12/03/2018 House of Commons


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12/03/2018

Live coverage of the day's proceedings in the House of Commons, including urgent questions on hate crime and treatment of parliamentary staff.


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I think we are done. Are we done?

OK, urgent question.

Thank you. To

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ask the Secretary of State and home

Department if she will make a

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statement on hate crime in light of

the inflammatory letters inciting a

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punish a Muslim day on the 3rd of

April.

As you will appreciate the

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letters described in the question

are part of an ongoing investigation

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and as such I'm not in a position to

comment on them but the government

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condemns the content of these

letters is clearly a torrent with no

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place in decent society -- ab

horrid.

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We take a crime and is a phobia very

seriously and we have a framework to

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respond to it -- Islamophobia.

Freedom of speech and the rule of

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law and equal rights defined us as a

society and the government is

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determined to promote these values

actively working in partnership and

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alongside Muslim and indeed all

faith communities to demonstrate

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that what we have in common is the

best defence against extremists who

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would seek to divide and our hate

crime action plan sets out our comp

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Ran Singh approach to tackling hate

crime. -- sets out our

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comprehensive. We have a strong

range of guidelines. The legislation

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provides equal protection under the

law for all ethnic and religious

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groups. We have sources of expert

advice on the nature and causes of

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hate crime through the anti-Muslim

hate crime working group and the

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Independent advisory group on hate

crime. We have committed £2.4

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million over three years to help

protect places of worship that have

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been subject or vulnerable to a hate

crime attack and we have also

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committed a further £1 million

following the terrible Finsbury Park

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attack in June last year to help

protect places of worship and

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associated community centres which

are vulnerable to attack on racial,

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religious or ideological grounds and

so far we have funded 45 mosques

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under both schemes and we have also

funded tell Mama to record

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anti-Muslim hatred incidents and we

have made it mandatory for police

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forces to disaggregate religious

hate crime data held by the police

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to reveal the true scale and nature

of the problem which we are

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determined to tackle.

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Thank you for granting this urgent

question. The letter calling for an

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attack on Muslims on April the 3rd

offers reward for attackers, ten

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points for verbal abuse, 50 points

for throwing acid, 1000 points for

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bombing at a mosque and two and two

and a half thousand points to nuke

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Mecca. Can I remind the house that

millions of Muslims fought for us in

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the two world wars including members

of my own family. Figures show that

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Islamophobia hate crime has

increased by 40%, 1678 anti-Muslim

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hate crimes reported in London just

until January this year, so can I

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ask the minister if she can explain

why no government ministers in the

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last eight years have ever made a

speech on the rise of anti-Muslim

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hatred? Recent history has shown

that 50% of the British population

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believe that Islam is a threat to

Western democracy and over 30% of

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young children believe that Muslims

are taking over England. Given such

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anti-Muslim views have gained such

traction what is the government

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going to do to help prevent the

growth of such extreme views that

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appears to have come from parts of

the print, broadcast and social

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media? What concrete stuff is the

government going to do to tackle the

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growth in hate crimes and hate

against Muslims question up can the

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minister set up the amount of

funding that is provided by the Home

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Office to tackle each form of

bigotry? Mr speaker, and I'm sure

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every member will accept this, there

has been a sharp rise in the far

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right movement in Europe and beyond

with the USA president retweeting

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far right material, this is a really

urgent situation and it needs to be

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urgently tackled another forward to

hearing the minister respond as to

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what concrete stuff will be taken to

deal with this.

I thank you for

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bringing forward this urgent

question and may I make it clear

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that this government wants to give a

strong message of support to Muslims

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across the UK, we are committed to

their safety and security and if

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anyone has received this letter or a

similar communication please contact

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the police where they will be

treated with the utmost seriousness

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and action will be taken. Moving to

the points, the issue of anti-Muslim

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and indeed far right extremism, is a

focus for the government. The

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preventive strategy which tackles

extremism doesn't tackle Muslim

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extremism in and of itself, it

tackles extremism in general and

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sadly over a quarter of referrals in

the strategy in 2015 concerned the

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far right extremists and and so this

government and in particular this

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Prime Minister with the experience

that she brings to her position

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following her experience in the Home

Office, all of this is focused on

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tackling extremism and

radicalisation and how this affects

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our community which is precisely why

we are refreshing the hate crime

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action plan this year.

Anna Soubry.

I want to put this on record, the

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mayor of rock star happens to be a

Muslim -- Brock Stowe. She happens

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to be the first person of colour to

be mayor here and the first person

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to be a Muslim mayor and also

happens to be a Tory, and as it also

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happens in her office of nearly one

year completed, she has had a warm

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welcome where ever she has gone in

my borough and rightly so. People

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are sick and tired of hate crime,

Islamophobia, it is absolutely no

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longer to be tolerated and I commend

the minister for everything she has

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said in her statement and I do

believe that this government takes

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it very seriously. This isn't really

a hate crime, this is an act of

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blatant incitement to terrorism but

in any event I'm looking over at the

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co-chair of the all-party

Parliamentary group on Muslims, the

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member for Ilford North, we worked

together on this and I'm sure he'll

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agree, the time has come for a

proper legal definition of

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Islamophobia, would the minister

agree?

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We don't accept the need for a

definitive one

but we know that

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Islamophobia is clearly recognised

and we have very effective

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monitoring of the anti-Muslim hatred

group in these areas.

Can I

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congratulate my honourable friend

for securing it? The despicable

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sentiments behind the sickening

letters has caused revulsion across

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our communities, and while we can be

confident that thanks to the

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tireless dedication of community

leaders, charities, faith groups in

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civil society these deliberate

attempts to divide us will not

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succeed. Nevertheless, this act will

have struck fear into the heart of

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communities, and indeed that was its

intention. This was indeed an

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incitement to violence, and it

cannot go unpunished. As we have

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heard, hate crimes nationwide are

rising. In London alone there has

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been a fivefold increase on attacks

on Muslims in the last year. The

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threat from the extreme right wing

as the outgoing territory Mark

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Rowley has said is significant and

it requires urgent attention. The

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murder of our colleague and friend

Jo Cox, the attack at Finsbury Park

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Moss, the jailing of the leaders of

Britain first and the reports from

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the Anderson review, which suggested

that the extreme right wing are

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engaged in credible attack planning,

including bomb-making. There is now

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overwhelming evidence that the

threat from the extreme right is

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growing increasingly violent, and we

have to be clear that by threatening

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members of our diverse communities,

they are also a threat to our

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national security, fax to their

anti-democratic, dehumanising and

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murderous beliefs. Given the

overwhelming evidence it is clear

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that so-called domestic extremism

needs to be dealt with as a first

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order threat, so can the minister

assure us that in mind that the

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Anderson review recommendations, the

joint terrorist analysis centre will

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increase the role for MI5, JTAC and

the counter terror network in the

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monitoring and handling of domestic

extremism? And is it not time to

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update the contest strategy to

reflect the growing threat from the

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extreme right? More broadly, can we

be assured that counterterrorism

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policing has the resources they

need? Last month, only half of what

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was requested by the police was

given, for counterterrorism, and

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police and our services are facing

unprecedented threat from terrorism

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in all forms. These letters are an

attempt to divide us, in that they

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will not succeed. We must be united

as a house and a country in bearing

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down in the insidious beliefs

contained within and be absolutely

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clear how we will bring together the

police, schools, colleges and all

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authorities to stand up to hate

crime and terrorism in every single

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one of its forms. And finally to

ensure that we, all of us, as

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elected politicians are at all times

responsible in our language and

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rhetoric, and never seek to embolden

those who hold such insidious and

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extremist views.

I am sure everyone

in the house agrees with the

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honourable lady, particularly on

that last point about the importance

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of using our language very, very

carefully. In terms of resources,

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she asked me about police resources,

of course we have increased fees,

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and the Home Secretary, is the

honourable lady will know, reviews

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these resources constantly. We asked

the police if they have the

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resources we need and the Home

Secretary act accordingly. In terms

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of the JTAC and other queries that

she made, may I undertake to write

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to the honourable lady specifically,

please? And finally just say it is

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gratifying to see so many Members

End house today here unified in

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condemning these dreadful letters

and their sentiments, and our

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determination to tackle them.

Hate

crime in all its forms is to be

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condemned, as is this letter.

Another group which is affected by

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growing hate crime is the Jewish

community, and the community

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security trust is having to go to

ever greater lengths to protect

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local Jewish community centres. Can

we ensure that all these forms of

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hate crime are combated as far as

possible?

I thank my honourable

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friend for his question, and of

course any group of people who are

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the victims of hate crime as a

result of their religious beliefs

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deserve our sympathy and also our

action, and I, like him, condemn any

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form of anti-Semitism, and I know

that the police are as focused on

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this form of crime as they are on

any other form of religious hate

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crime.

Can I congratulate the

honourable and landed lady for

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Bolton South East in securing this

urgent question, and reassure her

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and the rest of the house that the

Scottish National Party joins in the

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condemnation of Islamophobia in the

strongest possible terms? We believe

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that there is no excuse for any sort

of hate crime, and we were as

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concerned as everyone else in this

house to see the significant rise in

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hate crime statistics in England and

Wales last year and we note that

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followed a spike in hate crime stats

around the time of the EU

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referendum, and as others have said

this is happening alongside a

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significant rise in right wing

extremism. In Scotland, the police

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are committed to making victims,

witnesses and partner agencies feel

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more confident in reporting hate

crime, and they do that through a

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variety of methods, including a note

network of third-party porting

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centres. In Scotland a senior judge

has been appointed to lead an

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independent review into hate crime

legislation, and he will be

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reporting to the Scottish Government

later this year. Can I ask the

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minister what reassurance she can

give us that similar steps are being

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taken in the rest of the UK where

hate crime is rising and in

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particular that similar steps are

being taken to tackle the specific

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problem here, which is Islamophobia?

I thank the honourable lady for her

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question and indeed for her

contributions as to what is

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happening in Scotland. We very much

look at how we tackle hate crime

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particularly throughout hate crime

action plan, which was published in

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2016 and will be refreshed this

year, and includes a range of

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actions, including funding for

security for places of worship, the

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disaggregation of religious -based

hate crime data, and taking further

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action in relation to education, so

that teachers can have sometimes

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difficult conversations with this

Judon is as to beliefs, and words,

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and funding programmes through the

Anne Frank trust and street crimes.

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We are determined that our action in

relation to hate crime is up-to-date

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and current.

As someone who visited

a Syrian refugee camp in Turkey over

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the weekend, I find it a little

offensive that a member on the

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opposite side said that no

Conservative minister had actually

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ever condemned any kind of Muslim

extremism. Is the Minister aware

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that her equivalent at the

Department for Education publicly

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rebuked the President of the United

States for retweeting said in

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comments and invited him to visit

this link communities in the United

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Kingdom?

Iheanacho tamely grateful

to my honourable friend, I wasn't

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sure I had heard the honourable lady

correctly, because as I say the

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record of the Prime Minister and

Cabinet ministers on the issue of

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tackling anti-Muslim sentiment I

thought was pretty clear. But it may

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be that the honourable lady can

clarify her remarks at a later

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stage.

With regard to the previous

question, I don't think it

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represented the point my honourable

friend was making, and I hope that

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we can address this issue as a

united Parliament, and not in a way

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that is divided, when I think we

should all stand together against

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this kind of vile threat, this

insight and this illegal incitement

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to violence, and our whole

parliament, the police and

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communities across the country

should want to stand firm with

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Muslim families, Muslim communities,

against this kind of vile

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Islamophobia, because we know from

throughout history that an attack on

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some of us is an attack on all of

us, and that is why we stand firm.

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But I want to ask the Minister what

the Home Office has done since I

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raised last week the prevalence of

national action, illegal propaganda

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videos on YouTube still, and also I

discover on Twitter and on Facebook?

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Because we know that the former

counterterror chief has warned of

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online radicalisation, of the rise

right extremism, and our select

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committee has heard in our enquiry

about the serious issues around as a

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phobia and hate crime. She will know

we are allowing social media

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companies to collude with these far

right extremists if action is not

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taken to take this vile illegal

propaganda down.

I am a dream the

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grateful to the right honourable

member, and she knows the work that

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my right honourable friend the Home

Secretary is doing to work with a

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large technology companies to

improve their reaction on this. I

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think pretty much everyone in this

place and certainly outside of this

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place agrees that technology

companies need to do more to remove

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these hateful pieces of incitement

on their platforms. They must do it

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much more quickly and they must do

it in working with police. So I'm

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sure that we have agreement on that.

Can my right honourable friend

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reassure this house that those

spreading this fear and hatred, in

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whatever form, should be

investigated by the police, and

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where appropriate, dealt severely by

the courts.

Of course, I mustn't

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comment on this particular case

because it is a life police

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investigation but the principle is

that if there is an incident of hate

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crime, the victim of that hate crime

must please report it to the police

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so they can do all they can to bring

these people to justice.

Mr Speaker,

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these letters are abhorrent and are

causing immense distress across

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communities around the country, but

as my right honourable friend has

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indicated, this hate crime is being

amplified via the internets. We know

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there are still too little action

being taken by those social media

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companies. I attended a Round Table

coordinated by two of her

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government's department just before

Christmas and we are still to see

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action. If I tell her a case that

went to court which saw a man jailed

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for two years for the far right

material he put on year -- online,

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that material is still up and it

remains the case for many cases

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across our country. What action is

the government going to take to make

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sure that we don't flame tensions in

our communities by what is seen

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online?

And honourable Mende herself

has been the victim of much hatred

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online, as indeed have other numbers

of this house, and we are very clear

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in our expectation of technology

companies that they will in

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accordance with the law remove this

material as and when it is brought

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to their attention. We have had some

progress, the technology companies I

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think I getting better at this but I

don't for a moment pretend that we

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have got the full response that we

would like to see these posts taken

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down as quickly as possible, and

that is the expectation that the

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Home Secretary makes when she meets

these technology companies.

Could I

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ask the Minister whether a national

unit has been established to check

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on hate crime and identify those

people that are dealing in it, and

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bring them to justice?

We take the

view that hate crime is a matter for

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the whole community, given that it

can take ceremony forms, it is not

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restricted to one's religion. The

five characteristics are set out

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very clearly in the hate crime

legislation and we ensure that the

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police and others are trained to

spot the Skrine when it occurs and

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to deal with it seriously, and I

hope also sensitively.

These letters

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are nothing short of a sick and

cowardly attempt to divide our

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communities. We are proud of our

communities living side by side in

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harmony. There must be a clear

message sent from this house, across

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the house, that we will never cower

to any form of extremism, and we

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will never allow it to threaten the

very fabric of our society for stock

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can I please urge the Minister that

this government does not sit idly by

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and let it happen, as in this great

time of need allowing such awful

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hatred to be propagated would send

the worse message of all?

I would

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hope that the honourable lady has

understood from my reaction that the

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government is not sitting idly by.

We are refreshing, as I say, the

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hate crime action plan this year,

because it has to keep up-to-date

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with the new threats faced by all

different types of people and

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communities. And I can assure her

that we take these allegations, as

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indeed we take allegations, as we

have heard already in the chamber

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today, of anti-Semitism, online

hatred and so on, we take them very

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seriously and I know the police do

as well.

The rising tide of creeping

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Islamophobia and anti-Jewish

sentiment is something that should

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concern us all. I would like to know

how improving the recording of this

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hate crime is helping us to track

what is going on in our society and

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how we can tackle it?

I am extremely

grateful to my honourable friend to

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that question. Of course we now

increasingly data helps give us

0:22:550:23:02

answers, it helps direct our

resources in the right way, and so

0:23:020:23:05

we are very much hoping that by this

aggregating the specific type of

0:23:050:23:12

hate crime, that that will help

individual constabularies work out

0:23:120:23:15

how better to prioritise the

resources to do with the different

0:23:150:23:18

types of hate crime that we know

exist.

0:23:180:23:23

The level of hate and violence

against Muslims has become utterly

0:23:230:23:30

intolerable and for years many of

our constituencies have faced the

0:23:300:23:34

onslaught of threats from the image

defence league and the British first

0:23:340:23:37

and others, can the minister explain

what action her government is going

0:23:370:23:42

to take to provide protections to

those communities who feel under

0:23:420:23:47

threat on the 3rd of April and

secondly what action will she take

0:23:470:23:53

to prescribe groups who are actively

seeking to incite violence and

0:23:530:23:57

hatred across our communities in

this country?

You will understand

0:23:570:24:03

that I must not comment on the

particular investigation going on at

0:24:030:24:06

the moment, but given it is a live

investigation, by definition,

0:24:060:24:15

communities that may be affected by

any such communication will be

0:24:150:24:20

uppermost in the mind of the police

when it comes to protection and

0:24:200:24:25

their vulnerability, but in terms of

tackling far right extremism more

0:24:250:24:30

generally this is part of a cross

government programme of tackling and

0:24:300:24:34

also support for victims and this is

why the preventive strategy is a

0:24:340:24:45

safeguarding strategy and this is

where it has such an impact because

0:24:450:24:49

sadly a quarter of referrals to

Prevent work from far right

0:24:490:24:57

extremism and the strategy is about

leading them away from that part of

0:24:570:25:00

radicalisation so they don't commit

these terrible acts.

This house is

0:25:000:25:06

at its best when it comes to condemn

and comes together to condemn evil

0:25:060:25:10

actions and when it is not trying to

score political points against each

0:25:100:25:15

other and I think we can all unite

about this letter, and we don't know

0:25:150:25:19

who wrote it, it might be some side

individual in a bedsit playing with

0:25:190:25:24

his computer or may be something far

more serious, but we are right to

0:25:240:25:30

say that this is a condemnation and

an in citation to violence,

0:25:300:25:36

especially when it calls on people

to throw acid in people's face. Can

0:25:360:25:40

I just ask the house to think of the

moment of the office of the MP for

0:25:400:25:46

Bedford. There was an incident in

this place earlier today which

0:25:460:25:53

involved him and his staff which may

or may not be connected but we think

0:25:530:25:58

it might be, with this letter and we

must come together and make sure

0:25:580:26:02

this does not happen, not only here

but also throughout the country.

I

0:26:020:26:11

thank my honourable friend from

raising this and I'm sure the

0:26:110:26:14

thoughts of the house are with the

member of Parliament and their

0:26:140:26:17

members of staff concerned although

I have received a note that the

0:26:170:26:22

package found there was not

hazardous which must be of

0:26:220:26:28

significant relief to those people

concerned but we give our sincere

0:26:280:26:32

thanks to the police and others who

went to the rescue of these members

0:26:320:26:36

of staff when they found the

package.

Stella Creasy.

It was

0:26:360:26:42

Friday night when I started to

receive reports from residents in

0:26:420:26:45

Walthamstow that they had received

one of these letters, the fear and

0:26:450:26:49

the terror it caused at the very

point when I was helping other

0:26:490:26:53

residents report anti-Semitic

graffiti they had found in our

0:26:530:26:58

community, will the minister join in

welcoming the work that tell Mammana

0:26:580:27:04

and the security forces are doing to

support these groups? And does she

0:27:040:27:08

agree that we had to do more than

just condemn these instances, when

0:27:080:27:13

we see Steve Bannon come to Europe

and tell people that they should be

0:27:130:27:16

proud to be called a racist, we must

in this house speak up for the

0:27:160:27:22

communities we represent and the

power of diversity and immigration

0:27:220:27:26

to enrich all of our lives and I

tell the minister the people of

0:27:260:27:32

Walthamstow need to demand nothing

less from this government.

They are

0:27:320:27:35

getting it. I'm very grateful to the

the honourable lady setting out her

0:27:350:27:41

concerns and she has highlighted the

fear that people must have felt when

0:27:410:27:43

they received these letters and she

is absolutely right that Tell Mama

0:27:430:27:49

is an organisation which is

universally recognised as playing an

0:27:490:27:52

important role in this field. I'm

told that from the 1st of January

0:27:520:27:58

until the 31st of December 2015,

2622 anti-Muslim hate incidents were

0:27:580:28:05

reported to Tell Mama by victims or

third parties, and that shows the

0:28:050:28:11

scale, three years ago, that we are

facing in this country after these

0:28:110:28:19

worrying incidents of hate crime. We

support Tell Mama to the June >>

0:28:190:28:25

STUDIO:

0:28:250:28:27

-- we support Tell Mama with money.

There's a urgent question to this,

0:28:300:28:37

and so there is a premium on extreme

brevity from back and front benches

0:28:370:28:41

alike.

I also condemn these

despicable letters, following the

0:28:410:28:48

recent incident in my constituency

which I would classify as racist

0:28:480:28:59

abuse, can I confirm that that crime

will be classified correctly and not

0:28:590:29:02

just classified as a public order

offence?

Of course what any such

0:29:020:29:09

matter is an operational matter for

the police but I know she is such a

0:29:090:29:14

good advocate for her local

community but that she will be

0:29:140:29:17

asking searching key Western --

searching questions to make sure the

0:29:170:29:25

question receives the attention it

deserves.

The government is right to

0:29:250:29:29

say this is a hate crime which has

no place in our modern society and I

0:29:290:29:32

want to place my thanks to our

communities in Hounslow who have a

0:29:320:29:37

track record of working together to

create understanding. Will the

0:29:370:29:43

minister confirmed the police would

have the resources to work together

0:29:430:29:45

effectively and fast to track where

these horrific letters are coming

0:29:450:29:50

from, who is disseminating them, who

is behind them, and to make sure our

0:29:500:29:56

schools and communities have the

resources they need to stop this and

0:29:560:30:00

to support these committees which

will rightly feel at risk and under

0:30:000:30:02

threat?

The honourable lady has

identified that this has a threat

0:30:020:30:11

not just on those who received the

letters but also the wider

0:30:110:30:17

neighbourhood and please, ask anyone

who has received any of these

0:30:170:30:20

communications to report them to the

police and the Home Office is in

0:30:200:30:25

constant medication with the police

to make sure they have the resources

0:30:250:30:28

they need to tackle this -- constant

communication.

I join my honourable

0:30:280:30:35

friend in condemning these letters,

and in view of the similarities

0:30:350:30:37

between the anti-Muslim hate crime

and the anti-Semitism we have seen,

0:30:370:30:43

will she reassured me that the

action plan proposed by the

0:30:430:30:46

government will be adequate?

I'm

very grateful for the question and

0:30:460:30:52

he has a long record of supporting

our Jewish committees, and yes, the

0:30:520:30:59

hate crime action plan covers all

form of hatred as defined by the act

0:30:590:31:02

and sadly anti-Semitism forms part

of that.

The appalling letters that

0:31:020:31:10

we have seen have to be seen in the

context of the flames of prejudice

0:31:100:31:16

being found in mainstream newspapers

and in the comments made by

0:31:160:31:23

mainstream politicians against their

Muslim opponents and also in the

0:31:230:31:27

bystanders who are just as complicit

when in person or online they see

0:31:270:31:32

Pegida is on Facebook and other

social media platforms -- Basie

0:31:320:31:36

prejudice. -- they see prejudice.

And instead of tackling it they look

0:31:360:31:43

the other way, can I ask the

minister to confirm that the

0:31:430:31:47

government will take action against

this kind of extremism and also in

0:31:470:31:50

the weeks leading up to the first

week of April, every mosque receives

0:31:500:31:55

a visit from the police to give them

adequate security advice and make

0:31:550:31:58

sure that the Muslim community know

that the authorities are with them

0:31:580:32:02

and on their side?

The anti-Muslim

hatred working group is a group

0:32:020:32:07

which brings together all parties

across government and further afield

0:32:070:32:13

to try and tackle this specific form

of hate crime and one of the initial

0:32:130:32:18

achievements was to work with the

Society of editors to tackle

0:32:180:32:20

anti-Muslim hatred and more recently

with the independent press standards

0:32:200:32:27

organisation to develop training for

editors and journalists to tackle

0:32:270:32:31

the negative portrayal of Muslims in

the media. On his point about making

0:32:310:32:36

sure that mosques are visited in the

run-up to the date mentioned in the

0:32:360:32:42

letter, we will send letters happily

to each Chief Constable to make sure

0:32:420:32:47

they are aware of this and it is a

matter for chief constables but we

0:32:470:32:53

would expect that mosques will be

protected.

I also join with my

0:32:530:33:00

honourable friend in condemning

these letters but I also welcomed

0:33:000:33:03

the money that has been devoted to

protecting places of worship from

0:33:030:33:06

hate crime. Good my right honourable

friend also expand on this? -- code.

0:33:060:33:19

I'm happy to do this and it follows

on from the previous question, the

0:33:190:33:24

government has committed £2.4

million over three years to help

0:33:240:33:28

protect places of worship that have

been subject to or are vulnerable to

0:33:280:33:33

a hate attack and we hope this will

make people feel safe in their

0:33:330:33:40

places of worship.

You don't have to

have been taught media studies to

0:33:400:33:46

know that anti-Muslim sentiment is

comment -- becoming common in our

0:33:460:33:54

tabloid press, so could she have a

word with our friends in the Tory

0:33:540:34:01

press? These things feed into the

actions of extremists.

I hope

0:34:010:34:10

everyone in the house knows that as

the minister for crime and

0:34:100:34:13

safeguarding and von ability of

course I'm against language which

0:34:130:34:18

leads to the incitement of violence

and hate crime -- vulnerability. I

0:34:180:34:22

would help this debate that I would

hope this debate sends a clear

0:34:220:34:26

message to the people with whom she

is concerned.

As one house we all

0:34:260:34:31

find these letters are awful and our

constituents will feel the same but

0:34:310:34:38

can my honourable friend make sure

that police forces will tackle these

0:34:380:34:46

instances collaboratively?

Indeed,

we expect police forces to work

0:34:460:34:52

collaboratively especially online,

because online extremism and online

0:34:520:35:01

radicalisation knows no geographical

boundary and the police are well

0:35:010:35:04

versed sadly in working together to

tackle this form of hatred.

There

0:35:040:35:10

has been horror and revulsion at

these letters and I'm proud of our

0:35:100:35:18

record in standing up against hate

crime in the diverse timidity that

0:35:180:35:22

we live in Cardiff, but would the

minister agree that words social

0:35:220:35:26

media companies are simply not

enough? Does she share my concern

0:35:260:35:32

that representatives of these social

media companies said to me they

0:35:320:35:36

would not routinely search for

prescribed organisations? The very

0:35:360:35:44

basic level of what they are doing,

does she have a concern?

The Home

0:35:440:35:50

Secretary is focused on the conduct

and assistance that technology

0:35:500:35:54

companies can give to the police

nationally and locally in taking

0:35:540:35:57

down this awful material in this

goes across online with child sexual

0:35:570:36:10

expertise you and there is a great

0:36:100:36:13

this shows the ignorance of the

perpetrators, and the anonymity is

0:36:270:36:33

even more damaging online, so is it

not time not just to do more to take

0:36:330:36:37

them down once these things have

been posted but to stop them being

0:36:370:36:41

posted in the first place and make

sure that the identity of the people

0:36:410:36:46

posting has to be revealed before

they have these accounts?

The Home

0:36:460:36:52

Secretary was in California recently

to discuss these matters with the

0:36:520:36:55

online companies, the technology

companies, and the question of

0:36:550:37:01

anonymity is an issue which we are

looking at in terms of the internet

0:37:010:37:08

stretcher to -- internet strategy

because we want the UK to be the

0:37:080:37:17

safest place in the world to be

online.

This is the latest addition

0:37:170:37:23

to a long line of Islamophobic hate

crimes which have been sadly growing

0:37:230:37:28

over the last number of years in

courage by the undeniable rise of

0:37:280:37:31

the far right in Dost directly and

indirectly by leaders of powerful --

0:37:310:37:40

leaders and powerful figures across

the globe. Within increase in

0:37:400:37:46

religious hate crime of 267% since

2011, why has the government record

0:37:460:37:54

been so poor? -- with an.

Reflecting

on the overall tone of this urgent

0:37:540:38:02

question I'm not going to rise to

the debate but I think we can all

0:38:020:38:07

work together to call hate crime at

when it happens, and we have already

0:38:070:38:10

heard the forms in which it can take

including anti-Semitism and last

0:38:100:38:16

week the member for Grimsby spoke of

experiences in terms of the misogyny

0:38:160:38:21

which is not yet a hate crime but

which was the cause of much debate

0:38:210:38:24

last week. We are very clear and I

think the house has been very clear

0:38:240:38:29

today that this letter and these

letters, their sentiments, by our

0:38:290:38:33

holy awful and they are to be

condemned. -- they are entirely

0:38:330:38:38

awful and they are to be condemned.

0:38:380:38:43

What practical support is being

provided to help the targets of the

0:38:430:38:47

victims of hate crime?

I thank my

honourable friend for his question.

0:38:470:38:51

Of course we want first of all clues

for victims to report their

0:38:510:38:55

experience to the police. The police

are sadly aware of these events

0:38:550:39:01

today, and I hope are to be trusted

by the particular groups of people

0:39:010:39:10

concerned, and they will receive a

concerned and sensitive welcome from

0:39:100:39:14

the police in reporting these

crimes. There is much we are doing

0:39:140:39:18

as I have said already in the hate

crime action plan, and also trying

0:39:180:39:22

to tackle the root of

radicalisation, so that these awful

0:39:220:39:27

sentiments are not expressed in the

first place.

Anti-Muslim hate crimes

0:39:270:39:33

and anti-Semitic hate crime is

rising at such a shocking rate, this

0:39:330:39:36

sort of anonymous letter can strike

fear into whole communities. But

0:39:360:39:44

isn't it also the case that

anonymous social media is also

0:39:440:39:47

dissimilar problem and happens on a

daily basis? We have to confront

0:39:470:39:54

this question of anonymity in

shedding such bile. Will she address

0:39:540:39:58

this?

I have very much heard what

the house has said on this, as the

0:39:580:40:03

honourable gentleman will now, the

strategy was published last year,

0:40:030:40:08

and I would ensure that in terms of

anonymity, they are very much heard

0:40:080:40:16

by the Secretary of State to

culture, media and sport.

What makes

0:40:160:40:24

you British is not what you look

like, where your parents were from,

0:40:240:40:29

or how you worship, but the

contribution that you make to our

0:40:290:40:32

country. And nowhere has the

contribution made by British is and

0:40:320:40:39

is being greater than in the West

Midlands, which is why I will be

0:40:390:40:42

spending April the 3rd, which has

been identified as this day of hate,

0:40:420:40:48

I will be spending the day visiting

as many mosques and community

0:40:480:40:53

centres as possible across the

region to ensure Muslims in the West

0:40:530:40:57

Midlands of my support and

solidarity to show them I am on

0:40:570:41:00

their side, and I hope that other

members of the house will be doing

0:41:000:41:03

the same.

The honourable gentleman

has set out beautifully I think the

0:41:030:41:09

values that bind this house and our

countries together, and I wish him

0:41:090:41:15

luck on his visit to the many

mosques that must be there in the

0:41:150:41:21

West Midlands will stop

I welcome

the funding the Minister has

0:41:210:41:25

promised, but of course Muslims do

not only gather at places of

0:41:250:41:28

worship, so what reassurance can she

give to the many Muslim community

0:41:280:41:33

groups, schools where children

gather, other places which are not

0:41:330:41:36

specifically Muslim but where there

will be groups of Muslims, to give

0:41:360:41:39

them some reassurance that they will

have funding for extra security,

0:41:390:41:42

should that be needed, in Bristol

West?

I thank the honourable lady

0:41:420:41:47

for her question. As I say, the

government has not only pledged or

0:41:470:41:52

indeed spent up to £2.4 million over

three years, but of course we also

0:41:520:41:57

have the funding of tell Mama, which

is a very important, as it were,

0:41:570:42:01

intelligence tool, to help us or the

police understand where they need to

0:42:010:42:05

best focus their resources. If there

are particular areas in her

0:42:050:42:10

constituency about which she has

concerns, I would ask are pleased to

0:42:100:42:15

ensure her Chief Constable nose and

her Police and Crime Commissioner

0:42:150:42:17

knows, because they must be the ones

who make the operational decision.

0:42:170:42:22

My constituency are very worried

about the rise in hate crime. Is the

0:42:220:42:29

Minister satisfied that West

Yorkshire and further afield have

0:42:290:42:31

the police resources they need in

light of the significant cuts in

0:42:310:42:36

order to investigate and apprehend

those responsible for this abhorrent

0:42:360:42:39

crime?

Mr Speaker, it is about how

resources are spent, and that is

0:42:390:42:45

particularly relevant and pertinent

question of West Yorkshire, I can't

0:42:450:42:51

recall the figure of the top of my

head but I seem to recall that West

0:42:510:42:57

Yorkshire has several millions of

reserves in savings. Of course how

0:42:570:43:02

that is spent is a matter for the

elected Police and Crime

0:43:020:43:05

Commissioner. I hope you will be

taking up the Home Office's funding

0:43:050:43:11

initiative of increasing council tax

to make sure they have more money to

0:43:110:43:14

deal with the resource in issue.

I

have been deeply concerned about

0:43:140:43:18

these letters. Like with the Muslim

ban last year they feel unfairly

0:43:180:43:25

targeted and under siege. Whilst

this is obviously a target to target

0:43:250:43:32

the social media sites and so on,

these were snail mail. Can I pick up

0:43:320:43:36

on the Minister to pick out the

Minister from Feltham and Hastings,

0:43:360:43:40

can she update us on who sent these

letters, what is being done to stop

0:43:400:43:46

these letters and once those people

are apprehended, can she reassure my

0:43:460:43:50

constituents that they will feel the

full weight of the law?

I mustn't, I

0:43:500:43:58

can't go into more detail on the

specifics of the ongoing police

0:43:580:44:01

investigation, because she will not

want me or anyone asked to

0:44:010:44:05

inadvertently endanger any future

prosecution, but I can give her the

0:44:050:44:09

reassurance that this case is being

investigated very, very carefully,

0:44:090:44:13

and that the full force of the law

is being applied.

Anti-Semitic and

0:44:130:44:19

Islamic hate crime on the rise, it

is well documented but we'll soon

0:44:190:44:24

know there is significant

underreporting, and in my spirit and

0:44:240:44:28

by women. Hijabs wearing Muslim

women are often most honourable

0:44:280:44:32

because of their visibility. What

assurances can the minister Gibney

0:44:320:44:34

in terms of in the community that

the government is doing what it can

0:44:340:44:41

to ensure the message of reporting

all hate crime incidents is got out

0:44:410:44:47

into the community?

The honourable

lady has hit upon a very important

0:44:470:44:50

point: we must all do what we can to

encourage victims of hate crime,

0:44:500:44:54

whether it is to do with race,

religion, disability or gender

0:44:540:44:59

identity and so on, we must please

encourage people to report it

0:44:590:45:01

because we know that underreporting

is a real issue. We know also that

0:45:010:45:06

the work of organisations like tell

Mama I hope will help people find

0:45:060:45:11

the wherewithal to report those

incidents to the police.

I welcome

0:45:110:45:15

that we are all united in condemning

this despicable attempt to divide

0:45:150:45:22

our community. Since 2016, national

rhetoric and language has led to a

0:45:220:45:26

real increase in hate crime.

Government lead by example and

0:45:260:45:30

encourage everyone to turn down

national language and rhetoric?

Yes.

0:45:300:45:40

The Minister referred several times

to the £2.4 million funding under

0:45:400:45:43

the government's anti-hate scheme.

She also referred to just 45 places

0:45:430:45:48

of worship receiving funding. Are

there any plans to increase the

0:45:480:45:52

number of funding and the number of

places of worship that will attract

0:45:520:45:56

that funding?

May I write to the

honourable lady, because I am an

0:45:560:46:04

clear, I will confess, as to whether

applications are in June and I would

0:46:040:46:08

not wish to in any way inadvertently

answering correctly so I will answer

0:46:080:46:12

the lady by writing.

The best way to

build the longing, tolerance and

0:46:120:46:18

relationships is to invest in people

to come together and understanding.

0:46:180:46:26

In Oldham, they were completely

undermined by the government

0:46:260:46:28

snatching away the grant in 2010

with no assessment made on what

0:46:280:46:33

would impact would have.

Of course

we recognise the importance of

0:46:330:46:43

bringing communities together, and

there are many ways in which to do

0:46:430:46:47

that. The way in which my

constituency may enjoy being brought

0:46:470:46:50

together may be very different from

another constituency elsewhere in

0:46:500:46:53

the country. I'm not quite clear as

to the direct impact that honourable

0:46:530:47:00

gentleman said in relation to that

project but I will happily write to

0:47:000:47:03

him about it, thank you.

First of

all, can I condemn this letter along

0:47:030:47:11

with every body else, it is

apparent. It has been reported there

0:47:110:47:16

has been a spike in hate crime since

the EU referendum, both in

0:47:160:47:21

Islamophobia and anti-Semitism,

coming from the hard right and the

0:47:210:47:23

hard left. It is also reported by

the CPS that there has been a drop

0:47:230:47:30

in the number of prosecutions in

2017 by over 1000 against this

0:47:300:47:36

increase in incidents. What is the

Minister doing with the CPS and the

0:47:360:47:40

police to ensure that that is

reserved -- reversed?

We know there

0:47:400:47:45

has been a drop in referrals

recorded last year which has had an

0:47:450:47:49

impact on the number of completed

prosecutions in 2016 and 2017 and

0:47:490:47:53

the CPS is working with the police

at a local and national level to

0:47:530:47:56

understand the reasons for the

overall fall in referrals for the

0:47:560:47:59

past two years. But again the

message is pleased to spread around

0:47:590:48:03

our constituencies, if you have been

the victim of hate crime, please

0:48:030:48:06

report it because that way we can

try and do something about it.

Those

0:48:060:48:11

police forces like Greater

Manchester which have long targeted

0:48:110:48:13

hate crime and work hard with the

community nevertheless recognise

0:48:130:48:22

that community policing is central

to challenging hate crime. Will the

0:48:220:48:26

Minister take that message back,

because frankly the community

0:48:260:48:30

policing is about trust, and trust

is fundamental. We need our

0:48:300:48:33

community police.

I'm grateful to

the honourable gentleman. Of course

0:48:330:48:40

local policing is important, but we

also have to recognise that we can't

0:48:400:48:44

just rely on policing alone to reach

into communities, and not just to

0:48:440:48:50

reach into, but to build

relationships. This is why

0:48:500:48:54

organisations like Tell Mama and

other charities are such an

0:48:540:48:56

important part of the overall

picture of people when they feel

0:48:560:49:02

they have been the victims of crime,

they know what to do, where to go,

0:49:020:49:06

and they feel they will be listened

to and their experiences will be

0:49:060:49:10

acted upon.

It is quite clear the

whole house condemns these letters

0:49:100:49:16

but it is not just those sending the

letters causing this hate, not just

0:49:160:49:20

groups like Britain first was that

it includes groups like the BMP. My

0:49:200:49:26

honourable friend and I received a

letter from the BNP with a poem

0:49:260:49:30

making racist comments, and on the

back of the letter, would the

0:49:300:49:37

Minister condemn the actions of the

BMP and so there should be no part

0:49:370:49:41

in political parties who peddle this

hate?

