23/01/2014 This Week

Tonight on This Week, is Westminster descending into political farce?

What is it with the Lib Dems and sex scandals? As Nick Clegg and his

party find themselves in a fine old mess over allegations of improper

behaviour, racing driver and TV presenter Amanda Stretton thinks it

time for men to stop behaving like Benny Hill in the workplace. Women,

don't lap up that any hill type of behaviour. It's the pits.

Britain's economic recovery is speeding up, as unemployment falls

faster than expected. The Guardian's Nick Watt has been chasing the

stories in outer space. The economy is accelerating faster than a

speeding comment, leaving Ed Miliband a little lost in space.

And a proper comedian and proud Essex boy, Russell Kane chases his

dream of being on This Week. I'm working class but I've got a degree.

Honest! And we drive the fastest political

milk cart in the West. Evenin' all. Welcome to This Week.

Yes, another week, another Lib Dem sex scandal. The Chris Rennard saga

was showing no sign abatement when along came an official report into

another Lib Dem worthy, Portsmouth along came an official report into

MP Mike Hancock, which promptly knocked Rennard off the headlines,

at least for now. If the Rennard affair is less Jimmy Savile, more

Benny Hill, without the slapstick but with the tickle, the Hancock

affair is no laughing matter. Not that the Lib Dems can be accused of

a rush to judgment. Despite serious allegations, "credible" according to

the report, against Mr Hancock by a vulnerable female constituent three

years ago, it was only on Wednesday that the Lib Dems got round to

suspending him. And that was only because the QC's report, which

suspending him. And that was only MP's local Lib Dems voted to keep

under wraps, was leaked. Have you noticed, by the way, how the Lib

Dems have become a job creation scheme for lawyers investigating sex

scandals? Yes, whenever anybody drops their trousers when they

shouldn't, it's the lawyers who trouser the dosh. But I digress. The

Lib Dems may have taken their time to deal with Mr Hancock but they

moved like greased lightning compared with their handling of the

Rennard Chronicles, which are now in their 11th year. There are dark

rumours that the saga is splitting the Lib Dems in two, though I would

have thought ridicule a bigger threat than division. And even

have thought ridicule a bigger the Lib Dems did divide, would

anybody notice? Speaking of those who you wouldn't notice in an empty

room, I'm joined on the sofa by two men whose on-screen partnership has

caused a minor puddle in the Westminster area. Think of them as

the Elton John and David Furnish of late night political chat. I speak,

of course, of #manontheleft Alan "AJ" Johnson... And #sadmanonatrain

Michael Portillo. Your moment of the week? A worker in a Shoreditch

restaurant spotted a former prime minister, Tony Blair. He put his

hand on his shoulder and attempted to perform a citizens arrest for war

crimes over Iraq, to which the former Prime Minister retorted, do

you not agree Saddam Hussein was a former Prime Minister retorted, do

brutal dictator who needed to be removed? The dishonesty of that

reply astonishes me, because Tony Blair explained to the House of

reply astonishes me, because Tony Commons why we had to go to war in

Iraq, because he was content for Saddam Hussein to remain in place

and it was all about weapons of mass destruction. If they gave them up,

the regime was welcome to stay. You have to be careful when you give

permission to Prime Minister to go to war because they will change the

basis on which permission is given, which is why the House of Commons

was so very wise to deny David Cameron the right to go to war in

Syria. I think it means you have to be careful if you go to a restaurant

in Shoreditch. If you are a worker there. There have always been a

small number of terrorist suspects we can neither deport nor take

through the courts, because that would reveal the intelligence

sources. We had a system called control orders which was changed to

something else, which was, as Chamois Chakravarty would say,

control orders light. The light bit was that they removed the ability to

relocate these people, and they also said, you cannot have one of these

for more than two years, so they removed the right to renew it. Two

people have gone. Two people have escaped over the last ten months, ab

squandered, one in a taxi and one in a burka. We now have six left, whose

control order lights come to an end next week. We had a debate on

Tuesday and we said to the Home Secretary, you thought these men so

dangerous they were subject to these strict orders this week. What has

changed next week. Answer, was there none.

