15/02/2013 Newsnight


15/02/2013

Horsemeat is identified in food supplied to schools and hospitals. Plus, the director of Les Miserables on when not to burst into song. With Mishal Husain.


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Transcript


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When it comes to the food on our plates, who can we trust?

:00:12.:00:17.

Can we trust anyone? When schools and hospitals serve

:00:17.:00:22.

beef adulterated with horsemeat. Cottage pies become the latest to

:00:22.:00:26.

fail the horse test. Police raid new premises and new cases are

:00:26.:00:30.

found across Europe. As the Government criticise the

:00:30.:00:33.

supermarkets for not being o. We have Sainsbury's boss here to

:00:33.:00:37.

respond. As tonight as the Lib Dem high

:00:37.:00:43.

command fights to hang on to Chris Huhne's old seat, horsemeat leads

:00:43.:00:53.

to some political points scoring. We had the horsemeat lasagne and

:00:53.:00:59.

tested it and it was 100% Tory. is a box-office smash, even if the

:00:59.:01:02.

singing doesn't do it for everyone. Tonight The Missing Ink director

:01:02.:01:09.

explains how it works. You have the naturalism die oing, and the key

:01:09.:01:17.

change singing, there is a simple point of singing.

:01:17.:01:23.

# If you wondered why I was singing # Why on earth now.

:01:23.:01:27.

Good evening, school meals, hospital food, Westminster and

:01:27.:01:32.

retailers, we don't know how horsemeat began to be passed off as

:01:32.:01:37.

beat, where, or how long it has gone on. Everyone agrees making

:01:37.:01:42.

more money was the motive. In a moment the Sainsbury's boss on how

:01:42.:01:47.

the food industry can begin to build trust. First we have been

:01:47.:01:52.

following the trail from farms to suppliers, via regulators and

:01:52.:01:57.

retailers, to the consumer. Everyone had been waiting for

:01:57.:02:01.

today's first batch of industry- wide test results, to get a feel

:02:01.:02:05.

for how big the horsemeat problem might be. It turned out that all

:02:05.:02:10.

the positives were in projuncts we already knew about. Up until about

:02:10.:02:17.

10.00am, the Food Standards Agency had received 2501 results. 2472

:02:17.:02:22.

were negative. 29 were positive. That means more than 1% of the meat

:02:22.:02:27.

content was horse. Those positive results include different sized

:02:27.:02:32.

portion of the same product. So, in total, we are talking about only

:02:32.:02:38.

seven products. 15 of the positives were on various sizes of packets of

:02:38.:02:48.

Findus beef last sangria. But do the DN -- Lasagne. Do the DNA

:02:48.:02:54.

results reflect the size of the problem. The hotel and catering

:02:54.:02:58.

company, Compass and Whitbread, and Lancashire County Council said they

:02:58.:03:06.

found products positive for horse. Other places are still testing.

:03:07.:03:10.

47self of Lancashires primary schools been sent food with

:03:10.:03:14.

horsemeat. Had children even the the meals that tested positive.

:03:14.:03:18.

sorry to have to say there is no doubt the children have eaten it T

:03:18.:03:23.

that is why I'm so concerned and angry, that the suppliers have done

:03:23.:03:28.

this. We are in exactly the same position as a private individual

:03:28.:03:33.

who goes into the supermarket and buys a Findus lasagne. We are just

:03:33.:03:38.

as angry as those people. It is entirely unacceptable, we found it

:03:38.:03:40.

because we carried out our own tests, they have done something

:03:40.:03:43.

about it. I asked the head of the FSA how

:03:43.:03:49.

parents should react to this news? The advice from the Chief Medical

:03:49.:03:54.

Officer is very clear, there is no need for people to be concerned on

:03:54.:04:00.

any health grounds at all. I think anybody who has eaten something

:04:00.:04:04.

which has been misdescribed to them, or whose child as eaten something

:04:04.:04:09.

that was not what they expected them to be eating has every right

:04:09.:04:14.

to be extremely angry and indignant. You can imagine the scenes, can't

:04:14.:04:18.

you, at the school gate, they will be saying, what do you make of this,

:04:18.:04:22.

our kids have been eating horse. They will be really upset, won't

:04:22.:04:29.

they? It is completely unacceptable. It is completely unacceptable that

:04:29.:04:34.

people are being told that product is beef, when it is horse.

