Browse content similar to 13/10/2011. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Tonight, This Week presents political Autumnwatch. Will the | :00:17. | :00:21. | |
blue fox survive? The Defence Secretary, fobg Fox is under | :00:21. | :00:25. | |
pressure over his relation -- Liam Fox is under pressure over his | :00:25. | :00:29. | |
relationship with his best man. Anne McElvoy has been waiting for | :00:29. | :00:36. | |
him to break cover. That crafty old urban fox has been causing mayhem | :00:36. | :00:41. | |
in the Tory chicken coup. We're on his tail. Job spotting has become | :00:42. | :00:50. | |
more difficult as unemployment rises to a 17-year high. Music | :00:50. | :00:55. | |
superstar Wyclef Jean tells us why politics matters more in tough | :00:55. | :00:59. | |
economic times. Politics matters, because politics is the only way to | :00:59. | :01:08. | |
get things done. Keeping out of sight - the art of | :01:08. | :01:16. | |
the political adviser. Nigel Planer looks for comedy in | :01:16. | :01:22. | |
the hedgerows. One thing I have learnt by playing Peter Mandelson | :01:22. | :01:27. | |
is keep your friends close, keep your advisers closer. Binoculars at | :01:27. | :01:34. | |
the ready! Evening all. Welcome to This Week. | :01:34. | :01:41. | |
A week of improbable stories like the one about the car salesman from | :01:41. | :01:47. | |
Texas known as scar face who tried to hire a Mexican drugs cartel to | :01:47. | :01:55. | |
blow up a restaurant in Washington, DC where the ambassador ate his waf | :01:55. | :02:01. | |
fells. It almost sound believable, compared to the one about the self- | :02:01. | :02:04. | |
styled political adviser to the Defence Secretary, Liam Fox. Known | :02:05. | :02:12. | |
to his only friend as Adam Werritty, whose entire career has mirrored | :02:12. | :02:17. | |
Liam Fox's every professional move. He printed up his own make believe | :02:17. | :02:23. | |
business cards, appearing to operate on an off the books policy. | :02:23. | :02:29. | |
Passing himself as a go-between, gaining access to Fox's | :02:29. | :02:33. | |
departmental diary. Jetting around the globe to meet up with him on 18 | :02:33. | :02:40. | |
occasions since the election. Paid for by a motly collection of | :02:40. | :02:44. | |
ideological fill lan introduce pists, who ever they are. And why | :02:44. | :02:50. | |
and this is the killer line, being not a dependant on any | :02:50. | :02:52. | |
transactional behaviour to maintain his income. | :02:52. | :02:58. | |
What does that mean in English? Clearly drafted by a very well paid | :02:58. | :03:01. | |
lawyer. Liam Fox now regrets he allowed the impression of wrong | :03:01. | :03:07. | |
doing to arise. The Secretary of State stood by and gazed into the | :03:07. | :03:12. | |
middle distance as the impression of wrongdoing went about its own | :03:12. | :03:16. | |
business. Speaking about those who use words to get themselves off the | :03:16. | :03:20. | |
hook I am joined by two of Westminster's least convincing | :03:20. | :03:26. | |
witnesses, the deaf, blind and drunk of late political chat. It is | :03:26. | :03:32. | |
Michael Portillo and Alan Johnson. Good evening. Very dumbed down | :03:32. | :03:40. | |
shirts. Do you mean toned down, rather than dumbed down? | :03:40. | :03:44. | |
OK then, give me a moment. The Care Quality Commission looked into the | :03:44. | :03:49. | |
care of the elderly in NHS hospitals. They looked at 100. 55 | :03:49. | :03:54. | |
of them failed. One in five, the treatment of the elderly was | :03:54. | :03:57. | |
outside the law. It was against the law. They had neglected the | :03:57. | :04:03. | |
patients. It struck me this follows a recent report about the failures | :04:03. | :04:06. | |
of abdominal surgery in NHS hospitals. The death rate is four | :04:06. | :04:12. | |
times as high as in the United States. Of course we have the Mid | :04:12. | :04:17. | |
Staffs things where 1,000 patients died, surplus to what was the case. | :04:17. | :04:21. | |
Horrendous. If you look at cancer survival rates they are worse in | :04:21. | :04:25. | |
this country than other countries. I tell you what strikes me, the | :04:25. | :04:30. | |
Government, I saw it in the Prime Minister's speech. It goes on | :04:30. | :04:33. | |
saying more and more money nor the NHS, yet they are trying to reform | :04:33. | :04:37. | |
it. You wonder if it would not be better to say, look our NHS is not | :04:37. | :04:42. | |
doing the job. It is doing worse than other health systems in | :04:42. | :04:45. | |
continental countries that is why we have to reform it. Someone on | :04:45. | :04:50. | |
Question Time said tonight, get it real, it is not the envy of the | :04:50. | :04:58. | |
world. I think your catalogue of wows may be the reason why it isn't. | :04:58. | :05:02. | |
My moment, I think a step forward for grown-up politics. Yesterday | :05:02. | :05:09. | |
was opposition day, which means we laid the motion. Our motion drew | :05:09. | :05:12. | |
attention to the mess the Government are making of the | :05:12. | :05:16. | |
economy. What the Government generally does to one of these | :05:16. | :05:21. | |
amendments we put down they have cocked up the economy. The | :05:21. | :05:25. | |
Government put down an amendment which says is the most fantastic, | :05:25. | :05:29. | |
