12/09/2016 Newsnight


12/09/2016

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Ceasefire in Syria - but not for Islamic State

:00:00.:00:08.

and the jihadists formerly known as Nusra Front.

:00:09.:00:12.

A leading figure exclusively tells Newsnight that America and Russia

:00:13.:00:14.

can't carry out their plan to hit them without hitting

:00:15.:00:16.

It's not uncommon to have one family with members from several groups

:00:17.:00:23.

They go fight and they come back to their houses, with their

:00:24.:00:28.

JFS is deeply embedded in society and cannot be singled

:00:29.:00:34.

And can this really alleviate the suffering?

:00:35.:00:38.

We film an extraodinary operation in Aleppo guided

:00:39.:00:42.

Hilary Clinton is unwell - she cancels campaigning

:00:43.:00:48.

because of a bout of pneumonia, diagnosed but not

:00:49.:00:50.

Now Donald Trump is to release his medical records.

:00:51.:00:55.

We hear from former candidate Howard Dean.

:00:56.:00:58.

Well, that's what the press does, the press doesn't like people's

:00:59.:01:02.

privacy, as we say on this side of the Atlantic, so they resent it.

:01:03.:01:07.

But if you had Hillary Clinton with the experience of the press,

:01:08.:01:09.

The founder of the Daily Beast, Tina Brown, is here to

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I can't believe this has happened to me!

:01:15.:01:18.

It's all gone horribly wrong for the BBC.

:01:19.:01:21.

Bake Off, which delivered ten million viewers and headlines

:01:22.:01:23.

galore, is leaving the broadcaster for the Channel 4 kitchen

:01:24.:01:26.

First Top Gear, then The Voice, now this.

:01:27.:01:30.

Should the BBC do what it takes to keep their best show,

:01:31.:01:37.

or is there a limit to the money? We'll ask former BBC One controller

:01:38.:01:40.

executive Lorraine Hegassy what she would have done.

:01:41.:01:51.

Just before the ceasefire in Syria which started six hours ago

:01:52.:01:56.

President Assad vowed to take back the whole of Syria from rebel groups

:01:57.:01:59.

in an interview broadcast on state media.

:02:00.:02:02.

The seven day ceasefire includes improved humanitarian access

:02:03.:02:05.

and joint US Russian targeting of hardline extremists,

:02:06.:02:12.

but a big challenge is how to separate nationalist rebels

:02:13.:02:16.

from jihadists, especially as the grouping formerly

:02:17.:02:18.

known as the Nusra Front, which has been playing a vital role

:02:19.:02:21.

Our reporter Secunder Kermani has had an exclusive interview

:02:22.:02:26.

with a representative of the jihadi group.

:02:27.:02:29.

On the Muslim festival of sackrifies more bloodshed as regime planes

:02:30.:02:42.

bombed rebel held Aleppo, ahead of the ceasefire coming into effect.

:02:43.:02:48.

A deal is meant to bring a week of peace allowing aid into besieged

:02:49.:02:51.

areas. It is no long-term solution though.

:02:52.:02:57.

Assad performed triumph fall prayers in a district newly captured from

:02:58.:03:00.

rebels. And vowed to take the entire

:03:01.:03:06.

country. Opposition representatives haven't formally signed a deal, and

:03:07.:03:11.

many in rebel areas, while glad of any pause in fighting are sceptical.

:03:12.:03:17.

One of the key elms in the deal is if the ceasefire holds for a week,

:03:18.:03:22.

instead of Assad's Air Force America and Russia will set up a joint

:03:23.:03:30.

command, they say to target Isis, and the Jihadist group JFS.

:03:31.:03:37.

JFS were until recently called Nusra and were Al-Qaeda's affiliate in

:03:38.:03:41.

Syria. They officially severed ties with

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Al-Qaeda. Unlike Isis, they fought a long side mainstream rebel groups

:03:50.:03:53.

and have been key in breaking the regime siege of Aleppo. JFS

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spokesman answered questions I e-mails to him about the plans to

:03:57.:04:01.

target them. The question is where do they think it exists? They are

:04:02.:04:05.

not on another planet. They are parliament of the Syrian society. It

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is not uncommon to have one family with members from several groups

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living in the same house. They go fight and come back to their house,

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with their family, with civilians. JFS is deeply embedded in society,

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and cannot be singled out in any way. They don't govern, and area on

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their own, they are not exclusive to any particular location. America and

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Russia know this very very well. This map shows areas under control

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by different factions in Syria. Isis territory is demarcated but JFS

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jointly controlled areas alongside rebel groups and that ignored the

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complicated aligns in many place, it seems the US is trying to split the

:04:54.:04:58.

other rebels away from JFS but they are seen as a powerful ally It is

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seen as a Syrian movement, standing up for Syrians and fighting the

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regime. They are effective particularly in recent offensives in

:05:10.:05:13.