Now, Lib Dems tend to hold themselves in rather high regard,

unlike the electorate. Yet it's increasingly hard for the party to

unlike the electorate. Yet it's claim the moral high ground when

unlike the electorate. Yet it's it's mired in accusations of sexual

unlike the electorate. Yet it's harassment, complacency and

shambolic party discipline. Nick Clegg's former special adviser

Bridget Harris, who accused former election supremo Chris Rennard of

improper behaviour, this week said, "After 15 years working in the Lib

Dems I realised there's no greater good, just everyone doing a sheet

job". I think we can safely conclude she's

disillusioned. So how difficult is it being a woman in worlds dominated

by men? We turned to presenter, journalist, and pioneering female

racing driver, Amanda Stretton. This is her take of the week.

I know what it's like to be a woman in a man's world. When I started in

motor racing they were so I'm used to female drivers there was nowhere

for me to get changed apart from the back of a truck, so I had to learn

fast how to change quickly. In the beginning, I came across a huge

amount of sexism. It was never sexual, more passive aggressive,

because, like politics, motor sport is about psyching out the

opposition. Male drivers would put their arm around my shoulder and

say, don't worry, you're just a girl. I you sure you want to be out

in all of this? -- are you sure? Fortunately, motor sport has changed

and there are more and more women coming through, but the recent

allegations of sexual harassment in the Liberal Democrat ring into

question whether the world of politics is keeping up with the

times. -- bring into question. When it comes to attitudes, there has

been an enormous shift in society for the better. I have a degree of

sympathy for older men, who find themselves living in a world they no

sympathy for older men, who find longer grew up in, but that does not

mean women should put up with sexual harassment at work or

What makes motor racing almost unique as a sport is that once you

get on the track, men and women compete against one another on a

level playing field. The same should be true for politics but clearly,

for now, there is a long way to go. And from the automotive laboratory

at Oxford Brookes University to our own little laboratory of racing

machines here in the heart of Westminster, welcome, Amanda. And

we're also joined by our resident expert on all things Lib Dem,

Miranda Green. You talked about casual, endemic

harassment in racing when you started. Has that really changed? It

still seems to me to be a testosterone driven sport. It is,

unquestionably. Motor sport is very fast moving. By nature of the fact

that it is a sporting platform, the people who are taking part tend to

be younger. So in terms of the management the establishment, they

are, if you like, men of a certain age, but when you are looking at

are, if you like, men of a certain your peers and the you are on track

with, you are racing against young men who have grown up in this

society, who do not think in that way. So is it a generational matter?

The hand on the leg, an invitation, particularly from someone who has

power over you, come to my bedroom for a nightcap, there was a time

when that was not appropriate but it was tolerated. It was tolerated. I

think this is the key point, whether it be motor sport or politics, where

we need to define what sexual harrassment actually is. It seems

everybody has very vague, uncertain boundaries. Mine may be different to

somebody else's. I don't know why you're gesturing at me. She has no

boundaries. She's a Lib Dem woman. Only joking. You see, for some, in a

generational thing, sexual harrassment can sometimes be

clear-cut. Other times, it is hard to know whether it is sexual

harrassment, or an inappropriate, cack-handed attempt to pick somebody

up. Again, this is where the difficulty lies. We are crossing

over into tradition and people's expectations. Traditionally, I would

expect to be asked on a date. I have never done the asking. The

difficulty comes in the workplace. Because as soon as you are

discussing these matters with somebody who is in power, you are in

a position where you do not know how to behave will stop that is where,

when we look at these cases, it is always the man is in power and the

woman who has less power. That goes to the heart of the Lib Dem problem.

You can have views that what Chris Rennard was doing was more Benny

Hill Van Jimmy Savile, but he was the one in power. These younger

women did not really know how to react. That seems to be the crux of

the matter, and why they left the organisation, which is so sad. Some

are still there. That is also why they have kept up their complaints

and not gone away, because they do not want to see him remain in a

position of power while they are forced out. Unfortunately, in many

different scenarios and industries, that is probably what happens,

people who make a complaint are the ones who end up pushed out, not the

person against whom the complaint is made, which is completely unjust.

