22/08/2014 Newsnight


22/08/2014

In-depth investigation and analysis of the stories behind the day's headlines with Emily Maitlis.


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Self funded and generating $40 million a month, why the finances of

:00:07.:00:16.

ISIS make it such a powerful en After the death of James Foley, the

:00:17.:00:19.

rights and wrongs of paying a ransom. We talk to a host age negoti

:00:20.:00:31.

or. The Yazidi Swire who escaped ISIS bullets and the pit he was

:00:32.:00:35.

buried in but found his entire village had been massacred. And why

:00:36.:00:42.

would a football manager in this day and age have to say this? I am no

:00:43.:00:51.

racist. I am no sexist. I'm no home ophobe and no anti-Semitic. Good

:00:52.:01:03.

evening. ISIS terror tactics are well known. Their strategies brutal

:01:04.:01:06.

and publicity seeking. What is less understood is how this terrorist

:01:07.:01:09.

group grew into a working business virtually the size of a small state.

:01:10.:01:13.

They have a glossy annual report, a business plan, and generate a

:01:14.:01:16.

revenue of - conservatively - $40 million a month. Their money comes

:01:17.:01:20.

from oil and also from extortion and kidnap ransom. But what makes the

:01:21.:01:23.

group so terrifying is how contained they have become, insulated from

:01:24.:01:26.

sanctions as they are no longer dependent on foreign funds or

:01:27.:01:30.

governments. Our economics correspondent, Duncan Weldon, looks

:01:31.:01:33.

at where its money comes from and how the self

:01:34.:01:35.

at where its money comes from and it such a powerful enemy.

:01:36.:01:43.

at where its money comes from and State is an unusually well organised

:01:44.:01:47.

terrorist group. Everything from me till louse record keeping to slickly

:01:48.:01:53.

produced videos suggest it. Floss better illustration of the their

:01:54.:01:57.

approach than the annual publication of a report detailing their

:01:58.:02:03.

activities. Complete with graphics detailing their success on things

:02:04.:02:07.

like suicide bombings and kidnappings. They are the most well

:02:08.:02:13.

funded group of their ilk we've ever seen. Like most terror groups

:02:14.:02:16.

Islamic State first relied on donors. Since 2011 Islamic State's

:02:17.:02:24.

fighting in the Syrian civil war reportedly received donations from

:02:25.:02:28.

Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Kuwait. Much of this cash apparent ly flowed

:02:29.:02:32.

through Kuwait. One of the traditional ways the Governments

:02:33.:02:37.

seek to combat organisations like IS is through cutting off the flow of

:02:38.:02:40.

finance, identifying and sanctioning is through cutting off the flow of

:02:41.:02:44.

donors and related firms. But IS is is through cutting off the flow of

:02:45.:02:47.

no long er dependent is through cutting off the flow of

:02:48.:02:48.

funds. It raises is through cutting off the flow of

:02:49.:02:55.

firmly rooted into the local is through cutting off the flow of

:02:56.:02:55.

regional economies of is through cutting off the flow of

:02:56.:03:01.

Iraq. IS's biggest source of revenue is isle. There's been a large black

:03:02.:03:06.

market in oil in the Middle East in decades. It was used by Saddam

:03:07.:03:10.

Hussein in Iraq to get round sanction,s. And it has been

:03:11.:03:14.

exploited by the complots IS has controlled several fields in Syria

:03:15.:03:18.

since 2012 and this year added four small fields in Iraq. Some of this

:03:19.:03:22.

oil is transported to Turkey, Jordan and Iran and sold on the black

:03:23.:03:29.

market for $50 to $60 a barrel. Some of it is transported to refineries

:03:30.:03:33.

in northern Syria. As these pictures show, this is dangerous work. The

:03:34.:03:39.

refined fuel is used in IS's only vehicles and sold in petrol stations

:03:40.:03:43.

in areas under their control. Taken together, crude and refine. Oil

:03:44.:03:49.

sales are currently worth around $1 million to ?3 million per day to

:03:50.:03:54.