:04:34.:04:37.

They might also, they will presumably be upset with the

:04:37.:04:41.

company that sold that material to the school. But if they know about

:04:41.:04:44.

the Food Standards Agency, they will be probably pretty shocked

:04:44.:04:48.

that you hadn't found that out before? I think they should be

:04:48.:04:52.

reassured that we are now in the process of get to go the bottom of

:04:52.:04:56.

this. From the news yesterday around the result of our

:04:56.:04:59.

investigations and how we are following through, you can see that

:04:59.:05:04.

we are finding out who are responsible for these things. We

:05:04.:05:07.

are taking vigorous measures against them, that will ultimately

:05:07.:05:10.

enable us to get back to the situation that we all know we need

:05:10.:05:17.

to be in. Nothing is more important to us at

:05:17.:05:21.

Tesco than the trust of our customers. Tesco said today it will

:05:21.:05:26.

build a world-class tracability and DNA testing system. In a poll for

:05:26.:05:30.

the Grocer Magazine, of more than 2,000 consumers, half said they

:05:30.:05:34.

weren't prepared to pay a penny more to ensure their meat does not

:05:34.:05:38.

contain horse. The Grocer survey found that consumers are not

:05:38.:05:43.

prepared to pay more money to guarantee that the food they eat is

:05:43.:05:46.

horse-free. What I think that tells us is that consumers think this is

:05:47.:05:50.

the industry's mess, and it is up to the industry to sort it out. And

:05:50.:05:55.

why should they pick up the bill? There are still thousands of test

:05:55.:05:58.

results to come in. They have got through a quarter so far. They

:05:58.:06:04.

asked companies to look at the high-risk products first. So, they

:06:04.:06:07.

think we may have heard the worst of it T they seemed overwhelmed by

:06:07.:06:11.

the volume of data coming in, even at the last minute.

:06:12.:06:15.

Across Europe, countries have withdrawn products found to be

:06:15.:06:19.

contaminated with horsemeat. There appear to be two meat trails, which

:06:19.:06:24.

may have introduced horsemeat into the UK. One involving Romania,

:06:24.:06:28.

France and the Netherlands, the other Poland and Ireland. It

:06:28.:06:35.

remains unclear precisely how the UK fits in. Until recently,

:06:35.:06:39.

Professor Morris was an adviser to the British Horseracing Authority.

:06:39.:06:45.

He told me horses have a passport system, that is supposed to keep

:06:45.:06:49.

veterinary medicines, like bute, out of the food chain. Yesterday it

:06:49.:06:56.

confirmed that bute has been found in a small number of horse

:06:56.:07:00.

carcasses for food. The principle is drugs shouldn't be in food. The

:07:00.:07:04.

point of the masses of paperwork, instructions to owners, signing

:07:04.:07:09.

horses out of the food chain if they do have bute, is to protect

:07:09.:07:13.

consumers. It is a marker that the system isn't working. I think that

:07:13.:07:18.

consumers can be reassured that in this particular instance, there

:07:18.:07:25.

isn't a food safety issue, it is a wake-up call. Meanwhile the

:07:25.:07:28.

criminal investigations continue. Three premises, two in North London,

:07:28.:07:32.

one in Hull have been raided. There have been three arrests in Wales

:07:32.:07:35.

and Yorkshire. With me is King, the chief

:07:35.:07:40.

executive of Sainsbury's. None of whose meat is so far shown to

:07:40.:07:45.

contain horsemeat. Although, only a quarter of beef products have been

:07:45.:07:48.

tested. You are not out of the woods yet? I don't think anyone can

:07:49.:07:52.

say they are out of the woods. As it happens in Sainsbury's, we are

:07:52.:07:55.

three-quarters of the way through our testing. Indeed it is one of

:07:55.:07:59.

the reasons I'm able to talk to you tonight. We have done around 200 of

:07:59.:08:03.

the, nearly 300 products we have to do. Nobody can say they are out of

:08:03.:08:06.

the woods. There is a long way to go before we can truly say we

:08:06.:08:09.

understand how this came about, and therefore, what we need to do

:08:09.:08:13.

differently going forward. You say a long way to go. The fact is, we

:08:13.:08:17.

are one month into this, since the stories first started to emerge.