Why has it taken your party 11 years to work this out? Good question. It

is an utter shambles. It is a shambles, isn't it? How could I say

otherwise? You worked at Lib Dem headquarters. You knew the power

structure. Chris Rennard was the Chief Executive. That's right. Were

you ever aware that this inappropriate use of power was going

on? Absolutely not, not when I worked there. I worked there quite a

long time ago. But I was still very much in touch with people and it was

not, at all, some sort of open secret. I think the crucial thing

about this case is that it was an isolated case, and that's why it

should have been dealt with clearly and firmly. It goes what you get,

because of this saga as you described it, is the impression it

is not only endemic and commonplace but that nobody really minded, which

could not be further from the truth. That is why it is such a disaster

not to deal with it firmly and appropriately and early. I have seen

people saying, why did the women not just whack him. I might have, but I

have always been fairly spirited and not really adhering to the norm. But

then, women don't. It depends on how you have been brought up and your

expectations. And if it is the boss it is a different matter. You

can't. If this was my show and I was rubbing your leg and you didn't

quite know how to act, would it be sexual harrassment? It would be a

miracle! The rules have changed from what was tolerated. And things that

were tolerated in years gone by - actually, the private sector is much

better. Well, you say that but I am not convinced. I experience more

instinctive sexism when I encounter business people than when I'm doing

my daily job in politics and journalism. What do you think it is

like for women in the city? I would suggest sexism is different from

sexual harassment. Are the rules clear enough yet? They are still

muddied. Like everything in Britain, it develops through case history.

What is happening at the moment is changing the rules. Many people, if

they are sensible, will be more wary about the way they are behaving and

complainers will be more in courage to complain in future. I think the

issue has become slightly more compensated since last week. There

is one case where a woman says, well, he touched me. And then later

in his hotel bedroom I thought... Excuse me, later in his hotel

bedroom? How did this situation come about? There is a certain mutuality

implied in at least one case. It is a pity that this report is not

published because it leaves us pretty much in the dark, with one

set of complainants making some point very clearly, and Chris

Rennard mounting a pretty strong, I would say slightly hysterical, 2600

words counterblast. If the rules are not as clear as some would like the

fact is in all of these circumstances, the men know what

they are doing and they know it is inappropriate.

There is a generational thing here. I experienced it growing up through

the 60s and 70s. It's clear what sexual harassment is, unwanted

physical contact, advances. Vntss. Or suggestions. Pressure. The Benny

Hill generation was seeing it on their telly. A younger generation of

young men. The problem we have to watch here, is Michael is absolutely

right, you set this case study... You set the rules as you go forward.

I hope we don't go backwards here. Some of the people defending. There

is a completely, I think it's a mess with the Lib Dems, we talk about the

political aspects perhaps later, on with the Lib Dems, we talk about the

the actual issue here, we don't want to send out different messages, this

is all right. What is the problem with it? Why didn't they slap him

around the face, whatever? The problem is, on the one hand, we are

telling young women, go out into engineering, become scientists, go

out into these fields where you are terribly under represent... Yet, on

the other hand... Before we become too complacent say it's a

generational thing that has taken care of itself. Younger generation

of men have different attitudes. No, we are getting a different series of

stories. Which is that teenage guys and teenage girls, there is

bullying, victimisation. Yes. Sexualisation through texting,

sexting. The availability of on pornography. Absolutely. Different

problems. Do you think there is less of it in professions, for example,

the law? You get into big law of it in professions, for example,

companies in the city, full of women. If there are more women in

companies in the city, full of top positions, is there less of it?

If there are more women in top positions, yes. We come on to the

whole issue of, women in the workplace. Because whether we like

it or not, we are different. We have children. We have to take time off

you talk about maternity benefits. That is a whole can of worms, not

for now. Yes, if there are more women in the top level of

management, there will be less, I think the other thing is, you know,

in politics, for example, as opposed to motor sport, you don't get people

moving out. They don't really retire. True. They hang around for

quite a while. Shouldn't a woman be able to invite a man on a date? My

mother proposed to my father in 1940. No, women should. Yes. Your

mother was Scottish, was she not? She was. They have pushy Scottish

women. Thank you so much for being with us. We will let you go. Miranda

we will hold on. We haven't finished torturing her yet. Thought so much.

