will not go on | 0:31:49 | 0:31:53 | |
there anymore. Let's hear what the
shadow chancellor did say in terms | 0:31:53 | 0:31:57 | |
of Labour's response to what the
government had proposed in Theresa | 0:31:57 | 0:32:03 | |
May's Commons statement. I agree
with the Prime Minister completely. | 0:32:03 | 0:32:06 | |
What she said is that Russia is
culpable either by direct | 0:32:06 | 0:32:10 | |
commission, Putin has ordered this,
or they've lost control of their | 0:32:10 | 0:32:15 | |
supply. To be clear, she has backed
away from the pieces they've lost | 0:32:15 | 0:32:20 | |
control. She is holding him
personally responsible. You not | 0:32:20 | 0:32:26 | |
agreeing with that? I do agree with
that. She has repeated that | 0:32:26 | 0:32:30 | |
statement three times. He is
responsible whichever way you look | 0:32:30 | 0:32:33 | |
at it. All the evidence points to
him. John McDonnell was very clear | 0:32:33 | 0:32:39 | |
is today, Helen Goodman but Jeremy
Corbyn said that he still believes | 0:32:39 | 0:32:42 | |
the Prime Minister's initial line
there are two civilities for who | 0:32:42 | 0:32:45 | |
carried out the attack, so which one
is the official line? Did Putin do | 0:32:45 | 0:32:51 | |
it or do we need to pursue both
lines of inquiry that it could have | 0:32:51 | 0:32:55 | |
been someone else? Vladimir Putin is
responsible because the nerve agent | 0:32:55 | 0:33:01 | |
was made in Russia. And, therefore,
whatever the root, Vladimir Putin | 0:33:01 | 0:33:10 | |
must be the person held responsible.
I think it is more important we now | 0:33:10 | 0:33:13 | |
think about what we need to do, and
I think the government is very weak | 0:33:13 | 0:33:20 | |
on the money-laundering because
we've got billions coming into | 0:33:20 | 0:33:24 | |
London. The National Crime Agency
estimates £90 billion of money is | 0:33:24 | 0:33:29 | |
laundered through London every year.
We have been putting down amendments | 0:33:29 | 0:33:33 | |
to this bill. And we've talked about
the Magnitsky. We will come onto the | 0:33:33 | 0:33:39 | |
money-laundering in a moment. Let's
talk about Jeremy Corbyn and John | 0:33:39 | 0:33:41 | |
McDonnell. Where does the party
stand? The Labour Party... It is an | 0:33:41 | 0:33:49 | |
uneasy compromise. John McDonnell
said yesterday the phrase the Prime | 0:33:49 | 0:33:53 | |
Minister is right to blame Russia.
That is quite uncomfortable when set | 0:33:53 | 0:33:58 | |
against what Jeremy Corbyn did last
week. I think John McDonnell has his | 0:33:58 | 0:34:03 | |
eye on the internal Labour politics
which have been very messy. I think | 0:34:03 | 0:34:07 | |
he is trying to put behind the row
brewing at the back end of last week | 0:34:07 | 0:34:13 | |
and smooth over some of the
difficulties. Whilst they are not | 0:34:13 | 0:34:18 | |
saying President Putin was
responsible, they are saying he is | 0:34:18 | 0:34:21 | |
to blame, which seems to be a line
Labour can more or less unite | 0:34:21 | 0:34:25 | |
around. Except there has been a
divide. Last week there were a | 0:34:25 | 0:34:29 | |
number of Labour MPs that felt
Jeremy Corbyn was equivocating. In | 0:34:29 | 0:34:33 | |
his article, he said we shouldn't
resign ourselves to McCarthy like | 0:34:33 | 0:34:37 | |
intolerance of dissent. What did
that mean to you? I was as | 0:34:37 | 0:34:42 | |
flabbergasted at as many Labour
backbenchers. You only had to see | 0:34:42 | 0:34:47 | |
Yvette Cooper's reaction when she
shot up immediately after Jeremy | 0:34:47 | 0:34:52 | |
Corbyn to make her position clear
and later John Woodcock's early day | 0:34:52 | 0:34:57 | |
motion. Some might say that John
McDonnell now is almost isolated | 0:34:57 | 0:35:03 | |
Jeremy Corbyn in his position but
any journalist who stood in the | 0:35:03 | 0:35:07 | |
huddle last Wednesday after PMQs
when Jeremy Corbyn spokesman's | 0:35:07 | 0:35:11 | |
brought up the weapons of mass
destruction dossier would be no | 0:35:11 | 0:35:17 | |
doubt. Was that irresponsible of the
director of communication to set had | 0:35:17 | 0:35:23 | |
been failures in intelligence in the
past and we should be cautious over | 0:35:23 | 0:35:26 | |