:08:17.:08:22.

Help us understand why it is at this point we don't know how

:08:22.:08:26.

extensive this is, how long it has been going on for, and how the

:08:26.:08:29.

horsemeat got into the products in the first place? We are in the

:08:29.:08:36.

middle of the biggest set of tests ever done, DNA tests on beef. The

:08:36.:08:40.

first discovery in Ireland was in the middle of January. Most

:08:40.:08:44.

retailers, ourselves included, started a testing process

:08:44.:08:48.

immediately after that. One of the reassuring things about today's

:08:48.:08:52.

news, is of the thousands or so tests back from grocery retailers,

:08:52.:08:58.

there is no new news. The five grocery products known to contain

:08:58.:09:01.

horsemeat have already been announced. We have new news is food

:09:01.:09:04.

service, and as we heard earlier, some schools. There is still more

:09:04.:09:10.

to find out, as you heard from the FSA. He there is some reassurance

:09:10.:09:13.

in today's data that we are starting to get to the end of the

:09:13.:09:16.

bad news. Before all of this, having a look at your website, you

:09:16.:09:21.

have clearly put a lot of emphasis on tracability. You talk about how

:09:21.:09:26.

a secure, traceable supply chain, a British supply chain is the key to

:09:26.:09:31.

consumer confidence. I wonder if you feel why is it your job to

:09:31.:09:35.

assure the consumers in that way. We have all sorts of other bodies

:09:35.:09:38.

and regulatory frameworks that are supposed to be playing a role on

:09:38.:09:42.

this. Is it their job our your's? It is our job, we value our brand,

:09:42.:09:47.

we have been delivering safe food to our customers since 1869. That

:09:47.:09:52.

was how Sainsbury's was founded, on the back of a milk food scare in

:09:52.:09:57.

the mid-Victorian era. What is the Food Standards Agency for if it is

:09:57.:10:01.

your job to do all the testing and police yourselves? You have to have

:10:01.:10:04.

a police force in any system, of course you do. Not everybody values

:10:04.:10:07.

their brand as highly as Sainsbury's does. We have to

:10:07.:10:10.

reassure our customer, we take responsibility for that. That is

:10:10.:10:14.

why I think we have been a little bit ahead of the curve in this. The

:10:14.:10:17.

Food Standards Agency have a role to look much more widely, and the

:10:17.:10:21.

role that they will play is they will weave together the bits of

:10:21.:10:26.

information that they have, it does seem, at the moment, that horse has

:10:26.:10:30.

entered the food supply chain outside of the UK. You mentioned

:10:30.:10:33.

our beef in our ready meals is only sourced in the UK, that is probably

:10:33.:10:37.

one of the reasons why we have not had this issue so far. Is the

:10:37.:10:42.

police force not working as it should? The fact is, it may not be

:10:42.:10:45.

in Sainsbury's products as far as we know. But it is still out there.

:10:45.:10:49.

Who is makes the mistakes? As I understand it, the Food Standards

:10:49.:10:53.

Agency have not tests for horse DNA for eight or nine years. It is not

:10:53.:10:57.

a safety issue. Therefore, their focus has been on safety-related

:10:57.:11:02.

issues. The question is whether it was possible for them to have

:11:02.:11:05.

better evidence earlier, that would have allowed them to target.

:11:05.:11:08.

it? I don't think we know. Over the next month or so, as we become

:11:09.:11:12.

clearer on where this got into the food chain, it will be legitimate

:11:12.:11:15.

then to ask, could we have seen it coming sooner. What are you going

:11:15.:11:18.

to do in the future, have you stepped up the amount of testing

:11:18.:11:23.

that you plan to do in general, beyond this crisis. Will you be

:11:23.:11:26.

testing for more possible contaminants, for instance? We are

:11:26.:11:30.

in the middle of a major step up, as we have already described. DNA

:11:30.:11:34.

testing is part of the normal testing of the supply chain, we

:11:34.:11:38.

require that of the suppliers too. We test for country of origin, we

:11:38.:11:43.

test and we do for whether meat in particular has been previously

:11:43.:11:47.

frozen all of these things provide a safety net. For anyone to say

:11:47.:11:51.

they will not do anything different in the future loob fool hard yo. We

:11:51.:11:57.

have to look at what this -- will be foolhardy. We have to look at

:11:57.:12:02.

what will happen in future. Your emphasis is on British, is

:12:02.:12:06.

that because you acknowledge that it is much harder, if possible to

:12:06.:12:12.

have the same level of confidence in a supply chain generated abroad?

