02/11/2017 Newsnight

It's been 10 years,

three months and 27 days

of cheaper and cheaper money.

But today, it just

got a little dearer.

The Bank of England hikes

interest rates by 0.25%,

but who's that going to help?

We ask whether the Bank has

got its timing right.

Also tonight, a breaking story

of fresh allegations of sexual

harrassment by another Member

of Parliament emerges.

On the day the PM was forced

to replace a Cabinet minister,

could this herald a crisis

for both her and the leader

of the Opposition?

And we speak Goldie -

from breakdancer to DJ,

grafitti and grills,

a more mellow Goldie

tells his life story.

Goldie fights with 19-year-old on

the way to yoga. Goldie dies in

knife fight on the way to yoga.

Either way that's not going to look

right!

First tonight, the breaking

political story.

The Labour MP, Kelvin Hopkins,

has been suspended from the party

after it received allegations

of inappropriate behaviour

towards a young woman.

The Labour Party is remaining

relatively tight-lipped about it.

Our political editor,

Nick Watt is here.

Nick, what can you tell us?

Kelvin Hopkins, a 76-year-old former

shadow minister has been suspended

from the Labour Party and that means

the whip is suspended from him after

an incident that took place in 2014

with a young Labour activist and he

was addressing the Labour society at

Essex University and it is alleged

that he sent a text after saying, if

only I was 40 years younger and this

why he has been suspended, he then

allegedly rubbed himself against

her.

By the event in the Daily

Telegraph the woman reported it to

the whip's office twice before he

was made a Shadow Cabinet minister.

So if that is to be believed, then

the whips knew about this.

Also Eva

reported it in December 2015 in June

Hopkins was appointed to the Shadow

Cabinet. But he had been reprimanded

by the office and the leader knew.

The report to the leader's office

was yes, he has been reprimanded,

but the matter had been settled and

the only information they knew at

that stage was that he sent this

text saying if only I was 40 years

younger. It was only today that the

further information came that he

sent a text saying he wanted to meet

outside the formal Essex University

event and crucially only today that

the information came through of this

very serious sexual harassment, a

sexual assault, that he had rubbed

himself against her and that is why

the Labour acted immediately.

It is

only after that Daily Telegraph

produced that story that we have had

that response from the Labour Party.

So they're having to be made to

react rather than being proactive.

In the Sun there is more on Michael

Fallon that may give a clue to his

demise. We have a story about his

behaviour.

This is reporting and

this may well explain why he

resigned so quickly, that he is

alleged to have told Andrea

leadsome, his cabinet colleague, who

complained of cold hands, he said, I

know a warm place to put them. That

is deeply inappropriate and that may

well explain why he resigned so

quickly. But there are allegations

that there are serial examples of

wholly inappropriate behaviour by

Sir Michael Fallon.

Those

allegations would have gone to the

Chief Whip's office, the Chief Whip

is no I the Defence Secretary. You

can look at two ways, he is a close

ally of Theresa May, or she didn't

act with Elan to produce a woman for

that office.

She likes to promote

people she trusts. But there is fury

that Gavin Williamson has been made

Defence Secretary, because he was

involved in the conversation with

Michael Fallon, saying, is there

anything more. The answer meant he

resigned from the cabinet. Now

Downing Street are saying that Gavin

Williamson wasn't then involved in

the next level of conversation,

which is who should be our new

Defence Secretary. But that is not

how it has been seen. I have been in

touch with somebody who worked close

with Theresa May in the past and

said many say this is the biggest

and probably last mistake, that

Gavin Williamson and his deputy

Julia Smith are seen as parasites

feeding off her weakness and using

it to advance themselves. I have

been looking at these issues and you

see how angry Theresa May is, she is

has been campaigning to change the

culture at Westminster and now this

is really sort of posing a challenge

to her premiership.

The dark clouds

of an unlucky premiership are

hovering over Theresa May. There is

the feel of a Prime Minister

struggling at times to control

events. The Prime Minister has lost

her Defence Secretary after he

admitted that his behaviour had

fallen short of the high standards

expect of the armed forces. Theresa

May has campaigned for decades to

change the habits of male-Dom named

world of -- male-dominated world of

Westminster.