I am absolutely clear that the

0:49:410:49:46

British National Party and all the

other far right organisations that

0:49:460:49:51

have been described today have no

place in our society, and frankly

0:49:510:49:55

they're showing at ballot box is

when they dared to stand for

0:49:550:49:59

election shows how little truck the

British public have with them.

0:49:590:50:05

Urgent question, Caroline Lucas.

Mr

Speaker, to ask the Leader of the

0:50:050:50:10

House about the treatment of House

of Commons staff.

The Leader of the

0:50:100:50:14

House, Andrea Leadsom.

Thank you, Mr

Speaker. I am grateful to the

0:50:140:50:19

honourable lady for a question. She

and I worked together on a

0:50:190:50:23

cross-party working group on an

independent complaints and grievance

0:50:230:50:27

policy, and I thank sincerely for

her work on it. Reports of bullying

0:50:270:50:29

of house staff are of huge concern

to me, and to honourable members

0:50:290:50:35

right across the house. I am

committed to stamping out all kinds

0:50:350:50:43

of bullying and harassment in

Parliament in order to create an

0:50:430:50:47

environment in which everyone feels

safe and is treated with the respect

0:50:470:50:51

and dignity that they deserve. We

can only achieve our goals in this

0:50:510:50:55

house with the support of others. A

great debt of gratitude is owed by

0:50:550:51:00

us all to the house staff who

support us behind the scenes. I

0:51:000:51:06

myself have worked with a large knob

of civil servants and staff of the

0:51:060:51:09

house during my time in Parliament,

from the clerks of the Treasury

0:51:090:51:13

Select Committee to my private

offices at the Treasury, in energy

0:51:130:51:18

and Defra, and now to the team in

the leaders's office, and the

0:51:180:51:23

excellent secretariat that supported

the working group. I have always

0:51:230:51:25

been impressed and I am very

grateful for the dedication,

0:51:250:51:31

professionalism, high standards and

courtesy that all the civil servants

0:51:310:51:35

and house staff have shown. I know

that many honourable and right

0:51:350:51:38

honourable members across the house,

and in the other place, would say

0:51:380:51:44

the same. The house will be aware

that significant progress has been

0:51:440:51:48

made in recent months following the

shocking report at the end of last

0:51:480:51:53

year of sexual harassment, bullying

and intimidation in this place. The

0:51:530:51:56

working group that I'd shared set up

by the Prime Minister has now

0:51:560:52:00

published its report and it has been

agreed by both houses -- that I

0:52:000:52:05

chaired. Questions are in place to

get the new independence complaint

0:52:050:52:10

procedure up and running within the

next three months. The honourable

0:52:100:52:13

lady will recall that the working

group wanted house staff to be

0:52:130:52:17

included in the new complaints

procedure from day one. However,

0:52:170:52:22

following evidence taken and in

consultation with the trade union

0:52:220:52:27

representatives of house staff, it

was agreed that the staff of the

0:52:270:52:30

house would not immediately be

covered by the new independent

0:52:300:52:34

procedure, because they were already

covered by the house's own respect

0:52:340:52:37

policy. It was believed that the

respect policy was working well and

0:52:370:52:43

that house staff were satisfied with

it. However, it was acknowledged

0:52:430:52:49

during the working group evidence

sessions that the respect policy did

0:52:490:52:52

not cover complaints of sexual

harassment and violence, and the

0:52:520:52:57

aspiration of the working groups is

to take up the question of whether

0:52:570:53:01

house staff should have immediate

access to the new independent

0:53:010:53:06

complaints procedure, now that the

report has been agreed by both

0:53:060:53:08

houses. And following the Newsnight

allegations, and others, it is clear

0:53:080:53:15

that the respect policy may not be

sufficient to protect house staff.

0:53:150:53:22

I'm aware that the clerk of the

House of Commons has written to

0:53:220:53:26

staff saying they are unresolved

issues over bullying and harassment

0:53:260:53:29

including sexual harassment which

needs to be addressed and this will

0:53:290:53:34

include a review of the respect

policy. The clerk of the House of

0:53:340:53:38

Commons has also reassured staff who

wish to come forward with complaints

0:53:380:53:42

of bullying that they will be dealt

with in the proper manner with the

0:53:420:53:47

support of their managers and

colleagues. It is right that

0:53:470:53:50

everyone working for or with

parliament regardless of position or

0:53:500:53:56

seniority should have the same

rights and protections and should be

0:53:560:54:00

held to the same high standards. The

house commission next meets on

0:54:000:54:07

Monday the 19th of March next

Monday, and I've given notice to my

0:54:070:54:12

fellow members I will be

recommending a short and dependent

0:54:120:54:14

the lead inquiry by the house

commission looking into allegations

0:54:140:54:20

of systemic bullying of

Parliamentary staff -- independent.

0:54:200:54:25

I will propose the inquiry should

hear from past and current staff

0:54:250:54:29

members about their experiences and

help to provide them with closure

0:54:290:54:32

where ever possible. I would also

propose that it should take

0:54:320:54:37

soundings from current and former

house staff on whether the respect

0:54:370:54:41

policy is fit for purpose and

whether house staff would be better

0:54:410:54:45

served by having access to the new

independent complaints and grievance

0:54:450:54:49

policy from the first day. I'm more

determined than ever that we banish

0:54:490:54:56

all kinds of harassment and bullying

from this place because make no

0:54:560:55:01

mistake there is a need for change.

Caroline Lucas.

Thank you for

0:55:010:55:08

granting this urgent cross-party

question, and this isn't about party

0:55:080:55:12

politics and political gain, it is

about doing the right thing by the

0:55:120:55:18

staff who support us on a daily

basis and making sure the House of

0:55:180:55:21

Commons leads by example would it

comes to robust lead tackling

0:55:210:55:24

workplace bullying and sexual

misconduct. Members of the public

0:55:240:55:28

will be shocked by the revelations

of bullying at Westminster which

0:55:280:55:31

were highlighted by Newsnight last

week and I commend the leader for

0:55:310:55:35

her ongoing work to establish the

siege and the need for that because

0:55:350:55:41

of the respect policy did not apply

to large numbers of those working in

0:55:410:55:45

Parliament -- established that.

There are now considerable grounds

0:55:450:55:50

to make sure the same policy does

not have the confidence of the staff

0:55:500:55:54

it is intended to protect and that

the new procedure must be expanded

0:55:540:55:58

to avoid a two tier system so

ungrateful to the leader of the

0:55:580:56:04

house that she broadly agrees with

that and I'm pleased to hear about a

0:56:040:56:07

new short inquiry but will she also

confirmed very specifically that

0:56:070:56:11

there will be a presumption in

favour of historic allegations being

0:56:110:56:14

thoroughly investigated should those

affected choose to make formal

0:56:140:56:19

complaints, either under the respect

policy or the new procedure? Will

0:56:190:56:24

she acknowledge the positive work

she has led to date risks being

0:56:240:56:27

undermined if we continue to allow

sanctions to be determined by a

0:56:270:56:31

committee on which MPs are

effectively hold all the power? Will

0:56:310:56:36

she agree that the whole process

including sanctions must be handled

0:56:360:56:39

by an independent body? Will she

revisit whether good employer and

0:56:390:56:45

consent training is an important

part of culture change should start

0:56:450:56:48

before the next election? The

evidence is clear that it should. In

0:56:480:56:52

the meantime can she make sure that

further complaints will be treated

0:56:520:56:58

with the seriousness and respect

which they deserve and will not be

0:56:580:57:00

dismissed as they were last Friday

as grotesque exaggeration.

The

0:57:000:57:07

leader of the house.

As I've already

mentioned I certainly agree with the

0:57:070:57:17

honourable lady and it was the

aspiration of the working group to

0:57:170:57:20

cover all staff working here in

Parliament including staff of the

0:57:200:57:27

house in our independent complaints

procedure from the first day, and I

0:57:270:57:29

share her concern that we should now

take steps to make sure that that

0:57:290:57:34

does become the case as soon as that

independent policy is up and running

0:57:340:57:39

which we intend to be within three

months from now. Regarding the bond

0:57:390:57:43

about historic allegations she will

recall the working group made clear

0:57:430:57:52

we will deal with historic

allegations and it will be down to

0:57:520:57:56

the working group to establish how

that can be done. What the clerk of

0:57:560:58:00

the House of Commons has made clear

is that he will be looking to

0:58:000:58:03

provide that reassurance to House

staff that any historic allegations

0:58:030:58:09

will be properly dealt with in the

future. She mentions sanctions that

0:58:090:58:14

those must be independent, that has

been a part of the work of the

0:58:140:58:18

working group and we are now looking

very carefully and closely at how

0:58:180:58:22

that impacts on the work of the

independent Parliamentary

0:58:220:58:24

Commissioner for standards and the

standards committee itself where

0:58:240:58:30

there are both Parliamentary members

and lay members and that work is

0:58:300:58:35

ongoing and later today I'm looking

forward to meeting with the

0:58:350:58:38

standards committee to have exactly

the start of those discussions. She

0:58:380:58:42

mentions consent training and in the

working group we were clear that

0:58:420:58:47

consent training should be something

that all people not only who employ

0:58:470:58:52

staff but who come into contact with

other people, should be very clear

0:58:520:58:55

about what constitutes consent and

precisely what doesn't and I can

0:58:550:59:04

assure the honourable lady I'm clear

to provide the carrot that people

0:59:040:59:08

want to take up the training but we

did not have the levers at the time

0:59:080:59:11

as we said to make it compulsory.

And I totally share her desire to

0:59:110:59:18

see all staff here treated with the

dignity and respect that everybody

0:59:180:59:21

in this place deserves.

Mark Harper.

Can I welcome what the leader of the

0:59:210:59:31

house said about her short inquiry,

and it seems to me a good test for

0:59:310:59:34

her to adopt is to make sure that

this house does what all

0:59:340:59:38

organisations should do which is to

make sure that everybody that works

0:59:380:59:42

here whether they work for members

of Parliament or they work for the

0:59:420:59:46

house have the same processes and

can be expecting to be treated to

0:59:460:59:49

the same high standards and can she

bring that measure in as soon as she

0:59:490:59:56

can.

I completely agree and I can

assure him that that is the

0:59:561:00:01

aspiration of the working group and

that is my personal goal.

Thank you.

1:00:011:00:08

It is noted that you have granted

the urgent question even though you

1:00:081:00:13

are one of the people mentioned in

media reports, but no one, critics

1:00:131:00:17

or otherwise can deny your

commitment to accountability and

1:00:171:00:21

transparency and attempt to move the

house forward, recognising diversity

1:00:211:00:27

and modern customs and practice. The

opposition take all allegations

1:00:271:00:32

seriously and we want to accommodate

everyone and I don't want to, Don

1:00:321:00:39

individual cases, that is a matter

for authorities, but I want to ask

1:00:391:00:44

the leader of the house, is she

aware of any formal complaints that

1:00:441:00:47

have been instigated on the basis of

the cases that have been reported

1:00:471:00:49

and if so when? She has suggested an

inquiry, and I'm very pleased that

1:00:491:00:56

we can have this discussion at the

commission and we look forward to

1:00:561:00:59

that. Some cases predate the respect

policy and I know that as a result

1:00:591:01:05

of the work streams following the

report of the working group into

1:01:051:01:08

sexual harassment and bullying that

that is also being amended and that

1:01:081:01:13

there will be a new behaviour code

and procedure that covers everyone

1:01:131:01:17

working on the estate and in our

constituencies. It is imperative

1:01:171:01:23

that all staff working here feel

they can raise any complaints and

1:01:231:01:26

grievances immediately. Can the

leader that has confirmed that she

1:01:261:01:31

would agree to the president of the

staff attending the steering group

1:01:311:01:35

which I previously requested. The

working group published its report

1:01:351:01:42

in 2018, the steering group is

monitoring the work carried out and

1:01:421:01:47

I'm pleased they said permanent

secretariat -- there is a permanent

1:01:471:01:53

secretariat. The further work is

being regressed to make sure that

1:01:531:01:57

the grievance policy put into place

is fair and robust. It is only when

1:01:571:02:02

that is tested will we know if they

work. There will be a continual

1:02:021:02:08

process to find them until they are

effective so everyone has confidence

1:02:081:02:11

in them. Can the leader of the house

say, and she has touched on the

1:02:111:02:18

figure of three months, but we need

to balance speed with making sure

1:02:181:02:21

there is an effective process,

whether this work will be completed

1:02:211:02:25

by three months or at least by

summer before the house rises? The

1:02:251:02:31

opposition Labour Party takes all

complaints of sexual harassment and

1:02:311:02:34

abuse and discrimination extremely

seriously so that anyone with a

1:02:341:02:37

complaint comes forward and that all

allegations can be fully

1:02:371:02:43

investigated and any appropriate

disciplinary action taken in line

1:02:431:02:46

with the party's procedures. All of

us have the utmost respect for the

1:02:461:02:54

house clerks and any of us have had

dealings with them on the various

1:02:541:02:58

select committees know they are

experts in their field and they

1:02:581:03:01

offer vital assistance and advice to

everyone. But I know everyone who

1:03:011:03:08

works in whatever capacity knows

that they play a vital role in

1:03:081:03:13

making sure that our Parliament and

our democracy thrives.

The leader of

1:03:131:03:19

the house.

I thank the shadow leader

of the house for her remarks and

1:03:191:03:26

also I'm grateful to her for the

part she played in the working group

1:03:261:03:30

on setting up the independent

complaints procedure and it was

1:03:301:03:32

notable that there was unanimous

support for establishment that

1:03:321:03:39

independent procedure which the

whole house can be very pleased

1:03:391:03:41

about. Regarding her specific

questions, GR is whether unaware of

1:03:411:03:47

specific formal complaints and it

was not in the terms of reference of

1:03:471:03:51

the working group -- she asks

whether I'm aware. It was not in the

1:03:511:04:00

terms of reference to consider

specific requests, but that I've had

1:04:001:04:04

a number of people come to me and

I've sought to deal where ever

1:04:041:04:07

possible with complaints that have

been brought to me but I don't

1:04:071:04:09

propose to discuss any specific

allegations in the chamber. She asks

1:04:091:04:15

about a review of the respect policy

for house staff and I can say to her

1:04:151:04:23

that reading from the letter of the

clerk of the house to house staff

1:04:231:04:27

today, he says there are unresolved

issues over bullying and harassment

1:04:271:04:30

including sexual harassment which

need to be addressed and the clerk

1:04:301:04:33

of the house goes on to say that we

will read this it and renew the

1:04:331:04:36

respect policy. -- revisit. She asks

whether the house authorities trade

1:04:361:04:43

union representative will be invited

to join the steering group and I

1:04:431:04:48

believe that has happened, and she

asks when will be finalised

1:04:481:04:53

procedures be finished. We have set

the aspiration that the bulk of it

1:04:531:04:59

is done within three months and

there will be a final vote in this

1:04:591:05:06

house on changes necessary to

standing orders and to adopt the

1:05:061:05:09

behaviour code and we certainly

expect and hope that will be before

1:05:091:05:13

the house rises in the summary says.

-- summer recess for the.

Is it

1:05:131:05:23

appropriate for Mr speaker to remain

in his place when there are

1:05:231:05:26

allegations against him which he is

trying to suppress using taxpayer

1:05:261:05:28

funded money by sending out letters

through speakers cancelled. --

1:05:281:05:35

speaker's council.

The leader of the

house.

It is vital that all

1:05:351:05:41

colleagues join together in

supporting the efforts being made by

1:05:411:05:44

this house to stamp out all bullying

and harassment where ever we see it

1:05:441:05:48

and to make sure that everybody will

be treated in the future with the

1:05:481:05:53

respect and dignity that they

deserve.

Can I congratulate the

1:05:531:06:03

honourable lady for securing this

urgent question and she like me will

1:06:031:06:06

face these urgent questions, and it

is something that comes as it'll

1:06:061:06:12

surprise to any of us who has

listened to the evidence as part of

1:06:121:06:17

the working group -- little

surprise. This endemic culture has

1:06:171:06:26

got to be tackled and I'm sure the

house is confident in the

1:06:261:06:29

independent inquiry. Does the leader

of the house agree that historical

1:06:291:06:36

allegations must be considered and

does she support the view that we

1:06:361:06:41

will be helping victims past and

present if we respond to such

1:06:411:06:45

allegations? This is all part of the

normalisation of bullying and

1:06:451:06:50

harassment which continues to poison

our politics. ... And last, does she

1:06:501:07:03

share that all members, whether they

work for this house or members of

1:07:031:07:08

Parliament, are covered by the new

behaviour code and will have access

1:07:081:07:13

to the new complaints procedure as

quickly as possible.

I would like to

1:07:131:07:19

pay tribute to the honourable

gentleman for his part in the

1:07:191:07:21

working group, he was assiduously

attending meetings and taking a full

1:07:211:07:24

part in the work and I'm grateful to

him for his contribution. He asked

1:07:241:07:31

how the independent inquiry will be

conducted and clearly my intention

1:07:311:07:35

is to make this proposal to the

house commission and it will be a

1:07:351:07:38

matter for the commission to agree

whether to do that or not at the

1:07:381:07:43

house commission is made up of a

number of members from across the

1:07:431:07:45

house including one from his own

party but I would like to sit

1:07:451:07:51

carried out by an independent

individual who can hear from past

1:07:511:07:53

and current members of the staff of

the house so that person can be free

1:07:531:08:01

of any input from either employers

or indeed parliamentarians. And

1:08:011:08:06

people can feel they can come

forward in confidence. I completely

1:08:061:08:10

agree with him, it would be letting

people down if we fail to deal with

1:08:101:08:14

it and it is vital that those who

have passed allegations who feel the

1:08:141:08:19

time has passed for them to doubt

with seriously, can achieve some

1:08:191:08:22

closure by coming forward and be

heard in that way, and I also agree

1:08:221:08:27

that it is demeaning to this house

and to all of us if we fail to get a

1:08:271:08:31

grip on it and that is why this

house has shown such commitment is

1:08:311:08:36

setting up an independent complaints

and grievance policy which is the

1:08:361:08:38

right way forward.

1:08:381:08:43

I very much welcome the leader's

statement, and she agree with me

1:08:431:08:48

that sometimes the accused can be

victims too? And that is why it is

1:08:481:08:52

so important that we have an

independent enquiry. But would she

1:08:521:08:56

also agree with me that the House of

Commons commission would not be an

1:08:561:09:02

independent judge or jury, and

indeed would not be seen to be as

1:09:021:09:05

such, simply because of the very

membership of that commission, and

1:09:051:09:10

that it does need to be an

independent individual, or group of

1:09:101:09:14

individuals?

Of course my honourable

friend raises an important point,

1:09:141:09:23

and during the working group

evidence sessions, we were very

1:09:231:09:26

conscious that it is important to

protect both complainants, who are

1:09:261:09:30

at the heart of the independent

complaints procedure, but also the

1:09:301:09:34

alleged perpetrator. It is important

that justice is seen to be done, and

1:09:341:09:39

that all parties are properly

supported. He is also right to say

1:09:391:09:44

that an enquiry led by the house

commission could not be independent,

1:09:441:09:48

which is why my recommendation to

the house commission would be that

1:09:481:09:51

it should be an independently lead

enquiry into allegations of

1:09:511:09:55

bullying.

Can I say to the Leader of

the House that when she chooses, as

1:09:551:10:03

she has done today, to focus on the

thoroughness and decency of the

1:10:031:10:09

process of dealing with these

issues, she will get support from

1:10:091:10:11

right across this house? And she has

mentioned several times the

1:10:111:10:18

involvement of trade union

representatives, so would she just

1:10:181:10:22

join me in asserting that it is

right that members of our staff and

1:10:221:10:25

members of staff of this house are

members of trade unions if they

1:10:251:10:30

choose to be, and that their

representatives ought to be involved

1:10:301:10:34

at every stage of this process?

The

honourable lady gives me the

1:10:341:10:41

opportunity to thank and pay tribute

to the very good staff

1:10:411:10:44

representatives who were on the

working group, a representative from

1:10:441:10:51

Unite, working as a researcher for a

member of the Labour Party, the

1:10:511:10:56

representative of the members and

peers staff Association who works

1:10:561:11:01

for a member of the Conservative

Party and a representative of the

1:11:011:11:05

NUJ, who works for the Scottish

Nationalists here. They all made a

1:11:051:11:08

great contribution and are to be

commended for their contributions.

1:11:081:11:14

Does my right honourable friend

agree that unfortunately the system

1:11:141:11:17

we have at the moment is that House

of Commons staff believe that they

1:11:171:11:22

make a complaint about bullying and

harassment it would be taken

1:11:221:11:25

seriously and secondly they believe

it will be seriously detrimental to

1:11:251:11:30

their future career? I welcome the

fact we will have an independent

1:11:301:11:33

investigation into the allegations

we heard on Newsnight. When will

1:11:331:11:37

that start and when will it

complete?

The house commission meets

1:11:371:11:41

next Monday. I will be making that

recommendation there and then that

1:11:411:11:46

will start as soon as possible.

The

house is exceptionally well served

1:11:461:11:53

by de Klerk star. I think that is a

matter of common accord, so surely I

1:11:531:11:58

hope it goes without saying that

these complaints required to be

1:11:581:12:02

investigated with the rigour in a

conference of and independently. Mr

1:12:021:12:08

Speaker, when you and I first

entered the house, the house was

1:12:081:12:12

almost entirely self-regulating. The

position today is very, very

1:12:121:12:16

different, but that change has come

in a way that is piecemeal. What

1:12:161:12:22

surely now is required is a proper

comprehensibility again at the

1:12:221:12:28

question of Parliamentary privilege

and self-regulation. So can I say in

1:12:281:12:34

welcoming the short independent

enquiry that the leader seeks to

1:12:341:12:37

establish that once that is done,

she should apply her mind to

1:12:371:12:40

revisiting the work of the joint

committee set up in 1998 to look at

1:12:401:12:46

the question of the extent of

definition of Parliamentary

1:12:461:12:53

privilege?

I think the right

honourable gentleman makes a very

1:12:531:12:56

interesting observation and I will

certainly look at it.

Does the

1:12:561:13:01

Leader of the House agree with me

that every single individual

1:13:011:13:05

complete made against a member

reflects badly on each and every one

1:13:051:13:09

of us in this place? And given the

Newsnight allegation that the

1:13:091:13:12

policies and play was not up to

scratch, and certainly was something

1:13:121:13:16

we decided amongst ourselves, though

she agree with me that we not only

1:13:161:13:21

need an independent investigation

but we also need an external

1:13:211:13:24

independent body to establish our

board policy going forward?

I hope I

1:13:241:13:31

can reassure my honourable friend

that the independence grievance

1:13:311:13:34

policy we are in the process of

establishing will ensure that the

1:13:341:13:38

culture in this place changes to the

benefit of all who work here. But I

1:13:381:13:42

would also just like to say that

many honourable members are very

1:13:421:13:48

troubled by these allegations. That

is as ever a small minority of

1:13:481:13:52

people who behave badly and he is

right to point out that it demeans

1:13:521:13:55

all of us when a fewer of us behave

badly.

Mr Speaker, having been in

1:13:551:14:01

the house quite a long time, I

recall in nearly days that if

1:14:011:14:07

warnings to particularly young women

of this house was not just a certain

1:14:071:14:10

small group of members of parliament

but some senior clerks who were

1:14:101:14:14

known to be bullies, and as chair of

the anti-bullying group of MPs for

1:14:141:14:20

some years, I have been fighting

everyone's corner in that respect,

1:14:201:14:24

and I have to say in recent years I

have never known a speaker as

1:14:241:14:30

strong, in terms of reforming that

particular part of our lives. But

1:14:301:14:34

can I urge her to get on with as

quickly. We want justice to be seen

1:14:341:14:39

and to be seen to be done, but I

also want this committee to know

1:14:391:14:45

there are certain, only a tiny

minority of members of this house

1:14:451:14:48

have used this, it is a must like a

new kind of McCarthyism, you know,

1:14:481:14:51

to name someone from someone is put

into purge on that side or the side

1:14:511:14:57

with no redress, dreadful things

happening to their families, one

1:14:571:15:02

doesn't even know what happens to

the families and the members who are

1:15:021:15:08

accused. There is a danger of a kind

of political McCarthyism that we

1:15:081:15:11

also have two stamp out in this

place.

So again I would remind the

1:15:111:15:16

honourable gentleman the independent

complaints procedure will be exactly

1:15:161:15:20

that, it will be independent, it

will be confidential, so that

1:15:201:15:23

complainants who very often don't

want to come forward, for fear of

1:15:231:15:26

having to then deal with the person

they are accusing, so they will come

1:15:261:15:32

forward in confidence. The alleged

perpetrator will also be able to

1:15:321:15:37

have their side of the story hurt in

confidence. There will therefore be

1:15:371:15:42

natural justice rules applied to the

entire process, but there will also

1:15:421:15:46

be very serious sanctions for

wrongdoing. I genuinely believe that

1:15:461:15:49

this work will change the culture in

Parliament. It will take us to a new

1:15:491:15:53

stage where people can come forward

and it will make people think twice

1:15:531:15:57

about some of their attitudes.

I

appreciate there may be problems

1:15:571:16:02

with definition. Lots of these cases

would have been investigated and

1:16:021:16:06

often at best the details will be

sketchy at this stage. But can the

1:16:061:16:10

Leader of the House give a house an

indication of the scale of this

1:16:101:16:13

issue? How many cases of abuse of

house or members staff have been

1:16:131:16:18

brought to her attention in her

recent dealings with this issue?

I

1:16:181:16:24

don't really think I can give my

honourable friend and idea of the

1:16:241:16:30

scale of the problem. I think like

all honourable members different

1:16:301:16:34

cases appear in the media and it is

very difficult to understand the

1:16:341:16:39

enormity and range of the problem.

But suffice to say that going

1:16:391:16:43

forward I think across this house we

are determined to see change for the

1:16:431:16:46

better.

I welcome the Leader of the

House's emphasis she has placed on

1:16:461:16:52

June process, -- due process, and

complainants have to be taken

1:16:521:16:59

seriously. The person who is being

complaint against also has rights

1:16:591:17:04

and a case should be heard on the

basis of evidence. I think that is

1:17:041:17:08

really a potent in this whole

process will stop Krygios of say a

1:17:081:17:11

word about the independent

commission of Parliamentary

1:17:111:17:15

standards that we currently have,

and they can be put to the

1:17:151:17:22

Parliamentary privileges committee.

That is also a route that needs to

1:17:221:17:26

be incorporated into the new process

she is envisaging.

The honourable

1:17:261:17:31

gentleman is exactly right and

indeed that is part of the process.

1:17:311:17:34

Very specifically, it is heard in

confidence, and if there is a

1:17:341:17:40

finding against the alleged

perpetrator that would then in the

1:17:401:17:43

case of a member of Parliament being

complained about go to the

1:17:431:17:48

Parliamentary Commissioner for

standards, who would either carry

1:17:481:17:49

out an appeal and look at the

evidence again or find against the

1:17:491:17:55

member, or find that there is no

cause to answer, and then she will

1:17:551:17:59

have expanded sanctions at a lower

level, or indeed she will pass it

1:17:591:18:02

onto the committee for standards for

them to consider, including

1:18:021:18:06

recommending suspension to this

house, which could lead to the

1:18:061:18:10

recall of members of Parliament act

2015 being invoked.

Does the Leader

1:18:101:18:17

of the House agree that any member

of staff who feels that he or she

1:18:171:18:24

has been bullied must have an

absolute guarantee that their career

1:18:241:18:30

will not suffer in any way if they

make a complaint? And if they have

1:18:301:18:37

that guarantee, does she agree that

the reputation of members of

1:18:371:18:42

Parliament should not be sullied by

accusations that they are bullies

1:18:421:18:46

unless a complaint against them has

actually been made?

Yes, I think my

1:18:461:18:53

honourable friend sums it up very

well. It is vital that complainants

1:18:531:18:57

are protected, so they can come

forward in confidence and not be

1:18:571:19:01

further victimised, but it is also

essential that people who are

1:19:011:19:06

complained about have the

opportunity to put their side of the

1:19:061:19:09

story, and to receive proper

justice.

Can I commend the leader of

1:19:091:19:19

this house on their counterparts and

indeed you yourself Mr Speaker in

1:19:191:19:22

response to these issues so far. As

the Leader of the House agree with

1:19:221:19:25

me that this is a moment for each

and every one of us to reflect on

1:19:251:19:30

our behaviour and constantly reflect

on our behaviour? Because it is not

1:19:301:19:34

about what we judge to deem the

appropriate behaviour but how we

1:19:341:19:39

make others feel is the critical

issue, and that is why the

1:19:391:19:43

independent nature of her proposals

is so critical, because this has to

1:19:431:19:46

be without political fear or favour,

or political campaigns against

1:19:461:19:52

opponents or anybody else, so that

people can come forward in that

1:19:521:19:54

regard.

Yes, she's exactly right.

The power dynamic, the idea that you

1:19:541:20:01

behave is not necessarily how you

are seen to behave, is incredibly

1:20:011:20:06

important in this, and certainly in

the working Group evidence we took a

1:20:061:20:09

lot of witness statements about

exactly that and it is vital that we

1:20:091:20:15

take that into account.

Due process

sometimes takes a very long time.

1:20:151:20:22

Could I ask the Leader of the House

too insular that due process pull to

1:20:221:20:28

ensure that due process should be as

speedily as possible in the case of

1:20:281:20:31

everyone?

I completely agree with my

honourable friend and I think we are

1:20:311:20:36

quite proud that we move very

quickly with the independent

1:20:361:20:40

complaints procedure but at the same

time we are doing a thorough job and

1:20:401:20:43

that is our plan.

The industrial

tribunal has to be registered under

1:20:431:20:51

the Ministry of Justice. In the

interest of transparency, will the

1:20:511:20:56

Leader of the House publish all

industrial tribunal applications

1:20:561:21:02

that have been registered against

members of Parliament or indeed

1:21:021:21:04

against the House of Commons?

I

don't believe that would be a matter

1:21:041:21:10

for me that I would certainly look

into it.

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Can

1:21:101:21:17

I put on record my support for the

work that the Leader of the House

1:21:171:21:21

and the speaker and all the numbers

have been doing since November on

1:21:211:21:26

this issue. She agree with me that

we need to take the politics out of

1:21:261:21:29

this altogether? If people are to

have confidence that we truly are

1:21:291:21:35

listening, that victims will be

believed and that we will have a

1:21:351:21:39

proper process, then it is time for

professionals, not the press or

1:21:391:21:44

political expediency, to lead this

process?

I completely agree with the

1:21:441:21:49

honourable lady, the Independent is

absolutely vital.

I can assure you I

1:21:491:21:56

have great respect for all staff I

work with, but I was also the guinea

1:21:561:22:00

pig in 2012 after a record phone

hacking report for the original

1:22:001:22:05

respect policy. I was flayed by

selective leaking then six years ago

1:22:051:22:10

and it has just happened again now,

so I would ask the Leader of the

1:22:101:22:14

House and honourable members before

they jump to judgment after what was

1:22:141:22:18

a very one-sided selective BBC

broadcast that they approached the

1:22:181:22:20

cases that have been raised in a

more balanced way, and that they

1:22:201:22:24

also consider the reasons why the

original respect policy was scrapped

1:22:241:22:29

in the first place as not fit for

purpose. But they also give

1:22:291:22:35

consideration to the disparity of

report of MPs that are complained

1:22:351:22:38

against especially when the

complaints have the backing of the

1:22:381:22:41

very well resourced First Division

's Association in particular.

1:22:411:22:45

Perhaps finally I might ask the

house to consider why historical old

1:22:451:22:49

allegations like this are being

selected and recycled now and by

1:22:491:22:52

whom, because whatever is at play,

this is not a game, for reputations

1:22:521:22:56

or families.

What I've would say to

the honourable gentleman is that the

1:22:561:23:04

advantage of an independent

complaints procedure is that it

1:23:041:23:09

exists, and will exist, for people

to be able to come forward with

1:23:091:23:12

confidence, and with

confidentiality, and what that means

1:23:121:23:16

is they at long last to have

somewhere they can go and make their

1:23:161:23:20

complaint without just going

straight to the press, which, as he

1:23:201:23:23

raises, has caused some

difficulties.

1:23:231:23:33

The working group recommends

training by the end of Parliament

1:23:331:23:35

and clearly that is inappropriate,

with they make sure that everyone

1:23:351:23:39

has face-to-face training within

this year? -- with they make sure.

1:23:391:23:45

You're not quite right, trading is

essential for all members across the

1:23:451:23:48

house in a wide variety of areas --

training. There are measures brought

1:23:481:23:53

forward to encourage people to take

training and we have said in their

1:23:531:23:56

in Dutch and new members will

receive compulsory training -- in

1:23:561:24:01

their induction.

Could the leader of

the house clarify that if a member

1:24:011:24:06

of the House of Commons staff raises

a complaint in the next few days,

1:24:061:24:12

what policy or procedure with that

complaint be dealt with?

Currently

1:24:121:24:17

members of house staff who are

complaining about allegations of

1:24:171:24:23

bullying or inappropriate behaviour

will come under the house respect

1:24:231:24:26

policy which was established a few

years back. What the working group

1:24:261:24:32

is doing is creating an independent

and paints procedure and the house

1:24:321:24:37

staff were not going to be subject

or able to take advantage of the

1:24:371:24:41

independent complaints procedure and

it is that that we now want to look

1:24:411:24:45

at again -- independent complaints

procedure. I have huge respect for

1:24:451:24:52

the staff of this

1:24:521:24:54

and my experiences have been

excellent, but can I add

my voice to

1:24:561:25:02

those who are calling for due

process, we have got to be

1:25:021:25:11

respectful of the complainant and

the subject of the complaint, and we

1:25:111:25:20

have got to be wary of prejudicing

any process or give the impression

1:25:201:25:23

that it is politicised or

personalised in the way they

1:25:231:25:28

approach it.

What I can say, the

working group put the complainant at

1:25:281:25:34

the heart of this procedure and what

was very clear from the evidence is

1:25:341:25:38

that people will only come forward

if they feel they will be treated in

1:25:381:25:42

confidence and then they won't be

plastered all over the newspapers.

1:25:421:25:52

Bullying and harassment occur in all

walks of life and in all

1:25:521:25:56

professions, and whilst important if

the person is listened to and the

1:25:561:25:59

matter is investigated

independently, but, we must also

1:25:591:26:04

remember that the golden thread that

runs between our English law which

1:26:041:26:08

is you are innocent until proven

guilty.

Yes, the laws of natural

1:26:081:26:14

justice have been applied to the new

independent complaints procedure.

1:26:141:26:21

When I was a unite rap in the NHS I

represented members on both sides on

1:26:211:26:26

bullying and harassment cases --

representative. One thing that would

1:26:261:26:32

have made it difficult was if there

had been a two tier system in

1:26:321:26:36

operation and so will the leader

make sure that we moved to a system

1:26:361:26:41

of robust policy for everyone that

works in this house?

I can certainly

1:26:411:26:49

tell the honourable lady that it was

the ambition of the working group

1:26:491:26:52

that everyone here would have access

to the independent complaints

1:26:521:26:55

procedure and it is our intention to

look at that again.

Chris Brown.

1:26:551:26:59

Even today the vast majority of LGB

-- LGBT students will face bullying

1:26:591:27:13

and that is why they are more likely

to take their own lives, many

1:27:131:27:16

schools have said let's build a

tolerance school but sometimes that

1:27:161:27:20

feels as if we are being tolerated

as homosexuals. The keyword is

1:27:201:27:26

respect, for one another, whatever

our political views and whatever our

1:27:261:27:31

agenda and whatever our religious

views, and the anyway we can change

1:27:311:27:37

that culture is if we make sure that

every single one of us is fully and

1:27:371:27:40

properly trained, not only the first

time you come into this house, but

1:27:401:27:46

every time we are returned by our

voters.

I agree, respect is key and

1:27:461:27:52

that's what we are determined to

achieve, workplace environment in

1:27:521:27:56

Parliament that is amongst the best

in the world and that treats

1:27:561:27:59

everyone with the respect and

dignity they deserve.

We have noted

1:27:591:28:04

each other Mr speaker, -- known each

other, Mr speaker, for many years,

1:28:041:28:12

we have had strong and heated

disagreements about many issues over

1:28:121:28:16

the years, and I could not be

described as a cheerleader by any

1:28:161:28:20

means, but I do think there has got

to be a fair and proper process and

1:28:201:28:23

it can't be based on anonymous

briefings to the press and it can't

1:28:231:28:27

be based on political disagreements

and it can't be based on score

1:28:271:28:31

settling.

The leader of the house.

I

would say that the whole purpose of

1:28:311:28:40

the independent complaints and

grievance policy is to make sure

1:28:401:28:42

that there is justice for the

complainant and also for the person

1:28:421:28:47

alleged to have carried out the

wrongdoing.

Thank you. Order.

1:28:471:28:53

Statement, the Prime Minister.

With

permission I would like to update

1:28:531:29:00

the House on the incident in

Salisbury and the steps we are

1:29:001:29:03

taking to investigate what happened

and to respond to this reckless and

1:29:031:29:07

despicable act. Last week my right

honourable friend is the foreign and

1:29:071:29:12

Home Secretary 's set out the

details of events as they unfolded

1:29:121:29:16

on Sunday the 4th of March and I'm

sure the whole house will want to

1:29:161:29:21

once again paid tribute to the

bravery and professionalism of our

1:29:211:29:24

emergency services and Armed Forces

in responding to this incident as

1:29:241:29:29

well as the doctors and nurses who

are treating those affected. Our

1:29:291:29:33

thoughts in but it can with

Detective Sergeant Nick Bailey who

1:29:331:29:37

remains in a serious but stable

condition -- our thoughts in

1:29:371:29:42

particular. He exemplified the duty

and courage that define our

1:29:421:29:44

emergency services and which our

nation the greatest pride. I want to

1:29:441:29:50

pay tribute to the fortitude and

calmness with which people in

1:29:501:29:55

Salisbury have responded to these

events and to thank all those in

1:29:551:29:59

come forward to assist the police

with their investigation. This

1:29:591:30:04

incident has of course caused

considerable concern across the

1:30:041:30:07

community and following the

discussion of traces of nerve agent

1:30:071:30:11

in the restaurant and the pub, the

Chief Medical Officer issued further

1:30:111:30:16

advice, but as Public Health England

have made clear the risk to public

1:30:161:30:19

health is very low. I share the

impatience of this house and the

1:30:191:30:25

country at large to bring those

responsible to justice and to take

1:30:251:30:28

the full range of appropriate

responses against those who would

1:30:281:30:32

act against our country in this way.

