Browse content similar to 07/07/2016. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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A second female Prime Minister for Britain. | :00:00. | :00:00. | |
Andrea Leadsom, 84 votes, Theresa May, 199 votes. | :00:07. | :00:18. | |
Therefore Michael Gove, having the lowest number of | :00:19. | :00:21. | |
votes, has been eliminated from the ballot. | :00:22. | :00:24. | |
The Tories already have a female leader of course - in Scotland. | :00:25. | :00:27. | |
I really don't have any message for that monster. | :00:28. | :00:33. | |
He basically took away a person who was peaceful, who | :00:34. | :00:39. | |
wanted unity in the world, who wanted the communities to unite. | :00:40. | :00:42. | |
And: we've seen the headlines, but what lies buried | :00:43. | :00:50. | |
deep within the pages of the Chilcot Report? | :00:51. | :00:55. | |
I will be delving into this, extracting the tale of one | :00:56. | :01:00. | |
particularly murky episode. And novelist Robert Harris explores | :01:01. | :01:07. | |
the many lives of his former He often wore make-up, even when he | :01:08. | :01:16. | |
was not in a television studio. I don't know why, maybe it's just | :01:17. | :01:20. | |
appealed to him, that sense of always being a performer. | :01:21. | :01:26. | |
Theresa May and Andrea Leadsom will duke it out to lead | :01:27. | :01:30. | |
the Conservative Party and, of course, the nation | :01:31. | :01:34. | |
after the final round of voting by MPs saw Justice | :01:35. | :01:36. | |
Secretary Michael Gove limp home in third place. | :01:37. | :01:39. | |
I would have described it as a massive shock once but, | :01:40. | :01:43. | |
given the unprecedented political upheaval of the last | :01:44. | :01:46. | |
fortnight, Mrs Leadsom's presence on the ballot - | :01:47. | :01:49. | |
not to mention the absence of a Johnson or an Osborne - | :01:50. | :01:52. | |
It all means not only that the next Prime Minister will be a woman | :01:53. | :01:58. | |
but also that we won't have a firm hand on the country's tiller | :01:59. | :02:01. | |
Newsnight's political editor Nick Watt is with me. | :02:02. | :02:08. | |
Nick. As you were saying, an emphatic win for Theresa May, almost | :02:09. | :02:17. | |
200 votes and 60% of Tory MPs think she should be Prime Minister. She | :02:18. | :02:22. | |
will face in the final round Andrea Leadsom. She is also vote share | :02:23. | :02:28. | |
increase to 25% of the total, 84 votes. Michael Gove in third place, | :02:29. | :02:33. | |
humiliating result for him because his vote share went down and he is | :02:34. | :02:36. | |
therefore disqualified from the contest. Theresa May's team, are | :02:37. | :02:43. | |
they as confident as the numbers suggest? On paper she should walk it | :02:44. | :02:48. | |
but her team are nervous, they think that Andrea Leadsom, as the Brexit | :02:49. | :02:54. | |
campaign could run an insurgency campaign, some ministers say she is | :02:55. | :02:58. | |
connecting in their constituencies. One Cabinet minister I spoke to said | :02:59. | :03:02. | |
that if she becomes Prime Minister with only 25% of Tory MPs supporting | :03:03. | :03:08. | |
hurt the Tories could have and Jeremy Corbyn situation. You called | :03:09. | :03:11. | |
and humiliation for Michael Gove, any word on how he's taking it? | :03:12. | :03:17. | |
Licking his wounds and the word from this camp is that he's really hurt | :03:18. | :03:20. | |
at the end of this week from which she cannot escape from the image of | :03:21. | :03:25. | |
being the double assassin. They say he won't be cutting any deals. He | :03:26. | :03:30. | |
will accept a Cabinet post if he is offered one, if he is not offered | :03:31. | :03:34. | |
one he will not brood and think when he can return. The dilemma for him | :03:35. | :03:40. | |
is who dizzy endorse? He says it must be a Brexiteer as the next | :03:41. | :03:44. | |
Prime Minister that Andrea Letson does not share his worldview. We | :03:45. | :03:49. | |
thought we would take a look at her although I should warn that this | :03:50. | :03:52. | |
report contains some flash photography. | :03:53. | :03:57. | |
I can announce the result of the election for the leadership of the | :03:58. | :04:03. | |
Conservative Party. Will it be third time lucky for the plucky outsider | :04:04. | :04:07. | |
in the Conservative leadership contest? Andrea Leadsom has not even | :04:08. | :04:14. | |
made it to the Cabinet yet she is now within reach of the premiership | :04:15. | :04:18. | |
after making it the final stage of the battle choose David Cameron's | :04:19. | :04:29. | |
succession. What do we want? She has a Eurosceptic fan base on the right | :04:30. | :04:34. | |
of the party after playing a leading role on the Brexit side of the | :04:35. | :04:38. | |
referendum campaign and debate Mrs Leadsom showed she will run an | :04:39. | :04:42. | |
insurgency campaign by instructing the supporters to march on Whitehall | :04:43. | :04:45. | |
other she did not trouble it with her presence. Concerns are raised | :04:46. | :04:50. | |
about her lack of Cabinet experience could make a something of a novice | :04:51. | :04:55. | |
as Prime Minister. Opponents also point to the socially conservative | :04:56. | :05:00. | |
views which prompted her today to highlight her unease about same-sex | :05:01. | :05:05. | |
marriage. Because she decided to abstain on the subject of same-sex | :05:06. | :05:10. | |
marriage, this does not in any way make her less respectful of loving | :05:11. | :05:14. | |
couples who just happened to be in a same-sex relationship. We have moved | :05:15. | :05:23. | |
on. Get over it! Mrs Leadsom, who has so far escaped scrutiny as a | :05:24. | :05:27. | |
relatively junior minister now finds her CV under the spotlight. Shortly | :05:28. | :05:35. | |
after her election to Parliament in 2010 she finished her record in the | :05:36. | :05:39. | |
