Episode 20 The Phone Hacking Inquiry

Rebekah Brooks, and former editor of the News of the World and

Downing Street communications director Andy Coulson. It is not

possible to state with any certainty whether or not those

voice mails were deleted. I know nothing about what Clive Goodman

did... I would Text Mr Cameron on occasion, like a lot of people...

It was a moment of anguish like few others. Milly Dowler was missing,

her mum called her mobile phone, expecting to hear a message saying

the mailbox was full. I rang her phone and it clicked through on to

her voice mail, so I heard her voice. I was just, she has picked

up her voicemails, she is a live! The Guardian said it was the News

of the World that deleted messages to free up space for more. This was

the week that saw two former News of the World editors, one of whom

he became the top spin-doctor for the Prime Minister, another who

counts herself as a friend of David Cameron, appearing at the inquiry.

But before the appearance of Andy Coulson and Rebekah Brooks at the

end of the week, the inquiry heard about a Metropolitan Police

investigation which was intended to get to the truth about Milly

Dowler's voicemail. As proceedings started on day 67, some facts

needed little explaining. This report into the findings of the

explanation -- investigation does not go into the detail about Milly

Dowler's telephone being hacked. It is public knowledge that this is

the case, and I can confirm that there is evidence to support the

fact that it happened. But have voicemail system wiped messages on

her phone after they had been there for 72 hours. The Met concluded...

Milly Dowler's mother's call is likely to have been made when one

of the previous messages had been automatically deleted. The

telephone provider has also confirmed that when the voicemail

box was full, the automated message would be heard, and once messages

had started to drop off the personal voicemail greeting, this

would have come into effect. did journalists delete voice mails

later on? The verdict from the Met was... Taking all of the

information into account, it is not possible to state with certainty

whether Milly Dowler's first males were or were not deleted. -- voice

mails. Two messages are believed to have been missing. When trying to

interpret the and -- the evidence, it is necessarily important to

consider the lack of complete data. Breaching a definitive conclusion

is not and may never be possible. - - reaching. News International

repeated its apology to the Milly Dowler family for the hacking of

the voice mail, and The Guardian explained... Our error, as we

acknowledged and corrected last December, was to have written about

the cause of the deletions as a fact, rather than as the belief of

several people involved in the case. We regret that. And the barrister

for the victims read a statement from Milly Dowler's family, wishing

the police had done more about the actions of the News of the World.

If Surrey police have prosecuted his activity in 2002, then the

position would have been very different, and perhaps countless

others might also have avoided having their private messages

hacked into by the News of the World. Police neglect and deference

meant that it took the relentless efforts of one journalist to

uncover what the police knew had gone on. The News of the World is

of course history, but unlike so many other editors who have come

here, this one had something of a success story to talk about. The

Daily Mail's online edition boasts more than 5.5 million readers every

day. In the 1980s, when they deregulated the City, it gave the

City a chance to compete around the world for financial business, and

it did so fantastically. In a way, this is the chance for Fleet Street

to compete with a one else in the world. -- with everyone else in the

world. The home of the Internet is America, the biggest news providers

are American. He warned that that chance to compete could be stifled

by too much regulation. How far is the state willing to go to compel

private individuals and curtail their freedom of speech? I am

suggesting that in the real world, when it comes to a point of

principle, it would not be a prize that the public was willing to pay.

You're asking me, how do we regulate the Internet? My question

is, do we need to regulate the Internet, any more than you need to

have a policeman standing in the corner of every pub watching what

everyone says? On the next day, Lord Leveson started with a warning,

a warning with potential political ramifications. I am not so naive

that I do not understand that there are elements of what I am doing

which are likely to be of party political interest. I have

absolutely no intention of allowing the inquiry to be drawn into such a

debate, and will vigorously resist any attempt to do so. But even

staying out of political rowers can have a political impact. He made it

clear he would not rule on breaches of the Ministerial Code, so he

would not be deciding whether this man, the Culture Secretary, Jeremy

Hunt, handled News Corporation's bid for control of BSkyB properly.