But as a nation that believes in

1:30:321:30:38

justice and the rule of law it is

essential that we proceed in the

1:30:381:30:41

right way led not by speculation but

by the evidence. That is why we have

1:30:411:30:47

given the police the space and time

to carry out their investigation

1:30:471:30:51

properly, hundreds of others as have

been working round the clock

1:30:511:30:54

together with experts from the Armed

Forces to assess all the available

1:30:541:30:59

evidence and to identify crime

scenes and decontamination sites and

1:30:591:31:03

to follow every possible lead to

find those responsible. That

1:31:031:31:08

investigation continues and we must

allow the police to continue with

1:31:081:31:10

their work. This morning I chaired a

meeting of the national security

1:31:101:31:16

council in which we considered the

information so far available. As is

1:31:161:31:21

normal decals was updated on the

assessment and intelligence picture

1:31:211:31:23

as well as the state of the

investigation -- as is normal the

1:31:231:31:28

council was updated. It is clear

that Sergei Skripal and his daughter

1:31:281:31:31

were poisoned with a military grade

nerve agent of eight type developed

1:31:311:31:36

by Russia and this is part of a

group of nerve agents. Based on the

1:31:361:31:41

positive identification of this

chemical agent by world leading

1:31:411:31:44

experts at the defence science and

technology laboratory, our knowledge

1:31:441:31:50

that Russia has been reproduced this

ageing and would still be capable of

1:31:501:31:54

doing so -- this agent. Russia's

record of sponsoring state

1:31:541:31:59

assassinations and our view that

Russia sees some defectors as

1:31:591:32:08

legitimate targets for assassination

and so the government has concluded

1:32:081:32:11

that Russia was highly likely to be

responsible for the act against

1:32:111:32:16

Sergei Skripal and Yulia Skripal,

and there are only two possible

1:32:161:32:20

explanation for what happened.

Either this was a direct act by the

1:32:201:32:27

Russian State or the Russian

government lost control of its

1:32:271:32:30

potentially catastrophically

damaging nerve agent and allowed it

1:32:301:32:32

to get into the hands of others. My

right honourable friend the Foreign

1:32:321:32:37

Secretary has some of the Russian

ambassador to the Foreign and

1:32:371:32:40

Commonwealth Office and asked him to

explain which of these two

1:32:401:32:45

possibilities it is. Therefore to

account for how this Russian

1:32:451:32:49

produced nerve agent could have been

deployed in Salisbury against Sergei

1:32:491:32:54

Skripal and his daughter. My right

honourable friend has stated to the

1:32:541:32:59

ambassador that the Russian

Federation must immediately provide

1:32:591:33:02

full and complete disclosure of the

nerve agent programme for the

1:33:021:33:09

Prohibition of chemical weapons and

he is requested the ration

1:33:091:33:13

government was not response by the

end of tomorrow. This action has

1:33:131:33:17

happened against a backdrop of a

well-established pattern of Russian

1:33:171:33:20

state aggression. Russia's illegal

annexation of Crimea was the first

1:33:201:33:25

time since the Second World War that

one sovereign nation has forcibly

1:33:251:33:28

taken territory from another in

Europe and Russia has fermented

1:33:281:33:36

conflict in the Dundas and violated

the airspace of several countries

1:33:361:33:42

and this is included meddling in

elections and packing the Danish

1:33:421:33:48

Ministry of Defence and the

Bundestag. During his recent State

1:33:481:33:53

of the union address Vladimir Putin

showed video graphics of missile

1:33:531:33:58

launches and fight to deck trees and

explosions including the modelling

1:33:581:34:03

of a attack on the United States

with a series of warheads impacting

1:34:031:34:06

in Florida while the extrajudicial

killing of terrorists outside Russia

1:34:061:34:12

were given legal sanction by the

Russian parliament in 2006. And of

1:34:121:34:18

course Russia used radiological

substances in its barbaric assault

1:34:181:34:24

on Alexander Litvinenko, weasel

promises to assist the investigation

1:34:241:34:26

then but they resulted in denial --

we saw promises. And the stifling of

1:34:261:34:35

due process and the rule of law, and

following the death of Alexander

1:34:351:34:39

Litvinenko we expel Russian

diplomats and suspended co-operation

1:34:391:34:43

and broke off bilateral plans and

froze the assets of the suspects and

1:34:431:34:47

put them on international

extradition lists and these measures

1:34:471:34:50

remain in place. Furthermore our

commitment to collective defence and

1:34:501:34:55

security through Nato remains as

strong as ever in the face of

1:34:551:34:58

Russian behaviour and indeed our

Armed Forces have a leading role in

1:34:581:35:03

Nato's enhanced with presence with

British troops leading a group in

1:35:031:35:11

Estonia and we have led the way in

securing TASS actions against the

1:35:111:35:13

Russian economy and we have at all

stages worked closely with our

1:35:131:35:24

allies and we must now stand ready

to take more extensive measures for

1:35:241:35:27

the Wednesday we will consider in

detail the response from the Russian

1:35:271:35:31

state and should there be no

credible response we will conclude

1:35:311:35:33

that this action amounts to an

unlawful use of force by the Russian

1:35:331:35:38

state against the UK. And I will

come back to this house and set out

1:35:381:35:45

the full range of measures that we

will take in response. This

1:35:451:35:49

attempted murder using a weapons

grade nerve agent in a British town

1:35:491:35:55

was not just a crime against Sergei

Skripal and his daughter, it was an

1:35:551:35:59

indiscriminate and reckless act

against the UK putting the lives of

1:35:591:36:03

innocent civilians at risk. And we

will not tolerate such a brazen

1:36:031:36:07

attempt to murder innocent civilians

on our soil. I commend this

1:36:071:36:12

statement to the house.

Jeremy

Corbyn.

I would like to thank the

1:36:121:36:20

Prime Minister in advance... For an

advance copy of her statement on

1:36:201:36:24

this deeply alarming attack which

raises very serious questions. The

1:36:241:36:29

whole house condemns the suspected

poisoning of Sergei Skripal and his

1:36:291:36:32

daughter in Salisbury and of course

we wish them a return to good

1:36:321:36:35

health. I'm sure the whole house

will join me in wishing Detective

1:36:351:36:40

Sergeant Nick Bailey a speedy

recovery as well, no member of our

1:36:401:36:44

police force and nobody on the

streets of Britain should ever face

1:36:441:36:47

such an attack that alone with

chemical weapons. I thank the Prime

1:36:471:36:53

Minister for updating the house, the

investigation into the shocking

1:36:531:36:57

events in Salisbury must reach its

conclusions and we need to see the

1:36:571:37:01

evidence and a full account from the

Russian authorities in light of

1:37:011:37:07

emerging evidence that the Prime

Minister has just referred to. For

1:37:071:37:11

now can the Prime Minister clarify

what level of threat it was believed

1:37:111:37:16

Sergei Skripal faced at the time of

the attack and what security

1:37:161:37:20

protection if any was deemed

necessary for him and his daughter?

1:37:201:37:26

This morning the Conservative chair

of the Foreign Affairs Committee

1:37:261:37:30

said, I would be surprised if the

Prime Minister did not point the

1:37:301:37:38

finger at the Kremlin, and the

honourable man but also accused the

1:37:381:37:45

Russians of -- honourable member

also accused the Russians of

1:37:451:37:49

behaving aggressively in this

country for the we need a dialogue

1:37:491:37:53

in Russia with all the issues in our

country both domestic and

1:37:531:37:57

international, rather than simply

cutting off contact and letting the

1:37:571:37:59

tensions and divisions get worse and

potentially even more dangerous.

1:37:591:38:08

Mr Speaker, we are all familiar with

the way huge fortunes often acquired

1:38:081:38:13

in the most dubious circumstances in

Russia sometimes connected with

1:38:131:38:16

criminal elements have ended up

sheltering in London and trying to

1:38:161:38:22

buy political influence in British

party politics. Meddling in

1:38:221:38:28

elections, as the Prime Minister put

it, and there has been over £800,000

1:38:281:38:33

worth of donations to the

Conservative Party from Russian

1:38:331:38:40

oligarchs and their associates. So,

Mr Speaker, if that is the evidence

1:38:401:38:54

before the government even before

the investigation into Salisbury is

1:38:541:38:57

complete, the government could be

taking action to introduce new

1:38:571:39:05

financial sanctions powers. But

instead, Mr Speaker, they are

1:39:051:39:11

currently resisting Labour's

amendments to sanctions and

1:39:111:39:16

money-laundering bell, which could

introduce the so-called magnate Skip

1:39:161:39:22

ours, so will the Prime Minister

agreed today to back those

1:39:221:39:28

amendments to the money-laundering

bell? More specifically...

Order,

1:39:281:39:39

there can be strongly held opinions

and inflamed passions, but I do

1:39:391:39:43

appear to colleagues who sincerity

and integrity I don't doubt to

1:39:431:39:48

remember that we hear views, and

other colleagues will be heard, but

1:39:481:39:53

the right honourable gentleman must

be had.

1:39:531:40:05

And ensure they come forward and are

checked? What extra resources are

1:40:091:40:18

being provided to the local police

force which quite understandably

1:40:181:40:21

have never had to deal with such an

incident before. We know that a

1:40:211:40:29

cross country the National health

services incredible pressure is at

1:40:291:40:31

the moment, but what extra resources

have been provided to NHS hospitals

1:40:311:40:36

in and around Salisbury, and what

training has been given to NHS staff

1:40:361:40:44

and GPs in identifying the symptoms

from a nerve agent attack? Mr

1:40:441:40:47

Speaker, the events in Salisbury on

4th of March have appalled the

1:40:471:40:54

country and need thorough

investigation. The local community

1:40:541:40:56

and public services involved need

reassurances and the resources

1:40:561:41:04

necessary. The action the government

takes needs to be both decisive and

1:41:041:41:11

proportionate, once the facts are

clear, and focused on ridges in

1:41:111:41:14

conflicts and tensions rather than

increasing them. I join the Prime

1:41:141:41:20

Minister in paying tribute to the

magnificent work of our public

1:41:201:41:24

services, responding to this attack,

the NHS staff, the police and

1:41:241:41:30

security services, the Armed Forces

and the analysts from Porton down.

1:41:301:41:32

Let us do everything we can to

ensure this never, never happens

1:41:321:41:37

again.

1:41:371:41:40

Can I first of all said to the right

honourable gentleman that I'm sure

1:41:451:41:48

everybody in the whole house sends

their best wishes to all those who

1:41:481:41:52

have suffered as a result of this

incident and wish them a recovery.

1:41:521:41:58

In the case of Detective Sergeant

Nick Bailey, I saw a quote which I

1:41:581:42:02

was not surprised that, because I

have heard it from so many police

1:42:021:42:05

officers who have been in dangerous

situations before, that he was

1:42:051:42:11

merely doing his job, and we are

grateful to him and all of our

1:42:111:42:15

police officers and the emergency

services for doing that. We don't

1:42:151:42:18

comment on the threats in relation

to individual cases, but of course

1:42:181:42:25

the police and others always look to

ensure that we are taking these

1:42:251:42:30

matters fully into account, and

taking them very seriously. In

1:42:301:42:34

relation to Russia, we have a very

simple approach to Russia, which is

1:42:341:42:37

engaged but beware, and I think this

shows how right it is that this

1:42:371:42:42

government has been cautious in

relation to arrangements with

1:42:421:42:44

Russia. I set out in my Mansion

house speech last November very

1:42:441:42:50

clearly the concerns we have about

the activities of Russia. It is a

1:42:501:42:55

matter I have discussed with fellow

leaders at the European council, I

1:42:551:42:58

think we must be all very well aware

of the various ways in which Russia

1:42:581:43:04

is affecting activity across the

continent and elsewhere. There can

1:43:041:43:08

be no question of business as usual

with Russia. The right honourable

1:43:081:43:13

gentleman raised the issue of party

donations. I will say two things to

1:43:131:43:18

him, firstly as my right honourable

friend the Chancellor of the

1:43:181:43:23

Exchequer said at the weekend, you

should not car anybody who lives in

1:43:231:43:27

this country of Russian extraction

with the same brush. And secondly

1:43:271:43:32

there are rules on party political

donations, and I can assure him that

1:43:321:43:36

my party and I hope all parties

follow those rules. He talked about

1:43:361:43:44

the Magnitsky powers, this is an

issue that I have been challenged on

1:43:441:43:47

previously on this question, where

we do have already some of the

1:43:471:43:52

powers that are being prepared, but

we have already been talking with

1:43:521:44:00

all parties about the amendment that

has been put down, and we will work

1:44:001:44:04

to others to ensure that we have the

maximum possible consensus before

1:44:041:44:09

the report stage. He also raised the

question of police capabilities and

1:44:091:44:16

resources. Not only are Wiltshire

Police involved in this, but they

1:44:161:44:19

have support from neighbouring

forces, as would normally happen

1:44:191:44:22

when an incident takes place which

requires that extra capability. But,

1:44:221:44:29

crucially, at a very early stage, it

was decided that counterterrorism

1:44:291:44:33

police should take over the response

for this because the

1:44:331:44:36

counterterrorism police network as

capabilities which are not available

1:44:361:44:41

to regional forces, and they are

indeed in charge in relation to

1:44:411:44:44

this. And I can assure the right

honourable gentleman that boccia

1:44:441:44:50

county council, Salisbury City

Council are working with Public

1:44:501:44:53

Health England, the NHS locally,

working with the police to ensure

1:44:531:44:56

that there is maximum information

available to members of the public.

1:44:561:45:01

The Chief Medical Officer has

herself reassured members of the

1:45:011:45:03

public that the public health risk

is locum and to ensure that the

1:45:031:45:08

proper arrangements are being put in

place to help the police to get on

1:45:081:45:12

with their enquiries and that is

important. The police are still

1:45:121:45:17

working, investigating this, and we

should ensure they have the time and

1:45:171:45:20

space to be would conduct these

investigations.

May I commend my

1:45:201:45:29

right honourable friend for rising

to this occasion, as she should.

1:45:291:45:32

Many in this house would wish the

Leader of the Opposition had

1:45:321:45:38

abandoned party politics and done

just the same. She is quite right,

1:45:381:45:52

if the response from the Russian

ambassador is simply not credible,

1:45:521:45:56

she is quite right to expect the

house to back her in taking the most

1:45:561:46:01

severe action as is required and

commence at, and she is also right

1:46:011:46:05

to remind the house and the country

that this country, Russia, is now

1:46:051:46:09

close to being a rogue state as any.

It occupies Crimea, it has helped

1:46:091:46:16

occupy eastern Ukraine, it has

created a hell on earth in Syria,

1:46:161:46:21

and is even now overseeing worst

action. This is a country locking up

1:46:211:46:28

its members of the opposition. It is

a country frankly we have learned

1:46:281:46:32

this lesson before, if we appease a

country like this then we expect

1:46:321:46:35

even worse.

I thank my right

honourable friend for his remarks,

1:46:351:46:41

and he is absolutely right. Nobody

should be in any doubt of the

1:46:411:46:47

various activities that the Russian

state is involved in across the

1:46:471:46:50

continent of Europe and elsewhere.

And the damage that that is doing in

1:46:501:46:56

so many different places, and he is

absolutely right that that is why it

1:46:561:47:01

is important that this government,

that this country, stands up very

1:47:011:47:06

clearly and not only calls out

actions by Russia, but also ensures

1:47:061:47:10

that we have a robust response to

them.

Thank you, Mr Speaker. I would

1:47:101:47:18

like to thank the Prime Minister for

advance copy of her statement and

1:47:181:47:21

share with her the concerns around

the recent attack in Salisbury. It

1:47:211:47:25

is important that we all work

together to get to the bottom of

1:47:251:47:28

what has happened here. Mr Speaker,

there can be no denying that this

1:47:281:47:35

assassination attempt on Mr Sergei

Skripal and his daughter is not only

1:47:351:47:38

a step too far by those responsible,

but calls into question every aspect

1:47:381:47:45

of our current and future

relationship with Russia. Mr

1:47:451:47:50

Speaker, this ruthless action puts

not only the likes of our emergency

1:47:501:47:56

services at risk but also threatens

the safety of the wider public who

1:47:561:47:59

were enjoying a Sunday afternoon in

the cathedral city of Salisbury.

1:47:591:48:04

Everyone has the right to live in

the UK in security and safety and

1:48:041:48:08

any challenge to those rights needs

to be responded to in an appropriate

1:48:081:48:12

manner. Police have so far

identified more than 200 witnesses

1:48:121:48:17

and 240 pieces of evidence in this

attempted killing. Our thoughts, all

1:48:171:48:21

of us, our thoughts are with Nick

Bailey and his family, and we wish

1:48:211:48:25

him a speedy recovery. We commend

the emergency services for putting

1:48:251:48:31

their lives on the line in order to

defend all of us. However, there are

1:48:311:48:36

legitimate concerns around the delay

in time between the events on Sunday

1:48:361:48:40

for the march and yesterday when the

Chief Medical Officer advised the

1:48:401:48:45

public who had been at the pub and

restaurant wash their clothing and

1:48:451:48:49

personal items. Can the Prime

Minister give reassurances to those

1:48:491:48:52

members of the public who may have

real concerns that they may have

1:48:521:48:55

been exposed to the effects of the

nerve agent used? I welcome the

1:48:551:49:00

Prime Minister's actions detailed in

her statement as I ask when she

1:49:001:49:05

intends to return to the house to

update us all on what measures we

1:49:051:49:09

can all take. There must be firm and

strong action taken to send a clear

1:49:091:49:16

message to the Kremlin we will not

accept interference from Russia on

1:49:161:49:21

our way of life or in our politics.

This kind of international outrage

1:49:211:49:32

must never again be seen on our

streets.

Can I first of all thank

1:49:321:49:39

the right honourable gentleman for

the turn that he's adopted in his

1:49:391:49:43

response to this statement, because

this is indeed a matter which should

1:49:431:49:46

concern us all. This is a matter of

national interest, it is a matter of

1:49:461:49:51

an attack that has taken place, and

we must respond to it appropriately,

1:49:511:49:55

as he said. He asked the question

about the Chief Medical Officer's

1:49:551:50:01

most recent advice to those who had

been in the restaurant or the pub.

1:50:011:50:06

The answer to that is that over the

course of time in the last week as

1:50:061:50:12

work was done more information

became available, which led to that

1:50:121:50:19

precautionary advice being made

yesterday. He also asked what I will

1:50:191:50:24

be returning to the house. We will

consider in detailed response from

1:50:241:50:28

the Russian state on Wednesday and I

will return to the house at the

1:50:281:50:33

earliest possible opportunity.

1:50:331:50:36

This is not an act of war was

certainly a warlike act by the

1:50:401:50:45

Russian Federation, and this is not

the first we've seen. While some in

1:50:451:50:49

this house have stayed silent and

decided to join the information

1:50:491:50:53

warfare that that state is

conducting against us and our

1:50:531:50:57

allies, we have seen them invade

countries in the east, attack

1:50:571:51:00

allies, attempt to kill Prime

Minister 's, and even now, even now

1:51:001:51:05

they are backing the murderous Assad

regime, which thinks of nothing of

1:51:051:51:11

gassing its own people, and the

honourable gentleman opposite stays

1:51:111:51:14

silent. Would my right honourable

friend agree with me that now is the

1:51:141:51:20

time for us to call on our allies,

the European Union who has worked so

1:51:201:51:24

well with us on sanctions, on Nato

and particularly on the United

1:51:241:51:30

States, and ask what they will do to

assist us in this moment when we are

1:51:301:51:33

in need?

Can I say to my on the wall

friend, I think he is absolutely

1:51:331:51:41

right, we should be giving a robust

response from the whole of this

1:51:411:51:45

house to this incident, this act,

that has taken place, but we also

1:51:451:51:48

will be working, and there has

already been a number of engagements

1:51:481:51:53

with allies on this particular

matter, and we will be continuing to

1:51:531:51:57

talk with our allies to ensure both

that they are aware of what has

1:51:571:52:02

happened on British soil, and also

that we can talk with them about the

1:52:021:52:08

response that we will be giving.

Would the Prime Minister not agree

1:52:081:52:14

that one of the most effective ways

of punishing Russia for these

1:52:141:52:18

appalling activities would be to

seize the private property assets of

1:52:181:52:23

members of the Putin regime and

their associates? And as a first

1:52:231:52:27

step, could she arranged to publish

a list of who they are and what they

1:52:271:52:30

own?

1:52:301:52:37

We are aware here of the need in the

United Kingdom to ensure that our

1:52:371:52:41

financial system cannot be used for

a list that money flows and

1:52:411:52:46

appropriate action is taken by law

enforcement and other bodies to

1:52:461:52:49

ensure that we do identify such

flows, and that we make the

1:52:491:52:54

appropriate response to them. As he

will know, we are already putting in

1:52:541:52:59

place a number of measures to

improve the information that is

1:52:591:53:03

available in a transparent way and

relation to the holding of certain

1:53:031:53:08

assets here by those from overseas

and that is something that we will

1:53:081:53:12

continue to work on.

Thank you Mr

Speaker. I entirely agree with the

1:53:121:53:18

Prime Minister and her approach to

this murderous attack. And she will

1:53:181:53:22

be aware and has stated that it's

part of a pattern of behaviour by

1:53:221:53:29

which a state uses covert means and

breach of both international and

1:53:291:53:33

international law and the rule of

law to attack with impunity whoever

1:53:331:53:38

it wishes. In those circumstances,

which he agreed with me that we face

1:53:381:53:42

a very particular challenge which is

not likely to go away anytime soon?

1:53:421:53:49

And in this context, and trying to

inform the public of the risks and

1:53:491:53:54

of the appropriate way of responding

for a Parliamentary democracy, could

1:53:541:53:59

I encouraged her to make use of the

intelligence and security committee

1:53:591:54:03

who chose to carry out an inquiry

into Russia's threat last autumn so

1:54:031:54:08

that we can take that forward and

provide as much information as we

1:54:081:54:13

can publicly about the nature of the

threat and the best means of

1:54:131:54:16

responding to what?

I say to my

right honourable friend that I think

1:54:161:54:23

it was very good that the would be

considering issues around the... I

1:54:231:54:31

look forward to the worker that his

committee will be doing on that

1:54:311:54:36

particular matter and the Government

will work with the ISC to share that

1:54:361:54:41

information that is within its

remit.

I think the Prime Minister

1:54:411:54:47

for her statement, and it is hard to

see any alternative to her very

1:54:471:54:50

grave conclusion that this was

either a direct act by the Russian

1:54:501:54:54

state against our country or the

Russian government has lost control

1:54:541:54:58

of a dangerous nerve agent. In that

context, I hope the whole House will

1:54:581:55:02

be able to come together to find a

firm response from the Government

1:55:021:55:08

and the interest of our national

security and public safety. Can I

1:55:081:55:12

therefore ask her whether the Mac

Security Council have asked for the

1:55:121:55:17

review of the 14 other cases that I

wrote to the Home Secretary amount

1:55:171:55:22

to see whether any of those should

be investigated and also to press

1:55:221:55:25

her on what further action she has

taken in preparation for potential

1:55:251:55:30

UN Security Council resolutions that

perhaps should be drafted in order

1:55:301:55:35

to get the widest possible

international support.

Can I say to

1:55:351:55:41

the right honourable lady she is

absolutely right pretty neat for

1:55:411:55:43

them to be a clear response for the

whole of this House, and I think no

1:55:431:55:48

one will be in doubt of the nature

of what has happened and we should

1:55:481:55:53

respond robustly to it. I understand

that my right honourable friend the

1:55:531:55:58

Home Secretary has responded to the

right honourable lady's letter in

1:55:581:56:01

relation to those 14 other cases,

and I think the focus at the moment

1:56:011:56:06

should be on ensuring that the

resource has put into this criminal

1:56:061:56:10

investigation so that they're able

to do their work with the maximal

1:56:101:56:15

time and space.

Does the Prime

Minister recall that when Edward

1:56:151:56:21

Heath expelled over 100 Russian

so-called diplomats in the early

1:56:211:56:29

1970s it gave a blow to Russian

intelligence operations against this

1:56:291:56:32

country from which it never

recovered until the end of the cold

1:56:321:56:36

war. The she also recall that when

it was clear that a member of the

1:56:361:56:42

Libyan embassy staff, which one was

unknown, had killed the UPC wind

1:56:421:56:51

Fletcher and wholesale expulsion of

staff occurred then. That she

1:56:511:56:54

therefore conclude that as it would

be impossible for an operation to

1:56:541:57:00

have been mounted by the Russian

state without someone in the London

1:57:001:57:04

Russian embassy knowing about it and

similar measures may well be

1:57:041:57:07

necessary.

And I thank my honourable

friend and as I said any statement I

1:57:071:57:15

gave, the Foreign Secretary had

called the ambassador into the

1:57:151:57:22

office today and was presented these

two possibilities of the origin of

1:57:221:57:28

this action to him and we wait for

the Russian state's response. I'm

1:57:281:57:33

very clear that should the response

not be credible, we will conclude

1:57:331:57:36

that this action is unlawful use of

force by the Russian state against

1:57:361:57:41

the United Kingdom and as I said

earlier, I will come back to this

1:57:411:57:45

House and set out the full range of

measures that we will take in

1:57:451:57:49

response.

And naturally there is the

most intense interest in this

1:57:491:57:52

extraordinary grave matter and I am

keen to a call at accommodate

1:57:521:57:55

colleagues. Can I ask colleagues to

help me help each of them by

1:57:551:58:00

confining themselves to pity

questions.

Thank you Mr Speaker. As

1:58:001:58:05

the Prime Minister agree that in

here but me further aggression from

1:58:051:58:11

the Russian mafia state that the

policy of the Leader of the

1:58:111:58:15

Opposition to engage in robust

dialogue will only encourage Putin

1:58:151:58:19

to engage in further acts of

state-sponsored terror, and would

1:58:191:58:22

she agree it's in regard to the cost

of this that the only other

1:58:221:58:28

effective answer is to have robust

action against those who are using

1:58:281:58:34

the UK as a battle ground to carry

out their own...

I agree with the

1:58:341:58:40

honourable gentleman that need to

ensure that we do respond robustly

1:58:401:58:43

to this matter, but we need to do so

with careful consideration of the

1:58:431:58:47

assessments that have been made and

the information that is available to

1:58:471:58:51

us and that is exactly what the

Government is doing. I think nobody

1:58:511:58:54

in the towel should be in any doubt

that there could be no suggestion as

1:58:541:58:59

business as usual in relation to our

interaction with Russia.

The whole

1:58:591:59:05

country will welcome be precise and

clear statement which the Prime

1:59:051:59:08

Minister has delivered to the House

this afternoon, and in particular,

1:59:081:59:14

setting out precisely what she will

do in terms of laying out the

1:59:141:59:17

evidence for the international

community and the United Nations of

1:59:171:59:21

the acts that has been perpetrated

on British soil. Matt also welcome

1:59:211:59:27

the comment she made about the

so-called Megan Nitschke amendment.

1:59:271:59:31

There are many of those across the

House of Commons who believe that

1:59:311:59:34

this can make a big contribution and

I hope that she will continue

1:59:341:59:40

considering following the way in

which America, Canada, and three

1:59:401:59:45

European countries have introduced

this particular amendment.

I

1:59:451:59:49

recognise my right honourable friend

has been supporting the amendment

1:59:491:59:53

and working on this issue. I would

say to him as I have done earlier

1:59:531:59:57

that we do want to ensure that we

get the maximum possible consensus

1:59:572:00:02

across the House on this particular

issue and we will talk to the

2:00:022:00:05

parties involved to ensure that the

approach that is taken is one that

2:00:052:00:13

the Shadow Foreign Secretary says

that there is not an amendment down.

2:00:132:00:16

There is an amendment down.

Discussions are taking place with

2:00:162:00:21

parties about the impact of the

amendment as currently drafted

2:00:212:00:26

ensuring that any action that is

taken is going to the action that we

2:00:262:00:31

are sure will work.

Can I commend

the Prime Minister for today making

2:00:312:00:38

the sort of a resolute and realistic

statement about the Kremlin that

2:00:382:00:41

many of us have been looking for in

this House for some time. Would she

2:00:412:00:47

invite the heroic and brave Bill

Browder who's done more than any

2:00:472:00:49

other single individual to uncover

the Kremlin's methods to give her a

2:00:492:00:55

full briefing about what he knows a

putrid's roadies money laundering

2:00:552:00:59

exploits in London and... And will

she make sure that the whole of the

2:00:592:01:05

Government machinery is now giving

full cooperation to Robert Mueller's

2:01:052:01:09

inquiry in the United States because

of what he has already uncovered

2:01:092:01:13

about what the Russians have been

doing here.

- to be right arm was

2:01:132:01:18

uncommon, we've already been clear

in relation to the Mueller inquiry

2:01:182:01:23

and we will respond to the

appropriate requests. I am told that

2:01:232:01:27

the other individual that he

referred to has actually met the

2:01:272:01:31

Security Minister and has been able

to brief him on what he knows.

Thank

2:01:312:01:38

you Mr Speaker. Friends from his

candid AVI, the Baltics, and Eastern

2:01:382:01:44

Europe have told me how much they

feel at risk for Russian aggression.

2:01:442:01:52

Can my friend update the House and

how we work with our allies and

2:01:522:01:56

response to does incident?

2:01:562:02:01

I am conscious that those who are

particularly geographically close to

2:02:022:02:05

Russia on the European continent to

feel very much the immediacy of many

2:02:052:02:13

of the activities that Russia gets

involved with, particularly around

2:02:132:02:18

matters for example on propaganda

use. I will certainly be speaking to

2:02:182:02:23

an number of our allies. I think

it's important not only that people

2:02:232:02:27

recognise what has taken place here

in the United Kingdom, but also the

2:02:272:02:30

implication that Ed has -- that it

has for Russia's activities

2:02:302:02:38

elsewhere on the continent of

Europe.

Thank you Mr Speaker. Can I

2:02:382:02:42

also commend the Prime Minister for

her remarks. The last time we had

2:02:422:02:51

been a clear, defined

state-sponsored act of terrorism was

2:02:512:02:56

in 2006, and she has referred to it.

Kenji also have conversations with

2:02:562:03:01

her predecessor Prime Minister at

that time, Tony Blair, about some of

2:03:012:03:05

the issues that arose subsequent to

the actions we took, because it's

2:03:052:03:10

quite clear the Russians will

retaliate and we will then be into a

2:03:102:03:14

tit-for-tat process. They think we

will back down. We have to stay

2:03:142:03:20

resolutely and strongly we're not

backing down, this is an act of

2:03:202:03:24

terrorism and all members of

Parliament stand together.

Can I say

2:03:242:03:30

to the honourable gentleman he is

absolutely right that when they take

2:03:302:03:33

action and it is to ensure that that

is action and we will continue to

2:03:332:03:37

follow through. As I said in my

statement, many of the actions that

2:03:372:03:41

were taken in response to Litvinenko

murder are still in place in

2:03:412:03:45

relation to our relations with the

Russian state. Nobody should be in

2:03:452:03:51

any doubt of the likelihood of an

impact from the Russian state and

2:03:512:03:57

attempting to, as they did in that

case, suggest that the information

2:03:572:04:01

that we were putting out was

incorrect. Actually, what we saw

2:04:012:04:05

particularly from the inquiry that

followed significantly later which

2:04:052:04:10

very firmly put the responsibility

for Litvinenko's murder at the door

2:04:102:04:18

of the Russian state, and indeed to

President Putin.

Thank you Mr

2:04:182:04:23

Speaker. Can I commend the Prime

Minister for the robust tone of her

2:04:232:04:26

statement? Which I believe is

entirely appropriate. Which he also

2:04:262:04:32

accepted that while we might not be

in a period of cold war with Russia,

2:04:322:04:36

as they were in the 1980s, because

of their actions it could be said

2:04:362:04:40

that we are at least now entering a

period of cool. And if that be so,

2:04:402:04:47

would she be prepared at the

appropriate time to look again at

2:04:472:04:51

our ability to determine out of the

resources that we require in order

2:04:512:04:58

to do so?

Can I say to my honourable

friend, that as I said previously

2:04:582:05:05

there is no question of business as

usual with Russia. We must be very

2:05:052:05:09

clear of the actions that they have

taken. I think this incident proves

2:05:092:05:15

that the actions we've taken over

the past decade have been entirely

2:05:152:05:20

justified. What we see is a Kremlin

that is intent on dismantling the

2:05:202:05:27

international rules based order, and

we should stand up resolutely in

2:05:272:05:30

defence of that international

orders.

Thank you Mr Speaker. The

2:05:302:05:35

evidence the Prime Minister provided

to date makes it absolutely clear

2:05:352:05:38

that the onus is on the Russian

state to explain how this nerve

2:05:382:05:42

agent entered into our country. I

thank her for her answer to my

2:05:422:05:47

colleague, the chair of the

intelligence and security committee,

2:05:472:05:50

it's essential that we carry out...

That she also agree that our inquiry

2:05:502:05:55

should also be able to understand

the pressures on our intelligence to

2:05:552:05:59

understand the pressures on our

intelligent security services at how

2:05:592:06:01

best they are supported to do the

job they have to do?

Of course, it

2:06:012:06:08

is for the ISC committee itself to

determine the breath of the

2:06:082:06:12

inquiries that it undertakes within

the remit that it has been set. Buy

2:06:122:06:18

this House and by government. It is

for that committee to determine this

2:06:182:06:24

particular issues. Extra resources

are being put into the security and

2:06:242:06:28

intelligence agencies, because we

have recognised the increasing

2:06:282:06:32

challenges and threats that we need

to address and that's why those

2:06:322:06:39

resources are going into the FIA.

The grisly face of so many a

2:06:392:06:48

President Putin's opponents both at

home and abroad, even those high

2:06:482:06:54

profile as Boris and that's all.

Having said that and supporting all

2:06:542:07:06

of the measures she will take

against the Government of Russia, if

2:07:062:07:10

it turns out that way we all into

will she try as far as is possible

2:07:102:07:17

to continue the opportunity for

British society in its widest sense

2:07:172:07:20

to be opened with the people of

Russia so that the virus of truth

2:07:202:07:25

and openness can do its work on that

regime?

I think my honourable

2:07:252:07:32

gentleman has raised an important

issue which is that of coarse but we

2:07:322:07:35

are talking about is the dealings UK

Government has with the Russian

2:07:352:07:40

state. Of course I think it is

important that people in Russia

2:07:402:07:44

understand the exact nature of the

regime that is an government at the

2:07:442:07:49

moment.

I don't suppose a single

member of this House is a price that

2:07:492:07:55

President Putin will resort to

violence because he done it so many

2:07:552:07:59

times before. 334 killed and the

best land massacre. 170 killed

2:07:592:08:06

unnecessarily in the Moscow theatre

siege, 299 killed in the aeroplane

2:08:062:08:14

that was brought down by the

Russians. Countless journalist,

2:08:142:08:18

countless people who stood up to him

as political opponents and other

2:08:182:08:22

countries around the world murdered

by him and yes sir Quebec Nitschke.

2:08:222:08:27

I've heard what the Prime Minister

says but for the 29th time I'm

2:08:272:08:32

asking this question, can we just

make sure that at the end of this

2:08:322:08:37

process nobody who was involved in

the murder of Sir Day Luck Magnitsky

2:08:372:08:41

or in the corruption that he

unveiled

2:08:412:08:50

And for that matter can we stop

Russia today from broadcasting its

2:08:502:08:52

propaganda?

Can I say to the right

honourable gentleman as I know that

2:08:522:09:00

he has asked me this question about

the Magnitsky issue on many

2:09:002:09:04

occasions in this House when I was

Home Secretary and subsequently, and

2:09:042:09:09

we of course already has a number of

powers that enable us to take action

2:09:092:09:13

against individuals to prevent them

from coming into this country, but

2:09:132:09:16

we are looking seriously at the

amendments and as I say we do want

2:09:162:09:22

to ensure that we get maximum

consensus in relation to this issue.

2:09:222:09:29

On the further action that we might

take as a government, I will be

2:09:292:09:33

returning to the House at the

possible opportunity once we have

2:09:332:09:36

the response from the Russian state

to update the House on the further

2:09:362:09:39

measures we would take.

If you have

one permanent member of the UN

2:09:392:09:47

Security Council carrying out a

targeted assassination in the

2:09:472:09:52

country of another, surely it is

time for the UN Secretary General to

2:09:522:09:56

watch an immediate inquiry.

I thank

my honourable friend for his

2:09:562:10:03

suggestion. Can I say to him that of

course what the United Nations is

2:10:032:10:06

one of those bodies that we will be

speaking to about the nature of this

2:10:062:10:10

incident that has taken place here

in the United Kingdom. Among other

2:10:102:10:16

allies and other organisations such

as Nato, but we will certainly be

2:10:162:10:20

raising this matter with the UN.

Thank you Mr Speaker. While these

2:10:202:10:26

investigations are ongoing we are

waiting from the response from the

2:10:262:10:29

Russian government. Can I ask the

Primus or what her government is

2:10:292:10:33

doing to protect other people who

are targeted here in the UK?

We

2:10:332:10:36

don't talk about the measures that

are taken into relation with

2:10:362:10:41

individuals. That is a matter for

the police and law enforcement

2:10:412:10:48

generally. I can assure her that

that is a matter that is being

2:10:482:10:52

considered.

Johnny Mercer.

I think I

have just seen and I would look at

2:10:522:11:01

my honourable friend opposite that I

have seen the most shameful moments

2:11:012:11:04

in the House of Commons in my time

today. It is clear that this is

2:11:042:11:08

sobering United Kingdom has come

under attack from another state. The

2:11:082:11:12

Prime Minister -- does the premise

or agree with me that the care to

2:11:122:11:17

conflict is changing? We must to

relentless in trying to keep pace of

2:11:172:11:20

that and nothing was out those

looking to do this work?

In my

2:11:202:11:24

honourable friend is absolutely

right that the character of the

2:11:242:11:28

threats that we face is changing.

They are diversifying. And we need

2:11:282:11:33

to ensure that we are able to deal

with those threats across the range

2:11:332:11:38

of actions that need to be taken.

Some of those will not always fall

2:11:382:11:45

into what my convention -- might

conventionally be defensible.

Were

2:11:452:11:51

the premise or confirmed that we

bear the Russian people nothing but

2:11:512:11:58

good well, it is president Putin

that we have in our sights and we

2:11:582:12:02

will not allow him to use this in

the presidential elections to

2:12:022:12:06

burnish his image as a strong man?

The right honourable gentleman is

2:12:062:12:11

absolutely right. It is the Russian

state that we are challenging in

2:12:112:12:16

relation to this particular act that

has taken place on UK soil. Not the

2:12:162:12:20

Russian people.

John Lyndale.

