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Now on BBC News, it's HARDtalk's review of the year. | :00:00. | :00:10. | |
Welcome to my review of heart talk to thousand 16. This was the year of | :00:11. | :00:21. | |
a certain Donald J Trump. Hundreds of thousands of loggerheads in this | :00:22. | :00:26. | |
country who will follow anyone and vote or a reality TV star. If the | :00:27. | :00:33. | |
choice is between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton, I vote for Donald | :00:34. | :00:39. | |
Trump. The statement of banning all Muslims is very much contrary to | :00:40. | :00:44. | |
American values. There is one certainty from the Mac, we have | :00:45. | :00:50. | |
voted to take back control of our country. There is my personal | :00:51. | :00:55. | |
feeling that comes into play because I love the UK so much I want them to | :00:56. | :01:01. | |
be with the Europeans. This could be the beginning of the unravelling of | :01:02. | :01:10. | |
the European Union, i.e. Agree. We are in need try new ideas. The only | :01:11. | :01:18. | |
thing which will move is war. Ifill want to make the world a better | :01:19. | :01:22. | |
place and I leave it a better place and that I am honest while I hear | :01:23. | :01:26. | |
which is why I want to do your show because I want to to be asked hard | :01:27. | :01:34. | |
questions. Hard questions is what we do and in 2016, our focus was on the | :01:35. | :01:40. | |
global political phenomena and, a wave of popular anger and disgust | :01:41. | :01:44. | |
with the status quo, sweeping through the democracies of the | :01:45. | :01:49. | |
Western world. People left out and left behind. Look for politicians | :01:50. | :01:55. | |
who seemed to speak to them. In the US, there are likely champion was a | :01:56. | :01:59. | |
billionaire property tycoon with an outsized ego. There are elements, | :02:00. | :02:05. | |
sub elements, fringe element in every country. Did I already know | :02:06. | :02:11. | |
that there are hundreds of thousands of blockheads in this country, who | :02:12. | :02:17. | |
are idiots and will vote for a TV reality star? Lets breed a little | :02:18. | :02:22. | |
bit before we give it too much credit of representing a real thing. | :02:23. | :02:27. | |
I will say this, there is a phoniness about this, consternation | :02:28. | :02:31. | |
at what it means is guys like you love it. You dine out on it. You | :02:32. | :02:40. | |
like a chance to look down upon, to go to the mystery of the Donald | :02:41. | :02:44. | |
Trump phenomena. Any one of our candidates will be better than an | :02:45. | :02:50. | |
Obama third term under the auspices of Hillary Clinton. Even if a colic | :02:51. | :02:58. | |
says he is a race baiting xenophobe missed bigot and would be an | :02:59. | :03:02. | |
absolute disaster to our party and destroy conservatism as we know it | :03:03. | :03:08. | |
and we will get wiped out. I do not agree on all of that. He is a | :03:09. | :03:15. | |
leading to the policies which include building a world with | :03:16. | :03:21. | |
Mexico. I for immigration reform but because we need to get back to legal | :03:22. | :03:27. | |
immigration and put a stop to illegal immigration and most | :03:28. | :03:30. | |
Republicans agree with me on that. They are not allowed Holler about | :03:31. | :03:39. | |
building a wall. I have lived my whole life on the US Mexico border | :03:40. | :03:44. | |
and I have flown it, driven it and read it on horseback and know it | :03:45. | :03:51. | |
very well and my view is... You show me a ten foot well and I will show | :03:52. | :03:58. | |
you a 12 foot ladder. Of all is not adequate. Once he decided to come on | :03:59. | :04:04. | |
board with the Donald Trump, is what you think is so important for people | :04:05. | :04:08. | |
to understand and you claim the media failed to understand, is that | :04:09. | :04:15. | |
this guy is not ideological? He is common sense, problem-solving in his | :04:16. | :04:20. | |
orientation so some of the staff will be surprisingly less than write | :04:21. | :04:28. | |
lenient. This guy, far from being a danger to the world is going to be | :04:29. | :04:32. | |
somebody that governments around the world can work with and put trust in | :04:33. | :04:38. | |