:12:12.:12:17.

That is not our emphasise on British, our emphasis on British is

:12:17.:12:20.

that is what customers expect. They expect the food to come as close to

:12:21.:12:25.

home as possible. We all eat food from all around the world .0% of

:12:25.:12:29.

what we sell in Sainsbury's is sourced in the UK. Our customers

:12:29.:12:33.

have been clear to us, if you can source it in the UK you should.

:12:33.:12:37.

That has always been our policy S You know what people say about the

:12:37.:12:43.

supermarkets in general. It is the drive for cheaper food that is

:12:43.:12:48.

pushing the search for cheaper meat outside the UK. That is why there

:12:48.:12:55.

is more and more non-British meat endering the food chain? People

:12:55.:12:58.

have to ask themselves whether or not the shop they go to has meat

:12:58.:13:01.

from the UK. There are no differences, I would say this of

:13:01.:13:04.

Sainsbury's, of course, I believe this to be true of the whole of the

:13:04.:13:07.

grocery supermarkets in the UK, there are no differences in the

:13:07.:13:10.

safety approach that supermarkets take for the cheapest food that

:13:10.:13:14.

they sell, the most affordable food they sell, and the more expensive.

:13:14.:13:19.

Safety is an absolute. Even when it originates abroad, you can't go

:13:19.:13:22.

checking on a supply that originates abroad than one in the

:13:22.:13:27.

UK? You can, but safety is an absolute. The issue here is an

:13:27.:13:30.

ingredient that is in our food supply chain, that is not a safety

:13:30.:13:34.

issue. But it shouldn't be there. What is on the packet, what it says

:13:34.:13:38.

the ingredients are, should always be what it says on the tin. And the

:13:38.:13:41.

issue here is that we have found that meat has got into the food

:13:41.:13:46.

supply chain. As I said earlier, probably overseas. It then has led

:13:46.:13:50.

to people misleading customers. That is unacceptable, even if there

:13:50.:13:53.

was only one instance of that. did you feel when the Government

:13:53.:13:57.

started to come out today and really put the focus on

:13:57.:13:59.

supermarkets, saying essentially that the industry, your industry

:13:59.:14:02.

should have been a lot more open in the first place, and you should

:14:02.:14:06.

have been doing media interviews, like this one, from day one to try

:14:06.:14:11.

to reassure people. You are only really starting to do it now?

:14:11.:14:15.

conversation was premature, we knew and have known since the meeting of

:14:15.:14:18.

the industry in Government last Saturday, that there were going to

:14:18.:14:21.

be significant numbers of tests coming out today. I'm doing this

:14:21.:14:25.

interview now, because it is the first possible moment I could have

:14:25.:14:28.

done that interview. We had 150 tests coming in today, bringing the

:14:28.:14:34.

total to just short of 200. Some about 7.00pm. It was unfair of that

:14:34.:14:38.

suggestion to come out today? we had was a pregnant pause ahead

:14:38.:14:42.

of this news. Nobody knew what was going to come out today. Today's

:14:42.:14:45.

news story, ahead of the news coming out was who was going to say

:14:45.:14:49.

what. I hope on behalf of Sainsbury's I can provide

:14:49.:14:52.

reassurance through doing this interview, but also, the industry

:14:52.:14:56.

has started to demonstrate that it is prepared to take its absolute

:14:56.:14:59.

responsibility on this. Other chief executives have spoken to me too.

:14:59.:15:03.