Is it

not increasingly clear that we are

2:12:202:12:29

engaged in hybrid warfare which

includes disinformation, political

2:12:292:12:34

information Butland affairs, cyber

attacks another set of attempted

2:12:342:12:37

murder? In considering a response,

will my right honourable friend look

2:12:372:12:41

at what additional help we might

give to the people of Ukraine who

2:12:412:12:44

are being hurt in resisting Russian

aggression expansionism?

I would

2:12:442:12:52

like to thank my right honourable

friend and he is right we do need to

2:12:522:12:56

look across the very diverse nature

of the threat that we face. And the

2:12:562:13:00

actions that we are taking and have

already been taking a number of

2:13:002:13:04

actions in support of the Ukraine.

It is also an important part of our

2:13:042:13:11

deliberations and important part of

our response.

Malcolm MacDonald.

The

2:13:112:13:18

question was understood by only

three people. Everybody understands

2:13:182:13:21

what is happened here today. There

can be no criticism of the two of

2:13:212:13:25

the prime is or has adopted. She

would know that under article four

2:13:252:13:29

of Nato, she can raise this as a

concern with our Nato allies. Does

2:13:292:13:33

she intend to do so?

As I has said

in response to a number of other

2:13:332:13:39

questions, we will be raising this

with allies in a number of forms.

2:13:392:13:44

And I will obviously consider as I

said earlier the response to the

2:13:442:13:47

Russian state on Wednesday and I

will return at the earliest possible

2:13:472:13:50

opportunity to this House is set out

for the measures.

Love the Prime

2:13:502:13:54

Minister join me in commending

Wilshire police and health services

2:13:542:13:58

will donate superb job in restraint

of this case? I highlight the

2:13:582:14:04

dedication in public service not

just in Wilshire but up and down the

2:14:042:14:09

country?

I am very happy to join my

honourable friend in commending the

2:14:092:14:15

valuable work that has been done by

emergency services in Wilshire but

2:14:152:14:20

also they are simply a fine example

of the dedication and commitment to

2:14:202:14:24

our public services and emergency

services to across the whole

2:14:242:14:26

country.

I have absolutely no doubt

that the only way to deal with

2:14:262:14:33

Putin's regime is robustly

decisively and together as a

2:14:332:14:35

Parliament and the country. I want

to add my voice to those talk about

2:14:352:14:40

the oppression of the Russian

people, not policing Keshia where

2:14:402:14:44

Putin continues to back the brutal

regime there and his attacks on the

2:14:442:14:48

LGBT community. But Russia today,

can I urge her to speak to Russia's

2:14:482:14:56

broadcasting licence and speak to

the House authorities about blocking

2:14:562:14:59

their broadcasts in this building

itself? Why should we be watching

2:14:592:15:03

their propaganda in this Parliament?

As I have said in the response of

2:15:032:15:09

another of questions, I will look at

the response to the Russian state,

2:15:092:15:14

but I will come back to the size of

the earliest opportunity to look at

2:15:142:15:17

the range of measures which could be

necessary and I think in relation to

2:15:172:15:20

the House authorities, as the

honourable gentleman will be aware,

2:15:202:15:25

that would not be a matter for me

but for the House authorities.

I

2:15:252:15:28

think we have for the honourable

gentleman politely and clearly.

2:15:282:15:30

Thank you.

I congratulate the Prime

Minister for her powerful statement

2:15:302:15:37

and for her leadership in this

incredibly grave matter. Is Russia a

2:15:372:15:42

fit and proper state to be hosting

or engaging in international

2:15:422:15:48

sporting fixtures in 2018?

Can I say

and answer to my right honourable

2:15:482:15:55

friend is that we as I said in

response to prime Ministers

2:15:552:16:01

questions last week, I think we will

be in possession of considering the

2:16:012:16:07

attendance at that particular event

that is coming up in Russia, notably

2:16:072:16:11

the World Cup, of dignitaries and

Ministers here in the United

2:16:112:16:14

Kingdom.

There should be unity

across the House in terms of what I

2:16:142:16:21

feel is a proportionate and sensible

approach that she has taken to

2:16:212:16:25

analysing what has been happening

and coming back to report to the

2:16:252:16:28

House. Can I also say that there are

certain circumstances as she knows

2:16:282:16:33

where we take part in political

differences of opinion, but when our

2:16:332:16:37

country is potentially under attack,

that is just not appropriate.

Can I

2:16:372:16:44

think the right honourable gentleman

for the town that he has adopted. He

2:16:442:16:49

is absolutely right. -- tone. This

is a question of the national

2:16:492:16:53

interest in the interest of our

country. And what another state may

2:16:532:16:55

have done on British soil to people

living here in the United Kingdom.

2:16:552:17:01

And that should be a matter that

should concern all of us and should

2:17:012:17:06

be above party politics.

Having

served with my right honourable

2:17:062:17:12

friend in the Home Office which you

do what is right to keep what is...

2:17:122:17:18

Would be the conclusion of Her

Majesty prospector met that there

2:17:182:17:21

was a unlawful use of force by the

Russians say, do we possess a

2:17:212:17:25

miserable rage of cyber capabilities

which we will not hesitate to deploy

2:17:252:17:29

against that state if it is

necessary to keep our country safe?

2:17:292:17:33

Can I say to my right honourable

friend that of course will look at

2:17:332:17:39

responses across a number of areas

of activity should be as he has a

2:17:392:17:44

set and in my statement as I said

that we conclude that this action

2:17:442:17:48

does amount to an unlawful use of

force by the Russian state in the

2:17:482:17:53

UK.

Thank you Mr Speaker. It is good

that the Prime Minister spells out

2:17:532:18:01

the actions already taken today and

inform us what is happening next.

2:18:012:18:06

Was also make sure that the lessons

learned in the software community

2:18:062:18:10

about this threat and how to prevent

it -- Salisbury community is shared

2:18:102:18:16

an appropriate across the country?

I

am very happy to say that I am sure

2:18:162:18:22

that there will be lessons coming

out of this for local communities

2:18:222:18:27

for the NHS, the police themselves

as they look into this matter. And

2:18:272:18:30

I'm sure that we will ensure those

are available to those across the

2:18:302:18:35

country.

Alex Chok.

Considering

Russia, for all of its geographical

2:18:352:18:42

size, the Russian economy is a

little more than half that of the

2:18:422:18:46

UK. Are the service as is, does my

right honourable friend agree with

2:18:462:18:50

me that British economic levers are

far more potent than some might

2:18:502:18:52

realise and we should not hesitate

the circumstance demanded to pull

2:18:522:18:56

them hard?

As I said we will be

looking at the full range of

2:18:562:19:03

measures should we -- once we

consider the response of the Russian

2:19:032:19:09

state. It is in fact United Kingdom,

we have been one of the leaders in

2:19:092:19:13

ensuring that within the European

Union, that sanctions against Russia

2:19:132:19:17

are in place as a result of the

action that they took place in the

2:19:172:19:20

Crimea and the Ukraine.

Thank you Mr

Speaker. This horrific attempted

2:19:202:19:26

murder on British soil demands a

strong and united response. Can she

2:19:262:19:33

confirm whether the nerve agent in

question is listed under the

2:19:332:19:40

chemical weapons convention?

Yes, it

is illegal to use a nerve agent of

2:19:402:19:45

this board -- this sort and one

bandit of the convention.

Thank you

2:19:452:19:53

Mr Speaker. Will the Prime Minister

agree with me that this attack

2:19:532:19:57

probably involved a professional

Russian trained operatives in order

2:19:572:20:04

to carry out such an individually

targeted assault with what was up in

2:20:042:20:11

a very minute amount of something

like staring VX work something else

2:20:112:20:15

that could have catastrophic,

widescale, indiscriminate and deadly

2:20:152:20:22

consequences?

I say to my honourable

friend that I would not speculate

2:20:222:20:27

the nature of the individual

responsible or individuals

2:20:272:20:34

responsible for this attack. That is

a matter for the police

2:20:342:20:37

investigation.

Mr Speaker, with the

Prime Minister agree now that we

2:20:372:20:44

have all agreed that Russia is a

clear and present danger, we have

2:20:442:20:48

got to be fully organised to meet

their danger? And would she agree

2:20:482:20:53

with me that if we walk out into

London and we see Russian Mafia and

2:20:532:20:57

Russian security people about our

capital city over Europe we see

2:20:572:21:02

them. But they don't like is

sanctions that bite. Will she come

2:21:022:21:06

back to this House an early

education and actually with a firm

2:21:062:21:11

list of sanctions, new sanctions we

can take against Russia?

Diablo

2:21:112:21:17

gentlemen is asking me to refer --

the asked about -- the honourable

2:21:172:21:21

Donovan is having to revert to

particular measures. As I have said

2:21:212:21:24

earlier, we will consider the

response from the Russian state and

2:21:242:21:27

should there be no credible

response, then we will determine and

2:21:272:21:32

conclude that the action amounts to

unlawful use of force by the Russian

2:21:322:21:35

state in the United Kingdom and I

will return with further measures.

2:21:352:21:43

What my right honourable friend the

Prime Minister confirm that despite

2:21:432:21:47

the difficulties the American

presidency may have on these issues,

2:21:472:21:50

that we are fully engaged with the

American government and our allies

2:21:502:21:53

on this very important matter?

I'm

very happy to give my right

2:21:532:21:59

honourable friend a confirmation

that we have been engaged with our

2:21:592:22:01

allies and continue to be engaged

with them on this important issue.

2:22:012:22:06

Can I think the Prime Minister for

coming to the House with this very

2:22:062:22:13

important but sadly not surprising

conclusion today? She is going to

2:22:132:22:17

make it further statement on

Wednesday, but can I ask her to say

2:22:172:22:21

a bit more about the options for

response and to ensure at a time

2:22:212:22:27

when there are voices and forces

trying to erode confidence in open

2:22:272:22:31

democratic society, that those

responses will place as firmly and

2:22:312:22:38

foursquare behind the solidarity and

security of the West?

I hope the

2:22:382:22:44

right honourable and settlement will

forgive me if I say I will not set

2:22:442:22:49

out today what the response is going

to be because we need to consider

2:22:492:22:52

the response from the Russian state

and put together further measures

2:22:522:22:58

appropriate to ensure that we get

the robust response that I and other

2:22:582:23:01

members of this House have been

calling for. But he can be rest

2:23:012:23:05

assured as can other members of this

House that we see a Russia that is

2:23:052:23:10

flouting the international rules

based order, we have been very clear

2:23:102:23:13

about that. And we will stand up for

democracy, stand up to the rule of

2:23:132:23:19

law, for the international rules

based order, and the values that

2:23:192:23:24

underpin it. And continued to be

committed to the security and

2:23:242:23:26

defence of Europe and the defence of

the phase that underpin the West.

2:23:262:23:36

I understand the nerve agent was

developed by Russia specifically to

2:23:362:23:40

avoid being covered by the chemical

weapons treaty and to avoid

2:23:402:23:44

detection by standard equipment.

Could my right honourable friend

2:23:442:23:48

today confirmed that the nerve agent

is a totally illegal substance under

2:23:482:23:53

a treaty to which Russia is

signatory and I'm any knowledge of

2:23:532:23:58

detection and treatment that we

learned from this ghastly attack

2:23:582:24:02

will be shared with authorities and

health authorities not just in this

2:24:022:24:06

country but with our allies abroad

as well.

Can I say to my honourable

2:24:062:24:11

friend that it's very clear that the

use of such nerve agent goes against

2:24:112:24:16

the spirit of the treaty in relation

to the use of chemical weapons. They

2:24:162:24:22

will be, as my honourable friend

expect, be talking to the

2:24:222:24:25

responsible body in relation to

chemical weapons to raise this

2:24:252:24:28

issue.

Thank you Mr Speaker. In late

of the Prime Minister's comments

2:24:282:24:35

which I commend, does the PM agree

that there is no place for

2:24:352:24:39

honourable members on all sides of

the House to appear on... It's a

2:24:392:24:46

topic in the mouthpiece and it

should not be engaged with with any

2:24:462:24:50

Democratic politicians who should

think twice before they do so and

2:24:502:24:53

not be engaging with a media outlet

like this and give it credibility.

I

2:24:532:24:58

think we should all be very wary and

careful in looking at media outlets

2:24:582:25:03

that any individual member of this

House chooses to appear on. As I've

2:25:032:25:08

said in response to other questions,

this issue of Russia today is

2:25:082:25:13

obviously one which is of concern to

members across this House and as I

2:25:132:25:18

said I will be coming back and

making further statements to the

2:25:182:25:22

House after we've had the Russian

state response.

In the early 1980s

2:25:222:25:29

the planning assumption was that the

road to war with the Soviet Union

2:25:292:25:34

would be proceeded by six months of

increasing tension sabotage, and

2:25:342:25:39

assassination. What are the current

assumptions?

Can I say to my

2:25:392:25:44

honourable friend that I think what

we see today, there was a time when

2:25:442:25:52

that issue of the threats that were

posed to us by Russia and indeed by

2:25:522:25:57

others were clear and limited in

their type. What we see today is the

2:25:572:26:07

diversity of threats. We Russia --

with Russia we see being referenced

2:26:072:26:11

in the previous question about the

issue of propaganda. We see them

2:26:112:26:15

using a variety of means in which to

attempt to interfere, intervene, and

2:26:152:26:20

to affect countries in the West and

be there for in terms of our

2:26:202:26:26

approach to this and respond across

a whole range of threats.

Thank you

2:26:262:26:34

Mr Speaker. I would also like to

thank the Prime Minister for her

2:26:342:26:39

remarks about this growing crisis. I

appreciate she would not want to

2:26:392:26:44

give individual circumstances, the

candy Prime Minister assure the

2:26:442:26:48

House that not only former Russian

nationals, former Eastern European

2:26:482:26:52

nationals who may also have offended

Mr Putin, but British high-profile

2:26:522:26:59

figures and British public buildings

are being reviewed in order to

2:26:592:27:03

determine the status of security in

light of the recent situation?

As I

2:27:032:27:09

said earlier, she is absolutely

right, we don't comment on

2:27:092:27:13

individual cases. In relation to

national security, we regularly

2:27:132:27:17

update and monitor the actions that

are taken and the protection of

2:27:172:27:25

people and premises here in the

United Kingdom based on the fact

2:27:252:27:27

that we perceive at the time.

As

someone who has campaigned for the

2:27:272:27:35

Magnitsky law and on the Bill

committee of the sanctions and money

2:27:352:27:39

bill, can I say that the opposition

amendments or flawed and can be

2:27:392:27:44

improved on. I am actually grateful

for the cooperation of Ministers and

2:27:442:27:48

I hope the discussions will be

fruitful. When my -- will my right

2:27:482:27:54

honourable friend reflects that our

allies abroad reflect that this

2:27:542:27:58

could've happened and a provincial

town in France, Germany, or any

2:27:582:28:01

other country, and we are looking

for action to be taken as well as

2:28:012:28:05

warm words of support.

Can I say to

my right honourable friend, I am

2:28:052:28:09

grateful to him as a supporter of

the Magnitsky law and putting up the

2:28:092:28:15

point I'm trying to make earlier,

which is that if amendments are to

2:28:152:28:19

be passed many to ensure they will

be workable and we need to get the

2:28:192:28:25

amendments right. And also, in

response to the point that he made

2:28:252:28:31

about our allies, he is absolutely

right. I think we should point out

2:28:312:28:35

this is something that happened

anywhere, and any provincial town or

2:28:352:28:40

any city like Salisbury.

The level

of resilience voiced by the Prime

2:28:402:28:50

Minister and the Chairman today has

been many years coming, but it is

2:28:502:28:53

usually welcome. Indeed, it would

put our national security at

2:28:532:28:58

significant risk that we were led by

anyone who did not understand the

2:28:582:29:02

gravity of the threat which Russia

poses to this nation. Can I ask her,

2:29:022:29:07

she mentioned our Nato allies. She's

going to come forward with measures

2:29:072:29:15

on Wednesday, will she confirmed

that our Nato allies and the

2:29:152:29:19

potential for collective response,

it is in her thinking and doing so?

2:29:192:29:23

Can I think the honourable gentleman

for the comment that he is made. He

2:29:232:29:30

is absolutely right, it's imperative

that in this country we recognise

2:29:302:29:32

the nature of the threat and the

nature of the actions that Russia

2:29:322:29:37

has taken across a wide range of

means. And also I'm very clear that

2:29:372:29:43

as we look at any further actions

that need to be taken, we need to

2:29:432:29:49

ensure that that is robust, that it

does very clearly defend our values

2:29:492:29:55

here in the United Kingdom and

ensure that we aren't sending a very

2:29:552:29:57

clear message from those who would

seek to undermine those.

And

2:29:572:30:03

congratulation the Prime Minister on

her robust stance against Russian

2:30:032:30:07

aggression, she will be aware that

the very most effective sanctions

2:30:072:30:12

are those taken multilaterally. The

concern that some habits that when

2:30:122:30:15

leave the European Union, we will

lose our seat at the table on the

2:30:152:30:19

body that sets those sanctions. Can

she therefore assure us that effort

2:30:192:30:24

is going to go into building up a

new relationship so we will have

2:30:242:30:29

continuity in our approach towards

Russia?

I think my honourable

2:30:292:30:35

friend, and this issue of collective

action was one of the honourable

2:30:352:30:38

gentleman for the member firm arrow

have raised and his previous

2:30:382:30:42

question. My friend has said that

the position in relation to the UK

2:30:422:30:48

Government's actions on sanctions

will change when we leave the

2:30:482:30:50

European Union. We are taking

measures to ensure that we are able

2:30:502:30:57

to act as the United Kingdom

independently. But I also made clear

2:30:572:31:01

in the speech that I gave at the

mansion house, this is one that we

2:31:012:31:06

want to be working with our allies

because indeed, as both he and the

2:31:062:31:11

honourable member for Barrow have

said, they are more effective if

2:31:112:31:15

they are undertaken collectively.

Thank you Mr Speaker, and commanding

2:31:152:31:18

the Prime Minister for the stance

you has adopted today. When she

2:31:182:31:21

returned to the House, will she take

the opportunity to switch the

2:31:212:31:25

crossbody concerns on the defence

select committee that there has been

2:31:252:31:28

a de-escalation of our presence and

that the escalation of our presence

2:31:282:31:36

and the high North, production of

maritime surveillance and patrols,

2:31:362:31:40

and in fact a cancellation of our

cold weather training Bishoo? I hope

2:31:402:31:46

the Prime Minister will take this

2:31:462:31:47

we look carefully at actions that we

are taking at the training exercises

2:31:522:31:58

that our military forces undertake,

and as I indicated in my statement,

2:31:582:32:00

I am pleased that our forces are

leading part of the enhanced for

2:32:002:32:05

presence and Estonia. I visited

those forces in Estonia in the

2:32:052:32:09

oddest of -- August of last year.

And I can save not only is that

2:32:092:32:14

valuable for our forces, but hugely

welcome by the people of Estonia who

2:32:142:32:17

arrayed against the border with

Russia and feel this thread very

2:32:172:32:22

particularly.

I think the Prime

Minister for her statement and in

2:32:222:32:27

doing so would like to pay tribute

to a group of individuals

2:32:272:32:30

unmentioned so far this afternoon,

members of the Armed Forces. I would

2:32:302:32:38

also like to ask what she is doing

with our allies in Nato and the UN,

2:32:382:32:42

and of course the European Union to

ensure the maintenance of the rules

2:32:422:32:46

based system which is under systemic

threat from the Russian Federation.

2:32:462:32:51

Can I reiterate what my honourable

friend has said the? I mentioned in

2:32:512:32:55

my statement, but once again praised

the work of the Armed Forces

2:32:552:33:01

alongside our emergency services in

relation to this particular incident

2:33:012:33:05

and what they also do for us and the

Armed Forces Day in and day out. I

2:33:052:33:11

can assure him that we will be

looking very carefully at any

2:33:112:33:14

further up the measures that should

be taken him a sponsor this.

The

2:33:142:33:18

Prime Minister should note that if

by Wednesday she concludes that we

2:33:182:33:24

are embattled she will find duty and

resolve across this House and facing

2:33:242:33:28

down a common threat. 12 years ago

in the aftermath of a wave of

2:33:282:33:34

Al-Qaeda inspired attacks, we

transfer the capacity of government

2:33:342:33:37

to co-ordinate and fight back

against extremism. Can I urge her

2:33:372:33:42

measures she brings forward on

Wednesday to think radically about

2:33:422:33:45

how she creates the governing

capacity to co-ordinate our response

2:33:452:33:49

to this new level of threat,

including new safeguards against

2:33:492:33:55

abuse of social media which we know

is part of the Russian's active

2:33:552:34:00

measures playbook.

And I think the

right honourable gentleman for his

2:34:002:34:04

remarks, and the tone with which he

has set those out, and can I say

2:34:042:34:09

that we do... And he has right,

after the attacks by Al-Qaeda, it

2:34:092:34:14

was very clear, and the Government

put in place to hold the structure

2:34:142:34:21

of response in terms of

counterterrorism. Hostile state

2:34:212:34:24

activity is something that the

Government has been consistently

2:34:242:34:26

looking out over many years, but as

we have looked at our national

2:34:262:34:31

security capability review, as we

look at the ability to react to the

2:34:312:34:37

fact that we now face, we will now

find that the structure of

2:34:372:34:42

government find it it's...

2:34:422:34:46

Can I welcome the statement like

tone of the Prime Minister's... The

2:34:472:34:59

grandmother would have done no

benefit to the Russians did it. Can

2:34:592:35:03

I urge her to be uncompromising in

signalling that Liberal Democratic

2:35:032:35:05

values are not negotiable? And that

this country will not be a country

2:35:052:35:13

for the Kremlin... And aggressive

cultural sanctions to hit Mr Putin

2:35:132:35:19

where it hurts?

I think my

honourable friend for the remarks

2:35:192:35:24

that he has made and I assure him

that we will be looking at a range

2:35:242:35:32

of activities, responses and I will

update the House further at the

2:35:322:35:38

earliest opportunity. Can I also

say, just to confirm, that it is

2:35:382:35:43

those democratic values that

underpin us as a country that we we

2:35:432:35:48

you'll be defending and continue to

defend but wish to do so alongside

2:35:482:35:51

our allies? It was remarked earlier

that the international rules based

2:35:512:35:56

order is under threat from Russia.

The international rules based order

2:35:562:36:01

is also under threat from others and

it's important to we stand up and

2:36:012:36:05

robustly defended.

Three people are

gravely and hospital following his

2:36:052:36:11

horrific chain of events. Can I

welcome the Prime Minister's was all

2:36:112:36:15

that business cannot go on as usual?

And she didn't take this opportunity

2:36:152:36:18

to tighten up the loopholes that do

exist in the system concerning money

2:36:182:36:25

laundering to be from Russia with

cash issue does not turn into from

2:36:252:36:30

Russia with blood?

The honourable

Lady has been awarded at the

2:36:302:36:34

Government has recently taken on

extra powers to enable us to deal

2:36:342:36:38

with the criminal finances through

the criminal finances act. It's

2:36:382:36:41

important that we did that, we are

very well aware that the

2:36:412:36:46

attractiveness for normal financial

activity here in London can mean

2:36:462:36:50

that there are those who see an

opportunity for illicit flows of

2:36:502:36:54

money and we will take every action

against those.

I welcome the

2:36:542:37:00

strength of the Prime Minister

statement today. I'm sure she will

2:37:002:37:04

like me and be concerned by the

parallels the previous time when

2:37:042:37:06

autocratic clique they decided to

challenge the international wills

2:37:062:37:11

based system to prove that might

would be right. Could she assured me

2:37:112:37:14

that she will be working with allies

to make sure that we could go down

2:37:142:37:18

the path to disaster and defeat as

well?

I will certainly be working

2:37:182:37:24

with allies to make very clear they

... And that those that try to

2:37:242:37:30

attack it will not win.

Mr Speaker,

inevitably today the focus has been

2:37:302:37:34

on the Russians that are crooks and

cronies of Putin, but there are

2:37:342:37:40

decent Russians who have spoken out

against the regime. Those that I've

2:37:402:37:43

met over the years here in sometimes

feel very alone, can we send out a

2:37:432:37:48

signal that we are appalled by what

Putin has been? We designed a set

2:37:482:37:53

bill of solidarity with those

2:37:532:38:02

The honourable Lady does speak about

this. There are those who had been

2:38:022:38:06

proven up to speak up. And we

support them in doing so. And we

2:38:062:38:10

want them to be able to do so and be

free to do so and that they are able

2:38:102:38:13

to feel the competence of doing so

without steering action that might

2:38:132:38:16

be taken against them as a result.

Mr Speaker, can I too thanks the

2:38:162:38:21

right honourable friend handling

this appalling case and can also ask

2:38:212:38:27

her that if it is indeed proved that

this was state sponsored, the

2:38:272:38:31

response is not just in the United

Kingdom, but from Nato and all our

2:38:312:38:35

European allies because together we

stand and divided we provide an

2:38:352:38:40

opening for this man?

I say to my

right honourable friend that we will

2:38:402:38:46

always be be talking with allies

about the nature of this act that

2:38:462:38:49

has taken place and we will continue

to do so and will be encouraging our

2:38:492:38:54

allies to end -- recognise the

despicable nature of what has

2:38:542:38:59

happened in the UK.

The main

security challenges we face are from

2:38:592:39:08

Daesh and others. Will she meet

those challenges as opposed to

2:39:082:39:14

constituting a new nuclear weapons?

He prefers the number of threats

2:39:142:39:21

obviously the terrorist threat, the

threat of hostile state activity.

2:39:212:39:25

Those are ones of which we are sure

we had the capabilities to address.

2:39:252:39:30

That has a variety of actions that

the Government takes. I indicated

2:39:302:39:33

earlier not every response actually

sets within what would be

2:39:332:39:38

conventionally called the fence. The

work of the security and

2:39:382:39:43

intelligence agencies, the work of

the office against counterterrorism

2:39:432:39:46

this is in the Home Office, these

are all part. That's why our

2:39:462:39:52

national security review is

important in bringing together all

2:39:522:39:54

parts are response ensuring that we

have the capabilities that we need.

2:39:542:40:00

Mr Speaker, from a hacking

infrastructure to spreading

2:40:002:40:06

information, the prime Minster is

coolly right that Russia has been

2:40:062:40:08

waging a cyber war against the West.

She took to the investigation of the

2:40:082:40:14

Bill. Can she ensure the House that

is more parsing needed, she will not

2:40:142:40:20

hesitate?

I am very happy to give

that confirmation to the honourable

2:40:202:40:25

friend. My right eyeball friend at

the Home Secretary is already

2:40:252:40:29

looking at what further

counterterrorism powers made be

2:40:292:40:31

needed.

Thank you Mr Suter. I has

had a great deal of time with

2:40:312:40:40

service workers since my Russian. It

is disappointing that we had to

2:40:402:40:44

reflect on how we keep them safe

from nerve agents. And I welcome the

2:40:442:40:47

Prime Minister process segment that

we must outlined what was

2:40:472:40:51

particularly reckless about this

attack was the decision to use Isner

2:40:512:40:54

vision that would put members of the

public and our emergency services

2:40:542:40:58

and an workers they would have to

respond at risk, can I welcome the

2:40:582:41:01

news that she will put that at the

forefront at the meeting she's due

2:41:012:41:04

to have this week and the

seriousness and the risks presented

2:41:042:41:07

to police and NHS workers in

particular for the robust

2:41:072:41:11

consequences that must now follow

was white she raises a very good

2:41:112:41:17

points in relation to our emergency

services. We have already had a book

2:41:172:41:21

at the framework on our emergency

services operate.

In terms of the

2:41:212:41:26

sorts of incidents that they might

need to be responding to. We will of

2:41:262:41:30

course need to keep this under

review.

Thank you Mr Speaker. The

2:41:302:41:40

attacks on Skripal were designed to

kill in hour highway. With that

2:41:402:41:45

threat in mind, can she ensure that

our national -- our national defence

2:41:452:41:51

is sufficient to meet that threat in

terms of funding?

As I said earlier,

2:41:512:41:59

this is a matter of the capabilities

that we have across our security,

2:41:592:42:05

national security and defence. And

it is important that we have been

2:42:052:42:09

conducting a number of reviews and

are continuing a number of her fears

2:42:092:42:12

that goes straight to the heart of

this matter to ensure we have the

2:42:122:42:15

capabilities across the board that

we need.

Thank you Mr Speaker. May I

2:42:152:42:21

commend the Prime Minister for her

statement of a robust as to which

2:42:212:42:24

they address the House was back in

the coming days when the Prime

2:42:242:42:29

Minister discusses actions whether I

like, was she at ensure that there

2:42:292:42:33

will act robustly with some of the

more recalcitrant Nato allies to

2:42:332:42:36

give clouds to the Russian athletes

to lie than to read fuel, notably

2:42:362:42:42

spin? Enough is enough.

Can I say to

the honourable gentleman that I will

2:42:422:42:47

of course be raising this issue with

allies and we will be talking with

2:42:472:42:53

them about the nature of the

response that we feel is appropriate

2:42:532:42:56

to such an action having taken

place.

Order. Statement, the

2:42:562:43:02

Secretary of State for Northern

Ireland. Secretary Karen Bradley.

2:43:022:43:17

Thank you. With permission, Mr

Speaker, I would like to make case

2:43:172:43:24

statement about Northern Ireland

finances. Last week I laid a written

2:43:242:43:27

statement in which I explained the

pressures on public services

2:43:272:43:31

imperative for the Government to

take steps to provide clarity to

2:43:312:43:36

enable planning in Northern Ireland

for 2000 1819. With great reluctance

2:43:362:43:40

-- 2000 18 -- 19. I set out in the

statement a capital allocation which

2:43:402:43:48

I considered to be the most balanced

and appropriate settlement for

2:43:482:43:51

Northern Ireland departments. I did

this following intensive engagement

2:43:512:43:57

with Northern Ireland civil service

and consultation with all of the

2:43:572:43:59

main Northern Ireland parties. Mr

Speaker, in the continued absence of

2:43:592:44:05

an executive, I have an obligation

to take these and any other measures

2:44:052:44:09

necessary to keep Northern Ireland

functioning. I would only take such

2:44:092:44:12

measures where they are clear and

essential and limited in nature on

2:44:122:44:16

our part -- are part of a clear and

consistent approach by the

2:44:162:44:20

Government. This approach is based a

number of principles. First, we

2:44:202:44:24

remain steadfast in our commitment

to the Belfast agreement. All that

2:44:242:44:28

we do will be with a purpose of

protecting and fulfilling the

2:44:282:44:31

agreement. But second we will take

those decisions which are necessary

2:44:312:44:37

to provide good governance and

political stability for Northern

2:44:372:44:41

Ireland, consistent always with

restrain the Executive and local

2:44:412:44:44

decision-making at the earliest

possible opportunity. Third, we will

2:44:442:44:48

continue to implement our

obligations under the agreement and

2:44:482:44:52

as success where possible, always

looking for the good of the

2:44:522:44:55

community as a whole. Finally, we

will continue to work with all of

2:44:552:45:00

Northern Ireland parties and with

the Irish government as appropriate

2:45:002:45:03

to remove the barriers to restrain

the Executive and fully functioning

2:45:032:45:06

assembly. The principles and the

core of the agreement and the

2:45:062:45:12

political institutions that it

establishes continue to have

2:45:122:45:14

powerful and unreserved support.

That means that we will uphold the

2:45:142:45:20

upload of consent, consistent with

this government's support for

2:45:202:45:23

Northern Ireland's plays within the

union and well-maintained

2:45:232:45:27

constitution and integrity of the

United Kingdom. We believe in

2:45:272:45:32

devolution and imperative for local

dissent -- decision-making by local

2:45:322:45:36

politicians. We support

power-sharing on a cross community

2:45:362:45:38

basis based on mutual respect and

recognition. Will continue to the

2:45:382:45:42

Dutch continued to support

cooperation as we leave the EU while

2:45:422:45:49

always preserving the economic

integrity of the United Kingdom. We

2:45:492:45:51

will continue to work closer with

the Irish government in full

2:45:512:45:54

accordance with the three stranded

approach. We will continue to act

2:45:542:45:58

fairly and to govern in the interest

of all parts of the community in

2:45:582:46:02

Northern Ireland. Mr Speaker, the

necessary steps which I have taken

2:46:022:46:06

and will continue to take our

consistent with all of these

2:46:062:46:11

commitments. In addition to the

steps I set out last week, there are

2:46:112:46:15

several associated measures required

to further secure public finances

2:46:152:46:18

which I will be taking forward. As

well as cutting costs, securing

2:46:182:46:23

efficiencies and beginning to take

steps to transform public services,

2:46:232:46:26

it is right to look at how income

can be increased to protect the

2:46:262:46:31

public services on which the people

of Northern Ireland depend. I will

2:46:312:46:35

introduce legislation to set a

regional rate which will increase

2:46:352:46:38

domestic rates by 3% of inflation.

This will make an important

2:46:382:46:43

contribution to sustainable finances

with additional funding addressing

2:46:432:46:47

urgent pressures in health and

education. I also intend to act to

2:46:472:46:52

extend the cost capping of the key

consensus KeyBank -- of the scheming

2:46:522:46:58

in Northern Ireland which were put

in place over a year ago. It will

2:46:582:47:01

not be acceptable to put finances at

risk by allowing that cap to last. I

2:47:012:47:06

therefore propose to extend it from

the 1st of April the minimal

2:47:062:47:11

possible step to protect the public

purse. I also concert -- confirm the

2:47:112:47:15

final spending totals for the

Northern Ireland departments for the

2:47:152:47:19

previous financial year -- for the

current at note -- for the previous

2:47:192:47:24

dear. I also believe that the time

is right to address the ongoing

2:47:242:47:29

public concern in the absence of a

functioning assembly. I think him it

2:47:292:47:33

was inserted by my predecessor to

produce an independent review and

2:47:332:47:38

recommended eight 27.5% reduction

MLA pay. Further to that I am in

2:47:382:47:50

mind to reduce... I will recommend

full and final representations for

2:47:502:47:54

that tired and parties before make

that final decision. These measures

2:47:542:48:00

adjusted reluctantly put are

necessary in the absence of a

2:48:002:48:03

functioning executive and the sadly,

will give forward planning for the

2:48:032:48:07

financial year had. They cannot

provide the local input and

2:48:072:48:13

fundamental decisions which are

needed to secure a more sustainable

2:48:132:48:16

future for Northern Ireland. My

powers as Secretary of State for

2:48:162:48:21

Northern Ireland are limited. The

scope of this House to cast

2:48:212:48:24

legislation on the default issues

which matter for Northern Ireland is

2:48:242:48:27

limited. This rightly reflects the

devolution settlement which is in

2:48:272:48:33

place into which this government is

commitment -- committed. But it does

2:48:332:48:37

mean that in continuing absence of

executive, there are fundamental

2:48:372:48:42

decisions that cannot be taken or

screwed knives as it should be. --

2:48:422:48:46

scrutinise. This is when the

situation for 14 months already and

2:48:462:48:50

in the continuing absence, it would

be responsible for us stop to

2:48:502:48:56

consider how we might provide for

different arrangements until such

2:48:562:48:58

time as evolved institutions are

back up and running. I also continue

2:48:582:49:04

to keep under review my statutory

obligation to call on Assembly

2:49:042:49:08

election. I would welcome the views

and proposals of the Northern

2:49:082:49:13

Ireland parties and others and have

such arrangements are for local

2:49:132:49:18

decision-making and screw Nana cross

community basis might be achieved in

2:49:182:49:20

the continued accident -- as is of

an executive. And how arrangements

2:49:202:49:27

would work with other institutions

of the agreement. Let me be clear

2:49:272:49:29

that this in no way impacts my

commitment to the Belfast agreement

2:49:292:49:36

nor my commitment to work through

the barriers to the restoration

2:49:362:49:40

devolution. As the 20th anniversary

of the Belfast agreement approaches,

2:49:402:49:45

I am clear as ever that Northern

Ireland needs strong political

2:49:452:49:49

leadership from a locally elected

and accountable default government.

2:49:492:49:51

And that remains my goal. I commend

the statement to the House.

Thank

2:49:512:49:59

you very much Mr Speaker and may I

begin by wishing the Secretary of

2:49:592:50:03

State is very happy birthday for

today is back and thank her for

2:50:032:50:06

advanced sight of her statement. We

did see most that last week when

2:50:062:50:12

they published the budget for

Northern Ireland in a written

2:50:122:50:15

statement that came out at 5pm on a

Thursday evening. And I do have to

2:50:152:50:20

say Mr Speaker, that is an

unsatisfactory state of affairs, a

2:50:202:50:23

bit discourteous to this House and

more apartment to the people of

2:50:232:50:26

Northern Ireland. Announcing what is

a £10.5 billion pot should affecting

2:50:262:50:35

key services for 1.8 billion

citizens -- million citizens with no

2:50:352:50:40

ability to question or challenge

those accommodations. With ads of no

2:50:402:50:47

accountable government. I'm sure the

Secretary of State would think that

2:50:472:50:50

that was not a suitable way to send

a budget for constituents in stature

2:50:502:50:53

-- her staff. And I hope she was

plain to the House why she felt it

2:50:532:50:57

was needed to be done and that's --

that fashion. Messages that this

2:50:572:51:04

sadly announcement was embarrassed

because days before the Conservative

2:51:042:51:09

Party will vote for cuts affecting

citizens in Wales and Scotland that

2:51:092:51:14

the billion pound partnership with

the DUP Meza Northern Ireland alone

2:51:142:51:17

is being spared. We welcome that

investment in Northern Ireland, Mr

2:51:172:51:24

Speaker. But we also need to see

investment in health and education

2:51:242:51:28

and other key public services in

every part of the UK, not just the

2:51:282:51:32

bit where the Tories need DUP votes.

Mr Speaker, turning out to the

2:51:322:51:39

substance of the budget, the

Secretary of State said last week

2:51:392:51:41

and repeated a moment ago that in

absence of an assembly with

2:51:412:51:44

decisions being taken by wholly

unaccountable permanent secretaries,

2:51:442:51:48

some fundamental decisions cannot be

addressed, we agree. At the do seem

2:51:482:51:53

to need to be some pretty

fundamental decisions that were

2:51:532:51:57

taken last week by the Secretary of

State and awarded she might answer

2:51:572:52:00

some questions about those today.