Islamic State. There's more to Islamic State's revenue an oil. It

:03:55.:03:58.

extorts cash from local businesses in areas it controls, behaving like

:03:59.:04:03.

a Mafia protection racket. Before the capture of Mosul extortion

:04:04.:04:05.

wassest mated the capture of Mosul extortion

:04:06.:04:10.

million a month. It has almost certainly increased significantly

:04:11.:04:13.

since then. There have been reports that IS is selling captured women

:04:14.:04:19.

and girls to people traffickers. The sale of hostages is another means of

:04:20.:04:28.

cash. It asked for goods 250 million for the release of James Foley. The

:04:29.:04:31.

average price paid for the release of James Foley. The

:04:32.:04:34.

to 5 million. What are they spending all of this cash on? IS's revenues

:04:35.:04:41.

are in the region of at least $40 million a month and possibly much

:04:42.:04:45.

higher. Manchester of it goes on fighting their enemies, but not all

:04:46.:04:50.

of it. In areas they control, IS is subsidising food and water,

:04:51.:04:56.

providing basic public services and dolling out charity. This attempt to

:04:57.:04:59.

win over hearts and minds is a crucial part of their strategy. They

:05:00.:05:04.

are by far and away the best funded group of their ilk we've seen. With

:05:05.:05:09.

the funds they've got they are in a cycle that allows them to attract

:05:10.:05:13.

fighters, to buy weapons, to take more territory and more financially

:05:14.:05:16.

attractive assets. That's a psyche hall the West needs to try and

:05:17.:05:20.

break. Through conquest, extortion and oil trading IS have managed to

:05:21.:05:25.

make themselves financially self sufficient. It is increasingly

:05:26.:05:31.

looking less like a financed terror group and more Plaid Cymru a poor

:05:32.:05:39.

state. The brother of murdered hostage James Foley said today he

:05:40.:05:43.

believed the US Government could have done more to help his brother.

:05:44.:05:52.

His ransom, the unimaginable sum of $132 million, never seemed remotely

:05:53.:06:00.

realistic. I spoke to a hostage negotiator. He goes by the name of

:06:01.:06:08.

Jan. He wishes to remain anonymous. We work for anybody who has been

:06:09.:06:14.

kidnap ed. Whether that's a family, an individual or a company, a

:06:15.:06:19.

corporation, an aid agency for instance as well. How often is a

:06:20.:06:26.

ransom part of the ultimate negotiation? Quite often. It depends

:06:27.:06:32.

on the country and the area and the profile of the victim and the

:06:33.:06:38.

kidnappers. What we would always do is do our utmost not to pay a

:06:39.:06:43.

ransom, if there is another way of getting somebody released by

:06:44.:06:47.

providing some sort of concession for instance, which is not money. We

:06:48.:06:53.

would have a go at that. Quite often with aid agencies in south Asia

:06:54.:07:00.

particularly, then the aid agencies are sufficiently well liked by the

:07:01.:07:04.

local communities that if one of them is kidnapped, they can use that

:07:05.:07:11.

community leverage in order to pressure the kidnappers or persuade

:07:12.:07:16.

them to release them for no money. Ostensibly there's a real

:07:17.:07:20.

discrepancy between the way, say, British and US Governments deal with

:07:21.:07:25.

ransoms with hostages and the way the French Government deals with

:07:26.:07:29.

them. The French is more likely to pay money. Is that a good thing?

:07:30.:07:34.

Governments, particularly the Europeans, have got a very bad

:07:35.:07:38.

record now for paying far too much and far too quickly and feeding the

:07:39.:07:48.

kidnappers, the terrorists, with money. Governments are poor

:07:49.:07:53.

generally at countering kid naps, because they are seen by the

:07:54.:07:59.

kidnappers to be a bottomless pit of money. And they are also seen as

:08:00.:08:05.

being very subject to political, domestic political precious, so they

:08:06.:08:11.

pay very fast and quickly, which is exactly what kidnappers like. But

:08:12.:08:14.

essentially you're saying if the Government says we are not paying,

:08:15.:08:18.

but here's a negotiator who will work it out for you, you are still

:08:19.:08:23.

paying the ransom. You are still increasing the likelihood that more

:08:24.:08:28.

hostages will be taken. I think it is right that you try to save

:08:29.:08:32.

people's lives, innocent people who've been caught up with let's say

:08:33.:08:38.

aid agency workers on journalists who just somebody who is travelling

:08:39.:08:44.

and is kidnapped. The UK and US Governments tell us they don't pay

:08:45.:08:48.

ransoms. Is the that true? I think it is true that the US and the UK

:08:49.:08:53.

don't. I think the Europeans or some European governments have been for

:08:54.:08:57.

fairly sure. But I think what the US and UK are doing now is trying to

:08:58.:09:04.

stop people, families and corporate or companies from paying rans Oms.

