Browse content similar to 26/03/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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It's Sunday morning, this is the Sunday Politics. | :00:43. | :00:47. | |
The police believe the Westminster attacker Khalid Masood acted alone, | :00:48. | :00:49. | |
but do the security services have the resources and | :00:50. | :00:51. | |
We'll ask the leader of the House of Commons. | :00:52. | :00:55. | |
As Theresa May prepares to trigger Brexit, details of | :00:56. | :00:58. | |
Will a so-called Henry VIII clause give the Government too much power | :00:59. | :01:04. | |
Ukip's only MP, Douglas Carswell, quits the party saying it's "job | :01:05. | :01:08. | |
East Midlands, as to to and the party's | :01:09. | :01:17. | |
East Midlands, as to to trigger Article 30, how ready is our region | :01:18. | :01:20. | |
for life outside And with me - as always - | :01:21. | :01:29. | |
the best and the brightest political panel in the business - | :01:30. | :01:32. | |
Toby Young, Polly Toynbee and Janan Ganesh, who'll be tweeting | :01:33. | :01:35. | |
throughout the programme. First, it was the most | :01:36. | :01:41. | |
deadly terrorist attack The attacker was shot dead trying | :01:42. | :01:43. | |
to storm Parliament, but not before he'd murdered four | :01:44. | :01:47. | |
people and injured 50 - one of those is still in a critical | :01:48. | :01:49. | |
condition in hospital. His target was the very | :01:50. | :01:53. | |
heart of our democracy, the Palace of Westminster, | :01:54. | :01:55. | |
and he came within metres of the Prime Minister | :01:56. | :01:58. | |
and senior Cabinet ministers. Without the quick actions | :01:59. | :02:01. | |
of the Defence Secretary's close protection detail, | :02:02. | :02:05. | |
fortuitously in the vicinity at the time, the outcome | :02:06. | :02:06. | |
could have been even worse. Janan Ganesh it is four days now, | :02:07. | :02:19. | |
getting on. What thoughts should we be having this weekend? First of | :02:20. | :02:25. | |
all, Theresa May's Parliamentary response was exemplary. In many | :02:26. | :02:29. | |
ways, the moment she arrived as prime minister and her six years as | :02:30. | :02:32. | |
Home Secretary showed a positive way. No other serving politician is | :02:33. | :02:36. | |
as steeped in counterterror and national security experience as she | :02:37. | :02:41. | |
is and I think it showed. As to whether politics is going now, it | :02:42. | :02:44. | |
looks like the Government will put more pressure on companies like | :02:45. | :02:50. | |
Google and Facebook to monitor sensor radical content that flows | :02:51. | :02:54. | |
through their channels, and I wonder whether beyond that the Government, | :02:55. | :02:58. | |
not just our Government but around the world, will start to open this | :02:59. | :03:03. | |
question of, during a terror attack, as it is unfolding, should there be | :03:04. | :03:08. | |
restrictions on what can appear on social media? I was on Twitter at | :03:09. | :03:12. | |
the time last week, during the attack, and people were posting | :03:13. | :03:15. | |
things which may have been useful to the perpetrators, not on that | :03:16. | :03:20. | |
occasion but future occasions. Should there be restrictions on what | :03:21. | :03:24. | |
and how much people can post while an attack is unfolding? I think we | :03:25. | :03:29. | |
have learned that this is like the weather, it is going to happen, it | :03:30. | :03:33. | |
is going to happen all over the world and in every country and we | :03:34. | :03:37. | |
deal with it well, we deal with it stoically, perhaps we are more used | :03:38. | :03:43. | |
to it than some. We had the IRA for years, we know how to make personal | :03:44. | :03:47. | |
risk assessments, how to know the chances of being in the wrong place | :03:48. | :03:52. | |
at the wrong time are infinitesimal, so people in London didn't say, I'm | :03:53. | :03:58. | |
not going to go to the centre of London today, everything carried on | :03:59. | :04:01. | |
just the same. Because we know that the odds of it, being unlucky, are | :04:02. | :04:06. | |
very small. Life is dangerous, this is another very small risk and it is | :04:07. | :04:14. | |
the danger of being alive. I think from an Isis Islamist propaganda | :04:15. | :04:17. | |
point of view, it showed just what a poor target London and the House of | :04:18. | :04:21. | |
Commons is, and it is hard to imagine the emergency services and | :04:22. | :04:26. | |
local people, international visitors, reacting much better than | :04:27. | :04:31. | |
they did. And the fact that our Muslim mayor was able to make an | :04:32. | :04:36. | |
appearance so quickly afterwards shows, I think, that we are not city | :04:37. | :04:40. | |
riddled with anti-Islamic prejudice. It couldn't really have been a | :04:41. | :04:44. | |
better advertisement for the values that is attacking. | :04:45. | :04:46. | |
OK, thank you for that. So, four days after the attack, | :04:47. | :04:49. | |
what more do we know The police have made 11 arrests, | :04:50. | :04:51. | |
but only one remains Here's Adam with the latest | :04:52. | :04:55. | |
on the investigation. According to a police timeline, | :04:56. | :05:00. | |
that's how long it took Khalid Masood to drive | :05:01. | :05:05. | |
through a crowd on Westminster to crash his car into | :05:06. | :05:07. | |
Parliament's perimeter... to fatally stab PC Keith Palmer, | :05:08. | :05:14. | |
before being shot by a bodyguard The public are leaving tributes | :05:15. | :05:18. | |
to the dead at Westminster. The family of PC Palmer released | :05:19. | :05:28. | |
a statement saying: "We would like to express our | :05:29. | :05:34. | |
gratitude to the people who were with Keith in his last | :05:35. | :05:36. | |
moments and who were There was nothing more | :05:37. | :05:39. | |
you could have done, you did your best and we are just | :05:40. | :05:42. | |
grateful he was not alone." Investigators say Masood's motive | :05:43. | :05:45. | |
may have gone to the grave with him. Officers think he acted alone, | :05:46. | :05:48. | |
despite reports he spent a WhatsApp The Home Secretary now has | :05:49. | :05:51. | |
such encrypted messaging There should be no place | :05:52. | :05:58. | |
for terrorists to hide. We need to make sure that | :05:59. | :06:04. | |
organisations like WhatsApp, and there are plenty of others | :06:05. | :06:06. | |
like that, don't provide a secret place for terrorists | :06:07. | :06:09. | |
to communicate with each other. It used to be that people | :06:10. | :06:12. | |
would steam open envelopes or just listen in on phones when they wanted | :06:13. | :06:16. | |
to find out what people were doing, legally, through warrantry, | :06:17. | :06:25. | |
but in this situation we need to make sure | :06:26. | :06:27. | |
that our intelligence services have the ability to get | :06:28. | :06:29. | |
into situations like encrypted She will ask the tech industry | :06:30. | :06:31. | |
to suggest solutions at a meeting this week, | :06:32. | :06:35. | |
although she didn't rule out But for those caught up | :06:36. | :06:37. | |
in the attack, perhaps it will be ..not the policy implications that | :06:38. | :06:41. | |
will echo the loudest. We're joined now from the Hague | :06:42. | :06:49. | |
by the Director of Europol, the European Police Agency, | :06:50. | :06:51. | |
Rob Wainwright. What role has Europol played in the | :06:52. | :07:02. | |
aftermath of Wednesday's attacks? I can tell you we are actively | :07:03. | :07:06. | |
supporting the investigation, because it is a live case I cannot | :07:07. | :07:10. | |
of course go into the details, but to give you some context, Andrew, | :07:11. | :07:14. | |
this is one of about 80 counterterrorist cases we have been | :07:15. | :07:18. | |
supporting across Europe this year, using a platform to shed thousands | :07:19. | :07:22. | |
of intelligence messages between the very large counterterrorist | :07:23. | :07:26. | |
community in Europe, and also tracking flows of terrorist finance, | :07:27. | :07:30. | |
illegal firearms, and monitoring this terrible propaganda online as | :07:31. | :07:34. | |
well. All of that is being made available now to the Metropolitan | :07:35. | :07:41. | |
Police in London for this case. Do we know if there is any European | :07:42. | :07:44. | |
link to those who may have inspired or directed Khalid Massoud? That is | :07:45. | :07:49. | |
an active part of the inquiry being led by Metropolitan Police and it is | :07:50. | :07:52. | |
not for me to comment or speculate on that. There are links of course | :07:53. | :07:58. | |
in terms of the profile of the attacker and the way in which he | :07:59. | :08:02. | |
launched these terrible events in Westminster, and those that we've | :08:03. | :08:06. | |
seen, for example, in the Berlin Christmas market last year and the | :08:07. | :08:11. | |
attack in Nice in the summer of last year, clear similarities between the | :08:12. | :08:15. | |
fact that the attackers involved have criminal background, somewhat | :08:16. | :08:19. | |
dislocated from society, each of them using a hired or stolen vehicle | :08:20. | :08:26. | |
to deliberately aim at pedestrians in a crowded place and using a | :08:27. | :08:30. | |
secondary weapon, whether it is a gun or a knife. So we are seeing a | :08:31. | :08:34. | |
trend, I think, of the kind of attacks across Europe in the last | :08:35. | :08:37. | |
couple of years and some of that at least was played out unfortunately | :08:38. | :08:41. | |
in Westminster this week as well. Mass and was known to the emergency | :08:42. | :08:45. | |
services, so were many of those involved in the Brussels, Paris and | :08:46. | :08:49. | |
Berlin attacks, so something is going wrong here, we are not | :08:50. | :08:54. | |
completely across this, are we? Actually most attacks are being | :08:55. | :08:59. | |
stopped. This was I think at least the 14th terrorist plot or attempted | :09:00. | :09:04. | |
attack in Britain since 2013 and the only one that has got through, and | :09:05. | :09:09. | |
that fits a picture of what we see in France last year, 17 attempted | :09:10. | :09:14. | |