- that is not going to be easy. What I see happening is what happens in | :04:39. | :04:42. | |
life, a convergence between how the media presents somebody, how the | :04:43. | :04:49. | |
soundbites happen on a campaign on how when you are interacting with a | :04:50. | :04:55. | |
person face to face, that might be a difference between your perception | :04:56. | :05:00. | |
and what the person is like and as the gap closes, the world community | :05:01. | :05:04. | |
will be happy to have him as president. Donald Trump's Drive much | :05:05. | :05:10. | |
of the world by surprise. It had the shock value of a political | :05:11. | :05:16. | |
earthquake. Much more political was the other storyline, the | :05:17. | :05:20. | |
continuation of Syria's hellish war. The slow death of a nation under the | :05:21. | :05:28. | |
worlds gaze. We are in a horrible war. Frankly, on behalf of every | :05:29. | :05:34. | |
one, we need to throw new ideas about why things are not moving. The | :05:35. | :05:40. | |
only thing that will move is war and victory but the reason no victory. | :05:41. | :05:45. | |
That is the essence of this crisis. Some players believe victory is | :05:46. | :05:48. | |
still possible and people who believe that our sad and his | :05:49. | :05:56. | |
supporters in Moscow and Tehran. You are totally right. At this very | :05:57. | :06:04. | |
moment, and Assad and his team are feeling comfortable but what they | :06:05. | :06:07. | |
should not be feeling comfortable about is that Russia has no interest | :06:08. | :06:13. | |
in inheriting a broken, destroyed, non- reconstruct a ball Syria and | :06:14. | :06:22. | |
with constant warfare. Russian military forces, airstrike forces | :06:23. | :06:29. | |
being involved in offensives against civilians is out of possibility. | :06:30. | :06:35. | |
They are still performing their task in terms of fighting terrorist | :06:36. | :06:40. | |
organisation. Your air forces been involved with the Syrians in the | :06:41. | :06:46. | |
most ferocious on bad men of Aleppo that we have seen in more than five | :06:47. | :06:51. | |
years of the Syrian conflict. Why are you the point, for example, | :06:52. | :06:55. | |
these are uncovered a sting bombs which reach down into basements, | :06:56. | :07:00. | |
kill civilians where they are sheltering, and also, we know this | :07:01. | :07:05. | |
ROM multiple sources, hitting hospitals. This is false | :07:06. | :07:12. | |
information. There is no possibility that Russian air force can be | :07:13. | :07:18. | |
involved in this kind of activities. Understandably, the war is going on | :07:19. | :07:26. | |
and understandably the cessation of hostile activity is not active right | :07:27. | :07:33. | |
now and we are too far away from a situational ceasefire in Aleppo. We | :07:34. | :07:36. | |
tried to give voice to the survivors of conflict, particularly and | :07:37. | :07:43. | |
predictably, women. For those oppressed by so-called Islamic State | :07:44. | :07:46. | |
to those victimised by one of Africa's most violent militant | :07:47. | :07:53. | |
gangs. You were held for three months, in that time did you have | :07:54. | :08:01. | |
conversations all make any normal conversations with any of these men | :08:02. | :08:03. | |
that were holding you? You have come through the most | :08:04. | :09:38. | |
terrible dramatic experience - eight years you were held captive by the | :09:39. | :09:45. | |
Lord's resistance Army. Do you still find it easy to recall just how | :09:46. | :09:51. | |
awful those moments were? First of all, I was so scared. They are | :09:52. | :09:57. | |
telling you, get up. Get up. I did not know where we were going and | :09:58. | :10:04. | |
that was the day and I only realised in the night, when I been told, | :10:05. | :10:10. | |
come. A lady told me to go to the other tent. Two gentlemen alone? I | :10:11. | :10:17. | |
asked what is this? He said if I do not accept, I have the power to kill | :10:18. | :10:25. | |
you. I accepted it. That is how this man raped me. You board this man to | :10:26. | :10:31. | |
children, a son and a daughter. I cannot even begin to imagine how | :10:32. | :10:35. | |
