10/01/2016 The Andrew Marr Show

The Chancellor talks of a cocktail of threats to the British economy

as the Prime Minister wrestles with a tight,

self-imposed deadline over our European future.

2016, another crunch year for David Cameron.

My guests this week include the Prime Minister, and,

after that extended Labour reshuffle, the last Blairite

standing in the Shadow Cabinet, Lord Falconer.

Now the other big thing about this year is that it's the 400th

anniversary of Shakespeare's death, so lots of drama of a more

I've been talking to Greg Doran, who runs the Royal Shakespeare

Company, along with one of his favourite actors and a man

you may have heard of, David Tennant.

You remember Squeeze and Cool For Cats?

Well, Deptford's finest are back with a new album and they'll be

And to review the papers, Tim Montgomerie of the Times,

possibly one the the most influential Tory Eurosceptics

outside the Cabinet, and Ayesha Hazarika,

former Labour advisor, comic and now Member of the British

All that coming up after the news with Ben Thompson.

England's worst housing estates will be torn down or renovated,

the Prime Minister will announce today.

David Cameron will pledge to end what he calls "decades of neglect"

and hopes the scheme will, in turn, tackle drug abuse and gang culture.

A panel of experts will be set up to choose the 100 sites

Our political correspondent, Ross Hawkins, reports.

Put right or pull down the old towers and dark alleyways,

Put up new social housing, like this project in North London,

which got the go-ahead before he became Prime Minister.

Writing in the Sunday Times he says, "The mission here is nothing short

of social turnaround with massive estate regeneration,

tenants protected and land unlocked for new housing."

More social housing that looks like this.

The actual promise today from the government

They are not saying which estates yet they would like to knock down

and rebuild and they are not promising to stump up all the money

that would be needed for expensive schemes like this one.

It will certainly cost much, much more than the ?140 million

he is promising to get early work under way.

Lord Heseltine will be in charge of the report saying how pension

funds might invest more money, and drawing up a list of places

Labour say a small-scale scheme stretched over 100 estates

It is tenants who will judge this policy by whether they see

The chairwoman of a Labour pressure group has resigned from the post

after claiming that it is impossible to work with the current party

Alison McGovern's decision to quit her role with the Progress

group comes after the resignation of three junior ministers

following Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn's reshuffle

of his Shadow Cabinet earlier this week.

Stars of rock and roll of all ages have been paying tribute

to Motorhead singer Lemmy at his funeral.

The service, which was held in Los Angeles, was streamed online

and watched by more than 280,000 fans.

He died from cancer last week, shortly after celebrating

Slash from Guns 'n' Roses and the Foo Fighters' Dave Grohl

were among the many musicians who paid their respects.

Two ticket holders will share the ?66 million prize from last

It's the biggest prize fund in the competition's history.

The operator's website struggled to cope with demand in the hours

leading up to the draw as people logged on to

I'll be back with the headlines just before 10 o'clock.

There is the Sunday Times. No one can really agree what the splashes

today, saying that Labour pars hard left, the Momentum movement are

going to picket hospitals. The same story, doctors told strike will harm

patients, that is coming on Wednesday. The Observer, parents

should take lessons in how to control children, says the Prime

Minister. Some people think the government is going like a nanny

state at the moment. And finally, the alleged killer of his

ex-girlfriend and two children has been grabbed in Ghana on the beach,

hiding in some rocks. Whether you're going to start today? I thought we

would start with the story in the Independent On Sunday about the row

that visit the heart of the Labour Party over our stance on Trident.

There is a report saying that the leadership hope to change the rules,

so they would effectively stripped the Shadow Cabinet of taking

decisions, and allowed the NEC and the members to take the decisions.

This is actually a very poor than story. If the NEC, on which Jeremy

Corbyn has a majority, if they take decisions on the future, he will get

his way on this and a lot of other things. Correct. It is not

clear-cut. He controls the NEC and he has powerful people on it such as

Ken Livingstone. However, such of -- some of the biggest trade unions,

the GMB and Kallis Unite, they are not in the same places Jeremy

Corbyn, because a massive number of manufacturing and engineering jobs

are dependent on Trident. A large number of the Shadow Cabinet would

resign if the position on Trident would read -- is the position on

Trident changed. It is difficult to see how they can keep the party

united. This is a very symbolic issue. It is an important moment for

Jeremy Corbyn because he has to achieve a Shadow Cabinet which

sounds like him and agrees with him otherwise this will go on forever.