attacks that were stopped, for example. Unfortunately some of them | :09:15. | :09:18. | |
get through. But people on the security services' Radar getting | :09:19. | :09:22. | |
through, in Westminster, Brussels, Paris and Berlin. There is clearly | :09:23. | :09:27. | |
something we are not doing that could stop that. Again, if you look | :09:28. | :09:34. | |
at what happened in Berlin and at least the first indications from | :09:35. | :09:38. | |
what police are saying in London, these are people that haven't really | :09:39. | :09:42. | |
appeared on Baha'i target list of the authorities, they are on the | :09:43. | :09:47. | |
edge at best of radicalised community -- on the high target | :09:48. | :09:51. | |
list. When you are dealing with a dispersed community of thousands of | :09:52. | :09:54. | |
radicalised, Senate radicalised individuals, it is very difficult to | :09:55. | :09:59. | |
monitor them 24/7, very difficult when these people, almost out of the | :10:00. | :10:03. | |
blue and carry out the attacks that they did. I think you have to find a | :10:04. | :10:08. | |
sense of perspective here around the work and the pressures of the work | :10:09. | :10:12. | |
and the difficult target choices that police and security authorities | :10:13. | :10:16. | |
have to make around Europe. The Home Secretary here in London said this | :10:17. | :10:20. | |
morning it is time to tackle apps like WhatsApp, which we believe | :10:21. | :10:24. | |
Massoud was using, because they encrypt from end to end and it is | :10:25. | :10:28. | |
difficult for the security services to know what is happening there. | :10:29. | :10:32. | |
What do you say, are you up for that? Across the hundreds of cases | :10:33. | :10:38. | |
we have supported in recent years there is no doubt that encryption, | :10:39. | :10:42. | |
encrypted communications are becoming more and more prominent in | :10:43. | :10:46. | |
the way terrorists communicate, more and more of a problem, therefore, a | :10:47. | :10:50. | |
real challenge for investigators, and that the heart of this is a | :10:51. | :10:53. | |
stark inconsistency between the ability of the police to lawfully | :10:54. | :10:57. | |
intercept telephone calls, but not when those messages are exchanged | :10:58. | :11:02. | |
via a social media messaging board, for example, and that is an | :11:03. | :11:07. | |
inconsistency in society and we have to find a solution through | :11:08. | :11:10. | |
appropriate legislation perhaps of these technologies and law | :11:11. | :11:14. | |
enforcement agencies working in a more constructive way. So you back | :11:15. | :11:21. | |
that? I agree that there is certainly a problem, absolutely. We | :11:22. | :11:24. | |
know there was a problem, I'm trying to find out if you agree with the | :11:25. | :11:34. | |
Home Secretary's solution? I agree certainly with her calls for changes | :11:35. | :11:38. | |
to be made. What the legislative solution for that is of course for | :11:39. | :11:41. | |
her and other lawmakers to decide but from my point of view, yes, I | :11:42. | :11:44. | |
would agree something has to be done to make sure we can apply more | :11:45. | :11:49. | |
consistent interception of communication in all parts of the | :11:50. | :11:54. | |
way in which terrorists invade our lives. Rob Wainwright of Europol, | :11:55. | :11:56. | |
thank you very much. Here with me in the studio now | :11:57. | :11:57. | |
is the Leader of the House What did last week's attack tell us | :11:58. | :12:06. | |
about the security of the Palace of Westminster? It told us that we are | :12:07. | :12:10. | |
looked after by some very courageous, very professional police | :12:11. | :12:18. | |
officers. There is clearly going to be a lessons learned with you, as | :12:19. | :12:23. | |
you would expect after any incident of this kind. That will look very | :12:24. | :12:27. | |
carefully at what worked well but also whether there are changes that | :12:28. | :12:30. | |
need to be made, that is already under way. And that is being run by | :12:31. | :12:36. | |
professionals, by the police and security director at Parliament... | :12:37. | :12:46. | |
Palace authorities, we will get reports from the professionals, | :12:47. | :12:50. | |
particularly our own Parliamentary security director, and just as | :12:51. | :12:54. | |
security matters in parliament are kept under constant review, if there | :12:55. | :12:57. | |
are changes that need to be made as a result, then they will need to be | :12:58. | :13:01. | |
made. Let's look at some of the issues it has thrown up, as we get | :13:02. | :13:05. | |
some distance from these appalling events when our first reaction was | :13:06. | :13:10. | |
always the people who lose their lives and suffer, and then we start | :13:11. | :13:14. | |
to become a bit more analytical. Is it true that the authorities removed | :13:15. | :13:19. | |
armed guards from Cowbridge gate, where the attacker made his entry, | :13:20. | :13:22. | |
because they looked to threatening for tourists? -- carriage gate. No, | :13:23. | :13:30. | |
the idea that a protest from MPs led to operational changes simply not | :13:31. | :13:33. | |
the case. What happened in the last couple of years is that the security | :13:34. | :13:40. | |
arrangements in new Palace Yard have actually been strengthened, but I | :13:41. | :13:43. | |
don't think your view was would expect me to go into a detailed | :13:44. | :13:48. | |
commentary upon operational security matters. Why were the armed guards | :13:49. | :13:52. | |
removed? There are armed guards at all times in the Palace of | :13:53. | :13:58. | |
Westminster, it is a matter for the security authorities and in | :13:59. | :14:02. | |
particular for the police and direct command of those officers to decide | :14:03. | :14:09. | |
how they are best deployed. Is it because, as some from Scotland Yard | :14:10. | :14:13. | |
sources have reported to the papers this morning, was it done because of | :14:14. | :14:18. | |
staffing shortages? I'm in no position to comment on the details | :14:19. | :14:21. | |
of the operation but my understanding is that the number of | :14:22. | :14:27. | |
people available is what the police and the security authorities working | :14:28. | :14:31. | |
together have decided to deploy and that they think was commensurate | :14:32. | :14:36. | |
with the threat that we faced. Is it not of concern that as the incident | :14:37. | :14:42. | |
unfolded the gates were left unguarded by armed and unarmed, they | :14:43. | :14:46. | |
were just unguarded, so much so that, as it was going on, a career | :14:47. | :14:50. | |
with a parcel on a moped at was able to drive through? -- up career. I | :14:51. | :14:59. | |
think we will need to examine that case as part of looking into any | :15:00. | :15:02. | |
lessons learned, but what I don't yet know, because the police are | :15:03. | :15:06. | |
still interviewing everybody involved, witnesses and police | :15:07. | :15:11. | |
officers involved, was exactly who was standing where in the vicinity | :15:12. | :15:17. | |
of the murder at a particular time. We have seen pictures, the gates | :15:18. | :15:21. | |
were unguarded as people were concentrating on what was happening | :15:22. | :15:25. | |
to the police man and to the attacker, but the delivery man was | :15:26. | :15:31. | |
able to come through the gates with a parcel?! You have seen a | :15:32. | :15:34. | |
particular camera angle, I think it is important before we rush to | :15:35. | :15:39. | |
judgment, and we shouldn't be pointing fingers, we need... We are | :15:40. | :15:45. | |
trying to get to the bottom of it. To get to the bottom of it means we | :15:46. | :15:48. | |
have to look at what all the witnesses and all the police | :15:49. | :15:52. | |
officers involved say about what happened, and then there needs to be | :15:53. | :15:56. | |
a decision taken about what if any changes need to be made in light of | :15:57. | :15:58. | |
that. We know the attacker was stopped in | :15:59. | :16:07. | |
his tracks by the Defence Secretary's bodyguard, where was the | :16:08. | :16:13. | |
armed roving unit that had replaced the armed guard at the gate? I | :16:14. | :16:18. | |
cannot comment on operation details but my understanding is there were | :16:19. | :16:22. | |
other armed officers who would have been able to prevent the attacker | :16:23. | :16:27. | |
from getting to the chamber, as has been alleged it would be possible | :16:28. | :16:33. | |
for him to do. Were you aware that a so-called table top simulation, | :16:34. | :16:38. | |
carried out by Scotland Yard and the Parliamentary authorities, ended | :16:39. | :16:41. | |
with four terrorists in this simulation able to storm parliament | :16:42. | :16:51. | |
and killed dozens of MPs? No, that is the first time that has been | :16:52. | :16:57. | |
mentioned to me. You are the leader of the house. These matters are | :16:58. | :17:03. | |
dealt with by security professionals who are involved, they are advised | :17:04. | :17:10. | |
by a security committee, chaired by the Deputy Speaker, but we do not | :17:11. | :17:13. | |
debate operational details in public. I'm not asking for a debate, | :17:14. | :17:20. | |
I raise this because it's been reported because it's quite clear | :17:21. | :17:24. | |
that after this simulation, it raised serious questions about the | :17:25. | :17:28. | |
security of the palace. Actions should have followed. What I've said | :17:29. | :17:34. | |
to you is that these matters are kept under constant review and that | :17:35. | :17:41. | |
there are always changes made both in the deployment of individual | :17:42. | :17:47. | |
officers and security guards of the palace staff and other plans to | :17:48. | :17:51. | |
strengthen the hard security of the perimeter. If you look back at | :17:52. | :17:56. | |
Hansard December last year, they was a plan already been brought forward | :17:57. | :18:02. | |
to strengthen the security at carriage Gates, looking at questions | :18:03. | :18:10. | |
of access. Will there be armed guards now? You need to look not | :18:11. | :18:18. | |
just at armed guards, you need to look at the entirety of the security | :18:19. | :18:23. | |
