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dangerous dog to be out in the public. Those are the headlines. It | :00:07. | :00:14. | |
is time for HARDtalk. The satellite TV station Al Jazeera is credited | :00:14. | :00:18. | |
with giving ordinary Arabs a platform from which to challenge | :00:19. | :00:22. | |
their government. Day-by-day it has been covering the dramatic events | :00:23. | :00:28. | |
of the Arab Spring using the latest technology on both its Arabic and | :00:28. | :00:34. | |
English channels. Is it selective in whom it criticises? My guest is | :00:34. | :00:39. | |
Wadah Khanfar, he was the boss of Al Jazeera for ten years. Was the | :00:39. | :00:44. | |
coverage biased on his watch? Why did he leave Al Jazeera in the | :00:44. | :00:54. | |
:00:54. | :01:17. | ||
midst of the biggest news event in the Arab world for decades? Wadah | :01:17. | :01:26. | |
Khanfar, welcome to HARDtalk. Has the coverage of the Arab Spring | :01:26. | :01:32. | |
been biased? I do not think so. They have done a fantastic job | :01:32. | :01:42. | |
:01:42. | :01:45. | ||
covering the Arab Spring since it started. The coverage is continuing. | :01:45. | :01:53. | |
I think Al Jazeera is doing very well in following the developments | :01:53. | :02:00. | |
and evolutions. There is a criticism that Al Jazeera's | :02:01. | :02:09. | |
coverage has focused more on Egypt, Libya, Syria, downplaying the | :02:09. | :02:17. | |
unrest in Bahrain and Saudi Arabia. Evidence on the ground it defines | :02:17. | :02:27. | |
:02:27. | :02:31. | ||
what coverage you put on the screen. The Bahraini up rising did not | :02:31. | :02:35. | |
evolve into a revolution like what happened in Egypt and Libya and so | :02:35. | :02:44. | |
on. Second, the situation in all of these countries, if you take Egypt, | :02:44. | :02:54. | |
:02:54. | :02:55. | ||
it was central in the way that you look at the Middle East. | :02:55. | :02:59. | |
Unfortunately in places like Bahrain there has been sectarian | :02:59. | :03:04. | |
divide. The issue should not become as prominent as the Egyptian or | :03:04. | :03:14. | |
:03:14. | :03:18. | ||
The criticism that Al Jazeera pulled back on coverage at home. | :03:18. | :03:21. | |
The President of a human rights group said that the programme did | :03:22. | :03:30. | |
not do enough to cover the event. He said they will only question | :03:30. | :03:40. | |
:03:40. | :03:45. | ||
governmental people. We did do that very well. The Bahraini government | :03:45. | :03:55. | |
:03:55. | :03:58. | ||
is more upset with cell than anyone else. -- one with Al Jazeera -- | :03:58. | :04:07. | |
with Al Jazeera. Somebody who has studied the coverage of middle | :04:07. | :04:13. | |
Eastern events, a senior at the Washington Institute, says Al | :04:13. | :04:23. | |
:04:23. | :04:26. | ||
Jazeera is on the line, and the coverage of Bahrain is a example of | :04:26. | :04:36. | |
:04:36. | :04:38. | ||
poor reportage. There were glaring omissions on your part. This is not | :04:38. | :04:48. | |
:04:48. | :04:50. | ||
true. We covered Bahrain, developing and evil thing at the | :04:50. | :05:00. | |
:05:00. | :05:00. | ||
same time. There was more interest in what was happening in Egypt -- | :05:00. | :05:10. | |
:05:10. | :05:28. | ||
of -- evolving. But you did not cover certain events? Going into | :05:28. | :05:38. | |
:05:38. | :05:44. | ||
Bahrain was covered on Al Jazeera. We have never tried to take | :05:44. | :05:53. | |
coverage amounts of our programme. -- out of the power programme. | :05:53. | :06:03. | |
:06:03. | :06:07. | ||
you are saying he did cover it? very professionally. Was there but | :06:07. | :06:14. | |
political pressure on you do not cover it? Last battle. What about | :06:14. | :06:23. | |
the process in the eastern provinces? -- not at all -- | :06:23. | :06:28. | |
protests. There were four young people who were killed during the | :06:28. | :06:36. | |
