Browse content similar to 15/01/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
Line | From | To | |
---|---|---|---|
It's Sunday morning, and this is the Sunday Politics. | :00:35. | :00:38. | |
Is the Prime Minister prepared to end Britain's membership | :00:39. | :00:42. | |
of the EU's single market and its customs union? | :00:43. | :00:45. | |
We preview Theresa May's big speech, as she seeks to unite the country | :00:46. | :00:48. | |
Is the press a force for good or a beast that needs taming? | :00:49. | :00:55. | |
As the Government ponders its decision, we speak to one | :00:56. | :00:58. | |
of those leading the campaign for greater regulation. | :00:59. | :01:02. | |
Just what kind of President will Donald Trump be? | :01:03. | :01:08. | |
Piers Morgan, a man who knows him well, joins us live. | :01:09. | :01:15. | |
In our region, Labour faces a by-election in Cumbria and | :01:16. | :01:18. | |
And we speak exclusively to Labour leader, Jeremy Corbyn, | :01:19. | :01:21. | |
as the Copeland campaigning gets underway. | :01:22. | :01:30. | |
And to help me make sense of all that, three of the finest | :01:31. | :01:33. | |
hacks we could persuade to work on a Sunday - Steve Richards, | :01:34. | :01:36. | |
They'll be tweeting throughout the programme, and you can join | :01:37. | :01:44. | |
So, Theresa May is preparing for her big Brexit speech on Tuesday, | :01:45. | :01:50. | |
in which she will urge people to give up on "insults" | :01:51. | :01:53. | |
and "division" and unite to build, quote, a "global Britain". | :01:54. | :01:57. | |
Some of the Sunday papers report that the Prime Minister will go | :01:58. | :02:00. | |
The Sunday Telegraph splashes with the headline: "May's big | :02:01. | :02:04. | |
gamble on a clean Brexit", saying the Prime Minister | :02:05. | :02:08. | |
will announce she's prepared to take Britain out of membership | :02:09. | :02:10. | |
of the single market and customs union. | :02:11. | :02:15. | |
The Sunday Times has a similar write-up - | :02:16. | :02:18. | |
they call it a "clean and hard Brexit". | :02:19. | :02:20. | |
The Brexit Secretary David Davis has also written a piece in the paper | :02:21. | :02:24. | |
hinting that a transitional deal could be on the cards. | :02:25. | :02:27. | |
And the Sunday Express says: "May's Brexit Battle Plan", | :02:28. | :02:30. | |
explaining that the Prime Minister will get tough with Brussels | :02:31. | :02:33. | |
and call for an end to free movement. | :02:34. | :02:36. | |
Well, let's get some more reaction on this. | :02:37. | :02:38. | |
I'm joined now from Cumbria by the leader | :02:39. | :02:40. | |
of the Liberal Democrats, Tim Farron. | :02:41. | :02:47. | |
Mr Farron, welcome back to the programme. The Prime Minister says | :02:48. | :02:52. | |
most people now just want to get on with it and make a success of it. | :02:53. | :02:56. | |
But you still want to stop it, don't you? Well, I certainly take the view | :02:57. | :03:02. | |
that heading for a hard Brexit, essentially that means being outside | :03:03. | :03:05. | |
the Single Market and the customs union, is not something that was on | :03:06. | :03:10. | |
the ballot paper last June. For Theresa May to adopt what is | :03:11. | :03:13. | |
basically the large all Farage vision of Britain's relationship | :03:14. | :03:18. | |
with Europe is not what was voted for last June. It is right for us to | :03:19. | :03:22. | |
stand up and say that a hard Brexit is not the democratic choice of the | :03:23. | :03:25. | |
British people, and that we should be fighting for the people to be the | :03:26. | :03:29. | |
ones who have the Seat the end of this process, not have it forced | :03:30. | :03:33. | |
upon them by Theresa May and David Davis. When it comes though dual | :03:34. | :03:37. | |
position that we should remain in the membership of the Single Market | :03:38. | :03:41. | |
and the customs union, it looks like you are losing the argument, doesn't | :03:42. | :03:47. | |
it? My sense is that if you believe in being in the Single Market and | :03:48. | :03:51. | |
the customs union are good things, I think many people on the leave site | :03:52. | :03:55. | |
believe that, Stephen Phillips, the Conservative MP until the autumn who | :03:56. | :04:00. | |
resigned, who voted for Leave but believe we should be in the Single | :04:01. | :04:03. | |
Market, I think those people believe that it is wrong for us to enter the | :04:04. | :04:08. | |
negotiations having given up on the most important part of it. If you | :04:09. | :04:12. | |
really are going to fight Britain's corner, then you should go in there | :04:13. | :04:15. | |
fighting the membership of the Single Market, not give up and | :04:16. | :04:21. | |
whitefly, as Theresa May has done before we even start. -- and wave | :04:22. | :04:26. | |
the white flag. Will you vote against regret Article 50 in the | :04:27. | :04:30. | |
Commons? We made it clear that we want the British people to have the | :04:31. | :04:33. | |
final Seat -- vote against triggering. Will you vote against | :04:34. | :04:38. | |
Article 50. Will you encourage the House of Lords to vote against out | :04:39. | :04:44. | |
Article 50? I don't think they will get a chance to vote. They will have | :04:45. | :04:48. | |
a chance to win the deuce amendments. One amendment we will | :04:49. | :04:51. | |
introduce is that there should be a referendum in the terms of the deal. | :04:52. | :04:56. | |
It is not right that Parliament on Government, and especially not civil | :04:57. | :04:59. | |
servants in Brussels and Whitehall, they should stitch-up the final | :05:00. | :05:03. | |
deal. That would be wrong. It is right that the British people have | :05:04. | :05:07. | |
the final say. I understand that as your position. You made it clear | :05:08. | :05:13. | |
Britain to remain a member of the Single Market on the customs union. | :05:14. | :05:16. | |
You accept, I assume, that that would mean remaining under the | :05:17. | :05:19. | |
jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice, continuing free movement | :05:20. | :05:21. | |
of people, and the free-trade deals remained in Brussels' competence. So | :05:22. | :05:28. | |
it seems to me that if you believe that being in the Single Market is a | :05:29. | :05:32. | |
good thing, then you should go and argue for that. Whilst I believe | :05:33. | :05:36. | |
that we're not going to get a better deal than the one we currently have, | :05:37. | :05:39. | |
nevertheless it is up to the Government to go and argue for the | :05:40. | :05:42. | |
best deal possible for us outside. You accept your position would mean | :05:43. | :05:47. | |
that? It would mean certainly being in the Single Market and the customs | :05:48. | :05:51. | |
union. It's no surprise to you I'm sure that the Lib Dems believe the | :05:52. | :05:54. | |
package we have got now inside the EU is going to be of the Nutley | :05:55. | :05:58. | |
better than anything we get from the outside, I accept the direction of | :05:59. | :06:02. | |
travel -- is going to be the Nutley better. At the moment, what the | :06:03. | :06:06. | |
Government are doing is assuming that all the things you say Drew, | :06:07. | :06:10. | |
and there is no way possible for us arguing for a deal that allows in | :06:11. | :06:13. | |
the Single Market without some of those other things. If they really | :06:14. | :06:16. | |
believed in the best for Britain, you would go and argue for the best | :06:17. | :06:21. | |
for Britain. Let's be clear, if we remain under the jurisdiction of the | :06:22. | :06:28. | |
ECJ, which is the court that governs membership of the Single Market, | :06:29. | :06:31. | |
continued free movement of people, the Europeans have made clear, is | :06:32. | :06:36. | |
what goes with the Single Market. And free-trade deals remaining under | :06:37. | :06:40. | |
Brussels' competence. If we accepted all of that is the price of | :06:41. | :06:44. | |
membership of the Single Market, in what conceivable way with that | :06:45. | :06:46. | |
amount to leaving the European Union? Well, for example, I do | :06:47. | :06:53. | |
believe that being a member of the Single Market is worth fighting for. | :06:54. | :06:56. | |
I personally believe that freedom of movement is a good thing. British | :06:57. | :07:00. | |
people benefit from freedom of movement. We will hugely be hit as | :07:01. | :07:04. | |
individuals and families and businesses. Mike I understand, but | :07:05. | :07:09. | |
your writing of leaving... There the butt is that if you do except that | :07:10. | :07:14. | |
freedom of movement has to change, I don't, but if you do, and if you are | :07:15. | :07:19. | |
Theresa May, and the problem is to go and fight for the best deal, | :07:20. | :07:23. | |
don't take it from Brussels that you can't be in the Single Market | :07:24. | :07:26. | |
without those other things as well, you don't go and argue the case. It | :07:27. | :07:32. | |
depresses me that Theresa May is beginning this process is waving the | :07:33. | :07:35. | |
white flag, just as this morning Jeremy Corbyn was waving the white | :07:36. | :07:40. | |
flag when it comes to it. We need a Government that will fight Britain's | :07:41. | :07:43. | |
corner and an opposition that will fight the Government to make sure | :07:44. | :07:47. | |
that it fights. Just explain to our viewers how we could remain members, | :07:48. | :07:53. | |
members of the Single Market, and not be subject to the jurisdiction | :07:54. | :07:59. | |
of the European court? So, first of all we spent over the last many, | :08:00. | :08:03. | |
many years, the likes of Nigel Farage and others, will have argued, | :08:04. | :08:06. | |
you heard them on this very programme, that Britain should | :08:07. | :08:10. | |
aspire to be like Norway and Switzerland for example, countries | :08:11. | :08:13. | |
that are not in the European Union but aren't the Single Market. It is | :08:14. | :08:17. | |
very clear to me that if you want the best deal for Britain -- but are | :08:18. | :08:21. | |
in the Single Market. You go and argue for the best deal. What is the | :08:22. | :08:25. | |
answer to my question, you haven't answered it | :08:26. | :08:31. | |
the question is, how does the Prime Minister go and fight for the best | :08:32. | :08:36. | |
deal for Britain. If we think that being in the Single Market is the | :08:37. | :08:41. | |
right thing, not Baxter -- not access to it but membership of it, | :08:42. | :08:45. | |
you don't wave the white flag before you enter the negotiating room. I'm | :08:46. | :08:48. | |
afraid we have run out of time. Thank you, Tim Farron. | :08:49. | :08:52. | |
The leaks on this speech on Tuesday we have seen, it is interesting that | :08:53. | :08:58. | |
Downing Street has not attempted to dampen them down this morning, in | :08:59. | :09:06. | |
the various papers, do they tell us something new? Do they tell us more | :09:07. | :09:10. | |