this? Mary Griffiths pointed out to
the BBC, the shadow defence | 0:35:26 | 0:35:33 | |
spokesman, that these situations are
rather different, and I think she's | 0:35:33 | 0:35:37 | |
right, they are. So the spokesman
should have spoken out of turn? He | 0:35:37 | 0:35:41 | |
has to say what he thinks is best in
the moment when he says it but I | 0:35:41 | 0:35:46 | |
think once we have reflected, it is
clear this is quite different from | 0:35:46 | 0:35:51 | |
the Iraq situation. Do you think we
have to hear the Labour leader say | 0:35:51 | 0:35:55 | |
that in the same way we've heard
John McDonnell, who is very clear | 0:35:55 | 0:35:59 | |
that Putin is responsible whichever
way you look at it, and all the | 0:35:59 | 0:36:02 | |
evidence points to him? I think that
it is really important that we all | 0:36:02 | 0:36:08 | |
support the action the government
has taken which Jeremy has done, | 0:36:08 | 0:36:12 | |
that we condemn the attack which
Jeremy has done... He said this | 0:36:12 | 0:36:20 | |
serves neither justice nor our
national security. Is he right? The | 0:36:20 | 0:36:25 | |
role of the oppositionist was
questions and he asks questions. He | 0:36:25 | 0:36:29 | |
is not denying the Russians are
responsible. He is saying the | 0:36:29 | 0:36:33 | |
Russians are responsible. He hasn't
said Putin is responsible. Should he | 0:36:33 | 0:36:38 | |
quiz low I haven't got the text in
front of me and you have but what he | 0:36:38 | 0:36:42 | |
has said is we have two
possibilities. Either they did it | 0:36:42 | 0:36:48 | |
pop deliberately or they've lost
control and on either bases the | 0:36:48 | 0:36:52 | |
Russians are responsible. But
actually it is clear in terms of | 0:36:52 | 0:36:55 | |
what John McDonald is saying, that
Putin did it. I mean, there are no | 0:36:55 | 0:37:00 | |
two ways, he is saying. He isn't
saying let's have a look at the | 0:37:00 | 0:37:04 | |
evidence. Who is right? The Labour
leader or shadow chancellor? We are | 0:37:04 | 0:37:10 | |
having a look at the evidence now
and your correspondent has pointed | 0:37:10 | 0:37:14 | |
out that it is being sent round to
20 different laboratories around the | 0:37:14 | 0:37:18 | |
world. Should we wait for that
evidence? I think it would be | 0:37:18 | 0:37:22 | |
helpful to wait for what comes out
of that evidence. My own view is | 0:37:22 | 0:37:27 | |
that Putin is responsible and I've
made that clear. Should we be | 0:37:27 | 0:37:31 | |
waiting? Did Theresa May rush to
judgment? If we have people going in | 0:37:31 | 0:37:35 | |
to decide exactly what the nerve
agent was and how it was used, | 0:37:35 | 0:37:41 | |
should we have waited before
pointing the finger of blame firmly | 0:37:41 | 0:37:44 | |
at Putin? I agree with Helen. The
Prime Minister was right to give the | 0:37:44 | 0:37:50 | |
Russians one last opportunity to
explain how this nerve agent which | 0:37:50 | 0:37:53 | |
only they make had come to be on the
streets of Wiltshire. They haven't | 0:37:53 | 0:37:57 | |
been able to do that. They've mocked
us. Putin in a triumphalist way has | 0:37:57 | 0:38:02 | |
gloated about this. And it is
absolutely clear he did this. From | 0:38:02 | 0:38:06 | |
the conversation, the winner of this
discussion is that a mere Putin | 0:38:06 | 0:38:11 | |
because we've spent a long time
talking about party politics. Our | 0:38:11 | 0:38:16 | |
party politics not important? Not
enough time thinking about what we | 0:38:16 | 0:38:20 | |
will to about the problem. This is a
Richey MEDLINE, hacking into the | 0:38:20 | 0:38:26 | |
defence Defence Ministry, they've
attacked the Bundestag in Germany, | 0:38:26 | 0:38:30 | |
they've destabilise the Baltics and
now we must come together and take | 0:38:30 | 0:38:35 | |
firm action to stop this
state-sponsored murder on our | 0:38:35 | 0:38:37 | |
streets. Thank you both for coming
in. | 0:38:37 | 0:38:39 | |
If you live in England you can
still, at the moment, | 0:38:39 | 0:38:42 | |
use a shock collar to train your dog
or your cat. | 0:38:42 | 0:38:44 | |
But not for much longer, it seems,
after Environment Secretary Michael | 0:38:44 | 0:38:47 | |