Domestic violence is

appalling. Many women were made to

feel like they were making mountains

out of mole hills.

In a cruel twist

the unravelling of this culture is

now challenging her leadership.

It

is like a Greek tragedy what Theresa

May's legacy will be. Nobody doubts

that Theresa May hates this culture

that she is having to wrangle with.

Nobody would deny that. But the fact

of the matter is she is too weak

amongst her own people to be able to

dole out the punishments I'm certain

she would wants to.

Traichl Theresa

May is so week she embarked on a

minimal reshuffle. But it left a

sour taste and one said it has the

intrigue of the house of cards with

the surreal element of the Rick

Mayall commend. Comedy.

Other Tories dismiss the febrile

atmosphere at Westminster and say it

is wrong to suggest that the Prime

Minister is being weakened by the

unmasking of a culture she has

campaigned to reform.

I'm astonished

by this sort of narrative. She, it

has been something she has been

passionate about, all the equality

issues, gender issues when people in

the Conservative Party didn't talk

about it, didn't care, and I am, I

don't, I'm mystified by how somebody

with such integrity has the

narrative has built up that it is

her fault. But some of goes back

many years and will be very hard to

prove. We have got to investigate

the serious stuff and I'm sure she

would be the first to say this and

then draw a line, move on and sort

the stuff out.

The Prime Minister

has led the way on this. She was

clear about it on Monday. In the

statement she was clear at Prime

Minister's question and she has made

it clear to the cabinet and said if

you believe you don't meet the

standard that is to be tolerated,

then you have to think about your

position. And to that extents,

Michael Fallon realised he would not

cross the bar she had set. That is

down to her leadership and saying,

we have to take this seriously and

lead. It is not just about the

Conservative Party, but the Labour

Party they have something facing

potential rape charges which is very

serious.

Theresa May is going on,

but after her inner circle was wiped

out in the general election, she

will hope events don't conspire to

make her an even more ice lapted

figure. -- isolated figure.

Our Political Editor Nick Watt.

Well now to chew over

the latest allegations

from Westminster I'm joined

by the LBC Presenter Iain Dale

and the former aide

to the Deputy Prime Minister,

Polly Mackenzie.

We heard Jess Philips saying it is a

Greek tragedy. Wech is falling to

bits.

We have been here in the 90s

with back to basics with a weak

Prime Minister and day after day

revelations about affairs and all

sorts of things in Parliament.

Everyone thought everybody in

Parliament was having an affair.

This is slightly different, sexual

what racksment. Harassment.

This is

a plague on all their houses.

No one

has escaped. No party escapes, it is

in the Lord's and the Commons and

Theresa May has missed a an

opportunity to put a new broom

behind cleaning this out.

Now the

Gavan Williamson, it is because she

is weak that Theresa May can't move

to make a bolder move. But she wants

to keep Gavin Williamson close.

It

is a bold move to put somebody from

out side the cabinet there.

Is it a

sign of weakness.

She is not weaker

than she was yesterday.

Which was

weak.

She is not in a great

position. Gordon Brown put Jacqui

Smith to Home Secretary, Margaret

Thatcher did it with Cecil

Parkinson.

But not in this crisis.

The whip's office have been part of

problem, they covered up the

problem. Where did this spread sheet

come from.

Gavin Williamson as

Defence Secretary may well know

about other examples of, we just

don't know, of other bad behaviour

that will come back to bite the

cabinet.

I think the reshuffle is a

separate issue. What this story and

it is across all parties, I don't

think anyone should try to gain

political capital, the complaints

system does not work. People take to

it the whips and it doesn't get

used. The whips office this to

control MPs.

What people are shocked

to know is that actually there has

been a real culture of sexual

misbehaviour and it is not about

sex, but about power.

Yes,

Westminster is still male-dominated,

it is older men in senior position,

junior women and men... They felt

uncomfortable and the men saying, I

had no idea.

It is not only talking

of Theresa May and you can juxtapose

with what Theresa May has done with

what Ruth Davidson said about

cleaning the stable. Here we have a

situation where Jeremy Corbyn's own

office of whips is also possibly

compromised.

