11/06/2017 Sunday Politics Northern Ireland


With guests Dominic Raab, Jon Ashworth, Anna Soubry and Graham Brady. Journalists Steve Richards, Julia Hartley-Brewer and Tom Newton Dunn are on the political panel.

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But stay with us for more drama as we can now go straight


to the Sunday Politics with Andrew Neil who's


We are indeed in the sunshine. Welcome from the heart of


Westminster. Theresa May reappointing key figures


to the Cabinet, sacking had to closest aides, Nick Timothy and


Fiona Hill. After Conservative MPs demanded their removal in the


Conservative failure to win an overall majority in the House of


Commons. Over the next hour and a bit we'll continue to take stock on


the remarkable events of the last 72 hours and try to work out where we


go from here. First though, here's Adam Fleming


with a reminder of the high octane I was going to say this


chair is quite warm. Michael Fallon's bum


was on this chair. Bums on seats, its election


night at the BBC, hosted This is David Dimbleby's


actual seat! Look, he's got four pencils,


stopwatch and a calculator. And what we are saying


is the Conservatives Note, they don't have an overall


majority at this stage. 314 for the Conservatives,


that's down 17. Luckily there were plenty


of politicians who never are. What does this exit


poll actually mean? Well, if it's accurate it means


Theresa May has just presided over the greatest catastrophe that I can


think of in the Conservative We haven't seen a seat change hands


and we are hearing about possible Conservative gains in the Midlands


and losses in London, People will write Ph.D.s about the


2017 election Labour candidates were winning


in unexpected places. Tories were losing in unexpected


places, including eight members of the Government,


like Treasury minister The Home Secretary, Amber Rudd,


held on in Hastings...just. OK, the former Deputy Prime Minister


and former leader of the Liberal Democrats,


Nick Clegg, has been beaten I've always sought to stand


by the liberal values I believe in, but I, of course, have encountered


this evening something many people have encountered before tonight,


and I suspect many people will encounter after tonight,


which is - in politics you live by the sword, and you


die by the sword. Lib Dem leader Tim Farron


was narrowly re-elected in Cumbria, unlike the SNP's Westminster


leader Angus Robertson, who lost his seat, former First


Minister Alex Salmond defeated too. The Scottish National Party have


lost many fine parliamentarians this evening, and that is a grievous blow


to the SNP. But overall the results in Scotland


show the SNP will have won a majority of the seats in this


country and a majority of the vote. Paul Nuttall failed to get


elected in Skegness So, the green room looking a bit


ruined, a bit like Ukip I think we are doing


better than the SNP. We deliberately didn't stand in some


seats to try to give Brexit I think it's quite interesting


the main leading Brexit candidates in this election


are getting their seat back. Right, it's dawn in the real world


and I found a pub that has been open What state are they going


to be in, in there? And was it young people


who had seen Corbyn, voted, and got the T-shirt who helped


the Labour leader to Right, five past five


in the morning, we are outside Jeremy Corbyn's house in Islington


in north London. Surprisingly small press pack


for the man who's destroyed Jeremy!


Jeremy! If there is a message from


tonight's result, it's this - the Prime Minister called


the election because Well, the mandate she's got is lost


Conservative seats, lost votes, I would have thought that's enough


to go actually and make way for a government that will be truly


representative of all Theresa May did the opposite,


popping to the palace, What the country needs more


than ever is certainty, and having secured the largest


number of votes and the greatest number of seats in the general


election, it is clear that only the Conservatives and Unionist Party


have the legitimacy and ability to provide that certainty


by commanding a majority As we do, we will continue to work


with our friends and allies, in the Democratic Unionist Party


in particular. 15 hours after election night


started, it's all over. And joined by Tom Newton Dunn, Julia


Hartley-Brewer and Steve Richards. Julia, why did it go so wrong for


the Conservatives? You can't run a presidential campaign if you have a


candidate with less than the charisma of this desk. If you're not


going to put her out to debate, if she's not coming to the people and


selling herself, which she studiously didn't do, you can't run


that campaign. There was the possibility another leader could


have walked that with 800 majority against Jeremy Corbyn. Another


campaign, we will never know, could have delivered a majority of 30 or


40, without the deal with the DUP. I'm not saying it was fundamentally


wrong to call the election at this time, but it was the wrong candidate


and the wrong campaign. The third election in a row that Labour has


failed to win. It was still a substantial and historic achievement


for Jeremy Corbyn. If you consider the context in which this election


was called, Theresa May, on her honeymoon to die for, politically,


with Labour voters split over Brexit, suddenly calling an election


when most Labour MPs were not willing to cooperate with whatever


campaign was being held by Labour, for them to do as well as they have


done is an extraordinary achievement. They got no more seats


than Gordon Brown in 2010, roughly the same. But the context couldn't


have been more daunting, and to wipe out a majority of this figure, who


six weeks ago was walking on water and appeared to have Brexit as part


of her ammunition against the split Labour vote, remains astonishing.


One of the errors she made and so many others she made and probably


all of us, was to underestimate the potency of Corbyn and the relatively


modest social Democrat manifesto. Doesn't it take stupidity bordering


on genius to turn a 20 point lead at the start of the campaign into a


hung parliament? It does and it did. That's what happened. I think the


lead was soft, largely because Theresa May was unknown. We know her


because we have been having lunch and interviews with her for years on


end. The public didn't know her. They got to know her and they


discovered she was the Maybot, which is the term that will stick after


this campaign. I differ from my two colleagues here, it wasn't the


amazing right of Corbyn, it was a complete failure to remember that


people wanted a revolution when they voted for Brexit, and she came


across as the party and candidate of continuity. As things stand, we are


where we are. Where are we?! Where do we go from here? I was with


College Green with you in the early hours of Friday morning and I didn't


see anybody that said, see you back here in October. A second election?


God forbid, nobody wants a second election, but I can't see the Tories


being able to stay in power with the DUP and I'm personally very unhappy


with a lot of DUP policies, their stance on gay rights, capital


punishment, abortion rights, and there will be an awful lot of


people, floating voters, who will recoil in horror at that, even on


unofficial lines. I get the sense Jeremy Corbyn will be up for a


second election, as quick as it comes. I'm sure he is, and if there


was one company might well win it, which is why there won't be. All


logic points to another election but I don't think there will be one,


because I don't think any Conservative Prime Minister will


feel strong and confident enough after the trauma of this. They would


have to be 50 points ahead in the polls to take the risk. I think


rather like between 74 and 79 we will have a frail and fragile House


of Commons with a minority government for quite a long time,


simply because whoever is Prime Minister will not have the


confidence to call an election. So the Tories fear of a quick second


election could well result in them going more leniently on Mrs May than


they really want to. We have seen already, Miss Mrs May is still Prime


Minister. That wouldn't have happened by now if they thought they


could win a second snap election. I think they will stabilise. They are


also desperate to get Brexit negotiations underway. That's


another reason she is still there. She is the one who needs to pull the


trigger. Most of the Tory party are aching to have the trigger pulled.


When that is bold, when I have stabilised, and when Jeremy Corbyn


is back the House of Commons, where remember he's not very good, I think


they might your right. Lots more to talk about. Thank you for being with


me in the open air, the Westminster penthouse, open to the world. I just


need to find the cocktail bar. Although it is early.


So, let's take a look at the election results


Here's how the parties fared in the election on Thursday.