of the Goverment's aims in the Brexit negotiations? I think it's | :09:11. | :09:14. | |
only a confirmation of something which has been in the mating really | :09:15. | :09:17. | |
for the six months that she's been in the job. The logic of everything | :09:18. | :09:23. | |
that she's said since last July, the keenness on re-gaining control of | :09:24. | :09:28. | |
migration, the desire to do international trade deals, the fact | :09:29. | :09:31. | |
that she is appointed trade Secretary, the logic of all of that | :09:32. | :09:34. | |
is that we are out of the Single Market, quite probably out of the | :09:35. | :09:37. | |
customs union, what will happen this week is a restatement of a fairly | :09:38. | :09:41. | |
clear position anyway. I think Tim Farron is right about one thing, I | :09:42. | :09:45. | |
don't think she will go into the speech planning to absolutely | :09:46. | :09:48. | |
definitively say, we are leaving those things. Because even if there | :09:49. | :09:56. | |
is a 1% chance of a miracle deal, where you stay in the Single Market, | :09:57. | :09:58. | |
somehow get exempted from free movement, it is prudent to keep | :09:59. | :10:01. | |
hopes on that option as a Prime Minister. -- to keep open that | :10:02. | :10:06. | |
option. She is being advised both by the diplomatic corps and her | :10:07. | :10:09. | |
personal advisers, don't concede on membership of the Single Market yet. | :10:10. | :10:12. | |
We know it's not going to happen, but let them Europeans knock us back | :10:13. | :10:21. | |
on that,... That is probably the right strategy for all of the | :10:22. | :10:25. | |
reasons that Jarlan outlined there. What we learned a bit today is the | :10:26. | :10:29. | |
possibility of some kind of transition or arrangements, which | :10:30. | :10:32. | |
David Davies has been talking about in a comment piece for one of the | :10:33. | :10:36. | |
Sunday papers. My sense from Brexiteers aborting MPs is that they | :10:37. | :10:41. | |
are very happy with 90% of the rhetoric -- Brexit sporting MPs. The | :10:42. | :10:45. | |
rhetoric has not been dampened down by MPs, apart from this transitional | :10:46. | :10:52. | |
arrangement, which they feel and two France, on the one front will | :10:53. | :10:55. | |
encourage the very dilatory EU to spend longer than ever negotiating a | :10:56. | :10:59. | |
deal, and on the other hand will also be exactly what our civil | :11:00. | :11:03. | |
service looks for in stringing things out. What wasn't explained | :11:04. | :11:07. | |
this morning is what David Davies means by transitional is not that | :11:08. | :11:11. | |
you negotiate what you can in two years and then spend another five | :11:12. | :11:14. | |
years on the matter is that a lot of the soul. He thinks everything has | :11:15. | :11:20. | |
to be done in the two years, -- of the matter are hard to solve. But it | :11:21. | :11:23. | |
would include transitional arrangements over the five years. | :11:24. | :11:28. | |
What we are seeing in the build-up is the danger of making these kind | :11:29. | :11:33. | |
of speeches. In a way, I kind of admired her not feeding the media | :11:34. | :11:36. | |
machine over the autumn and the end of last year cars, as Janan has | :11:37. | :11:42. | |
pointed out in his columns, she has actually said quite a lot from it, | :11:43. | :11:46. | |
you would extrapolate quite a lot. We won't be members of the Single | :11:47. | :11:51. | |
Market? She said that in the party conference speech, we are out of | :11:52. | :11:57. | |
European court. Her red line is the end of free movement, so we are out | :11:58. | :12:01. | |
of the Single Market. Why has she sent Liam Fox to negotiate all of | :12:02. | :12:05. | |
these other deals, not that he will succeed necessarily, but that is the | :12:06. | :12:09. | |
intention? We are still in the customs union. You can extrapolate | :12:10. | :12:12. | |
what she will say perhaps more cautiously in the headlines on | :12:13. | :12:17. | |
Tuesday. But the grammar of a big speech raises expectations, gets the | :12:18. | :12:20. | |
markets worked up. So she is doing it because people have said that she | :12:21. | :12:24. | |
doesn't know what she's on about. But maybe she should have resisted | :12:25. | :12:28. | |
it. Very well, and she hasn't. The speech is on Tuesday morning. | :12:29. | :12:31. | |
Now, the public consultation on press regulation closed this | :12:32. | :12:34. | |
week, and soon ministers will have to decide whether to | :12:35. | :12:36. | |
enact a controversial piece of legislation. | :12:37. | :12:38. | |
Section 40 of the Crime and Courts Act, if implemented, | :12:39. | :12:40. | |
could see newspapers forced to pay legal costs in libel and privacy | :12:41. | :12:43. | |
If they don't sign up to an officially approved regulator. | :12:44. | :12:53. | |
The newspapers say it's an affront to a free press, | :12:54. | :12:55. | |
while pro-privacy campaigners say it's the only way to ensure | :12:56. | :12:58. | |
a scandal like phone-hacking can't happen again. | :12:59. | :12:59. | |
Ellie Price has been reading all about it. | :13:00. | :13:05. | |
It was the biggest news about the news for decades, | :13:06. | :13:09. | |
a scandal that involved household names, but not just celebrities. | :13:10. | :13:14. | |
They've even hacked the phone of a murdered schoolgirl. | :13:15. | :13:17. | |
It led to the closure of the News Of The World, | :13:18. | :13:20. | |
a year-long public inquiry headed up by the judge Lord Justice Leveson, | :13:21. | :13:29. | |
and in the end, a new press watchdog set up by Royal Charter, | :13:30. | :13:33. | |
which could impose, among other things, million-pound fines. | :13:34. | :13:34. | |
If this system is implemented, the country should have confidence | :13:35. | :13:37. | |
that the terrible suffering of innocent victims | :13:38. | :13:38. | |
like the Dowlers, the McCanns and Christopher Jefferies should | :13:39. | :13:41. | |
To get this new plan rolling, the Government also passed | :13:42. | :13:47. | |
the Crime and Courts Act, Section 40 of which would force | :13:48. | :13:51. | |
publications who didn't sign up to the new regulator to pay legal | :13:52. | :13:54. | |
costs in libel and privacy cases, even if they won. | :13:55. | :13:58. | |
It's waiting for sign-off from the Culture Secretary. | :13:59. | :14:01. | |
We've got about 50 publications that have signed up... | :14:02. | :14:05. | |
This is Impress, the press regulator that's got the backing | :14:06. | :14:08. | |
of the Royal Charter, so its members are protected | :14:09. | :14:13. | |
from the penalties that would be imposed by Section 40. | :14:14. | :14:17. | |
It's funded by the Formula One tycoon Max Mosley's | :14:18. | :14:22. | |
I think the danger if we don't get Section 40 is that | :14:23. | :14:28. | |
you have an incomplete Leveson project. | :14:29. | :14:29. | |
I think it's very, very likely that within the next five or ten years | :14:30. | :14:32. | |
there will be a scandal, there'll be a crisis in press | :14:33. | :14:35. | |
standards, everyone will be saying to the Government, | :14:36. | :14:37. | |
"Why on Earth didn't you sort things out when you had the chance?" | :14:38. | :14:40. | |
Isn't Section 40 essentially just a big stick to beat | :14:41. | :14:43. | |
We hear a lot about the stick part, but there's also a big juicy carrot | :14:44. | :14:51. | |
for publishers and their journalists who are members of an | :14:52. | :14:53. | |
They get huge new protections from libel threats, | :14:54. | :14:56. | |
from privacy actions, which actually means they've got | :14:57. | :14:58. | |
a lot more opportunity to run investigative stories. | :14:59. | :15:07. | |
Impress has a big image problem - not a single national | :15:08. | :15:10. | |
Instead, many of them are members of Ipso, | :15:11. | :15:15. | |
the independent regulator set up and funded by the industry that | :15:16. | :15:18. | |
doesn't seek the recognition of the Royal Charter. | :15:19. | :15:24. | |
The male cells around 22,000 each day... | :15:25. | :15:27. | |
There are regional titles too, who, like the Birmingham Mail, | :15:28. | :15:29. | |
won't sign up to Impress, even if they say the costs | :15:30. | :15:32. | |
are associated with Section 40 could put them out of business. | :15:33. | :15:36. | |
Impress has an umbilical cord that goes directly back to Government | :15:37. | :15:39. | |
through the recognition setup that it has. | :15:40. | :15:40. | |
Now, we broke free of the shackles of the regulated press | :15:41. | :15:43. | |
when the stamp duty was revealed 150 years ago. | :15:44. | :15:46. | |
If we go back to this level of oversight, then I think | :15:47. | :15:53. | |
we turn the clock back, 150 years of press freedom. | :15:54. | :15:58. | |
The responses from the public have been coming thick and fast | :15:59. | :16:01. | |
since the Government launched its consultation | :16:02. | :16:02. | |
In fact, by the time it closed on Tuesday, | :16:03. | :16:05. | |
And for that reason alone, it could take months before | :16:06. | :16:10. | |
a decision on what happens next is taken. | :16:11. | :16:14. | |
The Government will also be minded to listen to its own MPs, | :16:15. | :16:17. | |
One described it to me as Draconian and hugely damaging. | :16:18. | :16:23. | |
So, will the current Culture Secretary's thinking be | :16:24. | :16:25. | |
I don't think the Government will repeal section 40. | :16:26. | :16:34. | |
What I'm arguing for is not to implement it, but it will remain | :16:35. | :16:37. | |
on the statute book and if it then became apparent that Ipso simply | :16:38. | :16:42. | |
was failing to work, was not delivering effective | :16:43. | :16:45. | |
regulation and the press were behaving in a way | :16:46. | :16:48. | |
which was wholly unacceptable, as they were ten years ago, | :16:49. | :16:53. | |
then there might be an argument at that time to think well in that | :16:54. | :16:57. | |
case we are going to have to take further measures, | :16:58. | :16:59. | |
The future of section 40 might not be so black and white. | :17:00. | :17:04. | |
I'm told a compromise could be met whereby the punitive parts | :17:05. | :17:07. | |
about legal costs are dropped, but the incentives | :17:08. | :17:11. | |
to join a recognised regulator are beefed up. | :17:12. | :17:14. | |
But it could yet be some time until the issue of press freedom | :17:15. | :17:17. | |
I'm joined now by Max Mosley - he won a legal case against the News | :17:18. | :17:27. | |
Of The World after it revealed details about his private life, | :17:28. | :17:30. | |
and he now campaigns for more press regulation. | :17:31. | :17:34. | |
Are welcome to the programme. Let me ask you this, how can it be right | :17:35. | :17:43. | |
that you, who many folk think have a clear vendetta against the British | :17:44. | :17:47. | |
