01/05/2013 Newsnight


01/05/2013

In-depth investigation and analysis of the stories behind the day's headlines with Jeremy Paxman.


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$:/STARTFEED. What sort of a country are we? On the eve of

:00:12.:00:18.

elections the Prime Minister gets stick for appointing cronies to his

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top team. Labour is accused again of being the trades unions catspaw,

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and UKIP shout "vote for us we are not part of the establishment".

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Times have changed yet old customs have survived. Just the

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establishment even exist any longer, and if not, why does the Prime

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Minister keep adding more products of Eton to his team. We go skiing

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with the wounding of America's wars in Afghanistan and Iraq and

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discover what the promise of mobility means. I'm too proud to

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take my life. But for a long time it didn't sound like a bad idea.

:00:55.:01:00.

years on screen, now the actor Bill Roache is named as a suspected

:01:00.:01:04.

rapist. Should those accused of such crimes be entitled to the same

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anonymity as the victims of the crimes? And the great director,

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Peter Brook, talks life and literature and why people should

:01:15.:01:18.

stop questioning Shakespeare's authorship. I wanted to write a

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short little pamphlet to make fun, once and for all and destroy this

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idiotic idea that somebody else wrote Shakespeare.

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Who runs this place? It is the question any reporter worth their

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salt ought to ask when they pitch up somewhere. But supposing this

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reporter was to be deposited in Britain, if he or she picked up the

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newspapers they might well conclude that the introduction of

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universally free education in the 1940s hadn't changed much. On the

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eve of local elections David Cameron is having to fight

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accusations that his Government is some sort of make work scheme for

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the products of Eton. Although it is not entirely true that

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Methuselah was an eat tonia, the argument has been around for a

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while. It is 50 years since a senior Tory talked about a magic

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circle of Etonians making prime ministers.

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Campaigning in the local elections the Prime Minister is keen to show

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how in touch he is with regular folk. See for example how he eats

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cheese! But increasingly he's having to answer charge that he and

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his inner circle are some what a breed apart. But what he leads is

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not so much a Government as a chum- ocracy. I appoint people because

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they are good enough to do a job and they are the right people for

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that job. I have people around me with all sorts of different

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backgrounds and schooling, but the most important thing is are you

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going to be good enough to do the job? So who is this supposedly cosy

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group of chums? Well, the latest name in the frame is Christopher

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Lookwood, he's just been appointed as the latest member of David

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Cameron's policy unit, they are pals he and the Prime Minister,

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they holidayed in Tuscany, he's also a pal of George Osborne. An

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old school friend. From the elegality St Paul's public school.

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Another recent apppointee is Joe Johnson, the brother of Boris

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Johnson, both men, of course, attended Eton at the same time as

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David Cameron. Coincidently so did David Cameron's Chief of Staff, Ed

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Llewlyn, and another apppointee, Jessie Norman, also went to Eton.

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That may leave Andrew Fellman feeling left out. He only knows the

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Prime Minister from their days at Oxford together. It doesn't leave

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much room for women, who of course don't get to go to Eton. But does

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this really matter if this pool of talent is, from a small source.

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This whole thing about a chum- ocracy has two negative effects.

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There is the obvious one that people look at the Prime Minister's

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operation and think it is completely staffed by his friends,

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people from very good private schools. There is the perception

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problem. I think the deeper problem is that actually it means that you

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have a Downing Street operation which has such a narrow experience

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of the country that it doesn't produce such good policy. It isn't

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so effective politically at understanding the country. It is

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that second problem that I think is the bigger one. And what about

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Labour? Well they have their own inner circle in the shape of some

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of the trades unions, Billy Hayes has donated money from his union to

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Ed Balls. The head of the other trade unions gives money to Chuka

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Umunna's office. As for Ed Miliband, the unions have signed up to

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support him, he has received money from the GMB and the most powerful

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union of all, Unite, led by Len McClues key. We should remember the

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trades union movement founded the Labour Party in the first place.

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Even so the Electoral Commission's data has shown they have given more

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generously in the last two years, and given a greater total of

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donations to the party. One former trade union official says all

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unions are not equal, that Unite has become dominant in Labour

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politics. Obviously Awe night are very influential in terms of the --

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obviously Unite are very influential in terms of what they

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give. They have a total political strategy, it is not just about

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tweaking the purse strings. They are training up candidates,

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training policy, and running independent campaigns, they have a

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strategy outside of the TUC. In a sense they are not saying "your

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money or your life", they are basically establishing an entirely

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independent Labour movement if you like. What about those other

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centres of power outside Westminster? The European Union for

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example. These are some of their big players. You probably don't

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recognise all that many of them. Estimates on the extent of EU

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influence on the UK vary widely. But the House of Commons library

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has calculated that between 1997 and 2009, only 6.8% of primary

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legislation, acts of parliament, and 14.1% of secondary legislation,

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those are the regulation that is implement law, came from the EU.