And here's how they got on in the previous general


As you can see, the Labour vote is up dramatically, by ten points.


But the Conservative vote also rose quite significantly, by five points.


The SNP and the Liberal Democrats both saw declines in their support.


And Ukip's vote has almost completely collapsed,


from 13% in 2015 to just 2% this time around.


So the resurgence of two-party politics is one of the key


The combined vote share of the two main parties is now 82%,


the highest it's been since the election in 1970.


And it's more if you exclude Northern Ireland.


That's partly explained by the collapse of Ukip.


According to one estimate, the Conservatives may have got 57%


It's also thought that last year's EU referendum has helped to polarise


support along the traditional Labour and Conservative lines.


In polls carried out before the election,


it was estimated that 50% of remain voters supported Labour and nearly


two-thirds of leave voters supported the Conservatives.


There's also speculation that a rise in the number of young voters may be


behind the boost in Labour's support - but we don't yet have


But it's notable that Labour did well in certain constituencies


For example, it's thought that the large number of students


in Canterbury helped Labour win the seat for the first time


ever, with a 9% swing from the Conservatives.


The two main parties have also seen changes in their number of seats.


Labour lost six seats but gained 36, giving them a net gain of 30 seats.


Most of those Labour gains were in England,


where the party took 27 seats, mainly from the Conservatives.


They also gained three seats in Wales and six


As for the Conservatives, they lost a total of 33


seats but also gained 20, giving them a net loss of 13 seats.


Most of those 20 Conservative gains came in Scotland,


where the party took 12 seats from the SNP.


Meaning the Scottish Tories are allowing Mrs May to try to form a


government this week! Who would have thought!


In England, the Conservatives won


Joining me now from Glasgow is the brains behind Thursday


night's astoundingly accurate exit poll, the polling expert


And John, the Tories saw a 5-point rise in the share of the votes to


42%, very high by recent historical standards, but still lost over a


dozen seats, why? Under our first past the post electoral system, the


share of the vote you get is almost irrelevant. What is crucial is how


you do relative to your opponents. In particular so far as Conservative


and Labour are concerned, what determines the fate is the gap


between them. In the 2015 election, the Conservatives had a 7-point


lead, that only got them a majority of 12, and somebody should have said


to the Prime Minister before she pulled the trigger, you do realise


you have to be a long way ahead of the Labour Party in order to


increase your majority. The opinion polls say you are at that point now


but if they fall you are in trouble. In the end of the Conservative lead


is 2.5 points, which is not enough to secure a majority given that


Northern Ireland is out of the frame, Scotland still has a majority


of third party MPs, and there are still Liberal Democrats and greens.


This now looks like a two party race once again. We have still got much


more in the House of Commons than in 1970 which makes a hung parliament


much more likely. Meanwhile there weren't that many marginal seats. It


is the relative standing of the parties that's crucial. And how do


we explain the 10% rise in Labour's share of the vote? There's a lot of


anecdotal evidence of a youth Surge, and I'd like to know if we can nail


that down, but also the work of the swings too. Some green voters moved


into Labour, some Liberal Democrats, even perhaps some Ukip voters moved


into Labour, what do we know? I think we can pick up three crucial


patterns. The first is a lot of people who at the beginning of the


campaign said are usually vote Labour but cannot imagine doing so


under Jeremy Corbyn, he so hopeless. Because of his relatively strong


performance they came back into the fold so by the time we got to


polling day there was many 2015 voters who said they would vote


Labour again. That was the crucial point, getting the faithful back on


board. It is certainly clear there was a substantial swing to young


voters during the campaign. Labour started off well in that group, the


opinion polls had it around 65% by the time the election came. We don't


know exactly the turnout amongst young people, but certainly the


pattern of the results suggests the turnout was going up more in places


where there were young people so probably somewhat more of them did


turn out to vote. The third crucial patent is that this was an election


which to some degree voters did polarise around the issue of the


shape of Brexit, weather you are a Remain or Leave voter. Labour's


progress during the campaign was disproportionately amongst Remain


voters so although the parties were not thought to be that far apart on


the shape of Brexit, they seem to be sufficiently far apart that Labour


was more attractive for those less keen on the kind of Brexit Theresa


May had in mind. John Curtice, thank you as always. We are now going to


Salford. Graham Brady, you think Mrs May should soldier on, why? There's


no other party in a position to form a government. Clearly these aren't


the circumstances that either the Prime Minister nor I nor my


colleagues would want to be dealing with at the moment but this is what


we are presented with and it's our duty to make the best of it and try


to offer government as resilient as it can be an quite difficult times.


But is she ever going to be more than a caretaker leader now? I think


one of the odd things about the experience of the last 12 months is


Theresa May performed well as Prime Minister and the public rather liked


her as Prime Minister. I think few people would say the campaign


succeeded in projecting her qualities as strongly as it could


and should have done. As we return to government, albeit in difficult


circumstances and dependent on support from other parties, I think


we will see people once again seeing the steady, calm, thoughtful Theresa


May as Prime Minister. Do you fear a leadership election might lead to a


second general election, and that prospect terrifies you, doesn't it?


I'm not sitting here terrified, but I think there is zero appetite


amongst the public for another general election at the moment, and


I don't detect any great appetite amongst my colleagues for presenting


the public with a massive additional dose of uncertainty by getting


involved in a rather self-indulgent Conservative Party internal election


campaign. That's because they are frightened they might lose, that's


why they don't want another one. I think most of us are motivated by a


belief in the national interest and we are responsible people who want


to try to offer that responsible, steady government, especially at


this point as we know it's just a matter of days until those important


negotiations on leaving the European Union begins. It's a time when we


need experience and responsible people in Government, and I think


it's our duty to try to offer that. Many Tories have said to me that Mrs


May must never be allowed to leave your party into another general


election, do you agree with that? No, these are judgments that will be


made in the fullness of time by the Prime Minister and by colleagues, as


is always the case with any Prime Minister and leader of the party,


but at the moment we are resolutely focused on trying to make sure the


country can have the responsible study government that it really


needs at this point, and that should be our focus too. In what way should


Mrs May change? I think there are all sorts of lessons we can pick up


from the campaign and the reaction to it, even from the thing that


surprised most of us, the way in which Jeremy Corbyn, in spite of all


of his manifest failings, in particular his extreme political


views, was able to present himself in a rather avuncular way. I didn't


ask about Mr Corbyn. I'm saying I think there are some lessons there,


in terms of relaxing little bit into communicating with the electorate.


It is something she does very well in person, increasingly so since she


became Prime Minister. That's not the experience of the campaign, the


more people saw her the more they didn't like the colour of her gym.


It didn't communicating the campaign, but also I think we need


to see a much more open and inclusive approach within


government, within Parliament as well. That's not just a kind of


desirable outcome, which I think always would have been desirable and


I've had this conversation with previous prime ministers as well.


