Browse content similar to 24/09/2012. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
Line | From | To | |
---|---|---|---|
150,000 people have asked for. On Newsnight Scotland tonight: | :00:12. | :00:16. | |
Is it a credible idea that it might be Labour voters who breathe life | :00:16. | :00:19. | |
into the campaign for Scottish independence? The organisers of | :00:19. | :00:22. | |
Saturday's demonstration in Edinburgh said they were proud of | :00:22. | :00:29. | |
their broad-church approach. Also tonight: | :00:29. | :00:31. | |
Is prejudice against gypsy travellers the last bastion of | :00:31. | :00:33. | |
socially unacceptable attitudes? An MSPs' committee finds some | :00:33. | :00:37. | |
uncomfortable statistical evidence. Good evening. | :00:37. | :00:40. | |
Voters usually have to choose a political party in a fairly | :00:40. | :00:43. | |
monolithic way. For example, if you like party A's social policies, | :00:43. | :00:48. | |
you're going to be voting for their economic ideas too. But with a | :00:48. | :00:54. | |
referendum issue, it's different. Opinion polls in recent years have | :00:54. | :00:56. | |
often suggested that SNP voting preference is well ahead of support | :00:56. | :00:59. | |
for independence, but now the idea's emerging that some people | :00:59. | :01:02. | |
who support the Labour Party might be quite keen on the idea of | :01:02. | :01:04. | |
Scottish independence. David Allison went to Saturday's | :01:04. | :01:06. | |
demonstration in Edinburgh to search for the Labour Vote Yes | :01:06. | :01:16. | |
campaign. Across the meadows and the capital, | :01:16. | :01:20. | |
something different was growing. But what? In among this pro- | :01:21. | :01:27. | |
independence rally, there was what you would expect in terms of | :01:27. | :01:30. | |
affiliation, banners, and dress sense. But there was also something | :01:30. | :01:35. | |
new and out of the ordinary. A group called Labour for Scottish | :01:35. | :01:38. | |
independence. So, Labour for independence. What | :01:38. | :01:43. | |
is going on? Is it some kind of double allegiance? Or is it some | :01:43. | :01:47. | |
kind of nationalist front pretending to be Labour? They | :01:47. | :01:50. | |
insist they are exactly what they say they are. Labour people in | :01:50. | :01:54. | |
favour of independence. The a claim to have 1,000 members | :01:54. | :02:01. | |
and their Facebook site has 1,000 likes. Are you a Labour person or | :02:01. | :02:06. | |
you want to say you are? It is amazing the number of times I | :02:06. | :02:10. | |
have heard this. I'm a Labour Party member, and have been for 10 years. | :02:10. | :02:17. | |
I have supported Labour all my life. We disagree with the policy of the | :02:17. | :02:20. | |
better to get the campaign. I believe Scothern would be better as | :02:20. | :02:27. | |
an independent country. The marchers set off for the rally | :02:27. | :02:32. | |
while many were unaware of who had joined their ranks. How do veterans | :02:32. | :02:39. | |
feel about these Johnny-come-lately These are the arch enemy, anyway. I | :02:39. | :02:45. | |
think we are entering a new political... A new political time | :02:46. | :02:49. | |
in Scotland. It is all going to change. Everybody is going to be | :02:50. | :02:55. | |
looking at it with their own eyes. Maybe the old Left have the right | :02:55. | :03:02. | |
thing might disappear. - left-right thing. | :03:02. | :03:06. | |
For those in favour of independence, the polls are still a long way off. | :03:06. | :03:10. | |
But depending on how we vote in two years, Scotland could be said for a | :03:10. | :03:14. | |
political earthquake. Some people see this as the start | :03:14. | :03:19. | |
of something new, a sort of independence politics. | :03:19. | :03:22. | |
Labour Party members were not the only ones coming from a different | :03:22. | :03:28. | |
point of view and the way down to the rally. But a skirmish over a | :03:28. | :03:33. | |
Union Jack showed there were limits over who was welcome and he was not. | :03:33. | :03:36. | |
Speaking of being welcome, what about Labour for independence and | :03:36. | :03:41. | |
the Labour Party? They must think you are about as | :03:41. | :03:46. | |
welcome as a fart in a spacesuit! We have not officially heard | :03:46. | :03:51. | |
anything from the Labour Party. Despite the support we have been | :03:51. | :03:56. | |
getting from social media, public opinion is that it is not a large | :03:56. | :04:06. | |
:04:06. | :04:08. | ||
