15/07/2012 Sunday Politics East Midlands

Coming up on Sunday Politics in the East Midlands:

a Tory MP it warns the Lib Dems not to cut up rough over boundary

changes. Will European rules save our pig

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1793 seconds

Hello, I'm Marie Ashby and my guests in the East Midlands this

week are two of our members of the European Parliament, Lib Dem Bill

Newton Dunn and UKIP's Derek Clark. Coming up:

Is the Eurozone crisis really a good opportunity for us to

renegotiate the terms of our EU membership?

And our farmers say the EU is making a pig of a job of enforcing

new rules on animal welfare. First, seven of our region's

Conservative MPs this week put the knife into Lib Dem ambitions to

reform the House of Lords. One of them, Andrew Bridgen, is with me

now. You've made your point. But at what

cost? David Cameron is apparently incensed and the Lib Dems are

warning that if the Tories don't come good with Lords Reform,

they'll withdraw support for those boundary changes your party so

desperately wants. Yes, I don't think you can give in

to blackmail. Is that how you would describe it? Absolutely. The

boundary changes will not be confirmed until one year this

October, if we give in to those blackmail threats we will come back

here again and again because blackmailers always come back. It

is not fit point of principle. This is not about reform of the House of

Lords, it is about the abolition of the House of Lords. You can see by

the ropes on Tuesday night there was no consensus. Andrew says they

will not give in to blackmailers. He was elected on a Tory manifesto

saying he would reform the House of Lords so he is defying his own

league and manifesto. I am in favour of reforming the House of

Lords by looking at retirement age or a test to see if you are

mentally agile and there are a lot of ways that numbers can be reduced

but this is quite different. This also threatens the primacy of the

House of Commons, I was not elected to see their how was denigrated.

This is a very important point. It is an unstable constitution do have

one chamber that makes all the rules. Every other country where a

has a written constitution that is a safeguard. You need a safeguard

and Britain does not have one. is absolutely wrong. The upper

chamber is not elected, it is a revealing and revising chamber that

analyses decisions made in the House of Commons. You're talking

about a major change to undermine our constitution. We did not have a

constitution! Your party wants a hybrid house. The yes. Why? All the

wailing traditionalist, I have got to admit that we are looking a bit

old fashioned. We are the only party -- we are the only country

apart from one other in the world that has an unelected second

chamber. I think that is wrong in the modern era. We would suggest

400... 200 Upper House elected, Lord's or senators, call them what

you will. Does this offer a better way out? Another 100 appointed,

plus bishops and 12th... Others. That is another option, isn't it?

Is elected Halsall Lords will be cut down and they were her staff

and offices but it will cost more than the other system. This current

system has an unelected appointed Upper Cheyne in Canada and Germany

so we are not the only country with up. It is not a legislature, it is

a revealing chain and it works well. There is much more discussion do

have on this. Well, Andrew Bridgen is also one of

a number of Conservative MPs who see the crisis in the Eurozone as

an opportunity to renegotiate the terms of our membership of the EU.

This week they called for a reduction in EU spending for a

start. Is this really the time we should be you negotiating this when

you look at the mess the Eurozone is in? Our relationship with Europe

will change. They are going to have to change their relationship. Full

fiscal union will change our relationship with Europe. It is in

our joint manifesto, our coalition agreement to get how was back from

Europe, if not now, when? Would you like to name it how you would like

to bring that? No one says anything? I would bring back the

social chapter straight away. We read the -- we need reform of

farming policy and fishery policy. Those have devastated our fish

stocks. Do we pay too high a price for our membership? No, we do not.

We are a family of nations and in every family there is a give-and-

take. No one has it all their own way. If you're outside on your own

you have your own way but you have no significance and no influence.

We want to be a part of the family so we are a rich cut -- we are one

of the richer countries so we should pay in. How far would you be

prepared to take this? Are you happy to leave Britain on the

sidelines? We are in the gladiatorial contest and we are

sitting in the stalls watching people being eaten by the Lions,

would you rather be a spectator or a participant? This is a huge

crisis. We are the second biggest net contributor after Germany and

we get very little out of this relationship. We get an enormous

amount out of it. Terry Kharkiv shaking his head. -- Derek Clark is

shaking his head. We just want to get out but we do not mean we will

pull up the drawbridge and go home with no deals. It means we go one

as we work before there was a European Union, trading with all of

those countries. I come from Bristol and I have seen it happen

all the time with ships in the harbour. What relationship the one

with Brussels? We do not need one. We just need to get out. After that

we will restore or continue our trade links. We will maintain items

of common interest but what more do you want? Some people wonder why

you turn up in Europe if you think that? We are there to try and draw

dip -- attention to its deficiencies. The enormous weakness

of the UK position is that Britain could technically leave -- the UKIP

position. We would have no stay over the rules of trading with the

rest of Europe. We would have to adapt to the rules that the rest of

Europe make. There is no problem with that. Of course there is.