Firstly on the decision to put up

2:52:002:52:05

taxes in Northern Ireland for the

regional rate, and the Secretary of

2:52:052:52:09

State confirm whether that was

discussed in detail and agree with

2:52:092:52:12

any or all of the parties in

Northern Ireland? Second respected

2:52:122:52:15

to the decision of the increase of

the budget for some individual

2:52:152:52:22

departments, can she is point to the

House the reasons for increased to

2:52:222:52:25

the Department of Justice of 36

million or 70% or the Department of

2:52:252:52:33

Agriculture which saw an increase of

£40 million or are hundred and 10%

2:52:332:52:37

increase unless you're positive

budget or the Department of

2:52:372:52:41

Communities which saw £38 million or

eight 38% increase last year. I

2:52:412:52:46

should there are very good reasons

for these increases and the

2:52:462:52:49

significant cuts that have been made

to the administrative departments

2:52:492:52:53

elsewhere. But I think the House and

people of Northern Ireland deserve

2:52:532:52:56

to have some explanation as to how

these decisions and by whom and why

2:52:562:53:00

they have been made.

2:53:002:53:09

For health and education and the

£100 million transform to help

2:53:092:53:15

service and light with the report.

Could the secretary of state spell

2:53:152:53:19

out how that 80 million on health

and education and is to be divided,

2:53:192:53:23

and who will make the decision now

about the appropriate allocation?

2:53:232:53:29

And is that something that the DUP

coordination committee will be

2:53:292:53:33

discussing with the conservative

government, and it that has already

2:53:332:53:38

been discussed? When a secretary of

state talks about big health

2:53:382:53:42

reforms, she will be aware that some

of the reforms that were talked

2:53:422:53:45

about and then do let and other

health plans with respect hospital

2:53:452:53:51

closures and other changes to the

configuration of health services,

2:53:512:53:55

does the secretary of state imagine

that such big decisions could be

2:53:552:53:59

taken by civil servants? And if not,

what should it be spent on exactly?

2:53:592:54:05

Mr Speaker, the gravity of the

issues at hand and the skill of the

2:54:052:54:08

decisions being taken merely serves

to undermine what a grave crisis

2:54:082:54:12

began face now in Northern Ireland

after 14 months the Executive

2:54:122:54:18

collapse power-sharing ending and I

welcome the commitment that the

2:54:182:54:22

secretary of state reiterated today

to the Belfast agreement and the

2:54:222:54:25

principles of consent and power that

underpin it, especially in the late

2:54:252:54:29

I think of the recent attempts by

some to undermine that agreement. I

2:54:292:54:34

have to say to the secretary of

state, we need to see more than a

2:54:342:54:38

more tireless activity. We need to

see some success in the forthcoming

2:54:382:54:42

negotiations if we are to get to

next month's 20th anniversary with a

2:54:422:54:46

real sense of optimism about the

future of the agreement and the

2:54:462:54:50

future of power shift. I'm sure that

the secretary of state did not mean,

2:54:502:54:54

and she was at pains to point this

out, that she anticipate any failure

2:54:542:54:59

and those negotiations. But the

whole House and country would have

2:54:592:55:02

been struck by the acknowledgement

that we may need to look at

2:55:022:55:07

alternative means of keeping the

agreement and political

2:55:072:55:09

accountability and elite back alive

in the absence of an executive. And

2:55:092:55:14

that raises very significant

questions about the feasibility,

2:55:142:55:16

given that some parties will not

want to take part in such a shadow

2:55:162:55:21

assembly or another form of an

assembly, and a form of that

2:55:212:55:25

alternative. It also raises I think

a very significant risk and I hope

2:55:252:55:31

the secretary of state will take

particular note of, moving to an

2:55:312:55:35

alternative form of assembly would

take the pressure off the parties

2:55:352:55:38

and come to an agreement and engage

in meaningful peril. Power-sharing.

2:55:382:55:46

The secretary of state acknowledged

that risk?

2:55:462:55:51

And the last time that we see a

budget being set by this House and

2:55:562:56:02

not where it ought to be an?

Mr

Speaker, can I start by thinking the

2:56:022:56:08

honourable judgement for his kind

words about my birthday, I was not

2:56:082:56:12

expecting my birth to spend my

birthday doing budget statement but

2:56:122:56:15

thank you. It is quite right, as he

has acknowledged. And we all agree,

2:56:152:56:25

these are decisions that should be

taken by locally elected

2:56:252:56:28

politicians. The people who a lot to

those politicians in Northern

2:56:282:56:33

Ireland want them to take the

decisions and I genuinely believe

2:56:332:56:36

that those politicians want to take

those decisions. We have discussed

2:56:362:56:40

this previously in this House there

are some issues on which the parties

2:56:402:56:45

cannot agree, but I agree that we

can get to a point where we can get

2:56:452:56:49

the ball to government up and

running and that is what I am

2:56:492:56:53

determined to achieve. Everything

that I have set out today is in line

2:56:532:56:57

with that aim. That is my aim, I

want to see devolved government back

2:56:572:57:03

up and Stormont. When that is by the

decisions that have been taken,

2:57:032:57:07

whilst difficult, one many to be

taken for the public services but

2:57:072:57:10

I've taken them in light of the fact

that I did not want to undermine the

2:57:102:57:14

constitutional arrangements and the

devolution settlement that there a

2:57:142:57:17

Northern Ireland. He asked about

timing he will recall what I was

2:57:172:57:25

here I committed I would lay a

budget by last week and that is why

2:57:252:57:29

it was important that I got the

written statement out last week but

2:57:292:57:33

I'm here at the earliest opportunity

to explain to the House and take

2:57:332:57:36

questions from honourable and right

honourable members across the House

2:57:362:57:39

in order that I can deal with their

concerns. I think it's important to

2:57:392:57:45

put on the record that I did not

publish a statement until I had the

2:57:452:57:50

chance to show it to all the main

parties were presented at Stormont

2:57:502:57:53

and they had had the chance to see

what the allocations were. Because

2:57:532:57:59

my fervent hope is that they would

be the individuals who would

2:57:592:58:03

actually deliver this budget and not

is why it's important that they were

2:58:032:58:07

all consulted on the work that had

been done. I also want to pay

2:58:072:58:11

tribute, Mr Speaker, to my officials

and the civil servant working. They

2:58:112:58:22

have worked hard and selflessly to

help to deliver this in a way that

2:58:222:58:27

is very uncomfortable for many

officials. They want to have

2:58:272:58:30

political direction, they want

politicians to give them direction

2:58:302:58:34

and it is very difficult to do so

and I hope they have worked above

2:58:342:58:39

and beyond anything that we have

spoken to civil servants and I want

2:58:392:58:45

to put that on the record. He asked

about the decisions that were taken

2:58:452:58:48

in terms of allocations. I looked

out to the key department, I wanted

2:58:482:58:54

to make sure there was money to

protect the policing budget. That

2:58:542:58:58

was very important, he will

acknowledge and recognise that. He

2:58:582:59:03

asked about the £100 billion from

the confidence and supply

2:59:032:59:08

arrangement for health

transformation. That is his money

2:59:082:59:10

that was recognised and agreed by

the Government needed to be spent in

2:59:102:59:15

Northern Ireland because of the

unique circumstances and Northern

2:59:152:59:18

Ireland and I visited the hospital

and dairy in London last Monday and

2:59:182:59:24

met consultants and managers there,

and it was very clear to me that

2:59:242:59:28

health transformation is a priority

and we do need to make sure that

2:59:282:59:31

that money is spent and I have taken

advice, legal advice, about how that

2:59:312:59:37

money can be spent to ensure that it

is spent on the priorities which it

2:59:372:59:40

is designed to be spent on. He asked

also about the alternative

2:59:402:59:46

approaches. You will know that many

have suggested ways that we may be

2:59:462:59:50

able to form some form of

functioning assembly or scrutiny at

2:59:502:59:55

Stormont. I am considering all the

suggestions, and I would welcome

2:59:553:00:03

further suggestions and I'm taking

legal advice on all of them because

3:00:033:00:06

I don't want to do anything that

undermines what we have achieved and

3:00:063:00:09

the 20 years and the Belfast

agreement. But if there is a way

3:00:093:00:13

that we can move ourselves back on

the road to devolved government

3:00:133:00:18

functioning and Stormont and having

scrutiny being applied by local

3:00:183:00:21

elected politicians, and that I

think we should all endeavour to try

3:00:213:00:24

to find that route if at all

possible.

This is the second of four

3:00:243:00:29

ministerial statements to the House

this afternoon and notwithstanding

3:00:293:00:32

its immense importance, I appealed

to collect in the interest of

3:00:323:00:37

accommodating subsequent this is not

to prep their questions with many

3:00:373:00:39

speeches but to simply ask a pithy

questions.

Nevertheless, I hope

3:00:393:00:47

you'll allow me to add my best

wishes to be secretary of state on

3:00:473:00:51

her birthday. Can I also welcome the

statement particularly the bit in

3:00:513:00:57

which she invites comments about how

we might close the Democratic... My

3:00:573:01:02

select committee has held the

suggestions and will be sending them

3:01:023:01:05

to her. Can I draw her attention to

the ministerial statement on

3:01:053:01:08

Thursday in what she says the

permanent secretaries cannot

3:01:083:01:11

position that will be available to

Ministers which is incorrect and

3:01:113:01:14

goes on to say that Ministers will

be helpful and offering guidance.

3:01:143:01:20

Can I press her on exactly what form

that guidance will take, given that

3:01:203:01:24

she has set out the departmental

expenditure limits, about what

3:01:243:01:31

actually goes to constitutes those

D.

Thank you, and can I thank my

3:01:313:01:36

honourable friend for his good

wishes and for his question and the

3:01:363:01:41

work that his committee is doing

with the issue of devolution and

3:01:413:01:46

Northern Ireland. I was pleased to

give evidence to the inquiry,. I

3:01:463:01:56

look forward to their

recommendations. He is right that,

3:01:563:02:05

and the absence of ministerial

direction for storm and there is

3:02:053:02:08

concern about the work that civil

servants can do. We have worked very

3:02:083:02:11

closely with civil servants making

sure legal advice is... So they have

3:02:113:02:20

the support they need to take

decisions based on decisions that

3:02:203:02:24

were previously taken by the

Executive or certainly indicating

3:02:243:02:27

what had been taken by the

Executive. And I have for this to

3:02:273:02:31

the permanent secretary to set out

my view as to how any money should

3:02:313:02:37

be spent in line with the

recommendation that they have that

3:02:373:02:41

guidance.

I think the secretary of

state on her statement and may I

3:02:413:02:49

join the House and wishing her a

happy birthday today. I will send my

3:02:493:02:54

contribution by making it clear that

while many needs to be allocated for

3:02:543:02:57

the continued funding of public

services and Northern Ireland, these

3:02:573:03:01

matters should more properly be

addressed by locally elected

3:03:013:03:05

representatives. The decision to

increase rates, a policy decision

3:03:053:03:10

that reverses key policies of storm

and. Ensure none of us want to be

3:03:103:03:14

here again, but here we are. We keep

the lights on, people wage's paid

3:03:143:03:21

can continue, we must have keep in

mind that the restoration of

3:03:213:03:27

devolved government and Northern

Ireland is the principal aim. I was

3:03:273:03:33

pleased that the secretary of state

continues to welcome the views of

3:03:333:03:37

the Northern Irish parties and other

Angel local decision-making and

3:03:373:03:40

scrutiny on a cross community basis

might be achieved. Could you tell us

3:03:403:03:44

a little bit more about how those

views and proposals might be more

3:03:443:03:48

transparently canvassed and then

shared with Northern Irish citizens?

3:03:483:03:53

In regard to the confidence and

supply agreement monies, while of

3:03:533:03:56

course no one ever progresses extra

money spent on health or education,

3:03:563:04:03

there's more than £400 million is

part of the £1 billion the DUP

3:04:033:04:08

extracted from the Conservatives to

prop up this government. In views of

3:04:083:04:11

the considerable concerns around the

steel, and recent concerns about the

3:04:113:04:15

transparency of the political

donations process in Northern

3:04:153:04:19

Ireland, when can we expect further

details on what this extra money is

3:04:193:04:22

going to be spent on? Will be

secretary of state be laying the

3:04:223:04:27

destination of that money before the

House separately to the allocation

3:04:273:04:29

of funds required to fund public

services? It's wearing that we look

3:04:293:04:35

to be stepping into a zone where

money is allocated without close

3:04:353:04:39

ministerial direction and we have

not yet seen any criteria for how

3:04:393:04:43

that money will be spent. Was she

not commit to providing much greater

3:04:433:04:46

transparency around the spending of

the DUP deal money and lay the full

3:04:463:04:52

details before the House?

Can I

thank the honourable Lady, I will

3:04:523:04:59

thank everyone for their good wishes

but it's very kind. Thank you. The

3:04:593:05:02

honourable Lady asked about the

approaches, I and by any parties

3:05:023:05:12

that have suggestions about how this

could function and how we might have

3:05:123:05:15

some form of assembly functioning

with scrutiny and Starr, but I will

3:05:153:05:21

have to take legal advice on

everything that is proposed and

3:05:213:05:25

clearly if there is a suggestion

that is gathering cross party

3:05:253:05:30

support they clearly would we want

to talk about that with others so

3:05:303:05:34

that we could ensure that we were

able to do do something that

3:05:343:05:40

everyone was confident was not

something that took us back on the

3:05:403:05:43

route to devolution and not away

from it, that is my key priority.

3:05:433:05:47

She asked also about money for the

continental supply arrangement. She

3:05:473:05:51

will note that the agreement is on

the Internet available for anybody

3:05:513:05:57

to see and download, but I think she

should also recognise that these are

3:05:573:06:02

important particularly changes to

infrastructure, that has been needed

3:06:023:06:05

for some time. This is something

that anybody in Belfast will know is

3:06:053:06:12

crying out for investment and change

to be made, and that is why the

3:06:123:06:16

Government wants to make sure that

money is spent on things and needs

3:06:163:06:21

to be spent on, including health

transformation and line with the

3:06:213:06:25

recommendation.

Thank you Mr

Speaker. Does my right honourable

3:06:253:06:31

friend think that allocations and

the budget are largely suggested by

3:06:313:06:38

the Northern Ireland civil service

which is pretty canny, would bat the

3:06:383:06:44

same civil service was inviting that

the Executive is not working at the

3:06:443:06:49

moment.

Clearly my honourable friend

is right to say that these are

3:06:493:06:56

conversations that the Northern

islands of a have at the parties, as

3:06:563:07:00

well as with the UK Government. And

they have been incredibly

3:07:003:07:07

professional ensuring they looked at

the decisions that were taken by the

3:07:073:07:13

Executive before the Executive

collapse and also the programme for

3:07:133:07:18

government that they have had. And

also, it reflects the priorities

3:07:183:07:23

that the UK Government and ensuring

the health and education policing

3:07:233:07:26

our protected.

Can I join in wishing

the secretary of State every best

3:07:263:07:34

wish on this momentous occasion and

can I think the secretary of state

3:07:343:07:39

for her statement and the

Government's live support and that

3:07:393:07:42

statement, once again, for Northern

Ireland's plays within the United

3:07:423:07:46

Kingdom that is very welcome. Also

welcome, the budget statement and

3:07:463:07:52

the £410 million extra to Northern

Ireland as a result of the competent

3:07:523:07:56

supply agreement which is going on

infrastructure, health, education,

3:07:563:08:00

to deprived communities to mental

health, East and West, urban and

3:08:003:08:05

rural, nationalist and unionist,

everyone benefits. That's a good

3:08:053:08:09

news story for Northern Ireland and

has been welcomed across Northern

3:08:093:08:13

Ireland as such. Can I welcome her

statement today where it says that

3:08:133:08:17

she is now going to take a series of

decisions which the Government is

3:08:173:08:25

beginning to take for the good

government of Northern Ireland? This

3:08:253:08:27

is long overdue and I welcome the

series of measures that she has

3:08:273:08:30

announced and also welcome very

warmly her willingness to look at

3:08:303:08:34

arrangements providing for local

decision-making and scrutiny across

3:08:343:08:36

community basis in the meantime she

can be assured of our full support

3:08:363:08:42

and engagement in that process. We

want devolution up and running, she

3:08:423:08:46

knows he would form the Executive

tomorrow on the bases of the agreed

3:08:463:08:50

programme for government with Sinn

Fein and we welcome all

3:08:503:09:00

Can I thank the right honourable of

general men for both his well wishes

3:09:003:09:04

and his comment. And also can I

thank the DUP for the role that they

3:09:043:09:08

played along with all of the other

parties in working with the

3:09:083:09:11

governments to deliver the budget

and ensure that we were able to

3:09:113:09:16

reflect the priorities of the

parties of Northern Ireland? And he

3:09:163:09:21

is right that the confidence and an

supply arrangement that -- money

3:09:213:09:28

that we have reached is absolutely

met the spent on a cross community

3:09:283:09:31

basis for all parts of Northern

Ireland dealing with some issues

3:09:313:09:34

that have been perhaps underfunded

in the past like infrastructure that

3:09:343:09:41

need of funding today and I thank

him for his kind words.

Thank you Mr

3:09:413:09:46

Speaker. I welcome the Secretary of

State positive review of MLA pay. On

3:09:463:09:50

a separate matter does she think it

is unsustainable for honourable

3:09:503:09:54

members in this plates who do not

take their seats to take

3:09:543:09:58

representative money from political

campaigning?

Can I thank my right

3:09:583:10:03

honourable friend. Clearly the

manager first is a matter for this

3:10:033:10:09

House and I know that there are

members of this House who are well

3:10:093:10:12

aware and first in the procedures

that are needed for such matters.

3:10:123:10:17

Clearly the issue of an up pay is

something and you look at as a

3:10:173:10:20

result the review done and I would

welcome representations from that.

3:10:203:10:29

Can also thank the Secretary of

State for the statement. They are

3:10:293:10:38

sad, but inevitable. It is sad but

inevitable that it should have to

3:10:383:10:42

come in this way. But what we're

doing here is treating it not as an

3:10:423:10:48

underlying disease. The reason, so

the chairperson of policing Board

3:10:483:10:55

and the need for proper

accountability of policing in

3:10:553:10:57

Northern Ireland. When we see that

PS and I is spending under Dragon

3:10:573:11:01

£25,000 a day on overtime doesn't

not really say... Is it not

3:11:013:11:08

something else that needs to be

tackled?

Mr Speaker, the right

3:11:083:11:14

honourable gentleman makes a point

that were fakes once again why we

3:11:143:11:18

need to evolve government

instalment. I have met the chair of

3:11:183:11:21

the policing board and the Chief

Constable about this matter. Both

3:11:213:11:24

are keen to see the book

overrepresentation of the policing

3:11:243:11:29

Board restored to add that proper

governance. I will be in Washington

3:11:293:11:36

at the end of the week for the St

Patrick's Day event and believed he

3:11:363:11:41

will be there and I hope to catch up

with her and discuss how we might

3:11:413:11:44

make that a reality stop the my

decisions were under the clear

3:11:443:11:49

impression that the main purpose and

life of Sinn Fein was to avoid all

3:11:493:11:54

costs direct rule from Westminster.

Is it clear and that by refusing to

3:11:543:12:00

reach an agreement with the DUP

commission fain have brought about

3:12:003:12:03

exactly which they always campaigned

to avoid?

-- Sinn Fein I don't want

3:12:033:12:09

to get into the wiser what's about

the process. I do know that all

3:12:093:12:16

sides have given me very strong

commitment that they want to go back

3:12:163:12:21

into Galt -- into devolved

government and I want to find a way

3:12:213:12:24

we can make that a reality.

Lady

Herman.

Thank you Mr Speaker. She

3:12:243:12:32

noted very carefully that she was

very decisive about an increase in

3:12:323:12:38

Northern Ireland. I was extremely

disappointed to put it lightly that

3:12:383:12:42

the Secretary of State continues to

go about cutting the salaries of MLA

3:12:423:12:47

is. Doesn't the Secretary of State

accept and recognise that it is

3:12:473:12:53

morally indefensible that and always

should continue to receive a full

3:12:533:12:56

salary in the absence of a

functioning assembly for 14 months?

3:12:563:13:02

Morally indefensible.

Mr Speaker,

the honourable Lady sums up the

3:13:023:13:06

comments I have been made to me by

members of the public across

3:13:063:13:09

Northern Ireland. But I do want to

make sure that everybody has the

3:13:093:13:14

chance to make representations about

this matter. So that the power that

3:13:143:13:17

we can't legislate forward in

Westminster is used appropriately. I

3:13:173:13:24

also do want to say and I have said

to her at the select committee that

3:13:243:13:29

whilst I think there are good

grounds to look at the pay of MLA

3:13:293:13:34

is, I don't think that their staff

should, that the paper said should

3:13:343:13:39

be affected. I think we would all

agree that our staff do fantastic

3:13:393:13:43

work and that they need to be

properly remunerated for the great

3:13:433:13:47

work that they do and for the

constituents of the MLA is.

I

3:13:473:13:51

welcome this statement, but would

she agree with me that the fact that

3:13:513:13:56

this year and on the Priebus budget

that she has had to take some

3:13:563:13:59

decisions that could not have been

thought through -- but there are

3:13:593:14:03

things today that are several step

further towards rule and were few

3:14:033:14:08

week ago?

I do not agree with my

right honourable friend. I think

3:14:083:14:12

there was a budget that needed to be

balanced. These were steps that were

3:14:123:14:16

taken to balance that budget. And I

have done so. Mindful, consistently

3:14:163:14:24

of the need to make sure that we

plates and maintain the position of

3:14:243:14:29

restoring devolved government

wherever possible.

Gregory Campbell.

3:14:293:14:34

In welcoming the Secretary of

State's statements like others, I

3:14:343:14:41

also concur in wishing her a happy

birthday. And I also say that there

3:14:413:14:44

is a very good move in terms of her

consultation about the MLA salary

3:14:443:14:49

issue. But what she agree with me

that it would be intolerable to move

3:14:493:14:53

on that if the House were not also

to move on the issue of MPs from

3:14:533:14:59

Sinn Fein who deliberately boycott

this House rather than MLA to

3:14:593:15:03

prevent them from doing therefore

job?

Mr Speaker, the honourable

3:15:033:15:07

gentleman, I thank him for his kind

words,, knows that this is a matter

3:15:073:15:12

for the House but that the House

will have heard the strong words

3:15:123:15:15

from both sides.

Thank you sir. Can

I start by training -- painter bid

3:15:153:15:21

to my right honourable friend and

her predecessor for the tireless

3:15:213:15:25

work to try to restore devolved

government in Northern Ireland and

3:15:253:15:28

Cannes jury affirmed that her clear

commitment toward working to that

3:15:283:15:31

Brecht dashed workings at evolve

government to ensure that why

3:15:313:15:36

network goes on, through this

budget, that the people of Northern

3:15:363:15:40

Ireland continue to receive the

services and investment that they

3:15:403:15:43

need?

I thank my honourable friend

for his question. He seemed to have

3:15:433:15:50

a frog in his throat, but he seemed

to do very well in delivering it

3:15:503:15:54

without coughing too much. I do

agree with him. It would not be

3:15:543:15:58

tolerable for the UK Government to

not do what is necessary to enable

3:15:583:16:04

public services to continue to be

delivered. The people I have met in

3:16:043:16:09

Northern Ireland have been very

dedicated public services --

3:16:093:16:12

servants, they do really deserve

that. So they can continue to

3:16:123:16:16

deliver the schools, the policing

and all other man is a public

3:16:163:16:18

services that... .

There are some

decisions that cannot be taken in

3:16:183:16:26

Northern Ireland at the moment. Can

she say how long it will go on

3:16:263:16:29

before accepting that we had to

decide to go further and appoint

3:16:293:16:32

Ministers in which you make a

decision in the next month please

3:16:323:16:36

stop on the Commonwealth youth games

that is supposed be held in our

3:16:363:16:40

Northern Ireland in 2021 and that if

there are no decisions taken by the

3:16:403:16:44

end of the month, that we will lose

those games?

The honourable Lady who

3:16:443:16:49

was a great spokesman Mr knows

exactly what the problem and our

3:16:493:16:54

member from my previous break the

frustration of the fact that Belfast

3:16:543:16:56

has been awarded the Commonwealth

youth games. But in the absence of

3:16:563:17:02

an incest -- of Ministers to sign

the appropriate documentation

3:17:023:17:09

Anchorage actual intermission, there

was great difficulty. -- contractual

3:17:093:17:12

information. I am looking to resolve

as many issues and this is one of

3:17:123:17:19

those issues certainly on my table

at the moment.

Mr Speaker can I

3:17:193:17:23

welcome the Secretary of statement

-- stay positive statement and that

3:17:233:17:27

action that will be taken MLA pay.

She is up for full and final

3:17:273:17:31

representation from the island

parlays. But would she be seeking

3:17:313:17:37

from community groups, many of whom

who have had to fill the gap left by

3:17:373:17:41

and always carrying out Parliament

to do it -- duties?

Mr Speaker, I

3:17:413:17:49

would welcome representations from

all. So far the work being done by

3:17:493:17:53

Trevor Rini which I thank him for

the recommendations, but it would be

3:17:533:17:59

helpful to hear from all parties and

all sides as to the news on this

3:17:593:18:04

matter.

Sandy Wilson's.

We welcome

the fact that the... Does he

3:18:043:18:11

recognise that there are hundreds of

decisions about how that money is

3:18:113:18:18

spent that to require some input

from the Minister and will she give

3:18:183:18:21

a commitment that those issues will

be addressed by the promises that

3:18:213:18:27

she has made to the House today to

look at further measures?

Mr

3:18:273:18:31

Speaker, in terms of the budget that

I have spoken about today, I am

3:18:313:18:36

confident that the director is there

for civil servants to deliver. As

3:18:363:18:42

required and as wanted by all

parties. But he is right that there

3:18:423:18:48

are many decisions that are waiting

and it is frustrating for all, and I

3:18:483:18:52

ensure it is frustrating for him

that in the absence of a devolved

3:18:523:18:55

demonstration in Northern Ireland

that some of those decisions have

3:18:553:18:57

not yet been taken.

Thank you Mr

Speaker. I agree with my right

3:18:573:19:03

honourable friend that it is deeply

regrettable that she has had to take

3:19:033:19:05

actions that out today in regards to

the budget for Northern Ireland

3:19:053:19:09

which is no substitute for local

Ministers on the ground making

3:19:093:19:12

incisions. Will she assure the House

today that she would do everything

3:19:123:19:15

to prevent any and the direct rule?

Mr Speaker, my priority is to

3:19:153:19:23

restore devolved government in

Northern Ireland. For the good of

3:19:233:19:27

the Union, for the good of the

people of Northern Ireland, that is

3:19:273:19:31

the right thing to do. I also think

that is the primary aim of the Irish

3:19:313:19:38

government as well. And I want to

put on the record my thanks for

3:19:383:19:42

their support in the talks process

and I know they are committed to

3:19:423:19:46

restoring devolved government as we

are.

Could the Minister set a

3:19:463:19:51

timetable for her consideration of a

halfway house of some in the certain

3:19:513:19:57

issues that have been mentioned

across the House she would have

3:19:573:20:02

support of a malaise to table

questions and to scrutinise

3:20:023:20:04

decisions. As a direct room and so,

I know there are hundreds of

3:20:043:20:09

decisions taken every day by

Ministers that are now not been

3:20:093:20:11

taken and scrutiny needs to be given

to those who are making those

3:20:113:20:15

decisions.

Mr Speaker, he served as

a Minister in 2004, sometime around

3:20:153:20:26

there, it is producing which in

doing so. 2005 and six, I ended

3:20:263:20:32

being corrected by the opposition

backbench. It always happens. He is

3:20:323:20:39

right that these are decisions that

need to be taken, we do want to see

3:20:393:20:42

devolved government and we want to

see decisions and scrutiny been

3:20:423:20:46

taken into. I went up put a time

frame on it because we need to find

3:20:463:20:52

something that has consent as he

will no constitutional changes in

3:20:523:20:57

Northern Ireland, we would need all

communities. And I do need to work

3:20:573:21:03

through all suggestions would be. I

would welcome his suggestions from

3:21:033:21:07

his extensive x-rays of doing the

job.

Thank you Mr Speaker. I welcome

3:21:073:21:12

this statement, but it is a

statement that that is the right

3:21:123:21:15

thing to do an given the right

approach. We would much rather these

3:21:153:21:19

decisions being taken back into

instalment work -- in the storm and

3:21:193:21:23

where they should be taken. Would

she agree with me that this is about

3:21:233:21:28

a whole range of decisions that need

to be delivered based on the agreed

3:21:283:21:33

programme of governing, not just

literally relying on the UK

3:21:333:21:35

Government to step in? --?

I agree

he sums it up very well.

I welcome

3:21:353:21:44

or seven because she outlined for

the House what actions she intends

3:21:443:21:47

to take in the efficiency within the

efficiencies within the different

3:21:473:21:53

departments as she has outlined in

her statement?

Mr Speaker, the

3:21:533:21:57

honourable gentleman will know that

in Northern Ireland civil service

3:21:573:22:03

has started work on efficiencies

before the Executive collapsed to

3:22:033:22:06

stop --. They have been things

talked about within ministries

3:22:063:22:11

before it there were Ministers in

place. It is working forward from

3:22:113:22:16

the programme to deliver those

efficiencies as was previously being

3:22:163:22:22

looked at by the Ministers. I

recognise this is all terribly...

3:22:223:22:25

Difficult to explain. But we are

working within the boundaries of

3:22:253:22:29

what we can.

I very much welcome the

strong commitment to the Belfast

3:22:293:22:38

Good Friday Agreement. That is... Is

welcome to the rest of the United

3:22:383:22:46

Kingdom. But in tying of the money,

the strength of that undermined.

3:22:463:22:52

What impact assessment has the

Secretary of State done on the

3:22:523:22:55

confidence and supply money?

Mr

Speaker, the confidence and supply

3:22:553:23:00

money as a say, the agreement is on

the Internet and publicly available.

3:23:003:23:05

It was recognised those priorities

and those issues that need to

3:23:053:23:10

support and needed additional

funding. This is not been an -- this

3:23:103:23:15

has not been an easy process.

Balancing budgets is not easy. But

3:23:153:23:19

we have done so mindful to all of

the arrangements and to the previous

3:23:193:23:25

governments of what they had done.

3:23:253:23:29

Can she confirm that not all

political parties will be... And was

3:23:293:23:37

she outline who made the political

decisions?

Mr Speaker, as the UK

3:23:373:23:43

Government we have had to take those

decisions, but I ensure that all

3:23:433:23:48

parties saw the statement, saw the

allocations, and were allowed to

3:23:483:23:51

have been put into them both before

the Thursday but I have the final

3:23:513:23:57

figures, but during that period to

ensure that they were all able to

3:23:573:24:01

make some contribution towards the

work we were doing.

Can I think the

3:24:013:24:08

secretary of state and welcome the

budget about key decisions that are

3:24:083:24:11

urgently required such as the

support for the victims of this, but

3:24:113:24:16

can the secretary of state also

confirmed that she has been informed

3:24:163:24:20

by departments they will not be able

to balance their budgets within

3:24:203:24:25

those departments for the next year?

Mr Speaker, that is not the advice

3:24:253:24:31

that I've had, but she is right. She

should be concerned about legacy and

3:24:313:24:37

also about victims of institutional

abuse. These are matters that, the

3:24:373:24:44

UK Government is used to... On the

Stormont agreement and to setting

3:24:443:24:51

those up. On historical abuse, the

inquiry was set up by the Executive

3:24:513:24:56

before it collapsed. It is therefore

constitutionally very difficult for

3:24:563:25:00

other party or government to look at

the decisions and recommendations

3:25:003:25:06

from that review as it was not a

review that was instigated by the UK

3:25:063:25:11

Parliament or the UK Government. She

absolutely describes the tension

3:25:113:25:14

that we are operating within.

Thank

you very much secretary of State for

3:25:143:25:23

the statement to the House and can I

wish you many happy returns. It's

3:25:233:25:28

interesting to note that the message

that we are receiving from civil

3:25:283:25:33

servants is they cannot move on and

make decisions as to where money

3:25:333:25:37

should be spent. In the absence of

there not being an assembly, and

3:25:373:25:41

unlikely to be an assembly in the

foreseeable future, it is important

3:25:413:25:45

that we have Ministers making

decisions, and if not yourself other

3:25:453:25:49

Ministers, when is this going to

happen?

Mr Speaker, I have attempted

3:25:493:25:55

in this budget to deliver a

certainty, financial certainty that

3:25:553:26:00

is needed to enable public services

to continue. And of course, it is

3:26:003:26:04

down to if devolved government is up

and running in Starr, -- and

3:26:043:26:12

Stormont, then Stormont can't amend

the way the budget has operates. I

3:26:123:26:16

have done what I have to do to

enable public services to continue

3:26:163:26:20

to enable public servants to have

some certainty within the

3:26:203:26:25

restrictions of what is possible for

me as Secretary of State for

3:26:253:26:28

Northern Ireland.

Thank you very

much Mr Speaker and happy returns to

3:26:283:26:36

the secretary of state from across

the House and cross party agreement

3:26:363:26:40

on this northern Ireland statement

time. I understand the secretary of

3:26:403:26:44

State's caution and her concerned

and reluctance to advanced issues of

3:26:443:26:49

direct rule, but in today's

statement and providing a soft

3:26:493:26:53

landing for the perpetual glidepath

that we've had for the last 14

3:26:533:26:56

months, can I encourage her to be

bold, to provide the political

3:26:563:27:02

opportunities for decision-making

for the benefits and interest of all

3:27:023:27:05

the people in Northern Ireland, and

to do it with confidence?

Mr

3:27:053:27:09

Speaker, I think the honourable

gentleman for his good wishes. If I

3:27:093:27:13

can repeat, and I am committed to

the Belfast agreement and the

3:27:133:27:17

institutions that were set up under

the Belfast agreement. I want to be

3:27:173:27:21

in a position that those

institutions can be up and running

3:27:213:27:24

and can be delivered for the people

of Northern Ireland, the politicians

3:27:243:27:29

they'll elected delivering for them.

That is what I want to determine to

3:27:293:27:34

do, and I don't want to undermine

that in any way. So, that is the

3:27:343:27:40

very difficult balancing act I've

been operating under. I wanted to

3:27:403:27:43

make sure that civil servants of the

certainty they needed and that they

3:27:433:27:45

have the money that they needed, but

without undermining. I would welcome

3:27:453:27:50

any suggestions from him and others

about what sort of constitutional

3:27:503:27:54

arrangements could be put in place

to get back to devolved government.

3:27:543:28:00

Thank you, order. Statement the

Secretary of State for International

3:28:003:28:04

Development, Secretary Doctor Liam

Fox.

Thank you. Mr Speaker, on

3:28:043:28:10

Thursday the 8th of March President

Trump announced that the United

3:28:103:28:13

States would impose tariffs of 25%

on steel imports in a 10% tariff on

3:28:133:28:20

aluminium imports after a period of

15 days, the final date being the

3:28:203:28:24

23rd of March. Canada and Mexico

within the United States is

3:28:243:28:31

renegotiating the North American

Free Trade Agreement, have been

3:28:313:28:32

exempted from the tariffs subject to

successful conclusion of the Nafta

3:28:323:28:37

negotiations. For the products

within the scope of this

3:28:373:28:42

investigation, and 2017, the US

accounted for 7% of UK steel exports

3:28:423:28:49

and 3% of UK aluminium exports. In

addition, the UK accounted for 1% of

3:28:493:28:53

US steel imports into your .1% of US

aluminium imports and tonnage value

3:28:533:29:02

of 360 million and £29 million,

respectively. The president also

3:29:023:29:05

outlined that there scope for

further countries and certain

3:29:053:29:09

products to be exempted from those

tariffs. From a UK perspective, as

3:29:093:29:14

members of this House know, the UK

and US are strong partners and

3:29:143:29:19

allies in the US UK economic and

security relationship is very

3:29:193:29:23

important. The glass is our largest

single trading nation partner

3:29:233:29:28

accounting for a set of all of our

exports worth over £100 billion a

3:29:283:29:32

year. It is also a top destination

for outward direct investment by the

3:29:323:29:36

UK and the single biggest source of

inward investment into the UK. We

3:29:363:29:40

have a long-standing and special

relationship with the US. However,

3:29:403:29:44

this does not mean that if we

disagree with something that we will

3:29:443:29:48

not say so. And Mr Deputy Speaker,

we do disagree with the US decision

3:29:483:29:52

to implement tariffs on steel and

aluminium imports based on national

3:29:523:29:57

security considerations. These

unilateral trade measures have a

3:29:573:30:03

weak foundations and international

law and they are not consistent with

3:30:033:30:06

the Department of defence's on

judgement and an investigation that

3:30:063:30:11

was conducted on the basis of

national security. It was

3:30:113:30:15

undoubtedly a problem of

overcapacity in the global steel

3:30:153:30:17

market, but our strong view is that

a global problem will cause a global

3:30:173:30:25

solution that unilateral action. The

UK has worked hard to address this

3:30:253:30:29

issue of overcapacity. The Prime

Minister called for a form of T20

3:30:293:30:33

members to tackle this issue which

my right honourable friend the

3:30:333:30:36

Secretary of State for Business and

energy and industrial strategy

3:30:363:30:40

intended in Berlin in November. And

most recently, the Prime Minister

3:30:403:30:47

raised it during her visit to China

which is the worlds leading producer

3:30:473:30:50

of steel and aluminium products. The

UK will continue to work within the

3:30:503:30:58

rules based international trade

system to tackle this problem. Since

3:30:583:31:03

the president asked the Commerce

Department to launch the

3:31:033:31:06

investigation into the national

security impact of steel and

3:31:063:31:09

aluminium imports last April, the

Government has made clear on

3:31:093:31:12

repeated occasions to the

administration that potentially

3:31:123:31:16

damaging impact of tariffs on the UK

and the ED steel and aluminium

3:31:163:31:22

industries so the Prime Minister has

raised her concerns directly with

3:31:223:31:26

President Trump. I myself have

spoken on several occasion to the

3:31:263:31:30

commerce secretary and the US trade

representative about the

3:31:303:31:33

investigation, including this

afternoon. I've also spoken again

3:31:333:31:37

today but the director general of

the WTO and regularly speak with EU

3:31:373:31:42

trade Commissioner. Several of my

Cabinet colleagues erased it with

3:31:423:31:48

their offices and the Government has

worked closely with the EU as of our

3:31:483:31:53

unified response. I can assure my

right honourable and honourable

3:31:533:31:57

friends that have been in regular

contact with the UK steel and

3:31:573:32:00

aluminium industry throughout and I

spoke to Gary at the begin and also

3:32:003:32:04

this afternoon. Mr Speaker, there

are two routes to petition the US

3:32:043:32:08

for exemptions from the tariffs. The

first overseen by the US trade

3:32:083:32:14

representative, will exempt

countries was with which the US has

3:32:143:32:18

a strong national security

relationship and alternative means

3:32:183:32:23

to address the threat to US national

security from the relevant imports.