wise Government ever in the history of Parliament. Do you know, | :05:29. | :05:33. | |
yesterday the Government didn't do that? They allowed us to debate, | :05:33. | :05:38. | |
not end up with a North Korean amendment. I think, good for the | :05:38. | :05:40. | |
Government. They may not do well on the economy, but they are doing | :05:41. | :05:45. | |
very well on making Parliament a much more mature debating place. | :05:45. | :05:51. | |
Maybe they were hoping to pick up ideas. Now politicians often have a | :05:51. | :05:58. | |
bit of rough. Sorry, often have a bit of a rough time. And not just | :05:58. | :06:01. | |
from me. The Troubles of the world are laid at their feet. When there | :06:01. | :06:06. | |
is no-one else to blame we pile it at their door. I know, your heart | :06:06. | :06:11. | |
is bleeding now into your little glass of Blue Nun. Politics is a | :06:11. | :06:19. | |
mug's game. Why, you might ask, did Wyclef Jean decide last year, when | :06:19. | :06:24. | |
his native Haiti was in trouble, to run for President? Surely he had | :06:24. | :06:30. | |
better things to do than get embroiled in politics? No, here is | :06:30. | :06:40. | |
:06:40. | :06:49. | ||
# Election time's coming # Politics matter. If you want to change | :06:49. | :06:53. | |
something around the world, no matter how much you want to sing | :06:53. | :06:57. | |
and talk about it has to go through a Parliament, a Congress. | :06:57. | :07:03. | |
# They go back to work on Monday # I ran for President because over | :07:03. | :07:08. | |
51% of the population is a youth population. So, if we're talking | :07:08. | :07:12. | |
about a reconstruction of a country. The youth population should be | :07:12. | :07:17. | |
included in that. When I myself decided I was running for President, | :07:17. | :07:26. | |
I was like, Wyclef don't do it, you can do much more than not being | :07:26. | :07:30. | |
President. We cannot sit around and sing songs. If we keep doing that | :07:30. | :07:33. | |
the Parliaments, the Congress, they're going to do exactly what | :07:33. | :07:38. | |
they want to do. And not listen to the voice of the vit Seines. | :07:38. | :07:44. | |
-- citizens. What I learnt when I ran for the | :07:44. | :07:49. | |
presidency of Haiti is it's more popular to be a rock star than to | :07:49. | :07:58. | |
be, than to run for President. The kind of people that we need as | :07:58. | :08:03. | |
politicians are thinkers that are thinking for the future when it | :08:03. | :08:09. | |
comes to energy, when it comes to job creation, technology, but how | :08:09. | :08:14. | |
can we do it differently? I think we need new thinkers for a new way | :08:14. | :08:19. | |
of politics. The first things the politicians | :08:19. | :08:23. | |
must learn is how to get their swagger up. You know, and swagger | :08:23. | :08:27. | |
means you have to have that certain charm about you, that certain | :08:27. | :08:31. | |
charisma about you. Do you know what I mean? For example, President | :08:31. | :08:35. | |
Barack Obama, at times when he was running for the first term, I am | :08:35. | :08:45. | |
:08:45. | :08:46. | ||
sure you saw him do this. Now this is swag. He got it from Jay Z. | :08:46. | :08:53. | |
What turns people off politics is basically the citizen feels that | :08:53. | :08:57. | |
every politicians do exactly what they need to do to get elected. | :08:57. | :09:02. | |
They say exactly what you said and once they get elected the | :09:02. | :09:10. | |
population feels there's no change. If you want to get things done in | :09:10. | :09:16. | |
the sense of stamping it, you want to get legislation. You want to | :09:16. | :09:20. | |
change policy. You have to be part of a political structure to make | :09:20. | :09:29. | |
that happen. Wyclef Jean joins us here in our | :09:29. | :09:34. | |
studio. Welcome to the programme. Thank you. It is refreshing to hear, | :09:34. | :09:40. | |
I mean musicians have got involved in politics, it has either been | :09:40. | :09:47. | |
single issue or eeg go led. It is interesting to hear that you say it | :09:47. | :09:51. | |
is political process. I still have my musician eye. Looking at you | :09:51. | :10:00. | |
three I think I could recreate the Fujis. | :10:00. | :10:06. | |
He doesn't know who they are! You think it's important to get | :10:06. | :10:12. | |
involved in the process. I think we, as musicians, what we do is we sing | :10:12. | :10:18. | |
policy all the time. Artists like John Lennon and different artys and | :10:18. | :10:24. | |
Bob Mali. -- Marley. You have to engage in the politics. | :10:24. | :10:31. | |
Why at the time you choose, why did you get in, particularly Haiti | :10:31. | :10:37. | |
politics, it is a murky world. is a murky world, but looking at | :10:37. | :10:44. | |
Nelson man del da and Martin Luther King, at the time when an | :10:44. | :10:48. | |
earthquake are buried under rubble and we are talking about | :10:48. | :10:55. | |
reconstruction of a country. I say 52% of the population is a youth | :10:55. | :11:00. | |
population, I felt they had to be included in the reconstruction. | :11:00. | :11:06. | |
This was an opportunity for job creation. Some musicians get | :11:06. | :11:11. | |
involved in raising money for charities, Band-Aid being famous. | :11:11. | :11:15. | |
