12/02/2016 Newsnight


12/02/2016

In-depth investigation and analysis with Kirsty Wark. The Syrian opposition leader talks about the ceasefire. Plus a look behind the scenes at the new ROH ballet.


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Transcript


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Is the Syrian ceasefire no more than smoke and mirrors?

:00:00.:00:17.

We have an exclusive interview with a key opposition leader.

:00:18.:00:24.

We'll discuss how all this squares with Assad's boast that he'll retake

:00:25.:00:27.

As the people's bank tries to hatch entrepreneurs,

:00:28.:00:33.

RBS's chief executive warns that the possibility of a Brexit

:00:34.:00:37.

is already taking its toll on business.

:00:38.:00:43.

I think the issue we've got is just the uncertainty. It might slow

:00:44.:00:50.

business is down and over time slowdown banking as well.

:00:51.:00:52.

And in this week's Artsnight, museum director Maria Balshaw looks

:00:53.:00:54.

A woman is still deemed to be representative of her whole gender.

:00:55.:01:06.

So if she's a failure then we're all failures. However, if she's a

:01:07.:01:09.

success, she is the exception that proves the rule. And I don't know

:01:10.:01:11.

how you change that. The definition of a ceasefire

:01:12.:01:17.

is "the temporary suspension of fighting", and the word has been

:01:18.:01:21.

sprayed around like confetti today, even though it is unclear whether it

:01:22.:01:26.

will be maintained on the ground and doesn't even apply to many

:01:27.:01:29.

who are fighting in Syria. And all the while Bashar al-Assad

:01:30.:01:33.

is insisting that he will return the whole of the country

:01:34.:01:36.

to his control. So, the cessation in a week's time,

:01:37.:01:39.

vaunted by major powers in Munich, will not necessarily move

:01:40.:01:44.

the resolution of the conflict Here's our Diplomatic

:01:45.:01:46.

Editor, Mark Urban. The world's decision-makers had

:01:47.:02:00.

assembled in Munich for a security conference. After long hours of

:02:01.:02:07.

negotiations late into the night they announced a deal. 17 states and

:02:08.:02:12.

three international organisations signed off on it, but in essence

:02:13.:02:16.

it's a Russian and American plan. Our work today, while it has

:02:17.:02:23.

produced commitments on paper, I want to restate that the real test

:02:24.:02:30.

is clearly whether or not all the parties on those commitments and

:02:31.:02:35.

implement them in reality. The agreement sets up an international

:02:36.:02:38.

humanitarian task force, lists places where aid needs to go now,

:02:39.:02:45.

notes that humanitarian access should not benefit any particular

:02:46.:02:50.

group over any other. It calls for a cessation of hostilities in one

:02:51.:02:55.

week's time. The 19th of February. With another task force to agree the

:02:56.:02:58.

boundaries of who holds what territory in Syria. And then the

:02:59.:03:04.

resumption of peace talks as soon as possible, in Geneva, the 25th of

:03:05.:03:09.

February is the hoped-for date, we here. Does this provide a real hope

:03:10.:03:14.

for peace? Earlier I spoke exclusively to the leader of Syria's

:03:15.:03:17.

opposition umbrella group. The battle for Aleppo continued

:03:18.:03:52.

today, with the Syrian army warning of imminent further assaults and its

:03:53.:03:56.

leader bullish after recent successes.

:03:57.:04:00.

TRANSLATION: If we negotiate it does not mean that we will stop fighting

:04:01.:04:05.

terrorism. Two tracks are negotiating -- expect inevitable in

:04:06.:04:09.

Syria, through negotiation and through fighting terrorism. And the

:04:10.:04:13.

two tracks asked about from each other. As for the president himself,

:04:14.:04:18.

his future is central to the political transition envisaged in

:04:19.:04:22.

today's agreement. But even if the Americans now see Assad staying on

:04:23.:04:25.

for a while, the opposition insists he cannot.

:04:26.:05:00.