sorts of country's trade with the European Union. I went to a

motorbike factory not long ago and asked them, how would you get on

with satisfying the different requirements for your bikes across

the world? It is not a problem. We know where they're going and we

just put the bits on that they want and take the bits of that they

don't want so there is not a problem with the in the different

requirements. It is totally unacceptable to a large proportion

of my electorate for the EU budget to increase every year when we have

to deal with our deficit for the European gravy train to carry on

and keep expanded and expecting more money. The last increase was

an extra �750,000 a year from my constituency which I did not

support when it went through the Commons and I will support no more

increases. Thank you very much for joining us in the

Next, you won't find many fans of the EU among our pig farmers. 13

years after they accepted improved welfare standards, their European

competitors have finally been ordered to do the same. But being

the EU, it's not that simple. Jane Dodge reports.

It makes for uncomfortable viewing. Pregnant pigs kept in cages so

narrow they can't turn round. They're known as sow stalls.

But you won't find them on this pig farm in Arnold, or any other farm

in the UK. Sow stalls were banned in 1999 on animal welfare grounds.

I think they are fairly barbaric ways to keep a very intelligent

animal and we have never ever had our fouls installed at all. -- our

sows installs. 13 years after it was banned in the

UK, the rest of Europe is finally playing catch up. From January next

year it'll be illegal to use sow stalls across the EU. But several

countries have already said they won't be ready to comply with the

ban. And look at the small print and

you'll see it's only a partial ban. Farmers in the rest of the EU will

still be able to put pigs in sow stalls for up to four weeks. It

leaves farmers like Richard worried about his future. The cheaper

European pork will continue to be imported, particularly with the

exchange rate helping it and it will undercut our attempts to

produce peeks under our present high welfare conditions. -- pigs.

In an attempt to reassure farmers like Richard some of the larger

retailers have said they won't buy pork from those EU countries

flouting the ban. UK retailers have a vigorous system of thought

traceability which means they know exactly which farm or even which

building within the farm the meat has come from. There are no issues

for UK retailers about being confident of the need to have good

produce. So who are the countries not ready

to ban these sow stalls? We did ask, but the European Commission wasn't

able or willing to name names. But it insisted those who don't

comply will be punished. We are saying right now to the member-

states that the sure if you do not comply it on 1st January then by

much you will get a letter from the commission saying that you have to

compile and we will keep on reminding you that you have to

comply and then the procedure will the one. -- go on.

But hen farmers say they've heard it all before. At the start of this

year the European Commission imposed another ban, this time on

the use of cramped cages for laying hens. Yet they're still in use in

nine EU countries, none of whom have been punished yet.

Roger Hosking, a hen farmer in Etwall in Derbyshire, believes

it'll be the same for the ban on sow stalls. When somebody says in

Europe we will enforce this, there is not the political will to do it

because people want cheap food and there is not any money available

for inspectors to go round and check up what is happening because

they have got other things they could be doing with their money

rather than putting pig people out of business. It will not happen.

But animal welfare organisations are keen to reassure farmers that

the EC will enforce the law. nations are not complying they can

take them to court and they can give them finds and so

realistically, these will be of an extent that the farmers and the

nations that are not complying they will have to pay attention and

comply eventually. But by the time that happens it may be too late for

Richard Blant. After 40 years in pig farming he's now thinking of

selling up. With us now the chairman of the

National Pig Association, Richard Longthorp.

The EU Commission cannot identify the country at the moment that have

said they will not -- have said that they will comply with these

rules, are you any the wiser? course there are a lot of promises

from various people about what will happen. At the end of the day this

is a real test, it is a test of the integrity that are making the new

law. It is a test of those people to implement and enforce the law

and a test of the integrity of the people who will be selling the

pigmeat from those big farmers we have heard about. Isn't this one of

the things that exasperated -- excess Greece people most about --

exasperated the people most the way we are not sure which countries

will drag their feet? It is exasperated but they have another

five months to do it so it is natural we cannot be exactly sure.