engagements including fencing. There's lots about the security we | :18:24. | :18:27. | |
don't need to know and shouldn't know, but whether or not there are | :18:28. | :18:31. | |
armed guards is something we will find out quite soon and I'm asking | :18:32. | :18:36. | |
you if you think there should be. If you think the judgment is by our | :18:37. | :18:41. | |
security experts that there need to be more armed guards in certain | :18:42. | :18:46. | |
places, then they will be deployed accordingly, but I think before we | :18:47. | :18:50. | |
rush to make conclusions about lessons to be learned from | :18:51. | :18:55. | |
Wednesday's appalling attack, it is important the police are allowed to | :18:56. | :18:59. | |
get on with completing the interview of witnesses and their own officers, | :19:00. | :19:04. | |
and then that there is considered view taken about what changes might | :19:05. | :19:08. | |
need to be made and then they will be implemented. Let me come onto the | :19:09. | :19:13. | |
triggering of Article 50 that begins our negotiations to exit the | :19:14. | :19:18. | |
European Union. It will happen on Wednesday. John Claude Juncker told | :19:19. | :19:22. | |
Germany's most popular newspaper that he wants to make an example of | :19:23. | :19:27. | |
the UK to make everyone realise it's not worth leaving the EU. What do | :19:28. | :19:34. | |
you make of that? I think all sorts of things are said in advance of | :19:35. | :19:38. | |
negotiations beginning. Clearly the commission will want to ensure the | :19:39. | :19:45. | |
EU 27 holds together. As the Prime Minister has said, that is a British | :19:46. | :19:49. | |
national interest as well. She has been very clear... What do you make | :19:50. | :19:56. | |
of President Juncker's remark? It doesn't surprise me ahead of | :19:57. | :19:59. | |
negotiations but I think if rational mutual interest is to the fore that | :20:00. | :20:07. | |
it's perfectly possible for an agreement to be negotiated between | :20:08. | :20:12. | |
the UK and our 27 friends and allies that addresses all of the issues | :20:13. | :20:17. | |
from trade to security, police cooperation, foreign policy | :20:18. | :20:21. | |
co-operation, works for all countries. The EU wants to agree a | :20:22. | :20:25. | |
substantial divorce bill before it will even discuss any future UK EU | :20:26. | :20:32. | |
relations, what do you make of that? Article 50 says the terms of exit | :20:33. | :20:38. | |
need to be negotiated in the context of the kind of future relationship | :20:39. | :20:43. | |
that's going to exist between the departing country and the remaining | :20:44. | :20:47. | |
member states. It seems it is simply not possible to separate those two. | :20:48. | :20:52. | |
Clearly there will need to be a discussion about joint assets and | :20:53. | :20:55. | |
join liabilities but I think if we all keep to the fore the fact we | :20:56. | :21:00. | |
will continue to be neighbours, we will continue to be essential allies | :21:01. | :21:04. | |
and trading partners, then it is possible to come to a | :21:05. | :21:18. | |
deal that works for all size. The question is do you agree the divorce | :21:19. | :21:22. | |
bill first and then look at the subsequent relations we will have or | :21:23. | :21:25. | |
do you do them both in parallel? Article 50 itself says they have to | :21:26. | :21:30. | |
run together. Do you think they have to be done together or sequentially? | :21:31. | :21:35. | |
I think it is impossible to separate the two but we will get into | :21:36. | :21:39. | |
negotiations very soon and then once David Davis is sitting down with | :21:40. | :21:44. | |
Michel Barnier and others and the national governments become involved | :21:45. | :21:49. | |
too, then I hope we can make steady progress. An early deal about each | :21:50. | :21:53. | |
other's citizens would be a good piece of low hanging fruit. Is the | :21:54. | :21:57. | |
Government willing to pay a substantial divorce bill? The Prime | :21:58. | :22:06. | |
Minister has said we don't rule out some kind of continuing payments, | :22:07. | :22:11. | |
for example there may be EU programmes in the future in which we | :22:12. | :22:15. | |
want to continue to participate. 50 billion? We don't envisage long-term | :22:16. | :22:25. | |
payments of vast sums of money. So 50 billion isn't even the Government | :22:26. | :22:30. | |
ballpark? You are tempting me to get into the detail of negotiation, that | :22:31. | :22:34. | |
is something that will be starting very soon and let's leave it to the | :22:35. | :22:38. | |
negotiations. During the referendum there was no talk from the Leave | :22:39. | :22:46. | |
side about any question of separation bill, now the talk is of | :22:47. | :22:50. | |
50 billion and I'm trying to find out if the British government thinks | :22:51. | :23:02. | |
that of amount is on your radar. The Government is addressing the | :23:03. | :23:07. | |
situation in which we now are, which is that we have a democratic | :23:08. | :23:10. | |
obligation to implement the decision of the people in the referendum last | :23:11. | :23:15. | |
year, and that we need to do that in a way that maximises the | :23:16. | :23:19. | |
opportunity, the future prosperity and security of everybody in the UK. | :23:20. | :23:24. | |
Let me try one more thing on the Great Repeal Bill, the white Paper | :23:25. | :23:27. | |
will be published I think on Thursday, is that right? We haven't | :23:28. | :23:32. | |
announced an exact date but you will see the white Paper very soon. Let's | :23:33. | :23:39. | |
say it is Thursday, it will enshrine thousands of EU laws into UK law, it | :23:40. | :23:42. | |
will use what's called Henry VIII powers, who of course was a | :23:43. | :23:48. | |
dictator. Is this an attempt to avoid proper Parliamentary scrutiny? | :23:49. | :23:55. | |
No, we are repealing the Communities Act 1972, then put existing EU legal | :23:56. | :24:01. | |
obligations on the UK statutory footing, so business know where they | :24:02. | :24:07. | |
stand. Then, because a lot of those EU regulations will for example | :24:08. | :24:15. | |
refer to the commission or another regulator, you need to substitute a | :24:16. | :24:20. | |
UK authority in place so we need to have a power under secondary | :24:21. | :24:25. | |
legislation to tweak the European regulators so it is coherent. This | :24:26. | :24:34. | |
is weather Henry VIII powers come in. It is secondary legislation and | :24:35. | :24:40. | |
the scope, the definition of those powers and when they can be used in | :24:41. | :24:44. | |
what circumstances is something the parliament will have to approve in | :24:45. | :24:49. | |
voting through the bill itself. And if it is as innocuous as you say, | :24:50. | :24:53. | |
will you accept the proposal of the Lords for an enhanced scrutiny | :24:54. | :24:58. | |
process on the secondary legislation? Neither the relevant | :24:59. | :25:03. | |
committee of the House of Lords, the constitution committee, nor anyone | :25:04. | :25:07. | |
else has seen the text of the bill and I think when it comes out, I | :25:08. | :25:12. | |
hope that those members of the House of Lords will find that reassuring, | :25:13. | :25:18. | |
but as I say the definition of those powers are something the parliament | :25:19. | :25:23. | |
itself will take the final decision. David Lidington, thank you for being | :25:24. | :25:25. | |
with us. So, Ukip has lost its only MP - | :25:26. | :25:27. | |
Douglas Carswell. He defected to Ukip | :25:28. | :25:30. | |
from the Conservative Party almost three years ago, | :25:31. | :25:31. | |
but yesterday announced that he was quitting | :25:32. | :25:33. | |
to sit as an independent. His surprise defection came | :25:34. | :25:35. | |
in August 2014 saying, "Only Ukip can shake up that cosy | :25:36. | :25:37. | |
little clique called Westminster". But his bromance with Nigel Farage | :25:38. | :25:40. | |
turned sour when Mr Carswell criticised the so-called "shock | :25:41. | :25:44. | |
and awful" strategy as Then, during the EU referendum | :25:45. | :25:46. | |
campaign last year, Nigel Farage was part of the unofficial Leave.EU | :25:47. | :25:51. | |
campaign, whereas Douglas Carswell opted to support the official | :25:52. | :25:54. | |
Vote Leave campaign. Just last month, former | :25:55. | :26:00. | |
Ukip leader Nigel Farage accused Douglas Carswell | :26:01. | :26:02. | |
of thwarting his chances of being awarded a knighthood, | :26:03. | :26:04. | |
writing that, Announcing his resignation | :26:05. | :26:06. | |
on his website yesterday, Mr Carswell said, "I desperately | :26:07. | :26:14. | |
wanted us to leave the EU. Now we can be certain that | :26:15. | :26:16. | |
that is going to happen, I have decided that I will be leaving | :26:17. | :26:19. | |
Ukip." When Mr Carswell left | :26:20. | :26:22. | |
the Conservative Party in 2014 he resigned as an MP, | :26:23. | :26:24. | |
triggering a by-election. "I must seek permission | :26:25. | :26:27. | |
from my boss," he said referring This time, though, Mr Carswell has | :26:28. | :26:30. | |
said there will be no by-election. We're joined now from Salford | :26:31. | :26:39. | |
by Ukip leader, Paul Nuttall. Welcome back to the programme. Are | :26:40. | :26:50. | |
you happy to see the back of your only MP? Well, do you know, I'm | :26:51. | :26:57. | |
always sad when people leave Ukip at a grass roots level or Parliamentary | :26:58. | :27:03. | |
level, but I'm sad but I'm not surprised by this. There has been | :27:04. | :27:07. | |
adrift by Douglas and Ukip over the past couple of years, his | :27:08. | :27:12. | |
relationship with Nigel Farage certainly hasn't helped, and it is a | :27:13. | :27:16. | |
hangover from the former regime which I inherited. I try to bring | :27:17. | :27:20. | |
the party together, I thought I had done that for a few months but it | :27:21. | :27:24. | |
seems now as if I was only papering over the cracks. Douglas has gone | :27:25. | :27:28. | |
and I think we will move on and be a more unified party as a result. Did | :27:29. | :27:35. | |
Douglas Carswell jump because he expected to be pushed out your | :27:36. | :27:38. | |
national executive committee tomorrow? He came before the | :27:39. | :27:42. | |
