23/06/2014 Newsnight


The British teens fighting for ISIS. Reaction to Egypt sentencing. Polish foreign minister on David Cameron. An interview with Mandela's PA. Tennis star Li Na on China.

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They are young British and fighting for ISIS, who is persuading


teenagers from Coventry to fly to Syria and persue Jihad? We ask their


parents. TRANSLATION: The Iman of the mosque who lives in our area,


organised classes for them after evening prayers, he encouraged them


and sent them down this road. The F-word is flying in Polish, we hear


what Poland's Foreign Minister thinks of our PM's Europe policy. He


BEEPed up, he's not interested, because he believes the stupid


propaganda. She was the Afrikaans racist who went to become Nelson


Mandela's most trusted confident, she went to see him with stem ma


and... Jeremy Clarkson. When he came in he said Mr Mandela have you had a


lap dance, a person of that age doesn't know what that is. Good


evening, they borrowed money, removed their passports and headed


off to find Jihad. Three young teenagers, friends from Coventry


have been lured to Syria to fight for ISIS. The boys never told their


parents, one father tells us his son was brainwashed by the local Imam.


They are believed to be amongst 500 Britons who have joined the conflict


in Syria. MI5 tells us the security threat they pose on their return


will be a top priority. What makes a kid studying computer science give


it all up to risk his life. This film is from BBC Afghan. Three young


teenagers, friends from Coventry, they all left home and are now in


Syria. Apparently lured in by the militant group ISIS. Their families


are in shock. The father of one of the boys, 18-year-old Ali, who is of


Afghan origin spoke to us exclusively. He said Ali was


planning to study computer science, and last February he asked for his


passport. He told his parents it was for university paperwork. He also


borrowed ?1,000 for one -- from one of his brothers, saying it was for a


computer. In fact it was for a plane ticket. Ali hadn't admitted it to


his family, but his father believes he has joined ISIS.


What is your biggest fear of what might happen to Ali now he's in


Syria? At least two of the three teenagers


went to this small local mosque. Their parents believe that it was an


Imam here who encouraged their sons to go to Syria. We have just been to


the mosque to speak to the Imam, he refused to give us an interview, but


he completely denies these allegations. Ali and his two friends


set out from Coventry travelling to Birmingham where they then flew to


Frankfurt and from there to Turkey. They are now believed to be in


Syria, near the city of Aleppo. The police were informed of their


absence just after they flew out. It was too late. The father of one of


the other teenagers who travelled with Ali told me that family members


went to the Turkish Syrian border in the hope of finding the boys. Rashid


hasn't told his family much about his activities in Syria, but they


are worried he has joined ISIS. They tried to bring him back if possible


they would find him somewhere in Turkey or somewhere. But they didn't


find him. After 15 or 16 days. They came back, empty handed. That must


have been very difficult for you? Yeah, it is also dangerous to go


there. And I don't know, maybe the border is dangerous to be there, but


any way we went to them. Because my family, my background is not


extremist, we don't like them, we hate them. I don't know what


happened to him, maybe somebody worked with him. Maybe somebody


brainwashed him. Because he was not like that. So who are these three


teenagers? Rashid was studying business, recently he became more


religious and grew a beard and attending prayers in the mosque


regularly. That didn't worry his family. At one time Ali tried to get


into modelling, but things changed and he became more religious. The


third teenager, Mohammed appeared a normal youngster and then started


expressing strong views about Syria, and apparently last month he tweeted


saying he had joined ISIS. The three young men are said to be among 500


Britons who have joined the conflict in Syria during the last three


years. MI5 says the possible threat from those returning is their number


one fright priority. But tracking all of them down after they come to


the UK will be a difficult task. The families of those boys feel helpless


and say it is up to the Government to secure their return. The one hope


is the Government. The Government and media has to help us bring them


back. That's it. I can't do, as a person, an individual person, I


can't do nothing. They are united by grief and say they just want their


sons back. If you could speak to Ali now, what


would you tell him? That was Ali's father. He believes


his son is now fighting Jihad. We're joined by our guests from The Muslim


Council of Britain, Lord Carlyle the former reviewer of terrorism in


Britain. And a former extremist and expert on radicalisation.