:09:05.:09:08.

They are trying to ban the payment of rans Oms to terrorists. I think

:09:09.:09:15.

that is wrong. That is wrong to take out of the hands of people their own

:09:16.:09:20.

way to get their loved ones back. You can see why they are doing it,

:09:21.:09:25.

because they want to cut down on the incidence of kidnap-taking. You can

:09:26.:09:30.

and I sympathise with that entirely but I think there are more direct

:09:31.:09:33.

ways of bringing security to these areas. Again I just think it is

:09:34.:09:39.

wrong. I think legally it is very dubious to be trying to ban people

:09:40.:09:46.

from trying to save their loved ones. Jan, thank you. Joining us now

:09:47.:09:58.

is a research fellow from RUSI, the think-tank. He said it is legally

:09:59.:10:03.

dodgy ground for the Government to stop people. His explanation is

:10:04.:10:07.

dubious. He says bring security instead. That's effectively a call

:10:08.:10:11.

for world peace. We would all like to see Iraq, Syria stabilise, but

:10:12.:10:18.

that isn't going to happen. His points about not incentivising

:10:19.:10:24.

further kidnappings or funding terrorist groups, which they can use

:10:25.:10:31.

to grow. Whoever pays the ranges, pays the ransom, it makes no

:10:32.:10:35.

difference to the long-term effect of the market for hostages. You

:10:36.:10:40.

can't say if no ransom were ever paid there would be no host age

:10:41.:10:45.

taking. No, if you go back to Al-Qaeda in Iraq, they murdered many

:10:46.:10:50.

hostages brutally for pure propaganda purposes alone, so we can

:10:51.:10:53.

concede there'll certainly be hostage taking for political

:10:54.:10:59.

reasons, propaganda purposes and blew bloodshed, which is barbaric

:11:00.:11:04.

group like ISIS desires. We are not talking a bit of spare change or

:11:05.:11:09.

bonus money, but the core funding for Al-Qaeda over recent years and a

:11:10.:11:14.

significant source of the growth of this plague, the Islamic State. And

:11:15.:11:17.

yet you could say, and you could never quantify a human life in terms

:11:18.:11:22.

of money or money paid, but you could say that the response to the

:11:23.:11:29.

killing of James Foley may now be war. May now be military

:11:30.:11:33.

intervention, maybe a hardening of public opinion which is clearly

:11:34.:11:37.

going to be way more costly than paying for his release. That's an

:11:38.:11:42.

interesting argument but we know the structural conditions in Iraq and

:11:43.:11:46.

Syria point in that direction anyway. The growth of Islamic State,

:11:47.:11:50.

there are over 500 British fighters with the Islamic State, all of this

:11:51.:11:54.

means a form of confrontation with the ITV, military or otherwise, was

:11:55.:12:00.

coming. So you are saying the beheading of this hostage had very

:12:01.:12:04.

little bearing on American policy now? I think American policy has

:12:05.:12:09.

been gearing up slowly. I think it would have made a difference to

:12:10.:12:17.

Chuck Hagel's sweeping statement about ISIS being a luge threat yet,

:12:18.:12:24.

but it is inevitable they will expand air strikes. Before Foley. I

:12:25.:12:29.

think after Foley that's how it is. Clearly this is something the

:12:30.:12:31.

Americans haven't stated is explicitly, but we know our Foreign

:12:32.:12:36.

Secretary said, we will not go into business with Assad. Air strikes on

:12:37.:12:42.

Syria are presumably going to do Assad's work for him? Assad will be

:12:43.:12:49.

the beneficiary but so will those fighting Assad or the Islamic State.

:12:50.:12:53.

