30/09/2011 Newsnight


30/09/2011

With Emily Maitlis. In his conference speech Ed Miliband condemned 'predatory businesses', but what is wrong with a bit of predatory capitalism if the net result improves our lot?


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Transcript


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We know there is acrisis of economic growth, is there really a

:00:09.:00:13.

crisis of can capitalism in Britain? As the new �50 note goes

:00:13.:00:20.

on display boosting the face not just of a great British scientist

:00:20.:00:26.

but a venture capitalist Ed Miliband calls for us to get a

:00:26.:00:31.

Fayer economy. Growth is built on sand if it comes from our predators

:00:31.:00:38.

and not our producers. Is it type to tear up the old rule back. The

:00:38.:00:42.

CIA kill another Al-Qaeda spiritual leader. Was he really the lifrpbl

:00:42.:00:48.

pin we are led to believe. Amanda Knox isn't only guilty of murder as

:00:48.:00:52.

her Court of Appeal edges towards it is conclusion we are told she's

:00:52.:00:55.

also a diabolical, satanic, demonic she-devil. Is our cultural

:00:55.:01:05.
:01:05.:01:07.

fascination with female killers Good evening. On the even of the

:01:07.:01:09.

Conservative conference, the government knows it has to convince

:01:09.:01:14.

us that it has a real plan for economic growth. That may just mean

:01:14.:01:19.

tearing up the rule book. Earlier this week, to the derision of many

:01:19.:01:23.

business leaders, Ed Miliband, tried to do just that. Talking of a

:01:23.:01:27.

need to find a fairer and more decent capitalism. It was time to

:01:27.:01:30.

cull, he said, the predator businesses who leave morality

:01:30.:01:36.

behind. Is he right? Realistically, how could it work? We ask if

:01:36.:01:40.

politic has to re-think its big ideas to help Britain emerge from

:01:40.:01:47.

the economic abyss. On the knewly designed �50 note there is

:01:47.:01:53.

recognition of what capitalism can achieve at its best. On the left is

:01:53.:01:57.

Matthew Bolton who transformed James Watts improvement from a

:01:57.:02:00.

steam engine into a business that changed the world for good. Ed

:02:00.:02:03.

Miliband believes there is a crucial difference between business

:02:03.:02:07.

owners that support the industries of the future, and those who just

:02:07.:02:13.

want a quick puff of profit. must learn the lesson that growth

:02:13.:02:17.

is built on sand if it comes from our predators and not our producers.

:02:17.:02:24.

For years as a country we have been neutral in that battle. This is the

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Mayfair Headquarters of the company singled out by Ed Miliband as being

:02:28.:02:34.

willing to sell your grandmothers for a fast buck. They took over

:02:34.:02:39.

Southern Cross and sold out increasing its investment. Ed

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Miliband would say that's asset stripping, black stone Group would

:02:44.:02:51.

say it's adding value. What is asset stripping anyway? Richard

:02:51.:02:58.

Gere gave a good explanation to Julia Roberts when she played a

:02:58.:03:02.

prostitute and him a kor corporate rate raider. You don't make

:03:02.:03:06.

anything or build anything. What do you do with the companies

:03:06.:03:12.

when you buy them. I sell them. sell them? I don't sell the whole

:03:12.:03:16.

company. I break them into pieces and I sell that off. It's worth

:03:16.:03:21.

more than the whole. It's like stealing cars and selling them for

:03:21.:03:26.

pof its. Sort of, but legal. Here is what Ed Miliband sees Alex

:03:26.:03:30.

Salmond set stripping. Blackstone took over Southern Cross. It split

:03:30.:03:33.

the company into a property firm which owned the buildings and a

:03:33.:03:37.

care provider then expanded with borrowed money. The property firm

:03:37.:03:41.

then sold the homes to third party landlords which leased them back to

:03:41.:03:47.

the care provider. Blackstone sold out in 2007 for a big profit. As

:03:47.:03:50.

rents rose and local authority payments fell, Southern Cross

:03:50.:03:57.

collapsed and had to break itself up, causing anguish for 31,000

:03:57.:04:02.

residents. Not every takeover is asset stripping. Critics believe it

:04:02.:04:07.