City to MPs. I should declare that I have been in banking even longer | :05:40. | :05:44. | |
than my honourable friend having been 23 years in investment banking | :05:45. | :05:49. | |
and funds management. Now it seems that giving a ten year stint, she | :05:50. | :05:53. | |
only had official approval to deal with funds for three months. | :05:54. | :05:58. | |
Supporters of Theresa May say that she is a safer pair of hands. I | :05:59. | :06:02. | |
think what people want is someone who can not only bring the party | :06:03. | :06:08. | |
together but the country together. I think the results today has | :06:09. | :06:12. | |
demonstrated that Theresa has that ability. It is no time for a risk. | :06:13. | :06:17. | |
Friends of Andrea Leadsom are hurt by a tax on her record and what | :06:18. | :06:23. | |
regard as a sneering attitude to the membership of the parliament Bible | :06:24. | :06:26. | |
study group. They say that Christianity lies at the root of the | :06:27. | :06:31. | |
plain speaking approach to politics and explains why she takes pride in | :06:32. | :06:37. | |
delivering on her promises. With this background, the team have high | :06:38. | :06:42. | |
hopes that Leadsom will go down as a major figure in British political | :06:43. | :06:47. | |
history. This candidate can outstrip Margaret Thatcher. She is the real | :06:48. | :06:52. | |
deal. She is absolutely fantastic. You ain't seen nothing yet. Would | :06:53. | :06:58. | |
Theresa May outstrip Lady Thatcher? I don't think any of us would want | :06:59. | :07:03. | |
to make that comparison. Theresa May's camp are nervously watching | :07:04. | :07:08. | |
the newcomer, they hope the Home Secretary's overwhelming support | :07:09. | :07:14. | |
among MPs will said the grass roots message to Tories determined to vote | :07:15. | :07:17. | |
with their hearts we Brexit campaigner. Last time it was very | :07:18. | :07:23. | |
close, this time it's two and a half times as many votes for Theresa May | :07:24. | :07:27. | |
as for her nearest rival. So my message to the membership is, please | :07:28. | :07:31. | |
think long and hard about your decision. British politics has | :07:32. | :07:37. | |
undergone a roller-coaster ride in recent months. It is now over to | :07:38. | :07:40. | |
Tory members to decide whether something of the old order is | :07:41. | :07:45. | |
re-established. I'm hopeful, optimistic. Or if Britain will | :07:46. | :07:51. | |
venture out of Europe with a true, though untested believer. | :07:52. | :07:54. | |
We're joined now from our Edinburgh studio by Ruth Davidson, leader | :07:55. | :07:56. | |
of the Scottish Conservatives, who earlier today announced | :07:57. | :07:58. | |
she was backing Theresa May for Prime Minister. | :07:59. | :08:03. | |
Michael Gove, Ruth, I know that he is not the force that he was a | :08:04. | :08:09. | |
fortnight ago but he said the successful candidate must be on the | :08:10. | :08:13. | |
winning side of the argument. Theresa May was not. Does Michael | :08:14. | :08:18. | |
Gove have a point? Well I think it must be someone who can unite both | :08:19. | :08:22. | |
the country and the party and I think Theresa May is the only one | :08:23. | :08:26. | |
that can do that. She's already got the vast majority of the | :08:27. | :08:29. | |
parliamentary party behind her and has huge support in all parts of the | :08:30. | :08:31. | |
country and my colleagues in Scotland, both | :08:32. | :08:52. | |
in the Commons and the house of Lords, the MEPs, myself in Holyrood, | :08:53. | :08:55. | |
all four of us in this position is back and we also have to talk about | :08:56. | :08:58. | |
some of the divides in this country, including the privileged few and | :08:59. | :09:00. | |
those like me who went to the local comprehensive, someone who can speak | :09:01. | :09:03. | |
to that and make sure government is for everyone in this country and not | :09:04. | :09:05. | |
for those people who feel far removed from the corridors of power. | :09:06. | :09:08. | |
Theresa May and Andrea Leadsom both went to grammar school, why can't | :09:09. | :09:10. | |
Andrea Leadsom unite the party. There will be a lot of challenges | :09:11. | :09:13. | |
for whoever comes up. This won't be easy years. We don't have much time, | :09:14. | :09:18. | |
why can't Andrea Leadsom unite the party and the country? She hasn't | :09:19. | :09:22. | |
got the plurality of the party behind her, she did not get support | :09:23. | :09:25. | |
of the party in Scotland and in other parts of the country but I'm | :09:26. | :09:29. | |
not here to criticise Conservative colleagues. It takes a lot of guts | :09:30. | :09:37. | |
to put your name on a ballot paper, it takes guts to say you want to | :09:38. | :09:40. | |
lead and I want to see a big broad debate across the UK and all the | :09:41. | :09:43. | |
hustings planned for the candidates, it is right that the membership get | :09:44. | :09:46. | |
there and say but I think it's right that in terms of the person who's | :09:47. | :09:49. | |
got a steal for the job, who can go eyeball to eyeball with Angela | :09:50. | :09:53. | |
Merkel and Nicholas Turgeon, it can only be Theresa May. When David | :09:54. | :09:57. | |
Cameron re-signed two digit think would be the next prime Minster? | :09:58. | :10:02. | |
Theresa May. What did she mean when she described the nasty party? About | :10:03. | :10:08. | |
the few people used to have of us. She talked about that when she was | :10:09. | :10:12. | |
chairman of the party. She has held big roles in the party and done a | :10:13. | :10:17. | |
lot of work in the country, I know that every time I called her during | :10:18. | :10:21. | |
the referendum, to make speeches all to come to drop to Scotland's | :10:22. | :10:24. | |
business women, she was there and heartbeat. Anything she needed to | :10:25. | :10:29. | |
do. She's got a huge capacity for work, all the leadership skills, she | :10:30. | :10:33. | |