Aleppo. It makes no sense to peel away from them. In some ways some of

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the rebel groups could see this as divide and rule by the great powers

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and ignore it. JFS has concentrated on attacking

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the Assad regime but some say despite the official break, they are

:05:31.:05:35.

still Al-Qaeda and still a danger. Something their spokesman denies. We

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have been very clear about our split but I will say it again, JFS is not

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an affiliate of Al-Qaeda. We are an independent body working to

:05:46.:05:48.

establish the common goals of the revolutionary forces in Syria.

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I asked if that means they oppose events like 9/11? As for 9/11 that

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happened 15 years ago, and is completely irrelevant to what is

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happening in Syrian today. Would you ask Obama to be responsible for

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policies that the United States had in Japan, or Vietnam, or South

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America under previous admin straights? Obviously not. Our

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policies are clear, and that is all that matters.

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The coalition of other rebel groups have tonight indicated they will

:06:23.:06:26.

abide by the ceasefire. But they have also strongly criticised the

:06:27.:06:30.

plans to attack JFS, this could be one of the key flaws that leads to

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the ceasefire's downfall. JFS was not established to fight

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anyone except the Assad regime and whoever allies with him. Who are the

:06:40.:06:45.

terrorists? Hezbollah and the PKK both terrorist organisations,

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according to the US, and they are actively and opening fighting in

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Syria, why are they not targeted For now the ceasefire appears to be

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holding but for many in city like Aleppo, a temporary peace is not

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enough. My wife told me that after sunset we

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will go out, because it is a ceasefire. Now we are able to, I can

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go with you and our daughter without being afraid, or scared about, a bit

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of life, but in general, we want better, we want, what we want, it is

:07:20.:07:25.

freedom, OK, to remove Assad. Families tonight have some respite

:07:26.:07:27.

from the bombs but for how long? What happens in rebel held parts of

:07:28.:07:36.

Syria when hospital doctors are under constant pressure from

:07:37.:07:39.

bombing, lack of equipment, and even lack of experience. Well, in Aleppo,

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they call for David knot, the British doctor who specialises in

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emergency scare in war zones and training doctors under fire, this

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week, however, he lent a hand remotely, advising in an operation

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via Skype. John Sweeney was there as he oversaw the reconstruction of a

:08:00.:08:06.

man's jaw after an attack. Under ground and under siege. A rare

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glimpse into an operating theatre in Aleppo. Hollywood doesn't do the

:08:13.:08:16.

reality of war, so this is what it looks like. When a man has his jaw

:08:17.:08:23.

blown off. In rebel held Syria, being a doctor is a dangerous game.

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754 doctors have been actively killed in the north of Syria, since

:08:30.:08:35.

the conflict started in 2011, and it suggested that being a medic or even

:08:36.:08:39.

a patient in a hospital is probably the worst place you possibly can be

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in, because hospitals are targeted constantly, doctors are targeted

:08:45.:08:48.

constantly. Mohammed was hit they say by a Russian bomb which also

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killed two of his friends. They have never done a jaw reconstruction

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before, but if they don't, the chances for this father of three are

:08:59.:09:04.

slim. David Knot is a London surgeon who went to Aleppo two years ago to

:09:05.:09:09.

train surgeon, now they have asked him to direct the jaw operation via

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Skype and what's app. How exciting is this? It is one of the most

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exciting things I have done. Being able to direct surgeons who are I

:09:22.:09:24.

have trained, I have trained them when I was this in Syria, they know

:09:25.:09:27.

me and they have confidence in me that I know them, I have confidence

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in them, I know what they can do, sow between the two of us, we can do

:09:33.:09:35.

this operation. -- so. We believe this is a world

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first. A selfie stick being used to transport an eminent London surgeon

:09:44.:09:46.

into a basement hospital in a besieged city. I want you to take an

:09:47.:09:54.

incision which goes to take the whole of the major muscle, so I want

:09:55.:10:03.

you to make an incision, laterally, below the laterally below the

:10:04.:10:08.

nipple, to start to mobilise the major muscle. OK?

:10:09.:10:19.

What about the nipple. I make two flaps and mobilise. That is fine.

:10:20.:10:28.

The challenge is that the doctors are young and enthusiastic but they

:10:29.:10:32.

are inexperienced. David Knot, he knows what he is doing, and the two

:10:33.:10:38.

sets of doctors are connecting with the latest in our amazing digital

:10:39.:10:43.

technology, but of course batteries go down. The line drops out. It is

:10:44.:10:51.

difficult, but nevertheless the two sets of doctors are breaking the

:10:52.:10:55.

siege of Aleppo. There is a small problem here. OK.

:10:56.:11:05.

We can't put two screws... The doctors solve their problem then

:11:06.:11:08.

David explained to me the complexity of the operation. This is the

:11:09.:11:13.

muscle, and this is the muscle which has an artery comes off just below

:11:14.:11:18.

the collarbone, so we preserve that artery, to this muscle, we have put

:11:19.:11:22.

an area of skin on here as well, so we are going to move that right up

:11:23.:11:27.

into the man's jaw, and we are going to put it underneath the metal plate

:11:28.:11:32.

and then the skin goes over the top, so the skin will come here, and the

:11:33.:11:36.

muscle will cover the plate. So you won't know when you look at him he

:11:37.:11:41.

has a plate in his mouth? Correct. You have done a wonderful job today.