3:32:233:32:28

And second, overseen by the Commerce

Department, will evaluate product

3:32:283:32:32

exemptions if there deemed there is

no domestic US alternative and

3:32:323:32:37

national security considerations but

only after a request for exclusion

3:32:373:32:40

is made by directly affected parties

located in the United States. The

3:32:403:32:46

Department for Business energy and

industrial strategy will be

3:32:463:32:51

assisting UK industry and working

with US customers to build their

3:32:513:32:54

cases for the exemption of

individual products. I will be

3:32:543:32:57

travelling to Washington this week

for meeting face-to-face with the US

3:32:573:33:00

trade representative and a commerce

secretary as well as leading members

3:33:003:33:06

of Congress. I'll be making the case

for the UK as part of the EU. We

3:33:063:33:12

have a strong defence and security

cooperation relationship, as close

3:33:123:33:17

allies and Nato permanent members of

the UN Security Council and nuclear

3:33:173:33:22

powers." Version between the US and

UK is vital to international peace

3:33:223:33:26

and security. As the House is aware,

our current membership of the

3:33:263:33:30

European Union means that the

European Commission will be cord

3:33:303:33:33

knitting the EU response and we've

been clear that we will continue to

3:33:333:33:37

adhere to the cooperation. The EU

response is focused on three

3:33:373:33:43

possible areas. First, the European

Commission is preparing to introduce

3:33:433:33:46

and media duties on the US ahead of

a WTO dispute. The EU has shared a

3:33:463:33:52

draft list of proposed items for

duties and we expect to protect the

3:33:523:34:04

steel and aluminium industries from

being damaged by an influx of

3:34:043:34:08

exports to the EU caused by the

displacing effect of US tariffs. And

3:34:083:34:12

third, the EU can pursue a dispute

at the WTO. We are currently

3:34:123:34:17

evaluating all aspects of these

responses together. Mr Speaker, we

3:34:173:34:22

are clear that it is right to seek

to defend our industries from the

3:34:223:34:26

direct and indirect impact of these

US tariffs are taking both jobs and

3:34:263:34:30

industrial capacity. We will also

press for any response of the EU to

3:34:303:34:35

be measure and proportionate. It's

important that the UK and EU

3:34:353:34:40

response words within the boundaries

of the rules based international

3:34:403:34:43

trading system. Over the coming

days, we will be working closely

3:34:433:34:47

with British industry and the EU to

seek swift clarification and

3:34:473:34:54

mitigation. I commend this statement

to this House.

Mr Deputy Speaker as

3:34:543:35:00

pink the Secretary of State for

advanced side of his statement and

3:35:003:35:03

his telephone call over the weekend.

-- I think the secretary of state.

3:35:033:35:07

The world steel industry is on the

verge of a crisis. 32,000 workers

3:35:073:35:12

and the steel industry are facing an

existential threat to their jobs.

3:35:123:35:15

Many of those men and women are

angry that it has taken the

3:35:153:35:19

secretary of state more than ten

days since President Trump's initial

3:35:193:35:23

announcement to come to this House

and make a statement about the

3:35:233:35:26

impact of this might have on their

communities and what measures the

3:35:263:35:29

Government is taking to protect

their livelihoods. They expected

3:35:293:35:33

better, and they had a right to

expect better. But I want to assure

3:35:333:35:37

the Secretary of State that for our

part, the official opposition will

3:35:373:35:41

not seek to make this issue one a

party political point score.

3:35:413:35:48

Everyone in this House must work

together. We will be constructively

3:35:483:35:51

critical where we considered the

Government can do better, but our

3:35:513:35:55

fundamental position will be to work

with the Government to achieve the

3:35:553:35:59

best outcome for our steel

communities, for other aluminium

3:35:593:36:03

industry, and for our wider economy.

The Secretary of State was correct

3:36:033:36:07

but the fundamental cause of this

crisis is overcapacity in the global

3:36:073:36:12

market, and a long-standing failure

by governments around the world to

3:36:123:36:16

tackle dumping and unfair practises.

But he should have acknowledged that

3:36:163:36:19

this included his own government. We

have not forgotten that it was the

3:36:193:36:25

conservative government in 2016 that

sought to block EU plans to impose

3:36:253:36:28

tougher tariffs on progression of

Chinese steel import. Global

3:36:283:36:35

oversupply has in other countries

dump their service, is server is

3:36:353:36:39

created by an actionable subsidies

and lax enforcement of labour

3:36:393:36:42

standards and workers' rights and

less than market value. Whilst the

3:36:423:36:47

global situation has not been

created by President Trump, the

3:36:473:36:50

manner in which he has gone about

trying to resolve its impact on the

3:36:503:36:55

US is fundamentally wrong and

friends to take a very bad situation

3:36:553:37:00

into a full-scale global trade

crisis. The application of 25%

3:37:003:37:05

tariffs on steel and 10% aluminium

imports into the United States is

3:37:053:37:12

unjust and unjustifiable. The

suggestion that such tariffs are

3:37:123:37:16

necessary under section 232 to

mitigate a threat to American

3:37:163:37:20

national security is patently false.

The US secretary of defence himself

3:37:203:37:25

has publicly stated that US military

requirements represent no more than

3:37:253:37:30

3% of US steel production and that

the Department of defence is able to

3:37:303:37:34

acquire the steel and aluminium it

needs for US national defence

3:37:343:37:41

requirements. The UK steel industry

has made it clear that the amount of

3:37:413:37:43

UK steel exports to the United

States is very small indeed. The

3:37:433:37:49

secretary of state says that Trump's

tariffs have weak foundations in

3:37:493:37:54

international law. In fact, they

have none. The truth is that the

3:37:543:37:59

president is seeking to bully and

threaten his trading partners to

3:37:593:38:01

bring

3:38:013:38:07

The temporary exemption for Canada

and Mexico making the subject to a

3:38:073:38:13

renegotiated -- renegotiation of

Nafta, he's doing the same at UK and

3:38:133:38:17

Europe review books to reverse the

US trade deficit. Given that the

3:38:173:38:24

Secretary of State accept that these

tears are unjustified, I would ask

3:38:243:38:28

them to say... It is to act as if

they had a series of legitimacy.

3:38:283:38:36

This is recycling -- precisely the

trap that President Trump is a set.

3:38:363:38:40

Negotiate with us and we will not

believe further. In that part of

3:38:403:38:44

Glasgow where I grew, it was called

a protection racket. If the

3:38:443:38:49

Secretary of State goes down this

route of trying to secure an

3:38:493:38:52

exemption, will he give a commitment

now to be totally transparent about

3:38:523:38:56

any price he has to pay and any

assurances he has to get to the US

3:38:563:39:02

administration in order to get it?

It is reported that following the

3:39:023:39:06

Austrian Foreign Minister's meeting

with Rex Tillerson, these tariffs

3:39:063:39:10

may not apply to Australia. Reports

have also been reported that the

3:39:103:39:14

gesture has had to agree to

bilateral agreement to contribute

3:39:143:39:22

more military spending. Willie also

clear how any such attempt by the UK

3:39:223:39:28

sits with the duty of sincere

cooperation? Which the Secretary of

3:39:283:39:33

State rightly referred to in his own

statement. The President Trump is

3:39:333:39:37

imposing these tariffs on national

security grants precisely because

3:39:373:39:40

under the BT overrules, this means

that article 21 would not apply.

3:39:403:39:47

This specifically prevents member

states of the WTO of demanding

3:39:473:39:50

clarity on the grounds of such a

pronouncement and commencing --

3:39:503:39:57

articulate country action. The

president is seeking to under nine

3:39:573:40:01

-- undermined the multilateral

system of the WTO to which he has

3:40:013:40:04

long been opposed. He has said that

he would welcome a trade war and

3:40:043:40:07

thinks America could win it. He

cares nothing for the viability of

3:40:073:40:11

UK producers who have respected the

wins. He is treating them no

3:40:113:40:15

different to the competitors who

have not. And as the US market

3:40:153:40:19

closest to our exports, countries

that would otherwise export into the

3:40:193:40:23

US will seek to diverge their

production to the UK. This will tend

3:40:233:40:27

to undercut the Mr producers here

even further. What action has the

3:40:273:40:33

secondary of state taken to defend

against this divergence a? Reckon is

3:40:333:40:39

that our industry is particularly

vulnerable because we have a

3:40:393:40:41

government that prides itself on

taking the weakest possible approach

3:40:413:40:46

to remedy unfair practises by

adhering to the lesser duty rule.

3:40:463:40:49

Both the trade bill and the taxation

cross-border trade bill currently

3:40:493:40:53

going through Parliament were

opposed by the Labour Party

3:40:533:40:55

precisely because they proposed to

create what the manufacturers trade

3:40:553:41:00

remedies or otherwise described as

one of the weakest trade remedy

3:41:003:41:03

regimes in the world. I asked

Secretary of State whether he will

3:41:033:41:11

look to bring government amendments

to bring strength and secretary

3:41:113:41:14

representation function of the trade

remedies authority and powers

3:41:143:41:17

available to it in line with those

opposed by the opposition at

3:41:173:41:20

committee stage. This Secretary of

State state spoke... What assessment

3:41:203:41:27

has his department made of the legal

rights of the course under article

3:41:273:41:31

eight of the WTO agreement on

safeguards? And what provision is

3:41:313:41:36

made to the European commissions

director in relation to those

3:41:363:41:39

measures? Is he persuaded that they

would be lawful? Is he persuaded

3:41:393:41:43

that they would be effective? The

Secretary of State's fond of

3:41:433:41:47

painting international trade as a

balance of consumer and producer

3:41:473:41:50

interest, the fear of thousands of

steel and aluminium workers in the

3:41:503:41:53

UK is that he naturally leads... I

am doing so. That he naturally leads

3:41:533:42:00

to far. He needs to prove to them

that he will stand up for British

3:42:003:42:05

industry, for their jobs and for

their communities. They confidence

3:42:053:42:08

that he will tackle unfair practises

that distort the market. If he does,

3:42:083:42:13

he will have this side of the

House's. Part.

Mr Speaker, I am

3:42:133:42:18

grateful to the cooperation that the

honourable gentleman gave over the

3:42:183:42:24

weekend and some of the

constructions -- constructive

3:42:243:42:27

suggestions he made as to how we

might apply for the pressure to

3:42:273:42:32

those US producers to enable them to

seek exemptions for imports from the

3:42:323:42:35

UK. He is right that there is a

capacity. The G20 has now made 28

3:42:353:42:44

recommendations. We now wait to see

whether China will implement those

3:42:443:42:49

recommendations which is the key to

sorting out the global overcapacity

3:42:493:42:52

issue. We have regularly said that

we do not believe that 232 was an

3:42:523:43:00

appropriate vehicle for carrying out

this particular investigation. And

3:43:003:43:05

the UK sends that only some

specifically high and a steel

3:43:053:43:11

products into the United States

which the US market has not

3:43:113:43:14

necessarily been able to provide for

itself, so therefore terrorists will

3:43:143:43:19

apply on on -- therefore tariffs

will apply... Into the American

3:43:193:43:27

military programme itself. Which

makes action taken against united

3:43:273:43:31

kingdom quite an absurdity. He is

right to mention that the sincere

3:43:313:43:39

cooperation I have made very clear

to the commission that we continue

3:43:393:43:41

to operate on that basis and that as

we leave the European Union, we will

3:43:413:43:47

replicate the EU's trade remedies

system. I would remind him however

3:43:473:43:53

that his party voted against the

setting up of the trade remedies

3:43:533:43:56

authority itself, its self, the

setting up of the body. Not the

3:43:563:44:01

issues that relate to the operation

of it. Which I think was a dangerous

3:44:013:44:06

thing to do. But I think, Mr

Speaker, it is right that we regard

3:44:063:44:11

this as a national issue. There is a

fundamental issue between us. Nor is

3:44:113:44:20

there any difference between us on

the options we believe that the

3:44:203:44:24

European Union should take as a

response.

With the Secretary of

3:44:243:44:29

State stressed to the EU that it is

in our interest to try and take some

3:44:293:44:34

of the tension out of this festering

dispute rather than to take it on to

3:44:343:44:39

another hide given that the

president is already talking about

3:44:393:44:43

tariffs against German cars for

example? Is it in our interest to

3:44:433:44:49

get back to tariff free business?

Mr

Deputy Speaker, the EU is taking

3:44:493:44:58

countermeasures because the EU views

the 232 itself as a safeguard. Any

3:44:583:45:05

action that United States would you

take in response to that would be

3:45:053:45:07

completely out of line with

international trade law as well as

3:45:073:45:11

an already tense situation.

And Mr

spec that --. This really is a blow

3:45:113:45:20

to those right wing free-market

Brexiteers to argue that the US

3:45:203:45:24

would welcome a trade deal with open

arms. Anyone looking at the somewhat

3:45:243:45:28

unhinged tweets coming out of

president Trump's office will tell

3:45:283:45:31

us otherwise. But I'm interested to

note given the Secretary of State's

3:45:313:45:37

nationality and where he was brought

up, has he raised specifically the

3:45:373:45:44

matter of Scottish steel and

aluminium and the steel industry as

3:45:443:45:48

an impact on all of the nations of

the UK because it was in 1992 that

3:45:483:45:52

house conservative government close

ravens Creek in Scotland decimating

3:45:523:45:59

1200 jobs and livelihoods and it was

as NP government in Scotland that

3:45:593:46:02

brought this steel works and that

aluminium back. We are fed up in

3:46:023:46:09

Scotland of cleaning up his

government's mass. And we do not

3:46:093:46:12

want to be in the possession that we

have to do that again. From recent

3:46:123:46:16

reports in the press, that the

indicators such as Scotch whiskey

3:46:163:46:21

could be under threat in the US UK

trade. Secretary of State may have

3:46:213:46:26

seen the article in the Scotsman

last week that Scotch whiskey may be

3:46:263:46:31

a product that could carry an

American tag after Brexit. It is

3:46:313:46:33

further said that US law could trap

geographical name possessions after

3:46:333:46:39

Brexit to allay supermarkets that

import American products. That would

3:46:393:46:45

be averages. Would he commit to

protecting our valuable steel and

3:46:453:46:48

aluminium industries, not trading

off our bite the GI for Scotch

3:46:483:46:56

whiskey in any trade gives? And

would he reconsider given a Tory

3:46:563:47:00

Brexit -- a total president would

reduce GDP by 8% and reverse key

3:47:003:47:05

experts, will he finally reconsider

his approach to Brexit and admit

3:47:053:47:08

that he was wrong in suggesting that

between the EU's single market

3:47:083:47:13

cousin Susan bashing and consent be

overcome by medical trade deals --

3:47:133:47:18

single market trade union. In what

he said was he -- and his words

3:47:183:47:23

would be the eases in human history?

It is not won since I remember that

3:47:233:47:27

the SNP being delighted at some of

Mr Trump's tweets when he was having

3:47:273:47:33

some of his relationships with the

previous as and leader. In terms of

3:47:333:47:40

how we tackle this, we best tackle

this as a UK and the United Kingdom

3:47:403:47:46

in line with our European Union

partners. The honourable Lady dares

3:47:463:47:49

to raise the issue of GI. These are

actually in the rollover of the EU

3:47:493:47:57

trade agreements that we are trying

to get the continuity for in our

3:47:573:48:04

current trade and customs bill. And

when it comes to talking about her,

3:48:043:48:09

she needs to understand that she

voted against the rollover of those

3:48:093:48:11

bills which would have given that

there are protections she is asking

3:48:113:48:14

is for.

Thank you Mr Speaker. It is

condemnation of President Trump's

3:48:143:48:24

proposed steel tariff that the EU as

I said that it would be a retrograde

3:48:243:48:28

step to impose tariffs or engage

recalibrate measures, how would my

3:48:283:48:33

right honourable friend use the

present my second husband for open,

3:48:333:48:36

fresh and astray with the EU pose

present at the UK's position as a

3:48:363:48:41

leading proponent of free trade in

the 21st century?

I think what we

3:48:413:48:46

are seeing are the sort of problems

that come from introducing

3:48:463:48:52

rejectionist measures. Tariffs are

very seldom for any length of time

3:48:523:49:00

of successfully protect a domestic

industry. They are likely to add

3:49:003:49:03

cost to the inputs for that economy

and in the United States where there

3:49:033:49:09

are 140,000 people employed in the

production of steel, there are 6.5

3:49:093:49:14

million people and industries

dependent on steel usage. And it

3:49:143:49:17

will not be held by an increase in

the price. My honourable friend

3:49:173:49:21

makes a good point that we should

actually all be recommitting

3:49:213:49:25

ourselves out to an open, liberal

global trading system rather than

3:49:253:49:28

considering impediments to it.

If he

wants to, will he rebuffed Donald

3:49:283:49:37

Trump's claim that these tariffs are

therefore national security reasons

3:49:373:49:41

need only look at the President's

tweet from six hours ago where he

3:49:413:49:47

starts out saying, oh, what about

European farming tariffs or

3:49:473:49:50

manufacturing tariffs. It is quite

clear that he and the European Union

3:49:503:49:56

should drive a Trojan horse to the

national security nonsense that he

3:49:563:49:59

is putting up. Should he edit --

with the ABC does that this is an

3:49:593:50:05

odd thing to work with our European

Union partners and the leverage that

3:50:053:50:09

we use of data lives of 500 million

customers that the Americans cannot

3:50:093:50:13

walk all over us?

I suggest that if

we Grimm

can we have sure questions

3:50:133:50:22

and short answers?

We will work with

our partners in the European Union

3:50:223:50:28

because we are under the duty is

sincere cooperation. But there are

3:50:283:50:31

many other countries that are

affected that will also make their

3:50:313:50:34

voices known that are not members of

the European Union.

Mr Stewart.

My

3:50:343:50:42

right eyeball friend is rightly

mentioned that many of the UK

3:50:423:50:48

exports are high by men specialise

and that many of the supplies go to

3:50:483:50:52

the United States military. Does he

have an opinion at this stage

3:50:523:50:56

whether the product exemption or the

country extension route offers the

3:50:563:51:00

best hope for gaining an advantage

for the United Kingdom?

Mr Deputy

3:51:003:51:05

Speaker, that is a very good

question that he asks. Until we are

3:51:053:51:10

able to explore in greater detail

with the US authorities exactly what

3:51:103:51:16

the details will mean, it is

difficult to answer the question. In

3:51:163:51:19

any case whichever routes are best

to gain exceptions for the United

3:51:193:51:23

Kingdom and European Union...

Could

I ask the Secretary of State what

3:51:233:51:29

his view is of comments in the last

ten days around tit-for-tat for

3:51:293:51:36

example, the peanut butter, the

cranberry juice and other products

3:51:363:51:39

which are consumed here? Does he

believe this is a good approach,

3:51:393:51:42

sensible?

Mr Deputy Speaker, she

asks a good question, the EU, as I

3:51:423:51:51

said, tends to impose

countermeasures under article eight

3:51:513:51:54

of the WTO agreement. It believes

that the 232 itself is a safeguard.

3:51:543:52:01

And that it is therefore entitled to

respond to that. But I would say

3:52:013:52:05

that these constant upping of the

antsy about what may happen and what

3:52:053:52:12

countermeasures may be taken,

because there's not as as a way for

3:52:123:52:15

us to approach global trade. Issue

suggesting that it would be wise for

3:52:153:52:18

everyone to keep the temperature

down, then I entirely, 100% agree

3:52:183:52:21

with that.

Can I welcome the

Cemetery of state's statement both

3:52:213:52:28

in terms of its content but also in

terms of its tone? Free-trade is

3:52:283:52:32

about being free to trade within the

agreed rules. It is not about a

3:52:323:52:38

free-for-all. And I strongly

encourage him to reiterate that

3:52:383:52:43

message but to the United States and

to China?

Mr Deputy Speaker, I take

3:52:433:52:49

every opportunity to do so. It is

worth remembering that we had in the

3:52:493:52:55

United States a number of those who

very strongly agree with us. Notley

3:52:553:53:00

Society American business lobby,

many of whom may be harmed as a

3:53:003:53:03

result of the measures that may be

undertaken. We also have very strong

3:53:033:53:07

and vocal allies in the US Congress.

I very much welcome than making

3:53:073:53:14

their voices known in the recent

days.

3:53:143:53:21

I'd be very concerned if the

Government is putting all of its

3:53:213:53:24

hopes on an exemption for the UK or

the European Union because there

3:53:243:53:28

will still be a substantial amount

on a fact by those countries with

3:53:283:53:31

which to behave badly when they are

shut out of the US. As the Secretary

3:53:313:53:35

of State Doug and impact...

3:53:353:53:39

We are working along with the

industry to have a look at that my

3:53:433:53:50

colleagues are engaged in not work.

The honourable Lady knows that it's

3:53:503:53:55

getting Grove is a good example of

what I was discussing earlier. It is

3:53:553:54:00

one of those areas where you make a

specialist steel that goes into the

3:54:003:54:04

US programme and so the concept that

we should be taking to task on and

3:54:043:54:09

national security basis for

providing the US with something that

3:54:093:54:11

they need for their own security

programme does not make much sense.

3:54:113:54:17

Thank you Mr Deputy Speaker. It

seems to me that tariffs and

3:54:173:54:21

protectionism fundamentally

undermine the industry that they

3:54:213:54:23

seek to protect. Can the secretary

of State confirm that it remains the

3:54:233:54:26

British Government position that we

are committed to world wide

3:54:263:54:30

free-trade? And secondly, will they

be seeking a way to gain a

3:54:303:54:37

bilateral... As able to do so.

Mr

Speaker, as I've said today we will

3:54:373:54:42

work alongside the European Union

because we have a duty of sincere

3:54:423:54:46

corporation as well as members of

the European Union. I've often taken

3:54:463:54:52

this view that is strange that

people should want us to obey the

3:54:523:54:56

rules when we want them and not one

we don't want them. We have a legal

3:54:563:55:02

duty as EU members to fulfil that

and we will intend to do so and work

3:55:023:55:08

with our EU partners accordingly.

But we do as a country, and this has

3:55:083:55:15

been clear under government of both

colours, we agree in free-trade and

3:55:153:55:19

have been a global champion. Let's

remember, free trade is the means by

3:55:193:55:23

which we take it a billion people

out of abject poverty in a

3:55:233:55:28

generation and we as a country

should be proud to be in the lead.

3:55:283:55:32

Can the secretary of State give us

some examples of how he has been

3:55:323:55:35

able to use our close and special

trading relationship with the United

3:55:353:55:40

States to develop his vision of an

open liberal multilateral trade

3:55:403:55:43

agreements. The honourable gentleman

knows they are able to conduct an

3:55:433:55:50

independent trade policy as long as

we are members of his beloved

3:55:503:55:53

European Union. But what we've got

is the trade working group with the

3:55:533:55:58

United States, working at short-term

localisation, areas we might look at

3:55:583:56:02

in the future of free trade

agreement, cooperation and the WTO

3:56:023:56:06

when we leave.

And for some reason I

think that he would be well to

3:56:063:56:14

remember his own comments from

yesterday that were as mean-spirited

3:56:143:56:18

as they were wrong in substance.

Tenant I congratulate might... When

3:56:183:56:27

he goes to the United States he says

he is going to meet members of

3:56:273:56:32

Congress. Will he continue to build

the case for the open liberal

3:56:323:56:36

trading system that we all support

on both sides of this House with our

3:56:363:56:41

other good friends and the Congress

there to make sure that this can be

3:56:413:56:47

delivered once we are out of the

European Union?

I would just correct

3:56:473:56:52

my honourable friend a little. We're

not just talking to Republican

3:56:523:56:56

members of Congress, there are

strong democratic elements that have

3:56:563:56:59

long been in favour of free trade

and I think it's very important that

3:56:593:57:04

in this country in the United States

and elsewhere we work with

3:57:043:57:07

like-minded people who believe in

genuinely open liberal trade to

3:57:073:57:11

achieve the ends that we have in

common.

The recovery we've seen and

3:57:113:57:17

our steel industry has been fragile

and we are facing as my honourable

3:57:173:57:21

friend says not only the direct

impact of tariffs but the indirect

3:57:213:57:26

effects of other countries finding a

home for displaced steel. The

3:57:263:57:30

Government has been slow to act

during the steel crisis. To the

3:57:303:57:37

Secretary of State assure my steel

working constituents they will do

3:57:373:57:39

everything they can to fight for our

industry at this time.

The EU will

3:57:393:57:48

impose countermeasures because it

believes that what we are witnessing

3:57:483:57:51

is a safeguard and we believe that

that is not justified by the 232

3:57:513:57:57

case on national security. We will

alongside the EU take whatever

3:57:573:58:01

measures are required to ensure that

that is dealt with.

Can the Minister

3:58:013:58:07

confirm what steps his Department

has taken to ensure that the UK can

3:58:073:58:10

protect to produce businesses of all

sectors from unfair trading

3:58:103:58:14

practises once the UK leads the EU?

We touched on that earlier in the

3:58:143:58:22

way which we will do that is by

replicating the trade remedies

3:58:223:58:26

measures that exist, but to do that

we have to set up a trade remedies

3:58:263:58:29

authority under the trade bill

currently going through the House

3:58:293:58:34

and I hope that the opposition

parties will look again at what I

3:58:343:58:40

think is their rather inexplicable

decision to vote against the setting

3:58:403:58:43

up of the trade remedies authority

itself.

Point of order come at the

3:58:433:58:47

end of the statement.

In 2002 when

the US administration lasted this US

3:58:473:58:56

economist estimated cost the US

economy 200,000 jobs and they had to

3:58:563:59:01

back down at the WTO when the EU

took them to add. Will the Secretary

3:59:013:59:05

of State reassure this House and

still workers in my constituency and

3:59:053:59:10

elsewhere that the UK will argue for

the strongest possible safeguard

3:59:103:59:13

measures up in the EU's response.

Mr

Speaker, first of all, we hope that

3:59:133:59:19

we can persuade the United States

thing before and EU exemption so we

3:59:193:59:24

don't have to go down this

particular route and I hope that

3:59:243:59:28

sense will prevail. He's quite right

Theresa 2002 issue. At that point,

3:59:283:59:35

there is a great deal of activity

where we saw the lines between the

3:59:353:59:39

free-trade agreements and Congress

and the business community and the

3:59:393:59:42

United States come together to

change the might of the

3:59:423:59:44

administration of that time. I hope

the combination will be successful

3:59:443:59:47

this time.

This has caused

widespread concern, so what's steps

3:59:473:59:56

will discover be doing to exert

pressure on President Chen from the

3:59:564:00:00

outside and the inside in terms of

the American political and trading

4:00:004:00:05

establishments?

There is a great

deal of opinion inside Congress on

4:00:054:00:12

both parties that this is a mistake

in route to take, and I had

4:00:124:00:18

discussions in recent days with Paul

Ryan on this very subject and I

4:00:184:00:22

think that we should be trying to

mobilise all the allies they can. I

4:00:224:00:27

just mentioned the cooperation from

the honourable gentleman. I think it

4:00:274:00:32

is very important that we also not

just politically and through

4:00:324:00:36

business, but there is a role for

the trade unions to play here and

4:00:364:00:39

talking to their opposite numbers in

the United States where industries

4:00:394:00:44

are potentially damaged that are

users of steel should the price of

4:00:444:00:48

steel rise as a result of tariffs.

There is a multilayered approach

4:00:484:00:52

that we can take to dealing with

this issue, and they actually have a

4:00:524:00:55

duty to use every one of those

levers that we have.

Dumping is also

4:00:554:01:03

the crucial issue for steel workers

of my own constituency plant, does

4:01:034:01:08

the secretary of State not find it

ironic that he is talking about the

4:01:084:01:11

importance of working together

across the EU to put in place the

4:01:114:01:14

safeguards which are so necessary

whilst... And when he is speaking to

4:01:144:01:20

his US counterparts, will he remind

them that every single US state lost

4:01:204:01:25

jobs as a result of George W Bush's

actions in 2002?

The EU can take

4:01:254:01:32

countermeasures on the basis that it

believes that this is a safe car. He

4:01:324:01:35

can also take the safe guard of his

own. Steel product was damaging our

4:01:354:01:44

own market. I will remind him that

this is not a dispute between the

4:01:444:01:48

United States in the EU but involves

all the countries in the world that

4:01:484:01:54

are still producers as the WTO is

much bigger than the EU and we will

4:01:544:01:59

not be leaving the WTO as the eyes

of founding member.

I want to thank

4:01:594:02:04

the Secretary of State for

referencing that and his response to

4:02:044:02:12

the lady. Can he commit all the

necessary support given that the

4:02:124:02:21

products produced there for

Caterpillar, an American firm, and

4:02:214:02:23

are produced in the UK market and --

US market and pose no risk to those

4:02:234:02:30

jobs.

My honourable friend makes it

very important point, and the

4:02:304:02:36

exports from there to Caterpillar

which is about 25% of the site

4:02:364:02:42

output is quite right that the US

producers have low capability in

4:02:424:02:47

this product. And therefore, the

application of tariffs is only

4:02:474:02:50

likely to result in a rise in input

costs which is not really in any

4:02:504:02:54

economic's benefit. Thank you Mr

Speaker, should the stanza paint

4:02:544:03:00

impose on the 23rd of March and we

hope that they wouldn't be, should

4:03:004:03:04

they be, what steps should this

government commit to does support

4:03:044:03:08

steel-making in this country and

still making community. It's not

4:03:084:03:14

quite the deadline the 23rd of March

that it may appear. And my initial

4:03:144:03:19

discussions of the Department of

commerce and the USTR is clear that

4:03:194:03:24

the period of exemption will

continue somewhere beyond the

4:03:244:03:28

initial introduction. Clearly, if

there are going to be exemptions for

4:03:284:03:31

the EU, the UK, we did want them to

be introduced as soon as possible.

4:03:314:03:36

We will continue to push for an

Zengin on the basis I set out today.

4:03:364:03:42

When my right honourable friend

travels to Washington later this

4:03:424:03:45

week, will he be accompanied by

representatives from Brussels as

4:03:454:03:50

well? Because obviously, we're still

at EU member, and cannot

4:03:504:03:54

unilaterally yet?

Mr Speaker, I

don't require a baby-sitter from the

4:03:544:04:02

EU for my visit to Washington. We

are in continuous contact with

4:04:024:04:08

milestone and our team because this

is an issue that affects us all and

4:04:084:04:12

it affects is whether we're in the

European Union are not because these

4:04:124:04:16

actions are not actions taken

against the EU, but all producers

4:04:164:04:20

globally who will be equally

effective.

Did the secretary of

4:04:204:04:27

state or for that matter the

European Union have advanced

4:04:274:04:29

knowledge of President from's

statement on the 1st of March? And

4:04:294:04:33

if so, either way, what is that say

about the jubilation ships with the

4:04:334:04:36

president?

Mr Speaker, I'm not many

people if any had advance notice of

4:04:364:04:44

President Trump's initial

announcement.

What representations

4:04:444:04:49

has he made to China with regard to

tackling the global overcapacity of

4:04:494:04:53

steel?

Mr Speaker, as I said, do the

work that we're doing multilaterally

4:04:534:05:01

there are currently 28

recommendations outstanding which we

4:05:014:05:03

expect China to apply. The Prime

Minister raised it on her recent

4:05:034:05:11

visit to China, we continue the

conversation. We understand China's

4:05:114:05:18

E for production of aluminium and

steel for it in for the domestic

4:05:184:05:22

use, but if are going to have a

rules based system than the rules

4:05:224:05:25

need to be obeyed in Transparent,

and we need to know sufficient

4:05:254:05:30

information to be able to make that

determination as to WTO rules are

4:05:304:05:33

still being affected.

Is faced with

a trade war, what post Brexit trade

4:05:334:05:39

defence mechanisms will be employed

against the might of the US economy?

4:05:394:05:47

As I said, the whole aim of policy

at the present time in both the UK

4:05:474:05:51

and the European Union and beyond is

to try to temper these proposals to

4:05:514:05:56

get exemption so that we do not feel

any of the impetus that might lead

4:05:564:06:02

to an escalation of the current

position.

Thank you Mr Deputy

4:06:024:06:08

Speaker, as tariffs go, 25% is

particularly high and could lead to

4:06:084:06:14

all sorts of unforeseen

consequences. Is there any evidence

4:06:144:06:17

that there will be trade diversion

to the UK, because of the US

4:06:174:06:24

position at 25%?

Is quite difficult

to know in advance where there might

4:06:244:06:28

be diversion. I make the point that

our aim is not to deal with the

4:06:284:06:34

consequences, but to prevent the

imposition of the tariffs.

The

4:06:344:06:41

secretary of state jokes that

sometimes it's not very clear to

4:06:414:06:43

anybody else knew that the president

did what he was about to announce.

4:06:434:06:48

Sometimes it looks like the

president does not know what he's up

4:06:484:06:51

about to announce. And all too often

it's a tweet and set a policy. But

4:06:514:07:02

the false promise that it offers to

some of the poorest people in the

4:07:024:07:07

United States of America who in the

end will not benefit one was white

4:07:074:07:14

Mr Speaker, the honourable gentleman

makes an even better point than he

4:07:144:07:18

think he's made. The fact is in his

case possibly not. What we've seen

4:07:184:07:32

in recent years has been a rising

and worrying trend amongst Jeep 20

4:07:324:07:40

countries to impose protectionist

measures. In 2010, we saw around 300

4:07:404:07:46

nontariff barriers to trade being

operated by the G20.

The 2015 that

4:07:464:07:52

was around 1200. There has been a

gradual move away from the context

4:07:524:07:56

of global free trade and a

4:07:564:08:04

We should remember that those

countries that benefited from the

4:08:044:08:08

benefits of free trade should not be

pulling up the drawbridge behind

4:08:084:08:10

them and denying those benefits to

developing countries.

Is China doing

4:08:104:08:16

anything at all to help cut the

global supplies of steel?

That it's

4:08:164:08:23

a discussion that we have constantly

with China. They are taking measures

4:08:234:08:28

to reduce it but there are 28

recommendations outstanding. Time

4:08:284:08:32

will tell whether we are witnessing

the correct action direct -- or

4:08:324:08:37

merely the rhetoric.

Given what

President Trump said during his

4:08:374:08:43

election, none of us really should

be surprised at this. But when he

4:08:434:08:46

goes to Washington and if he doesn't

manage to change the mind of the

4:08:464:08:52

United States government, but they

do offer us as the United Kingdom an

4:08:524:08:56

exemption, would that exemption come

in from March 2019 or what it has to

4:08:564:09:01

be subject to this almost ridiculous

implementation period?

Any exemption

4:09:014:09:07

given by the United States is a US

law as intern by the US president,

4:09:074:09:15

it is far less European law.

"

Operation the time the United States

4:09:154:09:23

in the UK is a vitamin O peace --

FidoNet -- fun of these. We must

4:09:234:09:31

demonstrate this strongly to Daschle

security. How confident is my right

4:09:314:09:35

honourable friend that we can make a

strong case on those grounds?

Mr

4:09:354:09:40

state -- Mr Speaker. Yes, that we

have a strong national security

4:09:404:09:46

linkage not only through our

relationship with the kids -- with

4:09:464:09:52

the Security Council, but not only

as nuclear powers in the world, but

4:09:524:09:56

it is always just worth reminding

our US colleagues who were those

4:09:564:10:02

alongside them in Iraq and

Afghanistan and many of the other

4:10:024:10:05

conflicts of the United States has

been involved in. The United Kingdom

4:10:054:10:09

has never been wanting as a loyal

and steadfast partner and our

4:10:094:10:13

security and global security.

Seeking exemptions from the US steel

4:10:134:10:19

tariffs will not and in itself

protect the UK's steel industry from

4:10:194:10:27

dump divergent seal from the

American market. Will the Secretary

4:10:274:10:34

of State undertake to work with the

EU to ensure that whatever measures

4:10:344:10:38

are necessary to preserve the UK

steel industry are taking and work

4:10:384:10:45

with the WTO to get a more rational

and anti-dumping regime

4:10:454:10:49

internationally?

It is what we are

for in the WTO and is to make sure

4:10:494:10:57

that there is a rules based system

and that the rules are applied. And

4:10:574:11:02

when the rules are not applied,

there is a way to help those

4:11:024:11:07

countries affected. That is what we

regard as our duty.

Thank you Mr

4:11:074:11:14

Deputy Speaker. As he will note from

visiting Goodwins international in

4:11:144:11:17

my constituency and as it is a world

leader in steel products, this is

4:11:174:11:25

important not for our British

industry, but also supplying US

4:11:254:11:28

defence with equipment. How can we

ensure that this is recognised for

4:11:284:11:31

the US so that these vital British

products can continue to be exported

4:11:314:11:35

to the states?

Mr Deputy Speaker,

the US Department of defence has

4:11:354:11:42

made it quite clear that it

understands fully the contribution

4:11:424:11:46

that United Kingdom makes an airport

that the issue, they do not believe

4:11:464:11:50

that issue two -- 232 was

appropriate. I hope that the good

4:11:504:11:58

sense of the Department of defence

diffuses throughout Washington.

4:11:584:12:03

Thank you Mr Deputy Speaker. Very

kind of you. May I just come into

4:12:034:12:12

the Secretary of State the

experience of bombarding which in

4:12:124:12:18

recent months risked losing

thousands of jobs because of

4:12:184:12:22

unfairly imposed US tariffs of a

mere 300%? The winning formula into

4:12:224:12:29

defeating that was a combination of

trade unions, management, local MPs

4:12:294:12:39

and Ministers right across the

Government under the personal

4:12:394:12:43

intervention of the Prime Minister

and speaking to President Trump at

4:12:434:12:46

the Devils economic summit. --

daffodils. To protect the steel

4:12:464:12:55

industry in the United Kingdom.

Mr

Deputy Speaker, we have had as I

4:12:554:13:02

said earlier a wide range of

contacts in a wind range of areas.

4:13:024:13:07

May also say to the right honourable

lady that the ITC itself was

4:13:074:13:11

ultimately the vehicle that started

out the bombarding case so there are

4:13:114:13:17

in the United States, those elements

of an independent free trading

4:13:174:13:21

policy that we can rely on those

occasions when they are needed.

4:13:214:13:26

Because it was not just the politics

ultimately. Hard as we try for

4:13:264:13:32

bombarding a, it was American

mechanism itself which has a lot to

4:13:324:13:37

be commended for.

Thank you Mr

Deputy Speaker. Today steel and

4:13:374:13:43

aluminium, it could easily be

another industry which tour -- which

4:13:434:13:48

sell to the United States. On

Commonwealth Day, would the cemetery

4:13:484:13:53

estate and honourable friend assured

me that we are talked about allies

4:13:534:13:56

within the comment -- Commonwealth

that would defeat a policy that

4:13:564:14:00

would be as negative for the United

States to them as it would to us?