The Assad regime is offensive, backed by the Russians from the air,

:05:01.:05:09.

spearheaded by uranium and other volunteers on the ground, began

:05:10.:05:12.

getting real traction three months ago, south-east of Aleppo. Earlier

:05:13.:05:22.

this year, rebels were driven back in the rebel heartland. Under

:05:23.:05:30.

today's deal, the Al-Qaeda linked front and Islamic State will still

:05:31.:05:39.

be attacked, but will more moderate groups the too? They've got the

:05:40.:05:43.

potential for a very important breakthrough but it all depends now

:05:44.:05:45.

on the behaviour of the Russians. If the Russians carry on bombing the

:05:46.:05:50.

moderate opposition this will not be the outcome we want. So today aims

:05:51.:05:54.

for a ceasefire but only between certain people. Even if it works,

:05:55.:05:58.

Russia, America and others will still be taking aim at the Islamic

:05:59.:06:06.

State and others. The Syrian groups are not actually party did today's

:06:07.:06:10.

agreement. Instead, those who did sign are meant to deliver them.

:06:11.:06:16.

Iraqi and Russia -- Iran and Russia, the Assad government and the US and

:06:17.:06:24.

Gulf states and various opposition groups. Talking to opposition

:06:25.:06:27.

leaders it is apparently already resent that.

:06:28.:06:50.

As Munich ends, there is a sober realisation that this will be very

:06:51.:06:59.

tough, but they are already working on speeding up humanitarian aid to

:07:00.:07:04.

besieged communities, and that at least could be something.

:07:05.:07:07.

Joining me to discuss this from Munich, where the deal

:07:08.:07:11.

is being struck, is Andrey Kortunov, Director General of the Moscow-based

:07:12.:07:14.

Russian International Affairs Council and here with me

:07:15.:07:18.

is columnist and author Anne Applebaum.

:07:19.:07:21.

Good evening to you both. First of all, how could this possibly work if

:07:22.:07:30.

Russia continues to bomb Aleppo? Our Defence Secretary today said that

:07:31.:07:38.

Aleppo will be the new Sarajevo. I think it can only work if the two

:07:39.:07:42.

sides agree on how they define terrorism and terrorist

:07:43.:07:46.

organisations. They should look at the lists, they should compare the

:07:47.:07:50.

lists, and they should find a common to nominate. Because definitely

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until it is done, the hostilities will continue and it would be very

:07:56.:08:00.

difficult to maintain a ceasefire. Unfortunately because you couldn't

:08:01.:08:07.

see the translation, basically the opposition leader was saying that

:08:08.:08:10.

this ceasefire has simply been designed to preserve Russian and

:08:11.:08:11.

uranium -- preserve Russian and Iranian

:08:12.:08:25.

games. I think the situation on the ground might change. I don't think

:08:26.:08:28.

there is a military solution to the problem. I think that for the time

:08:29.:08:35.

being indeed the Syrian army has accomplished something but it can be

:08:36.:08:42.

reversed, especially if there is an inflow of support from places like

:08:43.:08:48.

Saudi Arabia or Turkey, not to mention the potential Turkish direct

:08:49.:08:53.

intervention into Syria. So, do you think this is designed simply to

:08:54.:09:02.

sort out the situation or two -- to preserve Russia's position? I will

:09:03.:09:06.

give the people participating in the conversation credit for saying it is

:09:07.:09:12.

designed to get humanitarian aid into a desperate situation. But I

:09:13.:09:15.

think we should all be clear about what Russia is trying to do. The

:09:16.:09:20.

object of Russia and Assad is to create a situation where there are

:09:21.:09:23.

only two sides, the regime and the terrorists. They identify everyone

:09:24.:09:28.

who is not the regime as terrorists. Their bombing campaign in Syria for

:09:29.:09:31.

the last several months has been exactly that. They have been allowed

:09:32.:09:35.

to do this presumably because America has abdicated its

:09:36.:09:42.

responsible at the in Syria? I would not say just America, I would say

:09:43.:09:45.

the West in general has not had a clear plan from the start of this

:09:46.:09:49.

conflict. We sort of supported some groups but we didn't really give any

:09:50.:09:54.

serious aid. We help some of the non-regime areas stay alive but we

:09:55.:09:57.

haven't really intervened and we haven't had a clear role. Let's

:09:58.:10:03.

quickly talk about Aleppo here because Isis and others operating in

:10:04.:10:11.

the area, as well as moderate opposition groups and a lot of

:10:12.:10:15.

civilians there. The fact that we have created a cessation of

:10:16.:10:20.

hostilities and allowed Russia to bomb Aleppo is very strange. If

:10:21.:10:24.