One of the jobs of MEPs like us will be to put questions and make

sure the commission are up to the task of finding out what is going

on and reporting back to was. That is what we can do. All we really

want, and he is a note of controversy, we need more power was

in Brussels soap they can intervene in these countries and go directly

to the farms in Romania or Bulgaria and point out they are not doing it

and punish them with a fight. that work? More effective power was,

perhaps. I am not sure about more powers. We are told that the

countries that might not comply include France, Italy and Poland.

What should MEPs like Bill and Derek be doing? What pressure

should they put on this? They should bring pressure to bear on

the commission to find out exactly what the committee intends to do in

terms of finding out those which are not complying and what they are

going to do about enforcing it. What will happen to those people

who were not complying. They should know that now. That is the issue.

They should know it now as we are speaking but I don't believe they

do. Derek, what are you doing about this issue? Once again we have got

the UN forcing something. What is all this end forcing, and forcing

them forcing. I want to know from a pig farmer, weather and the pigs

really do need a revision of their quarters? Is it necessary? Did you

see the pictures on the film? DDC the pens that they are putting? Did

you think those conditions were acceptable? Well, I don't know. It

was a very short clip and it is difficult to see if the pig is

suffering or not. In this country farmers are complying with those

rules and that is the issue. If we do it, why shouldn't they? Yes, it

is going back to the situation with eggs. How many products are support

-- imported from the 10th that are kept in the small cages which are

illegal. There is all this enforcement but it does not really

work. The you have any work they will that -- do you have any hope

they will make more progress on this than they did on the Henie

she? Well they have had the bitter experience of the fiasco around

hems and we have asked them all this year and we continue to press

them so I hope that they will do a better job this time around.

Fingers crossed. When it comes to the EU rules it seems as though we

are the ones that apply them and other countries can just get round

them or not comply. That does not seem fair. It is a generalisation

but there's a lot of truth in it. That is why I would like to see a

group in Brussels who can go where the rules are not being forced and

say, come along with me, you will be lapped up and punished or will

you obey the rules? Let us be more specific about the problems? Take

the loss of the jobs at Bombardier in Derby. Our Government stuck to

the letter of the Thames Link bidding process where other

countries would take into account the social impact of losing. They

mull did their bit in the light of all those social requirements so

they got the contract. Bombardier did not. Why, I do not know.

Perhaps they are not first enough in EU requirements and I don't know

where they did not do that. There has been other countries who have

been offering bribes to countries to give them the contract. It has

boosted a bank balance which is one of the criteria that the government

said was the reason for government contracts, they had a good strong

bank balance. A Labour MP this week tabled a motion that would require

social and environmental criteria to be considered in all future

contracts, are you with a? Yes, I am sorry to say she did not ask me

to sign it, which would have been a good idea. She ought to have away

support. She has not asked us, that is a mistake. This could stop a

East -- this could stop a future Bombardier fiasco happening again.

We are all about putting pressure on people, we are not a

dictatorship, we are about democracy and powers. If you put

pressure on people, they might just move so it is worth trying.

Time marches on and it goes even faster in our Sixty Second round-up

of some of the other political stories in the East Midlands this

week. Labour have denied Tory allegations

that they're snubbing the Queen by not inviting her to open Derby's

new council house. Labour say they want a community champion to do the

honours. The MP for Nottingham South, Lilian

Greenwood, laid into Grantham MP Nick Boles at PMQs. He's called for

free bus passes and other pensioner concessions to be means-tested.

Where, she demanded, did the Prime Minister stand? At the last

election I made a very clear promise about bus passes and

television licences and winter fuel payments, we are keeping all those

policies. Leicestershire Conservatives have

elected Nick Rushton as their acting leader. It follows the

resignation of David Parsons, who's facing a police investigation over

his expenses for trips to Europe. Nottingham City Council is spending

�1 million to create another 160 jobs for young people.

And finally, a national survey by Nottingham Trent University

suggests most young people are interested in politics, but,

surprise, surprise, they've little It could be worse, Derek. At least

politicians are above bankers when it comes to public esteem. Not in

the UK press over the last few years, know they are not. With all

of these dwindling and the second homes and all of the rest of it. I

have to say, for once I think the EU have got something right. People

like Bill and myself get a flat 300 euros a day allowance for being

there and that covers everything. You don't have to put in a receipt

for a Mars bar and you just pay for your hotel and your meals and if

there is anything left over then it is for you. Encouraging feature

going back to the survey is that at least these students have a real

interest in politics. It is their world. Derek and I have got grey

hair and we will soon be retiring. It is terrific that these kids are

interested but they should get involved and try and takeover and

do a better job than half. We want young people to beat interested and

involved but they should not go straight into politics. They should