happens too often. A company comes and acquires a business. It doesn't

:04:07.:04:11.

improve that business in anyway at all. What it does, it loads the

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business up with debt. It extracts as much cash out as it can by

:04:16.:04:20.

cutting costs and cutting employees and investment. Then it simply

:04:20.:04:24.

walks away as soon as possible with a profit. It doesn't build any

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long-term improvement at all. bad or for good predators are

:04:29.:04:32.

stalking businesses like the leisure industry. This might seem

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like a goodbyes on a Friday night. The owner of All Bar One is the

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prey of a hostile takeover bid itself. It's predator is Joe Lewis,

:04:45.:04:50.

the Tottenham Hotspur owner. He reckons if he took it over he would

:04:50.:04:55.

do a better job of running it. If capitalism is red in tooth and claw

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don't we need a few predators. The private equity companies say they

:05:01.:05:09.

are often supporting invest os not asset strippers. We invested in

:05:09.:05:14.

companies between three or or five years. They that has gone up during

:05:14.:05:17.

the downturn. If you talk to the managing directors of the companies

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we invest in they value the skills that private equity brings to bear.

:05:22.:05:27.

It's about building sustainable business over the longer term.

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most criticised press tors like BlackStone have achieved positive

:05:33.:05:37.

results keeping employees in work who may have lost their jobs. How

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could you discourage the bad predators without keeping out the

:05:40.:05:46.

good ones? There is an important point at the root of this. Alhamzi

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though very often markets work really well, private interests work

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in the public interest. Sometimes, it doesn't. The public interest

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isn't being well served by unregulated markets. We don't have

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to talk about state intervention much we can talk about getting

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employees, kust ministers mers and other stake holders involved with

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the governance of companies or the ownership of companies. If I take a

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company that is going to go bust, I may have to shut down one of the

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three factories and sell it off. That could look like asset

:06:21.:06:27.

stripping, I may lay staff off, I would say save 1,000 jobs rather

:06:27.:06:32.

than cutting 200. There are no set of rules you can write down in

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black-and-white and a tick box exercise. There is an awful lot of

:06:36.:06:41.

judgment involved. That is a hard thing to do. The capitalism of

:06:41.:06:51.

Matthew Boulton and James Watt may not have been kinder than today's.

:06:51.:06:56.

By putting them on the �50 cot Bank of England be hinting we should

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take a trip back to the future stphr Joining me now to discuss the

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morality of capitalism is Rowenna Davis of the soon to be published

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book, Tangled up in Blue, Blue Labour and the Struggle for

:07:12.:07:15.

Labour's Soul. Also joining me from Newcastle is Business Angel and

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multi-millionaire venture capitalist, Jeremy Middleton. He's

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also the deputy Chair of the Conservative Party Board. Business

:07:21.:07:24.

has slammed Ed Miliband's vision this week. He is right, isn't he,

:07:24.:07:29.

to be thinking big and thinking philosophically, this is radical?

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It shows he doesn't understand business. He is talking about

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predators, he means people like me who are business angels or venture

:07:38.:07:44.

capitalists. What this country needs is more venture cam

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capitalists. They fill the gap where banks won't go. Banks won't

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do startups which we need. You won't find banks taking risks,

:07:55.:08:00.

venture capitalists do that. If you look at Dragon's Den. I'm sure your

:08:00.:08:06.

viewers see it, who would put the money in if the Dragons didn't, no-

:08:06.:08:09.

one certainly would put the money. In we need more dragons we don't

:08:09.:08:14.

need to put the fire that the dragons have out. Which is what Ed

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Miliband would do. Now will is a question in the wake of 200 about

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what kind of capitalism we want. The fact is, it hasn't been working.

:08:24.:08:27.

At the moment we are going to be paying back a hell of a lot of

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money to banks because they acted morally irresponsiblibly. Business

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cannot continue as normal. What about the venture capitalists we

:08:36.:08:42.

are talking about - With all due respect to Jeremy, it's a sip

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simplistic interpretation of the speech to say that Ed Miliband

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doesn't like venture capitalists. What he was saying was, there is a

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difference between goodbyes practice and bad business practice.

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We should divide those lines. We don't need business that is built

:08:55.:09:00.

on sand, that ends up bringing long-term - Of which Jeremy

:09:00.:09:05.

