Live Fixed-Odds Betting Terminals Question House of Commons

to serve their sentence abroad. I

would like to assure him, this is a

key focus and we will continue to

pursue it.

Order. Urgent question,

Tom Watson.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Will the Secretary of State make a

statement on gaming machines and

social responsibility?

Minister,

Tracy Crouch.

Mr Speaker, I am

pleased to inform the House this

morning I published a consultation

on proposals to changes to gaming

machines and social responsibility

measures across the gambling

industry. The consultation will run

for 12 weeks during which the

general public, industry and

interested parties can voice their

views. I appreciate some I not

understand why we run a consultation

but this is the right process to

proceed if we are to address this

issue thoroughly and properly. The

government announced a review of

gaming machines and social

responsibility measures in October

20 16. I am grateful to those who

responded, including former addicts,

faith groups, local authorities and

the bookmakers. The objective was to

make sure we have the right balance

between a sector that can grow and

contribute to the economy and one

that is socially responsible to do

all it could to protect consumers

and communities. While our

consultation sets out a package of

measures to protect vulnerable

people from harm, the main area of

interest has been on gaming

machines. We believe the current

regulation is inappropriate to

achieve our objective of protecting

consumers and wider communities. We

are therefore consulting on

regulatory changes to the maximum

state looking at options between £50

and £2 in order to reduce the

potential for large losses and the

potential harmful impact on the

player, their families and the wider

community. The factors which

influence the extent of harm to the

player of wider than one product or

a limited set of parameters, such as

steaks and prizes and include

factors around the player, the

environment and the products. We are

consulting on corresponding social

responsibility measures on player

protections in the online sector and

a package of measures on gambling

advertising. We want to see industry

regulator and charities continuing

to drive this social responsibility

agenda to make sure all is being

done to protect players and those

affected can get the treatment and

help they needed.

Tom Watson.

Thank

you for granting this urgent

question. I would like to praise the

Minister for the manner in which she

has conducted this review. She has

kept me under the members of the

House informed through the process

and has shown exemplary attention to

detail. It is a shame she doesn't

have a completely free hand in this

policy. Because we think the outcome

could have been very different, Mr

Speaker. The response from the

government after a year-long process

of delay, after delay and hundreds

of submissions from industry, local

government, charities, campaigners

and church groups, is deeply

disappointing. Instead of taking a

firm and reasonable action of

counteracting the problems of these

machines, the government has kicked

this process further into the long

grass and announced another

consultation beyond the budget. Mr

Speaker, let's look at the Public

policy challenge we face in this

House. 430,000 people addicted to

gambling. Up a third in three years.

A further 2 million problem gamblers

at risk of developing an addiction.

£1.8 billion lost on these machines

each year, an increase of 79% over

the last eight years. Gambling

industry whose yield the amount they

win in bets, has increased to £13.8

billion, up from £8.3 billion in

2009. But they only paid £10 million

for education and treatment services

on a voluntary levy this year. Worst

of all, 450,000 children who gamble

at least once a week. Mr Speaker,

this situation requires action now.

There is an old maxim that the

bookies always win. And they have

one again today. Their shares are up

and their lobbyists were grinning

from ear to ear on their TV

interviews this morning. We have

consistently said to the government,

our gambling laws are no longer fit

for purpose. There has been an

explosion of online and digital

platform gambling that the current

act could not have anticipated. We

have offered to work with the

government on a cross-party basis,

to make our laws fit for the digital

age. This report could have been a

significant starting point for the

process. Because even by the most

conservative estimates, the

associated harms and cost of a

gambling addiction is believed to be

over £1 billion a year and I bet the

true figure is far higher. The

impact is not just felt to the

losses gamblers accrue, but through

the NHS and treatment costs in our

communities, as families struggle

and breakdown and in our police

forces dealing with the crime. I

would like to ask the Minister, what

discussions did she have with the

Home Office on how to measure

gambling related crime? Does the

Minister know how many people have

received counselling or treatment

for gambling addiction in the last

12 months when her review started.

Does the Minister know how much

treatment for gambling addiction

cost the NHS each year. She said, on

the number of occasions from the

dispatch box, the gambling industry

has not done enough to fund

research, education and treatment of

gambling related harm. But again,

she failed to bring the industry to

heal. She could have introduced a

compulsory levy and we would have

supported her. Mr Speaker, this is a

missed opportunity. A missed

opportunity to settle the issues of

these machines once and for all.

Quite frankly, we expected more. The

government had a strong hand to

play, but this is a busted flush.

Minister.