Russia is allowed to bomb Aleppo, there is no ceasefire, there is no

:10:25.:10:28.

cassation of hostilities. Do you agree with that? Well, if Russia is

:10:29.:10:38.

going to bomb the city, I think that can be regarded as a continuation of

:10:39.:10:43.

the war but I don't think this is the plan. I think the plan is to

:10:44.:10:47.

have a ceasefire that would include Aleppo. So you're suggesting that

:10:48.:10:54.

actually the Aleppo area will not come under fire in a week's time.

:10:55.:10:58.

You are suggesting there will be a proper cessation? Well, I think that

:10:59.:11:06.

there might be some surgical strikes against terrorist groups, if indeed

:11:07.:11:12.

these terrorist groups happened to be in adjacent places. But I don't

:11:13.:11:19.

think there will be a kind of massive campaign against Aleppo, I

:11:20.:11:24.

don't see it. Let's turn to what Russia's position is on Bashar

:11:25.:11:29.

al-Assad. Is the position is not necessarily, you've said already,

:11:30.:11:33.

that he would retain control of the gain control of the country, but is

:11:34.:11:38.

Russia's position to leave Assad in power? Well, I think that the main

:11:39.:11:46.

goal of Russia, as far as I understand the main position taken

:11:47.:11:50.

by President Putin, is to preserve the Syrian statehood. Russia is

:11:51.:11:53.

emphatically against any partition of the country and it wants to

:11:54.:11:59.

maintain the democratic integrity of Syria. Right now, Assad seems to be

:12:00.:12:05.

the only person who can do that. That if there are alternatives, if

:12:06.:12:09.

there are other forces may be from moderate opposition who can do it

:12:10.:12:13.

better than Assad, I don't Inc that Russia would necessarily stick to

:12:14.:12:17.

this particular person. He's not a personal friend of Mr Putin. He is

:12:18.:12:25.

not a person who should be rescued at any cost... Sorry to interrupt, I

:12:26.:12:29.

know there is a delay... Can I just say, it is very clear to the West

:12:30.:12:34.

that it looks as if President Putin right now is shoring up President

:12:35.:12:44.

Assad? Well, I think that Putin made it very clear many times that his

:12:45.:12:50.

goal in Syria is not to protect a particular personality. His goal is

:12:51.:12:59.

to maintain the integrity of the Syrian state, to prevent it from

:13:00.:13:03.

disintegrating. The truth is this would not be happening right now at

:13:04.:13:07.

all if it wasn't for the fact that there is now a ruckus over the

:13:08.:13:11.

migrant numbers and countries don't want to take them, isn't that the

:13:12.:13:16.

case? It's true that the migrant issue has dragged Europe back into a

:13:17.:13:19.

conflict that it has been desperate to avoid and has been trying to stay

:13:20.:13:23.

out for many months and years. I think returning to point about

:13:24.:13:28.

Russia, whatever Putin does say, and he says many things at different

:13:29.:13:32.

times, it's very clear from his actions that his goal in Syria has

:13:33.:13:37.

stooped -- has been to keep Assad in power and his bombing campaign has

:13:38.:13:41.

been designed to help Assad's army. His goal and his desire to take a

:13:42.:13:47.

dictator and insert itself into the Middle East peace process so that he

:13:48.:13:53.

has a role... Absolutely, this has been his role from the very

:13:54.:13:56.

beginning. I don't think anyone who has been watching this closely has

:13:57.:14:00.

any doubt about that. What does what has been happening over the last few

:14:01.:14:04.

months say about Russia's plays in the world and its ambition to change

:14:05.:14:08.

that again? Russia was involved in this disastrous war in Ukraine.