On the face of it, that sounds helpful to David Cameron, but it

could put more pressure on Downing Street to get its own adviser on

the Ministerial Code to investigate Jeremy Hunt. And there was no

comfortable passage for Rupert Murdoch, as the inquiry barrister

reflected on the fact that Mr Murdoch could not recall a key

meeting with Margaret Thatcher in 1981, as he was battling for

ownership of the Times newspapers. One has to question whether this is

a selective amnesia. Mr Murdoch told us in evidence that he did not

enjoy frequent encounters with Baroness Thatcher, not merely with

-- would be selective amnesia appear to be convenient, but

inferences might be drawn as to Mr Murdoch's intentions in seeking to

meet with the Prime Minister in 1981. Furthermore, this issue is

capable of having a bearing on Mr Murdoch's integrity. It was another

reminder of the power of this inquiry to shape how people are

perceived, to shape their reputations. Next up, man has been

-- who has been a top editor, as well as a top adviser to David

Cameron - Andy Coulson. Mr Coulson had to resign from the News of the

World after a report was sent to jail for phone hacking. But he was

not out of work for long, David Cameron subsequently hiring him to

work for him. Was the Chancellor given an easy ride over a rather

awkward story for him in the News of the World? The inquiry's

barrister suggested a favourable slant in the paper's editorial.

But... I would say this, that is the leader column of the News of

the World, and as much as I would love to say that the leaders that I

wrote were the most read part of the newspaper, I think I can safely

say that they were not. The front page I don't think in any way can

be described as career enhancing for George Osborne. The idea that

we somehow or other went easy on him I think is ridiculous, when you

look at the paper. Not that this was all about the Conservatives.

When you resigned from the opposition as editor of the News of

the World, did you receive any commiserations from Mr Blair?

some time later, yes. Mr Brown? Mr Cameron? I do not remember doing

so. But the key questions were about what he was asked, by whom,

and when. You say in paragraph 31 of your statement, this is the

conversation you have just been referring to - He, Mr Cameron, also

asked me about the Clive Goodman case. Can you remember the gist of

your answer? I was able to repeat what I had said publicly, that I

knew nothing about the Clive Goodman and Glenn Mulcaire case in

terms of what they did. But what about much later, when this story

raised concerns that it wasn't just Clive Goodman hacking phones?

publication of the piece in The Guardian in July 2009, were any

further assurances sought by Mr Cameron or anyone else on his

behalf in relation to the matter of Clive Goodman and Glenn Mulcaire?

Not that I recall. There was something David Cameron didn't know

- because Mr Coulson did not tell him or anyone else, that he had

shares in News Corporation. He continued to hold the stock even as

the Government had to decide whether to let News Corp buy those

BSkyB shares it did not already own, the decision in which Andy Coulson

said he played no part. Do you know the approximate value of these

stocks? I did not throw out any time in opposition or in government,

but in preparation for day, -- for today, I have checked, and their

gross value is around �40,000. I am not clear what deductions will come

from that. Why do you think you overlooked them? This is by way of

explanation, not excuse. My job in opposition was a busy one, my job

in government was busier still, and they did not take the time to pay

close attention to my own circumstances in this regard, and I

should have done. There were also revelations about what Andy Coulson

was allowed to do despite not having the highest level of

Did you ever attend meetings of the National Security Council? Yes. My

understanding is that they s sea level allows occasional access to

top-secret paper work -- the SC level. Andy Coulson also spelt out

his relationship with Frederic Michel. He had a hand in the

organising of a lunch between David Cameron and the former Spanish

prime minister. Once in government, I'd do we call talking to him, very

briefly in my office, I think. I cannot find a full record of that

meeting. It could be he was seeing someone else all in the building,

with another meeting and popped in. A Andy Coulson's evidence contained

plenty of intriguing titbits, but no jaw-dropping revelations likely

to cause embarrassment to David Cameron. Mr Coles and insisted

there was no grand conspiracy between the Conservative Party and

Rupert Murdoch -- Andy Coulson insisted. His evidence did not make

any reference to the phone hacking scandal, because that is subject to

an investigation by the Metropolitan Police. On day 69, it

was the turn of Rebekah Brooks, perhaps best thought of as Rupert

Murdoch's ambassador for Britain. She became chief executive of the

organisation that runs his British newspapers. Robert Jay QC asked

whether politicians cameras -- whether politicians commiserated

with her when she had to resign. Big you receive messages of support

from politicians -- did you receive messages of support from

politicians, in 20th July 11 particularly? Yes, some. Directly

or indirectly? Mainly indirectly. In order to get a fair picture, can

you are sisters bike -- can you assist us by saying he you got the

message is from? Nothing direct. whether politicians? The variety.