I wanted to start with you, these families think their sons have been


radicalised by an Imam from the local mosque. What would be your


response to that? I think if we have evidence of this then our police and


our Security Services have to take action against this individual. I


believe that this is a very complex area, I don't believe one single


speech can turn someone. The footage showed concern about the young boys


growing beards, all my sons, those who are of that age have beards, I


have a very long beard. I think we need to be very, very careful and


sensitive about how we tackle the whole issue. But this is not about


beards and this is not coming from outside, this is the parents who are


saying that over a course of months they believe the messages that were


coming out from one individual in one mosque was influencing their


sons to the point where they took off to fight for their lives? Indeed


it is not about beards that is what I'm saying, we don't trivialise this


into discussions about beards. These are teenagers, let's look at maybe


Shiraz can tell us more about this, what life have these teenagers seen.


They have grown up through a decade of wars and fighting on the back of


an illegal war in Iraq, the wars in Afghanistan. They have grown through


measures of security and county councillor terrorism which are


unprecedented. They have gone through a period of demonisation in


the media, every single day their faith and their... Does that sound


right to you, is that what is at root here, we are going back to the


war in Iraq or is this now about a much more localised fight within


Iran, within Syria? I agree it is an incredibly complex problem, we have


to avoid demonising young Muslim men, particularly as 99. 9%


recurring of Muslims in this country are totally opposed to this kind of


action. And indeed I think the authorities would confirm that the


closest and most important partners in detecting people who might become


terrorists and deradicalising them are the Muslim community themselves.


Mothers, wives, sisters, do not want their husbands, brothers, sons to


become Jihadists and run the risk of being killed in a Civil War. But we


have to have a more structured approach to it. The Prevent Policy,


that part of counter terrorism focussed on antiradicalisation is


working extremely well in some place, Middlesborough, and to a


great extent Birmingham, despite recent education problems. But there


are other places it is barely functioning at all. And we need to


ensure that the funding that the Home Office provides is used to best


advantage, and not, by the way, by the police. Is that really right


then, it comes down to funding, it comes down to sort of the


localisation of places where Prevent is working and it isn't. You know


what it is like to have been extremist. Is it that easily


stopped? I think the issue now with Prevent and these types of


programmes is they were very much focussed in the past to dealing with


a kind of civilisational conflict, the idea that the west was at war in


Islam, so Prevent was trying to suck out some of the heat and tension


people felt around those issues. That narrative is completely


changed, this is where I would disagree with the Sheikh. People


talking about the conflict in Syria and the conflict in Iraq are not


being motivated by the same narratives of the past, they are


being motivated now by a sectarian conflict, where they believe they


have the opportunity to go in and affect change on the ground and


establish a Khalafit. Are there British fighters in Iraq? Not that


we know. I was speaking to a British member of ISIS, he says there are no


Brits as yet that have crossed over. This is their group, this is their


organisation, they are waiting for their Marching orders. -- marching


orders. Do you believe it has to come from within the mosques or the


Muslim communities or is it work for the police or the legislation? In


the past we have seen preachers who have operated, who have radicalised


people and sort of inspired them to do things. What is slightly


different now about the Syrian conflict is the use of social media.