can see the way others work, the way people look at the party and don't | :10:34. | :10:36. | |
like what they see and she knows the way she wants to change the party so | :10:37. | :10:40. | |
it is for everyone and not just for one section of the society. Can you | :10:41. | :10:46. | |
put flesh on those bums and tell me some of the ideologies you would | :10:47. | :10:51. | |
have filed under nasty? I think the way that we spoke in the past, I was | :10:52. | :10:56. | |
not a member of the party back in the days that you are talking about, | :10:57. | :11:00. | |
I was still a BBC journalist being neutral like you are now. She was | :11:01. | :11:04. | |
talking about the way in which often our opponents have thought we only | :11:05. | :11:08. | |
spoke to one section when actually we are a broad church. I know in my | :11:09. | :11:13. | |
first selection when I stood as a candidate, Michael Martin, the | :11:14. | :11:16. | |
disgraced former Speaker of the House of Commons, I was being told | :11:17. | :11:22. | |
that Margaret Thatcher shot the railroads when actually they were | :11:23. | :11:27. | |
shot long before her, not because of industrial policy but they made | :11:28. | :11:30. | |
steam locomotives when the world had moved on to diesels are many myths | :11:31. | :11:34. | |
have been perpetrated about our party by its opponents and it's time | :11:35. | :11:38. | |
to break them down. And by having to state educated women by merit, I | :11:39. | :11:42. | |
think it will help address some of that. -- two state educated women. | :11:43. | :11:54. | |
This is not a myth, Theresa May says she can't guarantee the lives of the | :11:55. | :11:58. | |
immigrants who are here. She says she wants to guarantee them. I | :11:59. | :12:02. | |
publicly said that I think she should give that guarantee. Why | :12:03. | :12:09. | |
hasn't she? She knows if she takes on this role she's got work to do in | :12:10. | :12:13. | |
making sure that the British abroad are allowed to stay, and looked | :12:14. | :12:17. | |
after. I think the person in that role should be able to say, | :12:18. | :12:20. | |
irrespective of that, that they should stay. The one thing David | :12:21. | :12:24. | |
Cameron will tell you over the last five years is, while I am a | :12:25. | :12:28. | |
supporter of colleague, when I disagree I will say and they will | :12:29. | :12:32. | |
know about it. Do you know what her vision for Brexit is? Does it | :12:33. | :12:37. | |
involve the single market? Have you had a conversation with her? I have | :12:38. | :12:41. | |
and I've said that I want Scotland to have access to that single | :12:42. | :12:45. | |
market. I think it is important for Scottish business, for a lot of | :12:46. | :12:49. | |
sectors, passports for financial services and the best deal for | :12:50. | :12:54. | |
Scotland's fishermen. A lot of sectors have specific interests and | :12:55. | :12:58. | |
we need a hard negotiator who is tough and steely and can go toe to | :12:59. | :13:02. | |
toe with the big players in Europe and who already has contacts with | :13:03. | :13:06. | |
all the interior ministers like Theresa May does. While I think that | :13:07. | :13:10. | |
Andrea Leadsom has a huge, Bright future in the party and has done | :13:11. | :13:14. | |
incredibly well, I have been up against debates and she is talented | :13:15. | :13:18. | |
but I think we need someone who can hit the ground running on day one | :13:19. | :13:23. | |
and that is Theresa May. Hit the ground running yet not offer any | :13:24. | :13:29. | |
decrease in immigration? There has been a lot of discussion. Actual | :13:30. | :13:34. | |
policy? I think there will have to be a lot of work done, not just on | :13:35. | :13:40. | |
the framework... What will that policy look like? On what is on the | :13:41. | :13:46. | |
table form the other 27 nations. I don't think you can criticise anyone | :13:47. | :13:50. | |
who wants the top job for wanting to keep their cards close to their | :13:51. | :13:54. | |
chest before they go to Europe to negotiate. Forgive me for not having | :13:55. | :13:59. | |
congratulated you sooner, Ruth, you got engaged on 23rd May. Andrea | :14:00. | :14:05. | |
Leadsom described as of today as not happy with the legislation that | :14:06. | :14:08. | |
would let you marry your girlfriend. I was a huge proponent of same-sex | :14:09. | :14:13. | |
marriage and that still parts of the UK where that is not permitted, I've | :14:14. | :14:20. | |
been invited by Amnesty to give the animal Pride march in Belfast... | :14:21. | :14:23. | |
Would you want to be in a party led by a woman not happy with the fact | :14:24. | :14:27. | |
that you could marry your fiance in a church? This is my party. She has | :14:28. | :14:38. | |
such is not a huge supporter of it, how do you feel, is it a crisis of | :14:39. | :14:43. | |
conscience, or water off a ducks back? I don't know Andrea Leadsom | :14:44. | :14:47. | |
well, she said it was something to do with her faith, as a woman of | :14:48. | :14:52. | |
faith myself. About my Christianity and some of the difficulties after | :14:53. | :14:56. | |
reconciling my faith and my sexuality I know it can take time | :14:57. | :15:00. | |
for people to do that. I'm very pleased that Theresa May was | :15:01. | :15:03. | |
instrument or in bringing forward same-sex marriage, something I have | :15:04. | :15:08. | |
supported going forward, and whoever becomes Prime Minister will get an | :15:09. | :15:12. | |
invitation to my wedding when it happens! With Davis, thank you, and | :15:13. | :15:18. | |
when that happy day dawns, I hope it is wonderful that you -- Ruth | :15:19. | :15:20. | |
Davidson. The murder of Glasgow shopkeeper | :15:21. | :15:25. | |
Asad Shah on 24th March this year sent shockwaves | :15:26. | :15:27. | |
through the Shawlands area of the city and saw hundreds take | :15:28. | :15:29. | |