:14:09.:14:13.

Disastrous for Russia and Ukraine. I think it was becoming clear to the

:14:14.:14:17.

Russian public that the war wasn't working out, so they decided to

:14:18.:14:20.

change the narrative. The narrative is, we're now going to become

:14:21.:14:24.

involved in Syria. There was a clear moment when he did that and that has

:14:25.:14:28.

been his goal, to become a major broker in the Middle East, somebody

:14:29.:14:31.

that nobody can ignore, so that he gets back into the role of world

:14:32.:14:35.

power which is what he wants to have. Finally, do you think this is

:14:36.:14:40.

actually a turning point? From the last five years. Is this the change

:14:41.:14:42.

that people need in Syria? I think it might be a turning point.

:14:43.:14:53.

It depends object political will on both sides and whether both sides

:14:54.:14:58.

can restore some trust. And it also depends whether they can convince

:14:59.:15:04.

their local partners and clients to support the agreement. Because no

:15:05.:15:08.

matter what Russia and the United States might do, if there is no buy

:15:09.:15:15.

in by Saudis, and Iranians, it is not likely to work. Thank you very

:15:16.:15:17.

much indeed. In the years since the Royal Bank

:15:18.:15:20.

of Scotland crashed and almost burned, the bank has tried

:15:21.:15:23.

to reposition itself as a bank And so today a hatchery

:15:24.:15:25.

opened in Edinburgh, in what was once the restricted

:15:26.:15:29.

access executive wing when the now disgraced Chief Executive Fred

:15:30.:15:31.

Goodwin was in charge. The Hatchery, for entrepreneurs

:15:32.:15:35.

rather than chickens, offers free office facilities

:15:36.:15:37.

and mentoring and collaborating with bank staff for up to eighty

:15:38.:15:39.

businesses every six months, and the project Entreprenurial Spark

:15:40.:15:41.

will be stitched into the fabric Royal Bank of Scotland was

:15:42.:15:59.

Scotland's bank when it became the world's. At one point it was not

:16:00.:16:05.

only the world's biggest bank, but its biggest company. Then the most

:16:06.:16:12.

exposed of British banks, RBS crashed. The purchase of a Dutch

:16:13.:16:17.

bank turned out to be a disaster trousers overreach. -- disastrous

:16:18.:16:24.

overreach. It is a nightmare for Wall Street. When in 2008 the

:16:25.:16:29.

financial world came toppling down, the bank was bailed out and

:16:30.:16:36.

nationalised by the then Chancellor, costing the British taxpayer some

:16:37.:16:40.

?45 billion. Last year the Chancellor began the process of

:16:41.:16:45.

reprivatisation, selling 5% of the shares. Below the cost price at

:16:46.:16:50.

which the Government bought them. It is the right thing to do for British

:16:51.:16:56.

businesses and taxpayers. We may get a lower price, but we will get the

:16:57.:17:01.

best possible price. Now that looks shrewd. Over the last 12 months

:17:02.:17:07.

their share price has fallen by 45%. The price today is 220 pence a

:17:08.:17:12.

share. It is up to the Chief Executive Ross McKeown to try to

:17:13.:17:20.

steady the ship and prepare it for a proper return to the private sector.

:17:21.:17:24.

Nurturing a new generation of entrepreneurs in the heart of their

:17:25.:17:28.

HQ is a signal that the bank wants us to take that the atmosphere is

:17:29.:17:34.

different. This was part of the executive wing, it was a restricted

:17:35.:17:40.

area for only certain people. Now you have entrepreneurs, 80 are here,

:17:41.:17:45.

young or older entrepreneurs, growing businesses again in

:17:46.:17:50.

Scotland. This looks good for the Royal Bank of Scotland, but no one

:17:51.:17:54.

knows the share price more than you at today it is 224, so it has lost

:17:55.:18:03.

