15/11/2015 The Papers


15/11/2015

No need to wait until tomorrow morning to see what's in the papers - Martine Croxall presents a lively and informed conversation about the next day's headlines.


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Transcript


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We'll be taking a look at tomorrow morning's papers

:00:00.:00:08.

The merciless fight against terror promised by the French President

:00:09.:00:16.

begins as the country launches air strikes on Raqqa,

:00:17.:00:18.

In Europe, a massive manhunt is under way for

:00:19.:00:25.

one of the suspected assailants, Belgian-born Salah Abdeslam.

:00:26.:00:34.

France, meanwhile, continues to mourn the worst loss

:00:35.:00:36.

of life to hit the country since the Second World War.

:00:37.:00:41.

And across the world people are paying their respects to

:00:42.:00:43.

Hello and welcome to our look ahead to what the papers

:00:44.:01:03.

With me are Joe Watts, political correspondent London Evening

:01:04.:01:06.

Standard and Benedicte Paviot, France 24 and joining us from

:01:07.:01:08.

our Paris bureau is Daily Telegraph Columnist Anne-Elisabeth Moutet.

:01:09.:01:23.

Tomorrow's front pages are looking like this.

:01:24.:01:27.

Le Figaro concentrates on the challenge President Hollande

:01:28.:01:29.

faces in responding to Friday's terror attacks in Paris.

:01:30.:01:31.

The FT says France and the US have pledged to step up air strikes

:01:32.:01:35.

The Express claims 450 Jihadis are on the streets of Britain

:01:36.:01:41.

and planning attacks after returning from fighting in Syria.

:01:42.:01:46.

The Telegraph focuses on the manhunt and says

:01:47.:01:48.

the suspect was in a car stopped at the border, hours after the

:01:49.:01:51.

The manhunt leads the Times too, with the headline

:01:52.:01:58.

Pictures of some of those killed dominate the front of the Guardian.

:01:59.:02:08.

And the Metro has included a picture of the Eiffel Tower in its logo

:02:09.:02:12.

Let's begin with the French newspaper Les Figaro. Quite a few

:02:13.:02:35.

different strands -- Le. Everyone is asking how the president will

:02:36.:02:37.

respond to the challenge. We have some answers already. What is the

:02:38.:02:45.

appetite like in Paris for a merciless war against Islamic

:02:46.:02:49.

State, which is what the president has promised? It is pretty much

:02:50.:02:54.

something the French are behind. They are very angry. They were in

:02:55.:03:01.

shock at the time of Charlie Hebdo but now this carnage against the

:03:02.:03:04.

French people at large, against young people in one of the most

:03:05.:03:09.

diverse neighbourhoods in Paris, is has really made people angry. We

:03:10.:03:16.

already have our mutual resources, our resources in Syria -- it has. It

:03:17.:03:26.

has started already. But one thing about the Middle East is that, if

:03:27.:03:34.

you go and you appear weak come ID will not be taken seriously. -- if

:03:35.:03:41.

you go and you appear weak, you will not be taken seriously. You must go

:03:42.:03:50.

and appear strong. There is a huge bombardment against an Islamic State

:03:51.:03:53.

camp and it doesn't mean strategically it will change very

:03:54.:03:58.

much but it will change minds and that is part of warfare. This is

:03:59.:04:02.

very similar to the 1986 bombardment of Tripoli by the American Air

:04:03.:04:07.

Force. Libya stopped a great deal of its terrorism afterwards. The other

:04:08.:04:12.

stance on the front of the paper is that the inquiry will focus on the

:04:13.:04:27.

network of Islamists, a Franco -Belgian network. Yes and the big

:04:28.:04:31.

revelation is that this has been brewing for some time. These

:04:32.:04:38.

Islamist cells in Brussels, it has become a terrorism hotspot. I've

:04:39.:04:42.

been looking into it this afternoon and reading on it and a lot of

:04:43.:04:48.

things, the pieces of the puzzle are falling together. When you look at

:04:49.:04:53.

the structure of Belgium, you find out that Brussels has six Police

:04:54.:04:57.

