12/03/2018 House of Commons


12/03/2018

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I think we are done. Are we done?

OK, urgent question.

Thank you. To

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ask the Secretary of State and home

Department if she will make a

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statement on hate crime in light of

the inflammatory letters inciting a

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punish a Muslim day on the 3rd of

April.

As you will appreciate the

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letters described in the question

are part of an ongoing investigation

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and as such I'm not in a position to

comment on them but the government

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condemns the content of these

letters is clearly a torrent with no

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place in decent society -- ab

horrid.

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We take a crime and is a phobia very

seriously and we have a framework to

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respond to it -- Islamophobia.

Freedom of speech and the rule of

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law and equal rights defined us as a

society and the government is

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determined to promote these values

actively working in partnership and

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alongside Muslim and indeed all

faith communities to demonstrate

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that what we have in common is the

best defence against extremists who

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would seek to divide and our hate

crime action plan sets out our comp

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Ran Singh approach to tackling hate

crime. -- sets out our

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comprehensive. We have a strong

range of guidelines. The legislation

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provides equal protection under the

law for all ethnic and religious

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groups. We have sources of expert

advice on the nature and causes of

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hate crime through the anti-Muslim

hate crime working group and the

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Independent advisory group on hate

crime. We have committed £2.4

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million over three years to help

protect places of worship that have

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been subject or vulnerable to a hate

crime attack and we have also

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committed a further £1 million

following the terrible Finsbury Park

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attack in June last year to help

protect places of worship and

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associated community centres which

are vulnerable to attack on racial,

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religious or ideological grounds and

so far we have funded 45 mosques

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under both schemes and we have also

funded tell Mama to record

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anti-Muslim hatred incidents and we

have made it mandatory for police

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forces to disaggregate religious

hate crime data held by the police

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to reveal the true scale and nature

of the problem which we are

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determined to tackle.

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Thank you for granting this urgent

question. The letter calling for an

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attack on Muslims on April the 3rd

offers reward for attackers, ten

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points for verbal abuse, 50 points

for throwing acid, 1000 points for

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bombing at a mosque and two and two

and a half thousand points to nuke

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Mecca. Can I remind the house that

millions of Muslims fought for us in

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the two world wars including members

of my own family. Figures show that

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Islamophobia hate crime has

increased by 40%, 1678 anti-Muslim

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hate crimes reported in London just

until January this year, so can I

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ask the minister if she can explain

why no government ministers in the

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last eight years have ever made a

speech on the rise of anti-Muslim

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hatred? Recent history has shown

that 50% of the British population

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believe that Islam is a threat to

Western democracy and over 30% of

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young children believe that Muslims

are taking over England. Given such

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anti-Muslim views have gained such

traction what is the government

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going to do to help prevent the

growth of such extreme views that

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appears to have come from parts of

the print, broadcast and social

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media? What concrete stuff is the

government going to do to tackle the

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growth in hate crimes and hate

against Muslims question up can the

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minister set up the amount of

funding that is provided by the Home

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Office to tackle each form of

bigotry? Mr speaker, and I'm sure

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every member will accept this, there

has been a sharp rise in the far

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right movement in Europe and beyond

with the USA president retweeting

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far right material, this is a really

urgent situation and it needs to be

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urgently tackled another forward to

hearing the minister respond as to

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what concrete stuff will be taken to

deal with this.

I thank you for

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bringing forward this urgent

question and may I make it clear

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that this government wants to give a

strong message of support to Muslims

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across the UK, we are committed to

their safety and security and if

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anyone has received this letter or a

similar communication please contact

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the police where they will be

treated with the utmost seriousness

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and action will be taken. Moving to

the points, the issue of anti-Muslim

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and indeed far right extremism, is a

focus for the government. The

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preventive strategy which tackles

extremism doesn't tackle Muslim

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extremism in and of itself, it

tackles extremism in general and

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sadly over a quarter of referrals in

the strategy in 2015 concerned the

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far right extremists and and so this

government and in particular this

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Prime Minister with the experience

that she brings to her position

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following her experience in the Home

Office, all of this is focused on

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tackling extremism and

radicalisation and how this affects

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our community which is precisely why

we are refreshing the hate crime

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action plan this year.

Anna Soubry.

I want to put this on record, the

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mayor of rock star happens to be a

Muslim -- Brock Stowe. She happens

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to be the first person of colour to

be mayor here and the first person

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to be a Muslim mayor and also

happens to be a Tory, and as it also

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happens in her office of nearly one

year completed, she has had a warm

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welcome where ever she has gone in

my borough and rightly so. People

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are sick and tired of hate crime,

Islamophobia, it is absolutely no

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longer to be tolerated and I commend

the minister for everything she has

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said in her statement and I do

believe that this government takes

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it very seriously. This isn't really

a hate crime, this is an act of

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blatant incitement to terrorism but

in any event I'm looking over at the

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co-chair of the all-party

Parliamentary group on Muslims, the

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member for Ilford North, we worked

together on this and I'm sure he'll

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agree, the time has come for a

proper legal definition of

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Islamophobia, would the minister

agree?

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We don't accept the need for a

definitive one

but we know that

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Islamophobia is clearly recognised

and we have very effective

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monitoring of the anti-Muslim hatred

group in these areas.

Can I

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congratulate my honourable friend

for securing it? The despicable

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sentiments behind the sickening

letters has caused revulsion across

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our communities, and while we can be

confident that thanks to the

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tireless dedication of community

leaders, charities, faith groups in

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civil society these deliberate

attempts to divide us will not

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succeed. Nevertheless, this act will

have struck fear into the heart of

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communities, and indeed that was its

intention. This was indeed an

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incitement to violence, and it

cannot go unpunished. As we have

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heard, hate crimes nationwide are

rising. In London alone there has

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been a fivefold increase on attacks

on Muslims in the last year. The

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threat from the extreme right wing

as the outgoing territory Mark

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Rowley has said is significant and

it requires urgent attention. The

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murder of our colleague and friend

Jo Cox, the attack at Finsbury Park

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Moss, the jailing of the leaders of

Britain first and the reports from

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the Anderson review, which suggested

that the extreme right wing are

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engaged in credible attack planning,

including bomb-making. There is now

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overwhelming evidence that the

threat from the extreme right is

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growing increasingly violent, and we

have to be clear that by threatening

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members of our diverse communities,

they are also a threat to our

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national security, fax to their

anti-democratic, dehumanising and

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murderous beliefs. Given the

overwhelming evidence it is clear

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that so-called domestic extremism

needs to be dealt with as a first

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order threat, so can the minister

assure us that in mind that the

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Anderson review recommendations, the

joint terrorist analysis centre will

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increase the role for MI5, JTAC and

the counter terror network in the

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monitoring and handling of domestic

extremism? And is it not time to

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update the contest strategy to

reflect the growing threat from the

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extreme right? More broadly, can we

be assured that counterterrorism

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policing has the resources they

need? Last month, only half of what

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was requested by the police was

given, for counterterrorism, and

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police and our services are facing

unprecedented threat from terrorism

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in all forms. These letters are an

attempt to divide us, in that they

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will not succeed. We must be united

as a house and a country in bearing

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down in the insidious beliefs

contained within and be absolutely

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clear how we will bring together the

police, schools, colleges and all

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authorities to stand up to hate

crime and terrorism in every single

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one of its forms. And finally to

ensure that we, all of us, as

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elected politicians are at all times

responsible in our language and

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rhetoric, and never seek to embolden

those who hold such insidious and

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extremist views.

I am sure everyone

in the house agrees with the

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honourable lady, particularly on

that last point about the importance

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of using our language very, very

carefully. In terms of resources,

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she asked me about police resources,

of course we have increased fees,

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and the Home Secretary, is the

honourable lady will know, reviews

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these resources constantly. We asked

the police if they have the

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resources we need and the Home

Secretary act accordingly. In terms

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of the JTAC and other queries that

she made, may I undertake to write

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to the honourable lady specifically,

please? And finally just say it is

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gratifying to see so many Members

End house today here unified in

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condemning these dreadful letters

and their sentiments, and our

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determination to tackle them.

Hate

crime in all its forms is to be

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condemned, as is this letter.

Another group which is affected by

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growing hate crime is the Jewish

community, and the community

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security trust is having to go to

ever greater lengths to protect

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local Jewish community centres. Can

we ensure that all these forms of

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hate crime are combated as far as

possible?

I thank my honourable

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friend for his question, and of

course any group of people who are

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the victims of hate crime as a

result of their religious beliefs

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deserve our sympathy and also our

action, and I, like him, condemn any

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form of anti-Semitism, and I know

that the police are as focused on

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this form of crime as they are on

any other form of religious hate

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crime.

Can I congratulate the

honourable and landed lady for

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Bolton South East in securing this

urgent question, and reassure her

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and the rest of the house that the

Scottish National Party joins in the

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condemnation of Islamophobia in the

strongest possible terms? We believe

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that there is no excuse for any sort

of hate crime, and we were as

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concerned as everyone else in this

house to see the significant rise in

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hate crime statistics in England and

Wales last year and we note that

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followed a spike in hate crime stats

around the time of the EU

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referendum, and as others have said

this is happening alongside a

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significant rise in right wing

extremism. In Scotland, the police

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are committed to making victims,

witnesses and partner agencies feel

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more confident in reporting hate

crime, and they do that through a

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variety of methods, including a note

network of third-party porting

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centres. In Scotland a senior judge

has been appointed to lead an

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independent review into hate crime

legislation, and he will be

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reporting to the Scottish Government

later this year. Can I ask the

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minister what reassurance she can

give us that similar steps are being

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taken in the rest of the UK where

hate crime is rising and in

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particular that similar steps are

being taken to tackle the specific

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problem here, which is Islamophobia?

I thank the honourable lady for her

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question and indeed for her

contributions as to what is

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happening in Scotland. We very much

look at how we tackle hate crime

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particularly throughout hate crime

action plan, which was published in

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2016 and will be refreshed this

year, and includes a range of

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actions, including funding for

security for places of worship, the

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disaggregation of religious -based

hate crime data, and taking further

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action in relation to education, so

that teachers can have sometimes

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difficult conversations with this

Judon is as to beliefs, and words,

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and funding programmes through the

Anne Frank trust and street crimes.

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We are determined that our action in

relation to hate crime is up-to-date

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and current.

As someone who visited

a Syrian refugee camp in Turkey over

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the weekend, I find it a little

offensive that a member on the

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opposite side said that no

Conservative minister had actually

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ever condemned any kind of Muslim

extremism. Is the Minister aware

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that her equivalent at the

Department for Education publicly

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rebuked the President of the United

States for retweeting said in

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comments and invited him to visit

this link communities in the United

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Kingdom?

Iheanacho tamely grateful

to my honourable friend, I wasn't

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sure I had heard the honourable lady

correctly, because as I say the

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record of the Prime Minister and

Cabinet ministers on the issue of

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tackling anti-Muslim sentiment I

thought was pretty clear. But it may

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be that the honourable lady can

clarify her remarks at a later

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stage.

With regard to the previous

question, I don't think it

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represented the point my honourable

friend was making, and I hope that

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we can address this issue as a

united Parliament, and not in a way

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that is divided, when I think we

should all stand together against

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this kind of vile threat, this

insight and this illegal incitement

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to violence, and our whole

parliament, the police and

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communities across the country

should want to stand firm with

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Muslim families, Muslim communities,

against this kind of vile

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Islamophobia, because we know from

throughout history that an attack on

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some of us is an attack on all of

us, and that is why we stand firm.

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But I want to ask the Minister what

the Home Office has done since I

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raised last week the prevalence of

national action, illegal propaganda

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videos on YouTube still, and also I

discover on Twitter and on Facebook?

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Because we know that the former

counterterror chief has warned of

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online radicalisation, of the rise

right extremism, and our select

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committee has heard in our enquiry

about the serious issues around as a

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phobia and hate crime. She will know

we are allowing social media

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companies to collude with these far

right extremists if action is not

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taken to take this vile illegal

propaganda down.

I am a dream the

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grateful to the right honourable

member, and she knows the work that

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my right honourable friend the Home

Secretary is doing to work with a

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large technology companies to

improve their reaction on this. I

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think pretty much everyone in this

place and certainly outside of this

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place agrees that technology

companies need to do more to remove

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these hateful pieces of incitement

on their platforms. They must do it

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much more quickly and they must do

it in working with police. So I'm

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sure that we have agreement on that.

Can my right honourable friend

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reassure this house that those

spreading this fear and hatred, in

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whatever form, should be

investigated by the police, and

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where appropriate, dealt severely by

the courts.

Of course, I mustn't

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comment on this particular case

because it is a life police

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investigation but the principle is

that if there is an incident of hate

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crime, the victim of that hate crime

must please report it to the police

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so they can do all they can to bring

these people to justice.

Mr Speaker,

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these letters are abhorrent and are

causing immense distress across

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communities around the country, but

as my right honourable friend has

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indicated, this hate crime is being

amplified via the internets. We know

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there are still too little action

being taken by those social media

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companies. I attended a Round Table

coordinated by two of her

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government's department just before

Christmas and we are still to see

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action. If I tell her a case that

went to court which saw a man jailed

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for two years for the far right

material he put on year -- online,

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that material is still up and it

remains the case for many cases

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across our country. What action is

the government going to take to make

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sure that we don't flame tensions in

our communities by what is seen

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online?

And honourable Mende herself

has been the victim of much hatred

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online, as indeed have other numbers

of this house, and we are very clear

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in our expectation of technology

companies that they will in

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accordance with the law remove this

material as and when it is brought

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to their attention. We have had some

progress, the technology companies I

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think I getting better at this but I

don't for a moment pretend that we

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have got the full response that we

would like to see these posts taken

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down as quickly as possible, and

that is the expectation that the

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Home Secretary makes when she meets

these technology companies.

Could I

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ask the Minister whether a national

unit has been established to check

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on hate crime and identify those

people that are dealing in it, and

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bring them to justice?

We take the

view that hate crime is a matter for

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the whole community, given that it

can take ceremony forms, it is not

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restricted to one's religion. The

five characteristics are set out

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very clearly in the hate crime

legislation and we ensure that the

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police and others are trained to

spot the Skrine when it occurs and

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to deal with it seriously, and I

hope also sensitively.

These letters

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are nothing short of a sick and

cowardly attempt to divide our

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communities. We are proud of our

communities living side by side in

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harmony. There must be a clear

message sent from this house, across

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the house, that we will never cower

to any form of extremism, and we

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will never allow it to threaten the

very fabric of our society for stock

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can I please urge the Minister that

this government does not sit idly by

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and let it happen, as in this great

time of need allowing such awful

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hatred to be propagated would send

the worse message of all?

I would

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hope that the honourable lady has

understood from my reaction that the

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government is not sitting idly by.

We are refreshing, as I say, the

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hate crime action plan this year,

because it has to keep up-to-date

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with the new threats faced by all

different types of people and

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communities. And I can assure her

that we take these allegations, as

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indeed we take allegations, as we

have heard already in the chamber

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today, of anti-Semitism, online

hatred and so on, we take them very

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seriously and I know the police do

as well.

The rising tide of creeping

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Islamophobia and anti-Jewish

sentiment is something that should

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concern us all. I would like to know

how improving the recording of this

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hate crime is helping us to track

what is going on in our society and

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how we can tackle it?

I am extremely

grateful to my honourable friend to

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that question. Of course we now

increasingly data helps give us

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answers, it helps direct our

resources in the right way, and so

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we are very much hoping that by this

aggregating the specific type of

0:23:050:23:12

hate crime, that that will help

individual constabularies work out

0:23:120:23:15

how better to prioritise the

resources to do with the different

0:23:150:23:18

types of hate crime that we know

exist.

0:23:180:23:23

The level of hate and violence

against Muslims has become utterly

0:23:230:23:30

intolerable and for years many of

our constituencies have faced the

0:23:300:23:34

onslaught of threats from the image

defence league and the British first

0:23:340:23:37

and others, can the minister explain

what action her government is going

0:23:370:23:42

to take to provide protections to

those communities who feel under

0:23:420:23:47

threat on the 3rd of April and

secondly what action will she take

0:23:470:23:53

to prescribe groups who are actively

seeking to incite violence and

0:23:530:23:57

hatred across our communities in

this country?

You will understand

0:23:570:24:03

that I must not comment on the

particular investigation going on at

0:24:030:24:06

the moment, but given it is a live

investigation, by definition,

0:24:060:24:15

communities that may be affected by

any such communication will be

0:24:150:24:20

uppermost in the mind of the police

when it comes to protection and

0:24:200:24:25

their vulnerability, but in terms of

tackling far right extremism more

0:24:250:24:30

generally this is part of a cross

government programme of tackling and

0:24:300:24:34

also support for victims and this is

why the preventive strategy is a

0:24:340:24:45

safeguarding strategy and this is

where it has such an impact because

0:24:450:24:49

sadly a quarter of referrals to

Prevent work from far right

0:24:490:24:57

extremism and the strategy is about

leading them away from that part of

0:24:570:25:00

radicalisation so they don't commit

these terrible acts.

This house is

0:25:000:25:06

at its best when it comes to condemn

and comes together to condemn evil

0:25:060:25:10

actions and when it is not trying to

score political points against each

0:25:100:25:15

other and I think we can all unite

about this letter, and we don't know

0:25:150:25:19

who wrote it, it might be some side

individual in a bedsit playing with

0:25:190:25:24

his computer or may be something far

more serious, but we are right to

0:25:240:25:30

say that this is a condemnation and

an in citation to violence,

0:25:300:25:36

especially when it calls on people

to throw acid in people's face. Can

0:25:360:25:40

I just ask the house to think of the

moment of the office of the MP for

0:25:400:25:46

Bedford. There was an incident in

this place earlier today which

0:25:460:25:53

involved him and his staff which may

or may not be connected but we think

0:25:530:25:58

it might be, with this letter and we

must come together and make sure

0:25:580:26:02

this does not happen, not only here

but also throughout the country.

I

0:26:020:26:11

thank my honourable friend from

raising this and I'm sure the

0:26:110:26:14

thoughts of the house are with the

member of Parliament and their

0:26:140:26:17

members of staff concerned although

I have received a note that the

0:26:170:26:22

package found there was not

hazardous which must be of

0:26:220:26:28

significant relief to those people

concerned but we give our sincere

0:26:280:26:32

thanks to the police and others who

went to the rescue of these members

0:26:320:26:36

of staff when they found the

package.

Stella Creasy.

It was

0:26:360:26:42

Friday night when I started to

receive reports from residents in

0:26:420:26:45

Walthamstow that they had received

one of these letters, the fear and

0:26:450:26:49

the terror it caused at the very

point when I was helping other

0:26:490:26:53

residents report anti-Semitic

graffiti they had found in our

0:26:530:26:58

community, will the minister join in

welcoming the work that tell Mammana

0:26:580:27:04

and the security forces are doing to

support these groups? And does she

0:27:040:27:08

agree that we had to do more than

just condemn these instances, when

0:27:080:27:13

we see Steve Bannon come to Europe

and tell people that they should be

0:27:130:27:16

proud to be called a racist, we must

in this house speak up for the

0:27:160:27:22

communities we represent and the

power of diversity and immigration

0:27:220:27:26

to enrich all of our lives and I

tell the minister the people of

0:27:260:27:32

Walthamstow need to demand nothing

less from this government.

They are

0:27:320:27:35

getting it. I'm very grateful to the

the honourable lady setting out her

0:27:350:27:41

concerns and she has highlighted the

fear that people must have felt when

0:27:410:27:43

they received these letters and she

is absolutely right that Tell Mama

0:27:430:27:49

is an organisation which is

universally recognised as playing an

0:27:490:27:52

important role in this field. I'm

told that from the 1st of January

0:27:520:27:58

until the 31st of December 2015,

2622 anti-Muslim hate incidents were

0:27:580:28:05

reported to Tell Mama by victims or

third parties, and that shows the

0:28:050:28:11

scale, three years ago, that we are

facing in this country after these

0:28:110:28:19

worrying incidents of hate crime. We

support Tell Mama to the June >>

0:28:190:28:25

STUDIO:

0:28:250:28:27

-- we support Tell Mama with money.

There's a urgent question to this,

0:28:300:28:37

and so there is a premium on extreme

brevity from back and front benches

0:28:370:28:41

alike.

I also condemn these

despicable letters, following the

0:28:410:28:48

recent incident in my constituency

which I would classify as racist

0:28:480:28:59

abuse, can I confirm that that crime

will be classified correctly and not

0:28:590:29:02

just classified as a public order

offence?

Of course what any such

0:29:020:29:09

matter is an operational matter for

the police but I know she is such a

0:29:090:29:14

good advocate for her local

community but that she will be

0:29:140:29:17

asking searching key Western --

searching questions to make sure the

0:29:170:29:25

question receives the attention it

deserves.

The government is right to

0:29:250:29:29

say this is a hate crime which has

no place in our modern society and I

0:29:290:29:32

want to place my thanks to our

communities in Hounslow who have a

0:29:320:29:37

track record of working together to

create understanding. Will the

0:29:370:29:43

minister confirmed the police would

have the resources to work together

0:29:430:29:45

effectively and fast to track where

these horrific letters are coming

0:29:450:29:50

from, who is disseminating them, who

is behind them, and to make sure our

0:29:500:29:56

schools and communities have the

resources they need to stop this and

0:29:560:30:00

to support these committees which

will rightly feel at risk and under

0:30:000:30:02

threat?

The honourable lady has

identified that this has a threat

0:30:020:30:11

not just on those who received the

letters but also the wider

0:30:110:30:17

neighbourhood and please, ask anyone

who has received any of these

0:30:170:30:20

communications to report them to the

police and the Home Office is in

0:30:200:30:25

constant medication with the police

to make sure they have the resources

0:30:250:30:28

they need to tackle this -- constant

communication.

I join my honourable

0:30:280:30:35

friend in condemning these letters,

and in view of the similarities

0:30:350:30:37

between the anti-Muslim hate crime

and the anti-Semitism we have seen,

0:30:370:30:43

will she reassured me that the

action plan proposed by the

0:30:430:30:46

government will be adequate?

I'm

very grateful for the question and

0:30:460:30:52

he has a long record of supporting

our Jewish committees, and yes, the

0:30:520:30:59

hate crime action plan covers all

form of hatred as defined by the act

0:30:590:31:02

and sadly anti-Semitism forms part

of that.

The appalling letters that

0:31:020:31:10

we have seen have to be seen in the

context of the flames of prejudice

0:31:100:31:16

being found in mainstream newspapers

and in the comments made by

0:31:160:31:23

mainstream politicians against their

Muslim opponents and also in the

0:31:230:31:27

bystanders who are just as complicit

when in person or online they see

0:31:270:31:32

Pegida is on Facebook and other

social media platforms -- Basie

0:31:320:31:36

prejudice. -- they see prejudice.

And instead of tackling it they look

0:31:360:31:43

the other way, can I ask the

minister to confirm that the

0:31:430:31:47

government will take action against

this kind of extremism and also in

0:31:470:31:50

the weeks leading up to the first

week of April, every mosque receives

0:31:500:31:55

a visit from the police to give them

adequate security advice and make

0:31:550:31:58

sure that the Muslim community know

that the authorities are with them

0:31:580:32:02

and on their side?

The anti-Muslim

hatred working group is a group

0:32:020:32:07

which brings together all parties

across government and further afield

0:32:070:32:13

to try and tackle this specific form

of hate crime and one of the initial

0:32:130:32:18

achievements was to work with the

Society of editors to tackle

0:32:180:32:20

anti-Muslim hatred and more recently

with the independent press standards

0:32:200:32:27

organisation to develop training for

editors and journalists to tackle

0:32:270:32:31

the negative portrayal of Muslims in

the media. On his point about making

0:32:310:32:36

sure that mosques are visited in the

run-up to the date mentioned in the

0:32:360:32:42

letter, we will send letters happily

to each Chief Constable to make sure

0:32:420:32:47

they are aware of this and it is a

matter for chief constables but we

0:32:470:32:53

would expect that mosques will be

protected.

I also join with my

0:32:530:33:00

honourable friend in condemning

these letters but I also welcomed

0:33:000:33:03

the money that has been devoted to

protecting places of worship from

0:33:030:33:06

hate crime. Good my right honourable

friend also expand on this? -- code.

0:33:060:33:19

I'm happy to do this and it follows

on from the previous question, the

0:33:190:33:24

government has committed £2.4

million over three years to help

0:33:240:33:28

protect places of worship that have

been subject to or are vulnerable to

0:33:280:33:33

a hate attack and we hope this will

make people feel safe in their

0:33:330:33:40

places of worship.

You don't have to

have been taught media studies to

0:33:400:33:46

know that anti-Muslim sentiment is

comment -- becoming common in our

0:33:460:33:54

tabloid press, so could she have a

word with our friends in the Tory

0:33:540:34:01

press? These things feed into the

actions of extremists.

I hope

0:34:010:34:10

everyone in the house knows that as

the minister for crime and

0:34:100:34:13

safeguarding and von ability of

course I'm against language which

0:34:130:34:18

leads to the incitement of violence

and hate crime -- vulnerability. I

0:34:180:34:22

would help this debate that I would

hope this debate sends a clear

0:34:220:34:26

message to the people with whom she

is concerned.

As one house we all

0:34:260:34:31

find these letters are awful and our

constituents will feel the same but

0:34:310:34:38

can my honourable friend make sure

that police forces will tackle these

0:34:380:34:46

instances collaboratively?

Indeed,

we expect police forces to work

0:34:460:34:52

collaboratively especially online,

because online extremism and online

0:34:520:35:01

radicalisation knows no geographical

boundary and the police are well

0:35:010:35:04

versed sadly in working together to

tackle this form of hatred.

There

0:35:040:35:10

has been horror and revulsion at

these letters and I'm proud of our

0:35:100:35:18

record in standing up against hate

crime in the diverse timidity that

0:35:180:35:22

we live in Cardiff, but would the

minister agree that words social

0:35:220:35:26

media companies are simply not

enough? Does she share my concern

0:35:260:35:32

that representatives of these social

media companies said to me they

0:35:320:35:36

would not routinely search for

prescribed organisations? The very

0:35:360:35:44

basic level of what they are doing,

does she have a concern?

The Home

0:35:440:35:50

Secretary is focused on the conduct

and assistance that technology

0:35:500:35:54

companies can give to the police

nationally and locally in taking

0:35:540:35:57

down this awful material in this

goes across online with child sexual

0:35:570:36:10

expertise you and there is a great

0:36:100:36:13

this shows the ignorance of the

perpetrators, and the anonymity is

0:36:270:36:33

even more damaging online, so is it

not time not just to do more to take

0:36:330:36:37

them down once these things have

been posted but to stop them being

0:36:370:36:41

posted in the first place and make

sure that the identity of the people

0:36:410:36:46

posting has to be revealed before

they have these accounts?

The Home

0:36:460:36:52

Secretary was in California recently

to discuss these matters with the

0:36:520:36:55

online companies, the technology

companies, and the question of

0:36:550:37:01

anonymity is an issue which we are

looking at in terms of the internet

0:37:010:37:08

stretcher to -- internet strategy

because we want the UK to be the

0:37:080:37:17

safest place in the world to be

online.

This is the latest addition

0:37:170:37:23

to a long line of Islamophobic hate

crimes which have been sadly growing

0:37:230:37:28

over the last number of years in

courage by the undeniable rise of

0:37:280:37:31

the far right in Dost directly and

indirectly by leaders of powerful --

0:37:310:37:40

leaders and powerful figures across

the globe. Within increase in

0:37:400:37:46

religious hate crime of 267% since

2011, why has the government record

0:37:460:37:54

been so poor? -- with an.

Reflecting

on the overall tone of this urgent

0:37:540:38:02

question I'm not going to rise to

the debate but I think we can all

0:38:020:38:07

work together to call hate crime at

when it happens, and we have already

0:38:070:38:10

heard the forms in which it can take

including anti-Semitism and last

0:38:100:38:16

week the member for Grimsby spoke of

experiences in terms of the misogyny

0:38:160:38:21

which is not yet a hate crime but

which was the cause of much debate

0:38:210:38:24

last week. We are very clear and I

think the house has been very clear

0:38:240:38:29

today that this letter and these

letters, their sentiments, by our

0:38:290:38:33

holy awful and they are to be

condemned. -- they are entirely

0:38:330:38:38

awful and they are to be condemned.

0:38:380:38:43

What practical support is being

provided to help the targets of the

0:38:430:38:47

victims of hate crime?

I thank my

honourable friend for his question.

0:38:470:38:51

Of course we want first of all clues

for victims to report their

0:38:510:38:55

experience to the police. The police

are sadly aware of these events

0:38:550:39:01

today, and I hope are to be trusted

by the particular groups of people

0:39:010:39:10

concerned, and they will receive a

concerned and sensitive welcome from

0:39:100:39:14

the police in reporting these

crimes. There is much we are doing

0:39:140:39:18

as I have said already in the hate

crime action plan, and also trying

0:39:180:39:22

to tackle the root of

radicalisation, so that these awful

0:39:220:39:27

sentiments are not expressed in the

first place.

Anti-Muslim hate crimes

0:39:270:39:33

and anti-Semitic hate crime is

rising at such a shocking rate, this

0:39:330:39:36

sort of anonymous letter can strike

fear into whole communities. But

0:39:360:39:44

isn't it also the case that

anonymous social media is also

0:39:440:39:47

dissimilar problem and happens on a

daily basis? We have to confront

0:39:470:39:54

this question of anonymity in

shedding such bile. Will she address

0:39:540:39:58

this?

I have very much heard what

the house has said on this, as the

0:39:580:40:03

honourable gentleman will now, the

strategy was published last year,

0:40:030:40:08

and I would ensure that in terms of

anonymity, they are very much heard

0:40:080:40:16

by the Secretary of State to

culture, media and sport.

What makes

0:40:160:40:24

you British is not what you look

like, where your parents were from,

0:40:240:40:29

or how you worship, but the

contribution that you make to our

0:40:290:40:32

country. And nowhere has the

contribution made by British is and

0:40:320:40:39

is being greater than in the West

Midlands, which is why I will be

0:40:390:40:42

spending April the 3rd, which has

been identified as this day of hate,

0:40:420:40:48

I will be spending the day visiting

as many mosques and community

0:40:480:40:53

centres as possible across the

region to ensure Muslims in the West

0:40:530:40:57

Midlands of my support and

solidarity to show them I am on

0:40:570:41:00

their side, and I hope that other

members of the house will be doing

0:41:000:41:03

the same.

The honourable gentleman

has set out beautifully I think the

0:41:030:41:09

values that bind this house and our

countries together, and I wish him

0:41:090:41:15

luck on his visit to the many

mosques that must be there in the

0:41:150:41:21

West Midlands will stop

I welcome

the funding the Minister has

0:41:210:41:25

promised, but of course Muslims do

not only gather at places of

0:41:250:41:28

worship, so what reassurance can she

give to the many Muslim community

0:41:280:41:33

groups, schools where children

gather, other places which are not

0:41:330:41:36

specifically Muslim but where there

will be groups of Muslims, to give

0:41:360:41:39

them some reassurance that they will

have funding for extra security,

0:41:390:41:42

should that be needed, in Bristol

West?

I thank the honourable lady

0:41:420:41:47

for her question. As I say, the

government has not only pledged or

0:41:470:41:52

indeed spent up to £2.4 million over

three years, but of course we also

0:41:520:41:57

have the funding of tell Mama, which

is a very important, as it were,

0:41:570:42:01

intelligence tool, to help us or the

police understand where they need to

0:42:010:42:05

best focus their resources. If there

are particular areas in her

0:42:050:42:10

constituency about which she has

concerns, I would ask are pleased to

0:42:100:42:15

ensure her Chief Constable nose and

her Police and Crime Commissioner

0:42:150:42:17

knows, because they must be the ones

who make the operational decision.

0:42:170:42:22

My constituency are very worried

about the rise in hate crime. Is the

0:42:220:42:29

Minister satisfied that West

Yorkshire and further afield have

0:42:290:42:31

the police resources they need in

light of the significant cuts in

0:42:310:42:36

order to investigate and apprehend

those responsible for this abhorrent

0:42:360:42:39

crime?

Mr Speaker, it is about how

resources are spent, and that is

0:42:390:42:45

particularly relevant and pertinent

question of West Yorkshire, I can't

0:42:450:42:51

recall the figure of the top of my

head but I seem to recall that West

0:42:510:42:57

Yorkshire has several millions of

reserves in savings. Of course how

0:42:570:43:02

that is spent is a matter for the

elected Police and Crime

0:43:020:43:05

Commissioner. I hope you will be

taking up the Home Office's funding

0:43:050:43:11

initiative of increasing council tax

to make sure they have more money to

0:43:110:43:14

deal with the resource in issue.

I

have been deeply concerned about

0:43:140:43:18

these letters. Like with the Muslim

ban last year they feel unfairly

0:43:180:43:25

targeted and under siege. Whilst

this is obviously a target to target

0:43:250:43:32

the social media sites and so on,

these were snail mail. Can I pick up

0:43:320:43:36

on the Minister to pick out the

Minister from Feltham and Hastings,

0:43:360:43:40

can she update us on who sent these

letters, what is being done to stop

0:43:400:43:46

these letters and once those people

are apprehended, can she reassure my

0:43:460:43:50

constituents that they will feel the

full weight of the law?

I mustn't, I

0:43:500:43:58

can't go into more detail on the

specifics of the ongoing police

0:43:580:44:01

investigation, because she will not

want me or anyone asked to

0:44:010:44:05

inadvertently endanger any future

prosecution, but I can give her the

0:44:050:44:09

reassurance that this case is being

investigated very, very carefully,

0:44:090:44:13

and that the full force of the law

is being applied.

Anti-Semitic and

0:44:130:44:19

Islamic hate crime on the rise, it

is well documented but we'll soon

0:44:190:44:24

know there is significant

underreporting, and in my spirit and

0:44:240:44:28

by women. Hijabs wearing Muslim

women are often most honourable

0:44:280:44:32

because of their visibility. What

assurances can the minister Gibney

0:44:320:44:34

in terms of in the community that

the government is doing what it can

0:44:340:44:41

to ensure the message of reporting

all hate crime incidents is got out

0:44:410:44:47

into the community?

The honourable

lady has hit upon a very important

0:44:470:44:50

point: we must all do what we can to

encourage victims of hate crime,

0:44:500:44:54

whether it is to do with race,

religion, disability or gender

0:44:540:44:59

identity and so on, we must please

encourage people to report it

0:44:590:45:01

because we know that underreporting

is a real issue. We know also that

0:45:010:45:06

the work of organisations like tell

Mama I hope will help people find

0:45:060:45:11

the wherewithal to report those

incidents to the police.

I welcome

0:45:110:45:15

that we are all united in condemning

this despicable attempt to divide

0:45:150:45:22

our community. Since 2016, national

rhetoric and language has led to a

0:45:220:45:26

real increase in hate crime.

Government lead by example and

0:45:260:45:30

encourage everyone to turn down

national language and rhetoric?

Yes.

0:45:300:45:40

The Minister referred several times

to the £2.4 million funding under

0:45:400:45:43

the government's anti-hate scheme.

She also referred to just 45 places

0:45:430:45:48

of worship receiving funding. Are

there any plans to increase the

0:45:480:45:52

number of funding and the number of

places of worship that will attract

0:45:520:45:56

that funding?

May I write to the

honourable lady, because I am an

0:45:560:46:04

clear, I will confess, as to whether

applications are in June and I would

0:46:040:46:08

not wish to in any way inadvertently

answering correctly so I will answer

0:46:080:46:12

the lady by writing.

The best way to

build the longing, tolerance and

0:46:120:46:18

relationships is to invest in people

to come together and understanding.

0:46:180:46:26

In Oldham, they were completely

undermined by the government

0:46:260:46:28

snatching away the grant in 2010

with no assessment made on what

0:46:280:46:33

would impact would have.

Of course

we recognise the importance of

0:46:330:46:43

bringing communities together, and

there are many ways in which to do

0:46:430:46:47

that. The way in which my

constituency may enjoy being brought

0:46:470:46:50

together may be very different from

another constituency elsewhere in

0:46:500:46:53

the country. I'm not quite clear as

to the direct impact that honourable

0:46:530:47:00

gentleman said in relation to that

project but I will happily write to

0:47:000:47:03

him about it, thank you.

First of

all, can I condemn this letter along

0:47:030:47:11

with every body else, it is

apparent. It has been reported there

0:47:110:47:16

has been a spike in hate crime since

the EU referendum, both in

0:47:160:47:21

Islamophobia and anti-Semitism,

coming from the hard right and the

0:47:210:47:23

hard left. It is also reported by

the CPS that there has been a drop

0:47:230:47:30

in the number of prosecutions in

2017 by over 1000 against this

0:47:300:47:36

increase in incidents. What is the

Minister doing with the CPS and the

0:47:360:47:40

police to ensure that that is

reserved -- reversed?

We know there

0:47:400:47:45

has been a drop in referrals

recorded last year which has had an

0:47:450:47:49

impact on the number of completed

prosecutions in 2016 and 2017 and

0:47:490:47:53

the CPS is working with the police

at a local and national level to

0:47:530:47:56

understand the reasons for the

overall fall in referrals for the

0:47:560:47:59

past two years. But again the

message is pleased to spread around

0:47:590:48:03

our constituencies, if you have been

the victim of hate crime, please

0:48:030:48:06

report it because that way we can

try and do something about it.

Those

0:48:060:48:11

police forces like Greater

Manchester which have long targeted

0:48:110:48:13

hate crime and work hard with the

community nevertheless recognise

0:48:130:48:22

that community policing is central

to challenging hate crime. Will the

0:48:220:48:26

Minister take that message back,

because frankly the community

0:48:260:48:30

policing is about trust, and trust

is fundamental. We need our

0:48:300:48:33

community police.

I'm grateful to

the honourable gentleman. Of course

0:48:330:48:40

local policing is important, but we

also have to recognise that we can't

0:48:400:48:44

just rely on policing alone to reach

into communities, and not just to

0:48:440:48:50

reach into, but to build

relationships. This is why

0:48:500:48:54

organisations like Tell Mama and

other charities are such an

0:48:540:48:56

important part of the overall

picture of people when they feel

0:48:560:49:02

they have been the victims of crime,

they know what to do, where to go,

0:49:020:49:06

and they feel they will be listened

to and their experiences will be

0:49:060:49:10

acted upon.

It is quite clear the

whole house condemns these letters

0:49:100:49:16

but it is not just those sending the

letters causing this hate, not just

0:49:160:49:20

groups like Britain first was that

it includes groups like the BMP. My

0:49:200:49:26

honourable friend and I received a

letter from the BNP with a poem

0:49:260:49:30

making racist comments, and on the

back of the letter, would the

0:49:300:49:37

Minister condemn the actions of the

BMP and so there should be no part

0:49:370:49:41

in political parties who peddle this

hate?

