30/09/2012 Sunday Politics West

In the West... Road the financial crisis in the town halls.

His Eric Pickles squeezing the life out of local councillors, as

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2114 seconds

spending is reduced? Joined us for This is the Sunday Politics in the

West. The Communities Secretary Eric Pickles has been attending a

fundraising dinner in Bristol - well, it is dirty work, but someone

has to do it. He has also been meeting Tory councillors in North

Somerset who are feeling the squeeze - but do the smiles cover

up the real tensions? We're very happy together. He is happy with

the government, I'm happy with his council. So is it all sweetness and

light in the town halls? We will find out the real story a bit later.

But there is nothing touchy feely about our two guests this morning,

because their politics are miles apart. James Gray is a colourful

Conservative MP from Wiltshire. And Thangam Debbonaire is a gender

equality activist and a Labour candidate in Bristol. Thangam,

let's talk about equality. Has that warned not yet been won? A British

sure it hasn't. I want to be part of making sure that walk gets one

fairly. In terms of gender inequality, women are still likely

to earn about one third of what men earn for all sorts of reasons. We

still have a tiny minority of MPs in this country - always smaller

than the brander, for instance. So there is still a lot to do. --

smaller than Rwanda. We are all doing our best. We try to get women

into Parliament, but it is how you do that. It doesn't suit women

somehow. Having more women in their would change the atmosphere. It has

already changed things on childcare and working hours. If you are

representing Bristol, you don't want to go home at five o'clock. So

actually this is child-friendly, this region. If you happen to be in

Inverness or Cornwall, you can't get home to your kids at five.

it would be terrible if MPs didn't have children will never saw their

children. But what you're saying is that MPs would have their children

in London. It only works if the MPs live in London! It is easy to say,

but hard to do, that is my.. have appointed -- started yet. --

that is my point. Labour supporters from across the

west are off to Manchester this weekend for their annual knees up

at conference. They will need their leader Ed Miliband to be on

sparkling form if he is going to impress the country and increase

Labour's lead in the polls. But can he reach out to the west - as Tony

Blair did - and what does he stand for? I've been to meet him at his

office in Westminster. Givers and blue of where you stand, you closer

to Tony Blair or Tony Benn? I am Labour, that is what people need to

know. I think really be did a lot of the good things but I am about

moving on. -- I think New Labour did a lot of good things. My first

priority will be to get young people back to work. How you going

to do that? We are going to tax the bonuses of bankers and asked

companies to provide training. When I go round the country, people say

this is such a tragedy, young people are out of work for two or

three years. You have spent those bankers bonuses at -- a million

times over. No, I haven't. But we would have a youth employment task

force. They would work with local council leaders. It is a big

question, how do we get by young people back to work? This

government promised change, they promised things would get better,

but they got worse. Margaret Thatcher reached out to the West

Country and turned it into a sea of blue. Tony Blair turned it read.

How will you get people in Swindon and Gloucester, those people you

have to reach it you have any chance of going across the road

into Number Ten? We will be talking at a conference about how we can

cut energy bills for people, make a difference for people. But you

haven't got a magic bullet. There is no simple solution. Well, the

problem with this government is all we offer people is the long haul. I

say to people who voted Conservative at the last election,

some people gave Mr Cameron their trust, and I say to them, we have

had to 0.5 years and people are suffering more not less. -- We've

had 2.5 years. Isn't it true that there is not enough rich people to

pay the price? Middle and lower income earners also have to suffer.