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Clearly European regulations have an effect. Devolution certainly has

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a big effect in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. Less of an impact

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in England, apart from the areas that have elected mayors. Even

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despite all that it is still a pretty centralised society. There

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is still a lot a Prime Minister with the proper backing and

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organisation and will can do. was in 1440 that Henry VI founded

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Eton College. Maybe it is significant that so many in British

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public life come from such a narrow circle. But whether voters care,

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whether it will make the slightest bit of difference to tomorrow's

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elections in England and Wales, well that's another question. To

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talk about this we have Sarah Wollaston, who is a Conservative MP,

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who has questioned the number of old Etonians in Government. She

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joins us from Exeter where the sun is apparently still shining. Dr

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Milton Celiz is a political historian and -- Dr Anthony Seldon

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is a political historian. Harry Mount is a journalist on the public

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schools system, and Toni Pearce is the newly elected President of the

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National Union of students. When she takes up her post in the summer

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she will become the first leader in the organisation who hasn't been to

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university. What do you think this appointments

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policy looks like? I don't think it looks very good, does it? It is not

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just from one sector of education, the public schools, it is from one

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particular school. We have been a democracy for getting on for two

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centuries, so it is bound to provoke all kinds of questions

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about exactly how fair is Britain today? What do you think, Harry?

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doesn't look great and they certainly are an elite, but what

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they really are is an intellectual elite. For what it is worth Joe

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Johnson got a first, Jessie Norman has written an intellectual

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biography of Edmund Burke. I know some of them, not just because they

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are friends. The more important thing is they are intellectual as

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opposed they have been to a certain school or university. They are all

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men, of course, Sarah Wollaston, what does it feel like to you?

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other commentators have said it is about the appearance that it gives.

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It is not just the message we give, it is the messenger that delivers

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it that is important. About being much more inclusive. Go on? I think

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also it is something about patronage. This is the heart of

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this. We are also hearing about the problem within the Labour Party,

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and if you take, for example, when David Miliband left for New York,

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Ed commented if I'm Prime Minister I will make sure one way or another

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that he service this country. What is that if it is not patronage. It

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is about how we tackle how patronage operates throughout

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Westminster. Toni Pearce you took at it from a different generation

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and different background, what does it look like to you? It has a huge

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impact on the way that people in this country see politics. And

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their view of politics. This idea that politics is some sort of elite

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club where only men who went to a certain school or university

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together can get in and lead the country. I think it is really

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concerning actually. It says a lot about the way this Government are

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running the country, I think. Actually but that goes and is

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symptomatic of a wider problem in the political system. And not

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exclusive to the Conservative Party because the Labour Party is in the

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same kind of boat? This idea it is full of different clubs of

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different types of people who give jobs to people that they grew up

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with or are friends W I take your point that these people -- I take

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your point that niece people are intellectual elite. You get that

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through a certain way and through privilege. Going somewhere like

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Eton probably allows you to become an intellectual elite that going to

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other places you get less of that opportunity. That is certainly true.

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What is extremely unfair is the school system in this country that

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the independent schools are some of the best schools in the world. The

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state schools are some of the worst schools in Europe. So you will end

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up with this situation. You don't mean all state schools, you mean

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some state schools, and some private sector schools are very,

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very good. Some of them are very bad too. There is a reason why you

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end up with a skewed result of having the country run by public

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school boys, which it is, it is because those public schools are

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extremely good at teaching. There are some fantastic state schools in

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Britain achieving not just great results but also doing some of what

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the public schools do so well, which is to teach character and

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attitude and determination to make a mark, to make a change. As

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opposed to what, sadly, Governments left and right have imposed on

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schools which is to render them little more than exam factories,

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making the teachers and students feel that the passing of exams is

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all that matters. That is not why Etonians get to the top, it is

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because they have a confidence and connections, and everything that

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Toni was talking about, it is more than just that. A bigger point here

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is Eton teaches something else, which is boys, they don't teach

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women. I don't take the point at all that these people are by nature

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the most capable people in the country. They may well be, that

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could be complete coincidence, I find it very hard to believe that

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the six most talented people in the country are men and they went to

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Eton. It could be, but it would be a great coincidence. Sarah

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Wollaston the interesting question, David Cameron is a highly

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intelligent man, if he knows, as he must know what this looks like, why

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does he keep on doing it? I do not know. I think it has to change. It

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could be so different. Today I met with the head of science and

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technology from a fantastic state Community College in my

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constituency, and he was appointed by interview. That's what the

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public would expect. Would Government expect him to be

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appointed by patronage? Think we would be outrageed if that happened

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in the state sector, we wouldn't want surgeons appointed by

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patronage. Does it matter, is it damaging? If Joe Johnson turns out

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to be exactly what Cameron is looking for, if he gives the

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Conservative Government a coherence that Cameron is rather lack to date,

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then I think people will forget where he's come from. But if it is

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just more of the same then I think it will really matter. Yes it does

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matter. I think that there should be perhaps more people, more of an

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open process, I think we also have to remember that all leaders tend

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to, in China and Russia, tend to appoint people they know. Because

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heeders are highly exposed and you like -- leaders are highly exposed

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and you like to appoint people you know and trust or who share the

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same kind of assumptions you do. Previous politicians have done

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exactly the same thing. When Tony Blair appointed Charlie Faulkner

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his old flatmate, or Derry Ervine the old barrister in his chambers.