Absolutely. There are problems on the other side of politics. You have

a out campaign story. David Cameron said he will allow his ministers to

campaign freely on the European Union. Now the out campaign, of

which I am a supporter, are waiting for a big beast to come forward to

champion the cause. The out campaign lacks leadership. David Cameron will

lead the in campaign. He has told Christian Democrats this week, the

Times reported, the -- that he will lead the campaign. But will Theresa

May, Boris Johnson, Michael Gove, will they lead the out campaign? The

campaign does not have that leader yet. The Daily Mail had a story this

week which said it was an feed in effect. Although ministers will be

able to campaign for Britain to leave the EU, that only happens

after the negotiations are over, so the likes of Iain Duncan Smith,

Therese of earlier is, they are effectively gagged at the moment. It

is not a fair laying fields. I do. Lynton Crosby, one of his favourite

catchphrases for campaigning was, you cannot fight in a pig on market

day. In other words, start early. Yes, we need to be making this

argument now. If you want to overturn the scepticism, you have to

make the argument early. If you cannot make it until after the

renegotiation, which is still six weeks away from being complete, it

is a live-in sour. I do not think it will be all plain sailing for a

David Cameron. It is not just his backbenchers. There are massive

number of cabinet members who are not happy with his position. Number

10 started briefing before Christmas that what he wants will be watered

down significantly. Will David Cameron be enough -- be able to

throw enough red meat to his very blue Uris get the colleagues? You

would get a sort of purple results. Another European story, which is

related. This is all tied up with the migrant crisis and what we think

about that, what is going on in Cologne. Absolutely, we were

horrified by the awful events on New Year's Eve were lot of women were

attacked. The fallout from these events has been interesting. The far

right has seized upon those attacks as an excuse to say, look, you

cannot have migrants coming into the West, they do not agree with us

culturally. That is not the right way to approach this. Interestingly

lots of women have taken to the streets to march against the

fascists, saying that the police did not take the right action as well,

and I think what we are seeing, a Leeds back to the fact that there

needs to be a proper examination across the whole of Europe, about

how we deal with the migrant crisis. What really went on in Cologne and

to was responsible is a tricky business, but what is clear is that

Angela Merkel, who looked like a European heroin a few weeks ago, is

now in real trouble over this. She is, and she has toughened her

rhetoric on deporting migrants after these assaults. It is important in

this sensitive, complex situation to not pitch race and religion against

attacks on women. That is a dangerous game. That is true, but it

is also one of the first responsibilities of any government

and Prime Minister to keep their people say. At the moment, the

German people do not feel there are adequate tests on the refugees

coming into their country. In the Independent On Sunday this morning,

you have a story, at the moment, Germany can only expel migrants and

asylum seekers if they are convicted of an offence with a three-year

sentence. She wants to change that limit so it is much easier to expel

people. People do not accept large influxes of refugees unless they

believe their government has a system to ensure that the bad eggs

can be excluded. Yes, but we must not let the action of a small number

of criminals tarnished the majority. A does show the importance of having

a EU that works together. This migrants crisis does need to be

solved. We could have a long debate about that. If only we could have a

EU that work together. I want to get onto the Prime Minister's big

announcement today, smashing up these council estates. It sounds

like what Tony Blair said in his big first speech after becoming Prime

Minister in 1997, at, I think, the Aylesbury estate in South London.

David Cameron does not want to be talking about Europe, labour ripping

itself apart on issues like Trident, David Cameron wants to talk about

the centre ground, he wants to elder one nation Conservative Party. The

sink estates we have in this country and a massive problem and this is a

welcome development, but a for what is a massive problem that is

detailed in some numbers released by the campaigning housing charity

Shelter in the Observer. A quarter of people in London are renting

privately. They are spending half of their monthly income on

accommodation alone. We are building only half the number of

houses that we need in this country. The scale of the response from the

Prime Minister, it is good he is talking about this but it needs to

be bolder. Once these estates are raised and rebuilt, more density of

housing, how much of that is social housing and how much is for sale?

