Leaders Special with Theresa May and Jeremy Corbyn Question Time

Tonight, the Prime Minister, Theresa May,

the leader of the Conservative Party,

and the leader of Labour Party, Jeremy Corbyn, face the voters.

Welcome to Question Time.

So, over the next 90 minutes, the leaders of the two larger parties

are going to be quizzed by our audience here in York.

Now, this audience is made up like this -

just a third say they intend to vote Conservative next week.

The same number say they're going to vote Labour,

and the rest either support other parties,

or have yet to make up their minds.

As ever, you can comment on all of this from home

either on Twitter - our hashtag is #BBCQT -

we're also on Facebook, as usual, and our text number is 83981.

Push the red button on your remote to see what others are saying.

The leaders - this is important -

don't know the questions that are going to be put to them tonight.

So, first to face our audience,

please welcome the leader of the Conservative Party,

the Prime Minister, Theresa May.

APPLAUSE

Thank you.

Thank you very much. Thank you.

Good evening, Prime Minister.

Your first question comes from Abigail Eatock, please.

Why should the public trust anything you say or any of your policies

when you have a known track record of broken promises

and backtracking during your time

as Home Secretary and now Prime Minister?

Well, thank you, David, and thank you...

APPLAUSE

Thank you, Abigail,

and can I first of all say good evening to everybody,

and thank you for coming to be an audience at this programme tonight,

which is an important part of the election campaign.

Let me tell you about some of the things

that I did as Home Secretary, Abigail.

I said that I would ensure

that we were dealing with extremist hate preachers,

and I excluded more than any Home Secretary before me.

I said I would do something about stop and search,

cos I don't think anybody should be stopped and searched

on the streets of our country because of the colour of their skin.

I said I would be tough on crime,

and I said I would ensure our police and our security services

had the powers they need to be able to do their job,

and I gave them those in the legislation that I put through,

and I made sure that we kept the records of criminals and terrorists

on the DNA database,

whereas Diane Abbott actually wants to wipe them clean,

and I don't think that's a good idea,

cos that helps us catch criminals.

So, no backtracking, and...

APPLAUSE

..no broken promises? What were you thinking of, Abigail?

Erm... Well, you have backtracked as Prime Minister.

You backtracked when you became leader of the Conservatives,

and then immediately Prime Minister after the referendum.

You said you wouldn't call an election, and you did.

And then you are here calling an election

and refusing to take part in debates,

refusing to answer people's questions,

refusing to talk to Jeremy Corbyn,

and you've backtracked on your social care policy,

and your entire manifesto has holes in it,

and everyone else can see that.

Well, first of all...

APPLAUSE

First of all, can I just say,

I'm not refusing to take part in debates,

because I'm here answering questions from you,

this audience, this evening,

and that's what I think is important in an election campaign.

It's not politicians arguing amongst each other,

but actually listening and taking questions from voters.

And you mentioned about not holding...

Saying I wouldn't hold an election and now holding one.

You're right - I thought we needed a period of stability,

but what became clear to me when we went through the Article 50 process

to trigger the process of leaving the European Union,

to respect the will of the British people,

was that other parties wanted to frustrate those negotiations,

and wanted to frustrate that will of the people

that had been expressed in the referendum vote.

And, you know, it would have been easy - I could have said,

"OK, I'm Prime Minister, there's another couple of years going -

"why don't I just stay and hang on in the job?"

But I didn't do that. I've called an election because of Brexit.

I was willing to do that

because I think this is a really important moment for our country.

We've got to get this right.

If we get it right, I'm optimistic for the British people,

because I believe in the British people, but we need to get it right.

APPLAUSE

Yes, the woman there.

Who is it that contested you, because Labour have clearly

issued a whip to get people to vote for Article 50 being passed.

Besides the Lib Dems,

who have kind of said that they would like another referendum,

I don't understand who it is

that has contested your leadership through Brexit.

Well, you're right, we got the Article 50 legislation

through Parliament.

That was important - it's triggered the ability for us

to start these negotiations, and those negotiations, by the way,

start just 11 days after election day next week.

So whoever comes in as Prime Minister,

whoever comes in as a government,

has got to be ready to actually get the ball rolling

and start those negotiations straight away.

But it was clear through the discussions that we had

around that time that the other parties did want to frustrate us,

and you say... You talk about the Liberal Democrats,

I mean, we have a situation at the moment where if Jeremy Corbyn

was to get into Number ', he'd be being propped up

by the Liberal Democrats and the Scottish nationalists.

You'd have Diane Abbott, who can't add up,

sitting around the Cabinet table, John McDonnell, who's a Marxist,

Nicola Sturgeon, who wants to break our country up,

and Tim Farron, who wants to take us back INTO the EU,

the direct opposite of what the British people want.

APPLAUSE

-You, sir.

-Thank you.

That being said, Prime Minister,

one of the things that I would like to know is,

secretly, do you really regret calling this election,

now the polls have moved against you?

I'm a Tory and I pray and hope that we win, or that you win,

but you must feel a little bit of... "Ooh!" A little bit of remorse, no?

No, I've been in politics quite a long time, and I've always said

at every election, the only poll that matters

-is the one that takes place on polling day.

-Yeah.

And I think the British people, when they're voting,

when everybody's casting your vote, people here and people watching

and others, have a simple choice, and it is about who do you trust

to have that leadership, to take us to get the best deal for Brexit

in Europe, and who's got the will and the vision,

not just to take us through Brexit, not just to get on with the job

of delivering Brexit, but to take us beyond and build a better future

for this country.

Were you surprised, though, that the polls have gone from a lead of 20%

when you called the election, remorselessly down like that?

David, I'm never surprised at things that happen

-during election campaigns.

-You thought you were THAT popular,

-and now you accept you're THAT popular?

-No.

I'm never surprised at things that happen during election campaigns,

because the only poll I look at

-is the one that takes place on election day.

-Al right. You, sir.

Just face it - you called the election

for your own political gains.

It's nothing to do with the good of the country -

it's for your own political gains.

No, it's not, sir. Can I just say to you, as I've just said...

APPLAUSE

It would have been the easiest thing in the world for me,

having become Prime Minister after the referendum

when David Cameron resigned, to say, you know, the next election's

not till 2020, this is a good job, I enjoy the job, I want to do it -

in this job I do what I believe is the best for Britain.