National executive committee to answer questions regarding issues | :27:43. | :27:45. | |
that have come to the fore over the last couple of months. There was the | :27:46. | :27:50. | |
knighthood issue, the issue surrounding the Thanet election and | :27:51. | :27:56. | |
his comments in a book which came out regarding Brexit. So was he | :27:57. | :28:02. | |
under suspicion? He was coming to answer these questions and they | :28:03. | :28:06. | |
would have been difficult. So he did jump in your view? No, I'm not | :28:07. | :28:13. | |
saying he would have been pushed out of the party but he would have faced | :28:14. | :28:16. | |
difficult questions. What is clear is that a fissure had developed and | :28:17. | :28:25. | |
I'm not surprised by him leaving the party. You have also lost Diane | :28:26. | :28:30. | |
James, Stephen Wolf, Arron Banks, you failed to win the Stoke by | :28:31. | :28:36. | |
election, Mr Carswell is now a pundit on US television, Ukip now | :28:37. | :28:41. | |
stands for the UK irrelevance party, doesn't it? Paul's hard us yesterday | :28:42. | :28:47. | |
on 12%, membership continues to rise. -- the polls had us on 12%. 4 | :28:48. | :29:04. | |
million people voted for Ukip. Over the summer exciting things will be | :29:05. | :29:09. | |
happening in the party, we will rewrite the constitution, | :29:10. | :29:11. | |
restructure the party, it will have a new feel to it and we will be | :29:12. | :29:16. | |
launching pretty much the post Brexit Ukip. Arron Banks, who used | :29:17. | :29:21. | |
to pay quite a lot of your bills, he said the current leadership, that | :29:22. | :29:26. | |
would be you, couldn't knock the skin off a rice pudding, another way | :29:27. | :29:29. | |
of saying you are relevant, isn't it? I don't think that's fair. I've | :29:30. | :29:36. | |
only been in the job since November the 28th, we have taken steps to | :29:37. | :29:40. | |
restructure the party already, the party is on a sound financial | :29:41. | :29:44. | |
footing, we won't have a problem money wise going forward. It is a | :29:45. | :29:49. | |
party which can really unified, look forward to the post Brexit Iraq, | :29:50. | :29:54. | |
tomorrow we are launching our Brexit test for the Prime Minister. If it | :29:55. | :29:58. | |
wasn't for Ukip there wouldn't have been a referendum and we wouldn't | :29:59. | :30:04. | |
have Brexit. Every time you say you will unified, someone else leaves. | :30:05. | :30:10. | |
Is Arron Banks still a member? No, not at this moment in time. He has | :30:11. | :30:14. | |
been a generous donor in the past, he's done a great job of ensuring we | :30:15. | :30:19. | |
get Brexit and I'm thankful for that but he isn't a member. He has just | :30:20. | :30:24. | |
submitted an invoice of ?2000 for the use of call centres, will you | :30:25. | :30:35. | |
pay that? No. That should be interesting to watch. | :30:36. | :30:39. | |
In the aftermath of the Westminster attack, Nigel Farage told Fox News | :30:40. | :30:43. | |
that it vindicates Donald Trump's extreme vetting of migrants. Since | :30:44. | :30:48. | |
the attacker was born in Kent, like Nigel Farage, can you explain the | :30:49. | :30:53. | |
relevance of the remark? I personally haven't supported Donald | :30:54. | :30:57. | |
Trump's position on this, but what I will say, this is what Nigel has | :30:58. | :31:02. | |
said as well, we have a problem within the Muslim community, it is a | :31:03. | :31:06. | |
small number of people who hate the way we live... Can you explain the | :31:07. | :31:12. | |
relevance of Mr Farage's remark? Mr Farage also made the point | :31:13. | :31:26. | |
about multiculturalism being the problem as well and he is correct on | :31:27. | :31:30. | |
that because we cannot have separate communities living separate lives | :31:31. | :31:32. | |
and never integrating. How would extreme vetting of migrants help you | :31:33. | :31:34. | |
track down a man who was born in Kent? In this case it wouldn't. | :31:35. | :31:37. | |
Maybe in other cases it would. But, as I say, I'm not a supporter of | :31:38. | :31:40. | |
Donald Trump's position on extreme vetting, never have been, so I'm the | :31:41. | :31:44. | |
wrong person to ask the question too, Andrew. That has probably | :31:45. | :31:48. | |
become clear in my efforts to get you to answer it. Let me as too, | :31:49. | :31:53. | |
should there be a by-election in Clacton now? Douglas has called | :31:54. | :31:56. | |
by-elections in the past when he has left a political party, I know | :31:57. | :32:00. | |
certain people in Ukip are keen to go down this line, Douglas is always | :32:01. | :32:06. | |
keen on recall and if 20% of people in his constituency want a | :32:07. | :32:08. | |
by-election then maybe we should have won. Ukip will be opening | :32:09. | :32:15. | |
nominations for Clacton very soon. Hold on with us, Mr Nuttall, I have | :32:16. | :32:20. | |
Douglas Carswell here in the studio. Why not call a by-election? I'm not | :32:21. | :32:29. | |
switching parties. You are, you are becoming independent. There is a | :32:30. | :32:31. | |
difference, I've not submitted myself to the whip up a new party, | :32:32. | :32:37. | |
if I was, I would be obliged to trigger a by-election. If every time | :32:38. | :32:40. | |
an MP in the House of Commons resigned the whip or lost the whip, | :32:41. | :32:45. | |
far from actually strengthening the democracy against the party bosses, | :32:46. | :32:49. | |
that would give those who ran parties and enormous power, so I'm | :32:50. | :32:53. | |
being absolutely consistent here, I'm not joining a party. It is a | :32:54. | :32:58. | |
change of status and Nigel Farage has just said he will write to every | :32:59. | :33:04. | |
constituent in Clacton and he wants to try and get 20% of constituents | :33:05. | :33:10. | |
to older by-election. We are going to testing, he says, write to every | :33:11. | :33:15. | |
house in Clacton, find out if his constituents want a by-election, if | :33:16. | :33:20. | |
20% do we will find out if Mr Carswell is honourable. I'm sure | :33:21. | :33:22. | |
they will be delighted to hear from Nigel. There have been several | :33:23. | :33:29. | |
by-elections when Nigel has had the opportunity to contact the | :33:30. | :33:32. | |
electorate we did -- which did not always go to plan. If you got 20%, | :33:33. | :33:39. | |
would you? Yesterday I sent an e-mail to 20,000 constituents, I | :33:40. | :33:44. | |
have had a lot of responses back, overwhelmingly supported. Recently | :33:45. | :33:48. | |
you said you were 100% Ukip, now you are 0%. What happened? I saw Theresa | :33:49. | :33:55. | |
May triggering article 50, we won, Andrew. You knew a few months ago | :33:56. | :34:00. | |
she was going to do that. On June the 24th I had serious thought about | :34:01. | :34:04. | |
making the move but I wanted to be absolutely certain that Article 50 | :34:05. | :34:08. | |
would be triggered and I think it is right. This is why ultimately Ukip | :34:09. | :34:13. | |
exists, to get us out of the European Union. We should be | :34:14. | :34:15. | |
cheerful instead of attacking one another, this is our moment, we made | :34:16. | :34:21. | |
it happen. Did you try to sideline the former Ukip leader during the | :34:22. | :34:25. | |
referendum campaign? Not at all, I have been open about this, the idea | :34:26. | :34:29. | |
I have been involved in subterfuge. You try to sideline him openly | :34:30. | :34:35. | |
rather than by subterfuge? I made the point we needed to be open, | :34:36. | :34:39. | |
broad and progressive to win. I made it clear in my acceptance speech in | :34:40. | :34:43. | |
Clacton and when I said that Vote Leave should get designation that | :34:44. | :34:46. | |
the only way Euroscepticism would win was by being more than just | :34:47. | :34:50. | |
angry natives. What do you make of that? I am over the moon that we | :34:51. | :34:58. | |
have achieved Brexit, unlike Douglas I rarely have that much confidence | :34:59. | :35:04. | |
in Theresa May because history proves that she is good at talking | :35:05. | :35:07. | |
the talk but in walking the walk often fails, and I'm disappointed | :35:08. | :35:11. | |
because I wanted Douglas to be part of the post Brexit Ukip where we | :35:12. | :35:15. | |
move forward with a raft of domestic policies and go on to take seat at | :35:16. | :35:20. | |
Westminster. Do you think you try to sideline Mr Farage during the | :35:21. | :35:24. | |
referendum campaign? Vote Leave certainly didn't want Nigel Farage | :35:25. | :35:29. | |
front of house, we know that. They freely admit that, they admitted it | :35:30. | :35:36. | |
on media over the past year. Nigel still was front of house because he | :35:37. | :35:40. | |
is Nigel Farage and if it wasn't for Nigel, as I said earlier, we | :35:41. | :35:44. | |
wouldn't have at the referendum and we wouldn't have achieved Brexit | :35:45. | :35:49. | |
because Nigel Farage appeals, like Ukip to a certain section of the | :35:50. | :35:53. | |
population. If our primary motive is to get us out of the European Union, | :35:54. | :35:57. | |
why are we having this row, why can't we just celebrate what is | :35:58. | :36:01. | |
happening on Wednesday? We can, but you are far more confident that | :36:02. | :36:04. | |
Theresa May will deliver on this than I am. Ukip may have been a | :36:05. | :36:09. | |
single issue pressure group ten years ago, it wasn't a single issue | :36:10. | :36:13. | |
pressure group that you joined in 2014, it wasn't a single issue | :36:14. | :36:17. | |
pressure group that you stood for in 2015 at the general election, and | :36:18. | :36:21. | |
I'm disappointed that you have left us when we are moving onto an | :36:22. | :36:25. | |
exciting era. What specifically gives you a lack of confidence in | :36:26. | :36:30. | |
Mrs May's ability deliver? Her record as Home Secretary, she said | :36:31. | :36:33. | |
she would deal with radical Islam, nothing happened, she said she would | :36:34. | :36:38. | |
get immigration down to the tens of thousands, last year in her last | :36:39. | :36:42. | |
year as Home Secretary as city the size of Newcastle came to this | :36:43. | :36:46. | |