Absolutely. Housing will be a big issue for the forthcoming mayoral

election in London. It will be the top issue in London. Until we start

building on some of the green belt which is not that Breen, we will not

solve the crisis. Another day, another Andrew Neil Shaw, another

Labour resignation. It looks like the Sunday Politics will have

another resignation. Alison McGovern who leads a group within the Labour

Party called Progress, is resigning over comments made by John McDonnell

over progress being the hard right, she disagrees with the leadership's

position. All of this is pointing to a very dangerous split in the Labour

Party. It feels like there is an impasse in terms of, you have the

PLP, against the members, in terms of Jeremy Corbyn's mandate. My plea,

and everyone's plea, to the PLP and the NEC and the Progress -- Momentum

group, we need to have a bit of composure. It feels like a landslide

of the centre-right of labour. They are all peeling away one by one and

the question is, should they be steadying the ship? It is difficult,

but we all have to come together, as difficult as it is. We start the

year by making ourselves the story when large parts of the country are

flooded, the doctors are on strike, train fares are going up, and the

danger for the Labour Party is that David Cameron is merciless with the

Labour Party. He is coming to execute the Labour Party, are

funding will be cut in terms of the trade unions, the boundaries will be

redrawn in an unfair way. I think it is suicide at the moment. It is self

harm. She is quitting over a review which has not happened yet, so it is

premature, to see the least. We will see on the Sunday Politics. Moving

on, it is hard to tell whether she is resigning or not. She's quite

subtle and her use of language. Another good story from the Sunday

Telegraph. Yes, one of the big issues we will be facing, as you

mentioned, is the coming strike by junior doctors. Jeremy Hunt has

given an interview in the Sunday Telegraph, very robust, reminding us

why we need a seven-day working week across the NHS, that this strike is

all about. He is highlighting facts that the mortality rates for newborn

babies is 7% higher at weekends, emergency surgery, 11% higher. The

question is whether you can do this skill of change without increasing

the amount of money available to the NHS? The doctors are being asked to

work on new shifts and given no option. We are heading for a strike,

and if the papers are right, hospitals to.

I think the doctors have a lot of goodwill from the public, but the

first few days of strike action or about non-emergency cover, but the

third day could see nonemergency cover removed and that could be

dangerous for the doctors because if they start not providing that basic

level, they might lose public sympathy. We have been chairing the

nation up over the Sunday newspapers, so thank you for that.

It's been foul, completely disgusting, warm and very, very wet.

When are we going to get some decent winter weather?

It sounds like you want weather like this. This was the scene earlier

this morning from Lancashire when we had snow in the Pennines. And in

chalk two of snow on the ground, which came from this weather system

which has pushed rain across north-west England and around 200

metres elevation we saw that turn readily to snow. That is clearing

away now. There will be some snow mixed in across the central belt and

certainly across the southern uplands today. Elsewhere it is a day

of bright spells and showers. In the southern counties of England they

will be accompanied by rumbles of thunder and hail at times too.

Overnight a more organised band of rain will move in, we could see

about an inch of rain fall at one time bringing the risk of flooding

in some parts. It will be a cold night, and ice will be an additional

hazard to take us into Monday morning. The majority of the showers

on Monday will be affecting Northern Ireland and Wales and the southern

counties of England. It is set to get colder in the week ahead, so you

might just have your wish, Andrew. In a very strange way, that cheers

me up! There's a bit of a row going over

over allegations that the BBC colluded in the resignation of one

of Jeremy Corbyn's team last week. No comment, but let me be absolutely

clear there have been no furtive conversations with my next guest,

Charlie Falconer, who is, for the time being at least,

the Shadow Justice Secretary. We will see for how much longer over

the course of this interview! Pat McFadden was fired for disagreeing

with Jeremy Corbyn about the causes of terrorism. Was that the right

thing to happen? Pat McFadden said there was no excuse, you cannot

justify what terrorists have done because of any allegation about what

the Western policy is and I agreed with that proposition so I regret

that Pat has gone. So that was a wrong decision in your view? The

decision as to who is in or out of the Shadow Cabinet is one for the

leader, my view about Pat McFadden is that it was an excellent

minister. He is an exceptional... So you think he is an exceptional

public serviceman, politician and you don't think he should have been

fired? I certainly wouldn't have fired him. We are in a period where

a lot of people in the moderate side of the party are beginning to peel

away from Jeremy Corbyn's leadership, will you be one of them?

No, from where we stand at the moment the country needs an

effective opposition. The flooding, junior doctors about to go into

straight for the first time in 40 years, what is going on for

Britain's support for the justice system in Saudi Arabia, these are

issues we should be focusing on, they are just examples. We, as a

party, need to be coming together and doing the work to provide an

alternative to this Government, which is a very bad government. To

be an effective opposition traditionally you need to be quite a

broad church, are you still? Yes, and you can see we are broad church

from the make up of the Shadow Cabinet which remains a broad church

even after the reshuffle. But the broad church to be effective has got

to be a broad church that is not at war with itself. It has got to be a

broad church looking outwards on holding the Government to account.