Others have their own axe to griepbld. This was different for | :11:15. | :11:19. | |
you though -- grind. This was different for you. You running for | :11:19. | :11:24. | |
office, I assume would have to have a set of policies a platform to run | :11:24. | :11:30. | |
on? Definitely. A lot underestimated me, just to be frank | :11:30. | :11:34. | |
with you. I didn't get a chance to make it. I got taken out of the | :11:34. | :11:41. | |
residency, the fact they said you need five years residency. I did | :11:41. | :11:47. | |
have a policy plan. I didn't get to that point where I could share the | :11:47. | :11:51. | |
future of the country. They were scared of you? I think what happens | :11:51. | :11:55. | |
is when it comes to real change and real things to happen, I thought | :11:55. | :12:01. | |
that the fear came from the fact that I have enough allys in the | :12:01. | :12:04. | |
world that actually I could have rallied up to actually make a | :12:04. | :12:08. | |
change. I can see that. Surprising for a musician to get | :12:08. | :12:13. | |
involved in the process rather than the Grandstanding? Yes, I entirely | :12:14. | :12:19. | |
agree with you Andrew that it is really refreshing. A lot of people | :12:19. | :12:23. | |
are pretty intellectually lazy about this and say, all politics is | :12:23. | :12:26. | |
correct. Actually, you know there have been many attempts in the | :12:26. | :12:30. | |
world to change things, avoiding political processes and avoiding | :12:30. | :12:33. | |
political parties. For example, when the United States was first | :12:33. | :12:36. | |
established they did not have political parties. No, they thought | :12:36. | :12:39. | |
they were a bad thing. They thought they were terrible things. Within | :12:39. | :12:44. | |
20 years they had to have political parties. There is no other way to | :12:44. | :12:48. | |
get groups of people around a programme which will be effective. | :12:48. | :12:55. | |
I was reading today the last royal governor of said the easiest thing | :12:55. | :12:59. | |
in the world is to convince people that their Government is bad. It is | :12:59. | :13:02. | |
very, very toz make people despondent and cynical about | :13:02. | :13:06. | |
politics. If you are going to have change and believe in democracy, | :13:06. | :13:11. | |
then the only thing to do is get involved. If you think that the | :13:11. | :13:14. | |
politicians you have today are a group of people, then by all means | :13:14. | :13:24. | |
:13:24. | :13:28. | ||
You mentioned John Lennon - this naivety was frustrating for me as a | :13:28. | :13:35. | |
postman on a council estate. You could see you had to join the | :13:35. | :13:40. | |
political system - it demanded that you had to get power. You had to be | :13:40. | :13:43. | |
in Parliament. You had to have a programme. It seemed as if it was | :13:43. | :13:49. | |
too much trouble to do that. It is amazingly encouraging. I wonder | :13:49. | :13:54. | |
about this point that you have to have swagger. That is the view of | :13:55. | :14:01. | |
Obama, Tony Blair. You can't get elected unless you have got this | :14:01. | :14:06. | |
charisma. I wonder, there's lots of very good people who could do very | :14:06. | :14:13. | |
good things but won't past that -- won't pass that swagger test. | :14:13. | :14:22. | |
Einstein had real cool swagger. We rate Einstein. When I say "swagger" | :14:22. | :14:26. | |
- swagger is not necessarily within just the charisma. Swagger is if | :14:26. | :14:30. | |
you are a politician, you have to be able to communicate with the | :14:30. | :14:35. | |
citizen. The citizen has to just feel that what you are giving out | :14:35. | :14:42. | |
is not bogus. Yeah. In that term, that is where the politicians lack. | :14:42. | :14:47. | |
They are not connecting with the public. This is where the trouble | :14:47. | :14:51. | |
starts. Isn't it true that in general, on both sides of the | :14:51. | :14:56. | |
Atlantic, there is a general increased cynicism about politics | :14:57. | :15:01. | |
and politicians and real belief that not - it doesn't matter who | :15:01. | :15:07. | |
you thought for that not much will change? Yes. That comes from a view | :15:07. | :15:12. | |
that politics is about politicians. Politics is about the people. If | :15:12. | :15:15. | |
you think it is simply - there is a group of people who do politics and | :15:15. | :15:20. | |
you have no way of influencing them, then the game is over. In a | :15:20. | :15:24. | |
democracy, anybody can be a politician. I mean, he began as a | :15:24. | :15:30. | |
postman and I began - I don't know what I began as. A politician! | :15:30. | :15:34. | |
didn't come from a political dynasty. My father was a Spanish | :15:34. | :15:39. | |
immigrant. We are both people who came into it. Anybody else, you | :15:39. | :15:44. | |
know, potentially can come into it. Politics has to be about the people. | :15:44. | :15:48. | |
I would suggest the lesson from your experience - you decided to | :15:48. | :15:51. | |
get involved in your country's politics as a time of great crisis | :15:51. | :15:55. | |
in the country. You could argue that although it is very different | :15:55. | :16:00. | |
that on both sides of the Atlantic this is a time of economic crisis. | :16:00. | :16:04. | |