Middleton it's hard to disagree with? This country needs growth and

:09:05.:09:11.

jobs. For that we need risk takers. We don't need more regulation, more

:09:11.:09:15.

taxation - Can I come in on that point? We need support. It's

:09:15.:09:19.

nonsense to be talking in this way. How are you going to do it? When

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you talk about risk takers, is a bad company or two a price worth

:09:25.:09:28.

worth paying? I think, we talk about the odd bad company, there

:09:28.:09:34.

are good and bad in life. To be perfectly - They do exist?

:09:34.:09:37.

Businesses overwhelmingly are forces for good. I have been

:09:37.:09:44.

investing in companies for 20 years. I sit on numerous boards. Over that

:09:44.:09:46.

time the companies I'm involved with employed 5,000 people or more.

:09:46.:09:51.

They have paid millions in tax. That is a force for good. The idea

:09:51.:09:57.

that somebody can set up some sort of commissar to judge what is good

:09:57.:10:00.

and bad. You have to pay taxes and follow the law. That is what

:10:00.:10:06.

companies need to do. How would you do it? I find this ridiculous.

:10:06.:10:09.

Goodbyes practice and bad business practice. If you get the regulation

:10:09.:10:13.

right in the beginning you stop state intervention. People don't

:10:13.:10:19.

have to step in and bail out - There is already regulation -

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good is that regulation. We have a massive financial crisis much I

:10:24.:10:28.

don't see many regulations changing in the way wake of it. What would

:10:28.:10:33.

you do? We have rules anyway. Why don't we make them recognise moral

:10:33.:10:39.

standards. Why don't we - nothing revolutionary - What does that mean,

:10:39.:10:44.

recognise moral standards? Put it into something that someone can

:10:44.:10:49.

understand. When you do public procurement, make sure we give

:10:49.:10:53.

contracts to those companies who give apprenticeships. Tax breaks to

:10:53.:10:57.

companies who pay the living wage wage to their workers because we

:10:57.:11:03.

respect dignity in work. concrete examples? You find anybody

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who does apply will, living in this country lrks have to pay the

:11:08.:11:12.

minimum wage - Living wage. might give the contracts to people

:11:12.:11:15.

who are paying higher sums. You are forming a judgment there which you

:11:15.:11:20.

are not in a position to do. You talk about apprenticeships as good

:11:20.:11:23.

things. What about small companies. And people taking - Why don't we

:11:23.:11:28.

give tax breaks to those companies to help them? Can I also point out.

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It's obvious that Jeremy knows what goodbyes practice is and recognises

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moral standards. One of the companies he set up Homeserve say

:11:39.:11:47.

it's bleest believes in responsibilities of integrity. When

:11:47.:11:54.

the government starts talking about it, it's as if it's - You are being

:11:54.:11:57.

complimented. Whether you like it or not, you are an ethical business

:11:57.:12:02.

and that the economy would flourish from that? Well, I'm grateful for

:12:02.:12:06.

that. And I think it's great that companies - You recognise your

:12:06.:12:11.

morality in your business? It's in the best interests of business to

:12:11.:12:14.

behave in the best interest of their communities. All the Boards I

:12:14.:12:19.

sit on we spend our time thinking about how to improve customer

:12:19.:12:23.

services. How do we improve the motivation and moral of our staff?

:12:23.:12:29.

We don't need to do is more regulation and more taxation and -

:12:29.:12:34.

It's not more regulation to give awe tax break. Apart - it looked to

:12:34.:12:38.

me like a speech where he is trying to create a bogey man. Trying to

:12:38.:12:41.

find someone to blame. I really don't know what he was specifically

:12:41.:12:45.

planning to do. Who is going to judge what is good and what is bad?

:12:46.:12:51.

It's in the best interests - It's not about sitting in judgment on

:12:51.:12:56.

companies? What is it. Who are the predators. You are talking about

:12:56.:13:00.

practices, that is not what he said. I spoke to the office today to make

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sure it's clear. He is not sitting in judgment on companies. He is

:13:06.:13:10.

saying there are rules to the game in the market. When we design the

:13:10.:13:13.

rules they should be implemented with an eye to marral standards.

:13:13.:13:16.