I could have stayed on doing that job for another couple of years...

Your party called a European referendum...

I had the balls to call an election.

..for the good of the Conservative Party.

You've called a general election for the good of Conservative Party,

-and it's going to backfire on you.

-No, I called...

APPLAUSE

I called a general election because I believe that the British people

have a right to vote, and to say who they want to see leading them

through the Brexit negotiations,

and I believe they should have a Prime Minister

who has an absolutely resolute determination to respect their will.

My party is the only party that is going to respect the will

of the British people, get on with the job,

-and deliver a successful Brexit.

-OK.

APPLAUSE

We'll come on to Brexit in a moment. One more point from you.

I think it's a very different thing to debate a studio audience

as debating the other leaders, and I think there has been a lot

of debating through the media.

Would it not give a more interesting debate

having you say these things face to face to the other leaders,

and speak that way about the policies,

rather than through TV and through journalists?

-APPLAUSE

-Well...

I think election campaigns should be about getting out and about,

yes, answering questions from voters, meeting voters,

talking to people across the UK in a whole variety of circumstances,

and I'm afraid I think that actually having that interaction

with voters is more useful for the voter and for the politician.

I think anybody who wants to be Prime Minister

should be out and about listening to what people are thinking,

and I don't think seven politicians just arguing amongst themselves

is actually that interesting or that revealing.

OK. Let's... APPLAUSE

We'll go on. I want to go on, cos we've talked about the election.

Let's go on to talking about Brexit,

which you've mentioned once or twice.

Barry Clarke, could we have your question, please?

-Good evening.

-Good evening.

If the EU start being awkward,

why don't we just cut and run and pay no money at all?

-Well...

-APPLAUSE

I've said that I think no deal would be better than a bad deal.

Now, I'm confident we can get a good deal

with the right plan for those negotiations,

because I think a good deal is in our interest,

and in the interests of the rest of the EU.

But we have to be prepared to stand up for Britain.

We have to be prepared to go in there

recognising that we're not willing to accept a bad deal.

What is a bad deal? People are very confused.

You talk all the time about a bad deal, which you won't accept.

Can you explain what in your mind would be a bad deal?

Well, yes. I think on the one hand, David,

you've got politicians in Europe, some of whom are talking

about punishing the UK for leaving the EU.

I think what they want to see in terms of that punishment

would be a bad deal, and secondly, you've got politicians here

in the United Kingdom, who seem to be willing to accept any deal,

whatever it is, just for the sake of getting a deal.

I think the danger is, they'd be accepting

the worst possible deal at the highest possible price.

APPLAUSE

You, sir, at the back there.

Good evening.

You always say you want to serve for the whole people in Britain,

but Brexit was basically voted by 52%.

So, how do you actually serve for the whole country

if just 52% backed Brexit?

Well, the first thing I would say is that as I go around

and talk to people, individuals, business representatives and others,

I find that actually, the greater majority of opinion here in the UK

is that the decision was taken, the public were given their choice -

they chose to leave the European Union.

Let's just have a government that gets on with it,

and delivers a good deal.

And how I would respond, for all of those who voted to remain,

and I voted to remain, is to say that now we must make sure

we get the negotiations right, we get that good free trade agreement,

the continued co-operation, a deep and special partnership with the EU,

but that also, we take this opportunity of Brexit,

new trade deals around the rest of the world,

actually seeing how we can build a more prosperous,

stronger and fairer Britain.

I think we can do that,

and I think we can do that because I believe in Britain

and I believe in the British people.

What I'm... APPLAUSE

It's curious, because just over a year ago,

when you were a Remainer, er...

and David Cameron got this wrong, and he resigned,

you got it wrong and remained to become Prime Minister.

You said,

"Remaining inside the European Union makes us more prosperous."

Yesterday, you said, "Brexit makes us more prosperous."

LAUGHTER I mean, what...

Where are you at on this?

What I... And I set out very carefully before the referendum

why I believed on balance we should stay in the EU.

I also said the sky will not fall in if we leave the EU.

What then happened was the British people,

who had been given the choice -

you know, Parliament decided to say to the public, "It's your choice."

-They chose that we should leave the EU.

-But will we be less prosperous?

-Going back to your old argument.

-We've got to make sure

that we can actually use the opportunities that come from Brexit.

We've got to grasp those opportunities,

but fundamentally, David, the thing I think that matters most in this

is being willing to deliver on the will of the people.

Not saying, "Oh, you got it wrong, let's have a second referendum,"

but saying, "You voted, you've chosen, you want a government

"that's going to do it for you," and I say to people,

if you voted for Brexit, you need to make sure you get it

with a government, with me and my team,

who will actually deliver it for you.

Yeah, but the people made the wrong choice, by your book,

-cos you were a Remainer.

-No, the people...

They made the wrong choice because you were a Remainer,

so, in your mind you must have thought, "What are they on about?"

And then you said they'll get richer if they stay,

if they leave, they won't - they'll be poorer.

Can you now honestly say there's no difference -

we'll get richer by leaving just the same as we would have done

if we'd remained?

-I said...

-Or is there going to be a price to pay?

I did say at the time that I thought there were advantages, on balance,

in being in the EU, but now, what I believe we must do

is deliver on the will of the people,

but also make sure we make a success of it.

So what I'm doing as Prime Minister

is saying, let's find those opportunities

that will enable us to be more prosperous in the future.

All right. Too much of me. The man over there. You, sir.

No, on the far side there. Yes.

-Good evening.

-Evening.

You don't need to say good evening all the time,

because I think we've met! LAUGHTER

It looks increasingly likely that we are going to have to pay

a divorce bill, and it's speculated anything between nothing

to 100 billion.

Could you quantify in billions of pounds, straightforward question,

what is a good deal?

Well, the...

I'm not going to give you a figure on that for two reasons.

First of all because we need to go through very carefully,

as part of the negotiation, what rights and obligations

the United Kingdom has.

And secondly, because if I gave you a figure here tonight,

for what I thought would be a good figure,

that wouldn't be a very good negotiating stance when I'm sitting

down, if I'm Prime Minister in 11 days' time, with the European Union.

But it is... It's his money you're spending?

Yes, well, it's all our money that will be...

That is taxpayers' money, David.

