20/09/2016 Scotland 2016

What have we got against fruit and veg?

We are smoking and drinking less, but why aren't our diets improving?

A survey of the health of the nation suggests advice on healthy

Kezia Dugdale's smiling - as the Scottish Labour party gets

more decision making power at the party's ruling body.

And is the meaning of Brexit coming into focus?

The Scottish Health survey out today had some encouraging news -

There are fewer binge drinkers and smokers but more

Most of us are exercising - but almost a third of Scots are not

Neither is our apparent aversion to fruit and veg.

Aileen Clarke has been trying to find out why the vast majority

of us don't eat the recommended five portions a day.

Take a look around Scotland's cities. The landscape is changing.

All high-rises are being pulled down. Smart low-rise houses with

gardens appearing in their places. But there are some trends which

don't appear to be changing. We are still more likely to have deep-fried

food... Ben Boyle vegetables like broccoli

-- than Boyle. The latest research shows that only

around one fifth of adults met the five-day fruit and veg

recommendation, and 11% of adults said that they did not eat any fruit

or vegetables. Children are even worse, only 12% of

children had their five a day while 7% said that they did not eat any

fruit or vegetables at all. So most of us in Scotland are not

getting off either day. But that comes at a time where fruit

and veg appear to be at the forefront of the supermarket price

war is. Look at this.

I have my greens, bananas, onions, fun size apples, plums, two tens of

tomatoes and a tenor of peas, all for less than ?5.

But that does not appear to be in courage in us to eat more fruit and

vegetables -- tins. Unravelling why we eat what we do is complex,

according to this expert. Price is only one factor to consider

when trying to change people's habits. It's a cultural change but

we have to tackle it and think of ways outside the box to encourage

people to buy fruit and vegetables, and to cook with it, particularly

vegetables, eat it raw and get a liking of it.

Snack with it. At the same time, this is the reality, it cannot just

be making those things a better price but we have to make unhealthy

stuff harder to buy and more expensive.

It has to be a two-way thing. Let's have a go and see if I can interest

anybody in my fruit and vegetables. I have a two-year-old at home. We do

it as a family to make sure he's getting all of the vitamins he

needs. Looking at my shopping... Would you be up for the broccoli?

Yes. Potatoes and plums? Yes. Mangetout? I love that. You are

happy with all of that? Is there anything I can interest you in? Do

you do plums? No, I don't like them. I love broccoli. Mangetout? No.

Don't you want to try it? I don't like them! What about one of these?

Green beans, ie them. -- I read them. I don't like plums. How are

you making up your five a day? Bananas and grapes, tomatoes and

cucumbers, lettuce... Onions... Everything really. But not a fan of

broccoli? No, not broccoli. This project in Glasgow is tried to

approach the healthy eating message from the soil up, encouraging people

to grow their own and cook with it. There are barriers to be broken

down. We have been sleepwalking into this way of shopping in the

supermarket. We have lost contact with how food

is produced and how it should be produced. Plenty to tempt the taste

buds here. But if you are still more likely to push cauliflower aside and

go for chips, if you wondering, chips don't count as one of your

five a day! Getting her shopping done at the

same time as well! I asked Linda Bauld,

who's Professor of Health Policy at the University of Stirling,

what needs to be done We know it's an average of three

portions of fruit and vegetables a day that adults in Scotland are

currently consuming, well below what we recommend. I think there are a

number of things there, we had to communicate to people about the

health benefits of eating healthily and we need to make it easier for

them to make healthy choices. So, at the moment in Scotland, we have

multibuy promotions of unhealthy foods. We have to give people the

right information and get the government to take action as well.

As we saw in that report, vegetables are plentiful and easy to buy. There

are more supermarkets than ever and vegetables have never been cheaper?