45% on your watch last last year. That is no at good position. No,

:18:04.:18:10.

you're seeing all banking stocks across the world, the prices have

:18:11.:18:14.

come down. This time around quite similar to the last time the market

:18:15.:18:18.

collapsed, we are drifting with the market place. So you're in the hands

:18:19.:18:22.

of market place, when you said last year that you were confident that we

:18:23.:18:27.

would all get our money back in three year, you're having to revise

:18:28.:18:32.

that? The markets go down as we are seeing today, they also go up and we

:18:33.:18:36.

will wait and see. The Government's aim was to get out 75% of their

:18:37.:18:41.

shareholding in this term of government. It makes it much more

:18:42.:18:45.

difficult when the markets are like this. But that is in the Treasury's

:18:46.:18:53.

hands. It looks like they will be in the red for the eighth year. How do

:18:54.:18:57.

you feel about that It is clear we will be in the red given the

:18:58.:19:02.

decisions that we made a month ago. We said 2014 was a year when we

:19:03.:19:08.

would restructure and get the business into the customer groupings

:19:09.:19:13.

and rebuild capital. Phase two is 2016 and our aim is to take, get rid

:19:14.:19:20.

as much of the conduct and litigation issues that have plagued

:19:21.:19:24.

the organisation and the heavy costs. So it does put you in a

:19:25.:19:33.

position of making losses. But Joe public, ?45 billion, they won't get

:19:34.:19:37.

their money back at this rate? No, but can I go back to why 45 billion

:19:38.:19:41.

was put into the bank, because this is important. We would love to get

:19:42.:19:47.

that money back to the public. But at the time, if they hadn't saved

:19:48.:19:51.

the Royal Bank of Scotland, a lot of financial services in the UK would

:19:52.:19:56.

probably have collapsed. Because a fair number of transactions go thus

:19:57.:20:00.

this bank and if you let that drop it would have been a catastrophe for

:20:01.:20:05.

the public and the economy. The decision was the right decision. Now

:20:06.:20:09.

Europe, do you think the British sector will be better or worse off

:20:10.:20:16.

outside the EU? I think, I haven't seen any economic data that says we

:20:17.:20:22.

would be better off outside in the short to medium term. Let's go back

:20:23.:20:26.

too the facts, in the short to medium term. There is a lot of

:20:27.:20:30.

uncertainty, what does it mean to come out of Europe as well? The

:20:31.:20:35.

issue we have got is the uncertainty that will slow businesses down and

:20:36.:20:40.

will over time I think slow down banking, it is the uncertainty. It

:20:41.:20:43.

is good that the Government's trying to get to a point of having the vote

:20:44.:20:50.

quickly. Because it is the uncertainty. I haven't seen any data

:20:51.:20:56.

that says it is a good thing. RBS has said that economic growth is

:20:57.:21:00.

being undermined by uncertainty over the EU vote. It is clear. We saw

:21:01.:21:05.

that under the, with the Scottish referendum. When you go through

:21:06.:21:09.

these times, businesses stop making the decisions that they would

:21:10.:21:11.

normally make, because of the uncertainty. That is why it is

:21:12.:21:16.

important that the Government does move on quickly with they can get it

:21:17.:21:19.

in June, I think it would be better than having it later. On interest

:21:20.:21:25.

rates, do you think the Fed was wrong to jump ahead and raise the

:21:26.:21:31.

rate? I think the Fed saw the US was starting to grow and they wanted to

:21:32.:21:35.

make sure that inflation stayed that way. They have got great economics

:21:36.:21:39.

and analysts doing the work on their... I will leave them to make

:21:40.:21:44.

their calls. I would say we are going to be lower interest rates for

:21:45.:21:50.

a lot longer than anticipated. Any talk of an interest rate rise, it is

:21:51.:21:54.

not going to happen this year. I don't think this year and possibly

:21:55.:21:58.

into all of 17. We have to get used to an environment with low interest

:21:59.:22:03.

rates for a long period of time. Finally on that, do you think people

:22:04.:22:08.

in this country will ever like bankers again? A number of people do

:22:09.:22:16.

like them, but banks' reputations got tarnished because of what

:22:17.:22:22.

happened and the consequence it had on people. They never want that to

:22:23.:22:27.

happen again. Banks and bankers have still a long way to go to rebuild

:22:28.:22:32.

that trust and it is done with every interaction every day. Thank you

:22:33.:22:34.

very much indeed. Ross McEwan says that low interest

:22:35.:22:37.

rates are here to stay perhaps even beyond next year, but there's

:22:38.:22:40.

another scenario being talked about right now,

:22:41.:22:43.

negative interest rates. Our Policy Editor

:22:44.:22:44.