But you don't go into a negotiating stance saying, "The thing I

"want out of this is, absolutely want out of this, is X."

Because you can bet your bottom dollar

the other side is going to try and make sure you don't get X.

And do you think they'll have to...you'll have to agree that

before they'll talk about all the other things, trade

and all the rest of it? Which way do you think it's going to run?

They've... I've been very clear, as indeed has the EU on recognising

that we need to negotiate that new relationship with them,

which will be about trade, but will be about other things, too.

So like co-operation on security and criminal justice.

They want to start off by talking about the bill.

I want one of the early discussions to be about the reciprocal

arrangement for EU and UK citizens.

They haven't said that we can't negotiate the trade deal

until we've agreed the bill.

What they've said is we need to make sufficient progress.

And what several of them have also said

is we need to get on to the trade deal quickly.

-The woman at the very back there.

-Hello.

-Hello.

You've said that you think you can negotiate a good deal, but do you

really think that you actually have any real leverage with Brussels?

Well, yes, I do. And one of the reasons

I think we can negotiate a good deal is because, actually,

a good deal, in trade terms,

is not just of benefit to the UK, it's of benefit to businesses

in the remaining countries, remaining in the European Union.

So this isn't just about us.

It's actually about a relationship that matters to them as well

as it matters to us.

You over here, on the right.

I'd like to pull you up on the comment about Diane Abbott's

miscalculations that you made a few minutes ago.

Cos Philip Hammond, who's Chancellor of the Exchequer

got a £20 billion miscalculation a few weeks ago,

so I think that's a bit rude of you.

APPLAUSE

Well, what I will say is this, as I said earlier on,

Diane Abbott wants to be Home Secretary and she wants to

wipe the records of criminals and terrorists from the DNA database.

That would mean we could catch fewer criminals and fewer terrorists.

OK, you, sir, here. The man in green.

Talking about Brexit and Remainers, I think the voting 52% to 48%,

I think you lack the confidence in asking the public, the electorate,

one more time because the voting was so in the middle,

what would the electorate want to do?

I think Nigel Farage made a big mess.

I think Michael Gove led the electorate the wrong way

and Boris Johnson, they had buses,

you know, pasted with "NHS, £350 million".

We were all told lies.

So even people who voted out,

perhaps they should be given the second chance,

so you should have the confidence to say, "Shall we have another vote?"

Over... Over...

GROANING

Look, can I put it like this?

Over the years, in the European Union,

and its European Economic Community, there've been a number

of occasions where referendums have been held in countries.

There was one in Ireland, I think France is an example as well,

where they voted against what the EU was suggesting.

And basically, the bureaucrats and the EU politicians

turned round to those countries and said,

"You've got it wrong, have another vote.

"We want you to come up with what we think is the right answer."

Now we know how much it's going to cost.

Sorry, you can come back in a minute.

At that time, I think, collectively, people here in the UK said,

"You know what? That's not the way to behave.

"If the people have given their choice,

"let's listen to the people and deliver it on it for them."

On the wrong information.

APPLAUSE

-You, sir.

-The wrong information.

They weren't giving the right information to choose from.

OK, you, sir.

Earlier this week, Prime Minister, you said that you wanted the people

of Britain to trust you with regards to Brexit and winning the election.

How can the people trust you when your manifesto has not

given them any detail as to figures or what you propose to do

with other things in Government?

Well, what my manifesto...

APPLAUSE

You're right, I use that word "trust"

and I used it because that is actually what politicians,

when we go out, when we ask people to vote for us, we are asking people

to trust us in the role that we are being, want to be voted in to.

And I....if I look at our manifesto,

what our manifesto has done is to be open with people

about the great challenges that we believe that this country faces

and that need to be addressed by whoever is in Government.

We've been open about that.

I've also been open that there will be some hard choices

to be made in addressing those various challenges.

You talk about figures in our manifesto,

of course, we already have budgets that have been set out in

the Autumn Statement, as Government, and in the Spring Budget,

and we've added some figures in various areas like our extra funding

on the NHS and schools in the manifesto.

But I think it's important that the next Government sets out for

people the really big issues that are going to have to be addressed

by whoever is in Government, and those are in our manifesto.

The one thing that was missing from your manifesto and seemed to cause

a panic in the Conservative Party was the figures on what happens

to people who have to fund their care in old age

and we have a question about it from Derek Griffin.

Let's just have that, Mr Griffin.

I'm just wondering, with regards to social care,

you kind of spend your whole life obviously working hard

to build up a nest egg and have a nice, little pension and savings

so you can be comfortable in your later life after you've retired,

but if it's all going to be taken away from you again,

if care is needed, essentially,

why should you even bother in the first place?

And a reminder that your manifesto said

£100,000 is all you would be left with.

Well, the figure that you're left with at the moment is £23,000.

So we're actually quadrupling that.

You are sticking with £100,000?

-Yes!

-I thought you'd changed that?

-No.

Sorry, I thought you were going to have an upper limit?

The £100,000 is a floor, David. There's a cap and a floor.

Ah, but you didn't mention the cap in the manifesto.

No, but you didn't mention it in the manifesto, that's the point.

-I will come on to that.

-He's talking about the figures not being there.

I will answer the question I was asked, if I may.

Do it your own way. APPLAUSE

If we look at the situation at the moment, if you need care

then if you've got more than £23,000 in savings,

you have to pay for that care.

And if you need residential care,

the value of your house will be taken into account.

And so it's today that we see people sometimes having to sell

their house in order to pay those bills.

Now, what we say is that, under the system we introduce,

which is important because we need a sustainable system for the future,

given the ageing population.

If we do nothing, our social care system will collapse.

We say we will ensure that people are able to protect more of

their savings, the £100,000.

That they will also not have to sell their house

during their lifetime to pay for their care bills.

But I also wanted a system that was fair across the generations

and I believe this is, too.

We said in our manifesto we'd consult on the details.

I heard the scaremongering that came out after our manifesto

was published and I set out one of the details that,

aspects that would have been in the consultation, which is about

having a cap on the absolute level.

So there's a floor of £100,000.

You can protect £100,000 and we'll consult on what should be the

cap of the - absolute cap - on the level of care costs.

Funny thing to leave out the cap,

cos it's rather important for people.

£100,000 that you keep, but whether you get rid of half

a million or £250,000 or that, the manifesto told you nothing.