Doesn't that mean that the NEC, the Shadow Cabinet, the Parliamentary

party needs to support Jeremy Corbyn and his views? There needs to be a

period of calm, there needs to be a period in which policy is debated

internally. In some respects the view is that the leader has will

prevail, in other respects we need proper policies put to the nation

and that means we need to do what political parties do, which is work

together to come to an agreement on policy both in relation to foreign

affairs and defence and domestic policy and work politically. If the

NEC is going to take charge of policy, like Trident, is that

something you would be worried about? I don't think that will

happen. The Labour Party is made ultimately by confident. In relation

to Trident, there are many people employed in industries which support

the Trident defence system. The unions should have a role in

determining what our policy is in relation to that and I'm not aware

of any detailed proposals that would change the method by which we make

Wallasey. You are pro-Trident, has anybody suggested you belt up about

that? No, I'm not being muzzled, and one of the reason Jeremy won the

election of the leadership in the Labour Party is that people wanted a

more open debate and that's what will happen. There are a lot of your

friends, including the former Mr Tony himself, who are puzzled... If

the policy changed on Trident, would you leave? Why is Charlie Falconer

in the Shadow Cabinet? Because I believe my role is to do my best to

ensure there is an effective opposition against the Government.

Some would say you are legitimising a leader who cannot win an election,

that's what the right of the party say. I am doing my best to make

Labour effective and the broader the church that we are, the more we

reach out to the public, and reaching out to the public is what

we have got to do. If you will stop attacking each other, can Jeremy

Corbyn become Prime Minister? He became the leader of the Labour

Party, I think he can become Prime Minister. As long as there is an

offer that connects with the country. This is the biggest year of

decisions, like the European Union, the Labour Party is completely

divided on it. We have opportunities as a party, we can only take them if

we are not divided. Charlie Falconer, staying resolutely where

you are, thank you for joining us this morning.

This year is the 400th anniversary of Shakespeare's death and doublets

and hose all round and bags of glorious ballyhoo.

The Royal Shakespeare Company is announcing an astounding

new production tomorrow and it's a huge year for them on many fronts.

They're back at the Barbican in London,

with David Tennant reviving his acclaimed Richard II,

directed once more by the RSC's Artistic Director, Greg Doran.

The three of us spoke earlier and David told me why he loved

Is not the king's name forty thousand names?

A puny subject strikes At thy great glory.

Look not to the ground, Ye favourites of a king:

High be our thoughts: I know my uncle York Hath power

I was fascinated by the idea of this man who was born to be king,

clearly, always believed in the divine right of kings,

Yes, all historically true, and was in fact crowned

when he was a child, so if that's been your life,

You know, you can be whoever you want to be and nobody will tell

And he does not want to be a macho, kind of slaughtering,

He doesn't need to be because he is God's

He is a unique creation and every decision he makes is correct.

That's going to define an unusual personality,

Greg, it's going to be a huge year for Shakespeare,

obviously, and tomorrow you have got an announcement of what the RSC

Just give a sense of what you are going to be saying.

We have our flagship production of Midsummer Night's Dream,

which is touring the entire UK, picking up Bottom

and the Rude Mechanicals, an amateur group, in each place

to play the Rude Mechanicals, and Titania's fairies,

So schoolchildren and amateur actors will be working with the RSC.

Yes, and then coming back to Stratford.

Cymbeline, directed by Melly Still, the twist is that Cymbeline

is the Queen of England, rather than...

A bit of regendering, as we say.

The finale of the year is this extraordinary production,

This is the production where you will see the ship sink,

Ariel fly, Juno in the mask arrive on her chariot drawn with peacocks.

So it is kind of CGI on a live stage, I have no idea how

It's a very new, innovative technique and Shakespeare was doing

that in 1610, looking at the Jacobean mask tradition,

which had spectacular effects, extraordinary lighting effects

and stage scenery, and we are looking at what the cutting edge

21st-century technology would be if it was applied to the Tempest.

You two have worked together on three big Shakespeare,

Love's Labour's Lost, Hamlet and now this.

Are you running out of roles, Greg, for David?

We've got one or two in the pipeline.

David is hosting the Shakespeare Show.

This is basically a huge knees up on Shakespeare's birthday.

Exactly, it's a great variety bill of opera,

ballet, jazz, hip hop, comedy, tragedy, some Shakespeare bits...

Big names taking part, the sort of usual suspects,

We've got Judi Dench, Ken Branagh, we've got David...

Don't call them the usual suspects!

Sorry! But also some surprising people.

Rufus Wainwright singing the sonnets.

David, you've always said doing drama, doing theatre,

and above all doing Shakespeare is your proper job but you've been

doing a lot of TV for Netflix in particular in the last year,

but you play possibly the most vile character I've ever seen on TV.

The next person whose phone rings has to eat it!

You play a superhero who can make people do whatever he wants just

Yes, he compels you to do whatever he wants by requesting it of you.

Well, he makes some fairly poor life choices.

In 30 seconds you will realise this was a hilarious joke

and you will let Jessica Jones leave.