Department 's just covering the city and 19 municipalities with 19

:04:58.:05:02.

mayors, you have a very divided approach between the different local

:05:03.:05:06.

authorities between police and the intelligence services. This does not

:05:07.:05:15.

make dealing with these things very easy. We know there is a suburb in

:05:16.:05:20.

Brussels and picture this, imagine four miles from Parliament, on

:05:21.:05:29.

Islamist cell is busy being a terrorist camp and that is

:05:30.:05:31.

effectively what is happening at the moment in Brussels where, Nato HQ

:05:32.:05:44.

is, by the way, also located. The French president has not only been

:05:45.:05:47.

consulting people in his own party but also the ex-president Nicolas

:05:48.:05:55.

Sarkozy and Marine Le Pen and all of this is indicating a very big

:05:56.:06:00.

Monday, not just for the minute of silence, but also because he will be

:06:01.:06:03.

addressing a joint session of Parliament and that state of

:06:04.:06:08.

emergency that is supposed to last for 12 days in a democracy and needs

:06:09.:06:14.

a lot to be extended, it seems there is a consensus and he will ask for a

:06:15.:06:19.

three-month extension. So, the question tonight is whether the UN

:06:20.:06:22.

climate change conference with nearly 197 heads of state in

:06:23.:06:26.

government and 40,000 people coming in delegations to Paris at the end

:06:27.:06:29.

of November and beginning of December, still go ahead. The

:06:30.:06:34.

argument is that it should still go ahead because we shouldn't kowtow to

:06:35.:06:40.

these terrorists. We will talk about the controls on the borders of it

:06:41.:06:44.

later but the very powerful front pages we have seen here, like in the

:06:45.:06:50.

Guardian where we have a number of photographs of people who died, and

:06:51.:06:54.

it strikes you how young they were, out having fun on a Friday night in

:06:55.:07:02.

Paris. Absolutely. Many of the papers went with pictures of the

:07:03.:07:05.

victims and it really hits home just what acute human tragedy this is. --

:07:06.:07:18.

what a huge human tragedy. There is only one British victim as of yet,

:07:19.:07:23.

who is known, but it really brings home, away from all the politics and

:07:24.:07:29.

military strategy, how this affects people there in France and also

:07:30.:07:33.

possibly here in Britain. We have a front page which came into us just a

:07:34.:07:41.

few minutes ago, Liberation, and it is a picture that was taken of the

:07:42.:07:45.

crowd inside the Theatre where that banned from the United States were

:07:46.:07:50.

playing. We don't know quite when this photograph was taken, it could

:07:51.:07:53.

have been a very short time before the attack by those gunmen

:07:54.:08:03.

happened. It is a very moving picture. There were some 15

:08:04.:08:07.

nationalities, Americans, Chilean 's, Polish... There is an

:08:08.:08:16.

international response. The Eiffel Tower is being projected, not just

:08:17.:08:23.

on British buildings but from one side of the planet to the other, and

:08:24.:08:29.

as the French ambassador said, that is deeply touching and I think the

:08:30.:08:32.

French people welcome that solidarity in the midst of this

:08:33.:08:39.

darkness. What is the response in Paris to that show of support all

:08:40.:08:46.

over the world? The French are very deeply touched about this. We have

:08:47.:08:57.

been complaining for the past few months about something that every

:08:58.:09:02.

French politician will bring up, an all-purpose excuse, which is French

:09:03.:09:07.

bashing. This is the end of that. The solidarity is something that is

:09:08.:09:13.

very impressive. As you said, there were 15 nationalities. Liberation

:09:14.:09:20.

has extraordinary 20 pages of reports that they call the

:09:21.:09:36.

Generation BAFTA: -- Bataclan. They are saying this neighbourhood is a

:09:37.:09:40.

place where you are young and you go to meet other people. There is a

:09:41.:09:46.

very strong feeling that France and this way of life has been attacked.

:09:47.:09:51.

The openness of France, those things that people make fun about it but

:09:52.:10:00.

that do exist in French society -- make fun of a bit. A journalist

:10:01.:10:08.

today said France had been targeted because they had a bill against the

:10:09.:10:14.

burqa and key job and they didn't welcome diversity -- hijab. I don't

:10:15.:10:26.

think we should find faults in ourselves, the Faulds came from the

:10:27.:10:31.

assassins who come among us -- faults. Assassins who, if they are

:10:32.:10:42.

radicalized by Islamic State, many Muslims are fleeing the terror they

:10:43.:10:44.

are perpetrating in the Middle East. Let's look at the Metro. France

:10:45.:10:51.

strikes back against the IS. This has already started. Something on

:10:52.:11:02.

