29/04/2012 The Andrew Marr Show

Good morning. Welcome, to a nation much of which - not all - is

huddled, shivering and drenched, double-dipped, unemployment-mired

but good news too. The Sunday Times Rich List tells us the British rich

are very doing well, which cheers us all up. But here are the top six

names - Mittal, Usmanov, Abramovich, Hinduja, Blavatnik and Bertarelli.

The richest person with a traditional British name is the

Duke of Westminster, in at number seven.

Joining me today for a review of the Sunday newspapers is the lawyer

and Labour peer, Baroness Helena Kennedy and Nick what of the

Guardian newspaper. We must be different in how we

think and how we behave, transparent about what we do and

how we do it, above improper influence.

Those are the words of David Cameron in the forward to the

Ministerial Code of conduct in which, as a new Prime Minister, he

set out how his government would rebuild faith in politics and

politicians. Now, just a couple of weeks short of his anniversary in

Number Ten, Mr Cameron is under intense pressure to demonstrate

that he lives up to those words. This culture secretary may be on

the rack, but, says Labour, the Prime Minister has just as many

questions to answer when it comes to relationships with the Murdochs

and their ambitions. This morning, we will hear what he has to say

because David Cameron is my guest in the studio. We will be talking

just as importantly about the faltering economy. Also this

morning, not exactly like relief because it is a Jacobean drama, the

Duchess of Malfi which features the bid and love, insane jealousy,

murder and strangulation. It almost makes Westminster look moderate.

The Duchess is one of the great female theatrical roles. I will be

talking to the actress Eve Best, star of the latest production of

the plate in London. Finally, from the work of John Webster to his

great contemporary, William Shakespeare.

This time, it is his sonnets given a contemporary twist in an album

which gives new melodies to the instruments of Shakespeare's Day. A

lot coming up but first, the news, with Riz Lateef.

Good morning. Residents in a block of flat in east London have been

told that surface-to-air missiles could be placed on their roof

during the Olympics. Ministers revealed late last year that the

ministry might deploy missiles and the capital to defend the gains

from possible terrorist attacks. People living in the complex near

the site have received a leaflet telling them soldiers could be

based there near the summer. More than a billion pounds will be

spent on securing the Olympics. River patrols, snipers and

helicopters will be used, as well as surface-to-air missiles.

Residents in a private gated block of flats have now been told those

weapons could be based in their complex. I was aware of government

plans for missiles, I have seen it in the last few months. I did not

think they would actually be placed on top of people's private

residences. It creates a lot of fears, it is a massive

inconvenience and I am not sure it is entirely necessary as well.

Dummy missiles will be brought here this week. Real weapons could be

here for two months over the summer, are protected by as many as 10

soldiers. The residents here may have concerns about their apartment

blocks being used to house surface- to-air missiles, but the government

has repeatedly said they would need to embark on a larger security

operation. What that means in practice is now becoming apparent.

The Ministry of Defence says they have not made a final decision on

where exactly to put the missile battery, but with the game's just

three months away, final preparations are clearly under way.

The leader of the Catholic Church in Scotland, Cardinal Keith O'Brien,

has said the Prime Minister is behaving immorally by putting the

needs of the rich ahead of the ordinary people affected by the

recession. The UK's most senior Catholic criticised David Cameron

and said people who had worked hard and saved for their retirement were

being forgotten. Days after David Cameron was

accused by one of his own MPs of being arrogant posh boy who showed

no compassion in understanding the lives of others, he is again

accused of being out of touch with ordinary people. Cardinal O'Brien

is not pulling any punches. He says he believes the way the Prime

Minister is trying to deal with the budget deficit is a moral and

focuses on the needs of his very rich colleagues in the finance

industry at the expense of the poor. The cardinal said the poorest in

society are now those who once thought themselves reasonably well-

off. Young families, workers and pensioners. It is these people who

have had to suffer because of the financial disasters in recent years

and it is immoral, it is not moral, just to ignore them and to say,

well, struggle along and the rich can go one sailing in their own

sweet way. But the government says it is determined to help people who

are struggling. It says majors in the last Budget meant 2 million

people on the lowest in comes with no longer pay income tax. But the

leader of the Catholic Church in Scotland wants to see a so called

Robin Hood tax on the financial sector. He said that would raise

�20 billion each year to be spent tackling poverty.

A man has been charged over a London seige which brought one of

the country's busiest shopping street to a standstill. Tottenham

Court Road was closed for hours on Friday after Michael Green entered

an office, allegedly making threats. Last night he was charged with

making a bomb hoax, making a weapon and false imprisonment.