I'm sure you have seen the same poll that we have been looking at

:15:03.:15:08.

from the Grocer. Many consumers feel this is the tip of the iceberg

:15:08.:15:12.

about finding out about our food. As you look at it, how big a crisis

:15:12.:15:15.

do you think your industry is in? don't think it is the tip of an

:15:15.:15:19.

iceberg. As I said, there are encouraging signs from today's test

:15:19.:15:23.

that is we are starting to get to the bottom of this particular issue.

:15:23.:15:27.

More widely, the Ishikawa uis what it says on the tin in the tin, we

:15:27.:15:31.

can be very confident that the answer to that is, yes. We in

:15:31.:15:37.

Sainsbury's have a huge testing programme. We have 250-odd people

:15:37.:15:41.

whose job is to test products, the raw materials, the product

:15:41.:15:45.

delivered to warehouse, and we buy product to test it too, as

:15:45.:15:49.

customers do. Most in the industry would say something similar. We go

:15:49.:15:53.

to great lengths to ensure our food is what we expect it to be. Trust

:15:53.:15:56.

is the score of our businesses, without trust we don't have

:15:56.:16:02.

customers, we understand that and work hard to win it. Are you going

:16:02.:16:06.

to do what Tesco's is doing, a world class specific website, you

:16:06.:16:12.

can look exactly where they are on DNA testing? I'm not sure about the

:16:12.:16:17.

website, we already do the most testing of any people in the

:16:17.:16:20.

industry. The reason why we have the highest level of trust for food

:16:20.:16:25.

by our customers, is our customers know it is this the way of

:16:25.:16:28.

Sainsbury's doing business for many years. We will have to step up, but

:16:28.:16:38.

we also have a proud record on this already. Still to come:

:16:38.:16:45.

The director of Les Mis on when not to burst into song.

:16:45.:16:49.

Could the future of the coalition be decided by a small town in

:16:49.:16:53.

Hampshire. The voters in Eastleigh are being closely fought over with

:16:53.:16:57.

less than two weeks to go before the by-election sparked by Chris

:16:57.:16:59.

Huhne's resignation. The Conservatives are hoping to snatch

:16:59.:17:03.

the seat away from the Lib Dems, Labour is hoping the suggestion it

:17:03.:17:08.

could bring back the 10p tax rate will help it breakthrough. UKIP are

:17:08.:17:17.

in the hunt also. Learning a new skill on a Thursday

:17:17.:17:22.

night in February, when the memory of new year's resolutions still nag,

:17:22.:17:26.

some therapeutic exercise, but while all inside is tranquil, the

:17:26.:17:30.

moment they leave this room, these women can expect to walk into the

:17:30.:17:34.

brutish machinery of a British by- election. It is Eastleigh, supposed

:17:34.:17:37.

to be one NUT cracker of a by- election.

:17:37.:17:41.

-- nut cracker of a by-election. This by-election is the first of

:17:41.:17:45.

the parliament that pits the two coalition partners against each

:17:45.:17:50.

other. For that reason, many see it as last Tango, probably so

:17:50.:17:54.

acrimonious they couldn't work together afterwards. So far so

:17:54.:17:58.

disappointing. They have strecheded every sinew to make sure it is

:17:58.:18:02.

quite a gentile affair. But there are two weeks left. This by-

:18:02.:18:07.

election matters for both the port and starboard side of the coalition.

:18:07.:18:13.

The Conservatives are placed second to the Lib Dems, thanks to votes

:18:13.:18:18.

froms like this here. To get majority in 2015, the Tories need

:18:18.:18:22.

20 seats off Lib Dem colleagues. Eastleigh is one such seat. It is a

:18:22.:18:25.

test of whether the Prime Minister is in control. The Liberal

:18:25.:18:29.

Democrats believe they too can reach dry land. Their national

:18:29.:18:34.

ratings may suggest ruin in 2015, but, they say, they mask a more

:18:34.:18:40.

local story of gritty determination. UKIP candidate, nice to meet you.

:18:40.:18:45.

Thank you very much for stopping there. This isn't a pure laboratory

:18:45.:18:49.

for the two parties in power. There are other parties keen for their

:18:49.:18:53.

own upset. The bill that has gone through with the marriage of gays

:18:53.:18:57.

in church. That is a big issue for us, as we are Christians.

:18:57.:19:00.

