The Great Car Insurance Swindle Panorama


The Great Car Insurance Swindle

Similar Content

Browse content similar to The Great Car Insurance Swindle. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!

Transcript


LineFromTo

There has been widespread condemnation of three bomb attacks

:00:07.:00:12.

in India's main commercial city, Mumbai. At least 21 people were

:00:12.:00:17.

killed and many more injured. One exploded in the heart of the city

:00:17.:00:21.

and two others in the south, all during rush hours. Indian officials

:00:21.:00:24.

say it appeared to be a co- ordinated terrorist attack.

:00:24.:00:29.

News Corporation has withdrawn its controversial bid for a full

:00:29.:00:37.

takeover of BSkyB Youth stop-off -- BSkyB. The company said it was too

:00:37.:00:40.

difficult to progress with the bid in the current climate.

:00:40.:00:44.

The Egyptian government says more than 600 senior police officers

:00:44.:00:49.

have been removed from their jobs. Their dismissal has been a key

:00:49.:00:56.

demand of protesters, who criticised officers of the killing

:00:56.:01:03.

-- for the killing of hundreds of protesters during their Hutu

:01:03.:01:10.

uprising against Holzinger Barak. - - during February's uprising

:01:10.:01:14.

against Hosni Mubarak. This year, Amnesty International

:01:14.:01:21.

passes a milestone. 50 years of campaigning against prisoners of

:01:22.:01:26.

conscious. This 50th birthday is marked less by collective

:01:26.:01:34.

satisfaction than soul-searching. The group's strategy has come under

:01:34.:01:44.
:01:44.:02:15.

Welcome to HARDtalk. 50 years - congratulations on that. Would you

:02:16.:02:20.

except Amnesty International is now a campaigning juggernaut that has

:02:20.:02:26.

moved an awful long way from the founding ideas of 1961?

:02:26.:02:31.

Not in its values and its basic premise because that has not

:02:31.:02:34.

changed. Currently, Amnesty International is about ordinary

:02:34.:02:38.

people coming together to do extraordinary things and when we

:02:38.:02:44.

started, it was about political prisoners. Then we realised many of

:02:44.:02:48.

the theme -- many of them were being tortured. Dictators are

:02:48.:02:56.

getting much smarter so they started making people disappear.

:02:56.:03:02.

Then you have to deal with the dictators themselves, international

:03:02.:03:08.

justice. I would say Amnesty has evolved over 50 years, but always

:03:08.:03:13.

adapting to changing circumstances. As you described it, always working

:03:13.:03:16.

towards the idea of political freedom and baffling political

:03:16.:03:21.

oppression, it will look at what Amnesty International is involved

:03:21.:03:29.

in today it is a sort of capsule against fighting and -- fighting

:03:29.:03:32.

against a grab-bag of different abuses.

:03:32.:03:36.

I recently came back from North Africa. When you look at what is

:03:36.:03:42.

happening on the streets of many cities, especially in North Africa,

:03:42.:03:47.

you can see the classic problem of political freedom, and people's

:03:47.:03:51.

writes for food and water, that is something we can talk about sitting

:03:51.:03:58.

in the studio. There was a Tunisian who set himself on fire, which

:03:58.:04:01.

triggered the Tunisian Revolution, which triggered the rest of the

:04:01.:04:11.

Arab world's revolution. No-one campaigning organisation can

:04:11.:04:15.

represent all of those different issues. Wars and the beauty of

:04:15.:04:20.

Amnesty in early days was that the focus was clear, thein all about

:04:20.:04:25.

representing those people who were locked up because of their thoughts

:04:25.:04:28.

and speech. We a fighting for the rights of

:04:28.:04:34.

people whose rights are violated. - we are fighting. You cannot

:04:34.:04:37.

separate economic rights from political rights. It is not for us

:04:37.:04:42.

to say, "We are only doing this thing." Where is the clarity of

:04:42.:04:46.

Amnesty getting involved in the abortion debate?