Rather than people being switched off, they ought to get more | :16:04. | :16:08. | |
involved? Definite I will have to get more involved. We need to stop | :16:08. | :16:18. | |
:16:18. | :16:18. | ||
fighting. We need a bi-partisan front. We have financial crises | :16:18. | :16:21. | |
through the entire world. Starvation rate, you see what is | :16:21. | :16:25. | |
going on. Once again, if you are getting into politics, you want | :16:25. | :16:29. | |
things to change. Remember, there is a group of people that elect you | :16:29. | :16:33. | |
to do a job and that is why you get into politics. You can never think | :16:33. | :16:36. | |
that you are bigger than these people. Now, if you two had your | :16:36. | :16:42. | |
chance to do it again, would you go into politics again? I would, yeah. | :16:42. | :16:49. | |
I was reflecting there about the world trade, the way that people | :16:49. | :16:53. | |
are kept starving in poorer countries because Japan has a huge | :16:53. | :16:59. | |
tariff on rice imports. We tried to change that. So many young people | :16:59. | :17:04. | |
got involved with Make Poverty History. And the fact it dragged on | :17:04. | :17:08. | |
probably meant that many of those turned away from politics. If we | :17:08. | :17:13. | |
could only instead of it being a single issue, get people engage and | :17:13. | :17:18. | |
see the process through. Would you, Michael? I certainly would. There | :17:18. | :17:23. | |
is a lot of stress in politics. The press gives you a very hard time. | :17:23. | :17:28. | |
Your political career will end in tears. It is such a privilege to be | :17:28. | :17:31. | |
involved. The canvas is so broad. You are dealing with such big | :17:31. | :17:38. | |
issues. It is a great honour to do it. Why are you in Britain? | :17:38. | :17:44. | |
here for Party in the Pink and Breakthrough Breast Cancer. Zumba | :17:44. | :17:49. | |
is very important. I suggest you all get into it. It is dancing | :17:49. | :17:53. | |
fitness, it keeps you in top shape and on Sundayly be performing. The | :17:53. | :17:57. | |
cool thing about fitness is there are -- on Sunday I will be | :17:58. | :18:03. | |
performing. The cool thing about fitness is there are fun ways to do | :18:03. | :18:11. | |
it. If you need help forming a group, we are available. | :18:11. | :18:14. | |
# One time # Two time... # | :18:14. | :18:20. | |
We could do that! Speak to my agent! Now, it may be later than a | :18:20. | :18:25. | |
knighthood for Bruce Forsyth, because coming up actor, novelist, | :18:25. | :18:31. | |
playwright, all round showbiz polymath Nigel Planer telling us | :18:31. | :18:35. | |
why Peter Mandelson deserves some overdue affection. For those who | :18:35. | :18:45. | |
:18:45. | :18:45. | ||
like to spread the love wider, there is our interweb site. We have | :18:45. | :18:52. | |
now signed up to some new-fangled thing called the Facebook! Now, we | :18:52. | :18:58. | |
are a caring bunch, after all who else would give so many former MPs | :18:58. | :19:04. | |
a break? Yeah, exactly. So we are troubled here that our current | :19:04. | :19:09. | |
bunch are dealing with severe psychological stress. The cause? | :19:09. | :19:14. | |
Having to answer constituents' e- mails, coping with the new expenses | :19:14. | :19:22. | |
system and listening to jokes about themselves. Bet you Dr Fox thinks | :19:23. | :19:31. | |
he's got an easy week this week. We sent Anne McElvoy to the This Week | :19:31. | :19:41. | |
:19:41. | :19:54. | ||
garden. It is time for Westminster Autumn is nearly here. There have | :19:54. | :19:59. | |
been some wild goings on in the Westminster garden. Fortunately, | :19:59. | :20:07. | |
there's always a record of who's been about and what's been going on. | :20:07. | :20:15. | |
Look at that. It is that crafty urban fox. Must be about the 40th | :20:15. | :20:21. | |
time he has been creeping around here. I accept it was a mistake to | :20:21. | :20:24. | |
allow distinctions to be blurred between my professional | :20:24. | :20:29. | |
responsibilities and my personal loyalties to a friend. Friends are | :20:29. | :20:33. | |
a wonderful thing, but Dr Fox does seem to have taken it a bit far | :20:33. | :20:42. | |
with Mr Werritty. He ended up talking his language somewhere | :20:42. | :20:52. | |
:20:52. | :20:53. | ||
between a lawyer and a thesaurus to get him off the hook. One rarely | :20:53. | :20:59. | |
spotted Scottish woodland creature had him in his sights. It is not | :20:59. | :21:04. | |
part of the rules you can ask your friends to fund your advisers and | :21:04. | :21:08. | |
then your advisers can travel the world claiming to represent you. | :21:08. | :21:16. | |
Liam Fox is thought of as a lone wolf in the Tory tribe. There is at | :21:17. | :21:22. | |
least one good reason why they rallied around. Dr Fox has another | :21:22. | :21:28. | |
close friend. She's the former matriarch of the Den, Lady Thatcher. | :21:28. | :21:32. | |
Dr Fox accompanied her in public. He's a Standard Bearer of the right | :21:32. | :21:35. | |
and that's a good reason why David Cameron doesn't want to pull the | :21:35. | :21:40. | |
trigger at the moment. I think the Defence Secretary has done an | :21:40. | :21:50. | |
:21:50. | :22:00. | ||