majority of people. But there our discussions. | :04:08. | :04:15. | |
So, as Alex Salmond, who is to do it himself as trek, rallied the | :04:15. | :04:19. | |
crowd, would be the higher echelons of the SNP make of having in a band | :04:19. | :04:26. | |
-- Labour for independence on board? It is not just the SNP. Them | :04:26. | :04:29. | |
up for our people from all political parties and no political | :04:29. | :04:32. | |
parties. Significantly, a contingent of Labour supporters who | :04:32. | :04:36. | |
think the best picture Oscar and his independence, where the can | :04:36. | :04:41. | |
take our own positions. In a way, they are the enemy. How | :04:41. | :04:45. | |
are you about having them on board? It is about more than party | :04:45. | :04:51. | |
politics. I welcome everybody and anybody to this campaign. | :04:51. | :04:55. | |
I realise that many of you are proud to call yourself | :04:55. | :05:01. | |
nationalists... This is a former Labour MP and MSP. | :05:01. | :05:06. | |
So, as Alice prepared his be, perhaps the crowd was prepared for | :05:06. | :05:14. | |
the concert of labour for independence. -- Alex. | :05:14. | :05:20. | |
If it is any consolation, I think everybody is wondering why we are | :05:20. | :05:24. | |
here. Is it like passing the rubric on | :05:24. | :05:29. | |
for you, doing that speech? -- Ruby Khan. | :05:29. | :05:35. | |
I'm happy to speak to so many people. What we need to do now is | :05:35. | :05:38. | |
get the message across further. This is not about breaking up the | :05:38. | :05:48. | |
:05:48. | :05:51. | ||
Labour Party. I just want an honest, Clearly, Labour for independence is | :05:51. | :05:56. | |
hardly on-message for the Labour Party. But with the SNP keen to get | :05:56. | :06:03. | |
a devolution Max selection on the ballot box, constitutional things | :06:03. | :06:08. | |
are getting fuzzy around the edges. I'm joined now from Edinburgh by | :06:08. | :06:11. | |
Simon Pia, journalist and until recently a Scottish Labour spin | :06:11. | :06:14. | |
doctor who served three party leaders. And here in Glasgow, Jean | :06:14. | :06:17. | |
Freeman, formerly a special adviser to Labour First Minister Jack | :06:17. | :06:26. | |
McConnell, now a founding member of Scottish Women for Independence. | :06:26. | :06:28. | |
Have you always been independence minded? | :06:28. | :06:33. | |
No, I haven't. I have been a Labour voter for most of my adult life. I | :06:33. | :06:38. | |
did not believe that we needed independence. But actually, what | :06:38. | :06:43. | |
has changed my mind is the experience of devolution. I have | :06:43. | :06:47. | |
seen what in Scotland we can choose to do that goes with the grain of | :06:47. | :06:52. | |
who we are in Scotland, and now, what I want is the opportunity to | :06:52. | :06:57. | |
have all the powers that a nation should have to make the decisions | :06:57. | :07:02. | |
for our future, for our children's future, and the thing I think about | :07:02. | :07:06. | |
the Yes Scotland campaign which is so good is that it's beyond party | :07:06. | :07:10. | |
politics and is about ambition and hope. That is what I am four. | :07:10. | :07:15. | |
And your experience in government as a specialist adviser, did that | :07:15. | :07:21. | |
shape your view? I think it gave me confidence that in Scotland, we can | :07:21. | :07:24. | |
make decisions for ourselves. We can be accountable for those | :07:24. | :07:30. | |
decisions. We can make the right choices. It convinced me, by seeing | :07:30. | :07:33. | |
what we can do in education, what we can do in health, that we can | :07:33. | :07:37. | |
also make those decisions on the economy. | :07:37. | :07:42. | |
Does that persuade you? I think working in government can | :07:42. | :07:45. | |
twist your views. I don't think that applies to her in particular. | :07:45. | :07:52. | |
I actually think, I don't want to sound rude or dismissive, but I | :07:52. | :07:56. | |
think it is a fairly insignificant movement or section of the Labour | :07:56. | :08:03. | |
Party. What it does reflect, there's no getting away from people | :08:03. | :08:08. | |
like Jean who went away from the party, but there's a vacuum there. | :08:09. | :08:16. | |
I have been urging Labour to fill that, about what the other to offer | :08:16. | :08:21. | |
us a vision for Scotland in the 21st century. Labour has had a | :08:21. | :08:27. | |
stasis and it has not adjusted to whether or not we are going to move | :08:27. | :08:31. | |