It's a necessity in the circumstances, trying to make a hung


parliament and minority government work really requires a much more


inclusive approach. You are being brought into the decision taking


process on the deal being done with the DUP? I have said to the Prime


Minister I think it is important she speaks to colleagues as soon as


possible. I'm hoping to bring it forward to tomorrow so she can


talk... But are you being involved in this more inclusive process? I am


not on a negotiating team but I saw the Prime Minister very early after


the election had taken place, I went to London on Friday afternoon and


met with her and we had a discussion about all sorts of things that need


to be addressed over the coming days and weeks. When Mrs May spoke in


Downing Street after she'd gone to see the Queen, it was another


robotic performance. It didn't even express any regrets for the Tories


that had lost. You had to into being to get her to make a second


statement, didn't you? No, she was already going to give the interview


she gave. You urged her to do so. She was already scheduled to give


the interview. I happen to see her in between the statement and


interview, and I was keen to press home that in the past Conservative


Party that has been very poor in its communications with colleagues who


have lost their seats in the general election, that is something none of


my colleagues likes to see so I certainly did say that I think it's


important we do better this time. What bits of the manifesto will you


now have to jumk for the Queen 's speech? That will be an interesting


process to witness. I don't think it will just be the Queen 's speech, it


will be the whole experience of government. There's no point in


sailing ahead with items that were in the manifesto which we won't get


through Parliament so I think we will have to work very carefully. No


doubt we will slim down the Queen's speech. So tell me, which bits will


you have to junk? Back to the triple lock on pensioners and no grammar


schools? How about that? I would be upset if we couldn't make any


progress on allowing people to have a choice of grammar schools if they


wanted. Are you hoping they will drop it? If we cannot get things


through Parliament, we cannot do them so I certainly would suggest


that we can look for instance at a rather modest sort of pilots,


opening some state grammar schools in inner urban areas, especially


where education at the moment is not offering great opportunities to


people of lower income backgrounds. I think that is something that could


command quite broad support. I have heard from friends on the Labour


ventures quietly that they would like that approach to be taken. We


will certainly have to trim our policies carefully according to what


we think Parliament will support. Graham Brady in Salford, thank you.


Let's go to Nottingham where I am joined by Anna Soubry. In the early


hours of Thursday morning you called on Theresa May to consider her


position. Is that still your view? Yes, she obviously has considered


her position and she is set to go in due course, but I very much agree


with Graham, we don't want her to go now. We want a period of stability


and she has got to reach out and form a consensus and she has got to


form a consensus in particular on Brexit. She has now got to make sure


she understands that the British people have rejected a hard Brexit.


We are leaving the EU, I don't think there's any change there but we are


not going to be leaving the EU in some irresponsible weights that will


damage future generations in our country and there's a big lesson to


be learned as you've already identified in your programme, about


younger people and the message they have sent out in this election. I


will come onto Brexit in the moment, but you have said she is set to go


in due course, what does that mean? I don't know. After the summer,


before the end of the year? I would have thought so. She is flawed,


she's in a desperate situation. Her position is untenable and I think


she knows that and she is doing the right thing, which is she's got rid


of these special advisers, she's brought in Gavin Barwell, and she's


listening to people from all parts of not just the party but the


country. She has got to reach out more and broaden the base within her


Cabinet, and she's got to include people from all parts of my party as


well as all points of view across Parliament. So what impact in your


view will, as you describe it, Mrs May's much more weakened position,


what impact will that have on her current Brexit stance? Will she have


to change it and water it down? Yes, absolutely. The country did not vote


for a hard Brexit. This is based on my experience of having knocked on


the literally thousands of dollars, actually since February. I have


listened to a lot of people, and the idea of a hard Brexit, people didn't


like that. It's one of the reasons we haven't won this election. They


accept we are leaving, I accept it, but we want to get the best deal and


she must not turn her back on British business as I'm afraid she


has. She's got to listen to British business and Philip Hammond, she's


got to listen to Greg Clark. Wise owls who know what British business


once and they want that single market and they also wanted proper


immigration policy that recognises we need immigrants and free movement


in order for British business to continue to flourish.


She has to at least listen to these things, and she hasn't in the past.


Is that what Ruth Davidson, leader of the Scottish Conservatives, about


the only Conservative to emerge with credit on Thursday, is that what she


means? We should remain members of the single market, remain in the


customs union and put the economy before immigration. Is that what you


are talking about? Absolutely. And I always have. And in my literature I


made it very clear I would continue to make the case for the single


market and positive benefits of immigration. Although my majority


was reduced, I put on 1800 more votes. It's not about me, obviously,


it's about me being a Conservative, but I made my position clear and I


have not faulted on that. Turning our back on the customs union in


particular is the stuff of madness. The single market sees off the


Nationalists and their desire for a second referendum, although the


mighty Ruth Davidson is already done that with her remarkable result in


Scotland, but it would also solve the problem with Ireland. Don't you


risk reopening all those Tory divisions over Europe on this? I


haven't. You have held these views for a long time. There are 20 of


other, probably more Tories, who want what you call a hard Brexit. --


plenty of other. It's what the people want. But you don't have a


majority. At this election the people have spoken and they have


rejected the hard Brexit. I think we can all agree on that. That doesn't


mean to say we are not leaving the EU, we will leave the EU, and I


believe even people who voted to remain accept we are leaving. I


found very few angry Remainers on the doorsteps. People accept the


result, but they do not want a hard Brexit. That's the message coming


out from this and I hope Theresa May gets that. If she does, then she has


to build the con census. There's nothing to stop her working with


sensible people in the Labour Party, who also accept the referendum


result, no we will be leaving the EU, and know we have to get the best


deal, and we can't close our minds on the single market and Customs


union. What are the bits of the Tory manifesto you will now have to drop


to keep your new bedfellows happy in the DUP? I don't think we have


reached a deal yet with the DUP. But that is the aim. Apparently it's the


aim. I will tell you now, Andrew, you probably know far more than I


do. I get on well with a number of members of the DUP. I don't like a


lot of their policies on abortion, gay and lesbian issues, I completely


disagree with them, but if we can put those issues aside and put the


focus on making a stable government and putting the national interest


first, we might well make strides forward. Many people have been


talking about public services and public sector pay, but we have to do


recognise that at the same time we are going into choppy economic


waters, and that's why I think it's so important Theresa May listens to


Philip Hammond and puts him much more at the core and front of this


government. It's the economy that matters more than anything else.


That's one of the spectacular failings of the campaign. The issue


that was hardly mentioned during the campaign. Never mentioned it. Anna


Soubry, we will leave it there. After Theresa May had been to see


the Queen at Buckingham Palace on Friday she made a brief statement on


Friday. We can remind ourselves what she said.


We will continue to work with our friends and allies,


in the Democratic Unionist Party in particular.


Our two parties have enjoyed a strong relationship over many


years, and this gives me the confidence to believe


that we will be able to work together in the interests


This will allow us to come together as a country


and channel our energies towards a successful


Brexit deal that works for everyone in this country.


Securing a new partnership with the EU that guarantees our


That's what people voted for last June, that's what we will deliver.


I've been joined by the Conservative MP Dominic Raab -


a former government minister who's been tipped for a return in Theresa


We shall see. Welcome to the programme. Her two most senior


advisers have fallen on their swords. Most of the Cabinet has gone


to ground since the result. Could Theresa May be any more isolated? I


don't think that's true. You have three Cabinet ministers doing


television this morning. We are in the middle of a reshuffle, so you


wouldn't expect them all to be out on the airwaves, and we also in the


business of hammering out the detail on the supply and confidence


arrangement with the DUP. Where are we on that? On the question of Chief


of staff, a new appointment has been made, Gavin Barwell, I know him


well, a smart policy guide and also very sensitive on the political


radar and that shows we are moving forward. It was forced on her. I


think they did the honourable thing. The two aids that fell on their


sword? Yes. The key point is, looking forward, which we have to


do, we had the outcome of the election and the people have spoken


and we have to make the best of it. Gavin Barwell is an important


appointment. Conservative MPs across-the-board know, respect and


trust him. Nobody in the country has heard of him, but maybe that doesn't


matter. How many had heard of Nick Timothy and Fiona Hill before they


were appointed? They do now. Do you agree with Anna Soubry that Theresa


May is no more than a caretaker Prime Minister now? I don't.