Then you suddenly said, "Oh, there will be a cap,

"we won't charge you more than a certain amount."

Odd to leave that out, wasn't it?"

No, we set out the principles in our manifesto,

which are the ones I've just set out in the answer,

which is crucially that it's fair across the generations,

that we enable people to have the knowledge and the comfort of

knowing they won't have to sell their house in their lifetime

-to pay for their care bills.

-Barry wants to come back on it.

Obviously, from a personal perspective,

you're saying about the caps.

Myself and my wife, for instance, we are actually both disabled.

So, statistically, as we get older,

we are maybe more likely to be the ones needing to use that care.

So are there any kinds of safeguards or guarantees or something that

we're not going to be left bankrupt in our retirement, basically,

purely because of a condition we have no control over?

Yes. Well, what I want to...

APPLAUSE

What I want to do, in relation to the details of

the policy, how it actually works, including the level of the cap,

is to consult, consult with people, consult with voters.

Also consult with organisations, charities and others working

with older people, so that we ensure that we get that right.

And I think that's a fair way to do it

rather than just producing a figure now.

I think it's important to have that consultation.

You, sir. APPLAUSE

If you can tell us what the floor is now, why can't you tell us the cap?

-APPLAUSE

-Because...

APPLAUSE

Because we're talking about two different things, aren't we?

On the floor, I think it's important that we give people

the protection of their savings, which is greater than it is today.

That's why we've set that figure at £100,000.

But on the cap, as to where you set that figure as to the absolute

figure that people pay, amount that people pay,

I think it's right that we have that consultation.

We will consult, as I've just said to Barry, with individuals,

but also with organisations that deal with these issues,

charities that work with older people, to make sure we get

-that at the right level.

-OK.

Victoria Davey. Let's go on to another question.

Sorry, yes, you.

We had a cap of £79,000,

why can't we at least start with something around that figure?

In our manifesto we said we weren't following the Dilnot...

Those are the Andrew Dilnot proposals.

We weren't going to follow those Andrew Dilnot proposals

and there were two reasons why.

The first is that those tended to protect people who were

wealthier but didn't protect people who were on modest incomes.

And secondly it required payment out of taxation.

And I actually think that if you're going to be fair across the

generations, then we don't ask young people to be having their

taxes increased in order to pay for the social care costs of

somebody who may... people who may be sitting

on a very significant value in their house.

APPLAUSE

Victoria Davey.

Working as a nurse for 26 years, do the Tories expect our support

in the light of another 1% pay increase?

APPLAUSE

What we're looking at, in terms of the National Health Service,

and ensuring that we can provide

the National Health Service in the future, is,

if we just look at how much money is now being spent on the NHS,

in the five years to 2020 we will be spending half a trillion pounds

on the National Health Service.

Now, we're putting more money in at the moment and we will continue

to put more money in into the future into the NHS.

Bu it is important that we recognise,

as you will know as a nurse,

the demands on the NHS are increasing all the time.

We recognise the work that the NHS staff do, but...

But nurses get paid less and less.

-Nurses get an increase. Obviously some other payments as well.

-No, no.

A real terms decrease of 14% since 2010.

So don't tell us we're getting a pay rise.

Let the person sitting next to you say it, the nurse.

I agree with that.

My wage slips from 2009 reflect exactly what I'm earning today.

So how can that be fair in light of the job that we actually do?

And I recognise the job that you do.

Then why hasn't it changed before now, then?

We have had to take some hard choices across the public sector

in relation to public sector pay restraint.

We did that because of the decisions we had to take

to bring public spending under control

because it wasn't under control under the last Labour Government.

And I'm being honest with you,

in terms of saying that we will put more money into the NHS

but there isn't a magic money tree that we can shake

that suddenly provides for everything that people want.

You come in on this.

You say you'll cut, you're cutting NHS spending,

but you also cut tax for the rich?

APPLAUSE

We're not actually cutting NHS spending, we're putting in fact

record levels of funding overall into the National Health Service

and we will continue to increase the funding

for the National Health Service in government.

But other countries spend way more on their health service than we do,

but we're giving it out for free.

So why are we spending less?

Well, it's not... I mean, the figures do vary,

but actually it's not the case

that all other countries are spending more money

on their NHS than we are.

We are putting more funding into the NHS.

We're putting and we will continue to do that.

But I also want to do some other things in relation to the NHS.

We have put into a requirement that mental health should be given

parity of esteem with physical health in the NHS.

I think there's...

More money's going into it, but there's more for us to do.

In our manifesto, we've set out a whole package

of what we can do on mental health.

It's not just about the money that's going into the NHS,

which will increase, it's about ensuring that we're dealing

and addressing the issues we need to.

And I think mental health is something

that's been put to one side for too long

and not been given the attention it deserves.

Going back to the nurses just for a moment,

do you think it's fair that the nurses get just the 1% increase

year in, year out, regardless of inflation,

so they get poorer, so some of them, we're told, go to food banks?

Is that fair, do you feel, do you sleep happy at that?

The public sector has been restrained

in its pay to 1% increase.

Of course, there will be those working within the NHS,

nurses and others, who will get progression pay increases.

Are they not a special case, compared...

Are they not a special case, nurses,

compared with other people in the public sector?

Well, people in the public sector across all sorts of services

are working very hard on some jobs that we want them to do because they

are about looking after us, about protecting us, about caring for us.

But we have to look at public sector spending.

We have to make sure that we're managing our money carefully

because, at the end of the day, as I say,

there isn't a magic money tree that suddenly delivers all the money

everybody wants for the spending everybody wants.

You may hear later on that you can ask for anything

that you want to have money spent on.

But actually, you can't. It's not there.

We have to ensure we manage your money, taxpayers' money, carefully.

There are a lot of hands up, so I'll go to you, sir, first.

And then...

You mentioned mental health there. I'm just wondering,

does that include the work capability assessment

-with the mental health as well?

-It's...

-Because I've just recently failed that assessment.

-So have I.

Just through mental health.

There's a number of things we want to do.

Hold on. You say your bit, too.

-You're sitting together by chance?

-By chance.

-By chance.

OK, well, say what you were going to say, then. Go on.

Basically, again on mental health, I agree, it's so important.

The NHS is an absolute shambles for mental health at the moment.