That is the single most important recruitment driver at the moment. In


the past what you would have is you would get an Al-Qaeda video that


would be union low-directional, and tell people to do things. Now you


have hundreds of fighters on the ground giving a live feed on what is


happening and they engage in conversation. We see young people


reaching out to them saying you are in Syria, just like me, how can I be


part of this. It is the individual people who have become empowered to


become recruiters in their own right. We have all seen the viral


videos preaching hate, I guess the question is where are the viral


videos that don't preach hate. Are the voices loud enough saying this


is a dumb thing to do? Absolutely, we can't dismiss the fertile ground


that is present in the decade or two in which these young people have


grown up, which has allowed them to sow the seeds of that anger and


hatred. What we need to say is The Muslim Council of Britain is very,


very clear with the position of Islam and as British Muslims that


this is wrong. To go and involve ourselves in conflict abroad doesn't


serve anybody any good. The way you can help the people of Iraq, to help


the people of Syria is to remain in this country. Do you think that


voice is being heard? No I don't. We do hear it from The Muslim Council


of Britain? I don't, I think the counter narrative is weak, if there


is a weakness in the Prevent Policy, it is that it does not build a


sufficient counter narrative. There is a weakness which I would urge


very respectfully upon the Sheikh is that the Muslim communities are


dominated by rather older men and there are plenty of young leaders


out there, young men and women, brilliant in the professions and


business, who would be like to be given the leadership of that


community and would be able to present a more convincing counter


narrative than we are receiving at the moment. At the end of the day,


what we are doing is not only trying to prevent people taking part in


heretical, violent extremism, religiously heretical violent


extremism, but we are trying to do our duty of protecting it our own


country and citizens from violence. But the state cannot tell young


Muslim men how to interpret their own religion, it has to come from


the newer members and the invigorated members, presumably you


agree with that? The state has no business in the interpretation and


practice of religion, where I would support the suggestion about the


counter narrative is let's strengthen it. Let's work


collectively together. If we put this problem at the doors of Imams


and mosques and say that is your problem and you deal with it, we


won't see any success. Let's see in Coventry we have seen it. Let us


work together, collectively, Government agencies, Muslim


communities, Imams and wider society. These boys are not Muslim


boys, they are British boys, these are our boys who have gone away. It


feels like we have been this sort of narrative chat for ten years, a


decade almost, and yet it doesn't, it hasn't stopped the next round of


fighters going to ISIS? No it wasn't. What we're seeing is the


debate has morphed unfortunately. The discourse has shied into the


intra-Muslim. The strength of feeling hasn't changed? It has


morphed into a new stage. Before the state was talking about what it was


doing, and telling Muslims its policies weren't weighted against


them for example. Now you have this very dynamic internal situation in


Syria and Iraq that we don't really have a stake in, the Government has


to find smarter ways. One thing is could do is highlight the fact of


all the British deaths in Syria, only one came from a fighter


fighting against the regime, all the rest game from the infighting. They


are going through to fight in gangs against one another, they are not


fighting the regime. . Thank you for coming in.


This was the day the three jeers journalists imprisoned in the Cairo


jail for six months expected to walk free. Instead they were met with


seven-year prison sentences, one longer, a stark reminder of the


incomprehensible Egyptian legal system and its attempts to censor


press freedom. They were charged with attempting to oust the Muslim


Brotherhood. Jeers has called the sentences outrageously, Al-Jazeera


has called the sentences outrageous. They expected to be freed through


lack of evidence. When the sentences were read out the court erupted.


Peter Greste punched the bars in frustration, the families received


the news dumb founded in their homes. Peter Greste and five other


defendants present, my God, my God, sorry. That's crazy. The charges


against them are helping a terrorist group in spreading false news,


spurious charges, their news organisation claimed, politically


and economically motivated. The British PM and the US Secretary of


State have been quick to condemn the verdicts and their sentences.


It is a chilling and draconian sentence. You know it is deeply


disturbing to see in the midst of Egypt's transition. It simply cannot


stand if Egypt is going to be able to move forward in the way that


Egypt needs to move forward. What is still unclear is how quickly an


appeal process can begin and whether the international voices of


condemnation are prepared to add actions to their words. A little


while ago I spoke to Peter Greste's brother, Michael, who was in court


today. What did you go through when you


heard that verdict being handed down? I was just stunned, to begin


with. I couldn't believe what I just heard, I still have difficulty in


comprehending it all. It is just a totally baffling and utterly


disappointing and deflating decision. And you had to make the


phone call to your parents back home. Yeah, there was a very tough


call to make. Obviously my parents are extremely distressed and upset


by the decision as well. But we will have to pick ourselves up and


continue to fight. What do you think Peter's response will be to this


now? Look it is very hard to say, quite often we go into the prison


after a court appearance and what seems like a bit of a setback and


think that we have to go and pick him up, but only to find that he's


the one who is ending up picking us up. He's extremely strong in


character and very resolved. Can you describe the conditions he's in at


the moment, how is he living? They are quite depressing, he shares a


cell with his two other colleagues. The cell is three by four metres in


area. There is a very small opening in the door to their cell and then


there's another very small window which is very high up on the wall.


They don't receive any direct sunlight at this time of year. And


they are locked away in that cell for 23 hours of the day. That's six


days a week, and on Friday they are locked away for the whole day. So


they are permitted reading material and newspapers but any other form of


entertainment is refused. I tried to take a deck of cards in with me on a


visit and that was just handed straight back to me and refused. The


boys tried to fashion a rudimentry homemade sort of back gammon board


but that was taken off them. Extremely hard and oppressive


conditions. Do you think that US money is able to open doors now. We


know some $700 million have come in through security and military


assistance, is this the route that you think Egypt will take to release


them? It is very difficult to identify, but obviously you know if


they have any form of diplomatic pressure and encouragement to you


know produce a just and fair result is to be commended and encouraged.