It shows you that the

system doesn't work and I have

spoken with people in the whips

office, around Parliament still, the

issue here and there has to be a

full inquiry. What I would like the

Labour Party to do is to appoint

somebody independent to come in and

look at the situation.

Let's look at

the leadership on this. We don't

know what is going on behind the

scenes, but I do not know that

Jeremy Corbyn has been out being

condemning people in the last

48-hours.

I couldn't agree more.

There are two problems. One is

sexual abuse by a small number of

people and a wider culture of

secrecy and cover ups. I would like

to see everybody who has made a

complaint make a subject request to

find out what records they have been

keeping. They say they don't know.

How do you have these complaints

against Kelvin Hopkins and then the

same, how could there be such a

position where the woman who makes

the complaints watches him walk into

the Shadow Cabinet.

He is an MP and

she is not.

The issue is curl churl

of the -- cultural. It is women not

coming forward and young men, they

don't want their names splashed

across the newspaper. There is no

confidential way to report this and

it is the power thing. A lot of

people are scared.

Power does not

create Monday stores, power --

monsters, it reveals monsters. That

was said in house of cards. The

problem is the whips, because the

job of the whips is to get

legislation through the House of

Commons or stop it going through.

Anything else is of secondary

importance. There was a story

condemning the 1922 committee for

blocking David Cameron's attempts to

give the whips power to sort this

out, because they knew they would

cover it up.

The problem is a male MP's being

sleazy and abusing power.

Everyone

thinking it's more useful to keep

those things in a draw and use them

as blackmail rather than sorting

things out.

Going back to the

appointment of the new Defence

Secretary, what would have been the

ball thing that Theresa May could

have done without the appointment?

She should have an appointed and a

woman, the first female...

Why

should she have done that? Just as a

statement?

Because an opportunity

was there to put a woman into a job

that men have historically done, an

opportunity to say that she is

bringing a new broom to appointments

and dealing with sexual harassment

by putting in somebody who doesn't

have a history of doing it.

And

Milton would have been a popular

choice to be Chief Whip, she is

experienced, people say she has had

good experience of the grievance

procedure as well so she might have

signalled a fresh start.

Estimate he

is deputy Chief Whip...

Theresa

May....

When I saw her go into

Downing Street eyes and dues either

going to be Chief Whip or the new

chairman of the Conservative Party,

why Theresa May did not take the

opportunity to have a new party

chairman I do not know because

everyone knows Patrick McLoughlin

wants to step down.

How damaging is

it to the whole prosecution of

politics in this country that we are

having a slow drip of even more

egregious and there are other

things, the other night, John Mann

said a Newsnight he knew of a rape

at when spinster -- at Westminster,

but he did not name names, but he

would not be saying that unless he

had a pretty good idea. So we know

more is to come and how damaging is

that to the standing of politicians

who are standing is already damaged

thanks to the expensive -- expenses

scandal and so forth?

All of my

friends say to me you must be so

relieved you never got into

Parliament, when I told my mother I

was not standing again she cheered.

What a terrible thing, she ought to

want her son to go into Parliament.

I am glad I never became an MP.

Do

you still want to go into

Parliament? Not particularly, not

right now, but I don't think this is

the issue.

About hope politicians

feel about their reputation. This is

about victims. Watching us

squabbling about who is up and who's

down in the reshuffle is not the

issue. The issue is people of all

parties who feel they have been

treated badly need to feel that they

can come forward and talk about this

and be believed and not victimised

or which handed.

Thank you all very

much indeed.

It hasn't happened in more

than a decade, but there are no

fanfares or fireworks.

The Bank of England raised

interest rates today -

signalling a change

in the economic weather.

Is this a big moment, or time

for a bit of shoulder shrugging?

Why has the Monetary

Committee done it?

Is it because things getting

out of hand and we need

to tighten up a bit?

Well, consumers are showing

a prodigious appetite for credit,

creating a growing pile

of personal debt.

Money's been very

cheap for a long time.

But are they borrowing

because they're trying

to cope with 3% inflation

and near stagnant wages?

If so, then they're going to get

a shock, because mortgages and other

repayments are going to rise

and inflation is not expected

to fall any time soon.

