10/06/2012 Sunday Politics North West

And in the North West: Think one-party state and North

Korea comes to mind. But did you know there's a local authority in

the region where every single councillor represents the same

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1711 seconds

Hello, I'm Arif Ansari. In the next 20 minutes we meet Peter Cranie,

the man who hopes to be the new leader of the Green Party.

But let me introduce my guests, Michael Meacher, the leader at --

the former Labour Minister of State for the Environment and MP for

Oldham West and Royton, and Andrew Bingham, the Conservative MP for

High Peak. Labour is getting used to appear

rude when it is dominating local Government across the North West.

The Conservatives have long ago vanished from places like Liverpool

and Manchester, but now that they bowled -- and now the Liberal

Democrats are disappearing too. Labour controls all but two of the

region's metropolitan councils. Is this good for democracy? Elaine

Dunkley reports from Knowsley whether 63 councillors are all

Labour. When you are think of a one-party

state you think of places like North Korea.

There the leader can result -- rely on 100% support. No one would

expect to see the people of Knowsley marching down the High

Street, but they have elected a single party to run the council.

All 63 councillors are Labour. are in touch with our communities.

Everything else we have done, building schools for the future,

delivering first-class facilities for our communities...

In the local elections it was total wipeout for all four Liberal

Democrat councillors. But is it healthy to run it council without

opposition? It is very healthy for me. I have never felt better in my

life! The one thing I would have to look at now is how we do our

council meetings. I am sure that the members of the public would not

want to just sit through a council meeting with everything just going

through at full support. The leader of the council might be

happy, but there is concern that single party councils could result

in a multitude of problems. Democracy needs genuine competition

between political parties. Voters will respond, they will not turn

out, they think the result is a foregone conclusion, and democracy

was suffer if. This area has always been a Labour

heartland. Politics is at times like football and religion -

loyalty can be passed down through generations, but many people feel

here it is a backlash against the Coalition. I do not think anybody -

- I thought -- I think some people think it was -- thought it was a

general election and they just voted against conservative.

people are brainwashed. You have his statue of Harold Wilson. That

is how much people law of labour. Has your family always voted

Labour? Yes. We have always voted Labour. I think it does more for

the working class than the middle class.