to the streets for a vigil Today his killer pled guilty to the | :15:30. | :15:32. | |
murder at Glasgow High Court. A well loved petition Pakistani | :15:33. | :15:59. | |
shopkeeper, Asad Shah, is brutally murdered by another Muslim. A | :16:00. | :16:05. | |
community, a family, are left asking why. Initially, tabloids linked the | :16:06. | :16:12. | |
murder to a Facebook post hours before his death, where Asad Shah | :16:13. | :16:15. | |
wished everybody a happy Easter. Others said he belonged to the | :16:16. | :16:22. | |
persecuted Ackerman Ahmadiyya sect of Islam. This is the story of a | :16:23. | :16:28. | |
murder planned in Bradford, carried out in Glasgow and inspired by | :16:29. | :16:32. | |
events in Pakistan. It ties together the killing of a Scottish shopkeeper | :16:33. | :16:38. | |
with the killing of the Pakistani politician five years ago. Both | :16:39. | :16:43. | |
victims are accused by some Muslims as having committed Basa me. Today | :16:44. | :16:49. | |
the killer of Asad Shah pleaded guilty to the murder. I haven't | :16:50. | :16:55. | |
called him a man. I don't have any message for that monster. He | :16:56. | :17:05. | |
basically took away a person who was peaceful, who wanted unity in the | :17:06. | :17:11. | |
world, who wanted the community is to unite, who wanted to help the | :17:12. | :17:20. | |
community and him harming somewhat someone of peace, literally, he is | :17:21. | :17:32. | |
the enemy of humanity. On the 24th of March, Asad Shah had been working | :17:33. | :17:37. | |
in his family's shop when he was brutally attacked. After stabbing | :17:38. | :17:41. | |
him to death, his killer, who had travelled 200 miles from Bradford, | :17:42. | :17:45. | |
calmly waited at a bus stop opposite for the police. Asad Shah's brother | :17:46. | :17:52. | |
witnessed the attack but still finds it ethical to talk about. He said | :17:53. | :17:58. | |
his father had brought the family to Scotland in the 1990s from Pakistan | :17:59. | :18:04. | |
to escape religious intolerance. His pharmacy was set on fire by | :18:05. | :18:08. | |
extremist there and a hospital was burnt down. We had an apartment | :18:09. | :18:14. | |
above the pharmacy where my parents were with the kids. It was set on | :18:15. | :18:19. | |
fire. My dad thought about our future and thought we would be safer | :18:20. | :18:27. | |
in Britain. It's unimaginable, that's what's happened to my | :18:28. | :18:30. | |
brother. And it was all my dad trying to protect the kids, thinking | :18:31. | :18:35. | |
something like this would happen in Pakistan, and it has happened here. | :18:36. | :18:39. | |
But it seems Asad Shah wasn't targeted for his faith, but for | :18:40. | :18:45. | |
videos posted online. Recorded in his shop but discussing his | :18:46. | :18:51. | |
spiritual beliefs. In some he claims to be a prophet himself. One of | :18:52. | :18:56. | |
those who watched the videos and was incensed by them was 32-year-old | :18:57. | :19:01. | |
Tanveer Ahmed, a minicab driver from Bradford, who would go on to murder | :19:02. | :19:06. | |
Asad Shah. Tanveer Ahmed was a fervent admirer of another killer | :19:07. | :19:12. | |
who had murdered a prominent Pakistani politician who had | :19:13. | :19:18. | |
proposed to reform Pakistan's controversial blasphemy laws. He was | :19:19. | :19:25. | |
held up as a hero, despite being executed earlier this year. His | :19:26. | :19:31. | |
brother says Tanveer Ahmed had talked to him about the Glasgow | :19:32. | :19:32. | |
shopkeeper Asad Shah. Photo tributes online portrayed the | :19:33. | :19:50. | |
two killers together. Qadri's brother says Tanveer Ahmed was | :19:51. | :19:56. | |
inspired by his example. Tanveer Ahmed wasn't the only person | :19:57. | :20:14. | |
in Britain to admire Qadri. A number of mosques, including some in | :20:15. | :20:18. | |
Glasgow and Bradford expressed support for him, even if they | :20:19. | :20:23. | |
haven't for Tanveer Ahmed. Both Tanveer Ahmed and Qadri came from a | :20:24. | :20:27. | |
strand of Islam normally associated with a spiritual, liberal | :20:28. | :20:33. | |
interpretation of religion, one that completely opposes Al-Qaeda and | :20:34. | :20:40. | |
Isis, but the murders they committed upsets the narrative. Extremism it | :20:41. | :20:47. | |
seems is much more contradicted. Tonight, Tanveer Ahmed faces a | :20:48. | :20:52. | |
lengthy jail sentence. But even from behind bars he seems able to spread | :20:53. | :20:57. | |
his messages. This post on Facebook appears to be him sending his | :20:58. | :21:03. | |
supporters Eid greetings earlier this week but we haven't been able | :21:04. | :21:10. | |
to confirm it. It ends with a chilling warning, cut the heads from | :21:11. | :21:15. | |
the bodies. The man who murdered your brother, he said he did so | :21:16. | :21:19. | |
because he was defending the honour of the Prophet Muhammad because your | :21:20. | :21:22. | |
brother was claiming to be a prophet. I think it's very clear, | :21:23. | :21:32. | |
when you look at the history, the Prophet Muhammad did not result to | :21:33. | :21:37. | |
violence and things like this. Asad Shah's family have been torn apart | :21:38. | :21:41. | |
by the murder. They want to preserve his memory but are in fear of their | :21:42. | :21:44. | |
lives. It's been very difficult for the family. The family don't feel | :21:45. | :21:52. | |
safe any more. Living here in Scotland. And it has split the | :21:53. | :22:04. | |
family apart, since the incident. And some members of the family have | :22:05. | :22:11. | |
left Scotland, or are in the process of leaving and it really shouldn't | :22:12. | :22:17. | |
have come to this. In the last few years, | :22:18. | :22:24. | |
the word "whatever" and its youthful abbreviation "whatevs" have become | :22:25. | :22:28. | |
bywords for banality, the stock response of | :22:29. | :22:30. | |
the uninterested to tidings about which they | :22:31. | :22:32. | |