press, can bankroll a government approved regulator of the press? If | :17:48. | :17:52. | |
we hadn't done it, nobody would, section 40 would never have come | :17:53. | :17:56. | |
into force because there would never have been a regulator. It is | :17:57. | :18:00. | |
absolutely wrong that a family trust should have to finance something | :18:01. | :18:05. | |
like this. It should be financed by the press or the Government. If we | :18:06. | :18:10. | |
hadn't done it there would be no possibility of regulation. But it | :18:11. | :18:11. | |
means we end up with a regulator financed by you, as I say | :18:12. | :18:39. | |
many people think you have a clear vendetta against the press. Where | :18:40. | :18:41. | |
does the money come from? From a family trust, it is family money. | :18:42. | :18:43. | |
You have to understand that somebody had to do this. I understand that. | :18:44. | :18:46. | |
People like to know where the money comes from, I think you said it came | :18:47. | :18:49. | |
from Brixton Steyn at one stage. Ages ago my father had a trust there | :18:50. | :18:52. | |
but now all my money is in the UK. We are clear about that, but this is | :18:53. | :18:56. | |
money that was put together by your father. Yes, my father inherited it | :18:57. | :19:02. | |
from his father and his father. The whole of Manchester once belonged to | :19:03. | :19:06. | |
the family, that's why there is a Mosley Street. That is irrelevant | :19:07. | :19:11. | |
because as we have given the money, I have no control. If you do the | :19:12. | :19:14. | |
most elementary checks into the contract between my family trust, | :19:15. | :19:24. | |
the trust but finances Impress, it is impossible for me to exert any | :19:25. | :19:29. | |
influence. It is just the same as if it had come from the National | :19:30. | :19:35. | |
lottery. People will find it ironic that the money has come from | :19:36. | :19:40. | |
historically Britain's best-known fascist. No, it has come from my | :19:41. | :19:49. | |
family, the Mosley family. This is complete drivel because we have no | :19:50. | :19:53. | |
control. Where the money comes from doesn't matter, if it had come from | :19:54. | :19:58. | |
the national lottery it would be exactly the same. Impress was | :19:59. | :20:02. | |
completely independent. But it wouldn't exist without your money, | :20:03. | :20:08. | |
wouldn't it? But that doesn't give you influence. It might exist | :20:09. | :20:12. | |
because it was founded before I was ever in contact with them. Isn't it | :20:13. | :20:18. | |
curious then that so many leading light show your hostile views of the | :20:19. | :20:22. | |
press? I don't think it is because I don't know a single member of the | :20:23. | :20:28. | |
Impress board. The chairman I have met months. The only person I know | :20:29. | :20:33. | |
is Jonathan Hayward who you had on just now. In one recent months he | :20:34. | :20:40. | |
tweeted 50 attacks on the Daily Mail, including some calling for an | :20:41. | :20:46. | |
advertising boycott of the paper. He also liked a Twitter post calling me | :20:47. | :20:52. | |
Daily Mail and neofascist rag. Are these fitting for what is meant to | :20:53. | :20:57. | |
be impartial regulator? The person you should ask about that is the | :20:58. | :21:01. | |
press regulatory panel and they are completely independent, they | :21:02. | :21:05. | |
reviewed the whole thing. You have probably produced something very | :21:06. | :21:10. | |
selective, I have no idea but I am certain that these people are | :21:11. | :21:12. | |
absolutely trustworthy and independent. It is not just Mr | :21:13. | :21:17. | |
Hayward, we have a tonne of things he has tweeted calling for boycotts, | :21:18. | :21:22. | |
remember this is the man that would be the regulator of these papers. | :21:23. | :21:28. | |
He's the chief executive, that is a separate thing. The administration, | :21:29. | :21:34. | |
the regulator. Many leading light show your vendetta of the press. I | :21:35. | :21:43. | |
do not have a vendetta. Let's take another one. This person is on the | :21:44. | :21:59. | |
code committee. Have a look at this. As someone with these views fit to | :22:00. | :22:05. | |
be involved in the regulation of the press? You said I have a vendetta | :22:06. | :22:09. | |
against the press, I do not, I didn't say that and it is completely | :22:10. | :22:14. | |
wrong to say I have a vendetta. What do you think of that? I don't agree, | :22:15. | :22:20. | |
I wouldn't ban the Daily Mail, I think it's a dreadful paper but I | :22:21. | :22:31. | |
wouldn't ban it. Another Impress code committee said I hate the Daily | :22:32. | :22:39. | |
Mail, I couldn't agree more, others have called for a boycott. Other | :22:40. | :22:43. | |
people can say what they want and many people may think they are right | :22:44. | :22:47. | |
but surely these views make them unfit to be partial regulators? I | :22:48. | :22:54. | |
have no influence over Impress therefore I cannot say anything | :22:55. | :22:57. | |
about it. You should ask them, not me. All I have done is make it | :22:58. | :23:03. | |
possible for Impress to exist and that was the right thing to do. I'm | :23:04. | :23:09. | |
asking you if people with these kind of views are fit to be regulators of | :23:10. | :23:15. | |
the press. You would have to ask about all of their views, these are | :23:16. | :23:20. | |
some of their views. A lot of people have a downer on the Daily Mail and | :23:21. | :23:27. | |
the Sun, it doesn't necessarily make them party pre-. Why would | :23:28. | :23:31. | |
newspapers sign up to a regulator run by what they think is run by | :23:32. | :23:37. | |
enemies out to ruin them. If they don't like it they should start | :23:38. | :23:41. | |
their own section 40 regulator. They could make it so recognised, if only | :23:42. | :23:48. | |
they would make it independent of the big newspaper barons but they | :23:49. | :23:57. | |
won't -- they could make Ipso recognised. Is the Daily Mail | :23:58. | :24:07. | |
fascist? It certainly was in the 1930s. Me and my father are | :24:08. | :24:11. | |
relevant, this whole section 40 issue is about access to justice. | :24:12. | :24:16. | |
The press don't want ordinary people who cannot afford to bring an action | :24:17. | :24:20. | |
against the press, don't want them to have access to justice. I can | :24:21. | :24:24. | |
understand that but I don't sympathise. What would happen to the | :24:25. | :24:30. | |
boss of Ofcom, which regulates broadcasters, if it described | :24:31. | :24:37. | |
Channel 4 News is a Marxist scum? If the press don't want to sign up to | :24:38. | :24:46. | |
Impress they can create their own regulator. If you were to listen we | :24:47. | :24:55. | |
would get a lot further. The press should make their own Levenson | :24:56. | :25:00. | |
compliant regulator, then they would have no complaints at all. Even | :25:01. | :25:05. | |
papers like the Guardian, the Independent, the Financial Times, | :25:06. | :25:09. | |
they show your hostility to tabloid journalism. They have refused to be | :25:10. | :25:16. | |
regulated by Impress. I will say it again, the press could start their | :25:17. | :25:20. | |
own regulator, they do not have to sign... Yes, but Levenson compliant | :25:21. | :25:25. | |
one giving access to justice so people who cannot afford an | :25:26. | :25:30. | |
expensive legal action have a proper arbitration service. The Guardian, | :25:31. | :25:33. | |
the Independent, the Financial Times, they don't want to do that | :25:34. | :25:38. | |
either. That would suggest there is something fatally flawed about your | :25:39. | :25:43. | |
approach. Even these kind of papers, the Guardian, Impress is hardly | :25:44. | :25:55. | |
independent, the head of... Andrew, I am sorry, you are like a dog with | :25:56. | :26:04. | |
a bone. The press could start their own regulator, then people like the | :26:05. | :26:08. | |
Financial Times, the Guardian and so one could decide whether they wanted | :26:09. | :26:11. | |
to join or not but what is absolutely vital is that we should | :26:12. | :26:15. | |
have a proper arbitration service so that people who cannot afford an | :26:16. | :26:18. | |
expensive action have somewhere to go. This business of section 40 | :26:19. | :26:24. | |
which you want to be triggered which would mean papers that didn't sign | :26:25. | :26:28. | |
up to Impress could be sued in any case and they would have to pay | :26:29. | :26:32. | |
potentially massive legal costs, even if they win. Yes. This is what | :26:33. | :26:40. | |
the number of papers have said about this, if section 40 was triggered, | :26:41. | :26:46. | |
the Guardian wouldn't even think of investigation. The Sunday Times said | :26:47. | :26:53. | |
it would not have even started to expose Lance Armstrong. The Times | :26:54. | :26:56. | |
journalist said he couldn't have done the Rotherham child abuse | :26:57. | :27:01. | |
scandal. What they all come it is a full reading of section 40 because | :27:02. | :27:05. | |
that cost shifting will only apply if, and I quote, it is just and | :27:06. | :27:12. | |
equitable in all the circumstances. I cannot conceive of any High Court | :27:13. | :27:16. | |
judge, for example the Lance Armstrong case or the child abuse, | :27:17. | :27:21. | |
saying it is just as equitable in all circumstances the newspaper | :27:22. | :27:26. | |
should pay these costs. Even the editor of index on censorship, which | :27:27. | :27:32. | |
is hardly the Sun, said this would be oppressive and they couldn't do | :27:33. | :27:36. | |
what they do, they would risk being sued by warlords. No because if | :27:37. | :27:42. | |
something unfortunate, some really bad person sues them, what would | :27:43. | :27:47. | |
happen is the judge would say it is just inequitable normal | :27:48. | :27:50. | |
circumstances that person should pay. Section 40 is for the person | :27:51. | :27:54. | |
that comes along and says to a big newspaper, can we go to arbitration | :27:55. | :27:58. | |
because I cannot afford to go to court. The big newspaper says no. | :27:59. | :28:03. | |
That leaves less than 1% of the population with any remedy if the | :28:04. | :28:08. | |
newspapers traduce them. It cannot be right. From the Guardian to the | :28:09. | :28:14. | |
Sun, and including Index On Censorship, all of these media | :28:15. | :28:20. | |
outlets think you are proposing a charter for conmen, warlords, crime | :28:21. | :28:23. | |
bosses, dodgy politicians, celebrities with a grievance against | :28:24. | :28:27. | |
the press. I will give you the final word to address that. It is pure | :28:28. | :28:36. | |
guff and the reason is they want to go on marking their own homework. | :28:37. | :28:40. | |
The press don't want anyone to make sure life is fair. All I want is | :28:41. | :28:45. | |
