02/06/2013 Sunday Politics East Midlands

lobbying and give voters the chance to kick out this great MPs. He did

then and since come at nothing. We will ask Cabinet office Minister

Francis Maude if the latest scandals will force the government to act. It

is hardly the best day for MPs to complain about the deal they are

getting on expenses, but many are angry about the new system.

Conservative MP Noureddine Doris in the Newark constituency of

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2438 seconds

Patrick Mercer, and we hear from his reputation of our politicians: We're

live from Newark with the latest on the Patrick Mercer story. He has

resigned the Conservative whip, but should he be allowed to stay on as

an independent MP? I will be getting reaction from local voters. Also

this lunchtime: thousands of people across our region are asking for

help as cuts in housing benefit bite. I think that the courts are

going to be overrun with cases. All of the eviction process is that

going to come up. -- eviction processes that are going to come up.

We'll go across to Newark in a moment, but first my guests in the

studio are Mark Spencer, the Conservative who's a neighbour of

Patrick Mercer, as the Sherwood MP, and Chris Williamson, Labour's MP

for Derby North. More allegations in this morning's papers, this time

involving the House of Lords. All of the peers involved have denied doing

anything wrong. But for both of you, after the expenses scandal, you have

a hard enough time winning the public over, this must just make

your job even harder. Mark Spencer? It is, and it is enormously

frustrating. There are more than 650 MPs, 640 of them are working hard to

their constituents and doing a good job, and it only takes two or three

to tar the rest of us with a pretty uncomfortable brush. How do you

legislate for the bad apples? the things we could do with the

problem of lobbying is have a registry whereby all lobbyists have

to register, whether they are companies or a charity. That would

be an appropriate way forward. This needs to be addressed in a

cross-party way, to ensure that we have legislation to stop this

problem happening again in future. This is enormously complicated. How

do you distinguish between big-money lobby groups and normal

constituents? This week I have talked to the Fire Brigades union,

to Nottinghamshire police, to the local vicar, all lobbying me over an

issue that is going through Parliament. How do you distinguish

between the people who are trying to buy influence and normal, genuine

people, trying to influence the political process? But we have

business interests involved and foreign governments. What is a

business interests? Nottinghamshire Fire and rescue our lobbying me

about how they deliver their services and how their pension

system works. Aren't they a lobby group not? But there is a big

difference between major companies and normal people. Francis Maude

said he expected measures on the statute book by the next general

election. Will Labour help? If we can get that collaboration, we can

find a way forward. Except that it may not be straightforward. But it

is not beyond the wit of parliamentarians to come up with a

resilient system that'll prevent this sort of Cobham happening again

to protect the reputation of the political process. -- this sort of

problem. For the moment, thank you very much. It was already promising

to be a big day in Newark. It's the Mayor's annual parade today. But

with the resignation of the town's MP from the Tory whip, you can

guarantee what the political small talk is this morning. Let's find out

from Eleanor Garnier. Good morning from Newark's marketplace, where the

new mayor has been welcomed into office. There will be celebration

there, but not elsewhere. Will it the more like commiseration at the

town's local Conservative Association now that the MP has

resigned the Conservative whip. I am joined by Stuart Wallis, chairman of

Newark conservatives and also, the leader of Nottinghamshire Lib Dems.

Your first reaction when Patrick Mercer told you he was resigning the

whip. Obviously it was shock. I had not heard anything at all. You must

feel devastated after all the hard work you have put in, to building up

such a healthy majority. You must feel let down. That is not quite

true, if you think about this. He has been an exceptional constituency

MP and has worked very hard for the town. He has earned a great deal of

respect. I would like to say that there should be an inquiry into what

has gone on, and until we have a report from that, it is unfair to

comment in that way. If things have proved the front, then many people

in this town will be saddened, but I prefer to wait for a proper inquiry

into the exact circumstances. that inquiry, what is the

constituency organisation's relationship with Patrick? Are you

still supporting him? We need to have a working relationship. Let's

be honest. It is less than 40 hours since this broke. I need to have

lots of conversations with Patrick and with the Conservative party

before I can give you an answer to that one. If your leader Nick Clegg

had been more pushy about this and got that statutory register of

lobbyists in, we might not have this situation. I think that you are

right. This needs to look -- needs to be looked at again. Why have we

not got the power of recall, and more transparency over what MPs do,

and that is because the Conservatives and Labour have made

it difficult to get those powers through. The Conservatives have

blocked the power of recall. This is the time to look at those things

again. You can see that the Dems might not get that through. Do you

think Patrick Mercer should stay as an independent or resign as an MP

and force a by-election? It is down to his constituents and to his own

conscience. An investigation has still to take place. This region,

the East Midlands, has been marred in the past by things like cash for

questions. We have got to take a stand and make sure that people have

the power of recall over MPs. just heard, the investigation still

has to take place, and Patrick Mercer is denying the allegations.