mixed your feelings were in having those children in these | :10:36. | :10:38. | |
circumstances you were forced to have them? In real life, when you | :10:39. | :10:48. | |
start interpreting, Vijaya will never know this circumstance in | :10:49. | :10:56. | |
which anything happen. -- the child. You never know where their children | :10:57. | :11:02. | |
will lead me to. Europe will remember the thousand 16 as their | :11:03. | :11:15. | |
year of Brexit, coined to reflect Britain leaving the EU. It reflected | :11:16. | :11:20. | |
deep unhappiness with business as usual. A poke in the eye for the | :11:21. | :11:25. | |
political and business elite. Brexit, the idea of leaving the EU, | :11:26. | :11:30. | |
your team said that would cause severe national, regional and global | :11:31. | :11:36. | |
damage? That is partly a preliminarily analysis. Guesswork? | :11:37. | :11:43. | |
Partly intuition and a teeny tiny bit of my personal feeling that | :11:44. | :11:48. | |
comes into play because I love so much of the UK I want them to be | :11:49. | :11:53. | |
with the Europeans of which I consider myself. You comfortable | :11:54. | :11:58. | |
with the idea that the IMF is making statements which are making a huge | :11:59. | :12:04. | |
vertical role and in internal British debate? What right does the | :12:05. | :12:10. | |
IMF to play that role? Clearly embedded in the articles of the IMF | :12:11. | :12:19. | |
is our duty of analysing and maintaining as much as we can | :12:20. | :12:22. | |
stability in the global economy. Ultimately, there is one certainty | :12:23. | :12:28. | |
from Brexit, that we have voted to take back control of our country. | :12:29. | :12:32. | |
Are you ready now to express some regret for some of the things, | :12:33. | :12:38. | |
including false would pedal by the Leave campaign... As far as the | :12:39. | :12:42. | |
Leave campaign there was one mistake, what factual mistake. The | :12:43. | :12:52. | |
350 million. It was on the poster. A very small factual mistake. ?350 | :12:53. | :12:59. | |
million a week will go to the NHS is a complete falsehood. Why redirect | :13:00. | :13:08. | |
my question? Why not now that it is over, acknowledge that some things | :13:09. | :13:13. | |
were said that were false and you regret it. I think that was the only | :13:14. | :13:19. | |
fundamental mistake that was made in terms of fact... A fundamental | :13:20. | :13:23. | |
mistake! The course you are cynical and would say almost anything to | :13:24. | :13:29. | |
win. It was not my figure and argue very strongly against it. It was one | :13:30. | :13:33. | |
of the most that regular acts of litter called dishonest on the part | :13:34. | :13:37. | |
of a number of opportunists and populists. I bought interested in | :13:38. | :13:44. | |
the intellectual bases EU approach of this. All those of reasonable and | :13:45. | :13:51. | |
rational mind must be pro- remaining in the EU- you seem to assume that | :13:52. | :13:58. | |
those who won the argument are nothing but opportunists and liars? | :13:59. | :14:05. | |
Am not going to back pedal about my dismay at the intellectual | :14:06. | :14:13. | |
dishonesty of otherwise intelligent people who sought to persuade people | :14:14. | :14:19. | |
about this sort of Utopia beckoning. I want your opinion on what you are | :14:20. | :14:23. | |
seeing from the British government? About what kind of Brexit Theresa | :14:24. | :14:30. | |
May wants. Are you worried about the sense of confusion and K is the EC | :14:31. | :14:32. | |
in London? In your opinion, does it have to be | :14:33. | :15:25. | |
the so-called hard Brexit? President Hollande has said that Britain will | :15:26. | :15:29. | |
have to pay a heavy price for leaving the European Union, and | :15:30. | :15:31. | |
therefore, he seems to be suggesting that the idea that we stay in the | :15:32. | :15:36. | |
single market or have preferential access to the single market, it is | :15:37. | :15:40. | |
not going to be possible. What is your view? | :15:41. | :16:02. | |
This could be the beginning of the unravelling of the European Union. I | :16:03. | :16:08. | |
agree, it cannot be excluded. That could be terrible for Britain. Also, | :16:09. | :16:14. | |