It's true but some of the other products are cheaper than that as

well. I think some of the promotions we have surrounding fizzy drinks,

let's keep in mind we have some of the highest fizzy drink consumption

in Western Europe, and some of the foods that we buy are very high in

salt and sugar, for example. They are very accessible. And there

is the marketing of them. If vegetables are accessible and

affordable, they are not the products we see promoted on our

televisions, are they? We are all aware of the dangers of smoking and

how it affects your lungs, and we are aware of the dangers of drinking

too much and how it affects your liver, why don't we make the

connection between a poor diet and what it does to our waistlines? Well

actually, people don't necessarily have a good understanding of the

impact of a poor diet and health. We did a study with Cancer Research

UK, three in four Scots did not realise that obesity was related to

cancer. Smoking is an interesting contrast.

We had decades of health campaigning but it is not just about telling

people that smoking is harmful, we had smoke-free laws, a ban on

tobacco marketing, higher prices, and a lot of concerted government

action. What we call comprehensive action

but we have not seen any of that on diet and obesity related factors.

You think we need more legislation, what would you propose? A sugar tax?

The Westminster government is consulting on that. We were quite

disappointed with their strategy. The Scottish Government will publish

a baby city strategy, I want to see action on promotions and marketing

-- OP -- obesity.

Learning what we have done with tobacco. It is about striking a

balance but we are looking for more ambition from the Scottish

Government. Tackling obesity in terms of health consequences has

cost the NHS in Scotland well above ?300 million a year, we don't want

to have to deal with that in future. In some senses it is easy to tax

alcohol and attacks tobacco but as you say, everybody needs to eat.

If you put too high a tax on food it will penalised everyone. What we

want to see is a playing field where we benefit or make the healthier

products more affordable. And make the unhealthy products less

affordable. People are really influenced by

price. Nowadays, a of people don't have a lot of money in pockets.

-- a lot of people. We want to change the environment

and if we can do that, it makes it easier for people and their

families. We saw the push back over the years from the tobacco industry.

The food industry, is it likely to offer a opposition to government

legislation? Yes, there are a lot of retailers

doing responsible things, but at the end of the day they are interested

in profits and shareholders. They will try to market products and make

people and consumers consume as much as they can. Portion sizes in

Scotland have gone up significantly in recent years, I imagine we will

see the same tactics. The government has irresponsibility

to protect the public's health and strike a balance between what the

industry wants to do in some circumstances.

Looking at this survey on the whole, do you think our attitude to looking

after ourselves is getting better? I think some of the messages are ready

positive. Look at the reduction in second-hand

smoke exposure in children, down to 6%, a target already met.

We are definitely making progress. Half of the adult population in

Scotland have a chronic condition and obesity is still rising. It is

not just about people taking responsibility for their own health

by the government taking action, giving information and changing

things. That will improve the health of Scotland. We have a long way to

go competitive some of our countries who are neighbours, and there are

definitely things we can do to change that.

Now, one man who loves his fruit 'n' veg is Jeremy Corbyn.

With just hours to go until the deadline for ballot papers

in the Labour leadership contest, the embattled Labour leader could be

forgiven for wanting to retire to his well-tended allotment

But the question of who should lead the party isn't the only matter

Labour's National Executive Committee has been locked in intense

debate over how the party should be run.

I'm joined now by Johanna Baxter who sits on the NEC....

More than eight hours of negotiations today, and precious

little agreement. This does not really bode well for future party

unity, does it? It was a very long meeting. But a number of significant

changes were actually agreed at the meeting. I think that does spell

very good things for party unity. One of those was about giving the

Scottish Labour Party greater autonomy. One of the things I argued

for for the entire duration of my time on the NEC for the last six

years is that leaders of the Scottish and Welsh parties have a

place at the National executive committee.

With full voting rights. So, we recognise the devolved settlement

that exists across the UK. And we got agreement on that today.