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Thanks to you. How good as Dr Knot been in terms of helping you do this

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operation? How valuable has been his help, is the question? We are very

:11:56.:12:02.

thankful for Dr Knot, because it's a very difficult and complex

:12:03.:12:13.

operation. We can't do it alone. We need some help, and we can't go

:12:14.:12:17.

outside of Aleppo. We must do it here. This was never about just

:12:18.:12:23.

saving the life of one man. Now that the doctors in Aleppo know the

:12:24.:12:27.

technique, they can operate on other patients. But it is also about

:12:28.:12:32.

reminding them and their patients, that the world has not quite

:12:33.:12:34.

forgotten Aleppo. Joining me now from Washington

:12:35.:12:40.

DC is Farah al Atassi, a spokeswoman for

:12:41.:12:42.

the Syrian opposition Good evening to you. Can we talk

:12:43.:12:52.

about what you make of the ceasefire, do you think the deal is

:12:53.:13:01.

a good one? First of all, they did not receive an official copy of the

:13:02.:13:07.

US-Russian agreement yet, we cannot comment on it in an official way, we

:13:08.:13:12.

need a copy of this agreement so we can analyse it, we can discuss any

:13:13.:13:17.

defaults, in terms of enforcement measurements and then we can give an

:13:18.:13:22.

official statement and response about how do we view this agreement?

:13:23.:13:27.

However, from previous agreements between the Russian and the

:13:28.:13:34.

American, the HNC and other Syrian opposition group responds positively

:13:35.:13:37.

towards any international efforts that will really halt violence in

:13:38.:13:42.

Syria, particularly putting pressure on the Assad regime and his allies

:13:43.:13:50.

in stopping the bombardment and air strikes against civilian targets,

:13:51.:13:54.

including the Russians themselves, so if this agreement really enforced

:13:55.:13:57.

fully by the regime, absolutely we welcome it. And we saw you, images

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of children out playing on swings tonight, just the inStans youly

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different feeling they have -- instantaneously feeling they have, I

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wonder what you think will be the progress of this, what do you think

:14:15.:14:21.

the Russians intention is? As I said, from previous experience of

:14:22.:14:24.

prior agreements between the Russians and the American, it was

:14:25.:14:28.

the Russians who breached the agreements they made themselves,

:14:29.:14:34.

even the day after the agreement was announced, the Russian conducted an

:14:35.:14:40.

air strikes on the suburb of Idlib, and we have around 15 Syrian

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civilians were killed in that by the Russians themselves, so I said it is

:14:47.:14:49.

premature to assess how this agreement will be workable on the

:14:50.:14:54.

ground, we hope it is will workable on the ground, we we pray it will be

:14:55.:14:58.

workable on the ground, even secretary Carey -- Kerry today he

:14:59.:15:04.

raised some suspicions and he said it might not work well, but we have

:15:05.:15:10.

to wait, just, we need to see how the regime will abide with this

:15:11.:15:15.

agreement, the Armed Forces they always welcomed the channel of the

:15:16.:15:19.

humanitarian aid, and they say they are ready to protect the channel of

:15:20.:15:24.

the humanitarian aid, and they will reflect positively towards this.

:15:25.:15:29.

Earlier in the programme we had a representative of the former Nusra

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front JFS on the programme, saying that actually because they were very

:15:34.:15:36.

much in the forefront of in the battle for 11 and that I are as it

:15:37.:15:41.

were embedded in different napes and so forth, that the idea of

:15:42.:15:46.

separating them out as a legitimate target, as opposed to moderate

:15:47.:15:49.

opposition is impossible. What do you say to that? I am not a military

:15:50.:15:59.

expert. I can comment on political issue, however, gee graph Che and

:16:00.:16:03.

strategically that statement is true. And realistic because it is so

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hard to really isolate the civilians places because a lot of this places

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and areas are besieged by the Syrian regime and Iranian militia, so you

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cannot really recognise the Free Syrian Army from other armed, you

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know, maybe for fanatic groups so they are somehow, it is intertwined,

:16:27.:16:32.

that is why we read today a statement by most of the military

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armed groups on the ground, an article number eight, they are

:16:38.:16:44.

saying clearly that the agreement excludes some forces from the

:16:45.:16:48.

agreement, however, they did not talk about other militia fighting,

:16:49.:16:54.

or militia fighting beside the regime, like Hezbollah, like...

:16:55.:17:01.

All of these forces are on the ground and all of them are

:17:02.:17:07.

intertwined. Thank you for joining us tonight.

:17:08.:17:09.

Now if you caught Newsnight pretty much any night last week you'll know

:17:10.:17:12.

we have taken a keen interest in the progress - or lack of it -

:17:13.:17:16.

of a report by MPs into the use of UK arms by Saudi Arabia

:17:17.:17:19.