Gove launched a consultation
with a view to banning | 0:38:47 | 0:38:49 | |
what he called "punitive devices." | 0:38:49 | 0:38:53 | |
Well, they're due to be banned
in Scotland and were | 0:38:53 | 0:38:56 | |
banned in Wales in 2010. | 0:38:56 | 0:38:58 | |
Here's how the BBC
covered it at the time. | 0:38:58 | 0:39:04 | |
This is Lady. | 0:39:04 | 0:39:05 | |
She's being trained as a guard dog,
but there's a problem - | 0:39:05 | 0:39:08 | |
she likes chasing sheep. | 0:39:08 | 0:39:11 | |
She's been fitted with
a so-called "shock collar". | 0:39:11 | 0:39:15 | |
When her trainer presses a button
on a remotely-controlled handset, | 0:39:15 | 0:39:18 | |
it emits a pulse of electricity... | 0:39:18 | 0:39:23 | |
LADY BARKS. | 0:39:23 | 0:39:25 | |
..And Lady leaves the sheep alone. | 0:39:25 | 0:39:30 | |
We're joined now by Nathalie Ingham
a canine behaviourist | 0:39:30 | 0:39:32 | |
from Battersea Dogs and Cats Home. | 0:39:32 | 0:39:33 | |
She's brought along Bella
a staffordshire terrier | 0:39:33 | 0:39:35 | |
and Abbie a chihuahua. | 0:39:35 | 0:39:41 | |
Journalist Quentin Letts also joins
me in the studio and Deidre Brock | 0:39:41 | 0:39:43 | |
from the Scottish National Party
is in Edinburgh. | 0:39:43 | 0:39:49 | |
First of all tell us what these
shock collars two. Shock collars | 0:39:49 | 0:39:54 | |
administer an electric shock to the
animals so normally they are worn | 0:39:54 | 0:39:59 | |
around the collar. They should in
theory give off a sound to | 0:39:59 | 0:40:04 | |
pre-warned the animal that a shocker
is coming but not all of them do. | 0:40:04 | 0:40:07 | |
And the idea is that people utilise
them in thinking they are going to | 0:40:07 | 0:40:13 | |
stop an unwanted behaviour but the
realities are very different. What | 0:40:13 | 0:40:17 | |
methods do you recommend the
training? We recommend people use | 0:40:17 | 0:40:20 | |
positive reward -based method so it
is important owners of dogs create a | 0:40:20 | 0:40:26 | |
solid bond with their dogs so learn
how to play with their dogs, so they | 0:40:26 | 0:40:31 | |
have a connection with the animals.
By doing that, animals will want to | 0:40:31 | 0:40:36 | |
seek that attention from the owner
and will be able to respond them | 0:40:36 | 0:40:39 | |
more. So they'd look to the owner in
a situation rather than making their | 0:40:39 | 0:40:43 | |
own choices all the time. So
definitely using play, food as | 0:40:43 | 0:40:49 | |
rewards, anything that will
strengthen the bond and reward good | 0:40:49 | 0:40:53 | |
behaviour is. While they're sitting
quietly and not disturbed by you, | 0:40:53 | 0:40:57 | |
are you a fan of them? I'm not a fan
of those ones you press the button | 0:40:57 | 0:41:02 | |
and the dog gets shocked. We have
badly behaved terriers. Is that a | 0:41:02 | 0:41:07 | |
failure of the owners training? I'm
not sure it is because one of them | 0:41:07 | 0:41:11 | |
as a rescue dog and it goes around
the perimeter of our garden, and it | 0:41:11 | 0:41:16 | |
means when the dog goes near the
wire, it gets a sound and if it goes | 0:41:16 | 0:41:21 | |
a bit further, it doesn't get a
shock but a vibrating. And these | 0:41:21 | 0:41:24 | |
devices which are terrific, and are
very good for animal welfare... So | 0:41:24 | 0:41:29 | |
you wouldn't want to see them
banned? Michael Gove wants to put | 0:41:29 | 0:41:34 | |
these out of business because he is
a politician, he's playing games, | 0:41:34 | 0:41:40 | |
triangulating or whatever these
ghastly politicians do, trying to | 0:41:40 | 0:41:42 | |
show the Tories are very good on
animal welfare. I'm not going to | 0:41:42 | 0:41:47 | |
cost judgment on that but what is
going to do is make life worse for | 0:41:47 | 0:41:52 | |
cats and dogs that use these
containment devices which stops them | 0:41:52 | 0:41:56 | |
going out on roads and getting run
over. So, it'll make it worse for | 0:41:56 | 0:42:00 | |
dogs and cats. I'd have to disagree
with that. In fact the vibrating | 0:42:00 | 0:42:05 | |
collars are still permissible in
Scotland but I'm proud of the fact | 0:42:05 | 0:42:08 | |
the Scottish government have banned