somebody who has got no money to be able to sue in just the way that I | :28:46. | :28:49. | |
can. All right, thanks for being with us. | :28:50. | :28:53. | |
The doctors' union, the British Medical Association, | :28:54. | :28:55. | |
has said the Government is scapegoating GPs in England | :28:56. | :28:57. | |
The Government has said GP surgeries must try harder to stay | :28:58. | :29:01. | |
open from 8am to 8pm, or they could lose out on funding. | :29:02. | :29:04. | |
The pressure on A services in recent weeks has been intense. | :29:05. | :29:06. | |
It emerged this week that 65 of the 152 Health Trusts in England | :29:07. | :29:10. | |
had issued an operational pressure alert in the first | :29:11. | :29:12. | |
At either level three, meaning major pressures, | :29:13. | :29:18. | |
or level four, indicating an inability to deliver | :29:19. | :29:20. | |
On Monday, Health Secretary Jeremy Hunt told the Commons | :29:21. | :29:26. | |
that the number of people using A had increased by 9 million | :29:27. | :29:29. | |
But that 30% of those visits were unnecessary. | :29:30. | :29:37. | |
He said that the situation at a number of Trusts | :29:38. | :29:39. | |
On Tuesday, the Royal College of Physicians wrote | :29:40. | :29:44. | |
to the Prime Minister saying the health service was being | :29:45. | :29:47. | |
paralysed by spiralling demand, and urging greater investment. | :29:48. | :29:52. | |
On Wednesday, the Chief Executive of NHS England, Simon Stevens, | :29:53. | :29:56. | |
told a Select Committee that NHS funding will be highly constrained. | :29:57. | :30:01. | |
And from 2018, real-terms spending per person would fall. | :30:02. | :30:05. | |
The Prime Minister described the Red Cross's claim that A | :30:06. | :30:09. | |
was facing a "humanitarian crisis" as "irresponsible and overblown". | :30:10. | :30:13. | |
And the National Audit Office issued a report that found almost half, | :30:14. | :30:16. | |
46%, of GP surgeries closed at some point during core hours. | :30:17. | :30:23. | |
Yesterday, Mrs May signalled her support for doctors' surgeries | :30:24. | :30:27. | |
opening from 8am to 8pm every day of the week, in order to divert | :30:28. | :30:31. | |
To discuss this, I'm joined now by the Conservative | :30:32. | :30:38. | |
MP Maria Caulfield - she was an NHS nurse in a former | :30:39. | :30:40. | |
life - and Clare Gerada, a former chair of the Royal College | :30:41. | :30:43. | |
Welcome to you both. So, Maria Caulfield, what the Government is | :30:44. | :30:53. | |
saying, Downing Street in effect is saying that GPs do not work hard | :30:54. | :30:58. | |
enough and that's the reason why A was under such pressure? No, I don't | :30:59. | :31:01. | |
think that is the message, I think that is the message that the media | :31:02. | :31:05. | |
have taken up. That is not the expression that we want to give. I | :31:06. | :31:10. | |
still work as a nurse, I know how hard doctors work in hospitals and | :31:11. | :31:14. | |
GP practices. When the rose 30% of people turning up at A for neither | :31:15. | :31:19. | |
an accident or an emergency, we do need to look at alternative. Where | :31:20. | :31:24. | |
is the GPs' operability in this? We know from patients that if they | :31:25. | :31:28. | |
cannot get access to GPs, they will do one of three things. They will | :31:29. | :31:31. | |
wait two or three weeks until they can get an appointment, they will | :31:32. | :31:35. | |
forget about the problem altogether, which is not good, we want patients | :31:36. | :31:39. | |
to be getting investigations at early stages, or they will go to | :31:40. | :31:48. | |
A And that is a problem. I'm not quite sure what the role that GPs | :31:49. | :31:51. | |
play in this. What is your response in that? I think about 70% of | :31:52. | :31:54. | |
patients that I see should not be seen by me but should still be seen | :31:55. | :31:57. | |
by hospital consultants. If we look at it from GPs' eyes and not from | :31:58. | :32:01. | |
hospital's eyes, because that is what it is, we might get somewhere. | :32:02. | :32:05. | |
Tomorrow morning, every practice in England will have about 1.5 GPs | :32:06. | :32:10. | |
shot, that's not even counting if there is traffic problems, sickness | :32:11. | :32:15. | |
or whatever. -- GPs shot. We cannot work any harder, I cannot | :32:16. | :32:18. | |
physically, emotionally work any harder. We are open 12 hours a day, | :32:19. | :32:26. | |
most of us, I run practices open 365 days per year 24 hours a day. I | :32:27. | :32:30. | |
don't understand this. It is one thing attacking me as a GP from | :32:31. | :32:34. | |
working hard enough, but it is another thing saying that GPs as a | :32:35. | :32:37. | |
profession and doing what they should be doing. Let me in National | :32:38. | :32:43. | |
Audit Office has coming up with these figures showing that almost | :32:44. | :32:50. | |
half of doctors' practices are not open during core hours at some part | :32:51. | :32:53. | |
of the week. That's where the implication comes, that they are not | :32:54. | :32:57. | |
working hard enough. What do you say to that? I don't recognise this. I'm | :32:58. | :33:02. | |
not being defensive, I'm just don't recognise it. There are practices | :33:03. | :33:06. | |
working palliative care services, practices have to close home visits | :33:07. | :33:09. | |
if they are single-handed, some of us are working in care homes during | :33:10. | :33:13. | |
the day. They may shot for an hour in the middle of the data will sort | :33:14. | :33:20. | |
out some of the prescriptions and admin -- they may shot. My practice | :33:21. | :33:22. | |
runs a number of practices across London. If we shut during our | :33:23. | :33:25. | |
contractual hours we would have NHS England coming down on us like a | :33:26. | :33:30. | |
tonne of bricks. Maria Caulfield, I'm struggling to understand, given | :33:31. | :33:35. | |
the problems the NHS faces, particularly in our hospitals, what | :33:36. | :33:37. | |
this has got to do with the solution? Obviously there are GP | :33:38. | :33:41. | |
practices that are working, you know, over and above the hours. But | :33:42. | :33:46. | |
there are some GP practices, we know from National Audit Office, there | :33:47. | :33:52. | |
are particular black sports -- blackspots in the country that only | :33:53. | :33:55. | |
offer services for three hours a week. That's causing problems if | :33:56. | :33:58. | |
they cannot get to see a GP they will go and use A Nobody is | :33:59. | :34:03. | |
saying that this measure would solve problems at A, it would address | :34:04. | :34:07. | |
one small part of its top blog we shouldn't be starting this, as I | :34:08. | :34:11. | |
keep saying, please to this from solving the problems at A We | :34:12. | :34:15. | |
should be starting it from solving the problems of the patients in | :34:16. | :34:19. | |
their totality, the best place they should go, not from A This really | :34:20. | :34:25. | |
upsets me, as a GP I am there to be a proxy A doctor. I am a GP, a | :34:26. | :34:30. | |
highly skilled doctor, looking after patients from cradle to grave across | :34:31. | :34:34. | |
the physical, psychological and social, I am not an A doctor. I | :34:35. | :34:40. | |
don't disagree with that, nobody is saying that GPs are not working hard | :34:41. | :34:44. | |
enough. You just did, actually, about some of them. In some | :34:45. | :34:48. | |
practices, what we need to see, it's not just GPs in GP surgeries, it is | :34:49. | :34:53. | |
advanced nurse practitioners, pharmacists. It doesn't necessarily | :34:54. | :34:57. | |
need to be all on the GPs. I think advanced nurse practitioners are in | :34:58. | :35:02. | |
short supply. Position associate or go to hospital, -- physician | :35:03. | :35:06. | |
associates. We have very few trainees, junior doctors in general | :35:07. | :35:10. | |
practice, unlike hospitals, which tend to have some slack with the | :35:11. | :35:13. | |
junior doctor community and workforce. This isn't an argument, | :35:14. | :35:18. | |
this is about saying, let's stop looking at the National health | :35:19. | :35:21. | |
system as a National hospital system. GPs tomorrow will see about | :35:22. | :35:27. | |
1.3 million patients. That is a lot of thoughtful. A lot of activity | :35:28. | :35:32. | |
with no resources. If you wanted the GPs to behave better, in your terms, | :35:33. | :35:37. | |
when you allocated more money to GPs, part of the reforms, because | :35:38. | :35:41. | |
that's where it went, shouldn't you have targeted it more closely to | :35:42. | :35:45. | |
where they want to operate? That is exactly what the Prime Minister is | :35:46. | :35:49. | |
saying, extra funding is being made available by GPs to extend hours and | :35:50. | :35:53. | |
services. If certain GP practices cannot do that, the money will | :35:54. | :35:56. | |
follow the patient to where they move onto. We have no doctors to do | :35:57. | :36:00. | |
it. I was on a coach last week, the coach driver stopped in the service | :36:01. | :36:03. | |
station for an hour, they were stopping for a rest. We cannot do | :36:04. | :36:08. | |
it. Even if you gave us millions more money, and thankfully NHS is | :36:09. | :36:15. | |
recognising that we need a solution through the five-day week, we | :36:16. | :36:17. | |
haven't got the doctors to deliver this. It would take a while to get | :36:18. | :36:21. | |
them? That's my point, that's why we need to be using all how care | :36:22. | :36:24. | |
professional. Even if you got this right, would it make a difference to | :36:25. | :36:27. | |
what many regard as the crisis in our hospitals? I think it would. If | :36:28. | :36:31. | |
you look at patients, they just want to go to a service that will address | :36:32. | :36:36. | |
the problems. In Scotland for example, pharmacists have their own | :36:37. | :36:40. | |
patient list. Patients go and see the pharmacists first. There are | :36:41. | :36:43. | |
lots of conditions, for example if you want anticoagulants, you don't | :36:44. | :36:49. | |
necessarily need to see a doctor, a pharmacist can manage that and free | :36:50. | :36:53. | |
up the doctor in other ways. The Prime Minister has said that if | :36:54. | :36:57. | |
things do not change she is threatening to reduce funding to | :36:58. | :37:00. | |
doctors who do not comply. Can you both agree, that is probably an | :37:01. | :37:03. | |
empty threat, that's not going to happen? I hope it's an empty threat. | :37:04. | :37:08. | |
We're trying our best. People like me in my profession, the seniors in | :37:09. | :37:12. | |
our profession, are really trying to pull up morale and get people into | :37:13. | :37:16. | |
general practice, which is a wonderful profession, absolutely | :37:17. | :37:20. | |
wonderful place to be. But slapping us off and telling us that we are | :37:21. | :37:24. | |
lazy really doesn't help. I really don't think anybody is doing that. | :37:25. | :37:28. | |