The Free Syrian Army or whatever we wish to call them, they've been

:12:54.:12:56.

under the Islamic State cosh. They will benefit and the question is not

:12:57.:13:00.

just does Assad benefit or not, parents by being seen to overtly

:13:01.:13:05.

work with Assad, what effect does that have on the tens of millions of

:13:06.:13:09.

disenfranchised Sunnis who support we need to ultimately defeat the

:13:10.:13:13.

Islamic State? That's a bigger issue. Not does Assad benefit but is

:13:14.:13:18.

this going to help us peel Sunnis away from the Islamic State? I think

:13:19.:13:24.

overt active co-operation with Assad doesn't fulfil that objective. Thank

:13:25.:13:31.

you. What about those who survive ISIS but find themselves narrators

:13:32.:13:34.

of the terrible events they've witnessed with. One Yazidi man from

:13:35.:13:40.

northern Iraq tells Newsnight of the day his vic near Sinjar was

:13:41.:13:45.

surrounded by ISIS militants. They rounded up the men, shot them and

:13:46.:13:51.

buried them en masse. Rafid Said Amu fled but a thousand of his fellow

:13:52.:13:56.

villagers disappeared. He told his story. Hospitals in northern Iraq

:13:57.:14:03.

are struggling to cope with the influx of both wounded

:14:04.:14:06.

are struggling to cope with the military personnel, as Kurdish

:14:07.:14:09.

are struggling to cope with the Iraqi soldiers tried to push back

:14:10.:14:14.

against the IS offensive here. There are daily skirmishes. We are in the

:14:15.:14:17.

largest hospital in Dahuk, where many of the wounded are brought.

:14:18.:14:21.

This is the emergency room. I've seen a number

:14:22.:14:22.

This is the emergency room. I've being treated. This is also where

:14:23.:14:28.

they brought victims of a recent massacre.

:14:29.:14:32.

they brought victims of a recent five times during the massacre of

:14:33.:14:38.

non-Muslims by ISIS militants in a village near Sinjar. At least 80 men

:14:39.:14:42.

each the minorityies sect were rounded up and shot dead. Women and

:14:43.:14:45.

children were abducted. When they were surrounding you in

:14:46.:15:47.

your village, what was happening, what were they telling you?

:15:48.:17:21.

He told me he walked for about 12 hours, finally reaching Mount Sinjar

:17:22.:18:11.

in the dead of night. He says between 40 and 50 of the villagers

:18:12.:18:14.

rounded up with him died in the massacre. Where are the rest of the

:18:15.:18:17.

family? Do you know what happened to your

:18:18.:18:31.

wife and your children? Yalda Hakim speaking to the sole

:18:32.:18:39.

survivor. To give Malky Mackay credit,

:18:40.:19:05.

his text messages suggest he was indiscriminate

:19:06.:19:08.

in his discrimination. His racist, sexist, homophobic,

:19:09.:19:10.

anti-Semitic comments suggest he Today came a full-scale apology

:19:11.:19:12.

and a reminder that anyone who had their personal texts scrutinised

:19:13.:19:17.

would probably be in But it was the phrase that followed

:19:18.:19:19.

the texts, a plea to dismiss them as friendly banter, which some

:19:20.:19:23.

found most offensive of all. A new term has been added to the

:19:24.:19:31.

offensive language Mexican and that word may just be banter -- the

:19:32.:19:42.

offensive language lexicon. The text stream was between Malky Mackay and

:19:43.:19:49.

Iain Moody. Markey Mackay apparently covers the full gamut of offence,

:19:50.:19:52.

racist, anti-Semitic and sexist. It was something that was

:19:53.:20:11.

unacceptable, but as far as I am concerned, I have been in a

:20:12.:20:16.

multicultural football environment for 20 years. I love British

:20:17.:20:24.

football. I am no racist, I am no sexist, I am no homophobe, I am no

:20:25.:20:32.

anti-Semitic. The text messages have been condemned but a lone figure let

:20:33.:20:38.

to his defence. Show me someone who has never made a mistake and I will

:20:39.:20:44.

show you a liar. He has not murdered anyone, he is not a rapist, he is

:20:45.:20:48.

not a paedophile. He has made a mistake, a big mistake, but it

:20:49.:20:52.

should not finish his football career. The LMA has apologised for

:20:53.:21:00.

its wording and accepted it is beyond argument that it was

:21:01.:21:03.

discriminatory, a window has been opened onto the part of footballing

:21:04.:21:08.

world that they have tried so hard to shut. Have things changed or has

:21:09.:21:14.

the beautiful game managed to bury its beautiful side?

