Browse content similar to 12/06/2012. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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The United States believes the Russians are sending military | :00:12. | :00:14. | |
helicopters to Syria. The Secretary of State's warning came this | :00:14. | :00:19. | |
evening. We are concerned about the latest | :00:19. | :00:24. | |
information we have that there are attack helicopters on the way from | :00:24. | :00:29. | |
Russia to Syria. Which will escalate the conflict quite | :00:29. | :00:33. | |
dramatically. At least 50 people are said to have died in Syria | :00:33. | :00:37. | |
today. What will this intervention do to what the UN now calls a "full | :00:37. | :00:42. | |
scale civil war ". Brussels plans a system to link all | :00:42. | :00:47. | |
the banks of Europe to make the eurozone secure. Paul Mason is in | :00:47. | :00:49. | |
Athens. Locking Europe's banking systems | :00:49. | :00:53. | |
together, might save this place, but it would change Britain's | :00:53. | :00:56. | |
relationship with the continent forever. | :00:56. | :01:00. | |
Could such an institution save a currency in such deep trouble that | :01:00. | :01:03. | |
George Osborne today openly discussed the benefits of a Greek | :01:03. | :01:09. | |
exit. We will hear from Berlin, Strasbourg and from London. | :01:09. | :01:13. | |
The Lib Dem leader contradicts Cameron and tells his cabinet | :01:13. | :01:16. | |
colleague, the Culture Secretary, you're on your own in tomorrow's | :01:16. | :01:20. | |
vote in the House of Commons. A former Prime Minister discloses the | :01:20. | :01:24. | |
price Murdoch sought for his endorsement. He wished me to change | :01:24. | :01:28. | |
our European policies. If we couldn't change our European | :01:28. | :01:32. | |
policies, his papers could not and would not support the Conservative | :01:32. | :01:37. | |
Government. Also, a stand-off with one of Britain's most violent young | :01:37. | :01:42. | |
offenders in his new �20,000 cell. We go inside the wing where they | :01:42. | :01:52. | |
:01:52. | :01:54. | ||
handle the most violent teenagers in British jails. | :01:54. | :01:59. | |
It is only a belief, a suspicion, an accusation, but it is a Sirius | :01:59. | :02:03. | |
one. The Russians are shipping attack helicopters to support | :02:03. | :02:07. | |
President Al-Assad in Syria, according to the US Secretary of | :02:07. | :02:11. | |
State Hillary Clinton tonight. If if she didn't look or sound like a | :02:11. | :02:17. | |
woman warning of world war III, if did sound like the bad old days of | :02:17. | :02:21. | |
the Cold War. This, on day when the UN head of peacekeeping said the | :02:21. | :02:23. | |
conflict was now full scale civil war. | :02:23. | :02:28. | |
Our diplomatic editor Mark Urban is here. How did this revelation come | :02:28. | :02:32. | |
about? A bit of a bolt from a blue. The Israeli President was on a | :02:32. | :02:35. | |
visit to Washington. He and the Secretary of State did an event, | :02:35. | :02:42. | |
and she was asked about the issue of Russian arms supplies. We have | :02:42. | :02:47. | |
confronted the Russians about stopping their continued arms | :02:47. | :02:53. | |
shipments to Syria. They have, from time to time, said that we | :02:53. | :02:59. | |
shouldn't worry, everything they are shipping is unrelated to their | :02:59. | :03:06. | |
actions internally. That's patently untrue. And we are concerned about | :03:06. | :03:10. | |
the latest information we have, that there are attack helicopters | :03:10. | :03:16. | |
on the way from Russia to Syria. Which will escalate the conflict | :03:16. | :03:20. | |
quite dramatically. Do you think it will escalate the | :03:20. | :03:24. | |
conflict dramatically, as she puts it? I don't think it would, no. It | :03:24. | :03:29. | |
is an exaggeration. Bear in mind that Syria already has something | :03:29. | :03:33. | |
approaching 200 Russian-made helicopters, about half of them | :03:33. | :03:36. | |
armed or gunship helicopters. They have been filmed. This footage, | :03:36. | :03:46. | |
:03:46. | :03:47. | ||
taken by the BBC, in northern Syria, of this Mil-17-Hip, machining | :03:47. | :03:54. | |
gunning positions of the Syrian national army. Other pictures show | :03:54. | :04:00. | |
these helicopters firing rockets at the ground. This confronts the | :04:00. | :04:05. | |
Russian lie that these are not being used on the civilians in | :04:05. | :04:11. | |
military operations. The close- range nasty intercommunal violence | :04:11. | :04:15. | |
with militia groups and other murder gangs going around stirring | :04:15. | :04:23. | |
it all up is the issue. It is an escalation on the diplomatic level, | :04:23. | :04:29. | |
the US trying to push yau, into a more robust line. We have seen a | :04:29. | :04:33. | |
lot of information published about Russian ships docking in ports, | :04:33. | :04:37. | |
delivering Syrian arms. It is all campaign to put pressure on the | :04:37. | :04:42. | |
Russians, in particular. What is the Russian game in this? It is a | :04:42. | :04:45. | |
big geopolitical thing. As far as they are concerned they say they | :04:45. | :04:48. | |
have no interest in the survival of the Al-Assad regime, per se, that | :04:48. | :04:51. | |
is the line they have used in recent weeks. They do seem to feel | :04:51. | :04:55. | |
that this group of people around them, many of them Russian-trained | :04:55. | :04:59. | |
generals, and people who they have cult vailted for many years around | :04:59. | :05:04. | |
him, -- cultivated for many years around him, are national interest, | :05:04. | :05:09. | |
they should stay in power as a bulwark against Saudi and Sunni | :05:09. | :05:14. | |
forces, they would see as taking over there. | :05:14. | :05:18. | |
We have the director of the Middle East centre in the LSE, and our | :05:18. | :05:28. | |
guest from waarken to, the director of the Euraisa group's Russian team. | :05:28. | :05:35. | |
What do you think President Putin's reaction is likely to be to this | :05:35. | :05:38. | |
ultimatum, threat or menace from Hillary Clinton? He won't be very | :05:38. | :05:43. | |
happy. Mr Putin, who I have met a few times, is a tough customer. He | :05:43. | :05:48. | |
will not be shamed, he doesn't mind being named. He will just put his | :05:48. | :05:54. | |
next foot forward. I think we have a bit of a stand-off here now. | :05:54. | :05:59. | |
does it seem from a Middle East point of view, this is not new this | :05:59. | :06:02. | |
Russian arms supply to Syria. At this point it seems a strange thing | :06:02. | :06:07. | |
for the ruarks to do, doesn't it? Not at -- The Russians to do, | :06:07. | :06:14. | |