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The moment you appoint a 40-year- old, former journalist on the FT

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with a first from Oxford, no-one would have questioned that until

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suddenly you hear he went to Eton, it is appalling therefore. There

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are trigger words we think some how it is awful because of being

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associated with certain places. That is a form of reverse snobbery.

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That would be true if every other cabinet we had ever seen wasn't

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made up of this kind of political elite. It is a problem when every

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time we see a cabinet formed we see more men than women, we see

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increasing number of people going to private school, not just in the

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cabinet but wider politics, particularly at the highest levels

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across different political parties, I do think it does matter when

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people are more disenfranchised than ever with the political system,

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it bears huge importance. If we want people to participate in

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democracy and get involved in civil society. It turns you off politics?

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It turns me off wanting to be involved in politics or thinking

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that I'm going to be leading civil society. Because I'm not a man, I

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didn't go to Eton, I have not been to university and that's already

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kind of sets me apart from these people. There is no barrier actual

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lie holding back these people, I mean -- actually holding back these

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people, I mean one of the most powerful women died a few weeks ago

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and she wasn't held back because she didn't go to Eton. Those

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barriers aren't there saying because you didn't go to Eton?

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not sure that isn't there in 2013. I'm more with Toni, we are a

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democracy we not only have to be fairer but be seen to be fairer to

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women to all kinds of minority groups. What about quotas, wouldn't

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it be crazy to appoint a woman to the job because she's a woman

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rather than brilliant. We have to do much more than we are doing at

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the moment. This country is not becoming more fair or more open to

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minority groups and to people from ordinary backgrounds, it is

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becoming if anything less. This is worrying. I think that schooling is

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absolutely fundamental. We need to be doing for more our state schools,

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not just to teach them really well, which the Government is trying to

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do. But to give them the kind of confidences that Toni has.

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unfairness is in the schools system. You can teach character and

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confidence. I think we can also give these people more connections,

:16:30.:16:34.

more of a sense of a leg-up and then we can have a society that

:16:34.:16:38.

many people don't feel alienated from. Sarah Wollaston do you feel

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excluded? No, I don't feel excluded. The point is Government works

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better without patronage. Look at what happens to select committees,

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they are more effective since we got rid of the whips appointing

:16:51.:16:54.

them. They are more effective at challenging and holding Government

:16:54.:16:58.

to account. That is why it is so important to get rid of patronage,

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we will be better off for it. Some of the best advice any of us get is

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from people who have a different world view and who we don't agree

:17:05.:17:09.

with. This point about class, this obsession we have with class, you

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are absolutely right, it is the mention of that magic word "Eton"

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that conjures up all sorts of illusions. Are we getting over

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that? Eton is and is opening an academy, it is trying to reach out

:17:27.:17:31.

T has lots of bursaries. I think many more public schools could

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follow Eton's lead. But many more other schools could follow the kind

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of confidence building and the sense almost of entitlement to have

:17:40.:17:45.

a good job. But public schools generally, and Eton particularly,

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people in this kind of elite, they are a million miles away from the

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majority of people who live in this country. That is the real problem

:17:53.:17:57.

here. Actually I don't want my Government to feel a million miles

:17:57.:18:01.

away from my experiences and my life. I know that the people I grew

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up with, where I group up in the south west absolutely wouldn't want

:18:05.:18:10.

their Government to feel a million miles away, and yet they do. There

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is no way they could have that idea? I don't disagree with you. I

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think something has to happen to make Britain a fairb irand a more

:18:19.:18:22.

democratic -- fairer and more democratic country. If these people,

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regardless of where they come from can institute changes to achieve

:18:26.:18:30.

that and get voter turnout and participation in politics and civil

:18:30.:18:33.

society, which afterall is the closest they have ever had to an

:18:33.:18:38.

idea with their Big Society! If all this actually means something then

:18:38.:18:40.

maybe these people will have achieved something. I'm not going

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to ask you with what the fees are at your school? A lot. Thank you

:18:47.:18:52.

all very much. Coming up, should people accused of

:18:52.:18:56.

sex crimes remain anonymous until proven guilty. We talk to the

:18:56.:19:01.

theatre director, Peter Brook. Theatre cannot be a mass medium and

:19:01.:19:06.

thank good television has taken its place.

:19:06.:19:10.

Many tributes were paid today to three British soldiers who were

:19:10.:19:19.

killed in a bomb explosion in Helmand Province, Afghanistan. They

:19:19.:19:26.

bring the total number of daeds to well over 1,000. Modern medicine

:19:26.:19:29.

has aided many who once would have doid from their wounds to survive.

:19:29.:19:32.

What happens to those young men and women after the noise of battle has

:19:32.:19:39.

died, and they have had to rebuild their lives in new bodies. We have

:19:39.:19:44.

been to Colorado where several hundred disabled veterans have come

:19:44.:19:50.

together to learn how to ski as part of their rehabilitation. This

:19:50.:19:55.

report contains some graphic images, and they talk as soldiers talk, in

:19:55.:20:05.
:20:05.:20:16.

pretty direct language. The Colorado mountains.

:20:16.:20:21.