Is this a kind of ticket to Hollywood next?

That seems to be the way lots of people go.

They get on Netflix, they become incredibly famous in

the States, the next stage is the big Hollywood blockbuster films.

It was a great script, and yes, it's certainly true that

working for Marvel and Netflix, they do feel like two of the biggest

entertainment franchises around at the moment so it's a pleasure

to work for them but more importantly for me to

And I can see Greg Doran looking at you, thinking

but you are going to come back to the RSC again and again!

Gentlemen, it's going to be a blast of the year.

Of course, in Shakespeare's day, politicians who got too close

to continental Europeans tended to lose their heads.

Not a problem, I'm sure, for my next guest,

Or it is the future of this blessed plot. That speeches about England

going to the dogs by the end of it! You are in the thick of these

negotiations, gave us an update of where you have got to mid-January.

It is hard work but the areas I have been identified are things that

drive us up the wall about Europe. I think we are on the way to getting

not being an ever closer union fixed. Making sure this isn't just a

single currency club but it is flexible enough for countries like

Britain with our own currency, and dealing with this issue of the abuse

of free movement and the pressure of migration from the EU on to Britain

by amending welfare rules. It is hard work. I'm hopeful of a deal in

February, and if we get that we can go ahead and hold a referendum.

There is a huge prize for Britain, if we can deal with the things that

drive the wall about Europe, we can get the best of both worlds, secure

our economic future inside this valuable market and help keep our

people safe by staying together with our close allies as we confront

extremism and terrorism so it is a massive prize for Britain if we get

it right. It sounds like you like you think you might get it wrapped

up in February which would mean a summer referendum?

Some people think it is the migration bit that is the most

difficult than the others are easy. Certainly migration is difficult,

but the other areas are not simple and straightforward either. My aim

is clear, the best of both worlds for Britain, the massive prize of

sorting out what frustrates asked about Europe, but staying in a

reformed Europe. The prize is closer than it was. I will work to get that

done. If you do not get it wrapped up in February because of all the

time. We have legislated for the referendum. It must happen by the

end of 2017. If I cannot get it done, I will keep going. It is such

an important issue for the future of the country. If we get it right,

there is so much benefit we can feel from it. This idea of the four year

ban on European workers coming to this country before they can take in

work benefits, that is still on the table, I understand. Donald Tusk and

many others see it is illegal under European law. Francois Hollande and

Angela Merkel have suggested a three-year delay, rather than a

four-year delay. I do not understand the difference but is that possible?

There are lots of suggestions being made. My position is clear, the four

years remain on the table until I can see something equally meaningful

and powerful. At the moment, our welfare system acts as an unnatural

draw for people to come to Britain. We need to address that. We have a

welfare system that, unlike many in Europe, you have instant access to

and that creates difficulties. I cannot give a running commentary on

the negotiations but I am confident we are able to get a good outcome.

The Polish Foreign Minister says that if Britain supports Poland in

getting more Nato troops into Poland, because he's very worried

about Vladimir Putin, that may be a sort of quid pro quo that would

allow this to happen. I read lots of things in the newspapers that are

interesting and possibly worthwhile but I do not always recognise what

they are. It is true that Britain supports having Nato troops in

Poland. British troops regularly exercise in Poland. We will see an

increase in that. But no, what we need is a tough discussion about the

free movement of people on welfare, to get a good deal for Britain. You

sound sympathetic to the Polish government on that. Is that in

anyway linked to negotiations? Not in the conversations I have had,

that has not been the case. We have spoken about lots of issues and I

have made several visits to Poland. Some of the things I read in the

papers do not come in line with what my own experiences. It has been

suggested that because of EU legality, one way around for your

problem would be that British workers could lose benefits. That

seems bizarre. Is that the possibility? My aim is that the

unnatural draw of the UK welfare system, the problem I am try to

address, to give you figures, 60% of those who come from the EU to work

in Britain are job-seekers, they do not have a job when they arise. --

when they arrive. Sometimes we are adding ?10,000 to the link. To deal

with that and ensure there is no discrimination between EU citizens,

which is the legal problem, we might have to remove benefits from British

workers? I am in the middle of the negotiation, I have hard work to do

and when I have an announcement to make out will make it. Your critics

in the party say that this is camouflaged, David Cameron is

determined we will stay in the EU almost under any circumstances, and

he is determined to lead the in campaign when it comes. I am

determined to fulfil what we put in our manifesto, the renegotiation.