these collars. What we'd like to see | 0:42:08 | 0:42:13 | |
is this go further and the actual
sale is banned throughout the UK, | 0:42:13 | 0:42:18 | |
that is something under the quirks
of the devolution settlement that | 0:42:18 | 0:42:22 | |
the UK government has the power to
do at the moment so we are calling | 0:42:22 | 0:42:26 | |
on the UK government, and not us
alone. This is a cross-party | 0:42:26 | 0:42:31 | |
situation. The ban of these collars
is cross-party and we've done a lot | 0:42:31 | 0:42:35 | |
of work with colleagues in different
parties on this issue. Do you think | 0:42:35 | 0:42:39 | |
they are cruel? I had a Brave
colleague who volunteered to be | 0:42:39 | 0:42:44 | |
zapped by one of these collars on
his hand and it was only at 30% of | 0:42:44 | 0:42:49 | |
its strength but he was shocked at
how painful it was, and this was | 0:42:49 | 0:42:55 | |
very recently at an event I hosted
with other MPs and the parliament | 0:42:55 | 0:42:59 | |
which featured dogs trust UK, kennel
club and others, raising the profile | 0:42:59 | 0:43:07 | |
of this particular issue, and he was
accusingly later telling me that | 0:43:07 | 0:43:11 | |
some half an hour later his hand was
still numb afterwards. That's cruel, | 0:43:11 | 0:43:17 | |
isn't it? We've tried these things
to. You know those things you get | 0:43:17 | 0:43:23 | |
that joke shops when you shake
someone's hand and they put a | 0:43:23 | 0:43:27 | |
vibrating thing on? That is what it
feels like. The dog gets it once or | 0:43:27 | 0:43:32 | |
twice in its life and it learns.
Once or twice in their life they | 0:43:32 | 0:43:41 | |
might get a vibration, then that
means they can roam free, have a | 0:43:41 | 0:43:45 | |
terrific life and not get run over
and not chase horses all walkers. Is | 0:43:45 | 0:43:50 | |
it better than King run over? My
concern is there doesn't seem to be | 0:43:50 | 0:43:56 | |
any upper limit on the voltage of
electric shock collars. Most many | 0:43:56 | 0:44:01 | |
factors are a member of an
association which means their | 0:44:01 | 0:44:05 | |
products meet latest technical
requirements but some of these | 0:44:05 | 0:44:08 | |
collars can shock up to 6,000 volts.
They are painful. Just suggesting | 0:44:08 | 0:44:14 | |
they might only be used once or
twice and that will solve the issue | 0:44:14 | 0:44:17 | |
is I think... I am glad his dogs are
so well-behaved... No, they're not, | 0:44:17 | 0:44:23 | |
that's the thing! People say why
don't you put a fence up? Peep | 0:44:23 | 0:44:33 | |
don't you put a fence up? Peep --
they'd dig under these fences. | 0:44:34 | 0:44:36 | |
Michael Gove of all people who
believes in small government, why do | 0:44:36 | 0:44:40 | |
they want to wreck life for dogs and
cats? They will make life so much | 0:44:40 | 0:44:44 | |
worse for them and ruined the
freedom these animals have. I find | 0:44:44 | 0:44:47 | |
it baffling. I can't understand why
anyone would want to cause an animal | 0:44:47 | 0:44:54 | |
pain or distress, particularly in
the UK a group of nations renowned | 0:44:54 | 0:44:56 | |
the world over for its love of
animals. To still be containing... | 0:44:56 | 0:45:03 | |
Our last dog did not have one of
these and she was run over and spent | 0:45:03 | 0:45:07 | |
two years... She was in such pain we
had to put her down. That is what I | 0:45:07 | 0:45:12 | |
am trying to stop. And I get so
furious about this. It is a classic | 0:45:12 | 0:45:18 | |
example of politicians making life
worse for people. Maybe Michael Gove | 0:45:18 | 0:45:22 | |
doesn't think he is going to make
life worse for people. What will you | 0:45:22 | 0:45:27 | |
do if you ban is it? We will have to
obey the law but I'd trip to think | 0:45:27 | 0:45:32 | |
what will happen to our dogs. Will
we give them away or risk them | 0:45:32 | 0:45:37 | |
getting run over. I will put one of
their dead bodies on his desk. Most | 0:45:37 | 0:45:46 | |
organisations think positive
reinforcement training is far more | 0:45:46 | 0:45:49 | |
effective than the collars. Doesn't
seem to be any particular | 0:45:49 | 0:45:55 | |
restriction on the of these items.