doesn't it? Not at all, Russia is the main supplier for Syrian arms, | :06:14. | :06:19. | |
helicopters, jets, tanks and what have you. As your guest has just | :06:19. | :06:23. | |
said, Syria has scores of armed helicopters. Syria has no shortage | :06:23. | :06:29. | |
of armed helicopters. Syria has utilised armed helicopters, and in | :06:29. | :06:33. | |
the last few days, extensively. I think Clinton's statement, and this | :06:33. | :06:38. | |
is the point, is designed to exert more pressure on the Russian | :06:39. | :06:42. | |
leadership in order to stop supporting the Al-Assad regime. In | :06:42. | :06:46. | |
fact, statement itself testifies to the fact that the Obama | :06:46. | :06:52. | |
administration, as you know, has been trying to co-opt the Russians | :06:53. | :06:56. | |
to get a Security Council resolution and exert more sanctions | :06:56. | :07:01. | |
on Syria and the threat of force. It seems to me a rift has developed | :07:01. | :07:07. | |
between Washington and Russia. The second point, that hasn't received | :07:07. | :07:10. | |
any attention, Clinton warned the Syrian leadership against massing | :07:10. | :07:17. | |
groups in Alapo, that is a city that faces Turkey. This tells but | :07:17. | :07:21. | |
the implications, the potential that the Syrian conflict could | :07:21. | :07:25. | |
merge into a region-wide conflict. Syria has already become a | :07:25. | :07:29. | |
battleground, a war for proxy for regional players and we are seeing | :07:29. | :07:32. | |
the Russians and the Americans clashing over Syria at this point. | :07:32. | :07:36. | |
Does this seem to you to be a purely diplomatic manoeuvre that is | :07:36. | :07:41. | |
being engaged in here? Not really. It doesn't to me. I have a | :07:41. | :07:44. | |
different take than your other guest. I think it is a real big | :07:44. | :07:49. | |
deal when a global power sends attack helicopters on the very same | :07:49. | :07:55. | |
day the UN use the words "civil war" for the first time. On the | :07:55. | :08:00. | |
same day that a report documenting unspeakable atrocities has come out. | :08:00. | :08:04. | |
This is direct intervention in a military conflict by Russia. Now, | :08:04. | :08:10. | |
yes, there is stand-off, there is a diplomatic stand-off going on here. | :08:10. | :08:14. | |
But I think it is more than that. I think the Russian, I think the | :08:14. | :08:22. | |
secretary was right in calling it escalatory. How do you think, you | :08:22. | :08:27. | |
don't think this could evolve into any kind of military confrontation | :08:27. | :08:31. | |
between the two great powers, do you? Ironically an American general | :08:31. | :08:36. | |
was asked today why the Americans, the American military does not | :08:36. | :08:40. | |
really stop the shipment of Russian arms into Syria, his answer was, | :08:40. | :08:43. | |
well the administration has not made a decision to basically stop | :08:43. | :08:48. | |
the shipments. He said the question is not whether Syria receives arms, | :08:48. | :08:52. | |
the question is what does Assad do with the arms. The reality is, we | :08:52. | :08:59. | |
do have a stand-off, between Russia and the United States, and the | :08:59. | :09:04. | |
Russian-American rivalry over Syria has really exacerbated the Syrian | :09:04. | :09:08. | |
conflict. There is no doubt that Russia's support for Syria has | :09:08. | :09:12. | |
emboldened the Assad regime, and allowed him to do what has been | :09:12. | :09:17. | |
doing for the last 14 months. Are we closer to any outside | :09:17. | :09:22. | |
intervention in Syria? I doesn't doubt it very much. There is no | :09:22. | :09:24. | |
political will, on the part of the United States or the international | :09:24. | :09:29. | |
community, to intervene in Syria. The consensus in Washington is | :09:29. | :09:32. | |
military intervention would exacerbate an already dangerous | :09:32. | :09:37. | |
situation, and would turn into a region-wide conflict. Where | :09:37. | :09:42. | |
Hezbollah, Iran and Saudi Arabia would become involved, and also the | :09:42. | :09:49. | |
spill over into neighbouring countries, particularly Lebanon. | :09:49. | :09:52. | |
are led to believe then that these are rather hollow words by the | :09:52. | :09:56. | |
Secretary of State? I don't think they are hollow words, I think it | :09:56. | :10:01. | |
is a shot across the bough to Russia to stand down. There are | :10:01. | :10:05. | |
ways across this, the President of Yemen where the Dayton accords and | :10:06. | :10:11. | |
the power-sharing agreements in the Balkan agreement, there are -- the | :10:11. | :10:16. | |
Balkan conflict, there are model, but the Russians have to stop | :10:16. | :10:19. | |
saying no to everything. Which is there policy. I think this is | :10:20. | :10:26. | |
running through the hole and call your bluff, and make you play a | :10:26. | :10:34. | |
constructive game rather than an obfuscating role. You think that Mr | :10:34. | :10:43. | |
Putin is person who might take that opportunity? To Play a more | :10:43. | :10:47. | |
constructive game. Yes. Not when he has been caught shipping attack | :10:47. | :10:53. | |
helicopters over to Syria. I think when they take on more wart he, | :10:53. | :11:01. | |
taking bad press -- more water, taking bad press throughout the | :11:01. | :11:04. | |
world. The Secretary of State was right to call him out today. Things | :11:04. | :11:08. | |
are looking worse and worse in Syria? Absolutely. I think that | :11:08. | :11:13. | |
Syria is nearing the end of the point of no return. It is nearing | :11:13. | :11:17. | |
the tipping point. Syria reminds me of Lebanon during the first phase | :11:17. | :11:27. | |
of the 1975-1976 war. Massacres, assassination, car bombings, | :11:27. | :11:33. | |
neighbours turning against neighbours, communities against | :11:33. | :11:36. | |
communities. In Syria the Syrian Government is losing control of | :11:36. | :11:41. | |
areas of Syria, and losing its monopoly on the use of force. That | :11:41. | :11:49. | |
is Sirius situation. There is plan to safety trembling | :11:49. | :11:53. | |
banks of Europe, and therefore the euro. It is said to approve a first | :11:53. | :11:58. | |
stage of a banking ewe union in the eurozone at a summit this summer. | :11:58. | :12:02. | |
The British Government said it supports the scheme, yet earlier | :12:03. | :12:06. | |
today the Chancellor of the Exchequer was wondering aloud if it | :12:06. | :12:09. | |
would take the departure of Greece for the Germans to sign up for the | :12:09. | :12:14. | |
scheme. Something more is need for the bail out of troubled Spanish | :12:14. | :12:17. | |
banks, that was supposed to restore confidence there and didn't | :12:17. | :12:19. | |