Mr

4:14:004:14:03

Deputy Speaker, I say answer that

they... The people who have the most

4:14:034:14:11

to lose if we move away from a

global concept of free trade are the

4:14:114:14:16

world's pours. If we genuinely want

people to trade their way up, they

4:14:164:14:22

can only do it in a genuinely free

trading environment. The more

4:14:224:14:25

nontariff barriers, the advanced

countries for, the less chance they

4:14:254:14:29

have of doing so. It is in

everybody's interested to pursue a

4:14:294:14:35

global free-trade policy and this

country has always shown the way on

4:14:354:14:38

that and this government will

continue to show the way.

Doctor

4:14:384:14:46

David jurors.

With regard to what

the secular stage just said, will he

4:14:464:14:52

do all he can to intercede with not

just the US, but also the EU to make

4:14:524:14:57

sure that agricultural products do

not become part of a wider trade

4:14:574:15:03

war? It is essential for the reasons

he said that less-developed

4:15:034:15:08

countries have continued access to

all those markets.

Mr Deputy

4:15:084:15:13

Speaker, we can end on a boat of --

know the perfect harmonization.

4:15:134:15:17

There is no doubt that the EU

currently has the benefit of

4:15:174:15:25

developing countries, the better. At

last we find a note of consensus.

4:15:254:15:31

Can I tell the House of the

financial guidance and claims bill

4:15:314:15:34

has been withdrawn so we will deal

with the next and then this would be

4:15:344:15:39

completed. And then that next it

will take much more. The Minister

4:15:394:15:45

for State and international element,

Alastair Burns.

Thank you, Mr Deputy

4:15:454:15:53

Speaker. With permission, I would

like to update the House on the

4:15:534:16:00

situation in Afrin. We are closely

follow developments in Afrin and

4:16:004:16:07

Northwest is here. Over the weekend,

forces continued their gains and are

4:16:074:16:13

now approaching the town of Afrin

itself. We are concerned about a

4:16:134:16:16

recent report of rising civilian

casualties. The Government has

4:16:164:16:21

called for de-escalation and the

protection of civilians. While

4:16:214:16:23

recognising Turkey's legitimate

interest in the security of its

4:16:234:16:28

borders. We will continue to push

for a reduction in violence and for

4:16:284:16:32

a consideration of the humanitarian

needs of the population and the

4:16:324:16:35

affected areas. The Prime Minister

has raised the need for production

4:16:354:16:38

of civilians and proper humanitarian

access with President air to one, as

4:16:384:16:43

has the four cemetery. -- Foreign

Secretary. They have assured us that

4:16:434:16:51

they are looking to prevent civilian

carrot -- casualties. They have been

4:16:514:16:55

dissed -- delivering health and

protection services in Afrin. Some

4:16:554:17:01

of these activities have been

suspended during -- due to the

4:17:014:17:03

current hot sodas. Our partners

continue to meet needs for their

4:17:034:17:06

able. This includes health supplies,

blankets and food. Unicef and other

4:17:064:17:16

UN organisations and the World

Health organisation have temporarily

4:17:164:17:18

suspended all activities in Afrin

you to the recent military action.

4:17:184:17:22

As a Foreign Secretary said in the

26th of February, we are concerned

4:17:224:17:28

about the humanitarian consequences

of the operation in Afrin. We urge

4:17:284:17:32

all parties to respect the law

distinction between civilian and

4:17:324:17:35

military targets facilitate access

for life-saving humanitarian aid,

4:17:354:17:39

and to allow freedom of movement for

those caught up in the violence in

4:17:394:17:43

accordance with international law.

As your conflict was soon enter its

4:17:434:17:48

eighth year. The UK continues to

make every effort to achieve our

4:17:484:17:52

goals and cereal. Defeating the

scourge of Daesh, achieving a

4:17:524:17:56

political said would that ends the

stuff they are -- suffering and

4:17:564:17:59

provides stability for all Syrians

and the wider region. There must be

4:17:594:18:02

a transition to a new inclusive

nonsectarian government that can

4:18:024:18:06

protect the rights of all Syrians,

unite the country and end the

4:18:064:18:09

conflict. We are pragmatic about how

this might take place. Serious

4:18:094:18:15

future must be for Syrians to

decide. As the second donor in 2011,

4:18:154:18:21

the UK is at the forefront of the

humanitarian response and is

4:18:214:18:25

providing life-saving support to

millions of people. Since 2012

4:18:254:18:29

across Syria and the region, UK

supporters delivered 26 million food

4:18:294:18:35

rations. 9.8 million Belize

packages, eight main vaccines and 10

4:18:354:18:39

million medical consultations.

Westerlund we provided clean water

4:18:394:18:43

to over 5 million people and could

you do towards the formal primary

4:18:434:18:46

and secondary education of over

700,000 children affected by the

4:18:464:18:50

crisis. However the only way to end

the conflict is there a negotiated

4:18:504:18:55

political settlement. My right

honourable friend the Foreign

4:18:554:18:58

Secretary has emphasised including

to his Turkish counterpart the

4:18:584:19:03

importance of biblical solution and

the defeat of Daesh. This must be at

4:19:034:19:06

the forefront of international

efforts. We are concerned about the

4:19:064:19:10

possibility of the divergent of

Kurdish fighters. We are committed

4:19:104:19:15

to working close with Turkey and

other allies devise solutions in

4:19:154:19:19

Syria that provides stability and

bring to an end this terrible

4:19:194:19:21

conflict. I commend the statement

the House.

I welcome the Minister's

4:19:214:19:29

statement. And I thank him for

advanced site. Madam Deputy Speaker,

4:19:294:19:32

here we are again, Aleppo, Mosul,

Raqqa, today were Afrin, perhaps in

4:19:324:19:40

some rows. Today we stand in this

House while some troops marched to

4:19:404:19:46

this city and region with little

regard for international law or

4:19:464:19:49

force civilian production. Putting

hundreds of thousands of people at

4:19:494:19:54

risk. Again and again we express in

this House our concern, our alarm,

4:19:544:20:00

our anchor. But it is never enough.

It is just not enough. Time and

4:20:004:20:07

again, those fighting in Syria are

consistently failing to take

4:20:074:20:10

precaution that protect civilians.

Madam Deputy Speaker, just seven

4:20:104:20:15

weeks ago, Turkey launched its

so-called operation olive branch to

4:20:154:20:20

remove what they saw as the Kurdish

threat from Afrin. The Minister also

4:20:204:20:25

says that the production of

civilians must be balanced with it,

4:20:254:20:31

and I quote, Turkey's legitimate

interests in the security of its

4:20:314:20:34

borders. We must be clear, the

incursion is neither legitimate nor

4:20:344:20:39

justified. It should never have been

allowed in the first place and it

4:20:394:20:42

has no basis in international law.

On all of branch, Madam Deputy

4:20:424:20:49

Speaker, that could hardly have been

a less suitable name for the

4:20:494:20:52

assault. Since then, even the most

conservative reports estimate that

4:20:524:20:58

several hundred Kurds have died.

Shamefully, the Turkish forces have

4:20:584:21:03

used artillery and other explosive

weapons to target civilian areas.

4:21:034:21:07

The Kurdish red Crescent report that

in the month after attacks after

4:21:074:21:16

attacks are stated, 93 civilians

were killed, 24 of them children.

4:21:164:21:21

313 civilians wounded, 51 of them

children. Unicef reported this

4:21:214:21:26

morning that over 1000 children have

not died across Syria in just the

4:21:264:21:32

first two months of 2018. Madam

Deputy Speaker, the use of artillery

4:21:324:21:38

and explosive weapons against

residential areas is clearly

4:21:384:21:43

prohibited by international

humanitarian law. It is unforgivable

4:21:434:21:46

that they are still being used.

Madam Deputy Speaker, this is not an

4:21:464:21:52

olive branch, this is a stick to

beat the Kurdish community. Madam

4:21:524:21:59

Deputy Speaker, the situation is

evolving rapidly. But me turn to

4:21:594:22:03

three particular concerns for the

days ahead. According to reports,

4:22:034:22:08

Turkish forces are right now

advancing on Afrin. So we must do

4:22:084:22:12

what we can to protect civilians.

First, there are real concerns that

4:22:124:22:17

when Turkish forces enter Afrin,

there will be widespread atrocities.

4:22:174:22:22

As they seek to root out those they

call terrorists. It is particularly

4:22:224:22:28

disturbing to hear reports that at

the centre of the assault working

4:22:284:22:31

alongside the Turkish army have been

some of the very same jihadists that

4:22:314:22:38

the Kurdish forces have worked so

hard to drive out of northern Syria.

4:22:384:22:43

And given the call by those in Afrin

for civilians to form a human shield

4:22:434:22:49

around the city, the prospects of a

siege and an assault on the city is

4:22:494:22:54

likely to cause severe civilian

casualties. What is the UK doing to

4:22:544:23:00

apply pressure on Turkey to stop the

assault and respect international

4:23:004:23:03

law?

4:23:034:23:15

We can never excuse and throw the

word terrorism around to justify

4:23:154:23:21

human rights abuses. Second, the

Washington Post has today reported

4:23:214:23:24

accounts that they are already

thousands of Kurds fleeing from the

4:23:244:23:30

city of afferent fearing for their

lives and what will happen if or

4:23:304:23:35

when the city. What reassurance can

the Minister provide the refugees

4:23:354:23:41

and displaced people will be granted

safe passage. And that the

4:23:414:23:47

international community, including

Britain, will step up to the plate

4:23:474:23:50

and provide immediate humanitarian

aid and long-term support. Third,

4:23:504:23:54

then return to the access of

humanitarian aid. For the human

4:23:544:23:59

rights monitors who can act as one

of the greatest deterrent against it

4:23:594:24:03

-- like civilian atrocities. What

steps is the Government taking to

4:24:034:24:08

urge Turkey to allow accurate does

not access, independent monitors to

4:24:084:24:14

ensure that civilians are protected

and that perpetrators of abuses are

4:24:144:24:17

held to account. And now that UK

funded partners and UN agencies are

4:24:174:24:25

suspending humanitarian activities,

what's this is the Government taking

4:24:254:24:30

to quickly restore full humanitarian

access to afferent so that the UK

4:24:304:24:34

and other partners can get Aiden and

save us. Madam Deputy Speaker --

4:24:344:24:41

speakers, the Kurt community is

watching. At many to ensure that UK

4:24:414:24:46

is doing everything it can to help

civilians and afferent.

Thank you

4:24:464:24:56

Madam Deputy Speaker, can I thank

the young lady for her questions and

4:24:564:25:00

for the way in which she has a post

this. She poses some questions that

4:25:004:25:07

will be difficult for any government

to respond to. I will do my best.

4:25:074:25:12

This is an area where the United

Kingdom is not present underground,

4:25:124:25:16

where it is difficult to get

information out, where you and aid

4:25:164:25:19

workers are not able operate, and

where there was a limitation to what

4:25:194:25:26

we can actually deliver. But there

will be no shortage of effort to

4:25:264:25:33

absently do every pitcher recommend

in terms of protecting civilians.

4:25:334:25:35

She is right to say that once again

this is another part of the overall

4:25:354:25:40

Syrian tragedy. Whatever may be the

particular circumstances, it all

4:25:404:25:47

traces back to the war waged by a

president on his own people which

4:25:474:25:51

will enter its eighth year. In just

a couple of days' time. The

4:25:514:25:55

Secretary General of the UN got

recorded on the 12th of March this

4:25:554:26:00

year said this, Syria is bleeding

inside and out, there should only be

4:26:004:26:06

one agenda for all of us, ending the

suffering of the Syrian people and

4:26:064:26:10

find a political solution to the

conflict. Let me just deal with some

4:26:104:26:17

of the points that she raised. In

particular the way in which this is

4:26:174:26:24

seen, she gives a picture of how she

recognises this and how the Kurdish

4:26:244:26:28

community sees it. We are not here

to answer for the Kurdish

4:26:284:26:34

authorities, plainly did take a

different position. The aim is to

4:26:344:26:42

oust the white PG from the territory

they see them as an extension the

4:26:424:26:47

site -- white PG. WPG. The most

important thing for us in a moment

4:26:474:27:01

as if we can bring that particular

part of the conflict to an end and

4:27:014:27:05

help people. The Foreign Secretary

and the Prime Minister have both

4:27:054:27:10

been in contact with the respective

partners, our ambassador made

4:27:104:27:15

representations to the Turkish

government just three days ago. I

4:27:154:27:18

can surely, honourable lady in the

House, everything we do is meant to

4:27:184:27:29

do to dissuade the parties... And

allow humanitarian access. Secondly

4:27:294:27:34

in relations due to what happens to

people who flee, we've worked with

4:27:344:27:40

partners to ensure that the supplies

are in the area. We can't get close,

4:27:404:27:44

but we are doing our best of the UN

agencies and others I have been

4:27:444:27:48

active in the area have supplies

available if people are able to

4:27:484:27:52

leave. And of course, we would wish

them to be so, as there is a

4:27:524:27:57

distinction between civilians and

those considered as fighters. We are

4:27:574:28:01

doing everything we can in relation

to them. Thirdly, of course, we

4:28:014:28:07

would wish to advocate. However, the

brutality and the grimness of the

4:28:074:28:16

war in that region means there was a

gap between anything we would seek

4:28:164:28:20

to find in our deliberations and

what may be happening underground. I

4:28:204:28:27

wish I could promise the honourable

lady that we won't be back here soon

4:28:274:28:31

but I'm afraid I can't. We are doing

everything we can to meet the

4:28:314:28:37

humanitarian needs, and the pain. If

you can mean the end with a

4:28:374:28:43

political resolution.

I think my

right honourable friend for his

4:28:434:28:51

statement. Of course what you said,

the Turkish government has assured

4:28:514:28:56

the Foreign Office that it is

working to prevent civilian

4:28:564:29:00

casualties which I think it is

diplomatic code that means, I don't

4:29:004:29:03

believe you, we don't believe you.

The wretched truth is here, our

4:29:034:29:11

Kurdish allies in the war against

the enemies -- my enemies of

4:29:114:29:15

civilization are brutally treated by

Nato ally. Is there anything else we

4:29:154:29:18

can do about it?

I'm grateful to my

right honourable friend. You care

4:29:184:29:28

has consistently raise the need to

protect civilians and the escalator

4:29:284:29:31

situation. We believe the Turkish

government and we will hold them to

4:29:314:29:41

the statement.

Thank you Madam

Deputy Speaker. And afferent it

4:29:414:29:51

represents a new front, a sudden

crisis. A seven-year long proxy war

4:29:514:29:56

that's killed an estimated half a

million people as we all know, Madam

4:29:564:30:00

Deputy Speaker, the laws of war

strictly per batch ) prohibit

4:30:004:30:06

attacking civilian structures,

civilian areas unless they're being

4:30:064:30:08

used for military purposes. Since

the conflict began, the local

4:30:084:30:14

Kurdish health authorities estimated

200, civilians and 600 have been

4:30:144:30:19

injured. The UN say that the

afferent district has a population

4:30:194:30:27

of 320,000, the majority of this are

classified as being in need. 100,000

4:30:274:30:32

are not internally displaced. I was

speaking to my constituents and

4:30:324:30:38

Syrian refugees he was close to

tears in explaining what happened to

4:30:384:30:44

his family. He said his Sally was

not safe, it was only possible to

4:30:444:30:48

contact them every few days. Having

spoken to his brother this morning,

4:30:484:30:52

he said were under siege and didn't

know what to do. No water, no

4:30:524:30:56

electricity not enough food. In his

village near afferent, every one is

4:30:564:31:02

sheltered from bonds. Best

everything was settled shattered by

4:31:024:31:06

bombs. These are civilians, and to

have no place to go. Does the

4:31:064:31:18

Government and the pressure on

Turkey, and ensure respect for

4:31:184:31:22

international and UN law. What

progress has the Government made to

4:31:224:31:27

bring about a political resolution

in accordance resolution 2254. And

4:31:274:31:32

finally, on the 20th of February the

president of Turkey said, and he I

4:31:324:31:40

quote, cut external aid. What is the

UK Government doing doing to ensure

4:31:404:31:45

to increase it and to make sure that

it gets there?

I am grateful to the

4:31:454:31:51

honourable gentleman. He started

with a brief description of the

4:31:514:31:58

horrors of this particular conflict

and in that he is absolutely right.

4:31:584:32:01

The great horror is that we have

seen in recent times the shredding

4:32:014:32:05

of the international law on which we

have tried to work for the best part

4:32:054:32:10

of 70 years since 1945. The UN

Security Council, if the UN Security

4:32:104:32:17

Council can't bring it to an end, if

we have moved away from the norms in

4:32:174:32:20

the use of chemical weapons, that is

also if we've seen the tactics of

4:32:204:32:29

siege and hunger come back into

modern warfare, then we risk losing

4:32:294:32:36

everything in a way that national

community has put together after the

4:32:364:32:46

horrors of World War II,... It has

echoes of that. And unless we find

4:32:464:32:55

ways to restore this national --

international order, will be

4:32:554:32:58

debating this longer any will raise

the possibility, as to what states

4:32:584:33:04

are doing, and not going back to the

old ways of dealing with complex,

4:33:044:33:10

mice pick has to be bit -- my bigger

than yours of resolving conflict. To

4:33:104:33:14

answer those three questions we will

continue to talk to our Nato

4:33:144:33:21

partners about the need for security

and how this operation may be

4:33:214:33:26

assisting them, what distinctions

they are drawn between humanitarian

4:33:264:33:29

casualties and the need to protect

civilians and those who are seeking

4:33:294:33:33

to protect their own postulation --

population. We are doing everything

4:33:334:33:37

we can to support them. In response

to the second question, intercept

4:33:374:33:44

diplomatic question, we have seen it

means that the Geneva process is the

4:33:444:33:53

best bet for political resolution.

In terms of aid, 2.46 billion, that

4:33:534:33:59

this is been the largest support the

United Kingdom has ever given to a

4:33:594:34:03

conflict situation to protect

refugees. There will be no shortage

4:34:034:34:10

refugees -- no shortage of help for

refugees, those who need help. But

4:34:104:34:14

the best course is two end the

conflict.

Right honourable friend

4:34:144:34:22

was being pragmatic about how to

resolve the conflict. What are the

4:34:224:34:27

milestones that he is looking to

achieve along the journey?

I thank

4:34:274:34:31

my honourable friend. Several have

come about recently. The Syrian

4:34:314:34:40

negotiation committee reformed after

meetings not represent the Syrian

4:34:404:34:46

opposition and has Kurdish

representatives on it in order to

4:34:464:34:49

present a united front at the Geneva

talks. The failure of the secondary

4:34:494:34:55

process, as I said earlier, means

that there can be more concentration

4:34:554:35:00

on Geneva. I understand that special

envoy is working on a series of

4:35:004:35:07

boxes that people can talk about,

and gradually come back together.

4:35:074:35:12

Most importantly, we continue

through you when African resolutions

4:35:124:35:15

to demand humanitarian access into a

conflict in conflict areas, not to

4:35:154:35:23

move attention away from the area,

and the damage that is being done

4:35:234:35:29

there, in horrific humanitarian

circumstances. We are calling on all

4:35:294:35:32

parties do heavy-handed that to

desist from that. And also recognise

4:35:324:35:36

that the siege of Daesh has not been

distinguished. If...

Isn't this the

4:35:364:35:51

case that the gentleman is using...

To engage in a barbarous slaughter

4:35:514:36:04

of men, women and children. Should

the British Government be absolutely

4:36:044:36:11

clear that he must absolutely and

the offensive. And second has the

4:36:114:36:15

time not come to stop selling arms

to this man who is behaving like a

4:36:154:36:19

despot?

Mr would have been

consistent in our thoughts to

4:36:194:36:27

de-escalate. With our Turkish and

Nato partners. But within

4:36:274:36:38

recognising the territorial

concerns, we indeed call to an end

4:36:384:36:42

-- for an end of the operations.

This appalling and big kids -- on

4:36:424:36:52

vindictive vendetta on our strongest

allies on the ground in the battle

4:36:524:36:56

against Daesh. Is there absolutely

no chance of the UN, brokered

4:36:564:37:03

cease-fire so that perhaps if that

was to happen, we could put

4:37:034:37:07

peacekeeping in to protect civilian

people?

4:37:074:37:18

While there is no effect already.

4:37:184:37:29

Urge before

4:37:574:37:57

my Kurdish constituents are deeply

distressed about what is happening

4:38:024:38:07

to civilians and Afrin.

Hundreds of

people are being killed there and

4:38:074:38:13

hundreds of thousands are being

injured or are fleeing or being

4:38:134:38:20

displaced. What help can the

Minister give to those people who

4:38:204:38:22

are suffering so badly?

The right

honourable Lady will be aware as we

4:38:224:38:30

all are about the recent press

reports, Sky News coverage over the

4:38:304:38:35

weekend. What I can do for the

honourable lady is give her the

4:38:354:38:38

absolute assurance that the UK

Government that there is repeated

4:38:384:38:43

representations and is seeking to

have the conflict escalated as being

4:38:434:38:45

clear. So that this part of the

conflict can come to an end as

4:38:454:38:53

swiftly as possible.

It looks to me

that we have misread this Syrian

4:38:534:38:59

civil war from start to finish. The

facts on the grounds are the Asad is

4:38:594:39:05

winning the war. He will take the

eastern part of the city and he is

4:39:054:39:09

now allied with our allies, the

Kurds in resisting a naked invasion

4:39:094:39:13

from Turkey which can evolve to the

slaughter of thousands of innocent

4:39:134:39:17

civilians. Of the Turks have been

very generous in providing safe

4:39:174:39:22

refuge for millions of Syrian

refugees in Turkey itself, surely we

4:39:224:39:26

should call out this invasion for

what is and at this crucial moment,

4:39:264:39:32

Stan by the Kurds without whom we

would not have been able to defeat

4:39:324:39:36

Isis.

Mr Speaker, my honourable

friend is correct in recognising

4:39:364:39:45

extraordinary contribution of the

Kurdish people across the region

4:39:454:39:47

through Serie A and the pushing back

Isis. However, the complexities of

4:39:474:39:55

the politics in the area and parts

of the country, Iraq and Turkey and

4:39:554:39:59

what is led to the present

situation, the history of the

4:39:594:40:04

conflict of Serie A which I have a

certain amount of knowledge from

4:40:044:40:08

2010 onwards. All I can do is assure

my honourable friend that we will do

4:40:084:40:21

all we can as I said to seek the

de-escalate this conflict, protect

4:40:214:40:25

Kurdish civilians and see a

resolution to the present issue.

4:40:254:40:33

Thank you. Last year the Foreign

Affairs Committee went to Turkey in

4:40:334:40:37

January. We had meetings with the

president and his senior Ministers.

4:40:374:40:42

It was made very clear to us at that

time that Turkey intended at some

4:40:424:40:48

point to relocate hundreds of

thousands of the 3 million serious

4:40:484:40:53

Arab refugees who were in Turkey

into the areas on their border in

4:40:534:40:59

the north and prevent the Kurds

having a contiguous area under their

4:40:594:41:05

control. Why did the international

community not tomorrow to stop? And

4:41:054:41:15

is the Minister really serious when

he thinks that there will be a

4:41:154:41:18

political solution and defeat for

Isis as long as Turkey sees its

4:41:184:41:23

priority as stopping the Kurds

rather than getting a political

4:41:234:41:27

solution.

I'm not sure I really know

the answer to the honourable

4:41:274:41:36

gentleman's very good question.

Based on his knowledge of the area

4:41:364:41:41

which I certainly recognise. As I

said, the different aspects of this

4:41:414:41:48

conflict and the different reasons

why some states are taking action go

4:41:484:41:56

back many years and are intended to

sort out many difficulties in many

4:41:564:42:01

issues which are being brought to

light by the conflict against Isis

4:42:014:42:06

and the break-up of Syria. It's not

possible for the UK I don't think to

4:42:064:42:12

say to other states what the and

lines drawn on the map will be.

4:42:124:42:20

Countries have their concerns about

terrorist activity and Turkey has

4:42:204:42:22

been clear about that relation to

the PKK, a proscribed organisation

4:42:224:42:28

both there and here and that we

respect and a Nato ally. I've said

4:42:284:42:31

relation to what's happening

recently, we have been clear on our

4:42:314:42:36

determination that there should be a

de-escalation at that. We do call

4:42:364:42:39

for a resumption of the negotiations

with Tommy ended in 2015 between

4:42:394:42:42

Turkey and the PKK. Maybe perhaps it

is not quite as helpless as

4:42:424:42:49

sometimes we feel when we look at

the map.

Thank you Madam Deputy

4:42:494:42:54

Speaker. Most I welcome the tone and

content of the Minister's statement

4:42:544:43:00

it is depressing to be back in the

House to talk about more horrors and

4:43:004:43:03

a country that is seen more than its

fair share over the last seven

4:43:034:43:06

years. Would he reassure me about

what efforts the UK will take to

4:43:064:43:12

protect civilians if there is a

Turkish siege of Afrin?

I'm grateful

4:43:124:43:20

to my honourable friend. It

consistently raised the need to

4:43:204:43:23

protect civilians and to de-escalate

the operation. We want to see this

4:43:234:43:29

safe and sustained delivery of

humanitarian aid and services which

4:43:294:43:32

are urgently needed across the

region and indeed, in Syria as a

4:43:324:43:35

whole. We will continue to press for

that. He can only be assured that

4:43:354:43:43

although we cannot predict the

outcome we can be absolutely certain

4:43:434:43:45

of the efforts we will make to try

and de-escalate the situation and

4:43:454:43:49

have a humanitarian situation which

protect civilians.

Madam Deputy

4:43:494:44:00

Speaker, I have several hundred

constituents in Edinburgh East who

4:44:004:44:03

hail from this part of the world.

Many of whom tonight are fearful for

4:44:034:44:07

their loved ones in the city of

Afrin. I have to tell the Minister

4:44:074:44:10

that they expressed to me and

increasing sense of the trail. That

4:44:104:44:17

this government and its allies are

happy to praise the sacrifice of the

4:44:174:44:22

Curtis people and the fight against

international terrorism and yet when

4:44:224:44:25

it comes to upholding their

political rights, they are met with

4:44:254:44:28

silence. Is it not the truth at the

time has come to stop the pretence

4:44:284:44:32

that what is happening with that

Turkish siege of Afrin has anything

4:44:324:44:38

to do with protecting the Turkish

territorial sovereignty and to admit

4:44:384:44:43

that it is all about degrading

aspirations of the Kurds and any

4:44:434:44:47

future political settlement which

will one day followed the end of

4:44:474:44:51

this conflict.

The honourable

gentleman puts his own case and I

4:44:514:45:00

recognise that. It's not the view in

the United Kingdom government. We

4:45:004:45:05

recognise that terrorist concerns of

Turkey but equally we have been

4:45:054:45:10

clear about the impact of the

conflict and humanitarian basis and

4:45:104:45:15

on the opportunity to find a

political resolution. That solution

4:45:154:45:23

will knock him about the conflict,

it will come about through political

4:45:234:45:25

dialogue which is made more

difficult by the circumstances.

4:45:254:45:29

That's why the United Kingdom

continues to urge de-escalation,

4:45:294:45:33

humanitarian access and release for

the families of his constituents but

4:45:334:45:38

he speaks about.

Whilst the Turkish

government have assured the Foreign

4:45:384:45:45

and Commonwealth Office that it is

working to prevent civilian

4:45:454:45:48

casualties, report showed they are

increasing. Can the Minister confirm

4:45:484:45:52

how the UK can ensure that civilians

are protected from a Turkish sees of

4:45:524:45:57

Afrin city?

I'm grateful. The honest

answer is I cannot ensure it. The

4:45:574:46:05

United Kingdom government cannot

ensure this. Be to suggest something

4:46:054:46:09

we don't possess. It seems

inappropriate for me to do so. All I

4:46:094:46:15

can say is, along with others and

international community, we will

4:46:154:46:18

continue to make the representations

we can. We move for situation of

4:46:184:46:22

cease-fire in Syria in general.

Given resolution 2401 we worry that

4:46:224:46:30

these norms are not like here too.

-- the UN resolution. In the

4:46:304:46:36

immensely complex situation of

northern Syria, it's Turkish border,

4:46:364:46:40

what is been experienced and Turkey

over the years and the long-standing

4:46:404:46:43

conflict, there is none of this at

the United Kingdom can give an

4:46:434:46:47

assurance about. All we can say is

we are very clear that humanitarian

4:46:474:46:52

considerations must come first. You

must be humanitarian access. The

4:46:524:46:55

best way to deal with any of the

complexes political de-escalation

4:46:554:47:02

not that escalation of conflict

which will only lead to the

4:47:024:47:05

resurgence of the conflict as soon

as this is over.

The Minister is

4:47:054:47:10

right to urge restraint from Turkey,

I know the partners in the country.

4:47:104:47:16

-- region. And I asked what the

Government's assessment or the fair

4:47:164:47:22

affairs committee conclusion of the

link between the PKK and a wide PG

4:47:224:47:28

with essential to understanding what

is driving Turkey. Does he share my

4:47:284:47:38

fears that there may be a long

period where the protection of

4:47:384:47:42

civilians is under threat while we

tried to get a political settlement

4:47:424:47:47

and decent governance across areas

which are war-torn present.

Once

4:47:474:47:57

again the honourable gentleman

speaks about great knowledge of the

4:47:574:48:03

area. As I said in evidence, the

United Kingdom recognises some

4:48:034:48:11

similarities in terms of ideology

between PKK and why PG. Not the

4:48:114:48:15

direct link that is claimed by

Turkey which is why we prescribe PKK

4:48:154:48:21

not the other group. We are aware of

the issues of similarity. We don't

4:48:214:48:32

see the link in the same way. The

second point regarding the long-term

4:48:324:48:38

nature of this is of course entirely

real. The longer the conflict as a

4:48:384:48:42

whole goes on, more there will be

the opportunity for issues of

4:48:424:48:47

long-standing to be settled with the

disruption that's currently taking

4:48:474:48:53

place in Syria. That is why the best

opportunity for peace and security

4:48:534:48:58

all around is to support the Geneva

process as we are in work as hard as

4:48:584:49:02

we are diplomatically to get the

parties to find a better answer to

4:49:024:49:05

the conflict occurs as the region

aptly shows, the only certainty in

4:49:054:49:09

the region... Sooner or later that

group will take up arms against the

4:49:094:49:15

other.

Thank you. I would like to

thank the Minister for his statement

4:49:154:49:22

and the eloquence of his answers. It

reflects the view of Sony people in

4:49:224:49:30

the House with sympathy for the

Kurds have been fighting Isis for

4:49:304:49:37

years frankly often on our behalf

and a sense of helplessness we all

4:49:374:49:40

feel I what is happening at Afrin.

My question is, on the basis of the

4:49:404:49:47

considerable investment and money

that the United Kingdom has put in

4:49:474:49:53

in humanitarian aid, are there any

specific additional elements of the

4:49:534:50:00

humanitarian aid that the Minister

feels that the Government could

4:50:004:50:04

perhaps do to help the people

suffering in Afrin?

Mr Speaker I'm

4:50:044:50:10

grateful to the honourable

gentleman. At the moment, the honest

4:50:104:50:15

answer is I can't see anything that

we could currently add valid make a

4:50:154:50:19

significant difference beyond what

we are already seeking to do. I been

4:50:194:50:23

quite clear that we need to get

preparations made to ensure that

4:50:234:50:27

when civilians leave the area that

supplies are there. We are

4:50:274:50:38

consistent in supporting one in 401

to seek access and de-escalation of

4:50:384:50:47

conflict to allow opportunities to

be created both the dialogue and to

4:50:474:50:51

protect the people. If there is

anything new that we could think of

4:50:514:50:54

to add to it, we would. Meanwhile we

are working with all the partners we

4:50:544:50:59

can to see the de-escalate and get

the humanitarian access that is

4:50:594:51:01

crucial.

We should all be appalled

by the scenes affecting civilians in

4:51:014:51:08

Afrin. Our ability to influence the

operational military tactics of Isis

4:51:084:51:15

or Asad or Russia and the situations

is limited. Turkey is a member of

4:51:154:51:21

Nato. I wondered if he could save

whether there's been direct contact

4:51:214:51:24

between his Defence Secretary and

his counterpart in Turkey and

4:51:244:51:30

officer level contact about the

conduct and the tactics and the

4:51:304:51:35

importance of Turkey adhering to

international humanitarian law.

An

4:51:354:51:38

answer to that question is, I can't

speak for Defence Secretary. I can't

4:51:384:51:47

say there has been contact between

the military. Not to the extent he

4:51:474:51:49

is saying because it was almost a

question about tactics and

4:51:494:51:53

everything and that when a bee in

any way appropriate. Defensive

4:51:534:52:00

coaches, ambassadors approaches,

prime Ministers approaches, Foreign

4:52:004:52:04

secretaries approaches have been

consistent about the de-escalation

4:52:044:52:05

of the conflict. That is the

approach. As a Nato partner, other

4:52:054:52:11

partners are involved as well. The

United States has a significant

4:52:114:52:15

interest in the area and also in

this conflict coming to an end as

4:52:154:52:18

soon as possible.

As has already

been mentioned, the Kurds have been

4:52:184:52:25

key allies in our fight against

Isis. For the interest of clarity,

4:52:254:52:29

does the Government consider

Turkey's continued attacks on Afrin

4:52:294:52:32

as contravening UN Security Council

resolution 2401? If so, with the

4:52:324:52:39

Minister agree that is not only the

right thing to do to condemn them

4:52:394:52:43

also crucial if we are to restore

faith in the international order and

4:52:434:52:46

any hopes of bringing about a

political resolution.

4:52:464:52:53

Assad the honourable gentleman

princes question there well. If 2401

4:52:534:52:57

means what it says. It means

cease-fire for the whole of Syria.

4:52:574:53:01

The United Kingdom is part of that

expense by. As I said earlier, what

4:53:014:53:05

happens of resolutions now if there

was not sufficient will underground,

4:53:054:53:08

that we don't get what we need to

be. Indeed, the whole international

4:53:084:53:13

order is effective. That is a reason

why we are so consistent in talking

4:53:134:53:17

to our Turkish partner about the

de-escalation, the need for the

4:53:174:53:25

escalation, the need for

humanitarian access and to urge all

4:53:254:53:27

parties in the area defined way

beyond the concert.

Last weekend, a

4:53:274:53:34

Kurdish constituent dissolved in

tears at a meeting about something

4:53:344:53:36

else. They're worried about their

family. I am wondering what we can

4:53:364:53:40

do in terms of taking evidence so

that in future, war crimes can be

4:53:404:53:47

prosecuted on an international Court

of justice.

The honourable lady goes

4:53:474:53:53

further than I can go in relation to

this particular issue. Any war crime

4:53:534:53:59

allegations has to be reported to

the authorities. The United Kingdom

4:53:594:54:04

has worked extremely hard to put...

Provide those in Syria to gather

4:54:044:54:10

evidence of crimes wherever they may

be. Then again, one can understand

4:54:104:54:15

her constituents, but throughout

that area there are families in

4:54:154:54:20

tears. At each border atrocities

committed. That is a tragedy for the

4:54:204:54:25

united kingdom is worse for others

to bring an end to an end. It's only

4:54:254:54:33

bite digging into this in the manner

suggested by the UN, as individual

4:54:334:54:39

aspect of justice and accountability

are absolutely important. We...

4:54:394:54:53

The Minister will be aware that has

occurred is a Kurdish community in

4:54:554:54:57

my constituency is well. We have

discussed this in the recent past.

4:54:574:55:04

The Kurdish community in Glasgow has

a mixture of sadness and anger. To

4:55:044:55:09

ask given to the city of Afron is

under siege without water and food,

4:55:094:55:14

we have a motion for both sides of

house to condemn, displacement,...

4:55:144:55:21

And whole region.

What I can do

Madam Deputy Speaker is make

4:55:214:55:27

reference to what I said earlier.

The tactics of siege, ignoring

4:55:274:55:31

humanitarian norms, international

long conflict all communities in the

4:55:314:55:40

region will suffer longer it goes

on. We are calling for it

4:55:404:55:45

de-escalation. And the only thing

that ultimately will end the

4:55:454:55:53

conflict throughout the region.

Madam Deputy Speaker, the Minister

4:55:534:55:58

has said that the Government intends

to hold the Turkish government to

4:55:584:56:03

account for the representation is

given civilian customs. What

4:56:034:56:10

specific steps will the Government

do. Will they press for independent

4:56:104:56:17

monitoring -- I'm monitoring of

international law?

In terms of

4:56:174:56:22

holding people accountable, we

withhold any party that is guilty of

4:56:224:56:30

any crimes in the conflict as my

conflict in the same way that all

4:56:304:56:35

international structures monitoring

on the ground is extremely

4:56:354:56:38

difficult. We must be entirely

tactical about this. The holding it

4:56:384:56:43

to is the same holding into account

of any party in the conflict. We

4:56:434:56:48

have been very clear, as I said, we

understand the origins of this and

4:56:484:56:54

why Turkey has a concerns that it

does. But equally, we recognise the

4:56:544:57:01

risk of this conflict are diverting

attention from the regime, from

4:57:014:57:05

Isis, there is evidence that this

conflict in Afron has grown and

4:57:054:57:11

others elsewhere have taken the

opportunity do in order to start

4:57:114:57:15

their own operations again which is

just further misery for the people

4:57:154:57:18

of Syria. Again I go back to the

Secretary General and his determined

4:57:184:57:22

-- determination to try to find an

overall settlement over this.

4:57:224:57:26

Ultimately that is the only thing

that will end the conflict between

4:57:264:57:31

the parties and the pain that is

being suffered tonight in areas of

4:57:314:57:33

the region.

Does the Minister agree

that the Turkish assault on Afron

4:57:334:57:42

was entirely to him testify and has

no basis in international law and if

4:57:424:57:47

he does, what specific steps will be

taken by the Government ensure that

4:57:474:57:52

Turkey is held accountable for war

crimes being perpetrated in Afron.

4:57:524:57:57

At the beginning of my segment I set

out what the United Kingdom thought

4:57:574:58:04

of that.

I seek your advice one year

ago, today, exactly on the 12th of

4:58:044:58:25

March 2017, the foreign affairs

select committee published a report,

4:58:254:58:32

Article 50 negotiations,

implications of no deal. We also

4:58:324:58:37

published several other reports in

March of last year. Responses to

4:58:374:58:44

those reports on Turkey, on Russia,

in our second report on political

4:58:444:58:52

Islam were received by the former

does write for an Commonwealth

4:58:524:58:58

office on the 20th of July and were

published as soon as the committee

4:58:584:59:02

was re-established in September. We

have received no response to the

4:59:024:59:09

report that was published in March

on implications of no deal. We raise

4:59:094:59:15

the matter, I raise the matter with

the Foreign Secretary when he came

4:59:154:59:20

before our committee in November on

the 1st of November. And reminded

4:59:204:59:25

him that the committee had not yet

received the customary response to

4:59:254:59:29

within two months. He said, I think

you are asking the wrong department.