The best answer for Britain is to stay in a reformed European Union

and get those changes. If we do not get them, I am ruling nothing out,

and I mean that. They do not believe you. Not everyone sits with me in

those negotiations. I have been to 42 European Council since being

Prime Minister. I know what can and cannot be delivered. If you stop and

ask people, what bugs you about Europe, lots of people save it was

too much of a political union. I say, let's get out of that. People

say, I wear more or less competitive in Europe? I see we have got to fix

this. Europe should be completing the single market, making sure that

regulations come down rather than up. These are the things that people

on fixed in Europe. If it was easy, I would have fixed them. Coming out

of Europe would be a massive problem for us. If this is a genuinely open

question, presumably we have plans as a government? We have plans for a

renegotiation, the referendum, and of course, then the British public

will make their decision. We must obey that decision whatever it is.

That is the nature of a referendum. Are you as a government prepared for

the possibility of us leaving the EU? I do not think that is the right

answer for the reasons I have given, but whether it to be the answer, we

would have to do every thing necessary to make that work. In the

manifesto, it is the public that will decide, not the politicians. I

the civil service working on a contingency for this? They are

working around the clock to support my renegotiation. I suspect the

answer is no. Ministers are not allowed to work on a contingency.

That suggest a lots of people that there is no expectation we will

leave the EU. It is smoke and mirrors. This is not simple or easy.

All of the four areas I am talking about, sovereignty, the strength of

national parliaments, adding to your's competitiveness, migration,

all of those are difficult, and the civil service is working with me to

help deliver those things. If we fail to deliver them and have to

take a different stance, that is a new situation. My goal is

renegotiation and a referendum to secure Britain's plays in a reformed

European Union. Will the British Parliament be sovereign after these

negotiations? Yes, the British Parliament is sovereign now, we made

that clear in 2010. If the British Parliament wants to alter its

arrangements, it can. I was taught the British constitution can be

summed up in aid words, what the Queen and acts in Parliament is

love. Whether we are in or out of the EU, that is crucial. If we need

to reaffirm that more and put it up in lights, I am happy to do so. I

often say to my European colleagues, Britain is not difficult about these

matters, we are just immensely proud of our long history of strong,

democratic institutions. We joined Europe trade, corporation, working

together. We do not want to bury ourselves in some European

superstate. That is why Britain is not in the single currency, we are

not in the Schengen zone, we will never sign up to a European army.

There is a very strong patriotic is far in gauge meant on the continent

of Europe from a British perspective. We have talked about

this a lot, year ago, and a year ago, I said, what about cabinet

ministers that take a different line and you were clear, you said, no --

no, Cabinet responsibility. I was on your programme as recently as a

cobra. I said that the decision about collective responsibility

would be taken at the conclusion of the negotiation. I hope we are close

to that, and that has always been my intention. You cannot as people who

are very long-standing, sincerely held views to campaign in a

different way. That is what will happen. There are people in your

cabinet, I think, who will vote to leave, whatever happens. Other

people will wait to see the results of the negotiations. How much does

it matter to you that you can win over the majority of the Cabinet? I

want as many people supporting the side I am on, which ever side that

is, when the time comes, as is possible. The government will not be

neutral about this issue with people on one side or the other. My

intention is that the conclusion of the negotiation, Cabinet has a

discussion and reaches a clear recommendation to the British people

of what we should do. I hope that we'll be staying in a reformed

European Union because I will have got a good negotiation for Britain.

At that point, a clear government position, I am saying that members

of the Cabinet, ministers with long-standing held views on a

different basis, they will be able to campaign. And come back again

afterwards? Of course, they will not leave. Very much as happened on

previous occasions. You may have heard Tim Montgomerie earlier on.

Some people are concerned that at the moment it is OK if you're in the

Cabinet to come out, as Philip Hammond bid, and say, these are the

reasons why we want to stay in Europe, a say, these are the reasons

we want to leave. People who are for your position are able to speak but

people who are against are muzzled until the negotiations are over.

That is the wrong premise. It is not my position, it is the position of

the government. Iain Duncan Smith cannot come into this debate and

make the case for leaving the EU because of his Cabinet position. The

best outcome would be to keep Britain in a reformed European

Union. That is the position of the government. Anyone sitting in this

chair from my team should be making that argument. When we have

completed the negotiation, people who take a different view will be

able to do so. I think that is fair, sensible, reasonable, what happened

in the past. At the end of the referendum, the Conservative Party

has to come back together. It is important these discussions are

reasonable. All around the country, I can hear the twinkle of people

throwing their mobile phones at the television sets, get onto something

else, they are saying. You want to demolish lots of council estates.