It is a massive step forward, and what the NEC will now do is put that

proposal to the Labour Party conference taking place next week,

and I hope the conference are behind that and agree the proposal going

forward. And it also means the Scottish party has control over who

is going to stand for Parliament as well? Absolutely. Obviously the

Scottish party has full control over who stands in the administration of

those procedures. This also ensures that the Scottish party has full

control over the administration of Westminster selections and north of

the border, recognising that Windows representatives are selected and

hopefully elected to Westminster that they form part of the UK Labour

MP representation in the House of Commons, so we put forward a united

front and we fully support a strengthening United Kingdom. But in

terms of selecting those candidates, that is fully in the hands of the

Scottish Labour Party. Mostly unanimous agreement over that, in

the past there have been complaints by Scottish Labour that London was

holding them back. There were certainly I think it was support in

terms of selection of candidates, being in the control of the Scottish

Labour Party. There was some dispute and there was some debate about the

positions on the NEC, but not in respect of whether or not Scotland

should have them, but because some colleagues wanted to review the

composition of the NEC as a whole and unfortunately I think some of

that is down to the fact that there are now some wings of the party who

want to polarise debate between the left and the right of the party and

actually this is not an issue of left and right, it is what is best

for Scotland and the Scottish Labour Party and in the end the vast

majority of colleagues agreed that this was in the best interests of

Scottish Labour and I'm very, very pleased. The deputy leader Tom

Watson wants to go back to the system where MPs elect people onto

the Shadow Cabinet but what is wrong with Jeremy Corbyn taking those

decisions? He is the Democratic leader of the party. In the past

enemy has supported elections for the Shadow Cabinet amongst the PLP

and I would agree with Jeremy that this would be a very good thing to

bring back but ultimately this is about trying to unite the Labour

Party post the leadership election and whoever is the leader after

Saturday has a massive job to do in terms of uniting the party. If

selections to the Shadow Cabinet hello some MPs who did resign from

the Shadow Cabinet to come back and work under a reader that perhaps

they didn't vote for them perhaps it would be in the interests of party

unity for the leadership to get behind that. Of these MPs who

plotted against Mr Corbyn if he is elected again, they should get fully

behind the leader? Listen I don't know what it was plotting, to be

honest that it was wasn't very successful, but whatever the result

on Saturday, there has to be a way forward in terms of uniting our

party. I think there is a responsibility, whoever is everyday

after Saturday, to hold out an olive branch and Jeremy said that he has

been growing one of those in his Westminster offices so if it is him,

he has a branch there ready to hand out and I think if selections to the

Shadow Cabinet are going to do it then he should get behind that

because it is in everybody's interests for the party to unite.

Well listening to that here in the studio is Rhea Wolfson,

who's been elected to join the NEC, also representing constituency

parties, and takes up her role after the Labour conference.

She's a member of the Momentum movement and supports Jeremy Corbyn.

This idea of an autonomous Scottish Labour Party, is it something you

support? It is something that would be incredibly important for

efficiency and would improve confidence that the Scottish Labour

Party has in the governing of local groups. I think there is a lot of

positive news. One part of that agreement is that a front-page MSP

should be permanently on the NEC and that person should be nominated by

the leader, Kenya Dugdale at the moment, the thing that is a good

idea? I love the concern about how this has come about. I think they're

absolutely should be an official Scottish drugs and, it's just so

happens that we have billions from Wales and it is a coincidence that

we have a Scottish and Wales red this time around. That does not

usually happen. I think there should be a dedicated Scottish

representative and actually we have to look beyond Scotland and Wales

and look at the regions. However I have a problem with the fact that

this is someone who is appointed so they will not be elected onto the

NEC or accountable to anyone. Right now the situation is you have your

CLP wrecks, it considers the Labour Party Redken, over 85,000 people

fought it for myself. We have trading in rats accountable to trade

unions, PLP Reds directly accountable to the Parliamentary

Labour Party. Sought nothing to do with the fact that Kenya Dugdale

opposes Jeremy Corbyn and you don't want to hand over power? I think it

would be naive to say there is the political context of this, but

actually I don't want it to overshadow the fact that it is

important to have a stronger Scottish voice. This means that we

will not have a directly elected Scottish representative on the NEC.

I think that is a shame. Unity is surely important, Tom Watson as I

mentioned has this idea of going back to the system where MPs have

mercy on sits in the Shadow Cabinet. Do you think that is a good idea?