400 disabled American veterans from all conflicts arrive for a week of

:20:21.:20:27.

skiing and rehabilitation. Thank you so much for your service to our

:20:27.:20:32.

country. Thank you for thanking us. Come closer, I like it when the

:20:32.:20:37.

guys come closer. Alan Babin, a battlefield medic was seriously

:20:37.:20:45.

injured during the invasion of Iraq. It was one of the fiercest battles

:20:45.:20:50.

that the 82ndair bourne had been in since World War II. During the

:20:50.:20:56.

battle, about three hours into it, one of his fellow paratroopers was

:20:56.:21:03.

on the bridge and raised up to look and see what was coming. He was hit

:21:03.:21:09.

with a gunshot wound to the head. A call for a medic rang out. Alan

:21:09.:21:12.

left the safety of a covered position and ran through effective

:21:12.:21:19.

gunfire to render aid. When he was hit. It was a gunshot wound to the

:21:19.:21:25.

abdomen, through and through shot by an AK 47, however Alan lost 90%

:21:25.:21:35.

of his stomach, his spleen, part of his pan crease, it grazed his liver

:21:35.:21:39.

and diaphragm. The battle was so severe they couldn't extract him,

:21:39.:21:45.

he lay on the hood of a gun truck for three-and-a-half hours. For me

:21:45.:21:50.

first there is no thinking, when someone needs your help, you are

:21:50.:21:59.

there to help, that's that. I just knew I had to be somewhere because

:21:59.:22:06.

somebody needed me. Alan's wounds from the battlefield were very

:22:06.:22:13.

severe, but when he got to Walter Reed, April 26th and started

:22:13.:22:16.

undergoing more surgeries, he started to improve a little bit.

:22:16.:22:22.

But the weekend of May 10th Alan contracted meningitis and suffered

:22:22.:22:32.
:22:32.:22:35.

a stroke. Then for about two years Alan existed. Since 2001, almost

:22:35.:22:39.

7,000 American service personnel have been killed in Iraq and

:22:39.:22:48.

Afghanistan, 50,000 more wounded. Tell me what all this is? Ask him.

:22:48.:22:55.

One of the event's big donors and architect of America's foreign

:22:55.:23:01.

policy is America's former deputy secretary of defence. This is a

:23:01.:23:04.

demanding version of boot camp. They are pushed to do things they

:23:04.:23:08.

are afraid of and they thought they would never do before. Having done

:23:08.:23:13.

that it keeps them going through the year. When I was no longer

:23:13.:23:16.

having any official status to allow me to come I thought I want to

:23:16.:23:22.

still come but I can't come and say I was a former X, Y or Z. I thought

:23:22.:23:26.

the easist way is to be a sponsor. I could be a sponsor just giving

:23:26.:23:36.
:23:36.:23:41.

money and not turning up. I turn up because I find it very satisfying.

:23:41.:23:45.

Sergeant Dino Cedeno lost his leg eight month ago. I grew up in

:23:45.:23:50.

Queens all my life. When we were attacked it changed lives. I was a

:23:50.:23:53.

New Yorker and I felt there was a debt to be paid. One way or another

:23:53.:23:58.

I could have done more than donate sandwiches and donate blood. We

:23:58.:24:01.

knew we were going for Afghanistan after we got back from Iraq, it was

:24:01.:24:06.

a matter of time. On a routine foot patrol his platoon entered the

:24:06.:24:10.

village, he could see the ground had been disturbed, all the signs

:24:10.:24:15.

of an IED. When I scanned and moved I couldn't find it t I know it is

:24:15.:24:18.

right there, it is so obvious, unless they are trying to trick you

:24:18.:24:22.

to come over here to mess around somewhere else. The next thing I

:24:22.:24:30.

know I wake up Stateside and in a world of pain. Back in the states

:24:30.:24:34.

Dino struggled with his injuries. I'm too proud to take my life. But

:24:34.:24:44.
:24:44.:24:45.

for a long time it didn't sound like a bad idea. I didn't, I knew

:24:45.:24:49.

my left leg could be amputated right to the hip. I didn't know my

:24:49.:24:52.

near future, what it was. I begged my wife to get a divorce, she

:24:52.:24:57.

doesn't deserve this. I felt like I failed her, I failed my friend, I

:24:57.:25:01.

failed my buddies. Because they are over there fighting and I'm over

:25:01.:25:06.

here trying to piece myself together, I guess. I thought it was

:25:06.:25:16.
:25:16.:25:17.

over. I did have a falling through with alcoholism but I realiseed it

:25:17.:25:25.

is not, I can't do it. It is no excuse for it. I can only cry so

:25:25.:25:35.
:25:35.:25:36.

much. I can only look myself in a room and think woe is me for so

:25:36.:25:41.

long, I have to keep going. Slowly the process of healing began.

:25:41.:25:46.

very first or second day I was terrified, she popped me on the

:25:46.:25:49.

Walker and put that belt on me and literally kicked me, go, you will

:25:50.:25:53.

walk with one leg, you will hop. Want you to remember what it is

:25:53.:26:03.
:26:03.:26:04.

like to be tall again. I wanted to quit. Previously a keen snowboarder,

:26:04.:26:10.

today is Dino's first time back on the slopes as an amputee. We are

:26:10.:26:18.

going to this way, we don't care, we are snowboarders, we are chill

:26:18.:26:24.

td axed we don't wear ski suits et cetera. Lock no. Confident, don't

:26:24.:26:34.
:26:34.:26:54.