Chris Cook is here. What actually are negative interest

:22:45.:22:55.

rates and how do they impact? You're familiar with the idea of interest

:22:56.:23:00.

rates and central banks cut interest rates and that cuts the amount

:23:01.:23:04.

savers get when they keep their money in banks and cuts the cost of

:23:05.:23:09.

borrowing for investors or mortgage holders. The idea of negative

:23:10.:23:14.

interest rates are we have come down to zero interest and central banks

:23:15.:23:24.

have gone down as low as they can. We have tried quantitative easing,

:23:25.:23:29.

to reduce the amount that savers get and the amount, the cost of

:23:30.:23:33.

borrowing further. This goes beyond that and they would say to banks, if

:23:34.:23:38.

you have money sitting on your balance sheet that is uninvested we

:23:39.:23:43.

will fine you for having that. Capital reserve though? Not capital,

:23:44.:23:50.

the money they have that is uninvested. So the idea is banks

:23:51.:23:55.

would feel that it is what they have to do is get money out and lend. So

:23:56.:24:00.

the effect would be what? It depends how far and how fast they go. It has

:24:01.:24:05.

been talked about in the United States and things tend to travel in

:24:06.:24:09.

banking. Nothing affects one country alone. What would happen would

:24:10.:24:13.

defend on how far we went. It could be that things are as they are now,

:24:14.:24:18.

but a bank would be desperate to lend to you or you could have a

:24:19.:24:22.

situation where banks were so desperate to lend that theltd pay

:24:23.:24:26.

you -- they would pay you to take money. Here is ?100, give us 90 quid

:24:27.:24:31.

next year. Thank you. From Aphrodite to Marilyn,

:24:32.:24:35.

the image of the femme fatale has Those are the two emotions strongly

:24:36.:24:38.

associated with a John Singer Sargent painting that is merely

:24:39.:24:46.

known by the title Madame X. The extreme reactions it caused

:24:47.:24:49.

on first showing in 1884 have inspired a new ballet

:24:50.:24:52.

by Christopher Wheeldon, Strapless - which is being performed

:24:53.:24:53.

for the first time tonight Katie Razzall has been exploring how

:24:54.:24:56.

a 19th Century picture has It just seemed there must have

:24:57.:25:00.

been a story behind her. The scandal of this picture

:25:01.:25:14.

was so much that I don't think In a studio at London's Royal Opera

:25:15.:25:27.

House, two of the company's finest It's the latest creation

:25:28.:25:35.

of choreographer extraordinary, Inspired by the story

:25:36.:25:42.

of Amelie Gautreau, a young American It is this great story of the rise

:25:43.:25:49.

and fall of this great We always look for in story

:25:50.:25:59.

ballets quite large-sized And in this case downfall

:26:00.:26:04.

and the shunning of this This painting of Amelie Gautreau,

:26:05.:26:12.

by John Singer Sargent caused her downfall,

:26:13.:26:20.

though it is difficult these days to understand what all

:26:21.:26:23.

the fuss was about. Wheeldon fell in love

:26:24.:26:26.

with the picture on visits But when its American creator

:26:27.:26:29.

exhibited it at the Paris Salon At that time, his portrait

:26:30.:26:35.

showed Amelie with one dress strap falling

:26:36.:26:42.

from her shoulder. An earlier study at Tate Britain

:26:43.:26:45.

shows Amelie's right She had bare shoulders

:26:46.:26:47.

with this plunging cleavage, so it hints at nudity,

:26:48.:26:52.

without actually showing her naked There were lots of nudes in these

:26:53.:26:55.

