13/06/2016 Scotland 2016

After four long years, we might actually be on our way

to meet our challenging climate change targets.

We will get the latest news on climate change targets tomorrow

and there are strong indications Scotland will have met

Vote Leave says Brexit will mean Scotland gains

The First Minister calls that a fib and a half.

Scotland stands shoulder to shoulder with Orlando.

The attack is branded utterly evil by the Home Secretary.

At this point in the year, we pore over the news about annual

climate change targets, commiserating that once again,

There are strong indications we might actually have met our world

beating targets but that could be down to the way

To get a handle on all this, I caught up with Stuart Hazszeldine,

Professor of Carbon Capture at Edinburgh University.

It looks likely we are going to meet these targets. Good news for

Scotland? Yes, I think we have to welcome good news when it comes.

Reducing our carbon emissions is an essential thing to do for any

industrial country, to meet the climate targets, not just for

Scotland but the worldwide targets. Tierney, we have had trouble meeting

some of the detailed targets in the last few years but let us not beat

ourselves up to much, we have been successful since 1990. We used to

emit 80 million tonnes a year of carbon dioxide and in 2013, we

emitted 53 million tonnes, so we have reduced by 38% during that time

so that is good news. Good news but perhaps we might be eating these

targets because of changes to EU rules, is that correct? Well, we

have not seen the numbers yet but that is what the rumours are. The

way carbon emissions are counted is divided into two. There is the inner

lots and lots of emissions that we emit here but then chunky emissions

from factories and power stations they have to buy permits from the EU

and those are predicted each year in advance and reconcile afterwords

when we know what happened. That is probably the adjustment we're

talking about. What is happening in Scotland and in the rest of the UK

is, we are solving some of this problem by closing down our old

industry and that is good news and bad news of course because you had

to replace it with something to get people good jobs in the future. That

is maybe the easy thing to close down some of that industry but in

the future, whereas the power going to be coming from? Could do was

emissions start increasing through other means? That depends very much

what we do and so in Scotland we have taken the easy steps, we have

had power stations fuelled by coal at the end of their life. We have

got to avoid rebuilding power stations which emit carbon from gas

or coal so you could build low emission power stations perhaps in

the future. We could build more renewable energies, we could carry

on relying on the nuclear powers we have already got but all of this is

small part of our overall carbon emissions because when everybody

thinks about emissions, we just think, we have done really well, but

that is just electricity. Electricity is only about the team %

of the whole energy we use so we have barely started. The big things

are to carbonise heat so that burning gas in your House for

example in its carbon dioxide to get to your target, we will have to

change that. Driving cars which emit petrol or diesel fumes, we will have

to change those two electric cars. We will have to look after our big

industry where we have a big opportunity to change into a low

carbon centre because they will start paying extra emissions

penalties from 2021 because of the European innocence regulation so

people have not looked that far ahead properly yet, so we need to

look ahead and take this opportunity is because they are a good way to

create new business and lots of wealth in Scotland. Those are some

of the next steps but those can be quite challenging for people? Yes,

these are all challenging things but it is important to realise that we

can make good incomes out of this so it is rather like the disposing of

domestic waste, filling your wheelie bin by lots of rubbish and it got

taken away once a week and got put in at a call. Then someone had the

idea, we will charge you for disposing this waste and everyone

said, this is impossible, but now, we recycle three quarters of that

and the cost of the waste going to landfill is ?80 a tonne. It is

actually created lots of recycling and new business so cleaning up

carbon can be the same. For example, if we doubled the Forest area of

Scotland, which is quite feasible, that could take 5 million tonnes a

year out of the atmosphere of carbon dioxide and we could use those wood

products for a making things, building materials and that creates

a lot more employment in rural areas of Scotland.