Again it is a veritable lyrical context. The people proposing this

have not always been so supportive of having this directly elected

Shadow Cabinet. I am concerned again about the motives behind this, that

it is not about internal party democracy, which is important to

myself. It could help heal divisions, many MPs are in the cold

and fuel under attack by the new members. This could be a positive

thing but I am concerned it could be used to animate Jeremy 's mandate or

the manager or is elected on Saturday. One way to reach out would

be to have analytical college for the shadow capital members elected

by the Parliamentary Labour Party and some appointed. That is one way,

a potential compromise we could look at. I think unity is incredibly

important but I think we have to look at the context. Jeremy Corbyn

has gone one stage further and his suggesting that perhaps the wider

membership should have some say over who sits in the Cabinet. Isn't that

a mistake in that the directly elected MPs have a mandate, they are

the ones who care about Labour getting into power, Harley Berberis

well-qualified enough -- are the members well-qualified enough to

decide who gets into the cap is? I do not think this is the distinctly

should be making, ultimately the PLP are not elected to the Shadow

Cabinet, but if the past is that they think they should. It is an

interesting conversation to have, having a one person one vote for the

Shadow Cabinet but it is an interesting conversation and

anything that gets power to the members, I at least support looking

into it. Our momentum members sincere about unity and the party?

Will you hold out hands to those who disagree with you? Certainly are in

most momentum members I encounter a serious about the Labour Party and

understand the necessity to have unity in order to be governing in

2020, which is vitally important. Those Scottish parliament autonomy

proposals must go to conference, will momentum members vote in favour

of that? The Scottish economy once, there will be a question raised

around the fact that the retail rents in Scotland and Wales will not

be accountable to anyone. So that's now. Thank you.

The politicians have struggled to define exactly what that means.

So, at a sell-out conference in Edinburgh today,

Our political correspondent, Andrew Kerr, was there.

It looms over all political discussions, at this conference, in

the capital, experts brought the learning knowledge and guesswork to

attempt to chart a path. What is the Prime Minister 's plan? A lot of

this is not in her direct control, a lot of this is about how she gets

out from the government and the plans but you must look at the fact

that there are elections in other countries in the EU in 2017 have

other priorities. These negotiations once we kick them off are not in our

own hands. And then there is a discussion within the UK. So could

access to the single market be a red line for the Scottish Government as

the prospect of another referendum comes into focus? It is difficult to

identify redlines that is certainly a priority in the negotiation that

the First Minister has set aside, alongside some others like

guaranteeing some of the social protections. What I think may happen

is if the former Brexit -- form of Brexit does not allow for these then

I think not only will it bring the issue of independence back onto the

table but short of that the devolution settlement itself. At the

conference, the European committee convener John McAlpine said Nicola

Sturgeon has put independence on the back burner while focusing on

getting the best Brexit deal. The conference chair gave his

predictions after an interesting little journey. I am much closer to

being a supporter of independence but the SNP in Scotland has more

work to do. I would like to think there is a way forward that focuses

on the kind of society Scotland wants to be, a vision of the future.

If we leave the EU on bad terms for a future Scotland and would then

that would be the trigger for some people to say they would rather be

in the EU than the UK. Ultimately, a lot of questions are not many

answers. This has been difficult, you can muddle through

constitutionally for several years and have one settlement for Scotland

and one for the rest of the UK. We do not have a written positive, we

fudge things. That has worked well so far but it has become difficult

to do it in the UK. There has been a call for clarity particularly with

the EU. Brexit means Brexit but three months on from the vote to

leave the EU no one is quite sure what that means, not even the Prime

Minister is clear at this conference. Perhaps we need to wait

another three years before the full appropriations are realised.