We have run out of time, but I'm certain that we will be back to the | :37:29. | :37:31. | |
subject before this winter is out. It's just gone 11:35am, | :37:32. | :37:33. | |
you're watching the Sunday Politics. We say goodbye to viewers | :37:34. | :37:36. | |
in Scotland, who leave us now Hello and the warmest of welcomes | :37:37. | :37:38. | |
to your local part of the show and 2017 is already shaping up to be | :37:39. | :37:59. | |
full of political drama again. As by-elections are in the offings, | :38:00. | :38:02. | |
Jeremy Corbyn has been talking exclusively to us | :38:03. | :38:05. | |
about the one his party is facing We are also reporting | :38:06. | :38:07. | |
on the upcoming contest they'll face to be first elective mayor | :38:08. | :38:10. | |
of the Tees Valley. With me here in the studio is North | :38:11. | :38:19. | |
Tyneside Conservative Councillor, Judith Wallace, and in London, | :38:20. | :38:22. | |
the Labour MP for Stockton Let's start with that | :38:23. | :38:24. | |
by-election in Copeland caused Let's start with that by-election | :38:25. | :38:31. | |
in Copland caused by the resignation of MP Jamie Reid is going to work | :38:32. | :38:33. | |
in community Labour is defending a narrow | :38:34. | :38:36. | |
majority is so it's going to be Labour has held Copeland | :38:37. | :38:41. | |
and the previous Whitehaven seat since 1930s but recent boundary | :38:42. | :38:44. | |
changes and a declining labour vote When Jamie Reid retained the seat | :38:45. | :38:47. | |
in 2015, the Labour majority over the Conservatives was just 2564, | :38:48. | :38:50. | |
making it one of the most marginal It's a constituency | :38:51. | :38:53. | |
that is dominated by Sellafield and the new power station is also | :38:54. | :39:01. | |
planned at Moorside stop and the new power station is also | :39:02. | :39:09. | |
planned at Moorside. The Tories will want to make much | :39:10. | :39:12. | |
of Jeremy Corbyn's past opposition More than six in ten voting | :39:13. | :39:15. | |
to leave the EU last year But Labour will hope | :39:16. | :39:20. | |
the NHS is their trump card because of public concern | :39:21. | :39:23. | |
about the future of services Hardly surprising that two | :39:24. | :39:25. | |
on the short list to be Labour's candidate are at the forefront | :39:26. | :39:29. | |
of the Hospital campaign. Former Cumbrian woman of the year, | :39:30. | :39:32. | |
Rachel Holliday, is one of them. The other, County Councillor | :39:33. | :39:36. | |
and surgeon, Gillian Troutman. The ex-Penrith and border | :39:37. | :39:38. | |
candidate, Barbara Cannon, Jamie Reid begins his new role | :39:39. | :39:39. | |
at Sellafield on February first. But Labour may want to delay poll | :39:40. | :39:47. | |
to local election day in May. Copeland contains England's highest | :39:48. | :39:50. | |
mountain and deepest lake. Labour will be intent on making | :39:51. | :39:52. | |
sure they don't face Tristan Hunt is triggering the Stoke | :39:53. | :39:55. | |
by-election this week. This is a major test | :39:56. | :39:59. | |
for your party now. Both contests, you have | :40:00. | :40:02. | |
to win, don't you? There are tough contests in both | :40:03. | :40:04. | |
Copeland and in Stoke but we are confident | :40:05. | :40:08. | |
that the messages we have on the health services, | :40:09. | :40:10. | |
jobs and on investment, we believe the people | :40:11. | :40:13. | |
will respond to the Labour Party Most parliaments, and opposition | :40:14. | :40:15. | |
defending their seats, Isn't this a sign of a party, | :40:16. | :40:21. | |
to lose Jamie Reid and Tristan Hunt, two very talented, bright people, | :40:22. | :40:27. | |
held important positions in the party in the past, | :40:28. | :40:34. | |
they have decided there are better but the important thing for us | :40:35. | :40:40. | |
is to secure the Labour MP for Copeland to ensure | :40:41. | :40:46. | |
we can defend the NHS, look after the hospital | :40:47. | :40:48. | |
that is under threat, the hospital where they're | :40:49. | :40:57. | |
going to lose their maternity unit. They're going to lose | :40:58. | :40:59. | |
the maternity unit there and... They are calculating | :41:00. | :41:02. | |
that there is no chance of a Labour They still need people to defend | :41:03. | :41:05. | |
the services there and Jamie Reid and many others that have worked | :41:06. | :41:10. | |
hard to establish new services there, we've got to defend them | :41:11. | :41:12. | |
rather than see them disintegrate. Judith Wallace, given recent | :41:13. | :41:15. | |
polling, your party will be disappointed it didn't | :41:16. | :41:17. | |
win in Copeland. The bookies have made | :41:18. | :41:18. | |
you the favourites. Indeed so and I think it's | :41:19. | :41:20. | |
absolutely astonishing that we've had not one, | :41:21. | :41:22. | |
but two Labour MPs resign their seats and not that long | :41:23. | :41:24. | |
after a general election. It wasn't long ago that | :41:25. | :41:27. | |
a Conservative resigned, Well, it is unusual for them to be | :41:28. | :41:29. | |
going on to other jobs and shows a distinct lack of confidence | :41:30. | :41:34. | |
in their ability to retain their seats at the next election | :41:35. | :41:36. | |
and the ability of the Labour Party I think it's most unlikely that | :41:37. | :41:39. | |
Labour in its current shambles will hold the seats or former | :41:40. | :41:46. | |
government in the future. You say you're going | :41:47. | :41:49. | |
to winning Copeland, I think we have a very good record | :41:50. | :41:50. | |
and I think people can see the shambles that the Labour Party | :41:51. | :41:56. | |
is in at the moment and the economic We'll chat with the | :41:57. | :41:59. | |
results as they happen. There's more to discuss | :42:00. | :42:04. | |
because our correspondent, Luke Walton, has spoken | :42:05. | :42:06. | |
to Jeremy Corbyn is weak and suggested that Copeland | :42:07. | :42:08. | |
was a seat that Labour must win. We're going to be out | :42:09. | :42:11. | |
there campaigning, we going to be We're going to be out | :42:12. | :42:16. | |
there campaigning, we're going to be out there supporting the people | :42:17. | :42:18. | |
of the whole area, addressing the issues of low wages, | :42:19. | :42:21. | |
housing problems and crucially, the future of our National Health | :42:22. | :42:23. | |
Service is and their problems and hospitals throughout Cumbria | :42:24. | :42:26. | |
and other emergency services The people of Cumbria | :42:27. | :42:28. | |
deserve a fair deal. Another big local issue | :42:29. | :42:30. | |
there is the nuclear industry. Thousands of people | :42:31. | :42:34. | |
in West Cumbria rely on that. You have spoken out over a long | :42:35. | :42:36. | |
period against nuclear power. Doesn't that make you the Achilles | :42:37. | :42:38. | |
heel of labour in that area? Sellafield is there, | :42:39. | :42:42. | |
Sellafield employs a lot of people and it would be very helpful | :42:43. | :42:45. | |
if they treated their pensioners properly and treated the pension | :42:46. | :42:48. | |
fund properly as well. Those workers in Sellafield deserve | :42:49. | :42:50. | |
a fair deal just like everybody else and we are working | :42:51. | :42:53. | |
with them on that. You were on Conservative | :42:54. | :42:57. | |
leaflets and your comments about decommissioning power stations | :42:58. | :42:59. | |
is already making hay It is very odd that Conservative | :43:00. | :43:03. | |
leaflet is so well funded, so beautifully produced | :43:04. | :43:12. | |
and so expensive. Didn't find even that amount | :43:13. | :43:14. | |
of space to say something about the National Health Service, | :43:15. | :43:16. | |
about the crisis in I suggest to Conservatives, | :43:17. | :43:19. | |
they are in government, As Prime Minister, would you approve | :43:20. | :43:22. | |
a plan for a new nuclear power station next to Sellafield | :43:23. | :43:29. | |
which 20,000 jobs rely on? Well, we're not sure when that's | :43:30. | :43:33. | |
going to come up yet. That may have happened before | :43:34. | :43:36. | |
the general election takes place. I want to see an energy mix | :43:37. | :43:42. | |
in Britain, I want to see I don't know what the circumstances | :43:43. | :43:45. | |
would be at that time. I've obviously been very concerned | :43:46. | :43:52. | |
about nuclear safety as indeed has I want to see a safe nuclear system, | :43:53. | :44:03. | |
I want to see a strong energy mix in Britain which other | :44:04. | :44:09. | |
countries like Germany... So you don't rule out approving | :44:10. | :44:10. | |
a new nuclear power station? Let's look at the issue | :44:11. | :44:13. | |
when it comes up. I'll be all over Cumbria | :44:14. | :44:16. | |
in the election campaign. Someone who is worried | :44:17. | :44:21. | |
about your antinuclear stance is the departing MP, | :44:22. | :44:25. | |
Jamie Reid. He's talked about you poisoning | :44:26. | :44:26. | |
the Labour Party and not being fit I thanked him for his work and also | :44:27. | :44:29. | |
admired the way he stood up, particularly for very isolated rural | :44:30. | :44:41. | |
communities in his constituency. We had a very good discussion | :44:42. | :44:44. | |
about the need for public investment in good quality, | :44:45. | :44:46. | |
transport infrastructure, improvement of the rail | :44:47. | :44:49. | |
line along the coast, improvement of the rail links, | :44:50. | :44:52. | |
but also issues such as rural bus services such as communication | :44:53. | :44:55. | |
with isolated communities and also post industrial communities, | :44:56. | :44:57. | |
those people that used to work Jamie's voices Jamie's | :44:58. | :44:59. | |
responsibility. I'm happy to have those | :45:00. | :45:20. | |
discussions with him. We've had some good discussions | :45:21. | :45:24. | |
about these issues. We want to see a country where | :45:25. | :45:26. | |
communities are not left behind, where people don't end up forever | :45:27. | :45:29. | |
on zero hours contracts and low-paid jobs, where young people | :45:30. | :45:32. | |
can get into college, can go to university and can get | :45:33. | :45:35. | |
the apprenticeships they deserve. Jeremy Corbyn talking | :45:36. | :45:38. | |
to Luke Walton there. Alex, we know Jeremy Corbyn has been | :45:39. | :45:39. | |
against nuclear power as long That could be a source of disaster | :45:40. | :45:41. | |
in a constituency where the nuclear We believe in a thorough | :45:42. | :45:48. | |
energy mix and nuclear We have been very clear | :45:49. | :45:57. | |
in stressing this. Jeremy said he believes | :45:58. | :46:00. | |
in the mix that is necessary and we will continue to have nuclear | :46:01. | :46:02. | |
power in the mix. We're not going to do anything | :46:03. | :46:05. | |
at all that's going to jeopardise thousands of jobs in West Cumbria | :46:06. | :46:08. | |