Twitter suggested that if they knew where all these things were, why

:11:03.:11:05.

didn't they strike before? Many questions that can be asked. Was

:11:06.:11:10.

this strike planned beforehand and just conveniently fell at this

:11:11.:11:16.

time? Or perhaps these targets are not terribly important but they knew

:11:17.:11:21.

they were there and that they could hit them tonight, so they went ahead

:11:22.:11:28.

and did that as a show of strength. Obviously, the question that is

:11:29.:11:35.

going to emerge is whether it is part of a wider strategy and what

:11:36.:11:39.

they're trying to achieve, and how these are going to work towards

:11:40.:11:43.

that. Those questions still need to be answered once this period of

:11:44.:11:48.

Capitol politicians have in the wake of this tragedy will be answered.

:11:49.:11:57.

Martin on Twitter says, this is a war, but it is ISIS. We're not

:11:58.:12:02.

fighting against a State or a country like we were in World War I

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or World II. It is a movable target. And on the front of the

:12:06.:12:15.

Times, here is one of the suspects and the title is that he's the

:12:16.:12:20.

world's most wanted. Then the Daily Mail has a picture of him as well

:12:21.:12:28.

next to an individual who came to Europe from Syria as well. Just

:12:29.:12:33.

getting an idea of the young men who are thought to have been involved in

:12:34.:12:37.

these attacks. And the thing is that they call themselves a state but

:12:38.:12:44.

they are a movement and a group with a very twisted ideology. And that is

:12:45.:12:51.

why, here at the BBC, it is called the so-called Islamic State and that

:12:52.:12:56.

France 24 we call them the Islamic State Organisation and I think that

:12:57.:13:01.

is a very important distinction that needs to be made. It is not a small

:13:02.:13:06.

thing to say you are a state. What is crystal clear, as in many of the

:13:07.:13:14.

things that was reported, is that this is a very complex threat and on

:13:15.:13:22.

the one hand, you have a human aspect of what happened in the six

:13:23.:13:26.

premeditated attacks on Friday night, but it could've been so much

:13:27.:13:29.

worse if there hadn't been good security checks at the Stadium, we

:13:30.:13:36.

could've witnessed spectacular casualties. The system worked very

:13:37.:13:41.

well. Columnists, not evacuating people immediately. And the G20 is

:13:42.:13:48.

very portent and quite timely. I'm sure the Foreign Minister would have

:13:49.:13:56.

made France's views quite clear. It is not just military and none of our

:13:57.:13:58.

countries want troops on the ground, but how much do we get involved and

:13:59.:14:02.

how do we do with this threat? And where these people getting the

:14:03.:14:11.

money. --? The Daily Mail says there were two deadly blunders made. That

:14:12.:14:16.

one suicide bomber was allowed to come into Europe from Syria regarded

:14:17.:14:31.

as a refugee, and then sell out the salaam -- Salah Abdeslam was allowed

:14:32.:14:35.

to get past the border. How much pressure will they be under? There

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is a joint session of Congress tomorrow at Versailles and the

:14:41.:14:58.

question will be how Minority Report you want to get and whether you want

:14:59.:15:01.

to arrest people before they actually commit a crime. There have

:15:02.:15:07.

been calls for radical mosques to be closed, not just under survey

:15:08.:15:18.

loans. -- surveillance. In the very interesting series of reports in

:15:19.:15:22.

Liberation tomorrow morning, there is one that goes into the

:15:23.:15:33.

investigation. Whether the Arab and Muslim citizens who live in a

:15:34.:15:48.

certain neighbourhood want these people put in prison. We have to

:15:49.:15:51.

remember that there is a majority of French Muslim citizens who are just

:15:52.:15:58.

as horrified, who were victims at the Bataclan and on the streets on

:15:59.:16:03.

Friday who don't want to be targeted and stigmatized. They are French and

:16:04.:16:08.

they want to be on the side of the rest of the country. The Daily

:16:09.:16:13.