could not care less. Strange, then, that Tony Blair's | :22:33. | :22:33. | |
employment of it in a 2002 missive to George W Bush - | :22:34. | :22:36. | |
"I will be with you, whatever" - has proved | :22:37. | :22:39. | |
to be the most important of all 2.6 million words | :22:40. | :22:43. | |
in the Chilcot Report. But we can't be sure of that | :22:44. | :22:46. | |
quite yet because we That plum job's fallen | :22:47. | :22:48. | |
to Newsnight's Diplomatic Editor, Mark Urban, who's now had 36 hours | :22:49. | :22:53. | |
with a tome three times I have done a deep dive into volume | :22:54. | :23:10. | |
eight here, there all manner of different stories and aspects of | :23:11. | :23:13. | |
this. You can take your pick, really. The reason I have chosen to | :23:14. | :23:19. | |
tell this story tonight is because it's a pretty extraordinary tale. | :23:20. | :23:23. | |
Like many of other things, aspects of this were already in the public | :23:24. | :23:27. | |
domain. The idea that Britain's exit from Iraq and Basra was subject to | :23:28. | :23:33. | |
some sort of deal, and here it is in all its sordid detail, after years | :23:34. | :23:38. | |
of trying to bring peace to the streets of Basra and failing, the | :23:39. | :23:43. | |
British Army and MI6 ended up talking to a jailed militia | :23:44. | :23:47. | |
commander in a cell on the outskirts of Basra. | :23:48. | :23:53. | |
In mid-2007 after operations to hit the Shia militia and is, the dish | :23:54. | :24:02. | |
military tried a new tack, opening up discussions with a senior | :24:03. | :24:07. | |
commander they had arrested two years before. In the Chilcot Report | :24:08. | :24:08. | |
the prisoner is called Jam1. They came up with a trial deal. | :24:09. | :24:31. | |
British arrest operations would stop, it couple of British military | :24:32. | :24:35. | |
prisoners would be released and JAM1 would demonstrate his ability to | :24:36. | :24:40. | |
deliver a reduction in violence. The secretive talks came at an Aqua | :24:41. | :24:45. | |
time, just as the British military wanted to hand Basra over to Iraqi | :24:46. | :24:50. | |
forces and pull back to outside the city. -- awkward time. The Americans | :24:51. | :24:55. | |
had spent the summer doing the opposite, surging forces and | :24:56. | :24:58. | |
re-entering many areas. But the British wanted out. The security | :24:59. | :25:03. | |
situation was difficult for us. Every move outside our bases | :25:04. | :25:07. | |
required detailed planning and was high risk. I thought we were having | :25:08. | :25:14. | |
limited effect on improving the security situation in Basra. 90% of | :25:15. | :25:20. | |
the violence was directed against us. Politically there was no contact | :25:21. | :25:27. | |
between us and the local provincial government. Coalition sponsored | :25:28. | :25:36. | |
reconstruction had almost ceased. An MOD civil servant wrote that pulling | :25:37. | :25:38. | |
out of Basra city created... The British toe had started to roll | :25:39. | :25:52. | |
over the deals with debt captive, JAM1, from one month to the next. | :25:53. | :25:58. | |
Each time releasing more Iraqi military prisoners. One MoD civil | :25:59. | :26:01. | |
servant told the Defence Secretary... | :26:02. | :26:19. | |
Covered by their deal, the British pulled out of their main downtown | :26:20. | :26:25. | |
Basra base early in September. The Americans were seething and accused | :26:26. | :26:31. | |
the British of leaving Iraqis to the mercy of the militias, a charge one | :26:32. | :26:36. | |
Chilcot witness rejected. Yes, I think it is unfair. As we heard from | :26:37. | :26:41. | |
the general, we consolidated at the airport as part of a planned and | :26:42. | :26:47. | |
coherent transition from coalition lead to Iraqi lead for | :26:48. | :26:55. | |
responsibility for security. All agreed with the approach and the | :26:56. | :27:01. | |
timings. I think it is unfair. A joint intelligence committee report | :27:02. | :27:04. | |
showed a steep fall in attacks on British forces as a result of the | :27:05. | :27:09. | |
deal and speculated about a broader deal with the militias. Their | :27:10. | :27:15. | |
prisoner, JAM1, asked to be on the next wave of prisoner releases. Time | :27:16. | :27:22. | |
was running out. By the end of 2007, JAM1, who the Chilcot Report doesn't | :27:23. | :27:29. | |
name, but we know to have been... Was released. In the last months | :27:30. | :27:36. | |
violence picked up again. It reached a peak in March 2008 when Iraqi | :27:37. | :27:41. | |
forces engaged in a full-scale battle. For some days the British | :27:42. | :27:45. | |
hung back at the airport and American advisers went into Basra to | :27:46. | :27:50. | |
help restore the situation. It all added to the sense of an ignominious | :27:51. | :27:52. | |
end to the mission. It will take years for the full | :27:53. | :27:55. | |
impact of the Chilcot Report into the Iraq war to be | :27:56. | :27:59. | |
properly measured. Yesterday, as the man at its heart | :28:00. | :28:01. | |
responded to its publication, it took mere moments for talk | :28:02. | :28:05. | |
to turn to the demeanour and even They are, though, subjects | :28:06. | :28:08. | |
which have long exercised Once a close friend of the former | :28:09. | :28:13. | |
Prime Minister, it's fair to say they'd fallen out by the time Harris | :28:14. | :28:17. | |
published his 2010 novel, The Ghost, featuring | :28:18. | :28:20. | |
a thinly-disguised Blair facing In this film, Robert Harris | :28:21. | :28:23. | |
considers his former I first met Tony Blair in 1992, just | :28:24. | :28:42. | |
before John Major beat Neil Kinnock in that general election. My | :28:43. | :28:46. | |
overwhelming impression, I had never met him before, he was then the | :28:47. | :28:50. | |
Labour employment spokesman and I was a columnist on the Sunday Times. | :28:51. | :28:54. | |