As for saving, it's unlikely that

a 0.25% interest rate increase

is going to turn us into a nation

of savers - something that seems

part of a dim and distant past.

Our Business Editor, Helen Thomas,

has been trying to make sense

of the Bank of England's move.

Economic predictions or your average

weather forecast? It is hard to see

which engenders less faith. The

first rise in interest rates in over

ten years, it's not done too much to

clear things up. Usually a rate rise

would reflect strength, recovery,

robust growth and confidence. This

time, the economic weather feels a

little different. So why is the bank

acting now? The obvious and Sir is

inflation, at 3% it is well above

the bank 's 2% target. But most

people agree that a temporary

problem, related to a fall in the

pound. It should start to fix

itself. The Bank of England governor

conceded the outlook is unusually

uncertain thanks in part to Brexit

bust up still, he said, it was time

to move.

In many respects today's

decision is straight forward. With

the economy growing and rates above

its speed limit inflation is

unlikely to return to the 2% target

without some increase in interest

rates.

Once upon a time the Bank of

England's key interest rate moved up

and down with the UK economic

fortunes. Higher interest rates

turned the economic heat down.

Increasing the cost of borrowing and

reducing spending. These are the

last four periods the bank of

England was raising rates, quarterly

economic growth in the year before

the first height averaged 0.4%. Now

quarterly growth has been averaging

about 0.4%. Even more unusual, this

rate hike comes as real wages have

been falling. That is wage growth

adjusted for inflation.

I think they

made a mistake. I think at best the

decision to raise rates today was

premature and at worst could be

reckless. The risk is if you raise

rates against the backdrop of

economic weakness it tends to

frighten the horses are little and

what you may see is consumers who

are already running with very high

levels of debt against a backdrop of

pretty tough financial conditions

choose to build their savings of

little bit more than the Bank of

England would like an precipitate

something of a steep slowdown than

we are already seeing.

So this

wasn't a normal rate hike but as

Mark Carney said we do not live in

normal times. A decade of interest

at virtually zero is certainly

extraordinary and for some the

central bank had to at least start

the journey back to more

conventional levels.

Ultra low

interest rates have costs as well as

benefits and if you are in a

position where interest rates are

expected to remain near zero for the

foreseeable it creates all sorts of

distortions, misallocation is of

resources and so on. If you can get

interest rates back to mourn over

levels then you have a margin to cut

again if you need to. For example if

the Brexit those Asians go badly the

Bank of England will have more scope

to cut rates in future done if it

did not raise them today at all. --

of the Brexit negotiations go badly.

This only takes rates backs to where

they were in the summer of 2016,

before the post-referendum cut.

Still it all came with a gloomy

outlook. In the banks view, the

economy has hit its limit, the

economic climate now is about as

good as it's going to get. That's in

part because productivity, a big

determinant of economic potential,

has flat lined since the financial

crisis.

The Bank of England are

taking a conservative view about the

UK's potential supply growth, they

have seen growth around one and a

half percent as being the long-term

position. I think what is important,

what businesses want to see is the

right environment to invest and that

we are investing in our skills and

education and infrastructure and I

think that is why actually what the

business media wants is more action

by Philip Hammond than Mark Carney

and all eyes will be on the budget

later this month.

It's official,

interest rates are rising again. But

so is the pressure.

Well, what should we

make of today's move?

And is there anything

in the American experience

we should learn from -

where rates have already

been rising for a while?

I'm joined from New York

by Gillian Tett of the Financial

Times and from Florida

by Professor David Blanchflower,

Looking at this side of the pond,

inflation rise and an implement low,

was this the right time to move, are

we heading for more normal times?

I

am in the camp of people who think

it was the right time to move and we

have had extraordinarily abnormal

times for the best part of the last

decade. The ultralow interest rates

were introduced initially as an

emergency response after the

financial crisis. That was a long

time ago. I personally think getting

back to a more normal world is

healthy and it is something America

has been doing now for 18 months,

over 18 months. So far the markets

have absorbed it fairly calmly.

Are

we now just going to accept in this

country at least that growth is

sluggish, growth is reasonably

sluggish in the States, there is an

acceptance that that indeed is the

norm, that even in that position you

raise interest rates and it looks

like America will raise them next

month even though growth is not that

strong.