Gay marriage gets a mention on the doorsteps, but it is immigration

:19:00.:19:04.

that is UKIP's campaign priority. And it has a wide appeal. There

:19:04.:19:10.

needs to be a moratorium on immigration, for a period of time,

:19:10.:19:13.

to allow this country to absorb what is here already, and to

:19:13.:19:16.

develop a national Government policy which says who do we want,

:19:16.:19:20.

how do we want them, when do they come in, with what level of volume

:19:20.:19:25.

and frequency over time. Earlier in the week Diane James

:19:25.:19:30.

came under a lot of criticism for telling a newspaper that Romanian

:19:30.:19:34.

immigrants were associated with crime. Does she stand by those

:19:34.:19:37.

comments? I have already been accused in the Times article that

:19:37.:19:40.

appeared yesterday of being racist and a bigot. I contrast with the

:19:40.:19:46.

number of text messages, e-mail messages, telephone calls, saying

:19:46.:19:50.

Diane thank goodness somebody has actually voiced what we are all

:19:50.:19:53.

thinking. None of the other political parties will do that.

:19:53.:19:57.

Trying to topple the Lib Dems is the Tory candidate, Maria Hutchings

:19:57.:20:01.

a mother of four. Hutchings has been the Tory candidate for a near

:20:01.:20:04.

half decade. She has walked the streets of this constituency many

:20:04.:20:10.

times over. She's also trodden on many of her leadership's messages.

:20:10.:20:13.

She strayed away from their message on gay marriage, she's not in

:20:13.:20:17.

favour. And she would vote to leave in a future referendum on Europe.

:20:17.:20:20.

That morning the Prime Minister had been in Eastleigh hardening up the

:20:20.:20:24.

party line on immigration. I think the Conservative Party, as I said

:20:24.:20:28.

before, are the party that are going to do something about

:20:28.:20:31.

immigration. UKIP won't be running the country. Would you say that

:20:31.:20:36.

UKIP is wrong to go as far as saying there should be a moratorium

:20:36.:20:39.

on immigration? That is an issue for them. You don't agree with that,

:20:39.:20:43.

that is not something you would do? I think the policy we are looking

:20:43.:20:49.

at at the moment, is to assess what's immediately coming, in terms

:20:49.:20:53.

of immigration with Bulgaria and Romania. People around here will

:20:53.:20:56.

say that is waffle? How can you have a moratorium on immigration,

:20:56.:21:03.

when you are talking about immigration from outside Europe and

:21:03.:21:06.

inside Europe. Eastleigh's unemployment figures are not as

:21:06.:21:11.

poor as some parts of the country. But the town's economy is still

:21:11.:21:15.

pretty vacant. Eastleigh contains multitudes, it is the have-yachts

:21:15.:21:20.

and the have-nots, for Labour and Miliband to show they have no

:21:20.:21:23.

southern England discomfort, they really need to be winning in a seat

:21:23.:21:29.

like this. So, at a local coffee shop we

:21:29.:21:33.

caught up with Ed Miliband's celebrity candidate, author of

:21:33.:21:39.

Things Can Only Get Better, a memoir of a Labour activist in the

:21:39.:21:45.

1980s and 1990s what he do if he reached Westminster? I would raise

:21:45.:21:55.
:21:55.:21:57.

tax. This is me going off message. For the top bankers and football

:21:57.:22:01.

own - football club owners, how many houses do you need. In your

:22:01.:22:04.

book and such a recruiting place for the by-election. You said to

:22:04.:22:07.

your brother in the Richmond by- election, it is best to vote Lib

:22:07.:22:12.

Dem in your seat. Has that gone away forever as a trend because of

:22:12.:22:15.

the coalition? I think tactical voting still exists, people are so

:22:15.:22:18.

cross with the liberals, what do I do to get them out, the answer is

:22:18.:22:22.

vote Labour. We have been going around the supermarkets today

:22:22.:22:27.

explaining people, because we found these, this Lib Dem lasagne, we had

:22:27.:22:32.

it tested and at the found it was 100% Tory.

:22:32.:22:35.