convince the international money markets today. Last night Paul | :12:19. | :12:27. | |
Mason was in Madrid, on his no so grand tour, tonight he's in Athens. | :12:27. | :12:30. | |
Here in Athens we are in the last few days of a very important | :12:30. | :12:33. | |
election campaign. Opinion polls are banned. But it feels to me, | :12:33. | :12:38. | |
having been here half a day, speaking to contacts and ordinary | :12:38. | :12:43. | |
people, it is still 50-50 whether the Conservatives win this or the | :12:43. | :12:49. | |
far left party, Syriza. If they win, as their leader, Alexis Tsipras | :12:49. | :12:54. | |
said today, a new era starts on Monday. They scrap the bail out | :12:54. | :12:58. | |
conditions and throw the ball back into the European Union's court. | :12:58. | :13:02. | |
The old era is looking dodge year, the Spanish debt costs today rose | :13:02. | :13:06. | |
to their highest-ever in the eurozone, nudging the point of | :13:06. | :13:10. | |
uncontrollability, despite the bail out. So, what we have seen is bait | :13:10. | :13:14. | |
of choreography from the called mass Masters of the Universe, the | :13:14. | :13:20. | |
people supposed to run the whole system. Finally Doug a bit less | :13:20. | :13:24. | |
running and floundering, with this proposal of a banking union in | :13:24. | :13:30. | |
Europe, in the form of a plan from Mr Barroso. The eurocrisis needs a | :13:30. | :13:34. | |
circuit breaker. For months the leaders have struggled to find one. | :13:34. | :13:37. | |
The President of the European Commission proposed a European | :13:37. | :13:44. | |
banking union. He wants to flip the switch, sharpish. The commission in | :13:44. | :13:47. | |
this debate will be for a structured and ambitious approach, | :13:47. | :13:53. | |
that may include what you can call a banking union. Some elements of | :13:53. | :13:57. | |
this banking union will be more integrated financial supervision, | :13:57. | :14:02. | |
and also more integrated deposit guarnantees. And I think it is | :14:02. | :14:07. | |
important we have this long-term vision about more Europe. Here is a | :14:07. | :14:11. | |
clue to the size of the problem, when the European Central Bank lent | :14:11. | :14:15. | |
over a trillion euros to EU banks on rather favourable terms a few | :14:15. | :14:19. | |
months ago, there was no shortage of takers. We don't know the exact | :14:19. | :14:23. | |
figures, or participant, we found out quite a bit about the health of | :14:23. | :14:29. | |
the sector. Banks in Austria, Netherlands, Ireland, Denmark, | :14:29. | :14:33. | |
Britain and Spain. Barroso's plan involves moving rapidly towards a | :14:33. | :14:37. | |
common supervision system, and a common bail out fund, raised | :14:37. | :14:42. | |
through a levy on the banks themselves. Deeper reforms, like a | :14:42. | :14:46. | |
common deposit guarnantee and formal commitment to tax-payers to | :14:46. | :14:50. | |
fund cross-border bail out, would require a treaty change. But, says | :14:51. | :14:54. | |
Mr Barroso, the first phase could be agreed at the European Council, | :14:54. | :14:59. | |
this month, and implemented as early as January 1st next year. The | :14:59. | :15:03. | |
plan comes as the focus of the euro crisis has switched from | :15:03. | :15:08. | |
Governments struggling to borrow, to banks struggling to stay solvent | :15:08. | :15:12. | |
as losses on property loans mount, and billions of euros fly out of | :15:12. | :15:17. | |
the system to safe havens. Germany has already signalled its | :15:17. | :15:21. | |
support for common supervision, and Newsnight understands, Angela | :15:21. | :15:25. | |
Merkel is now ready to sign up to the first phase of a banking union | :15:25. | :15:29. | |
at the European Summit. The plan comes as the focus of the | :15:29. | :15:32. | |
eurocrisis has switched from Governments struggling to borrow, | :15:33. | :15:36. | |
to banks struggling to stay solvent as losses on property loans mount | :15:36. | :15:42. | |
and billions of euros fly out of the system to safe havens. | :15:42. | :15:47. | |
TRANSLATION: We do want Europe, we do want more Europe, but I want a | :15:47. | :15:51. | |
Europe in which it is always made certain that joint accountability | :15:51. | :15:57. | |
and joint control are always in one hand. There is a near consensus | :15:57. | :16:01. | |
amongst political leaders in Germany, business leaders, and | :16:01. | :16:06. | |
indeed senior bankers, and top officials, that the answer to the | :16:07. | :16:12. | |
eurozone crisis is more Europe, loosely defined, more integration. | :16:12. | :16:17. | |
Almost nobody is saying the reverse. There are one or two people in the | :16:18. | :16:23. | |
Bundesbank, who are not in favour and would be happy if it broke up. | :16:23. | :16:28. | |
And one 0 two maverick euro-sceptic academics saying the euro is bad | :16:28. | :16:32. | |
for Germany, they are very isolated. Britain has signalled its support | :16:32. | :16:36. | |
for the plan, agreed last week at the called quad of senior ministers | :16:36. | :16:40. | |
and at the cabinet today. But the UK will stay out of the union. Veto | :16:40. | :16:45. | |
any attempt to impose it beyond the eurozone, and insist on a | :16:45. | :16:50. | |
strengthened single market for financial services across the 27EU | :16:50. | :16:54. | |
countries, protecting the City of London. | :16:54. | :16:59. | |
Ever since the euro crisis started here in Greece, the focus has been | :16:59. | :17:03. | |
on bailing out countries, now the focus is definitely on bailing out | :17:03. | :17:07. | |
banks. Because money is flowing out of the system here and out of other | :17:07. | :17:10. | |
stressed peripheral economies. But the banking union, as a solution, | :17:10. | :17:16. | |
poses the question, point blank, who is in, and who is out? | :17:16. | :17:21. | |
But the circuit breaker might come too late. On Sunday Greece votes, | :17:21. | :17:26. | |
the left, Syriza, stands a chance of winning, and it would cancel the | :17:26. | :17:29. | |
austerity programme demanded during the write-off of the country's | :17:29. | :17:33. | |
debts. In any case, some think there are big problems with the | :17:33. | :17:41. | |
whole concept of the banking union. I think it is quite easy to levy a | :17:41. | :17:44. | |
criticism at European politicians and commissioners and say they are | :17:44. | :17:49. | |
just trying to do union of any description, because that's their | :17:49. | :17:53. | |
agenda and actually it is putting all Europe's sovereign invalids | :17:53. | :17:59. | |
together, which isn't going to make the situation better for anyone. I | :17:59. | :18:09. | |
:18:09. | :18:10. | ||
think that is a mistaken view on it. And taken by euro-sceptics, the key | :18:10. | :18:13. | |