British and Hollywood royalty brushed shoulders last night at the

launch of the Sundance Film Festival. If Prince Charles and

Robert Redford both attended the event, which is the first time the

festival had been held outside America. It opened with the premier

of a documentary which was narrated by the Prince.

I will be back just before 10 o'clock with the headlines.

Thank you. Now to the front pages, as usual. That Leveson related

story is almost everywhere. There is the Independent. And the

Observer has the former BBC chief Michael Lions attacking Hunt over

his ties to Murdoch. The Sunday Times is going big with its own

rich list. It also has a political story which we will pick up in a

minute. The Mail on Sunday has a completely different story. They

have interviewed the Russian banker shot six times in the centre of

London. A very vivid and pretty horrific first hand account. And

here we have the Sunday Telegraph. Boris, one of those politicians who

does not need a second name. Boris: We need more tax cuts.

As promised, Baroness Helena Kennedy and Nick what of the

Guardian newspaper. Thank you very much indeed. Nick, you have been

spending a busy week observing British politics. Give us a sense

of where we are. Quite an extraordinary week and pretty bad

news for Downing Street. The Tories at the lowest ebb for eight years.

This has Labour has hit the magical 40 % in the opinion polls and the

Tories have hit the not so magical 29 %. It is always important have a

health warning with his pulse. It is an opinion poll, not a general

election result. There were times in the 80s when Michael Foot was

ahead of Margaret Thatcher. But clearly there are deep nerves in

Downing Street and the debate goes like this: How are we facing an ex

potential crisis -- an existential crisis, or is this just a blip.

This is a live debate. There are real concerns. There have been a

series of unforced errors. David Cameron appears to have a

lackadaisical style. The bid -- the budget is the budget which is

keeping to give and their nerves. We have local elections. Are we

going to be in a position where we see the entire local elections

through the prism of London or are we going to be looking around the

country? Labour has got to make a lot of games but there are lots of

contrasts. What the newspapers tell you today, there are lots of big

stories and a lot of them are about austerity and what is seen as being

corruption in government and the rich having access and power which

the poor do not and ordinary folk do not have, but the other

interesting thing for me is if you look at all the tabloids, the front

pages have nothing to do with any of these stories. The front pages

are all stories about celebrities and so on. It is as if it is a

different world. The biggest one in a sense is still the Leveson story

and the allegation of an improper relationship between ministers and

Rupert Murdoch. This is really an incredibly serious story because if

this is about and it has all the appearances of a deal being done,

or behind the scenes, all winks and nods, it is not about Murdoch

having a conversation with David Cameron, it is all being done

behind the scenes, and it is a deal. And that deal goes to the heart of

government and it is about corruption. You have picked the

Independent. It is actually a very good story because not only does it

cover the subtleties of how this operates at one level, but you

cannot have somebody who is an age like Adam Smith, who everybody

would say is very close, you could say he was his master's voice and

the alter ego of the Culture Secretary, the idea that he was

operating on his own is not believable. Nick, this rale -- is

all hands on a distinction about whether the permanent secretary

positively gave the go-ahead for Adam Smith to be the Back Channel

to Rupert Murdoch or whether he tolerated it after he knew about it.

That is right. Jeremy Hunt gave the impression that the permanent

secretary had authorised this but Jane Merrick in the Independent on

Sunday has copies of documentation which shows he did not authorise it,

he sort of agreed to it. This does go to the heart of this problem.

Downing Street were saying initially, it does for the Leveson

Inquiry to decide on this. We cannot decide. We will not call on

the ministerial adviser. Now they are saying we will listen to what

Jeremy Hunt says at Leveson and then we will decide. Mixed emotions

for Conservative MPs. On one hand, you talk to them privately and they

say it is very difficult to see how Jeremy Hunt can continue. The idea

that the special adviser was freelancing is absurd. But, hugely

liked. Nobody has a bad word to say about Jeremy Hunt personally.

back to this business about who is this coalition in government and

who is the Conservative Party serving? It takes us to the economy.

Batters the other really big story which in some ways is the one we

have to look at because what you are getting is, we have got the

double dip but there is a big story here in the Observer which is about

how across Europe there is now a backlash against austerity drives

as a way of dealing with this economic crisis. Here we are, going

helter-skelter down further into the abyss and a recognition by

ordinary people that this is not the way that business has to be

done. What is interesting, we know about Greece, Spain and so on, but

there is Holland, the Netherlands which is very pro austerity, one of

the country's along with Germany who were leading this but they are

losing their government as well. I suppose the bigger story is still

the French elections where it looks as if President Sarkozy has his

final piece of unhelpful news. is right. There is a feature in the

Sunday Times. It is looking difficult to see how Nicolas

Sarkozy can win the election in the second round. Some people are

saying is he a bit too bling? Was it a good idea for him to go for a

posh meal? He has not delivered on the economy. Leaders who have been

in place during this crash are finding it very difficult to get

re-elected. And our relationship in this country with France is

incredibly important. It matters a lot to us whether it is Francois

Hollande or Sarkozy. It matters a lot and I sincerely hope that

Francois Hollande wins. There is a story that Sarkozy received a huge

amount of money for his campaigning to win this election from Gaddafi.