That would be good for society and good for business. That isn't

:13:16.:13:19.

radical at all, is it? particularly, no. I don't see what

:13:19.:13:25.

the problem. Is I would say that every single man - every single and

:13:25.:13:29.

man woman on the street would tell you that they know what goodbyes

:13:29.:13:32.

practice is. They know it's immoral to have something come through

:13:32.:13:36.

their door offering them a loan for something they can't afford and can

:13:36.:13:40.

never pay back. The public taste for that kind of operation has just

:13:40.:13:47.

reached a limit. You must recognise that things have gone badly wrong

:13:47.:13:51.

since 2007/2008 something big has to change? There is no doubt that

:13:51.:13:54.

most companies are ethical and wish to be as ethical as possible. That

:13:54.:13:58.

is goodbyes. What I'm saying, if all you are saying is what we

:13:58.:14:03.

already know, what are you saying? I mean, is motherhood an apple pie?

:14:03.:14:07.

Most of us entirely go along with that. If that is all it is, what is

:14:07.:14:11.

the substance in the speech? I didn't hear it. There is a hell of

:14:11.:14:16.

a lot. What you are suffering from a moral blindness in what is

:14:16.:14:19.

happening here. Even though we bailed out the banks the

:14:19.:14:23.

regulations that came through hardly make any difference at at

:14:23.:14:27.

all. Ed Miliband is saying - Firmer regulation? That would be one part

:14:27.:14:32.

of it. A lot of incentives. Have worker representation? Tax breaks

:14:32.:14:37.

for the living wage? What you mean, you want to interfere in business

:14:37.:14:43.

more. Not at all. One of the things you have - That is you hand it back.

:14:43.:14:45.

That is absolutely fan fine. There are rules already. Why don't we

:14:45.:14:51.

have rules that have an eye to marral standards. The status quo

:14:51.:14:59.

Jeremy, I know you are having problems with your earpiece. We

:14:59.:15:02.

understand George Osborne is going to say tomorrow that tax cuts will

:15:02.:15:06.

be pretty much ruled out before the next election. As an entrepreneur

:15:06.:15:11.

yourself, could we get your response? The most important thing

:15:11.:15:15.

is that we have an economy that is growing and that means lower

:15:15.:15:19.

interest rates and that means we have to control the debt. That is

:15:19.:15:23.

the most important thing. I hope taxation will come down when it can

:15:23.:15:27.

come down. The Government has already made some reductions in

:15:27.:15:30.

corporation tax and has promised more, but you can't we do use them

:15:30.:15:36.

further and to you can afford it. - - reduce them. Thank you both very

:15:36.:15:40.

much indeed. Where Bush tried, Obama, it could

:15:40.:15:43.

appear, has succeeded not once but twice - and in a field few imagined

:15:43.:15:46.

would be his strength. Tonight, America hailed as a victory the

:15:46.:15:49.

assassination of Anwar al-Awlaki - Al-Qaeda's link, they said, to the

:15:49.:15:53.

English-speaking world. So what is his legacy, and how will his death

:15:53.:16:03.
:16:03.:16:07.

be received? Tim Whewell reports. He was the western face of Al-Qaeda.

:16:07.:16:12.

Not a senior commander, or even a senior cleric at, but the terror

:16:12.:16:17.

network's most charismatic English language propagandist. I eventually

:16:17.:16:22.

came to the conclusion that she had against America is binding upon

:16:22.:16:27.

myself just as it is binding upon every other able Muslim. A US

:16:27.:16:32.

citizen born in New Mexico, Anwar al-Awlaki could speak to American

:16:32.:16:38.

and British Muslims in their own language and recruit them to do his

:16:38.:16:42.

cause. Now an air strike in his adopted homeland of Yemen has put a

:16:42.:16:50.

stop to that. My reaction is we got him. This is one of the most

:16:50.:16:53.

treasured targets we have been seeking for a long time. We all

:16:53.:16:58.

feel this is, in terms of winning that important wall we talked about,

:16:59.:17:05.

the war of ideas, it is an absolutely critical victory.

:17:05.:17:15.
:17:15.:17:17.