Tomorrow we'll be hearing from the Scottish government

but tonight I'm joined by two Climate Change spokepeople -

Mark Ruskell for the Scottish Greens and in our Edinburgh studio,

The Greens are a new force in the Scottish parliament and good news

about climate change targets for 2014 Games Mac I think it is a mixed

picture. What we have seen is a quirk of accountancy, I think, which

will show that Scotland has met its target at last. We have seen some

good progress so cuts in emissions from electricity and from waste

because of recycling, but we also see the ailing sectors as well. We

need to have decent public transport put in place to provide an

alternative so we can finally reduce emissions from transport. We need to

get to grips with making our homes more efficient and there are

opportunities coming up in the next session of the Scottish Parliament

but we need to make that as ambitious as possible so we can

really get the reductions and emissions but also create the jobs

and get people out of fuel poverty. That is where the real benefit lies.

The transformation that we need. Ambitious climate change targets,

they have now been met. Good news for the people of Scotland after

Labour called for more to be done, it looks we have done is? In a sense

it has been done, yes, you are right. Let us not be churlish about

this. It seems the rumours will be right, but we will meet our targets

tomorrow, but we have to be very careful about this because a change

is really needed right across Scotland and across all parts of

society and the Scottish Government needs to lead on this with a report

on policy proposals on the new climate change act which I believe

is going to be brought in by the new Cabinet Secretary in the autumn.

Having been to the Paris summit myself, and met with community

groups from across the world, there is a palpable sense in which there

is an obligation that we must, in developed countries such as Scotland

and as part of the UK, we must lead on these issues in the future.

Claudia talks about this step change and Stuart was pointing out some of

the things that need to be looked at. All very well for government to

legislate but a lot of it comes down to our own individual behaviour?

Yes, but it is the role of the government to make choices as easy

as possible. If you look at public transport infrastructure, we have

seen the success of -- successful governments through to the SNP now

failing to take the right decisions on public transport infrastructure.

Unless we get the investment in real roots, unless we have publicly bus

service which runs in the public interest, we're not going to be able

to divide the choices that people desperately need. If you don't have

the right infrastructure in your community to safely cycle to walk or

school or to work, then Frankie, you will drive. It is the role of

government to ensure that that infrastructure is in place and it is

making these choices easy for people to make other than hard. It can be

difficult for governments. Previous UK Labour government urged people to

buy and run the diesel cars and it looks like they are far more

polluting than petrol car is so people to train -- change their

behaviour, it has to be that they have to receive the right

information? Certainly and we have moved on from that. I give you an

example of the sort of adventurous policies that are happening in other

countries. Norway has just put forward a policy that says that by

2025 it will not be possible to buy a fuel car in Norway and if we are

to have that sort of a step change in Scotland, we need to be careful

that we work with businesses, manufacturers and with communities

to take those sorts of issues forward and to answer your question

specifically about what can people do, I think it is the role of

government but it is also the role right at across society and having

been a teacher, I have seen that young pupils can certainly be

eco-warriors and go and persuade their parents of the value, but we

must remember that climate justice is not something that the Scottish

Government should only be doing in sub-Saharan Africa, it is over here

as well so that we don't leave any communities behind and that is a

Scottish Labour view, we must take everyone with us on this quest.

Future targets, should they be quite easy to meet or should they be very

challenging? We need to look at that as a new climate bill coming into

the parliament, we sit here on the edge of Europe with fantastic

renewable resources, we should be an energy exporter so having higher

climate change targets makes sense, not just the environment but also

for the economy. We're talking about quitting jobs. Thank you both very

much for joining us. The Lord Chancellor

and Brexiteer Michael Gove has been back on home turf,

at his parents' house in the north east, and today

campaigning in Glasgow. He and his Vote Leave supporters say

Scotland could have greater control over immigration if

the UK leaves the EU. As Andrew Black reports,

the idea is based on Scotland having a distinct immigration policy

like the Isle of Man. In a tiny island, there is a whole

world of beauty and interest. This was the Isle of Man in 1959, a time

when the European Union was beginning to take shape. The island

never joined the EU but it did develop special relations with what

is known as the European economic area. Those arguing for Britain to

leave the EU said that has allowed them to have a more selective

immigration system which is argued could be a model for Scotland. One

Brexit campaigner, the UK Justice Secretary, was in Glasgow today to

argue that Scotland could get greater control over immigration in

the result of a vote to Leave. It seems unfair you have an immigration

policy that discriminates against book who come from outside the EU.