protests. Al Jazeera Arabic did cover the story but just said what | :06:36. | :06:42. | |
the authorities had say, which was the young people had been caught in | :06:42. | :06:46. | |
crossfire when security forces had fired. You did not question it. | :06:46. | :06:51. | |
That is an example of how Al Jazeera did not cover the unrest in | :06:51. | :06:59. | |
the area. Until I left, the policies the show is following and | :06:59. | :07:04. | |
I hope is continuing to follow, is that when any story happens it | :07:04. | :07:12. | |
should be covered without any political agenda. This is what we | :07:12. | :07:18. | |
have been doing for 15 years. This particular story, I am not so aware | :07:18. | :07:27. | |
of the way that we covered it. reasons I say this to you is that | :07:27. | :07:33. | |
it is easy for Al Jazeera to cover the up people's in Libya. True, it | :07:33. | :07:43. | |
:07:43. | :08:01. | ||
was an international co-operation - - our peoples. -- upheavals. These | :08:01. | :08:07. | |
were countries where it was easy to cover the crisis. But in your own | :08:07. | :08:16. | |
country, there were other issues. The friendship between President | :08:16. | :08:25. | |
Bashar al-Assad and the government was very close. The relationship | :08:25. | :08:35. | |
:08:35. | :08:45. | ||
between Pixar and Emma was instrumental -- que -- Qatar. -- | :08:45. | :08:53. | |
and the government. There was an exchange of investment | :08:53. | :09:01. | |
opportunities. During the revolution, this country supported | :09:01. | :09:11. | |
:09:11. | :09:13. | ||
the public. Other countries were reluctant to support the uprising. | :09:13. | :09:20. | |
So it is fair to say that when someone like the American | :09:20. | :09:27. | |
ambassador says Al Jazeera Arabic news channel will continue to be an | :09:27. | :09:37. | |
:09:37. | :09:37. | ||
instruments of the influence of the government. He said this in 2009. | :09:37. | :09:47. | |
:09:47. | :09:49. | ||
He has his own way of thinking. During his stay in this country, he | :09:49. | :09:59. | |
:09:59. | :09:59. | ||
was trying to locates Al Jazeera with the Americans. It has never | :09:59. | :10:09. | |
:10:09. | :10:18. | ||
been a tour of the country's foreign policy. -- a tool. But was | :10:18. | :10:28. | |
:10:28. | :10:40. | ||
it an indirect tool? That is nothing. So, when you were in | :10:40. | :10:46. | |
charge, the Qatari goverment had no influence. We listen to many | :10:46. | :10:56. | |
:10:56. | :11:03. | ||
countried. -- countries. Many times the leader of the goverment was | :11:03. | :11:13. | |
:11:13. | :11:23. | ||
unhappy with how we covered things. There was a centre set up for the | :11:23. | :11:33. | |
:11:33. | :11:42. | ||
freedom of the media. An ex-member of Doctors Without Borders was | :11:42. | :11:52. | |
:11:52. | :11:55. | ||
appointed to lead it. He left because he said there was no | :11:55. | :12:04. | |
freedom of speech accepted in the country. Al Jareeza was adopting | :12:04. | :12:14. | |
:12:14. | :12:23. | ||
professional standard. -- standards. Al Jazeera has had very | :12:23. | :12:33. | |
:12:33. | :12:46. | ||
professional reporting. You were never uncomfortable working for the | :12:46. | :12:52. | |
network when it was funded by the monarchy there? Like the BBc, it is | :12:52. | :13:02. | |
:13:02. | :13:09. | ||
publicly funded. The BBC is funded by the taxpayer. The monarchy fund | :13:09. | :13:19. | |
:13:19. | :13:37. | ||
Al Jazeera outright. Qatar was under fire for many years. | :13:37. | :13:43. | |
Democracy is eventually going to be everywhere. The governments are | :13:43. | :13:53. | |
:13:53. | :13:55. | ||
trying to make reforms. Even in Qatar? Next year they will have | :13:55. | :14:05. | |
:14:05. | :14:13. | ||
What do you make of that? I think Al Jazeera has grown in the past | :14:13. | :14:19. | |
year is from one TV station to more than 20 TV stations. Al Jazeera | :14:19. | :14:25. | |