excellent job clearing up the mess that he was left by Labour. Fox- | :22:00. | :22:05. | |
hunting has overshadowed some of the quieter rural pursuits this | :22:05. | :22:15. | |
week. Everyone forgot about the Labour reshuffle. Now he's got | :22:15. | :22:19. | |
quite a young brood and the female of the species is well represented | :22:19. | :22:24. | |
in the pecking order. With the exception of the greater crested | :22:24. | :22:29. | |
Harriet Harman, there are a lot of fledglings here. Ed must be a bit | :22:29. | :22:32. | |
nervous about well they will do in the Darwinian struggle at | :22:33. | :22:36. | |
Westminster. Are they ready to fly the nest? These are young people, | :22:36. | :22:40. | |
people who have not been in Parliament long. I hold to the view | :22:40. | :22:44. | |
that if you are good enough, you are old enough. Deep in the | :22:44. | :22:50. | |
undergrowth these days are the lesser spotted Lib Dems. Oh look. | :22:50. | :22:55. | |
Even these peaceful places are full of fights and flurries in the | :22:55. | :22:59. | |
hedgerows. Chris Huhne admitted to briefing against the Home Secretary | :22:59. | :23:04. | |
Theresa May. What was her reaction? Well, I haven't - I have left a | :23:04. | :23:14. | |
:23:14. | :23:21. | ||
message for her. I haven't managed to speak to her. I left a message. | :23:21. | :23:25. | |
We've had mild weather, most of the leaves are still on the trees. But | :23:25. | :23:33. | |
maybe the animals should be getting ready for a long hard winter. | :23:33. | :23:37. | |
the day of the worst unemployment figures in 17 years, the Prime | :23:37. | :23:40. | |
Minister is fiegtding to save the job of the Defence Secretary -- | :23:40. | :23:43. | |
fighting to save the job of the Defence Secretary. He is doing | :23:43. | :23:47. | |
nothing to save the jobs of hundreds of thousands of people up- | :23:47. | :23:52. | |
and-down this country. Ed Miliband is predicting a bleak midwinter. He | :23:53. | :23:55. | |
is looking more confident as his emphasis on the woes of the economy | :23:56. | :23:59. | |
is going to pay off. Still, David Cameron's got some tiger in his | :23:59. | :24:03. | |
tank, too. You are the party that borrowed too much, that spent too | :24:03. | :24:06. | |
much, that left us with the unregulated banks that has left us | :24:07. | :24:11. | |
with the mess that we have to clear up. When you see those two sitting | :24:11. | :24:15. | |
on the frontbench who worked for so long in the Treasury, you have to | :24:15. | :24:19. | |
ask - you wouldn't bring back Fred Goodwin to sort out the banks, why | :24:19. | :24:29. | |
:24:29. | :24:36. | ||
would you bring them back to sort It's time for a bit of hibernation | :24:36. | :24:40. | |
around here. It's good to know the wild creatures are still up for a | :24:40. | :24:50. | |
:24:50. | :24:54. | ||
fight. Who let him in?! We will see her again in the spring! We are | :24:54. | :25:02. | |
joined by journalist, former Lib Dem adviser, Miranda Green. Let me | :25:02. | :25:06. | |
ask you in the words of a famous song, Dr Fox, should he stay or | :25:06. | :25:13. | |
should he go? Should go. Because? He should go. He said I know it | :25:13. | :25:20. | |
looks bad. If it looks bad, it is bad. If half the things that he's | :25:20. | :25:25. | |
accused of have any substance to them, he's a goner. He met Harvey | :25:25. | :25:30. | |
Bolton, a businessman looking for MoD contracts, just him and this | :25:31. | :25:38. | |
guy. Werritty he met. General John Allen, he met him alone with Adam | :25:38. | :25:43. | |
Werritty. Leaving aside the fact Werritty had an office in the MoD, | :25:43. | :25:48. | |
this is extraordinary. He had an office? I missed that bit. OK. | :25:48. | :25:54. | |
Should he stay or should he go? think it is very bad. He is | :25:54. | :25:58. | |
determined to fight to stay. It seems the massed ranks of the Tory | :25:58. | :26:05. | |
benches are determined to fight to keep him. They are waiting on the | :26:05. | :26:10. | |
Cabinet secretary's report? They are fighting hard. You think he | :26:10. | :26:15. | |
should go? I think he is doomed, yes. Doomed. We are all doomed. | :26:15. | :26:20. | |
are all doomed in the long run. Former Defence Secretary, Michael | :26:20. | :26:26. | |
Portillo, should he stay or should he go? I think it is all about the | :26:26. | :26:30. | |
money. Where has the money come from for Mr Werritty and has he | :26:30. | :26:36. | |
made any money out of his position? The story in the Times this | :26:36. | :26:43. | |
morning... The Friday Times? Does not look good. It appears that his, | :26:43. | :26:48. | |
that Werritty's air fares and hotel bills have been funded by a group, | :26:48. | :26:54. | |
what did you describe them as? are basically people, there's some | :26:54. | :26:59. | |
hedge fund people, lobbyists, property developer, they are people | :26:59. | :27:06. | |
who are very transatlantic, pro- Israel, Thatcherite? I take it this | :27:06. | :27:12. | |
has not been registered anywhere? No. Here is a man travelling | :27:12. | :27:15. | |
alongside the Secretary of State, a lot of money involved, has not been | :27:16. | :27:20. | |
registered anywhere. I would have thought that would prove fatal. | :27:20. | :27:24. | |
Could you imagine as Defence Secretary having someone who would | :27:25. | :27:32. | |