The missing ingredient at the moment is economic growth. If you

end up with everybody on the dole claiming benefits and not paying

taxes, fewer benefits available, borrowing will rise. To borrow is

rising under this government. That is why we need to show a different

path to the future. If the Bristol mayor is elected, what do you think

the salary should be? I pay double the salaries in Bristol to people

in Bristol. I think Martin will be a fantastic met. He has shown that

he understands what people care about. I will be supporting them. -

- a fantastic mayor. Thangham and James were all ears

listening to that. Thangham - had you heard about this latest idea to

deal with youth unemployment? really liked his concern about

youth unemployment. That is something I hear all the time when

I talk to people. But I also liked what he said about who is paying

for the crisis. You said something about the lower and middle income

people paying the price. This government actually gave those rich

people are tax-break recently. Low- income people are wondering why

they are being punished. Had you read about this latest plan? Some

of that was mentioned in last year's speech. On Question Time

this week, Harriet Harman said bankers bonuses would be taxed to

fund cheaper housing. So how many times will they be taxed? There are

lots of different ways of spending a bank bonus. If you tax their

bonuses, that is an awful lot of money. Spending that Maxwell is

part of what aid is going to do. -- what Ed is going to do. James Gray,

youth unemployment must be a priority they any party. A you

ashamed that there over one million young people in a country out of

work? Of course we must do something about it. In my own

constituency, 823,000 are unemployed. This is a lost

generation. We must do something about this, but Labour ignore the

fact that they were in power for 18 years. We are where we are today

because of what they did. Mr Miliband is a nice man. Not one

single person watching today can imagine him becoming Prime Minister.

Ed Balls is much more worrying. He is a professional. Blaming the

Labour Party for the financial crisis is getting very tiring. You

have been in power of the two and a half years. People may have on that

under the Tories in the 1990s you were in deficit almost all of those

years. Saying that we are to blame for the entire financial crisis is

ridiculous. We did not cause the financial crisis in America.

right, we will talk more about the economy later. Eric Pickles has

been given some local councillors are hard recently. But off camera,

they claimed he squeezing the life but out of local government. Even

North Somerset, which is very conservative, is wondering how it

will manage. This is street-level politics...

And it doesn't look good. It's one of the most potholed roads in North

Somerset. Residents rail at the council. Obviously we are all

pretty appalled. It makes you feel undervalued as a member of

community. It makes you wonder why you pay your taxes. It's dangerous,

really dangerous. It's absolutely terrible. It has been like this

since we moved in. I thought they would do something about it, but

they haven't. Sorry, say the Conservative-run

council - but money's tight. In fact, they warn they may have to

chop tens of millions of pounds more, despite several years of

belt-tightening. More than most councils, they feel their been

doing what the government won and two. They say they had been

streamlining for years. They have just two offices that staff work

from - they used to the 18th. And yet the financial crisis continues.

-- there used to be 18. On Tuesday the council leader

showed off town hall improvements - an energy efficient building, lots

of staff hot-desking, and encouraging the public to access

services via computers. It will help save �700,000 a year. But that

won't be enough - by 2018 there may be only enough money to fund social

services. So he had this message for ministers. When we are already

one of most efficient councils in country, spending 61% on care

services, can you tell me how we are supposed to maintain roads and

collect rubbish without any funding whatsoever?

Two days later, he got to ask the top man - Secretary of State Eric

Pickles came to visit. There was plenty of smiling and

posing for pictures - after all, this was arranged by the

Conservatives. Then they went inside to talk - away from the

cameras. And afterwards there was this. We're very happy together. We

bonded, in the way. He is happy with the government, I am happy

with his council. Can you guarantee this council will get more money?

It's not my guarantee that you need to be concerned about, it is the

guarantee of a good, well run local council. That is why we're changing

the system. In your estimation, is it a well run council? It is a

wonderful Council. He is changing the system so councils may raise

more from business rates. But it was not the answer the council

leader have wanted. They clearly disagreed on camera -- off camera.

He has lost a sense of touch with the common people. You can say

something -- you can say anything to him. Of course, he is top.

more you Frank? Oh, yes. -- were you frank?

All was polite as the Secretary of State left. In North Somerset they

will now be working out what to cut next year. In Whitehall they'll be

deciding how much councils must cut in the years after that.

With me now is the former Lib Dem leader of Bristol City Council,

Barbara Janke, who joins us for the first time since she stood down

earlier this year. Well, North Somerset reckon the way things are

going they will have no money for anything apart from social services

in a few years' time. Do you have similar worries in Bristol? Well,

our budget is much bigger, being a city of half a million people. But

social services is by far and away the largest area or on the council

funding. Clearly, councils these days, the services they provide are

mainly for people who are more vulnerable, people who don't have

the same amount of income, the same advantages as many others. So those

people are being cut disproportionately. Now that you

are no longer in the top job, you can be honest. Do local council

leaders cry wolf, saying they have not got enough cash when actually

they know they are running fairly inefficient organisations? I pay

I'll always honest, and I will be honest now. Clearly there are some

savings that could be made. We have made savings of over �50 million in

the last few years. That was achieved by doing things

differently, by prioritising what were universal benefits for

vulnerable children - they and are targeted so we get less children

who are picked up, if you like, as needing extra support. So you can

make savings, but after two years at that level of cuts, it is

difficult to find savings that won't impact very seriously on the

city's more vulnerable people. council-tax be frozen again?