Heel side turn right from the start. When the opportunity came for me to

:26:54.:27:02.

starting to snowboarding I was thrilled, I was excited. But when

:27:02.:27:07.

it had the realisation kicking in that I'm an amputee, and it is no

:27:07.:27:13.

longer the same as it has been for the last 20 years I became angry. I

:27:13.:27:19.

was frustrated. Because now I have to relearn something I have loved

:27:19.:27:29.
:27:29.:27:30.

doing. For crying out loud, my leg just popped off! The knee has

:27:30.:27:35.

several gyroscopes and microprocessors to constantly think

:27:35.:27:41.

I can go from a slow crawl to a full sprint. I can go up the stairs,

:27:41.:27:46.

down the stairs, down the hill, it knows the angles. I'm still

:27:46.:27:50.

learning how to use it. There is so many features behind it. It brought

:27:50.:28:00.
:28:00.:28:09.

back a sense of normality to me. was nervous about coming here. I

:28:09.:28:16.

didn't know who these people were and I didn't know if they knew me

:28:16.:28:25.

or my situation so I was pretty much sceptical about this whole

:28:25.:28:35.
:28:35.:28:37.

thing. We arrived not prepared for the emotions that we were going to

:28:37.:28:43.

experience watching, not just Alan ski, but blind skiiers on the side

:28:43.:28:52.

of the mountain and amputees. Saturday morning, before we got

:28:52.:28:56.

ready to leave I asked him what his favourite part of the clinic had

:28:56.:29:06.
:29:06.:29:06.

been, fully expecting him to choose an activity. He said I felt normal.

:29:06.:29:12.

For a mother with his level of injuries and the impact that it had

:29:12.:29:17.

on our lives it was huge because for Alan to suddenly feel normal I

:29:17.:29:21.

was going to do whatever it took to get him involved in these types of

:29:21.:29:31.
:29:31.:29:33.

things. At the end of the week I was feeling so much better about

:29:33.:29:43.
:29:43.:29:44.

who I was. Yeah! How ya doing! consequences of war are highly

:29:44.:29:49.

visible here, what about those who make the decisions to go to war?

:29:49.:29:53.

have heard too much glib commentary that people who make these

:29:53.:29:58.

decisions don't appreciate what is involved. I think the people I have

:29:58.:30:02.

known who have had to make them, whether it was about Desert Storm

:30:02.:30:07.

20 years ago or about Afghanistan and Iraq Wars more recently are

:30:07.:30:13.

quite aware of how terrible it is. But they have to weigh the

:30:13.:30:19.

consequences of taking on those risks and dangers with the

:30:19.:30:22.

consequences of not taking them on. What I have gained in the last few

:30:22.:30:26.

days will give me the right ammunition to keep the fight at my

:30:26.:30:34.

job, to feel me, to physically push me out there. There isn't anything

:30:34.:30:41.

that this is going to stop me. is just day one of another 31 more

:30:41.:30:51.
:30:51.:30:51.

years to go. It is a whole other way to start it. We're out of here.

:30:51.:31:01.

These are the cards I was dealt so I'm going to play my hand. I don't

:31:01.:31:05.

think any of us anticipated the level of injuries that some of

:31:05.:31:10.

these men and women were going to be coming home with. The impact

:31:10.:31:16.

that it would have on the rest of our lives because for us the war

:31:16.:31:26.
:31:26.:31:27.

continues on a daily basis. That report from Jonathan Bell. The

:31:27.:31:33.

formal police statement just said that an 81-year-old man had been

:31:33.:31:37.

arrested in connection with the rape of a girl that occurred 41

:31:37.:31:44.

years ago, everyone knows the man is Bill Roache, the world's

:31:44.:31:47.

longest-serving soap car, playing Ken Barlow, he was tonight charged

:31:47.:31:50.

with two counts of rape. Are we entitled to know that before a

:31:50.:31:54.

single word has been heard in court. Recently Mr Roache recently claimed

:31:54.:32:00.

that anyone accused of rape should be entitled to the same anonymity

:32:00.:32:04.

grant today their alleged victims. Anybody can make an allegation,

:32:04.:32:07.

until an allegation is proven or going to court there should be

:32:07.:32:12.

anonymity for both parties. These people are instantly stigmatised,

:32:12.:32:16.

some will be innocent and some will not. Until such time as it is

:32:16.:32:20.

proven there should be anonymity for both. Let's discuss this now

:32:20.:32:24.

with Christine Hamilton, who along with her husband, the former MP

:32:24.:32:30.

Neil Hamilton were both falsely charged of sexual offences and with

:32:30.:32:36.

Sarah Green from the Campaign Group End Violence Against Women. You

:32:36.:32:39.

were falsely accused, you were never even charged, how long-

:32:39.:32:44.

lasting was the damage? We were accused of actual rape, not just a

:32:44.:32:46.

sexual offence. We were held at Barkingside Police Station, and

:32:46.:32:50.

that is when we were accused, for five hours. Which was a pretty

:32:50.:32:54.

horrendous experience. By the time we came out of the Police Station

:32:54.:32:58.

we were told we were being asked to go to Barkingside because nobody

:32:58.:33:04.

would know we were there. By the time we came out the whole media

:33:04.:33:07.

were there. Somebody told them they were there. We were on bail for two

:33:07.:33:10.

weeks before the police backed down and accepted that we had never even

:33:10.:33:14.

met the girl in question. I don't feel that our names should ever

:33:14.:33:17.

have been out there. The only reason that the world, if they

:33:17.:33:21.

wished to know, knows who she is, is because she sold her anonymity

:33:21.:33:29.

to the News of the World. I think what she did, her name is Nadine

:33:29.:33:32.