I am absolutely clear that the

0:49:410:49:46

British National Party and all the

other far right organisations that

0:49:460:49:51

have been described today have no

place in our society, and frankly

0:49:510:49:55

they're showing at ballot box is

when they dared to stand for

0:49:550:49:59

election shows how little truck the

British public have with them.

0:49:590:50:05

Urgent question, Caroline Lucas.

Mr

Speaker, to ask the Leader of the

0:50:050:50:10

House about the treatment of House

of Commons staff.

The Leader of the

0:50:100:50:14

House, Andrea Leadsom.

Thank you, Mr

Speaker. I am grateful to the

0:50:140:50:19

honourable lady for a question. She

and I worked together on a

0:50:190:50:23

cross-party working group on an

independent complaints and grievance

0:50:230:50:27

policy, and I thank sincerely for

her work on it. Reports of bullying

0:50:270:50:29

of house staff are of huge concern

to me, and to honourable members

0:50:290:50:35

right across the house. I am

committed to stamping out all kinds

0:50:350:50:43

of bullying and harassment in

Parliament in order to create an

0:50:430:50:47

environment in which everyone feels

safe and is treated with the respect

0:50:470:50:51

and dignity that they deserve. We

can only achieve our goals in this

0:50:510:50:55

house with the support of others. A

great debt of gratitude is owed by

0:50:550:51:00

us all to the house staff who

support us behind the scenes. I

0:51:000:51:06

myself have worked with a large knob

of civil servants and staff of the

0:51:060:51:09

house during my time in Parliament,

from the clerks of the Treasury

0:51:090:51:13

Select Committee to my private

offices at the Treasury, in energy

0:51:130:51:18

and Defra, and now to the team in

the leaders's office, and the

0:51:180:51:23

excellent secretariat that supported

the working group. I have always

0:51:230:51:25

been impressed and I am very

grateful for the dedication,

0:51:250:51:31

professionalism, high standards and

courtesy that all the civil servants

0:51:310:51:35

and house staff have shown. I know

that many honourable and right

0:51:350:51:38

honourable members across the house,

and in the other place, would say

0:51:380:51:44

the same. The house will be aware

that significant progress has been

0:51:440:51:48

made in recent months following the

shocking report at the end of last

0:51:480:51:53

year of sexual harassment, bullying

and intimidation in this place. The

0:51:530:51:56

working group that I'd shared set up

by the Prime Minister has now

0:51:560:52:00

published its report and it has been

agreed by both houses -- that I

0:52:000:52:05

chaired. Questions are in place to

get the new independence complaint

0:52:050:52:10

procedure up and running within the

next three months. The honourable

0:52:100:52:13

lady will recall that the working

group wanted house staff to be

0:52:130:52:17

included in the new complaints

procedure from day one. However,

0:52:170:52:22

following evidence taken and in

consultation with the trade union

0:52:220:52:27

representatives of house staff, it

was agreed that the staff of the

0:52:270:52:30

house would not immediately be

covered by the new independent

0:52:300:52:34

procedure, because they were already

covered by the house's own respect

0:52:340:52:37

policy. It was believed that the

respect policy was working well and

0:52:370:52:43

that house staff were satisfied with

it. However, it was acknowledged

0:52:430:52:49

during the working group evidence

sessions that the respect policy did

0:52:490:52:52

not cover complaints of sexual

harassment and violence, and the

0:52:520:52:57

aspiration of the working groups is

to take up the question of whether

0:52:570:53:01

house staff should have immediate

access to the new independent

0:53:010:53:06

complaints procedure, now that the

report has been agreed by both

0:53:060:53:08

houses. And following the Newsnight

allegations, and others, it is clear

0:53:080:53:15

that the respect policy may not be

sufficient to protect house staff.

0:53:150:53:22

I'm aware that the clerk of the

House of Commons has written to

0:53:220:53:26

staff saying they are unresolved

issues over bullying and harassment

0:53:260:53:29

including sexual harassment which

needs to be addressed and this will

0:53:290:53:34

include a review of the respect

policy. The clerk of the House of

0:53:340:53:38

Commons has also reassured staff who

wish to come forward with complaints

0:53:380:53:42

of bullying that they will be dealt

with in the proper manner with the

0:53:420:53:47

support of their managers and

colleagues. It is right that

0:53:470:53:50

everyone working for or with

parliament regardless of position or

0:53:500:53:56

seniority should have the same

rights and protections and should be

0:53:560:54:00

held to the same high standards. The

house commission next meets on

0:54:000:54:07

Monday the 19th of March next

Monday, and I've given notice to my

0:54:070:54:12

fellow members I will be

recommending a short and dependent

0:54:120:54:14

the lead inquiry by the house

commission looking into allegations

0:54:140:54:20

of systemic bullying of

Parliamentary staff -- independent.

0:54:200:54:25

I will propose the inquiry should

hear from past and current staff

0:54:250:54:29

members about their experiences and

help to provide them with closure

0:54:290:54:32

where ever possible. I would also

propose that it should take

0:54:320:54:37

soundings from current and former

house staff on whether the respect

0:54:370:54:41

policy is fit for purpose and

whether house staff would be better

0:54:410:54:45

served by having access to the new

independent complaints and grievance

0:54:450:54:49

policy from the first day. I'm more

determined than ever that we banish

0:54:490:54:56

all kinds of harassment and bullying

from this place because make no

0:54:560:55:01

mistake there is a need for change.

Caroline Lucas.

Thank you for

0:55:010:55:08

granting this urgent cross-party

question, and this isn't about party

0:55:080:55:12

politics and political gain, it is

about doing the right thing by the

0:55:120:55:18

staff who support us on a daily

basis and making sure the House of

0:55:180:55:21

Commons leads by example would it

comes to robust lead tackling

0:55:210:55:24

workplace bullying and sexual

misconduct. Members of the public

0:55:240:55:28

will be shocked by the revelations

of bullying at Westminster which

0:55:280:55:31

were highlighted by Newsnight last

week and I commend the leader for

0:55:310:55:35

her ongoing work to establish the

siege and the need for that because

0:55:350:55:41

of the respect policy did not apply

to large numbers of those working in

0:55:410:55:45

Parliament -- established that.

There are now considerable grounds

0:55:450:55:50

to make sure the same policy does

not have the confidence of the staff

0:55:500:55:54

it is intended to protect and that

the new procedure must be expanded

0:55:540:55:58

to avoid a two tier system so

ungrateful to the leader of the

0:55:580:56:04

house that she broadly agrees with

that and I'm pleased to hear about a

0:56:040:56:07

new short inquiry but will she also

confirmed very specifically that

0:56:070:56:11

there will be a presumption in

favour of historic allegations being

0:56:110:56:14

thoroughly investigated should those

affected choose to make formal

0:56:140:56:19

complaints, either under the respect

policy or the new procedure? Will

0:56:190:56:24

she acknowledge the positive work

she has led to date risks being

0:56:240:56:27

undermined if we continue to allow

sanctions to be determined by a

0:56:270:56:31

committee on which MPs are

effectively hold all the power? Will

0:56:310:56:36

she agree that the whole process

including sanctions must be handled

0:56:360:56:39

by an independent body? Will she

revisit whether good employer and

0:56:390:56:45

consent training is an important

part of culture change should start

0:56:450:56:48

before the next election? The

evidence is clear that it should. In

0:56:480:56:52

the meantime can she make sure that

further complaints will be treated

0:56:520:56:58

with the seriousness and respect

which they deserve and will not be

0:56:580:57:00

dismissed as they were last Friday

as grotesque exaggeration.

The

0:57:000:57:07

leader of the house.

As I've already

mentioned I certainly agree with the

0:57:070:57:17

honourable lady and it was the

aspiration of the working group to

0:57:170:57:20

cover all staff working here in

Parliament including staff of the

0:57:200:57:27

house in our independent complaints

procedure from the first day, and I

0:57:270:57:29

share her concern that we should now

take steps to make sure that that

0:57:290:57:34

does become the case as soon as that

independent policy is up and running

0:57:340:57:39

which we intend to be within three

months from now. Regarding the bond

0:57:390:57:43

about historic allegations she will

recall the working group made clear

0:57:430:57:52

we will deal with historic

allegations and it will be down to

0:57:520:57:56

the working group to establish how

that can be done. What the clerk of

0:57:560:58:00

the House of Commons has made clear

is that he will be looking to

0:58:000:58:03

provide that reassurance to House

staff that any historic allegations

0:58:030:58:09

will be properly dealt with in the

future. She mentions sanctions that

0:58:090:58:14

those must be independent, that has

been a part of the work of the

0:58:140:58:18

working group and we are now looking

very carefully and closely at how

0:58:180:58:22

that impacts on the work of the

independent Parliamentary

0:58:220:58:24

Commissioner for standards and the

standards committee itself where

0:58:240:58:30

there are both Parliamentary members

and lay members and that work is

0:58:300:58:35

ongoing and later today I'm looking

forward to meeting with the

0:58:350:58:38

standards committee to have exactly

the start of those discussions. She

0:58:380:58:42

mentions consent training and in the

working group we were clear that

0:58:420:58:47

consent training should be something

that all people not only who employ

0:58:470:58:52

staff but who come into contact with

other people, should be very clear

0:58:520:58:55

about what constitutes consent and

precisely what doesn't and I can

0:58:550:59:04

assure the honourable lady I'm clear

to provide the carrot that people

0:59:040:59:08

want to take up the training but we

did not have the levers at the time

0:59:080:59:11

as we said to make it compulsory.

And I totally share her desire to

0:59:110:59:18

see all staff here treated with the

dignity and respect that everybody

0:59:180:59:21

in this place deserves.

Mark Harper.

Can I welcome what the leader of the

0:59:210:59:31

house said about her short inquiry,

and it seems to me a good test for

0:59:310:59:34

her to adopt is to make sure that

this house does what all

0:59:340:59:38

organisations should do which is to

make sure that everybody that works

0:59:380:59:42

here whether they work for members

of Parliament or they work for the

0:59:420:59:46

house have the same processes and

can be expecting to be treated to

0:59:460:59:49

the same high standards and can she

bring that measure in as soon as she

0:59:490:59:56

can.

I completely agree and I can

assure him that that is the

0:59:561:00:01

aspiration of the working group and

that is my personal goal.

Thank you.

1:00:011:00:08

It is noted that you have granted

the urgent question even though you

1:00:081:00:13

are one of the people mentioned in

media reports, but no one, critics

1:00:131:00:17

or otherwise can deny your

commitment to accountability and

1:00:171:00:21

transparency and attempt to move the

house forward, recognising diversity

1:00:211:00:27

and modern customs and practice. The

opposition take all allegations

1:00:271:00:32

seriously and we want to accommodate

everyone and I don't want to, Don

1:00:321:00:39

individual cases, that is a matter

for authorities, but I want to ask

1:00:391:00:44

the leader of the house, is she

aware of any formal complaints that

1:00:441:00:47

have been instigated on the basis of

the cases that have been reported

1:00:471:00:49

and if so when? She has suggested an

inquiry, and I'm very pleased that

1:00:491:00:56

we can have this discussion at the

commission and we look forward to

1:00:561:00:59

that. Some cases predate the respect

policy and I know that as a result

1:00:591:01:05

of the work streams following the

report of the working group into

1:01:051:01:08

sexual harassment and bullying that

that is also being amended and that

1:01:081:01:13

there will be a new behaviour code

and procedure that covers everyone

1:01:131:01:17

working on the estate and in our

constituencies. It is imperative

1:01:171:01:23

that all staff working here feel

they can raise any complaints and

1:01:231:01:26

grievances immediately. Can the

leader that has confirmed that she

1:01:261:01:31

would agree to the president of the

staff attending the steering group

1:01:311:01:35

which I previously requested. The

working group published its report

1:01:351:01:42

in 2018, the steering group is

monitoring the work carried out and

1:01:421:01:47

I'm pleased they said permanent

secretariat -- there is a permanent

1:01:471:01:53

secretariat. The further work is

being regressed to make sure that

1:01:531:01:57

the grievance policy put into place

is fair and robust. It is only when

1:01:571:02:02

that is tested will we know if they

work. There will be a continual

1:02:021:02:08

process to find them until they are

effective so everyone has confidence

1:02:081:02:11

in them. Can the leader of the house

say, and she has touched on the

1:02:111:02:18

figure of three months, but we need

to balance speed with making sure

1:02:181:02:21

there is an effective process,

whether this work will be completed

1:02:211:02:25

by three months or at least by

summer before the house rises? The

1:02:251:02:31

opposition Labour Party takes all

complaints of sexual harassment and

1:02:311:02:34

abuse and discrimination extremely

seriously so that anyone with a

1:02:341:02:37

complaint comes forward and that all

allegations can be fully

1:02:371:02:43

investigated and any appropriate

disciplinary action taken in line

1:02:431:02:46

with the party's procedures. All of

us have the utmost respect for the

1:02:461:02:54

house clerks and any of us have had

dealings with them on the various

1:02:541:02:58

select committees know they are

experts in their field and they

1:02:581:03:01

offer vital assistance and advice to

everyone. But I know everyone who

1:03:011:03:08

works in whatever capacity knows

that they play a vital role in

1:03:081:03:13

making sure that our Parliament and

our democracy thrives.

The leader of

1:03:131:03:19

the house.

I thank the shadow leader

of the house for her remarks and

1:03:191:03:26

also I'm grateful to her for the

part she played in the working group

1:03:261:03:30

on setting up the independent

complaints procedure and it was

1:03:301:03:32

notable that there was unanimous

support for establishment that

1:03:321:03:39

independent procedure which the

whole house can be very pleased

1:03:391:03:41

about. Regarding her specific

questions, GR is whether unaware of

1:03:411:03:47

specific formal complaints and it

was not in the terms of reference of

1:03:471:03:51

the working group -- she asks

whether I'm aware. It was not in the

1:03:511:04:00

terms of reference to consider

specific requests, but that I've had

1:04:001:04:04

a number of people come to me and

I've sought to deal where ever

1:04:041:04:07

possible with complaints that have

been brought to me but I don't

1:04:071:04:09

propose to discuss any specific

allegations in the chamber. She asks

1:04:091:04:15

about a review of the respect policy

for house staff and I can say to her

1:04:151:04:23

that reading from the letter of the

clerk of the house to house staff

1:04:231:04:27

today, he says there are unresolved

issues over bullying and harassment

1:04:271:04:30

including sexual harassment which

need to be addressed and the clerk

1:04:301:04:33

of the house goes on to say that we

will read this it and renew the

1:04:331:04:36

respect policy. -- revisit. She asks

whether the house authorities trade

1:04:361:04:43

union representative will be invited

to join the steering group and I

1:04:431:04:48

believe that has happened, and she

asks when will be finalised

1:04:481:04:53

procedures be finished. We have set

the aspiration that the bulk of it

1:04:531:04:59

is done within three months and

there will be a final vote in this

1:04:591:05:06

house on changes necessary to

standing orders and to adopt the

1:05:061:05:09

behaviour code and we certainly

expect and hope that will be before

1:05:091:05:13

the house rises in the summary says.

-- summer recess for the.

Is it

1:05:131:05:23

appropriate for Mr speaker to remain

in his place when there are

1:05:231:05:26

allegations against him which he is

trying to suppress using taxpayer

1:05:261:05:28

funded money by sending out letters

through speakers cancelled. --

1:05:281:05:35

speaker's council.

The leader of the

house.

It is vital that all

1:05:351:05:41

colleagues join together in

supporting the efforts being made by

1:05:411:05:44

this house to stamp out all bullying

and harassment where ever we see it

1:05:441:05:48

and to make sure that everybody will

be treated in the future with the

1:05:481:05:53

respect and dignity that they

deserve.

Can I congratulate the

1:05:531:06:03

honourable lady for securing this

urgent question and she like me will

1:06:031:06:06

face these urgent questions, and it

is something that comes as it'll

1:06:061:06:12

surprise to any of us who has

listened to the evidence as part of

1:06:121:06:17

the working group -- little

surprise. This endemic culture has

1:06:171:06:26

got to be tackled and I'm sure the

house is confident in the

1:06:261:06:29

independent inquiry. Does the leader

of the house agree that historical

1:06:291:06:36

allegations must be considered and

does she support the view that we

1:06:361:06:41

will be helping victims past and

present if we respond to such

1:06:411:06:45

allegations? This is all part of the

normalisation of bullying and

1:06:451:06:50

harassment which continues to poison

our politics. ... And last, does she

1:06:501:07:03

share that all members, whether they

work for this house or members of

1:07:031:07:08

Parliament, are covered by the new

behaviour code and will have access

1:07:081:07:13

to the new complaints procedure as

quickly as possible.

I would like to

1:07:131:07:19

pay tribute to the honourable

gentleman for his part in the

1:07:191:07:21

working group, he was assiduously

attending meetings and taking a full

1:07:211:07:24

part in the work and I'm grateful to

him for his contribution. He asked

1:07:241:07:31

how the independent inquiry will be

conducted and clearly my intention

1:07:311:07:35

is to make this proposal to the

house commission and it will be a

1:07:351:07:38

matter for the commission to agree

whether to do that or not at the

1:07:381:07:43

house commission is made up of a

number of members from across the

1:07:431:07:45

house including one from his own

party but I would like to sit

1:07:451:07:51

carried out by an independent

individual who can hear from past

1:07:511:07:53

and current members of the staff of

the house so that person can be free

1:07:531:08:01

of any input from either employers

or indeed parliamentarians. And

1:08:011:08:06

people can feel they can come

forward in confidence. I completely

1:08:061:08:10

agree with him, it would be letting

people down if we fail to deal with

1:08:101:08:14

it and it is vital that those who

have passed allegations who feel the

1:08:141:08:19

time has passed for them to doubt

with seriously, can achieve some

1:08:191:08:22

closure by coming forward and be

heard in that way, and I also agree

1:08:221:08:27

that it is demeaning to this house

and to all of us if we fail to get a

1:08:271:08:31

grip on it and that is why this

house has shown such commitment is

1:08:311:08:36

setting up an independent complaints

and grievance policy which is the

1:08:361:08:38

right way forward.

1:08:381:08:43

I very much welcome the leader's

statement, and she agree with me

1:08:431:08:48

that sometimes the accused can be

victims too? And that is why it is

1:08:481:08:52

so important that we have an

independent enquiry. But would she

1:08:521:08:56

also agree with me that the House of

Commons commission would not be an

1:08:561:09:02

independent judge or jury, and

indeed would not be seen to be as

1:09:021:09:05

such, simply because of the very

membership of that commission, and

1:09:051:09:10

that it does need to be an

independent individual, or group of

1:09:101:09:14

individuals?

Of course my honourable

friend raises an important point,

1:09:141:09:23

and during the working group

evidence sessions, we were very

1:09:231:09:26

conscious that it is important to

protect both complainants, who are

1:09:261:09:30

at the heart of the independent

complaints procedure, but also the

1:09:301:09:34

alleged perpetrator. It is important

that justice is seen to be done, and

1:09:341:09:39

that all parties are properly

supported. He is also right to say

1:09:391:09:44

that an enquiry led by the house

commission could not be independent,

1:09:441:09:48

which is why my recommendation to

the house commission would be that

1:09:481:09:51

it should be an independently lead

enquiry into allegations of

1:09:511:09:55

bullying.

Can I say to the Leader of

the House that when she chooses, as

1:09:551:10:03

she has done today, to focus on the

thoroughness and decency of the

1:10:031:10:09

process of dealing with these

issues, she will get support from

1:10:091:10:11

right across this house? And she has

mentioned several times the

1:10:111:10:18

involvement of trade union

representatives, so would she just

1:10:181:10:22

join me in asserting that it is

right that members of our staff and

1:10:221:10:25

members of staff of this house are

members of trade unions if they

1:10:251:10:30

choose to be, and that their

representatives ought to be involved

1:10:301:10:34

at every stage of this process?

The

honourable lady gives me the

1:10:341:10:41

opportunity to thank and pay tribute

to the very good staff

1:10:411:10:44

representatives who were on the

working group, a representative from

1:10:441:10:51

Unite, working as a researcher for a

member of the Labour Party, the

1:10:511:10:56

representative of the members and

peers staff Association who works

1:10:561:11:01

for a member of the Conservative

Party and a representative of the

1:11:011:11:05

NUJ, who works for the Scottish

Nationalists here. They all made a

1:11:051:11:08

great contribution and are to be

commended for their contributions.

1:11:081:11:14

Does my right honourable friend

agree that unfortunately the system

1:11:141:11:17

we have at the moment is that House

of Commons staff believe that they

1:11:171:11:22

make a complaint about bullying and

harassment it would be taken

1:11:221:11:25

seriously and secondly they believe

it will be seriously detrimental to

1:11:251:11:30

their future career? I welcome the

fact we will have an independent

1:11:301:11:33

investigation into the allegations

we heard on Newsnight. When will

1:11:331:11:37

that start and when will it

complete?

The house commission meets

1:11:371:11:41

next Monday. I will be making that

recommendation there and then that

1:11:411:11:46

will start as soon as possible.

The

house is exceptionally well served

1:11:461:11:53

by de Klerk star. I think that is a

matter of common accord, so surely I

1:11:531:11:58

hope it goes without saying that

these complaints required to be

1:11:581:12:02

investigated with the rigour in a

conference of and independently. Mr

1:12:021:12:08

Speaker, when you and I first

entered the house, the house was

1:12:081:12:12

almost entirely self-regulating. The

position today is very, very

1:12:121:12:16

different, but that change has come

in a way that is piecemeal. What

1:12:161:12:22

surely now is required is a proper

comprehensibility again at the

1:12:221:12:28

question of Parliamentary privilege

and self-regulation. So can I say in

1:12:281:12:34

welcoming the short independent

enquiry that the leader seeks to

1:12:341:12:37

establish that once that is done,

she should apply her mind to

1:12:371:12:40

revisiting the work of the joint

committee set up in 1998 to look at

1:12:401:12:46

the question of the extent of

definition of Parliamentary

1:12:461:12:53

privilege?

I think the right

honourable gentleman makes a very

1:12:531:12:56

interesting observation and I will

certainly look at it.

Does the

1:12:561:13:01

Leader of the House agree with me

that every single individual

1:13:011:13:05

complete made against a member

reflects badly on each and every one

1:13:051:13:09

of us in this place? And given the

Newsnight allegation that the

1:13:091:13:12

policies and play was not up to

scratch, and certainly was something

1:13:121:13:16

we decided amongst ourselves, though

she agree with me that we not only

1:13:161:13:21

need an independent investigation

but we also need an external

1:13:211:13:24

independent body to establish our

board policy going forward?

I hope I

1:13:241:13:31

can reassure my honourable friend

that the independence grievance

1:13:311:13:34

policy we are in the process of

establishing will ensure that the

1:13:341:13:38

culture in this place changes to the

benefit of all who work here. But I

1:13:381:13:42

would also just like to say that

many honourable members are very

1:13:421:13:48

troubled by these allegations. That

is as ever a small minority of

1:13:481:13:52

people who behave badly and he is

right to point out that it demeans

1:13:521:13:55

all of us when a fewer of us behave

badly.

Mr Speaker, having been in

1:13:551:14:01

the house quite a long time, I

recall in nearly days that if

1:14:011:14:07

warnings to particularly young women

of this house was not just a certain

1:14:071:14:10

small group of members of parliament

but some senior clerks who were

1:14:101:14:14

known to be bullies, and as chair of

the anti-bullying group of MPs for

1:14:141:14:20

some years, I have been fighting

everyone's corner in that respect,

1:14:201:14:24

and I have to say in recent years I

have never known a speaker as

1:14:241:14:30

strong, in terms of reforming that

particular part of our lives. But

1:14:301:14:34

can I urge her to get on with as

quickly. We want justice to be seen

1:14:341:14:39

and to be seen to be done, but I

also want this committee to know

1:14:391:14:45

there are certain, only a tiny

minority of members of this house

1:14:451:14:48

have used this, it is a must like a

new kind of McCarthyism, you know,

1:14:481:14:51

to name someone from someone is put

into purge on that side or the side

1:14:511:14:57

with no redress, dreadful things

happening to their families, one

1:14:571:15:02

doesn't even know what happens to

the families and the members who are

1:15:021:15:08

accused. There is a danger of a kind

of political McCarthyism that we

1:15:081:15:11

also have two stamp out in this

place.

So again I would remind the

1:15:111:15:16

honourable gentleman the independent

complaints procedure will be exactly

1:15:161:15:20

that, it will be independent, it

will be confidential, so that

1:15:201:15:23

complainants who very often don't

want to come forward, for fear of

1:15:231:15:26

having to then deal with the person

they are accusing, so they will come

1:15:261:15:32

forward in confidence. The alleged

perpetrator will also be able to

1:15:321:15:37

have their side of the story hurt in

confidence. There will therefore be

1:15:371:15:42

natural justice rules applied to the

entire process, but there will also

1:15:421:15:46

be very serious sanctions for

wrongdoing. I genuinely believe that

1:15:461:15:49

this work will change the culture in

Parliament. It will take us to a new

1:15:491:15:53

stage where people can come forward

and it will make people think twice

1:15:531:15:57

about some of their attitudes.

I

appreciate there may be problems

1:15:571:16:02

with definition. Lots of these cases

would have been investigated and

1:16:021:16:06

often at best the details will be

sketchy at this stage. But can the

1:16:061:16:10

Leader of the House give a house an

indication of the scale of this

1:16:101:16:13

issue? How many cases of abuse of

house or members staff have been

1:16:131:16:18

brought to her attention in her

recent dealings with this issue?

I

1:16:181:16:24

don't really think I can give my

honourable friend and idea of the

1:16:241:16:30

scale of the problem. I think like

all honourable members different

1:16:301:16:34

cases appear in the media and it is

very difficult to understand the

1:16:341:16:39

enormity and range of the problem.

But suffice to say that going

1:16:391:16:43

forward I think across this house we

are determined to see change for the

1:16:431:16:46

better.

I welcome the Leader of the

House's emphasis she has placed on

1:16:461:16:52

June process, -- due process, and

complainants have to be taken

1:16:521:16:59

seriously. The person who is being

complaint against also has rights

1:16:591:17:04

and a case should be heard on the

basis of evidence. I think that is

1:17:041:17:08

really a potent in this whole

process will stop Krygios of say a

1:17:081:17:11

word about the independent

commission of Parliamentary

1:17:111:17:15

standards that we currently have,

and they can be put to the

1:17:151:17:22

Parliamentary privileges committee.

That is also a route that needs to

1:17:221:17:26

be incorporated into the new process

she is envisaging.

The honourable

1:17:261:17:31

gentleman is exactly right and

indeed that is part of the process.

1:17:311:17:34

Very specifically, it is heard in

confidence, and if there is a

1:17:341:17:40

finding against the alleged

perpetrator that would then in the

1:17:401:17:43

case of a member of Parliament being

complained about go to the

1:17:431:17:48

Parliamentary Commissioner for

standards, who would either carry

1:17:481:17:49

out an appeal and look at the

evidence again or find against the

1:17:491:17:55

member, or find that there is no

cause to answer, and then she will

1:17:551:17:59

have expanded sanctions at a lower

level, or indeed she will pass it

1:17:591:18:02

onto the committee for standards for

them to consider, including

1:18:021:18:06

recommending suspension to this

house, which could lead to the

1:18:061:18:10

recall of members of Parliament act

2015 being invoked.

Does the Leader

1:18:101:18:17

of the House agree that any member

of staff who feels that he or she

1:18:171:18:24

has been bullied must have an

absolute guarantee that their career

1:18:241:18:30

will not suffer in any way if they

make a complaint? And if they have

1:18:301:18:37

that guarantee, does she agree that

the reputation of members of

1:18:371:18:42

Parliament should not be sullied by

accusations that they are bullies

1:18:421:18:46

unless a complaint against them has

actually been made?

Yes, I think my

1:18:461:18:53

honourable friend sums it up very

well. It is vital that complainants

1:18:531:18:57

are protected, so they can come

forward in confidence and not be

1:18:571:19:01

further victimised, but it is also

essential that people who are

1:19:011:19:06

complained about have the

opportunity to put their side of the

1:19:061:19:09

story, and to receive proper

justice.

Can I commend the leader of

1:19:091:19:19

this house on their counterparts and

indeed you yourself Mr Speaker in

1:19:191:19:22

response to these issues so far. As

the Leader of the House agree with

1:19:221:19:25

me that this is a moment for each

and every one of us to reflect on

1:19:251:19:30

our behaviour and constantly reflect

on our behaviour? Because it is not

1:19:301:19:34

about what we judge to deem the

appropriate behaviour but how we

1:19:341:19:39

make others feel is the critical

issue, and that is why the

1:19:391:19:43

independent nature of her proposals

is so critical, because this has to

1:19:431:19:46

be without political fear or favour,

or political campaigns against

1:19:461:19:52

opponents or anybody else, so that

people can come forward in that

1:19:521:19:54

regard.

Yes, she's exactly right.

The power dynamic, the idea that you

1:19:541:20:01

behave is not necessarily how you

are seen to behave, is incredibly

1:20:011:20:06

important in this, and certainly in

the working Group evidence we took a

1:20:061:20:09

lot of witness statements about

exactly that and it is vital that we

1:20:091:20:15

take that into account.

Due process

sometimes takes a very long time.

1:20:151:20:22

Could I ask the Leader of the House

too insular that due process pull to

1:20:221:20:28

ensure that due process should be as

speedily as possible in the case of

1:20:281:20:31

everyone?

I completely agree with my

honourable friend and I think we are

1:20:311:20:36

quite proud that we move very

quickly with the independent

1:20:361:20:40

complaints procedure but at the same

time we are doing a thorough job and

1:20:401:20:43

that is our plan.

The industrial

tribunal has to be registered under

1:20:431:20:51

the Ministry of Justice. In the

interest of transparency, will the

1:20:511:20:56

Leader of the House publish all

industrial tribunal applications

1:20:561:21:02

that have been registered against

members of Parliament or indeed

1:21:021:21:04

against the House of Commons?

I

don't believe that would be a matter

1:21:041:21:10

for me that I would certainly look

into it.

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Can

1:21:101:21:17

I put on record my support for the

work that the Leader of the House

1:21:171:21:21

and the speaker and all the numbers

have been doing since November on

1:21:211:21:26

this issue. She agree with me that

we need to take the politics out of

1:21:261:21:29

this altogether? If people are to

have confidence that we truly are

1:21:291:21:35

listening, that victims will be

believed and that we will have a

1:21:351:21:39

proper process, then it is time for

professionals, not the press or

1:21:391:21:44

political expediency, to lead this

process?

I completely agree with the

1:21:441:21:49

honourable lady, the Independent is

absolutely vital.

I can assure you I

1:21:491:21:56

have great respect for all staff I

work with, but I was also the guinea

1:21:561:22:00

pig in 2012 after a record phone

hacking report for the original

1:22:001:22:05

respect policy. I was flayed by

selective leaking then six years ago

1:22:051:22:10

and it has just happened again now,

so I would ask the Leader of the

1:22:101:22:14

House and honourable members before

they jump to judgment after what was

1:22:141:22:18

a very one-sided selective BBC

broadcast that they approached the

1:22:181:22:20

cases that have been raised in a

more balanced way, and that they

1:22:201:22:24

also consider the reasons why the

original respect policy was scrapped

1:22:241:22:29

in the first place as not fit for

purpose. But they also give

1:22:291:22:35

consideration to the disparity of

report of MPs that are complained

1:22:351:22:38

against especially when the

complaints have the backing of the

1:22:381:22:41

very well resourced First Division

's Association in particular.

1:22:411:22:45

Perhaps finally I might ask the

house to consider why historical old

1:22:451:22:49

allegations like this are being

selected and recycled now and by

1:22:491:22:52

whom, because whatever is at play,

this is not a game, for reputations

1:22:521:22:56

or families.

What I've would say to

the honourable gentleman is that the

1:22:561:23:04

advantage of an independent

complaints procedure is that it

1:23:041:23:09

exists, and will exist, for people

to be able to come forward with

1:23:091:23:12

confidence, and with

confidentiality, and what that means

1:23:121:23:16

is they at long last to have

somewhere they can go and make their

1:23:161:23:20

complaint without just going

straight to the press, which, as he

1:23:201:23:23

raises, has caused some

difficulties.

1:23:231:23:33

The working group recommends

training by the end of Parliament

1:23:331:23:35

and clearly that is inappropriate,

with they make sure that everyone

1:23:351:23:39

has face-to-face training within

this year? -- with they make sure.

1:23:391:23:45

You're not quite right, trading is

essential for all members across the

1:23:451:23:48

house in a wide variety of areas --

training. There are measures brought

1:23:481:23:53

forward to encourage people to take

training and we have said in their

1:23:531:23:56

in Dutch and new members will

receive compulsory training -- in

1:23:561:24:01

their induction.

Could the leader of

the house clarify that if a member

1:24:011:24:06

of the House of Commons staff raises

a complaint in the next few days,

1:24:061:24:12

what policy or procedure with that

complaint be dealt with?

Currently

1:24:121:24:17

members of house staff who are

complaining about allegations of

1:24:171:24:23

bullying or inappropriate behaviour

will come under the house respect

1:24:231:24:26

policy which was established a few

years back. What the working group

1:24:261:24:32

is doing is creating an independent

and paints procedure and the house

1:24:321:24:37

staff were not going to be subject

or able to take advantage of the

1:24:371:24:41

independent complaints procedure and

it is that that we now want to look

1:24:411:24:45

at again -- independent complaints

procedure. I have huge respect for

1:24:451:24:52

the staff of this

1:24:521:24:54

and my experiences have been

excellent, but can I add

my voice to

1:24:561:25:02

those who are calling for due

process, we have got to be

1:25:021:25:11

respectful of the complainant and

the subject of the complaint, and we

1:25:111:25:20

have got to be wary of prejudicing

any process or give the impression

1:25:201:25:23

that it is politicised or

personalised in the way they

1:25:231:25:28

approach it.

What I can say, the

working group put the complainant at

1:25:281:25:34

the heart of this procedure and what

was very clear from the evidence is

1:25:341:25:38

that people will only come forward

if they feel they will be treated in

1:25:381:25:42

confidence and then they won't be

plastered all over the newspapers.

1:25:421:25:52

Bullying and harassment occur in all

walks of life and in all

1:25:521:25:56

professions, and whilst important if

the person is listened to and the

1:25:561:25:59

matter is investigated

independently, but, we must also

1:25:591:26:04

remember that the golden thread that

runs between our English law which

1:26:041:26:08

is you are innocent until proven

guilty.

Yes, the laws of natural

1:26:081:26:14

justice have been applied to the new

independent complaints procedure.

1:26:141:26:21

When I was a unite rap in the NHS I

represented members on both sides on

1:26:211:26:26

bullying and harassment cases --

representative. One thing that would

1:26:261:26:32

have made it difficult was if there

had been a two tier system in

1:26:321:26:36

operation and so will the leader

make sure that we moved to a system

1:26:361:26:41

of robust policy for everyone that

works in this house?

I can certainly

1:26:411:26:49

tell the honourable lady that it was

the ambition of the working group

1:26:491:26:52

that everyone here would have access

to the independent complaints

1:26:521:26:55

procedure and it is our intention to

look at that again.

Chris Brown.

1:26:551:26:59

Even today the vast majority of LGB

-- LGBT students will face bullying

1:26:591:27:13

and that is why they are more likely

to take their own lives, many

1:27:131:27:16

schools have said let's build a

tolerance school but sometimes that

1:27:161:27:20

feels as if we are being tolerated

as homosexuals. The keyword is

1:27:201:27:26

respect, for one another, whatever

our political views and whatever our

1:27:261:27:31

agenda and whatever our religious

views, and the anyway we can change

1:27:311:27:37

that culture is if we make sure that

every single one of us is fully and

1:27:371:27:40

properly trained, not only the first

time you come into this house, but

1:27:401:27:46

every time we are returned by our

voters.

I agree, respect is key and

1:27:461:27:52

that's what we are determined to

achieve, workplace environment in

1:27:521:27:56

Parliament that is amongst the best

in the world and that treats

1:27:561:27:59

everyone with the respect and

dignity they deserve.

We have noted

1:27:591:28:04

each other Mr speaker, -- known each

other, Mr speaker, for many years,

1:28:041:28:12

we have had strong and heated

disagreements about many issues over

1:28:121:28:16

the years, and I could not be

described as a cheerleader by any

1:28:161:28:20

means, but I do think there has got

to be a fair and proper process and

1:28:201:28:23

it can't be based on anonymous

briefings to the press and it can't

1:28:231:28:27

be based on political disagreements

and it can't be based on score

1:28:271:28:31

settling.

The leader of the house.

I

would say that the whole purpose of

1:28:311:28:40

the independent complaints and

grievance policy is to make sure

1:28:401:28:42

that there is justice for the

complainant and also for the person

1:28:421:28:47

alleged to have carried out the

wrongdoing.

Thank you. Order.

1:28:471:28:53

Statement, the Prime Minister.

With

permission I would like to update

1:28:531:29:00

the House on the incident in

Salisbury and the steps we are

1:29:001:29:03

taking to investigate what happened

and to respond to this reckless and

1:29:031:29:07

despicable act. Last week my right

honourable friend is the foreign and

1:29:071:29:12

Home Secretary 's set out the

details of events as they unfolded

1:29:121:29:16

on Sunday the 4th of March and I'm

sure the whole house will want to

1:29:161:29:21

once again paid tribute to the

bravery and professionalism of our

1:29:211:29:24

emergency services and Armed Forces

in responding to this incident as

1:29:241:29:29

well as the doctors and nurses who

are treating those affected. Our

1:29:291:29:33

thoughts in but it can with

Detective Sergeant Nick Bailey who

1:29:331:29:37

remains in a serious but stable

condition -- our thoughts in

1:29:371:29:42

particular. He exemplified the duty

and courage that define our

1:29:421:29:44

emergency services and which our

nation the greatest pride. I want to

1:29:441:29:50

pay tribute to the fortitude and

calmness with which people in

1:29:501:29:55

Salisbury have responded to these

events and to thank all those in

1:29:551:29:59

come forward to assist the police

with their investigation. This

1:29:591:30:04

incident has of course caused

considerable concern across the

1:30:041:30:07

community and following the

discussion of traces of nerve agent

1:30:071:30:11

in the restaurant and the pub, the

Chief Medical Officer issued further

1:30:111:30:16

advice, but as Public Health England

have made clear the risk to public

1:30:161:30:19

health is very low. I share the

impatience of this house and the

1:30:191:30:25

country at large to bring those

responsible to justice and to take

1:30:251:30:28

the full range of appropriate

responses against those who would

1:30:281:30:32

act against our country in this way.