Whether he will remain as an independent MP or not, that is

something I am going to be asking local voters later on. Should

Patrick Mercer stand down? He has not been convicted of anything at

this moment in time. Once the facts are established, we can answer that

question. The prospect of a parliamentary by-election in Newark

is not going to be welcomed. Not by me, because I will probably be on

the streets of Newark, delivering leaflets. We need to make the

decision later on whether there should be a by-election. Why do you

think the prime minister is taking so long to bring in this register of

lobbyists? It is a complicated issue, joined those lines as to what

is a lobby group, and what is not. We need to find cross-party

consensus as well, and it needs to stand the test of time for a

generation. It is disappointing that no legislative programme has been

brought forward by the prime Minister on this. Perhaps this will

concentrate his mind and we will see something in the next Queen's

speech. It takes two to tango in the coalition. But with Labour backing,

this could come through fairly quickly. I would have thought there

was consensus with the Lib Dems on this. So I can't see what the

impediments actually is. Probably the same impediment that under the

Labour government, why didn't Gordon Brown ring this forward.

proposition was brought forward when we were in government. We did

include it in the manifesto. We can all point the finger of blame. We

need to grasp the nettle and get on with it. Grasping the nettle.

Yesterday I was speaking to Ken Clarke about this. He said that a

register of lobbyists was in legislative terms, fairly

straightforward. But on recall, having a mechanism whereby a

by-election is triggered, that is more complex. Is he right that it is

much more complex? It is much more complex because you get individual

lobby groups who might target an MP will stop let's take the example of

gay marriage that has just gone through Parliament. If you have a

lobby group against one of those and they disapprove of how an MP votes,

then they can target that individual MP. It could cause mayhem. 10% of

the electorate? Whichever way that, my seat as an example, the

opposition could trigger a by-election quite easily. Would you

welcome this? No, I wouldn't. It is a knee-jerk response to this media a

few raw. -- furore. Mark is right when he says that a group of people

could get together. It would undermine the political process. It

is a gimmick. We have seen in California where the democratically

elected Democrats candidate, for Governor, was replaced with our much

what's in a ghetto is unresolved problems that flowed to the people

of California as a result of that. But could this be dissed -- could

this be embraced despite the opposition? We need to address these

scandals that seem to keep rearing their head, and get on with the

business of governing the country. The problem is, you go down this

road, and it is a cul-de-sac, in my opinion and there would be many

unintended consequences. We'll be returning to this issue later; but

now let's take a look at another story from this week. There's been a

big increase in the number of people across the East Midlands seeking

help with paying their rent. It comes in the wake of the

introduction of the Coalition's "under-occupancy penalty", or what

Chris would no doubt, call the "bedroom tax". Before its

introduction last month, Sunday Politics spoke to a tenant from

Derby, who was worried what it would mean for her. Tim Parker's been back

to see what's happened. June McDermott unpacks her groceries.

They have not come from a shop, but the food rank. Since the benefits

changes, she finds herself in debt and behind on rent for the first

time in her life will stop I didn't know that these places existed.

thought no, no chance, but yes, absolutely. The biggest largest

number of people that they are helping at the moment is people

suffering from benefit cuts. Jill helps to look after her

grandchildren and as a full-time carer for her father who lives

nearby, but her two-bedroom flat is deemed to be too big, and that means

she's having to find an extra �16 a week in rent. I have been able to

pay a little bit each week to pick -- protect myself from eviction but

I am only doing that because I can go to the food bank. Her landlord is

the housing provider, Derwent living. It says that some tenants

are being affected more than others. It all began on April the 1st. 750

of our residents were subject to it. Eight weeks in, and it is early

days, and about 250 of those residents are not paying what is

known as the bedroom tax. The bulk of people have found ways to deal

with the additional payments they are having to make. So, families in

all types of situations across the East Midlands, including here in

Loughborough, are facing life with the under siege at, or bedroom tax.

This woman has found a part-time job to afford the under siege charge she

now faces. I have to pay a little bit more, with the bedroom tax, but

I am still that are off and it has worked out better for me as well.

But for Jill, in Derby, the future is looking more difficult. Sometimes

you just want to put your head in your hands and cried. Last time, I

said that the courts would be overrun with cases. They are not

going to be able to cope with all the eviction cases that are going to

come up. June is still waiting to hear if she can get any extra cash

from her council to help her. Thousands more people across the

region face the same weight. Is this issue in danger of becoming David

Cameron's poll tax? This is about trying to bring fairness to the

system. There are 250,000 people with overcrowded people, and 2

million people on the waiting list for a council house, and there are

all of these spare bedrooms within the system, and it is about trying

to bring balance so that those with spare rooms can release them and

those desperate for extra space can have it. Surely he has got a point.