Last Tuesday, Gabriel Gatehouse obtained a draft of the report

:17:20.:17:22.

which was highly critical of the Saudis.

:17:23.:17:24.

It found that it was "inevitable" that British weapons had been

:17:25.:17:27.

involved in violations of international law and that arms

:17:28.:17:31.

sales to Saudi were "very possibly in contravention

:17:32.:17:34.

The report called for arms sales to Saudi Arabia

:17:35.:17:43.

But some MPs had other ideas - a second leak revealed how two

:17:44.:17:47.

pro-Saudi MPs were attempting to water down the report.

:17:48.:17:50.

Here's how the report would change if amendments tabled by John Spellar

:17:51.:17:55.

and Crispin Blunt, the influential chair of the Foreign Affairs

:17:56.:17:57.

Last Thursday Blunt came on Newsnight to explain why

:17:58.:18:05.

I also asked him if he'd walked out of the committee to freeze its work

:18:06.:18:15.

That portrays a misunderstanding of how this particular...

:18:16.:18:28.

...collection of four committee's works.

:18:29.:18:30.

Whatever comes out of this particular, of the oversight of arms

:18:31.:18:36.

Did you walk out last night, Crispin Blunt?

:18:37.:18:39.

I am not going to talk about a committee process

:18:40.:18:43.

over the lengths Blunt has gone to in order to -

:18:44.:18:54.

Yes, Crispin Blunt is not giving up. He has provided a new report and

:18:55.:19:10.

essentially his acknowledging he will not get the numbers he wants to

:19:11.:19:14.

soften the criticisms of Saudi Arabia and pull back on a ban on

:19:15.:19:18.

arms sales to the kingdom. He is writing what he is describing as an

:19:19.:19:22.

alternative report and he is planning to put that to the

:19:23.:19:26.

committee he chairs, the Foreign Affairs Select Committee, tomorrow

:19:27.:19:28.

afternoon, and he will essentially say to the members of that

:19:29.:19:32.

committee, let's agree to this and tack it onto the end of the report

:19:33.:19:36.

when he is not going to get his way. He may get it just about past his

:19:37.:19:41.

committee but he certainly will not get unanimous agreement for that.

:19:42.:19:46.

And that is not all he is talking about? He says the arms committee,

:19:47.:19:52.

which has defence, foreign affairs, International affairs and the

:19:53.:19:55.

business committee is not working, and he says there should be one

:19:56.:19:59.

select committee that does that work... His? No, he is a senseless

:20:00.:20:08.

chap, he says it should be a new committee. Now, the members of that

:20:09.:20:12.

committee may think the most important thing is to look at the

:20:13.:20:15.

number of exports, rather than ethical questions about arms sales

:20:16.:20:19.

to Saudi Arabia. This evening I spoke to Crispin Blunt and this is

:20:20.:20:22.

what he told me. I have no comment on the private

:20:23.:20:27.

proceeding of my committee or other select committees. When we are in a

:20:28.:20:32.

position to say something publicly then of course I'd be happy to do

:20:33.:20:35.

so. Nick, thank you.

:20:36.:20:38.

How big a deal to American voters is Hilary Clinton's bout

:20:39.:20:41.

of "walking pneumonia", - in other words a mild

:20:42.:20:43.

Donald Trump speaking this morning on Fox News said he hopes

:20:44.:20:46.

the Democrat candidate gets well soon, and then immediately announced

:20:47.:20:49.

he that was going to release his own medical records.

:20:50.:20:51.

Health, he says, is an issue in the campaign, and he'll be

:20:52.:20:54.

releasing what he calls "very specific numbers".

:20:55.:20:56.

So everything, it seems, is fair game

:20:57.:20:57.

Will Hillary be accused of hiding her health history -

:20:58.:21:05.

diagnosed on Friday, forced to reveal it on Sunday

:21:06.:21:08.

Here is Emily. This is the Hillary she wants you to

:21:09.:21:19.

know, the fighter, the woman of strength. And this is the Hillary

:21:20.:21:24.

you will have seen a lot of today, played silently on a loop. The woozy

:21:25.:21:29.

wobble as she struggles to stay upright, even losing issue as she

:21:30.:21:34.

crumples into the car. The decision from the campaign to attract Hillary

:21:35.:21:40.

from the 9/11 memorial service without telling any reporters for

:21:41.:21:45.

about 90 minutes was incredibly short-sighted and foolish, given

:21:46.:21:48.

that there were all these conspiracy theories already swirling about her

:21:49.:21:53.

health. Her emergency exit from the memorial service was followed by 90

:21:54.:21:56.

minutes where nobody knew what to think. Unexpectedly left early

:21:57.:22:05.

because of what appears to be a medical episode... And then the

:22:06.:22:08.

revelation she had been diagnosed two days earlier with pneumonia.

:22:09.:22:15.

We're breaking news on Hillary Clinton's health. Something which

:22:16.:22:18.

seemed retrospectively to explain this. A Cleveland coughing fit,

:22:19.:22:26.

rescued at the 11th hour with a stab at a joke. Every time I think about

:22:27.:22:37.