But as a nation that believes in

1:30:321:30:38

justice and the rule of law it is

essential that we proceed in the

1:30:381:30:41

right way led not by speculation but

by the evidence. That is why we have

1:30:411:30:47

given the police the space and time

to carry out their investigation

1:30:471:30:51

properly, hundreds of others as have

been working round the clock

1:30:511:30:54

together with experts from the Armed

Forces to assess all the available

1:30:541:30:59

evidence and to identify crime

scenes and decontamination sites and

1:30:591:31:03

to follow every possible lead to

find those responsible. That

1:31:031:31:08

investigation continues and we must

allow the police to continue with

1:31:081:31:10

their work. This morning I chaired a

meeting of the national security

1:31:101:31:16

council in which we considered the

information so far available. As is

1:31:161:31:21

normal decals was updated on the

assessment and intelligence picture

1:31:211:31:23

as well as the state of the

investigation -- as is normal the

1:31:231:31:28

council was updated. It is clear

that Sergei Skripal and his daughter

1:31:281:31:31

were poisoned with a military grade

nerve agent of eight type developed

1:31:311:31:36

by Russia and this is part of a

group of nerve agents. Based on the

1:31:361:31:41

positive identification of this

chemical agent by world leading

1:31:411:31:44

experts at the defence science and

technology laboratory, our knowledge

1:31:441:31:50

that Russia has been reproduced this

ageing and would still be capable of

1:31:501:31:54

doing so -- this agent. Russia's

record of sponsoring state

1:31:541:31:59

assassinations and our view that

Russia sees some defectors as

1:31:591:32:08

legitimate targets for assassination

and so the government has concluded

1:32:081:32:11

that Russia was highly likely to be

responsible for the act against

1:32:111:32:16

Sergei Skripal and Yulia Skripal,

and there are only two possible

1:32:161:32:20

explanation for what happened.

Either this was a direct act by the

1:32:201:32:27

Russian State or the Russian

government lost control of its

1:32:271:32:30

potentially catastrophically

damaging nerve agent and allowed it

1:32:301:32:32

to get into the hands of others. My

right honourable friend the Foreign

1:32:321:32:37

Secretary has some of the Russian

ambassador to the Foreign and

1:32:371:32:40

Commonwealth Office and asked him to

explain which of these two

1:32:401:32:45

possibilities it is. Therefore to

account for how this Russian

1:32:451:32:49

produced nerve agent could have been

deployed in Salisbury against Sergei

1:32:491:32:54

Skripal and his daughter. My right

honourable friend has stated to the

1:32:541:32:59

ambassador that the Russian

Federation must immediately provide

1:32:591:33:02

full and complete disclosure of the

nerve agent programme for the

1:33:021:33:09

Prohibition of chemical weapons and

he is requested the ration

1:33:091:33:13

government was not response by the

end of tomorrow. This action has

1:33:131:33:17

happened against a backdrop of a

well-established pattern of Russian

1:33:171:33:20

state aggression. Russia's illegal

annexation of Crimea was the first

1:33:201:33:25

time since the Second World War that

one sovereign nation has forcibly

1:33:251:33:28

taken territory from another in

Europe and Russia has fermented

1:33:281:33:36

conflict in the Dundas and violated

the airspace of several countries

1:33:361:33:42

and this is included meddling in

elections and packing the Danish

1:33:421:33:48

Ministry of Defence and the

Bundestag. During his recent State

1:33:481:33:53

of the union address Vladimir Putin

showed video graphics of missile

1:33:531:33:58

launches and fight to deck trees and

explosions including the modelling

1:33:581:34:03

of a attack on the United States

with a series of warheads impacting

1:34:031:34:06

in Florida while the extrajudicial

killing of terrorists outside Russia

1:34:061:34:12

were given legal sanction by the

Russian parliament in 2006. And of

1:34:121:34:18

course Russia used radiological

substances in its barbaric assault

1:34:181:34:24

on Alexander Litvinenko, weasel

promises to assist the investigation

1:34:241:34:26

then but they resulted in denial --

we saw promises. And the stifling of

1:34:261:34:35

due process and the rule of law, and

following the death of Alexander

1:34:351:34:39

Litvinenko we expel Russian

diplomats and suspended co-operation

1:34:391:34:43

and broke off bilateral plans and

froze the assets of the suspects and

1:34:431:34:47

put them on international

extradition lists and these measures

1:34:471:34:50

remain in place. Furthermore our

commitment to collective defence and

1:34:501:34:55

security through Nato remains as

strong as ever in the face of

1:34:551:34:58

Russian behaviour and indeed our

Armed Forces have a leading role in

1:34:581:35:03

Nato's enhanced with presence with

British troops leading a group in

1:35:031:35:11

Estonia and we have led the way in

securing TASS actions against the

1:35:111:35:13

Russian economy and we have at all

stages worked closely with our

1:35:131:35:24

allies and we must now stand ready

to take more extensive measures for

1:35:241:35:27

the Wednesday we will consider in

detail the response from the Russian

1:35:271:35:31

state and should there be no

credible response we will conclude

1:35:311:35:33

that this action amounts to an

unlawful use of force by the Russian

1:35:331:35:38

state against the UK. And I will

come back to this house and set out

1:35:381:35:45

the full range of measures that we

will take in response. This

1:35:451:35:49

attempted murder using a weapons

grade nerve agent in a British town

1:35:491:35:55

was not just a crime against Sergei

Skripal and his daughter, it was an

1:35:551:35:59

indiscriminate and reckless act

against the UK putting the lives of

1:35:591:36:03

innocent civilians at risk. And we

will not tolerate such a brazen

1:36:031:36:07

attempt to murder innocent civilians

on our soil. I commend this

1:36:071:36:12

statement to the house.

Jeremy

Corbyn.

I would like to thank the

1:36:121:36:20

Prime Minister in advance... For an

advance copy of her statement on

1:36:201:36:24

this deeply alarming attack which

raises very serious questions. The

1:36:241:36:29

whole house condemns the suspected

poisoning of Sergei Skripal and his

1:36:291:36:32

daughter in Salisbury and of course

we wish them a return to good

1:36:321:36:35

health. I'm sure the whole house

will join me in wishing Detective

1:36:351:36:40

Sergeant Nick Bailey a speedy

recovery as well, no member of our

1:36:401:36:44

police force and nobody on the

streets of Britain should ever face

1:36:441:36:47

such an attack that alone with

chemical weapons. I thank the Prime

1:36:471:36:53

Minister for updating the house, the

investigation into the shocking

1:36:531:36:57

events in Salisbury must reach its

conclusions and we need to see the

1:36:571:37:01

evidence and a full account from the

Russian authorities in light of

1:37:011:37:07

emerging evidence that the Prime

Minister has just referred to. For

1:37:071:37:11

now can the Prime Minister clarify

what level of threat it was believed

1:37:111:37:16

Sergei Skripal faced at the time of

the attack and what security

1:37:161:37:20

protection if any was deemed

necessary for him and his daughter?

1:37:201:37:26

This morning the Conservative chair

of the Foreign Affairs Committee

1:37:261:37:30

said, I would be surprised if the

Prime Minister did not point the

1:37:301:37:38

finger at the Kremlin, and the

honourable man but also accused the

1:37:381:37:45

Russians of -- honourable member

also accused the Russians of

1:37:451:37:49

behaving aggressively in this

country for the we need a dialogue

1:37:491:37:53

in Russia with all the issues in our

country both domestic and

1:37:531:37:57

international, rather than simply

cutting off contact and letting the

1:37:571:37:59

tensions and divisions get worse and

potentially even more dangerous.

1:37:591:38:08

Mr Speaker, we are all familiar with

the way huge fortunes often acquired

1:38:081:38:13

in the most dubious circumstances in

Russia sometimes connected with

1:38:131:38:16

criminal elements have ended up

sheltering in London and trying to

1:38:161:38:22

buy political influence in British

party politics. Meddling in

1:38:221:38:28

elections, as the Prime Minister put

it, and there has been over £800,000

1:38:281:38:33

worth of donations to the

Conservative Party from Russian

1:38:331:38:40

oligarchs and their associates. So,

Mr Speaker, if that is the evidence

1:38:401:38:54

before the government even before

the investigation into Salisbury is

1:38:541:38:57

complete, the government could be

taking action to introduce new

1:38:571:39:05

financial sanctions powers. But

instead, Mr Speaker, they are

1:39:051:39:11

currently resisting Labour's

amendments to sanctions and

1:39:111:39:16

money-laundering bell, which could

introduce the so-called magnate Skip

1:39:161:39:22

ours, so will the Prime Minister

agreed today to back those

1:39:221:39:28

amendments to the money-laundering

bell? More specifically...

Order,

1:39:281:39:39

there can be strongly held opinions

and inflamed passions, but I do

1:39:391:39:43

appear to colleagues who sincerity

and integrity I don't doubt to

1:39:431:39:48

remember that we hear views, and

other colleagues will be heard, but

1:39:481:39:53

the right honourable gentleman must

be had.

1:39:531:40:05

And ensure they come forward and are

checked? What extra resources are

1:40:091:40:18

being provided to the local police

force which quite understandably

1:40:181:40:21

have never had to deal with such an

incident before. We know that a

1:40:211:40:29

cross country the National health

services incredible pressure is at

1:40:291:40:31

the moment, but what extra resources

have been provided to NHS hospitals

1:40:311:40:36

in and around Salisbury, and what

training has been given to NHS staff

1:40:361:40:44

and GPs in identifying the symptoms

from a nerve agent attack? Mr

1:40:441:40:47

Speaker, the events in Salisbury on

4th of March have appalled the

1:40:471:40:54

country and need thorough

investigation. The local community

1:40:541:40:56

and public services involved need

reassurances and the resources

1:40:561:41:04

necessary. The action the government

takes needs to be both decisive and

1:41:041:41:11

proportionate, once the facts are

clear, and focused on ridges in

1:41:111:41:14

conflicts and tensions rather than

increasing them. I join the Prime

1:41:141:41:20

Minister in paying tribute to the

magnificent work of our public

1:41:201:41:24

services, responding to this attack,

the NHS staff, the police and

1:41:241:41:30

security services, the Armed Forces

and the analysts from Porton down.

1:41:301:41:32

Let us do everything we can to

ensure this never, never happens

1:41:321:41:37

again.

1:41:371:41:40

Can I first of all said to the right

honourable gentleman that I'm sure

1:41:451:41:48

everybody in the whole house sends

their best wishes to all those who

1:41:481:41:52

have suffered as a result of this

incident and wish them a recovery.

1:41:521:41:58

In the case of Detective Sergeant

Nick Bailey, I saw a quote which I

1:41:581:42:02

was not surprised that, because I

have heard it from so many police

1:42:021:42:05

officers who have been in dangerous

situations before, that he was

1:42:051:42:11

merely doing his job, and we are

grateful to him and all of our

1:42:111:42:15

police officers and the emergency

services for doing that. We don't

1:42:151:42:18

comment on the threats in relation

to individual cases, but of course

1:42:181:42:25

the police and others always look to

ensure that we are taking these

1:42:251:42:30

matters fully into account, and

taking them very seriously. In

1:42:301:42:34

relation to Russia, we have a very

simple approach to Russia, which is

1:42:341:42:37

engaged but beware, and I think this

shows how right it is that this

1:42:371:42:42

government has been cautious in

relation to arrangements with

1:42:421:42:44

Russia. I set out in my Mansion

house speech last November very

1:42:441:42:50

clearly the concerns we have about

the activities of Russia. It is a

1:42:501:42:55

matter I have discussed with fellow

leaders at the European council, I

1:42:551:42:58

think we must be all very well aware

of the various ways in which Russia

1:42:581:43:04

is affecting activity across the

continent and elsewhere. There can

1:43:041:43:08

be no question of business as usual

with Russia. The right honourable

1:43:081:43:13

gentleman raised the issue of party

donations. I will say two things to

1:43:131:43:18

him, firstly as my right honourable

friend the Chancellor of the

1:43:181:43:23

Exchequer said at the weekend, you

should not car anybody who lives in

1:43:231:43:27

this country of Russian extraction

with the same brush. And secondly

1:43:271:43:32

there are rules on party political

donations, and I can assure him that

1:43:321:43:36

my party and I hope all parties

follow those rules. He talked about

1:43:361:43:44

the Magnitsky powers, this is an

issue that I have been challenged on

1:43:441:43:47

previously on this question, where

we do have already some of the

1:43:471:43:52

powers that are being prepared, but

we have already been talking with

1:43:521:44:00

all parties about the amendment that

has been put down, and we will work

1:44:001:44:04

to others to ensure that we have the

maximum possible consensus before

1:44:041:44:09

the report stage. He also raised the

question of police capabilities and

1:44:091:44:16

resources. Not only are Wiltshire

Police involved in this, but they

1:44:161:44:19

have support from neighbouring

forces, as would normally happen

1:44:191:44:22

when an incident takes place which

requires that extra capability. But,

1:44:221:44:29

crucially, at a very early stage, it

was decided that counterterrorism

1:44:291:44:33

police should take over the response

for this because the

1:44:331:44:36

counterterrorism police network as

capabilities which are not available

1:44:361:44:41

to regional forces, and they are

indeed in charge in relation to

1:44:411:44:44

this. And I can assure the right

honourable gentleman that boccia

1:44:441:44:50

county council, Salisbury City

Council are working with Public

1:44:501:44:53

Health England, the NHS locally,

working with the police to ensure

1:44:531:44:56

that there is maximum information

available to members of the public.

1:44:561:45:01

The Chief Medical Officer has

herself reassured members of the

1:45:011:45:03

public that the public health risk

is locum and to ensure that the

1:45:031:45:08

proper arrangements are being put in

place to help the police to get on

1:45:081:45:12

with their enquiries and that is

important. The police are still

1:45:121:45:17

working, investigating this, and we

should ensure they have the time and

1:45:171:45:20

space to be would conduct these

investigations.

May I commend my

1:45:201:45:29

right honourable friend for rising

to this occasion, as she should.

1:45:291:45:32

Many in this house would wish the

Leader of the Opposition had

1:45:321:45:38

abandoned party politics and done

just the same. She is quite right,

1:45:381:45:52

if the response from the Russian

ambassador is simply not credible,

1:45:521:45:56

she is quite right to expect the

house to back her in taking the most

1:45:561:46:01

severe action as is required and

commence at, and she is also right

1:46:011:46:05

to remind the house and the country

that this country, Russia, is now

1:46:051:46:09

close to being a rogue state as any.

It occupies Crimea, it has helped

1:46:091:46:16

occupy eastern Ukraine, it has

created a hell on earth in Syria,

1:46:161:46:21

and is even now overseeing worst

action. This is a country locking up

1:46:211:46:28

its members of the opposition. It is

a country frankly we have learned

1:46:281:46:32

this lesson before, if we appease a

country like this then we expect

1:46:321:46:35

even worse.

I thank my right

honourable friend for his remarks,

1:46:351:46:41

and he is absolutely right. Nobody

should be in any doubt of the

1:46:411:46:47

various activities that the Russian

state is involved in across the

1:46:471:46:50

continent of Europe and elsewhere.

And the damage that that is doing in

1:46:501:46:56

so many different places, and he is

absolutely right that that is why it

1:46:561:47:01

is important that this government,

that this country, stands up very

1:47:011:47:06

clearly and not only calls out

actions by Russia, but also ensures

1:47:061:47:10

that we have a robust response to

them.

Thank you, Mr Speaker. I would

1:47:101:47:18

like to thank the Prime Minister for

advance copy of her statement and

1:47:181:47:21

share with her the concerns around

the recent attack in Salisbury. It

1:47:211:47:25

is important that we all work

together to get to the bottom of

1:47:251:47:28

what has happened here. Mr Speaker,

there can be no denying that this

1:47:281:47:35

assassination attempt on Mr Sergei

Skripal and his daughter is not only

1:47:351:47:38

a step too far by those responsible,

but calls into question every aspect

1:47:381:47:45

of our current and future

relationship with Russia. Mr

1:47:451:47:50

Speaker, this ruthless action puts

not only the likes of our emergency

1:47:501:47:56

services at risk but also threatens

the safety of the wider public who

1:47:561:47:59

were enjoying a Sunday afternoon in

the cathedral city of Salisbury.

1:47:591:48:04

Everyone has the right to live in

the UK in security and safety and

1:48:041:48:08

any challenge to those rights needs

to be responded to in an appropriate

1:48:081:48:12

manner. Police have so far

identified more than 200 witnesses

1:48:121:48:17

and 240 pieces of evidence in this

attempted killing. Our thoughts, all

1:48:171:48:21

of us, our thoughts are with Nick

Bailey and his family, and we wish

1:48:211:48:25

him a speedy recovery. We commend

the emergency services for putting

1:48:251:48:31

their lives on the line in order to

defend all of us. However, there are

1:48:311:48:36

legitimate concerns around the delay

in time between the events on Sunday

1:48:361:48:40

for the march and yesterday when the

Chief Medical Officer advised the

1:48:401:48:45

public who had been at the pub and

restaurant wash their clothing and

1:48:451:48:49

personal items. Can the Prime

Minister give reassurances to those

1:48:491:48:52

members of the public who may have

real concerns that they may have

1:48:521:48:55

been exposed to the effects of the

nerve agent used? I welcome the

1:48:551:49:00

Prime Minister's actions detailed in

her statement as I ask when she

1:49:001:49:05

intends to return to the house to

update us all on what measures we

1:49:051:49:09

can all take. There must be firm and

strong action taken to send a clear

1:49:091:49:16

message to the Kremlin we will not

accept interference from Russia on

1:49:161:49:21

our way of life or in our politics.

This kind of international outrage

1:49:211:49:32

must never again be seen on our

streets.

Can I first of all thank

1:49:321:49:39

the right honourable gentleman for

the turn that he's adopted in his

1:49:391:49:43

response to this statement, because

this is indeed a matter which should

1:49:431:49:46

concern us all. This is a matter of

national interest, it is a matter of

1:49:461:49:51

an attack that has taken place, and

we must respond to it appropriately,

1:49:511:49:55

as he said. He asked the question

about the Chief Medical Officer's

1:49:551:50:01

most recent advice to those who had

been in the restaurant or the pub.

1:50:011:50:06

The answer to that is that over the

course of time in the last week as

1:50:061:50:12

work was done more information

became available, which led to that

1:50:121:50:19

precautionary advice being made

yesterday. He also asked what I will

1:50:191:50:24

be returning to the house. We will

consider in detailed response from

1:50:241:50:28

the Russian state on Wednesday and I

will return to the house at the

1:50:281:50:33

earliest possible opportunity.

1:50:331:50:36

This is not an act of war was

certainly a warlike act by the

1:50:401:50:45

Russian Federation, and this is not

the first we've seen. While some in

1:50:451:50:49

this house have stayed silent and

decided to join the information

1:50:491:50:53

warfare that that state is

conducting against us and our

1:50:531:50:57

allies, we have seen them invade

countries in the east, attack

1:50:571:51:00

allies, attempt to kill Prime

Minister 's, and even now, even now

1:51:001:51:05

they are backing the murderous Assad

regime, which thinks of nothing of

1:51:051:51:11

gassing its own people, and the

honourable gentleman opposite stays

1:51:111:51:14

silent. Would my right honourable

friend agree with me that now is the

1:51:141:51:20

time for us to call on our allies,

the European Union who has worked so

1:51:201:51:24

well with us on sanctions, on Nato

and particularly on the United

1:51:241:51:30

States, and ask what they will do to

assist us in this moment when we are

1:51:301:51:33

in need?

Can I say to my on the wall

friend, I think he is absolutely

1:51:331:51:41

right, we should be giving a robust

response from the whole of this

1:51:411:51:45

house to this incident, this act,

that has taken place, but we also

1:51:451:51:48

will be working, and there has

already been a number of engagements

1:51:481:51:53

with allies on this particular

matter, and we will be continuing to

1:51:531:51:57

talk with our allies to ensure both

that they are aware of what has

1:51:571:52:02

happened on British soil, and also

that we can talk with them about the

1:52:021:52:08

response that we will be giving.

Would the Prime Minister not agree

1:52:081:52:14

that one of the most effective ways

of punishing Russia for these

1:52:141:52:18

appalling activities would be to

seize the private property assets of

1:52:181:52:23

members of the Putin regime and

their associates? And as a first

1:52:231:52:27

step, could she arranged to publish

a list of who they are and what they

1:52:271:52:30

own?

1:52:301:52:37

We are aware here of the need in the

United Kingdom to ensure that our

1:52:371:52:41

financial system cannot be used for

a list that money flows and

1:52:411:52:46

appropriate action is taken by law

enforcement and other bodies to

1:52:461:52:49

ensure that we do identify such

flows, and that we make the

1:52:491:52:54

appropriate response to them. As he

will know, we are already putting in

1:52:541:52:59

place a number of measures to

improve the information that is

1:52:591:53:03

available in a transparent way and

relation to the holding of certain

1:53:031:53:08

assets here by those from overseas

and that is something that we will

1:53:081:53:12

continue to work on.

Thank you Mr

Speaker. I entirely agree with the

1:53:121:53:18

Prime Minister and her approach to

this murderous attack. And she will

1:53:181:53:22

be aware and has stated that it's

part of a pattern of behaviour by

1:53:221:53:29

which a state uses covert means and

breach of both international and

1:53:291:53:33

international law and the rule of

law to attack with impunity whoever

1:53:331:53:38

it wishes. In those circumstances,

which he agreed with me that we face

1:53:381:53:42

a very particular challenge which is

not likely to go away anytime soon?

1:53:421:53:49

And in this context, and trying to

inform the public of the risks and

1:53:491:53:54

of the appropriate way of responding

for a Parliamentary democracy, could

1:53:541:53:59

I encouraged her to make use of the

intelligence and security committee

1:53:591:54:03

who chose to carry out an inquiry

into Russia's threat last autumn so

1:54:031:54:08

that we can take that forward and

provide as much information as we

1:54:081:54:13

can publicly about the nature of the

threat and the best means of

1:54:131:54:16

responding to what?

I say to my

right honourable friend that I think

1:54:161:54:23

it was very good that the would be

considering issues around the... I

1:54:231:54:31

look forward to the worker that his

committee will be doing on that

1:54:311:54:36

particular matter and the Government

will work with the ISC to share that

1:54:361:54:41

information that is within its

remit.

I think the Prime Minister

1:54:411:54:47

for her statement, and it is hard to

see any alternative to her very

1:54:471:54:50

grave conclusion that this was

either a direct act by the Russian

1:54:501:54:54

state against our country or the

Russian government has lost control

1:54:541:54:58

of a dangerous nerve agent. In that

context, I hope the whole House will

1:54:581:55:02

be able to come together to find a

firm response from the Government

1:55:021:55:08

and the interest of our national

security and public safety. Can I

1:55:081:55:12

therefore ask her whether the Mac

Security Council have asked for the

1:55:121:55:17

review of the 14 other cases that I

wrote to the Home Secretary amount

1:55:171:55:22

to see whether any of those should

be investigated and also to press

1:55:221:55:25

her on what further action she has

taken in preparation for potential

1:55:251:55:30

UN Security Council resolutions that

perhaps should be drafted in order

1:55:301:55:35

to get the widest possible

international support.

Can I say to

1:55:351:55:41

the right honourable lady she is

absolutely right pretty neat for

1:55:411:55:43

them to be a clear response for the

whole of this House, and I think no

1:55:431:55:48

one will be in doubt of the nature

of what has happened and we should

1:55:481:55:53

respond robustly to it. I understand

that my right honourable friend the

1:55:531:55:58

Home Secretary has responded to the

right honourable lady's letter in

1:55:581:56:01

relation to those 14 other cases,

and I think the focus at the moment

1:56:011:56:06

should be on ensuring that the

resource has put into this criminal

1:56:061:56:10

investigation so that they're able

to do their work with the maximal

1:56:101:56:15

time and space.

Does the Prime

Minister recall that when Edward

1:56:151:56:21

Heath expelled over 100 Russian

so-called diplomats in the early

1:56:211:56:29

1970s it gave a blow to Russian

intelligence operations against this

1:56:291:56:32

country from which it never

recovered until the end of the cold

1:56:321:56:36

war. The she also recall that when

it was clear that a member of the

1:56:361:56:42

Libyan embassy staff, which one was

unknown, had killed the UPC wind

1:56:421:56:51

Fletcher and wholesale expulsion of

staff occurred then. That she

1:56:511:56:54

therefore conclude that as it would

be impossible for an operation to

1:56:541:57:00

have been mounted by the Russian

state without someone in the London

1:57:001:57:04

Russian embassy knowing about it and

similar measures may well be

1:57:041:57:07

necessary.

And I thank my honourable

friend and as I said any statement I

1:57:071:57:15

gave, the Foreign Secretary had

called the ambassador into the

1:57:151:57:22

office today and was presented these

two possibilities of the origin of

1:57:221:57:28

this action to him and we wait for

the Russian state's response. I'm

1:57:281:57:33

very clear that should the response

not be credible, we will conclude

1:57:331:57:36

that this action is unlawful use of

force by the Russian state against

1:57:361:57:41

the United Kingdom and as I said

earlier, I will come back to this

1:57:411:57:45

House and set out the full range of

measures that we will take in

1:57:451:57:49

response.

And naturally there is the

most intense interest in this

1:57:491:57:52

extraordinary grave matter and I am

keen to a call at accommodate

1:57:521:57:55

colleagues. Can I ask colleagues to

help me help each of them by

1:57:551:58:00

confining themselves to pity

questions.

Thank you Mr Speaker. As

1:58:001:58:05

the Prime Minister agree that in

here but me further aggression from

1:58:051:58:11

the Russian mafia state that the

policy of the Leader of the

1:58:111:58:15

Opposition to engage in robust

dialogue will only encourage Putin

1:58:151:58:19

to engage in further acts of

state-sponsored terror, and would

1:58:191:58:22

she agree it's in regard to the cost

of this that the only other

1:58:221:58:28

effective answer is to have robust

action against those who are using

1:58:281:58:34

the UK as a battle ground to carry

out their own...

I agree with the

1:58:341:58:40

honourable gentleman that need to

ensure that we do respond robustly

1:58:401:58:43

to this matter, but we need to do so

with careful consideration of the

1:58:431:58:47

assessments that have been made and

the information that is available to

1:58:471:58:51

us and that is exactly what the

Government is doing. I think nobody

1:58:511:58:54

in the towel should be in any doubt

that there could be no suggestion as

1:58:541:58:59

business as usual in relation to our

interaction with Russia.

The whole

1:58:591:59:05

country will welcome be precise and

clear statement which the Prime

1:59:051:59:08

Minister has delivered to the House

this afternoon, and in particular,

1:59:081:59:14

setting out precisely what she will

do in terms of laying out the

1:59:141:59:17

evidence for the international

community and the United Nations of

1:59:171:59:21

the acts that has been perpetrated

on British soil. Matt also welcome

1:59:211:59:27

the comment she made about the

so-called Megan Nitschke amendment.

1:59:271:59:31

There are many of those across the

House of Commons who believe that

1:59:311:59:34

this can make a big contribution and

I hope that she will continue

1:59:341:59:40

considering following the way in

which America, Canada, and three

1:59:401:59:45

European countries have introduced

this particular amendment.

I

1:59:451:59:49

recognise my right honourable friend

has been supporting the amendment

1:59:491:59:53

and working on this issue. I would

say to him as I have done earlier

1:59:531:59:57

that we do want to ensure that we

get the maximum possible consensus

1:59:572:00:02

across the House on this particular

issue and we will talk to the

2:00:022:00:05

parties involved to ensure that the

approach that is taken is one that

2:00:052:00:13

the Shadow Foreign Secretary says

that there is not an amendment down.

2:00:132:00:16

There is an amendment down.

Discussions are taking place with

2:00:162:00:21

parties about the impact of the

amendment as currently drafted

2:00:212:00:26

ensuring that any action that is

taken is going to the action that we

2:00:262:00:31

are sure will work.

Can I commend

the Prime Minister for today making

2:00:312:00:38

the sort of a resolute and realistic

statement about the Kremlin that

2:00:382:00:41

many of us have been looking for in

this House for some time. Would she

2:00:412:00:47

invite the heroic and brave Bill

Browder who's done more than any

2:00:472:00:49

other single individual to uncover

the Kremlin's methods to give her a

2:00:492:00:55

full briefing about what he knows a

putrid's roadies money laundering

2:00:552:00:59

exploits in London and... And will

she make sure that the whole of the

2:00:592:01:05

Government machinery is now giving

full cooperation to Robert Mueller's

2:01:052:01:09

inquiry in the United States because

of what he has already uncovered

2:01:092:01:13

about what the Russians have been

doing here.

- to be right arm was

2:01:132:01:18

uncommon, we've already been clear

in relation to the Mueller inquiry

2:01:182:01:23

and we will respond to the

appropriate requests. I am told that

2:01:232:01:27

the other individual that he

referred to has actually met the

2:01:272:01:31

Security Minister and has been able

to brief him on what he knows.

Thank

2:01:312:01:38

you Mr Speaker. Friends from his

candid AVI, the Baltics, and Eastern

2:01:382:01:44

Europe have told me how much they

feel at risk for Russian aggression.

2:01:442:01:52

Can my friend update the House and

how we work with our allies and

2:01:522:01:56

response to does incident?

2:01:562:02:01

I am conscious that those who are

particularly geographically close to

2:02:022:02:05

Russia on the European continent to

feel very much the immediacy of many

2:02:052:02:13

of the activities that Russia gets

involved with, particularly around

2:02:132:02:18

matters for example on propaganda

use. I will certainly be speaking to

2:02:182:02:23

an number of our allies. I think

it's important not only that people

2:02:232:02:27

recognise what has taken place here

in the United Kingdom, but also the

2:02:272:02:30

implication that Ed has -- that it

has for Russia's activities

2:02:302:02:38

elsewhere on the continent of

Europe.

Thank you Mr Speaker. Can I

2:02:382:02:42

also commend the Prime Minister for

her remarks. The last time we had

2:02:422:02:51

been a clear, defined

state-sponsored act of terrorism was

2:02:512:02:56

in 2006, and she has referred to it.

Kenji also have conversations with

2:02:562:03:01

her predecessor Prime Minister at

that time, Tony Blair, about some of

2:03:012:03:05

the issues that arose subsequent to

the actions we took, because it's

2:03:052:03:10

quite clear the Russians will

retaliate and we will then be into a

2:03:102:03:14

tit-for-tat process. They think we

will back down. We have to stay

2:03:142:03:20

resolutely and strongly we're not

backing down, this is an act of

2:03:202:03:24

terrorism and all members of

Parliament stand together.

Can I say

2:03:242:03:30

to the honourable gentleman he is

absolutely right that when they take

2:03:302:03:33

action and it is to ensure that that

is action and we will continue to

2:03:332:03:37

follow through. As I said in my

statement, many of the actions that

2:03:372:03:41

were taken in response to Litvinenko

murder are still in place in

2:03:412:03:45

relation to our relations with the

Russian state. Nobody should be in

2:03:452:03:51

any doubt of the likelihood of an

impact from the Russian state and

2:03:512:03:57

attempting to, as they did in that

case, suggest that the information

2:03:572:04:01

that we were putting out was

incorrect. Actually, what we saw

2:04:012:04:05

particularly from the inquiry that

followed significantly later which

2:04:052:04:10

very firmly put the responsibility

for Litvinenko's murder at the door

2:04:102:04:18

of the Russian state, and indeed to

President Putin.

Thank you Mr

2:04:182:04:23

Speaker. Can I commend the Prime

Minister for the robust tone of her

2:04:232:04:26

statement? Which I believe is

entirely appropriate. Which he also

2:04:262:04:32

accepted that while we might not be

in a period of cold war with Russia,

2:04:322:04:36

as they were in the 1980s, because

of their actions it could be said

2:04:362:04:40

that we are at least now entering a

period of cool. And if that be so,

2:04:402:04:47

would she be prepared at the

appropriate time to look again at

2:04:472:04:51

our ability to determine out of the

resources that we require in order

2:04:512:04:58

to do so?

Can I say to my honourable

friend, that as I said previously

2:04:582:05:05

there is no question of business as

usual with Russia. We must be very

2:05:052:05:09

clear of the actions that they have

taken. I think this incident proves

2:05:092:05:15

that the actions we've taken over

the past decade have been entirely

2:05:152:05:20

justified. What we see is a Kremlin

that is intent on dismantling the

2:05:202:05:27

international rules based order, and

we should stand up resolutely in

2:05:272:05:30

defence of that international

orders.

Thank you Mr Speaker. The

2:05:302:05:35

evidence the Prime Minister provided

to date makes it absolutely clear

2:05:352:05:38

that the onus is on the Russian

state to explain how this nerve

2:05:382:05:42

agent entered into our country. I

thank her for her answer to my

2:05:422:05:47

colleague, the chair of the

intelligence and security committee,

2:05:472:05:50

it's essential that we carry out...

That she also agree that our inquiry

2:05:502:05:55

should also be able to understand

the pressures on our intelligence to

2:05:552:05:59

understand the pressures on our

intelligent security services at how

2:05:592:06:01

best they are supported to do the

job they have to do?

Of course, it

2:06:012:06:08

is for the ISC committee itself to

determine the breath of the

2:06:082:06:12

inquiries that it undertakes within

the remit that it has been set. Buy

2:06:122:06:18

this House and by government. It is

for that committee to determine this

2:06:182:06:24

particular issues. Extra resources

are being put into the security and

2:06:242:06:28

intelligence agencies, because we

have recognised the increasing

2:06:282:06:32

challenges and threats that we need

to address and that's why those

2:06:322:06:39

resources are going into the FIA.

The grisly face of so many a

2:06:392:06:48

President Putin's opponents both at

home and abroad, even those high

2:06:482:06:54

profile as Boris and that's all.

Having said that and supporting all

2:06:542:07:06

of the measures she will take

against the Government of Russia, if

2:07:062:07:10

it turns out that way we all into

will she try as far as is possible

2:07:102:07:17

to continue the opportunity for

British society in its widest sense

2:07:172:07:20

to be opened with the people of

Russia so that the virus of truth

2:07:202:07:25

and openness can do its work on that

regime?

I think my honourable

2:07:252:07:32

gentleman has raised an important

issue which is that of coarse but we

2:07:322:07:35

are talking about is the dealings UK

Government has with the Russian

2:07:352:07:40

state. Of course I think it is

important that people in Russia

2:07:402:07:44

understand the exact nature of the

regime that is an government at the

2:07:442:07:49

moment.

I don't suppose a single

member of this House is a price that

2:07:492:07:55

President Putin will resort to

violence because he done it so many

2:07:552:07:59

times before. 334 killed and the

best land massacre. 170 killed

2:07:592:08:06

unnecessarily in the Moscow theatre

siege, 299 killed in the aeroplane

2:08:062:08:14

that was brought down by the

Russians. Countless journalist,

2:08:142:08:18

countless people who stood up to him

as political opponents and other

2:08:182:08:22

countries around the world murdered

by him and yes sir Quebec Nitschke.

2:08:222:08:27

I've heard what the Prime Minister

says but for the 29th time I'm

2:08:272:08:32

asking this question, can we just

make sure that at the end of this

2:08:322:08:37

process nobody who was involved in

the murder of Sir Day Luck Magnitsky

2:08:372:08:41

or in the corruption that he

unveiled

2:08:412:08:50

And for that matter can we stop

Russia today from broadcasting its

2:08:502:08:52

propaganda?

Can I say to the right

honourable gentleman as I know that

2:08:522:09:00

he has asked me this question about

the Magnitsky issue on many

2:09:002:09:04

occasions in this House when I was

Home Secretary and subsequently, and

2:09:042:09:09

we of course already has a number of

powers that enable us to take action

2:09:092:09:13

against individuals to prevent them

from coming into this country, but

2:09:132:09:16

we are looking seriously at the

amendments and as I say we do want

2:09:162:09:22

to ensure that we get maximum

consensus in relation to this issue.

2:09:222:09:29

On the further action that we might

take as a government, I will be

2:09:292:09:33

returning to the House at the

possible opportunity once we have

2:09:332:09:36

the response from the Russian state

to update the House on the further

2:09:362:09:39

measures we would take.

If you have

one permanent member of the UN

2:09:392:09:47

Security Council carrying out a

targeted assassination in the

2:09:472:09:52

country of another, surely it is

time for the UN Secretary General to

2:09:522:09:56

watch an immediate inquiry.

I thank

my honourable friend for his

2:09:562:10:03

suggestion. Can I say to him that of

course what the United Nations is

2:10:032:10:06

one of those bodies that we will be

speaking to about the nature of this

2:10:062:10:10

incident that has taken place here

in the United Kingdom. Among other

2:10:102:10:16

allies and other organisations such

as Nato, but we will certainly be

2:10:162:10:20

raising this matter with the UN.

Thank you Mr Speaker. While these

2:10:202:10:26

investigations are ongoing we are

waiting from the response from the

2:10:262:10:29

Russian government. Can I ask the

Primus or what her government is

2:10:292:10:33

doing to protect other people who

are targeted here in the UK?

We

2:10:332:10:36

don't talk about the measures that

are taken into relation with

2:10:362:10:41

individuals. That is a matter for

the police and law enforcement

2:10:412:10:48

generally. I can assure her that

that is a matter that is being

2:10:482:10:52

considered.

Johnny Mercer.

I think I

have just seen and I would look at

2:10:522:11:01

my honourable friend opposite that I

have seen the most shameful moments

2:11:012:11:04

in the House of Commons in my time

today. It is clear that this is

2:11:042:11:08

sobering United Kingdom has come

under attack from another state. The

2:11:082:11:12

Prime Minister -- does the premise

or agree with me that the care to

2:11:122:11:17

conflict is changing? We must to

relentless in trying to keep pace of

2:11:172:11:20

that and nothing was out those

looking to do this work?

In my

2:11:202:11:24

honourable friend is absolutely

right that the character of the

2:11:242:11:28

threats that we face is changing.

They are diversifying. And we need

2:11:282:11:33

to ensure that we are able to deal

with those threats across the range

2:11:332:11:38

of actions that need to be taken.

Some of those will not always fall

2:11:382:11:45

into what my convention -- might

conventionally be defensible.

Were

2:11:452:11:51

the premise or confirmed that we

bear the Russian people nothing but

2:11:512:11:58

good well, it is president Putin

that we have in our sights and we

2:11:582:12:02

will not allow him to use this in

the presidential elections to

2:12:022:12:06

burnish his image as a strong man?

The right honourable gentleman is

2:12:062:12:11

absolutely right. It is the Russian

state that we are challenging in

2:12:112:12:16

relation to this particular act that

has taken place on UK soil. Not the

2:12:162:12:20

Russian people.

John Lyndale.