Well to discuss that and the rest of today's stories I'm joined

by the journalist Katie Grant and by the Evening Times' political

Brexit means Brexit, we are no further forward. We are, one half of

the population has forgotten about it and the other half is getting

quite cross. One of the interesting is going to happen, and I might be

wrong, so as Theresa May's prime ministerial time goes on people full

of vim and vigour at the start, if it doesn't materialise in any way at

all then her, it will be interesting to see whether her power slightly

diminishes in the heart was Brexit ears say we should just say we are

off, trigger article 50 and we are off. This possibly might mean Boris

John and on. Whether the star begins to shine again. The interesting that

might won in the Conservative Party as a result of this food while we

are all muddling around. -- as a result of this vote. Will Scotland

get much they say, Stewart, because the result was clear. The May has a

mandate to get us out of the EU. That might not said Nicola Sturgeon

when it comes to free movement of labour. The language from Theresa

May is certainly that Scotland will play a role and Nicola Sturgeon

wants to play a role but I conceded to them on a collision course,

especially when it comes to the key issues south south of the border,

controls on immigration. Trees may spoke about it today that country

should have the right to control the borders the sea is playing up that

side of it and Nicola Sturgeon last week said that the least worst

option is membership of the single market, not just access to it, so

the two of them can't meet together. They are on a collision course. The

Labour leadership contest, the ballot papers have to be in by

midday tomorrow. Katie, do you think it is a certainty that Jeremy Corbyn

will win? So many certainties have been overturned recently but I think

it is pretty much a certainty. The sad thing about the Labour Party now

is that it increasingly looks like medieval chat about how many angels

can you get on the head of a pin. Look at everything going on in the

world, eight hours of what is clearly ludicrous discussion about

things which shall be as interested in and your previous speaker

although she knew her stuff they well, you're sort of thinking, these

people are accountable to those people and those who plan

accountable to other people, you think this is really not the sort of

stuff which should be convulsing the Labour Party when there is so much

other stuff going on. The whole thing has been a disaster. He win

the election has been conducted has been so bad for the Labour Party,

which is a tragedy for a representative democracy. Stuart,

Ian not think this might settle things? If Mr Corbyn is elected

again then he might have an even worse something majority. Doesn't

that settlers? You would think it should but the fact that they were

debating whether to allow elections to the Shadow Cabinet, again, take

that power away from the leader, that seems to be a direct bid to

undermine Jeremy Corbyn, knowing he will win again. To take some of the

power away from him, it is only five years since the change their mind on

that again. I am not too sure he will get support. I think he's doing

the right thing by putting the party on an election footing, if there's

one thing that should unite a party it is the prospect of a general

election. If that doesn't bring the party together then nothing will.

You has said that about putting the party on an election footing. Do you

think you serious? John McDonnell on the BBC said we have to make changes

and we have to listen to some of the old hands on the party and get

advice from them. I think Jeremy Corbyn is intent on uniting the

party can buy -- considering everyone agrees with him. Labour is

no longer a broad church, it is becoming increasingly a narrow track

but they only listen to each other so it is a echo chamber for the

Corbyn fans and they feel that they are absolutely in the ascendant. He

may put the Labour Party on an election footing but to win an

election you need to get more than the people who are shouting for

Jeremy or think Jeremy Corbyn is a site. You need more than those

people. It is quite another thing to produce a party party that can win

an election. Good news recently on smoking and drinking but not on our

diet. Not on mental health, either, especially with young people.

Opposition parties will use this as a stick to beat the SNP but in the

mental health issue, it is something that has been missing from the

discussion today. One of the things that I have noticed speaking to

people and communities in Glasgow and the West is one of the things

that lead to anxiety and depression and feeling powerless has been the

welfare reforms over the last 45 years. That plays a huge part in

people's mental health and how empowered they feel and I think that

is something that should be discussed. It is the root of some of

these problems. Surely Katie that is one of the great white people are

getting enough fruit and veg? That is right and a lot of the things

said today where, they have been said many thanks nothing came as a

great surprise that one of the things I thought was interesting was

that the stuff about teeth. 23% of women I think it is between 55 and

64 don't have any of their own teeth. That is an extraordinary

statistic in a western democracy where we have food and we are not

deprived of dental care. And I think the stuff about teeth often gets

ignored and I think that is also a big test of how we are. We focus on

obesity, but let's look at the teeth. Americans were right, we have

bad teeth! Thank you both. Shelly is back again

tomorrow night, usual time. So do join her then,

bye bye.