Trump, I get a coughing fit. Was this cover-up a mistake? The press

:22:38.:22:53.

does not like people's privacy but... Here is the man you might

:22:54.:23:00.

remember from this moment, the Iowa caucus of 2004. The screen that

:23:01.:23:04.

spells the sound of his own presidential hopes slipping away.

:23:05.:23:07.

The whole thing did not slip away from a because of the I have a

:23:08.:23:12.

scream speech, the whole thing slipped away because we were not

:23:13.:23:15.

organised. This is not slipping away from Hillary Clinton, it is not

:23:16.:23:20.

going to slip away from Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton will be the

:23:21.:23:25.

next president of the United States because the alternative is

:23:26.:23:29.

unthinkable. Unthinkable to Democrats but the whole thing will

:23:30.:23:34.

give credence to something of a trump conspiracy, that Hillary was

:23:35.:23:40.

too ill to stand. This evening he revealed his own medical records

:23:41.:23:46.

live on TV. I took a physical and I will be revealing the numbers when

:23:47.:23:49.

they come in. Hopefully they will be good, I feel great. Clinton will

:23:50.:23:57.

miss a couple of days of campaigning to rest. Somewhere lurks the

:23:58.:24:04.

question they cannot ask, her constitutional contingency plan if

:24:05.:24:09.

the nominee herself cannot stand. Tisbury difficult in the United

:24:10.:24:13.

States whereby presidents and presidential candidates have an

:24:14.:24:16.

existence which is separated from the party because it is a

:24:17.:24:20.

presidential system rather than a parliamentary system. We have not

:24:21.:24:24.

had such close to horse race for some time so the sound as people

:24:25.:24:27.

would claim that Bernie had a legitimate right to be on the

:24:28.:24:35.

ticket, even if only as a vice president running mate because Kane

:24:36.:24:41.

would have to nominate someone and how would it have to be approved? It

:24:42.:24:47.

would have to be done by some sort of process approved by the

:24:48.:24:52.

Democratic National committee. Clinton has seen something of a

:24:53.:24:55.

narrowing in the polls in recent days. She is still ahead nationally

:24:56.:24:59.

and in most of the battle ground states. Convincing the public she is

:25:00.:25:05.

fit might be the work of antibiotics and a few days in bed. But

:25:06.:25:10.

convincing the public she has nothing to hide, that is a battle

:25:11.:25:14.

she has been fighting for two and a half decades and it probably will

:25:15.:25:17.

not disappear when the cough does. Tina Brown is the former editor

:25:18.:25:23.

of Vanity Fair, The New Yorker, I asked her if Hillary had done

:25:24.:25:35.

damage by being secretive? Does question about who she has done

:25:36.:25:39.

damage with. Politically it gives rise to another round of lack of

:25:40.:25:44.

transparency. Why didn't she reveal it before? With the public, I am not

:25:45.:25:50.

so sure. I think there will be a lot of sympathy for a woman who has been

:25:51.:25:55.

brutally pummelled from one whole year on the campaign trail. And when

:25:56.:25:59.

people learn she was diagnosed Friday and yet she went on and did

:26:00.:26:03.

it to our national security meeting, she went to Barbra Streisand

:26:04.:26:06.

fundraiser, she did another fundraiser, she went to the 9/11

:26:07.:26:11.

event, she was trying to soldier on. In many ways people will say this

:26:12.:26:16.

woman is valiant and why is everybody on her case? Howard Dean

:26:17.:26:20.

said to us, why doesn't she just do things on Skype? Why does she use

:26:21.:26:26.

social media more? Why does she have to be ever present? On the other

:26:27.:26:33.

hand, a whole bunch of people on CNN were saying why didn't she go to

:26:34.:26:38.

talk to people more, why was she raising money in the Hamptons in

:26:39.:26:40.

August when she could have done stuff like this? I think Hillary

:26:41.:26:45.

does feel that connecting with real people and hearing what they have to

:26:46.:26:52.

say is as important to her as them talking -- is heard talking to them.

:26:53.:26:57.

That is why she goes out on the trail will stop does this matter to

:26:58.:27:02.

the voters? If she becomes ill again, does this build a picture? It

:27:03.:27:09.

does, unfortunately. Only 35% of Americans polled by CNN in the last

:27:10.:27:14.

poll said they thought she was honest or trustworthy. 50% amazingly

:27:15.:27:18.

think Trump is honest or trustworthy. It is not a great

:27:19.:27:23.

figure for either of them but it is remarkable because pretty much

:27:24.:27:26.

everything comes out of Donald Trump is that mouth is fallacious and he

:27:27.:27:30.

has a higher trust rating than Hillary Clinton. Only 80% think what

:27:31.:27:35.