So there is also allegations of corruption. I do not think Gaddafi

would have been in a state to be handing out money! There is a story

in the Mail on Sunday saying Sarkozy had a gift from the late

Libyan leader and that would be illegal. You make a really

interesting point about what happens is -- if Francois Hollande

wins. There are very few centre- left leaders in Europe. He is

planning to confront Angela Merkel and he is saying this eurozone

fiscal compact is too austere, there is no emphasis on growth. He

will have a battle with Angela Merkel stop that will be good news

for Ed Balls and Ed Miliband. you get a hint of the nasty side of

this. It opens up opportunities for extremist parties. Here we have in

Greece neo-Nazi is going round giving food parcels to people who

are having difficulties surviving. This ways of winning and winning

voters' suffering most is being taken advantage by neo-fascists. We

also see the far right in France making headway during this period.

I cannot see the Greeks in pro neo- Nazi given a hard time they had

from the real Nazis. Let's move on This television Review is a battle

between our reviewer and a Cambridge classicist. The reviewer

says that maybe it should not be on television, she does not have the

looks. But she has hit back. She is charismatic. He the reviewer was

saying that she was not attractive enough to be preventing a

television programme, but it is interesting that women have risen

up and said, he is a man who Sturton by intelligent women.

said, come to my college and let's have a debate. He has said no.

in favour of eccentric looking people being on television! This

story is amazing, this Chinese story. It is about the British

businessman who was murdered. The story is about how it looks as

though it was about a class of Chinese who are really wanting to

live the good life into a nationally, and to send their

children to public schools in Britain, and having to get money

out today it and use people to make it possible. The race and at -- the

reason I've read all those names from that the rich list at the

beginning is that London has become an international base for people

who want to educate their children in posh schools, who want to live

in expensive houses, all the money is pouring into this country.

Francois Hollande is elected as President of France, lots of people

can come to London to go to it their private school. It is why

lots of people cannot afford to pay the rent on a flat in London.

is also as stories here how a Chinese lawyer who has been

campaigning for human rights in China and has now taken sanctuary

in the American embassy in Beijing. There is real political

significance to this story, because we're about to get a massive change

in the make-up of the Politburo in China. This man was destined for

great things, doing all sorts of interesting business deals, his son

going to Harrow, but he was trying to be traditional. Some of the old

guard, who are more in favour of free market reforms, have been

boosted by this. I did mention the weather and it is bizarre to think

that the Chelsea Flower Show is on the way given the battering from

the skies. Yes, and there are saying that the Chelsea Flower Show

will is threatened by the wettest drought. It says we should not be

using our hosepipes, but we are all absolutely soaked. How can there be

a hosepipe ban when there is all this water? The thing is, it has

come too late and it is running of hard soil so it is not seeping down.

When plants are tender, it can whether their roots because it is

too wet. On that downbeat note, thank you very much. We're going to

carry on speaking about the weather. carry on speaking about the weather.

Let's take a look at the weather. Good morning. You are right, there

are massive contrast across the UK, with Scotland faring well and also

Northern Ireland. For England and Wales, wet and windy conditions.

There is a warning for heavy rain from the Met Office across England

and Wales. Combine that with strong winds and there is severe weather.