We don't have any control over those decisions, but certainly diplomacy


is another avenue that we would strongly you know appreciate and


condone. Do you feel that the international community has been as


supportive as they can over this? It is difficult to assess, but I


certainly think after today's decision there has been a very


strong and huge backlash from the international community and that is


encouraging signs. What is your final message to the Egyptian


Government tonight? I would like them to think about and have a look


at the decision that has been made and if they are truly on the path to


democracy then they will review the decision and overturn it. And you


know free these journalist who is are completely innocent and have no


guilt whatsoever towards the charges that they faced. Thank you very


much, thank you. I'm joined now from Doha by the British journalist from


all mal areas year a, Al-Jazeera. I wonder if this has made you think


twice about reporting as a journalist? Not at all. I have been


a reporter for 25 years, 12 of those with Channel 4 News in the UK. And


you know it is kind of what I always wanted to do for a living and I


probably will die still doing this job. This is a horrendous setback


for all of us involved in this. For all of Al Jazeera now, who are


looking to the guys in prison and wondering how they can pick


themselves up and stay positive and keep fighting this decision by the


Egyptian and to get them out. And we are not going to stop being


journalists, we may not be able to report from Cairo, but we will


certainly try to report what is going on in Egypt still. One of the


most insidious responses to something like this is often


self-censorship, I wonder inside Al Jazeera, there has been a change or


shift, is there in the way you are reporting news or willing to report


news? Not at all. I mean most of my colleagues here are English, a lot


of them I would say are former BBC journalists, former ITN, former ABC,


NBC journalists. We all come from different backgrounds from much of


the western media. And we all, we come toal jazz AlJazeera with


different attitude, we won't censor ourselves, we work in countries all


over the world and have different bureaus all over the world. A lot of


the time we are facing different environments. I covered the whole


Libyan revolution, and had been in and out of Syria in a lot of years


in different conflict zones we don't self-censorship our selves in that


respect and never will. Michael hinted today the intnational


community had rallied but possibly not enough beforehand. I wonder if


you felt that there wasn't enough strength of feeling before today


happened for your colleagues? No, I wouldn't say that, I have been all


over, trying to keep this campaign going, I have been to DC to talk to


the state department, I have been in the UK Foreign Office, we have been


talking to all the different media channels across the world. They have


done everything they can think of to try to put pressure on the Egyptian


Government. The one thing possibly I would say is we all started to


believe the best was going to happen today. From when the Al Jazeera


Arabic journalist was released last week after being on hunger strike,


we thought maybe Egypt's tide had turned, he hadn't charges against


him and the authorities released him. Maybe they were recognising the


guys that we had in prison here would also be released because all


they were doing is their jobs as. We know there is six days to appeal,


many thanks for that. She had a ring side seat throughout


the presidential lifetime of one of the world's greatest statesmen ever


Zelda L e Grange became his most trusted confidant, a self-confessed


racist who voted in favour of apartheid. She described Mandela's


views on schtum had a, Thatcher and Jeremy Clarkson, I asked her how her


views had changed. I was a racist and happily lived apartheid and


happily did so up to the age of 23. Because it was completely acceptable


in my environment to live apartheid. Was there ever a voice in your head


at that time questioning what you had been brought up to believe? Up


to the age of 23 nothing, not one single question. I voted against the


abolishment of apartheid in our last referendum in South Africa, that's


how strongly I felt to protect the white supremacy in South Africa.