meet you abroad regularly, went to meetings, fixed meetings for you? | :27:32. | :27:38. | |
Is that conceivable as a Minister of the Crown? I think it is | :27:38. | :27:42. | |
inconceivable. More particularly... Unless it was your official | :27:42. | :27:50. | |
adviser? Of course, that is completely different. I always | :27:50. | :27:53. | |
think it inconceivable that you set up this arrangement and not imagine | :27:53. | :27:58. | |
one day it would come out. Do you think - isn't it possible that at | :27:58. | :28:04. | |
some of these meetings, which involved generals and other | :28:04. | :28:09. | |
important people in the British governance, that they thought that | :28:09. | :28:13. | |
this chap, Mr Werritty was more than just a friend, they probably | :28:13. | :28:17. | |
assumed he was some kind of official? Or Special Adviser? | :28:18. | :28:22. | |
you are talking about British generals, that would be | :28:22. | :28:25. | |
inconceivable. Surely anybody in the Ministry of Defence would be | :28:25. | :28:28. | |
very clear about the person's status. I think that is hard to | :28:28. | :28:35. | |
argue. Pretty damaging that he had business cards, saying that he - he | :28:35. | :28:40. | |
didn't say he was adviser to the Secretary of State for Defence, but | :28:40. | :28:50. | |
:28:50. | :28:57. | ||
it said he was adviser to the Also he changed his area of | :28:57. | :29:03. | |
expertise as his chum moved. That is not unusual. | :29:03. | :29:08. | |
He's not a special adviser. didn't he make him a special | :29:08. | :29:13. | |
adviser. For Cameron Her Majesty's Government has a foreign policy | :29:13. | :29:15. | |
articulated by the Foreign Secretary, William Hague, and they | :29:15. | :29:22. | |
have Liam Fox, foreign policy. Parallel operation. Because he | :29:22. | :29:27. | |
thought that Cameron and the Civil Service were too soft. It's quite - | :29:28. | :29:33. | |
these are people, as I understand it, who helped to bank-roll Liam | :29:33. | :29:38. | |
Fox's campaign to be leader of the Conservative Party. He didn't | :29:38. | :29:46. | |
succeed but he didn't have a bad campaign. They like what Dr Fox | :29:46. | :29:51. | |
stands for, as compared to what David Cameron stands for. Dr Fox | :29:51. | :29:57. | |
doesn't trust the Tory establishment or the Ministry of | :29:57. | :30:04. | |
Defence. He has tried to build a small parallel, think-tank adviser | :30:04. | :30:12. | |
operation. Isn't that enough? not transparent at all. | :30:12. | :30:16. | |
To build a think-tank is perfectly all right in ministerial terms. The | :30:16. | :30:26. | |
:30:26. | :30:28. | ||
Prime Minister might not think it an adviser who is funded by that | :30:28. | :30:35. | |
and for it not to be declared, that is very difficult. So you form, | :30:35. | :30:40. | |
there's union nimty here, you don't think he will survive and shouldn't | :30:40. | :30:44. | |
survive? This is the first time I have said this. I have tried to | :30:44. | :30:49. | |
keep off the subject. If it is true he has flown around the world and | :30:49. | :30:54. | |
it has not been declared anywhere that seems unsis tainable. Do you | :30:54. | :30:58. | |
think David Cameron -- unsustainable. Do you think David | :30:58. | :31:03. | |
Cameron has made a mistake by letting it go on for so long. | :31:03. | :31:07. | |
doesn't want to lose his Defence Secretary and in a coalition, | :31:07. | :31:10. | |
reshuffles are difficult. There's no love lost between the two of | :31:10. | :31:14. | |
them. I don't think he wants a reshuffle at the moment. He doesn't | :31:14. | :31:19. | |
want a reshuffle in a coalition. They are more complicated. He | :31:19. | :31:23. | |
doesn't want Liam Fox, with these supporters around him, particularly | :31:24. | :31:28. | |
on the backbenchers doing unimaginable things into the tent. | :31:28. | :31:32. | |
Very diplomatic of you. Just stopped myself in time. We are | :31:32. | :31:38. | |
grateful you did. Ironically I think Liam Fox has | :31:38. | :31:43. | |
cemented his position this week by a lot of tittle-tattle about him. | :31:43. | :31:46. | |
Real gossip which has nothing to do with the case at all. And you have | :31:46. | :31:51. | |
noticed we have not mentioned a word of that. You have now. | :31:51. | :31:55. | |
It has put the Prime Minister into an impossible position because to | :31:55. | :32:00. | |
get rid of Fox, you know, on the back of that gossip, would risk the | :32:00. | :32:04. | |
appearance that he was kind of allowing gossip to ride the man out. | :32:04. | :32:08. | |
What he's got to wait for, apparently is for the facts to come | :32:08. | :32:13. | |
out. What I think is embarrassing now is the Times seems to be going | :32:13. | :32:19. | |
for the facts quicker than civil servants. The unemployment figures | :32:19. | :32:24. | |
out, dreadful. So far the coalition has not been blamed. Are we close | :32:24. | :32:31. | |
to turning upon it. How long that - - can that worse? I think we are in | :32:31. | :32:36. | |
for a bleak winter. I think we're in for several bleak winters. I | :32:36. | :32:40. | |
don't think the coalition has the opportunity of changing its policy | :32:40. | :32:46. | |
because its commitment to reduce the deficit at the rate at which it | :32:46. | :32:51. | |