Is it

not increasingly clear that we are

2:12:202:12:29

engaged in hybrid warfare which

includes disinformation, political

2:12:292:12:34

information Butland affairs, cyber

attacks another set of attempted

2:12:342:12:37

murder? In considering a response,

will my right honourable friend look

2:12:372:12:41

at what additional help we might

give to the people of Ukraine who

2:12:412:12:44

are being hurt in resisting Russian

aggression expansionism?

I would

2:12:442:12:52

like to thank my right honourable

friend and he is right we do need to

2:12:522:12:56

look across the very diverse nature

of the threat that we face. And the

2:12:562:13:00

actions that we are taking and have

already been taking a number of

2:13:002:13:04

actions in support of the Ukraine.

It is also an important part of our

2:13:042:13:11

deliberations and important part of

our response.

Malcolm MacDonald.

The

2:13:112:13:18

question was understood by only

three people. Everybody understands

2:13:182:13:21

what is happened here today. There

can be no criticism of the two of

2:13:212:13:25

the prime is or has adopted. She

would know that under article four

2:13:252:13:29

of Nato, she can raise this as a

concern with our Nato allies. Does

2:13:292:13:33

she intend to do so?

As I has said

in response to a number of other

2:13:332:13:39

questions, we will be raising this

with allies in a number of forms.

2:13:392:13:44

And I will obviously consider as I

said earlier the response to the

2:13:442:13:47

Russian state on Wednesday and I

will return at the earliest possible

2:13:472:13:50

opportunity to this House is set out

for the measures.

Love the Prime

2:13:502:13:54

Minister join me in commending

Wilshire police and health services

2:13:542:13:58

will donate superb job in restraint

of this case? I highlight the

2:13:582:14:04

dedication in public service not

just in Wilshire but up and down the

2:14:042:14:09

country?

I am very happy to join my

honourable friend in commending the

2:14:092:14:15

valuable work that has been done by

emergency services in Wilshire but

2:14:152:14:20

also they are simply a fine example

of the dedication and commitment to

2:14:202:14:24

our public services and emergency

services to across the whole

2:14:242:14:26

country.

I have absolutely no doubt

that the only way to deal with

2:14:262:14:33

Putin's regime is robustly

decisively and together as a

2:14:332:14:35

Parliament and the country. I want

to add my voice to those talk about

2:14:352:14:40

the oppression of the Russian

people, not policing Keshia where

2:14:402:14:44

Putin continues to back the brutal

regime there and his attacks on the

2:14:442:14:48

LGBT community. But Russia today,

can I urge her to speak to Russia's

2:14:482:14:56

broadcasting licence and speak to

the House authorities about blocking

2:14:562:14:59

their broadcasts in this building

itself? Why should we be watching

2:14:592:15:03

their propaganda in this Parliament?

As I have said in the response of

2:15:032:15:09

another of questions, I will look at

the response to the Russian state,

2:15:092:15:14

but I will come back to the size of

the earliest opportunity to look at

2:15:142:15:17

the range of measures which could be

necessary and I think in relation to

2:15:172:15:20

the House authorities, as the

honourable gentleman will be aware,

2:15:202:15:25

that would not be a matter for me

but for the House authorities.

I

2:15:252:15:28

think we have for the honourable

gentleman politely and clearly.

2:15:282:15:30

Thank you.

I congratulate the Prime

Minister for her powerful statement

2:15:302:15:37

and for her leadership in this

incredibly grave matter. Is Russia a

2:15:372:15:42

fit and proper state to be hosting

or engaging in international

2:15:422:15:48

sporting fixtures in 2018?

Can I say

and answer to my right honourable

2:15:482:15:55

friend is that we as I said in

response to prime Ministers

2:15:552:16:01

questions last week, I think we will

be in possession of considering the

2:16:012:16:07

attendance at that particular event

that is coming up in Russia, notably

2:16:072:16:11

the World Cup, of dignitaries and

Ministers here in the United

2:16:112:16:14

Kingdom.

There should be unity

across the House in terms of what I

2:16:142:16:21

feel is a proportionate and sensible

approach that she has taken to

2:16:212:16:25

analysing what has been happening

and coming back to report to the

2:16:252:16:28

House. Can I also say that there are

certain circumstances as she knows

2:16:282:16:33

where we take part in political

differences of opinion, but when our

2:16:332:16:37

country is potentially under attack,

that is just not appropriate.

Can I

2:16:372:16:44

think the right honourable gentleman

for the town that he has adopted. He

2:16:442:16:49

is absolutely right. -- tone. This

is a question of the national

2:16:492:16:53

interest in the interest of our

country. And what another state may

2:16:532:16:55

have done on British soil to people

living here in the United Kingdom.

2:16:552:17:01

And that should be a matter that

should concern all of us and should

2:17:012:17:06

be above party politics.

Having

served with my right honourable

2:17:062:17:12

friend in the Home Office which you

do what is right to keep what is...

2:17:122:17:18

Would be the conclusion of Her

Majesty prospector met that there

2:17:182:17:21

was a unlawful use of force by the

Russians say, do we possess a

2:17:212:17:25

miserable rage of cyber capabilities

which we will not hesitate to deploy

2:17:252:17:29

against that state if it is

necessary to keep our country safe?

2:17:292:17:33

Can I say to my right honourable

friend that of course will look at

2:17:332:17:39

responses across a number of areas

of activity should be as he has a

2:17:392:17:44

set and in my statement as I said

that we conclude that this action

2:17:442:17:48

does amount to an unlawful use of

force by the Russian state in the

2:17:482:17:53

UK.

Thank you Mr Speaker. It is good

that the Prime Minister spells out

2:17:532:18:01

the actions already taken today and

inform us what is happening next.

2:18:012:18:06

Was also make sure that the lessons

learned in the software community

2:18:062:18:10

about this threat and how to prevent

it -- Salisbury community is shared

2:18:102:18:16

an appropriate across the country?

I

am very happy to say that I am sure

2:18:162:18:22

that there will be lessons coming

out of this for local communities

2:18:222:18:27

for the NHS, the police themselves

as they look into this matter. And

2:18:272:18:30

I'm sure that we will ensure those

are available to those across the

2:18:302:18:35

country.

Alex Chok.

Considering

Russia, for all of its geographical

2:18:352:18:42

size, the Russian economy is a

little more than half that of the

2:18:422:18:46

UK. Are the service as is, does my

right honourable friend agree with

2:18:462:18:50

me that British economic levers are

far more potent than some might

2:18:502:18:52

realise and we should not hesitate

the circumstance demanded to pull

2:18:522:18:56

them hard?

As I said we will be

looking at the full range of

2:18:562:19:03

measures should we -- once we

consider the response of the Russian

2:19:032:19:09

state. It is in fact United Kingdom,

we have been one of the leaders in

2:19:092:19:13

ensuring that within the European

Union, that sanctions against Russia

2:19:132:19:17

are in place as a result of the

action that they took place in the

2:19:172:19:20

Crimea and the Ukraine.

Thank you Mr

Speaker. This horrific attempted

2:19:202:19:26

murder on British soil demands a

strong and united response. Can she

2:19:262:19:33

confirm whether the nerve agent in

question is listed under the

2:19:332:19:40

chemical weapons convention?

Yes, it

is illegal to use a nerve agent of

2:19:402:19:45

this board -- this sort and one

bandit of the convention.

Thank you

2:19:452:19:53

Mr Speaker. Will the Prime Minister

agree with me that this attack

2:19:532:19:57

probably involved a professional

Russian trained operatives in order

2:19:572:20:04

to carry out such an individually

targeted assault with what was up in

2:20:042:20:11

a very minute amount of something

like staring VX work something else

2:20:112:20:15

that could have catastrophic,

widescale, indiscriminate and deadly

2:20:152:20:22

consequences?

I say to my honourable

friend that I would not speculate

2:20:222:20:27

the nature of the individual

responsible or individuals

2:20:272:20:34

responsible for this attack. That is

a matter for the police

2:20:342:20:37

investigation.

Mr Speaker, with the

Prime Minister agree now that we

2:20:372:20:44

have all agreed that Russia is a

clear and present danger, we have

2:20:442:20:48

got to be fully organised to meet

their danger? And would she agree

2:20:482:20:53

with me that if we walk out into

London and we see Russian Mafia and

2:20:532:20:57

Russian security people about our

capital city over Europe we see

2:20:572:21:02

them. But they don't like is

sanctions that bite. Will she come

2:21:022:21:06

back to this House an early

education and actually with a firm

2:21:062:21:11

list of sanctions, new sanctions we

can take against Russia?

Diablo

2:21:112:21:17

gentlemen is asking me to refer --

the asked about -- the honourable

2:21:172:21:21

Donovan is having to revert to

particular measures. As I have said

2:21:212:21:24

earlier, we will consider the

response from the Russian state and

2:21:242:21:27

should there be no credible

response, then we will determine and

2:21:272:21:32

conclude that the action amounts to

unlawful use of force by the Russian

2:21:322:21:35

state in the United Kingdom and I

will return with further measures.

2:21:352:21:43

What my right honourable friend the

Prime Minister confirm that despite

2:21:432:21:47

the difficulties the American

presidency may have on these issues,

2:21:472:21:50

that we are fully engaged with the

American government and our allies

2:21:502:21:53

on this very important matter?

I'm

very happy to give my right

2:21:532:21:59

honourable friend a confirmation

that we have been engaged with our

2:21:592:22:01

allies and continue to be engaged

with them on this important issue.

2:22:012:22:06

Can I think the Prime Minister for

coming to the House with this very

2:22:062:22:13

important but sadly not surprising

conclusion today? She is going to

2:22:132:22:17

make it further statement on

Wednesday, but can I ask her to say

2:22:172:22:21

a bit more about the options for

response and to ensure at a time

2:22:212:22:27

when there are voices and forces

trying to erode confidence in open

2:22:272:22:31

democratic society, that those

responses will place as firmly and

2:22:312:22:38

foursquare behind the solidarity and

security of the West?

I hope the

2:22:382:22:44

right honourable and settlement will

forgive me if I say I will not set

2:22:442:22:49

out today what the response is going

to be because we need to consider

2:22:492:22:52

the response from the Russian state

and put together further measures

2:22:522:22:58

appropriate to ensure that we get

the robust response that I and other

2:22:582:23:01

members of this House have been

calling for. But he can be rest

2:23:012:23:05

assured as can other members of this

House that we see a Russia that is

2:23:052:23:10

flouting the international rules

based order, we have been very clear

2:23:102:23:13

about that. And we will stand up for

democracy, stand up to the rule of

2:23:132:23:19

law, for the international rules

based order, and the values that

2:23:192:23:24

underpin it. And continued to be

committed to the security and

2:23:242:23:26

defence of Europe and the defence of

the phase that underpin the West.

2:23:262:23:36

I understand the nerve agent was

developed by Russia specifically to

2:23:362:23:40

avoid being covered by the chemical

weapons treaty and to avoid

2:23:402:23:44

detection by standard equipment.

Could my right honourable friend

2:23:442:23:48

today confirmed that the nerve agent

is a totally illegal substance under

2:23:482:23:53

a treaty to which Russia is

signatory and I'm any knowledge of

2:23:532:23:58

detection and treatment that we

learned from this ghastly attack

2:23:582:24:02

will be shared with authorities and

health authorities not just in this

2:24:022:24:06

country but with our allies abroad

as well.

Can I say to my honourable

2:24:062:24:11

friend that it's very clear that the

use of such nerve agent goes against

2:24:112:24:16

the spirit of the treaty in relation

to the use of chemical weapons. They

2:24:162:24:22

will be, as my honourable friend

expect, be talking to the

2:24:222:24:25

responsible body in relation to

chemical weapons to raise this

2:24:252:24:28

issue.

Thank you Mr Speaker. In late

of the Prime Minister's comments

2:24:282:24:35

which I commend, does the PM agree

that there is no place for

2:24:352:24:39

honourable members on all sides of

the House to appear on... It's a

2:24:392:24:46

topic in the mouthpiece and it

should not be engaged with with any

2:24:462:24:50

Democratic politicians who should

think twice before they do so and

2:24:502:24:53

not be engaging with a media outlet

like this and give it credibility.

I

2:24:532:24:58

think we should all be very wary and

careful in looking at media outlets

2:24:582:25:03

that any individual member of this

House chooses to appear on. As I've

2:25:032:25:08

said in response to other questions,

this issue of Russia today is

2:25:082:25:13

obviously one which is of concern to

members across this House and as I

2:25:132:25:18

said I will be coming back and

making further statements to the

2:25:182:25:22

House after we've had the Russian

state response.

In the early 1980s

2:25:222:25:29

the planning assumption was that the

road to war with the Soviet Union

2:25:292:25:34

would be proceeded by six months of

increasing tension sabotage, and

2:25:342:25:39

assassination. What are the current

assumptions?

Can I say to my

2:25:392:25:44

honourable friend that I think what

we see today, there was a time when

2:25:442:25:52

that issue of the threats that were

posed to us by Russia and indeed by

2:25:522:25:57

others were clear and limited in

their type. What we see today is the

2:25:572:26:07

diversity of threats. We Russia --

with Russia we see being referenced

2:26:072:26:11

in the previous question about the

issue of propaganda. We see them

2:26:112:26:15

using a variety of means in which to

attempt to interfere, intervene, and

2:26:152:26:20

to affect countries in the West and

be there for in terms of our

2:26:202:26:26

approach to this and respond across

a whole range of threats.

Thank you

2:26:262:26:34

Mr Speaker. I would also like to

thank the Prime Minister for her

2:26:342:26:39

remarks about this growing crisis. I

appreciate she would not want to

2:26:392:26:44

give individual circumstances, the

candy Prime Minister assure the

2:26:442:26:48

House that not only former Russian

nationals, former Eastern European

2:26:482:26:52

nationals who may also have offended

Mr Putin, but British high-profile

2:26:522:26:59

figures and British public buildings

are being reviewed in order to

2:26:592:27:03

determine the status of security in

light of the recent situation?

As I

2:27:032:27:09

said earlier, she is absolutely

right, we don't comment on

2:27:092:27:13

individual cases. In relation to

national security, we regularly

2:27:132:27:17

update and monitor the actions that

are taken and the protection of

2:27:172:27:25

people and premises here in the

United Kingdom based on the fact

2:27:252:27:27

that we perceive at the time.

As

someone who has campaigned for the

2:27:272:27:35

Magnitsky law and on the Bill

committee of the sanctions and money

2:27:352:27:39

bill, can I say that the opposition

amendments or flawed and can be

2:27:392:27:44

improved on. I am actually grateful

for the cooperation of Ministers and

2:27:442:27:48

I hope the discussions will be

fruitful. When my -- will my right

2:27:482:27:54

honourable friend reflects that our

allies abroad reflect that this

2:27:542:27:58

could've happened and a provincial

town in France, Germany, or any

2:27:582:28:01

other country, and we are looking

for action to be taken as well as

2:28:012:28:05

warm words of support.

Can I say to

my right honourable friend, I am

2:28:052:28:09

grateful to him as a supporter of

the Magnitsky law and putting up the

2:28:092:28:15

point I'm trying to make earlier,

which is that if amendments are to

2:28:152:28:19

be passed many to ensure they will

be workable and we need to get the

2:28:192:28:25

amendments right. And also, in

response to the point that he made

2:28:252:28:31

about our allies, he is absolutely

right. I think we should point out

2:28:312:28:35

this is something that happened

anywhere, and any provincial town or

2:28:352:28:40

any city like Salisbury.

The level

of resilience voiced by the Prime

2:28:402:28:50

Minister and the Chairman today has

been many years coming, but it is

2:28:502:28:53

usually welcome. Indeed, it would

put our national security at

2:28:532:28:58

significant risk that we were led by

anyone who did not understand the

2:28:582:29:02

gravity of the threat which Russia

poses to this nation. Can I ask her,

2:29:022:29:07

she mentioned our Nato allies. She's

going to come forward with measures

2:29:072:29:15

on Wednesday, will she confirmed

that our Nato allies and the

2:29:152:29:19

potential for collective response,

it is in her thinking and doing so?

2:29:192:29:23

Can I think the honourable gentleman

for the comment that he is made. He

2:29:232:29:30

is absolutely right, it's imperative

that in this country we recognise

2:29:302:29:32

the nature of the threat and the

nature of the actions that Russia

2:29:322:29:37

has taken across a wide range of

means. And also I'm very clear that

2:29:372:29:43

as we look at any further actions

that need to be taken, we need to

2:29:432:29:49

ensure that that is robust, that it

does very clearly defend our values

2:29:492:29:55

here in the United Kingdom and

ensure that we aren't sending a very

2:29:552:29:57

clear message from those who would

seek to undermine those.

And

2:29:572:30:03

congratulation the Prime Minister on

her robust stance against Russian

2:30:032:30:07

aggression, she will be aware that

the very most effective sanctions

2:30:072:30:12

are those taken multilaterally. The

concern that some habits that when

2:30:122:30:15

leave the European Union, we will

lose our seat at the table on the

2:30:152:30:19

body that sets those sanctions. Can

she therefore assure us that effort

2:30:192:30:24

is going to go into building up a

new relationship so we will have

2:30:242:30:29

continuity in our approach towards

Russia?

I think my honourable

2:30:292:30:35

friend, and this issue of collective

action was one of the honourable

2:30:352:30:38

gentleman for the member firm arrow

have raised and his previous

2:30:382:30:42

question. My friend has said that

the position in relation to the UK

2:30:422:30:48

Government's actions on sanctions

will change when we leave the

2:30:482:30:50

European Union. We are taking

measures to ensure that we are able

2:30:502:30:57

to act as the United Kingdom

independently. But I also made clear

2:30:572:31:01

in the speech that I gave at the

mansion house, this is one that we

2:31:012:31:06

want to be working with our allies

because indeed, as both he and the

2:31:062:31:11

honourable member for Barrow have

said, they are more effective if

2:31:112:31:15

they are undertaken collectively.

Thank you Mr Speaker, and commanding

2:31:152:31:18

the Prime Minister for the stance

you has adopted today. When she

2:31:182:31:21

returned to the House, will she take

the opportunity to switch the

2:31:212:31:25

crossbody concerns on the defence

select committee that there has been

2:31:252:31:28

a de-escalation of our presence and

that the escalation of our presence

2:31:282:31:36

and the high North, production of

maritime surveillance and patrols,

2:31:362:31:40

and in fact a cancellation of our

cold weather training Bishoo? I hope

2:31:402:31:46

the Prime Minister will take this

2:31:462:31:47

we look carefully at actions that we

are taking at the training exercises

2:31:522:31:58

that our military forces undertake,

and as I indicated in my statement,

2:31:582:32:00

I am pleased that our forces are

leading part of the enhanced for

2:32:002:32:05

presence and Estonia. I visited

those forces in Estonia in the

2:32:052:32:09

oddest of -- August of last year.

And I can save not only is that

2:32:092:32:14

valuable for our forces, but hugely

welcome by the people of Estonia who

2:32:142:32:17

arrayed against the border with

Russia and feel this thread very

2:32:172:32:22

particularly.

I think the Prime

Minister for her statement and in

2:32:222:32:27

doing so would like to pay tribute

to a group of individuals

2:32:272:32:30

unmentioned so far this afternoon,

members of the Armed Forces. I would

2:32:302:32:38

also like to ask what she is doing

with our allies in Nato and the UN,

2:32:382:32:42

and of course the European Union to

ensure the maintenance of the rules

2:32:422:32:46

based system which is under systemic

threat from the Russian Federation.

2:32:462:32:51

Can I reiterate what my honourable

friend has said the? I mentioned in

2:32:512:32:55

my statement, but once again praised

the work of the Armed Forces

2:32:552:33:01

alongside our emergency services in

relation to this particular incident

2:33:012:33:05

and what they also do for us and the

Armed Forces Day in and day out. I

2:33:052:33:11

can assure him that we will be

looking very carefully at any

2:33:112:33:14

further up the measures that should

be taken him a sponsor this.

The

2:33:142:33:18

Prime Minister should note that if

by Wednesday she concludes that we

2:33:182:33:24

are embattled she will find duty and

resolve across this House and facing

2:33:242:33:28

down a common threat. 12 years ago

in the aftermath of a wave of

2:33:282:33:34

Al-Qaeda inspired attacks, we

transfer the capacity of government

2:33:342:33:37

to co-ordinate and fight back

against extremism. Can I urge her

2:33:372:33:42

measures she brings forward on

Wednesday to think radically about

2:33:422:33:45

how she creates the governing

capacity to co-ordinate our response

2:33:452:33:49

to this new level of threat,

including new safeguards against

2:33:492:33:55

abuse of social media which we know

is part of the Russian's active

2:33:552:34:00

measures playbook.

And I think the

right honourable gentleman for his

2:34:002:34:04

remarks, and the tone with which he

has set those out, and can I say

2:34:042:34:09

that we do... And he has right,

after the attacks by Al-Qaeda, it

2:34:092:34:14

was very clear, and the Government

put in place to hold the structure

2:34:142:34:21

of response in terms of

counterterrorism. Hostile state

2:34:212:34:24

activity is something that the

Government has been consistently

2:34:242:34:26

looking out over many years, but as

we have looked at our national

2:34:262:34:31

security capability review, as we

look at the ability to react to the

2:34:312:34:37

fact that we now face, we will now

find that the structure of

2:34:372:34:42

government find it it's...

2:34:422:34:46

Can I welcome the statement like

tone of the Prime Minister's... The

2:34:472:34:59

grandmother would have done no

benefit to the Russians did it. Can

2:34:592:35:03

I urge her to be uncompromising in

signalling that Liberal Democratic

2:35:032:35:05

values are not negotiable? And that

this country will not be a country

2:35:052:35:13

for the Kremlin... And aggressive

cultural sanctions to hit Mr Putin

2:35:132:35:19

where it hurts?

I think my

honourable friend for the remarks

2:35:192:35:24

that he has made and I assure him

that we will be looking at a range

2:35:242:35:32

of activities, responses and I will

update the House further at the

2:35:322:35:38

earliest opportunity. Can I also

say, just to confirm, that it is

2:35:382:35:43

those democratic values that

underpin us as a country that we we

2:35:432:35:48

you'll be defending and continue to

defend but wish to do so alongside

2:35:482:35:51

our allies? It was remarked earlier

that the international rules based

2:35:512:35:56

order is under threat from Russia.

The international rules based order

2:35:562:36:01

is also under threat from others and

it's important to we stand up and

2:36:012:36:05

robustly defended.

Three people are

gravely and hospital following his

2:36:052:36:11

horrific chain of events. Can I

welcome the Prime Minister's was all

2:36:112:36:15

that business cannot go on as usual?

And she didn't take this opportunity

2:36:152:36:18

to tighten up the loopholes that do

exist in the system concerning money

2:36:182:36:25

laundering to be from Russia with

cash issue does not turn into from

2:36:252:36:30

Russia with blood?

The honourable

Lady has been awarded at the

2:36:302:36:34

Government has recently taken on

extra powers to enable us to deal

2:36:342:36:38

with the criminal finances through

the criminal finances act. It's

2:36:382:36:41

important that we did that, we are

very well aware that the

2:36:412:36:46

attractiveness for normal financial

activity here in London can mean

2:36:462:36:50

that there are those who see an

opportunity for illicit flows of

2:36:502:36:54

money and we will take every action

against those.

I welcome the

2:36:542:37:00

strength of the Prime Minister

statement today. I'm sure she will

2:37:002:37:04

like me and be concerned by the

parallels the previous time when

2:37:042:37:06

autocratic clique they decided to

challenge the international wills

2:37:062:37:11

based system to prove that might

would be right. Could she assured me

2:37:112:37:14

that she will be working with allies

to make sure that we could go down

2:37:142:37:18

the path to disaster and defeat as

well?

I will certainly be working

2:37:182:37:24

with allies to make very clear they

... And that those that try to

2:37:242:37:30

attack it will not win.

Mr Speaker,

inevitably today the focus has been

2:37:302:37:34

on the Russians that are crooks and

cronies of Putin, but there are

2:37:342:37:40

decent Russians who have spoken out

against the regime. Those that I've

2:37:402:37:43

met over the years here in sometimes

feel very alone, can we send out a

2:37:432:37:48

signal that we are appalled by what

Putin has been? We designed a set

2:37:482:37:53

bill of solidarity with those

2:37:532:38:02

The honourable Lady does speak about

this. There are those who had been

2:38:022:38:06

proven up to speak up. And we

support them in doing so. And we

2:38:062:38:10

want them to be able to do so and be

free to do so and that they are able

2:38:102:38:13

to feel the competence of doing so

without steering action that might

2:38:132:38:16

be taken against them as a result.

Mr Speaker, can I too thanks the

2:38:162:38:21

right honourable friend handling

this appalling case and can also ask

2:38:212:38:27

her that if it is indeed proved that

this was state sponsored, the

2:38:272:38:31

response is not just in the United

Kingdom, but from Nato and all our

2:38:312:38:35

European allies because together we

stand and divided we provide an

2:38:352:38:40

opening for this man?

I say to my

right honourable friend that we will

2:38:402:38:46

always be be talking with allies

about the nature of this act that

2:38:462:38:49

has taken place and we will continue

to do so and will be encouraging our

2:38:492:38:54

allies to end -- recognise the

despicable nature of what has

2:38:542:38:59

happened in the UK.

The main

security challenges we face are from

2:38:592:39:08

Daesh and others. Will she meet

those challenges as opposed to

2:39:082:39:14

constituting a new nuclear weapons?

He prefers the number of threats

2:39:142:39:21

obviously the terrorist threat, the

threat of hostile state activity.

2:39:212:39:25

Those are ones of which we are sure

we had the capabilities to address.

2:39:252:39:30

That has a variety of actions that

the Government takes. I indicated

2:39:302:39:33

earlier not every response actually

sets within what would be

2:39:332:39:38

conventionally called the fence. The

work of the security and

2:39:382:39:43

intelligence agencies, the work of

the office against counterterrorism

2:39:432:39:46

this is in the Home Office, these

are all part. That's why our

2:39:462:39:52

national security review is

important in bringing together all

2:39:522:39:54

parts are response ensuring that we

have the capabilities that we need.

2:39:542:40:00

Mr Speaker, from a hacking

infrastructure to spreading

2:40:002:40:06

information, the prime Minster is

coolly right that Russia has been

2:40:062:40:08

waging a cyber war against the West.

She took to the investigation of the

2:40:082:40:14

Bill. Can she ensure the House that

is more parsing needed, she will not

2:40:142:40:20

hesitate?

I am very happy to give

that confirmation to the honourable

2:40:202:40:25

friend. My right eyeball friend at

the Home Secretary is already

2:40:252:40:29

looking at what further

counterterrorism powers made be

2:40:292:40:31

needed.

Thank you Mr Suter. I has

had a great deal of time with

2:40:312:40:40

service workers since my Russian. It

is disappointing that we had to

2:40:402:40:44

reflect on how we keep them safe

from nerve agents. And I welcome the

2:40:442:40:47

Prime Minister process segment that

we must outlined what was

2:40:472:40:51

particularly reckless about this

attack was the decision to use Isner

2:40:512:40:54

vision that would put members of the

public and our emergency services

2:40:542:40:58

and an workers they would have to

respond at risk, can I welcome the

2:40:582:41:01

news that she will put that at the

forefront at the meeting she's due

2:41:012:41:04

to have this week and the

seriousness and the risks presented

2:41:042:41:07

to police and NHS workers in

particular for the robust

2:41:072:41:11

consequences that must now follow

was white she raises a very good

2:41:112:41:17

points in relation to our emergency

services. We have already had a book

2:41:172:41:21

at the framework on our emergency

services operate.

In terms of the

2:41:212:41:26

sorts of incidents that they might

need to be responding to. We will of

2:41:262:41:30

course need to keep this under

review.

Thank you Mr Speaker. The

2:41:302:41:40

attacks on Skripal were designed to

kill in hour highway. With that

2:41:402:41:45

threat in mind, can she ensure that

our national -- our national defence

2:41:452:41:51

is sufficient to meet that threat in

terms of funding?

As I said earlier,

2:41:512:41:59

this is a matter of the capabilities

that we have across our security,

2:41:592:42:05

national security and defence. And

it is important that we have been

2:42:052:42:09

conducting a number of reviews and

are continuing a number of her fears

2:42:092:42:12

that goes straight to the heart of

this matter to ensure we have the

2:42:122:42:15

capabilities across the board that

we need.

Thank you Mr Speaker. May I

2:42:152:42:21

commend the Prime Minister for her

statement of a robust as to which

2:42:212:42:24

they address the House was back in

the coming days when the Prime

2:42:242:42:29

Minister discusses actions whether I

like, was she at ensure that there

2:42:292:42:33

will act robustly with some of the

more recalcitrant Nato allies to

2:42:332:42:36

give clouds to the Russian athletes

to lie than to read fuel, notably

2:42:362:42:42

spin? Enough is enough.

Can I say to

the honourable gentleman that I will

2:42:422:42:47

of course be raising this issue with

allies and we will be talking with

2:42:472:42:53

them about the nature of the

response that we feel is appropriate

2:42:532:42:56

to such an action having taken

place.

Order. Statement, the

2:42:562:43:02

Secretary of State for Northern

Ireland. Secretary Karen Bradley.

2:43:022:43:17

Thank you. With permission, Mr

Speaker, I would like to make case

2:43:172:43:24

statement about Northern Ireland

finances. Last week I laid a written

2:43:242:43:27

statement in which I explained the

pressures on public services

2:43:272:43:31

imperative for the Government to

take steps to provide clarity to

2:43:312:43:36

enable planning in Northern Ireland

for 2000 1819. With great reluctance

2:43:362:43:40

-- 2000 18 -- 19. I set out in the

statement a capital allocation which

2:43:402:43:48

I considered to be the most balanced

and appropriate settlement for

2:43:482:43:51

Northern Ireland departments. I did

this following intensive engagement

2:43:512:43:57

with Northern Ireland civil service

and consultation with all of the

2:43:572:43:59

main Northern Ireland parties. Mr

Speaker, in the continued absence of

2:43:592:44:05

an executive, I have an obligation

to take these and any other measures

2:44:052:44:09

necessary to keep Northern Ireland

functioning. I would only take such

2:44:092:44:12

measures where they are clear and

essential and limited in nature on

2:44:122:44:16

our part -- are part of a clear and

consistent approach by the

2:44:162:44:20

Government. This approach is based a

number of principles. First, we

2:44:202:44:24

remain steadfast in our commitment

to the Belfast agreement. All that

2:44:242:44:28

we do will be with a purpose of

protecting and fulfilling the

2:44:282:44:31

agreement. But second we will take

those decisions which are necessary

2:44:312:44:37

to provide good governance and

political stability for Northern

2:44:372:44:41

Ireland, consistent always with

restrain the Executive and local

2:44:412:44:44

decision-making at the earliest

possible opportunity. Third, we will

2:44:442:44:48

continue to implement our

obligations under the agreement and

2:44:482:44:52

as success where possible, always

looking for the good of the

2:44:522:44:55

community as a whole. Finally, we

will continue to work with all of

2:44:552:45:00

Northern Ireland parties and with

the Irish government as appropriate

2:45:002:45:03

to remove the barriers to restrain

the Executive and fully functioning

2:45:032:45:06

assembly. The principles and the

core of the agreement and the

2:45:062:45:12

political institutions that it

establishes continue to have

2:45:122:45:14

powerful and unreserved support.

That means that we will uphold the

2:45:142:45:20

upload of consent, consistent with

this government's support for

2:45:202:45:23

Northern Ireland's plays within the

union and well-maintained

2:45:232:45:27

constitution and integrity of the

United Kingdom. We believe in

2:45:272:45:32

devolution and imperative for local

dissent -- decision-making by local

2:45:322:45:36

politicians. We support

power-sharing on a cross community

2:45:362:45:38

basis based on mutual respect and

recognition. Will continue to the

2:45:382:45:42

Dutch continued to support

cooperation as we leave the EU while

2:45:422:45:49

always preserving the economic

integrity of the United Kingdom. We

2:45:492:45:51

will continue to work closer with

the Irish government in full

2:45:512:45:54

accordance with the three stranded

approach. We will continue to act

2:45:542:45:58

fairly and to govern in the interest

of all parts of the community in

2:45:582:46:02

Northern Ireland. Mr Speaker, the

necessary steps which I have taken

2:46:022:46:06

and will continue to take our

consistent with all of these

2:46:062:46:11

commitments. In addition to the

steps I set out last week, there are

2:46:112:46:15

several associated measures required

to further secure public finances

2:46:152:46:18

which I will be taking forward. As

well as cutting costs, securing

2:46:182:46:23

efficiencies and beginning to take

steps to transform public services,

2:46:232:46:26

it is right to look at how income

can be increased to protect the

2:46:262:46:31

public services on which the people

of Northern Ireland depend. I will

2:46:312:46:35

introduce legislation to set a

regional rate which will increase

2:46:352:46:38

domestic rates by 3% of inflation.

This will make an important

2:46:382:46:43

contribution to sustainable finances

with additional funding addressing

2:46:432:46:47

urgent pressures in health and

education. I also intend to act to

2:46:472:46:52

extend the cost capping of the key

consensus KeyBank -- of the scheming

2:46:522:46:58

in Northern Ireland which were put

in place over a year ago. It will

2:46:582:47:01

not be acceptable to put finances at

risk by allowing that cap to last. I

2:47:012:47:06

therefore propose to extend it from

the 1st of April the minimal

2:47:062:47:11

possible step to protect the public

purse. I also concert -- confirm the

2:47:112:47:15

final spending totals for the

Northern Ireland departments for the

2:47:152:47:19

previous financial year -- for the

current at note -- for the previous

2:47:192:47:24

dear. I also believe that the time

is right to address the ongoing

2:47:242:47:29

public concern in the absence of a

functioning assembly. I think him it

2:47:292:47:33

was inserted by my predecessor to

produce an independent review and

2:47:332:47:38

recommended eight 27.5% reduction

MLA pay. Further to that I am in

2:47:382:47:50

mind to reduce... I will recommend

full and final representations for

2:47:502:47:54

that tired and parties before make

that final decision. These measures

2:47:542:48:00

adjusted reluctantly put are

necessary in the absence of a

2:48:002:48:03

functioning executive and the sadly,

will give forward planning for the

2:48:032:48:07

financial year had. They cannot

provide the local input and

2:48:072:48:13

fundamental decisions which are

needed to secure a more sustainable

2:48:132:48:16

future for Northern Ireland. My

powers as Secretary of State for

2:48:162:48:21

Northern Ireland are limited. The

scope of this House to cast

2:48:212:48:24

legislation on the default issues

which matter for Northern Ireland is

2:48:242:48:27

limited. This rightly reflects the

devolution settlement which is in

2:48:272:48:33

place into which this government is

commitment -- committed. But it does

2:48:332:48:37

mean that in continuing absence of

executive, there are fundamental

2:48:372:48:42

decisions that cannot be taken or

screwed knives as it should be. --

2:48:422:48:46

scrutinise. This is when the

situation for 14 months already and

2:48:462:48:50

in the continuing absence, it would

be responsible for us stop to

2:48:502:48:56

consider how we might provide for

different arrangements until such

2:48:562:48:58

time as evolved institutions are

back up and running. I also continue

2:48:582:49:04

to keep under review my statutory

obligation to call on Assembly

2:49:042:49:08

election. I would welcome the views

and proposals of the Northern

2:49:082:49:13

Ireland parties and others and have

such arrangements are for local

2:49:132:49:18

decision-making and screw Nana cross

community basis might be achieved in

2:49:182:49:20

the continued accident -- as is of

an executive. And how arrangements

2:49:202:49:27

would work with other institutions

of the agreement. Let me be clear

2:49:272:49:29

that this in no way impacts my

commitment to the Belfast agreement

2:49:292:49:36

nor my commitment to work through

the barriers to the restoration

2:49:362:49:40

devolution. As the 20th anniversary

of the Belfast agreement approaches,

2:49:402:49:45

I am clear as ever that Northern

Ireland needs strong political

2:49:452:49:49

leadership from a locally elected

and accountable default government.

2:49:492:49:51

And that remains my goal. I commend

the statement to the House.

Thank

2:49:512:49:59

you very much Mr Speaker and may I

begin by wishing the Secretary of

2:49:592:50:03

State is very happy birthday for

today is back and thank her for

2:50:032:50:06

advanced sight of her statement. We

did see most that last week when

2:50:062:50:12

they published the budget for

Northern Ireland in a written

2:50:122:50:15

statement that came out at 5pm on a

Thursday evening. And I do have to

2:50:152:50:20

say Mr Speaker, that is an

unsatisfactory state of affairs, a

2:50:202:50:23

bit discourteous to this House and

more apartment to the people of

2:50:232:50:26

Northern Ireland. Announcing what is

a £10.5 billion pot should affecting

2:50:262:50:35

key services for 1.8 billion

citizens -- million citizens with no

2:50:352:50:40

ability to question or challenge

those accommodations. With ads of no

2:50:402:50:47

accountable government. I'm sure the

Secretary of State would think that

2:50:472:50:50

that was not a suitable way to send

a budget for constituents in stature

2:50:502:50:53

-- her staff. And I hope she was

plain to the House why she felt it

2:50:532:50:57

was needed to be done and that's --

that fashion. Messages that this

2:50:572:51:04

sadly announcement was embarrassed

because days before the Conservative

2:51:042:51:09

Party will vote for cuts affecting

citizens in Wales and Scotland that

2:51:092:51:14

the billion pound partnership with

the DUP Meza Northern Ireland alone

2:51:142:51:17

is being spared. We welcome that

investment in Northern Ireland, Mr

2:51:172:51:24

Speaker. But we also need to see

investment in health and education

2:51:242:51:28

and other key public services in

every part of the UK, not just the

2:51:282:51:32

bit where the Tories need DUP votes.

Mr Speaker, turning out to the

2:51:322:51:39

substance of the budget, the

Secretary of State said last week

2:51:392:51:41

and repeated a moment ago that in

absence of an assembly with

2:51:412:51:44

decisions being taken by wholly

unaccountable permanent secretaries,

2:51:442:51:48

some fundamental decisions cannot be

addressed, we agree. At the do seem

2:51:482:51:53

to need to be some pretty

fundamental decisions that were

2:51:532:51:57

taken last week by the Secretary of

State and awarded she might answer

2:51:572:52:00

some questions about those today.