to the euro-system survival is integration or bust, there is very | :18:13. | :18:18. | |
little inbetween. Meanwhile, this is a scene from the | :18:18. | :18:24. | |
Europe they are trying to save. Miners in the Spanish provinces, | :18:24. | :18:28. | |
protesting about job losses, after the Government withdrew their | :18:28. | :18:35. | |
supsidies. Europe can at least measure its | :18:35. | :18:40. | |
banking and bond risks in tenths of one per cent. The social risks of | :18:40. | :18:47. | |
failure are, in some parts of southern Europe, off the scale. | :18:47. | :18:51. | |
Paul's still in Athens. Are the Germans likely to fall for this | :18:51. | :18:57. | |
scheme. Mr Barroso wouldn't have made the point so strongly today, | :18:57. | :19:03. | |
come out, with the proposal, unless he was getting big signals, and I | :19:03. | :19:07. | |
understand he is, from the CDU, from Merkel's Government, that they | :19:07. | :19:13. | |
are going to support phase 1, the du doable bit that they can decide | :19:13. | :19:18. | |
at the end of the month of banking union, likewise voices in the ECB | :19:18. | :19:22. | |
are being put behind that. There is a theory out there, among people | :19:22. | :19:25. | |
close to the loop, it is a were, that the Germans are in the process | :19:25. | :19:28. | |
of deciding that the future of Europe will look like who will go | :19:28. | :19:32. | |
with them, which countries might not make it. Obviously with Mr | :19:32. | :19:35. | |
Osborne raising the possibility of Greece here not making it through | :19:35. | :19:39. | |
to the much more tightly integrated Europe that is being designed. One | :19:40. | :19:44. | |
has to hope that somebody is indeed designing the future of Europe. | :19:44. | :19:47. | |
Because day by day, as we cover this, the surface impression | :19:47. | :19:51. | |
remains that nobody is really designing much. | :19:51. | :19:57. | |
Thank you very much. Our political editor, Allegra Stratton, is here | :19:57. | :20:02. | |
today. There were some surprisingly frank words from George Osborne | :20:02. | :20:06. | |
weren't there? An American journalist once said gap is when a | :20:06. | :20:10. | |
politician speaks the truth. Today George Osborne suggested this idea | :20:10. | :20:14. | |
that he was possibly speaking off the record, but his aides are not | :20:14. | :20:18. | |
resigning from his comments, that it might be best for Germany if | :20:18. | :20:21. | |
Greece were to leave the Europe, because the German public would | :20:21. | :20:25. | |
have a greater sense of clarity of there being resolution within the | :20:25. | :20:28. | |
eurozone to deal with various countries, and Greece wasn't one of | :20:28. | :20:31. | |
those countries that was prepared to deal with it. Is this what is | :20:31. | :20:35. | |
known as being helpful? He's incredibly frustrated. Some of his | :20:35. | :20:41. | |
friends talk about his stories from some G20/eurozone meetings where | :20:41. | :20:44. | |
people are playing on their I pads rather than coming up with | :20:44. | :20:49. | |
pollution -- iPads rather than coming up with solutions. His | :20:49. | :20:54. | |
frustrations is coming through. Equally, Paul used the phrase, | :20:54. | :20:59. | |
"people close to the loop", many people don't think there is a loop | :20:59. | :21:04. | |
and people are close to the game plan. And other people saying | :21:04. | :21:07. | |
really Barroso could legislate with all these eurozone economies for | :21:07. | :21:11. | |
the beginning of January 2014, that is very quick and unlikely even | :21:11. | :21:14. | |
Barroso's plan is being met with raised eyebrows inside Government | :21:14. | :21:17. | |
right now I think there is a sense that we are hearing concrete plans, | :21:17. | :21:22. | |
but actually the likelihood of them being realised is still, very, very | :21:22. | :21:25. | |
small. One further thing, there is a growing number of people within | :21:25. | :21:28. | |
cabinet who think this entire chaos should be used as way in which to | :21:28. | :21:34. | |
back out of Europe. We might explore that later on. | :21:34. | :21:39. | |
Here also tonight we have Joe Johnson, the business ministers's | :21:39. | :21:42. | |
Parliamentary Private Secretary, an opening bowler for the House of | :21:42. | :21:45. | |
Commons cricket team. We have the chair of the European Parliament's | :21:46. | :21:49. | |
economic affairs committee in Strasbourg, and from Berlin we have | :21:49. | :21:53. | |
the head of the Berlin stock exchange. | :21:53. | :22:01. | |
Let's go to Strasbourg, do you think this is a good idea? | :22:01. | :22:05. | |
banking union? Yeah. There are elements of a good idea in it. One | :22:05. | :22:10. | |
of the things it recognises is that banking supervision has to take | :22:10. | :22:15. | |
account of what monetary policy is. So to have the ECB involved in | :22:15. | :22:19. | |
supervision of eurozone banks, and therefore taking account of | :22:19. | :22:23. | |
eurozone monetary policy in that supervision is a good idea. The | :22:23. | :22:27. | |
parallel to that is, of course, that it would mean that in the | :22:27. | :22:31. | |
United Kingdom then the Bank of England would be able to continue | :22:31. | :22:36. | |
to have some adjustment in banking supervision, in line with the | :22:36. | :22:40. | |
policies that we were setting. So there is some happy parallels there. | :22:40. | :22:44. | |
There is a lot more that we would have to do. There is concern, I | :22:44. | :22:48. | |
think, as to whether Germany actually would have all their banks | :22:48. | :22:52. | |
in it. They tend to talk about the largest banks. Let's go to Berlin | :22:52. | :23:02. | |
:23:02. | :23:03. | ||
and find out does it seem a sensible idea to you there? | :23:03. | :23:06. | |
Obviously it is feasible with having a centralised supervision, | :23:06. | :23:12. | |
most likely that will happen, but please remember we have the EAB in | :23:12. | :23:17. | |
London, there is almost something already in place. The EAC doesn't | :23:17. | :23:22. | |
have the power which is -- EAB doesn't have the power needed for | :23:22. | :23:27. | |
centralised supervision, and the ECB might be better suited to do | :23:27. | :23:31. | |
that. The second part is there should be a joint debt insurance | :23:31. | :23:36. | |
system, here I believe we first need some kind of fiscal common | :23:36. | :23:40. | |
policy. And the third bit would be some kind of institution which | :23:40. | :23:43. | |
deals with failed banks, which currently happens on national level, | :23:43. | :23:47. | |
and then should happen on a European level. The British | :23:47. | :23:53. | |