I applied for NHS counselling about, I think, probably the end of 2015.

-My first appointment is next Tuesday.

-Yes.

My first appointment is next Tuesday.

I've been waiting a year-and-a-half for this

and I have suffered so much over that year,

in part because of the work capability assessment.

APPLAUSE

And let me tell you...

Let me tell you, I'm partially sighted as well.

I'm partially sighted, I have mental health problems

and also I have other issues, jaw issues,

and I went into my assessment and I was asked in detail

about suicide attempts and I came out crying

because I was so upset because of the way I was treated by that nurse.

And she came out after me - she'd forgotten to measure my eyesight.

I'm partially sighted.

She found time to, you know, insult me, basically,

-by asking for all these upsetting details.

-All right.

Let the Prime Minister answer.

I'm not going to make any excuses for the experience that you've had.

That's why I think it is so important

that we actually do deal with mental health.

Both of you have raised two different issues.

One is how we deal with mental health issues in the health service,

and the other is actually the work capability assessment.

And this is something where we are...

We do look at improving how that assessment has taken place.

But I know your... I know the issue of mental health is a particularly

difficult one to address in term of those work capability assessments.

On the National Health Service,

and the other things we want to do with mental health,

one of the things I want to do is ensure better support in schools

so that we have individual members of staff trained in schools

who are able to better identify mental health problems

and then know how to address them.

And I was talking to a young woman only at the turn of the year

who, in school, said nobody had really known what to do

because of her mental health problems.

So she'd suffered as a result.

If we can give people the support they need at an earlier stage,

it's better for everybody.

But as I say, I make no excuses for the experience that you had.

All right. The woman in orange. I'm sorry, we've got to go on

cos we've only got ten more minutes with the Prime Minister. Yes.

I think it's fair to say that mental health funding is one of your

soundbites whenever people ask you about the NHS,

but it really concerned me a couple of weeks ago,

you were filmed when a lady

challenged you about her benefits for learning difficulties,

you turned around and gave an answer about mental health funding

and it really concerned me that

the Prime Minister and potential future Prime Minister of the UK

apparently doesn't understand the difference between

a learning disability and a mental health condition.

APPLAUSE DROWNS OUT SPEECH

In fact, when the lady first spoke to me, she talked about learning

disabilities AND mental health.

She'd actually raised mental health herself.

But I recognise that the particular issue she had

was about learning disabilities.

But this is... Both of these are areas where we need to ensure

that we've got the ability for people's needs to be identified

at as early a stage as possible

and then the support goes in.

Obviously, all the evidence is,

the earlier you can get that support to somebody,

the earlier you can identify an issue,

then the better it is for that individual,

but also the better it will be for the rest of their lives.

That's why on the mental health front, as I say,

I'm so keen to ensure that we get more support, in terms of training

in schools. There are other things I want to do as well,

including in the work place, actually, because too often

I think there is discrimination in relation to mental health

in the work place so I want to...

I'm going to bring in a new Mental Health Act,

scrap the old Mental Health Act,

but also change the equalities legislation so that discrimination

on mental health will not be possible in the workplace.

Robert Waite, let's have your question.

Robert Waite, please.

I will be voting Tory, but I'm not happy with the foreign aid budget,

and especially why we are giving money to North Korea?

Can you explain that, please?

-Well, we...

-APPLAUSE

I think the commitment we've given on the foreign aid budget

is an important one,

and I think it's an important one for two reasons.

First of all, we are one of the...

We're the fastest growing,

second fastest growing economy in the G7 last year,

we are one of the most significant economies in the world.

I think it's right that we say that we help those people

who are less well off than we are in those developing countries.

There are millions of children,

millions of girls, being educated today,

who would not be educated were it not for the foreign aid money

that we're giving.

But it's also about something else

because it means that in certain states

it's possible to help to develop the economy,

the governance of that state, and that is of benefit to us

in protecting us as a United Kingdom for a whole range of reasons.

If we can stabilise some certain countries, then that's going to be

better for us both in terms of security, for example.

Robert, do you want to come back?

We do look very carefully at individual countries and payments.

But North Korea.

SOME LAUGHTER

That is one of the worst places going, surely.

It is not somewhere that...

I would...

suggest that is somewhere that one holds out as a paragon of virtue.

I think what the DPRK, what North Korea has been doing

in terms of its missiles and its nuclear situation...

And, you know, we had another ballistic missile test only

a few days ago. We're clear that we want to see those changes in

North Korea. I think it's important for China to be influencing those.

Does the aid budget go to North Korea?

Does North Korea receive money from the aid budget?

The gentleman has suggested that it did.

I don't know the details of that.

About £4 million in 2015.

-£4 million?

-Yeah.

-OK. You, sir, in the red and white checked shirt.

So you're the Prime Minister of the country and you don't know

where that foreign aid is going to,

whether it's going to the government

or it's actually going to benefit its people?

If we are putting money into... When we put money into countries,

we change the way that we spend the foreign aid budget.

In the past, foreign aid budget

was all too often just given to governments

and you know the stories in the past of the way the money was then spent.

So we work through NGOs. We work

through organisations that are helping people, so money

that we put into countries

is targeted on things like education, on health,

on welfare of people,

on support for the people who are the most vulnerable.

OK. Brief one from you, sir.

You spoke earlier of foreign aid money.

Can you explain why it is that a great deal more of our largesse

that goes to the rest of world

is not in the form of British manufactures rather than of cash?

It's much easier to avoid having a field hospital pocketed

than it is a few million of cash

and it's also the case that if this money fed its way

through British manufacturing and provided British jobs,

there would be much less contention

concerning the sums of money given away.

-Can you answer briefly?

-Yes.

APPLAUSE

First of all, some of money we're talking about

is not about buying kit in the sense of

things that would be manufactured here.

I've just said, if you're talking about education,

it's about providing the facilities where children who would not

otherwise be educated are being educated.

But we do give support to countries in ways other than just the money.

So there are some countries where we are, indeed, our military are

working on things like field hospitals

and providing those directly.

If we want to improve British manufacturing around the world,

that's why I want to ensure we get good trade agreements around

the whole of the world when we leave the European Union.

APPLAUSE OK, Sally Jones, please.

Sally Jones.

Yes, fire away.

State schools are underfunded and teachers are overworked.

Why are you putting money into grammar schools when state schools

are beneficial to all abilities?