country, that is not tens of thousands. I think we need to take | :36:47. | :36:50. | |
yes for an answer eventually. The problem with some Eurosceptics is | :36:51. | :36:54. | |
they never accept they have won the argument. We have one, Theresa May | :36:55. | :36:59. | |
is going to do what we have wanted her to do, let's be happy, let's | :37:00. | :37:03. | |
celebrate that. But let's wait until she starts bartering things away, | :37:04. | :37:08. | |
until she betrays our fishermen, just as other Conservative prime | :37:09. | :37:10. | |
ministers have done in the past. Let's wait until we end up still | :37:11. | :37:15. | |
paying some sort of membership fee into the European Union or a large | :37:16. | :37:18. | |
divorce bill. That is not what people voted for on June the 23rd | :37:19. | :37:21. | |
and if you want to align yourself with that, you are clearly not a | :37:22. | :37:31. | |
Ukipper in my opinion. So for Ukip to have relevance, it has to go | :37:32. | :37:34. | |
wrong? I'm confident politics will come back to our terms but -- our | :37:35. | :37:40. | |
turf but there will be a post Brexit Ukip that will stand for veterans, | :37:41. | :37:44. | |
book slashing the foreign aid bill and becoming the party of law and | :37:45. | :37:49. | |
order. Finally, to you, Douglas Carswell, you say you have | :37:50. | :37:53. | |
confidence in Mrs May to deliver in the way that Paul Nuttall doesn't. | :37:54. | :37:57. | |
You backed her, you were Conservative, you believe that | :37:58. | :38:03. | |
Brexit will be delivered under a Conservative Government. Why would | :38:04. | :38:08. | |
you not bite the 2020 election as a Conservative? I feel comfortable | :38:09. | :38:12. | |
being independent. If you join a party you have to agree to a bunch | :38:13. | :38:15. | |
of stuff I would not want to agree with. I am comfortable being | :38:16. | :38:23. | |
independent. So you will go into 2020 as an independent? If you look | :38:24. | :38:27. | |
at the raising of funds, what Vote Leave did as a pop-up party... We | :38:28. | :38:31. | |
only have five seconds, will you fight as an independent in the next | :38:32. | :38:34. | |
general election? Let's wait and see. Very well! Thank you both very | :38:35. | :38:38. | |
much. In the East Midlands, after a tragic | :38:39. | :39:00. | |
week at Westminster, it is back to the politics that article 50 due to | :39:01. | :39:04. | |
be triggered this week, but is the East Midlands ready for Brexit? In | :39:05. | :39:09. | |
the EU is at the investing in a lot of money in the East Midlands and we | :39:10. | :39:13. | |
agree to miss it. I'm looking forward to sovereignty for a | :39:14. | :39:16. | |
national parliament, that was paramount to me. Are we paying too | :39:17. | :39:25. | |
much for our concert tickets? The lighthouse adding hundreds of pounds | :39:26. | :39:30. | |
to the cost. What can parliament do to stop online ticket touts who are | :39:31. | :39:33. | |
making millions out of supply and demand for tickets? My guess this | :39:34. | :39:41. | |
week, ten o'clock and is a Conservative MEP for the East | :39:42. | :39:44. | |
Midlands and Chris Leslie is Labour MP for Nottingham ace. Political | :39:45. | :39:50. | |
editor Tony Rowe, who was in Parliament as events unfolded on | :39:51. | :39:56. | |
Wednesday, is here. MR, this latest terrorist attack happened on the | :39:57. | :40:00. | |
anniversary of the attacks in Brussels, in which the EU Parliament | :40:01. | :40:04. | |
was also in lockdown. This must bring back difficult memories. You | :40:05. | :40:08. | |
were there. Absolutely, it was a very sad day. We gathered in | :40:09. | :40:13. | |
Brussels for commemorations all over the city, and it was tense already. | :40:14. | :40:17. | |
People were thinking about the memories, where we had been locked | :40:18. | :40:20. | |
inside the parliament watching and hearing about the events unfold | :40:21. | :40:26. | |
outside. I was on a train to Paris at the time when it happened. I | :40:27. | :40:32. | |
desperately hope the day will pass... Of course it had not be the | :40:33. | :40:36. | |
case. What was going to your head as you heard the events unfold? It took | :40:37. | :40:42. | |
me back. I was deeply concerned and worried about colleagues in | :40:43. | :40:46. | |
Westminster, of course, that I know every time I go to London, I step on | :40:47. | :40:51. | |
the Westminster Bridge, even though I had been net 1 million tyres and | :40:52. | :40:55. | |
take that photo from the spot, so I know just from any people out there | :40:56. | :41:00. | |
and how much it means to London and hope that we can all recover. Chris. | :41:01. | :41:07. | |
You are on a visit to Berlin on Wednesday when this tactic place. | :41:08. | :41:10. | |
Many of your colleagues in Parliament. Yes, I was watching it | :41:11. | :41:16. | |
in the same way everyone else was watching it. That was pretty | :41:17. | :41:23. | |
shocking, but I know for those of us who worked in Parliament staff, | :41:24. | :41:29. | |
tourists as well, all-round Westminster, you do kind of know | :41:30. | :41:34. | |
that this is a focal point for the nation, and if you work in | :41:35. | :41:38. | |
Westminster, there is very high security, seen the back of your mind | :41:39. | :41:42. | |
there is always that anxiety that something might happen, and | :41:43. | :41:47. | |
tragically this individual costs so much havoc in such a dreadful way, | :41:48. | :41:54. | |
and to see the loss, particularly of the police officer, everybody was | :41:55. | :41:58. | |
absolutely devastated by what happened. Tony, you were in | :41:59. | :42:02. | |
Parliament when this tactic place. What was like? Where MPs have their | :42:03. | :42:07. | |
offices and where there is a big meeting area, all of a sudden I | :42:08. | :42:13. | |
became aware of a commotion which sounded like somebody was try to get | :42:14. | :42:18. | |
into the building, and the security emerged in that way. It was only | :42:19. | :42:22. | |
when I saw people rushing in terror away from Westminster Bridge | :42:23. | :42:28. | |
outside, you could see the silhouette running past. You | :42:29. | :42:31. | |
realised that something terrible was happening. You must have been | :42:32. | :42:35. | |
scared. I think anybody in those few moments where we didn't know what | :42:36. | :42:39. | |
was happening was quite frightened by what was going on. But everyone | :42:40. | :42:45. | |
really went in the back of the building and we stay calm, and I | :42:46. | :42:48. | |
think it was a unity among the people in their, we had to stay calm | :42:49. | :42:55. | |
and do what ever the police said. Was security good enough? I was | :42:56. | :42:59. | |
slightly troubled because when it first started and we were all been | :43:00. | :43:01. | |
moved back, somebody came up to me and said, is this normal? And I | :43:02. | :43:08. | |
looked at him in a critical way, because I thought, what do you mean? | :43:09. | :43:12. | |
I realised he was a visitor, he had come to visit Parliament and he said | :43:13. | :43:16. | |
to me he had been going through security and he had been searched | :43:17. | :43:19. | |
properly, and he said they open the door and let everyone in. And I | :43:20. | :43:24. | |
thought, if he has come in without being searched, who else is coming? | :43:25. | :43:32. | |
That the troubled me. What is your abiding memory of that day, apart | :43:33. | :43:38. | |
from the tragic loss of life? For me, as we were pushed back, police | :43:39. | :43:43. | |
were racing from all corners of the building, outside, we didn't know | :43:44. | :43:46. | |
what was out there and neither did they. It was just their bravery. At | :43:47. | :43:52. | |
the end of the day, in the evening, five hours after it started, we were | :43:53. | :43:57. | |
all led out of parliament, through the passageways, under the | :43:58. | :44:00. | |
parliament building, and as we were going out, the route was lying by | :44:01. | :44:05. | |
police and security staff, the same police and been defending us. You | :44:06. | :44:13. | |
wanted to thank everyone of them. As you would expect, it is business as | :44:14. | :44:16. | |
usual in politics, and S3 Theresa May prepares to trigger article 50 | :44:17. | :44:20. | |
that can mean only one thing, Brexit on Wednesday. The premise of a | :44:21. | :44:25. | |
former give notice of our intention to leave the EU. What will it mean | :44:26. | :44:29. | |
for the East Midlands and I'll be really ready for life outside the | :44:30. | :44:37. | |
EU? Gearing up for a big change, East Midlands copies are preparing | :44:38. | :44:41. | |
for Brexit. All it is then Nigel Baxter, one of the leaders of the | :44:42. | :44:45. | |
League campaign, leaving the EU can't come soon enough. Be let in... | :44:46. | :44:53. | |
A large owner operators, all those people are still coming in, | :44:54. | :44:56. | |
enquiring about the cause and taking orders. Business has continued as | :44:57. | :45:03. | |
well if not better. Cross while bosses he have had no trouble | :45:04. | :45:06. | |
finding business, what about the workforce? One idea being discussed | :45:07. | :45:11. | |
is that a regional immigration that would let areas like London and | :45:12. | :45:14. | |
Scotland set their own targets. But would that work in East Midlands? | :45:15. | :45:19. | |
All of the examples that have successful regional immigration have | :45:20. | :45:25. | |
either people registering with the police in the know where people are, | :45:26. | :45:30. | |
or they are huge countries, like Canada as jelly, where it is not | :45:31. | :45:34. | |
easy to travel from one region to another. Doctor Williams has another | :45:35. | :45:40. | |
concern for the region's economy. My main fear is the development fund. | :45:41. | :45:47. | |
The councils promise of a job or apprenticeship for everyone to the | :45:48. | :45:53. | |
age of 24 is part funded by the EU, the tram expansion, part funded by | :45:54. | :45:56. | |
the EU. New base for college, part funded by the EU. Nothing and | :45:57. | :46:04. | |
Derbyshire working as enterprise partnership, it had money from the | :46:05. | :46:08. | |