Emotions are way up. But we still won the most votes and most seats.


My reading from talking to MPs across-the-board is the overwhelming


majority want to see Theresa May continue in office. As a matter of


necessity, the people have spoken, and we have to respect what the


people have decided, so we will do this supply and confidence


arrangement with the DUP. There are strong areas of overlap but we don't


agree on everything. The key thing is to give the country certainty and


direction moving forward. That's the only viable option and people are


rallying behind that. Not all. George Osborne said this morning on


the BBC that Mrs May was a dead woman walking. He has made the


transition from Conservative MP to mischievous journalist with ease.


Most MPs when they listen to that will think it's disloyal,


unprofessional and frankly pretty self-indulgent. In reality I think


it will shore up support among a lot of MPs for Theresa May. What went


wrong? I'm not going to candy coat, sugar-coat the result here. We did


far worse than expected and we need to figure out the lessons to learn.


I know it went wrong, but why? There isn't anyone thing. You have to take


time to learn the lessons. We need to show some humility about the


result. Nick Timothy has written a column that touches on some of the


issues from his perspective. To be honest with you, I'm focused now, I


missed all the drama and disappointment of not getting the


result we wanted, focus on the facts. We got 56 more seats than the


Labour Party and we are the only ones who can put together a


legitimate parliament that can also be affected, passing a judgment and


pass legislation, however tricky it may be. That remains to be seen, you


might not be able to do that. We are the only ones, with the DUP, who


could form a viable and effective government that would reflect


legitimately the outcome of the election and we will focus 100% on


that. Let's do that. Mrs May promised strength and stability. We


now have a hung parliament and she is dependent on the DUP for the


slimmest of majorities. There is nothing strong and stable about


that. I have said to you, I will not tell you this result is the one we


wanted. We are disappointed. It's not strong and stable. It can still


be effective. It's also the only outcome that can respect and be


legitimate of the outcome of the election. At the end of the day, we


had campaigning, we can differ on the opinions, but the facts and


parliamentary arithmetic is there. The only way we can have an


effective government of any time that Del Paso budget is the


Conservatives with the support of the DUP. To do that you'll have to


make compromises you would not have to do make if you had won a


substantial majority. What part of the manifesto will have to go to get


a budget and a confidence motion through? 48 hours after the election


I can't answer that definitively. What we do have to do, every MP,


whatever part of the country they were elected, has to deliver as best


can be manifesto commitments. At the same time, that's what the country


expects. At the same time we had forced on us the need to be


flexible. The people didn't vote for your manifesto in the end. Something


has to go. The triple lock for pensioners that you were going to


change, the DUP is in favour of the triple lock. Does that bit of the


manifesto go? You can ask me any aspect of the manifesto, we'll know


more answers the detail next week. You were on our programmes more than


any Cabinet minister. You will be drafted back in. You should know. I


don't bet too much money on the tittle tattle in the media. We have


the outline of the supply and confidence arrangement with the DUP.


We are hammering out the details. Next week we will publish the


details. What about social care? You asking me about different points in


a manifesto but you know I can't answer that question until... I want


to deliver as much of the manifesto as possible. You don't have a


mandate to do that. That's because we've got... The Queen's speech is


only a week away, a week tomorrow. You are trying to work out what


parts, Labour lost, but you didn't win, and I'm trying to work out how


you just said we will have to comprise and make changes. It's


legitimate to ask which parts... I'm explaining I don't have the answers


on the detail because until we have formed the supply and confidence


arrangement with the DUP, we will not have those details. My starting


point is that we deliver as much of the manifesto as we conceivably can.


That's what the country expects because that's what they are elected


us to do. They have given us their verdict, we need to respect the


outcome of the election and we will not do it in the same way will as if


we had a stonking majority, obviously. The result has given a


kind of new spring in the step of politicians who wanted to remain in


the European Union. What do you make, and we heard Anna Soubry, and


many others have said it as well, that you need to reconsider your


Brexit stands, and in their language community soften your Brexit stands.


Whether you are a Scottish, Welsh or English MP, elected to Parliament


behind me on the basis of a manifesto that sets out in great


detail, a 75 page white Paper, the approach to Brexit. All this talk of


hard Brexit, our ambition is to get the best possible deal we can with


our EU partners. Do you change your stands because you didn't get a


majority for your Brexit position. Do you follow the advice of Ruth


Davidson, who talked of an open Brexit, framing a new Brexit


strategy? Hard and soft Brexit, I don't know exactly what Ruth means


by that. But she did a great job in Scotland. But every MP was elected


on our manifesto. We will deliver the plans of that manifesto as best


we can, including and especially on Brexit. Just a point of fact,


obviously be Conservative number of votes went up, Labour effectively...


The vote share went up, but we lost seats, but we are 56 seats ahead of


the Labour Party. The Labour Party effectively endorsed the leave the


EU strategy we set out and they didn't offer a alternative. So no


change on the Brexit strategy? And the anti-Brexit parties, the SNP and


Lib Dem, both suffered a fall in their vote share. The country has


said they want us to make a success of Brexit. So no change? The plans


in the White Paper set out are the right ones and the voters expect us


to deliver on the manifesto we ran on, whether you are a Scottish,


English or Welsh MP. I can hear your helicopter arriving to whisk you off


to the wry ministerial meeting. Let us know what job you get. Viewers in


Scotland will leave us for Sunday Politics Scotland now. Jeremy


Corbyn... Jeremy Corbyn may have


lost the election, but he's clearly cock-a-hoop


with the big increase in Labour's share of the vote and


the nmber of Labour On Friday he called


on Theresa May to resign, and said he was ready to govern


the country as a minority Speaking this morning, the Labour


leader said he thought there could be another election in the near


future. I think it's quite possible that there will be an election later


this year or early next year. And that might be a good thing, because


we cannot go on with a period of great instability. We have a


programme, we have the support, and we are ready to fight another


election campaign as soon as may be because you want to be able to serve


the people of this country on the agenda we put forward, which is


transformative, and has gained amazing levels of support. People


say, hang on, why are my children worse off than we are, why are my


grandchildren? This election wasn't just about Brexit, there was


something different about it. It was challenging the economic consensus


that has impoverished Sony people. The Labour


leader speaking earlier this morning.


We've been joined by the Shadow Health Secretary, Jon Ashworth.


A lot of Labour people have been behaving as if you have won this


election, can I point out you have lost three in a row?