position has been that we want the euro to succeed. So we think this | :23:53. | :23:57. | |
is a good idea, do we? Britain is supportive of anything that | :23:57. | :24:02. | |
resolves the eurocrisis, and this is potentially the big bass zook ka | :24:02. | :24:08. | |
that the eurocrisis -- bazooka that the eurocrisis has been waiting for | :24:08. | :24:11. | |
years. If it resolves the crisis, Britain won't stand in the way of | :24:11. | :24:16. | |
it. We won't be part of any banking union, but we won't be part of the | :24:16. | :24:19. | |
problem. We are in favour of the eurozone taking the medicine, but | :24:20. | :24:25. | |
not taking it ourselves? Osborne has made clear he's happy for | :24:25. | :24:29. | |
eurozone countries to go ahead with banking union, but Britain would | :24:29. | :24:33. | |
want safeguards to protect British tax-payers, and to make sure that | :24:33. | :24:39. | |
the single market continues to be the property of all 27 member- | :24:39. | :24:45. | |
states. And isn't arrogated to the signatories of the Fiscal Compact | :24:45. | :24:50. | |
or members of a banking union. you think the German people be | :24:50. | :24:56. | |
prepared to see perfectly decent German banks used to prop up flakey | :24:56. | :24:59. | |
foreign banks? Only if there is a control element in it. I believe if | :25:00. | :25:07. | |
the control, the budget control has been influenced by German | :25:07. | :25:12. | |
politicians then, then the German taxpayer is willing to risk moving | :25:12. | :25:18. | |
some of its tax into banks which fail in different nations. | :25:18. | :25:23. | |
Britain would be right to worry, wouldn't they, about some of the | :25:23. | :25:27. | |
implications of an agreement like this? Yes, I think we would have to | :25:27. | :25:31. | |
get the balance right, in the model that I'm envisaging where the | :25:31. | :25:34. | |
European Central Bank does the actual supervision, or the high- | :25:35. | :25:38. | |
level supervision of the banks. There would still be the European | :25:38. | :25:42. | |
banking authority, which is in London, and that would be looking | :25:42. | :25:47. | |
after the single market side. We still would have common rules about | :25:47. | :25:51. | |
our financial services industry being able to have passports into | :25:51. | :25:55. | |
doing business in other European countries. That's not going to stop | :25:55. | :25:59. | |
and we still would have the EBA as the referee for that. We would have | :25:59. | :26:03. | |
to make sure the voting rules were changed so that the eurozone didn't | :26:03. | :26:07. | |
always outvote everybody else. I think that could quite easily be | :26:07. | :26:11. | |
done. When it comes to market infrastructure, that is talking | :26:11. | :26:19. | |
about whether you are operating in euro, it has been said by the E -- | :26:19. | :26:23. | |
ECB that they would want everything cleared by the eurozone, they don't | :26:23. | :26:27. | |
do that in the United States with dollars. We would demand that there | :26:27. | :26:29. | |
wouldn't be discrimination that have kind. That would be the single | :26:29. | :26:32. | |
most important thing for the City, and many other things flow from | :26:32. | :26:35. | |
that. Do you think that an agreement like | :26:35. | :26:41. | |
this would require revisions of European treaties? Foingsly, a | :26:41. | :26:46. | |
banking union might -- potentially, a banking union might. There are | :26:46. | :26:50. | |
many different variations of fiscal union and banking unions. Wouldn't | :26:50. | :26:53. | |
this country be committed to a referendum on membership of the | :26:53. | :26:55. | |
whole thing? The Government's position is pretty clear, it is set | :26:56. | :26:59. | |
down in legislation, if there is a transfer of powers or competences | :26:59. | :27:04. | |
away from the UK to Brussels, then that would automatically trigger a | :27:04. | :27:08. | |
referendum. But that need not necessarily apply in the case of | :27:08. | :27:13. | |
this sort of a thing? Ultimately it will be a political decision as to | :27:13. | :27:17. | |
whether closer fiscal and economic co-ordination among the eurozone | :27:17. | :27:21. | |
members or the Fiscal Compact members, which is a broader group | :27:21. | :27:24. | |
of countries, constitutes a transfer of powers from Britain. | :27:25. | :27:30. | |
Personally I think it is certainly, you can see the strengthening of a | :27:30. | :27:32. | |
group diminishes the relative standing of a country outside of | :27:32. | :27:35. | |
that group, in relation to that group. But it doesn't necessarily, | :27:36. | :27:39. | |
in legal terms, constitute a transfer of powers. It is a | :27:39. | :27:42. | |
political shift of power, not necessarily a legal one. But the | :27:42. | :27:44. | |
question of where exactly the national interest lies is a | :27:44. | :27:48. | |
difficult one, isn't it? Certainly, and Britain's national interest is | :27:48. | :27:51. | |
in resolving this eurocrisis, that is why Britain is supporting | :27:51. | :27:56. | |
measures po, tensionly, such as the banking union, that might do that. | :27:56. | :27:59. | |
The British Chancellor today, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, said | :27:59. | :28:06. | |
that it might require a Greek exit to make Germany take the crisis | :28:06. | :28:11. | |
sufficiently seriously how does that play in Germany? We call this | :28:11. | :28:15. | |
a Lehmans event. There is actually discussion in Germany if it might | :28:15. | :28:21. | |
be a healthy thing to go through an exercise like that. It is pretty | :28:22. | :28:25. | |
drastic, but I believe the eurozone could demonstrate they could | :28:25. | :28:28. | |
survive an exit of a country from the euro. That would stablise on | :28:28. | :28:32. | |
the one hand, on the other hand it would discipline everybody else. | :28:32. | :28:35. | |
I'm not sure if that is the right approach. I personally think you | :28:35. | :28:40. | |
should try everything to keep Greece in the euro, we should try | :28:40. | :28:45. | |
everything to avoid further distance between the most important | :28:45. | :28:50. | |
financial centre in Europe, which is London, from mainland Europe. I | :28:50. | :28:55. | |
think it is very important that if you have a banking union, with 25 | :28:55. | :29:00. | |
banks, or so, that we stay as close as possible to what happens in the | :29:00. | :29:04. | |
UK, because we depend in mainland on London and the City. I think the | :29:04. | :29:08. | |
other way round as well. From your point of view, supposing there were | :29:08. | :29:14. | |
this banking union, which didn't involve Britain, for obvious | :29:14. | :29:19. | |