I think it would be terrible to have a united Europe to Britain's | :16:15. | :16:17. | |
exclusion, which is something that Britain tried to prevent 500 years. | :16:18. | :16:22. | |
We will miss you. The European Union with Britain in it was better than | :16:23. | :16:26. | |
what we are going to get now, but you have made your decision. We have | :16:27. | :16:31. | |
to take care of our union, do have to take care of your union. We are | :16:32. | :16:36. | |
facing an existential crisis as never before. It is a crisis of | :16:37. | :16:41. | |
solidarity. Everybody is talking the national talk, and pass imperilling | :16:42. | :16:48. | |
the European Union and its ability to commonly act. This could be the | :16:49. | :16:55. | |
new experience, the new situation, that failure of Europe is possible, | :16:56. | :16:59. | |
and I think we have even more awareness of this new possibility | :17:00. | :17:02. | |
which has not been there since World War Two. Do you see yourself and | :17:03. | :17:08. | |
your political movement as part of a worldwide phenomenon? I am thinking | :17:09. | :17:12. | |
of Donald Trump in the United States, I am thinking of the vote | :17:13. | :17:16. | |
for Brexit in the United Kingdom. Do you think something is happening | :17:17. | :17:20. | |
which the Front National, your party, is a part of? | :17:21. | :18:29. | |
Every year, HARDtalk throws up moments of tension, drama and deep | :18:30. | :18:37. | |
emotion. It can be political, like my encounter with a member of South | :18:38. | :18:41. | |
Africa's troubled government, or it can be personal. Either way, it is | :18:42. | :18:48. | |
compelling. There is no legal or constitutional reason for the | :18:49. | :18:50. | |
President to leave office. It becomes a political question. One of | :18:51. | :18:56. | |
the most important ministers in your government, the government which you | :18:57. | :19:00. | |
loyally serve, has basically declared that in his view, given | :19:01. | :19:05. | |
what the Constitutional Court has said, the President has roped in his | :19:06. | :19:08. | |
contract with the people. I am asking you. Do you agree with that, | :19:09. | :19:17. | |
or disagree? I... I think the minister was actually saying, he was | :19:18. | :19:22. | |
warning us, that we cannot operate beyond the bounds of the | :19:23. | :19:25. | |
constitution. We have to operate within the framework of the | :19:26. | :19:29. | |
constitution. The President is way beyond the bounds of the | :19:30. | :19:34. | |
constitution. Well, I think that is a matter of debate and discussion, | :19:35. | :19:38. | |
so what I am saying is that I inked that from a legal and constitutional | :19:39. | :19:42. | |
point of view, there is no reason for the President to leave office. | :19:43. | :19:46. | |
Minister, are you in any way embarrassed by the answer is that | :19:47. | :19:50. | |
you feel you have had to give to me today, presumably for political | :19:51. | :19:53. | |
reasons? I haven't any reason to be embarrassed. I am just telling you | :19:54. | :19:58. | |
the way I look at the situation in South Africa, that we have got a | :19:59. | :20:01. | |
functioning government in place, we have got a president in place, which | :20:02. | :20:05. | |
there have been some unfortunate incidents around. This wonderful | :20:06. | :20:09. | |
creation of yours, which has in essence to find your career, and | :20:10. | :20:13. | |
that if this marvellous lady, the veto. -- Evita. She is this sort of | :20:14. | :20:25. | |
wonderful Afrikaans woman, obviously a creation, you are in drag. Let's | :20:26. | :20:29. | |
get our first look at Evita herself, in the most iconic circumstances, | :20:30. | :20:33. | |
perhaps one of the most memorable times of your life, actually | :20:34. | :20:36. | |
interviewing Nelson Mandela just months after he was released in | :20:37. | :20:41. | |
1994. Let's play this video clip and give everybody an idea. In the old | :20:42. | :20:46. | |
days, as you probably remember, Afrikaners like me were frightened | :20:47. | :20:49. | |
that when black South Africans would take control of South Africa, all | :20:50. | :20:54. | |
the old symbols, the old paintings, the old furniture would be removed, | :20:55. | :20:58. | |