forward and have more devolution. But Scottish home rule is as old as | :08:31. | :08:38. | |
the Labour Party itself. Go back to 1901, it was in our manifesto in | :08:38. | :08:42. | |
1945, and I think there's a lot of common ground in politics in | :08:42. | :08:45. | |
Scotland and many areas. People like Jean and I could sit around a | :08:45. | :08:55. | |
:08:55. | :08:58. | ||
Is there anything that would persuade you to vote yes? | :08:58. | :09:04. | |
Ultimately, I think we are better together because I still feel a | :09:04. | :09:10. | |
Solidarity with people in the labour movement and what they have | :09:10. | :09:13. | |
achieved throughout in Manchester, London, Wales, where every you want | :09:13. | :09:19. | |
to go. I still think these are the strongest points about what my | :09:19. | :09:26. | |
politics are. What independence is getting offered to us by the SNP is | :09:26. | :09:34. | |
very unclear. The monetary union seems to be a remaining thing. The | :09:34. | :09:37. | |
monarchy... I do not think there is a clear enough alternative that | :09:37. | :09:43. | |
life would be that different. need to give Jean Freeman a chance | :09:43. | :09:48. | |
to come in at this point. There will be people in the Labour Party | :09:48. | :09:52. | |
that share that view. Simon says people in favour of independence | :09:52. | :09:58. | |
and who vote Labour are the minority. A I am not sure I agree. | :09:58. | :10:02. | |
There is a big difference in the number of Labour Party members and | :10:02. | :10:05. | |
voters who would be willing, at this early stage, to join that | :10:05. | :10:10. | |
rally and the number of people who are Labour Party supporters who | :10:10. | :10:14. | |
feel the party has disconnected from them. I agree with Simon in | :10:14. | :10:19. | |
many ways. The Labour Party did not think beyond a Scottish Parliament, | :10:19. | :10:24. | |
did not think beyond devolution, even though Donald Dewar said it is | :10:24. | :10:29. | |
a process, not an end in itself. The problem is, all the Labour | :10:29. | :10:35. | |
Party is offering at the moment is vote no and we will see. That is | :10:35. | :10:40. | |
not good enough. Scotland is an ambitious, creative, till -- | :10:40. | :10:45. | |
talented country and we want to make our own decision as. Simon, | :10:46. | :10:51. | |
the leader in Scotland is making a speech on the future direction of | :10:51. | :10:57. | |
the party tomorrow. What do you want her to say? I have always been | :10:57. | :11:03. | |
a bit of a federalist. I think she will identified areas in which we | :11:03. | :11:08. | |
will move forward. Why do not know the specifics of what she will say. | :11:08. | :11:14. | |
-- I do not know. I think we should try and find out what people really | :11:14. | :11:20. | |
want. People do not want separation. We live in an integrated society | :11:20. | :11:24. | |
throughout the UK. People should appreciate that a lot more. People | :11:24. | :11:29. | |
should not be so negative about being part of the union. Separation, | :11:29. | :11:39. | |
:11:39. | :11:40. | ||
or independence, is not an answer to the problems. Thank you. | :11:40. | :11:43. | |
Here are some statistics that might surprise you. Did you know two- | :11:43. | :11:46. | |
thirds of people would be unhappy if a member of their family formed | :11:46. | :11:49. | |
a relationship with a gypsy traveller? And how about this? | :11:49. | :11:52. | |
Nearly a quarter of people thought travellers were unsuited to be | :11:52. | :11:54. | |
primary school teachers. Those survey findings found their way | :11:54. | :11:57. | |
into a Holyrood committee report into the treatment of travellers in | :11:57. | :12:00. | |
modern Scotland. But most alarming for committee members were reports | :12:00. | :12:03. | |
of families being turned away from GP and dentist surgeries in what is | :12:03. | :12:13. | |
:12:13. | :12:19. | ||
supposed to be a free and universal healthcare system. | :12:19. | :12:26. | |
Gypsy traveller up brother and sisters this morning. Nobody is | :12:26. | :12:32. | |
quite sure how many travellers they are in Scotland. One estimate says | :12:32. | :12:38. | |
1,500. Another says 15,000. That is if you include those who live in | :12:38. | :12:43. | |
houses. How could you be in trouble if you live in a house? The Equal | :12:43. | :12:47. | |
Opportunities Committee considers gypsy traveller has to be a | :12:47. | :12:52. | |
distinct ethnic group. Whether they consider a caravan or a cottage as | :12:52. | :12:57. | |