You can see this on the radar picture. Northern Ireland and

Scotland are faring better with sunshine and dry conditions, but

there will be a brisk north- easterly wind for most places. At 4

o'clock this afternoon it will be dry and sunny for many parts of

Scotland and Northern Ireland. But here is the heavy rain across the

northern Pennines. It will gradually start to brighten up

later in the afternoon for the south-eastern corner of the UK but

as we head towards Devon and Cornwall, there will be persistent,

heavy rain, and that will be combined with strong winds. The low

pressure in charge starts to slip away towards the West. The weather

front pages away to the north as we head into Monday. Showers around on

Monday, but elsewhere, turning brighter and warmer. A gradual

brighter and warmer. A gradual improvement in the weather, but

turning better during the week. The Duchess of Malfi in the play of

that name by the Jacobean dramatist John Webster is one of those career

defining roles for a classical actress. A very fine actress, Eve

Best, who is also in the funny American series Nurse Jackie, she

is playing her to great effect at the Old Vic theatre in London. This

is a challenging and dark work featuring madness and murder, meat

and drink to 17th century playgoers, but does it still speak to

audiences today? I am joined by Eve Best. Thank you for coming in. It

is a grim play, in a way. How did you approach the role because it is

very testing, and very important, but how do you think about it for

an audience today? I thought that I was going to have lots of time and

I gave myself a month to prepare, and I thought I would do lots of

research and lots of in debt fought at about Jacobean life, but in the

end, it took me so long to learn the lines, that was the main bulk

of my time, because the language is so dense and difficult. -- in depth

thoughts about. Suddenly we got to the first day of rehearsals, and I

thought, I have not done all the sort of things I meant to do.

set is very beautiful, it is claustrophobic and dark. The

English had this notion that Spanish and Italian courts were

places of incredible wickedness were terrible things were going on,

and it really feels like that. Probably the most difficult part of

the whole thing it is when you are killed, because it is strangulation,

and I do not think you would see this kind of thing on film?

Somebody else said that to me, and it had not struck me before, but

your producer said it is more appalling to see it live than on

film. I had not thought about that before, but I suppose it is,

because everyone is in the same room. We should explain why your

character is strangled, it is a case of falling in love with the

wrong person. Yes, and it is what would be called an honour killing

nowadays. That is what is terrifying about the play. It is

something that is going on right now a lot. It is going on in

Britain as well as in the Middle East. And it is the brothers?

brothers are intensely threatened by her because she is an

independent woman of means. She must be controlled at all costs.

She certainly must marry who they choose if she's going to marry at

all, and she falls in love with somebody who is not appropriate at

all. When you put it like that, it sounds completely contemporary.

This is another hit at the Old Vic, which, under Kevin Spacey... You

have acted alongside Kevin Spacey. It has been a great success story

in a West End theatre world which is so dominated by musicals. Yes,

and that is great news. It is an extraordinary play. It is very

brutal, and very glory, and horrible. -- gory. But I think it

is wonderful because she is at the core of the play and she is such a

spirit of ballet -- and she is such a wonderful spirit. Her strength

shines through despite the fact that awful things are happening and

that she is strangled brutally. Her spirit remains intact. I think that

is wonderful and incredibly positive. To those people who say

that the play is just a bloodbath, it has a different message?

absolutely not. It has a massively positive central core. People keep

asking if it is misogynist, but I think quite the opposite. It is of

humanist play. It is about the strength of the human spirit.

remember learning Webster at school and the language is amazing. How do

you compare him to William Shakespeare? That is why it was

difficult to learn because the Shakespeare I have done in the past

has been rhythmically more coherent. It somehow goes into easier than

this. The rhythm is broken up and the structure is uneven. Sometimes

it goes into prose, sometimes the lines are stretched, so your brain

and your body is more confused. Kevin Spacey famously uses his big

Hollywood moments to help keep the Old Vic project going. You also

moved between the two world. Let's see a clip of Nurse Jackie. Well,

it year arteries are not co- operating, they are closing up

again which is restricting blood flow to your heart. For we will

take to consult, but I would say that you're looking at angioplasty

and possibly another bypass. I am thinking Indian food for lunch,

text me and I will make a reservation.

I have never seen that. It is not the most flattering portrayal in a

way. She is very tough. Yes, but she is fabulous, she is no nonsense.

If you want a doctor to tell you what is really happening, then she

is the woman. Yes, and she was very good high heels. Which is nice,

because it is nice to get a bit of bling. Yes, I finish playing a pig

farmer before I got that part, so it was a great relief. A Eve Best,

Dr, Duchess, pig farmer, thank you very much indeed.

It has been a difficult week for the Government is a phrase we

should probably banned but it has been with the news that the economy

has slipped back into recession. Coming on top of a Conservative

funding scandal, panic at the petrol pumps, and a budget watch

was not universally acclaimed, it has been difficult for the

Conservatives. -- and a budget which was not universally acclaimed.

David Cameron joins me now. Let's start with the Rupert Murdoch story.

We will get on to the general picture in a moment, but there has

been some confusion as to whether you yourself discussed the BSkyB

bid waved James Murdoch at Rebekah Brooks' party. Can you tell us

about that? I have always said I have never had any inappropriate

conversations with anyone about this. I completely took myself out

of any decision-making about this important deal. What I recall is

that the dinner came a couple of days after the Business Secretary

had had to resign from this part of his job, effectively, because he

had been recorded saying he wanted to destroy Rupert Murdoch and his

company. I cannot remember every detail of the conversation, but I

think I said that was unacceptable and embarrassing for the Government.