Essentially what the central

Bank of America is trying to do is

exactly what Mark Carney is trying

to do, it's like the pilot of an

aeroplane trying to lose altitude

very slowly over a long period of

time. They are trying to return

slowly to a more normal world

without anybody noticing. Let's keep

this in perspective, it's not

exactly a dramatic rise. The rate

rise we have seen in the US have not

been dramatic either. But it's a

sign the central bank is moving into

a slightly more normal world and as

Helen says, they are creating a

reserve firepower for themselves to

use if there is another crisis.

Let's talk about that reserve

firepower. We are joined by the

former member of the Bank of England

monetary policy committee David

Blanchflower, is it necessary to

create firepower or will it create

firepower?

No. I don't normally

disagree with my friend Gillian, but

I'm afraid this looks to be a big

mistake to me. The way you create

firepower is not to create a

recession yourself. People want to

raise rates so when a recession

comes you can cut rates. This looks

like an enormous mistake. There is

nothing in the data whatsoever to

sustain it. It looks to me like the

rate rise which was done in July

2007 that I actually voted against.

It was returned a few months later

and then we went into recession. I

think this is a huge mistake. The

reality is there is absolutely no

data that says you should do it now.

With the uncertainty over Brexit,

the uncertainty over the fiscal

position of the government this

looks like a big mistake.

Not only

do you have sterling on the floor,

the uncertainty of Brexit, in the

states you have a president who says

he's going to cut taxes and simplify

taxes would perhaps leads to more

optimism but you don't necessarily

have that coming out of Philip

Hammond's briefcase.

Right. What you

have in the US is talk about the

huge fiscal cut, huge stimulus going

into the economy which is pushing

up, growth is double what it is in

the UK, real wages have risen in the

US over the last for five years and

they are down, be aware of the US is

the slowest growing economy in

Europe, growth is going to slow on

any measure this looks disastrous.

Real wages are down and there would

you are going to do is raise the

cost of borrowing to people not only

to homeowners but firms who are

going to cut their dividends. This

looks like a huge mistake.

Gillian,

on the basis of the 0.25% increase

your not going to have consumers

jumping up and down and saying we

are going to save because the debt

mountain is growing so much we will

have an increased tomorrow in

mortgage rates and the APR and

credit card will go sky-high? Kill

mac not exactly sky-high, let's keep

this in perspective. The question I

would put to Daniel is what you make

of things growing sharply in the UK,

does that not concern you? How do

you make sure consumers do not take

a huge amount of credit David

Blanchflower?

You can deal with

that, the FPC can deal with, the

likelihood is retail sales are

falling, they are about to plummet

as people realise they should not

have been saving so that will fix

it. We have already seen that. This

will make it much worse, it will

lower output. That seems a really

crazy way, you will force yourself

into a recession. Yes it's a small

mistake but it's better than making

a big mistake. But I would rather

not mistake at all. Yes credit is

rising, it's been a surprise to the

central bank but pretty dancing

that. Because people's real wages

are falling.

So what you are arguing

is you would like to create more of

a consumer credit bubble even as the

underlying fundamentals in the UK

are not so healthy? That is simply

eating your jam today and creaking

more problems in the future?

Well I

mean the economy is being held

together by the stimulus from the

central bank. If you want to deal

with the credit problems deal with

that through credit restrictions or

whatever but think about the streets

of Hartlepool, Blackpool, Wakefield,

do you think there is a credit boom

going on? I don't think so. People

are struggling, why do you think in

those places people voted for

Brexit? Not because there was a boom

going on and they were doing great.

That's not true. The economy is

basically flat, there is some credit

going on, people have been spending

more than they should but the

economy is hurting.

Thank you both

very much indeed.

Never before in the history

of the EU have a group of elected

members of any government -

regional or national -

been clapped in jail without trial,

but a Spanish High Court judge has

imprisoned eight members

of the former Government

of Catalonia, believing them

to be a flight risk.

The precedent

being the former leader

Carlos Puigdement and four members

of his sacked Cabinet

who are in Belgium.