OK, why...? APPLAUSE

Stick with the grammar schools issue.

Sally, what we're doing,

the grammar schools will be within the state sector.

They might be free schools, they might be other types of schools.

We want a diversity of education, because education is so important.

I want every youngster to get the best possible start in life and that

means every youngster getting the education that is right for them.

We are actually putting more money...

You said we're putting money

into the possibility for grammar schools to be set up.

Yes, but we're also increasing the overall amount of money

that goes into schools and ensuring there's a fairer

distribution of that money across the country.

But I believe it's important that

if we know that there are good schools out there...

At the moment we have a law that says you can't set up any more

of these types of schools, despite the fact that they're good.

I think that's wrong. I think we should allow new grammar schools

to be set up so we ensure every child gets the education

that's right for them and the best possible start in life.

The woman there. APPLAUSE

In the school that I work in,

by 2020, every single child in that school

will receive £898 per year less

than under a Labour Government in 2020.

My question to you is why do you care less about the children

-than a Labour Government?

-I don't care less about the children.

APPLAUSE

-£898...

-I don't...

-OK.

-..per child...

You're saying the per child, per pupil spending has fallen.

..per annum, by 2020.

-Not the overall figure but how much you get.

-£898.

OK, you made the point. Let the Prime Minister answer.

There are two things I want to do because I do care about education.

As I have said in response to Sally, I think it is so important

for every youngster to get the best start in life.

That's why we will be putting more money overall into the schools,

we'll be ensuring the pupil premium

is there for those children who are disadvantaged,

but we will also ensure that there is a fairer distribution

of school funding because, at the moment, as you probably know,

there are some schools that get twice the amount of money per pupil

than other schools in other parts of the country.

I want to see a fairer system of funding and, in doing that,

we will make sure that no school sees a budget cut

when that fairer funding is introduced.

But getting a good quality education isn't just about the money going

into schools. It's about ensuring that we're encouraging people

to come into the teaching profession.

So we're going to give student loan forgiveness to people who come into

teaching and stay in teaching.

It's about a diversity of types of school.

So we see innovation and creativity in education,

so we genuinely can say in this country that how far you go in life

depends not on where you come from or who your parents are,

but it depends on your talents and abilities

and your willingness to work hard.

OK. APPLAUSE

We've got a couple of minutes left. Mandy Holder.

Mandy Holder, let's have your question.

Why haven't you signed a letter to Donald Trump, condemning his

decision to pull out of the Paris Climate Change Agreement?

Something which... APPLAUSE

Something which the presidents of Germany and France

and Italy have done.

Yes, and I haven't because I actually have spoken to Donald Trump

and told him the UK believes in the Paris Agreement

and that we didn't want the United States to leave the Paris Agreement.

The G7 leaders sat round the table last week

and spoke to, and told Donald Trump,

the six of us told him that we believed the Paris Agreement was

an important international agreement on climate change, that we wanted

the United States to stay in it.

I've spoken to him. I spoke to him last night about this.

-What did he say?

-Canada and Japan haven't signed the letter either.

-What did he say?

-What did he say?

He says he's taken the decision because he thinks it's in

the best interests of America.

I say that the Paris Agreement

actually is important for us globally

in terms of dealing with climate change.

That's why the UK supported it

and it's why the UK is continuing to support it.

You're negotiating our departure from the EU.

Wouldn't it have been sensible and prudent

to go along with France and Germany and Italy,

and sign a letter to Donald Trump, instead of it being released

that you just said you were disappointed by his decision?

It's not a question of

whether or not we should go along with somebody else, David.

We take independent decisions as the UK.

I spoke to Donald Trump,

I've told him my views from the UK's position last week,

I told him last night what our views are -

we remain committed to the Paris Agreement,

we continue to think it's important

for dealing with climate change internationally.

Well, that, I'm afraid, ends the first half of this programme.

Prime Minister, thank you very much.

Thank you very much, David. Thank you. Thank you, everybody.

APPLAUSE

And now, would you please welcome

the Leader of the Labour Party, Jeremy Corbyn?

APPLAUSE AND CHEERING

Good evening. Good evening, Mr Corbyn.

Our first question to you comes from Ciaran Hepworth, please.

Why should the British public

trust you and your peers to negotiate Brexit?

Why should the British public

trust you and your peers to negotiate Brexit?

Thank you for inviting me here tonight.

I'm very sorry this is not a debate, this is a series of questions.

I think it's a shame the Prime Minister

hasn't taken part in a debate.

APPLAUSE

We're very clear on Brexit.

A referendum took place, a decision was reached,

we're leaving the European Union.

Secondly, we will immediately legislate in office to guarantee

rights of EU nationals to remain in this country.

Secondly, we will negotiate with the European Union to guarantee

trade access to the European markets and protection of the conditions

that we've achieved through EU membership

because it's crucial to protect our manufacturing industry.

Your point about our negotiating team - we have a great team.

We have a great team of very experienced people.

Keir Starmer is one of the leading lawyers of this country.

I think I can trust Keir Starmer with negotiations

more than some other people who are undertaking those negotiations.

APPLAUSE

On Question Time last night,

your International Trade Secretary, Barry Gardiner,

said that Britain would absolutely - "absolutely" was his word -

be poorer after leaving the EU. Do you agree with that?

I don't think we necessarily would be poorer.

I hope that we will retain, as I said, the trade access and

I hope also that we will have a Labour Government that will be

investing in a growing economy in this country

and challenging the terrible levels of inequality that exist

in this country at the same time.

You, sir.

David Cameron went to the EU and asked for a few concessions.

He got nothing because they knew that he would stay,

he would want to stay in the EU.

If the EU understands your position,

that no deal is a bad deal,

then you've got no chance.

APPLAUSE

I've made it very clear we accept the results of the referendum.

I think it's important to go from that point.

I've made the point also about the need for trade access

to the European Union and there is, of course, an interest in that

on both sides of the Channel.

Most of our big manufacturing companies have supply chains here

and in Europe and vice versa. There is a mutual interest in this.

But we're not approaching these negotiations by

threatening Europe with setting up some kind of low-tax haven

for big corporations in this country.

We're instead saying we want to continue that trading relationship

outside the European Union,

but I think a sensible relationship with them is very important.