I wanted to be clear that from now on this whole issue would be dealt

with impartially and in the correct way, but obviously I had nothing to

do with it. I said that out at the Do you find it embarrassing that

you were at Rebekah Brooks' Christmas party? Clearly, because

of what has been said about it, of course. One might do things

differently, but what I would say is this. Let's go to the big

picture, we might as well. Let's be frank. The thing that people are

asking is was there some big deal, some big agreement between me and

Rupert Murdoch or James Murdoch, in return for support for the

Conservative Party that I would somehow help their business

interests or allow this merger to go through. Batters not tree.

Rupert Murdoch said it under oath at the Leveson Inquiry. I will say

it under oath. I wanted the support of as many newspapers and as many

television commentators for the Conservative Party because I want

to detect a country in a different direction. When it comes to the

Murdoch newspapers, I was trying to convince a set of newspapers which

had largely right to conservative views anyway. They would be better

off with a Conservative Party running the country in the way that

they would. There is no great mystery here. Batters what I was

stranded it. Here -- what I was trying to do. It was a huge moment,

we know how angry Gordon Brown was and we also know that Rupert

Murdoch wanted a series of things. He was very hostile to Ofcom. After

he made that switch, you made a speech saying if you got into power

you would clip Ofcom's wings and he also wanted takeover BSkyB, an

enormously lucrative deal. The problem your government has, I

would suggest, is the texts and emails which have come up from

Jeremy Hunt's people and Rupert Murdoch's people, are so friendly

that it beggars belief that the government was not tilted one way.

I do not accept that. My views on media policy, a lot of them were

formed because I worked for an ITV company for 7.5 years. I have

always believed in a strong BBC with the licence fee funding it.

That's not a view that you find in many Murdoch newspapers. Batters my

government's policy. On the issue of Ofcom, I did think that it had

become too big, I thought the people running it were paid too

much money. A good thing going back to my time in television, when we

had the Independent Television Commission, I think the focus of a

competition authority and a regulatory authority, ought to be

on those things rather than policy- making so that was my view.

Sometimes I agree with Rupert Murdoch about things, lots of

things I violently disagree. His papers and thus the attack made a

firm my opposition to 40 today detention for suspects. I just want

to be really clear. I think people watching this need to know that the

positions I reach our because I believe them, I think they are

right for our country, battered the platform I stand on. I do not do

things to change my policies to suit this proprietor or that

proprietor. That isn't the way that I work. I will say that under oath.

Can we be absolutely clear that if there was a grand deal of the kind

you said that there was not, that would be corrupt. It would be

absolutely wrong for there to be any sort of deal and there was not.

If they had been, let's assume that, would I have appointed Vince Cable,

be Liberal Democrat with quite a track record of not being

particularly keen on News Corporation and Rupert Murdoch, do

the job of running competition policy? Of course not. The whole

thing I think falls down. There was no grand deal. Did I spent time

trying to win over newspaper proprietors, including the Daily

Mail, the Daily Telegraph? Yes. Do I spend time with the Guardian and

Independent, trying to persuade them I did not have a tail and

horns? Yes. He did I spend time with the BBC, political editors,

people who are watched by millions of people on the television every

night to try and convince them that I had the right policies and plans

and personality? Yes, I did. What politicians have to do, have we all

got too close? Yes. Do we spend too much time on the short-term news

management agenda? Yes, we did. Should we try and have a better

relationship where we fight the Daily firefight with the media but

we focus on the long term change our economy needs and our society

needs? Yes. If that comes out of Leveson, great. Would it be great

thing if you stopped seeing editors and proprietors privately, just

stopped at? Personally, I would be pleased if I did not have to see as

many as I did. -- as I do. I'm trying to communicate my vision for

this country, how we will get our economy going, how we help hard-

working people who feel they get a bad deal. Do you need to get your

message across? Yes, you do. Batters why I spend a lot of time

talking to them. I think the answer is transparent. You can now see

which political editors, proprietors that icy, it is all

made public. Since coming into government, I have also tried to

have a slightly better distance in terms of news management and all

the rest of it. We live in a 24 hour media news world where you are

permanently under pressure to try and deal with those issues. Let's

go through a bit of the detail and -- with all of this. Do you know

how many meetings you had with Rupert Murdoch? Yes, they also

doubt in the disclosures I'd made. What he set out in his evidence to

the inquiry, and then those had to be corrected because I think there

were some mistakes. They are also some things put down as possible

meetings. My officials have been through my diary in the greatest

possible detail. The thing about a Prime Minister's diary is not just

the things you think you are going to do, you can also go back and it

has been locked exactly what you did do. And as certain as I can but

I got it right. I'm not embarrassed about these meetings because I have

been trying to communicate, get across what the government is doing,

what I believe in, the things we need to did for our country.