Mr Speaker, can I thank

the honourable gentleman for his

initial kind words at the start of

his speech. I am pleased to see his

conversion on this issue. He was

minister in the government that took

through legislation that liberalised

gambling and cause harm many people

have suffered as a consequence of

these machines. It is this

government that is taking action on

this issue. I appreciate his

concerns about the fact that this is

a consultation. But it is clearly

the fact the Labour government, in

2005, rushed through the gambling

act without paying proper focus on

the issue of these machines, that

have led to the proliferation of

these machines. They didn't exist in

1997 when the Labour Party came into

power. It is this government that

has recognised the harm that has

been caused and is taking action on

this issue. There is a consultation,

it is due process and I expect

people to contribute to that

process.

May I welcome the

consultation, particularly as I

think there is information now about

the effect of category B machines,

which did not exist when the select

committee look that this about five

years ago. Will she confirm the

government's position remains that

any decisions taken in the future

will be evidence -based?

I can

confirm that to be the case. The

call for evidence, a lot of

people'sviews on this matter, but it

has been made clear we need to take

action on this issue. The

Constitution sets out for different

options, but the one thing that is

certain from the call for evidence,

is the status quo will not be

maintained.

I fear the government

have missed another opportunity to

tackle this problem. By announcing

yet another consultation, they are

attempting to kick this further into

the long grass. The move to cut the

maximum state, while welcome, it

doesn't go far enough and Scotland,

£4 billion is spent every year on

2000 gaming machines and this is at

a time when more people are being

identified as being problem or at

risk gamblers.

If this Parliament is willing to

act, the Scottish Parliament is.

Will the minister start the process

of devolving all gambling powers to

the Scottish Parliament?

We have

already devolved a number of powers

to the Scottish Parliament, of which

they have not taken up a number of

the powers.

Can I congratulate the

minister on her announcements today?

Does she not find the hypocrisy of

the members opposite astonishing

when it was then that meant that

doubled the number of fixed odds

betting terminals in shops, tried to

withdraw powers of local councils to

stop betting shops being placed on

high streets, does she find their

attitude extraordinary at this

stage?

I would be perfectly honest,

I find the attitude disappointing.

We have worked on a cross-party

basis for a number of years. I have

poured heart and soul into the

consultation. We have taken the

issue much further forward than it

has ever been before. This

government is taking action on an

area of gambling that brings a great

deal of concern into our communities

and affects individuals, families

and society as a whole and this

government is taking it forward and

dealing with it.

I refer to my entry

in the register of interests. I am a

member of the co-party group on

horse racing. Horse racing relies

heavily on the levy from bookmakers

but also on advertising sponsorship

and media rights. Will she assure me

that she will work with the

industry, with horse racing, over

the coming weeks to ensure that

whilst protecting those who are

vulnerable to gambling, we also

protect jobs, investment, and

economic benefits that my

constituency receives for hosting

the best racecourse in the country,

Haydock Park.

What my honourable

friend in the department would not

let me forget it is one of the

largest racecourses in his

constituency. We do not see any

particularly negative impact of

these changes to horse racing.

Actually it may well encourage

bookmakers and others to concentrate

and focus more on horse racing.

The

honourable gentleman for Shipley is

clutching a newspaper article from

which no doubt he wishes to quote.

Can I urge the minister not to

listen to the Shadow Secretary of

State. He and I were both on the

select committee that looked into

these matters and he was that

interested that he did not turn up

to one evidence session. Perhaps if

he had he would have been more

knowledgeable on the subject. The

gambling commission, over the

summer, published its report into

problem gambling and found that the

highest levels of problem gambling

were in spread betting. Then three

betting on the betting exchange and

then through paying poker in pubs

and clubs. Then betting online on

events like horse racing and

greyhound racing. Then followed by

gaming machines in bookmakers. Given

that are much higher levels of

problem gambling with unlimited

stakes and unlimited potential

winnings, if the Government is so

obsessed with evidence, why is it

just focusing so much on betting

machines in bookmakers or is it

plain to the gallery as most of us

know it really is all about.

--

gallery. Can I gently urge my

honourable friend to read the

consultation document that was

published today. This is not just

about public gamblers, it is also

about those who may be at risk from

harmful gambling. One thing we know

is there are more people out there

who are at risk of harmful gambling,

of which the issue around this is

just one of those. This delivers a

whole package of measures to look at

the whole risk it might cause.

My

constituency has 54 Fobts. We are

deprived constituency. The gambling

aware of report which came a

sedative costing the UK 1.2 billion

to look after those people who are

victims of gambling who have become

addicted and have various problems.