:21:15.:21:18.

I am joined now by former footballer turned pundit,

:21:19.:21:20.

Mark Bright, and the award-winning sports writer, Matthew Syed. Malky

:21:21.:21:26.

When you have a manager saying, I am not anti-Semitic, I am not a

:21:27.:21:36.

homophobe, it is a strange state of affairs. This is about far more than

:21:37.:21:43.

Markey Mackay and Iain Moody. There are no black managers. No women

:21:44.:21:49.

managers. No women working in youth team football. No openly gay

:21:50.:21:54.

footballers. That is what the situation is in football. It hints

:21:55.:21:58.

at a culture going way beyond one man, these two men. That is the

:21:59.:22:03.

issue football has to address. It is deeper and wider. You were pretty

:22:04.:22:11.

shocked. We talked on the phone. How wide do you think this goes?

:22:12.:22:16.

Everyone in football condemns what they have said. No one can put up a

:22:17.:22:23.

case with them. I have been in Iain Moody's company since he joined the

:22:24.:22:28.

club, in the boardroom, travelling, he has never said anything untoward

:22:29.:22:32.

to me. There have always been rumours and when it came out, the

:22:33.:22:38.

content of the texts, I was shocked. I did not think in 2014 anyone is

:22:39.:22:42.

going to write it down never mind think it. You said write it down,

:22:43.:22:47.

the defence Harry Redknapp tried to put up was

:22:48.:22:50.

the defence Harry Redknapp tried to away looking good if their text

:22:51.:22:53.

messages were scrutinised. Any of us. I don't know. Would you be

:22:54.:22:57.

comfortable someone going us. I don't know. Would you be

:22:58.:23:02.

phone? Does he have a point? Depends what it says. Has

:23:03.:23:08.

phone? Does he have a point? Depends their friends about their boss? That

:23:09.:23:12.

goes on. But that is discrimination. It is wrong. Every box ticked. And

:23:13.:23:20.

yet every time you go and watch a game, there are adverts and the

:23:21.:23:27.

thing about combating racism and homophobia, is that just the surface

:23:28.:23:36.

question might the reality is a disaster. The spin is good. Better

:23:37.:23:41.

than it was. -- is that just the surface? Football lags behind. Why?

:23:42.:23:49.

If you work at a big corporate institution, you are told by the

:23:50.:23:53.

very very strenuous page our department that it is unacceptable

:23:54.:24:01.

to use racist, sexist, homophobic terminology as banter. In football

:24:02.:24:07.

clubs, on the training pitch, homophobic epithets used as terms of

:24:08.:24:13.

abuse. It is just a group of young guys, a bit of banter. Let me

:24:14.:24:18.

finish, if I made? This is a place of work. If there is a gay person

:24:19.:24:23.

not out of the closet... They are not going to say, it is out of

:24:24.:24:27.

order. They might not want to be identified. Think of the attritional

:24:28.:24:32.

affected that will have. They do not understand that this is not just

:24:33.:24:36.

banter, it is not just a group of guys having a kick around, it is a

:24:37.:24:41.

place of work. They need to have the same rules as big companies. I have

:24:42.:24:48.

heard players told the manager to F off on the training ground. Anywhere

:24:49.:24:53.

else, you lose your job. In football, you don't. You can't down

:24:54.:24:58.

on the manager comes down and you say sorry and move on. -- you calm

:24:59.:25:04.

down. What is your point, it is not going to change? It is not banter.

:25:05.:25:10.

It is an exchange on the pitch against each other and the manager

:25:11.:25:13.

and the player, when you are in training... I mean, we were talking

:25:14.:25:20.

before and I said, Jeremy Clarkson has come out with a couple of

:25:21.:25:26.

things, close to the knuckle, he is still employed. You talk about

:25:27.:25:29.

football having a problem... Really interesting. Thank you very much.

:25:30.:25:36.

The Budleigh is the perky and hold of butterflies who seek out

:25:37.:25:38.