Some Tories, a few Labour politicians. Can you be a bit more

specific? I am not trying to be evasive. I received indirect

messages from Number Ten, number 11, the Home Office, the Foreign Office.

So you were talking about Secretary of State, the Prime Minister, the

Chancellor of the Exchequer. also people who worked in those

offices as well. How about Labour politicians? Like I say, very few

Labour politicians cent commiserations. Did Mr Blair sent

you won? Yes. Probably not Mr Brown. Now. He was probably getting the

bunting out. That's is a reference to the Sun changing allegiances. A

pattern emerged throughout her evidence of just how close her

relationships were two prime ministers. Tony Blair went to her

40th birthday party and David Cameron was in touch with her by

text message. He would textual to a dozen times a day? Is that true?

Known, thanks to Lee. A handful of times a day? No. I have read this

as well, 12 times a day, it is preposterous. One would hope he

would have better things to do. And I would hope that I did. I would

text Mr Cameron and vice fares that on occasion. Care new give an idea

of frequency? -- can you give an idea. Probably more between 20th

January 10, maybe during the election campaign, may be slightly

more, on average, maybe once a week. The critical time as you say is the

election campaign. Can you give an idea about frequency in relation to

that period? Maybe twice a week. Everybody wants to know how his

messages are signed off. Can you help? What was the decision? Answer

the question. He would sign them off, with his initials mainly.

Anything else? Occasionally, he would sign them off LOL, lots of

love. That was until I told him it meant a laugh out loud. Then he did

not do it like that anymore. evidence had a mixture of

interesting history and the odd moment that could provoke Esquire

of embarrassment in Downing Street. Nothing too politically

uncomfortable. The afternoon session was to prove a bit

different. A previously unreleased e-mail emerged, sent from Frederic

Michel to Rebekah Brooks. In it, he suggested that Jeremy Hunt, the

Culture Secretary, had a cyst -- had asked for private advice from

News Corp to guide his positioning over the issue. Jeremy Hunt has

said Frederic Michel has admitted to the inquiry that sometimes when

he suggested he was communicating with the Culture Secretary, he was

actually talking to the now resigned former adviser Adam Smith.

Mr Hunt says that when he appears here, he feels he will be

vindicated. Rebekah Brooks told the inquiry she had spoken about the

BSkyB deal with the Chancellor, George Osborne. Did Mr Osborne

support News Corp? He never said so. He never said explicitly that.

However, I think one of the points we were trying to make about the

bid was it that kind of level of investment was coming into their UK,

country to what some people were saying, that it would be a bad

thing, we thought that in the call centres around the country, there

would be a creation of jobs, and we would try to put that argument

forward. I think my question was only was he supportive of the bid.

And as I said, he never explicitly said said. Can you confirm whether

he was on not? He was interested in our organisation. The revelations

of the phone hacking scandal eventually make those discussions

immaterial. The BSkyB takeover was off. The question returned to their

ethics and practice of the Sun newspaper, at one particular story.

The news that Gordon Brown's son Fraser suffered from cystic

fibrosis. Gordon Brown says -- Gordon Brown suggested then pay-

per- got hold of this news by getting hold of medical records. It

is a terrible accusation for a prop -- or a former Prime Minister to

make. Rebekah Brooks said the paper got the story from another parent

with a child with cystic fibrosis. She would not give any more

information. Gordon Brown and his wife expressed concern that it was

still not clear specifically how the Sun obtained details of

Fraser's medical condition. So, another week wraps up. Proceedings

in the coming weeks will get even more intensively political as

politicians themselves start to give evidence in person. Next week,