Can you explain the plan? It is straightforward, we have an economy

where we are generating hundreds of thousands of new jobs. We have

rising wages, taxes coming down. There are good prospects for people

but we have to many people in the country who are stuck, left behind,

sometimes permanently left behind. If we are really going to have a

society with greater equality of opportunity, more chances for

people, we have to deal with the things that hold people back. We

have done things to help with good education, with the reforms in the

last parliament, but I think that sink housing estates, where people

can feel trapped in poverty, unable to get on, I think it is time, with

government money, but with massive Private and perhaps pension sector

help, to demolish the worst of these and rebuild houses that people feel

they can have a future in. A greater intensity of housing is well? In

some cases, the odd thing about these high-rise blocks, the way they

have been structured, they do not provide a massive number of houses.

The demolishing them, you might be able to provide better and more

houses at the same time. The crucial question is what they do provide

traditionally is social housing for rent. Will there be as many social

housing units for rent as they were before after this project is

finished? It depends how you define... I want affordable housing.

That is a different town. When people hear that town, they often

think the government means that is affordable for me to buy, I can

become a homeowner. Then they discover that for years affordable

housing has only meant housing for rent. I think we need both, but yes,

we should have a big shift towards more affordable housing to buy. You

always need some affordable housing for rent. Most people in the

country, getting a job, getting together with a partner, they want a

home of their own. You have this great vista of London behind us. In

London, the average house ?500,000. We have to build more houses.

?900,000 for a single flat sometimes behind me. Some people cannot afford

that. They need somewhere to rent. With the new Housing Bill on this

proposal, there is less social housing of the traditional cane,

more and more Private rented housing. Lots of people are having a

tough time. The government is changing the planning system so we

build more houses, doubling the housing budget, because we are

making that our priority, introducing more shared ownership,

so you can on sharing the house and parents as well, and then these new

starter homes, which will be 20% of the market price, available from

people under the age of 40, as we promised in our manifesto. Help To

Buy was a massive boost for people to get on the housing ladder. We are

helping them with their mortgage. For those people in council housing,

can you promised there will be as many such places for them at the end

of your term as there is now? Well, we want more, and the key thing for

people in those properties are that we are giving them a chance to buy

them. Recently I have had so many people saying, please get on with

this right to buy. I would love to be able to buy my home and we will

deliver that. Over the last year, Right To Buy takes a lot more social

housing out of the country than it puts in. For those people who cannot

afford to buy, the number of properties they can rent is going

down and down. That's why an amendment to the Housing Bill, who

was put forward by Zac Goldsmith, who will be a mayoral candidate, for

every one of these high cost social houses that we sell, we will build

at least two new rental houses. In London, you sometimes get council

houses that become vacant, worth up to ?800,000, and we are saying that

sell those houses and use that money, sometimes up to ?1 million or

more. We can use that money for some to rent and some which are

affordable to buy. You mentioned the economy and you are upbeat about it,

there seems a marked change of tone from the Autumn Statement when ?27

billion appeared from behind the back of the sofa, and there is this

generally sunny air, things didn't need to be as tight as we thought,

to this cocktail of risks ahead for the British economy, why has the

mood changed so rapidly? It is right that we are warning of risks, we

have the slowing of the Chinese economy, this dislocation in the

east and concerns in the global economy. We must stick to the

long-term economic plan, keep getting the deficit down, keep

making sure Britain is competitive and I think it was a powerful speech

on that basis. There are internal threat too, we have something that

is close to an asset problem at the moment. House prices have been

shooting up around the country. One thing we know about the bubble is

that it essentially bursts. We have domestic borrowing now higher per

household than it was before the crash. I wonder about how alarmed

you are about the asset bubble, and the amount people are borrowing on

their credit cards. You have got to look at borrowing as a percentage of

income rather than borrowing alone, but these sorts of concerns are why

we gave the Bank of England the proper independent ability to call

time on excessive levels of borrowing in banks, building

societies or the economy. They have taken some steps already. We had

these very low interest rate for a long time, they have taken some

steps on the mortgage market to make sure people are not taking out

mortgages they cannot afford. In the Budget we took steps on the

buy-to-let phenomenon, which needs to be kept ... We think interest

rates are about to go up again, are you not concerned we are heading

toward something quite nasty? We need to make sure government plays

the right role, get our borrowing down and we are doing that, making

sure there are jobs for people to take, and now you can see jobs with

rising salaries and lower taxes so people are better able to service

any debts. So you are not worried about the economy? I worry about

everything, that is my job. You should take advice from financial

advisers and listen to what the Bank of England says. We identified this

in opposition, the real problem, that there was no clear authority

responsible for the overall level of borrowing in the economy, and to

warn when things were getting out of control. We now have a highly

capable independent governor of the Bank of England, and we have vested

in that organisation the ability to deal with excessive levels of

borrowing and I think we should listen to them and let them set... .