It looks as though a judge

is about to issue a European arrest

warrant for their return

after they failed to appear in court

in Madrid today to answer

charges of rebellion,

sedition and misuse of public funds.

Today they were protests against the

arrests in Barcelona. But Catalans

are divided.

Catalans are divided over

whether Puigdemont acted

precipitously in leaving

so what will he do next

and how will his EU hosts, Belgium,

respond to the warrant?

Joining me from Brussels

is Mark Demesmaeker

from the Flemish nationalist party,

the New Flemish Alliance.

Good evening.

Good evening.

Tell me,

what do you think Carles Puigdemont

and his four colleagues should do -

should they return to Spain if the

arrest warrant is issued?

It is not

for me to tell what they should do.

I understand why they're in Belgium,

they're here to denounce this

political trial... In front of the

international community. They have

used their rights as a European

citizen to travel to Belgium and to

stay here.

But of course, because

they did that, of course the others

in Spain are being detained as a

flight risk, what do you make of the

arrests?

It's not because of that,

but what we have seen in Spain the

last few weeks is outrageous. It is

a shock for every democrat in the

EU, it is a shock. This is obviously

a political trial. Jailing,

imprisoning elected members of a

government is unprecedented, it is

disturbing and unacceptable in the

EU. That is my reaction.

It looks as

if there is going to be a European

arrest warrant and Spain are going

to ask for the extradition of Carles

Puigdemont and the four others,

perhaps as early as tomorrow. Do you

think Belgium should comply with

that as an EU member?

Well this is

something for the judge in Belgium

to decide, politics doesn't

interfere with this. So there is a

procedure for that. It can take a

while. And as I have understood,

Carles Puigdemont has a got Flemish

lawyer who can assist him through

this. But it is up to the judge to

decide. So I have good faith in the

Belgium judicial system. Which

cannot be said of Spanish highly

politicised system.

So it is likely

the judge will comply with it in

Belgium?

I can't decide on that...

Would you be campaigning against the

extradition and throwing your

weight, you are, your party is part

of coalition government, do you

feel, would your party's position be

that Carles Puigdemont should be

extradited, should be returned,

after all what he did was

unconstitutional under Spanish law?

Again this is not nor a political

party or the Government to comment

on. It is a matter for the judge to

decide. There is a procedure and

will follow it. What we have seen in

other cases is after first hearing

the defendant... Was released. And

certainly when there is no... There

is no terrorist allegation or

something like that, which is not

the case here, but we will see. It

is up to the judge to decide. Do you

think we should have heard more from

Jean-Claude Juncker and the EU

should have weighed in on this? Yes

of course the EU is silent and this

is a disgrace. It is a shame for the

whole of the EU. The EU should not

stick its head in the sand any more

and should speak up. This is about a

fundamental democratic values which

are at stake. If the EU fails to

defend our rights as citizens and

democratic values, then our

democracies will crumble and...

Thank you very much I'm afraid I

have to stop you there.

The DJ and producer Goldie

is considered one of the pioneers

of dance music in this country.

Now 52, he winningly describes

himself as 'the Doris Stokes of Drum

'n' Bass'.

He says it's because

he likes to channel

the spirits of his favourite

musicians into his own records.

In his new memoir,

'All Things Remembered',

Goldie recounts his progress

from care homes and fosters parents

to life on the streets

as a graffiti artist -

to the nation's embrace with roles

in James Bond and 'Strictly'.

Goldie's been talking to our Culture

Correspondent, Stephen Smith.

Beware some flashing

lights in the film which,

of course, befits the star.

Goldie, it's very nice to see

you again, thanks for coming

to talk to us on Newsnight.

Yeah, I love your office!

Producer, DJ, actor,

reality TV veteran -

Goldie's used to having his name up

in lights, but in

the beginning it was about seeing

his name up in paint.

Does graffiti still excite him?

If we were to erase,

let's erase graffiti.

Let's erase it from

the face of the earth.

Some people will applaud

it, "Great stuff".

It's going to be a very grey

journey on the way to work.

But some people would say it's very

kind of solipsistic - you

put your tag up, you don't

necessarily put, you know, "end

poverty," although some people do.

Some people may think it's all part

of this kind of narcissistic culture

we are in.