reasons, would that be in, would it do Britain any good or not? | :29:19. | :29:24. | |
wouldn't do Britain any good, it wouldn't do Europe any good. | :29:24. | :29:30. | |
Because the financial system is very much interwoven, and having a | :29:30. | :29:34. | |
two-speed Europe is bad thing, and having two different financial | :29:34. | :29:38. | |
systems in place, might make things even worse. I can see that there | :29:38. | :29:45. | |
will be a lot of arguments coming up between banks sitting in London, | :29:45. | :29:50. | |
and banks sitting in Europe. Thank you all very much indeed. | :29:50. | :29:56. | |
Now, when Jeremy Hunt, the embattled Culture Secretary, faces | :29:56. | :29:59. | |
the House of Commons demands tomorrow that he be investigated | :29:59. | :30:02. | |
for alleged breaches of the Ministerial Code, he will do so | :30:02. | :30:07. | |
without the aid of some of his supposed allies. The Lib Dem | :30:07. | :30:12. | |
leaders has told his MPs to abstain, when the man he shares a cabinet | :30:12. | :30:17. | |
table with faces censure tomorrow. One might say with friends like | :30:17. | :30:20. | |
this...He Survived Leveson, but not the Lib Dems. They had a meeting | :30:20. | :30:23. | |
this evenings, and Nick Clegg told them to abstain on a vote tomorrow. | :30:23. | :30:29. | |
It won't be critical in terms of the Government losing the vote. But | :30:29. | :30:34. | |
it will be embarrassing, or a sign to Jeremy Hunt that his Lib Dem | :30:34. | :30:38. | |
colleagues don't support him not having been referred to Sir Alex | :30:38. | :30:42. | |
Allan who is the Prime Minister's adviser on the Code of Conduct | :30:42. | :30:46. | |
issues. Is it surprising that Nick Clegg is behaving like this, or is | :30:46. | :30:51. | |
he leading from the back? It is not surprising, he's supposed to have | :30:51. | :30:54. | |
raised these issues with David Cameron many times in private, and | :30:54. | :30:58. | |
indeed, his MPs have made careers out of these sort of probity issues. | :30:58. | :31:03. | |
It is not surprising, it is very, very irritating for Tory MPs, | :31:03. | :31:08. | |
possibly like Joe Johnson, but more discreet than Joe Johnson, who feel | :31:08. | :31:12. | |
they have been ordered back. One person has come back from honeymoon | :31:12. | :31:17. | |
to vote in favour of the Government, and alongside Jeremy Hunt tomorrow | :31:17. | :31:21. | |
afternoon, and then they learn their coalition colleagues are | :31:21. | :31:25. | |
abstaining. It stores up this feeling that the Lib Dems are | :31:25. | :31:28. | |
allowed to do what their consciences says but the Tories | :31:28. | :31:33. | |
can't. There is elements of the Jeremy Hunt that upsets Tory | :31:33. | :31:36. | |
backbenchers, but it is also about coalition relationships getting | :31:36. | :31:41. | |
more difficult. What do you feel about it, Joe Johnson? Jeremy Hunt | :31:41. | :31:43. | |
has the confidence of the Prime Minister and the parliamentary | :31:43. | :31:47. | |
party. Tomorrow's vote should be mechanical and over quickly. What | :31:47. | :31:51. | |
do you think about the Lib Dems abstaining? It is something for | :31:51. | :31:54. | |
them to explain. Frankly Jeremy Hunt has the confidence of the | :31:54. | :31:58. | |
Government and the Prime Minister, and parliamentary party, and | :31:58. | :32:02. | |
everybody wishes him the best of luck into the olympics. You are | :32:02. | :32:05. | |
more discreet than the people Allegra Stratton has been talking | :32:05. | :32:08. | |
Earlier today it was the turn of the former Prime Minister, John | :32:08. | :32:14. | |
Major, to appear at Leveson, it turned into an awkward session for | :32:14. | :32:18. | |
Rupert Murdoch. David Grossman looked on. By his own admission, | :32:18. | :32:20. | |
John Major cared too much about what the press wrote about him. It | :32:20. | :32:25. | |
was natural, he explained, to get a bit raty, when his policies, like | :32:25. | :32:32. | |
"back to basics ", were, he said, willfully misrepresented. I wear by | :32:32. | :32:36. | |
almighty God...We Did get an and very interesting anecdote of a | :32:36. | :32:39. | |
dinner before the 1997 election, where, Rupert Murdoch, apparently, | :32:40. | :32:44. | |
sought to change the Major Government's policy on Europe. | :32:45. | :32:47. | |
Murdoch said that he really didn't like our European policies, this | :32:47. | :32:53. | |
was no surprise to me. That he didn't like our European policies, | :32:53. | :32:57. | |
and he wished me to change our European policies. If we couldn't | :32:58. | :33:02. | |
change our European policies, his papers could not and would not | :33:02. | :33:08. | |
support the Conservative Government. As I recall, he used the word "we", | :33:08. | :33:14. | |
when referring to his newspapers. He didn't make the usual nod | :33:14. | :33:19. | |
towards editoral independence. this point there was a collective | :33:19. | :33:23. | |
"aha" from those watching. Afterall Rupert Murdoch had previously told | :33:23. | :33:27. | |
the inquiry this. I have never asked a Prime Minister for anything. | :33:27. | :33:31. | |
Mr Murdoch's supporters say he was talking there about asking prime | :33:31. | :33:36. | |
ministers for personal or commercial favours. Changing | :33:36. | :33:40. | |
Government policy is another matter. Afterall, more or less every | :33:40. | :33:43. | |
newspaper seeks to change Government policy, more or less | :33:43. | :33:48. | |
every day. Although, not always in that sort of face-to-face personal | :33:48. | :33:51. | |
way. It is not very often someone sits in front of a Prime Minister | :33:51. | :33:55. | |
and says to a Prime Minister, I would like you to change your | :33:55. | :34:00. | |
policy. If you don't change your policy, my organisation cannot | :34:00. | :34:04. | |
support you. So it is unlikely to be something I | :34:04. | :34:09. | |
would have forgotten. John Major then went on to accuse former | :34:09. | :34:14. | |
advisers of Gordon Brown of lying about him to the press, on not one | :34:14. | :34:20. | |
but two occasions. Firstly, saying both he and Norman Lamont were | :34:20. | :34:23. | |
trying to prevent publication of documents relating to Black | :34:23. | :34:27. | |
Wednesday, and on a second occasion, that he had tried to prevent Robert | :34:27. | :34:32. | |
Mugabe being striped of his Knighthood. In fact, Sir John said, | :34:32. | :34:35. | |
he was so angry about what had happened, he wrote to the then | :34:35. | :34:45. | |
:34:45. | :35:04. | ||
cabinet secretary about it. In the I regarded the behaviour that | :35:04. | :35:09. | |
Norman Lamont and I, in the first instance, and me in the second, had | :35:09. | :35:12. | |
suffered, as being absolutely dishonest and dishonourable. I | :35:12. | :35:15. | |