Telegraph is saying that the EU border crisis is brewing as France

:16:14.:16:22.

demands new controls. I have a message on Twitter that says that

:16:23.:16:27.

the European ideals of politicians are now in tatters. We need more

:16:28.:16:31.

controls and more scrutiny of our borders. It will not just been

:16:32.:16:34.

France where this question is being asked.

:16:35.:16:53.

France but in Germany. Angela Merkel's popularity has plummeted

:16:54.:16:54.

since she invited these people to come to Germany. People in her

:16:55.:17:01.

parties say she has made a big mistake there. Eastern Europe,

:17:02.:17:04.

Poland, they really have a huge problem with the way the migration

:17:05.:17:07.

crisis has been handled with by Germany. And immigration is a huge

:17:08.:17:17.

issue in the UK and it feeds into David Cameron's negotiations with

:17:18.:17:21.

the EU. That was meant to be the top issue on the EU summit in December.

:17:22.:17:29.

It is hard to see how terrorism and security is not going to be on top

:17:30.:17:33.

of the agenda now, but you can bet that David Cameron is going to be

:17:34.:17:37.

using this to try and get a better deal on the principle of free

:17:38.:17:43.

movement within the EU. We don't quite know... It is only two days

:17:44.:17:48.

and we don't know the full picture at all yet. We don't know where this

:17:49.:17:56.

was co-ordinated... People are bound to be very frightened in France at

:17:57.:18:01.

the moment. Yes. That state of emergency that was decreed on Friday

:18:02.:18:05.

night gives the police a lot of arresting powers. They don't have to

:18:06.:18:12.

go via a judge to go into somebody's house. The French police,

:18:13.:18:15.

when you look at the way they stormed the Bataclan, they did not

:18:16.:18:22.

let that fester. They went in there quickly. They did the same thing in

:18:23.:18:27.

January. There is a lot to be said for that kind of swift and firm

:18:28.:18:30.

action and that is what Francois Hollande is really going to have to

:18:31.:18:35.

continue to do. Interesting today, these false alarms. How sad it is to

:18:36.:18:45.

see people at the Place de la Republique, which became such a

:18:46.:18:49.

symbol... Everybody around the world saw those world leaders and those

:18:50.:18:55.

thousands of people marching in solidarity with Charlie Hebdo and

:18:56.:19:01.

then suddenly we saw these people running on live broadcast on British

:19:02.:19:04.

television because they heard what they thought at the time were

:19:05.:19:08.

gunshots. And it is no coincidence that we heard afterwards that it was

:19:09.:19:12.

maybe fireworks that had gone off. And one person told me there had

:19:13.:19:17.

been a false alarm and again it was fireworks. Is this people who are

:19:18.:19:24.

not so subtly supporting the killers and ISIS by actually... How

:19:25.:19:29.

insensitivity is at this moment to be setting any kind of firework! --

:19:30.:19:36.

how insensitive it is. People don't want this to affect daily life but

:19:37.:19:40.

it will, even if it is just because there are lots of army and police on

:19:41.:19:45.

the streets. First of all, we have seen the army in the streets for

:19:46.:19:48.

decades. It started in the 1980s with the bombings in Paris in 1983

:19:49.:20:03.

and then in 1986. 1976, 1978. And in 1995... We have had terrorism for a

:20:04.:20:08.

very long time. Whenever I take the train to go to Avignon, there are

:20:09.:20:13.

young soldiers who are there to make sure nothing happens. That is one

:20:14.:20:22.

thing. The other thing is that I was close to Notre Dame, working at the

:20:23.:20:29.

time of the mass and there was a bomb alert. We had to go around to

:20:30.:20:39.

the place we were broadcasting. The police said they would have an

:20:40.:20:43.

expert in and they would see if it was a bomb or not but the likelihood

:20:44.:20:46.

was that it was just an abandoned bike and not a bomb at all. People

:20:47.:20:51.

are going to be jittery. It makes perfect sense to run if you think

:20:52.:20:54.

that people are going to shoot at you. It may be part of our life but

:20:55.:20:59.

it will only be panic if we are not rational. We will be jittery but we

:21:00.:21:04.