Firstly on the decision to put up

2:52:002:52:05

taxes in Northern Ireland for the

regional rate, and the Secretary of

2:52:052:52:09

State confirm whether that was

discussed in detail and agree with

2:52:092:52:12

any or all of the parties in

Northern Ireland? Second respected

2:52:122:52:15

to the decision of the increase of

the budget for some individual

2:52:152:52:22

departments, can she is point to the

House the reasons for increased to

2:52:222:52:25

the Department of Justice of 36

million or 70% or the Department of

2:52:252:52:33

Agriculture which saw an increase of

£40 million or are hundred and 10%

2:52:332:52:37

increase unless you're positive

budget or the Department of

2:52:372:52:41

Communities which saw £38 million or

eight 38% increase last year. I

2:52:412:52:46

should there are very good reasons

for these increases and the

2:52:462:52:49

significant cuts that have been made

to the administrative departments

2:52:492:52:53

elsewhere. But I think the House and

people of Northern Ireland deserve

2:52:532:52:56

to have some explanation as to how

these decisions and by whom and why

2:52:562:53:00

they have been made.

2:53:002:53:09

For health and education and the

£100 million transform to help

2:53:092:53:15

service and light with the report.

Could the secretary of state spell

2:53:152:53:19

out how that 80 million on health

and education and is to be divided,

2:53:192:53:23

and who will make the decision now

about the appropriate allocation?

2:53:232:53:29

And is that something that the DUP

coordination committee will be

2:53:292:53:33

discussing with the conservative

government, and it that has already

2:53:332:53:38

been discussed? When a secretary of

state talks about big health

2:53:382:53:42

reforms, she will be aware that some

of the reforms that were talked

2:53:422:53:45

about and then do let and other

health plans with respect hospital

2:53:452:53:51

closures and other changes to the

configuration of health services,

2:53:512:53:55

does the secretary of state imagine

that such big decisions could be

2:53:552:53:59

taken by civil servants? And if not,

what should it be spent on exactly?

2:53:592:54:05

Mr Speaker, the gravity of the

issues at hand and the skill of the

2:54:052:54:08

decisions being taken merely serves

to undermine what a grave crisis

2:54:082:54:12

began face now in Northern Ireland

after 14 months the Executive

2:54:122:54:18

collapse power-sharing ending and I

welcome the commitment that the

2:54:182:54:22

secretary of state reiterated today

to the Belfast agreement and the

2:54:222:54:25

principles of consent and power that

underpin it, especially in the late

2:54:252:54:29

I think of the recent attempts by

some to undermine that agreement. I

2:54:292:54:34

have to say to the secretary of

state, we need to see more than a

2:54:342:54:38

more tireless activity. We need to

see some success in the forthcoming

2:54:382:54:42

negotiations if we are to get to

next month's 20th anniversary with a

2:54:422:54:46

real sense of optimism about the

future of the agreement and the

2:54:462:54:50

future of power shift. I'm sure that

the secretary of state did not mean,

2:54:502:54:54

and she was at pains to point this

out, that she anticipate any failure

2:54:542:54:59

and those negotiations. But the

whole House and country would have

2:54:592:55:02

been struck by the acknowledgement

that we may need to look at

2:55:022:55:07

alternative means of keeping the

agreement and political

2:55:072:55:09

accountability and elite back alive

in the absence of an executive. And

2:55:092:55:14

that raises very significant

questions about the feasibility,

2:55:142:55:16

given that some parties will not

want to take part in such a shadow

2:55:162:55:21

assembly or another form of an

assembly, and a form of that

2:55:212:55:25

alternative. It also raises I think

a very significant risk and I hope

2:55:252:55:31

the secretary of state will take

particular note of, moving to an

2:55:312:55:35

alternative form of assembly would

take the pressure off the parties

2:55:352:55:38

and come to an agreement and engage

in meaningful peril. Power-sharing.

2:55:382:55:46

The secretary of state acknowledged

that risk?

2:55:462:55:51

And the last time that we see a

budget being set by this House and

2:55:562:56:02

not where it ought to be an?

Mr

Speaker, can I start by thinking the

2:56:022:56:08

honourable judgement for his kind

words about my birthday, I was not

2:56:082:56:12

expecting my birth to spend my

birthday doing budget statement but

2:56:122:56:15

thank you. It is quite right, as he

has acknowledged. And we all agree,

2:56:152:56:25

these are decisions that should be

taken by locally elected

2:56:252:56:28

politicians. The people who a lot to

those politicians in Northern

2:56:282:56:33

Ireland want them to take the

decisions and I genuinely believe

2:56:332:56:36

that those politicians want to take

those decisions. We have discussed

2:56:362:56:40

this previously in this House there

are some issues on which the parties

2:56:402:56:45

cannot agree, but I agree that we

can get to a point where we can get

2:56:452:56:49

the ball to government up and

running and that is what I am

2:56:492:56:53

determined to achieve. Everything

that I have set out today is in line

2:56:532:56:57

with that aim. That is my aim, I

want to see devolved government back

2:56:572:57:03

up and Stormont. When that is by the

decisions that have been taken,

2:57:032:57:07

whilst difficult, one many to be

taken for the public services but

2:57:072:57:10

I've taken them in light of the fact

that I did not want to undermine the

2:57:102:57:14

constitutional arrangements and the

devolution settlement that there a

2:57:142:57:17

Northern Ireland. He asked about

timing he will recall what I was

2:57:172:57:25

here I committed I would lay a

budget by last week and that is why

2:57:252:57:29

it was important that I got the

written statement out last week but

2:57:292:57:33

I'm here at the earliest opportunity

to explain to the House and take

2:57:332:57:36

questions from honourable and right

honourable members across the House

2:57:362:57:39

in order that I can deal with their

concerns. I think it's important to

2:57:392:57:45

put on the record that I did not

publish a statement until I had the

2:57:452:57:50

chance to show it to all the main

parties were presented at Stormont

2:57:502:57:53

and they had had the chance to see

what the allocations were. Because

2:57:532:57:59

my fervent hope is that they would

be the individuals who would

2:57:592:58:03

actually deliver this budget and not

is why it's important that they were

2:58:032:58:07

all consulted on the work that had

been done. I also want to pay

2:58:072:58:11

tribute, Mr Speaker, to my officials

and the civil servant working. They

2:58:112:58:22

have worked hard and selflessly to

help to deliver this in a way that

2:58:222:58:27

is very uncomfortable for many

officials. They want to have

2:58:272:58:30

political direction, they want

politicians to give them direction

2:58:302:58:34

and it is very difficult to do so

and I hope they have worked above

2:58:342:58:39

and beyond anything that we have

spoken to civil servants and I want

2:58:392:58:45

to put that on the record. He asked

about the decisions that were taken

2:58:452:58:48

in terms of allocations. I looked

out to the key department, I wanted

2:58:482:58:54

to make sure there was money to

protect the policing budget. That

2:58:542:58:58

was very important, he will

acknowledge and recognise that. He

2:58:582:59:03

asked about the £100 billion from

the confidence and supply

2:59:032:59:08

arrangement for health

transformation. That is his money

2:59:082:59:10

that was recognised and agreed by

the Government needed to be spent in

2:59:102:59:15

Northern Ireland because of the

unique circumstances and Northern

2:59:152:59:18

Ireland and I visited the hospital

and dairy in London last Monday and

2:59:182:59:24

met consultants and managers there,

and it was very clear to me that

2:59:242:59:28

health transformation is a priority

and we do need to make sure that

2:59:282:59:31

that money is spent and I have taken

advice, legal advice, about how that

2:59:312:59:37

money can be spent to ensure that it

is spent on the priorities which it

2:59:372:59:40

is designed to be spent on. He asked

also about the alternative

2:59:402:59:46

approaches. You will know that many

have suggested ways that we may be

2:59:462:59:50

able to form some form of

functioning assembly or scrutiny at

2:59:502:59:55

Stormont. I am considering all the

suggestions, and I would welcome

2:59:553:00:03

further suggestions and I'm taking

legal advice on all of them because

3:00:033:00:06

I don't want to do anything that

undermines what we have achieved and

3:00:063:00:09

the 20 years and the Belfast

agreement. But if there is a way

3:00:093:00:13

that we can move ourselves back on

the road to devolved government

3:00:133:00:18

functioning and Stormont and having

scrutiny being applied by local

3:00:183:00:21

elected politicians, and that I

think we should all endeavour to try

3:00:213:00:24

to find that route if at all

possible.

This is the second of four

3:00:243:00:29

ministerial statements to the House

this afternoon and notwithstanding

3:00:293:00:32

its immense importance, I appealed

to collect in the interest of

3:00:323:00:37

accommodating subsequent this is not

to prep their questions with many

3:00:373:00:39

speeches but to simply ask a pithy

questions.

Nevertheless, I hope

3:00:393:00:47

you'll allow me to add my best

wishes to be secretary of state on

3:00:473:00:51

her birthday. Can I also welcome the

statement particularly the bit in

3:00:513:00:57

which she invites comments about how

we might close the Democratic... My

3:00:573:01:02

select committee has held the

suggestions and will be sending them

3:01:023:01:05

to her. Can I draw her attention to

the ministerial statement on

3:01:053:01:08

Thursday in what she says the

permanent secretaries cannot

3:01:083:01:11

position that will be available to

Ministers which is incorrect and

3:01:113:01:14

goes on to say that Ministers will

be helpful and offering guidance.

3:01:143:01:20

Can I press her on exactly what form

that guidance will take, given that

3:01:203:01:24

she has set out the departmental

expenditure limits, about what

3:01:243:01:31

actually goes to constitutes those

D.

Thank you, and can I thank my

3:01:313:01:36

honourable friend for his good

wishes and for his question and the

3:01:363:01:41

work that his committee is doing

with the issue of devolution and

3:01:413:01:46

Northern Ireland. I was pleased to

give evidence to the inquiry,. I

3:01:463:01:56

look forward to their

recommendations. He is right that,

3:01:563:02:05

and the absence of ministerial

direction for storm and there is

3:02:053:02:08

concern about the work that civil

servants can do. We have worked very

3:02:083:02:11

closely with civil servants making

sure legal advice is... So they have

3:02:113:02:20

the support they need to take

decisions based on decisions that

3:02:203:02:24

were previously taken by the

Executive or certainly indicating

3:02:243:02:27

what had been taken by the

Executive. And I have for this to

3:02:273:02:31

the permanent secretary to set out

my view as to how any money should

3:02:313:02:37

be spent in line with the

recommendation that they have that

3:02:373:02:41

guidance.

I think the secretary of

state on her statement and may I

3:02:413:02:49

join the House and wishing her a

happy birthday today. I will send my

3:02:493:02:54

contribution by making it clear that

while many needs to be allocated for

3:02:543:02:57

the continued funding of public

services and Northern Ireland, these

3:02:573:03:01

matters should more properly be

addressed by locally elected

3:03:013:03:05

representatives. The decision to

increase rates, a policy decision

3:03:053:03:10

that reverses key policies of storm

and. Ensure none of us want to be

3:03:103:03:14

here again, but here we are. We keep

the lights on, people wage's paid

3:03:143:03:21

can continue, we must have keep in

mind that the restoration of

3:03:213:03:27

devolved government and Northern

Ireland is the principal aim. I was

3:03:273:03:33

pleased that the secretary of state

continues to welcome the views of

3:03:333:03:37

the Northern Irish parties and other

Angel local decision-making and

3:03:373:03:40

scrutiny on a cross community basis

might be achieved. Could you tell us

3:03:403:03:44

a little bit more about how those

views and proposals might be more

3:03:443:03:48

transparently canvassed and then

shared with Northern Irish citizens?

3:03:483:03:53

In regard to the confidence and

supply agreement monies, while of

3:03:533:03:56

course no one ever progresses extra

money spent on health or education,

3:03:563:04:03

there's more than £400 million is

part of the £1 billion the DUP

3:04:033:04:08

extracted from the Conservatives to

prop up this government. In views of

3:04:083:04:11

the considerable concerns around the

steel, and recent concerns about the

3:04:113:04:15

transparency of the political

donations process in Northern

3:04:153:04:19

Ireland, when can we expect further

details on what this extra money is

3:04:193:04:22

going to be spent on? Will be

secretary of state be laying the

3:04:223:04:27

destination of that money before the

House separately to the allocation

3:04:273:04:29

of funds required to fund public

services? It's wearing that we look

3:04:293:04:35

to be stepping into a zone where

money is allocated without close

3:04:353:04:39

ministerial direction and we have

not yet seen any criteria for how

3:04:393:04:43

that money will be spent. Was she

not commit to providing much greater

3:04:433:04:46

transparency around the spending of

the DUP deal money and lay the full

3:04:463:04:52

details before the House?

Can I

thank the honourable Lady, I will

3:04:523:04:59

thank everyone for their good wishes

but it's very kind. Thank you. The

3:04:593:05:02

honourable Lady asked about the

approaches, I and by any parties

3:05:023:05:12

that have suggestions about how this

could function and how we might have

3:05:123:05:15

some form of assembly functioning

with scrutiny and Starr, but I will

3:05:153:05:21

have to take legal advice on

everything that is proposed and

3:05:213:05:25

clearly if there is a suggestion

that is gathering cross party

3:05:253:05:30

support they clearly would we want

to talk about that with others so

3:05:303:05:34

that we could ensure that we were

able to do do something that

3:05:343:05:40

everyone was confident was not

something that took us back on the

3:05:403:05:43

route to devolution and not away

from it, that is my key priority.

3:05:433:05:47

She asked also about money for the

continental supply arrangement. She

3:05:473:05:51

will note that the agreement is on

the Internet available for anybody

3:05:513:05:57

to see and download, but I think she

should also recognise that these are

3:05:573:06:02

important particularly changes to

infrastructure, that has been needed

3:06:023:06:05

for some time. This is something

that anybody in Belfast will know is

3:06:053:06:12

crying out for investment and change

to be made, and that is why the

3:06:123:06:16

Government wants to make sure that

money is spent on things and needs

3:06:163:06:21

to be spent on, including health

transformation and line with the

3:06:213:06:25

recommendation.

Thank you Mr

Speaker. Does my right honourable

3:06:253:06:31

friend think that allocations and

the budget are largely suggested by

3:06:313:06:38

the Northern Ireland civil service

which is pretty canny, would bat the

3:06:383:06:44

same civil service was inviting that

the Executive is not working at the

3:06:443:06:49

moment.

Clearly my honourable friend

is right to say that these are

3:06:493:06:56

conversations that the Northern

islands of a have at the parties, as

3:06:563:07:00

well as with the UK Government. And

they have been incredibly

3:07:003:07:07

professional ensuring they looked at

the decisions that were taken by the

3:07:073:07:13

Executive before the Executive

collapse and also the programme for

3:07:133:07:18

government that they have had. And

also, it reflects the priorities

3:07:183:07:23

that the UK Government and ensuring

the health and education policing

3:07:233:07:26

our protected.

Can I join in wishing

the secretary of State every best

3:07:263:07:34

wish on this momentous occasion and

can I think the secretary of state

3:07:343:07:39

for her statement and the

Government's live support and that

3:07:393:07:42

statement, once again, for Northern

Ireland's plays within the United

3:07:423:07:46

Kingdom that is very welcome. Also

welcome, the budget statement and

3:07:463:07:52

the £410 million extra to Northern

Ireland as a result of the competent

3:07:523:07:56

supply agreement which is going on

infrastructure, health, education,

3:07:563:08:00

to deprived communities to mental

health, East and West, urban and

3:08:003:08:05

rural, nationalist and unionist,

everyone benefits. That's a good

3:08:053:08:09

news story for Northern Ireland and

has been welcomed across Northern

3:08:093:08:13

Ireland as such. Can I welcome her

statement today where it says that

3:08:133:08:17

she is now going to take a series of

decisions which the Government is

3:08:173:08:25

beginning to take for the good

government of Northern Ireland? This

3:08:253:08:27

is long overdue and I welcome the

series of measures that she has

3:08:273:08:30

announced and also welcome very

warmly her willingness to look at

3:08:303:08:34

arrangements providing for local

decision-making and scrutiny across

3:08:343:08:36

community basis in the meantime she

can be assured of our full support

3:08:363:08:42

and engagement in that process. We

want devolution up and running, she

3:08:423:08:46

knows he would form the Executive

tomorrow on the bases of the agreed

3:08:463:08:50

programme for government with Sinn

Fein and we welcome all

3:08:503:09:00

Can I thank the right honourable of

general men for both his well wishes

3:09:003:09:04

and his comment. And also can I

thank the DUP for the role that they

3:09:043:09:08

played along with all of the other

parties in working with the

3:09:083:09:11

governments to deliver the budget

and ensure that we were able to

3:09:113:09:16

reflect the priorities of the

parties of Northern Ireland? And he

3:09:163:09:21

is right that the confidence and an

supply arrangement that -- money

3:09:213:09:28

that we have reached is absolutely

met the spent on a cross community

3:09:283:09:31

basis for all parts of Northern

Ireland dealing with some issues

3:09:313:09:34

that have been perhaps underfunded

in the past like infrastructure that

3:09:343:09:41

need of funding today and I thank

him for his kind words.

Thank you Mr

3:09:413:09:46

Speaker. I welcome the Secretary of

State positive review of MLA pay. On

3:09:463:09:50

a separate matter does she think it

is unsustainable for honourable

3:09:503:09:54

members in this plates who do not

take their seats to take

3:09:543:09:58

representative money from political

campaigning?

Can I thank my right

3:09:583:10:03

honourable friend. Clearly the

manager first is a matter for this

3:10:033:10:09

House and I know that there are

members of this House who are well

3:10:093:10:12

aware and first in the procedures

that are needed for such matters.

3:10:123:10:17

Clearly the issue of an up pay is

something and you look at as a

3:10:173:10:20

result the review done and I would

welcome representations from that.

3:10:203:10:29

Can also thank the Secretary of

State for the statement. They are

3:10:293:10:38

sad, but inevitable. It is sad but

inevitable that it should have to

3:10:383:10:42

come in this way. But what we're

doing here is treating it not as an

3:10:423:10:48

underlying disease. The reason, so

the chairperson of policing Board

3:10:483:10:55

and the need for proper

accountability of policing in

3:10:553:10:57

Northern Ireland. When we see that

PS and I is spending under Dragon

3:10:573:11:01

£25,000 a day on overtime doesn't

not really say... Is it not

3:11:013:11:08

something else that needs to be

tackled?

Mr Speaker, the right

3:11:083:11:14

honourable gentleman makes a point

that were fakes once again why we

3:11:143:11:18

need to evolve government

instalment. I have met the chair of

3:11:183:11:21

the policing board and the Chief

Constable about this matter. Both

3:11:213:11:24

are keen to see the book

overrepresentation of the policing

3:11:243:11:29

Board restored to add that proper

governance. I will be in Washington

3:11:293:11:36

at the end of the week for the St

Patrick's Day event and believed he

3:11:363:11:41

will be there and I hope to catch up

with her and discuss how we might

3:11:413:11:44

make that a reality stop the my

decisions were under the clear

3:11:443:11:49

impression that the main purpose and

life of Sinn Fein was to avoid all

3:11:493:11:54

costs direct rule from Westminster.

Is it clear and that by refusing to

3:11:543:12:00

reach an agreement with the DUP

commission fain have brought about

3:12:003:12:03

exactly which they always campaigned

to avoid?

-- Sinn Fein I don't want

3:12:033:12:09

to get into the wiser what's about

the process. I do know that all

3:12:093:12:16

sides have given me very strong

commitment that they want to go back

3:12:163:12:21

into Galt -- into devolved

government and I want to find a way

3:12:213:12:24

we can make that a reality.

Lady

Herman.

Thank you Mr Speaker. She

3:12:243:12:32

noted very carefully that she was

very decisive about an increase in

3:12:323:12:38

Northern Ireland. I was extremely

disappointed to put it lightly that

3:12:383:12:42

the Secretary of State continues to

go about cutting the salaries of MLA

3:12:423:12:47

is. Doesn't the Secretary of State

accept and recognise that it is

3:12:473:12:53

morally indefensible that and always

should continue to receive a full

3:12:533:12:56

salary in the absence of a

functioning assembly for 14 months?

3:12:563:13:02

Morally indefensible.

Mr Speaker,

the honourable Lady sums up the

3:13:023:13:06

comments I have been made to me by

members of the public across

3:13:063:13:09

Northern Ireland. But I do want to

make sure that everybody has the

3:13:093:13:14

chance to make representations about

this matter. So that the power that

3:13:143:13:17

we can't legislate forward in

Westminster is used appropriately. I

3:13:173:13:24

also do want to say and I have said

to her at the select committee that

3:13:243:13:29

whilst I think there are good

grounds to look at the pay of MLA

3:13:293:13:34

is, I don't think that their staff

should, that the paper said should

3:13:343:13:39

be affected. I think we would all

agree that our staff do fantastic

3:13:393:13:43

work and that they need to be

properly remunerated for the great

3:13:433:13:47

work that they do and for the

constituents of the MLA is.

I

3:13:473:13:51

welcome this statement, but would

she agree with me that the fact that

3:13:513:13:56

this year and on the Priebus budget

that she has had to take some

3:13:563:13:59

decisions that could not have been

thought through -- but there are

3:13:593:14:03

things today that are several step

further towards rule and were few

3:14:033:14:08

week ago?

I do not agree with my

right honourable friend. I think

3:14:083:14:12

there was a budget that needed to be

balanced. These were steps that were

3:14:123:14:16

taken to balance that budget. And I

have done so. Mindful, consistently

3:14:163:14:24

of the need to make sure that we

plates and maintain the position of

3:14:243:14:29

restoring devolved government

wherever possible.

Gregory Campbell.

3:14:293:14:34

In welcoming the Secretary of

State's statements like others, I

3:14:343:14:41

also concur in wishing her a happy

birthday. And I also say that there

3:14:413:14:44

is a very good move in terms of her

consultation about the MLA salary

3:14:443:14:49

issue. But what she agree with me

that it would be intolerable to move

3:14:493:14:53

on that if the House were not also

to move on the issue of MPs from

3:14:533:14:59

Sinn Fein who deliberately boycott

this House rather than MLA to

3:14:593:15:03

prevent them from doing therefore

job?

Mr Speaker, the honourable

3:15:033:15:07

gentleman, I thank him for his kind

words,, knows that this is a matter

3:15:073:15:12

for the House but that the House

will have heard the strong words

3:15:123:15:15

from both sides.

Thank you sir. Can

I start by training -- painter bid

3:15:153:15:21

to my right honourable friend and

her predecessor for the tireless

3:15:213:15:25

work to try to restore devolved

government in Northern Ireland and

3:15:253:15:28

Cannes jury affirmed that her clear

commitment toward working to that

3:15:283:15:31

Brecht dashed workings at evolve

government to ensure that why

3:15:313:15:36

network goes on, through this

budget, that the people of Northern

3:15:363:15:40

Ireland continue to receive the

services and investment that they

3:15:403:15:43

need?

I thank my honourable friend

for his question. He seemed to have

3:15:433:15:50

a frog in his throat, but he seemed

to do very well in delivering it

3:15:503:15:54

without coughing too much. I do

agree with him. It would not be

3:15:543:15:58

tolerable for the UK Government to

not do what is necessary to enable

3:15:583:16:04

public services to continue to be

delivered. The people I have met in

3:16:043:16:09

Northern Ireland have been very

dedicated public services --

3:16:093:16:12

servants, they do really deserve

that. So they can continue to

3:16:123:16:16

deliver the schools, the policing

and all other man is a public

3:16:163:16:18

services that... .

There are some

decisions that cannot be taken in

3:16:183:16:26

Northern Ireland at the moment. Can

she say how long it will go on

3:16:263:16:29

before accepting that we had to

decide to go further and appoint

3:16:293:16:32

Ministers in which you make a

decision in the next month please

3:16:323:16:36

stop on the Commonwealth youth games

that is supposed be held in our

3:16:363:16:40

Northern Ireland in 2021 and that if

there are no decisions taken by the

3:16:403:16:44

end of the month, that we will lose

those games?

The honourable Lady who

3:16:443:16:49

was a great spokesman Mr knows

exactly what the problem and our

3:16:493:16:54

member from my previous break the

frustration of the fact that Belfast

3:16:543:16:56

has been awarded the Commonwealth

youth games. But in the absence of

3:16:563:17:02

an incest -- of Ministers to sign

the appropriate documentation

3:17:023:17:09

Anchorage actual intermission, there

was great difficulty. -- contractual

3:17:093:17:12

information. I am looking to resolve

as many issues and this is one of

3:17:123:17:19

those issues certainly on my table

at the moment.

Mr Speaker can I

3:17:193:17:23

welcome the Secretary of statement

-- stay positive statement and that

3:17:233:17:27

action that will be taken MLA pay.

She is up for full and final

3:17:273:17:31

representation from the island

parlays. But would she be seeking

3:17:313:17:37

from community groups, many of whom

who have had to fill the gap left by

3:17:373:17:41

and always carrying out Parliament

to do it -- duties?

Mr Speaker, I

3:17:413:17:49

would welcome representations from

all. So far the work being done by

3:17:493:17:53

Trevor Rini which I thank him for

the recommendations, but it would be

3:17:533:17:59

helpful to hear from all parties and

all sides as to the news on this

3:17:593:18:04

matter.

Sandy Wilson's.

We welcome

the fact that the... Does he

3:18:043:18:11

recognise that there are hundreds of

decisions about how that money is

3:18:113:18:18

spent that to require some input

from the Minister and will she give

3:18:183:18:21

a commitment that those issues will

be addressed by the promises that

3:18:213:18:27

she has made to the House today to

look at further measures?

Mr

3:18:273:18:31

Speaker, in terms of the budget that

I have spoken about today, I am

3:18:313:18:36

confident that the director is there

for civil servants to deliver. As

3:18:363:18:42

required and as wanted by all

parties. But he is right that there

3:18:423:18:48

are many decisions that are waiting

and it is frustrating for all, and I

3:18:483:18:52

ensure it is frustrating for him

that in the absence of a devolved

3:18:523:18:55

demonstration in Northern Ireland

that some of those decisions have

3:18:553:18:57

not yet been taken.

Thank you Mr

Speaker. I agree with my right

3:18:573:19:03

honourable friend that it is deeply

regrettable that she has had to take

3:19:033:19:05

actions that out today in regards to

the budget for Northern Ireland

3:19:053:19:09

which is no substitute for local

Ministers on the ground making

3:19:093:19:12

incisions. Will she assure the House

today that she would do everything

3:19:123:19:15

to prevent any and the direct rule?

Mr Speaker, my priority is to

3:19:153:19:23

restore devolved government in

Northern Ireland. For the good of

3:19:233:19:27

the Union, for the good of the

people of Northern Ireland, that is

3:19:273:19:31

the right thing to do. I also think

that is the primary aim of the Irish

3:19:313:19:38

government as well. And I want to

put on the record my thanks for

3:19:383:19:42

their support in the talks process

and I know they are committed to

3:19:423:19:46

restoring devolved government as we

are.

Could the Minister set a

3:19:463:19:51

timetable for her consideration of a

halfway house of some in the certain

3:19:513:19:57

issues that have been mentioned

across the House she would have

3:19:573:20:02

support of a malaise to table

questions and to scrutinise

3:20:023:20:04

decisions. As a direct room and so,

I know there are hundreds of

3:20:043:20:09

decisions taken every day by

Ministers that are now not been

3:20:093:20:11

taken and scrutiny needs to be given

to those who are making those

3:20:113:20:15

decisions.

Mr Speaker, he served as

a Minister in 2004, sometime around

3:20:153:20:26

there, it is producing which in

doing so. 2005 and six, I ended

3:20:263:20:32

being corrected by the opposition

backbench. It always happens. He is

3:20:323:20:39

right that these are decisions that

need to be taken, we do want to see

3:20:393:20:42

devolved government and we want to

see decisions and scrutiny been

3:20:423:20:46

taken into. I went up put a time

frame on it because we need to find

3:20:463:20:52

something that has consent as he

will no constitutional changes in

3:20:523:20:57

Northern Ireland, we would need all

communities. And I do need to work

3:20:573:21:03

through all suggestions would be. I

would welcome his suggestions from

3:21:033:21:07

his extensive x-rays of doing the

job.

Thank you Mr Speaker. I welcome

3:21:073:21:12

this statement, but it is a

statement that that is the right

3:21:123:21:15

thing to do an given the right

approach. We would much rather these

3:21:153:21:19

decisions being taken back into

instalment work -- in the storm and

3:21:193:21:23

where they should be taken. Would

she agree with me that this is about

3:21:233:21:28

a whole range of decisions that need

to be delivered based on the agreed

3:21:283:21:33

programme of governing, not just

literally relying on the UK

3:21:333:21:35

Government to step in? --?

I agree

he sums it up very well.

I welcome

3:21:353:21:44

or seven because she outlined for

the House what actions she intends

3:21:443:21:47

to take in the efficiency within the

efficiencies within the different

3:21:473:21:53

departments as she has outlined in

her statement?

Mr Speaker, the

3:21:533:21:57

honourable gentleman will know that

in Northern Ireland civil service

3:21:573:22:03

has started work on efficiencies

before the Executive collapsed to

3:22:033:22:06

stop --. They have been things

talked about within ministries

3:22:063:22:11

before it there were Ministers in

place. It is working forward from

3:22:113:22:16

the programme to deliver those

efficiencies as was previously being

3:22:163:22:22

looked at by the Ministers. I

recognise this is all terribly...

3:22:223:22:25

Difficult to explain. But we are

working within the boundaries of

3:22:253:22:29

what we can.

I very much welcome the

strong commitment to the Belfast

3:22:293:22:38

Good Friday Agreement. That is... Is

welcome to the rest of the United

3:22:383:22:46

Kingdom. But in tying of the money,

the strength of that undermined.

3:22:463:22:52

What impact assessment has the

Secretary of State done on the

3:22:523:22:55

confidence and supply money?

Mr

Speaker, the confidence and supply

3:22:553:23:00

money as a say, the agreement is on

the Internet and publicly available.

3:23:003:23:05

It was recognised those priorities

and those issues that need to

3:23:053:23:10

support and needed additional

funding. This is not been an -- this

3:23:103:23:15

has not been an easy process.

Balancing budgets is not easy. But

3:23:153:23:19

we have done so mindful to all of

the arrangements and to the previous

3:23:193:23:25

governments of what they had done.

3:23:253:23:29

Can she confirm that not all

political parties will be... And was

3:23:293:23:37

she outline who made the political

decisions?

Mr Speaker, as the UK

3:23:373:23:43

Government we have had to take those

decisions, but I ensure that all

3:23:433:23:48

parties saw the statement, saw the

allocations, and were allowed to

3:23:483:23:51

have been put into them both before

the Thursday but I have the final

3:23:513:23:57

figures, but during that period to

ensure that they were all able to

3:23:573:24:01

make some contribution towards the

work we were doing.

Can I think the

3:24:013:24:08

secretary of state and welcome the

budget about key decisions that are

3:24:083:24:11

urgently required such as the

support for the victims of this, but

3:24:113:24:16

can the secretary of state also

confirmed that she has been informed

3:24:163:24:20

by departments they will not be able

to balance their budgets within

3:24:203:24:25

those departments for the next year?

Mr Speaker, that is not the advice

3:24:253:24:31

that I've had, but she is right. She

should be concerned about legacy and

3:24:313:24:37

also about victims of institutional

abuse. These are matters that, the

3:24:373:24:44

UK Government is used to... On the

Stormont agreement and to setting

3:24:443:24:51

those up. On historical abuse, the

inquiry was set up by the Executive

3:24:513:24:56

before it collapsed. It is therefore

constitutionally very difficult for

3:24:563:25:00

other party or government to look at

the decisions and recommendations

3:25:003:25:06

from that review as it was not a

review that was instigated by the UK

3:25:063:25:11

Parliament or the UK Government. She

absolutely describes the tension

3:25:113:25:14

that we are operating within.

Thank

you very much secretary of State for

3:25:143:25:23

the statement to the House and can I

wish you many happy returns. It's

3:25:233:25:28

interesting to note that the message

that we are receiving from civil

3:25:283:25:33

servants is they cannot move on and

make decisions as to where money

3:25:333:25:37

should be spent. In the absence of

there not being an assembly, and

3:25:373:25:41

unlikely to be an assembly in the

foreseeable future, it is important

3:25:413:25:45

that we have Ministers making

decisions, and if not yourself other

3:25:453:25:49

Ministers, when is this going to

happen?

Mr Speaker, I have attempted

3:25:493:25:55

in this budget to deliver a

certainty, financial certainty that

3:25:553:26:00

is needed to enable public services

to continue. And of course, it is

3:26:003:26:04

down to if devolved government is up

and running in Starr, -- and

3:26:043:26:12

Stormont, then Stormont can't amend

the way the budget has operates. I

3:26:123:26:16

have done what I have to do to

enable public services to continue

3:26:163:26:20

to enable public servants to have

some certainty within the

3:26:203:26:25

restrictions of what is possible for

me as Secretary of State for

3:26:253:26:28

Northern Ireland.

Thank you very

much Mr Speaker and happy returns to

3:26:283:26:36

the secretary of state from across

the House and cross party agreement

3:26:363:26:40

on this northern Ireland statement

time. I understand the secretary of

3:26:403:26:44

State's caution and her concerned

and reluctance to advanced issues of

3:26:443:26:49

direct rule, but in today's

statement and providing a soft

3:26:493:26:53

landing for the perpetual glidepath

that we've had for the last 14

3:26:533:26:56

months, can I encourage her to be

bold, to provide the political

3:26:563:27:02

opportunities for decision-making

for the benefits and interest of all

3:27:023:27:05

the people in Northern Ireland, and

to do it with confidence?

Mr

3:27:053:27:09

Speaker, I think the honourable

gentleman for his good wishes. If I

3:27:093:27:13

can repeat, and I am committed to

the Belfast agreement and the

3:27:133:27:17

institutions that were set up under

the Belfast agreement. I want to be

3:27:173:27:21

in a position that those

institutions can be up and running

3:27:213:27:24

and can be delivered for the people

of Northern Ireland, the politicians

3:27:243:27:29

they'll elected delivering for them.

That is what I want to determine to

3:27:293:27:34

do, and I don't want to undermine

that in any way. So, that is the

3:27:343:27:40

very difficult balancing act I've

been operating under. I wanted to

3:27:403:27:43

make sure that civil servants of the

certainty they needed and that they

3:27:433:27:45

have the money that they needed, but

without undermining. I would welcome

3:27:453:27:50

any suggestions from him and others

about what sort of constitutional

3:27:503:27:54

arrangements could be put in place

to get back to devolved government.

3:27:543:28:00

Thank you, order. Statement the

Secretary of State for International

3:28:003:28:04

Development, Secretary Doctor Liam

Fox.

Thank you. Mr Speaker, on

3:28:043:28:10

Thursday the 8th of March President

Trump announced that the United

3:28:103:28:13

States would impose tariffs of 25%

on steel imports in a 10% tariff on

3:28:133:28:20

aluminium imports after a period of

15 days, the final date being the

3:28:203:28:24

23rd of March. Canada and Mexico

within the United States is

3:28:243:28:31

renegotiating the North American

Free Trade Agreement, have been

3:28:313:28:32

exempted from the tariffs subject to

successful conclusion of the Nafta

3:28:323:28:37

negotiations. For the products

within the scope of this

3:28:373:28:42

investigation, and 2017, the US

accounted for 7% of UK steel exports

3:28:423:28:49

and 3% of UK aluminium exports. In

addition, the UK accounted for 1% of

3:28:493:28:53

US steel imports into your .1% of US

aluminium imports and tonnage value

3:28:533:29:02

of 360 million and £29 million,

respectively. The president also

3:29:023:29:05

outlined that there scope for

further countries and certain

3:29:053:29:09

products to be exempted from those

tariffs. From a UK perspective, as

3:29:093:29:14

members of this House know, the UK

and US are strong partners and

3:29:143:29:19

allies in the US UK economic and

security relationship is very

3:29:193:29:23

important. The glass is our largest

single trading nation partner

3:29:233:29:28

accounting for a set of all of our

exports worth over £100 billion a

3:29:283:29:32

year. It is also a top destination

for outward direct investment by the

3:29:323:29:36

UK and the single biggest source of

inward investment into the UK. We

3:29:363:29:40

have a long-standing and special

relationship with the US. However,

3:29:403:29:44

this does not mean that if we

disagree with something that we will

3:29:443:29:48

not say so. And Mr Deputy Speaker,

we do disagree with the US decision

3:29:483:29:52

to implement tariffs on steel and

aluminium imports based on national

3:29:523:29:57

security considerations. These

unilateral trade measures have a

3:29:573:30:03

weak foundations and international

law and they are not consistent with

3:30:033:30:06

the Department of defence's on

judgement and an investigation that

3:30:063:30:11

was conducted on the basis of

national security. It was

3:30:113:30:15

undoubtedly a problem of

overcapacity in the global steel

3:30:153:30:17

market, but our strong view is that

a global problem will cause a global

3:30:173:30:25

solution that unilateral action. The

UK has worked hard to address this

3:30:253:30:29

issue of overcapacity. The Prime

Minister called for a form of T20

3:30:293:30:33

members to tackle this issue which

my right honourable friend the

3:30:333:30:36

Secretary of State for Business and

energy and industrial strategy

3:30:363:30:40

intended in Berlin in November. And

most recently, the Prime Minister

3:30:403:30:47

raised it during her visit to China

which is the worlds leading producer

3:30:473:30:50

of steel and aluminium products. The

UK will continue to work within the

3:30:503:30:58

rules based international trade

system to tackle this problem. Since

3:30:583:31:03

the president asked the Commerce

Department to launch the

3:31:033:31:06

investigation into the national

security impact of steel and

3:31:063:31:09

aluminium imports last April, the

Government has made clear on

3:31:093:31:12

repeated occasions to the

administration that potentially

3:31:123:31:16

damaging impact of tariffs on the UK

and the ED steel and aluminium

3:31:163:31:22

industries so the Prime Minister has

raised her concerns directly with

3:31:223:31:26

President Trump. I myself have

spoken on several occasion to the

3:31:263:31:30

commerce secretary and the US trade

representative about the

3:31:303:31:33

investigation, including this

afternoon. I've also spoken again

3:31:333:31:37

today but the director general of

the WTO and regularly speak with EU

3:31:373:31:42

trade Commissioner. Several of my

Cabinet colleagues erased it with

3:31:423:31:48

their offices and the Government has

worked closely with the EU as of our

3:31:483:31:53

unified response. I can assure my

right honourable and honourable

3:31:533:31:57

friends that have been in regular

contact with the UK steel and

3:31:573:32:00

aluminium industry throughout and I

spoke to Gary at the begin and also

3:32:003:32:04

this afternoon. Mr Speaker, there

are two routes to petition the US

3:32:043:32:08

for exemptions from the tariffs. The

first overseen by the US trade

3:32:083:32:14

representative, will exempt

countries was with which the US has

3:32:143:32:18

a strong national security

relationship and alternative means

3:32:183:32:23

to address the threat to US national

security from the relevant imports.