Milroy Sloane, I can say that because she took �50,000 in

:33:32.:33:36.

exchange for revealing her name from the News of the World, she did

:33:36.:33:41.

a massive disservice to genuine rape Vic tills, because any time a

:33:41.:33:45.

-- victim, because any time a girl like her calls wolf it makes it

:33:45.:33:51.

more difficult for a genuine victim to be heard. Let's loaf aside the

:33:51.:33:55.

particular circumstance of that particular -- leave aside a

:33:55.:33:59.

particular circumstance of a circumstance woman. This was a

:33:59.:34:04.

woman falsely accused and held up to public approbium and nothing

:34:04.:34:08.

happened? It is terrible to be accused of a crime that you haven't

:34:08.:34:12.

committed. There are provisions in place, including restricted

:34:12.:34:15.

reporting and contempt of court. Fundamentally the presumption of

:34:15.:34:18.

innocence, because it is not a conviction, it is about your name

:34:18.:34:22.

being known in the public sphere. We need to go right down to the

:34:22.:34:26.

legal basic, why do we know who is accused of a crime. In our legal

:34:26.:34:29.

system in the open justice system, part of our democratic ways of

:34:29.:34:32.

doing things, we know when someone is accused of a crime. The state

:34:32.:34:35.

makes that known in order that somebody who might be able to

:34:35.:34:39.

coroborate, somebody who might give extra testimony can come forward.

:34:39.:34:43.

Equally so somebody who can refute it and say no, that person didn't

:34:43.:34:46.

do it because they were with me that night. That is why we make the

:34:46.:34:50.

names of the accused known. We have a special exemption of victims of

:34:50.:34:53.

sexual offences, I think the mistake really comes in when we

:34:53.:34:56.

start saying there is parity between the two sides. There isn't

:34:56.:35:00.

parity between those accused of crimes and victims. We will come to

:35:00.:35:04.

the victims in a moment or two. What do you make of the argument

:35:04.:35:09.

that it service justice? In the vast majority of rape cases the two

:35:09.:35:13.

people concerned they know each other, there is usually absolutely

:35:13.:35:16.

no evidence whatsoever, it comes down to one person's word against

:35:16.:35:19.

another. If you say you need to name the alleged perpetrator

:35:19.:35:22.

because then other people will come forward. First of all you are

:35:22.:35:26.

assuming they are guilty. I don't like this phrase. It is not a

:35:26.:35:29.

presumption you are guilty, it is letting the community know that

:35:29.:35:32.

somebody has been ayes cues of a very serious crime. What is known

:35:32.:35:39.

about rape of the What if it is a tissue of lies. Our own criminal

:35:39.:35:41.

justice statistics show those who commit rape commit it again and

:35:41.:35:45.

again, and interviews with men who admit to committing rape show men

:35:45.:35:48.

commit it again and again. It is something we have to have on record.

:35:48.:35:52.

You are making the assumption that every man accused of rape is guilty

:35:52.:35:57.

of rape. I'm not making that presumption. The man unjustly

:35:57.:36:03.

accused of rape, let's take Bill Roache, I have to idea, let's sume

:36:03.:36:07.

he's 100% innocent, he's an internationally known star, his

:36:07.:36:10.

name is around the world, even if he's completely cleared at the end

:36:10.:36:13.

of the day and totally 100% innocent, there will always be a

:36:13.:36:17.

huge number of people who will think no smoke without fire. The

:36:17.:36:22.

person who accused him we will never know who they are. We have to

:36:22.:36:25.

depend in our open society with open justice we have to have the

:36:25.:36:29.

presumption of innocence. You were never convicted of everything.

:36:29.:36:32.

don't have open justice in this. You have to remember the protection

:36:32.:36:37.

is there for the victims. It don't apply in any other crime. It is a

:36:37.:36:41.

special crime, because of what rape and sexual offences are, because of

:36:41.:36:47.

who commits them and why and how. It should apply to the perpetrator?

:36:47.:36:51.

They are not equal parties, state is accusing someone of a crime, the

:36:51.:36:55.

witness is a person in their own place. The person is protected

:36:55.:36:59.

because of the known shame around sexual offences and many victims

:36:59.:37:03.

wouldn't report. There is no shame about being accused falsely? It is

:37:03.:37:09.

not the same. We only have to talk about Jimmy Savile and the evidence

:37:09.:37:13.

that emerged. The case in Rochdale and child grooming prosecutions

:37:13.:37:15.

where you have perpetrators committing many crimes against many

:37:15.:37:19.

victim who is are targeted usually because of their vulnerability.

:37:19.:37:25.

Girls and so on. They are not equal parties, they are not the same.