and we are so happy to see that everything is still here. Minorities | :20:59. | :21:04. | |
are entitled to be concerned about the type of changes that have taken | :21:05. | :21:09. | |
place in our country. The task of the government and the ANC | :21:10. | :21:16. | |
leadership will be to ensure the white South Africans that change | :21:17. | :21:21. | |
will not mean a reversal of the position where blacks were oppressed | :21:22. | :21:27. | |
by the white minority and the other minorities. And I think that we have | :21:28. | :21:31. | |
succeeded, we are succeeding in addressing their fears. I mean, what | :21:32. | :21:37. | |
is beautiful about that is that Mandela appears to be taking it very | :21:38. | :21:40. | |
seriously. Very seriously. And we sat down I was ready with | :21:41. | :21:45. | |
everything, which is frightening when a film crew weights, you know, | :21:46. | :21:49. | |
it is like waiting for the death warrant, the death sentence. And we | :21:50. | :21:52. | |
could hear his voice down the passage. He walked in, he came | :21:53. | :21:58. | |
round, he saw Evita and he said, Evita, you look so beautiful. He sat | :21:59. | :22:03. | |
down and I said, President Mandela, thank you so much for allowing us | :22:04. | :22:07. | |
this 30 minutes. It was a 30 minute interview. He said, no, I want to be | :22:08. | :22:12. | |
at Evita's show because I have important things to say at nobody | :22:13. | :22:15. | |
watches the news. I like this phrase that one of your critics came up | :22:16. | :22:21. | |
with. Every online pronouncements from planet well. You being the | :22:22. | :22:30. | |
ruler of Planet Wealth. Is there a spaceship bike and take there, too | :22:31. | :22:36. | |
Planet Wealth? You know, the truth of the matter is, we have a complete | :22:37. | :22:40. | |
range of price points on the site. You know, we have $8 lip balm, we | :22:41. | :22:46. | |
have $12 non-toxic deodorant, and also, to be honest, we have a bit of | :22:47. | :22:53. | |
fun and we will affiliate link to a $15,000 gold dildo just to trawl | :22:54. | :22:57. | |
people back. The two things that I remember most that I will not get | :22:58. | :23:01. | |
over, and that I probably worry about all the time, the feeling of | :23:02. | :23:05. | |
being existential, of having no power, that nobody cares, you are | :23:06. | :23:08. | |
invisible, you are nothing, you are not going to amount to anything, and | :23:09. | :23:13. | |
there is a part of me that I will always feel like somehow it is going | :23:14. | :23:17. | |
to turn out that way again. I will live running with that chasing me, | :23:18. | :23:23. | |
that I will be that helpless child, once again. And that is what keeps | :23:24. | :23:28. | |
me going, and you do not get over these things. And I think that | :23:29. | :23:31. | |
sometimes when I immerse myself in the traumas and the tragedies of | :23:32. | :23:34. | |
other people, because I desperately need to try to heal other people, | :23:35. | :23:39. | |
because I know what it feels like to have nobody come and do that for | :23:40. | :23:43. | |
you. So, you know, life is a struggle and it is what we make of | :23:44. | :23:47. | |
it, and I am so grateful to have the success that I have, but I also want | :23:48. | :23:52. | |
to feel that I make the world a better place and that I leave it a | :23:53. | :23:56. | |
better place and that I am honest while I am here, even if it is hard, | :23:57. | :24:00. | |
which is one of the reasons I want to do your show, because I want some | :24:01. | :24:04. | |
big asks me the hard questions that we should all be giving hard answers | :24:05. | :24:08. | |
to. I get to produce something beautiful out of it. The art is fun. | :24:09. | :24:12. | |
If I entertain people, then I have taken something and actually created | :24:13. | :24:15. | |
something good about something that maybe didn't start out so hot. 2016 | :24:16. | :24:19. | |
was a year that stirred deep emotion and turned conventional wisdom on | :24:20. | :24:22. | |
its head. My only prediction for 2017, HARDtalk will still be roving | :24:23. | :24:28. | |
the world with the questions that matter. Until then, have a very | :24:29. | :24:30. | |
happy New Year. | :24:31. | :24:33. |