He was above all refreshingly normal and he always talked as if he was | :28:55. | :28:58. | |
separate from politics in a funny way. He empathised with somebody | :28:59. | :29:03. | |
outside politics and he would say, I don't know why I'm doing this. We | :29:04. | :29:06. | |
don't seem to be going anywhere. I don't know why just don't give it | :29:07. | :29:12. | |
all up and go back to being a barrister and spend more time with | :29:13. | :29:18. | |
my wife and kids. One can't underestimate the importance of that | :29:19. | :29:22. | |
quality in Tony Blair, and what made in 1997 election possible. I was | :29:23. | :29:31. | |
with him in his constituency home in his sitting room, standing with him | :29:32. | :29:38. | |
at 10pm on election night when the election poll was first revealed and | :29:39. | :29:42. | |
David Dimbleby said we predict it will be the Labour Party with a | :29:43. | :29:46. | |
majority of 146. Extraordinary, nobody had forecast that. I remember | :29:47. | :29:51. | |
saying to him, how do you feel, because I had to write it up. He | :29:52. | :29:56. | |
said, I feel nothing, really. I'm just ready to get onto the next | :29:57. | :30:01. | |
thing. When I first arrived at his home in Sedgefield it was the | :30:02. | :30:05. | |
ordinary policemen on the door, but when I left, and it was clear he | :30:06. | :30:10. | |
would be Prime Minister, there were five or six men with machine guns | :30:11. | :30:13. | |
patrolling the gardens. From that time onwards I guess he never lived | :30:14. | :30:20. | |
a normal life again. I remember going to dinner at Chequers in the | :30:21. | :30:24. | |
summer after he was elected Prime Minister. Really almost the first | :30:25. | :30:32. | |
warning sign I got was that they were discussing a cabinet meeting, | :30:33. | :30:37. | |
and Roy Jenkins was there. In the 70s or 60s when he was a cabinet | :30:38. | :30:42. | |
minister, they had two hours on a Tuesday and two hours on Thursday. | :30:43. | :30:46. | |
Tony Blair said they wouldn't do that, just 45 minutes once per week. | :30:47. | :30:54. | |
Ireland but Jenkins looking at him, and I looked at Roy, and it was the | :30:55. | :30:58. | |
first moment where we thought, it will be a very personal, one-man | :30:59. | :31:03. | |
government. -- I remember. He often wore make-up, even when not in a | :31:04. | :31:08. | |
television studio. I don't know why, maybe it appealed to him, that sense | :31:09. | :31:13. | |
of always being gay performer. You don't pray together for example? No, | :31:14. | :31:20. | |
we don't pray together, Jeremy. Religious faith is very important | :31:21. | :31:27. | |
for him. He developed a very, good and evil point of view of the world. | :31:28. | :31:31. | |
When I saw he had written to George Bush, I am with you whatever, it has | :31:32. | :31:37. | |
the biblical connotation, I will be with you even to the end. And so, I | :31:38. | :31:45. | |
think you can see their this sort of very personalised, for want of a | :31:46. | :31:52. | |
better word, MSI and it kind of view of politics. -- Messianic view of | :31:53. | :32:02. | |
politics. As things went wrong, he developed a kind of masochism | :32:03. | :32:08. | |
strategy that reached its full flowering yesterday with the | :32:09. | :32:10. | |
publication of the Chilcot Report. That was almost like Christ nailed | :32:11. | :32:16. | |
to the cross. With Tony Blair you can never be quite sure where the | :32:17. | :32:20. | |
performance ends and the private man begins. I felt there there was | :32:21. | :32:26. | |
perhaps a mixture of the two and he was playing Christ on the cross, but | :32:27. | :32:33. | |
also in a way, he is in anguish, and he has morphed into this strange | :32:34. | :32:40. | |
figure that is not any longer quite of this world. It's said that all | :32:41. | :32:46. | |
prime ministers go mad after a time. And certainly Margaret Thatcher | :32:47. | :32:52. | |
began to behave erratically. But I don't think any has gone quite as | :32:53. | :32:58. | |
strange, I'm afraid, as Tony Blair, simply because he started out so | :32:59. | :33:00. | |
ordinary to begin with. David Cameron - remember him? | :33:01. | :33:06. | |
- didn't make much of it, and Alistair Campbell famously | :33:07. | :33:11. | |
forbade Tony Blair to speak of his own faith in public, boldly | :33:12. | :33:13. | |
stating, "We don't do God." But the next Prime Minister | :33:14. | :33:16. | |
definitely does. Both contenders are | :33:17. | :33:18. | |
practising Christians. Theresa May is a vicar's daughter | :33:19. | :33:19. | |
and Andrea Leadsom today declined to deny that she believed | :33:20. | :33:22. | |
the Almighty had ever On the other side of the Atlantic, | :33:23. | :33:24. | |
Christianity and right-wing politics often seem to combine to create | :33:25. | :33:31. | |
homophobic rhetoric and ugly scenes So, could we see more of that | :33:32. | :33:34. | |
over here, or perhaps, instead, a kinder, more | :33:35. | :33:37. | |
morally upright frame for politics, influenced | :33:38. | :33:40. | |
by the Christian religion? David Grossman has been | :33:41. | :33:43. | |
considering the leadership One of 5.4 FM in London and across | :33:44. | :34:05. | |
the UK and Digital radio. David Cameron once famously described his | :34:06. | :34:09. | |
own Christian faith as rather like the reception of the London radio | :34:10. | :34:14. | |
station Magic FM in the Chiltern Hills, it fades in and out, he said. | :34:15. | :34:20. | |
But for a large number of the current crop of Conservative MPs | :34:21. | :34:25. | |
their faith is constant and informs their politics. It is central to | :34:26. | :34:30. | |
their political lives. What's more large number of those who contested | :34:31. | :34:33. | |
the conservatively to ship this time say they are active Christians. The | :34:34. | :34:39. | |
question is, is this just a coincidence or has something | :34:40. | :34:43. | |