said it will is to secure the markets F it altered that we'll | :32:51. | :32:56. | |
have all the problems, plus it will cost us much more to borrow. We may | :32:56. | :33:00. | |
not be able to fund that. We will lose our triple-A credit rating and | :33:00. | :33:06. | |
the pound will sink. The worse it gets for the country the better it | :33:06. | :33:10. | |
is for Labour. Politicians are often in this position? Ed Miliband | :33:10. | :33:15. | |
was making the right points. If it had not been the hum bris we have | :33:15. | :33:19. | |
seen last year, unemployment will fall in each of the next three | :33:19. | :33:22. | |
years. The absence of any acceptance there was a global | :33:22. | :33:26. | |
economic problem that started in 208 and now everything is the | :33:26. | :33:29. | |
result of the global problem. They have left themselves pretty | :33:29. | :33:34. | |
vulnerable by the kind of statements "We are out of the | :33:34. | :33:40. | |
danger zone." Actually they didn't have to dig that hole for | :33:40. | :33:48. | |
themselves Maybe put a floor under this. And given a much morale lis | :33:48. | :33:55. | |
tick view to the British -- more realistic view to the British | :33:55. | :34:03. | |
public of how things were. You weren't tempted? No. They | :34:03. | :34:09. | |
didn't approach you because they knew the answer would be, "No?" | :34:09. | :34:14. | |
Absolutely. We are grateful for this. Otherwise we could not have | :34:14. | :34:23. | |
had you. I hope Miss Abbott is watching. Who to you rate? I think | :34:23. | :34:27. | |
Rachel Reeves is an important appointment. I once tried to get | :34:27. | :34:32. | |
her as my paid special adviser. is the one everyone is tipping. | :34:33. | :34:37. | |
Briefly, for you, these atrocious stories about the care of the | :34:37. | :34:41. | |
elderly, these big NHS reforms which have caused the coalition | :34:41. | :34:45. | |
problems, just a yes or no, is there anything in these reforms | :34:45. | :34:48. | |
which will stop these atrocious things from happening? The quality | :34:48. | :34:55. | |
of care is not the same as the structure of this organisation. | :34:55. | :34:58. | |
Andrew Lansley did look to be cheered up to be given bad news | :34:58. | :35:05. | |
about the state of the NHS. Does anybody like Chris Huhne? Well, | :35:05. | :35:10. | |
he's a carnivore in the Lib Dem party which is seen as herb vor. He | :35:10. | :35:16. | |
is an unusual man. That was not a yes or a no? It wasn't, was it? | :35:16. | :35:21. | |
Thank you very much. Beautifully done. There's an old sailing in | :35:21. | :35:25. | |
Westminster, never work with children or animals or Diane Abbott. | :35:25. | :35:29. | |
A lesson we learnt the hard way. One Labour's crack shadow health | :35:29. | :35:33. | |
team, I am sure you can name them all, are now learning to their | :35:33. | :35:38. | |
political cost. But alongside children and animals and Labour's | :35:38. | :35:42. | |
own Florence Nightingale you can add a certain Adam Werritty to the | :35:42. | :35:50. | |
list of emphatic no nos, if only Liam Fox had a trusted confident, a | :35:50. | :35:56. | |
person he could turn to, a best man, say, who could warn him. If only! | :35:56. | :36:06. | |
:36:06. | :36:21. | ||
That is why we decided to put Peter, Peter, are you there? It's | :36:21. | :36:31. | |
:36:31. | :36:32. | ||
Tony. You've got to let me in. Look, please, Peter. It's urgent. Help me. | :36:32. | :36:41. | |
The comic strip team are back, with a film sat tier of new Labour and a | :36:41. | :36:43. | |
scene- stealing performance by plane plane plane as Peter | :36:43. | :36:48. | |
Mandelson. -- Nigel Planer as Peter Mandelson. | :36:48. | :36:51. | |
What makes a political adviser so special? What are the dangers of | :36:51. | :36:56. | |
getting too close? Liam Fox is finding out to his cost. I accept | :36:56. | :37:00. | |
that mistakes were made and I should not have allowed the | :37:00. | :37:05. | |
impression of wrongdoing to arise. And I'm very sorry for that. | :37:05. | :37:11. | |
Meanwhile, the top civil servant, chief councillor to the Prime | :37:11. | :37:15. | |
Minister, Gus O'Donnell announced his retirement this week. He was | :37:15. | :37:21. | |
not nicknamed God just because of his initials. As Margaret Thatcher | :37:21. | :37:25. | |
once said, advisers advise, ministers decide. So, maybe we | :37:25. | :37:34. | |
shouldn't feed our fear of the power behind the throrn. Right you, | :37:34. | :37:44. | |
:37:44. | :37:44. | ||
get your hands up. Who are you? Peter Mandelson. | :37:44. | :37:50. | |
After he was released on jail he joins us now. You had to do a lot | :37:50. | :37:54. | |
of research I assume to get to play this part. In the cause of that did | :37:54. | :37:59. | |
you have views on -- did your views on Mr Mandelson change? They did. | :37:59. | :38:05. | |
My main source of research was the wraths child film, which I watched | :38:05. | :38:12. | |
again and again. She took a camera. Half the time he was not away she | :38:12. | :38:16. | |
was filming. The camera angle is low quite a lot of the time. She | :38:16. | :38:20. | |
took the camera right through the campaign when he was Gordon Brown's | :38:20. | :38:26. | |
campaign manager. It's quite, it's quite revealingment and I did end | :38:26. | :38:31. | |