Yes, but undoubtedly momentum is with us, and momentum is important


in politics. It looks like they got the young vote out and that's why


you did better-than-expected. The young vote certainly came out for


Labour. I found on my part of the world Tory voters switching to


Labour over things like the dementia tax, but I also think Ukip


supporters voted heavily for Labour because we wanted to invest heavily


in the NHS and schools, and people are fed up of cuts to public


services and the austerity agenda. So it was a good manifesto? You were


happy with it? Yes, I was part of putting it together. You would be


happy to fight another election based on that manifesto? Yes, I put


together the health section of that manifesto, which gives nurses and


midwives of the pay rise, I'm very happy with that manifesto. And yet,


you have this manifesto you were happy with, you will rub against a


Prime Minister who wanted to fight a personality led presidential


campaign, it then turned out the British people didn't think she had


much personality and wasn't presidential in nature. You had


momentum and you ended up winning no more seats than Gordon Brown in the


collection of 2010. Given where we were seven weeks ago, I looked at


the opinion polls and thought crikey, this could not be a good


result for Labour potentially. Theresa May thought she would have a


landslide victory and that's why she put her party first in going for


this snap election, and undoubtedly this campaign changed things. I


think the key moment was the manifesto week when the Labour Party


but forward proposed policies to the country which excited many people,


and the Tory party came forward with the dementia tax, getting rid of the


winter fuel payment, I think that was a turning point in the election.


What does Mr Corbyn do now? When I spoke to Ken Livingstone on Friday


he said we did so well on a socialist manifesto, we need more of


this. We need more socialism and we will do even better. Is that the


lesson Jeremy Corbyn will take or try to reach out more to the centre


of his party, now his position is unassailable does he try to reach


out beyond his own group? I think there is broad unity and the whole


party will come together to take on the Conservatives, who now have a


huge problem in Parliament. They can only offer a weak and unstable


government. She's trying to cobble together this supply and confidence


agreement with the DUP which means all of the decisions in Parliament


will be taken on a case-by-case basis. It isn't just the votes on


the floor of the House, all of is the statutory instruments will rely


on the support of the DUP. She will not be able to guarantee she can get


her programme through. We are likely to sue the Government collapse or


have a zombie Parliament where we are not debating and voting on


legislation because she knows she cannot get it through. If that's the


case, even if she puts together a deal with the DUP and it gets off


the ground but runs into the kind of difficulties you quite rightly say


are possible, and she cannot continue, should Mr Corbyn try to


form a minority government? I think so, I think we should try to put our


programme of getting rid of tuition fees, investing in the NHS, and ask


the other parties to support us. I'm anticipating your next question


which is what happens if that doesn't work, well then we are


probably heading to another general election at some point. I cannot


seem Theresa May surviving as the Prime Minister for the rest of this


Parliament for another five days to be frank but who knows. It's likely


that you think Mrs May cannot make this work, she can start to make it


work but as time goes on it could become more difficult, that Labour


could try to form a minority government but given that the


Parliamentary arithmetic is not great for her, it is much worse for


you, that it may not work? Yes, but you have a responsibility to try and


to challenge the other parties to support us honour policies of


investing in the NHS, investing in childcare, so that will be a


challenge for us but if the Conservatives cannot form a


government we would have to take up that responsibility. John McDonnell,


the Shadow Chancellor, said to me during the campaign there would be


no deals. You don't have to have deals. As I said to him, we have all


seen Borgen! They require deals, you have got to give them something. But


when you have an minority government, challenging MPs on the


other side to support new... My voters in Leicester South were not


invited to make a judgment on the DUP manifesto and yet we could have


a Conservative government propped up by the time being by the DUP, even


though that will have a huge impact on the peace process. I think it is


a different arrangement. A minority Labour government wouldn't


necessarily rule out getting support from the DUP, they might need it? If


they vote for us, everyone will see it because it will be transparent in


the way they vote. It does seem we are in for a period of instability


in British politics, that is the outcome of this election, and


usually when that happens it leads to a second election quite quickly.


It could lead to that, and it is ironic given the Tories promised a


strong and stable government, and the chaos she warned of is actually


chaos in the Tory party, but look at the number of seats in play at the


next election now. It will be a Labour Tory stand-off and as a whole


range of seats now with Tory majorities of a few hundred which


Labour is targeting. Seats which based on the 2015 result we didn't


think we could win. And Scotland is in play for Labour again, and it is


Scottish MPs sustaining Theresa May in Government at the moment. The


message in Scotland will be, if you want a Labour government, both


Labour. I bet you never thought you would say that, but let's leave it


there. Hello and welcome to Sunday Politics


in Northern Ireland. And we find ourselves


slap bang in the middle the attempts by Theresa May to form


a minority government. So what will the deal,


if there is one, look like? The DUP says it's not


in a position to take part so talking about that


potential agreement, plus their own election


performances, are representatives


from Sinn Fein, the SDLP, We'll also have analysis


from Stephen Walker in London and Allison Morris and


Newton Emerson will be joining me in studio later


to share their thoughts a remarkable few days


of political upheaval. and try to work out how precisely


we got to where we are, there's also the big question


about where we might be going. We know the Conservative Chief Whip


spent yesterday in Belfast Meantime in Westminster,


fears have been expressed about the DUP's approach to social


and moral issues. Here's our Political


Correspondent, Gareth Gordon. Theresa May has never been exactly


noted for her interest in Northern Ireland, but all of that appears to


have changed, and in a big way. This foray into East Belfast last week


brought her part the not so princely sum of 446 votes. But the DUP gives


political salvation for now. At what price? They are tough. They are


going to dry a very hard bargain and, like the 27 leaders in Europe,


they have seen they are not dealing with somebody strong and stable,


they are dealing with somebody who caves. They are going to have her


around their little finger and, frankly, they have already got there


by the speed with which she has done this today. The former spin doctor


was speaking from experience of the DUP. Others are downright hostile.


We have the party like the DUP, which is anti-same-sex marriage,


which denies climate change, at the forefront of British politics, and I


am absolutely petrified at the prospect of such a coalition of


chaos. Similar views were expressed at a protest in London yesterday.


DUP has got to go! Racist, sexist, anti-gay! But this former junior


minister says those views of the party are out of date. A caricature


of a party that may have existed 30 years ago. In the last ten years,


the book as has been on growing the economy, growing our tourism


industry. We have held a department in the past that has helped us get


the record levels of FDI, grow tourism and get major international


events and I think that is where the focus of the modern DUP years.


Concerns have already been expressed to Theresa May the leader of the


Scottish Conservatives, who is gay and thin plans to marry her partner.


I was fairly straightforward weather. I told her there is a


number of things that count to me more than party. One of them is


country, one of the others is LGBT rates. I asked for a categoric


assurance that there would be, if any deal or scoping deal with done


with the DUP, there would be absolutely no retention of LGBT


rates in the rest of the UK and Great Britain and that we would try


to use any influence that we had to advance those rights in Northern


Ireland. You don't have to go to Britain to find sceptics about the


DUP conservative deal. Oh mixed views on Carrick Vargas yesterday


but they are remembered King Billy's arrival in Ireland before the Battle


of the Boyne. It is particularly. Lots of English voters do not know


what they have let themselves and four. It is a good thing. If it will


help the country, I do not why not. I would love to hope and pray that


the DUP can go and get things for us, but can we get Stormont up and


running again please, local politicians? Just work together for


once, would you, please? The DUP Masie Theresa May's skin, but could


the price be the end of devolution at Stormont? Talks aimed at


restoring power-sharing are due to resume tomorrow. What impact it


enabled the DUP had been conservative deal had on them? The


British government has made a mistake, even in the recent past, of


siding with the DUP and holding up progress, preventing us reaching an


agreement on real power-sharing. As the British government wants to try


to unite with the DUP to turn back the clock, the mandate we received


on Thursday to make sure we do not allow anybody to turn back the clock


to the bus but instead continue to make progress. The fact that


potentially the DUP will be the Conservatives' government partners


asks very major questions about their ability to be an independent


guarantor of the agreement, or any of the processes here. Talks to


restore Stormont are no longer the biggest item on the DUP's in trade.