happened to the Conservative Party and its relationship with God and | :34:44. | :34:50. | |
church? There was, and I was part of it, an influential organisation | :34:51. | :34:54. | |
still active in the party today called the conservative Christian | :34:55. | :34:59. | |
Fellowship. Over a long period it recruited churchgoers, went to | :35:00. | :35:02. | |
churches and said get involved with politics. There may be an element of | :35:03. | :35:08. | |
that work coming to fruition but that work was certainly done before | :35:09. | :35:13. | |
people like Theresa May applied to be party members. Front runner | :35:14. | :35:17. | |
Theresa May is a vicar's daughter and says her faith is active and | :35:18. | :35:23. | |
deep. I think the point is that it is part of me. Part of who I am and | :35:24. | :35:28. | |
how I approach things. I think it's right that we don't flaunt these | :35:29. | :35:33. | |
things in British politics. But it is a part of me, it is there and it | :35:34. | :35:38. | |
obviously helps to frame my thinking and my approach. The other | :35:39. | :35:44. | |
contenders still in the race, Andrea Leadsom, has come to faith more | :35:45. | :35:48. | |
recently and seems more enthusiastic about discussing it. Ace I always | :35:49. | :35:55. | |
tried to ensure that I am doing what I think God would want me to do. I | :35:56. | :36:00. | |
don't mean that in the sense that I am not responsible for what I am | :36:01. | :36:04. | |
doing but try to keep in mind that God is there and guiding my hands, | :36:05. | :36:10. | |
and helping me. Andrea Leadsom is part of the all-party Christians in | :36:11. | :36:14. | |
Parliament group who meet to pray and study the Bible together. The | :36:15. | :36:19. | |
chairman of the group says Christian conservatives in particular have had | :36:20. | :36:23. | |
an image problem. Frankly over the last couple of decades Christians on | :36:24. | :36:28. | |
the right, we have not helped ourselves by pinpointing a couple of | :36:29. | :36:32. | |
issues and sometimes using the language. I think we are learning a | :36:33. | :36:36. | |
lot but that is not the way forward. It doesn't express the love of the | :36:37. | :36:41. | |
God we seek to follow. We've got to get over that. I don't blame people | :36:42. | :36:46. | |
for thinking we are hung up on one or two issues. It was the case a few | :36:47. | :36:51. | |
years ago. I hope increasingly it is not the case. Yet those issues, | :36:52. | :37:01. | |
abortion and particularly gay marriage are important to many party | :37:02. | :37:03. | |
activists who will be picking the next Prime Minister. David Cameron | :37:04. | :37:06. | |
drew criticism from his grasp modes legislating for gay marriage about | :37:07. | :37:09. | |
it being in the party manifesto. Today Andrea Leadsom said she would | :37:10. | :37:16. | |
have preferred the law not to be changed. I would have preferred | :37:17. | :37:20. | |
civil partnerships to be available to heterosexual and to gay couples | :37:21. | :37:24. | |
and four marriage to have remained as a Christian service that was her | :37:25. | :37:32. | |
men and women who wanted to commit in the eyes of God. But crucially | :37:33. | :37:38. | |
Andrea Leadsom isn't proposing to change the law back. It seems we are | :37:39. | :37:41. | |
a long way from the kind of religious rights are active in | :37:42. | :37:42. | |
American politics. Well, to discuss this and the wider | :37:43. | :37:45. | |
leadership race I'm joined by Conservative peer and commentator | :37:46. | :37:47. | |
Danny Finkelstein, Guardian columnist Zoe Williams | :37:48. | :37:49. | |
and Tim Montgomerie of the Times. And also the star of the film that | :37:50. | :38:02. | |
we just saw! Is religion having a resurgence in the Conservative | :38:03. | :38:08. | |
Party? I don't know but I welcome its overall influence. If you look | :38:09. | :38:11. | |
at Theresa May and some of the flagship reforms she has pioneered | :38:12. | :38:16. | |
against human trafficking, changing the stop and search laws that | :38:17. | :38:22. | |
discriminated and targeted minority communities particularly in London, | :38:23. | :38:26. | |
I think that sort of moral purpose... The Conservatives used to | :38:27. | :38:30. | |
talk about economic issues and it was more up like a party of | :38:31. | :38:32. | |
accountancy focus. I think what some of the Christians in the | :38:33. | :38:52. | |
party have brought in is not an American right style of politics but | :38:53. | :38:54. | |
it is a concern for bigger moral issues and I think it is overall | :38:55. | :38:57. | |
very good. Andrea Leadsom and are interested in tackling the problems | :38:58. | :38:59. | |
of young children, she wants much more spending on early intervention. | :39:00. | :39:01. | |
They could not hold these views unless they went to church? No axed | :39:02. | :39:06. | |
amuck sometimes I think there is coverage of the party claiming that | :39:07. | :39:12. | |
they are only interested in gay rights or abortion, whereas if you | :39:13. | :39:16. | |
go to a sermon in a church it is more likely to be on social justice | :39:17. | :39:20. | |
and concern for the poor and we are seeing those Christians coming to | :39:21. | :39:23. | |
the front of the party when they go week in, week out to cure about | :39:24. | :39:29. | |
those issues in churches. Zoe, are you joining your hands in prayer? I | :39:30. | :39:36. | |
am an atheist, all religions are equally ridiculous to me and I think | :39:37. | :39:40. | |
the place of religion in politics is to create an authoritarian frame | :39:41. | :39:44. | |
where one person establishes that authority over another, whether | :39:45. | :39:46. | |
because they are heterosexual or think of themselves as more moral, | :39:47. | :39:52. | |
that's equally problematic. And the weird thing is that Christians and | :39:53. | :39:57. | |