EU in the last few years. The EU is investing a lot of money in the East | :46:09. | :46:12. | |
Midlands and we're going to miss that. I am looking for to | :46:13. | :46:16. | |
sovereignty for a national parliament, that was paramount to | :46:17. | :46:22. | |
me. I am hoping very much that we will get a trade deal that will be | :46:23. | :46:26. | |
as good as close to as good as those we have today, I see no reason why | :46:27. | :46:30. | |
that should not be. Different views about the future holds, but on | :46:31. | :46:33. | |
Wednesday the clock starts ticking and Theresa May as two years to | :46:34. | :46:38. | |
strike a deal that keeps both sides happy. As we know, Emma, you | :46:39. | :46:42. | |
campaign for us to leave the EU, but now we have two years to get all of | :46:43. | :46:47. | |
this sorted after Article 50 is triggered, is it really doable? It | :46:48. | :46:52. | |
is really happening and Diane very glad that it is happening. We've had | :46:53. | :46:55. | |
a lot of speculation is that the referendum, but this is it. It is | :46:56. | :47:01. | |
all happening, it is to kick off on Wednesday. With the exchange of | :47:02. | :47:05. | |
letters that we have, we will see how we will go forward in those | :47:06. | :47:09. | |
negotiations. I would like to see them done in parallel so we will be | :47:10. | :47:12. | |
with drying at the same time as forming a new trading relationship, | :47:13. | :47:16. | |
said it began have a smooth transition. Melgart in two years? | :47:17. | :47:20. | |
Everything can be done if you have the will to see through. That is | :47:21. | :47:24. | |
what we have to do. We have deceived the EU is ready the Tigers are they | :47:25. | :47:30. | |
going to play ball? They will be tough negotiations, no doubt about | :47:31. | :47:33. | |
it, but I think what we need to focus on is what is in both parties' | :47:34. | :47:40. | |
rightfully people. Let's reassure rightfully people. Let's reassure | :47:41. | :47:44. | |
those people that are living in the UK on the UK Brits living overseas | :47:45. | :47:48. | |
that they can continue to live and work there. Two years, is a doable? | :47:49. | :47:54. | |
I will be very surprised. Surely it has to be done because that is what | :47:55. | :47:59. | |
the remaining states want. From the British perspective it has to be. | :48:00. | :48:03. | |
You can't adjust the Willets to happen. There are two parties to | :48:04. | :48:07. | |
this negotiation. From what I heard talking to other European countries, | :48:08. | :48:16. | |
they want to prove to their members that if you leave you will be worse | :48:17. | :48:21. | |
off, and so I was getting very strong messages that the charities | :48:22. | :48:24. | |
of us getting everything that we want as is currently the case, which | :48:25. | :48:27. | |
is what David Davis has promised, is what David Davis has promised, | :48:28. | :48:31. | |
not a chance of it. You could have total negotiations I wish the Prime | :48:32. | :48:37. | |
Minister well, but I think the worry I have is about the benefits that we | :48:38. | :48:40. | |
get from the single market, that people don't yet realise in two | :48:41. | :48:46. | |
years' time we the losers. The reality is we have to be tough when | :48:47. | :48:51. | |
we go into that room. We do have to start with being prepared to walk | :48:52. | :48:56. | |
away from the table. That is how you get a tough negotiation stance. It | :48:57. | :49:01. | |
is in both parties' interests to get an arrangement put in place for | :49:02. | :49:06. | |
future trade. What role will MEPs play in this? I'm doing a lot of | :49:07. | :49:10. | |
lines building with my colleagues in the open parliament and with the | :49:11. | :49:13. | |
other countries inside the EU about what is in their best interest and | :49:14. | :49:20. | |
what those countries top priorities in... And seen how we can move | :49:21. | :49:24. | |
forward. What needs to happen is the emotion needs to come out and we | :49:25. | :49:30. | |
need to step away from this punishment Park and think about what | :49:31. | :49:33. | |
is best for the people. It all sounds very easy and simple, if | :49:34. | :49:38. | |
everybody played by those rules. If you are a Manufacturer -- | :49:39. | :49:43. | |
manufacturer or any business in the ease Midlands and you rely on | :49:44. | :49:48. | |
exports, it is the Paris that we risk having added on to the supply | :49:49. | :49:58. | |
chain, all those goods coming in, that potentially could not just have | :49:59. | :50:03. | |
higher tariffs adding to all the costs, but the friction that is | :50:04. | :50:06. | |
added in slowing down the movement of those parts across the borders, | :50:07. | :50:09. | |
this is great headers all economically. How did we get round | :50:10. | :50:14. | |
that? We do not want to have any carrots. We're going in with a zero | :50:15. | :50:19. | |
tariff stance. The reality is that we buy more of days products the | :50:20. | :50:25. | |
name by ours. They would be hurting themselves. Are the EU negotiations | :50:26. | :50:29. | |
prepared to play politics with people's livelihoods? European | :50:30. | :50:33. | |
businesses still want to do business with the UK and vice versa. It is | :50:34. | :50:37. | |
the politicians that will be getting any way to prove a political point. | :50:38. | :50:42. | |
We saw an hour film the doctor who came up with this great long list of | :50:43. | :50:46. | |
projects in the region that are funded part funded by the EU. Will | :50:47. | :50:53. | |
your Government replace of that money? European money is our money | :50:54. | :50:59. | |
that we sent to the EU, they then sent back. We contribute more than | :51:00. | :51:03. | |
we had to do receive. When we are not contributing, we will be having | :51:04. | :51:07. | |
those fans here in the UK to distribute. Will you replace those? | :51:08. | :51:12. | |
I am engaged in making sure the even distribution of that, and making | :51:13. | :51:17. | |
sure our share of it in the east Midlands, and the people I ever have | :51:18. | :51:22. | |
that local decision, some involving local government and making sure | :51:23. | :51:25. | |
they have their say about what they are going to do in terms of those | :51:26. | :51:32. | |
funds. You promised that that ?350 million a week was going to go to | :51:33. | :51:36. | |
the NHS, it was on the side of the big red bus, and amazingly all those | :51:37. | :51:39. | |
who were campaigning for Leave before the summer have been very | :51:40. | :51:45. | |
quiet about whether they will guarantee that money. The reason as | :51:46. | :51:48. | |
it wasn't true and it is not to happen. There will be billions | :51:49. | :51:54. | |
coming back from not paying to the EU. We can use those funds as we see | :51:55. | :51:59. | |
fit you promised at. That is what we're going to do and we need | :52:00. | :52:03. | |
concentrate on getting the best be -- deal when we leave Brexit, and we | :52:04. | :52:08. | |
are using our funds for the priorities that each part of our | :52:09. | :52:12. | |
country sees fit. You don't look convinced. There is the risk that we | :52:13. | :52:16. | |
have gone from austerity from the banking crisis to posterity in the | :52:17. | :52:22. | |
result of Brexit. When you see what the offers and the Treasury are | :52:23. | :52:25. | |
projecting it is going to start hitting public services, because if | :52:26. | :52:28. | |
your economy is not a strong you don't generate those revenues, you | :52:29. | :52:31. | |
cannot have it for schools and hospitals. With all the developments | :52:32. | :52:37. | |
at Westminster this week, you may have missed the news that MPs had | :52:38. | :52:40. | |
been investigating the online ticket selling business. They heard | :52:41. | :52:44. | |
evidence from one Nottingham -based company which sold millions of kids | :52:45. | :52:49. | |
from concerts early to see them being sold on other sites with | :52:50. | :52:52. | |
hundreds of pounds added to the cost. Nick Cave is back in | :52:53. | :53:04. | |
Nottingham in September, last time he was in the city was a sell-out. | :53:05. | :53:09. | |
Tickets for events are snapped up quickly, not everyone intends to go | :53:10. | :53:14. | |
to the gig, some buy to sell to secondary agencies to make money. | :53:15. | :53:18. | |
The agencies make even more. This is a really good example, go to the | :53:19. | :53:25. | |
seat tickets website, ?48 60 hoodie booking fees. Go to a secondary site | :53:26. | :53:30. | |
and they will tell you to hurry because they are selling them fast. | :53:31. | :53:35. | |
Only three left apparently. When you go through you cannot select one | :53:36. | :53:40. | |
ticket, you can only buy three tickets, and those three tickets | :53:41. | :53:48. | |
will set you back ?513. At the Commons this week they investigated | :53:49. | :53:54. | |
what they have turned ticket abuse. They began selling tickets | :53:55. | :53:56. | |
over-the-counter as a Nottingham reckoned shop. Now they sell | :53:57. | :54:00. | |
millions online a year, including big events like Glastonbury. We are | :54:01. | :54:09. | |
powerless, if you bought six tickets today, if we don't know you and you | :54:10. | :54:13. | |
bought six tickets and floated them through, we are powerless to stop | :54:14. | :54:17. | |
that. One of the secondary agencies invited get evidence failed to show | :54:18. | :54:23. | |
up. It says something about their lack of self-respect and the shady | :54:24. | :54:27. | |
nature of the operation that they feel they cannot appear here and | :54:28. | :54:31. | |
answer questions. The bands will play an anti-music won't stop, but | :54:32. | :54:36. | |
how canny moneymakers be stopped from online touting in the face of | :54:37. | :54:44. | |
supply and demand? We're joined now by Robert Wilms Hurst from the | :54:45. | :54:49. | |
Nottingham based online to get select C Tickets. You are one of the | :54:50. | :54:52. | |
big players in this industry but your company started with very | :54:53. | :54:56. | |
humble beginnings. It was a record shop when I started. I should add I | :54:57. | :55:02. | |
didn't find the business, it was a growing concern. I wanted computer | :55:03. | :55:08. | |