will soldier on in the same way. People were not out in the cafes and

:21:05.:21:20.

so on... There was an amazing feature in Buzzfeed of people in all

:21:21.:21:30.

of those places that were decimated the day before. It was logical to be

:21:31.:21:35.

afraid of something. It only becomes a panic if you allow it to make you

:21:36.:21:40.

give up on moving around the city. Otherwise it is just part of what is

:21:41.:21:44.

going to be our lives. And 2000 extra spies will protect the UK. The

:21:45.:21:50.

government is going to have to mount a mass recruitment drive. How

:21:51.:21:54.

feasible is that? We are seeing lots of figures and talk being thrown

:21:55.:21:59.

around. We should remember the parallels with 9/11 madrigals top

:22:00.:22:03.

that was also the case and we had an under pressure and unpopular

:22:04.:22:08.

president whose people had suffered an atrocity. There was talk about a

:22:09.:22:14.

war against a stateless enemy. And then we had all sorts of

:22:15.:22:19.

infringements on liberty, several unpopular wars and the abominations

:22:20.:22:22.

of Guantanamo Bay, upgrades and extraordinary renditions. -- Abu

:22:23.:22:33.

Ghraib. There will be a lot of strong language but after that, we

:22:34.:22:35.

have to reflect on whether we will learn from this lesson and deal with

:22:36.:22:42.

this in a slightly different way. The Daily Express suggests there are

:22:43.:22:46.

450 jihadis on the loose in the UK, homegrown terrorist planning copycat

:22:47.:22:52.

attacks. -- terrorists. Some of them, the argument is, will have

:22:53.:22:56.

gone to Syria, picked up these deadly skills and brought them home

:22:57.:23:05.

with them. Unfortunately, there are many things that Britain and France

:23:06.:23:08.

co-ordinate on and this is something they have in common as a problem.

:23:09.:23:12.

But I would issue a word of caution. Apparently this morning

:23:13.:23:19.

about Britain's army of homegrown jihadis, this was made by the

:23:20.:23:21.

director of the office for security and counterterrorism in a speech

:23:22.:23:27.

last week. And the details of that emerged only yesterday. And yet this

:23:28.:23:31.

is on the front page of the Daily Express. I think that this comes

:23:32.:23:35.

with a very large caveat. But there is no doubt that these people have

:23:36.:23:39.

gained some skills and the danger is that they are sleepers and... They

:23:40.:23:52.

wanted to decapitate Lee Rigby and they almost did and I think that the

:23:53.:23:56.

company -- country reacted in a very calm manner. They are showing the

:23:57.:24:07.

keep calm and carry on spirit and that will always win fruit. We need

:24:08.:24:14.

joie de vivre on this planet. We don't want scaremongering. But we do

:24:15.:24:17.

need the weapons that are needed, and are not just talking militarily,

:24:18.:24:22.

to face this war we are waging as of now. One final brief word from you,

:24:23.:24:29.

Elizabeth. We are seeing the rebirth of the spirit of Marianne, the

:24:30.:24:39.

embodiment of liberty, in Paris and you are very proud of it. One thing

:24:40.:24:46.

I quote in my column is the 17-year-old son of a friend of mine,

:24:47.:24:50.

who was taken to hospital. He was shot in the gluteus maximus at the

:24:51.:24:57.

Bataclan. He was treated but refused to stay at the hospital because they

:24:58.:25:01.

needed the bed for other people. He told his mother that all he had to

:25:02.:25:06.

do was not sit down for a week and at other people needed the bed

:25:07.:25:12.

more. This was the same kind of youths stigmatised for saying that

:25:13.:25:17.

they use play and they spend all their time on the internet and they

:25:18.:25:21.

are no good. -- user PlayStation and Xbox. They have been stigmatised but

:25:22.:25:27.

they are good people and they are the same young men and women of the

:25:28.:25:32.

French resistance in the 1940s and they are very good young people.

:25:33.:25:36.

Thank you for joining us this evening. Now, the weather.

:25:37.:25:56.

Good evening. If you are just off to bed wondering what is in store, it

:25:57.:26:03.

is more of the same. Slightly quieter tomorrow but this has been

:26:04.:26:06.

the story over the last few

:26:07.:26:07.

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