Trump says is true whereas 50% is true. It is a very difficult thing

:27:36.:27:44.

for her. And unfortunately this has taken root. What have we come to

:27:45.:27:48.

where we will have the disclosure of Donald Trump's medical records which

:27:49.:27:53.

will be very specific and detailed, and actually, to run as a

:27:54.:27:57.

presidential candidate, you have to have full health disclosure? What is

:27:58.:28:03.

amusing with Donald Trump is he did one disclosure but it was by a

:28:04.:28:09.

giggling gastroenterologist who said his health was unbelievably terrific

:28:10.:28:13.

or awesomely amazing or some unlikely adjective. But

:28:14.:28:17.

unfortunately, yes, everyone will basically have to reveal how much

:28:18.:28:21.

under an head they have for the public scrutiny and be told that is

:28:22.:28:25.

relevant. It is absolutely grotesque. It has become the most

:28:26.:28:31.

brutal gladiatorial blood fest. If she is feeling ill right now, who

:28:32.:28:38.

can blame her? Does seem strange. Roosevelt was in a wheelchair, it

:28:39.:28:44.

did not make him a lesser president. People make judgments and here we

:28:45.:28:47.

are in the middle of the Paralympics. I could not agree more.

:28:48.:28:52.

The one thing you could not accuse Hillary Clinton of is lack of

:28:53.:28:57.

stamina. The woman is an unbelievable Sherman tank in energy.

:28:58.:29:01.

She wore down Obama to the bone crisp in the last election. She went

:29:02.:29:05.

to the bitter end. And then she turned around having lost, and did

:29:06.:29:11.

250 fundraisers for Obama without so much as a weekend. To use the

:29:12.:29:17.

stamina point with Hillary is. You may dislike her but she can out run

:29:18.:29:22.

anyone. And should age be an issue at all? In this moment, I did think

:29:23.:29:29.

either of the candidates really are old to run for president because we

:29:30.:29:34.

live in a different era. Trump is 70 and Hillary is 68. They are both

:29:35.:29:38.

getting up there. We have had a much younger president in Obama but we

:29:39.:29:42.

have also had all the presidents with Reagan. I think in this era,

:29:43.:29:47.

this age is not too old to run for president but I think it is

:29:48.:29:51.

enormously the key game and you cannot do it without very good

:29:52.:29:55.

health. I think Hillary's health is fine. She's very exhausted now and

:29:56.:30:00.

she has had this cough which has plagued her and has perhaps been

:30:01.:30:03.

wrongly diagnosed. I do know. That is the point we're most interested

:30:04.:30:07.

in. Tina Brown, thank you for joining us.

:30:08.:30:10.

Ron Christie is CEO of Christie Strategies

:30:11.:30:11.

which is a political strategy firm and he is a former senior

:30:12.:30:14.

Good evening, first of all, is Donald Trump right to make hay out

:30:15.:30:22.

of Hillary Clinton's health scare? I don't think so, I think this is the

:30:23.:30:27.

time where you look at the former Secretary of State and you say you

:30:28.:30:31.

wish her well, you want the see her back on the campaign trail. Mr Trump

:30:32.:30:35.

was very subdued talking art her health today, that is where it

:30:36.:30:39.

should be. He was subdued at fist but he announced he would be

:30:40.:30:43.

releasing his very specific medical records, he said and apparently he

:30:44.:30:47.

will be doing it live on television. So he is making a deal out of it.

:30:48.:30:55.

Well, with Donald Trump seefrmgs to be reality TV show, he said he had

:30:56.:30:59.

his physical taken last week, it shows he has a physical because the

:31:00.:31:04.

Secretary of State had her incident yet, it is very important for the

:31:05.:31:07.

American people to understand the health of their next President of

:31:08.:31:10.

the United States, and to ascertain whether north they have the stamina,

:31:11.:31:13.

they have the Fitzpatrick #k58 ability to do the job. -- physical

:31:14.:31:16.

ability to do the job. I can tell you it is gruelling at the staff

:31:17.:31:20.

level, it is more brutal for the President and the Vice President.

:31:21.:31:25.

You heard Tina Brown saying Hillary Clinton has the stamina of a Sherman

:31:26.:31:30.

tank, she did fund-raisers for Barack Obama, do you think there are

:31:31.:31:35.

doubts about her staying power if she were to become President,

:31:36.:31:39.

really? Yes, really. I am very worried about her health, she has

:31:40.:31:43.

not been very healthy this year, she is the first one to tell you that,

:31:44.:31:47.

the Secretary of State needs to come out and this is one of the reasons I

:31:48.:31:52.

think her disapproval numbers are so high, her trustworthiness numbers

:31:53.:31:55.

are so low, with the Clintons it is a drip, drip, drip. As a former

:31:56.:32:01.

Obama, the Obama administration official said set it out there,

:32:02.:32:04.

level with the American people, say here is my health condition, here is

:32:05.:32:08.

how I am feeling, I am feeling great. Put it behind her, the longer

:32:09.:32:12.

it takes for the Secretary of State to come out with her medical

:32:13.:32:16.

condition the ling doubts Americans have. Interestingly, what is the

:32:17.:32:21.

hierarchy of health is this we know there is lots of American have for

:32:22.:32:28.

example die Beattie, if Donald Trump was, to have that, do you think

:32:29.:32:33.

there would be a problem as it affects so much of the population

:32:34.:32:40.