and across the county where people are paid good wages, | :46:09. | :46:11. | |
very good wages in many cases and we don't want to | :46:12. | :46:13. | |
see any of that lost. He said he will make a decision | :46:14. | :46:21. | |
about that at the time. If he's a man of principle, | :46:22. | :46:25. | |
why doesn't he tell us he wouldn't sanction a nuclear power station | :46:26. | :46:28. | |
because he doesn't believe in it instead of trying to fudge | :46:29. | :46:31. | |
the issue and try and pretend It was a Labour government that | :46:32. | :46:33. | |
approved the plans for a power Very different Labour Party | :46:34. | :46:38. | |
from now, perhaps. There may be some different people | :46:39. | :46:42. | |
around and we have a different leader and he's got to determine | :46:43. | :46:45. | |
exactly what the situation is, if he is called | :46:46. | :46:47. | |
to make that decision. I hope there is going to be no | :46:48. | :46:50. | |
further delay and we can get those jobs there that can get this power | :46:51. | :46:54. | |
station built and the benefits can Judith Wallace, the reason you want | :46:55. | :46:57. | |
this by-election is you don't want to talk about the NHS | :46:58. | :47:03. | |
because their problems with the hospital that are mirrored | :47:04. | :47:07. | |
in hospitals all around the region. That's why you want | :47:08. | :47:13. | |
to avoid it, isn't it? There is an indication | :47:14. | :47:15. | |
that the Prime Minister is looking at the situation in Cumbria | :47:16. | :47:18. | |
and the NHS is under pressure. Some of the problems in A come | :47:19. | :47:21. | |
about because people misused A My local newspaper is reporting | :47:22. | :47:24. | |
they have had cases of going I think Labour, by removing from GPs | :47:25. | :47:26. | |
the out-of-hours services, We know about the threat | :47:27. | :47:34. | |
of the consultant led maternity services there, | :47:35. | :47:47. | |
we know women in difficult labours can face a 40 mile trip in order | :47:48. | :47:51. | |
to get to an alternative hospital. These decisions are made | :47:52. | :47:53. | |
by the local health trust, They are everything to do | :47:54. | :47:56. | |
with the government. Ultimately the health service | :47:57. | :48:00. | |
reports to the government they should be getting their fingers | :48:01. | :48:01. | |
out and saying, "That maternity unit is safe, | :48:02. | :48:04. | |
that A is safe and the people of West Cumbria can rest | :48:05. | :48:08. | |
assured the NHS is safe." As David Cameron said, | :48:09. | :48:11. | |
it is in the Tory's hands. It is cynical to put out a leaflet | :48:12. | :48:13. | |
which talks about nuclear power and doesn't address what is a big | :48:14. | :48:19. | |
issue in West Cumbria I think having heard | :48:20. | :48:26. | |
what Jeremy Corbyn had to say on that tape, | :48:27. | :48:31. | |
it's no wonder the Labour Party want to postpone this by-election | :48:32. | :48:34. | |
until May which would leave the local people without any | :48:35. | :48:36. | |
representation whilst It is worrying that Jeremy Corbyn | :48:37. | :48:38. | |
wants nuclear facilities That would have a massive effect | :48:39. | :48:42. | |
for this constituency and a disastrous affect | :48:43. | :48:52. | |
for the security of the country. Alex, you quit Labour's front bench | :48:53. | :48:55. | |
with many others because you had no confidence in Jeremy Corbyn, | :48:56. | :49:00. | |
that he wasn't fit Are you any more convinced | :49:01. | :49:01. | |
that he could be the man to hold on and win voters over | :49:02. | :49:05. | |
in Copland and Stockton? I have been enjoying | :49:06. | :49:09. | |
Prime Minister's Question Time. We have seen Jeremy Corbyn wipe | :49:10. | :49:15. | |
the floor with Theresa May. It doesn't matter what the subject | :49:16. | :49:18. | |
is, he's actually putting forward the arguments and most of those | :49:19. | :49:20. | |
are in social care, around our NHS. He has been getting that message | :49:21. | :49:24. | |
across and it has been So you reverse your | :49:25. | :49:27. | |
opinion from the summer. I believe certainly that | :49:28. | :49:30. | |
Jeremy Corbyn will lead us into the election and we will win | :49:31. | :49:34. | |
that election because we've got ideas, we talked | :49:35. | :49:37. | |
about the nationalisation of the railway system which has | :49:38. | :49:39. | |
tremendous public support. We have talked about ensuring jobs | :49:40. | :49:43. | |
are advertised in this country rather than abroad, | :49:44. | :49:46. | |
we can build an opportunity Judith, you can be smug | :49:47. | :49:49. | |
about Labour's current poll ratings. There's a danger is making | :49:50. | :49:56. | |
you complacent on that There will be no extra money for | :49:57. | :49:58. | |
the and Theresa May is in denial. We know the NHS receives billions | :49:59. | :50:08. | |
and billions of pounds and it is right and proper that | :50:09. | :50:16. | |
local people should Local decisions are made | :50:17. | :50:19. | |
by the local trust. There is medical profession | :50:20. | :50:21. | |
after medical professional saying you're not doing enough and this | :50:22. | :50:23. | |
is a huge crisis. The NHS were constantly told | :50:24. | :50:26. | |
as the envy of the world yet know other country chooses | :50:27. | :50:41. | |
to have the same system. We have to be looking | :50:42. | :50:43. | |
at the outcomes which are being Headlines made for the wrong | :50:44. | :50:45. | |
reasons, I suppose. You know your constituency, | :50:46. | :50:50. | |
will the people of Stockton North know what their immigration | :50:51. | :50:52. | |
policy is now? I would hope so because we spent | :50:53. | :50:54. | |
quite a bit of time on the streets of Stockton talking | :50:55. | :50:57. | |
to people about that. We believe that we've got to protect | :50:58. | :50:59. | |
jobs into the long term, we got to make sure that there | :51:00. | :51:04. | |
is still the skills In favour of freedom | :51:05. | :51:07. | |
of movement or not? I think it's no longer | :51:08. | :51:09. | |
really an issue. The British people have made it | :51:10. | :51:11. | |
clear that they do not believe They don't believe in it but we've | :51:12. | :51:14. | |
got to make sure the government do their best for our country | :51:15. | :51:19. | |
and if we require some form of movement of people across the EU, | :51:20. | :51:21. | |
we've got to have that in order to secure the markers | :51:22. | :51:25. | |
that we require. Judith, this is a man | :51:26. | :51:26. | |
of principle on immigration. Your party promised action | :51:27. | :51:29. | |
and never delivered. We have no idea what | :51:30. | :51:33. | |
Jeremy Corbyn's policy is. The speech this week | :51:34. | :51:36. | |
was supposed to clear that up. You promised on it and never | :51:37. | :51:38. | |
delivered it on immigration. The only way we can deliver on it is | :51:39. | :51:43. | |
by leaving the European Union. I've always been very | :51:44. | :51:47. | |
clear about that. As we leave the European Union, | :51:48. | :51:48. | |
Theresa May has been clear we will regain control | :51:49. | :51:51. | |
of our borders and that is what will happen, | :51:52. | :51:53. | |
commencing is important to people. The by-elections in Copland | :51:54. | :51:57. | |
and Stoke aren't the only big tests for the parties coming up | :51:58. | :52:00. | |
in the next few months. Campaigning will soon get underway | :52:01. | :52:02. | |
in the contest to choose the first-ever mayor of the Tees | :52:03. | :52:05. | |
Valley. Could one person represent an area | :52:06. | :52:06. | |
that includes not just Middlesbrough and Stockton but also Darlington, | :52:07. | :52:09. | |
Hartlepool and Redcar also. David McMillan took a tour around | :52:10. | :52:12. | |
Teesside to find out. It stretches from the North Sea | :52:13. | :52:16. | |
to North Yorkshire stop 670,000 people in a city region | :52:17. | :52:20. | |
with five different centres. Industrial, post-industrial | :52:21. | :52:23. | |
and occasionally rural. These offices in Stockton | :52:24. | :52:29. | |
where Tees Valley's But he or she will have a joint task | :52:30. | :52:31. | |
on their hands creating growth and prosperity across a large | :52:32. | :52:41. | |
and diverse region. Four parties have identified people | :52:42. | :52:43. | |
they believe can do just that. The local Councillor | :52:44. | :52:45. | |
is their candidate. There is a thread when it | :52:46. | :52:53. | |
comes to transport and Being from the area, | :52:54. | :52:55. | |
I have a good understanding of how My key drive is not to be looking | :52:56. | :53:00. | |
at what is great for the suburbs of Yarm because if Stockton | :53:01. | :53:12. | |
succeeds, Middlesbrough, Redcar, Hartlepool and | :53:13. | :53:14. | |
Darlington all succeed. South Barton near | :53:15. | :53:16. | |
Middlesbrough is one of many It is suffering in the | :53:17. | :53:17. | |
post-industrial age. Hugh Jeffrey, the leader of Redcar | :53:18. | :53:20. | |
and Cleveland Council says the closure of SSI shows how closely | :53:21. | :53:22. | |
linked the Tees Valley It didn't just affect Redcar, | :53:23. | :53:25. | |
it affected all five It is not going to be | :53:26. | :53:28. | |
about fighting each other, it's going to be about working | :53:29. | :53:36. | |
together, being pragmatic and working to deliver the goals | :53:37. | :53:38. | |
we have the Tees Valley which is and growing our jobs, | :53:39. | :53:40. | |
economy, a proven skills. North of Stockton, their rural | :53:41. | :53:42. | |
partnerships which contrasts sharply with the traditional image | :53:43. | :53:46. | |
of Teesside the north-east party's John Tait, says they can make sharp | :53:47. | :53:48. | |
contrast with the region's Transport will enliven | :53:49. | :53:51. | |
the whole area. Railways, roads, we need proper | :53:52. | :53:57. | |
ambition on how to put a transport infrastructure that is not fiddling | :53:58. | :54:00. | |
with the past but is ambitious and looks towards the future | :54:01. | :54:03. | |
and spreads prosperity Hartlepool is Ukip's | :54:04. | :54:05. | |
strongest race on Teesside. John Tennant is that | :54:06. | :54:15. | |
prospective candidate Andy has We're looking at the possibility of | :54:16. | :54:19. | |
bringing back the Tees Valley Metro system which was shelved | :54:20. | :54:26. | |
a few years ago. It will cost a lot of money to build | :54:27. | :54:29. | |
and we will have to find that money but you need a maypr who's | :54:30. | :54:37. | |
going to fight for the right We would expect the politicians | :54:38. | :54:40. | |
to insist that they can find unity and harmony to bring five distinct | :54:41. | :54:43. | |
areas together but one local journalist thinks they may be | :54:44. | :54:46. | |
