21/06/2012 Newsnight Scotland

goes back decades, but as austerity bites, it looks a less and less

funny. Tonight on Newsnight Scotland: Well

over half of GP surgeries are affected by industrial action by

doctors over their pension scheme. Are they right to strike over

pensions most people can only dream about? And if the Scottish

government is so sympathetic to their cause, why won't it pay to

keep their pensions as they are? And a special report from

California on what the First Minister has been up to. Has it

been a trip about promoting Scotland or promoting brand Alex

Salmond? Good evening. The doctors say

they've been betrayed by proposals to increase their pension

contributions and make them work until they are 68 before they can

retire. The UK government says current pension deals simply aren't

affordable. The Scottish government says it's against the strike but

sympathetic to the doctors' case. Tonight, are we any nearer to a

In waiting rooms across Scotland, empty seats tell the story. This

surgery has around 7,500 people on its books. Industrial action meant

today doctors dealt with nine patients. Normally we would have

three surgeries running and the waiting room would be very busy. In

addition we have an evening, late- night surgery and probably have a

couple of people arriving after 6pm. But his waiting room would be false.

The last time doctors down tools or was in 1975 when consultants and

junior doctors took action over proposed changes to their contracts.

On the walls, steps were taking standards of care for patients were

maintained and A&E units worked normally. Almost 40 years on it is

their proposed changes to pensions that has made them angry. This

lacked the trappings of a traditional strike, instead just

empty corridors as doctors turned up for work at GP practices, health

centres and hospitals where they refuse to carry out routine duties,

agreeing to see only emergency cases. Standing in for Alex Salmond

at First Minister's Questions, the Health Secretary outlined the

impact. I am advised approximately 3,200 out-patient appointments and

around 450 in-patient and day cases have been cancelled. I should say

patients have been advised and all appointments will be re schedule. I

also understand approximately 60% of GP practices are affected to

some extent. For Daniel, it means the hip replacement that was set to

bring 2.5 years on crutches to an end, will have to wait. I don't

think the doctors should be bringing patients into this. We

have nothing to do with this. I cannot have too much sympathy when

they have left me in this position waiting now... I don't know how

long. At the heart of the issue is a plan by the UK Government to

increase Dr's pension contributions, and raised their retirement age to

68 and replace their final salary scheme with an average earnings. A

doctor starting in 2015, will get a �68,000 a year pension. They get a

much better pension than we get. It is about being fair. That is what

we have said all along, we understand we get a good pension,

we pay enough for it. What is unfair his people on the same

income paying less than us. presents the Scottish Government -

who don't support the strike, with a dilemma. Either impose pension

reforms they don't agree with or make up the shortfall from

Holyrood's budget. In public, it is an issue being danced around.

deeply regret the note from the BMC material who say the action is

being forced to force the UK Government back to the Nicosia 18

table. The Scottish Government has never left the table and therefore,

I consider the action not just unfortunate, but a necessary.

Scottish Government have made it clear they are not supportive of

what is happening in England. That is very gratifying to hear that.

But we have not seen any action. What they're doing is dragging it

out by talking, but not making any offers. For doctors, the success or

otherwise of today's historic action will take time to judge,

time which tomorrow will be filled with patience with a host of stored

up complaints. I'm joined from Edinburgh by the

leader of the Scottish Conservatives, Ruth Davidson and

here is the SNP's Bob Dorris who is the Deputy Convenor of Holyrood's

Health Committee. The doctors say the NHS pension scheme is in

surplus to the tune of about �2 billion and will be double that by

the end of the year. Why do they have to have their pensions cut?

is about a sustainable future going forward. I am sure as somebody who

works for the BBC would understand. A just because a pension pot is in

surplus now, does not mean it will be in the future. You need to look

at the gaping hole in the BBC pension to understand that. It is

about health workers across the board. This not only allows the

pension settlement to continue into the future and be properly funded,

but helps people at the bottom end, people who won't be retiring on

�68,000 a year. His that right? is a misrepresentation of the

issues. In the case of the doctors, they did a deal for long-term

affordability in 2008. What the UK Government have done with those

talks have ripped them up completely. What they have said to

the Scottish Government, unless you impose these other cuts in public

sector wages, we will cut your budget to the tune of �8.4 million.