3:32:233:32:28

And second, overseen by the Commerce

Department, will evaluate product

3:32:283:32:32

exemptions if there deemed there is

no domestic US alternative and

3:32:323:32:37

national security considerations but

only after a request for exclusion

3:32:373:32:40

is made by directly affected parties

located in the United States. The

3:32:403:32:46

Department for Business energy and

industrial strategy will be

3:32:463:32:51

assisting UK industry and working

with US customers to build their

3:32:513:32:54

cases for the exemption of

individual products. I will be

3:32:543:32:57

travelling to Washington this week

for meeting face-to-face with the US

3:32:573:33:00

trade representative and a commerce

secretary as well as leading members

3:33:003:33:06

of Congress. I'll be making the case

for the UK as part of the EU. We

3:33:063:33:12

have a strong defence and security

cooperation relationship, as close

3:33:123:33:17

allies and Nato permanent members of

the UN Security Council and nuclear

3:33:173:33:22

powers." Version between the US and

UK is vital to international peace

3:33:223:33:26

and security. As the House is aware,

our current membership of the

3:33:263:33:30

European Union means that the

European Commission will be cord

3:33:303:33:33

knitting the EU response and we've

been clear that we will continue to

3:33:333:33:37

adhere to the cooperation. The EU

response is focused on three

3:33:373:33:43

possible areas. First, the European

Commission is preparing to introduce

3:33:433:33:46

and media duties on the US ahead of

a WTO dispute. The EU has shared a

3:33:463:33:52

draft list of proposed items for

duties and we expect to protect the

3:33:523:34:04

steel and aluminium industries from

being damaged by an influx of

3:34:043:34:08

exports to the EU caused by the

displacing effect of US tariffs. And

3:34:083:34:12

third, the EU can pursue a dispute

at the WTO. We are currently

3:34:123:34:17

evaluating all aspects of these

responses together. Mr Speaker, we

3:34:173:34:22

are clear that it is right to seek

to defend our industries from the

3:34:223:34:26

direct and indirect impact of these

US tariffs are taking both jobs and

3:34:263:34:30

industrial capacity. We will also

press for any response of the EU to

3:34:303:34:35

be measure and proportionate. It's

important that the UK and EU

3:34:353:34:40

response words within the boundaries

of the rules based international

3:34:403:34:43

trading system. Over the coming

days, we will be working closely

3:34:433:34:47

with British industry and the EU to

seek swift clarification and

3:34:473:34:54

mitigation. I commend this statement

to this House.

Mr Deputy Speaker as

3:34:543:35:00

pink the Secretary of State for

advanced side of his statement and

3:35:003:35:03

his telephone call over the weekend.

-- I think the secretary of state.

3:35:033:35:07

The world steel industry is on the

verge of a crisis. 32,000 workers

3:35:073:35:12

and the steel industry are facing an

existential threat to their jobs.

3:35:123:35:15

Many of those men and women are

angry that it has taken the

3:35:153:35:19

secretary of state more than ten

days since President Trump's initial

3:35:193:35:23

announcement to come to this House

and make a statement about the

3:35:233:35:26

impact of this might have on their

communities and what measures the

3:35:263:35:29

Government is taking to protect

their livelihoods. They expected

3:35:293:35:33

better, and they had a right to

expect better. But I want to assure

3:35:333:35:37

the Secretary of State that for our

part, the official opposition will

3:35:373:35:41

not seek to make this issue one a

party political point score.

3:35:413:35:48

Everyone in this House must work

together. We will be constructively

3:35:483:35:51

critical where we considered the

Government can do better, but our

3:35:513:35:55

fundamental position will be to work

with the Government to achieve the

3:35:553:35:59

best outcome for our steel

communities, for other aluminium

3:35:593:36:03

industry, and for our wider economy.

The Secretary of State was correct

3:36:033:36:07

but the fundamental cause of this

crisis is overcapacity in the global

3:36:073:36:12

market, and a long-standing failure

by governments around the world to

3:36:123:36:16

tackle dumping and unfair practises.

But he should have acknowledged that

3:36:163:36:19

this included his own government. We

have not forgotten that it was the

3:36:193:36:25

conservative government in 2016 that

sought to block EU plans to impose

3:36:253:36:28

tougher tariffs on progression of

Chinese steel import. Global

3:36:283:36:35

oversupply has in other countries

dump their service, is server is

3:36:353:36:39

created by an actionable subsidies

and lax enforcement of labour

3:36:393:36:42

standards and workers' rights and

less than market value. Whilst the

3:36:423:36:47

global situation has not been

created by President Trump, the

3:36:473:36:50

manner in which he has gone about

trying to resolve its impact on the

3:36:503:36:55

US is fundamentally wrong and

friends to take a very bad situation

3:36:553:37:00

into a full-scale global trade

crisis. The application of 25%

3:37:003:37:05

tariffs on steel and 10% aluminium

imports into the United States is

3:37:053:37:12

unjust and unjustifiable. The

suggestion that such tariffs are

3:37:123:37:16

necessary under section 232 to

mitigate a threat to American

3:37:163:37:20

national security is patently false.

The US secretary of defence himself

3:37:203:37:25

has publicly stated that US military

requirements represent no more than

3:37:253:37:30

3% of US steel production and that

the Department of defence is able to

3:37:303:37:34

acquire the steel and aluminium it

needs for US national defence

3:37:343:37:41

requirements. The UK steel industry

has made it clear that the amount of

3:37:413:37:43

UK steel exports to the United

States is very small indeed. The

3:37:433:37:49

secretary of state says that Trump's

tariffs have weak foundations in

3:37:493:37:54

international law. In fact, they

have none. The truth is that the

3:37:543:37:59

president is seeking to bully and

threaten his trading partners to

3:37:593:38:01

bring

3:38:013:38:07

The temporary exemption for Canada

and Mexico making the subject to a

3:38:073:38:13

renegotiated -- renegotiation of

Nafta, he's doing the same at UK and

3:38:133:38:17

Europe review books to reverse the

US trade deficit. Given that the

3:38:173:38:24

Secretary of State accept that these

tears are unjustified, I would ask

3:38:243:38:28

them to say... It is to act as if

they had a series of legitimacy.

3:38:283:38:36

This is recycling -- precisely the

trap that President Trump is a set.

3:38:363:38:40

Negotiate with us and we will not

believe further. In that part of

3:38:403:38:44

Glasgow where I grew, it was called

a protection racket. If the

3:38:443:38:49

Secretary of State goes down this

route of trying to secure an

3:38:493:38:52

exemption, will he give a commitment

now to be totally transparent about

3:38:523:38:56

any price he has to pay and any

assurances he has to get to the US

3:38:563:39:02

administration in order to get it?

It is reported that following the

3:39:023:39:06

Austrian Foreign Minister's meeting

with Rex Tillerson, these tariffs

3:39:063:39:10

may not apply to Australia. Reports

have also been reported that the

3:39:103:39:14

gesture has had to agree to

bilateral agreement to contribute

3:39:143:39:22

more military spending. Willie also

clear how any such attempt by the UK

3:39:223:39:28

sits with the duty of sincere

cooperation? Which the Secretary of

3:39:283:39:33

State rightly referred to in his own

statement. The President Trump is

3:39:333:39:37

imposing these tariffs on national

security grants precisely because

3:39:373:39:40

under the BT overrules, this means

that article 21 would not apply.

3:39:403:39:47

This specifically prevents member

states of the WTO of demanding

3:39:473:39:50

clarity on the grounds of such a

pronouncement and commencing --

3:39:503:39:57

articulate country action. The

president is seeking to under nine

3:39:573:40:01

-- undermined the multilateral

system of the WTO to which he has

3:40:013:40:04

long been opposed. He has said that

he would welcome a trade war and

3:40:043:40:07

thinks America could win it. He

cares nothing for the viability of

3:40:073:40:11

UK producers who have respected the

wins. He is treating them no

3:40:113:40:15

different to the competitors who

have not. And as the US market

3:40:153:40:19

closest to our exports, countries

that would otherwise export into the

3:40:193:40:23

US will seek to diverge their

production to the UK. This will tend

3:40:233:40:27

to undercut the Mr producers here

even further. What action has the

3:40:273:40:33

secondary of state taken to defend

against this divergence a? Reckon is

3:40:333:40:39

that our industry is particularly

vulnerable because we have a

3:40:393:40:41

government that prides itself on

taking the weakest possible approach

3:40:413:40:46

to remedy unfair practises by

adhering to the lesser duty rule.

3:40:463:40:49

Both the trade bill and the taxation

cross-border trade bill currently

3:40:493:40:53

going through Parliament were

opposed by the Labour Party

3:40:533:40:55

precisely because they proposed to

create what the manufacturers trade

3:40:553:41:00

remedies or otherwise described as

one of the weakest trade remedy

3:41:003:41:03

regimes in the world. I asked

Secretary of State whether he will

3:41:033:41:11

look to bring government amendments

to bring strength and secretary

3:41:113:41:14

representation function of the trade

remedies authority and powers

3:41:143:41:17

available to it in line with those

opposed by the opposition at

3:41:173:41:20

committee stage. This Secretary of

State state spoke... What assessment

3:41:203:41:27

has his department made of the legal

rights of the course under article

3:41:273:41:31

eight of the WTO agreement on

safeguards? And what provision is

3:41:313:41:36

made to the European commissions

director in relation to those

3:41:363:41:39

measures? Is he persuaded that they

would be lawful? Is he persuaded

3:41:393:41:43

that they would be effective? The

Secretary of State's fond of

3:41:433:41:47

painting international trade as a

balance of consumer and producer

3:41:473:41:50

interest, the fear of thousands of

steel and aluminium workers in the

3:41:503:41:53

UK is that he naturally leads... I

am doing so. That he naturally leads

3:41:533:42:00

to far. He needs to prove to them

that he will stand up for British

3:42:003:42:05

industry, for their jobs and for

their communities. They confidence

3:42:053:42:08

that he will tackle unfair practises

that distort the market. If he does,

3:42:083:42:13

he will have this side of the

House's. Part.

Mr Speaker, I am

3:42:133:42:18

grateful to the cooperation that the

honourable gentleman gave over the

3:42:183:42:24

weekend and some of the

constructions -- constructive

3:42:243:42:27

suggestions he made as to how we

might apply for the pressure to

3:42:273:42:32

those US producers to enable them to

seek exemptions for imports from the

3:42:323:42:35

UK. He is right that there is a

capacity. The G20 has now made 28

3:42:353:42:44

recommendations. We now wait to see

whether China will implement those

3:42:443:42:49

recommendations which is the key to

sorting out the global overcapacity

3:42:493:42:52

issue. We have regularly said that

we do not believe that 232 was an

3:42:523:43:00

appropriate vehicle for carrying out

this particular investigation. And

3:43:003:43:05

the UK sends that only some

specifically high and a steel

3:43:053:43:11

products into the United States

which the US market has not

3:43:113:43:14

necessarily been able to provide for

itself, so therefore terrorists will

3:43:143:43:19

apply on on -- therefore tariffs

will apply... Into the American

3:43:193:43:27

military programme itself. Which

makes action taken against united

3:43:273:43:31

kingdom quite an absurdity. He is

right to mention that the sincere

3:43:313:43:39

cooperation I have made very clear

to the commission that we continue

3:43:393:43:41

to operate on that basis and that as

we leave the European Union, we will

3:43:413:43:47

replicate the EU's trade remedies

system. I would remind him however

3:43:473:43:53

that his party voted against the

setting up of the trade remedies

3:43:533:43:56

authority itself, its self, the

setting up of the body. Not the

3:43:563:44:01

issues that relate to the operation

of it. Which I think was a dangerous

3:44:013:44:06

thing to do. But I think, Mr

Speaker, it is right that we regard

3:44:063:44:11

this as a national issue. There is a

fundamental issue between us. Nor is

3:44:113:44:20

there any difference between us on

the options we believe that the

3:44:203:44:24

European Union should take as a

response.

With the Secretary of

3:44:243:44:29

State stressed to the EU that it is

in our interest to try and take some

3:44:293:44:34

of the tension out of this festering

dispute rather than to take it on to

3:44:343:44:39

another hide given that the

president is already talking about

3:44:393:44:43

tariffs against German cars for

example? Is it in our interest to

3:44:433:44:49

get back to tariff free business?

Mr

Deputy Speaker, the EU is taking

3:44:493:44:58

countermeasures because the EU views

the 232 itself as a safeguard. Any

3:44:583:45:05

action that United States would you

take in response to that would be

3:45:053:45:07

completely out of line with

international trade law as well as

3:45:073:45:11

an already tense situation.

And Mr

spec that --. This really is a blow

3:45:113:45:20

to those right wing free-market

Brexiteers to argue that the US

3:45:203:45:24

would welcome a trade deal with open

arms. Anyone looking at the somewhat

3:45:243:45:28

unhinged tweets coming out of

president Trump's office will tell

3:45:283:45:31

us otherwise. But I'm interested to

note given the Secretary of State's

3:45:313:45:37

nationality and where he was brought

up, has he raised specifically the

3:45:373:45:44

matter of Scottish steel and

aluminium and the steel industry as

3:45:443:45:48

an impact on all of the nations of

the UK because it was in 1992 that

3:45:483:45:52

house conservative government close

ravens Creek in Scotland decimating

3:45:523:45:59

1200 jobs and livelihoods and it was

as NP government in Scotland that

3:45:593:46:02

brought this steel works and that

aluminium back. We are fed up in

3:46:023:46:09

Scotland of cleaning up his

government's mass. And we do not

3:46:093:46:12

want to be in the possession that we

have to do that again. From recent

3:46:123:46:16

reports in the press, that the

indicators such as Scotch whiskey

3:46:163:46:21

could be under threat in the US UK

trade. Secretary of State may have

3:46:213:46:26

seen the article in the Scotsman

last week that Scotch whiskey may be

3:46:263:46:31

a product that could carry an

American tag after Brexit. It is

3:46:313:46:33

further said that US law could trap

geographical name possessions after

3:46:333:46:39

Brexit to allay supermarkets that

import American products. That would

3:46:393:46:45

be averages. Would he commit to

protecting our valuable steel and

3:46:453:46:48

aluminium industries, not trading

off our bite the GI for Scotch

3:46:483:46:56

whiskey in any trade gives? And

would he reconsider given a Tory

3:46:563:47:00

Brexit -- a total president would

reduce GDP by 8% and reverse key

3:47:003:47:05

experts, will he finally reconsider

his approach to Brexit and admit

3:47:053:47:08

that he was wrong in suggesting that

between the EU's single market

3:47:083:47:13

cousin Susan bashing and consent be

overcome by medical trade deals --

3:47:133:47:18

single market trade union. In what

he said was he -- and his words

3:47:183:47:23

would be the eases in human history?

It is not won since I remember that

3:47:233:47:27

the SNP being delighted at some of

Mr Trump's tweets when he was having

3:47:273:47:33

some of his relationships with the

previous as and leader. In terms of

3:47:333:47:40

how we tackle this, we best tackle

this as a UK and the United Kingdom

3:47:403:47:46

in line with our European Union

partners. The honourable Lady dares

3:47:463:47:49

to raise the issue of GI. These are

actually in the rollover of the EU

3:47:493:47:57

trade agreements that we are trying

to get the continuity for in our

3:47:573:48:04

current trade and customs bill. And

when it comes to talking about her,

3:48:043:48:09

she needs to understand that she

voted against the rollover of those

3:48:093:48:11

bills which would have given that

there are protections she is asking

3:48:113:48:14

is for.

Thank you Mr Speaker. It is

condemnation of President Trump's

3:48:143:48:24

proposed steel tariff that the EU as

I said that it would be a retrograde

3:48:243:48:28

step to impose tariffs or engage

recalibrate measures, how would my

3:48:283:48:33

right honourable friend use the

present my second husband for open,

3:48:333:48:36

fresh and astray with the EU pose

present at the UK's position as a

3:48:363:48:41

leading proponent of free trade in

the 21st century?

I think what we

3:48:413:48:46

are seeing are the sort of problems

that come from introducing

3:48:463:48:52

rejectionist measures. Tariffs are

very seldom for any length of time

3:48:523:49:00

of successfully protect a domestic

industry. They are likely to add

3:49:003:49:03

cost to the inputs for that economy

and in the United States where there

3:49:033:49:09

are 140,000 people employed in the

production of steel, there are 6.5

3:49:093:49:14

million people and industries

dependent on steel usage. And it

3:49:143:49:17

will not be held by an increase in

the price. My honourable friend

3:49:173:49:21

makes a good point that we should

actually all be recommitting

3:49:213:49:25

ourselves out to an open, liberal

global trading system rather than

3:49:253:49:28

considering impediments to it.

If he

wants to, will he rebuffed Donald

3:49:283:49:37

Trump's claim that these tariffs are

therefore national security reasons

3:49:373:49:41

need only look at the President's

tweet from six hours ago where he

3:49:413:49:47

starts out saying, oh, what about

European farming tariffs or

3:49:473:49:50

manufacturing tariffs. It is quite

clear that he and the European Union

3:49:503:49:56

should drive a Trojan horse to the

national security nonsense that he

3:49:563:49:59

is putting up. Should he edit --

with the ABC does that this is an

3:49:593:50:05

odd thing to work with our European

Union partners and the leverage that

3:50:053:50:09

we use of data lives of 500 million

customers that the Americans cannot

3:50:093:50:13

walk all over us?

I suggest that if

we Grimm

can we have sure questions

3:50:133:50:22

and short answers?

We will work with

our partners in the European Union

3:50:223:50:28

because we are under the duty is

sincere cooperation. But there are

3:50:283:50:31

many other countries that are

affected that will also make their

3:50:313:50:34

voices known that are not members of

the European Union.

Mr Stewart.

My

3:50:343:50:42

right eyeball friend is rightly

mentioned that many of the UK

3:50:423:50:48

exports are high by men specialise

and that many of the supplies go to

3:50:483:50:52

the United States military. Does he

have an opinion at this stage

3:50:523:50:56

whether the product exemption or the

country extension route offers the

3:50:563:51:00

best hope for gaining an advantage

for the United Kingdom?

Mr Deputy

3:51:003:51:05

Speaker, that is a very good

question that he asks. Until we are

3:51:053:51:10

able to explore in greater detail

with the US authorities exactly what

3:51:103:51:16

the details will mean, it is

difficult to answer the question. In

3:51:163:51:19

any case whichever routes are best

to gain exceptions for the United

3:51:193:51:23

Kingdom and European Union...

Could

I ask the Secretary of State what

3:51:233:51:29

his view is of comments in the last

ten days around tit-for-tat for

3:51:293:51:36

example, the peanut butter, the

cranberry juice and other products

3:51:363:51:39

which are consumed here? Does he

believe this is a good approach,

3:51:393:51:42

sensible?

Mr Deputy Speaker, she

asks a good question, the EU, as I

3:51:423:51:51

said, tends to impose

countermeasures under article eight

3:51:513:51:54

of the WTO agreement. It believes

that the 232 itself is a safeguard.

3:51:543:52:01

And that it is therefore entitled to

respond to that. But I would say

3:52:013:52:05

that these constant upping of the

antsy about what may happen and what

3:52:053:52:12

countermeasures may be taken,

because there's not as as a way for

3:52:123:52:15

us to approach global trade. Issue

suggesting that it would be wise for

3:52:153:52:18

everyone to keep the temperature

down, then I entirely, 100% agree

3:52:183:52:21

with that.

Can I welcome the

Cemetery of state's statement both

3:52:213:52:28

in terms of its content but also in

terms of its tone? Free-trade is

3:52:283:52:32

about being free to trade within the

agreed rules. It is not about a

3:52:323:52:38

free-for-all. And I strongly

encourage him to reiterate that

3:52:383:52:43

message but to the United States and

to China?

Mr Deputy Speaker, I take

3:52:433:52:49

every opportunity to do so. It is

worth remembering that we had in the

3:52:493:52:55

United States a number of those who

very strongly agree with us. Notley

3:52:553:53:00

Society American business lobby,

many of whom may be harmed as a

3:53:003:53:03

result of the measures that may be

undertaken. We also have very strong

3:53:033:53:07

and vocal allies in the US Congress.

I very much welcome than making

3:53:073:53:14

their voices known in the recent

days.

3:53:143:53:21

I'd be very concerned if the

Government is putting all of its

3:53:213:53:24

hopes on an exemption for the UK or

the European Union because there

3:53:243:53:28

will still be a substantial amount

on a fact by those countries with

3:53:283:53:31

which to behave badly when they are

shut out of the US. As the Secretary

3:53:313:53:35

of State Doug and impact...

3:53:353:53:39

We are working along with the

industry to have a look at that my

3:53:433:53:50

colleagues are engaged in not work.

The honourable Lady knows that it's

3:53:503:53:55

getting Grove is a good example of

what I was discussing earlier. It is

3:53:553:54:00

one of those areas where you make a

specialist steel that goes into the

3:54:003:54:04

US programme and so the concept that

we should be taking to task on and

3:54:043:54:09

national security basis for

providing the US with something that

3:54:093:54:11

they need for their own security

programme does not make much sense.

3:54:113:54:17

Thank you Mr Deputy Speaker. It

seems to me that tariffs and

3:54:173:54:21

protectionism fundamentally

undermine the industry that they

3:54:213:54:23

seek to protect. Can the secretary

of State confirm that it remains the

3:54:233:54:26

British Government position that we

are committed to world wide

3:54:263:54:30

free-trade? And secondly, will they

be seeking a way to gain a

3:54:303:54:37

bilateral... As able to do so.

Mr

Speaker, as I've said today we will

3:54:373:54:42

work alongside the European Union

because we have a duty of sincere

3:54:423:54:46

corporation as well as members of

the European Union. I've often taken

3:54:463:54:52

this view that is strange that

people should want us to obey the

3:54:523:54:56

rules when we want them and not one

we don't want them. We have a legal

3:54:563:55:02

duty as EU members to fulfil that

and we will intend to do so and work

3:55:023:55:08

with our EU partners accordingly.

But we do as a country, and this has

3:55:083:55:15

been clear under government of both

colours, we agree in free-trade and

3:55:153:55:19

have been a global champion. Let's

remember, free trade is the means by

3:55:193:55:23

which we take it a billion people

out of abject poverty in a

3:55:233:55:28

generation and we as a country

should be proud to be in the lead.

3:55:283:55:32

Can the secretary of State give us

some examples of how he has been

3:55:323:55:35

able to use our close and special

trading relationship with the United

3:55:353:55:40

States to develop his vision of an

open liberal multilateral trade

3:55:403:55:43

agreements. The honourable gentleman

knows they are able to conduct an

3:55:433:55:50

independent trade policy as long as

we are members of his beloved

3:55:503:55:53

European Union. But what we've got

is the trade working group with the

3:55:533:55:58

United States, working at short-term

localisation, areas we might look at

3:55:583:56:02

in the future of free trade

agreement, cooperation and the WTO

3:56:023:56:06

when we leave.

And for some reason I

think that he would be well to

3:56:063:56:14

remember his own comments from

yesterday that were as mean-spirited

3:56:143:56:18

as they were wrong in substance.

Tenant I congratulate might... When

3:56:183:56:27

he goes to the United States he says

he is going to meet members of

3:56:273:56:32

Congress. Will he continue to build

the case for the open liberal

3:56:323:56:36

trading system that we all support

on both sides of this House with our

3:56:363:56:41

other good friends and the Congress

there to make sure that this can be

3:56:413:56:47

delivered once we are out of the

European Union?

I would just correct

3:56:473:56:52

my honourable friend a little. We're

not just talking to Republican

3:56:523:56:56

members of Congress, there are

strong democratic elements that have

3:56:563:56:59

long been in favour of free trade

and I think it's very important that

3:56:593:57:04

in this country in the United States

and elsewhere we work with

3:57:043:57:07

like-minded people who believe in

genuinely open liberal trade to

3:57:073:57:11

achieve the ends that we have in

common.

The recovery we've seen and

3:57:113:57:17

our steel industry has been fragile

and we are facing as my honourable

3:57:173:57:21

friend says not only the direct

impact of tariffs but the indirect

3:57:213:57:26

effects of other countries finding a

home for displaced steel. The

3:57:263:57:30

Government has been slow to act

during the steel crisis. To the

3:57:303:57:37

Secretary of State assure my steel

working constituents they will do

3:57:373:57:39

everything they can to fight for our

industry at this time.

The EU will

3:57:393:57:48

impose countermeasures because it

believes that what we are witnessing

3:57:483:57:51

is a safeguard and we believe that

that is not justified by the 232

3:57:513:57:57

case on national security. We will

alongside the EU take whatever

3:57:573:58:01

measures are required to ensure that

that is dealt with.

Can the Minister

3:58:013:58:07

confirm what steps his Department

has taken to ensure that the UK can

3:58:073:58:10

protect to produce businesses of all

sectors from unfair trading

3:58:103:58:14

practises once the UK leads the EU?

We touched on that earlier in the

3:58:143:58:22

way which we will do that is by

replicating the trade remedies

3:58:223:58:26

measures that exist, but to do that

we have to set up a trade remedies

3:58:263:58:29

authority under the trade bill

currently going through the House

3:58:293:58:34

and I hope that the opposition

parties will look again at what I

3:58:343:58:40

think is their rather inexplicable

decision to vote against the setting

3:58:403:58:43

up of the trade remedies authority

itself.

Point of order come at the

3:58:433:58:47

end of the statement.

In 2002 when

the US administration lasted this US

3:58:473:58:56

economist estimated cost the US

economy 200,000 jobs and they had to

3:58:563:59:01

back down at the WTO when the EU

took them to add. Will the Secretary

3:59:013:59:05

of State reassure this House and

still workers in my constituency and

3:59:053:59:10

elsewhere that the UK will argue for

the strongest possible safeguard

3:59:103:59:13

measures up in the EU's response.

Mr

Speaker, first of all, we hope that

3:59:133:59:19

we can persuade the United States

thing before and EU exemption so we

3:59:193:59:24

don't have to go down this

particular route and I hope that

3:59:243:59:28

sense will prevail. He's quite right

Theresa 2002 issue. At that point,

3:59:283:59:35

there is a great deal of activity

where we saw the lines between the

3:59:353:59:39

free-trade agreements and Congress

and the business community and the

3:59:393:59:42

United States come together to

change the might of the

3:59:423:59:44

administration of that time. I hope

the combination will be successful

3:59:443:59:47

this time.

This has caused

widespread concern, so what's steps

3:59:473:59:56

will discover be doing to exert

pressure on President Chen from the

3:59:564:00:00

outside and the inside in terms of

the American political and trading

4:00:004:00:05

establishments?

There is a great

deal of opinion inside Congress on

4:00:054:00:12

both parties that this is a mistake

in route to take, and I had

4:00:124:00:18

discussions in recent days with Paul

Ryan on this very subject and I

4:00:184:00:22

think that we should be trying to

mobilise all the allies they can. I

4:00:224:00:27

just mentioned the cooperation from

the honourable gentleman. I think it

4:00:274:00:32

is very important that we also not

just politically and through

4:00:324:00:36

business, but there is a role for

the trade unions to play here and

4:00:364:00:39

talking to their opposite numbers in

the United States where industries

4:00:394:00:44

are potentially damaged that are

users of steel should the price of

4:00:444:00:48

steel rise as a result of tariffs.

There is a multilayered approach

4:00:484:00:52

that we can take to dealing with

this issue, and they actually have a

4:00:524:00:55

duty to use every one of those

levers that we have.

Dumping is also

4:00:554:01:03

the crucial issue for steel workers

of my own constituency plant, does

4:01:034:01:08

the secretary of State not find it

ironic that he is talking about the

4:01:084:01:11

importance of working together

across the EU to put in place the

4:01:114:01:14

safeguards which are so necessary

whilst... And when he is speaking to

4:01:144:01:20

his US counterparts, will he remind

them that every single US state lost

4:01:204:01:25

jobs as a result of George W Bush's

actions in 2002?

The EU can take

4:01:254:01:32

countermeasures on the basis that it

believes that this is a safe car. He

4:01:324:01:35

can also take the safe guard of his

own. Steel product was damaging our

4:01:354:01:44

own market. I will remind him that

this is not a dispute between the

4:01:444:01:48

United States in the EU but involves

all the countries in the world that

4:01:484:01:54

are still producers as the WTO is

much bigger than the EU and we will

4:01:544:01:59

not be leaving the WTO as the eyes

of founding member.

I want to thank

4:01:594:02:04

the Secretary of State for

referencing that and his response to

4:02:044:02:12

the lady. Can he commit all the

necessary support given that the

4:02:124:02:21

products produced there for

Caterpillar, an American firm, and

4:02:214:02:23

are produced in the UK market and --

US market and pose no risk to those

4:02:234:02:30

jobs.

My honourable friend makes it

very important point, and the

4:02:304:02:36

exports from there to Caterpillar

which is about 25% of the site

4:02:364:02:42

output is quite right that the US

producers have low capability in

4:02:424:02:47

this product. And therefore, the

application of tariffs is only

4:02:474:02:50

likely to result in a rise in input

costs which is not really in any

4:02:504:02:54

economic's benefit. Thank you Mr

Speaker, should the stanza paint

4:02:544:03:00

impose on the 23rd of March and we

hope that they wouldn't be, should

4:03:004:03:04

they be, what steps should this

government commit to does support

4:03:044:03:08

steel-making in this country and

still making community. It's not

4:03:084:03:14

quite the deadline the 23rd of March

that it may appear. And my initial

4:03:144:03:19

discussions of the Department of

commerce and the USTR is clear that

4:03:194:03:24

the period of exemption will

continue somewhere beyond the

4:03:244:03:28

initial introduction. Clearly, if

there are going to be exemptions for

4:03:284:03:31

the EU, the UK, we did want them to

be introduced as soon as possible.

4:03:314:03:36

We will continue to push for an

Zengin on the basis I set out today.

4:03:364:03:42

When my right honourable friend

travels to Washington later this

4:03:424:03:45

week, will he be accompanied by

representatives from Brussels as

4:03:454:03:50

well? Because obviously, we're still

at EU member, and cannot

4:03:504:03:54

unilaterally yet?

Mr Speaker, I

don't require a baby-sitter from the

4:03:544:04:02

EU for my visit to Washington. We

are in continuous contact with

4:04:024:04:08

milestone and our team because this

is an issue that affects us all and

4:04:084:04:12

it affects is whether we're in the

European Union are not because these

4:04:124:04:16

actions are not actions taken

against the EU, but all producers

4:04:164:04:20

globally who will be equally

effective.

Did the secretary of

4:04:204:04:27

state or for that matter the

European Union have advanced

4:04:274:04:29

knowledge of President from's

statement on the 1st of March? And

4:04:294:04:33

if so, either way, what is that say

about the jubilation ships with the

4:04:334:04:36

president?

Mr Speaker, I'm not many

people if any had advance notice of

4:04:364:04:44

President Trump's initial

announcement.

What representations

4:04:444:04:49

has he made to China with regard to

tackling the global overcapacity of

4:04:494:04:53

steel?

Mr Speaker, as I said, do the

work that we're doing multilaterally

4:04:534:05:01

there are currently 28

recommendations outstanding which we

4:05:014:05:03

expect China to apply. The Prime

Minister raised it on her recent

4:05:034:05:11

visit to China, we continue the

conversation. We understand China's

4:05:114:05:18

E for production of aluminium and

steel for it in for the domestic

4:05:184:05:22

use, but if are going to have a

rules based system than the rules

4:05:224:05:25

need to be obeyed in Transparent,

and we need to know sufficient

4:05:254:05:30

information to be able to make that

determination as to WTO rules are

4:05:304:05:33

still being affected.

Is faced with

a trade war, what post Brexit trade

4:05:334:05:39

defence mechanisms will be employed

against the might of the US economy?

4:05:394:05:47

As I said, the whole aim of policy

at the present time in both the UK

4:05:474:05:51

and the European Union and beyond is

to try to temper these proposals to

4:05:514:05:56

get exemption so that we do not feel

any of the impetus that might lead

4:05:564:06:02

to an escalation of the current

position.

Thank you Mr Deputy

4:06:024:06:08

Speaker, as tariffs go, 25% is

particularly high and could lead to

4:06:084:06:14

all sorts of unforeseen

consequences. Is there any evidence

4:06:144:06:17

that there will be trade diversion

to the UK, because of the US

4:06:174:06:24

position at 25%?

Is quite difficult

to know in advance where there might

4:06:244:06:28

be diversion. I make the point that

our aim is not to deal with the

4:06:284:06:34

consequences, but to prevent the

imposition of the tariffs.

The

4:06:344:06:41

secretary of state jokes that

sometimes it's not very clear to

4:06:414:06:43

anybody else knew that the president

did what he was about to announce.

4:06:434:06:48

Sometimes it looks like the

president does not know what he's up

4:06:484:06:51

about to announce. And all too often

it's a tweet and set a policy. But

4:06:514:07:02

the false promise that it offers to

some of the poorest people in the

4:07:024:07:07

United States of America who in the

end will not benefit one was white

4:07:074:07:14

Mr Speaker, the honourable gentleman

makes an even better point than he

4:07:144:07:18

think he's made. The fact is in his

case possibly not. What we've seen

4:07:184:07:32

in recent years has been a rising

and worrying trend amongst Jeep 20

4:07:324:07:40

countries to impose protectionist

measures. In 2010, we saw around 300

4:07:404:07:46

nontariff barriers to trade being

operated by the G20.

The 2015 that

4:07:464:07:52

was around 1200. There has been a

gradual move away from the context

4:07:524:07:56

of global free trade and a

4:07:564:08:04

We should remember that those

countries that benefited from the

4:08:044:08:08

benefits of free trade should not be

pulling up the drawbridge behind

4:08:084:08:10

them and denying those benefits to

developing countries.

Is China doing

4:08:104:08:16

anything at all to help cut the

global supplies of steel?

That it's

4:08:164:08:23

a discussion that we have constantly

with China. They are taking measures

4:08:234:08:28

to reduce it but there are 28

recommendations outstanding. Time

4:08:284:08:32

will tell whether we are witnessing

the correct action direct -- or

4:08:324:08:37

merely the rhetoric.

Given what

President Trump said during his

4:08:374:08:43

election, none of us really should

be surprised at this. But when he

4:08:434:08:46

goes to Washington and if he doesn't

manage to change the mind of the

4:08:464:08:52

United States government, but they

do offer us as the United Kingdom an

4:08:524:08:56

exemption, would that exemption come

in from March 2019 or what it has to

4:08:564:09:01

be subject to this almost ridiculous

implementation period?

Any exemption

4:09:014:09:07

given by the United States is a US

law as intern by the US president,

4:09:074:09:15

it is far less European law.

"

Operation the time the United States

4:09:154:09:23

in the UK is a vitamin O peace --

FidoNet -- fun of these. We must

4:09:234:09:31

demonstrate this strongly to Daschle

security. How confident is my right

4:09:314:09:35

honourable friend that we can make a

strong case on those grounds?

Mr

4:09:354:09:40

state -- Mr Speaker. Yes, that we

have a strong national security

4:09:404:09:46

linkage not only through our

relationship with the kids -- with

4:09:464:09:52

the Security Council, but not only

as nuclear powers in the world, but

4:09:524:09:56

it is always just worth reminding

our US colleagues who were those

4:09:564:10:02

alongside them in Iraq and

Afghanistan and many of the other

4:10:024:10:05

conflicts of the United States has

been involved in. The United Kingdom

4:10:054:10:09

has never been wanting as a loyal

and steadfast partner and our

4:10:094:10:13

security and global security.

Seeking exemptions from the US steel

4:10:134:10:19

tariffs will not and in itself

protect the UK's steel industry from

4:10:194:10:27

dump divergent seal from the

American market. Will the Secretary

4:10:274:10:34

of State undertake to work with the

EU to ensure that whatever measures

4:10:344:10:38

are necessary to preserve the UK

steel industry are taking and work

4:10:384:10:45

with the WTO to get a more rational

and anti-dumping regime

4:10:454:10:49

internationally?

It is what we are

for in the WTO and is to make sure

4:10:494:10:57

that there is a rules based system

and that the rules are applied. And

4:10:574:11:02

when the rules are not applied,

there is a way to help those

4:11:024:11:07

countries affected. That is what we

regard as our duty.

Thank you Mr

4:11:074:11:14

Deputy Speaker. As he will note from

visiting Goodwins international in

4:11:144:11:17

my constituency and as it is a world

leader in steel products, this is

4:11:174:11:25

important not for our British

industry, but also supplying US

4:11:254:11:28

defence with equipment. How can we

ensure that this is recognised for

4:11:284:11:31

the US so that these vital British

products can continue to be exported

4:11:314:11:35

to the states?

Mr Deputy Speaker,

the US Department of defence has

4:11:354:11:42

made it quite clear that it

understands fully the contribution

4:11:424:11:46

that United Kingdom makes an airport

that the issue, they do not believe

4:11:464:11:50

that issue two -- 232 was

appropriate. I hope that the good

4:11:504:11:58

sense of the Department of defence

diffuses throughout Washington.

4:11:584:12:03

Thank you Mr Deputy Speaker. Very

kind of you. May I just come into

4:12:034:12:12

the Secretary of State the

experience of bombarding which in

4:12:124:12:18

recent months risked losing

thousands of jobs because of

4:12:184:12:22

unfairly imposed US tariffs of a

mere 300%? The winning formula into

4:12:224:12:29

defeating that was a combination of

trade unions, management, local MPs

4:12:294:12:39

and Ministers right across the

Government under the personal

4:12:394:12:43

intervention of the Prime Minister

and speaking to President Trump at

4:12:434:12:46

the Devils economic summit. --

daffodils. To protect the steel

4:12:464:12:55

industry in the United Kingdom.

Mr

Deputy Speaker, we have had as I

4:12:554:13:02

said earlier a wide range of

contacts in a wind range of areas.

4:13:024:13:07

May also say to the right honourable

lady that the ITC itself was

4:13:074:13:11

ultimately the vehicle that started

out the bombarding case so there are

4:13:114:13:17

in the United States, those elements

of an independent free trading

4:13:174:13:21

policy that we can rely on those

occasions when they are needed.

4:13:214:13:26

Because it was not just the politics

ultimately. Hard as we try for

4:13:264:13:32

bombarding a, it was American

mechanism itself which has a lot to

4:13:324:13:37

be commended for.

Thank you Mr

Deputy Speaker. Today steel and

4:13:374:13:43

aluminium, it could easily be

another industry which tour -- which

4:13:434:13:48

sell to the United States. On

Commonwealth Day, would the cemetery

4:13:484:13:53

estate and honourable friend assured

me that we are talked about allies

4:13:534:13:56

within the comment -- Commonwealth

that would defeat a policy that

4:13:564:14:00

would be as negative for the United

States to them as it would to us?