Devolution may have to wait. To discuss, we have


Mairtin O'Muilleoir from Sinn Fein. And Stephen Farry from


the Alliance party. The DUP said it wasn't


in a position to put anyone


forward for the programme. We're going to talk about the deal


between the DUP and the Tories, of course.


Mairtin O'Muilleoir, that report ended with you warning


about the Conservatives hindering a deal


between the DUP and Sinn Fein at Stormont.


The talks are supposed to start tomorrow.


Well, Sinn Fein will be at Stormont tomorrow. As you know, all of the


issues around agreement at Stormont could be sorted out expeditiously,


but I do think this new coalition, weather a coalition of chaos or


whatever, between the DUP and Tories will mean an assault on issues of


rates, respect and it will make a deal harder. There will be a price


to pay. The Tories are still wedded to austerity. As the DUP? Sir


Michael Farren, the Defence Secretary, a senior defence sector,


has said the deal will be about the DUP's support in government on big


economic and security issues. A lot of these things that people are


talking about expressing concerns about are not actually part of any


agreement being discussed. Of course, the DUP and Tories have not


spell out the nature of the deal yet. There has been a bit of a


wobble. Fallon spelt that out. Yesterday were told there was a deal


and now it is so and process because there's been a backlash from the


British people. It will end in tears but how long will it last? Will it


all because the British people say they do not want to have a coalition


with a party which is anti-gay, and he respect, and the Irish language?


In all stanzas, the DUP is more in 1977 than it I really do think the


British people and media are asking why we are getting into bed with an


organisation which in the last election was endorsed by the UDA,


UBS, the red hand commando. Theresa May warned about extremism in


politics and now performing a... You know that members of that party said


they did not want that endorsement. The MP for South Belfast is still


not renounced that endorsement and neither has the leader. Nicola,


Charlie Flanagan, the public's Minister for foreign affairs, has


said that the objectivity of both the British and Irish governments is


key as far as the Stormont negotiations are concerned. What is


your understanding? Or, to the wider issue about that relationship


between the Tories and the DUP and what that might mean for the


governance of the UK any moment, but in terms of its implications for


politics here in Northern Ireland, at Stormont, what is your reading of


where we are? It is very serious, Mark. The SDLP were clear at the


beginning of the first round of talks that the secretary of state


could not be accepted as an honest broker, particularly when it came to


the past. The British government are expected to be called guarantors of


the Good Friday Agreement. We expressed that concern. That was


then, and the situation... It has got even worse. Our first task is to


agree on an impartial jury. That needs to be neither side of business


first thing tomorrow morning. But it must not be allowed to run on and be


used as an excuse for not getting down to dogs and not getting the


institutions and running. I am sorry to raise the phrase red line, but is


that a line in the sand as far as you're concerned? There has to be an


independent doctor present? Anybody with in a sense looking at the


situation would realise that needs to happen. How can you have a


Secretary of State sitting at the table as an honest broker when they


are actually in understanding or agreement or arrangement, because


you're still not quite sure, with one of the parties round the table,


while also having the duty and responsibility of being a co-current


order of the Good Friday Agreement? It is not possible and anybody that


pretend otherwise is ludicrous. Do you accept that the situation has


changed? You might not have felt that before, but the accepted means


to be the case now? We are in a completely unique and different


situation. This is a very fluid and movable piece at the moment. I think


the main action initially will continue to be at Westminster. Yes,


we will come under that, I promise, any moment or two, but as far as


Stormont is concerned, will your talks team be turning up to Stormont


tomorrow to begin that three-week process? The Ulster Unionists will


be at Stormont tomorrow and hoping I'm expecting to see progress in


getting the Stormont institutions back up and running again. But are


you satisfied? That is what you want, that is what you see people


want, but you satisfied that a Secretary of State for Northern


Ireland will be able to demonstrate the kind of independence and


objectivity that would be required to reach an agreement between all


the parties? The Secretary of State, and indeed the Prime Minister, have


made no secret of their own news and views.


They are strongly prounion. But it is a different scenario now. We


welcome that the board. It is a fact of life that they have the


responsibility to administer the political affairs of Northern


Ireland. But they would be in bed with the DUP. It is a completely


different scenario. We are in a very fluid situation. Let's see what


happens at Westminster, if a deal can be brought together, and let's


also see then what repercussions it has potentially for Stormont. Where


you stand on a British Secretary of State 's objectivity, Stephen? There


is no a massive problem. Things were difficult before hand but he cannot


be objective in this contact any longer. And any circumstances?, even


if they go out and try to save water to be impartial mediators and try to


decouple what has happened in Westminster from Northern Ireland,


the reality is that a difficult decision as to be taken, whether now


or in six months. The Conservative Secretary of State, the UK


Government, will have one hand tied behind our back because if they push


the DUP into any issue, as they annoy them, the DUP will pull the


plug on whatever arrangement they have and the thing will come


crashing down. You're going to have to get over that. The facts of life


are it is the Conservative administration. It may well have the


support of the DUP, but it is a Conservative and Unionist and just


it. But surely the point is that if it comes to it, when undercooked --


normal circumstances the secretary of state would be pressuring the DUP


to agree to something that is not particularly keen about, the DUP


will tell it to get stuff? Those are the challenges. The alternative, of


course, to the DUP is to potentially hand the keys of Downing Street to


Germany Corbin. Not many unionists in Northern Ireland... The maths


won't let that happen. They can trigger an early general election.


The Conservative Party, in theory, can run on minority administration


and seek allies across the spectrum on different issues as they come


along, in particular as they were to pursue a more pragmatic approach to


a softer Brexit and forego what they the manifesto, they might find


support elsewhere in the House of Commons on different issues. They do


not need to do is cause a one-on-one deal with the DUP for stability, in


terms of the UK. If they want to, you cannot stop them. They cannot


stop them from doing that but the repercussions for Northern Ireland


are potentially severe. Do you think the prospect of a


restoration of devolution instalment are further away than ever? They are


more difficult, not impossible. I wouldn't want to rule it out but


there are two particular challenges. We have Sinn Fein is in a stronger


position, but further apart from the DUP than we've seen in the past.


Also, the sharing of independence, in terms of governance, one of the


key partners in a potential coalition has an in-built advantage


which outweighs that of the other parties, we don't have that proper


equilibrium. Those of us who've never seen the British Government is


independent in these matters are not surprised at all by this formal


coalition. The British Government has been a player here. We've never


said we would accept the independence of the Secretary of


State. Do you agree it is certainly more difficult but not impossible to


reach a deal? What I do believe is the British Government of finding a


deal when the talks were sabotaged by the calling of an election force


of the British Government has never been a passer-by or someone who is


just spectating. The Stormont has agreement and legacy failed because


the British Governor grenade, -- Renate. -- act out. -- backed out.