Testing a Lib Dem lasagne, would once have revealed a lot of Labour

:22:36.:22:41.

inside it. Here are Vincent Cable and Danny Alexander, visiting an

:22:41.:22:44.

Eastleigh laser factor. Before they went into coalition, many Labour

:22:44.:22:47.

voters would vote Lib Dem around the country to keep out the local

:22:47.:22:52.

Conservative. This by-election will test whether that remains true.

:22:52.:22:55.

very confused by Labour's point of view. First of all they want to

:22:56.:22:59.

steal one of our policies, then they want to pick up a discarded

:22:59.:23:05.

policy that didn't work, try to introduce it and give us no detail

:23:05.:23:10.

on they are going to. Do that is their policy, not our's. What would

:23:10.:23:16.

you say to wavering Lib Dem voters who have voted tackically in the

:23:16.:23:20.

past. Why should they vote like that again in the next election?

:23:20.:23:23.

have shown we fight the Tories every day and make a huge

:23:23.:23:28.

difference to their lives by keeping taxes down and license

:23:29.:23:33.

looking after families. At the coalition level, without us, they

:23:33.:23:39.

know that the situation would be far worse for them.

:23:39.:23:45.

What do our dancers make of all of this? Originally I voted Lib Dem

:23:45.:23:51.

because it was very much the local candidate where I lived, and people

:23:51.:23:55.

were generally voting Lib Dem. But then I felt very comfortable with

:23:55.:24:00.

that. I carried on. I have to say this time I'm not sure what I will

:24:00.:24:04.

do. I used to be quite Conservative, but then with David Cameron as

:24:04.:24:10.

leader, he has not lived up to what I thought he was. David Cameron has

:24:10.:24:14.

also to live up to the expectations of his MPs. Though it is not just

:24:14.:24:19.

him. All-party leaders are under similar pressure to net Eastleigh

:24:19.:24:24.

for their team. It has been a gentle campaign, but still waters

:24:24.:24:27.

run deep. There are other candidates standing

:24:27.:24:37.
:24:37.:24:38.

in Eastleigh, of course. Here they In a moment we will have a look at

:24:38.:24:42.

the front pages. First the film most likely playing at a cinema

:24:42.:24:48.

near you right now. It has had women throwing rowss at the screen.

:24:48.:24:55.

Mis-- roses at the screen. Les Mis is a hit, despite dubious singing

:24:55.:25:01.

by Crowe. It is hoping for Oscar glory. The director, Tom Hooper, is

:25:01.:25:06.

talking exclusively to Steve Smith, he's talking about bursting into

:25:06.:25:11.

song and whether Hollywood wants drama against. What about Les Mis?

:25:12.:25:21.
:25:22.:25:23.

Beautifully pronounced! Yes. Charge. Well, yes, what about Les Mis? The

:25:23.:25:27.

story of life and love on the barricades, you might have heard by

:25:27.:25:35.

now it is a musical. # All the love I walk with till

:25:35.:25:37.

morning But you might not know every star

:25:37.:25:41.

had to sing for his supper at auditions.

:25:41.:25:45.

# Pretend I'm not the man I was before.

:25:45.:25:51.

Even crow crow crow, Jackman -- Russell Crowe, and Hugh Jackman.

:25:51.:25:56.

When Anne McIntosh who produced the music and was responsible for the

:25:56.:26:00.

musical himself. He said they should all audition. It has become

:26:00.:26:05.

so conventional that you can't ask a big star to audition, you just

:26:05.:26:09.

offer, the Hollywood system, I laughed and thought, calm ran, this

:26:09.:26:13.

won't work. He was right to say it is a special case, we could say

:26:13.:26:16.

with singing live we can't have surprises.

:26:16.:26:21.

Who did you say "next" to? I never say that to anyone.

:26:22.:26:25.

# Your time is up and your parole has begun

:26:25.:26:31.

# You know what that means # Yes it means I'm free

:26:31.:26:33.

# Unless you learn the meaning of the law.

:26:33.:26:37.

The singing in the movie was a revelation, Russell Crowe has a

:26:37.:26:41.

voice like an angel, who knew? Interestingly. Is that a fair

:26:41.:26:46.

comment would you say? Interestingly, Russell had started

:26:46.:26:50.

off in musical theatre in Sydney in the rock rock. How did he do that?