Anyone who wishes to, you can go | 0:45:55 | 0:46:01 | |
online and see a huge range of these
collars on offer, you can purchase | 0:46:01 | 0:46:05 | |
them online or you can purchase them
from countries that haven't banned | 0:46:05 | 0:46:10 | |
their sale or use. I don't think
you're talking about containment | 0:46:10 | 0:46:15 | |
fences. These are the things that
will be caught by this rotten and | 0:46:15 | 0:46:20 | |
life ruining and life... Law. I
would argue animal welfare policies | 0:46:20 | 0:46:28 | |
have come on so much, why would you
want to endorse any sort of... We | 0:46:28 | 0:46:34 | |
will have to leave it there. | 0:46:34 | 0:46:40 | |
Ultimately I think there are better
ways of training dogs and cats. When | 0:46:40 | 0:46:44 | |
you look at the behaviour, you need
to look at motivation behind those. | 0:46:44 | 0:46:50 | |
Shock collars can be sold to
anybody. Anybody could put one on | 0:46:50 | 0:46:53 | |
tiny little bell here. Research
shows the shocks administered were | 0:46:53 | 0:47:00 | |
inconsistent with the manufacturing
guidelines, so it can cause a lot of | 0:47:00 | 0:47:04 | |
distress. We have | 0:47:04 | 0:47:12 | |
distress. We have noted the
difference between shock collars and | 0:47:12 | 0:47:15 | |
containment fences. We're going to
say goodbye now. Thank you. | 0:47:15 | 0:47:23 | |
This afternoon, MPs will debate
a petition calling for people | 0:47:23 | 0:47:26 | |
with cystic fibrosis to be given
a life-changing, but | 0:47:26 | 0:47:28 | |
very expensive, drug. | 0:47:28 | 0:47:29 | |
Elizabeth Glinka has been to meet
a young woman who's had access | 0:47:29 | 0:47:32 | |
to the treatment as part
of a medical trial and believes | 0:47:32 | 0:47:34 | |
strongly it should be
available on the NHS. | 0:47:34 | 0:47:36 | |
Cystic fibrosis is an inherited
genetic disorder, which you get | 0:47:36 | 0:47:39 | |
from your mum and your dad
being carriers, and then | 0:47:39 | 0:47:43 | |
you have a one in four chance
of getting cystic fibrosis. | 0:47:43 | 0:47:48 | |
Two years ago, 21-year-old
Chantelle Millward was | 0:47:48 | 0:47:50 | |
running out of options. | 0:47:50 | 0:47:52 | |
Her condition, which affects
breathing and digestion, | 0:47:52 | 0:47:54 | |
had become so severe a lung
transplant was the only treatment. | 0:47:54 | 0:47:59 | |
I didn't really have a life. | 0:47:59 | 0:48:01 | |
I was in and out of
hospital every 4-6 weeks. | 0:48:01 | 0:48:06 | |
When you get referred
for a lung transplant, | 0:48:06 | 0:48:08 | |
your life expectancy is two
years or less. | 0:48:08 | 0:48:14 | |
So, that's literally
the last option. | 0:48:14 | 0:48:15 | |
So, it's either a lung
transplant or die. | 0:48:15 | 0:48:17 | |
But it was then Chantelle
was offered a place | 0:48:17 | 0:48:19 | |
on the Orkambi drugs trial. | 0:48:19 | 0:48:25 | |
It's a treatment which slows
the decline of lung function | 0:48:25 | 0:48:27 | |
in around a third of patients. | 0:48:27 | 0:48:28 | |
But at £100,000 a year,
in 2016 the drugs advisory body Nice | 0:48:28 | 0:48:31 | |
concluded it wasn't cost effective
for the NHS. | 0:48:31 | 0:48:33 | |
Since then, patients
and their families have | 0:48:33 | 0:48:35 | |
been campaigning for
a change in guidelines. | 0:48:35 | 0:48:39 | |
So, what difference has
Orkambi made to your life? | 0:48:39 | 0:48:41 | |
I feel like I can plan
for my future, whereas two years ago | 0:48:41 | 0:48:44 | |
I couldn't even plan the day let