Of course it changes. But the non-unionist... No, no, no... The


non-unionist parties have to get over the fact, including Sinn Fein


and SDLP... They have to get over the political fact of life that the


Conservative Government re-elected, possibly with the assistance of a


Democratic Unionist party, that is the situation... It answers to the


DUP tumour. Your former party leader said yesterday it wouldn't be a good


idea for the UK Government to be dependent on any regional party. We


have yet to see the detail. Lets see because overnight... He said


Conservative backbenchers will not want to be held to ransom by the


DUP. That's properly correct but there is a case of political need


for the current Prime Minister. We are in a desperate situation, there


appears to be some nervousness on behalf of the DUP overnight so let's


see where this takes us over the next couple of days. Danny is making


his point but let's be sensible about this, OK. Say you have a


dispute in the workplace so you bring in a mediator, are we saying


it acceptable media as part of the management structure? It's as simple


as that. How do we get over this? We agree on an impartial chair to get


the talks up and running as a matter of urgency. Stephen is right, the


problem is we just had an election with an increasingly polarised


result. People have bigger mandate, they remind us about it, but what


are you going to do with those mandates? People are desperate to


get the institutions up and running. Words are great but it's time we got


the institutions up and running and if we did have a budget, all of


those things, schools would not be in a situation they are in, and


hospitals also, also, that's the key task. You said throughout this


campaign, Mairtin O'Muilleoir, Northern Ireland MPs did not, could


not, have any influence at Westminster and that's why you have


the abstention is the policy you have but you'd been proved


completely wrong because the DUP cartel wagging the Tory dog. Arlene


Foster and her ten MPs are about to have influence. Lets see what


happens this week and what this coalition tries to bring about and


that will be wide the DUP will be dictating to Theresa May where she


stands on rights and respectful stop it could be very good. Here is the


difficulty for Sinn Fein. This could deliver for people in Northern


Ireland, we had Arlene Foster say this morning, this is about


delivering for everybody in Northern Ireland, bringing investment,


benefits, ending austerity, and about the DUP's manifesto


commitments being delivered in Westminster in a way no one could've


imagined three or days ago. I have no doubt this coalition will be the


worst for the LGBT community. Those issues are not being discussed. They


are not part of the agenda. The DUP is not in favour of marriage


equality. They won't turn it might. It will be difficulty in equal


rights for gay people. You need to get back on the storm on to make


sure that's not the case. We want to do that. I don't believe you when


you say that. Our mandate on Thursday night was a strong mandate


and we do believe not only that you're about to collapse the


institutions of Stormont because they were not delivering the


Government people want... So you want to get back into Stormont? I


said that at the start of the programme. You need to compromise to


do that, and need to get rid of your Irish language thing, and Arlene


Foster being... The British gunmen signed on it and backed out of it.


Tomorrow morning we start dialogue. There are challenges for the DUP as


well. Broadly speaking, the Unionist opinion would welcome positive


influence from the prounion point of view in international Government, no


doubt about that but the difficulty in the balance the DUP have to find


is that how they balance it against more unpopular Tory Conservative


policies. When the Ulster Unionist Party had a link with the


Conservative Party in 2010, we were pilloried, absolutely verbally


abused, even by the DUP. Particularly by the DUP who called


us Tory boys. That was a completely different situation before the


election. That was a proper pact. Yes, there are good sides to be in


in Government with good news you can deliver on and there is a downside.


In a changing situation, about Brexit, and the economy, it gives us


a downturn leading to unemployment or further measures posterity, the


DUP cannot escape. Some compliance. This is why this could be unstable.


And why DUP could pull the plug on it in the future. That's why it's


important it's not just the deal we see in due course, but what happens


under the table. It may not be benign and responsible. There will


be all sorts of understandings reached, side deals. It untenable


without her full transparency. -- we don't have full transparency.


Posterity has cost us ?1 billion cash. -- austerity. If you would


have to work if they deliver the money. We would oppose austerity.


The DUP may be the party which owns austerity. They are opposed to the


ending of the triple lock as far as pensions are concerned, the end of


the pensioner went to payment. Let's see what success the Conservative


Party have. Can I ask you a question? If we had a budget, we


wouldn't be in this difficult situation. In terms of this


unravelling, I think that the irony is that you have the DUP during


gauging in this understanding because they want to give stability


to the union and its being rejected by parties across the union, the UK,


the Tory party as I think that's the irony. Just to remind people in case


they're just tuning in, the DUP has chosen not to be here to make its


case. Less than 50% for the first time ever and the majority against


Brexit, which would impose... You can't say the DUP didn't have a good


election. The three people at the far end of the table had a pretty


bad slap in the face. You have no chance of a border. Lets not talk


about that at the moment. Where do you go in terms of losing your three


seats? It was a bad night for the SDLP. Can you pick the pieces up?


Yes, it was a very bad result and a devastating blow considering the


calibre of the people we lost. Not just for their constituency but for


wider politics. We've been very clear. We need to hold a mirror up


to ourselves. The dynamic of politics on these islands is


changing and we need to have an honest conversation about that.


We're having a period of reflection and I won't shy away from trying to


look at things in a new way. Just to remind people about those figures,


let's take a look at the graphics which show how the results actually


ended up on Thursday night or the early hours of Friday morning. You


consider turn out there, 65.5%. That is the overall figure for sublets


look at the share of the vote and this is very revealing. The DUP with


over a third of the vote, almost 30% for Sinn Fein. The SDLP on nearly


12%. 10% for the Ulster Unionists. Here is the critical point, the


change from two years ago, 2015, the DUP up 10%, Sinn Fein, 5%, and the


rest are down. You can see there that the turnout was 7%. Danny,


those figures are not good as far as the Ulster Unionist Party is


concerned. No, but we understand the context in which this general


election has been fought. Clearly, there was a reaction from


grass-roots unionism to the rise of Sinn Fein through the assembly


election to the more aggressive nature of the political leadership


of Sinn Fein and the prounion people, largely decided, the best


message they could get was to support the DUP in this election. It


doesn't mean... The stronger of the two parties, the one who could


deliver. Not necessarily. We need to re-establish and make sure that the


prounion electorate have the confidence in the Ulster Unionist


Party to deliver on one or two key issues and to remain strong. Which


we are. Obviously we didn't gain any seats, but our vote has more or less


held. It went down. A fraction of voter share but... The boats are


still there. We are there, standing, viable alternative. We are merging


towards a strong unionist and nationalist voice. Our vote has held


and we are seen increasingly as that vehicle. OK, we've asked a lot of


questions today. I'm not sure how many satisfactory answers we have


provided. It will be an interesting couple of months ahead.


Now, there will be a big focus on Westminster this week as we see


what those efforts to put a government together look


like and it's being reported today that Arlene Foster is due to travel


to Downing Street on Tuesday to meet Theresa May.


Our Political Correspondent, Stephen Walker, is there.


Stephen, just talk is through first of all last night confusion about


the deal or no deal. Yes, it was very confusing. It was a bit like an


episode of the thick of it. It was a bitter shambles. At 7:30pm there was


a statement from Downing Street but basically said the principles of the


deal had been agreed, and the DUP had agreed in principle to do this


deal with the Conservatives effectively to keep them in power.