You can't have too much of a good thing, you know. Absolutely. Now,

it's late, so pour yourself another Blue Nun and leave the empties in an

it's late, so pour yourself another underground car park in the full

it's late, so pour yourself another glare of the CCTV cameras for an

it's late, so pour yourself another unsuspecting cleaner to find

because, waiting in the wings, comedian Russell Kane will soon

because, waiting in the wings, joining us to talk about his

aspirations and the poverty of ours. In case you were wondering, we're

still ignoring all your complaints on the Twitter, the Fleecebook and

the Interweb. Now, we know it's late, very late, too late for most

of our viewers. Wake up, Mrs Cholmondley, it's midnight dear!

You're watching BBC One. But even you lot can't beat Europe's Rosetta

space probe, which awoke this week after more than 950 days in

hibernation. That's almost as long as it takes Michael to order a drink

at Annabels. So we asked the Guardian's Nick Watt to stow away on

board for his round up of the week. I wondered why I hadn't seen him for

a while. Wake up this week 13. You are

nearing your destination. Repeat your last transmission This Week 13,

what is your current status? Control, control. I'm absolutely

starving. # There's a star man waiting in the

sky # He'd like to come and meet us, but

he thinks he'd blow our minds... #. It's been a long time in hypersleep.

On Monday the European Space Agency announced it had woken up its space

probe, how things have changed. Since I fell asleep. The economic

storm predicted by Ed Balls around the time I laid down my head has

been replaced by an upbeat IMF assessment. It says Britain is

coming out of a London period of hibernation as it revised growth up

from 1.9% to 2.4%. George Osborne wanted to shoot off into space with

great glee, but instead he adopted a serious tone, the better to mock his

opponents. We had some advice to avoid taking the difficult decisions

in Britain, but we rejected that advice. We rejected the quick fixes

and the easy options. By working through our plan, we are delivering

economic security for the hard-working people of this country

and that's reflected in the good news today. Unemployment has tumbled

to 7.1%, creating the moment when Mission Control, that is the Bank of

England, has to decide whether to pull the throttle and raise interest

rates from their historic low of 0.5%. It's all rather left Labour

looking, well, a little lost in space. He comes here every week and

does his bully routine and all he shows is that he is absolutely no

understanding of the lives of people up-and-down this country. For months

they told us to listen to the IMF. Remember that. Five tweets in one

month from the Shadow Chancellor, listen to the IMF. Now the IMF are

telling us the economy is growing, stick to the plan, you unemployment

is going down. Not a word. The message from Planet City is, for

once, clear, these figures are exceeding expectations. Ed Miliband,

who greeted the news about the fall in unemployment through gritted

teeth has a tricky job on his hands, not just because Ed Balls accused

the coalition of ripping up the foundations of growth at about the

time I went to sleep. George Osborne is now perfecting the art of

trashing Labour's weakest ideas and nicking the good ones. Most notably,

Ed Miliband's signature theme of the cost of living, which the Chancellor

hopes to neutralise with a 7% increase in the minimum wage.