With Knowsley delivering a Labour landslide, some political

commentators are concerned that the first-past-the-post system is

delivering deadlock, not democracy. Further north our cousins in

Scotland use a system called the single transferable vote. Broadly

speaking you match the party's number of seats with their share of

the vote to achieve proportional representation. Bringing about a

new system has its critics - some say it means that you have almost

endless coalitions and bargaining behind the scenes, some say it

weakens the link with individual councillors. But no one would

disagree that it has created a greater diversity in Scotland's

councils. It may be good news for Labour in

Knowsley, but there is concern that a lack of opposition is bad news

for politics. We are joined by Louis cobalt from

the think tank the Institute of Public Policy Research. Is this a

problem? It is a problem because it reflects a much bigger problem

which is a lack of democratic engagement in local Government. In

Knowsley turnout was in the low twenties. In some wards, Manchester

for example, it was 9%. Low turnout is a problem, but is it a specific

problem if one party ends up dominating it cancel? All we know

from different examples across the world is that it is not conducive

to good policy-making. You tend to have factions within councils. And

if you are living in with the -- in a council which is all Labour or

Tory, you think, what is the point in voting? I am not sure what the

voters are thinking that. 20% are. It is not a criticism of any

particular party. There are councils in the south of England

which a Conservative dominated, but it is a problem which is reflective

of a real lack of engagement. Most of our local councils do not have

enough power. We have seen a gradual leakage of power and

responsibility down to Whitehall over 30 years, and both parties

have been responsible. Research by us shows that if you give more

power to local councils, people will be more likely to vote. He is

there any evidence that in councils where they are dominated by his

single party, but they are run as well? I would not want to 0.2

specific councils and say they are not being run as well... But

certainly it is a big problem with regards to people turning out and

voting. Michael Meacher, is it quite nice if Labour is dominating

a council? I do not think it is healthy when one party controls all

the seats, although I do not think we should lose trust in democracy,

because if they start to behave badly than the voters will

certainly begin to vote for other parties. The fact is, even if you

have a single monolith, different groups, factions will begin to form,

and the opposition will form within that governing party. But I still

think it is not desirable. If you have two options - one is the

Scottish solution, proportional representation. The trouble with

that is that it works in Scotland because the SNP is already very

powerful, and the balance between them and Labour could go any way,

but in Knowsley I do not think that is true. If the Lib Dem and Tory

voters combined, they would still not thought about Labour. So I

think the real problem is that people's lack of interest in local

democracy. You have to increase the financial capability and the power

of local Government. At the moment it is the agent of Whitehall, and

people think the local authority cannot do very much. That is what

needs to change, and then more people will vote and we will get

greater diversity. Do you agree with that? I think that is a fair

point. I spent 12 years on a local authority, and you are frustrated

because you are in agent of Whitehall. But I think it is

incumbent on people like Michael and myself to get people to vote.

Do you think if High Peak was dominated purely by the

Conservative Party, it would be a good thing? I think that, but I

think a single council dominated by in the colour is not healthy. It is

healthy to have an opposition way you can challenge ideas, and have

different views. We all probably what the same thing... I thought

you up party was divorcing things back to local Government? That is

the thing. When local Government have power to do things and change

things, if more people will want to stand for council, become

councillors, and more people will get to vote and stand to vote in

local elections. There is a wider danger for the North of England

that both parties forget about it. If the Labour control of the North

continues, then everybody will take it for granted. The Conservative

Party needs to form -- gain new seats. But they will continue to

think we have to concentrate our efforts elsewhere. So there is a

danger for political monogamy in the North of England. But there is

an increasing polarisation within the country, but the South is

dominated by the Tories and the North by Labour. Because the

economy is splitting, the dynamism is in the south and the financial

sectors, and the old industrial areas of the North have not really

revived and they are not really yet the driving force of the country.

So you might want Tories to do better in the north and Labour in

the south, but it is not going to happen unless we have a major

change of policy. Thank you for coming in for.

It the Liberal Democrats continued to struggle in the North West,

could there be an opportunity for other parties? The Greens hope so.

In September Caroline Lucas steps down, and this week a college

lecturer and Green Party politician from Liverpool, Peter Cranie,

announced he once the leader's job. So what other challenges facing the

Greens and could he improve their chances?

The Green Party emerged in the 1980s, as people began to worry

about the environment. At the 2010 election it flowered, and the Green

Party leader Caroline Lucas became its first MP. But beyond that major

success are underlying problems. Lancaster is some with the Greens

have done well, but last year they lost four seats on the council.

Do you miss life at the Town Hall? John Whitelegg stood down

voluntarily as a councillor and thinks the party needs to offer

voters more than environmental stuff. If we want Britain to work

in a much fairer way, a much more social justice linked way, so that

we do not have the highest rate of child policy -- poverty of any EU

country, and I think we genuinely believe that and work on that, but

we are not getting that message of fur. Could this be the man to do

it? Peter Cranie wants to focus on social justice. What people need to

see is an ordinary person who cares about the issues that they care

about. The major parties have tried to race off with the environmental

agenda themselves. So the Greens have only enjoyed limited electoral

success. In 1997, the party got 0.2% of the vote, it then increased

at the two subsequent general elections before falling back

slightly last time when they got their first MP. This year's local

elections saw the Greens winning 40 of the 4,800 seats up for grabs, in

net gain of ten. There most recent election

manifesto was not really taken seriously. No one believes you can

offer free school meals for everyone. If there elected leader

in September, Peter Cranie will want to attract new supporters and

not just those worried about the environment.