:04:46.:04:51.

Saying it will champion the rights of women who have been raped or

:04:51.:04:57.

forcibly coerced into sex and then have become pregnant. I do not see

:04:57.:05:01.

how that fits with the original ideas.

:05:01.:05:08.

Half of the populations in the countries we working are women. The

:05:08.:05:17.

women we are working with, when we started looking beyond prison,

:05:17.:05:20.

there was a bit strong proportion of the population saying that

:05:20.:05:24.

women's rights were very Central. We do not take a generic position

:05:24.:05:30.

on the right to life all right to health. It is a human rights

:05:30.:05:32.

framework. My knee devoutly religious people,

:05:32.:05:38.

not least Catholics, like your founder, took the view that life

:05:38.:05:43.

began at conception. By outlining and championing the rights of women

:05:43.:05:49.

to have an abortion if they have been forcibly, basically, made to

:05:49.:05:54.

have sex, are you not pursuing the logic that right to life does not

:05:54.:06:00.

start at conception. We all know amnesty is fully committed to

:06:00.:06:04.

respect for life and against the death penalty.

:06:04.:06:09.

Him Indonesia, Amnesty has been working for many years against

:06:09.:06:13.

oppression and political dictatorship. Today, if you take

:06:13.:06:18.

the number of women dying because of bad health practices, it is

:06:18.:06:24.

20,000 women who died. Indonesia traditionally has one million

:06:24.:06:27.

abortions taking place. Most of them are in the shadow because no-

:06:27.:06:32.

one wants to legalise abortion. You can say that it does not matter

:06:32.:06:36.

that 20,000 women are dying because that is not your concern. What

:06:36.:06:38.

we're doing in the case of Indonesia is explaining to the

:06:38.:06:42.

people of Indonesia and talking to the Governor of Indonesia about how

:06:42.:06:51.

there is a direct relationship between rising abortion and the

:06:51.:06:56.

whole maternal mortality rate. It is very central. I think it is

:06:56.:07:00.

difficult to separate these things. We made British bishop, Michael

:07:00.:07:05.

Evans, after you adopted the stance, quit your organisation, saying,

:07:05.:07:11.

"Amnesty seems to have forgotten the paramount human right, the

:07:11.:07:18.

right to life," You do not focus on that?

:07:18.:07:22.

We are focused on making sure women do not have unsafe pregnancies. We

:07:22.:07:28.

need to make sure women have access to information, that they feel

:07:28.:07:31.

empowered to use contraception, whether they are rich or poor,

:07:31.:07:36.

single or married. That is our focused. We're not focused on what

:07:36.:07:41.

people do when they get married and get pregnant.

:07:41.:07:45.

Let's bring it back to politics and repression and the fight for

:07:45.:07:51.

freedom. You recently back from Cairo, in the midst of the Arab

:07:51.:07:56.

spring. Isn't the message of the Arabs bring in some ways that there

:07:56.:07:59.

is now less need for outside analysis and the intervention from

:07:59.:08:03.

groups such as yours because, in a very real sense, people are doing

:08:03.:08:09.

it for themselves. We are not outside. We may be

:08:09.:08:14.

sitting in a studio in the UK, but we have an organisation of 3

:08:14.:08:21.

million members across the globe. I was in so where's a few days ago

:08:21.:08:29.

and local people came to me and talk about their local Amnesty

:08:29.:08:33.

Group. We are spread across 100 countries with 3 million local

:08:33.:08:38.

members. What is a snake that you're dishing in Egypt? In the

:08:38.:08:44.

midst of all this crisis, the tarry a Square killings, Amnesty has been

:08:44.:08:50.

documented -- documenting all the human rights violations. I was

:08:50.:08:56.

mentioning to the Minister of the interior that we have records of

:08:56.:09:00.

all the violations that had been committed under Holzinger Barak

:09:00.:09:07.

over the last 30 years. -- under Hosni Mubarak.