Fast forward and you were working in the administrative department of the


President's office. You met him and you had an urge to apologise? Yes,


it is the strangest feeling and set of emotions that you can experience,


suddenly the man I feared my entire life, that I thought was my enemy


extends a hand to me, and speaks to me in my home language. I have to


ask him to repeat himself because I was so shocked I didn't realise he


was speaking to me in Afrikaans, my own language. Immediately you go


into shock. Then I could see he was visibly old, I could see the


kindness in his eyes and the sincerity of his smile. I was just


overcome by emotion, I was crying, I was really full on sobbing. You feel


sonsable responsible and I wanted to apologise immediately. Why didn't


you? First of all he didn't give me a chance, he was asking too many


questions. Secondly he could see that I was crying, so I think that


may have been an indication to him that I felt sorry, you know. I felt


I had remorse. Do you think there was a guilt element as well, do you


think that was why? From my side or his side, from my side. I think at


first definitely but after a while it was really I poured my heart and


soul into supporting this man. Not because I felt guilty but really


because I started adoring him, because he was really interested in


me, he gave me the opportunity of a lifetime. So you have to reciprocate


and I did so with loyalty. It sounds like you were a bit in love with


him? As a grandfather figure, almost, maybe, yes. I was never


blind to his mistakes. We had difficult times. You know having


different opinions about things. He knew I was very niave, I was stupid


and young, and not schooled really for that job. But he kind of took me


and moulded me. You were important to him, as an Afrikaner. It was


important to show the world he was representative of all minority


groups even those who represented the apartheid Government. He didn't


only allay fears with the Afrikaneres and the people who


represented those people but the rest of the world. Once in office


the world stateman there was a steady stream of celebrities who


would come paying homage, whatever, what did you make of the way people


treated him, and the questions they asked. You were a fly-on-the-wall?