She has a diagnosis of pneumonia, I almost died of pneumonia, I was out

:32:41.:32:46.

for several months in his 20, if I almost died in my 20, you have a

:32:47.:32:53.

68-year-old candidate who has been campaigning rerentlessly, people

:32:54.:32:55.

need to know the extent of what type she had and whether she is on the

:32:56.:32:58.

mend. I would say one other thing, given the fact she was here at

:32:59.:33:02.

Ground Zero yesterday, she was shaking hands with people, kissing

:33:03.:33:07.

baby, it is a extraordinarily contagious disease, if she had

:33:08.:33:11.

pneumonia why would she put people at risk? That is the question people

:33:12.:33:15.

want to know. Thank you very much for joining us.

:33:16.:33:16.

Bake Off, a British phenomenon, and a show that delivered the BBC

:33:17.:33:22.

10 million viewers on BBC One, is going to Channel Four.

:33:23.:33:25.

Will there be no more Mary and Paul, Mel and Sue on the Beeb?

:33:26.:33:28.

Love Productions, who make the programme for BBC,

:33:29.:33:30.

said that it is with regret that they have been unable

:33:31.:33:33.

to reach agreement on terms to renew the commission.

:33:34.:33:35.

So what will happen to a show which built up from a low audience

:33:36.:33:38.

on BBC Two six years ago to a raging success, and made Mary Berry

:33:39.:33:42.

and Paul Hollywood, and the most recent winner,

:33:43.:33:44.

Will Bake Off rise once more on Channel Four

:33:45.:33:47.

And is that the kind of fare Channel Four was set up to deliver?

:33:48.:33:52.

Here's our resident baker's boy Stephen Smith.

:33:53.:34:05.

Bake Off is the jewel in the crown of the BBC's schedules,

:34:06.:34:08.

or at least the glazed sultana in Auntie's Chelsea bun.

:34:09.:34:19.

This is your chance to get your dough prodded

:34:20.:34:21.

It is perfect comfort telly with its recipe

:34:22.:34:30.

of mildly salty banter, and 1950s WI resourcefulness.

:34:31.:34:32.

Carry On meets "Keep calm and carry on."

:34:33.:34:35.

It generates 10 million viewers a week and it is prime content.

:34:36.:34:49.

The BBC played a big role in helping that success.

:34:50.:34:51.

There is no question it is a blow to them.

:34:52.:34:53.

But I think there was an air of inevitability of bout it

:34:54.:34:56.

because as the price for premium content gets higher and higher,

:34:57.:34:59.

with increased competition with the likes of Amazon, Netflix,

:35:00.:35:02.

ITV, Sky and Channel 4 in the mix, it will become harder

:35:03.:35:04.

and harder for the BBC to bid for these types of rights.

:35:05.:35:11.

From modest beginnings on this channel, Bake Off has made stars

:35:12.:35:22.

But the BBC said tonight it was a considerable distance apart

:35:23.:35:25.

from the programme makers Love Productions over money.

:35:26.:35:34.

That is a scrapbook of our careers from the very beginning.

:35:35.:35:42.

All the nice things that people said about us?

:35:43.:35:44.

What about the nasty things people said about us?

:35:45.:35:47.

It is an ancient piece of showbiz wisdom known as Chiles' law,

:35:48.:35:52.

that popular presenters jump ship from the Beeb at their peril.

:35:53.:35:55.

A plane carrying 15 tonnes of rhubarb.

:35:56.:35:56.

Eric and Ernie were never the same on commercial TV.

:35:57.:36:11.

The BBC will back themselves to create another great hit

:36:12.:36:13.

like Bake Off, or at least to be part of creating this

:36:14.:36:16.

great successful show, and really that is the BBC's remit,

:36:17.:36:18.

and at a time when there is such scrutiny on its charter,

:36:19.:36:21.

with the new draft charter being published on Thursday

:36:22.:36:23.

by the Government, it knows really that it has to prove

:36:24.:36:26.

that it is distinctive and coming up with new content.

:36:27.:36:38.

So you'll still be able to enjoy a version of this programme

:36:39.:36:41.

on another channel somewhere up the dial, but for the BBC,

:36:42.:36:43.

Here tonight is Lorraine Heggessey, former controller of BBC One and

:36:44.:36:49.

head of the TV production company Talkback Thames.

:36:50.:36:57.

First of all, we understand that it is three, three series and it could

:36:58.:37:04.

be 25 million a series, more than double what the BBC, should the BBC

:37:05.:37:09.

have paid up? They couldn't pay up, they haven't got enough money to pay

:37:10.:37:13.

up, probe, they had to decide where to draw a line, I think this is one

:37:14.:37:18.

of the issues that the BBC faces, because commercial broadcasts can go

:37:19.:37:22.

for value pricinger the more successful a show is, the more

:37:23.:37:25.

advertising ref few, the more they can afford to pay. Of course on

:37:26.:37:30.