Now, our mission is to land a probe on the surface of Come et. The two

leaders did exchange civil blows on Syria in contrast to the tter

recriminations at the opening day of the Geneva II Conference in

Montreux. There is no way possible, in the imagination, that the man has

led the brutal response to his own people could regain the legitimacy

to regovern. One man, those who have supported him, can no longer hold an

entire nation and a region hostage. Oh, it all looks so small from up

here. Wait a minute, I can see a tiny Nick Clegg returning to his

home turf in the Swiss Alps. The Deputy Prime Minister headed to

Davos for the world economic forum, whose modest tight this will year is

Reshaping the World. There are signs there is growth. There are a lot of

risks out there. I've recently spent some time in Europe meeting with

some of my counterparts. I very much think it would be in you were 'S for

there to be policies that really drove investment and demand and

countries that are surplus countries. Mind you, the alpine

chill is nothing compared with the coldness we have to put up with in

space. There are solar storms and the odd passing meteorite. Must be

those gay marriage reforms. If the UKIP councillor, David Sylvester is

to be believed. He is not the party Chairman, he is not the party

leader. I have never met him, heard of him, he is one member who

recently joined the councillor who is a town councillor in a small town

in Oxford. Get a sense of perspective. Sometimes, it seems

falls our politicians live on a different planet. This week, we have

a problem. Hey, there's Sandra Bullock. Wee! He lives in a fantasy

world. He was at the National Space Centre, which is in Leicester, you

know. We thank them for letting us use the facilities there. Michael,

these appalling pictures coming out of Syria, about what has been

happening in the Syrian prisons, some of them looking more like from

Belsen than a prison, or Dhakar. Our decision not to intervene means

there is nothing we can do about that, right? That I think is

probably right. Indeed, this is a very difficult moment to say this,

clearly the regime has been caught performing the most appalling

atrocities. I must say, I'm still unconvinced at the western foreign

policy position, which is to support opposition to Assad rather than

Assad. Opposition now being a very broad front of organisations,

including many which are extremist and many of which are hostile to us.

After a series of policy decisions by the West, which seem to me to

have removed regimes that were almost always very nasty, but nearly

always western supporting western orientated and against the very

extremists who threaten our survival. I am puzzling as to what

western foreign policy is about. Don't we feel a little uncomfortable

though seeing this going on and we don't... We don't or we can't do

anything? We do. Tony Blair said that said to a waiter, aren't you

concerned about Syria, the point he is making, to intervene, not to

intervene, what do you do? Michael is right, it's an uncomfortable

time. I tell you what, I thought we might get something out of this,

just something until I heard John Kerry say, Assad has to go. The

alwhites will be massacred. He knows that. It's just not realistic to try

to get... If you are Assad, why would you agree? Yes. Set an

impossible condition. In Britain we, on the Daily Politics Today we had a

young Labour Shadow Minister on, this argument which Mr Miliband

brought up at Prime Minister's Questions, we should take 500

refugees. Good for the 500, but when you look at the scale of a country

with four million, you would think you are arguing on the head of a pin

here. If we are going to do is something, let us do something

here. If we are going to do is not argue about 500? It's a small,

it would be a small gesture, it would be one worth making, but also

it's very late. I mean, per narnogical, I found it very

upsetting that the September, you know, events where the West pulled

back from any sort of military strikes, the whole sort of Syria

issue disappeared off the front pages. It was sort of parked. There

was a terrible sense, well, that's Syria dealt with because of the

Russian deal on chemical weapons. It wasn't dealt with at all. Over

Christmas the situation for the refugees became worse and worse.

There is this sense we've actually balked our responsibilities and

failed because we forgot about it for too long. It could be the Middle

East is in the grip of forces way beyond our control? That what you

are seeing is ready really the Middle East 30 years war. It's a

battle of Sunni, Shia, religious battle which there is very little we

can do about. You see it in Lebanon. You see it in Iraq today. You see it

in Syria and the standoff between Iran and the Gulf states. It's

horrible, but it's huge? It has always been an element of what is

happening there but it is a counsel of despair to say there is nothing

we can do. We can exert influence. Russia is very important. The effort

to get talks going was great. To try it with such impossible condition at

the outset and to do it to failure was a big diplomatic error, not by

those you are talking about but by the West. I agree that possibly we

are at the threshold of a big civil war engulfing the whole area.