There is a point, doctors did sign in good faith, up to a deal only

four years ago in 2008. Normally successive governments, even of a

different political complexion would accept labour contracts that

have been signed up to. It is not unreasonable for the doctors to say,

we signed this in good faith. It is not like it is 15 years later, it

is only four years later. They could have said in 2008 when

pensions were signed, we signed something a few years ago then.

can understand their arguments for what you're saying. But there is

almost a principle. If you sign up as a group of employees in good

faith, to a deal that in four years your employer turns round and says,

we don't take it seriously, we are ripping it up. It does not do much

to encourage people to have trust in either the Government or

politics generally? It is in his characterisation of what has

happened. What the UK Government is looking to is a long-term funding

solutions. They had 23 meetings between the BMA and the Department

of Health. At least five of these have been with the Secretary of

State for Health and the head of the BMA. There has been a lot of

discussion and this is the best settlement the UK Government thinks

it can come up with. It gives doctors a settlement where they

receive more than 2.5 times their income other salary worker in their

retirement. One of the questions I asked Nicola Sturgeon today, what

is so unfair about a pension settlement of �68,000, more than

2.5 times average salaries. She could not tell me. A group of

employees, public sector employees, signed up to a pension and that a

few years later it gets ripped up? There is a point of a principal in

terms of affordability. MS Davidson cannot be saying things have

changed so dramatically in four years. There has been a world

financial crisis, the worst since the 1930s. In 2008, we weren't

exactly awash with cash. It is about deficit-reduction and not

about affordability of pensions. You think they're wrong to go back

on this deal? I think it is reasonable to talk, and renegotiate,

but it is also wrong to compel. I noticed the Scottish Government are

still at the table. Wright is in the Scottish Government refusing to

implement this? We would like to be able to implement it. The UK

Government is holding a gun to the Scottish Government's her. They

waltzed -- cut our budget a �0.4 million if we don't implement this.

The British Government wants to do what Ruth Davidson wants to do. If

you as the Scottish Government don't want to do that, it is a

political choice. You can choose to find the money from somewhere to do

this. Or you can say, no, it is not as important as other things we

want to spend the money on. cannot find the money from

elsewhere. You can. I am trying to explain. We decided to increase the

Scottish NHS budget by �243 million. We could have decided not to

increase it by that amount and not introduce these measures. We took

the decision to protect front line services. When push comes to shove,

you are on Ruth Davidson's side when it comes to pensions? It is

complete nonsense. It is not nonsense, you could choose not to

do it. You could get rid of no tuition

fees. The point is, your Government, when it comes to things they may

blame on London, it is a political choice you have made. You have

chosen not to spend �100 million a year on this, in order to spend it

on other things. It is perfectly reasonable, but you cannot pretend

you are not making that choice. cannot talk about our own pension

settlement without the UK Government docking our budget by

�100 million a year. Can the Scottish Government not do this if

they did not want to? Absolutely. The message bob is sending out is

mixed. He was saying, of course we are continuing to talk Andrea

Minguzzi aid. That is what the UK Government has been doing over a

period of over several months. They have decided to do is the best deal

they can come up with. But still gives doctors on retirement,

�68,000 a year. If we did not ask for increased contribution to the

pension scheme from doctors, it would come out of other health care

workers. That is simply not true. We are running out of time. An

obvious way and thing to do Rhys Davids and, which presumably you

would be in favour of which was mooted by George Osborne, is to

devolve bargaining on things like this to a national and regional

level. So you would have Scottish bargaining on the health service.

Would you be in favour of that? is an imposition from the

Chancellor. We have grandstanding from the SNP to have a choice, but

are choosing not to choose. We do like the idea of Scottish

bargaining for the Scottish Health What you have seen across

Scotland... Yes or no? Well, George Osborne has said that is his

suggestion that should be considered and of course we are

having to look at lots of different suggestions. He would love that

idea presumably? No, the sooner pensions are the 4th to the

Scottish parliament the better. -- are devolved to the Scottish

parliament. Of course I would want collective bargaining but that is

after discussions with trade unions. They are against it. Gordon, as I

said, the Scottish government will negotiate with trade unions to

reach settlements but what we've got just now is we cannot do that

because of a gun held to well ahead by Ruth Davidson's party. If we do

not choose to implement UK Tory cuts, they will dock the Scottish

budget by �100 million. On the principle of whether you think the

Scottish Health Service should Miguez EH Shepard plea from the UK

health service, your position is what, yes or no? Let's negotiate at

a Scottish level. The unions are against that. A let's talk to the

unions. There is no such thing as local pay bargaining. At a Scottish

level, we agree with the unions. in fact you and Ruth Davidson could

end up agreeing with each other, at least on that. I suspect not,

Gordon. Hobnobbing with Hollywood royalty

at film premieres, that seems to be the lasting impression of an

examines visit to California but he has managed to lobby for jobs and

investment. How much of his trip Stateside has been about selling

brand Scotland and how much has Introducing Alex Salmond, the

latest hopeful to head to Hollywood in search of success. The first

minister has been in the States to raise Scotland's profile. It didn't

do his any harm either. Disney helped with a cartoon called Brave.