:09:07.:09:11.

People now have mobile phones, they are on social networks, they're

:09:11.:09:14.

sending each other pictures and video of what is happening in real

:09:14.:09:18.

time. You then many months later sending researchers and right along

:09:18.:09:22.

reports about this and that. You were in danger of being overtaken

:09:22.:09:32.
:09:32.:09:32.

by events -- you are. I got a message from Aung San Suji.

:09:32.:09:40.

She said she wanted to express her gratitude to Amnesty. Her message

:09:40.:09:46.

was interesting, saying that she hoped that in the next 50 years we

:09:46.:09:50.

would not need and Mr International. I would share that hope. Let me

:09:50.:09:56.

assure you that at this point back in time, with the Sudans, the

:09:56.:10:05.

Chinas, everywhere I travel, people respect what we say.

:10:05.:10:11.

You said a few weeks ago that the Arabs bring marks a watershed where

:10:11.:10:16.

activists used new technology to speak truth to power. Are you over

:10:16.:10:22.

estimating what has changed in the last 12 months?

:10:22.:10:26.

No. What we have been saying in relation to the Middle East and not

:10:26.:10:30.

Africa in general, the Middle East is a good example, is that the

:10:31.:10:34.

dictator has gone but the systems of dictatorship have not gone. That

:10:34.:10:39.

will take a long time to change, meaning we need truth, justice and

:10:39.:10:43.

reparations. I was meeting with mothers of the first two martyrs

:10:43.:10:52.

who gave their lives and there are security officials who conducted

:10:52.:10:56.

killings and violations. Unless there is truth, justice and

:10:56.:11:01.

compensation, we need -- we have a long way to go.

:11:01.:11:07.

The people have lost loved ones, were winded themselves or

:11:07.:11:12.

imprisoned. Where is the justice for any of these people? -- were

:11:12.:11:17.

wounded. That is exactly what our same to

:11:18.:11:22.

the general of the armed forces. By wonder whether you said you were

:11:23.:11:26.

worried about the fact that they were rushing headlong into

:11:26.:11:30.

parliamentary elections in September, when the basic

:11:30.:11:37.

groundwork for democracy and civil society were not in place.

:11:37.:11:42.

The first thing I talked about were the mid- Barak laws. They are still

:11:42.:11:52.
:11:52.:11:52.

in place, the emergency laws. -- been. The media is much more free.

:11:52.:11:58.

They have started trials against the Interior Minister and Holzinger

:11:58.:12:08.
:12:08.:12:10.

Barak himself -- Hosni Mubarak. Up one of the facets we see more in

:12:10.:12:15.

Syria is that the government also make Ten News the new technology.

:12:15.:12:18.

They can use mobile and satellite technology to track protesters,

:12:18.:12:22.

undertake surveillance in New Inn sophisticated ways. Are you worried

:12:22.:12:26.

about that? We are very worried. We're talking

:12:26.:12:29.

to the companies, technology companies, about this question.

:12:29.:12:33.

We're developing our own strategies for the future on how we, on the

:12:33.:12:39.

one hand, digital can be a massive enabling technology to organise

:12:39.:12:43.

anonymously, but it is true companies Kent misuse it and there

:12:43.:12:48.

are smart governments already doing that. -- can misuse it. In a sense,

:12:48.:12:52.

this is a new area for Amnesty International and the human rights

:12:52.:12:55.

community. A I talked about the warp speed at

:12:55.:12:59.

which information can now flow, not least information about allegations

:12:59.:13:03.

of human rights abuse. That is sometimes very dangerous. Let's

:13:03.:13:10.

turn to Libya. Not long ago we had stories coming of mass rapes,

:13:10.:13:19.

systematic rapes by Gaddafi's forces, coming through the new

:13:19.:13:23.

media. I wonder if Amnesty International, after looking at

:13:23.:13:31.

those reports, now believe most of them not to be true?

:13:31.:13:36.