suppose we're big enough to take t but it seemed to me, from what I | :35:15. | :35:18. | |
heard, it was happening to lots of other people as well. In terms of | :35:18. | :35:22. | |
this direct briefing against people. I thought it was time that there | :35:22. | :35:26. | |
should be no doubt that the Prime Minister knew about it. Ed Miliband | :35:26. | :35:31. | |
was next up, giving evidence. He, of course, was once one of Gordon | :35:32. | :35:36. | |
Brown's advisers, although not one who briefed the press. He was, | :35:36. | :35:41. | |
though, asked about the then advisers who did? Were you aware of | :35:41. | :35:44. | |
off the record briefings against Tony Blair and other Government | :35:44. | :35:53. | |
ministers by, in particular, Ed Balls, Charley Whelan, and Damian | :35:53. | :35:59. | |
McBride? Let me answer that specifically, Ed Balls, no, Charley | :35:59. | :36:03. | |
Whelan left the Government in 1999. One of the reasons he left was | :36:03. | :36:06. | |
because of his style of operation. I can't point you to direct | :36:06. | :36:11. | |
evidence, but I would say one of the things he did, was he briefed. | :36:11. | :36:14. | |
Including potentially against people who were in the Government. | :36:14. | :36:21. | |
On Damian McBride, when I was a cabinet minister, I did raise a | :36:21. | :36:27. | |
specific concern that I had with Mr Brown, I believe in September 2008, | :36:27. | :36:32. | |
about some of Mr McBride's activities. | :36:32. | :36:36. | |
Mr Brown, of course, yesterday told the inquiry, that he didn't | :36:36. | :36:40. | |
authorise any briefings against John Major, Tony Blair or indeed | :36:40. | :36:44. | |
anyone else. Today, his successor as Labour leader told the inquiry | :36:44. | :36:49. | |
that part of the problem has been the size of Rupert Murdoch's | :36:50. | :36:55. | |
newspaper operation. I don't believe that one person should | :36:55. | :37:05. | |
:37:05. | :37:06. | ||
continue to control 37%, or now 34% of the newspaper market. My strong | :37:06. | :37:12. | |
instinct is that's too much. And I would like to see, I submit, that I | :37:12. | :37:15. | |
would like to see the inquiry looking at the question as to | :37:16. | :37:20. | |
whether we should have lower limits. Tomorrow the inquiry will be | :37:20. | :37:23. | |
hearing from Alex Salmond and Nick Clegg, before hearing from the | :37:23. | :37:29. | |
Prime Minister on Thursday. What do you do with young | :37:29. | :37:32. | |
criminals? Bang 'em up is the usual answer from much of the population, | :37:32. | :37:36. | |
despite the fact that we know that most of them will just go on to | :37:36. | :37:41. | |
offend again. Battery farms full of bothered young people is what one | :37:41. | :37:46. | |
reform group -- bored young people is what one reform group calls | :37:46. | :37:51. | |
prison. The hardest cases can be a nightmare to manage. Now the | :37:51. | :37:54. | |
biggest young offenders prison in Europe is trying a new way of | :37:54. | :37:59. | |
dealing with these most troubled and troublesome images. In this | :37:59. | :38:09. | |
:38:09. | :38:09. | ||
report they use some strong language. | :38:09. | :38:15. | |
Beyond two walls, hundreds of yards of razor wire, and five secure | :38:15. | :38:20. | |
gates. Europe's largest youth prison. Hindley, near Wigan, is | :38:20. | :38:23. | |
home to some of the most violent and disruptive teenagers in Britain. | :38:23. | :38:31. | |
And we're the first to film inside. Two lads tried to jump me, I turned | :38:31. | :38:35. | |
around and started fighting with them. One picked up a bottle and | :38:35. | :38:40. | |
tried to hit me with it, I took it off him and smashed it around one | :38:40. | :38:46. | |
of them and put it in the other one's neck. I walked into a shop | :38:46. | :38:52. | |
with a knife, I pointed the knife at him to give me all the money. | :38:52. | :38:56. | |
Talk me through the incident? a couple of drinks with the boys | :38:56. | :39:01. | |
and that, and just got into a bit of an argument, and broke one of | :39:01. | :39:08. | |
their noses, and the police seen it. This unit inside Hindley, the | :39:08. | :39:11. | |
Willow Unit, is the first of its kind, a prison within a prison, set | :39:11. | :39:16. | |
up to take the most difficult, violent teenagers. Almost all are | :39:16. | :39:19. | |
transferred here after getting involved in fights on the sprawling | :39:19. | :39:28. | |
main wings of Hindley. Why did you do that, did you that on purpose | :39:28. | :39:34. | |
you fuckin dickhead. I hit one lad and he fell on the floor and I | :39:34. | :39:37. | |
stamped him, and I went on to another one, I sorted two people | :39:37. | :39:41. | |
and went for the third one. People want to wind you up, you have to | :39:41. | :39:45. | |
stand your ground, or people will start bullying you. Is that quite | :39:45. | :39:48. | |
important to you, the whole reputation thing? If you don't have | :39:48. | :39:51. | |
a reputation people will take you as a Muppet, if you have a | :39:52. | :39:55. | |
reputation they will ease on you a bit. If I can't beat you I will | :39:55. | :39:59. | |
come back with a weapon. We are locking up far fewer young people. | :39:59. | :40:03. | |
The number held across England and Wales has fallen by a third in five | :40:03. | :40:09. | |
years. Fewer than 3% of those in custody are now under 18. But those | :40:09. | :40:14. | |
under 18s are involved in more than 20% of all assaults in prison. | :40:14. | :40:19. | |
The main wings in Hindley are large, 60 prisoners, watched over by six | :40:19. | :40:22. | |
prison officers. It is easy for one small incident | :40:22. | :40:28. | |
to get out of hand. Willow is the first real attempt to change that. | :40:28. | :40:33. | |
A separate 11-bed unit, with three- times more staff. There to respond | :40:33. | :40:43. | |
:40:43. | :40:44. | ||
when things go wrong. (shouting) A routine search has | :40:44. | :40:48. | |
turned violent a teenager has smashed up his TV. Now he's | :40:48. | :40:57. | |
throwing himself against his cell door again and again and again. | :40:57. | :41:01. | |
Do this on the busy main wing of the prison and you disturb everyone | :41:01. | :41:06. | |
else. You make yourself a target, as soon as you step outside your | :41:06. | :41:11. | |
cell. Ryan, are you going to talk to me? Talk to me, fucking talk to | :41:11. | :41:19. | |
He has been quite problematic this morning, very threatening and | :41:19. | :41:23. | |
abusive towards staff. He doesn't like to accept any responsibility. | :41:23. | :41:28. | |
I'm not litsening to this any more, we are going around in circles and | :41:28. | :41:32. | |