alone my future. | 0:48:44 | 0:48:49 | |
Chantelle's daily routine
involves taking more than 50 | 0:48:49 | 0:48:51 | |
drugs and supplements,
but that's actually better | 0:48:51 | 0:48:52 | |
than it used to be. | 0:48:52 | 0:48:56 | |
So, where's the drug that's made
such a difference, then? | 0:48:56 | 0:49:02 | |
I keep this one in the box,
because it's the treasured one. | 0:49:02 | 0:49:04 | |
So, I have a morning
and evening dose... | 0:49:04 | 0:49:06 | |
But while Chantelle's quality
of life has improved on Orkambi, | 0:49:06 | 0:49:09 | |
she's acutely aware that's not
the case for everyone. | 0:49:09 | 0:49:13 | |
The past two years, I've lost four
very, very close friends. | 0:49:13 | 0:49:17 | |
I've lost a lot over
the years, but these four | 0:49:17 | 0:49:19 | |
were very, very close. | 0:49:19 | 0:49:20 | |
We speak every day. | 0:49:20 | 0:49:23 | |
One I recently lost
just before Christmas, | 0:49:23 | 0:49:26 | |
on the same ward, and, yeah... | 0:49:26 | 0:49:30 | |
It's very, very hard. | 0:49:30 | 0:49:32 | |
How old was your friend who died? | 0:49:32 | 0:49:34 | |
She was 20. | 0:49:34 | 0:49:35 | |
Didn't even reach her 21st birthday. | 0:49:35 | 0:49:40 | |
Vertex, the drugs company,
can withdraw it at any point, | 0:49:40 | 0:49:42 | |
and that's the bit that worries me
the most, because if that happened | 0:49:42 | 0:49:47 | |
and that drug gets taken from me,
I'm going to be back in the same | 0:49:47 | 0:49:50 | |
position as I was two years ago,
which I really don't want to be in. | 0:49:50 | 0:49:54 | |
And so if people were to say
to you this drug is too expensive, | 0:49:54 | 0:49:57 | |
we can't afford it,
what would you say? | 0:49:57 | 0:49:59 | |
Over a year, in the long
run it would actually | 0:49:59 | 0:50:03 | |
save them a lot of money,
because I already know it's reduced | 0:50:03 | 0:50:06 | |
my admissions, which obviously
is reducing the costs. | 0:50:06 | 0:50:10 | |
Three antibiotics have stopped
because I don't need them anymore, | 0:50:10 | 0:50:12 | |
and with my IV, antibiotics
and things, I don't have to go | 0:50:12 | 0:50:15 | |
in as often as I did. | 0:50:15 | 0:50:19 | |
And you're at work, as well. | 0:50:19 | 0:50:20 | |
Exactly! | 0:50:20 | 0:50:21 | |
It's brought me
together as a person. | 0:50:21 | 0:50:29 | |
It's built me up, and I just think
if I didn't have this drug two years | 0:50:30 | 0:50:34 | |
ago I would not be in this place
right now, so... | 0:50:34 | 0:50:37 | |
You can't put a price on it. | 0:50:37 | 0:50:39 | |
The life expectancy for people
with cystic fibrosis has increased | 0:50:39 | 0:50:41 | |
to 47 in recent decades,
but the condition is still | 0:50:41 | 0:50:44 | |
life-threatening, even in the young. | 0:50:44 | 0:50:46 | |
For sufferers, the price of a drug
like Orkambi is one worth paying. | 0:50:46 | 0:50:54 | |
So, as I said, this is being debated
at Westminster later today, | 0:50:54 | 0:50:57 | |
the drug Orkambi hasn't been
approved for routine use in the UK. | 0:50:57 | 0:51:02 | |
The National Institute for Health
and Care Excellence, known as NICE, | 0:51:02 | 0:51:04 | |
which advises the NHS in England
and Wales on which drugs to buy | 0:51:04 | 0:51:08 | |
and use, said NICE issued guidance
in July 2016 which did not recommend | 0:51:08 | 0:51:11 | |
Orkambi to treat cystic fibrosis. | 0:51:11 | 0:51:18 | |
We were talking about the deal on
the Brexit transition that's been | 0:51:32 | 0:51:35 | |
reached between the EU and Britain.