Salons, so why did a picture that was not of someone

:26:56.:27:13.

naked cause such scandal? These were representations

:27:14.:27:15.

of historical or mythological characters,

:27:16.:27:16.

such as Diana or Venus. What was scandalous about this

:27:17.:27:21.

picture was that it was a portrait of a recognisable individual

:27:22.:27:24.

and the suggestion is through the dress that it is sort

:27:25.:27:26.

of slipping off her. She must have been perched

:27:27.:27:31.

on the precipice a little bit. And this painting gave society just

:27:32.:27:35.

an excuse to push her. That story of a woman

:27:36.:27:44.

from high society humiliated and shunned is now

:27:45.:27:47.

the centre piece of a triple bill of Wheeldon's work getting its world

:27:48.:27:50.

premiere at Covent Garden. This is Wheeldon's eighth creation

:27:51.:28:15.

for the Royal Ballet and he is back You have worked together before,

:28:16.:28:18.

how is it to be back together? Narrative ballet, telling

:28:19.:28:27.

a story, is just as much Wheeldon's How do you tell what's

:28:28.:28:37.

really more like a That is the sort of

:28:38.:28:45.

skill of it, I guess. Chris knows how to somehow get that

:28:46.:28:59.

character across through There is only a certain

:29:00.:29:03.

set of moves and there But just a shoulder

:29:04.:29:10.

change or an angle of a head or the way you phrase

:29:11.:29:14.

something can say a lot about that character's situation without sort

:29:15.:29:18.

of bending the rules too much. It is quite, it is

:29:19.:29:23.

an interesting thing for us to do as well,

:29:24.:29:25.

without changing any steps you can Decades later Sargent

:29:26.:29:28.

called the finished painting of her his finest work

:29:29.:29:37.

and in 1884, it stayed on the Salon wall in Paris,

:29:38.:29:41.

despite her humiliation. The scandal of this picture

:29:42.:29:46.

permeated so much through high society, I don't think

:29:47.:29:49.

she ever got over it. People always associated her

:29:50.:29:51.

with this particular She begged him to remove it

:29:52.:29:52.

from the Salon and he refused. I think he really did

:29:53.:30:00.

believe in the painting. But eventually he took it

:30:01.:30:04.

away and he painted, In the long-term this

:30:05.:30:07.

established his reputation as an artist who broke boundaries,

:30:08.:30:12.

who broke convention. And in fact when he moved

:30:13.:30:15.

to London, people flocked to his studio

:30:16.:30:18.

to have their portraits painted. It was a great scandal

:30:19.:30:21.

for him, but he, you know he left Paris, she was the one

:30:22.:30:24.

that really suffered. That's not the first

:30:25.:30:27.

time that's happened. No, unfortunately

:30:28.:30:29.

it's a man's world. Do you see parallels

:30:30.:30:34.

to now with her story? Yes, absolutely, we love to build

:30:35.:30:37.

celebrities up and then we sort of also rather relish

:30:38.:30:41.

in tearing them down. I do think we still as

:30:42.:30:45.

human beings take some Tomorrow morning's front-pages The

:30:46.:31:09.

Independent, refugees terrorised by far right militia and Independent is

:31:10.:31:15.

going to be digital after March. The financial times, banks fight to

:31:16.:31:21.

regain confidence. Daily Telegraph Facebook fights to find poor NHS

:31:22.:31:32.

care. And Guardian, plan for Islamist terrorist. And at the

:31:33.:31:42.

bottom, the guilt of killers, the mother of a killer from America. And

:31:43.:31:47.

an interview is on Newsnight. This week's presenter is museum

:31:48.:31:50.

director Maria Balshaw. She wants to explore continuing

:31:51.:31:53.

gender inequality in the arts and she talks to artist Sarah Lucas

:31:54.:31:55.

and double Oscar-winner Glenda Jackson, who today announced

:31:56.:31:58.

that she is returning to the stage

:31:59.:32:01.

With Kirsty Wark. The Syrian opposition leader talks about the ceasefire, there's an interview with the chief of RBS and the team examine negative interest rates. Plus a look behind the scenes at the new ROH ballet.