There was radio silence from the DUP until midnight when they then issued


a statement, not confirming in a statement did it been done but what


they did confirm was discussions were ongoing. Half an hour after


that, Downing Street issued another statement to basically say that


discussions were ongoing and the deal hasn't quite been done, so


there was a lot of confusion around last night. What appears to have


happened is an official from Downing Street released a statement in


error, a mistake, because of the confusion but today the position is


that those discussions are continuing. Arlene Foster is due in


Downing Street on Tuesday and the hopes of both sides I guess that


this deal can be done. We've got the prospect of a deal between the


Conservatives and the DUP but a lot of people across the water clearly


seem to be puzzled about what precisely the DUP represents. That's


right, the DUP must be the most research but your party on the


planet of the moment. Lots of newspaper articles, broadcasts about


the party, people want to know who the party are, what they stand for,


a lot of research going in so using lots of mentions of things about the


party 's stance on abortion, gay rights and creationism and all those


kinds of articles but the DUP are keen to stress can actually people


should member we've been in power-sharing in Northern Ireland,


with Sinn Fein, we have run Government departments so that the


message the DUP are trying to get out. Amongst Conservatives, who are


preparing to go into power, with the DUP, I suppose there are mixed


responses, those that know them well seem quite relaxed. There are good


relationships between the DUP and the Conservatives, and somewhere


people are nervous, concerned about their position on those social


issues but then the Conservatives have to come to this question, if


they want to remain in power, then they have to do a deal with the DUP.


What about Theresa May herself? The Tory grandees taking to the airwaves


seem to be at best qualified support. Some amazing stuff this


morning. George Osbourne of course, no lover of Theresa May's politics


and the way she handled the campaign, has described her as a


dead woman walking. Lord Heseltine, Tory grandees, said he does not


think she will fight another election. And Nicky Morgan, of


course was a cabinet minister, she is basically saying that she think


there will be a Tory leadership battle over the summer. There is an


awful lot of under his command of a lot of pressure on Theresa May. She


may be in Downing Street, but there is an awful lot of questions being


asked about the way she handled the election, and a lot of questions


being asked about whether or not she will be Prime Minister in six months


or 12 months. Stephen, just briefly, what are the key things you need to


look out for in the week ahead? Tuesday will be a key date. The DUP


will come your revolver ten MPs and there will be lots of photographs on


College Green. That is the day that Arlene Foster will meet Theresa May.


We anticipate a photograph in and around Downing Street. If this deal


is done, is as being talked about, the first big test will be tomorrow


week. That is the Queen's speech. If they are doing is confidence and


supply arrangement, the DUP would be expected to back the Queen's speech


on that day. That would be the first big test for the DUP. We leave it


there. Thank you very much indeed, Stephen Walker in Westminster.


And joining me now with their perspective on events


are Allison Morris and Newton Emerson.


Newton, it is hard to keep up, where are we? Gerry Adams has very


noticeably toned down the rhetoric over the weekend on the Tory, DUP


relationship and a border poll. I think everybody else should calm


down as well. The DUP, yes, is very ambitious for its Westminster deal


but it is also still absolutely desperate to get back to Stormont.


It recognises the danger there, the conflict of antagonising the


Nationalist electorate. It does not mean it will be able to resist it,


but it is clearly intending to stay with and social issues and focus on


getting Northern Ireland a bag of cash and goodies, particularly on


welfare reform and mitigating welfare reform, but I think makes it


more likely that Stormont will return. I think it is less likely


that Stormont will return as a result. Sinn Fein build-out of


Stormont and electorate have backed them on that. Their vote is


increasing again. The people who vote for Sinn Fein vote for them to


be abstention is. Martin O'Neill sitting in that seat was very clear


that Sinn Fein wanted to Stormont as soon as possible. They have said


repeatedly that will be no return of the status quo which means the red


lines are not movable. They will not go back of because everything they


want which the DUP will not give them and the DUP has very strong


position, given the fact they be in some kind of partnership coalition


in Westminster. I do not think they are going to be in any mood to


compromise with Sinn Fein. A lot of it does depend, Allison is correct,


about how the DUP manages to rein in its arrogance but listen to what


Gerry Adams said. Two months ago, Sinn Fein was grinning that it DUP


Ivan tore relationship would destroy the peace process. This weekend,


they're laughing it off as a flash and a plan that will end in tears.


They may or may not be right but they are turning that a on. What


actually happens, do you think, that Stormont tomorrow? We heard Nicola


very clear on what you had to say. There needs to be somebody


independent to chair the talks process, because no longer can the


British secretary of state be seen as an independent arbiter. Now, I


mean, a lot of people would have thought that was never the case, but


she seemed to be saying that the basic requirement? The chair does


not make the deal but again they see where they're coming from. At this


point in time, the Conservative Government are indebted to the DUP.


They need them to survive and stay afloat, so how can that Tory


Secretary of State be considered in any way independent? They could go


and bring somebody from America or rather like the in the past but


little thing that will help them get over the line. I do not think there


be any return to Stormont this side of summer. I will be surprised at


this up and running again by December. You both make two very


plausible arguments, you cannot both be right. The 20 will be discussed


before the election was a Stormont deal by the Ottoman. That timetable


might slip roads lately stop it depends on how long this


conservative arrangement looks likely to last. The main problem was


reappointing a chair, and Allison is right again, the timing of this


doesn't really matter. It would be an effective admission that the


British government is not an admission and I do not think that


admission needs to be made, because the DUP will be not be in the


British government. The counterargument to that would be to


say that we are now saying that no Northern Ireland party can


participate in any way on Westminster or Doyle voting. Charlie


Flanagan making it very clear that there needs to be an honest broker


in charge. The integrity and objectivity of both governments are


critical. Not surprising that he should say that. Does that help move


the process forward or draw up yet another obstacle? They're all going


to be there tomorrow. I do not think anybody everything will happen


tomorrow. We do not have a Secretary of State. There is no cheer at this


point of time. There is no budget as well, so the run-up be some kind of


partial direct role in that it will need to be administered by


Westminster before July because I not be Stormont before them. It is


hard to get out of that as well, so I think that we are heading. What is


the future for Theresa May? Speed of it will be difficult for the Tories


to get because we have come to believe in this country that a Prime


Minister made the personal mandate, which is against Parliamentary


representative democracy and its principles but we expect that


anyway. An unelected head of a minority government would really


struggle to have legitimacy. The Tories cannot risk trickling


accidentally an election or undermining their authority to that


point. Not in the foreseeable future, while curbing good win an


election. There are stuck. There is great unrest within the party. They


would like to ask but at this point in time, it could trigger an


election and going by the way the figures are, Corbin would win the


next one. That is the worst-case scenario, another election. I do not


think any others than the another election in the studio, not for a


while anyway! Thank you both very much indeed.


it seems Thursday night and Friday morning were a long time ago -


but what unfolded then has set up


the most remarkable of political stories.


Our coverage of the story will continue on TV,


radio and digital throughout the week,


and I'll see you on The View on BBC One on Thursday.


Until then, from everyone in the team, goodbye.


To the DUP candidate... But I have one. Northern Ireland's answer to


Jeremy Paxman. It's interesting. Unionism has awakened. I think when


you win you find out a lot about other people and when you lose you


find out a lot about yourself. Keep counting the votes!


We are certainly witnessing history. Thinking about how people are taking


the sort of result. And Martin, we did this for you.


But I am not going to keep you too much longer, because there is


parking to be done!


Andrew Neil and Mark Carruthers are joined by Dominic Raab, Jon Ashworth, Anna Soubry and Graham Brady.

Journalists Steve Richards, Julia Hartley-Brewer and Tom Newton Dunn are on the political panel.

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