:37:25.:37:29.

have turned the whole basis of British justice on the head, ever

:37:29.:37:34.

since Magna Carta, the whole basis of the system is the accused and

:37:34.:37:37.

accuser should face each other in open court. It is not what happens,

:37:37.:37:42.

the state faces those accused. fully understand why people who

:37:42.:37:45.

have been raped want anonymity, I'm not saying they shouldn't have it.

:37:45.:37:51.

I just think, it used to be the case that everybody was named, or

:37:51.:37:54.

everybody was anonymous, I think the pendulum has swung too far.

:37:54.:37:58.

There are plenty of cases, I'm not going to name them, where the men

:37:58.:38:02.

have been accused and hung out to try and they have been proved to be

:38:02.:38:06.

innocent. We know who they are. If you name them you add to their

:38:06.:38:09.

agony. If the consequence of the change in the law you seek was that

:38:09.:38:13.

fewer rapists were convicted, would you think it was a good thing?

:38:13.:38:16.

is why the Government has thrown it out. The coalition Government

:38:16.:38:20.

looked at this and looked at the arguments made for having anonymity

:38:20.:38:23.

for those accused, they were deemed less significant than the damage

:38:23.:38:26.

that would be done by having anonymity. Let her answer the

:38:26.:38:30.

question. There is no law that you can frame that will be right in

:38:30.:38:32.

every circumstance, of course there isn't. It is not going to be

:38:32.:38:37.

possible to do that. I just feel that of course some men will get

:38:37.:38:40.

away with rape, of course they will. Men get away with it every day.

:38:40.:38:47.

can do something about it. Some women, we know they cry wolf.

:38:47.:38:50.

just in March the CPS published a very authoritative and

:38:50.:38:53.

comprehensive report on called false allegations, it looked at 18

:38:53.:38:56.

months of cases, a really interesting report and well

:38:56.:39:00.

reported, it looked at the fact that false allegations for rape are

:39:00.:39:03.

no different than they are for any other crime, they are single-

:39:03.:39:06.

significant statistics, it is a myth and very damaging rape myth

:39:06.:39:10.

that women make it up. It is not the case. Those who do, who are

:39:10.:39:13.

actually accused and found for doing false allegations tend to be

:39:13.:39:16.

very vulnerable people. It is almost impossible to come up with

:39:16.:39:20.

any statistics that are foolproof, by definition we don't know do we.

:39:20.:39:26.

I know the statistic that only 6% of rapes are coming to conviction,

:39:26.:39:31.

it is 6% of reported rapes. The CPS decides, it is not because a woman

:39:31.:39:34.

is lying it is just because the evidence is perhaps flimsy and they

:39:34.:39:39.

are not going to get a conviction. That is not why a lot of cases

:39:39.:39:44.

don't reach it is because victims have to pull out. Now for something

:39:44.:39:47.

entirely familiar, did Shakespeare write Shakespeare. People have been

:39:47.:39:52.

claiming that he was a front or a fraud for 150 years and really his

:39:52.:39:57.

plays were written by Francis Bacon, Christopher Marlowe, the Earl of

:39:57.:40:03.

Oxford, Lord Lucan, Shergar or Dale Winton. Now, forgive the very sub-

:40:03.:40:06.

Shakespearian cliche, one of the grand old men of theatre has told

:40:06.:40:10.

everyone to snap out of it. When Peter Brook speaks, people tend to

:40:10.:40:16.

listen, Stephen Smith certainly did. I just wanted to write a short

:40:16.:40:24.

little familiar flet to make fun and destroy it by a -- pamphlet to

:40:24.:40:27.

make fun and destroy for once and for all that someone else wrote

:40:27.:40:33.

Shakespeare. While Peter Brook ought to know, the veteran director

:40:33.:40:37.

of Shakespeare, this was his Tempest, he's taking on the

:40:37.:40:40.

stubborn conspiracy theory surrounding the Bard. If he was a

:40:40.:40:47.

phoney, and didn't write the plays he would be derided by his rivals.

:40:47.:40:53.

There were many other writers and they were as bitchy and gelous as

:40:53.:40:58.

all writers were. Here was a successful writer, but nobody wrote

:40:58.:41:01.

a pamphlet, left a little note or stood at a street corner or stood

:41:01.:41:08.

up in a pub to say this guy is a fake. And it took two centuries

:41:08.:41:13.

before it suddenly occurred to somebody and that was this man with

:41:13.:41:22.

this good-given name of Mr Lun ee who defended Shakespeare. I know a

:41:22.:41:30.

bank where the wild thyme blows, where oxslips and the wild valleys

:41:30.:41:37.

grow. When plays like A Midsummer Night's Dream were put on, a

:41:37.:41:44.

century before the didgeridoos were added, Shakespeare must have been

:41:44.:41:49.

on hand to cover the awkward moments. When I did my first

:41:49.:41:54.

production at Stratford, in the middle of the first scene change,

:41:54.:41:59.

they were out on where the curtains closed, there was an enormous clash,

:41:59.:42:05.

all the scenery had collapsed. But he knew immediately that he had to

:42:05.:42:09.

find ways of improvising and filling in five minutes. Were you

:42:09.:42:13.

watching what was going through your mind? I was just hoping that

:42:14.:42:22.

