08/05/2014 Newsnight Scotland

that he can no longer control. We will have the latest on the

crisis tomorrow, when Mark will report on Victory Day in Moscow.

Tonight on Newsnight Scotland, we are being asked to go out an vote

for the members of the European Parliament but why does little, if

any of what the parties are saying have anything do the Parliament? Why

are voters so reluctant to exercise their right as citizens of the EU?

And willure Lokions ever be taken seriously by politicians or the

public? -- and Will euro elections. The past

few years have seen the usual dramatic increase in media coverage

of Europe which is fair enough. But much of the Europe coverage seems to

been slanted to domestic politics, either as a proxy battle over

Scottish independence or EU membership or the next UK general

election, is that what is it is about? First, Huw Williams reminds

us of some of the odd venues parties have used to pitch their votes. My

fellow friend, time to get your glad ration on, invite your friends over.

Only hours till people across Europe get to vote for the creme de la

creme of the continent's talent. I am talking of course about the

European Parliamentary elections. On May 22nd. The Scottish Conservatives

pitch is based on renegotiating a whole relationship with the European

Union. Or else we are off. We need to ring-fence financial service,

Glasgow, Edinburgh are affected by this. The EU tried to interfere to

impose taxes. Ring-fence it. Deep water oil, E. You interfered. Pull

it back, stop that happening I spent four years working for the Scottish

fisherman's federation, an area where the EU has been anything but

helpful. Stop it. Ring-fence it. There are six Scottish MEPs,

everyone will be watching to see if the Greens can rob the Scottish

Liberal Democrats of their place in the Parliament. The Green Party is

offering the people of Scotland an opportunity to vote for the politics

of hope. Politics that is stands against austerity, with people who

are suffering from the economic crisis. It's a politics that stands

with people who come to Scotland, to be part of our economy and our

culture, it stands against the nuclear aggression and the failed

systems of nuclear alliances. Last time round, in 2009, the for

the first time ever in a Last time round, in 2009, the for

make sure that we tackle tax evasion at the European level. We will try

to solve the banking crisis. The Liberal Democrats, of course,

aren't giving up without a fight. We are out with a strong message, we

are saying to people this election is about jobs, and economic

recovery, we believe as a party, that if we want to secure the jobs

that are linked to Europe, over 300,000, if be want to secure our

economic recovery we have to stay in Britain, and in the European Union.

Even here will be watching to see if the euro election results give

Even here will be watching to see if international politics at the

university there. Christian Kaunert, give us context on this. All the

debate in Britain, about the European elections seems to have

virtually nothing to do with what the European Parliament does, or is

likely to do over the next few years, is that the case all round

Europe? Well, indeed it is very unfortunate that in Britain the

debate is very much about whether Britain should be a member of the

European Union, which incidentally Britain has been since 1973. It is

not really so much about whether you know whether we should have more

austerity, less austerity, whether the euro needs to be saved or any of

those kind of issues that matter for most European countries at the

moment. I wouldn't say that the debate in Britain is very

representative for Europe as a whole. If you look at different

national debates you can find quite peculiar national flavours, but what

makes the debate in Britain a little bit outstanding here, is that

introspecktive perspective, whether it is about whether Britain should

be part of the European Union and not so much about what the European

Union should be about, that is very much to be regretted and in fact,

you could argue that debate between Nick Clegg and Nigel Farage, and

align that, even emphasise that, that is very much about that instead

of being about content. Lesley Riddoch, do you deprecate this?

There appears to be no debate here about what the European Parliament

should be doing. Well, sure, welcome to everyone who has fled the Nigel

Farage zone on the other channel tonight, because that is really what

has happened, the debate has been captured by what seems easier for

journalists. It is not just Nigel Farage, even before Nigel Farage had

ever been heard of, ahead of European elections, it was a debate

about whether or not Britain should be in the European Union or not.

Alex and I both came toe night from a debate where one person was not

from Britain put it very well and said that you are stuck here

discussing process, where the rest offure rope is discussing issue,

another speaker said there is a vacuum here because we can't take

our own democracy seriously, European Europe is too distant. He

pointed out the number of correspondents already from papers

and the BBC across Europe and in European countries has dwindled to

nothing. We we know everything ability how a state in the US might

vote in a Presidential election but nothing about how Angela Merkel

might get re-elected. We are basically to an extent we are

reaping what we have sown. I should say our European editor

might take exception so what you just said. Is it inevitable any

debate will have nothing do with the European Parliament and everything

to do with domestic politics? It is not inevitable. It is the case in

this country and think for a perfectly understandable and good

reasons, after all most of the issues the European issues that

affect people in the United Kingdom aren't really issued where the

European Parliament is the pre-eminent organisation, they are

issues that are discussed at heads of Government level, and with the

Commission, it is not really a question of what the European

Parliament does and people don't really see a link between the

European Parliament and their ordinary live, and I think that is

reasonable enough, it is after all the fourth tier of politics, there

is only so much people can expected to take notice of. To put European

elections on top of that and expect people to be fascinated by detail of

the Common Agricultural Policy seems to be taking an optimistic view.