What assessment has she done if the

£50 option is chosen as far as the

cost to the UK Government will be to

look after the people who will still

be affected by such a high stake?

Mr

Speaker, can I congratulate the

honourable gentleman for the work he

has done on this? He is a long-time

campaigner around the issues of

Fobts. He has done an excellent job

of standing up for his constituents

who have become victims of addiction

to gambling. In terms of the options

set out in the consultation paper,

there are four options within it.

£50 with £30, £20 and £2. Separate

impact assessments have been

published.

I am pleased to hear the

minister speaking about protecting

the vulnerable from harm. The CS

Jairo Paul says, the high stakes of

Fobts have compounded the social

issues perpetuated by gambling. This

goes way beyond addicted gamblers to

affect many families and children

disastrously. Can I implore the

minister to consider a reduction of

£50 will not resolve the issue for

those?

I am grateful for my

honourable friend was no comments it

is clear that we have listened to

all the public concerns about the

risk of high stake gambling, which

is why we have published this

overall package of measures today. I

would encourage her and others to

make their views clear as part of

the consultation.

With the minister

agree with me that were given the

danger that people wanting to make

large bets will be pushed online to

the less regulated area, that

perhaps they could consider

extending the consultation to online

equivalents like blackjack where

thousands of pounds can be backed

with one hand and then lost?

The

consultation does address the issue

around online gambling. There is a

huge amount of growth. As part of

this package today we have announced

we expect to see stricter

protections in place as part of the

licensing conditions for online

gambling operators and so I hope she

will look at those specific measures

and respond accordingly.

Thank you,

Mr Speaker. I am the other

co-chairman of the all-party racing

group. I have the honour of

representing Cheltenham racecourse,

which I would say is the best

racecourse in the world. I am

concerned that the transfers from

Fobts would happen. Can I stress the

importance to horse racing to the

importance of bookmakers? That is

the same across the world and you

takes a decision, can I ask for full

consultation so we do not throw the

baby out with the bath water?

There

is no intention to damage the horse

racing sector may encourage he and

other members of the house to look

at the letter that was sent to me by

the chief Executive of Paddy Power

who, himself recognises that this

issue has become a toxic issue for

the industry may well be driving

punters away from the shops. This is

something I know that members of the

bookmaking industry are very keen to

get involved with. There are

certainly no intention to the horse

racing or any other sporting

industry.

May I thank the Minister

for the consultation paper which we

will study with interest? Can I ask

the minister one matter, if this

results in losses to jobs in betting

shops across the United Kingdom,

will the minister carry out an

impact assessment on what that will

actually mean before she determines

her final decision on this matter?

In terms of television broadcasting,

there are five and a half lines in

their support on television

broadcasting. Everyone knows it is

gambling adverts that are doing more

damage to people than probably

Fobts.

We will assess all the

evidence we receive as part of the

consultation. The impact assessment

has been published looking at these

matters. In terms of advertising and

there are regulations in place

around advertising cost we have

announced as part of the package

today that there will be an industry

broadcast funded responsible

gambling campaign. It is of a scare

that is larger than any government

public awareness campaign. We expect

that to be prevalent within the

parameters that you are allowed to

have gambling adverts. It is a fact

that you can see gambling adverts

during live sporting events and we

are addressing some of the issues

around the tone and content of some

of those adverts. It is there to say

that while they may be annoying, in

terms of content, not to anything

good is beyond what they are allowed

to do in terms of regulation. We

will keep a close eye on that.

Is my

right honourable friend aware that

many people would like to see the

limits of fixed odds betting Sheen

machines dropped. In my constituency

we have 55 such machines and they

have taken £90 million out of our

economy. This money can frankly be

spent elsewhere. Was he comment on

the gambling industry in a deeply

selfish attitude to become addicted

to the profits that these machines

generate and add addiction to the

profits which has meant people

getting addicted to this kind of

gambling who are at the poorer end

of the spectrum.

It is deeply

troubling. I'm grateful to my

honourable friend's response. Many

have been impacted by these machines

and they should take a look at the

consultation paper and replied that

this is an opportunity to take a

long hard look at themselves and

look at the office to the British

punter for that we should see what

happens over the course of the next

12 weeks.

Mr Speaker, I recently

visited a national clinic and

commend the work done. This is the

only such clinic in the United

kingdom. Does the minister agree

with me that more help needs to be

riding for individuals of family who

are affected with problem gambling?

One way of doing this would be to

put a statutory levy on the makers

say they can do it with more than

the millions of pounds in profit

that they make. One can we do agree.