Mr

4:14:004:14:03

Deputy Speaker, I say answer that

they... The people who have the most

4:14:034:14:11

to lose if we move away from a

global concept of free trade are the

4:14:114:14:16

world's pours. If we genuinely want

people to trade their way up, they

4:14:164:14:22

can only do it in a genuinely free

trading environment. The more

4:14:224:14:25

nontariff barriers, the advanced

countries for, the less chance they

4:14:254:14:29

have of doing so. It is in

everybody's interested to pursue a

4:14:294:14:35

global free-trade policy and this

country has always shown the way on

4:14:354:14:38

that and this government will

continue to show the way.

Doctor

4:14:384:14:46

David jurors.

With regard to what

the secular stage just said, will he

4:14:464:14:52

do all he can to intercede with not

just the US, but also the EU to make

4:14:524:14:57

sure that agricultural products do

not become part of a wider trade

4:14:574:15:03

war? It is essential for the reasons

he said that less-developed

4:15:034:15:08

countries have continued access to

all those markets.

Mr Deputy

4:15:084:15:13

Speaker, we can end on a boat of --

know the perfect harmonization.

4:15:134:15:17

There is no doubt that the EU

currently has the benefit of

4:15:174:15:25

developing countries, the better. At

last we find a note of consensus.

4:15:254:15:31

Can I tell the House of the

financial guidance and claims bill

4:15:314:15:34

has been withdrawn so we will deal

with the next and then this would be

4:15:344:15:39

completed. And then that next it

will take much more. The Minister

4:15:394:15:45

for State and international element,

Alastair Burns.

Thank you, Mr Deputy

4:15:454:15:53

Speaker. With permission, I would

like to update the House on the

4:15:534:16:00

situation in Afrin. We are closely

follow developments in Afrin and

4:16:004:16:07

Northwest is here. Over the weekend,

forces continued their gains and are

4:16:074:16:13

now approaching the town of Afrin

itself. We are concerned about a

4:16:134:16:16

recent report of rising civilian

casualties. The Government has

4:16:164:16:21

called for de-escalation and the

protection of civilians. While

4:16:214:16:23

recognising Turkey's legitimate

interest in the security of its

4:16:234:16:28

borders. We will continue to push

for a reduction in violence and for

4:16:284:16:32

a consideration of the humanitarian

needs of the population and the

4:16:324:16:35

affected areas. The Prime Minister

has raised the need for production

4:16:354:16:38

of civilians and proper humanitarian

access with President air to one, as

4:16:384:16:43

has the four cemetery. -- Foreign

Secretary. They have assured us that

4:16:434:16:51

they are looking to prevent civilian

carrot -- casualties. They have been

4:16:514:16:55

dissed -- delivering health and

protection services in Afrin. Some

4:16:554:17:01

of these activities have been

suspended during -- due to the

4:17:014:17:03

current hot sodas. Our partners

continue to meet needs for their

4:17:034:17:06

able. This includes health supplies,

blankets and food. Unicef and other

4:17:064:17:16

UN organisations and the World

Health organisation have temporarily

4:17:164:17:18

suspended all activities in Afrin

you to the recent military action.

4:17:184:17:22

As a Foreign Secretary said in the

26th of February, we are concerned

4:17:224:17:28

about the humanitarian consequences

of the operation in Afrin. We urge

4:17:284:17:32

all parties to respect the law

distinction between civilian and

4:17:324:17:35

military targets facilitate access

for life-saving humanitarian aid,

4:17:354:17:39

and to allow freedom of movement for

those caught up in the violence in

4:17:394:17:43

accordance with international law.

As your conflict was soon enter its

4:17:434:17:48

eighth year. The UK continues to

make every effort to achieve our

4:17:484:17:52

goals and cereal. Defeating the

scourge of Daesh, achieving a

4:17:524:17:56

political said would that ends the

stuff they are -- suffering and

4:17:564:17:59

provides stability for all Syrians

and the wider region. There must be

4:17:594:18:02

a transition to a new inclusive

nonsectarian government that can

4:18:024:18:06

protect the rights of all Syrians,

unite the country and end the

4:18:064:18:09

conflict. We are pragmatic about how

this might take place. Serious

4:18:094:18:15

future must be for Syrians to

decide. As the second donor in 2011,

4:18:154:18:21

the UK is at the forefront of the

humanitarian response and is

4:18:214:18:25

providing life-saving support to

millions of people. Since 2012

4:18:254:18:29

across Syria and the region, UK

supporters delivered 26 million food

4:18:294:18:35

rations. 9.8 million Belize

packages, eight main vaccines and 10

4:18:354:18:39

million medical consultations.

Westerlund we provided clean water

4:18:394:18:43

to over 5 million people and could

you do towards the formal primary

4:18:434:18:46

and secondary education of over

700,000 children affected by the

4:18:464:18:50

crisis. However the only way to end

the conflict is there a negotiated

4:18:504:18:55

political settlement. My right

honourable friend the Foreign

4:18:554:18:58

Secretary has emphasised including

to his Turkish counterpart the

4:18:584:19:03

importance of biblical solution and

the defeat of Daesh. This must be at

4:19:034:19:06

the forefront of international

efforts. We are concerned about the

4:19:064:19:10

possibility of the divergent of

Kurdish fighters. We are committed

4:19:104:19:15

to working close with Turkey and

other allies devise solutions in

4:19:154:19:19

Syria that provides stability and

bring to an end this terrible

4:19:194:19:21

conflict. I commend the statement

the House.

I welcome the Minister's

4:19:214:19:29

statement. And I thank him for

advanced site. Madam Deputy Speaker,

4:19:294:19:32

here we are again, Aleppo, Mosul,

Raqqa, today were Afrin, perhaps in

4:19:324:19:40

some rows. Today we stand in this

House while some troops marched to

4:19:404:19:46

this city and region with little

regard for international law or

4:19:464:19:49

force civilian production. Putting

hundreds of thousands of people at

4:19:494:19:54

risk. Again and again we express in

this House our concern, our alarm,

4:19:544:20:00

our anchor. But it is never enough.

It is just not enough. Time and

4:20:004:20:07

again, those fighting in Syria are

consistently failing to take

4:20:074:20:10

precaution that protect civilians.

Madam Deputy Speaker, just seven

4:20:104:20:15

weeks ago, Turkey launched its

so-called operation olive branch to

4:20:154:20:20

remove what they saw as the Kurdish

threat from Afrin. The Minister also

4:20:204:20:25

says that the production of

civilians must be balanced with it,

4:20:254:20:31

and I quote, Turkey's legitimate

interests in the security of its

4:20:314:20:34

borders. We must be clear, the

incursion is neither legitimate nor

4:20:344:20:39

justified. It should never have been

allowed in the first place and it

4:20:394:20:42

has no basis in international law.

On all of branch, Madam Deputy

4:20:424:20:49

Speaker, that could hardly have been

a less suitable name for the

4:20:494:20:52

assault. Since then, even the most

conservative reports estimate that

4:20:524:20:58

several hundred Kurds have died.

Shamefully, the Turkish forces have

4:20:584:21:03

used artillery and other explosive

weapons to target civilian areas.

4:21:034:21:07

The Kurdish red Crescent report that

in the month after attacks after

4:21:074:21:16

attacks are stated, 93 civilians

were killed, 24 of them children.

4:21:164:21:21

313 civilians wounded, 51 of them

children. Unicef reported this

4:21:214:21:26

morning that over 1000 children have

not died across Syria in just the

4:21:264:21:32

first two months of 2018. Madam

Deputy Speaker, the use of artillery

4:21:324:21:38

and explosive weapons against

residential areas is clearly

4:21:384:21:43

prohibited by international

humanitarian law. It is unforgivable

4:21:434:21:46

that they are still being used.

Madam Deputy Speaker, this is not an

4:21:464:21:52

olive branch, this is a stick to

beat the Kurdish community. Madam

4:21:524:21:59

Deputy Speaker, the situation is

evolving rapidly. But me turn to

4:21:594:22:03

three particular concerns for the

days ahead. According to reports,

4:22:034:22:08

Turkish forces are right now

advancing on Afrin. So we must do

4:22:084:22:12

what we can to protect civilians.

First, there are real concerns that

4:22:124:22:17

when Turkish forces enter Afrin,

there will be widespread atrocities.

4:22:174:22:22

As they seek to root out those they

call terrorists. It is particularly

4:22:224:22:28

disturbing to hear reports that at

the centre of the assault working

4:22:284:22:31

alongside the Turkish army have been

some of the very same jihadists that

4:22:314:22:38

the Kurdish forces have worked so

hard to drive out of northern Syria.

4:22:384:22:43

And given the call by those in Afrin

for civilians to form a human shield

4:22:434:22:49

around the city, the prospects of a

siege and an assault on the city is

4:22:494:22:54

likely to cause severe civilian

casualties. What is the UK doing to

4:22:544:23:00

apply pressure on Turkey to stop the

assault and respect international

4:23:004:23:03

law?

4:23:034:23:15

We can never excuse and throw the

word terrorism around to justify

4:23:154:23:21

human rights abuses. Second, the

Washington Post has today reported

4:23:214:23:24

accounts that they are already

thousands of Kurds fleeing from the

4:23:244:23:30

city of afferent fearing for their

lives and what will happen if or

4:23:304:23:35

when the city. What reassurance can

the Minister provide the refugees

4:23:354:23:41

and displaced people will be granted

safe passage. And that the

4:23:414:23:47

international community, including

Britain, will step up to the plate

4:23:474:23:50

and provide immediate humanitarian

aid and long-term support. Third,

4:23:504:23:54

then return to the access of

humanitarian aid. For the human

4:23:544:23:59

rights monitors who can act as one

of the greatest deterrent against it

4:23:594:24:03

-- like civilian atrocities. What

steps is the Government taking to

4:24:034:24:08

urge Turkey to allow accurate does

not access, independent monitors to

4:24:084:24:14

ensure that civilians are protected

and that perpetrators of abuses are

4:24:144:24:17

held to account. And now that UK

funded partners and UN agencies are

4:24:174:24:25

suspending humanitarian activities,

what's this is the Government taking

4:24:254:24:30

to quickly restore full humanitarian

access to afferent so that the UK

4:24:304:24:34

and other partners can get Aiden and

save us. Madam Deputy Speaker --

4:24:344:24:41

speakers, the Kurt community is

watching. At many to ensure that UK

4:24:414:24:46

is doing everything it can to help

civilians and afferent.

Thank you

4:24:464:24:56

Madam Deputy Speaker, can I thank

the young lady for her questions and

4:24:564:25:00

for the way in which she has a post

this. She poses some questions that

4:25:004:25:07

will be difficult for any government

to respond to. I will do my best.

4:25:074:25:12

This is an area where the United

Kingdom is not present underground,

4:25:124:25:16

where it is difficult to get

information out, where you and aid

4:25:164:25:19

workers are not able operate, and

where there was a limitation to what

4:25:194:25:26

we can actually deliver. But there

will be no shortage of effort to

4:25:264:25:33

absently do every pitcher recommend

in terms of protecting civilians.

4:25:334:25:35

She is right to say that once again

this is another part of the overall

4:25:354:25:40

Syrian tragedy. Whatever may be the

particular circumstances, it all

4:25:404:25:47

traces back to the war waged by a

president on his own people which

4:25:474:25:51

will enter its eighth year. In just

a couple of days' time. The

4:25:514:25:55

Secretary General of the UN got

recorded on the 12th of March this

4:25:554:26:00

year said this, Syria is bleeding

inside and out, there should only be

4:26:004:26:06

one agenda for all of us, ending the

suffering of the Syrian people and

4:26:064:26:10

find a political solution to the

conflict. Let me just deal with some

4:26:104:26:17

of the points that she raised. In

particular the way in which this is

4:26:174:26:24

seen, she gives a picture of how she

recognises this and how the Kurdish

4:26:244:26:28

community sees it. We are not here

to answer for the Kurdish

4:26:284:26:34

authorities, plainly did take a

different position. The aim is to

4:26:344:26:42

oust the white PG from the territory

they see them as an extension the

4:26:424:26:47

site -- white PG. WPG. The most

important thing for us in a moment

4:26:474:27:01

as if we can bring that particular

part of the conflict to an end and

4:27:014:27:05

help people. The Foreign Secretary

and the Prime Minister have both

4:27:054:27:10

been in contact with the respective

partners, our ambassador made

4:27:104:27:15

representations to the Turkish

government just three days ago. I

4:27:154:27:18

can surely, honourable lady in the

House, everything we do is meant to

4:27:184:27:29

do to dissuade the parties... And

allow humanitarian access. Secondly

4:27:294:27:34

in relations due to what happens to

people who flee, we've worked with

4:27:344:27:40

partners to ensure that the supplies

are in the area. We can't get close,

4:27:404:27:44

but we are doing our best of the UN

agencies and others I have been

4:27:444:27:48

active in the area have supplies

available if people are able to

4:27:484:27:52

leave. And of course, we would wish

them to be so, as there is a

4:27:524:27:57

distinction between civilians and

those considered as fighters. We are

4:27:574:28:01

doing everything we can in relation

to them. Thirdly, of course, we

4:28:014:28:07

would wish to advocate. However, the

brutality and the grimness of the

4:28:074:28:16

war in that region means there was a

gap between anything we would seek

4:28:164:28:20

to find in our deliberations and

what may be happening underground. I

4:28:204:28:27

wish I could promise the honourable

lady that we won't be back here soon

4:28:274:28:31

but I'm afraid I can't. We are doing

everything we can to meet the

4:28:314:28:37

humanitarian needs, and the pain. If

you can mean the end with a

4:28:374:28:43

political resolution.

I think my

right honourable friend for his

4:28:434:28:51

statement. Of course what you said,

the Turkish government has assured

4:28:514:28:56

the Foreign Office that it is

working to prevent civilian

4:28:564:29:00

casualties which I think it is

diplomatic code that means, I don't

4:29:004:29:03

believe you, we don't believe you.

The wretched truth is here, our

4:29:034:29:11

Kurdish allies in the war against

the enemies -- my enemies of

4:29:114:29:15

civilization are brutally treated by

Nato ally. Is there anything else we

4:29:154:29:18

can do about it?

I'm grateful to my

right honourable friend. You care

4:29:184:29:28

has consistently raise the need to

protect civilians and the escalator

4:29:284:29:31

situation. We believe the Turkish

government and we will hold them to

4:29:314:29:41

the statement.

Thank you Madam

Deputy Speaker. And afferent it

4:29:414:29:51

represents a new front, a sudden

crisis. A seven-year long proxy war

4:29:514:29:56

that's killed an estimated half a

million people as we all know, Madam

4:29:564:30:00

Deputy Speaker, the laws of war

strictly per batch ) prohibit

4:30:004:30:06

attacking civilian structures,

civilian areas unless they're being

4:30:064:30:08

used for military purposes. Since

the conflict began, the local

4:30:084:30:14

Kurdish health authorities estimated

200, civilians and 600 have been

4:30:144:30:19

injured. The UN say that the

afferent district has a population

4:30:194:30:27

of 320,000, the majority of this are

classified as being in need. 100,000

4:30:274:30:32

are not internally displaced. I was

speaking to my constituents and

4:30:324:30:38

Syrian refugees he was close to

tears in explaining what happened to

4:30:384:30:44

his family. He said his Sally was

not safe, it was only possible to

4:30:444:30:48

contact them every few days. Having

spoken to his brother this morning,

4:30:484:30:52

he said were under siege and didn't

know what to do. No water, no

4:30:524:30:56

electricity not enough food. In his

village near afferent, every one is

4:30:564:31:02

sheltered from bonds. Best

everything was settled shattered by

4:31:024:31:06

bombs. These are civilians, and to

have no place to go. Does the

4:31:064:31:18

Government and the pressure on

Turkey, and ensure respect for

4:31:184:31:22

international and UN law. What

progress has the Government made to

4:31:224:31:27

bring about a political resolution

in accordance resolution 2254. And

4:31:274:31:32

finally, on the 20th of February the

president of Turkey said, and he I

4:31:324:31:40

quote, cut external aid. What is the

UK Government doing doing to ensure

4:31:404:31:45

to increase it and to make sure that

it gets there?

I am grateful to the

4:31:454:31:51

honourable gentleman. He started

with a brief description of the

4:31:514:31:58

horrors of this particular conflict

and in that he is absolutely right.

4:31:584:32:01

The great horror is that we have

seen in recent times the shredding

4:32:014:32:05

of the international law on which we

have tried to work for the best part

4:32:054:32:10

of 70 years since 1945. The UN

Security Council, if the UN Security

4:32:104:32:17

Council can't bring it to an end, if

we have moved away from the norms in

4:32:174:32:20

the use of chemical weapons, that is

also if we've seen the tactics of

4:32:204:32:29

siege and hunger come back into

modern warfare, then we risk losing

4:32:294:32:36

everything in a way that national

community has put together after the

4:32:364:32:46

horrors of World War II,... It has

echoes of that. And unless we find

4:32:464:32:55

ways to restore this national --

international order, will be

4:32:554:32:58

debating this longer any will raise

the possibility, as to what states

4:32:584:33:04

are doing, and not going back to the

old ways of dealing with complex,

4:33:044:33:10

mice pick has to be bit -- my bigger

than yours of resolving conflict. To

4:33:104:33:14

answer those three questions we will

continue to talk to our Nato

4:33:144:33:21

partners about the need for security

and how this operation may be

4:33:214:33:26

assisting them, what distinctions

they are drawn between humanitarian

4:33:264:33:29

casualties and the need to protect

civilians and those who are seeking

4:33:294:33:33

to protect their own postulation --

population. We are doing everything

4:33:334:33:37

we can to support them. In response

to the second question, intercept

4:33:374:33:44

diplomatic question, we have seen it

means that the Geneva process is the

4:33:444:33:53

best bet for political resolution.

In terms of aid, 2.46 billion, that

4:33:534:33:59

this is been the largest support the

United Kingdom has ever given to a

4:33:594:34:03

conflict situation to protect

refugees. There will be no shortage

4:34:034:34:10

refugees -- no shortage of help for

refugees, those who need help. But

4:34:104:34:14

the best course is two end the

conflict.

Right honourable friend

4:34:144:34:22

was being pragmatic about how to

resolve the conflict. What are the

4:34:224:34:27

milestones that he is looking to

achieve along the journey?

I thank

4:34:274:34:31

my honourable friend. Several have

come about recently. The Syrian

4:34:314:34:40

negotiation committee reformed after

meetings not represent the Syrian

4:34:404:34:46

opposition and has Kurdish

representatives on it in order to

4:34:464:34:49

present a united front at the Geneva

talks. The failure of the secondary

4:34:494:34:55

process, as I said earlier, means

that there can be more concentration

4:34:554:35:00

on Geneva. I understand that special

envoy is working on a series of

4:35:004:35:07

boxes that people can talk about,

and gradually come back together.

4:35:074:35:12

Most importantly, we continue

through you when African resolutions

4:35:124:35:15

to demand humanitarian access into a

conflict in conflict areas, not to

4:35:154:35:23

move attention away from the area,

and the damage that is being done

4:35:234:35:29

there, in horrific humanitarian

circumstances. We are calling on all

4:35:294:35:32

parties do heavy-handed that to

desist from that. And also recognise

4:35:324:35:36

that the siege of Daesh has not been

distinguished. If...

Isn't this the

4:35:364:35:51

case that the gentleman is using...

To engage in a barbarous slaughter

4:35:514:36:04

of men, women and children. Should

the British Government be absolutely

4:36:044:36:11

clear that he must absolutely and

the offensive. And second has the

4:36:114:36:15

time not come to stop selling arms

to this man who is behaving like a

4:36:154:36:19

despot?

Mr would have been

consistent in our thoughts to

4:36:194:36:27

de-escalate. With our Turkish and

Nato partners. But within

4:36:274:36:38

recognising the territorial

concerns, we indeed call to an end

4:36:384:36:42

-- for an end of the operations.

This appalling and big kids -- on

4:36:424:36:52

vindictive vendetta on our strongest

allies on the ground in the battle

4:36:524:36:56

against Daesh. Is there absolutely

no chance of the UN, brokered

4:36:564:37:03

cease-fire so that perhaps if that

was to happen, we could put

4:37:034:37:07

peacekeeping in to protect civilian

people?

4:37:074:37:18

While there is no effect already.

4:37:184:37:29

Urge before

4:37:574:37:57

my Kurdish constituents are deeply

distressed about what is happening

4:38:024:38:07

to civilians and Afrin.

Hundreds of

people are being killed there and

4:38:074:38:13

hundreds of thousands are being

injured or are fleeing or being

4:38:134:38:20

displaced. What help can the

Minister give to those people who

4:38:204:38:22

are suffering so badly?

The right

honourable Lady will be aware as we

4:38:224:38:30

all are about the recent press

reports, Sky News coverage over the

4:38:304:38:35

weekend. What I can do for the

honourable lady is give her the

4:38:354:38:38

absolute assurance that the UK

Government that there is repeated

4:38:384:38:43

representations and is seeking to

have the conflict escalated as being

4:38:434:38:45

clear. So that this part of the

conflict can come to an end as

4:38:454:38:53

swiftly as possible.

It looks to me

that we have misread this Syrian

4:38:534:38:59

civil war from start to finish. The

facts on the grounds are the Asad is

4:38:594:39:05

winning the war. He will take the

eastern part of the city and he is

4:39:054:39:09

now allied with our allies, the

Kurds in resisting a naked invasion

4:39:094:39:13

from Turkey which can evolve to the

slaughter of thousands of innocent

4:39:134:39:17

civilians. Of the Turks have been

very generous in providing safe

4:39:174:39:22

refuge for millions of Syrian

refugees in Turkey itself, surely we

4:39:224:39:26

should call out this invasion for

what is and at this crucial moment,

4:39:264:39:32

Stan by the Kurds without whom we

would not have been able to defeat

4:39:324:39:36

Isis.

Mr Speaker, my honourable

friend is correct in recognising

4:39:364:39:45

extraordinary contribution of the

Kurdish people across the region

4:39:454:39:47

through Serie A and the pushing back

Isis. However, the complexities of

4:39:474:39:55

the politics in the area and parts

of the country, Iraq and Turkey and

4:39:554:39:59

what is led to the present

situation, the history of the

4:39:594:40:04

conflict of Serie A which I have a

certain amount of knowledge from

4:40:044:40:08

2010 onwards. All I can do is assure

my honourable friend that we will do

4:40:084:40:21

all we can as I said to seek the

de-escalate this conflict, protect

4:40:214:40:25

Kurdish civilians and see a

resolution to the present issue.

4:40:254:40:33

Thank you. Last year the Foreign

Affairs Committee went to Turkey in

4:40:334:40:37

January. We had meetings with the

president and his senior Ministers.

4:40:374:40:42

It was made very clear to us at that

time that Turkey intended at some

4:40:424:40:48

point to relocate hundreds of

thousands of the 3 million serious

4:40:484:40:53

Arab refugees who were in Turkey

into the areas on their border in

4:40:534:40:59

the north and prevent the Kurds

having a contiguous area under their

4:40:594:41:05

control. Why did the international

community not tomorrow to stop? And

4:41:054:41:15

is the Minister really serious when

he thinks that there will be a

4:41:154:41:18

political solution and defeat for

Isis as long as Turkey sees its

4:41:184:41:23

priority as stopping the Kurds

rather than getting a political

4:41:234:41:27

solution.

I'm not sure I really know

the answer to the honourable

4:41:274:41:36

gentleman's very good question.

Based on his knowledge of the area

4:41:364:41:41

which I certainly recognise. As I

said, the different aspects of this

4:41:414:41:48

conflict and the different reasons

why some states are taking action go

4:41:484:41:56

back many years and are intended to

sort out many difficulties in many

4:41:564:42:01

issues which are being brought to

light by the conflict against Isis

4:42:014:42:06

and the break-up of Syria. It's not

possible for the UK I don't think to

4:42:064:42:12

say to other states what the and

lines drawn on the map will be.

4:42:124:42:20

Countries have their concerns about

terrorist activity and Turkey has

4:42:204:42:22

been clear about that relation to

the PKK, a proscribed organisation

4:42:224:42:28

both there and here and that we

respect and a Nato ally. I've said

4:42:284:42:31

relation to what's happening

recently, we have been clear on our

4:42:314:42:36

determination that there should be a

de-escalation at that. We do call

4:42:364:42:39

for a resumption of the negotiations

with Tommy ended in 2015 between

4:42:394:42:42

Turkey and the PKK. Maybe perhaps it

is not quite as helpless as

4:42:424:42:49

sometimes we feel when we look at

the map.

Thank you Madam Deputy

4:42:494:42:54

Speaker. Most I welcome the tone and

content of the Minister's statement

4:42:544:43:00

it is depressing to be back in the

House to talk about more horrors and

4:43:004:43:03

a country that is seen more than its

fair share over the last seven

4:43:034:43:06

years. Would he reassure me about

what efforts the UK will take to

4:43:064:43:12

protect civilians if there is a

Turkish siege of Afrin?

I'm grateful

4:43:124:43:20

to my honourable friend. It

consistently raised the need to

4:43:204:43:23

protect civilians and to de-escalate

the operation. We want to see this

4:43:234:43:29

safe and sustained delivery of

humanitarian aid and services which

4:43:294:43:32

are urgently needed across the

region and indeed, in Syria as a

4:43:324:43:35

whole. We will continue to press for

that. He can only be assured that

4:43:354:43:43

although we cannot predict the

outcome we can be absolutely certain

4:43:434:43:45

of the efforts we will make to try

and de-escalate the situation and

4:43:454:43:49

have a humanitarian situation which

protect civilians.

Madam Deputy

4:43:494:44:00

Speaker, I have several hundred

constituents in Edinburgh East who

4:44:004:44:03

hail from this part of the world.

Many of whom tonight are fearful for

4:44:034:44:07

their loved ones in the city of

Afrin. I have to tell the Minister

4:44:074:44:10

that they expressed to me and

increasing sense of the trail. That

4:44:104:44:17

this government and its allies are

happy to praise the sacrifice of the

4:44:174:44:22

Curtis people and the fight against

international terrorism and yet when

4:44:224:44:25

it comes to upholding their

political rights, they are met with

4:44:254:44:28

silence. Is it not the truth at the

time has come to stop the pretence

4:44:284:44:32

that what is happening with that

Turkish siege of Afrin has anything

4:44:324:44:38

to do with protecting the Turkish

territorial sovereignty and to admit

4:44:384:44:43

that it is all about degrading

aspirations of the Kurds and any

4:44:434:44:47

future political settlement which

will one day followed the end of

4:44:474:44:51

this conflict.

The honourable

gentleman puts his own case and I

4:44:514:45:00

recognise that. It's not the view in

the United Kingdom government. We

4:45:004:45:05

recognise that terrorist concerns of

Turkey but equally we have been

4:45:054:45:10

clear about the impact of the

conflict and humanitarian basis and

4:45:104:45:15

on the opportunity to find a

political resolution. That solution

4:45:154:45:23

will knock him about the conflict,

it will come about through political

4:45:234:45:25

dialogue which is made more

difficult by the circumstances.

4:45:254:45:29

That's why the United Kingdom

continues to urge de-escalation,

4:45:294:45:33

humanitarian access and release for

the families of his constituents but

4:45:334:45:38

he speaks about.

Whilst the Turkish

government have assured the Foreign

4:45:384:45:45

and Commonwealth Office that it is

working to prevent civilian

4:45:454:45:48

casualties, report showed they are

increasing. Can the Minister confirm

4:45:484:45:52

how the UK can ensure that civilians

are protected from a Turkish sees of

4:45:524:45:57

Afrin city?

I'm grateful. The honest

answer is I cannot ensure it. The

4:45:574:46:05

United Kingdom government cannot

ensure this. Be to suggest something

4:46:054:46:09

we don't possess. It seems

inappropriate for me to do so. All I

4:46:094:46:15

can say is, along with others and

international community, we will

4:46:154:46:18

continue to make the representations

we can. We move for situation of

4:46:184:46:22

cease-fire in Syria in general.

Given resolution 2401 we worry that

4:46:224:46:30

these norms are not like here too.

-- the UN resolution. In the

4:46:304:46:36

immensely complex situation of

northern Syria, it's Turkish border,

4:46:364:46:40

what is been experienced and Turkey

over the years and the long-standing

4:46:404:46:43

conflict, there is none of this at

the United Kingdom can give an

4:46:434:46:47

assurance about. All we can say is

we are very clear that humanitarian

4:46:474:46:52

considerations must come first. You

must be humanitarian access. The

4:46:524:46:55

best way to deal with any of the

complexes political de-escalation

4:46:554:47:02

not that escalation of conflict

which will only lead to the

4:47:024:47:05

resurgence of the conflict as soon

as this is over.

The Minister is

4:47:054:47:10

right to urge restraint from Turkey,

I know the partners in the country.

4:47:104:47:16

-- region. And I asked what the

Government's assessment or the fair

4:47:164:47:22

affairs committee conclusion of the

link between the PKK and a wide PG

4:47:224:47:28

with essential to understanding what

is driving Turkey. Does he share my

4:47:284:47:38

fears that there may be a long

period where the protection of

4:47:384:47:42

civilians is under threat while we

tried to get a political settlement

4:47:424:47:47

and decent governance across areas

which are war-torn present.

Once

4:47:474:47:57

again the honourable gentleman

speaks about great knowledge of the

4:47:574:48:03

area. As I said in evidence, the

United Kingdom recognises some

4:48:034:48:11

similarities in terms of ideology

between PKK and why PG. Not the

4:48:114:48:15

direct link that is claimed by

Turkey which is why we prescribe PKK

4:48:154:48:21

not the other group. We are aware of

the issues of similarity. We don't

4:48:214:48:32

see the link in the same way. The

second point regarding the long-term

4:48:324:48:38

nature of this is of course entirely

real. The longer the conflict as a

4:48:384:48:42

whole goes on, more there will be

the opportunity for issues of

4:48:424:48:47

long-standing to be settled with the

disruption that's currently taking

4:48:474:48:53

place in Syria. That is why the best

opportunity for peace and security

4:48:534:48:58

all around is to support the Geneva

process as we are in work as hard as

4:48:584:49:02

we are diplomatically to get the

parties to find a better answer to

4:49:024:49:05

the conflict occurs as the region

aptly shows, the only certainty in

4:49:054:49:09

the region... Sooner or later that

group will take up arms against the

4:49:094:49:15

other.

Thank you. I would like to

thank the Minister for his statement

4:49:154:49:22

and the eloquence of his answers. It

reflects the view of Sony people in

4:49:224:49:30

the House with sympathy for the

Kurds have been fighting Isis for

4:49:304:49:37

years frankly often on our behalf

and a sense of helplessness we all

4:49:374:49:40

feel I what is happening at Afrin.

My question is, on the basis of the

4:49:404:49:47

considerable investment and money

that the United Kingdom has put in

4:49:474:49:53

in humanitarian aid, are there any

specific additional elements of the

4:49:534:50:00

humanitarian aid that the Minister

feels that the Government could

4:50:004:50:04

perhaps do to help the people

suffering in Afrin?

Mr Speaker I'm

4:50:044:50:10

grateful to the honourable

gentleman. At the moment, the honest

4:50:104:50:15

answer is I can't see anything that

we could currently add valid make a

4:50:154:50:19

significant difference beyond what

we are already seeking to do. I been

4:50:194:50:23

quite clear that we need to get

preparations made to ensure that

4:50:234:50:27

when civilians leave the area that

supplies are there. We are

4:50:274:50:38

consistent in supporting one in 401

to seek access and de-escalation of

4:50:384:50:47

conflict to allow opportunities to

be created both the dialogue and to

4:50:474:50:51

protect the people. If there is

anything new that we could think of

4:50:514:50:54

to add to it, we would. Meanwhile we

are working with all the partners we

4:50:544:50:59

can to see the de-escalate and get

the humanitarian access that is

4:50:594:51:01

crucial.

We should all be appalled

by the scenes affecting civilians in

4:51:014:51:08

Afrin. Our ability to influence the

operational military tactics of Isis

4:51:084:51:15

or Asad or Russia and the situations

is limited. Turkey is a member of

4:51:154:51:21

Nato. I wondered if he could save

whether there's been direct contact

4:51:214:51:24

between his Defence Secretary and

his counterpart in Turkey and

4:51:244:51:30

officer level contact about the

conduct and the tactics and the

4:51:304:51:35

importance of Turkey adhering to

international humanitarian law.

An

4:51:354:51:38

answer to that question is, I can't

speak for Defence Secretary. I can't

4:51:384:51:47

say there has been contact between

the military. Not to the extent he

4:51:474:51:49

is saying because it was almost a

question about tactics and

4:51:494:51:53

everything and that when a bee in

any way appropriate. Defensive

4:51:534:52:00

coaches, ambassadors approaches,

prime Ministers approaches, Foreign

4:52:004:52:04

secretaries approaches have been

consistent about the de-escalation

4:52:044:52:05

of the conflict. That is the

approach. As a Nato partner, other

4:52:054:52:11

partners are involved as well. The

United States has a significant

4:52:114:52:15

interest in the area and also in

this conflict coming to an end as

4:52:154:52:18

soon as possible.

As has already

been mentioned, the Kurds have been

4:52:184:52:25

key allies in our fight against

Isis. For the interest of clarity,

4:52:254:52:29

does the Government consider

Turkey's continued attacks on Afrin

4:52:294:52:32

as contravening UN Security Council

resolution 2401? If so, with the

4:52:324:52:39

Minister agree that is not only the

right thing to do to condemn them

4:52:394:52:43

also crucial if we are to restore

faith in the international order and

4:52:434:52:46

any hopes of bringing about a

political resolution.

4:52:464:52:53

Assad the honourable gentleman

princes question there well. If 2401

4:52:534:52:57

means what it says. It means

cease-fire for the whole of Syria.

4:52:574:53:01

The United Kingdom is part of that

expense by. As I said earlier, what

4:53:014:53:05

happens of resolutions now if there

was not sufficient will underground,

4:53:054:53:08

that we don't get what we need to

be. Indeed, the whole international

4:53:084:53:13

order is effective. That is a reason

why we are so consistent in talking

4:53:134:53:17

to our Turkish partner about the

de-escalation, the need for the

4:53:174:53:25

escalation, the need for

humanitarian access and to urge all

4:53:254:53:27

parties in the area defined way

beyond the concert.

Last weekend, a

4:53:274:53:34

Kurdish constituent dissolved in

tears at a meeting about something

4:53:344:53:36

else. They're worried about their

family. I am wondering what we can

4:53:364:53:40

do in terms of taking evidence so

that in future, war crimes can be

4:53:404:53:47

prosecuted on an international Court

of justice.

The honourable lady goes

4:53:474:53:53

further than I can go in relation to

this particular issue. Any war crime

4:53:534:53:59

allegations has to be reported to

the authorities. The United Kingdom

4:53:594:54:04

has worked extremely hard to put...

Provide those in Syria to gather

4:54:044:54:10

evidence of crimes wherever they may

be. Then again, one can understand

4:54:104:54:15

her constituents, but throughout

that area there are families in

4:54:154:54:20

tears. At each border atrocities

committed. That is a tragedy for the

4:54:204:54:25

united kingdom is worse for others

to bring an end to an end. It's only

4:54:254:54:33

bite digging into this in the manner

suggested by the UN, as individual

4:54:334:54:39

aspect of justice and accountability

are absolutely important. We...

4:54:394:54:53

The Minister will be aware that has

occurred is a Kurdish community in

4:54:554:54:57

my constituency is well. We have

discussed this in the recent past.

4:54:574:55:04

The Kurdish community in Glasgow has

a mixture of sadness and anger. To

4:55:044:55:09

ask given to the city of Afron is

under siege without water and food,

4:55:094:55:14

we have a motion for both sides of

house to condemn, displacement,...

4:55:144:55:21

And whole region.

What I can do

Madam Deputy Speaker is make

4:55:214:55:27

reference to what I said earlier.

The tactics of siege, ignoring

4:55:274:55:31

humanitarian norms, international

long conflict all communities in the

4:55:314:55:40

region will suffer longer it goes

on. We are calling for it

4:55:404:55:45

de-escalation. And the only thing

that ultimately will end the

4:55:454:55:53

conflict throughout the region.

Madam Deputy Speaker, the Minister

4:55:534:55:58

has said that the Government intends

to hold the Turkish government to

4:55:584:56:03

account for the representation is

given civilian customs. What

4:56:034:56:10

specific steps will the Government

do. Will they press for independent

4:56:104:56:17

monitoring -- I'm monitoring of

international law?

In terms of

4:56:174:56:22

holding people accountable, we

withhold any party that is guilty of

4:56:224:56:30

any crimes in the conflict as my

conflict in the same way that all

4:56:304:56:35

international structures monitoring

on the ground is extremely

4:56:354:56:38

difficult. We must be entirely

tactical about this. The holding it

4:56:384:56:43

to is the same holding into account

of any party in the conflict. We

4:56:434:56:48

have been very clear, as I said, we

understand the origins of this and

4:56:484:56:54

why Turkey has a concerns that it

does. But equally, we recognise the

4:56:544:57:01

risk of this conflict are diverting

attention from the regime, from

4:57:014:57:05

Isis, there is evidence that this

conflict in Afron has grown and

4:57:054:57:11

others elsewhere have taken the

opportunity do in order to start

4:57:114:57:15

their own operations again which is

just further misery for the people

4:57:154:57:18

of Syria. Again I go back to the

Secretary General and his determined

4:57:184:57:22

-- determination to try to find an

overall settlement over this.

4:57:224:57:26

Ultimately that is the only thing

that will end the conflict between

4:57:264:57:31

the parties and the pain that is

being suffered tonight in areas of

4:57:314:57:33

the region.

Does the Minister agree

that the Turkish assault on Afron

4:57:334:57:42

was entirely to him testify and has

no basis in international law and if

4:57:424:57:47

he does, what specific steps will be

taken by the Government ensure that

4:57:474:57:52

Turkey is held accountable for war

crimes being perpetrated in Afron.

4:57:524:57:57

At the beginning of my segment I set

out what the United Kingdom thought

4:57:574:58:04

of that.

I seek your advice one year

ago, today, exactly on the 12th of

4:58:044:58:25

March 2017, the foreign affairs

select committee published a report,

4:58:254:58:32

Article 50 negotiations,

implications of no deal. We also

4:58:324:58:37

published several other reports in

March of last year. Responses to

4:58:374:58:44

those reports on Turkey, on Russia,

in our second report on political

4:58:444:58:52

Islam were received by the former

does write for an Commonwealth

4:58:524:58:58

office on the 20th of July and were

published as soon as the committee

4:58:584:59:02

was re-established in September. We

have received no response to the

4:59:024:59:09

report that was published in March

on implications of no deal. We raise

4:59:094:59:15

the matter, I raise the matter with

the Foreign Secretary when he came

4:59:154:59:20

before our committee in November on

the 1st of November. And reminded

4:59:204:59:25

him that the committee had not yet

received the customary response to

4:59:254:59:29

within two months. He said, I think

you are asking the wrong department.