Frankly, you have to deal with the media to do that. How do you feel

when you see these e-mails and text saying tipping off Rupert Murdoch?

There is no doubt about that will stop the contact between the

special adviser in the Department for Culture and News International,

that was too close, too frequent and inappropriate. That was why the

special adviser resigned. It was the right thing to do. It is

inconceivable to people that that level of contact would be going on

without Jeremy Hunt knowing it and proving it. This must be properly

investigated. It should be investigated by a parliamentary

inquiry, not through the Leveson presence. Leveson himself said he

has nothing to do with ministerial codes of conduct. The the

Ministerial Code is for me. Bad behaviour of ministers is for me.

If ministers have a badly, broken the Ministerial Code, it is my

responsibility either to ask Alex Allan's advice, or to take action

myself and say they cannot remain in the government. I do not duck my

responsibilities for one second. If that has happened, then I will act.

What is the best way of getting the information about what actually

happened? I do not believe there is any better process than an inquiry,

led by a judge, where people can give evidence under oath. That's

why after consulting the Cabinet Secretary, it would not be right to

set up a parallel investigation. Can I come back on that specific

point? The Leveson Inquiry will not report until the autumn. I am not

saying we have to wait until then. The inquiry is under way. Jeremy

Hunt and others, everyone is preparing their evidence for the

inquiry, evidence they will give under oath, they will be questioned

under oath and information arises that paints a different picture

from the one we have heard, obviously, I know my

responsibilities towards the Ministerial Code, towards how

ministers behave and I will act. The question that has been asked

his should you set up a parallel inquiry that will duplicate what

Leveson is doing? I do not think batters right. The actual code

itself does not say that the Prime Minister, if there is an allegation

of this kind, might or should or will, it says you absolutely will

report this to the Alex Allan process and allow this to happen.

On the face of it, you have to. things stand, I do not believe

Jeremy Hunt breached the Ministerial Code. If evidence comes

out through this exhaustive inquiry, if he did breach the Ministerial

Code, batters clearly -- that's clearly a different matter. I'm not

trying to duck my responsibilities, absolutely clear about the

standards that ministers have to live up to. I consulted the Cabinet

Secretary about what is right. Lord Justice Levison has quite rightly

said that people should allow his inquiry to take course but I am

responsible for the code of conduct, for ministers'' behaviour and I

will act properly in doing that. it comes out that people that

Rebekah Brooks will put all their emails and private correspondence

into the public domain relating to this, will you do the same? I will

do what I am asked to do by the inquiry. The aim of all this is to

get to the bottom of what happened. I have said very clearly due, the

idea that there was some grand bargain between me and Rupert

Murdoch is not true. Was there too much closeness in the relationship

which has led to distraught and media agenda? I think there was and

if you look at all the meetings I had between Rupert Murdoch since

becoming Prime Minister, that may - - many fewer than Tony Blair and

many fewer than Gordon Brown. The problem between media and politics

has been going on in our country for a long time. We have an

opportunity with a judge led inquiry, whose terms were agreed by

all three party leaders, we have got an opportunity to get to a much,

much better players. Let's remember it is not just about newspapers. It

is also about the BBC and ITV, both of whom are vigorous lobbyists.

Some of the toughest lobbying I have had is BBC executives on the

licence fee and regulation and all the rest of it. This issue, this is

an opportunity. In retrospect, Jeremy Hunt is a very popular man

in the House of Commons as we heard earlier on, he is a friend of yours,

he was a big cheerleader for the Murdoch empire beforehand, he spent

a lot of time with them over in the States, what's it a great idea to

put him in charge as a quasi- judicial figure with this process?

I think it was the right answer. You have to remember the problem we

had with the Business Secretary who does an excellent job, I admire his

work, but on this issue he said he wanted to destroy a British company.

He could not continue with that part of his responsibilities. I had,

as Prime Minister, to decide what to do it. I obviously consulted the

Cabinet Secretary and the most sensible, logical move was to take

back part of the responsibilities to the business -- from the

business department and give it to the Culture Department. He

consulted the Cabinet lawyers to make sure anything Jeremy Hunt had

said publicly in the past did not make it impossible for him to do

the job. That was the decision that was reached. Did I act probably in

that? I believe absolutely I did. The consensus across most of the

papers and many of your own backbenchers and leading

Conservatives, is that Jeremy Hunt has not much future in this

particular job. Are you standing 100 % behind him today? I think he

does a good job. I think he is a good Culture Secretary. I think he

is doing an excellent job on the Olympics. I think people deserve to

have these things look into properly. We have to have a sense

of natural justice where people can explain their actions, all the

information comes out and if someone has breached the

Ministerial Code badly and they cannot stay in the government, they

should be able to defend themselves. It comes to this whole thing about

short-term and long-term. Often, it would be much easier to sack

someone the first time the papers complain about them. I had this

with Liam Fox. You have to try and find some space to get to the truth.