system to Celtic as more efficiently. I am still here and | :55:09. | :55:13. | |
selling millions of figures a year in the UK. It is a substantial | :55:14. | :55:18. | |
business. We did about ?370 million worth of business last year, which | :55:19. | :55:24. | |
is a lot of money. As we saw, you did sign up for that committee | :55:25. | :55:29. | |
meeting. But your industry does have very serious problems with touts | :55:30. | :55:33. | |
buying tickets from your website. What are you doing to stop that? It | :55:34. | :55:40. | |
is a difficult one, so we have a number of technologies that try and | :55:41. | :55:45. | |
find repeat tabs, and read them out. What we cannot do is stop | :55:46. | :55:51. | |
individuals buying six, maybe selling to whatever, the bedroom | :55:52. | :55:56. | |
taxes we -- touts as the column. It is deeper than the consumer issue. | :55:57. | :56:02. | |
It is not just about consumers not wanted the high price which is what | :56:03. | :56:07. | |
the media picked up on, but for as the wider concern is one of | :56:08. | :56:13. | |
money-laundering, organised crime and credit card fraud. What you have | :56:14. | :56:14. | |
any ticket is the base civil store any ticket is the base civil store | :56:15. | :56:20. | |
and transfer value. It is incumbent on all parties to do what it can and | :56:21. | :56:24. | |
not just say, it is just about this guide not wanted to pay twice the | :56:25. | :56:28. | |
price for this ticket. What you think we should be doing about this? | :56:29. | :56:35. | |
I had to buy tickets for Michael Boo Bley, but she was worth it. It is a | :56:36. | :56:42. | |
Buick real... I work for the Rugby union has well and bizarreness Ollie | :56:43. | :56:45. | |
time. The problem is real fans getting hands on it tickets for real | :56:46. | :56:50. | |
face value. The Government understand this that it is a very | :56:51. | :56:55. | |
forward I making amendments for the forward I making amendments for the | :56:56. | :56:58. | |
Digital economy Bill, to make sure that the use of these is not being | :56:59. | :57:02. | |
abused in order to harvest lots of tickets above the maximum in order | :57:03. | :57:06. | |
to allow more tickets to remain available for the real fans. What | :57:07. | :57:10. | |
you think about this, have you paid over the odds for a ticket? The | :57:11. | :57:21. | |
thing is, for a lot of my constituents, it is something that | :57:22. | :57:25. | |
really gets on their nerves, because they want to go to a sporting event | :57:26. | :57:30. | |
or see their favourite artist, and sometimes what they do is they | :57:31. | :57:38. | |
Google it and go to the website and the secondary sites will pop up, and | :57:39. | :57:42. | |
they will think oh well, they must be telling the truth, there are | :57:43. | :57:45. | |
noting its left. The advice tends to be to go to the registered website | :57:46. | :57:50. | |
of the artist on a sporting event, because you're much more likely to | :57:51. | :57:55. | |
get the truth about what tickets are available. We did approach via | :57:56. | :58:00. | |
go-go, but we haven't replied. They said they don't buy and sell tickets | :58:01. | :58:04. | |
but they just run a site that people can run that excel tickets on. | :58:05. | :58:12. | |
Arenas disapprove of secondary ticketing. They are members of aid | :58:13. | :58:18. | |
music industry campaign. It is the second oldest game in the book. If | :58:19. | :58:28. | |
you look... I'll such a business in France, it is quite regulated, so | :58:29. | :58:33. | |
ticket agents are licensed, and the travel agent industry the UK is | :58:34. | :58:37. | |
licensed to. That is a possible solution, so at consumer knows... Go | :58:38. | :58:48. | |
slack or MEPs be doing more? Possibly, it needs some effort. I | :58:49. | :58:51. | |
was grilled quite a bit on this at the committee. They keep saying, we | :58:52. | :58:59. | |
have legislation, but it is about enforcement. Legislation doesn't | :59:00. | :59:05. | |
stop criminality. Is very rule -- a role for the EU? Is already | :59:06. | :59:10. | |
legislation in place, it just needs to be enforced, understanding the | :59:11. | :59:15. | |
trading standards officers around the country, and around the world | :59:16. | :59:18. | |
this problem. More needs to be done this problem. More needs to be done | :59:19. | :59:22. | |
in the identification of who you are buying from. The tickets I am bought | :59:23. | :59:27. | |
were from eBay, and I knew who I was buying from. It was my choice to | :59:28. | :59:32. | |
with faceless people. That is the with faceless people. That is the | :59:33. | :59:39. | |
way consumers can behave, and there are certain technologies now in | :59:40. | :59:44. | |
terms of putting the name of the person purchasing, even the | :59:45. | :59:46. | |
photograph of them, why did he take it to prevent this stuff from | :59:47. | :59:51. | |
happening. Give as an idea of the damage that has been done to the | :59:52. | :59:57. | |
industry? It is consumer damage that is the issue. People lose faith in | :59:58. | :00:02. | |
the industry, artist like it, they delivered a price their tickets to | :00:03. | :00:07. | |
attack their fan base, so it does reflect negatively on the artist, | :00:08. | :00:11. | |
because they can be seen to be complicit. People can be deterred. | :00:12. | :00:15. | |
They go to Google first. Cross not They go to Google first. Cross not | :00:16. | :00:23. | |
in a motorbike and we're also told is that they encourage fans to go to | :00:24. | :00:26. | |
the fanfare Alliance website for tips on how to beat the ticket | :00:27. | :00:28. | |
touts. The Government is being asked for | :00:29. | :00:43. | |
?40 million to create 1000 jobs in the region's former coalfield which | :00:44. | :00:52. | |
generated -- some of the highest levels of deprivation in the | :00:53. | :00:57. | |
country. Plans to develop a form of American amusement park are expected | :00:58. | :01:01. | |
go before councillors later this year. The value is expecting a | :01:02. | :01:05. | |
planning application frame eggs of homes and retail space on the site. | :01:06. | :01:10. | |
Skills in Nottingham will be among the worst hit in the country by | :01:11. | :01:14. | |
changes to education funding, according to figures released this | :01:15. | :01:19. | |
week. The Nottingham sub MP rated in the Commons. Every school in my | :01:20. | :01:28. | |
constituency will lose an average of ?584 per pupil. Figures also | :01:29. | :01:32. | |
revealed that skills and Derby will see an average rise of almost two in | :01:33. | :01:35. | |
.5%, one of the highest in the country. -- 2.5%. And that is the | :01:36. | :01:43. | |
study we don't have any more time! Thank | :01:44. | :01:49. | |
you both for coming in, Andrew, back to you. | :01:50. | :01:55. | |
So yesterday the European Union celebrated its 60th birthday | :01:56. | :02:12. | |
at a party in Rome, the city where the founding document | :02:13. | :02:15. | |
Leaders of 27 EU countries were there to mark the occasion - | :02:16. | :02:19. | |
overshadowing it, though, the continued terrorist threat, | :02:20. | :02:21. | |
And on Wednesday Theresa May, who wasn't in Rome yesterday, | :02:22. | :02:24. | |
will trigger Article 50, formally starting | :02:25. | :02:26. | |
The President of the European Council, Donald Tusk, | :02:27. | :02:29. | |
made an appeal for unity at the gathering. | :02:30. | :02:35. | |
Today in Rome, we are renewing the unique alliance of free nations | :02:36. | :02:40. | |
that was initiated 60 years ago by our great predecessors. | :02:41. | :02:48. | |
At that time, they did not discuss multiple speeds, | :02:49. | :02:51. | |
they did not devise exits, but despite all the tragic | :02:52. | :02:55. | |
circumstances of the recent history they placed all their faith | :02:56. | :02:58. | |
Mr Tusk, he is Polish, the man that has the Council of ministers, and on | :02:59. | :03:17. | |
that council where every member of the EU sits he is an important | :03:18. | :03:21. | |
figure in what is now about to happen. We have got to negotiate our | :03:22. | :03:25. | |
divorce terms, we've got to agree a new free trade deal, new | :03:26. | :03:32. | |
crime-fighting arrangements, we've got to repatriate 50 international | :03:33. | :03:35. | |
trade agreements, and all of that has to be ratified within two years, | :03:36. | :03:40. | |
by 27 other countries. Can that really happen?! I don't think it is | :03:41. | :03:47. | |
inconceivable because it is in the interests of those 27 EU member | :03:48. | :03:51. | |
states to try and negotiate a deal that we can all live with, because | :03:52. | :03:54. | |
that would be preferable to Britain crashing out within two years. But I | :03:55. | :03:59. | |
think this is why Labour's position is becoming increasingly incoherent. | :04:00. | :04:02. | |
Keir Starmer has briefed today that he will be making a speech tomorrow | :04:03. | :04:08. | |
setting out six conditions which he wants the deal to meet, otherwise | :04:09. | :04:11. | |
Labour won't vote for it, but if Labour doesn't vote for it that | :04:12. | :04:29. | |
doesn't mean we will be able to negotiate an extension, that would | :04:30. | :04:33. | |
be incredibly difficult and require the consent of each of the 27 member | :04:34. | :04:35. | |
states, so if Labour votes against it we will just crash out, it is | :04:36. | :04:38. | |
effectively Labour saying no deal is better than a poor deal, which is | :04:39. | :04:41. | |
not supposed to be their position. Labour's position may be incoherent | :04:42. | :04:43. | |
but I was not asking about their position, I was asking about the | :04:44. | :04:45. | |
Government's position. The man heading the Badila said he wants it | :04:46. | :04:48. | |
ready by October next year so that it can go through the ratification | :04:49. | :04:50. | |
process, people looking at this would think it is Mission: | :04:51. | :04:54. | |
Impossible. It seems impossible to me to be done in that time. The fact | :04:55. | :05:00. | |
that it is 27 countries, the whole of the European Parliament as well, | :05:01. | :05:04. | |