He had a special way of attracting a particular kind of person. And he


became friends with certain people over the years, from the


celebrities, and the heads of state. Because of certain qualities in


those mostly respect. You also relate to people and you judge


people based on how they treat him. If it was respectful I liked people


who were respectful towards him. And if it wasn't. You cite the Jeremy


Clarkson moment? I think maybe that was just a clash of personalities


maybe. And Jeremy not understanding what to expect of a person of over


90 years old. Talk us through what happened, I have only heard a very


sketchy explanation for what happened, but you can tell? First of


all when Jeremy walked in he said oh Mr Mandela have you ever had a lap


dance. Now a person of that age doesn't really know what a lap dance


is, I don't know if people over 90 know what lap dance is, but I didn't


expect him to know and he appeared confused Mr Mandela and he looked at


me expecting me to rescue him in a way and I felt sorry for him of


course. I said to him no you don't have to answer that. What was Mr


Mandela's sense of where South Africa was heading after him z he


talk to you about the rule of Mbeki or stem ma? -- Zuma. He withdrew


from politics, and he wasn't as involved as he wanted to be. He


wanted to focus more on his family in his free time. He wasn't


interested in politics any longer. Not interested or disappointed? I


think he felt he did his duty and he couldn't do anything else. The one


thing he couldn't stand was dishonesty, and South Africa has a


problem right now with corruption. If Mr Mandela was in power and there


was corruption, he would deal with it immediately. The implication that


those that came after him didn't live up to that? They need to go


back to what people sacrificed their lives for. This is my opinion, this


is what Nelson Mandela, these people they sacrificed their lives for the


freedom of South Africans. We need to go back to those ideals. Thank


you. The F-word in Polish is something a few more of us may be


familiar with tonight. It was used extensively by their Foreign


Minister to describe David Cameron's incompetence in Europe. He didn't,


needless to say realise his conversation with his former Finance


Minister was being recorded, but the content, now released to a Polish


magazine about previous negotiations some months back are still pretty


devastating. David Cameron has this evening tweeted of a full and frank


conversation on the commission President. But there is a growing


sense in many quarters that the Polish minister could well be on the


money. I warn you if you speak Polish the following report contains


the original audio. Oxford man, Bullingdon Club member, a


distinguished minister who, until at least recently has been favourite to


succeed Baroness Ashton as Europe's Foreign Policy Chief. But in truth,


he's never been a fan of David Cameron's Europe policy. It is


difficult to lead a club which you are considering whether to stay in


or leave. So, yes, in that since you have weakened your hand. Now comes


something much harder to hear for the British Government. Bugged


conversations between Mr Sikorski and former Finance Minister, leaked


to a Polish news magazine, who have shared some of the material with


Newsnight. The polls give Mr Cameron both verbals -- the Poles give Mr


Cameron both verbal barrels. TRANSLATION: He thinks he can go,


renegotiate and come back, no Polish Government can agree with that, only


in exchange for a mountain of gold. TRANSLATION: It is thought through


move his incompetence in European affairs, remember he locked up the


fiscal part, he locked it up, simple as that, because he's not


interested, because he doesn't get it because he believes in this


stupid prop beganed DACHLT he stupidly tries to manipulate the


system. Tonight he condemned the leak as a crime. Demned


TRANSLATION: The Government was attacked by an organised criminal


group, we hope to gain the identity of the group members and first of


all their leaders. And that they will be identified and obviously


punished. But for the Prime Minister who played host today to outgoing


President of the European Council, the leaks could be highly


embarrassing showing that other Europeans think he is attempting to


change Europe before a referendum will fail. But for the Prime


Minister, who played host today to the outgoing President of the


European Council, the leaks could be highly embarrassing. Showing that


other Europeans think his attempts to change Europe before holding a


referendum will fail. TRANSLATION: I think paradoxically you know what


the consequences will be for us. TRANSLATION: Yes. TRANSLATION: Not


particularly good for us, generally bad for us, because we want Great


Britain to stay in. I think that it will be like this, he will lose this


election, Great Britain leaves. The leak comes at a perilous moment for


the Prime Minister, whose unsuccessful attempt to block the


candidacy of Jean-Claude Juncker as the next President of the European


Commission is causing tensions with Germany. The Polish tape scandal


comes at a particularly difficult time for Mr Cameron's Europe policy.


Germany is hardening its support for Mr Juncker. We have been told that


the Germans would regard any attempt by Britain to block his appointment


as a betrayal of rules agreed by all European countries seven years ago


with the Lisbon Treaty. The risks for Mr Cameron now are many, for


having invested so much prestige in stopping Mr Juncker, if he fails it


will empower the euro-sceptics. And those who share the private view of


his abilities expressed by the Polish Foreign Minister.


With me I have the chairman of Business for New Europe. And Peter


Liley, touted as a possible choice for the UK commissioner. . When you


have one of Cameron's mates talking like this, you kind of wonder who


needs enemies? He seemed to be in a rather foul-mouthed and thoughtless


mood, it brought discredit on him and absolutely no discredit to the


Prime Minister. Except what he was saying was "incompetence". He used


lots of foul words and some other insults. But they discredit him by


the very use. What he did say more rationally when he got on to that is


it was not in Poland's interest that Britain should leave Europe. I take


it from that they will be prepared to make concessions to work hard, to


keep us in, and I hope they do. Leave the obscenities aside and he


was talking about Cameron losing the next election, being driven by


stupid propaganda. He used the word "election", everything clearly


referring to the referendum. He talked about the problems with the


fiscal pact. Here is somebody who clearly does not believe's on the


right trajectory with what he's fighting for, whether or not he used


swear words? He also said it would not be in Poland's interest that


Britain leaves. I heard that. That I think means that we have a strong


position. It is not in anyone's interest in Europe that we leave. If


they want to keep us in, then they should reach accommodations. That is


how Europe ought to work. It shouldn't be take it or leave it,


let's ignore Britain's interest and everything. When all three parties


in Britain take the same view of Mr Juncker, and the manner in which he


is being foisted upon us, it is unwise, I would have thought, for


our friends and colleagues in Europe to ignore are. Just because you are


isolated doesn't mean you are wrong? No it doesn't, to be fair to the


Prime Minister there is no question that Angela Merkel was on his side


at the beginning of this. She faces a backlash from her own MPs in


parliament who were absolutely adamant that Juncker should be, and


she folded and went with them. Of course it is a salutary warning that


we can't put all our eggs in the German basket, we have to build out


and build consensus. He should have chosen different language or broken


with her? You can't completely rely on one person, however even if it is


the most powerful person in Europe to get what you want. You have to


build allies right across. Which is precisely what I was trying to do. I


think that the Polish President said that was right, Britain is couching


its policies in terms of pan-European, not just in terms of


concessions, if we do that we will be sorely disappointed. Shouldn't he


have stuck his neck out, wasn't there a more diplomatic way of doing


this than clearly holding a position he has now lost? You don't win


anything. I had to negotiate for ten years with colleagues in Europe, we


never won if we didn't put our view forcefully and courteously and


winning as many allies across the world which is David Cameron is


doing. Are you suggesting every time you are not certain you could win


you should give in without a fight. You shouldn't give in, but you have


to realise you have lost this one, there is no point in having a vote


and finding you are just with Oban in Hungary, a pretty illiberal


country as it is. You don't want to be with that regime. You want to


fight for the reform agenda right now and try to get serious


concessions in terms of reform, rather than fighting an old battle


that has been lost. I guess the deal you will be looking at is one


possibly that will save face for Cameron, a good commissioner


position, do you know who is in the ring for that. Can I ask you whether


you have put your name into the ring or whether you would accept the job?