4:59:294:59:35

I think it is someone else who is

drafting the response to your

4:59:354:59:44

excellent report. I am asking if you

have seen thus like I asked him if

4:59:444:59:48

he had seen in a draft that you said

not that I'm aware of. And he said I

4:59:484:59:52

promise to take it up guys like to

get up and I set it is eight months,

4:59:524:59:59

he said thank you we will make sure

to take it up. To date, despite

4:59:595:00:05

expecting a response, the Foreign

Affairs Committee has not received a

5:00:055:00:10

response from the Department for

exiting the EU, or the Commonwealth

5:00:105:00:16

office, one year after the reports.

Madam Deputy Speaker, can you

5:00:165:00:19

suggest to me any course of action

that can be taken. I'm speaking here

5:00:195:00:27

on behalf of the committee. What can

we do to get the basic courtesy of a

5:00:275:00:34

response from this government on a

matter of topical interest, vital

5:00:345:00:39

interest to our country and to our

Parliament. How can we get the

5:00:395:00:45

Government to respond as they are

supposed to do a committee report?

I

5:00:455:00:53

thank the honourable member for

giving me notice that he intended to

5:00:535:00:57

raise this issue on behalf of of the

Foreign Affairs Committee. It

5:00:575:01:03

certainly, it is certainly very

unsatisfactory that the Government

5:01:035:01:06

hasn't replied to a report of the

41st committee, if indeed he was

5:01:065:01:12

published a year ago. It is

understandable, that sometimes there

5:01:125:01:19

will be a bit of the deep bass by

delay, during an election period. It

5:01:195:01:23

should normally be two guns. But

clearly, I delay every year is

5:01:235:01:30

something quite different. I do hope

in response to, I do hope that this

5:01:305:01:38

is being noted on the Treasury bench

and the departments involved, could

5:01:385:01:43

now get together resolve what is

going to be done about it so that a

5:01:435:01:50

committee can have a response as

soon as possible. Thank you. Point

5:01:505:01:55

of order.

Thank you Madam Deputy

Speaker, I seek your advice. Roof

5:01:555:02:04

railing around the international

Trade Secretary referred to both my

5:02:045:02:11

colleagues as being completely

opposed... That is categorically

5:02:115:02:21

incorrect. She will not as well as I

do, fighting against a poorly

5:02:215:02:25

developed policies is there a

definitive voting against the

5:02:255:02:28

concept in its entirety. The

honourable gentleman is it Doctor

5:02:285:02:37

but he has not done his work --

homework on this occasion. We had

5:02:375:02:44

tabled a number of amendments to

improve, ... None of which were

5:02:445:02:50

taken on board or accepted by the

Government. What can I do to ensure

5:02:505:02:56

the honourable gentleman and sets

the record straight?

The honourable

5:02:565:03:04

lady has made her point very clearly

about what she felt in terms of the

5:03:045:03:09

remarks made. The Bill will be

coming back to the House and so I

5:03:095:03:16

will suggest, and I'm sure she will,

continue to put over her view as I

5:03:165:03:21

am sure the local front bench will

as well when it comes back. So if

5:03:215:03:27

there are no quest -- no further

point of order, the court will now

5:03:275:03:34

proceed to read the orders of the

day.

Financial... And plays

5:03:345:03:40

billboard. To be considered. Not

moved. Built to be considered what

5:03:405:03:48

they?

Tomorrow. We now come to

motion number two relating to the

5:03:485:03:56

petitions committee, Bill Wiggin.

The question is is on the order

5:03:565:04:02

paper, essay I doesn't iMac... Thank

you very much. I wish to present I

5:04:025:04:17

was present a petition to improve

access at the...

Station. It is a

5:04:175:04:29

key station in Manchester, Sheffield

lined used by thousands of commuters

5:04:295:04:33

but also needed by elderly and

disabled people for access the

5:04:335:04:37

hospital. The centres for disabled

children and adults, it is

5:04:375:04:46

considerably needed. The platform

can only be accessed where injuries

5:04:465:04:52

regularly occur. The House of

Commons urges the Department for

5:04:525:04:56

Transport to make improvements to

Jimmy station so that a public can

5:04:565:05:00

have level access to railway at

Julie. -- Mike

5:05:005:05:15

Julie petition, accessibility at

Chin Lee station does not the

5:05:215:05:38

question is this House do now

adjourn. I am very grateful this

5:05:385:05:45

evening with the opportunity to

highlight this up issue. I will

5:05:455:05:54

start, if you are one of those

families who are just managing. I

5:05:545:05:59

want to address a directive of a

minor working around-the-clock, I

5:05:595:06:02

know you're doing your best and I

know that sometimes life can be a

5:06:025:06:05

struggle. Ministers are probably fed

up with empties quoting those words,

5:06:055:06:10

spoken by the Prime Minister just 20

months ago on the steps of Downing

5:06:105:06:14

Street. And to keep mentioning them

in many different contexts as we see

5:06:145:06:18

our community software, as the

promise that followed fails to meet

5:06:185:06:24

the needs. Here some of the most

venerable people in our community

5:06:245:06:28

believe as a race bike care price,

Madam Deputy Speaker, no one works

5:06:285:06:35

harder around the clock, doing the

best, struggling to cope and care

5:06:355:06:40

than the parents and siblings of

vulnerable adults. Vulnerable

5:06:405:06:44

adults, some of the have the most

complex needs imaginable. Those

5:06:445:06:49

vulnerable adults have some of the

most extreme personal needs, can be

5:06:495:06:54

in their 30s, 40s, or even the 50s.

Parents caring for them, are in

5:06:545:07:02

their 50s, 60s, 70s, we as a

society, all those parents and

5:07:025:07:08

carers, we are them is huge debt of

gratitude. Teachers do care for

5:07:085:07:11

their loved ones at home, they don't

hand them over to the state, but

5:07:115:07:17

they go on with the job. They injure

the sleepless nights, the clean-up

5:07:175:07:21

after the family members come and

give them the love and dedication

5:07:215:07:24

than he. To be honest, they don't

ask for much in return. Hugh Madam

5:07:245:07:33

Deputy Speaker, we often let them

down. By failing to provide them

5:07:335:07:37

with the subordinate. It appears to

many to be getting worse instead of

5:07:375:07:43

better. I know this issue isn't

exclusive to my constituency. But I

5:07:435:07:50

want to speak... All those families

who rely on the residential despite

5:07:505:08:01

care. Give them a break from caring,

a break from themselves. I

5:08:015:08:19

Does the honourable member or not

agree that rest take care must be...

5:08:195:08:25

In Northern Ireland, with honourable

gentleman is saying has happened to

5:08:325:08:34

us as well.

I think the Member for

his intervention. I agree with them.

5:08:345:08:40

The longer people state supported at

home, the longer they have a greater

5:08:405:08:46

financial burden on the state. Such

is the crisis in health and social

5:08:465:08:54

care in our country that our NHS

commissioners face difficult choices

5:08:545:08:59

and families are really worried that

they could be facing a substantial

5:08:595:09:02

cut in the provision offered to them

as the local tries to stretch

5:09:025:09:07

limited resources they have the

meeting increase of demand for

5:09:075:09:10

support. The clinical commissioning

group and the South cc CG are

5:09:105:09:18

reorganizing the way they provide

residential rest by care. When I met

5:09:185:09:24

with the Executive on Friday, she

told me at the need to have deep

5:09:245:09:28

space services and the plan to

review exactly what each individual

5:09:285:09:30

needs. I know and so does the

Minister that we do have to have

5:09:305:09:36

equity in the system and meet the

needs of each individual. I don't

5:09:365:09:40

have a problem with that. Sadly, the

review has been interpreted by the

5:09:405:09:44

families as a cut and provision.

Some believe they could lose up to

5:09:445:09:48

half their rest by knights and they

are anxious about that. I definitely

5:09:485:09:51

agree that provisions should be

right to meet the needs of the

5:09:515:09:55

individual but this issue is much

greater than that. It's also about

5:09:555:09:58

the needs of the whole family.

Before this ECG decided under

5:09:585:10:05

review, perhaps they should've done

and needs assessment first. In fact,

5:10:055:10:08

I've always thought that the rest by

care was very much for the family,

5:10:085:10:15

in opportunity to take a break from

their caring responsibilities, to

5:10:155:10:19

recharge the batteries and prepared

to resume what they see as their

5:10:195:10:22

duties. This ECG have been at pains

to stress to me that their proposals

5:10:225:10:29

don't necessarily mean that there

would be a huge resolution and the

5:10:295:10:33

number of rest by nights but

recognise that things will change

5:10:335:10:35

for some people and their working

with families and piloting ideas to

5:10:355:10:39

improve provision. Lust I think they

could've handled this whole business

5:10:395:10:49

better, the issues from the

perspective of the families and the

5:10:495:10:52

various local authority and joint

health screening groups who oppose

5:10:525:10:55

the plans, I can say is their fault.

I will give way.

Thank you for

5:10:555:11:01

giving way. On the point of rest

bites where you're moving onto. In

5:11:015:11:07

my constituency of Peterborough,

their closing a home where they

5:11:075:11:12

provide back care for very disabled

and unwell children and I very much

5:11:125:11:16

agree with you that it should be

about the whole child including the

5:11:165:11:21

family and the rest bites it gets to

the family to have that provision.

5:11:215:11:25

In my constituency they are

cancelling that provision altogether

5:11:255:11:28

and I think the impact of that needs

to be assessed. Would you agree?

5:11:285:11:34

Certainly I would. Not being just a

Teesside issue but an issue across

5:11:345:11:39

the country. I think it's a

tremendous challenge the Government

5:11:395:11:43

to plan for the future. I know the

team dealing with wider provision

5:11:435:11:51

are dedicated to their jobs and that

they too have been distressed as we

5:11:515:11:56

have gone through this process and I

for one appreciate the strains of

5:11:565:11:59

dealing with these sensitive issues.

They are trying to do their best

5:11:595:12:03

within what they say are that...

Personally I could've hoped they

5:12:035:12:09

would kick the Government a bit for

failing to provide the resources

5:12:095:12:13

needed. Currently it is provided

into NHS centres of excellence. What

5:12:135:12:18

are they planning to do now? The

best of the options available is

5:12:185:12:23

this perceived reduction in

residential care provided by the

5:12:235:12:27

expert... And then the provision of

alternative choices largely without

5:12:275:12:34

nurses. These includes beds and care

homes, hotel rooms, adapted caravans

5:12:345:12:39

and even in the carers own homes.

Could we see a vulnerable adult

5:12:395:12:46

accommodated in a caravan somewhere?

What about the risk assessments for

5:12:465:12:53

all of this menu or provision? Who

is going to check that all the new

5:12:535:12:57

people is probable people are cared

for about trained and suitable for

5:12:575:12:59

this role and that the premises also

are suitable. In what rest by is

5:12:595:13:05

therefore a carer if the rest bite

worker under their own roof. Not

5:13:055:13:11

much of a break for the carer or the

family member. To be fair, they are

5:13:115:13:19

promised there will always be a

properly trained staff to offer the

5:13:195:13:21

care and support required but sadly

they have yet to provide the

5:13:215:13:25

families with the reassurances they

need. The uncertainty is torturous

5:13:255:13:30

for them. So much more needs to be

done to drive understanding. But

5:13:305:13:34

we've also got asked, if changes

which cause such disruption are very

5:13:345:13:39

appropriate and the 21st-century

Britain when carers don't know what

5:13:395:13:43

the future holds. Our provision

should be improving, not

5:13:435:13:47

deteriorating in practical terms...

I recently wrote to the Hartlepool

5:13:475:13:56

regarding the consultation that was

taking place at the time I was

5:13:565:13:59

writing. They confirmed they are

committed to retaining the 4155

5:13:595:14:03

Ilium pound financial fund for this

provision. The highlighted that this

5:14:035:14:06

will have to spread further to reach

more families.

5:14:065:14:11

He is making a powerful case but

does he not agree that in terms of

5:14:155:14:19

carers we need to be doing a great

deal more in this country to set

5:14:195:14:23

for. I think back to the 97 Labour

government and my national insurance

5:14:235:14:28

contributions were introduced

towards their pensions. Isn't the

5:14:285:14:31

case really for looking at this and

doing more to terrorist? -- doing

5:14:315:14:37

more to support carers.

I don't know

we will get to the point we consider

5:14:375:14:44

we are content that we have done

enough. I think we need to do much

5:14:445:14:47

more. They were saying that the £1.5

million provision for this service

5:14:475:14:56

will be maintained but a has to be

spread to reach more families. The

5:14:565:15:01

confirms the provision is being

diluted when you dilute provision,

5:15:015:15:03

you cut it and it will be the carers

who pick up the extra

5:15:035:15:08

responsibility. I accept the point

that more people need services.

5:15:085:15:14

Surely the answer to this is to

increase funding and provide the

5:15:145:15:17

services that are needed, not

watered down what is available to

5:15:175:15:22

provide a poorer quality service. As

you know, the demand for these

5:15:225:15:27

services will continue to increase

over the coming years as more

5:15:275:15:31

vulnerable, high needs young people

grow into adults, live longer and

5:15:315:15:34

need the kind of support given by

the kind of people I've been

5:15:345:15:40

speaking out. The cost of meeting

these services will therefore go up

5:15:405:15:44

and yes, are may in some cases be

shared with NHS and local

5:15:445:15:49

authorities. Neither of them can

sustain quality services for a

5:15:495:15:53

growing cohort of people when their

income simply isn't there. Stockton

5:15:535:15:57

Council has had its budget cut by

52% since 2010. It spends around 57%

5:15:575:16:05

of the money it spends on social

care. I asked the Minister today if

5:16:055:16:11

she realises the potential crisis

we're facing. She understand the

5:16:115:16:16

tremendous role these carers take on

and can she appreciate the need for

5:16:165:16:20

comprehensive rest by care to give

them a few days break? Or does she

5:16:205:16:25

think they will get by? Summate,

others want. They will face the

5:16:255:16:32

difficult decision to hand over

their Lumb what the Lima -- loved

5:16:325:16:36

I would ask the Minister, what

short, mid and long-term planning is

5:16:395:16:46

government doing to ensure we have a

strategy in place across the country

5:16:465:16:51

to cope with increased demand in

this area and provide increased

5:16:515:16:53

resources required to deliver

appropriate provision. My colleagues

5:16:535:16:57

in Teesside have all listened to the

stories of these carers and

5:16:575:17:06

recognise they are facing tremendous

anxiety about what the changes will

5:17:065:17:10

mean the rest by care. Others two

have listened. The scrutiny

5:17:105:17:14

committees... This cross committee

of local counsellors stated they

5:17:145:17:22

cannot endorse either of the options

offered on... None of them believed

5:17:225:17:30

they have covered themselves and

glory over the way this matter has

5:17:305:17:32

been handled and can see why those

dependent on the services for a

5:17:325:17:38

decent quality of life have lost all

trust in the organisation and feel

5:17:385:17:41

they have just been ignored and

failed to understand their needs.

5:17:415:17:46

There's another dimension to this. I

applaud for the comprehensive

5:17:465:17:53

exercise that is gone and and it has

been competence have. Sadly, it has

5:17:535:17:59

failed to get their message across.

It is failed to give the reassurance

5:17:595:18:05

to those needy families. The

families interpret that as having

5:18:055:18:07

failed to recognise anxieties

created by the process and carer

5:18:075:18:12

stomach they have no understanding

of any new criteria which will

5:18:125:18:15

determine who gets what services.

They feel they are being left in the

5:18:155:18:20

dark. I praised the public

consultation but at the end of the

5:18:205:18:25

day, the real options are severely

limited. They repeat no more extra

5:18:255:18:32

cash to cope with increased demand.

I've heard at one meeting with

5:18:325:18:35

counsellors, they said carers

cheered when option two was chosen

5:18:355:18:39

over option one. The first option

would have ended all provision.

5:18:395:18:46

Naturally they cheered for the worst

of the two options. -- the better of

5:18:465:18:52

two bad options. There was no option

at all to extend the current

5:18:525:18:56

provision and resources to cater for

the additional needs of new adults

5:18:565:18:59

coming into the system, something I

believe Ministers need to reflect

5:18:595:19:02

on. They also stated its not a

cost-cutting exercise. What they

5:19:025:19:09

need to look after more people with

the same money, there are fewer

5:19:095:19:13

resources left per person in the

system. Was very critical of them

5:19:135:19:20

and the way they've handled this

issue I recognise they have been in

5:19:205:19:22

many ways backed into a corner. They

know the demands on their service

5:19:225:19:26

but does the Minister? They know

they have more people needing

5:19:265:19:29

services and new additional funding

to provide it. We all know we have a

5:19:295:19:34

health and social care crisis in our

country. As the Government cuts

5:19:345:19:41

deeper. It's not something our local

NHS commissioners can do. They can

5:19:415:19:49

tell the local taxpayers they are

sticking an extra 3% on their bill

5:19:495:19:52

to try and alleviate the shortage of

funds and areas like rest by care.

5:19:525:19:55

That leaves the Bok well and truly

in our chamber here with the

5:19:555:20:01

Secretary of State for Health and

social care and of course, the

5:20:015:20:04

Minister. My plea to her is simple.

Will she take an interest in what's

5:20:045:20:08

happening on Teesside with this type

of care for vulnerable adults? Will

5:20:085:20:13

she examine the proposals which

parents see as a cut to provision

5:20:135:20:17

for families in the area? This is

much bigger than Teesside. I know

5:20:175:20:22

there are cc cheese up and down the

country facing the same issues.

5:20:225:20:25

Perhaps it is time...

5:20:255:20:33

Will she instigate that much-needed

policy review to see how we can do

5:20:405:20:45

much better as a country to support

terrorist? -- carers. Many families

5:20:455:20:53

are already living on the edge. They

are struggling to cope with the

5:20:535:20:57

needs of their loved one but they

have no intention to hand them over

5:20:575:21:01

to the state. But they really need

is a comprehensive rest by care

5:21:015:21:05

service to give them a little of

their own time and space. We as a

5:21:055:21:09

nation owed them no less.

Doctor

Paul Williams.

Thank you Madam

5:21:095:21:18

Deputy Speaker and I congratulate my

honourable friend, the Member for a

5:21:185:21:22

Stockton North for securing this

debate. I also congratulate my

5:21:225:21:26

honourable friend for his leadership

in this area and the engagement he

5:21:265:21:29

is shown both with the families but

also with the clinical commissioning

5:21:295:21:34

groups. The challenge of being a ...

I have respect and admiration for

5:21:345:21:50

the people who do this work. In my

own family, my grandmother's sister

5:21:505:21:55

quietus been working out is actually

my great-aunt has spent her lifetime

5:21:555:22:02

actually looking after several

different adults with complex needs

5:22:025:22:05

that she adopted. I've seen the

enormous amount of love and

5:22:055:22:16

compassion that it is taken from her

to do that and I've seen with all of

5:22:165:22:21

my constituents that have contacted

me around these issues into my work

5:22:215:22:26

as a GP my constituency as well, the

amount of love and compassion that

5:22:265:22:29

goes into looking after adults...

This comes at a cost. They comes

5:22:295:22:38

mainly at a cost to to their help.

Often they prioritise the needs of

5:22:385:22:43

the person they are caring for and

don't think about particularly

5:22:435:22:50

preventing their own ill health

problems or looking after their

5:22:505:22:53

problems as they arise. It also

comes at a cost in terms of time.

5:22:535:23:01

congratulate and because the money,

cost of careers, there's a cost.

5:23:025:23:10

It's very important, Madam Deputy

skier -- Mike Speaker, there's issue

5:23:105:23:21

of young carers. Lots of young care

is my constituency. Madam Speaker.

5:23:215:23:27

The work they do with elderly

people, family members is the reason

5:23:275:23:31

why those families are together. The

issue of young carers is so

5:23:315:23:35

important. How important this the...

I think the honourable gentleman for

5:23:355:23:48

highlighting the needs of young

carers and yes, in my constituency

5:23:485:23:51

as I'm sure is the same with other

is a case where the other

5:23:515:23:58

constituencies it in a house., there

are some who grow up and go want to

5:23:585:24:03

be carers and hold families

together. In the context of how

5:24:035:24:07

difficult this can be, and the

tremendous effort that people make

5:24:075:24:12

in order to keep their loved ones

well, in order to look after them,

5:24:125:24:19

the provision of occasional rest

bite is the least that we should be

5:24:195:24:23

doing as a society. To say thank you

the least we should be doing to

5:24:235:24:31

sustain incredible effort that these

people are doing. I think I

5:24:315:24:35

honourable friend, I also give some

credit to the two commission groups

5:24:355:24:39

involved. For taking some

responsibility for this. In a time

5:24:395:24:47

when we all see the constant

jostling between local authorities

5:24:475:24:56

and health services, commissioners

of health services about who should

5:24:565:25:00

fund these issues at a time of

austerity, I think that our CCG has

5:25:005:25:05

stepped up to the plate and took on

responsibilities funding these

5:25:055:25:11

issues. But, a number of

constituents have also contacted me

5:25:115:25:18

in what I can only describe as a

state of panic during these

5:25:185:25:25

consultations that have taken place,

and actually since the outcome of

5:25:255:25:29

the of the consultations was

announced. They are fearful that

5:25:295:25:33

their much-needed breaks are going

to be taken away from them. As my

5:25:335:25:37

honourable friend has pointed out,

fears may well prove to be

5:25:375:25:43

ill-founded but it should not mean

they should be discounted. I think

5:25:435:25:46

that change is always difficult for

people, but to have the possibility

5:25:465:25:53

of services being cut has cost it

genuine anxiety for these people.

5:25:535:25:57

It's an anxiety that we should

rightly be recognising. We all know

5:25:575:26:02

that caring can be physically

demanding, it can also be mentally

5:26:025:26:08

demanding. Especially for long

periods of time. It's my opinion

5:26:085:26:14

that added respite is absolutely

essential for these carers. If the

5:26:145:26:19

are to maintain their own health and

well-being. It's also absolutely

5:26:195:26:24

essential that carers are involved

in any decisions about what is

5:26:245:26:31

adequate and appropriate matches for

their family members, but also for

5:26:315:26:35

the carers themselves. And a respite

package as was pointed out, is a

5:26:355:26:41

package that should be designed

around the needs of the whole

5:26:415:26:44

family, not just around the needs of

the individual with complex needs.

5:26:445:26:47

What we are seeing though, is that

limited funding, whether or not. I

5:26:475:26:54

don't know whether this is ring

fenced, or taken from an overall

5:26:545:27:01

pot, but there is limited funding,

the respite have -- Mike CCG... To

5:27:015:27:09

demand his outs dripping -- rank

outstripping the resources. Limited

5:27:095:27:16

funding and rising need for this

particular kind of care is meaning

5:27:165:27:19

that some people, packages are care

are likely to be reduced. That is

5:27:195:27:25

causing significant anxiety to

people. Adding another point that I

5:27:255:27:29

would like to make before finishes

that are experienced is illustrating

5:27:295:27:37

the health and social care don't

exist in isolation from it each

5:27:375:27:39

other. There have been some small

steps taken in changing the name of

5:27:395:27:46

the Department of Health Department

of Health and social care, but this

5:27:465:27:50

is a really good example to others

should be, could be some really

5:27:505:27:55

concrete steps to bring the funding

together. There should be a

5:27:555:28:00

partnership between local

authorities and commissioning

5:28:005:28:03

grooves, parents, carers and people

with complex needs in order to work

5:28:035:28:06

together. This is an area where we

should be seeing integration at its

5:28:065:28:10

best. I think if we are talking

about integration, I have to take

5:28:105:28:16

the opportunity to talk about the

green paper, the forthcoming green

5:28:165:28:19

paper on social care and say that it

is inconceivable for me that we

5:28:195:28:27

should, in 2018, be considering

social care and isolation and asked

5:28:275:28:32

the Department of Health and social

care at the thing whether or not

5:28:325:28:36

this should be a green paper on the

future of care and social care and

5:28:365:28:39

social together rather than just

considering social care in

5:28:395:28:44

isolation. So I and by paying

tribute to the carers who have come

5:28:445:28:48

together in this case the fight for

the very best services for their

5:28:485:28:53

loved ones. They deserve for us to

listen, these are for us to

5:28:535:28:58

consider, as it is there for us to

act. So that the gap the respite

5:28:585:29:04

that the deserve for themselves and

their families.

Like you Madam

5:29:045:29:11

Deputy Speaker I would like to

wholeheartedly congratulate my right

5:29:115:29:14

honourable friend for securities

debate. It's of crucial importance

5:29:145:29:17

for some of the people who face

these crucial challenges in their

5:29:175:29:23

lives. It's a nice debate, it's

extremely important and they're

5:29:235:29:27

grateful for it to be brought

forward. And to speak this evening.

5:29:275:29:31

I am particularly keen to speed

because the very first surgery I had

5:29:315:29:36

after it was elected three years

ago, the first people came to see me

5:29:365:29:40

were some carers and had disabled

adults in severe needs who were

5:29:405:29:45

shocked to hear, not considered by

themselves or the quality of care,

5:29:455:29:54

there were concerned about the

well-being of the staff and the

5:29:545:29:58

carers and those who look after her.

The lack of payment, low-paid, the

5:29:585:30:03

insecure nature of the work. I just

want to use this opportunity will be

5:30:035:30:09

having this debate to raise the

floor of the houses we look ahead to

5:30:095:30:12

the care green paper, that those who

work in the sector are so

5:30:125:30:17

fundamental to the care that is

needed by those vulnerable families.

5:30:175:30:20

If we don't look after them, we

can't expect to these families to

5:30:205:30:26

get the care they deserve. I also

want to mention briefly as well, the

5:30:265:30:31

other point I was May, young carers.

These voices are just not her it's a

5:30:315:30:36

busy fantastic charity can't my

charity of the year. It doesn't then

5:30:365:30:42

passed the job of supporting young

people who are trying to manage care

5:30:425:30:45

for members of their family who are

they are losing part of their

5:30:455:30:50

childhood in order to do so. People

are falling through the cracks,

5:30:505:30:56

really is a provision. Let's pay

tribute to all of those, the

5:30:565:31:03

charges, a state organisation

supporting young people. It ended

5:31:035:31:06

this issue in particular. I want to

focus their briefly on what it means

5:31:065:31:11

to the people of my constituency.

They're very beneficial to people

5:31:115:31:20

with learning needs. My disability.

They are a valuable lifeline to

5:31:205:31:25

family members who are working 20 47

caring for their members. It is

5:31:255:31:29

difficult for any of us to imagine

having to give a family member 20

5:31:295:31:34

47, someone has high high needs.

Extremely care packages, care plans,

5:31:345:31:41

for years and decades even to

support that family member. Maybe do

5:31:415:31:45

through their love we owe them

attribute to them and all to them

5:31:455:31:53

that stay provisions... The

consultation was very worrying. It

5:31:535:31:59

was overwhelmingly in support of

continuation of bed respite care. It

5:31:595:32:08

is overwhelmingly clear that people

want to make sure that respite is

5:32:085:32:11

still available. Some in my

constituency contacted me and was

5:32:115:32:18

very concerned about support, to

have a 15-year-old son, he requires

5:32:185:32:25

lasting care and she is concerned

about how people cope if the service

5:32:255:32:29

provided is. The reliability and

consistency of care is one of the

5:32:295:32:35

more most important reasons why it

is preferred by some disabled people

5:32:355:32:40

and their families. The biggest

issue around this is the insecurity

5:32:405:32:47

and disruption, and has a real

knock-down effect on people in their

5:32:475:32:50

lives. The reality is that services

are still going to be cut back. A

5:32:505:33:03

cut on spending on respite care, by

the local CCG, will inevitably

5:33:035:33:08

restrict services. There will be few

and active care, fewer people. This

5:33:085:33:13

is a decision we have to make. But

if someone has a need for care, the

5:33:135:33:18

CCG was to be able to provide it.

Does that mean that more cuts will

5:33:185:33:25

be made elsewhere to compensate. GP

care services are seen, I'm afraid,

5:33:255:33:36

as low hanging fruit. By the side to

save money. It I was surprised to

5:33:365:33:49

read about a case where a cut of

£600,000 to children with conflict

5:33:495:33:55

means had been proposed. There are

legal count challenges.

5:33:555:34:09

Respite care is an important part of

our social care system which already

5:34:105:34:13

relies on hundreds of thousands

unpaid family carers across the UK

5:34:135:34:17

who give of their lives to do so.

Cutting the services were placed

5:34:175:34:21

even more pressure on those trying

to do right by their loved ones.

5:34:215:34:28

Thank you Madam Deputy Speaker I am

very honourable to the -- and very

5:34:285:34:35

grateful to the honourable member

for raising this concern. And indeed

5:34:355:34:38

to his honourable colleague. And for

the very powerful language, very

5:34:385:34:48

justifiable concerns of their

constituents. I think whenever there

5:34:485:34:53

is an almond of change, people have

a tendency to feel concern and it's

5:34:535:34:59

absolutely right that there is fair

concern to be articulated. Because

5:34:595:35:04

supporting the Muslim ball in

arsenate -- society, those with

5:35:045:35:08

autism, learning disabilities --

autism health and social care

5:35:085:35:17

commissioners face. It's a task that

must be undertaken with a genuine

5:35:175:35:22

desire Madam Deputy Speaker, to

their best outcome for not only

5:35:225:35:28

those who are supported but those

who care for them. It's very

5:35:285:35:30

important to remember that much of

the services were are discussing

5:35:305:35:35

today are focused on people with

autism and learning disabilities.

5:35:355:35:41

Conditions which can manifest

different requirements. It may need

5:35:415:35:45

care and help ranging from routine,

or sometimes more than one person at

5:35:455:35:54

a time. There are mandate, there is

a very clear objective to improve

5:35:545:36:02

outcomes of people with autism or

learning disabilities. This means

5:36:025:36:05

that you are fully supported in the

community, hospital admissions are

5:36:055:36:12

reduced, and to have an opportunity

to live normal life. Building

5:36:125:36:18

concerted action to deliver that

community support. We know that

5:36:185:36:28

respite services are really

important and significant element

5:36:285:36:36

anomaly for the individual receiving

care but also their families and

5:36:365:36:38

carers. As my honourable members

have expressed were proffered. --

5:36:385:36:56

family care plays an important role,

very valuable role. Often

5:36:565:37:02

undervalued role. Often they do it

out of not a sense of duty, sense of

5:37:025:37:07

compassion, at a sense of pure love.

And he deserves nothing more than on

5:37:075:37:14

unbridled thanks and respect. You

asked me about what we're doing

5:37:145:37:17

support parents. Of course there

will be added several part of the

5:37:175:37:24

Government's green paper. Also we

have, at carers action plan which

5:37:245:37:31

will also sets out, and I feel

passionately about which will set

5:37:315:37:34

out some short-term... Now we

5:37:345:37:50

Is this clue the Minister gets this.

The issue is this is about resources

5:37:505:37:55

well. I'm concerned about the

current problem we have on Teesside

5:37:555:38:00

but in the longer term... They were

children who would never have

5:38:005:38:10

survived in previous generations.

They are coming to the system and

5:38:105:38:13

they would eat more and more

service. War and more people are

5:38:135:38:18

going from children to adults.

What's the Government doing about

5:38:185:38:24

that in terms of longer-term

lending?

He articulates real issue

5:38:245:38:30

that we have to contend with and

since 2010 that's why we have

5:38:305:38:34

increased NHS spending every single

year and our NHS has now £30 billion

5:38:345:38:40

more to spend on caring for people

than it did in 2010. He goes to the

5:38:405:38:44

heart of the issue he is identified

that we need to make sure our care

5:38:445:38:51

is responsive to the needs of

individuals. That implies both a

5:38:515:38:58

need to assess and determine what is

the right kind of support, the need

5:38:585:39:02

for flexibility to allow for

personal choice as I believe is

5:39:025:39:07

being looked in Teesside some needs

may be best met through a sustained

5:39:075:39:12

and suitable service, providing

overnight beds as he's articulated,

5:39:125:39:18

providing properly trained staff but

this may not be true for everybody.

5:39:185:39:21

Those with a severe physical or

learning disabilities may find

5:39:215:39:24

something in the community is more

desirable for them and more

5:39:245:39:27

appropriate for them. For example, a

leisure activity, a visit, even

5:39:275:39:35

visiting family members with the

right personal support. We don't

5:39:355:39:38

want these opportunities to be

ridden off for them because we have

5:39:385:39:42

a very restrictive system. That's

why it's right that commissioners

5:39:425:39:48

have the means to seek new

approaches and be flexible in how

5:39:485:39:51

they meet peoples needs. Understand

the intention and our Teesside is

5:39:515:39:56

exactly that. MSP based on suitable

engagement to assess what peoples

5:39:565:40:01

individual needs are. Listening to

the Commons from honourable members

5:40:015:40:06

today, I appreciate members concerns

that not everyone can currently

5:40:065:40:09

access rest bite services and that

they may not be flexible enough.

5:40:095:40:14

That's why local commissioners are

rightly looking to change their

5:40:145:40:17

provision. The honourable member why

understand that it's not customary

5:40:175:40:21

for a Minister to comment on detail

in specific commissioning decisions

5:40:215:40:24

or and extent to which there was

appropriate consultation. Unless

5:40:245:40:31

that's part of a formal review

process. I understand the local is

5:40:315:40:36

consulted on these proposals for ten

weeks and are now in the process of

5:40:365:40:40

designing a service.

Does the

Minister understand that the people

5:40:405:40:44

in Teesside, this ECG having

knowledge they need more people in

5:40:445:40:52

the system so it will be a service

diluted. The she recognised back?

5:40:525:40:56

Having recognised it, what can she

do about it?

As I've already

5:40:565:41:02

articulated, it's up to them to

commission the local services they

5:41:025:41:06

feel are appropriate in their local

communities. It's not for government

5:41:065:41:09

to force a top-down Dick not on how

they need to spend their resources.

5:41:095:41:14

I understand the local councils are

quite rightly scrutinising the

5:41:145:41:22

proposals and this is an important

means of quality assurance. It's

5:41:225:41:27

informed by local people with local

knowledge and I hope you will find

5:41:275:41:30

some reassurance and that. While

it's right that service

5:41:305:41:36

configurations are considered

locally and not being driven from

5:41:365:41:39

the top-down, any significant

changes to the services are subject

5:41:395:41:42

to governments for tests and is that

they demonstrate support for

5:41:425:41:46

clinical commissioners, strengthen

public and patient engagement,

5:41:465:41:50

clarity and criminal Tony Mike

medical evidence base and support

5:41:505:41:53

for patient choice. There are a very

clear set of expectations and

5:41:535:41:59

relation to that provision oppressed

by care and the of commissioners.

5:41:595:42:04

All clinical commissioning groups

must secure services to meet the

5:42:045:42:09

needs of their population. Rest by

care may be routinely commissioned

5:42:095:42:14

or made available as part of a

package of NHS continuing health

5:42:145:42:18

care and it's often also provided as

part of social care. The care act

5:42:185:42:23

2014 requires that where an adult

appears to have support needs, the

5:42:235:42:29

local authority must carry out an

assessment and meet any need where

5:42:295:42:32

the person has met the eligibility

criteria.

The Minister has been

5:42:325:42:37

generous and giving me the Mac way

to me several times. The scrutiny

5:42:375:42:44

groups on Teesside, at least some of

them are thinking of referring the

5:42:445:42:47

matter to the Secretary of State.

What happens when Bettis referred

5:42:475:42:51

and then what can the Government do?

That of course will be a matter for

5:42:515:43:02

the Secretary of State and he will

deal with it in the appropriate way.

5:43:025:43:06

They care act also requires local

authorities to take a preventative

5:43:065:43:13

approach to addressing peoples

needs, both taking steps early to

5:43:135:43:17

prevent or delay any worsening of an

adults need for care and support.

5:43:175:43:21

This would include... It's really

important allowing them to take the

5:43:215:43:28

rest bite that we have spoken about.

He might be interested to know that

5:43:285:43:35

the autism act 2009 also requires

the Government driver regularly

5:43:355:43:39

reviewed autism strategy and issue

guidance to local authorities and

5:43:395:43:43

NHS bodies and foundation trusts. In

addition, the children's and family

5:43:435:43:48

act of 2014 introduced a new

framework for children with special

5:43:485:43:53

educational needs and disabilities

which give commissioners very clear

5:43:535:43:58

responsibilities towards those with

learning disability and autism or

5:43:585:44:02

those who may be affected in the

review in Teesside.

You're been

5:44:025:44:08

generous in doing so. The Minister

referred to autism in particular. I

5:44:085:44:13

think all of us here will have her

knowledge of autism. The Minister

5:44:135:44:19

will be aware that in Northern

Ireland we have in autism strategy

5:44:195:44:25

and there is a very good strategy.

As the Minister had a chance to

5:44:255:44:29

check those other strategies?

I

haven't but now that the honourable

5:44:295:44:39

gentleman has recommended it to me I

certainly will look into that. It's

5:44:395:44:46

really important that commissioners

have that prerogative to make a

5:44:465:44:50

local determination of what

constitutes the right services and

5:44:505:44:53

we have set clear expectations for

health and social care in how it

5:44:535:44:56

meets peoples need for support and

family needs for rest bite. We can't

5:44:565:45:02

close the gap between the outcomes

for those were most vulnerable and

5:45:025:45:06

those with complex needs but a has

to be via a competition as a

5:45:065:45:11

national expectations alongside a

local approach to delivering the

5:45:115:45:13

necessary services. The NHS has a

responsibility to ensure that people

5:45:135:45:18

have access to the best and safest

health care possible and this means

5:45:185:45:22

and must plan ahead and look at how

best to secure safe and sustainable

5:45:225:45:27

NHS health care provision and

provide flexible approaches to meet

5:45:275:45:29

the widest range of needs. That's

what we are hopeful to see in action

5:45:295:45:32

here in Teesside. I know that any

change to local services for

5:45:325:45:36

vulnerable people must be cleared

with that degree of apprehension and

5:45:365:45:41

I understand that. Considering the

assurances given locally by

5:45:415:45:45

commissioners and the process they

have undertaken and the overall aim

5:45:455:45:48

of providing a more flexible set of

options for rest bite that moves

5:45:485:45:52

away from a very medical way of

care, I'm hopeful these changes will

5:45:525:45:55

be of benefit to the people who most

need their services.

The question is

5:45:555:46:03

that this House to adjourn.

Many of

that opinion say, I. The iPods might

5:46:035:46:10

have order, order.

5:46:105:46:12

-- the I's have it.

We will not be

going live

5:46:165:46:24

Live coverage of the day's proceedings in the House of Commons, including urgent questions on hate crime and treatment of parliamentary staff. Plus the prime minister's statement on the poisoning in Salisbury, a Northern Ireland budget statement, a US steel tariffs statement and a statement on protecting civilians in Syria. Finally, there is discussion on the remaining stages of the Financial Guidance and Claims Bill.