he could go on filling it. He did it by, he had a little front stage

:42:22.:42:26.

speech to do, he did it by marvellous pauses, and filling them

:42:26.:42:33.

with a look and a smile. Brook directed this acclaimed adaptation

:42:33.:42:37.

of the Lord of the Flies. And the job before this was a musical in

:42:37.:42:46.

the West End, if you can believe it. But his reputation is as a prophet

:42:46.:42:50.

in the wildness, turning his back on easy hits, in favour of

:42:50.:42:55.

exploring Shakespeare in Africa, the Middle East and the Australian

:42:55.:42:59.

bush. There are directors who stay in this country who do very well,

:42:59.:43:05.

who accept various gongs and so on, and from their perspective you were

:43:06.:43:12.

roughing it out, you were out in the back of beyond sometimes.

:43:12.:43:16.

Because I mean all that is secondary. Never, never to be

:43:16.:43:21.

imprisoned by that need to do the next play, to make a hit, because

:43:21.:43:26.

you are in a series of hit and you have to continue with it. Never to

:43:26.:43:33.

this day have I done that. The rise and fall of President

:43:33.:43:36.

Hollande, unpopular with the French because of unemployment and the

:43:36.:43:39.

economy has been followed with interest by Peter Brook, who has

:43:39.:43:47.

lived and worked in Paris for many years. He is in very, very great

:43:47.:43:55.

trouble. Only time will show whether what a lot of people said

:43:55.:44:00.

before he was elected, which was that while he was apparently a

:44:00.:44:07.

charming, intelligent, witty cultivated man in every day life

:44:07.:44:12.

and had been secretary of the party for a long time, he never had any

:44:12.:44:16.

administrative expowerence at all in Government.

:44:16.:44:20.

Peter Brook, during his most recent excursion on to the London boards,

:44:20.:44:25.

he says he now favours the most strict back production possible.

:44:25.:44:32.

He's still a true believer in the power of theatre. Theatre cannot be

:44:32.:44:37.

a mass medium, and thank good television has taken its place. So

:44:37.:44:44.

it is no longer elitist to say that a theatre with 500 seats is doing a

:44:44.:44:50.

very valuable service to the 500 people who prefer to go there than

:44:50.:44:57.

to do 100 other things. What about the old country? How is that

:44:57.:45:04.

looking from the other end of the Eurostar tunnel? My impression is

:45:04.:45:09.

that what is strong in England, very strongly in London, very

:45:09.:45:12.

strongly in everything that's creative is that there is, once

:45:12.:45:19.

again, a tremendous vitality, a tremendous surge of creativity.

:45:19.:45:23.

People say that this was the conference of the Olympic Games,

:45:23.:45:31.

that is too easy an answer, but in the flux of time, this is returning.

:45:31.:45:36.

So England, I don't feel at the moment, is a defeated country.

:45:36.:45:40.

Although the problems are as big as anywhere in the continent. So the

:45:40.:45:45.

moment is ripe for you to return here, Peter? Maybe, why not.

:45:45.:45:50.

not. Why stay over there, why deny us. Because I have got so much

:45:50.:46:00.
:46:00.:46:23.

going on! Tomorrow morning's front That's it, let us leave you with

:46:23.:46:26.

something rather astonishing, a clever bunch of people at IBM have

:46:26.:46:32.

made the smallest movie ever produced. They have manipulated

:46:32.:46:37.

individual atoms in a top-frame film. If you want to try it at home

:46:37.:46:40.

you need magnification of 100 million or so. This is individual

:46:41.:46:50.
:46:51.:46:51.

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 40 seconds

:46:51.:47:31.

atoms, the very smallest particles Good evening. Tomorrow most places

:47:31.:47:36.

will begin on a dry, some what chilly note. We have got a bit more

:47:36.:47:38.

cloud to the south-east and the North West corner, but inbetween

:47:38.:47:42.

some sunny spells developing, across Scotland some rain generally,

:47:42.:47:46.

maybe a bit of hill snow mixed in there as well. A few rain showers

:47:46.:47:49.

by the afternoon, scattered across Northern Ireland. The rain could be

:47:49.:47:55.

quite heavy for the Western Isles, and temperatures in tornaway really

:47:56.:47:59.

struggling. -- Stornaway really struggling. Looking at highs and

:47:59.:48:03.

lows of 13, it might be a grey day. A better chance of keeping some

:48:03.:48:08.

sunshine for England and Wales. There is a small chance of a shower

:48:08.:48:12.

developing, you will be unlucky if you do catch un. 15-16 degrees

:48:12.:48:17.

could be possible, a few degrees higher in a few place, 17-18. For

:48:17.:48:21.

south-west England, the south coast having cloud. For North Devon and

:48:21.:48:24.

Cornwall we will keep hold of sunshine. A small risk of a shower

:48:24.:48:29.

for Wales. But overall it is dry and it is bright. On Friday the

:48:29.:48:32.

cloud increases to the North West, across Scotland and Northern

:48:32.:48:36.

Ireland, that rainband turns heavier and starts to move its way

:48:36.:48:39.

further south. Although it will cloud over across England and Wales,

:48:39.:48:43.

we are still just about keeping hold of sunshine for south-east

:48:43.:48:47.

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