I think the difference

is that that's a social

media, which is a finger at the end

of a button - people liking and

social media and emojis

and everything else.

People physically

making an effort to go

and paint something physically

and go through the physical

process is very primal.

Spaces like this - youth clubs,

opportunities for the

young, are vital, says Goldie.

If we don't have

that backdrop, if we

don't have certain places for young

people to express themselves, it

will only be a boiling point.

You look at the effects

of what grime

music has done.

There's a place for young people

within this grime thing

to have their own voice, which has

become the voice of UK all of a

sudden, because of influx

of different urban people.

Goldie backs the Mayor

of London's plans to

invest £400,000 in regeneration

projects to benefit young people

among others.

I had a meeting with

Sadiq three months ago.

And I saw the cultural

plan, which a lot of

people conservatively are against.

"Why are we giving these

kids somewhere to paint?

Why are we giving them

somewhere to do music?

Because music's not going

to run the Government."

Well you haven't done a very good

job of it so far, have you?

It's time to change

the way we look at it.

Even if you're not an aficionado

of drum and bass, you may

know Goldie from his appearances

on reality shows like Maestro and

Strictly Come Dancing.

He even played a baddie

in a James Bond film.

I see you later, Mr Bond.

So you put your money

where your mouth is.

If it all goes wrong tomorrow,

at least I'll stay in James Bond

every Christmas for

the next how many years.

You know what I mean?

That is in itself

a great experience.

He has come a long way

from his childhood in care.

I was saved by social workers.

Underpaid.

Long hours.

I think the care system for me,

it was a really important

place they learned

about other cultures.

Knowing that the colour of my skin

is what it is - what am I?

Who am I?

Trying to find identity

was really important.

I think those halfway

houses have become very

sterile and the aspect of red tape

now, well you can't call them Aunts

and Uncles, because

they aren't related.

I didn't mind calling them Auntie

and Uncle, because it gave me

a sense of family.

And I think the people that

write the rules of all

that stuff forget they were young.

One phrase in particular that really

leapt out at me from your book,

given what's happened this year,

is where you say, "God forbid we'll

have to be on fire before we make

the

right change in the

housing situation.

And stop making rabbit burrows

full of speed bumps and

bollards to stop everyone

getting out of there."

You can't read that

after Grenfell without...

Making a connection.

Totally.

What can you say about that?

You know, you're

stacking these people

on the edge of a Borough that's 20

times richer than it.

We're looking at the

short-term, aren't we?

In society, we are tapping

into not even 3% of what we

should be doing for tomorrow's

children and I have said what

we do today creates tomorrow.

And what was done

in those days, when

you look at Grenfell and that

situation, the atrocity it has

caused, the heartache, people

will never recover from that - young

people in that situation

will never recover.

They will need mental help and help

for a very long time.

Those estates, those

places, the youth

clubs, the organisations

around it, are important.

Now in his 50s, Goldie's living

in Thailand with his

young family.

He has released an album this

year and his new memoir

is the work of a man who says

he counts his blessings.

Whisper it, but Goldie

may be mellowing.

Yes, it has been hard

and there's always

going to be challenges -

I was challenged yesterday.

We're always going to be challenged.

You were challenged

to a fight, effectively?

Yeah, effectively challenged

to a fight by a teenager who was

angry, barges past you.

I get it.

You're an angry young man,

but you know what, have a nice day.

Because an older version

of me was, A, that

kid and, B, I've got a choice here.

I'm on my way to yoga.

Imagine that headline -

"Goldie fights with

19-year-old on way to yoga.

Goldie dies in knife

fight on way to yoga!"

Either way, that's not

going to look right.

Bite your tongue, getting your head

down and realising I had a

choice and going to yoga.

When I came out of

that yoga session, I

felt like that's a beautiful

day I've just had.

Tomorrow's front-pages, two on the

sleaze story. And the Fallon story,

one says, I was a victim of Fallon.

The leader of the Commons complained

to Theresa May about vile language

used by Sir Michael and also that he

was tactile and put his arms around

her in unwanted attention and made

comments of a sexual nature. The

Guardian has more on Williamson's

promotion. That that is all we have

time for have a good evening. Good

night.