Jeremy Hunt did say he had published all the relevant

correspondence between his department and News International,

then it came out through the Leveson Inquiry, but there were all

these e-mails and contacts with Adam Smith. To be fair, he had

explained that specific point in the House of Commons, answering

that question, so why do not think that's an issue. I do not think he

and the Permanent Secretary are saying different things. The

Permanent Secretary said he was content and aware for the contact

to made. But content is not the same thing as actively saying yes,

that's a good way to deal with it. I think saying your permanent

secretary is content, I think batters the important point but I

am not content with the weight all this was done. The Cabinet

Secretary has written to all departments, asked to buy me, to

make sure we put in place proper processes and follow the correct

procedures for the sort of contacts. What was happening between the

special adviser and News International was wrong. Given that

the minister is in charge of his special adviser, that's what the

Ministerial Code says, why are you content with Jeremy Hunt's

behaviour in that regard? He is responsible for this. Of course,

but the special adviser acted inappropriately and he has resigned.

I do not think it would be right in every circumstance if the special

adviser get something wrong, to automatically sacked the minister.

I do not think that would be right. That's not the approach that I

You think nobody else knew about this? Or this will be revealed

through the Leveson enquiry process because all the contact between the

minister and the special adviser will be laid bare. -- all of this.

The accusation is that we're not getting to the bottom of what

Jeremy Hunt did and did not know. That is not true, did is a judge

led inquiry. People are giving evidence under oath. There is

absolutely no question that the information will be somehow buried,

and secondly, the accusation is, will you take at -- responsibility

for ministers' behaviour under the Ministerial Code? Absolutely, I

will. If the information comes out, I will act. If it is clear it

through the Leveson enquiry that we have not heard every single shred

of evidence, will you have another inquiry? Yes, the point about Alex

Allan is to give me advice whether the Ministerial Code has been

breached. The key thing here is the process, how do we find out the

information? I cannot think of a better way than a judge. What about

the economy, what is plan B? have got to strain every sinew to

make sure we get the economy growing and get ourselves back to

work, and get out of the mess that we were left in by the last

government. The figures this week were extremely disappointing, the

economy did not grow in the first three months of this year, but we

must not throw away our plans for dealing with the deficit and making

sure that public spending is probably reduced in the appropriate

areas. If we did that we would lose... The low-interest rates we

have a vital to recovering. So you are not going to do that, but

nonetheless, you and the Chancellor said we would have much stronger

growth by now, we were going to have growth, never mind stronger

growth. You were optimistic about what would happen in the private

sector, but all of those things have not happened. As between

totally changing direction on Europe austerity plan and just

chugging along, it seems like a lot of people say the policy is not

working. There must be something else, surely? What is happening in

our economy is a very difficult process of rebalancing the economy.

The old model of growth, all about financial services in the south of

England and about debt in our banks, that model is broken. What is

actually happening in our economy is the private sector is growing.

We have created 600,000 net private sector jobs since the election.

Manufacturing investment has increased. Experts to China and

India are up by 50 %. The thing you could do, if you were not leading a

coalition, is be even more ruthless on aspects of government spending

to get money to allow you to push infrastructure spending, more roads,

more railways, the kind of relatively short term but job-

creating schemes. We will look at all of those areas. This is the

biggest issue for the Government, the country, it is the thing that

drives me. We must make sure that when people work hard they get

rewarded. That is what I get out of bed to do every day. We need to

look at how we get our banks lending, how we make it easier for

businesses to employ people, how we boost exports, how we make sure

that rebalancing the economy takes place. The figures were

disappointing but if you look at what is happening in manufacturing,

our car industry, brand new plants built by Jaguar-Land Rover,

steelmaking returning to Teesside, there is a rebalancing taking place,

just not fast enough. So what are you going to do to change things?

We are going to redouble our efforts to make sure that whether

it is banking, manufacturing, regional policy, enterprise zones,

our work programme to help people with training, we will make sure

all of those things are working. Increasingly I am going to meetings

where we're just going through the programmes that we have set out, of

whether it is boosting the housing market or investment, and making

sure the Government is delivering the things it said it would do.