Highly capable man is also worried about the current account deficit as

it is now called. In basic terms we are not paying our way in the world,

not selling enough in goods or services to pay our way in the

world. We need to do better. We take China, we have seen a doubling of

our exports since I have been Prime Minister but there are other markets

we are doing less well. An export drive is a key part of our plans but

we shouldn't talk ourselves down. We were the star economy of the G7 in

2014... I am testing the extent... There is a strong economy that is

resilient, borrowing is coming down, but all of the risk factors we faced

- are we productive enough? Are we exporting enough? No, no... We have

a strong economy, a capable Chancellor, a team that can address

all of these challenges. You are now seeing really good growth in

business investment because people believe the British economy is

strong and can get stronger. A couple of foreign affairs cookies if

I may. We were told when we are going to the war in Syria that these

new Brimstone missiles America didn't have but we did, how many

will be fired? There has been an attack on Ramadi, that's the key

thing. This will take a very long time as I always said. Saudi Arabia,

47 people executed by the kingdom last week, some of them terrorists,

not all of them, some of them perfectly ordinary peaceful

demonstrators who were grabbed by police, given a secret trial and

beheaded. The response of the Government was that this was

disappointing. The last time I looked I was the Prime Minister, and

I have condemned it on television. Is there anything more we can do

because we have tight ties with Saudi Arabia. Of course we should

condemn it. We have many disagreements with Saudi Arabia, but

there is a bigger question which is do we think it is necessary to have

a strong relationship with Saudi Arabia for our own safety and

security? My answer is yes. You can have a foreign policy based on

issuing press releases or one based on trying to keep our people safe

and frankly I know what my job is. For now, thank you.

Now over to Ben for the news headlines.

David Cameron has said that he remains hopeful of a deal

next month on Britain's relationship with the European Union.

Speaking on this programme, the Prime Minister emphasised his

determination to negotiate a reformed EU.

Mr Cameron said he doesn't think leaving the EU would be best

for Britain and that he wishes to secure "the best of both worlds"

with Britain remaining in Europe when negotiations

However, if Britain voted to leave the EU in a referendum,

the Prime Minister accepted that the government would 'have

The chairwoman of a Labour pressure group has resigned from the post

after claiming that it is impossible to work with

Her decision to quit her role with the Progress

group comes after the resignation of three junior ministers

following Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn's reshuffle

of his Shadow Cabinet earlier this week.

The next news on BBC One is at one o'clock.

First, a look at what's coming up immediately after this programme.

We will be live in Canterbury at ten o'clock, debating the DRS' right to

strike, free speech at universities, and can the Anglican Communion stay

together? See you at ten o'clock on BBC One.

And the Prime Minister is still with me.

One of the things we didn't talk about, if you lose the referendum do

you stay as Prime Minister? The answer to that is yes, my policy is

to hold a renegotiation and then a referendum and then to abide by what

the British public say. I hope that answer will be staying in a reformed

Europe but I think it is important that people don't get... The

question on the ballot paper is clear, stay in or go, not this

politician's future. That is important or we don't get the clear

answer we need! The policy is clear, renegotiate, hold the referendum,

and people across the UK have wanted this to happen. They wanted choice

is not between the status quo and leaving but the best possible deal

for Britain or leaving. It would be a shattering blow to your own

authority if you lose, wouldn't it? I promised the referendum and I must

deliver it. We have had nanny state policies recently about smoking, now

about alcohol. I wonder if at the end of a long day negotiating, you

have had trouble with the kids, maybe Samantha has been on your back

about something, you turn on the television and have a nice cup of

tea, is that what it will be like? Come on. No, I often have a drink in

the evening after a long day. These are recommendations. The Government

doesn't get consulted on how many units it should be. It is important

these things are independent. We always suspected nanny was a Tory.

Well, this Tory isn't a nanny! Thank you very much indeed.

We're almost out of time this morning.

Andrew Neil and the Sunday Politics team will be here in an hour

with more on that latest Labour resignation.

Join me again at the same time next Sunday when I'll be talking

Plus the actor many critics think will be picking up

an Oscar next month - Hollywood superstar

But for now, we leave you with Squeeze and the title track

from their latest album, 'Cradle To The Grave'.

# They say time will not stand still.

# From the cradle to the grave # I know I won't be a slave

# To the mistakes I have made # I will get there when I'm ready

# From the cradle to the grave #

There are people who are hell bent on destruction of the state

# From the cradle to the grave # I know I won't be a slave

# To the mistakes I have made # But I get there when I'm ready

# No, I won't go till I'm ready # No, I won't go till I'm ready

# From the cradle to the grave #.