getting nowhere, when you have chilled out I will come back. He | :41:32. | :41:36. | |
saw the TV had been taken out and kicked the TV and went as if he was | :41:36. | :41:39. | |
going to assault staff, so staff restrained him and returned him to | :41:39. | :41:47. | |
his room. How long until he gets to another TV? Smashing a TV is 28 | :41:47. | :41:57. | |
days. We're going into the mental health unit. How do you begin to | :41:57. | :42:00. | |
handle teenagers who slam themselves against cell doors, and | :42:00. | :42:05. | |
think nothing of attacking other prisoners? Well, to start with, you | :42:05. | :42:10. | |
put them in a chill-out room. use it for young people to do | :42:10. | :42:16. | |
relaxation, to help them, to engage. Andy Rodgers is the senior clinical | :42:16. | :42:21. | |
psychologist here, he says the main aim is to improve safety in the | :42:21. | :42:25. | |
prison. Any rehabilitation is a bonus. It is not about they are | :42:25. | :42:29. | |
skwhrus going to be better, the reality is -- just going to be | :42:29. | :42:34. | |
better, the reality is they won't be. It has taken up to 17 years to | :42:34. | :42:38. | |
get to this point, it won't take three months for them to be better. | :42:38. | :42:43. | |
But we try to break some of those cycles, I guess. Is this a reward | :42:43. | :42:47. | |
for bad behaviour, you are behaving badly, therefore, you are put in a | :42:47. | :42:51. | |
nice wing, with an XBox, and the rest of it. You want to me ask me | :42:51. | :42:57. | |
is it a soft option? Yes? Our view, very clearly, is it is not a soft | :42:57. | :43:04. | |
option. Actually, developmentally, overcare, being overly nice can be | :43:04. | :43:08. | |
as harmful as neglect in the situation. All this costs money. �2 | :43:08. | :43:14. | |
million to set up Willow. �200,000 a cell. Prison reform groups say | :43:14. | :43:17. | |
that will be far better spent taking these teenagers completely | :43:17. | :43:21. | |
out of jail. And putting them in a high-security children's home, with | :43:21. | :43:27. | |
more staff, more care, more help. This place, they say, is no long- | :43:27. | :43:37. | |
:43:37. | :43:37. | ||
term answer, just a short-term fix. Give me a tour round here? | :43:37. | :43:43. | |
Scott has been on Willow for three months now, again because of his | :43:43. | :43:47. | |
behaviour in the main prison. There's my TV, I can watch that at | :43:47. | :43:52. | |
night.'S About to finish a sentence for holding up a shop with a knife, | :43:52. | :43:58. | |
and a string of burglaries. Do you think it has made a | :43:58. | :44:02. | |
difference to you? Pretty much, I have started to behave here. I have | :44:02. | :44:09. | |
only been on basics once. You get your XBox if you start behaving, I | :44:09. | :44:15. | |
will behave for that. I don't know, out next week, so, I don't know. It | :44:15. | :44:20. | |
has gone faster in here, time. are going to get leased next week? | :44:20. | :44:25. | |
Yeah. Next Friday. Are you looking forward to it? Not really bothered. | :44:25. | :44:29. | |
At the end of the day. You are not really bothered about getting | :44:29. | :44:34. | |
released? Not really. Are you a bit worried? A bit worried, but it is | :44:34. | :44:38. | |
standard, it was only 13 month, I don't know what to expect when I | :44:38. | :44:46. | |
get out. That is the next big step, reoffending rates in youth prisons | :44:46. | :44:50. | |
are notoriously high .5% of the teenagers in Hindley will end up | :44:50. | :44:57. | |
committing another crime within a year of their release. These young | :44:57. | :45:01. | |
-- These young people here will go d'oh well never to offend when they | :45:01. | :45:11. | |
get out? -- here will do well never to offend when they get out? It is | :45:11. | :45:14. | |
better if they refrain from offending earlier than they would | :45:14. | :45:18. | |
have done if they hadn't had some of the intervention. I guess it is | :45:18. | :45:22. | |
a developmental perspective that we take. It sound like the bar is, if | :45:22. | :45:27. | |
we can get someone to hit someone lightly less than they are at the | :45:27. | :45:31. | |
moment, that is almost a prosession? That is a start. | :45:31. | :45:35. | |
-- A progression. That is a start. It is something another Willow | :45:36. | :45:40. | |
inmate has been thinking about hard. Kieran has been in and out of | :45:40. | :45:45. | |
prison since he was 15, this last time after breaking someone's nose | :45:45. | :45:48. | |
in a pub brawl. He's now packing up his stuff, and getting ready to | :45:49. | :45:54. | |
leave in a few weeks time. Do you think being in a unit like this, | :45:54. | :46:02. | |
has it taught you to control your temper a little bit more? Yes, | :46:02. | :46:07. | |
because I haven't lost it since I have been here. I take it that's a | :46:07. | :46:12. | |
good thing. But it is different when I drink, yeah, but hopefully, | :46:12. | :46:19. | |
since I have been down here, I have had more opportunity to see the | :46:19. | :46:26. | |
alcohol nurse, the alcohol misuse worker, she has given me a lot of | :46:26. | :46:29. | |
advice. It is beneficial at the end of the day. Do you think you could | :46:29. | :46:36. | |
get on top of that? Yeah. Honestly, when you are out with mates back | :46:36. | :46:40. | |
home? I'm moving into a new area, I'm trying to have a fresh start. | :46:40. | :46:45. | |
What do you think your chances are of being successful? Auto-auto. | :46:45. | :46:52. | |
What are the odds of the Willow Unit working? The Government is | :46:52. | :46:56. | |
optimistic, it now wants more of these in other prisons. At the very | :46:56. | :46:59. | |
least they could make life safer behind bars. But even the people | :46:59. | :47:04. | |
working here accept the best Willow can really hope to do, is help | :47:04. | :47:08. | |
these teenagers commit a less serious, less violent crime, next | :47:08. | :47:11. | |
time round. On tomorrow's programme we will | :47:11. | :47:17. | |
continue to explore the issue of troubled teenagers. Tim Whewell has | :47:17. | :47:21. | |
been investigating how the private care home system has left | :47:21. | :47:24. | |
vulnerable children open to abuse. Some of tomorrow morning's front | :47:24. | :47:30. | |
pages now the Guardian chooses as its lead the same story we were | :47:30. | :47:32. | |
focusing on earlier, Hillary Clinton's accusation that is the | :47:32. | :47:42. | |
:47:42. | :48:06. | ||
Russians are shipping helicopters That's all for now, for fall-out | :48:06. | :48:13. | |
from last night's draw with France in the Euro 2012 championships. The | :48:13. | :48:17. | |
England supporters' band was banned for performing by stewards in the | :48:18. | :48:23. |