I will approach those negotiations to build up a trust

which gives us that sensible relationship in the future.

What... APPLAUSE

What exactly do you think the British people meant,

who voted to leave,

and what do you understand by "leave the EU"?

What does it actually mean to you to leave the EU?

What is it that matters in that?

Leaving the European Union means we withdraw from the Treaty of Rome,

we withdraw from the 1972 decision that was made

by the British Government at that time

to join with the European Union.

It means that there is no longer a legislative authority over UK law

within the EU or a parliamentary consent for it.

It means we have to have an independent and separate

relationship with the European Union

and I think we've got two years to negotiate it and I can't wait

to get started to make sure that we do retain manufacturing industry

and service industry jobs in Britain that are so essential

to our economy and our economic growth.

-But threatening will not work.

-Is your aim to remain...

APPLAUSE

Is your aim to remain in the single market?

Do you think that's possible?

Our aim is to have tariff-free trade access to Europe.

I think we should put it in those terms

rather than anything else at this stage.

OK. You, sir, over there, the far side.

No, the man over there.

That's it. Cos he's spoken already.

Thank you.

Will you rule out doing a deal with Nicola Sturgeon in the event of

a hung Parliament, because you will be negotiating,

as you would expect, with the EU at that time?

We are fighting this election to win

and we're mounting a fantastic campaign

in order to get that message across

of how different our society and our politics could be.

We are contesting all the constituencies.

We are not looking to do deals with anybody.

We are not forming a coalition government.

I want to form a Labour Government with a majority to carry out this

amazing programme which can give so much hope and opportunity

to so many people.

APPLAUSE

-Thank you.

-So, no deals.

That was the answer I expected

but it is wasn't the answer to my question.

I thought your question...

I thought your question was about deals and I said no deals.

OK. I'm going to go to somebody else.

You, sir, there, in the blue shirt.

Given the absence of the European Court of Justice,

how will you uphold government accountability post-Brexit?

On environmental issues, for example.

Air pollution, we're already breaching limits.

The European Court of Justice holds us to account.

What will happen when we leave the EU?

I want to ensure the environmental protocols are adopted into UK law.

I think it's very important to do that.

It's also absolutely crucial for the future of all of us

that we have agreements with all of Europe,

be they part of the EU or not, on air pollution, on air quality,

on sea pollution and protection of our seas

and our natural environment.

I'm very determined to achieve that.

Since you raise the subject,

I utterly deplore Donald Trump's decision to withdraw from

the Paris Climate Change.

I would sign a letter with any other leader

that would deplore that straight away.

APPLAUSE

Let's come home for a moment.

Steve Rudd, let's have your question, please.

-Steve Rudd.

-Hi, Steve.

Good evening. I run a small, local business.

I'm faced with the possibility of higher corporation tax rates.

Obviously we've alluded to the uncertainty that Brexit will create

over the next couple of years.

Today you've talked about creating jobs.

I just wonder how I can have confidence that those jobs,

well, that I, as a small business, can create those jobs?

-I don't know how big your small business is.

-It's a micro business.

-This big, that big?

-I employ five people.

-It's a small business, but it could grow.

-Good. Let's hope it does grow.

But it can't grow in in uncertain times, that's the problem.

-Absolutely.

-Just specify again,

what are your problems with the proposals that Labour is making?

Well, obviously it's the rise in corporation tax,

it's the uncertainty of Brexit and the outcome from Brexit.

It's planning ahead, basically, my problem is.

-OK.

-And obviously we've got the personal taxation issues

that create other issues further down the line.

I'm sure you recognise there are huge problems in the funding

of our public services - health, education -

and these have to be addressed and dealt with.

We have a fully costed and fully funded manifesto here.

That will cost, yes,

and we will raise corporation tax up to 26p by the end of the parliament.

That will be actually 2% lower than it was in 2010

and will actually be less than the G7 average.

What it will also do is not raise corporation tax

for small and medium businesses by that amount.

Some will have no rise whatsoever.

We have had very interesting and very good discussions with

a lot of small businesses about their problems of accessing capital,

their problems of growing

because banks don't like them and aren't interested in them,

and the need to have an investment strategy for this country.

So on top of that, we will also be forming

a national investment bank to improve infrastructure

all across the country and develop new, high technology industries

which, I think, are the future of this country.

Unharness... Let the people with the skills actually develop the jobs

and develop the industries in this country.

So, yes, we are asking the very biggest corporations

to pay a bit more, but I tell you what, I think it's worth it.

It's worth it so that any young person can go to university

and not leave with debt.

It's worth it to make sure school head teachers don't have to collect

at the school gate in order to pay the teachers' salaries.

I think it's worth it for a better society

in which everyone can achieve something.

OK. APPLAUSE AND CHEERING

-Jack Rowse, please.

-Just to come back to you.

I'm also working... I'm linked to an accountancy firm.

So we obviously deal with larger businesses as well

as potential clients and existing clients.

My choice, basically, and the choice of my clients,

is a Conservative Government and a Labour Government

and the difference, as you say, 2%, looking at it European-wide, but

it's a 9% difference between what the Conservatives are proposing

for corporation tax for larger businesses

and what the Labour Government is proposing.

It's a fair question but I would simply say this -

all of your clients, I'm sure, require workers at various times,

they require skilled workers at various times.

If we, as a society, don't look at the problems throughout

our school and education system and invest in it properly,

where are the skilled workers going to come from tomorrow?

Where are going to be the consumers of tomorrow?

I think it's time that we looked at inequality in our society

and used our public investment in order to improve services

and give real chances to everybody.

Poverty is a waste.

People who can't get the education they want

and the qualifications they want, we all lose.

It's a question of whether

the community gets together to support everybody

or we just let the rich get richer and the rest suffer.

What's the... APPLAUSE

What's the overall increase in the tax take that Labour,

if it comes to power, would expect?

What kind of percentage on the current tax take?

48 billion more...

What percent is it that of what comes in at the moment?

48 billion more, which is quite a small proportion of the total.

The point I'm making is that what we've got here is funding of

it through corporation tax, funding of it through some new taxes.

95%, 95% of the people of this country will pay no more in tax, VAT

or national insurance. The others will be asked to pay a bit more.

I think it's the right thing to do because it does gives us

a growing economy.

The figures for the country as a whole, for the economy as

a whole, is nearly a 10% increase in tax take by the Government.