If we leave the EU, we could have a policy that could shape the needs of

Scotland's economy and the needs of the whole of the UK. Michael Gove

says his plan for an Australian style system is what the SNP

advocated when it said: Nicola Sturgeon, testing out the

latest virtual reality here at this technology company, said his

argument was as far removed from reality as you can get. I have

argued long and hard about this but we have seen government is saying

now to that. But to leave the EU doesn't magically change that. He

might want to pretend he is on the same side as me but Michael Gove is

one of the passionate advocates of a new boat in the UK referendum. How

do these immigration arguments stack up? There is no reason why Brexit

would facilitate so I am not sure what the logical link is between

Brexit and this proposal, this is something the government could

propose whether or not the UK was in the EU. Scotland could have a

different system to England so I don't see how that is contingent on

EU membership or not. Immigration has been one of the biggest and most

controversial issue in this referendum campaign and in the

run-up to voting day on the 23rd of June, it looks like that is how

things will continue. representing the Scottish Vote Leave

campaign is Tom Harris, and in our Westminster studio

is the Head of the European Movement First of all, Tom, where on earth

did this idea come from? In the Smith commission there was no

promise of immigration policy for Scotland, in fact the SNP have been

campaigning to get post study work visas for Scotland and now we get

this promise. As you rightly say immigration has

been a big part of this campaign and people, especially employers, have

expressed some concerns that if we have control over borders and there

are low levels of education then how will we filled the skills gap? It is

the decision to leave the EU and the negotiation that follow that boat

that gives Scottish ministers an opportunity to engage in that issue

and make the case for a Scottish Visa scheme. It is true that the UK

Government hasn't given up that much of the hearing so far but the reason

I am raising this is that it is a vital opportunity for Scottish

ministers and all of the devolved ministers from all of the different

nations to get involved in the negotiations post the referendum and

make a case for this because it is a unique opportunity that will not

present itself again. I think Scottish ministers are pretty

sickened by the Lord Chancellor from the Westminster government coming

here and dangling the case of a family who could be deported back to

Australia through UK Government rules saying that they might be able

to stay but not under the current rules. It does not really seem right

or fair, does it? I understand the cynicism. It is a simple point, if

you have got to taps, are hot and hold -- a hot and cold, and you

cannot turn off the hot tap then you have two turn of the other tab

instead. If we have unlimited immigration from the EU and we need

to control it and the only way to control it is with non-EU

immigration, it isn't much of a choice. Perhaps this is a fair idea

if Scotland got control over immigration. First of all, the Isle

of Man is not a parallel, it is a Crown dependency, not part of the

United Kingdom. Scotland is part of the United Kingdom and at the moment

immigration is a reserved power. The only circumstances were if the

United Kingdom were to decide to leave the European Union in which

immigration would become the responsibility of Cardiff, Belfast

or Edinburgh would be if the united Kingdom government, the Westminster

government, was willing to devolve that responsibility to all of these

constituent nations of the United Kingdom. This idea has been floating

around for some weeks among those who want us to leave the European

Union. At one stage they were arguing that automatically, legally,

automatically these powers would transfer and that was shown to be

completely irrelevant. Perhaps the problem for your side is that boat

and leave our actually pressing all of the right buttons. They have hit

the sweet spot here and the Sun newspaper in England has been saying

that they will come out and back Brexit. Rupert Murdoch owns the

paper and he has said that this is our last chance to remove ourselves

from the undemocratic Brussels machine and it is time to take it.