Research and interviewing people is some of the most important work

:13:36.:13:40.

that Amnesty conducts. We have not had any direct evidence of rape

:13:41.:13:47.

being used as a weapon of war. Rape been used as a weapon of war is a

:13:47.:13:52.

serious human rights violation. If the UN and ICC have evidence, we

:13:52.:13:56.

need to see that. We're not saying it didn't happen. We're just saying

:13:56.:13:59.

we do not have direct evidence of that.

:13:59.:14:03.

We now get to a very sensitive line that Amnesty has had to tread for

:14:03.:14:09.

many years now. The war in Iraq, Afghanistan and maybe in Libya as

:14:09.:14:14.

well. You have people on both sides of the conflict who want to

:14:14.:14:22.

marshall facts. In Libya, one of the Western... The arguments used

:14:22.:14:28.

by Western intervention powers was that had they not intervened there

:14:28.:14:32.

would have been "A massacre" of tens of thousands of innocent

:14:32.:14:35.

civilians in Benghazi. Does Amnesty International believe that to be

:14:35.:14:40.

true? It is a kind of counterfactual

:14:41.:14:43.

question. I can ask you if you believe it to

:14:43.:14:47.

be credible. A Amnesty International is not an

:14:47.:14:52.

organisation that pronounces its views with force. We work within

:14:53.:14:57.

the human-rights framework. The important issue now is that all

:14:57.:15:01.

parties have to observe the rules of war and the rules of conflict

:15:01.:15:05.

and international humanitarian law and that is not happening. All

:15:05.:15:09.

parties are violating that as we speak. That is why we have an

:15:09.:15:12.

International Criminal Court. That is one of the pins Amnesty

:15:12.:15:17.

International campaigned for four years. We're happy that arrest

:15:17.:15:20.

warrants have come out now and we need to allow for a full

:15:20.:15:24.

investigation to take place. Just sticking with the notion of

:15:24.:15:27.

Amnesty's integrity and the enormous pressures it faces, I

:15:27.:15:32.

talked about the enormity -- enormous conflicts we have been

:15:32.:15:36.

through. Let's now talk about the war on terror, as it was

:15:37.:15:40.

characterised by George W. Bush. Do you think it fits with Amnesty's

:15:40.:15:45.

values to associate with, for example, former Guantanamo

:15:45.:15:54.

prisoners, in your campaign on the issue of detainees in Wantirna Road.

:15:54.:15:58.

-- in Guantanamo. In our view, in many cases, the

:15:59.:16:03.

West has it wrong. We think, in Guantanamo Bay itself, 2.5 years

:16:03.:16:08.

after President Obama said he would close Guantanamo Bay, we still have

:16:08.:16:13.

200 detainees in there. We know this is not in line with most

:16:13.:16:16.

international human rights standards and they are committed to

:16:16.:16:22.

taking several of them to civil trial and they have now reversed

:16:22.:16:32.

In that campaign you have run, you have worked closely with other

:16:32.:16:35.

organisations. You used to work with the Guantanamo Bay prisoners.

:16:35.:16:39.

Do you regret that association? There was a whole debate about that.

:16:39.:16:47.

Did you get it right or wrong? was before my time. It was

:16:47.:16:53.

independently done by two well respected people. They said there

:16:53.:16:58.

could have been some minor changes we could have made. There was no

:16:58.:17:06.

disagreement. We made the right choices. Was it the right choice to

:17:06.:17:09.

work with a self acknowledged jihadi fighter in Bosnia who had

:17:09.:17:12.

been to training camps in Afghanistan, who continues to talk

:17:12.:17:17.

about political campaign and conflict in America. Was it right

:17:17.:17:27.
:17:27.:17:32.

to have him as an associate? work with a wide range of partners.

:17:32.:17:39.