4:59:294:59:35

I think it is someone else who is

drafting the response to your

4:59:354:59:44

excellent report. I am asking if you

have seen thus like I asked him if

4:59:444:59:48

he had seen in a draft that you said

not that I'm aware of. And he said I

4:59:484:59:52

promise to take it up guys like to

get up and I set it is eight months,

4:59:524:59:59

he said thank you we will make sure

to take it up. To date, despite

4:59:595:00:05

expecting a response, the Foreign

Affairs Committee has not received a

5:00:055:00:10

response from the Department for

exiting the EU, or the Commonwealth

5:00:105:00:16

office, one year after the reports.

Madam Deputy Speaker, can you

5:00:165:00:19

suggest to me any course of action

that can be taken. I'm speaking here

5:00:195:00:27

on behalf of the committee. What can

we do to get the basic courtesy of a

5:00:275:00:34

response from this government on a

matter of topical interest, vital

5:00:345:00:39

interest to our country and to our

Parliament. How can we get the

5:00:395:00:45

Government to respond as they are

supposed to do a committee report?

I

5:00:455:00:53

thank the honourable member for

giving me notice that he intended to

5:00:535:00:57

raise this issue on behalf of of the

Foreign Affairs Committee. It

5:00:575:01:03

certainly, it is certainly very

unsatisfactory that the Government

5:01:035:01:06

hasn't replied to a report of the

41st committee, if indeed he was

5:01:065:01:12

published a year ago. It is

understandable, that sometimes there

5:01:125:01:19

will be a bit of the deep bass by

delay, during an election period. It

5:01:195:01:23

should normally be two guns. But

clearly, I delay every year is

5:01:235:01:30

something quite different. I do hope

in response to, I do hope that this

5:01:305:01:38

is being noted on the Treasury bench

and the departments involved, could

5:01:385:01:43

now get together resolve what is

going to be done about it so that a

5:01:435:01:50

committee can have a response as

soon as possible. Thank you. Point

5:01:505:01:55

of order.

Thank you Madam Deputy

Speaker, I seek your advice. Roof

5:01:555:02:04

railing around the international

Trade Secretary referred to both my

5:02:045:02:11

colleagues as being completely

opposed... That is categorically

5:02:115:02:21

incorrect. She will not as well as I

do, fighting against a poorly

5:02:215:02:25

developed policies is there a

definitive voting against the

5:02:255:02:28

concept in its entirety. The

honourable gentleman is it Doctor

5:02:285:02:37

but he has not done his work --

homework on this occasion. We had

5:02:375:02:44

tabled a number of amendments to

improve, ... None of which were

5:02:445:02:50

taken on board or accepted by the

Government. What can I do to ensure

5:02:505:02:56

the honourable gentleman and sets

the record straight?

The honourable

5:02:565:03:04

lady has made her point very clearly

about what she felt in terms of the

5:03:045:03:09

remarks made. The Bill will be

coming back to the House and so I

5:03:095:03:16

will suggest, and I'm sure she will,

continue to put over her view as I

5:03:165:03:21

am sure the local front bench will

as well when it comes back. So if

5:03:215:03:27

there are no quest -- no further

point of order, the court will now

5:03:275:03:34

proceed to read the orders of the

day.

Financial... And plays

5:03:345:03:40

billboard. To be considered. Not

moved. Built to be considered what

5:03:405:03:48

they?

Tomorrow. We now come to

motion number two relating to the

5:03:485:03:56

petitions committee, Bill Wiggin.

The question is is on the order

5:03:565:04:02

paper, essay I doesn't iMac... Thank

you very much. I wish to present I

5:04:025:04:17

was present a petition to improve

access at the...

Station. It is a

5:04:175:04:29

key station in Manchester, Sheffield

lined used by thousands of commuters

5:04:295:04:33

but also needed by elderly and

disabled people for access the

5:04:335:04:37

hospital. The centres for disabled

children and adults, it is

5:04:375:04:46

considerably needed. The platform

can only be accessed where injuries

5:04:465:04:52

regularly occur. The House of

Commons urges the Department for

5:04:525:04:56

Transport to make improvements to

Jimmy station so that a public can

5:04:565:05:00

have level access to railway at

Julie. -- Mike

5:05:005:05:15

Julie petition, accessibility at

Chin Lee station does not the

5:05:215:05:38

question is this House do now

adjourn. I am very grateful this

5:05:385:05:45

evening with the opportunity to

highlight this up issue. I will

5:05:455:05:54

start, if you are one of those

families who are just managing. I

5:05:545:05:59

want to address a directive of a

minor working around-the-clock, I

5:05:595:06:02

know you're doing your best and I

know that sometimes life can be a

5:06:025:06:05

struggle. Ministers are probably fed

up with empties quoting those words,

5:06:055:06:10

spoken by the Prime Minister just 20

months ago on the steps of Downing

5:06:105:06:14

Street. And to keep mentioning them

in many different contexts as we see

5:06:145:06:18

our community software, as the

promise that followed fails to meet

5:06:185:06:24

the needs. Here some of the most

venerable people in our community

5:06:245:06:28

believe as a race bike care price,

Madam Deputy Speaker, no one works

5:06:285:06:35

harder around the clock, doing the

best, struggling to cope and care

5:06:355:06:40

than the parents and siblings of

vulnerable adults. Vulnerable

5:06:405:06:44

adults, some of the have the most

complex needs imaginable. Those

5:06:445:06:49

vulnerable adults have some of the

most extreme personal needs, can be

5:06:495:06:54

in their 30s, 40s, or even the 50s.

Parents caring for them, are in

5:06:545:07:02

their 50s, 60s, 70s, we as a

society, all those parents and

5:07:025:07:08

carers, we are them is huge debt of

gratitude. Teachers do care for

5:07:085:07:11

their loved ones at home, they don't

hand them over to the state, but

5:07:115:07:17

they go on with the job. They injure

the sleepless nights, the clean-up

5:07:175:07:21

after the family members come and

give them the love and dedication

5:07:215:07:24

than he. To be honest, they don't

ask for much in return. Hugh Madam

5:07:245:07:33

Deputy Speaker, we often let them

down. By failing to provide them

5:07:335:07:37

with the subordinate. It appears to

many to be getting worse instead of

5:07:375:07:43

better. I know this issue isn't

exclusive to my constituency. But I

5:07:435:07:50

want to speak... All those families

who rely on the residential despite

5:07:505:08:01

care. Give them a break from caring,

a break from themselves. I

5:08:015:08:19

Does the honourable member or not

agree that rest take care must be...

5:08:195:08:25

In Northern Ireland, with honourable

gentleman is saying has happened to

5:08:325:08:34

us as well.

I think the Member for

his intervention. I agree with them.

5:08:345:08:40

The longer people state supported at

home, the longer they have a greater

5:08:405:08:46

financial burden on the state. Such

is the crisis in health and social

5:08:465:08:54

care in our country that our NHS

commissioners face difficult choices

5:08:545:08:59

and families are really worried that

they could be facing a substantial

5:08:595:09:02

cut in the provision offered to them

as the local tries to stretch

5:09:025:09:07

limited resources they have the

meeting increase of demand for

5:09:075:09:10

support. The clinical commissioning

group and the South cc CG are

5:09:105:09:18

reorganizing the way they provide

residential rest by care. When I met

5:09:185:09:24

with the Executive on Friday, she

told me at the need to have deep

5:09:245:09:28

space services and the plan to

review exactly what each individual

5:09:285:09:30

needs. I know and so does the

Minister that we do have to have

5:09:305:09:36

equity in the system and meet the

needs of each individual. I don't

5:09:365:09:40

have a problem with that. Sadly, the

review has been interpreted by the

5:09:405:09:44

families as a cut and provision.

Some believe they could lose up to

5:09:445:09:48

half their rest by knights and they

are anxious about that. I definitely

5:09:485:09:51

agree that provisions should be

right to meet the needs of the

5:09:515:09:55

individual but this issue is much

greater than that. It's also about

5:09:555:09:58

the needs of the whole family.

Before this ECG decided under

5:09:585:10:05

review, perhaps they should've done

and needs assessment first. In fact,

5:10:055:10:08

I've always thought that the rest by

care was very much for the family,

5:10:085:10:15

in opportunity to take a break from

their caring responsibilities, to

5:10:155:10:19

recharge the batteries and prepared

to resume what they see as their

5:10:195:10:22

duties. This ECG have been at pains

to stress to me that their proposals

5:10:225:10:29

don't necessarily mean that there

would be a huge resolution and the

5:10:295:10:33

number of rest by nights but

recognise that things will change

5:10:335:10:35

for some people and their working

with families and piloting ideas to

5:10:355:10:39

improve provision. Lust I think they

could've handled this whole business

5:10:395:10:49

better, the issues from the

perspective of the families and the

5:10:495:10:52

various local authority and joint

health screening groups who oppose

5:10:525:10:55

the plans, I can say is their fault.

I will give way.

Thank you for

5:10:555:11:01

giving way. On the point of rest

bites where you're moving onto. In

5:11:015:11:07

my constituency of Peterborough,

their closing a home where they

5:11:075:11:12

provide back care for very disabled

and unwell children and I very much

5:11:125:11:16

agree with you that it should be

about the whole child including the

5:11:165:11:21

family and the rest bites it gets to

the family to have that provision.

5:11:215:11:25

In my constituency they are

cancelling that provision altogether

5:11:255:11:28

and I think the impact of that needs

to be assessed. Would you agree?

5:11:285:11:34

Certainly I would. Not being just a

Teesside issue but an issue across

5:11:345:11:39

the country. I think it's a

tremendous challenge the Government

5:11:395:11:43

to plan for the future. I know the

team dealing with wider provision

5:11:435:11:51

are dedicated to their jobs and that

they too have been distressed as we

5:11:515:11:56

have gone through this process and I

for one appreciate the strains of

5:11:565:11:59

dealing with these sensitive issues.

They are trying to do their best

5:11:595:12:03

within what they say are that...

Personally I could've hoped they

5:12:035:12:09

would kick the Government a bit for

failing to provide the resources

5:12:095:12:13

needed. Currently it is provided

into NHS centres of excellence. What

5:12:135:12:18

are they planning to do now? The

best of the options available is

5:12:185:12:23

this perceived reduction in

residential care provided by the

5:12:235:12:27

expert... And then the provision of

alternative choices largely without

5:12:275:12:34

nurses. These includes beds and care

homes, hotel rooms, adapted caravans

5:12:345:12:39

and even in the carers own homes.

Could we see a vulnerable adult

5:12:395:12:46

accommodated in a caravan somewhere?

What about the risk assessments for

5:12:465:12:53

all of this menu or provision? Who

is going to check that all the new

5:12:535:12:57

people is probable people are cared

for about trained and suitable for

5:12:575:12:59

this role and that the premises also

are suitable. In what rest by is

5:12:595:13:05

therefore a carer if the rest bite

worker under their own roof. Not

5:13:055:13:11

much of a break for the carer or the

family member. To be fair, they are

5:13:115:13:19

promised there will always be a

properly trained staff to offer the

5:13:195:13:21

care and support required but sadly

they have yet to provide the

5:13:215:13:25

families with the reassurances they

need. The uncertainty is torturous

5:13:255:13:30

for them. So much more needs to be

done to drive understanding. But

5:13:305:13:34

we've also got asked, if changes

which cause such disruption are very

5:13:345:13:39

appropriate and the 21st-century

Britain when carers don't know what

5:13:395:13:43

the future holds. Our provision

should be improving, not

5:13:435:13:47

deteriorating in practical terms...

I recently wrote to the Hartlepool

5:13:475:13:56

regarding the consultation that was

taking place at the time I was

5:13:565:13:59

writing. They confirmed they are

committed to retaining the 4155

5:13:595:14:03

Ilium pound financial fund for this

provision. The highlighted that this

5:14:035:14:06

will have to spread further to reach

more families.

5:14:065:14:11

He is making a powerful case but

does he not agree that in terms of

5:14:155:14:19

carers we need to be doing a great

deal more in this country to set

5:14:195:14:23

for. I think back to the 97 Labour

government and my national insurance

5:14:235:14:28

contributions were introduced

towards their pensions. Isn't the

5:14:285:14:31

case really for looking at this and

doing more to terrorist? -- doing

5:14:315:14:37

more to support carers.

I don't know

we will get to the point we consider

5:14:375:14:44

we are content that we have done

enough. I think we need to do much

5:14:445:14:47

more. They were saying that the £1.5

million provision for this service

5:14:475:14:56

will be maintained but a has to be

spread to reach more families. The

5:14:565:15:01

confirms the provision is being

diluted when you dilute provision,

5:15:015:15:03

you cut it and it will be the carers

who pick up the extra

5:15:035:15:08

responsibility. I accept the point

that more people need services.

5:15:085:15:14

Surely the answer to this is to

increase funding and provide the

5:15:145:15:17

services that are needed, not

watered down what is available to

5:15:175:15:22

provide a poorer quality service. As

you know, the demand for these

5:15:225:15:27

services will continue to increase

over the coming years as more

5:15:275:15:31

vulnerable, high needs young people

grow into adults, live longer and

5:15:315:15:34

need the kind of support given by

the kind of people I've been

5:15:345:15:40

speaking out. The cost of meeting

these services will therefore go up

5:15:405:15:44

and yes, are may in some cases be

shared with NHS and local

5:15:445:15:49

authorities. Neither of them can

sustain quality services for a

5:15:495:15:53

growing cohort of people when their

income simply isn't there. Stockton

5:15:535:15:57

Council has had its budget cut by

52% since 2010. It spends around 57%

5:15:575:16:05

of the money it spends on social

care. I asked the Minister today if

5:16:055:16:11

she realises the potential crisis

we're facing. She understand the

5:16:115:16:16

tremendous role these carers take on

and can she appreciate the need for

5:16:165:16:20

comprehensive rest by care to give

them a few days break? Or does she

5:16:205:16:25

think they will get by? Summate,

others want. They will face the

5:16:255:16:32

difficult decision to hand over

their Lumb what the Lima -- loved

5:16:325:16:36

I would ask the Minister, what

short, mid and long-term planning is

5:16:395:16:46

government doing to ensure we have a

strategy in place across the country

5:16:465:16:51

to cope with increased demand in

this area and provide increased

5:16:515:16:53

resources required to deliver

appropriate provision. My colleagues

5:16:535:16:57

in Teesside have all listened to the

stories of these carers and

5:16:575:17:06

recognise they are facing tremendous

anxiety about what the changes will

5:17:065:17:10

mean the rest by care. Others two

have listened. The scrutiny

5:17:105:17:14

committees... This cross committee

of local counsellors stated they

5:17:145:17:22

cannot endorse either of the options

offered on... None of them believed

5:17:225:17:30

they have covered themselves and

glory over the way this matter has

5:17:305:17:32

been handled and can see why those

dependent on the services for a

5:17:325:17:38

decent quality of life have lost all

trust in the organisation and feel

5:17:385:17:41

they have just been ignored and

failed to understand their needs.

5:17:415:17:46

There's another dimension to this. I

applaud for the comprehensive

5:17:465:17:53

exercise that is gone and and it has

been competence have. Sadly, it has

5:17:535:17:59

failed to get their message across.

It is failed to give the reassurance

5:17:595:18:05

to those needy families. The

families interpret that as having

5:18:055:18:07

failed to recognise anxieties

created by the process and carer

5:18:075:18:12

stomach they have no understanding

of any new criteria which will

5:18:125:18:15

determine who gets what services.

They feel they are being left in the

5:18:155:18:20

dark. I praised the public

consultation but at the end of the

5:18:205:18:25

day, the real options are severely

limited. They repeat no more extra

5:18:255:18:32

cash to cope with increased demand.

I've heard at one meeting with

5:18:325:18:35

counsellors, they said carers

cheered when option two was chosen

5:18:355:18:39

over option one. The first option

would have ended all provision.

5:18:395:18:46

Naturally they cheered for the worst

of the two options. -- the better of

5:18:465:18:52

two bad options. There was no option

at all to extend the current

5:18:525:18:56

provision and resources to cater for

the additional needs of new adults

5:18:565:18:59

coming into the system, something I

believe Ministers need to reflect

5:18:595:19:02

on. They also stated its not a

cost-cutting exercise. What they

5:19:025:19:09

need to look after more people with

the same money, there are fewer

5:19:095:19:13

resources left per person in the

system. Was very critical of them

5:19:135:19:20

and the way they've handled this

issue I recognise they have been in

5:19:205:19:22

many ways backed into a corner. They

know the demands on their service

5:19:225:19:26

but does the Minister? They know

they have more people needing

5:19:265:19:29

services and new additional funding

to provide it. We all know we have a

5:19:295:19:34

health and social care crisis in our

country. As the Government cuts

5:19:345:19:41

deeper. It's not something our local

NHS commissioners can do. They can

5:19:415:19:49

tell the local taxpayers they are

sticking an extra 3% on their bill

5:19:495:19:52

to try and alleviate the shortage of

funds and areas like rest by care.

5:19:525:19:55

That leaves the Bok well and truly

in our chamber here with the

5:19:555:20:01

Secretary of State for Health and

social care and of course, the

5:20:015:20:04

Minister. My plea to her is simple.

Will she take an interest in what's

5:20:045:20:08

happening on Teesside with this type

of care for vulnerable adults? Will

5:20:085:20:13

she examine the proposals which

parents see as a cut to provision

5:20:135:20:17

for families in the area? This is

much bigger than Teesside. I know

5:20:175:20:22

there are cc cheese up and down the

country facing the same issues.

5:20:225:20:25

Perhaps it is time...

5:20:255:20:33

Will she instigate that much-needed

policy review to see how we can do

5:20:405:20:45

much better as a country to support

terrorist? -- carers. Many families

5:20:455:20:53

are already living on the edge. They

are struggling to cope with the

5:20:535:20:57

needs of their loved one but they

have no intention to hand them over

5:20:575:21:01

to the state. But they really need

is a comprehensive rest by care

5:21:015:21:05

service to give them a little of

their own time and space. We as a

5:21:055:21:09

nation owed them no less.

Doctor

Paul Williams.

Thank you Madam

5:21:095:21:18

Deputy Speaker and I congratulate my

honourable friend, the Member for a

5:21:185:21:22

Stockton North for securing this

debate. I also congratulate my

5:21:225:21:26

honourable friend for his leadership

in this area and the engagement he

5:21:265:21:29

is shown both with the families but

also with the clinical commissioning

5:21:295:21:34

groups. The challenge of being a ...

I have respect and admiration for

5:21:345:21:50

the people who do this work. In my

own family, my grandmother's sister

5:21:505:21:55

quietus been working out is actually

my great-aunt has spent her lifetime

5:21:555:22:02

actually looking after several

different adults with complex needs

5:22:025:22:05

that she adopted. I've seen the

enormous amount of love and

5:22:055:22:16

compassion that it is taken from her

to do that and I've seen with all of

5:22:165:22:21

my constituents that have contacted

me around these issues into my work

5:22:215:22:26

as a GP my constituency as well, the

amount of love and compassion that

5:22:265:22:29

goes into looking after adults...

This comes at a cost. They comes

5:22:295:22:38

mainly at a cost to to their help.

Often they prioritise the needs of

5:22:385:22:43

the person they are caring for and

don't think about particularly

5:22:435:22:50

preventing their own ill health

problems or looking after their

5:22:505:22:53

problems as they arise. It also

comes at a cost in terms of time.

5:22:535:23:01

congratulate and because the money,

cost of careers, there's a cost.

5:23:025:23:10

It's very important, Madam Deputy

skier -- Mike Speaker, there's issue

5:23:105:23:21

of young carers. Lots of young care

is my constituency. Madam Speaker.

5:23:215:23:27

The work they do with elderly

people, family members is the reason

5:23:275:23:31

why those families are together. The

issue of young carers is so

5:23:315:23:35

important. How important this the...

I think the honourable gentleman for

5:23:355:23:48

highlighting the needs of young

carers and yes, in my constituency

5:23:485:23:51

as I'm sure is the same with other

is a case where the other

5:23:515:23:58

constituencies it in a house., there

are some who grow up and go want to

5:23:585:24:03

be carers and hold families

together. In the context of how

5:24:035:24:07

difficult this can be, and the

tremendous effort that people make

5:24:075:24:12

in order to keep their loved ones

well, in order to look after them,

5:24:125:24:19

the provision of occasional rest

bite is the least that we should be

5:24:195:24:23

doing as a society. To say thank you

the least we should be doing to

5:24:235:24:31

sustain incredible effort that these

people are doing. I think I

5:24:315:24:35

honourable friend, I also give some

credit to the two commission groups

5:24:355:24:39

involved. For taking some

responsibility for this. In a time

5:24:395:24:47

when we all see the constant

jostling between local authorities

5:24:475:24:56

and health services, commissioners

of health services about who should

5:24:565:25:00

fund these issues at a time of

austerity, I think that our CCG has

5:25:005:25:05

stepped up to the plate and took on

responsibilities funding these

5:25:055:25:11

issues. But, a number of

constituents have also contacted me

5:25:115:25:18

in what I can only describe as a

state of panic during these

5:25:185:25:25

consultations that have taken place,

and actually since the outcome of

5:25:255:25:29

the of the consultations was

announced. They are fearful that

5:25:295:25:33

their much-needed breaks are going

to be taken away from them. As my

5:25:335:25:37

honourable friend has pointed out,

fears may well prove to be

5:25:375:25:43

ill-founded but it should not mean

they should be discounted. I think

5:25:435:25:46

that change is always difficult for

people, but to have the possibility

5:25:465:25:53

of services being cut has cost it

genuine anxiety for these people.

5:25:535:25:57

It's an anxiety that we should

rightly be recognising. We all know

5:25:575:26:02

that caring can be physically

demanding, it can also be mentally

5:26:025:26:08

demanding. Especially for long

periods of time. It's my opinion

5:26:085:26:14

that added respite is absolutely

essential for these carers. If the

5:26:145:26:19

are to maintain their own health and

well-being. It's also absolutely

5:26:195:26:24

essential that carers are involved

in any decisions about what is

5:26:245:26:31

adequate and appropriate matches for

their family members, but also for

5:26:315:26:35

the carers themselves. And a respite

package as was pointed out, is a

5:26:355:26:41

package that should be designed

around the needs of the whole

5:26:415:26:44

family, not just around the needs of

the individual with complex needs.

5:26:445:26:47

What we are seeing though, is that

limited funding, whether or not. I

5:26:475:26:54

don't know whether this is ring

fenced, or taken from an overall

5:26:545:27:01

pot, but there is limited funding,

the respite have -- Mike CCG... To

5:27:015:27:09

demand his outs dripping -- rank

outstripping the resources. Limited

5:27:095:27:16

funding and rising need for this

particular kind of care is meaning

5:27:165:27:19

that some people, packages are care

are likely to be reduced. That is

5:27:195:27:25

causing significant anxiety to

people. Adding another point that I

5:27:255:27:29

would like to make before finishes

that are experienced is illustrating

5:27:295:27:37

the health and social care don't

exist in isolation from it each

5:27:375:27:39

other. There have been some small

steps taken in changing the name of

5:27:395:27:46

the Department of Health Department

of Health and social care, but this

5:27:465:27:50

is a really good example to others

should be, could be some really

5:27:505:27:55

concrete steps to bring the funding

together. There should be a

5:27:555:28:00

partnership between local

authorities and commissioning

5:28:005:28:03

grooves, parents, carers and people

with complex needs in order to work

5:28:035:28:06

together. This is an area where we

should be seeing integration at its

5:28:065:28:10

best. I think if we are talking

about integration, I have to take

5:28:105:28:16

the opportunity to talk about the

green paper, the forthcoming green

5:28:165:28:19

paper on social care and say that it

is inconceivable for me that we

5:28:195:28:27

should, in 2018, be considering

social care and isolation and asked

5:28:275:28:32

the Department of Health and social

care at the thing whether or not

5:28:325:28:36

this should be a green paper on the

future of care and social care and

5:28:365:28:39

social together rather than just

considering social care in

5:28:395:28:44

isolation. So I and by paying

tribute to the carers who have come

5:28:445:28:48

together in this case the fight for

the very best services for their

5:28:485:28:53

loved ones. They deserve for us to

listen, these are for us to

5:28:535:28:58

consider, as it is there for us to

act. So that the gap the respite

5:28:585:29:04

that the deserve for themselves and

their families.

Like you Madam

5:29:045:29:11

Deputy Speaker I would like to

wholeheartedly congratulate my right

5:29:115:29:14

honourable friend for securities

debate. It's of crucial importance

5:29:145:29:17

for some of the people who face

these crucial challenges in their

5:29:175:29:23

lives. It's a nice debate, it's

extremely important and they're

5:29:235:29:27

grateful for it to be brought

forward. And to speak this evening.

5:29:275:29:31

I am particularly keen to speed

because the very first surgery I had

5:29:315:29:36

after it was elected three years

ago, the first people came to see me

5:29:365:29:40

were some carers and had disabled

adults in severe needs who were

5:29:405:29:45

shocked to hear, not considered by

themselves or the quality of care,

5:29:455:29:54

there were concerned about the

well-being of the staff and the

5:29:545:29:58

carers and those who look after her.

The lack of payment, low-paid, the

5:29:585:30:03

insecure nature of the work. I just

want to use this opportunity will be

5:30:035:30:09

having this debate to raise the

floor of the houses we look ahead to

5:30:095:30:12

the care green paper, that those who

work in the sector are so

5:30:125:30:17

fundamental to the care that is

needed by those vulnerable families.

5:30:175:30:20

If we don't look after them, we

can't expect to these families to

5:30:205:30:26

get the care they deserve. I also

want to mention briefly as well, the

5:30:265:30:31

other point I was May, young carers.

These voices are just not her it's a

5:30:315:30:36

busy fantastic charity can't my

charity of the year. It doesn't then

5:30:365:30:42

passed the job of supporting young

people who are trying to manage care

5:30:425:30:45

for members of their family who are

they are losing part of their

5:30:455:30:50

childhood in order to do so. People

are falling through the cracks,

5:30:505:30:56

really is a provision. Let's pay

tribute to all of those, the

5:30:565:31:03

charges, a state organisation

supporting young people. It ended

5:31:035:31:06

this issue in particular. I want to

focus their briefly on what it means

5:31:065:31:11

to the people of my constituency.

They're very beneficial to people

5:31:115:31:20

with learning needs. My disability.

They are a valuable lifeline to

5:31:205:31:25

family members who are working 20 47

caring for their members. It is

5:31:255:31:29

difficult for any of us to imagine

having to give a family member 20

5:31:295:31:34

47, someone has high high needs.

Extremely care packages, care plans,

5:31:345:31:41

for years and decades even to

support that family member. Maybe do

5:31:415:31:45

through their love we owe them

attribute to them and all to them

5:31:455:31:53

that stay provisions... The

consultation was very worrying. It

5:31:535:31:59

was overwhelmingly in support of

continuation of bed respite care. It

5:31:595:32:08

is overwhelmingly clear that people

want to make sure that respite is

5:32:085:32:11

still available. Some in my

constituency contacted me and was

5:32:115:32:18

very concerned about support, to

have a 15-year-old son, he requires

5:32:185:32:25

lasting care and she is concerned

about how people cope if the service

5:32:255:32:29

provided is. The reliability and

consistency of care is one of the

5:32:295:32:35

more most important reasons why it

is preferred by some disabled people

5:32:355:32:40

and their families. The biggest

issue around this is the insecurity

5:32:405:32:47

and disruption, and has a real

knock-down effect on people in their

5:32:475:32:50

lives. The reality is that services

are still going to be cut back. A

5:32:505:33:03

cut on spending on respite care, by

the local CCG, will inevitably

5:33:035:33:08

restrict services. There will be few

and active care, fewer people. This

5:33:085:33:13

is a decision we have to make. But

if someone has a need for care, the

5:33:135:33:18

CCG was to be able to provide it.

Does that mean that more cuts will

5:33:185:33:25

be made elsewhere to compensate. GP

care services are seen, I'm afraid,

5:33:255:33:36

as low hanging fruit. By the side to

save money. It I was surprised to

5:33:365:33:49

read about a case where a cut of

£600,000 to children with conflict

5:33:495:33:55

means had been proposed. There are

legal count challenges.

5:33:555:34:09

Respite care is an important part of

our social care system which already

5:34:105:34:13

relies on hundreds of thousands

unpaid family carers across the UK

5:34:135:34:17

who give of their lives to do so.

Cutting the services were placed

5:34:175:34:21

even more pressure on those trying

to do right by their loved ones.

5:34:215:34:28

Thank you Madam Deputy Speaker I am

very honourable to the -- and very

5:34:285:34:35

grateful to the honourable member

for raising this concern. And indeed

5:34:355:34:38

to his honourable colleague. And for

the very powerful language, very

5:34:385:34:48

justifiable concerns of their

constituents. I think whenever there

5:34:485:34:53

is an almond of change, people have

a tendency to feel concern and it's

5:34:535:34:59

absolutely right that there is fair

concern to be articulated. Because

5:34:595:35:04

supporting the Muslim ball in

arsenate -- society, those with

5:35:045:35:08

autism, learning disabilities --

autism health and social care

5:35:085:35:17

commissioners face. It's a task that

must be undertaken with a genuine

5:35:175:35:22

desire Madam Deputy Speaker, to

their best outcome for not only

5:35:225:35:28

those who are supported but those

who care for them. It's very

5:35:285:35:30

important to remember that much of

the services were are discussing

5:35:305:35:35

today are focused on people with

autism and learning disabilities.

5:35:355:35:41

Conditions which can manifest

different requirements. It may need

5:35:415:35:45

care and help ranging from routine,

or sometimes more than one person at

5:35:455:35:54

a time. There are mandate, there is

a very clear objective to improve

5:35:545:36:02

outcomes of people with autism or

learning disabilities. This means

5:36:025:36:05

that you are fully supported in the

community, hospital admissions are

5:36:055:36:12

reduced, and to have an opportunity

to live normal life. Building

5:36:125:36:18

concerted action to deliver that

community support. We know that

5:36:185:36:28

respite services are really

important and significant element

5:36:285:36:36

anomaly for the individual receiving

care but also their families and

5:36:365:36:38

carers. As my honourable members

have expressed were proffered. --

5:36:385:36:56

family care plays an important role,

very valuable role. Often

5:36:565:37:02

undervalued role. Often they do it

out of not a sense of duty, sense of

5:37:025:37:07

compassion, at a sense of pure love.

And he deserves nothing more than on

5:37:075:37:14

unbridled thanks and respect. You

asked me about what we're doing

5:37:145:37:17

support parents. Of course there

will be added several part of the

5:37:175:37:24

Government's green paper. Also we

have, at carers action plan which

5:37:245:37:31

will also sets out, and I feel

passionately about which will set

5:37:315:37:34

out some short-term... Now we

5:37:345:37:50

Is this clue the Minister gets this.

The issue is this is about resources

5:37:505:37:55

well. I'm concerned about the

current problem we have on Teesside

5:37:555:38:00

but in the longer term... They were

children who would never have

5:38:005:38:10

survived in previous generations.

They are coming to the system and

5:38:105:38:13

they would eat more and more

service. War and more people are

5:38:135:38:18

going from children to adults.

What's the Government doing about

5:38:185:38:24

that in terms of longer-term

lending?

He articulates real issue

5:38:245:38:30

that we have to contend with and

since 2010 that's why we have

5:38:305:38:34

increased NHS spending every single

year and our NHS has now £30 billion

5:38:345:38:40

more to spend on caring for people

than it did in 2010. He goes to the

5:38:405:38:44

heart of the issue he is identified

that we need to make sure our care

5:38:445:38:51

is responsive to the needs of

individuals. That implies both a

5:38:515:38:58

need to assess and determine what is

the right kind of support, the need

5:38:585:39:02

for flexibility to allow for

personal choice as I believe is

5:39:025:39:07

being looked in Teesside some needs

may be best met through a sustained

5:39:075:39:12

and suitable service, providing

overnight beds as he's articulated,

5:39:125:39:18

providing properly trained staff but

this may not be true for everybody.

5:39:185:39:21

Those with a severe physical or

learning disabilities may find

5:39:215:39:24

something in the community is more

desirable for them and more

5:39:245:39:27

appropriate for them. For example, a

leisure activity, a visit, even

5:39:275:39:35

visiting family members with the

right personal support. We don't

5:39:355:39:38

want these opportunities to be

ridden off for them because we have

5:39:385:39:42

a very restrictive system. That's

why it's right that commissioners

5:39:425:39:48

have the means to seek new

approaches and be flexible in how

5:39:485:39:51

they meet peoples needs. Understand

the intention and our Teesside is

5:39:515:39:56

exactly that. MSP based on suitable

engagement to assess what peoples

5:39:565:40:01

individual needs are. Listening to

the Commons from honourable members

5:40:015:40:06

today, I appreciate members concerns

that not everyone can currently

5:40:065:40:09

access rest bite services and that

they may not be flexible enough.

5:40:095:40:14

That's why local commissioners are

rightly looking to change their

5:40:145:40:17

provision. The honourable member why

understand that it's not customary

5:40:175:40:21

for a Minister to comment on detail

in specific commissioning decisions

5:40:215:40:24

or and extent to which there was

appropriate consultation. Unless

5:40:245:40:31

that's part of a formal review

process. I understand the local is

5:40:315:40:36

consulted on these proposals for ten

weeks and are now in the process of

5:40:365:40:40

designing a service.

Does the

Minister understand that the people

5:40:405:40:44

in Teesside, this ECG having

knowledge they need more people in

5:40:445:40:52

the system so it will be a service

diluted. The she recognised back?

5:40:525:40:56

Having recognised it, what can she

do about it?

As I've already

5:40:565:41:02

articulated, it's up to them to

commission the local services they

5:41:025:41:06

feel are appropriate in their local

communities. It's not for government

5:41:065:41:09

to force a top-down Dick not on how

they need to spend their resources.

5:41:095:41:14

I understand the local councils are

quite rightly scrutinising the

5:41:145:41:22

proposals and this is an important

means of quality assurance. It's

5:41:225:41:27

informed by local people with local

knowledge and I hope you will find

5:41:275:41:30

some reassurance and that. While

it's right that service

5:41:305:41:36

configurations are considered

locally and not being driven from

5:41:365:41:39

the top-down, any significant

changes to the services are subject

5:41:395:41:42

to governments for tests and is that

they demonstrate support for

5:41:425:41:46

clinical commissioners, strengthen

public and patient engagement,

5:41:465:41:50

clarity and criminal Tony Mike

medical evidence base and support

5:41:505:41:53

for patient choice. There are a very

clear set of expectations and

5:41:535:41:59

relation to that provision oppressed

by care and the of commissioners.

5:41:595:42:04

All clinical commissioning groups

must secure services to meet the

5:42:045:42:09

needs of their population. Rest by

care may be routinely commissioned

5:42:095:42:14

or made available as part of a

package of NHS continuing health

5:42:145:42:18

care and it's often also provided as

part of social care. The care act

5:42:185:42:23

2014 requires that where an adult

appears to have support needs, the

5:42:235:42:29

local authority must carry out an

assessment and meet any need where

5:42:295:42:32

the person has met the eligibility

criteria.

The Minister has been

5:42:325:42:37

generous and giving me the Mac way

to me several times. The scrutiny

5:42:375:42:44

groups on Teesside, at least some of

them are thinking of referring the

5:42:445:42:47

matter to the Secretary of State.

What happens when Bettis referred

5:42:475:42:51

and then what can the Government do?

That of course will be a matter for

5:42:515:43:02

the Secretary of State and he will

deal with it in the appropriate way.

5:43:025:43:06

They care act also requires local

authorities to take a preventative

5:43:065:43:13

approach to addressing peoples

needs, both taking steps early to

5:43:135:43:17

prevent or delay any worsening of an

adults need for care and support.

5:43:175:43:21

This would include... It's really

important allowing them to take the

5:43:215:43:28

rest bite that we have spoken about.

He might be interested to know that

5:43:285:43:35

the autism act 2009 also requires

the Government driver regularly

5:43:355:43:39

reviewed autism strategy and issue

guidance to local authorities and

5:43:395:43:43

NHS bodies and foundation trusts. In

addition, the children's and family

5:43:435:43:48

act of 2014 introduced a new

framework for children with special

5:43:485:43:53

educational needs and disabilities

which give commissioners very clear

5:43:535:43:58

responsibilities towards those with

learning disability and autism or

5:43:585:44:02

those who may be affected in the

review in Teesside.

You're been

5:44:025:44:08

generous in doing so. The Minister

referred to autism in particular. I

5:44:085:44:13

think all of us here will have her

knowledge of autism. The Minister

5:44:135:44:19

will be aware that in Northern

Ireland we have in autism strategy

5:44:195:44:25

and there is a very good strategy.

As the Minister had a chance to

5:44:255:44:29

check those other strategies?

I

haven't but now that the honourable

5:44:295:44:39

gentleman has recommended it to me I

certainly will look into that. It's

5:44:395:44:46

really important that commissioners

have that prerogative to make a

5:44:465:44:50

local determination of what

constitutes the right services and

5:44:505:44:53

we have set clear expectations for

health and social care in how it

5:44:535:44:56

meets peoples need for support and

family needs for rest bite. We can't

5:44:565:45:02

close the gap between the outcomes

for those were most vulnerable and

5:45:025:45:06

those with complex needs but a has

to be via a competition as a

5:45:065:45:11

national expectations alongside a

local approach to delivering the

5:45:115:45:13

necessary services. The NHS has a

responsibility to ensure that people

5:45:135:45:18

have access to the best and safest

health care possible and this means

5:45:185:45:22

and must plan ahead and look at how

best to secure safe and sustainable

5:45:225:45:27

NHS health care provision and

provide flexible approaches to meet

5:45:275:45:29

the widest range of needs. That's

what we are hopeful to see in action

5:45:295:45:32

here in Teesside. I know that any

change to local services for

5:45:325:45:36

vulnerable people must be cleared

with that degree of apprehension and

5:45:365:45:41

I understand that. Considering the

assurances given locally by

5:45:415:45:45

commissioners and the process they

have undertaken and the overall aim

5:45:455:45:48

of providing a more flexible set of

options for rest bite that moves

5:45:485:45:52

away from a very medical way of

care, I'm hopeful these changes will

5:45:525:45:55

be of benefit to the people who most

need their services.

The question is

5:45:555:46:03

that this House to adjourn.

Many of

that opinion say, I. The iPods might

5:46:035:46:10

have order, order.

5:46:105:46:12

-- the I's have it.

We will not be

going live

5:46:165:46:24

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