The Budleigh is the perky and hold nectar but to government officials

:25:39.:25:42.

and Network Rail it is a scourge smothering native plants and

:25:43.:25:47.

damaging infrastructure with its restless pen draws. It has been

:25:48.:25:53.

branded a non-native invader. In the late summer zenith, it is

:25:54.:25:57.

unbelievably common. Here is Steven Smith. What could be more restful?

:25:58.:26:11.

Yet we need to be on our guard against a threat on our very

:26:12.:26:16.

doorstep. On the white Cliffs of Dover themselves. They comes in the

:26:17.:26:21.

deceptively innocuous guys of a foreign invader. The buddleia. Is it

:26:22.:26:30.

a case of us and then with the buddleia? You have to admire these

:26:31.:26:36.

plants, but they are causing a lot of damage to wildlife. I think it is

:26:37.:26:41.

wonderful and vibrant and colourful. Let buddleias rule. You may have

:26:42.:26:49.

admired it from a railway carriage. In fact, you can hardly have missed

:26:50.:26:55.

it. It flourishes where other plants shrivel. Dry soil, cracks in mortar.

:26:56.:27:05.

It is a supreme opportunist, on the front, park rangers like this man

:27:06.:27:10.

keeping watch under the famous chalky sentinels, the home guard. It

:27:11.:27:16.

is a nature reserve that is protected for its very rare wild

:27:17.:27:22.

flowers and particularly its very rare assemblage of insects. Hundreds

:27:23.:27:26.

of insects that have been recorded here which are often not recorded

:27:27.:27:30.

anywhere else in Britain. It is very dense. You could not force your way

:27:31.:27:38.

through. This is what buddleia does. The shade kills off everything

:27:39.:27:41.

growing underneath. All of the wild flowers, grass, the insects and

:27:42.:27:47.

butterflies depend on them and they are not there any more. This is part

:27:48.:27:55.

of the buddleia? The Jan has eliminated almost everything. -- the

:27:56.:28:02.

buddleia. At garden centres like this one, customers are wild for

:28:03.:28:09.

buddleia though it can smother some plants. Paradoxically it is also

:28:10.:28:12.

known as a haunt of mature butterflies. We are up 20% on year

:28:13.:28:20.

to date. People are passionate about wildlife because of the decline of

:28:21.:28:26.

butterflies and ladybirds, they want to encourage these into their

:28:27.:28:31.

gardens again. This is the perfect thing. It flowers all summer until

:28:32.:28:36.

autumn and it is really pretty. Whitehall officials describe

:28:37.:28:41.

buddleia as invasive and purge gardeners to deadhead the plants

:28:42.:28:49.

before they can seed -- and they purge gardeners. The garden

:28:50.:28:55.

centre's star employee spruces the place up in honour of gardening

:28:56.:29:01.

royalty. Very nice to see you again. I hope you like the set we have

:29:02.:29:08.

bowled for you. What about these plants, the name of which I have

:29:09.:29:13.

momentarily forgotten, but I know you know what they are and they are

:29:14.:29:16.

running riot all over the country at the moment. Buddleias. When you

:29:17.:29:23.

think of a British garden, you think of buddleias and butterflies, maybe

:29:24.:29:33.

an Edwardian wall space, what harm does the buddleia of suburbia do?

:29:34.:29:39.

Genius! I see a range of gardening accessories. This could be huge. A

:29:40.:29:46.

garden is a melting pot so many different cultures, so many

:29:47.:29:50.

different places. Look how it combines beautifully and that is

:29:51.:29:54.

what this country has always been good at. Towards the end of August,

:29:55.:30:02.

do you have any gardening tips? Should they be deadheading anything?

:30:03.:30:09.

Hydrangeas. Fine when I last checked them out. On a clear day, you can

:30:10.:30:17.

look out to France across The Channel, the source of so many

:30:18.:30:21.

earlier threats to this green and pleasant land. Meanwhile the French

:30:22.:30:26.

can look back at us and see our buddleia. We leave you with a treat.

:30:27.:30:32.

As part of Newsnight's Proms preview, we enter night with the

:30:33.:30:37.

principal cellist with the London Symphony at playing the haunting

:30:38.:30:42.

Linguae Ignis, or Tongues of Fire, by Peter Maxwell Davies. Good night.

:30:43.:30:48.

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