Awlaki was in touch with an... He was in contact with the underpants

:17:17.:17:21.

bomber, who planned to blow up a plane to Detroit on Christmas Day

:17:21.:17:27.

that year. And he inspired Russian our Chowdhry, who stabbed the

:17:27.:17:33.

London MP Stephen Timms at his constituency in 2010. Ifan a fist

:17:33.:17:39.

comes to you and says give me prove that God exists, -- Ifan a feast.

:17:39.:17:45.

You say that you exist. Pish -- if an atheist or stop he enjoyed a

:17:45.:17:50.

devoted following worldwide. American and British Muslims after

:17:50.:17:56.

he moved to the UK in 2002. He spoke here at the East London

:17:56.:18:00.

Mosque in December 2003. During the two years or so that al-Awlaki

:18:00.:18:04.

spent in Britain, he was in great demand as a speaker at Islamic

:18:04.:18:11.

events. The group's hosting him did not support extremism. This London

:18:11.:18:14.

mosques -- this London Mosque actively opposed it and he didn't

:18:15.:18:19.

preach violence. But he did open the eyes of at least some of his

:18:19.:18:23.

audience to a more political understanding of Islam. And while

:18:23.:18:28.

it is perfectly possible to be an Islamist without being violent, it

:18:28.:18:33.

is quite difficult in these times to be a violent Jihad the without

:18:33.:18:40.

first being an Islamist. Emphasising the divide between

:18:40.:18:43.

Muslims and the West, pushing people towards the violence,

:18:43.:18:47.

without advocating it directly, was the subject of a major study

:18:47.:18:52.

published in London. He was immensely popular. He was the face

:18:52.:18:57.

of orthodox conservative Islam in the West. He was sent all around

:18:57.:19:00.

the country, speaking that universities, packing every place

:19:00.:19:05.

he went and spoke out. A lot of the Islamic Forum's lit up with

:19:05.:19:10.

excitement when he came. He was really treated... The treated he

:19:10.:19:15.

got was unparalleled as far as Islamic preachers go. Moving to his

:19:15.:19:20.

parents' home in Yemen in 2004, he taught at this university, where

:19:20.:19:24.

Newsnight found a strong anti- Western attitudes, before later

:19:24.:19:28.

becoming prominent in the increasingly powerful local branch

:19:28.:19:32.

of Al-Qaeda. Since Osama Bin Laden's death, it has emerged that

:19:32.:19:39.

it was al-Awlaki Al-Qaeda in the Arabian prince here but wanted to

:19:39.:19:44.

increase the Western attacks -- AQAP. What we have found is that

:19:45.:19:49.

there was this the division between the old guard and the new card and

:19:49.:19:52.

al-Awlaki represented the new guard. Even though it was lower

:19:52.:19:56.

consequence, they were higher density attacks, to illustrate they

:19:56.:20:02.

were still relevant. But now Yemen appears to many to be on the verge

:20:02.:20:07.

of civil war. Split in two opposing factions and tribes after months of

:20:07.:20:11.

protests against President Ali Abdullah Saleh. Al-Awlaki is dead

:20:11.:20:15.

but the chaos in the country may mean that the remaining Al-Qaeda et

:20:15.:20:22.

fighters have more space to operate. This period of turmoil with the

:20:22.:20:26.

President is supposedly committed to transition. We have seen an

:20:26.:20:31.

enormous amount of instability and in that process, unfortunately,

:20:31.:20:38.

over 65 members of AQAP have managed to escape from prison. On

:20:38.:20:44.

the one hand, we have decapitated their leader with al-Awlaki, but we

:20:44.:20:48.

have now seen at the Asper of a number of disciples across the

:20:48.:20:58.
:20:58.:20:59.

Off and his influence will outlive him in the West. -- and.

:20:59.:21:03.

Operationally, you can say we are safe for now, but if we are talking

:21:03.:21:06.

about ideologically, that is not going to end. He has said

:21:06.:21:10.

everything he needs to say as far as convincing people to mobilise in

:21:10.:21:16.

favour of Al-Qaeda. America's drone attacks in Yemen are likely to

:21:16.:21:20.

continue, further weakening the terror network, but the struggle

:21:20.:21:26.

for hearts and minds in the Muslim world will have to continue as well.

:21:26.:21:29.