:26:50.:26:54.

That was where he got his break as an actor before his film career

:26:54.:27:01.

started. I remember having cast Hugh Jackman, and thinking for the

:27:01.:27:08.

film to have suspense, opposite Hugh I have to cast someone

:27:08.:27:12.

everyone could believe could vanquish Jackman. That is hard once

:27:12.:27:18.

you have cast Wolverine, it struck me that Gladiator was one of the

:27:18.:27:22.

legitimate characters who could destroy Wolverine. Unlike many

:27:22.:27:28.

musicals on film, this one is sung all the way through. With very

:27:28.:27:34.

little straight dialogue. # If I was suddenly to

:27:34.:27:38.

# Start ING singing to you now I think we should do the rest of

:27:38.:27:41.

the programme like that. Apologise. It would be weird if I suddenly

:27:42.:27:46.

broke into song after talking to you for ten minutes. That is the

:27:46.:27:50.

very thing that can happen in a musical that adopts that form that

:27:50.:27:54.

the gear changes are awkward. Hooper's mantle piece already sags

:27:54.:28:02.

under the weight of the Oscars garnered two years ago by the --

:28:02.:28:06.

The King's Speech. Isn't he in the wrong business, all the wise acres

:28:06.:28:10.

have been saying television, box sets are the place for drama.

:28:10.:28:15.

Before I did The King's Speech, the phrase "the drama is dead" had

:28:15.:28:19.

become a common place phrase in Hollywood. To a director like me,

:28:19.:28:25.

and a lot of directors I knew it was a great sadness. It felt like

:28:25.:28:29.

the business had polarised into the big event movie and the teen comedy,

:28:29.:28:35.

there wasn't a lot inbetween. And the fact that this year sees not

:28:35.:28:41.

only the resurgence of drama, and you have Lincoln doing �150 million

:28:41.:28:45.

domestically, you have Zero Dark Thirty, Argo, all doing well, these

:28:45.:28:49.

are dramas in the classical tradition of a film drama. I think

:28:49.:28:52.

there is a lot to take comfort from at the moment. There is an

:28:52.:28:58.

impressive crop of movies up for the Oscars next week, but some have

:28:58.:29:01.

said that they are rather on the long side. Do you have any sympathy

:29:01.:29:05.

for the audience and their stiffening buttocks! My frustration

:29:05.:29:10.

when you make a long time is the awareness that the programme before

:29:10.:29:14.

the movie even starts can be as long as half an hour, in this

:29:14.:29:20.

country. All the ads do you mean? If you make a two-and-a-half hour

:29:20.:29:24.

movie, because of the programme you are into a three-hour movie

:29:24.:29:28.

experience. In the hey day of the long film, the 1960s when longer

:29:28.:29:32.

movies were less usual, you would sit down and the film would start.

:29:32.:29:38.

You didn't have to contend with the 30 minutes of ads and trailers.

:29:38.:29:48.
:29:48.:29:49.

Hooper directed Michael Sheen as the brilliantly spikey football

:29:49.:29:54.

matcher Brian Clough. What about the director himself, is he

:29:54.:30:00.

confident of more silverwear next week, make that goldwear. Are you

:30:00.:30:10.

going to William Hill's to put money on your film? I'm feeling

:30:10.:30:15.

good about it. I'm pleased with the BAFTAs, I'm very pleased to be

:30:15.:30:20.

there with eight nominations. It is very exciting to be there two years

:30:20.:30:25.

after The King's Speech. There is a diplomatic answer for

:30:25.:30:33.

you. Review is up next with Kirsty. Tonight, my guests gaze at the sea

:30:33.:30:38.

of souls and the cast including Tom Hanks, Halle Berry and Jim

:30:38.:30:43.

Broadbent in Cloud Atlas. Multiple roles in the 360 degree work by

:30:43.:30:48.

In-depth investigation and analysis of the stories behind the day's headlines with Mishal Husain.

As horsemeat is identified in food supplied to schools and hospitals, there is an interview with boss of Sainsbury's. Plus, the Liberal Democrats scrap for Eastleigh and the director of Les Miserables on when not to burst into song.


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