Peter Cranie joins me in the studio. When you made this decision to

stand for leader, was that a difficult personal decision to

make? I think you have got to recognise it is a very tough job at

this stage in our development. The Green Party is close to making

breakthroughs, electorally, in a number of the EU regions. So it is

a job that has to be done successfully. So I carefully

considered it and I believe I am the person to get us that electoral

success. What makes you think you are someone who has got the real

attributes to lead a party nationally and lead it to the kind

of success you want to see? I think people today are looking at

politicians and thinking they are in it for themselves, and people

want to see a person like them standing in politics. In the last

five years I have had to got -- go through what a lot of people have

had to go through. And I think knowing that real life experience

is going to be a real asset for me in communicating Green Party

policies and getting across our agenda. Net a say in September you

are successful. -- let us say. What is the most fundamental thing you

want to change? With have got some exceptionally good practice in

certain areas, we have councillors in certain locations like Brighton

and knowledge, and we Majid -- what by seek his us sharing practice

better and taking that best practice and using it everywhere. I

think electorally there is an opportunity for a party which will

speak differently and offer a distinctive policies from the red,

blue, yellow parties. So what about abolishing the men -- the monarchy?

Perhaps not after the Jubilee! But we stand for that on the basis that

we think the head of state should be elected. I think that is an

decision that should be made by the British people. But certainly that

is an idea we will put forward along with for example abolishing

the Trident nuclear deterrent. The other parties have a consensus,

with a few individuals exceptions. Or legalising drugs? What we'd be

do is say that we would look at it Queen's commission into drugs, and

say, what is the evidence here? So when the Government regraded

cannabis back from seat back to be. That was a decision that was not

listening to what was best in terms of medical advice and social

impacts. But in general terms, is that -- your political strategy to

almost move the Green Party, and maybe it is already there, but to

outflank the other political parties on the left? I think if you

talk took ordinary people, they are not really bothered about left and

right wing, they are interested in what are the policies that affect

them? They want a house that is warm in winter, energy costs that

are affordable, and they want to work. Those are the issues we are

going to focus on, the issues that mean we can relate to ordinary

people. Let us bring in Michael Meacher, a former environment

minister. Why do you think it is, giving your own interest in green

policies, that the Green Party has not done better? They clearly have

been doing better as we saw a moment ago. Voters have been going

up slightly, but what happens with minority parties is that they send

a warning signal to the main parties would then take over much

of birds -- Policies. I regard myself as a green banister in the

Labour Government. Was part of that thinking, let us Crapper some of

those falters? No, -- let us grab. No, I was thinking about a range of

policies, energy matters, recycling,... The you think if

Peter Cranie is successful and he starts pushing more of his social

justice agenda, do you think there is a potential for him to outflank

the mainstream parties? Frankly, I doubt it. Because way you have a

first-past-the-post system, it is extremely difficult for small

parties actually to look in and get traction. What happens is that if

they begin to be successful, the large parties take over the

policies. That is not bad for the parties but to fix -- the country,

but it is bad for the small parties. If what happened to the

Conservatives? You were supposed to be an environmental party. There

are various green issues we are concentrating on. Green technology

has a part to play on building the country up again. I think it will

build employment. But you are cutting, for example, support to

social energy -- Solar Energy. One council has said they do not want

wind farms... The whole feed-in tariff issue, the cut in the

terrace was brought about because the costs of Solar images have

plummeted. You can over subsidise in one section of renewable energy,

so there will be more subsidy for more people for longer. A final

brief word for you, Peter. Do see the other parties as a threat?

part of the reeds and we have not seen more of a breakthrough is the

first past the post system. Sorry, we are running late on time.

Time for the rest of the week's political news. The Chair of

Merseytravel, Mark Dowd, has announced he isn't going to stand

for re-election, after half of the Labour councillors on the authority

revealed they're not backing him. Lancashire's Acting Chief Constable

Chris Weigh told his police authority this week that the loss

of over 500 of police officers had inevitably contributed to a rise in

crime in the county. Sellafield's Thermal Oxide

Reprocessing Plant in Cumbria is set to close. The plant will stop

production by 2018, and it will take another couple of years to run

it down completely. The Nuclear Decommissioning Authority hopes

many of the 800 workers will be redeployed.

And a Wigan company apologised after 80 people working as stewards

at the Jubilee celebrations were left under London Bridge at 3:00 in