underestimating the challenge. There is no natural empathy | :54:47. | :54:49. | |
with the concept of Tees Valley. Teesside is Middlesbrough | :54:50. | :54:51. | |
and Stockton and I don't think Darlington as a town wants to be | :54:52. | :54:53. | |
part of that. It's an artificial construct | :54:54. | :55:07. | |
and the mayor has got to create a region for them | :55:08. | :55:09. | |
to be the figurehead. The Lib Dems expect to name | :55:10. | :55:19. | |
their mayoral candidate at the start of February and there's still plenty | :55:20. | :55:22. | |
of time for others to join the race. The challenge for whoever becomes | :55:23. | :55:25. | |
the first Tees Valley Mayor is to make their new devolved powers | :55:26. | :55:28. | |
work to the benefit of every corner Alex, if you ask people | :55:29. | :55:31. | |
in Stockton where they live, they wouldn't say they lived | :55:32. | :55:34. | |
in the Tees Valley. It will be a tough sell to convince | :55:35. | :55:36. | |
voters that what is good for Hartlepool is also good | :55:37. | :55:39. | |
for Stockton and Middlesbrough. I have been very impressed | :55:40. | :55:42. | |
with the way our five local authorities have | :55:43. | :55:44. | |
worked closely together. They work hard and while other | :55:45. | :55:46. | |
authorities were falling about about creating deals to work | :55:47. | :55:49. | |
with the government to bring prosperity to the area, | :55:50. | :55:52. | |
our area was working I am confident there may | :55:53. | :55:54. | |
be a weird construct, people will work hard together, | :55:55. | :56:03. | |
they will deliver for the whole Fine for councils to operate, | :56:04. | :56:07. | |
but it doesn't need an election Voters will say, "Why am | :56:08. | :56:13. | |
I being called out to do this?" This is an opportunity the | :56:14. | :56:25. | |
Conservatives have given local authorities to take powers from | :56:26. | :56:28. | |
Whitehall and get the money that goes with them. There was no | :56:29. | :56:34. | |
compulsion to take part. Full marks for driving this policy on. Full | :56:35. | :56:40. | |
marks to the local authorities in Tees Valley to take up the | :56:41. | :56:44. | |
opportunity. They decide the geographic boundaries and the | :56:45. | :56:51. | |
powers. There will be deals. More money and more powers. They can get | :56:52. | :56:57. | |
more money if they are successful in driving economic growth. It is sad | :56:58. | :57:01. | |
further north in the region, the Labour leaders and elected mayor | :57:02. | :57:05. | |
have not been able to reach agreements. The danger is this | :57:06. | :57:11. | |
election could raise expectations that cannot be delivered. The Tees | :57:12. | :57:17. | |
Valley Metro, the money is not there to achieve that. Candidates cannot | :57:18. | :57:25. | |
deliver. There will be uneconomic mayor and we will have the | :57:26. | :57:28. | |
development corporation who have a good record of driving growth. More | :57:29. | :57:34. | |
more growth, an opportunity to have more money from the government to | :57:35. | :57:40. | |
extend the powers. We are talking about adult skills, infrastructure | :57:41. | :57:46. | |
and the key to driving jobs. Alex, are you convinced it will be | :57:47. | :57:51. | |
transformative? I hope so. We have seen cuts to our local authority | :57:52. | :57:56. | |
budgets and lots of things they were able to do before can no longer be | :57:57. | :58:01. | |
done. We have to put eggs into this basket and make sure we have strong | :58:02. | :58:06. | |
person in Sue Jeffery as the new elected mayor. We have the | :58:07. | :58:10. | |
possibility of a Tees crossing which will be expensive. We need an agenda | :58:11. | :58:15. | |
that will drive jobs and ensure people have the skills to take those | :58:16. | :58:20. | |
jobs and give our communities the prosperity we need. And you will be | :58:21. | :58:24. | |
favourites to win this election. If you use it as a platform to talk | :58:25. | :58:30. | |
about the cuts to funding, it's not going to get very far. Do you need | :58:31. | :58:36. | |
to get all the parties together and sing from the same hymn sheet so it | :58:37. | :58:43. | |
has some cloud with government? I am always surprised when I talk to | :58:44. | :58:48. | |
people and I tell them I work cooperatively with other people from | :58:49. | :58:53. | |
the other parties. They are surprised about that. That is what I | :58:54. | :58:57. | |
do and what the mayor will do and what the local authorities will do. | :58:58. | :59:02. | |
They work together as a team with their communities to deliver. The | :59:03. | :59:07. | |
impact of Brexit on the north-east was debated in the Lords this week. | :59:08. | :59:18. | |
MPs and unions have criticised plans to change and close two of the post | :59:19. | :59:26. | |
offices in Billingham and concept. They will be located in to new | :59:27. | :59:34. | |
shops. They want to raise council tax by 4.9%. 3% will help towards | :59:35. | :59:40. | |
social care. Lord beef has said the impact on the colour me off the | :59:41. | :59:44. | |
north-east needs to be fully considered in future Brexit | :59:45. | :59:48. | |
negotiations. The north-east of England has had the most positive | :59:49. | :59:54. | |
trade balance of any region of the UK. 58% of these exports are to | :59:55. | :00:01. | |
European Union countries. North-east hospital's a Mac -- A has dealt | :00:02. | :00:06. | |
with over 2 million people and a rise of 4%. North Tyneside Council | :00:07. | :00:10. | |
has approved plans for two huge cranes to be used in the wind | :00:11. | :00:13. | |
turbine industry at Wallsend. One is turbine industry at Wallsend. One is | :00:14. | :00:17. | |
six times bigger than the Angel of the North. That is about it from us. | :00:18. | :00:24. | |
Tomorrow night, inside out and asks if the NHS is to the National | :00:25. | :00:29. | |
Service orders where you live matter to when you want to get treatment. | :00:30. | :00:35. | |
We are back next Sunday. We will have a packed agenda. Why not follow | :00:36. | :00:39. | |
me on Twitter. Details on the screen. | :00:40. | :00:43. | |
Now, if anyone thought Donald Trump would tone things down | :00:44. | :00:51. | |
after the American election campaign, they may have | :00:52. | :00:53. | |
The period where he has been President-elect will make them think | :00:54. | :01:06. | |
again. The inauguration is coming up on Friday. | :01:07. | :01:07. | |
Never has the forthcoming inauguration of a president been | :01:08. | :01:09. | |
In a moment, we'll talk to a man who knows Mr Trump | :01:10. | :01:13. | |
But first, let's have a look at the press conference | :01:14. | :01:17. | |
Mr Trump gave on Wednesday, in which he took the opportunity | :01:18. | :01:19. | |
to rubbish reports that Russia has obtained compromising information | :01:20. | :01:21. | |
You are attacking our news organisation. | :01:22. | :01:37. | |
Can you give us a chance, you are attacking our news | :01:38. | :01:42. | |
organisation, can you give us a chance to ask a question, sir? | :01:43. | :01:45. | |
As far as Buzzfeed, which is a failing pile of garbage, | :01:46. | :01:51. | |
writing it, I think they're going to suffer the consequences. | :01:52. | :01:55. | |
Does anyone really believe that story? | :01:56. | :01:58. | |
I'm also very much of a germaphobe, by the way. | :01:59. | :02:01. | |
If Putin likes Donald Trump, guess what, folks, that's called | :02:02. | :02:03. | |
The only ones that care about my tax returns are the reporters, OK? | :02:04. | :02:11. | |
Do you not think the American public is concerned? | :02:12. | :02:13. | |
The Wiggo, Donald Trump at his first last conference. The Can will he | :02:14. | :02:27. | |
change as President? Because he hasn't changed in the run-up to | :02:28. | :02:31. | |
being inaugurated? I don't think he will commit he doesn't see any point | :02:32. | :02:34. | |
in changing. Why would he change from the personality that just one, | :02:35. | :02:39. | |
as he just said, I just one. All of the bleeding-heart liberals can wail | :02:40. | :02:42. | |
and brush their teeth and say how ghastly that all this, Hillary | :02:43. | :02:47. | |
should have won and so on, but he has got an incredible mandate. | :02:48. | :02:50. | |
Remember, Trump has the House committee has the Senate, he will | :02:51. | :02:53. | |
have the Supreme Court. He has incredible power right now. He | :02:54. | :02:57. | |
doesn't have to listen to anybody. I spoke to him a couple of weeks ago | :02:58. | :03:00. | |
specifically about Twitter, I asked him what the impact was of Twitter. | :03:01. | :03:05. | |
He said, I have 60 million people following me on Twitter. I was able | :03:06. | :03:11. | |
to bypass mainstream media, bypass all modern political convention and | :03:12. | :03:14. | |
talk directly to potential voters. Secondly, I can turn on the TV in | :03:15. | :03:18. | |
the morning, I can see a rival getting all of the airtime, and I | :03:19. | :03:23. | |
can fire off a tweet, for free, as a marketing man he loves that, and, | :03:24. | :03:27. | |
boom, I'm on the news agenda again. He was able to use that | :03:28. | :03:31. | |
magnificently. Twitter to him didn't cost him a dollar. He is going to | :03:32. | :03:38. | |
carry on tweeting in the last six weeks, he was not sleeping. Trump | :03:39. | :03:46. | |
has never had an alcoholic drink a cigarette or a drug. He is a fit by | :03:47. | :03:51. | |
the 70, he has incredible energy and he is incredibly competitive. At his | :03:52. | :03:55. | |
heart, he is a businessman. If you look at him as a political | :03:56. | :03:59. | |
ideologue, you completely missed the point of trouble. Don't take what he | :04:00. | :04:03. | |
says literally, look upon it as a negotiating point that he started | :04:04. | :04:06. | |
from, and try to do business with him as a business person would, and | :04:07. | :04:11. | |
you may be presently surprised so pleasantly surprised. He treats the | :04:12. | :04:16. | |
press and the media entirely differently to any other politician | :04:17. | :04:19. | |
or main politician in that normally the politicians try to get the media | :04:20. | :04:25. | |
off a particular subject, or they try to conciliate with the media. He | :04:26. | :04:30. | |
just comes and punches the media in the nose when he doesn't like them. | :04:31. | :04:35. | |
This could catch on, you know! You are absolutely right, for a start, | :04:36. | :04:39. | |
nobody could accuse him of letting that victory go to his head. You | :04:40. | :04:46. | |
know, he won't say, I will now be this lofty president. He's exactly | :04:47. | :04:50. | |
the same as he was before. What is fascinating is his Laois and ship | :04:51. | :04:53. | |
with the media. I haven't met, and I'm sure you haven't, met a party | :04:54. | :04:57. | |
leader who is obsessed with the media. But they pretend not to be. | :04:58. | :05:03. | |