home. However defined, attitudes to this community have shocked | :12:57. | :13:02. | |
committee members. When it comes to access to health care, they are | :13:02. | :13:08. | |
angry. It should be universal, they say, but it is not. Back in | :13:08. | :13:13. | |
Montrose, the father of these children recognises the picture | :13:13. | :13:23. | |
MSPs paint. They say, you're not part of the community. It is our | :13:23. | :13:28. | |
culture. They should realise that. Scottish, Irish, Welsh travellers, | :13:28. | :13:34. | |
it does not matter who you are, they must recognise traveller Purim | :13:34. | :13:42. | |
a by now. They should help us. -- travellers are by now. This is not | :13:42. | :13:46. | |
even the first or second time parliament has looked at this | :13:46. | :13:52. | |
problem in recent years. We first looked at it in 2001. It was a | :13:52. | :13:58. | |
broad inquiry at the time. The thing that came across more than | :13:58. | :14:02. | |
anything was through all the inquiries no progress had been made. | :14:02. | :14:08. | |
It was almost as if it was a futile exercise. For government says it is | :14:08. | :14:14. | |
up to local NHS boards to ensure people recognise cultural diversity | :14:14. | :14:19. | |
and they should be no barriers to travellers. But a gypsy travellers | :14:19. | :14:25. | |
remain a community unwanted and unloved by many other Scottish | :14:25. | :14:29. | |
communities. As long as attitudes to them remain as negative as they | :14:29. | :14:34. | |
appear to be, it is hard to imagine their lot improving as quickly as | :14:34. | :14:42. | |
the committee might like. Annabel Goldie is here. She served on the | :14:42. | :14:47. | |
committee that throughout their investigation. How would you feel | :14:47. | :14:51. | |
if a traveller community moved in to an area near where you live? | :14:51. | :14:57. | |
Would you welcome them? I think if the traveller community was | :14:57. | :15:01. | |
behaving responsibly and wanted to respect the rights of other members | :15:01. | :15:06. | |
in that committee, there is no issue. What the report if exemplify | :15:06. | :15:11. | |
his and represents other profound concerns which the Equal | :15:11. | :15:15. | |
Opportunities Committee had on the evidence we got. I just want to | :15:16. | :15:20. | |
test your own views on one of the other areas. What about if somebody | :15:20. | :15:27. | |
in your family was dating a member of the gypsy traveller community? | :15:27. | :15:31. | |
would welcome them to my family. I am in a fortunate position. As a | :15:31. | :15:35. | |
young person, I grew up in the country where the annual visit by | :15:35. | :15:42. | |
travellers was a welcome part of the seasonal time. They helped the | :15:42. | :15:47. | |
farming community, they were part of my mother local country life. | :15:47. | :15:57. | |
:15:57. | :15:58. | ||
it seems your view it is a minority view. -- part of my map local | :15:58. | :16:05. | |
country life. The report lists a lid on a mixture of things that | :16:05. | :16:09. | |
have not been happening that should have been happening. Issues of | :16:09. | :16:13. | |
prejudice which are there that many people thought had disappeared and | :16:13. | :16:19. | |
were outdated. Perhaps, most importantly, we need to recognise | :16:19. | :16:24. | |
gypsy travellers and their community is a respectable every | :16:24. | :16:28. | |
minority grouping. It is entitled to the same protection as any other | :16:28. | :16:34. | |
group. It does not seem to enjoy that. Changing attitudes is | :16:34. | :16:38. | |
difficult. In terms of public services like the NHS, can the | :16:38. | :16:42. | |
Government to do something concrete to ensure equal access Questor rock | :16:42. | :16:47. | |
the Scottish government has been co-operative. -- to ensure equal | :16:47. | :16:54. | |
access? The committee has said if we discover there are inadequate | :16:55. | :17:00. | |
services, patchy provision of GP services, for example, patchy | :17:00. | :17:04. | |
provision of quality services from local authorities, we think the | :17:05. | :17:09. | |
Scottish government can give a strategic lead and start saying to | :17:09. | :17:13. | |
these agencies, have you got standard practice is in place to | :17:13. | :17:19. | |
understand the culture? There must be heightened awareness of that | :17:20. | :17:24. | |
culture. Thank you. A quick look at culture. Thank you. A quick look at | :17:24. | :17:31. |