It is a problem for your side, isn't it? Well, hold the front page! The

sun wants Britain to come out of the European Union. Everyone knows that

has been the policy of Rupert Murdoch for ever. The real point, if

you want to get onto the substance, never mind the illegality of what is

being proposed, the real point is that we now have a lot of ugly

language. Those who want to come out have given up any reference to the

economy, as --, any reference to security Britain's place in the

world. The sole issue on which they are trying to get a vote in their

favour is based on immigration and, quite frankly, if I can echo the

words of the Archbishop of Canterbury, with so much credibility

being given by the out campaign to Mr Phil Raj, then I am afraid that

what is being said is verging on racism. -- Mr Nigel Farage. In the

long term the kind of language which has been used in this country as

part of this campaign could have deep and long-lasting impact on race

relations within the United Kingdom. Those are strong words. I will let

you pick up on that. Verging on racism, really, from your side of

the campaign? I am not going to get into the gutter with Menzies

Campbell. It is just a smear. What he said earlier about the claim that

believe campaigners said that immigration powers would be

automatically devolved is he has not been paying attention once more.

There are extra powers that the Scottish parliament will get when we

leave the EU, fisheries and agriculture, what we are seeing here

is not about immigration powers but about work powers and employment. We

did have the fresh talent initiative so there is precedent for the

Scottish Parliament in coordination with the UK ministers, taking some

of those powers to benefit the economy. He says we have not been

saying anything about the economy but this is a hard and fast proposal

that he is not giving the time of day two. But what you are saying is

perhaps a bit illusory. You were sitting in the hot seat yesterday

and of course if the UK has access to the single market, we must allow

free movement then, so we don't have that kind of control? The Isle of

Man does not allow free movement. It has a relationship with the European

Union economic area and there is absolutely no reason at all in the

current political circumstance where we could not develop exactly the

same kind of opt out and relationship with the European

economic area. All the kind of pessimism that we have from Menzies

Campbell is not relevant to this debate. Let us pick up on the point

that he will not get into the gutter with you. On that basis you will not

get into the gutter with the Archbishop of Canterbury. I think it

is a legitimate question to ask whether the language that has been

used in recent days in support of bringing the United Kingdom out of

the European Union does or does not board on racism. I think... What is

it I have said that you find so offensive? The language that has

been used by Nigel Farage. I am not him, I about my language? I am

complaining about the attitude... It is a smear. Complaining that

attitude of the people who support the campaign to leave the European

Union. There was appointed a previous answer, if, but only if,

the United Kingdom Parliament was willing to make further adjustment

to the relationship between London and Edinburgh, then there could be a

scheme of the kind you described, but it is a political decision, not

a legal decision in any sense whatsoever. A final right of reply.

Of course it is a legal decision. We need to encourage the Scottish

ministers to be at the negotiations, batting for Scotland and getting

concessions and a new deal for the first time in over 40 years. It is a

marvellous opportunity for Scotland to have its voice heard. I am sorry

we have to leave it there. Thank you very much for joining me.

Now, security at public events in the UK will be reviewed

by the police in the wake of the attack on a nightclub in Orlando.

Theresa May, the Home Secretary, made the announcement

in parliament as she condemned the attack as utterly evil.

Solidarity vigils have been held around the world

by the LGBT community and their supporters.

Huw Williams reports from Glasgow's George Square.

Members of the public, activists, civic leaders and sports teams

gathered to stand in silence, light candles, and leave flags and

flowers. A piper played laments, and those who had come reflected on why

they wanted to be here. People go to gay clubs and bars around the city

all the time and have a great time at all of these people were doing

was trying to have a good time and someone took obviously offence to

that and did what they did and so it is a very sad time. I think it shows

that we're all standing together and we're not going to give in to fear

or hatred or anything like that. Stand together. As the rainbow flag

flies at half-mast from city chambers at least 600 people had

gathered for a vigil in George Square in memory of 49 people shot

dead at a gay nightclub at Orlando in Florida. From some who shared the

shooter's Afghan heritage, a keenness to distance themselves from

what he did. These were all innocent human beings who are out there to

enjoy and have a good time and secondly because this man, the

brutal killer, or the murderer, he was an Afghan origin and we are

Afghans and we are here to show solidarity, no matter if they are

gay or lesbian or transgender or whatever their background are.