You know, they state, oh, somebody told me about a column, I didn't | :05:04. | :05:10. | |
read it. He is utterly transparent in his obsession with the media, he | :05:11. | :05:15. | |
doesn't pretend. How that plays out, who knows? It's a completely | :05:16. | :05:17. | |
different dynamic than anyone has seen by. Like he is the issue, he | :05:18. | :05:23. | |
has appointed an unusual Cabinet, that you could criticise in many | :05:24. | :05:27. | |
ways. Nearly all of them are independent people in their own | :05:28. | :05:30. | |
right. A lot of them are wealthy, too. They have their own views. They | :05:31. | :05:34. | |
might not like what he tweaked at 3am, and he does have to deal with | :05:35. | :05:40. | |
his Cabinet now. Mad dog matters, now the Defence Secretary, he might | :05:41. | :05:43. | |
not like what's said about China at three in morning - general matters. | :05:44. | :05:49. | |
This is what gets very conjugated. We cannot imagine here in our | :05:50. | :05:52. | |
political system any kind of appointments like this. Using the | :05:53. | :05:55. | |
wouldn't have a line-up of billionaires of the kind of | :05:56. | :05:58. | |
background that he has chosen -- you simply wouldn't have. But that won't | :05:59. | :06:02. | |
stop him saying and reading what he thinks. Maybe it will cause him some | :06:03. | :06:06. | |
internal issues when the following day he has the square rigged with | :06:07. | :06:09. | |
whatever they think. But he's going to press ahead. Are we any clearer | :06:10. | :06:18. | |
in terms of policy. I know policy hasn't featured hugely in this | :06:19. | :06:22. | |
campaign of 2016. Do we have any really clear idea what Mr Trump is | :06:23. | :06:28. | |
hoping to achieve? He has had some consistent theme going back over 25 | :06:29. | :06:32. | |
years. One is a deep scepticism about international trade and the | :06:33. | :06:35. | |
kind of deals that America has been doing over that period. It has been | :06:36. | :06:39. | |
so consistent that is has been hard to spin as something that you say | :06:40. | :06:43. | |
during the course of a campaign of something to get elected. | :06:44. | :06:46. | |
Ultimately, Piers is correct, he won't change. When he won the | :06:47. | :06:49. | |
election committee gave a relatively magnanimous beach. I thought his ego | :06:50. | :06:53. | |
had been sated and he had got what he wanted. He will end up governing | :06:54. | :06:57. | |
as is likely eccentric New York liberal and everything will be fine. | :06:58. | :07:01. | |
In the recent weeks it has come to my attention that that might not be | :07:02. | :07:03. | |
entirely true! LAUGHTER | :07:04. | :07:09. | |
It is a real test of the American system, the Texan bouncers, the | :07:10. | :07:11. | |
foreign policy establishment which is about to have the orthodoxies | :07:12. | :07:16. | |
disrupted -- the checks and balances. I think he has completely | :07:17. | :07:20. | |
ripped up the American political system. Washington as we know it is | :07:21. | :07:24. | |
dead. From his garage do things his way, he doesn't care, frankly, what | :07:25. | :07:30. | |
any of us thinks -- Trump is going to do things his way. If he can | :07:31. | :07:34. | |
deliver for the people who voted for him who fault this disenfranchised, | :07:35. | :07:43. | |
-- who voted for him who felt this disenfranchised. They voted | :07:44. | :07:46. | |
accordingly. They want to see jobs and the economy in good shape, they | :07:47. | :07:50. | |
want to feel secure. They want to feel that immigration has been | :07:51. | :07:54. | |
tightened. If Trump can deliver on those main theme for the rust belt | :07:55. | :07:58. | |
communities of America, I'm telling you, he will go down as a very | :07:59. | :08:03. | |
successful president. All of the offensive rhetoric and the | :08:04. | :08:05. | |
argy-bargy with CNN and whatever it may be will be completely | :08:06. | :08:09. | |
irrelevant. Let me finish with a parochial question. Is it fair to | :08:10. | :08:16. | |
say quite well disposed to this country? And that he would like, | :08:17. | :08:18. | |
that he's up for a speedy free-trade, bilateral free-trade | :08:19. | :08:23. | |
you'll? Think we have to be sensible as the country. Come Friday, he is | :08:24. | :08:28. | |
the president of the United States, the most powerful man and well. He | :08:29. | :08:32. | |
said to me that he feels half British, his mum was born and raised | :08:33. | :08:36. | |
in Scotland until the age of 18, he loves British, his mother used to | :08:37. | :08:40. | |
love watching the Queen, he feels very, you know, I would roll out the | :08:41. | :08:44. | |
red carpet for Trump, let him eat Her Majesty. The crucial point for | :08:45. | :08:49. | |
us as a country is coming -- let him me to Her Majesty. If we can do a | :08:50. | :08:55. | |
speedy deal within an 18 month period, it really sends a message | :08:56. | :08:58. | |
that well but we are back in the game, that is a hugely beneficial | :08:59. | :09:01. | |
thing for this country. Well, a man whose advisers were indicating that | :09:02. | :09:06. | |
maybe he should learn a few things from Donald Trump was Jeremy Corbyn. | :09:07. | :09:12. | |
Yes, MBE. Mr Corbyn appeared on the Andrew Marr Show this morning. -- | :09:13. | :09:14. | |
yes, indeed. If you don't win Copeland, | :09:15. | :09:17. | |
and if you don't win Stoke-on-Trent Central, | :09:18. | :09:20. | |
you're toast, aren't you? Our party is going to fight very | :09:21. | :09:21. | |
hard in those elections, as we are in the local elections, | :09:22. | :09:26. | |
to put those policies out there. It's an opportunity to challenge | :09:27. | :09:29. | |
the Government on the NHS. It's an opportunity to challenge | :09:30. | :09:31. | |
them on the chaos of Brexit. It's an opportunity to challenge | :09:32. | :09:34. | |
them on the housing shortage. It's an opportunity to challenge | :09:35. | :09:36. | |
them on zero-hours contracts. Is there ever a moment that you look | :09:37. | :09:38. | |
in the mirror and think, you know what, I've done my best, | :09:39. | :09:43. | |
but this might not be for me? I look in the mirror | :09:44. | :09:47. | |
every day and I think, let's go out there and try | :09:48. | :09:49. | |
and create a society where there are opportunities for all, | :09:50. | :09:52. | |
where there aren't these terrible levels of poverty, where | :09:53. | :09:54. | |
there isn't homelessness, where there are houses for all, | :09:55. | :09:56. | |
and where young people aren't frightened of going to university | :09:57. | :09:58. | |
because of the debts they are going to end up | :09:59. | :10:01. | |
with at the end of their course. Mr Corbyn earlier this morning. | :10:02. | :10:09. | |
Steve, would it be fair to say that the mainstream of the Labour Party | :10:10. | :10:12. | |
has now come to the conclusion that they just have to let Mr Corbyn get | :10:13. | :10:16. | |
on with it, that they are not going to try and influence what he does. | :10:17. | :10:20. | |
They will continue to try and have their own views, but it's his show, | :10:21. | :10:25. | |
it's up to him, if it's a mess, he has to live with it and we'll have | :10:26. | :10:28. | |
clean hands? For now, yes. I think they made a mistake when he was | :10:29. | :10:32. | |
first elected to start in some cases tweeting within seconds that it was | :10:33. | :10:36. | |
going to be a disaster, this was Labour MPs. They made a complete | :10:37. | :10:40. | |
mess of that attempted coup in the summer, which strengthened his | :10:41. | :10:46. | |
position. And he did, it gave Corbyn the space with total legitimacy to | :10:47. | :10:49. | |
say that part of the problem is, we're having this public Civil War. | :10:50. | :10:55. | |
In keeping quiet, that disappeared as part of the explanation for why | :10:56. | :10:59. | |
Labour and low in the polls. I think they are partly doing that. But they | :11:00. | :11:05. | |
are also struggling, the so-called mainstream Labour MPs, to decide | :11:06. | :11:09. | |
what the distinctive agenda is. It's one of the many differences with the | :11:10. | :11:13. | |
80s, where you had a group of people sure of what they believed in, they | :11:14. | :11:17. | |
left to form the SDP. What's happening now is that they are | :11:18. | :11:21. | |
leaving politics altogether. That is a crisis of social Democrats all | :11:22. | :11:25. | |
across Europe, including the French Socialists, as we will find out | :11:26. | :11:29. | |
later in the spring. Let Corbyn because then, that's the strategy. | :11:30. | :11:36. | |
There is a weary and sometimes literal resignation from the | :11:37. | :11:38. | |
moderates in the Labour Party. If you talk to them, they are no longer | :11:39. | :11:41. | |
angry, they have always run out of steam to be angry about what's going | :11:42. | :11:44. | |
on. They are just sort of tired and feel that they've just got to see | :11:45. | :11:47. | |
this through now. I think the by-elections will be interesting. | :11:48. | :11:51. | |
When Andrew Marr said, you're toast, and you? I thought, he's never | :11:52. | :11:56. | |
posed! That was right. A quick thought from view? One thing Corbyn | :11:57. | :12:00. | |
has in common with Trump is immunity to bad news. I think he can lose | :12:01. | :12:10. | |
Copeland and lose Stoke, and as long as it is not a sequence of | :12:11. | :12:11. | |
resignations and by-elections afterwards, with maybe a dozen or 20 | :12:12. | :12:14. | |
Labour MPs going, he can still enjoy what. It may be more trouble if | :12:15. | :12:17. | |
Labour loses the United trade union elections. We are in a period of | :12:18. | :12:23. | |
incredible unpredictability generally in global politics. If you | :12:24. | :12:27. | |
look at the way the next year plays out, if for example brags it was a | :12:28. | :12:30. | |
disaster and it starts to unravel very quickly, Theresa May is | :12:31. | :12:34. | |
attached to that, clearly label would have a great opportunity | :12:35. | :12:38. | |
potentially disease that higher ground, and when Eddie the Tories -- | :12:39. | :12:41. | |
Labour would have an opportunity. Is Corbyn the right guy? We interviewed | :12:42. | :12:46. | |
him, what struck me was that he talked about being from, a laughable | :12:47. | :12:51. | |
comparison, but when it is really laughable is this - Hillary Clinton, | :12:52. | :12:56. | |
what were the things she stood for, nobody really knew? What does Trump | :12:57. | :13:00. | |
stand for? Everybody knew. Corbyn has the work-out four or five | :13:01. | :13:04. | |
messages and bang, bang, bang. He could still be in business. Thank | :13:05. | :13:06. | |
you for being with us. I'll be back at the same | :13:07. | :13:08. | |
time next weekend. Remember - if it's Sunday, | :13:09. | :13:11. | |
it's the Sunday Politics. | :13:12. | :13:13. |