The appeal trial of Amanda Knox will come to its conclusion early

:21:29.:21:32.

next week in Perugia, when six jurors and two judges decide

:21:32.:21:36.

whether to overturn her conviction and 26-year sentence for murder. In

:21:37.:21:39.

2007, the American was found guilty - along with her boyfriend and

:21:40.:21:44.

another man - of killing British student Meredith Kercher. But

:21:44.:21:47.

during the hearing, the lawyer of the man she had originally and

:21:47.:21:50.

wrongly accused of the crime, Diya Lumumba, described her as a

:21:50.:21:56.

"demonic she-devil with a dirty soul". Has a trial that started as

:21:56.:22:06.
:22:06.:22:11.

a media circus turned into She was a diabolical satanic and

:22:11.:22:21.
:22:21.:22:25.

Not the words of some medieval Pope, but one of the lawyer's are bought

:22:25.:22:29.

in the appeal of Amanda Knox. She has been described as everything

:22:29.:22:33.

from Jessica Rabbit to a Venus in a first during the past we got caught

:22:33.:22:39.

herrings. Just calling her a murderer doesn't seem to be another

:22:39.:22:49.
:22:49.:22:56.

Today, the prosecution alleged that if her appeal were allowed, she

:22:56.:23:05.

would immediately flee the country. TRANSLATION: We know that if the

:23:05.:23:10.

verdict is overturned, there will be an immediate escape overseas. As

:23:10.:23:14.

a result, even if this is the second of a three-step legal

:23:14.:23:19.

process in Italy, it is up to you to ensure that justice -- ensure

:23:19.:23:25.

justice. Amanda Knox claims the murder was carried out by Rudy

:23:25.:23:31.

Hermann Guede ape from the Ivory Coast on his own. He has also been

:23:31.:23:35.

convicted of the murder. -- from the Ivory Coast. Will we will find

:23:35.:23:39.

out the verdict on Monday, but guilty or not, what does her

:23:39.:23:42.

depiction in the media and now the court as some kind of modern-day

:23:42.:23:45.

witch say of misogyny in modern-day Italy?

:23:45.:23:48.

I'm joined now by author and feminist commentator Joan Smith and

:23:48.:23:50.

Annalisa Piras, the London correspondent for Italian news

:23:50.:23:54.

magazine L'Espresso. Welcome to you both. Just to

:23:54.:23:58.

clarify, we are not really talking about the innocence or guilt of

:23:58.:24:05.

Amanda Knox. But we have seen some of the words used there. You could

:24:05.:24:10.

just say it is a pretty normal case of a lawyer trying to influence the

:24:10.:24:15.

case, could ensue? I think it is the culmination of a pro -- process

:24:15.:24:20.

that has been going on since 2007. It is a really horrible murder of a

:24:20.:24:24.

young woman and the whole case has got completely messed up by the

:24:24.:24:28.

focus on Amanda Knox. After all, three people have been convicted of

:24:28.:24:33.

different things in relation to this murder. We hear enough --

:24:33.:24:36.

almost nothing about the two men involved and what has happened is,

:24:36.:24:40.

I think normally in cases like this, you get a sense of what actually

:24:40.:24:43.

happened. I think it has been completely impossible from the

:24:43.:24:47.

start to get a sense in this case because of the focus on one woman,

:24:47.:24:52.

who is a foreigner, who is pretty and obviously quite sexual, and

:24:52.:24:56.

that has muddied the entire case. Do you think this is specific to

:24:56.:25:02.

the culture in which the trial is taking case? Or is this what we do

:25:02.:25:07.

to all alleged women killers? is always a fascination with any

:25:07.:25:11.

crime which involves a man and a woman, or more than one murderer.

:25:11.:25:15.

If there is a woman involved, the focus tends to be on her rather

:25:15.:25:19.

than the male perpetrators. I think also you have to remember that

:25:19.:25:23.

Italian culture, particularly popular culture, is incredibly

:25:23.:25:27.

sexist and women are centralised all the time and it has a prime

:25:27.:25:30.

minister who seems to describe himself as a part-time Prime

:25:30.:25:33.