Let's have a listen to David Davis | 0:51:35 | 0:51:41 | |
speaking at that press Conference. | 0:51:41 | 0:51:45 | |
In Munich and at Mansion House, the
Prime Minister set out a powerful | 0:51:45 | 0:51:50 | |
deal, one which will ensure with
economic and security cooperation | 0:51:50 | 0:51:54 | |
reflects our unique starting point
and shared history. My job and that | 0:51:54 | 0:51:59 | |
of my team is to deliver on that
vision, and in doing so we must | 0:51:59 | 0:52:05 | |
seize the moment and carry forward
the moment of the past few weeks. | 0:52:05 | 0:52:10 | |
The deal was struck today on top of
that agreed in December which should | 0:52:10 | 0:52:14 | |
give us confidence that a good deal
for the UK and EU is closer than | 0:52:14 | 0:52:20 | |
ever before. Do you agree with that
analysis, that a good deal for | 0:52:20 | 0:52:24 | |
Britain is closer than ever before?
I don't know about that. I'm a bit | 0:52:24 | 0:52:29 | |
sceptical about these new trade
deals he's parading, because what I | 0:52:29 | 0:52:33 | |
hear from the other side of the
fence from the other countries is | 0:52:33 | 0:52:37 | |
that the British government just
wants to roll over the existing EU | 0:52:37 | 0:52:40 | |
trade deals because it takes so long
to negotiate any improvement. If you | 0:52:40 | 0:52:45 | |
look at China, for example, the
Germans are selling twice as much, | 0:52:45 | 0:52:51 | |
no, five times as much to China as
we are and they are still in the | 0:52:51 | 0:52:56 | |
customs union and single market.
Obviously David Davis is relieved | 0:52:56 | 0:53:01 | |
that this stage is over but I'm not
convinced it's that great. What | 0:53:01 | 0:53:05 | |
evidence is there that the free
trade deals that can be done with | 0:53:05 | 0:53:09 | |
third countries by Britain will
compensate for any loss of trade | 0:53:09 | 0:53:11 | |
done with the EU? You're assuming
there will be a loss of trade with | 0:53:11 | 0:53:17 | |
the EU... You don't think there will
be any? I think the purpose of what | 0:53:17 | 0:53:21 | |
the government is trying to do is to
minimise friction... Theresa May | 0:53:21 | 0:53:25 | |
said in her most recent speech that
there would be some loss, we won't | 0:53:25 | 0:53:30 | |
get the same benefits. Let's take
her word... We've made another major | 0:53:30 | 0:53:36 | |
step towards delivering Brexit which
means we'll get out of the situation | 0:53:36 | 0:53:40 | |
we are in now where we are paying
£16 billion a year into the EU, | 0:53:40 | 0:53:44 | |
where we are not able to control the
free movement of people between the | 0:53:44 | 0:53:48 | |
EU and the UK and we are not in
control of our own laws. These three | 0:53:48 | 0:53:54 | |
match the profound changes in this
country that Brexit will deliver, | 0:53:54 | 0:53:56 | |
this is another step towards
delivering that. We will also be | 0:53:56 | 0:54:01 | |
able to do our trade deals with
third countries and that is another | 0:54:01 | 0:54:04 | |
benefit. People always want to pick
at every micro-detail but... Someone | 0:54:04 | 0:54:10 | |
might debate about whether it is
micro-detail... Towards getting a | 0:54:10 | 0:54:15 | |
better situation for this country. | 0:54:15 | 0:54:20 | |
If you follow politics on social
media, you might be confused | 0:54:20 | 0:54:22 | |
about what is happening
with free school meals. | 0:54:22 | 0:54:24 | |
Have a look at this. | 0:54:24 | 0:54:25 | |
PIANO MUSIC THROUGHOUT. | 0:54:25 | 0:54:28 | |
James Cleverly for the Conservative
Party disputing claims made by the | 0:55:12 | 0:55:16 | |
opposition. | 0:55:16 | 0:55:19 | |
Yes, the Labour Party seems certain
that the Conservatives are pressing | 0:55:19 | 0:55:21 | |
ahead with a plan that could stop
more than a million children | 0:55:21 | 0:55:24 | |
receiving a free school meal. | 0:55:24 | 0:55:25 | |
The Conservatives say that's
"scaremongering and misinformation", | 0:55:25 | 0:55:27 | |
and actually the reverse is true -
an extra 50,000 | 0:55:27 | 0:55:29 | |
children could benefit. | 0:55:29 | 0:55:31 | |
Well, to hopefully shed a bit
of light on what's happening | 0:55:31 | 0:55:33 | |
here I'm joined by the BBC's head
of statistics, Robert Cuffe. | 0:55:33 | 0:55:36 | |
No pressure to clear up this. Our 1
million children going to lose the | 0:55:36 | 0:55:40 | |