He hasn't got a point. This is a combination of cruelty and

incompetence. We are talking about people's homes here. The

Conservatives, rather than building houses, want to throw people out of

their houses were they have brought their families. There are not enough

single bedroom properties available. I would certainly like to see Labour

get rid of this. It is pretty clear, with the statements that have been

made that it is unlikely to change -- survive a change of government.

It is about cruelty and incompetence. There are not enough

single bedroom properties are available. Labour built a lot more

houses than the Conservatives are doing now. Labour did this with

people in private rented accommodation so that people in

private rented accommodation were not getting that extra subsidy.

we are talking about here is applying this to people living in

council and housing association accommodation, people who aren't by

definition living on modest incomes without the resources to be able to

pay this additional rent. You are forcing people, only 271 single

bedroom properties came available in Derby last year and there are

hundreds more people than that affected by this. We will inevitably

have stories of evictions. How argue, as an MP, going to with that?

The government recognises that there are people under pressure and put in

place a fund of �150 million to address that. And local authorities

need to act to, rather than paying large salaries to chief executives.

The money in this government fund does not meet the demands placed on

it. Why not boost the economy and put people back into work? Why not

do that? Stefanie said that she had coped, we heard from the housing

chief who said two thirds of his tenants are paying it, so it is

early days. And he said that one third of them are struggling and

falling behind with their rent, and we're only one month into the

scheme. How are people living on extremely low incomes being able to

do this? Hats off to Stefanie in that report. People like her should

be encouraged. It is pushing people into poverty. It is outrageous and

appalling. Time for a round-up of some of the other political stories

in the East Midlands this week - in 60 seconds. Nothing was to get the

new preschool. The torch Academy which runs the slack schools in

Nottinghamshire is being given the go-ahead to open a new school in the

north of the city. Its plans for one at Trent Bridge have been rejected.

The Bosworth MP David Tredinnick has warned his party that it is losing

ground to UKIP. It says Tories should match the UKIP pledge to let

doctors offer herbal and alternative remedies. The European Parliament

has voted to restrict the use of three pesticides linked to declining

honeybee populations. The East Midlands MEP wants limitations

placed on another pesticide. Abhishek County Council has

appointed a new acting chief executive after the departure of

former chief, Nick Hodgson. He left when Labour took over following the

council elections. They have appointed Ian Stevens, the

environment services director. Let's return to Newark. When Patrick

Mercer resigned the Conservative whip he said it was to save

embarrassment for the Conservative party. But now that he's an

independent MP, how does that affect local issues? I asked one local

campaigner that question a few minutes ago. It should have a

positive affect on the campaign. I understand he has lost the

Conservative whip but he's independent now. He can speak out

when he feels things are wrong, and people are not, we are not getting

the right services. He can speak out. He does not have to follow the

Tory party line and I hope that he does. That is what one local

campaigner thinks. What about the boaters? Do they mind that he's able

stand as an independent, or, should he be forced out, prompting a

by-election? We feel that he's a very good MP, who does a lot of good

for the town, and it is a pity that he has made a full of himself and

slip up. He will continue to do a good job. This is a blip.

Unfortunately it is one of these things he has got to look at himself

and say, do I remain in politics. It is his decision. I think he should

step down. It is exactly 48 hours since Patrick Mercer resigned the

Conservative whip. And what many people here are asking is, if he's

found guilty or innocent, can he win back the trust of local voters here

a plague on both your houses. is why I said we need to bring

forward legislation to stop it happening again in future. A

statutory register would achieve that. It is not without its

problems, to get it right, but we need to do that. It is really

important to restore faith in the bloody good process. Winston

Churchill said that democracy was the worst form of government apart

from all the others that have been tried. We have to try and rescue

democracy. When MPs return to the Commons tomorrow after yet another

recess, what do you want to hear from the government? We need to look

at the legislation and move forward. But none of this would be necessary

if MPs acted with a bit more moral fibre and did what was right rather

than chase the Holytown. -- the holy pound. It is important that we

restore faith in analytical process. This is the best that we have got,

and we have got to make it work. The majority of MPs are good, decent,

upstanding individuals who believe in what they are trying to do, who

want to try and make a difference for the people that elected them.

don't know what the mood on the Tory benches would be, but if you bump

into Patrick Mercer tomorrow, what would you say to him? He will

probably be busy with other things, but let's see what happens. Let's

see, when the truth comes out in the end, and we can decide to move

forward. Thank you both for joining us. That's the Sunday Politics in

the East Midlands, thanks to my guests, Chris Williamson and Mark