politics are obsessed with sets. It's all about, sexuality and | :39:58. | :40:02. | |
abortion. If they were more into equality, Jesus's big thing, we | :40:03. | :40:06. | |
could talk. I don't keep abreast of major religions and maybe honesty is | :40:07. | :40:11. | |
not a big thing any more yet I don't take either of these women seriously | :40:12. | :40:16. | |
as people of faith when they are not honest. Leadsom all day long has | :40:17. | :40:21. | |
been embellishing her CV and her achievements and her role in the | :40:22. | :40:25. | |
financial sector. She insists she has done nothing of the sort. She | :40:26. | :40:30. | |
called herself an investment manager when she was an age are at the time. | :40:31. | :40:35. | |
She is not an honest person, I think. Bat she was in human | :40:36. | :40:39. | |
resources at the time. So to take her as an honest voice in Christian | :40:40. | :40:48. | |
politics is strange. Is it not the problem that if a politician can | :40:49. | :40:52. | |
say, God told me to do it, then all bets are off? It is a bizarre | :40:53. | :41:04. | |
metropolitan... To which by the way, I belong, idea that people who are | :41:05. | :41:09. | |
Christian and outlandish. I am Jewish and I have never experienced | :41:10. | :41:12. | |
Christianity in the Conservative Party as an oppressive force. I | :41:13. | :41:20. | |
think Tim is correct. What has happened which is increased | :41:21. | :41:23. | |
Christian activism in the party in the last 15 years has gone alongside | :41:24. | :41:29. | |
increased social liberalism. Those two things have coexisted. I think | :41:30. | :41:32. | |
we should not try to look into people's souls and tell them... | :41:33. | :41:39. | |
Let's look entirely at the surface. Because on the surface it is the | :41:40. | :41:44. | |
gender of the two leading candidates that the editors find most | :41:45. | :41:49. | |
interesting. Zoe, do you dream of a day where we would not even notice | :41:50. | :41:53. | |
that both candidates are women? That they will be a long time coming. | :41:54. | :41:59. | |
It's extraordinary that the Conservatives should deliver an | :42:00. | :42:03. | |
all-female short list, having ridiculed... There was an | :42:04. | :42:08. | |
interesting tweet which I disagreed with which was the reason that | :42:09. | :42:12. | |
conservatives are so good at women is that they don't obsess about | :42:13. | :42:16. | |
identity politics like the left too. I don't agree. This has occurred | :42:17. | :42:21. | |
acres of a bloodbath, a public school stitch up and then they all | :42:22. | :42:29. | |
turned on each other, like Lord Of The Flies. And so happened that the | :42:30. | :42:33. | |
only two people left all women. It's a triumph of deregulated free-market | :42:34. | :42:37. | |
politics that yields the result is that the left-wingers would love to | :42:38. | :42:43. | |
see. This is not proof of anything. No. The reason that the Labour | :42:44. | :42:52. | |
Party, the left, boastful and saw women is because they thought women | :42:53. | :42:57. | |
would vote Conservative. And for a long period of history the | :42:58. | :42:59. | |
Conservative Party has done women are better than men. But it has | :43:00. | :43:04. | |
stopped doing that and what many modernisers have wanted to achieved | :43:05. | :43:10. | |
is that it should do that again. Two things, this is an encouraging | :43:11. | :43:13. | |
development, secondly, only a small one. It comes despite the fact that | :43:14. | :43:18. | |
we are still a long way from equality. Because these women did | :43:19. | :43:23. | |
not come through all women short lists, they had to fight for seats. | :43:24. | :43:31. | |
They became much better politicians because they had to overcome | :43:32. | :43:35. | |
obstacles, sometimes more so, than the men face. Whereas the women who | :43:36. | :43:39. | |
have come through the Labour Party haven't had that same element of | :43:40. | :43:42. | |
political gorilla warfare that businesses are read to win these | :43:43. | :43:51. | |
seats. For example? The Labour have all women short lists. Give an | :43:52. | :43:55. | |
example of a rubbish Labour woman who would not have won a Tory seat. | :43:56. | :44:01. | |
You haven't had a woman he'd still whereas the Tory party has a stream | :44:02. | :44:05. | |
of women coming through. You don't seriously think these two women are | :44:06. | :44:10. | |
the best politicians in the Conservative Party? I think Theresa | :44:11. | :44:14. | |
May is incredibly impressive as a politician. You were backing Michael | :44:15. | :44:22. | |
Gove at the weekend. I backed Boris Johnson committee would have been my | :44:23. | :44:29. | |
choice. Go for the hat-trick, who will you back next? And that we will | :44:30. | :44:33. | |
have a two-month contest because I have no idea what Theresa May thinks | :44:34. | :44:37. | |
about, for example, Seve Javid and his idea of borrowing... Were not | :44:38. | :44:47. | |
some of the Labour women suggesting that at the last general election? | :44:48. | :44:51. | |
They was adjusting borrowing on every front! -- Sajid Javid. It's | :44:52. | :44:59. | |
exactly the same, it just came from a Tory. I think the Conservative | :45:00. | :45:06. | |
Party has a number of very good women and it is very good that we | :45:07. | :45:11. | |
have to women in but that should not disguise the fact that the party and | :45:12. | :45:15. | |
British politics is a long way from achieving equality in politics for | :45:16. | :45:23. | |
women. The point is that not all women are feminists. Neither of | :45:24. | :45:25. | |
these two will improve the lot of women. Thank you all very much. That | :45:26. | :45:32. | |
is all that we have time for. Good night. | :45:33. | :45:43. | |
Hello, not much changing over the next few days, more rain and some | :45:44. | :45:51. | |
sunshine. Heavy rain overnight will clear from | :45:52. | :45:53. |