Minister because he is so interested in his sex life. That is

:25:33.:25:37.

very much to the detriment of women because it portrays them as sexual

:25:37.:25:40.

creatures and whenever they are portrayed primarily as that, they

:25:40.:25:44.

get punished for it with this kind of rhetoric about witchcraft and

:25:44.:25:51.

last. Is that too profound to make this into a Berlusconi's it to

:25:51.:25:58.

leave...? -- Italy. I think it is quite clear that it is not a

:25:58.:26:03.

country for women. He has brought back a very chauvinistic and Mrs

:26:03.:26:08.

Dot -- misogynistic attitude towards women, dividing them into

:26:08.:26:16.

Madonna, Hall and which. Amanda Knox has fallen into the last

:26:16.:26:21.

category. On top of that, she is also American. That goes deeper

:26:21.:26:25.

into the Italian male Psyche, because in the Second World War,

:26:25.:26:29.

when the British and American women arrived, there is this image of

:26:29.:26:34.

these terrifying, liberated sexual woman that is not controllable but

:26:34.:26:39.

is incredibly attractive. Before we make this into a sob story, and she

:26:39.:26:45.

is not the real victim here at all, Meredith Kercher is, Jessica

:26:45.:26:49.

Rabbit? That is a quote used by her own defence lawyer. It works both

:26:50.:26:55.

ways. That is my point, it is actually impossible to work out who

:26:55.:27:00.

the real demand a Knox is in this trial. -- Amanda Knox is in this

:27:00.:27:04.

trial. But these are a generation of women who have been posting

:27:04.:27:08.

personal things about themselves on internet website and a huge deal

:27:08.:27:13.

has been made about what she posted on a social website. That is the

:27:13.:27:17.

kind of thing that young men and young women do it without thinking

:27:17.:27:22.

about what it would look like it in a highly publicised trial. You have

:27:22.:27:26.

to remember that the extraordinary accusation this week is that women

:27:26.:27:31.

are dressed -- driven by lust and our sex-crazed, that was kind of a

:27:31.:27:38.

pact with the devil. It is medieval. It goes back to 1486 and the

:27:38.:27:44.

publication of the Hammer at of witches. Most of that book inspired

:27:44.:27:49.

incredible scenes across Europe and ended in the deaths of thousands of

:27:50.:27:54.

its innocent people. All that was because women cannot be trusted

:27:54.:27:57.

because they are defective compared to men and are untrustworthy and

:27:57.:28:01.

all of that is coming out in the trial. The wider question is that

:28:01.:28:05.

whatever the verdict now, will there be a suspicion that somehow

:28:05.:28:10.

it has been influenced by the way this trial has been run? I guess

:28:10.:28:14.

that is impossible to avoid. There has been such a phenomenal media

:28:14.:28:19.

attention, and there has been all of these stereotypes are thrown at

:28:19.:28:26.

had, it is difficult to say they jury will not be influenced. On the

:28:26.:28:29.

other hand, I trust the final verdict will take into account

:28:29.:28:35.

everything that has been put on the table, the reliability of the Pru

:28:35.:28:39.

found the evidence and her behaviour and so on. -- prove, and

:28:39.:28:47.

the evidence. And nothing she will get a lesser conviction that she

:28:47.:28:51.

has now. -- I think. I think it does a disservice to everyone in

:28:51.:28:57.

the trial, including the victim, to turn a forensic forum into a witch

:28:57.:29:02.

hunt like this. Thank you very much. Let's take you

:29:02.:29:06.

through the papers. I mentioned the story in the Daily Telegraph. Just

:29:06.:29:10.

there to talk you through this. George Osborne says he is a

:29:10.:29:14.

conservative who believes in the Lower taxes but not finding them by

:29:15.:29:19.

borrowing more, so it is highly cautious on whether there will be

:29:19.:29:23.

tax cuts in the next -- before the next election.

:29:23.:29:27.

The Tories despairing over Cameron growth plans.

:29:27.:29:37.

The Daily Mail, the revolt over EU benefits. And at how the city

:29:37.:29:39.

bankrolls the Conservatives. That's all from Newsnight tonight,

:29:39.:29:42.

In-depth investigation and analysis of the stories behind the day's headlines with Emily Maitlis.

In his conference speech Ed Miliband condemned 'predatory businesses', but what is wrong with a bit of predatory capitalism if the net result improves our lot?


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