It is not up to me to put my name in the rin if I was offered it I would


accept it. Have you talked to anyone about it? I have talk to to people


but I haven't -- talked to people but I haven't been offered it and


they haven't come and talked to me. From the top end of Government? No,


so I probably won't be it. But it is a terribly important job, it is


important that we have someone with the right qualifications, who is not


going to go native as soon as they get the job and starting working for


a federal Europe but for the sort of Europe that Britain wants. And


someone who puts arguments cogently and forcefully within a democracy.


Do you think the barricades are up against whoever takes on that role,


do you think there is negotiation to be done. What can they win in that


role? I talk to ambassadors to a country quite close to us, he said


unfortunately we don't do consolation prizes in this game. It


will be tough. What I would add to what Peter said, you need somebody


with those qualities but who is actually willing to make allies and


actually fight for the corner in terms of fighting for what's


possible and not just fighting battles that look good back here,


but actually are achievable in Europe. Thank you both very much.


The second most highly paid athlete in the world has shown her rise on


the tennis stage. She graced Centre Court earlier today, in her only


television interslew she talked -- interview, she talked ahead of


Wimbledon. The most successful tennis player in Asian history.


She's the face of the Chinese game. Today she began her Wimbledon


campaign. She is fresh from winning the Australian Open, the second


Grand Slam of her career. The world number two may have passed you by,


but she's huge in China. Thanks to the TV close-ups so is her husband.


My husband is famous in China! She may like to repeat a joke but she's


witty for a sports star. I think I have to tell the truth. My husband


is more famous than me, no really, every time if I was working ing or


walking with my friend, nobody sees me, if I was walking with him they


are like this is Li Na's husband! Li Na is the second-highest female paid


athlete in the world, thanks to a string of endorsements from


companies who see her as their ticket to the increasingly lucrative


Chinese market. Such is our power she's the only player with a Nike


deal who can wear other sponsors on her clothes. She has helped


transform the Chinese tennis scene too, when she started out hardly


anybody played, now 15 million people do. The all England lawn


tennis club is hoping to use this Wimbledon tournament to lure more of


China's wealthy middle-class to a sport that is still not as popular


as ping pong. How many people are playing in China? A lot. Only in


Beijing, one city they have over 3,000 tennis courts. But always


fully booked, if you want to play you have to book in before. Is it a


massive transformation. Your parents I think when you started and the


coach said she should play tennis, they hadn't even heard of it? They


had never heard about tennis, what is tennis? Turns out tennis was the


game that brought Li Na $23 million so far, but it cost her. In brutal


state-run sports schools with constantly blistered palms because


there was no child-sized racquets, and knees, aged 14 she was not told


of her father's death for several days because she was playing a


tournament. She was also injected with steroids. You were never


praised you were always playing when you look back what do you see? If I


look back I think bravo for young Li Na because you never gave up, you


just continued to do that, so that is why make me famous right now. And


yet it was a bad experience at the time? This is life, you cannot have


the nice day like every day. The young Li Na was repeatedly called


stupid and pig by one coach. When she coached me in ten years she


never said I was good. She never praised you. So I was feeling a


little bit hurt in my heart. That is why after I think last year or the


year before I was coming back, talked to her again and I say hey,


look you hurt me when I was young. Can I ask, there was a video doing


the rounds from a 2001 national championship, did you see that where


you got, it looked like you were being slapped by the person giving


the medal? I think this is making a joke, it was not a slap. It wasn't a


slap? No. That video of her winning only bronze went viral in China


where she has 23 million followers on the Twitter equivalent. She's


criticised at home for not appearing grateful enough to the Chinese


state. She was cautious when I asked her was she free about writing


anything on social media. Before I put anything on I have to think is


this right or not. I worry if I send the wrong message, the people will


wrongly use it. The right news is at 32 she's playing her best tennis in


a career that has mirrored the changes in China. The tennis scene


has liberalised economically like the country and she no longer has to


give 65% of her earning to the state. If she does win Wimbledon she


still has to hand over a tenth to the tennis federation back home.


That's all we have time for. Good night from all of us here.


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