It brings me to a question from Jack Rouse, if I may.

Jack Rouse, please.

Where is Jack Rouse?

Yes, speak away.

Hi, Jack.

Is Labour's manifesto a realistic wish list

or is it just a letter to Santa Claus?

APPLAUSE

I urge you to read it.

I think it is a serious and realistic document that

addresses the issues that many people in this country face.

We've been brave enough to put it out there, with all the

policies that are in it.

How we deal with the school funding crisis.

How we make sure pre-school, all children, two to four, get 30 hours

childcare per week or opportunities for pre-school play and education.

How we bring back the Educational Maintenance Allowance

so that youngsters who be would be deterred from staying on at

school or going on to get A-levels or other qualifications,

and that those who can get into university won't end up with debts

of 50-60,000 at the end of it.

This is nothing unusual in many other countries in the world.

I think it's time for us to invest in our future.

The other crisis I may mention, David, is the question of health,

the question of mental health and the question of social care.

If we don't address it, what happens?

What happens is, more people suffer.

What happens is, more women, usually,

give up work to care for those who cannot be cared for because

we're not putting enough money into it.

Those with a mental health crisis suffer alone and don't get

the help and support that they want.

We have to respect the needs of people and, frankly,

challenge all of us to say - if we want to live in

a society that genuinely cares for all, we've got to be prepared

to deal with issues of inequality and pay for it.

-I'm prepared to do that.

-OK.

JACK SPEAKS OFF-MIC

..it's a question of funding it.

I'm thinking of last time Labour were in Government, they left

a note at the Chancellor's office saying, "We've no money left."

APPLAUSE

What I would say is,

for the past seven years of austerity,

that austerity has hit public sector workers with a 1% cap.

It has hit all our schools and public services.

It has caused a housing crisis.

And, do you know what,

the very richest in our society have got richer.

There's been more and more tax giveaways at the top end and

more and more charges at the other end.

It's time to rebalance it.

Our manifesto is a serious, well thought-out document that I

believe is getting a lot of support and people are very excited

by the idea of how we can do things differently.

APPLAUSE The woman here, in the third row.

You say this manifesto is serious and well thought-out,

and you speak about creating an equal society,

free from racism and anti-Semitism. But how can I believe

a word of this when you, as party leader, have failed to expel one of

your own members, Ken Livingstone, for his anti-Semitic remarks?

APPLAUSE

There is no place for anti-Semitism anywhere in our society,

and certainly not in our party.

Members have been suspended. If they've committed any remarks..

But he's not been held to account.

..that can be seen to be of an anti-Semitic nature.

Those that have done that are suspended.

We have a process that is independent of me within the

party which investigations these and makes a decision on it.

I deplore racism in any form whatsoever.

The way in which the Jewish people have suffered down the centuries,

the Holocaust and all that went with it,

was the most appalling stain in the history of mankind.

And I believe we have to fight racism in any form

with every fibre of our being.

A society that cannot challenge racism is

a society that is heading for division.

I will not tolerate it in our party or anywhere else.

APPLAUSE Do you want to come back on that?

If it's something that's so important to you,

how can you suffice with only suspending him

for a short period of time? How is it not enough to expel him?

He has been suspended and further investigations may or may not

happen after the election. But he is suspended from membership.

But he is suspended so that the investigation can take place.

All right. The woman there, on the gangway. You.

-Yes, you.

-Me? Oh.

I heard you recently commented that black and ethnic minorities'

potential has been locked under the Conservatives

and you plan to free up and unlock it.

So I just want some clarification as to how exactly you plan to do it?

Sorry, I didn't fully hear the question,

there was a camera right in front of you at the time.

Sorry about that.

I said there was a comment that I read in the news about you

purporting that black and ethnic minorities' potential has been

locked under the Conservatives,

so I just want some clarification as to how you'd

free it up or unlock it or help in that regard?

The issues are of poverty in Britain,

the issues are of differential levels of spending in inner-city

areas compared to other areas and there are serious issues about

the number of young, black people, particularly young men,

who are part of the criminal justice system, end up in youth custody

or youth justice institutions,

or those that end up in mental health institutions.

I think we have to look very seriously at levels of racism

within our society.

If you like, racism that is almost of an institutionalised nature,

that has to be looked at.

And one of the issues we've put forward was,

consider how difficult it can be for somebody with an African name

or a Muslim name to get on a shortlist to get

an interview for a job, compared to others.

So one suggestion - it is a suggestion, it may become a policy -

is that we should have blind applications for jobs,

where there's no name involved, there's merely a description

of your skills and abilities and qualifications,

so there can be a fair assessment of that person.

Because we are a multiethnic,

multilingual, multicultural society.

If it doesn't treat everybody equally and give everybody a decent

chance, then we end up with poverty and discrimination and divisions.

I want to see a country that comes together and is not divided

by poverty or by discrimination.

APPLAUSE

We may come back to education and the economy in a moment.

But let's have this question from Adam Murgatroyd, please.

Adam Murgatroyd?

If Britain were under imminent threat from nuclear weapons,

how would you react?

I would do everything I can to ensure that any threat is

actually dealt with earlier on by negotiations and by talks.

So that we do adhere to our obligations

under the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty,

that we do encourage China in its work in trying to bring about

six-party talks, in resolving the issue in North Korea,

and we do follow the lead that President Obama took

in doing a deal with Iran that would result

in them not developing the nuclear capability.

I think the idea of anyone, ever, using a nuclear weapon,

anywhere in the world, is utterly appalling and terrible.

It would result in the destruction of the lives and communities

and environment for millions of people.

So I would be actively engaged to ensure

that danger didn't come about.

I also be very aware of other dangers that we face.

Cyber attacks hit our National Health Service

a couple of weeks ago,

the dreadful terrorist attack in Manchester indicates the danger

of individual acts of terrorism that can take lives.

We have to be secure here,

we have to protect our society and our country,

but we also have to engage in the rest of the world to make sure

we don't have huge, ungoverned spaces, such as in Libya,

which can become the basis of terrible events

that are going to take the lives of many other people.

We have to deal with those issues here and globally.

That is the function of a responsible government.

APPLAUSE

Your party is committed to renewing Trident,

are you saying there are no circumstances in which

you would use a nuclear weapon at all?