We have put into the consultation

paper is some issues around the

levy. Bookmakers have to contribute

0.01% of their profits. If they did

that there would be something in the

region of £30 million to £40 million

going into the issue. That is

currently not happening across the

board. In the consultation we have

made it very clear we want to see

that happen. If it does not happen

then we will certainly consider the

introduction of a mandatory levy.

I

strongly welcome consultation

brought forward together and many of

us are member the disastrous

legislation on Fobts under the last

government and that oppose all to

bring in super casinos. I would urge

the minister to look at online

gambling, the situations where

people can gamble repeatedly through

the light night on online casinos

whilst drinking.

I am grateful to my

honourable friend for these

comments. We are looking at the

issue around online gambling. As it

stands at the moment, we are seeing

about 10% of the adult population

participating in online gambling and

betting, of which around 5.1% of the

players were problem gamblers. This

compares to 11.5% of Fobt users, who

are problem gamblers. While we have

seen growth, we know whether current

issues particularly live.

-- where

the current issues. On Thursday I

visited gambling rehabilitation

centre in my constituency which

provides a 14 week programme for

about half a dozen residents at time

it is run by the Gordon Moody

Association and demand for the

service outstrips what they can

offer. Will the minister commend the

bike to work that the Gordon Moody

Association does but also commit to

a compulsory levy on the industry to

fund vital work such as this?

Mr

Speaker, I would be very happy to

commend the work that is being done

in my constituency. We do know that

there is this shortage of places

that deal specifically with gambling

addiction. -- a shortage was that we

are speaking to colleagues within

the Department of Health to ensure

that happens. In answer to the

previous question, we do think the

industry should contribute more on a

voluntary basis. If they do not we

will consider mandatory levy.

The Victoria Derbyshire programme

this morning when the honourable

lady spoke and then at 10:15am a man

called Terry spoke and he said if

stakes were just £2, he wouldn't

have lost everything. On a vote, it

would get through and also on a

whipped vote, it would get through.

I am grateful to my honourable

friend for both television and

witting advice. We are looking at

these issues and the options are

there. £2 is in the consultation

paper and that is something there

has been a great deal of public

demand for. We are going through a

consultation process. Everyone will

be able to submit their views to

that process and we will make a

decision during next year.

May I

thank the Minister for the helpful

way she has worked with me as chair

of the all-party group to get us to

the point we are now. And the

Minister will be aware of my

concerns on these machines about the

addiction and the consequences of

addiction. There is insufficient

treatment for addicts and no

residential treatment at all for

women. There is potential for

criminal activity to feed their

habit, vandalism through frustration

and a worrying opportunity for

money-laundering. Addicts put

pressure on the benefit system

because of their chaotic lives and

mental health issues which prevent

them from working. Before a final

decision is made I urge the Minister

to consider all the social

consequences of a dreadful addiction

to these dreadful machines.

Mr

Speaker, may I first start by

congratulating the honourable lady,

what she has done, along with many

others across the House, across both

houses on the all-party group. Many

of the issues she raised is

precisely why the government is

taking action on this issue and why

we have published the consultation.

It is not just about the person who

is the Gambler, whether it is a

problem gambler, but the associated

consequences to their family,

friends and the communities they

live in.

Thank you Mr Speaker. Would

my honourable friend agree with me

that bookmakers do actually provide

considerable employment, they

contribute to the economy and for

the vast majority of gamblers, a bit

of enjoyment and light fun. We

should not forget that.

Mr Speaker,

that is why we are taking the

balanced approach we are, which is

making sure we continue to support a

socially responsible sector, while

also protecting the most vulnerable

in society.

Mr Speaker, in just one

borough, nearly £1.5 million was

lost to these machines last year.

Can I ask the minister, not to bow

to industry pressure and cap at the

top stake at £2.

I thank the

honourable member. We are looking at

the whole variety of options when it

comes to the stake and I would urge

him and others to make their views

known within the next 12 weeks.

It

is so important we have the right

and strong protections in place

around online gambling, particularly

where young people and some of the

most vulnerable are concerned. I

welcome her announcement. I wonder,

could she provide further details on

the responsible gambling advertising

campaign her department has

announced?

Mr Speaker, gamble aware

and the advertising Association will

come together to draw up a

multi-million pound, two-year

responsible advertising campaign. It

will have a budget between five and

£7 million each year and will

include television ads, including

around live sport, cinema and

online.