Actually, there's a good reason for not being interested in the

elections because the European Parliament doesn't actually do

anything important. There seems to be a contradiction here. If we were

to believe UKIP, the flip side of that argument is that the European

Parliament has quite a lot to do with that policy because most

legislation needs eco-decision of the European Parliament. If the

European Union is so powerful, that there is a reason for UKIP to

exist... The other side of that is the point Alex is making, which is

that every big decision of the European Union which affects how the

European Union will be has to be agreed by national governments,

whether or not the European Parliament plays a more important

than it used to. The aren't daft. -- electorate. Of course. But they are

on equal footing for 80% of the legislation. There is a point

there, a genuine issue about whether this isn't just asking people to

vote for something which they know doesn't have much meaning for their

lives. There is a contradiction about the big scary monster that

UKIP is worried about Andy powerless institution we can dismiss. In fact,

it is the case that the three main parties in the UK, none of them are

members of a larger European group which is putting forward a

presidential candidate. It's that lack of follow-through that makes

incomprehensible to people to know what they are voting for. It looks

like we are putting for a Parliament like Holly wrote, but it's not like

that. It is great we would have -- it is great if we could have

candidates with faces people could understand. Maybe a socialist future

or green future. That would let people understand about the

movements and pulses in European thinking which we had been excluded

from because England is not very interested, frankly. The reality is

this campaign has been all about UKIP, at least in the UK. Are they a

flash in the pan? Yes no. They will clearly do extremely well,

particularly in England. I suspect they will do better than many people

Scotland. But it is perfectly reasonable for the press to use this

in terms of the Westminster election and what impact UKIP can have on the

2015 election, particularly the extent to which it will damage the

conservative's chances. Remember, for every ten voters vote in 2015,

no more than six were built in the European Parliament elections and

again, UKIP voters are extremely motivated, so we can expect them to

turn out in great numbers. They will proceed in terms of the Westminster

but election will not disappear entirely. I would be surprised if

they won seats in the Westminster election but they influence matters

and they clearly have a constituency that takes a very pessimistic view

Britain's present day, let alone its future circumstances. But there is

room for a party that represents an alienated population. There was a

survey yesterday saying 60% of people who said they would vote for

UKIP in the European elections would consider it in the general

elections. I presume you are trying to say is that related into a 10%

UKIP vote, that would have serious consequences for the Conservatives

in the general elections. Yes. It would make impossible for David

Cameron to remain Prime Minister. It will be difficult enough for the

Conservatives as it is. There is a micro picture in terms of the

national polls and recovering economy which gives the

Conservatives reason for hope in 2015, but the micro picture becomes

difficult to see which seem to see which sees the Tories didn't win in

2010 that they have a realistic chance of winning in 2015. What do

you make of the UKIP phenomenon? One of the odd things of Europe is that

if you ask a lot of people, should we get out of the European Union?

Many will say yes. If you ask people, how important is Europe? It

is way down the list, which is presumably be problem you came IP

might have at the problem the Eurosceptics and Conservatives had

for years. -- the problem UKIP. Europe seems to be important for

voters. On the other hand, it doesn't seem to be so important to

them. There is something here that is followed European integration

over decades. It used to be permissive consensus. A lot of

people are not too bothered about European integration and going along

with it. In Britain, that has changed. You might have

non-permissive consensus in Britain, where people are not favourable

towards European integration but at the same time, it doesn't swing the

vote. I wonder what you make of what Alex said and what influence I have

on the independence referendum campaign because if you listen to a

lot of people on the yes side, they try to paint it as a nightmare

scenario of another Conservative government, will majority

Conservative government in Britain. The better UKIP look like doing in

the British general election, the less chance there is of a Tory

government and less motivation people will have for voting yes.

Look at some of the things UKIP have been saying and ask yourself if you

can imagine these guys in government or even welding seats down! --

holding. Alex isn't suggesting they would be in government. He is

suggesting they might have sufficient votes to deprive the

Conservative party of any chance of an overall majority. I am imagining

the relevance of this is to try and ask how that might impact of the

Scottish referendum. What I am trying to answer is the prospect of

UKIP having any power, any which way, even being elected, even the

fact we are sitting discussing this to light, is unbelievable to a lot

of people who look at the kind of policies of the Mickey Mouse party

that hasn't even had the time to take seriously what it would do with

a Scottish Parliament, which it wanted to abolish, and is taking

votes from working class people. We need to leak -- look at some depth

at this party. Polls are suggesting they might get 10% of votes in

Scotland than 30% of votes south of the border. One of the things that

UKIP is seen to represent is a protest vote against people that

don't like the Westminster/ Scottish elite. That's not unique to Britain,

is it? Absolutely. If we look right across Europe, we see a number of

parties right across UKIP. -- right across Europe. Then taking the

solution to that problem, that foreigners are to blame, because of

the Bulgarians and Romanians in Polish, we have that issue and that

exists right across Europe. We are in tough economic times, so it is

not too surprising. Why do you think UKIP doesn't do as it does in

England? It is harder to break into a four party system than a three

party system. UKIP is part of an internal Tory civil war and there

are fewer Conservatives in Scotland. The people who think that there is

no difference between Labour and the Tories and the Liberals in England

are tentative Yuki Abbey and the people in Scotland who think there

is no difference between... -- are tempted to vote UKIP.

And lastly, a quick look at what'll be in the headlines tomorrow. Good

Morning Scotland on BBC Radio Scotland will be looking at the

Defence Secretary's latest view of what happens to Trident in the event

of independence. Newsnet Scotland website says Johann Lamont is being

challenged over figures on A waiting times she used in the

Parliament today. And a look at some of the printed papers. Scottish law

to tackle domestic abuse. We will have to take the rough with

the smooth through this weekend. Friday is far from settled. Rain

across northern areas in the form of showers. The best of the sunshine

further south. This is a snapshot for 4pm. Sharp showers around and

they could be slow-moving because the winds won't be particularly

strong. Cloudy and cruel and showery across northern England. Sharp

showers across eastern counties but many central and southern parts of

England and Wales will see bright and breezy weather and a better day

than Thursday. The odd shower around but it will