up rather liking him. I think he came out of it rather well. Do you | :38:31. | :38:37. | |
think, do the media play up this power behind the thrown business? | :38:37. | :38:47. | |
:38:47. | :38:48. | ||
Or was he the power -- throene. was more -- throne. He was more | :38:48. | :38:56. | |
preoccupied with whether the tie was straight. However many times I | :38:56. | :39:01. | |
straighten it, once he gets in front of the camera his tie is | :39:01. | :39:07. | |
crooked. I listened to his memoirs every day as well. He read them on | :39:07. | :39:14. | |
an audio book. His voice picked up that. Special advisers, which | :39:14. | :39:19. | |
didn't really exist in the '50s, until the mid-60s, now more | :39:19. | :39:25. | |
important than ever, aren't they? Yeah, I mean, when I became a | :39:26. | :39:30. | |
special adviser in 1979 we were five in the entire fofplt. I think | :39:31. | :39:35. | |
when I -- in the entire Government. I then when I was Secretary of | :39:35. | :39:38. | |
State, there were 20 in the Government. It has grown vastly | :39:38. | :39:43. | |
since then. When I was a special adviser I was in touch with the | :39:43. | :39:50. | |
adviser to the Prime Minister, who later was the Chief Whip, many | :39:50. | :39:55. | |
years later. I called up to say if he could fix something. He said it | :39:55. | :40:00. | |
is not appropriate for us to have this conversation. Special advisers | :40:00. | :40:04. | |
never spoke to the press. Whereas now that is one of their biggest | :40:04. | :40:11. | |
jobs, dealing the press. Did you feel in Government there was a time | :40:11. | :40:15. | |
when Alistair Campbell and Peter Mandelson were more important than | :40:15. | :40:19. | |
the Cabinet? I would not describe him as a special adviser. Before | :40:19. | :40:22. | |
that. He was head of communications for the Labour Party. No, I think | :40:22. | :40:27. | |
what we did, my experience of them, I took mine to five different | :40:27. | :40:33. | |
Cabinet departments. It was the same and I saw how skillfully they | :40:33. | :40:37. | |
intertwined themselvess with the private office of the Civil Service. | :40:37. | :40:42. | |
A skill to doing that. I saw where others were not as good as doing | :40:42. | :40:46. | |
and therefore created the resentment. They liked good, | :40:46. | :40:49. | |
special advisers who knows the ministers mind and who can ensure | :40:49. | :40:54. | |
in a sensitive way that they do the job they are supposed to do. | :40:54. | :40:58. | |
There is a cross over there between them and the press officer. You | :40:58. | :41:02. | |
were saying, the press officer, I think there's a muddle in the | :41:02. | :41:08. | |
public's mind. Alistair Campbell, he was a press | :41:08. | :41:13. | |
officer wasn't he? A press office. He was more than that too. | :41:13. | :41:17. | |
Exactly. Where to you draw the line between the two? We speak to | :41:17. | :41:21. | |
special advisers all the time to get information about ministers. | :41:21. | :41:27. | |
That used to be not the case. there is a special adviser. I had | :41:27. | :41:33. | |
one who dealt with me and I had one who didn't go anywhere near the | :41:33. | :41:37. | |
media. Are you portraying them as shade you characters in this | :41:37. | :41:47. | |
:41:47. | :41:47. | ||
programme? Everybody in the... It aets definitely more fun having -- | :41:47. | :41:53. | |
it's definitely more fun having to play shady characters. What struck | :41:53. | :41:59. | |
me about the Mandelson-Brown relationship, is the concealed | :41:59. | :42:04. | |
hysteria. Peter loves all that. tears and screaming fits. | :42:04. | :42:08. | |
target of the sat tier is all the plethora of memoirs which came out. | :42:08. | :42:11. | |
We quote the page numbers of some of the quotes because they are | :42:12. | :42:18. | |
funny. And, as you saw, it's set in a black and film, 1950s setting. | :42:18. | :42:24. | |
thought it was our colour had gone off. It is black and white, like | :42:24. | :42:29. | |
the 39 Steps, which somehow suits the mellow drama. All the emotions, | :42:29. | :42:33. | |
yes, they are very raised in it. Nigel, here's a suggestion. I | :42:33. | :42:40. | |
suggest you ought to mug up on Andy Coulson now, or Adam Werritty? | :42:40. | :42:46. | |
Prince of Darkness I fancied. It's in the past. Michael Howard. He had | :42:46. | :42:52. | |
something of the night. I think I could do a good Michael Howard. I'm | :42:52. | :42:56. | |
not sure about Werritty. It is early days. There'll be programmes | :42:56. | :43:01. | |
about them one day. You are looking for your Ann Widdecombe, aren't | :43:01. | :43:09. | |
you? It is on tomorrow night. The show is tomorrow night. 9pm on | :43:09. | :43:16. | |
Channel 4. Great. I've set my sky plus for it. That's your lot | :43:16. | :43:23. | |
tonight. We are off on the Holloway Road for one of their puppy donor | :43:23. | :43:28. | |
specials, with Hugh fernly. He said it is OK to eat them, so long as it | :43:28. | :43:34. | |
is after midnight. And they are washed down by Blue Nun special | :43:34. | :43:44. | |
:43:44. | :43:46. | ||
vintage. Known as vina collapso. Michael Portillo, soon to be Lord | :43:46. | :43:52. | |
Portillo, I think, revealed to those that his famous quiff is kept | :43:52. | :43:59. |