Channel 4 they can do all sorts of product placement that I can. They

:37:31.:37:36.

can commercially exploit the programme than perhaps you can on

:37:37.:37:39.

the BBC where there are lots of rules. Will it be, we don't know

:37:40.:37:44.

anything yet, can it be the great British Bake Off? Let me just tell

:37:45.:37:50.

you what Channel 4, you will know this well was charged with,

:37:51.:37:56.

innovative, experiment and and distinctive so you nick a BBC

:37:57.:38:00.

success hit to be innovative and experimental? Well, obviously

:38:01.:38:03.

Channel 4 has to fight for its place as well, and my understanding is

:38:04.:38:08.

that talks broke down between the BBC and Love Productions. At 3.00,

:38:09.:38:14.

they signed with Channel 4 at seven. A coincidence! In my day there were

:38:15.:38:19.

often tough negotiations over programme budgets, over budget for

:38:20.:38:22.

talent, but in the end there was an unwritten rule you did not walk away

:38:23.:38:26.

and take your show somewhere else. Now, you have got a plethora of

:38:27.:38:31.

channel, you have Jeremy Clarkson about to be on Amazon, you have Sky

:38:32.:38:36.

owning Love Productions. Before we knew it was going to Channel 4, I

:38:37.:38:41.

thought it more likely it would go to ITV because with the amount of

:38:42.:38:45.

audience it get, which is much more than Channel 4 gets for any show, so

:38:46.:38:49.

normally you would escalate up the change, if you see what I mean.

:38:50.:38:52.

There is no doubt that ITV is looking for a baking show but it

:38:53.:38:56.

didn't offer for the show. Or they wanted the show knowing that the

:38:57.:38:59.

talent was signed up, and my understanding is the talent isn't

:39:00.:39:03.

signed up, and maybe Channel 4's prepared to take the risk of not

:39:04.:39:07.

having the talent. Why not do a completely new baking show with

:39:08.:39:10.

their own talent and leave The Great British Bake Off on BBC? It sounds

:39:11.:39:14.

like Love Productions were going to go any way, that is the thing, that

:39:15.:39:18.

is what worries me really, because the BBC has invested a huge amount

:39:19.:39:22.

of license fee payer's money in growing this show, and you know, no

:39:23.:39:27.

one person is ever responsible for a show, the Commissioner, the

:39:28.:39:31.

controller, the talent, the writer, everybody contributes to making it a

:39:32.:39:35.

success, and one of the advantages that the BBC has over other channels

:39:36.:39:39.

is they have BBC Two, which gets a substantial audience, but is a much

:39:40.:39:43.

coastier place if you like, a safer place, to grow a show, so this show,

:39:44.:39:48.

they took the risk on it on a new format, who thought that baking

:39:49.:39:51.

cakes would become a prime time success? It wasn't a done deal, and

:39:52.:39:56.

then they agree it on BBC Two, they moved it to BBC One, they further

:39:57.:40:00.

expanded it with Comic Relief and the spin off show. So the BBC has

:40:01.:40:04.

just got to be a place to nurture things and it might go out to other

:40:05.:40:08.

channel, because what... But that is dangerous for the BBC, isn't it,

:40:09.:40:12.

because the BBC has to have a mixed ecology, you can't only be

:40:13.:40:15.

experimenting with shows that haven't yet grown an audience, you

:40:16.:40:18.

need the shows that have the audience to bring to the shows. But

:40:19.:40:24.

tell me, you know, how does this deal for public service

:40:25.:40:26.

broadcasting? Channel 4 possibly will be privatised. Surely they will

:40:27.:40:33.

slap wads of money down. Maybe it was worried it would go ITV and that

:40:34.:40:42.

would put it as a come petstive disadvantage, because -- competitive

:40:43.:40:47.

disadvantage. There may be be a new show on the BBC? Will it? Will it

:40:48.:40:54.

ever be as good as Bake Off, will it be as good on Channel 4? There is

:40:55.:41:01.

something BBC about it, middle England, middle class, quite nice

:41:02.:41:04.

and Channel 4 has usually, a lot more edge. Thank you.

:41:05.:41:10.

That it is for tonight. The day David Cameron announced he is

:41:11.:41:13.

leaving Parliament it was reported that George Osborne's constituency

:41:14.:41:16.

is to disappear at the next election.

:41:17.:41:19.

We'll always remember them as impossibly young backbenchers,

:41:20.:41:21.

together orchestrating Michael Howard's PMQs.

:41:22.:41:22.

Do you think you've got a killer blow?

:41:23.:41:26.

It is something that is in the news and is very current,

:41:27.:41:32.

and affects lots of people and is something that we actually

:41:33.:41:34.

believe in terms of police paperwork,

:41:35.:41:36.

Hello, many parts of the United Kingdom are turning unusually warm

:41:37.:42:13.

to hot for the time of year. That is away from the weather front to the

:42:14.:42:16.

west, especially for Northern Ireland and western Scot. You won't

:42:17.:42:20.

see that bump in temperatures that other parts of the UK are going

:42:21.:42:22.

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