not in a position to know that. I'm not in the cabinet any more. But

that is another way money could be raised to pay for the services. I

think it will be the new mayor who will have that decision to make

when they are elected. James Gray, is it fair that local a authorities

are being kept with their budgets so tightly controlled by

Westminster? Well, I used to be a special adviser to the Prime

Minister. A local authority turned up and said it would be a disaster.

In Wiltshire, for example, we have cut �250 million from the Budget.

We have got rid of five rural district councils. We have frozen

council tax, services are as good as they are. We got rid of 250

managerial jobs. By doing this sort of thing, Wiltshire council have

saved an enormous amount. You spend a fortune hiring a chief executive

and you then got rid of them. was the Liberals. A so you can take

all the credit for the savings. quarter of the government's total

budget is spent on local councils. What do you think, Thangam? I think

what Eric Pickles has done is clever. He has managed to pass the

blame to the local authorities. It will be their fault if council tax

goes up. The amount of housing benefit has been changed but it is

local authority who as to deal with it. Not Somerset is very Tory, they

are the ones saying we don't have any more to cut. They didn't quite

say that. Eric and the leader were great mates by the end of your clip.

We are the mould -- the most centralised government. The

Treasury takes 80% of all finance and then reallocate assets. If you

want local councils to take decisions, if you want them to be

proactive, it would be much better to give them more powers over

finance. That way it is accountable, rather than the government dulling

our bits-and-pieces. -- doling out bits. Business rates are also not

differentiated. You don't benefit if you're doing well.

It is time now for our weekly political round up in 60 seconds.

He is one of the Tories most right- wing backbenchers, but Jacob Rees-

Mogg's hard exterior gave way to his softer side with a bit of love

for his coalition colleagues. -- one of the Tory's. I think the Nick

Clegg - I can hardly bring myself to say this - was rather noble game

going into coalition to the great disadvantage of his party.

But do his Lib Dem colleagues share his love? Our friends at the Daily

Politics went to their conference and asked some of our MPs who they

woud be happy to share power with next. I know, I'm not doing it on

camera! If you are facing the fight of your

life, then call on action man. Paddy Ashdown is heading up our new

election team. He is a hero in Somerset and for

Lib Dems everywhere - there is no doubt he will be leading some good

hand to hand combat at the next election.

James Gray, what do you think of Nick Clegg? I would like it to be a

Conservative government whip a Conservative majority. So I don't

like the coalition, I very much hope after the next election we

have a coalition -- a Conservative government. Barbara, were you proud

of them at the conference? Is a standing up enough for the party?

He is nothing short of heroic. The unfair treatment he receives from

just about everybody is quite beyond belief. I think he has been

a very strong leader and I don't think any of us are can argue

against that. I have led a rainbow cabinet of three parties. The issue

is policies - and what are we trying to achieve and what can we

achieve together? Some people would say you have been a cover for the

cuts. Well, I don't disagree with that. I think we had a very unfair

representation for the media. Thangam, would you go into

coalition with the Lib Dems? I pick it is interesting what James Gray

said. It is not surprising what a decent. We basically do have a

Conservative government. It is unfortunate that what we actually

have is tax-breaks for millionaires and harder bins for the hard-up

people. It is basically a Conservative government. Working

people are the ones paying the price. If the election isn't clear

cut next time round, would Labour do a deal with the Lib Dems? Well,

that is three years away and I will be fighting to win. But would you?

I'm not the leader of the Labour Party so it is not up to me. But I

will lead to be an effective Labour government. We shall have to see.

At the moment, the coalition continues. Nick Clegg did not have

a bad week, did he? I think he had a good week. I think we will see

people looking at long-term benefits. It is easy mid-term

government for Labour to say these things at the moment. Three ways is

a long way ahead. Thank you very much. That is all from us for now.