That is vital. If this country has been adopting the right policies,

unlike countries such as the United States which did not go for nearly

as tough an austerity regime, why is it that the United States are

growing and we are not? The United States'' plans are for tougher

austerity measures than we have in the UK. Secondly, they do not have

the Eurozone it on their doorstep and we have seen that the

Netherlands going into recession, Spain going into recession this

week. Do you think there will be another grim period ahead or are we

halfway through it? We are nowhere near halfway through it because

what is happening in the Eurozone is a massive tension between a

single currency that countries are finding difficult to adapt to. It

will be a long and painful process in the Eurozone as the workout if

they want a single currency with a single economic policy and all the

things that go with it, or will they have something quite different.

They have to decide. We are united Kingdom and I hope we stay united

Kingdom. We have a single currency call the pound. The different parts

of our United Kingdom support each other and they do not have that in

Europe. You are down to 29 % in an opinion poll in the Sunday Times.

It is a long time since you have been that unpopular in the country.

What are you going to say to people to convince them to give you

another go? It has been difficult but it is far harder for people

over trying to find work or make their household budgets work at a

difficult time. I have to convince people that we are making the right

decisions to deal with problems that have existed for years. The

reason the economy is finding it hard to recover is because there is

too much debt. We are taking the long term decisions, whether it is

on infrastructure, education, I am passionate that we provide really

aspirational skills for our Young People, all these things are long-

term decisions. Governments have got to focus on what is right for

the country in the long term and not be driven on by the short-term

difficulties, tough though they are. We have a strong coalition

government and a five-year term. I am determined that we should

deliver all the things we have spoken about. All of those people

who say on your own side, he is a posh boy, do you really get it? I

was speaking to a young person yesterday, and he said, asking,

what is his problem? Does he get it? I understand how difficult it

is if you are trying to make the household budget workout, with

petrol and diesel at the prices they are now. I understand the

problems when you need be private sector to expand, that is what

fires me up and gets me out of bed to work hard and do the right thing

for our country. But it has got to be for the long term. I do not want

to trim for the short term because we are in difficulty. David Cameron,

thank you very much. The Prime Minister has told this

programme that in our position he was keen to get the support of

Rupert Murdoch's newspapers and spend time with the media tycoon,

but he says he tried to win over other proprietors and broadcasting

organisations as well. The thing that people are asking, really, is

was there are some big deal, some big agreement between me and Rupert

Murdoch or James Murdoch, that in return for support for the

Conservative party I would somehow help their business interests of

allow this merger to go through. That is not true.

Surface to air missiles could be based on top of a block of flats in

London this summer as part of the security operation for the Olympics.

Residents at the complex near the Olympic site in East London have

received a leaflet about the plans. Ministers revealed late last year

that the military might deploy missiles to defend the Games from

possible terrorist attacks. That's all from me. The next news

on BBC One is at midday. Back to Andrew and guests in a moment, but

first, a look at what's coming up after this programme on The Big

Questions. Join us in Bristol where we will be

asking if there is something rotten at the heart of British politics?

Peter Hitchens is limbering up for that one.

Anders Behring Breivik said that a life sentence of 21 years would be

pathetic. Do some crimes deserve to the death penalty and should Hull

Allmey to be labelled. -- should halal meat be labelled.

Shakespeare's sonnets contain some of the most famous lines of love

poetry ever written. Shall I compare thee to a summer's day? Say

no more. Now some of the sonnets have been set to music in an album

which brings together contemporary melodies, and musical instruments

which would have been familiar to Shakespeare 400 years ago. I'm

joined now by the musical director of the project, the early music

specialist Robert Hollingworth. Good morning. At you have got a

grade group around you. This is about taking Shakespeare's world,

and Elizabeth the first, and putting it into the world of

Elizabeth the second? Yes, the peace that we are going to play

today has a renaissance baseline. Robert will sing a contemporary

song over these instruments. Can we say at couple of them. This is an

early version of an oboe. This is a kind of brass, woodwind hybrid

instrument. It is like the human voice. And this is like an early

trombone. We're looking forward to this massively. That's all we have

time for today. Thanks to all my guests. Do join me again at the

same time next week, when I'll be talking to the Deputy Prime

Minister, Nick Clegg, and digesting the results of the local election

results with him. We'll also have music from one of the most

successful bands of the last ten years, Keane. But we leave you now

with our musicians here performing Shakespeare's sonnet number 128,

How Oft, When Thou, My Music, Music # How oft when thou, my music,

music play'st. # Upon that blessed wood whose

motion sounds. # With thy sweet fingers when thou

gently sway'st. # The wiry concord that mine ear

confounds. # Do I envy those jacks that nimble

leap? # To kiss the tender inward of thy

# Since saucy jacks so happy are in this.

# Give them thy fingers, me thy lips to kiss. # Since saucy jacks