right way school meal? It depends on
how you ask the question. No one is | 0:55:40 | 0:55:45 | |
really arguing with the arithmetic
but each party is choosing a | 0:55:45 | 0:55:48 | |
different comparison. If you go back
to before Universal Credit was | 0:55:48 | 0:55:54 | |
started, back then free school meals
were means tested. When Universal | 0:55:54 | 0:55:58 | |
Credit was rolled out the government
promised as an interim measure only | 0:55:58 | 0:56:01 | |
to give free school meals to
everyone receiving Universal Credit | 0:56:01 | 0:56:04 | |
and have now decided it wasn't going
to be forever and they are going to | 0:56:04 | 0:56:10 | |
stop means testing again. It is true
to say that the current means | 0:56:10 | 0:56:14 | |
testing is more generous than the
old version was. That's how you get | 0:56:14 | 0:56:18 | |
the extra 50,000 kids receiving free
school meals. But of course means | 0:56:18 | 0:56:22 | |
tested meals are less generous than
meals for everybody so it is also | 0:56:22 | 0:56:26 | |
technically true to say that had
they gone on providing this for | 0:56:26 | 0:56:28 | |
ever, which they never said they
would do, their 1 million Jordan | 0:56:28 | 0:56:33 | |
would be receiving this. Is this
about a hypothetical situation being | 0:56:33 | 0:56:38 | |
created in the future? Are any
children receiving free school meals | 0:56:38 | 0:56:43 | |
now going to lose it? Nobody is
going to go into a school ready to | 0:56:43 | 0:56:49 | |
grab a tray from underneath a child.
The government made clear that | 0:56:49 | 0:56:55 | |
anyone receiving it under current
provisions will continue to receive | 0:56:55 | 0:56:58 | |
it. But children in the future will
not be getting them and they might | 0:56:58 | 0:57:02 | |
have been entitled, at the
government decided to continue this | 0:57:02 | 0:57:05 | |
benefit. Are you happy you've been
responsible for at least confusing | 0:57:05 | 0:57:09 | |
the issue in terms of statistics?
The way has been described as good. | 0:57:09 | 0:57:13 | |
1 million children who would have
had it under the current regime | 0:57:13 | 0:57:17 | |
won't get it. Actually all wrong
because people sometimes go on to | 0:57:17 | 0:57:21 | |
Universal Credit and off it and on
it again. You can be an UC now, | 0:57:21 | 0:57:27 | |
getting free school meals, go off
it, make a new claim and then not | 0:57:27 | 0:57:30 | |
get it. Perhaps that is an extremely
complicated approach. Do you accept | 0:57:30 | 0:57:35 | |
they aren't having their meals taken
away? I thought the government has | 0:57:35 | 0:57:39 | |
said 100,000 children were losing...
Not true at all. And I thought it | 0:57:39 | 0:57:46 | |
was the government saying only
100,000 were losing and the | 0:57:46 | 0:57:51 | |
Children's Society were saying 1
million... Should you have put out | 0:57:51 | 0:57:54 | |
that sort of information if you
weren't sure? This is why post-truth | 0:57:54 | 0:57:59 | |
politics. We've just heard from the
BBC's independent fact checker that | 0:57:59 | 0:58:03 | |
not one single child getting free
school meals will lose it and 50,000 | 0:58:03 | 0:58:07 | |
more schoolchildren will be
eligible. Tell us why that is truly. | 0:58:07 | 0:58:11 | |
We've made the system more generous.
The Labour Party Palm Springs and to | 0:58:11 | 0:58:15 | |
social media hoping to get things to
people before the fact checkers | 0:58:15 | 0:58:21 | |
catch up -- the Labour Party pumps
things into social media. We've | 0:58:21 | 0:58:27 | |
inherited a situation where... We
haven't got time, I must let Helen | 0:58:27 | 0:58:31 | |
responds. Some children will lose...
It's simply not true. Not one child | 0:58:31 | 0:58:39 | |
will lose... It's been cut to £7,400
which is below... Higher than the | 0:58:39 | 0:58:46 | |
threshold. Who knew statistics could
be so fiercely argued over! LAUGHTER | 0:58:46 | 0:58:51 | |
That's all for today. | 0:58:51 | 0:58:53 | |
Thanks to our guests. | 0:58:53 | 0:58:56 | |
Bye bye. | 0:58:56 | 0:58:59 |
Jo Coburn is joined by Conservative MP Neil O'Brien and Labour's Shadow Foreign Minister Helen Goodman, as EU leaders finalise details of the Brexit transition period in Brussels.
Also includes discussion on whether shock collars for pets should be banned.