However, another story this week, apart from the atrocities, is that

hundreds of Britons who are going to Syria are being trained as

terrorists and sent back to Britain in order to commit terrorist

atrocities here. We have to have some sense of our own interest. Our

first responsibility is to protect ourselves. Therefore, these are

areas of instability are greatly to the disadvantage of our country. It

seems we have added to the instability of Libya, Egypt, of

Syria throughout foreign policy, and that is one of the reasons I cannot

comprehend what we are up to. Economic news gets better and

better, the unemployment figures are actually quite remarkable in many

ways. But when did the Tories start to get the credit? Because it is not

clear at the moment that they are. I have said several times that I

doubted living standards would rise in time for the 2015 election. But

George Osborne has cottoned on to the point that the massive increase

he proposes in the minimum wage is obviously important. The fact that

the rate of inflation has fallen back to 2% and will fall further is

important. Degrees from the Treasury in the last couple of days,

suggesting that if you take into account tax reductions at the lower

end, because the threshold went up to ?10,000, that people's living

standards may have increased up to 4.8%... I have my doubts about these

figures. Not as bad as Labour has made out but I am not sure the

Treasury figures are right. Whereas three weeks ago I would have thought

the prospect of living standards rising by 2015 for most people would

have been poor, they are now a bit better than they were. There is also

the intervention from Mark Carney to say they will probably not look at

raising interest rates, even though unemployment is down. So much for

his formal guidance. And so much for the OBE are saying we would not hit

7%. And so much for the IMF. Giving a monkey a set of darts and the

board would be more accurate than the IMF. If this news continues, the

sense of an economy on the way back, growing, Labour needs to find a

position from which it can still attack the coalition. It has been

doing so successfully. British people are not stupid. They know

George Osborne said the deficit would be eradicated by next year and

now he needs another five. He said investment and exports would be our

next big push. In terms of investment, we are 159th. The worst

record ever. Exports has not worked. And unemployment has been a huge

boost for them. It is much bigger in the North than the south. What

happens if investment does not start to grow this year? There is no

reason why it should not. But if George Osborne had said in 2010,

this is how I will handle the fiscal deficit, it would be different. He

has met none of his targets. But no one has. Look at France. Let's not

put him on a pedestal in Trafalgar Square and say he is an economic

genius. Could we do that if we had ox is of tomatoes? Just before we

finish this, what is the political significance of the Rennard and now

the Hancock business for the Lib Dems, because it seems to be death

by 1000 cuts at the moment. I think the Lib Dems think that, certainly

on the Rennard affair, that both sides in this dispute, who have

become increasingly polarised, have looked death in the face and

realised they were going to destroy the party if they carried on, so

peace has not totally broken out but there is mediation going on. They

peace has not totally broken out but pulled back from the brink. There is

a way through on that. Nick Clegg has been holed below the water line

on this. I do not think it looks marvellous to be trying to fix lane

you're a labyrinth at it processes when people expect you to act. --

trying to explain your elaborate aquatic processes. -- democratic

processes. You do have democratic processes, and he does not have

absolute authority. He looked so weak, but I realised there were

fundamental reasons why he looked so weak. Michael is feeling sorry for

him. He is finished! That is really bad. Thank you.

Now, you don't kick a man when he's down, but no-one seems to have told

Miriam Gonzalez, who spoke this week to pupils at an Essex comprehensive

as part of a project to raise teenage girls' ambition, telling

them not to be overawed by the over-confidence of the expensively

educated. "You are going to have to take my word for this", said Miriam,

"there are lots of people from these top schools who are unimpressive".

That's no way to talk about our Westminster educated - fees ?30,000

a year - Deputy Prime Minister, Miriam. But it got us thinking,

which doesn't happen a lot, and that's why we've decided to put

aspiration in this week's Spotlight. As the global elite gather in

Davos, we ask, what's the point of being a world leader if you end up

stuck up a mountain with George Osborne. Should we all aspire to

more? Many young people do but record numbers cannot afford to

leave home, let alone buy property. Esther McVey thinks they should

lower their expectations, focus on working in a coffee shop, rather

than being a barrister. So, are our aspirations unrealistic. Stephen

McGann fears that council estate kids are finding it harder to become

screen stars, van posher, private school thespians. And although the

residence on Benefit Street are a long way from the Swiss mountain

chalet, they still have hopes of a better life. I am not too old to

have dreams. How easy is it to turn those dreams into reality? And do

politicians understand how to turn hard work and ambition into the good

life and success? Let us in this hall, this government, this country,

make this pledge. Let us build an aspiration nation.

Russell, welcome to the programme. Hello. As a working-class lad

growing up in Essex, what did aspiration mean to you? I think it

is complex. Very broadly, aspiration is ending up with more than you

started off with - nicer house, more money, better future for your kids

and more security and maybe the job you want. People say it is hard for

poor people to describe their dreams. I think that is nonsense.