It was just not on that issue alone. His group was described as a

:17:39.:17:42.

leading human rights group which says more of them just working with

:17:42.:17:48.

you on this specific issue. issue was about whether the

:17:48.:17:51.

comments he had made, which were kind of derogatory towards women's

:17:51.:18:01.
:18:01.:18:04.

rights. Amnesty International, for us, women's rights is paramount.

:18:04.:18:09.

What were you doing associating with him? When you have people in

:18:09.:18:13.

prisons, we do not interview them for their views. This was after he

:18:13.:18:21.

left prison. The reason this is important is because people inside

:18:21.:18:24.

the organisation and outside it are worried about the degree to which

:18:24.:18:27.

Amnesty is prepared to work with people who do not share the

:18:27.:18:37.
:18:37.:18:39.

universal values that Amnesty claims it represents. People are

:18:39.:18:41.

worried that Amnesty International has tended to align themselves with

:18:41.:18:51.

extremists. The nice thing is that we get criticised from all sides.

:18:51.:19:01.
:19:01.:19:09.

It is a reminder that we have to remain objective. In the Middle

:19:09.:19:13.

East, North Africa, many people came up to say how we are so anti-

:19:13.:19:16.

Islamist. I think Amnesty, without question, maintains its objectivity

:19:16.:19:20.

through all the processes that we carry out. That is why we are so

:19:20.:19:27.

valued. Before you toore you too another official said that Amnesty

:19:27.:19:31.

has become rather famous - thinking about the role of jihad in self-

:19:31.:19:37.

defence. Aren't such views not right? He said no. Do you believe

:19:37.:19:47.
:19:47.:19:53.

notions of jihad are antithetical to human rights? We were the first

:19:53.:19:55.

to criticise the Taliban for killing innocent civilians at the

:19:56.:19:58.

Intercontinental Hotel. Any kind of killing of civilians, using any

:19:58.:20:01.

kind of jihad or whatever is unacceptable. But he believes jihad

:20:01.:20:08.

is not antithetical to human rights? I am not going to go there.

:20:08.:20:12.

I am saying if there is any evidence that civilians have been

:20:12.:20:17.

killed, it is not acceptable. you cut your ties to caged

:20:17.:20:27.
:20:27.:20:36.

prisoners? He was associated with an alleged Al-Qaeda mastermind.

:20:36.:20:40.

Have you cut or your ties with them? We have a specific campaign

:20:40.:20:45.

with them on Guantanamo Bay. I worked with Caged Prisoners. What

:20:45.:20:55.
:20:55.:21:05.

about Israel? In the last few years, Amnesty spent too much time on

:21:05.:21:08.

Israel and Palestine and not at what was actually going on in the

:21:09.:21:15.

Arab world? If you look at Tunisia, Egypt, these were major investments

:21:15.:21:25.
:21:25.:21:34.

On Israel, Palestine, if you are talking about how we make sure of

:21:34.:21:37.

objectivity and balance, we work with that criticism. After the 2008

:21:37.:21:40.

and 2009 conflicts, we said their research conducted into human

:21:40.:21:50.

rights was inadequate. The head of Amnesty International's Finland

:21:50.:22:00.

branch described Israel as a scum state. Have you removed him?

:22:00.:22:06.

stand for freedom of expression. Someone might say something that is

:22:06.:22:12.

not representative. So he still speaks as the chief Amnesty person

:22:12.:22:22.
:22:22.:22:24.

in Finland? We have been cleared that is not Amnesty International's

:22:24.:22:29.

view. We have dealt with that. I do not know the specifics of the

:22:29.:22:36.

circumstances but that is not Amnesty International's view.

:22:36.:22:40.

wrote it in a blog and it caused a great deal of upset in Israel. Some

:22:40.:22:44.

believe there is an in-built bias. It is not about what one staff in

:22:44.:22:48.

Amnesty said. The important thing is that the blockade is not

:22:48.:22:54.

acceptable. People are suffering. We have done some very detailed

:22:54.:23:02.

studies on water sanitation so that has been lifted. We have one of the

:23:02.:23:08.

settlements there that has been destroyed 20 times. They are all

:23:08.:23:13.

the things that we need to stop. just want to talk about the future.