It's very exciting. The crowds are wonderful. Beyond the glitz, what

is the purpose of this four-day visit? This isn't a part of the

world which does subtlety and luckily, Alex Salmond can be bland

when he needs to be. That is what he is doing here in America. --

blunt. He also once America's attention. This is a country and

America, particular view of the West Coast, should -- way you

should be right up front. There's no room for shrinking violence in

California. Scotland has a fantastic amount to offer.

potential gift, a cut in corporation tax to 20 % if Scotland

becomes independent. Explain to people how we have a competitive

offering in Scotland, how we focus on research and development, a

brain power and intelligence are part of Scotland's offer. We have

top universities and fantastic higher-education institutions. That

is a powerful of all ready. It is not harmful to say before ambition

to do even better and have an even better a competitive offer in the

future. Certainly, with an edge on corporation tax it could mean more

revenue and jobs this will stop in Silicon Valley, there was no

announcement of 19 new jobs. What about independence? How is that

message going down in the land of the free? Scotland has a huge

profile and it is working incredibly well for us. There is

worldwide interest in Scotland. The whole constitutional debate is what

is giving us this profile. It is adding a tremendous amount to

Scotland's pitch to say Scotland is a country which is going places,

which has ambition and if you want to be in a country of ambition,

make investments and come to Scotland. It is certainly working.

Does this visit help you in the yes campaign? What helps us in the yes

campaign is a demonstration that the Scottish government policies

towards inward investment are working and also the fact that

companies worldwide have huge confidence in Scotland's future. It

also emphasises the argument that Scotland has a great advantage. All

these things of big pluses for the Yes campaign. Those plans will not

please other nationalists like the Greens and Scottish socialists. In

California, they have their own tax problems. Not enough of it to pay

the bills. In Sacramento, there was a meeting with the Governor. Jerry

Brown is one of America's most experienced politicians. What did

he make of Scotland's first minister? I don't understand

Scottish parliament -- Scottish politics. He has the kind of energy

which is needed to get through the hurly-burly of politics. Did you

give him any advice? No, I'm not a great advice giver. I have to

figure out my own path which is complicated enough, let alone

trying to tell other people how they should be working. In San

Francisco, Alex Salmond took his message to expats and business

people. Most interest was in the constitutional question. Things

like, what is Alex Salmond view on the monarchy moving forward in an

independent Scotland? Things like that. Looking for questions on what

is going to be the taxation policy in Scotland where it becomes

independent? That type of thing. One of the biggest things that

always concerned me was if Scotland was going to be independent, was

there enough quality people at the top to lead it? I have to say I was

very impressed. Brave sees a young woman set out to

take control of her own destiny. A I want my freedom. But are you

willing to pay the price for freedom will cost? How does it turn

out? A careful what you wish for, my mother would say. What is the

worst that can happen? I had better not spoil the story!

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 49 seconds

Tomorrow's front pages, a quick That is all from me. We will be

back on Monday. Until then, for all Hello. More downpours to come over

the next 24 hours, especially where it tonight of eastern Scotland. The

gusty night. It stays very busty throughout the day on Friday. It

stays very, very wet across north- western England. The Met Office

have an amber warning in force. Downpours throughout much of the

day. Further south, it is looking a lot brighter. There will be sunny

spells but there will be a few showers. They will zip through

quite quickly on a strong wind. That wind means that even if you

get sunshine, it will not feel particularly warm. There will be

drier spells across South Wales but in North Wales, persistent, at

times heavy rain and for Northern Ireland and south-west Scotland, it

looks very wet and that rain could build through the day and may be

caused some problems. For eastern Scotland, it is very wet tonight.

It will turn dry here through the course of Friday afternoon. But

there is more rain to come, particularly over more than Britain

during Saturday. Cloudy and outbreaks of such rain -- outbreaks

of rain across the North. A little bit drier across the south and

maybe even seeing some glimmers of sunshine across the south-east.

Temperatures could reach 19 degrees. A cold weekend, especially in the

breeze on Saturday. Outbreaks of rain across the North. Generally