People often don't realise that low-grade homophobia is happening to

all of us, every person who is gay experiences homophobia every day.

This kind of terrible event is one of those things that is bringing us

out on the streets to say the time has come to challenge that at a high

level, at political level, and at a low level, schools and institutions

on mosques, wherever homophobia is found it has to be worked on and it

has to be changed. The crowd applauded as to police Scotland

officers joined leaving tributes. Organisers said today's event was

designed to show support for LGBT people around the world and provide

an opportunity to mourn with the community. A similar event takes

place in Edinburgh on Wednesday. And with me tonight to pick up

on that story are two journalists, Marianne Taylor from the Herald,

and Keiran Andrews from The Courier. Some quite remarkable scenes in

George Square. We have got the police and the Muslim community

joining in support of the LGBT community. Yes, it is excellent to

see obviously. Everyone would want to join in how else can you respond

to something like this other than to want to show that coming together of

people. I think there are so many strands really in this story. There

is an anti-gay strand and there may or may not be an Islamic

fundamentalist strand and mental health strands but the strand that

is going through it and goes through all of these incidents is that you

are able to buy high-powered weapons in the USA. Anyone is able to go

into a and get ammunition, assault rifles, and carry out things like

this. This is the one thing that is the same in each of these incidents.

We will get on to gun control in just a second and we will pick up on

that. Remarkable scenes across the world, what can people do in a way?

We have seen similar scenes in London as well. This kind of show of

solidarity that you have seen here and across the world today is very

important, particularly for the gay community across the world. As we

saw there homophobia is not something that has been tackled

perhaps as well as other cases of discrimination that we see in public

life. It is the one kind of instance of discrimination where there are

types of languages and phrases that people can still get away with that

still sneak in unchallenged and I think that is incredibly dangerous.

It leads to, this is a very extreme example, but it opens the door to

that sort of violence and attacks on many levels. I think that is the key

message to hear, that is not acceptable in any form whatsoever.

Just to pick up on the point about gun control in the United States. A

key election issue. Yes, it is. It was interesting to see Hillary

Clinton said today that anyone who is being looked at at the FBI maybe

they shouldn't be able to go up and buy a gun off the shelf, maybe you

should be able to go up and buy a gun the shelf in America, it was

something that Barack Obama tried to tackle and he was knocked back, both

on his own party had a majority in the house and he had no chance when

the Republicans took over after that, but we saw in the aftermath of

the Dunblane message here that within a year, there was much

tighter controls and tight control and I just do not see that happening

in the USA. Barack Obama was on that podium lamenting gun controls in the

United States and I think you call them crazy, the way that extremes

can get hold of them. The most powerful man in the world and what

has been happening? What else can he say? He goes up again and again and

again. The National Rifle Association are so influential, so

powerful, it's very hard for us in Europe to understand the influence

they have in a nation which sees its right, it has a right to own a gun.

We find this absolutely astounding that it is in their constitution and

their lobbyists are so influential that most people think that's true.

We think it's obvious that they have to have some sort of control after

incident after incident but what I would also say is that nothing

happened after 20 young children being absolutely massacred at a

primary school, if nothing happened after that, I can't see anything

happening here. Just briefly, Donald Trump argues that people need guns

to protect themselves. Of course he does, it's a perverse logic from a

perverse man and I can't believe he is a candidate to be President of

the United States of America. Just arming more people, all it means is

that you escalate the danger and you escalate the violence and if

something happens then more people die. Thank you both very much for

reflecting that story tonight for us.

Shelley's back tomorrow night, usual time.

So do please join her then, bye-bye.

We could talk about some of these sights I'd like to see.

I really want to see Buckingham Palace, Tower Bridge.

Oh! Canary Wharf. Oh, and the Houses of Parliament.