:23:13.:23:23.
:23:23.:23:34.

You are the boss. Does it worry you that the most powerful emerging

:23:34.:23:37.

nations in the world, and I am thinking of China, maybe the BRIC

:23:37.:23:40.

countries, Russia, India, Brazil as well. These countries do not all

:23:40.:23:44.

sign on to your views of what human rights really are. You cannot lump

:23:44.:23:50.

all these countries together. It is a very big mix. They need to do a

:23:50.:23:55.

lot more. I was in Brazil not so long ago and there was some big

:23:55.:23:58.

challenges there. We were very worried that they are still

:23:58.:24:02.

evicting a lot of people. And then you think about China. What did the

:24:03.:24:06.

Chinese premier say in London the other day? He said stop lecturing

:24:06.:24:09.

us. Stop lecturing us about human rights. Treat us as equals, don't

:24:10.:24:12.

engage in finger-pointing and respect others on the basis of

:24:12.:24:19.

equality. That may be a message that he is also delivering to you

:24:19.:24:25.

as well. China had the Nobel Peace Prize going to a Chinese citizen

:24:25.:24:35.
:24:35.:24:47.

not so long ago. 10 years ago they would not worry about it but now

:24:47.:24:50.

they are worrying about their international image. They are

:24:50.:24:53.

concerned about their image more and more. They have to be held to

:24:53.:24:57.

international standards. As we see Beijing rise and Delhi as well, the

:24:57.:25:01.

power countries in the world, what you are doing may be even more

:25:01.:25:10.

difficult to deliver. Brazilians and the Indians and the

:25:10.:25:14.

Africans need to become part of the movement and raise their voices as

:25:14.:25:20.

well. They need to have pressure coming from their own countries. I

:25:20.:25:23.

think the idea that human rights is a Western concept has been exploded

:25:23.:25:33.
:25:33.:25:56.

recently. We have to leave it there. The weekend is approaching and the

:25:56.:26:01.

weather looks like turning pretty nasty by Friday with wind and rain

:26:01.:26:05.

expected. Before that happens, a reasonable weather today with

:26:05.:26:11.

sunshine prevailing. Many places will be dry and the one exception

:26:11.:26:15.

is the east of England with an active weather system bringing a

:26:15.:26:23.

wet start to the day. Further west, a cool start but a lovely day with

:26:23.:26:28.

sunshine. Things will warm up quite nicely. I've been to the mid-teens

:26:28.:26:34.

by mid-morning. A touch of frost in the northern Highlands and things

:26:34.:26:40.

warming up after that. No real problems weather-wise in the

:26:40.:26:45.

Midlands. It is the east of England that will have the cloud and wet

:26:45.:26:55.

weather. Fringing in two parts of Kent, and further west a lot of

:26:55.:27:03.

sunshine. As we go through the day not much changing - wet weather in

:27:03.:27:10.

the east of England, blustery wind. Further west - dry, bright and of

:27:10.:27:20.
:27:20.:27:27.

lighter wind. Temperatures in the low 20s but chilly. The Open, a lot

:27:27.:27:32.

of cloud and blustery wind back. Challenging conditions and coverage

:27:32.:27:37.

will be all over the BBC. Toward the evening, the wind will move

:27:37.:27:46.

east. Things will dry out. A largely dry start to Friday. Much

:27:46.:27:52.

warmer for parts of East Anglia, the south-east. Weather fronts are

:27:52.:28:02.
:28:02.:28:04.

With motor insurance premiums up nearly 40 percent this year Panorama investigates the car insurance industry from top to bottom.

We go undercover to infiltrate a criminal gang faking accidents for fraudulent insurance claims and we look at who's benefitting from some of those text claim messages we're all getting. Declan Lawn investigates what's gone wrong with the industry and discovers how we're all paying for it.


Download Subtitles

SRT

ASS