started with 200 people to up to 2,500 people. How does it look when | :14:25. | :14:33. | |
you have appointed this member of the royal family as part of the | :14:33. | :14:39. | |
news team. That is not an issue, the issue is what is he going to do | :14:39. | :14:45. | |
in this organisation. You said that Qatar is moving towards greater | :14:45. | :14:52. | |
freedom of speech and democracy, you are a Palestinian, someone who | :14:52. | :14:56. | |
worked as a war correspondent, people understood that you were in | :14:56. | :15:05. | |
the position you were in Al Jazeera, now they have this little knowing | :15:05. | :15:10. | |
royal who is heading Al Jazeera, how will that it received? It is | :15:10. | :15:17. | |
not always necessary to have the Director General as a journalist. | :15:17. | :15:21. | |
In many networks, the chief executive is involved in issues | :15:21. | :15:26. | |
related to marketing and administration and so on. To judge | :15:26. | :15:34. | |
the new general director we should see... Regardless of what happens | :15:34. | :15:39. | |
in November and the elections. Protests in Saudi Arabia were not | :15:39. | :15:46. | |
covered. Why did you leave Al Jazeera? You leave in the midst of | :15:46. | :15:51. | |
the events, September, the revelations were in full swing, | :15:51. | :15:59. | |
what made you go? I have been there for some time. In my opinion I have | :15:59. | :16:09. | |
:16:09. | :16:13. | ||
given and achieved... I realised that there is some kind of new | :16:13. | :16:19. | |
force in the region. How could you leave, the best stories in | :16:19. | :16:26. | |
journalism, Libya was up in the air, how could you leave at that time? | :16:26. | :16:32. | |
felt that at the peak of the coverage of the Egyptian revolution | :16:32. | :16:37. | |
has led to a new reality in the new Arab world. I thought I could | :16:37. | :16:47. | |
:16:47. | :16:50. | ||
become part of helping the these states. Did you choose to go | :16:50. | :16:59. | |
of your own three well? Yes, I did. -- free will. After eight years of | :16:59. | :17:07. | |
me staying as a Director General, I am not going to continue. After | :17:07. | :17:15. | |
that any Director General will start repeating himself. What Al | :17:15. | :17:20. | |
Jazeera has achieved in 15 years, could be wiped out in 15 days, is | :17:20. | :17:30. | |
that not a sign you are quite worried about your legacy? Actually, | :17:30. | :17:37. | |
I said that many times when I was Director General. I believe it. I | :17:37. | :17:42. | |
believe the most important thing in Al Jazeera is independence. If that | :17:42. | :17:48. | |
is not going to be maintained, Al Jazeera will lose credibility. This | :17:48. | :17:54. | |
statement actually, it is not new. People love Al Jazeera and they | :17:54. | :17:57. | |
watched Al Jazeera because they are providing them with something that | :17:57. | :18:05. | |
cannot be found on state TV stations. If Al Jazeera does not | :18:05. | :18:14. | |
maintain the professional standards, I think it will lose... You say | :18:14. | :18:20. | |
independence, but I will give you one example. We got this through | :18:20. | :18:26. | |
WikiLeaks, a cable sent by a US ambassador to Qatar in 2005, | :18:26. | :18:30. | |
described a US embassy official, asking you to tone down your | :18:30. | :18:35. | |
coverage of the Iraq war because your ex -- showing explicit images | :18:35. | :18:42. | |
of children and women. That is a trademark of Al Jazeera, you show | :18:42. | :18:46. | |
more than what we do in the BBC, he responded with a sigh, you said it | :18:46. | :18:52. | |
you would remove the few peace. But in a few days, because if you did | :18:52. | :18:57. | |
it immediately it would be two of the has. More than 420 cables | :18:57. | :19:07. | |
:19:07. | :19:13. | ||
breath -- where -- were sent, in all of them the Americans asked us | :19:13. | :19:22. | |
to do something and we refused. In regards to this, 0 Al Jazeera made | :19:22. | :19:27. | |