I consider the Minister of

fun, not least because we both

support Tottenham Hotspur, the best

in the Premiership. But she will

know on this issue, I have come paid

for the seven years. It was a

mistake to introduce these machines

to the high Street, a complete

mistake. It is not just a reduction

in state, can she say a bit more

about a reduction of the

proliferation of betting shops

across the country and across the

high street?

Mr Speaker, I am not

sure the reference to me supporting

Tottenham Hotspur endears me to you,

but can I thank the honourable

gentleman for his comments. The

issues around the proliferation of

bookmakers in our high streets is

one we looked at as part of the call

for evidence. We concluded local

authorities do have the powers to

address this issue, but I think when

we take the whole thing, the whole

package of measures, it is something

that there will be a reduction, if

the stakes are reduced significantly

in the future.

Mr Peter Bowen.

Thank

you, Mr Speaker, for calling another

Spurs fan immediately. The excellent

minister is bringing forward a

useful consultation. If we make the

wrong decision, if we make the

situation worse by driving problem

gamblers out of betting shops, which

is a controlled environment, to

online and making the situation

worse. I think the consultation is

right, but I think we should look at

that during the consultation.

Online

gambling manages to have a better

opportunity for protecting players

because they have the details and

the player practices, so we are

obviously going to, as part of the

consultation, look at how we can

protect online gambling. But we have

more opportunity to do that as a

post is somebody going in and out of

different bookmakers.

The scale of

harm being inflicted by these

appalling machines in my area

prompted new council to lead calls

for a £2 maximum stake. We have

heard that if that happens, the

number of betting shops could be

halved around the country. Can I

reassure the Minister, if the number

of betting shops in East Ham high

street was halved, there would still

be too many of them. Can she get on

and introduced the £2 stake as

quickly as possible?

This gives me

an opportunity to thank Newham

Council for the work they have done.

With the leader of the council, as

part of the call for evidence and to

his representation of other local

authorities, including my own, who

have signed up to the issues around

stakes, I do think it is part of the

consultation process and I would

encourage new and other local

authorities to let their views be

known.

Will consultation look at the

costs caused by the fix betting

terminals, bawling on the police,

mental health services and the

families of vulnerable gamblers,

especially the children?

That is

exactly what we are doing and as

part of the call for evidence, a lot

of that came through. I know the

honourable gentleman is a member of

the Health Select Committee, who

took evidence from a professor with

expertise in this, who related some

of the facts around suicide related

to gambling. It is important to

remember it is not just the person

who is gambling that faces the

consequences of harm, but it is

their families and communities they

live in. That is why we are taking a

balanced approach to this and having

an open consultation ensuring we

have a socially responsible sector

that protects those most at harm.

Can I thank the Minister for his

statement this morning. I know the

discussions I have had with the

Minister, she also concerns with

many in this House, to have drastic

and clear changes. My honourable

friend referred to the online

gambling and can I urge the Minister

to take more cognizance of that? But

the consultation is important.

450,000 addicts cannot be ignored.

The Minister stated the figure of

between £2 and £50 for a state. Can

I urge the Minister it is closer to

the lower figure than it is to the

higher figure and reduce the harmful

gambling addiction in this country.

I'm grateful for his question and I

hope he and many others will respond

to the consultation with their views

on this issue. We are trying to

ensure we take all people'sviews

into account before we make a final

decision as to what the stake is.

We

are shocked with the figures the

Minister shared with the House. The

number has gone up by a third in

recent years. Are these numbers the

government recognises? What does the

government say are the causes of

that? And where she to limit the

stakes to £2, how many fewer problem

gamblers would there be after that

policy was introduced.

The

honourable gentleman opposite is

absolutely correct in his figures,

they are government numbers, 430,000

problem gamblers in Great Britain

and there is a further 2 million

that might be at risk. We have

50,000 to call the helpline every

year and about 8000 are getting

treatment, but this figure doesn't

include those who get treatment

under the NHS system. So we are

looking at all the areas of harm

around this, it is not just about

problem gamblers, it is those at

risk of harmful gambling and the

consequences and impact it has on

the individual and their families. I

would encourage him to look at the

consultation and the impact

assessment and come to live view as

to what he thinks will be the best

steak and encourage his constituents

to do the same.

Millions of pounds

was frittered away in Glasgow in one

year. I am disappointed we are going

for another consultation and not

action on this. My make-up legally

do move to cut the stake to £2. Will

Minister listen and come to Main

Street where it is littered with

betting terminals and people are

addicted to these, so we can take

action on this sooner rather than

later.

We are following due process.

It is important we don't rush it

through because we have seen hastily

made legislation can cause great

impact than harm, as