Unless you read too much philosophy at Oxford and you are a mechanic out

of some weird philosophical irony, you want to end up with more than

you started with. For most people, that represent a better economic

state of affairs, living longer, good health and education. Is that a

boring answer? Do you think we have an inverted snobbery? If people are

seen to aspire to something and want to get on, to think big about that,

is there a kind of, a put down in Britain is, he tries too hard.

Without meaning to plug my show, it is called smallness. Jumping point

is about this odd relationship we have with success. You can be

successful, but not too famous, too loud, too good-looking. We prefer

the chipped teacup. It is one of the few countries where I play in the

world where I will say, please don't mention any of the awards that I

have one because I want a good gig. In America, he has won this award,

he must be great. Here, he has won an award, so let's not laugh. We

have this weird relationship, but it is different to the notion of

aspiration and dreams. I think the cards are stacked against

working-class kids these days more than they were a while back. Do you

think the education system does not do enough with working-class kids to

encourage aspiration, to say, the world is your oyster if you work

hard and get a good education and get on? Nothing should hold you

back. These are the sentiments of people that wished children were

things you could programme. However, having just come through the system,

and also having two parents who failed the 11th us and were tipped

into secondary modern, , what happens when you get to compensate,

regardless of how bright you are, the law of the jungle kicks in. I

was in the pack of nerds that wanted to study and do well, and you get

was in the pack of nerds that wanted slightly bullied and picked out for

it. In the playground, that is where the law of the jungle kicks in. I

don't understand why it is considered right-wing to want to

celebrate the success, the brightness, the intelligence of

working-class children. What does that have to do with right or left

wing, apart from the historic position of parties in the 1960s.

You can draw a bell curve from the education act and the grammar school

system kicking in, social mobility goes like that, and comes down again

as my generation get tipped into the melting pot of competency of this.

You do not get equal education, you get more grade C. If your mum is a

single parent, if you come from an Afro-Caribbean background, you are

less likely to go to Oxbridge now than you were in the 1960s. How can

that be right? At my school, there were musical prodigies who were

taken off for a special musical education. No one said, that is not

fair, the same violin lessons for everyone. Absurd. But if they had

been good at maths. It is unfair. Why do people struggle with two

different concepts, equality and fairness? They are totally

different. Sometimes equality is the way to go, but sometimes fairness is

the right way. Visit different from equality? Of course. Good stuff. At

grammar schools, kids got picked on as well. I think there is a

political issue about a kid doing well, getting on, being Brighton

being skimmed off. There is no difference. The man arrested in that

restaurant under citizens arrest would agree with everything you

said. That was one of the things he tried to change, because there was

this feeling that Labour wanted everyone to be on the same level.

Your definition of aspiration was right, you want to do better and get

on. The problem now is still the problem it always was. If a kid from

a working-class estate wants to be a surgeon, a neurosurgeon, very little

chance. If he wants to be a top judge, very little chance, Army

General, very little chance. Breaking down the barriers to those

professions and at the same time seeing the things that working-class

kids used to go into, music, even foot ball now, actually becoming

more elitist. You have two be picked up when you are young. And there is

international competition. The can I step back from education systems and

international competition. The can I put the question to both of you,

because you are in a good position to answer. I have read your book and

I think your mother was highly aspirational for you, thinking you

must go to the grammar school. She thought the way out of your

predicament of poverty was education. Are there enough parents

who believe the way out of their predicament, for their children, is

education? There seems to be a disconnect. It is an important

question and I will let you give a quick answer. There is a science

test where you look at the quick answer. There is a science

importance of environment versus education. In the UK, family is

equally as important as education. Shorter school holidays would help.

I am on tour at the moment. I am much funnier on tour. Funny and wise

tonight. That's your lot for tonight, folks.

But not for us, because it's Citizen's Arrest Night at Lou Lou's.

And Michael's looking for someone to Citizen's Arrest Night at Lou Lou's.

put him in handcuffs and punish him for being such a naughty, naughty

boy. I suspect they'll be forming queue. But we leave you tonight with

boy. I suspect they'll be forming conclusive proof that UKIP

weatherman David Silvester was right to blame recent flooding on a

homosexual warm front. Nighty night, don't let the Village People bite.

Join me on Room 101 to hear what grinds the gears

of my guests Richard Osman, Joan Bakewell and Roisin Conaty.