a mistake. You made a mistake. Jazeera made a mistake in covering | :19:27. | :19:37. | |
:19:37. | :19:38. | ||
the story. With our code of conduct if we make a mistake we should | :19:38. | :19:43. | |
remove it for starve that is exactly what we did. That policy | :19:43. | :19:48. | |
was with the relationship with America, China, any country in the | :19:48. | :19:55. | |
world. Whoever comes to us and protests against a story, if it is | :19:55. | :19:59. | |
limited in as far as our professional standards are | :19:59. | :20:08. | |
concerned, we will remove the story. But if it is to enhance their image, | :20:09. | :20:15. | |
we will have... Isn't this what it is about? The images inflamed | :20:15. | :20:21. | |
passions and made people, and bold and against the Americans the... | :20:21. | :20:25. | |
That story you are talking about was a particular incident. | :20:25. | :20:35. | |
:20:35. | :20:41. | ||
caved in to pressure. Not at all. Americans or not, it is because we | :20:41. | :20:45. | |
respect professional standards. The Americans pressurised us hundreds | :20:45. | :20:53. | |
of times, it was one incident where they were right and we were wrong. | :20:53. | :21:01. | |
This is a Certificate of professionalism. After 2005, read | :21:01. | :21:07. | |
the Americans happy with the Al Jazeera coverage? They are now. | :21:07. | :21:11. | |
Hillary Clinton has applauded the year. Talking about WikiLeaks, one | :21:11. | :21:20. | |
clear trademark of 0 Al Jazeera is that you cover the Palestinian- | :21:20. | :21:30. | |
:21:30. | :21:31. | ||
Israeli dispute. The fact of the matter is, the PLO was extremely | :21:31. | :21:35. | |
upset with the coverage that you are stationed gave three the | :21:35. | :21:41. | |
WikiLeaks story trying to imply that the PLO, Mahmoud Abbas, Brecht | :21:41. | :21:46. | |
Ho yin to the Israelis in some way. He describes it as a smear campaign | :21:46. | :21:55. | |
by Al Jazeera. -- toadying. You champion the Palestinian cause, yet | :21:55. | :22:01. | |
at the same time you are undermining the Palestinian | :22:01. | :22:05. | |
leadership, Mahmoud Abbas was negotiating. We are not championing | :22:05. | :22:15. | |
:22:15. | :22:15. | ||
any cause. The issue that Al Jazeera got exclusively, the | :22:15. | :22:19. | |
complete file of the negotiations between the Palestinians and | :22:19. | :22:26. | |
Israelis. Thousands of pages. After going through it and summarising it | :22:26. | :22:29. | |
and understanding it, we decide the public should know what is | :22:29. | :22:39. | |
happening. We did cover it through intensive coverage. It was with co- | :22:39. | :22:43. | |
operation with the Guardian. The issue was, it was a Certificate for | :22:43. | :22:48. | |
Al Jazeera, we did one of our finest jobs as investigative | :22:49. | :22:54. | |
journalists. It gave a proper understanding of what is happening. | :22:54. | :23:00. | |
You said you took it all out of context. He complained to Ofcom, we | :23:00. | :23:08. | |
lost the case. Not only that, Ofcom, in its ruling, said Al Jazeera | :23:08. | :23:14. | |
adopted the highest possible standards, there was nothing that | :23:14. | :23:19. | |
Mahmoud Abbas should be upset... Middle East is known for its lack | :23:19. | :23:24. | |
of freedom, we have now seen the Arab Spring, do you think it is | :23:24. | :23:27. | |
going to change quite soon and for the better that the Arab ordinary | :23:27. | :23:33. | |
person will find their voice? has already started. When it | :23:33. | :23:38. | |
started we had no choice. The new generation, the youth of the Arab | :23:38. | :23:43. | |
world have taken the lead. In my opinion, what will happen in the | :23:43. | :23:49. | |
next few years is the transition to stable democracy, that were not | :23:49. | :23:53. | |
only changed the political landscape but the social and | :23:53. | :23:57. | |
economic landscape and the future of the Arab world is going to be | :23:57. | :24:01. |