there will be too many people throbbing spanners in the works and | :05:05. | :05:09. | |
quite rightly. We have embarked on something that is truly terrible and | :05:10. | :05:14. | |
disastrous, and the imagery we can have of those 27 countries | :05:15. | :05:19. | |
celebrating together 60 years of the most extraordinary successful | :05:20. | :05:23. | |
movement for peace, for shared European values, and others not | :05:24. | :05:29. | |
there... We were not there at the start either, and we are not there | :05:30. | :05:33. | |
now! And we have been bad partners while we were inside, but now that | :05:34. | :05:40. | |
we are leaving... They did not look like it was a birthday party to me! | :05:41. | :05:45. | |
I think it was, there was a sense of renewal, Europe exists as a place | :05:46. | :05:51. | |
envied in the world for its values, for its peacefulness, that is why | :05:52. | :05:54. | |
people flocked to its borders, that is why they come here. Can you look | :05:55. | :06:00. | |
at the agenda that faces the UK Government and EU 27, is it not | :06:01. | :06:05. | |
possible, in fact even likely, that as the process comes to an end they | :06:06. | :06:12. | |
will have to agree on a number of areas of transitional arrangements? | :06:13. | :06:16. | |
I think they will and they will have to agree that soon, I would not be | :06:17. | :06:20. | |
surprised if sometime soon there is an understanding is not a formal | :06:21. | :06:23. | |
decision that this is a process that will extend over something closer to | :06:24. | :06:28. | |
buy or seven than two years. On Wednesday article 50 will be filed | :06:29. | :06:32. | |
and there will be lots of excitement and hubbub but nothing concrete can | :06:33. | :06:35. | |
happen for a while. Elections in France in May, elections in Germany | :06:36. | :06:39. | |
which could really result in a change of Government... That is the | :06:40. | :06:52. | |
big change, Mrs Merkel might not be there by October. And who foresaw | :06:53. | :06:55. | |
that a few months ago? So you might be into 28 Dean before you are into | :06:56. | :06:57. | |
the substantive discussions about how much market access or regulatory | :06:58. | :07:00. | |
observance. I cannot see it being completed in two years. I could see, | :07:01. | :07:03. | |
if negotiations are not too acrimonious, that transitional | :07:04. | :07:07. | |
agreement taking place. Let's look at the timetable again. The council | :07:08. | :07:11. | |
doesn't meet until the end of April, it meets in the middle of the French | :07:12. | :07:14. | |
elections, the first round will have taken place, they will need a second | :07:15. | :07:18. | |
round so not much can happen. President Hollande will be | :07:19. | :07:25. | |
representing France, then the new French government, if it is Marine | :07:26. | :07:29. | |
le Pen all bets are off, but even if it is Mr Mac run, he does not have a | :07:30. | :07:33. | |
party, he will not have a majority, the French will take a long while to | :07:34. | :07:37. | |
sort out themselves. Then it is summer, we are off to the Cote | :07:38. | :07:42. | |
d'Azur, particularly the Bolivian elite, then we come back from that | :07:43. | :07:45. | |
and the Germans are in an election, it may be very messy, Mrs Merkel no | :07:46. | :07:51. | |
longer a shoo-in, it could be Mr Schultz, he may have to try to form | :07:52. | :08:04. | |
a difficult green red coalition, that would take a while. Before you | :08:05. | :08:07. | |
know it, it is Guy Fawkes' Day and no substance has taken place, yet we | :08:08. | :08:10. | |
are then less than a year before this has to be decided. It is a big | :08:11. | :08:13. | |
task and I'm sure Jana is right that there will be transitional | :08:14. | :08:15. | |
arrangements and not everything will be concluded in that two year | :08:16. | :08:19. | |
timetable, but in some respects what you have described helps those of us | :08:20. | :08:23. | |
on the Eurosceptic site because it means they cannot really be a | :08:24. | :08:27. | |
meaningful parliamentary vote on the terms of the deal because nothing is | :08:28. | :08:30. | |
going to be agreed quickly enough for them to be able to go back and | :08:31. | :08:34. | |
agree something else if Parliament rejects it, so when the Government | :08:35. | :08:38. | |
eventually have something ready to bring before Parliament it will be a | :08:39. | :08:42. | |
take it or leave it boat. How extraordinary that people who have | :08:43. | :08:47. | |
campaigned. Indeed give us our country back and say, isn't it | :08:48. | :08:50. | |
wonderful, we won't have a meaningful boat for our | :08:51. | :08:54. | |
parliamentarians of the most important... We don't know what the | :08:55. | :08:59. | |
negotiation, the package is, day by day we see more and more complicated | :09:00. | :09:03. | |
areas nobody ever thought about, nobody mentioned during the | :09:04. | :09:06. | |
campaign, all of which has to be resolved and the European Council | :09:07. | :09:12. | |
and the negotiators say nothing is agreed until everything is agreed. | :09:13. | :09:18. | |
You lead us into a catastrophe. There will be plenty of opportunity | :09:19. | :09:23. | |
for Parliament to have its say following the introduction of the | :09:24. | :09:25. | |
Great Repeal Bill, it is not as if there will be no Parliamentary time | :09:26. | :09:29. | |
devoted. The final package is what counts. We have two years to blog | :09:30. | :09:33. | |
about this! There was a big Proview -- pro-EU | :09:34. | :09:45. | |
march yesterday... I was there! Polly Toynbee was there, down to | :09:46. | :09:50. | |
Parliament Square, lots of people there marching in favour of the | :09:51. | :09:54. | |
European Union. We can see the EU flags there on flags, lots of | :09:55. | :09:59. | |
national flags as well, the British one. Polly, is it the aim of people | :10:00. | :10:08. | |
like you still to stop Brexit, or to soften Brexit? I think the aim is | :10:09. | :10:13. | |
for the best you can possibly do to limit the damage. Of course, if it | :10:14. | :10:18. | |
happens that once people have had a chance to see how much they were | :10:19. | :10:22. | |
lied to during the campaign and how dreadful the deal is likely to be, | :10:23. | :10:26. | |
if it happens that enough people in the population have changed their | :10:27. | :10:30. | |
minds, then maybe... There is no sign up yet. But we have not even | :10:31. | :10:35. | |
begun, people have not begun to confront what it is going to mean. | :10:36. | :10:39. | |
Wait and see. I think it is just being as close as we can. Is that | :10:40. | :10:44. | |
credible, do you think, to stop it or to ameliorate it in terms of the | :10:45. | :10:49. | |
Remainers? I think it is far more credible to try and stop it but even | :10:50. | :10:54. | |
then the scope is limited. It is fairly apparent Theresa May's | :10:55. | :10:57. | |
interpretation of the referendum is the country wants an end to free | :10:58. | :11:16. | |
movement, there is probably no way of doing that inside the single | :11:17. | :11:20. | |
market. She also wants external trade deals, no way of doing that | :11:21. | :11:22. | |
outside the customs unit, said the only night you can depend if you are | :11:23. | :11:25. | |
pro-European is, let's not leave without any trade pact, at least | :11:26. | :11:27. | |
let's meet Canada and have a formalised trade agreement. The idea | :11:28. | :11:30. | |
of ace -- of a very soft exit is gone now because the public really | :11:31. | :11:33. | |
did want an end to free movement and the Government really does want | :11:34. | :11:35. | |
external trade deals. It depends what changes in Europe. I think the | :11:36. | :11:42. | |
momentum behind the Remoaning movement will move away. One of the | :11:43. | :11:46. | |
banners I saw being held up yesterday by a young boy on the news | :11:47. | :11:50. | |
was, don't put my daddy on a boat. It gets a lot of its moral force | :11:51. | :11:55. | |
from the uncertainty surrounding the fate of EU nationals here and our | :11:56. | :12:00. | |
resident in the remainder of the EU and I think David Lidington is right | :12:01. | :12:04. | |
that it will be concluded quite quickly once negotiations start and | :12:05. | :12:07. | |
that will take a lot of the heat and momentum out of the remaining | :12:08. | :12:11. | |
movement. Why didn't Theresa May allow that amendment that said, we | :12:12. | :12:18. | |
will do that, as an act of generosity, we will say, of course | :12:19. | :12:20. | |
those European citizens here are welcome to stay? It would have been | :12:21. | :12:25. | |
such a good opening move in the negotiations, instead of which she | :12:26. | :12:29. | |
blocked it. It does not augur well. I have interviewed many Tories about | :12:30. | :12:35. | |
this and put that point to them but they often say the Prime minister's | :12:36. | :12:42. | |
job is to look after UK citizen in the EU... Bargaining chips, I think | :12:43. | :12:46. | |
you have to be generous and you have to wish you people in Spain and | :12:47. | :12:50. | |
everywhere else where there are British citizens would have | :12:51. | :12:53. | |
responded. The British Government did try and raise that with their EU | :12:54. | :12:56. | |
counterparts and were told, we cannot begin to talk about that | :12:57. | :13:00. | |
until article 50 has been triggered. Next week we will be able to talk | :13:01. | :13:04. | |
about it. How generous it would have been, we would have started on a | :13:05. | :13:08. | |
better note. Didn't happen, we will see what happens next with EU | :13:09. | :13:13. | |
citizens. That is it for today, the Daily Politics will be back tomorrow | :13:14. | :13:17. | |
at midday and every day next week on BBC Two as always. | :13:18. | :13:20. | |
And there's also a Question Time special live tomorrow | :13:21. | :13:22. | |
night from Birmingham - with guests including | :13:23. | :13:23. | |
the Brexit Secretary David Davis, Labour's Keir Starmer, | :13:24. | :13:26. | |
former Ukip leader Nigel Farage and the SNP's Alex Salmond - | :13:27. | :13:28. | |
I'll be back next week at 11am here on BBC One. | :13:29. | :13:34. | |
Until then, remember - if it's Sunday, it's | :13:35. | :13:38. |